WEBVTT 00:00:10.759 --> 00:00:15.199 What would happen if instead of composing predetermined 00:00:15.199 --> 00:00:18.379 assignments, college composition students could 00:00:18.379 --> 00:00:21.899 compose whatever they want to compose? What would 00:00:21.899 --> 00:00:24.879 happen if students could set their own deadlines 00:00:24.879 --> 00:00:29.780 and grade their own work? Find out as assistant 00:00:29.780 --> 00:00:33.520 professor Mason Joiner and I explore these questions 00:00:33.520 --> 00:00:36.439 with a few of our fellow English department colleagues. 00:00:40.719 --> 00:01:03.100 is the English 101 experiment. Well, it is October 00:01:03.100 --> 00:01:10.280 25th and we are here to... Continue the English 00:01:10.280 --> 00:01:14.900 101 Experiment Podcast, Episode 2. I'm Monica 00:01:14.900 --> 00:01:18.040 Mankin, Associate Professor of English at Delgado 00:01:18.040 --> 00:01:21.200 Community College. I'm Mason Joiner. I am an 00:01:21.200 --> 00:01:24.140 Assistant Professor of English at Delgado Community 00:01:24.140 --> 00:01:28.159 College. And here we've got... I'm Joseph Buckley. 00:01:28.750 --> 00:01:31.450 An assistant professor of English at Delgado 00:01:31.450 --> 00:01:34.129 Community College. And how long have you been 00:01:34.129 --> 00:01:38.430 teaching at Delgado, Joe? Ooh. I don't know. 00:01:39.409 --> 00:01:42.290 2016, I think. Yeah, we were hired the same year. 00:01:42.390 --> 00:01:46.310 Yeah. Six years full -time. And then, like, I 00:01:46.310 --> 00:01:48.870 don't know, like four, I don't know, many semesters 00:01:48.870 --> 00:01:52.730 of adjuncting. And tutoring before that. Well, 00:01:52.849 --> 00:01:57.400 so. Joe, let's catch up a little bit on what 00:01:57.400 --> 00:02:00.260 we talked about last time. In our first episode, 00:02:00.319 --> 00:02:05.319 we were just sort of giving a general outline 00:02:05.319 --> 00:02:11.439 of what our experiment is. We are doing something 00:02:11.439 --> 00:02:14.840 radical and not assigning any essays to our students. 00:02:15.259 --> 00:02:17.740 We are having them design their own compositions 00:02:17.740 --> 00:02:22.610 and working with them on a... very much a one 00:02:22.610 --> 00:02:27.490 -on -one kind of basis in planning their projects 00:02:27.490 --> 00:02:32.669 and such. What else, Monica? I think that kind 00:02:32.669 --> 00:02:35.629 of summarizes the core of the experiment, which 00:02:35.629 --> 00:02:38.229 is that we're not doing the assigning. We're 00:02:38.229 --> 00:02:40.310 not spending our time explaining assignment instructions 00:02:40.310 --> 00:02:43.830 or requirements. What else was covered on this 00:02:43.830 --> 00:02:47.280 podcast? I guess maybe the why, you know, like 00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:49.360 why are we doing this? Why are we blowing? Well, 00:02:49.439 --> 00:02:50.659 we're not really blowing everything up. I don't 00:02:50.659 --> 00:02:52.319 really like describing it that way. It's very 00:02:52.319 --> 00:02:54.400 violent. Well, and it's also like this is very 00:02:54.400 --> 00:02:56.599 controlled, actually, because we did spend a 00:02:56.599 --> 00:02:58.699 lot of time planning what we're doing. And it's 00:02:58.699 --> 00:03:01.699 not just a free for all. It's a it's an experiment, 00:03:01.800 --> 00:03:03.439 which, you know, there's a control. There's something 00:03:03.439 --> 00:03:06.900 controlled about it. But, yeah, so we really 00:03:06.900 --> 00:03:08.539 just spent a lot of time with our colleague, 00:03:08.599 --> 00:03:11.639 Corey Pellerin, talking about why we're trying 00:03:11.639 --> 00:03:15.060 new things, why we're taking this approach. And 00:03:15.060 --> 00:03:18.580 and and that was kind of the goal of episode 00:03:18.580 --> 00:03:22.360 one. And I think in this episode, our goal is 00:03:22.360 --> 00:03:25.800 to sort of to like zoom in just one step and 00:03:25.800 --> 00:03:29.659 and talk about how those student projects are 00:03:29.659 --> 00:03:32.180 developed and monitored over the course of the 00:03:32.180 --> 00:03:35.139 semester. So like, how do you develop these? 00:03:37.020 --> 00:03:38.939 Because you have to have some way of evaluating 00:03:38.939 --> 00:03:40.919 them, right? So how does this come about? Right. 00:03:41.000 --> 00:03:43.000 We haven't gotten to evaluation yet. Oh, I'm 00:03:43.000 --> 00:03:45.360 sorry. Just monitoring. You know, evaluation 00:03:45.360 --> 00:03:47.900 is part of the process. We actually, at this 00:03:47.900 --> 00:03:48.819 point in the semester, haven't gotten there yet. 00:03:48.819 --> 00:03:50.259 We literally haven't gotten there yet. Oh, okay. 00:03:50.280 --> 00:03:51.780 I thought you meant in the conversation. I was 00:03:51.780 --> 00:03:56.900 like, I'm sorry! No. So I think the process sort 00:03:56.900 --> 00:04:02.120 of started asking the students to think about 00:04:02.120 --> 00:04:06.849 what... authentic composing they might want to 00:04:06.849 --> 00:04:09.990 do in their lives, in their personal life, in 00:04:09.990 --> 00:04:14.849 their online, I guess, presence at work, right? 00:04:14.889 --> 00:04:19.269 Is there anything that you want or need to write? 00:04:20.310 --> 00:04:22.649 Maybe, again, for yourself or as a professional 00:04:22.649 --> 00:04:26.709 or in some other way. And so we sort of had a 00:04:26.709 --> 00:04:31.769 list of ideas just to sort of get to wrap their 00:04:31.769 --> 00:04:35.009 minds around. what are things that people write 00:04:35.009 --> 00:04:37.329 in real life? You know, like not just for a class. 00:04:37.870 --> 00:04:41.550 What were those? Well, I want to add to that 00:04:41.550 --> 00:04:44.410 before we like dive into what the projects, potential 00:04:44.410 --> 00:04:48.189 projects were. I think, too, like we were spending 00:04:48.189 --> 00:04:49.750 a lot of time journaling and especially at the 00:04:49.750 --> 00:04:51.670 beginning, we talked a lot about goal setting 00:04:51.670 --> 00:04:54.410 and having students sort of think about their 00:04:54.410 --> 00:04:56.750 own goals, like what they want to achieve in 00:04:56.750 --> 00:04:58.810 a composition course. So to connect with what 00:04:58.810 --> 00:05:01.069 Mason was just saying about the kind of writing 00:05:01.069 --> 00:05:03.149 you need to do in your professional life, your 00:05:03.149 --> 00:05:05.939 personal life. I had students thinking really 00:05:05.939 --> 00:05:08.399 about their major. What kind of demands does 00:05:08.399 --> 00:05:11.879 your major have? And, you know, how can you use 00:05:11.879 --> 00:05:14.920 that to develop a composition project? So we 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:19.360 did spend a lot of time on goals. And that actually 00:05:19.360 --> 00:05:21.819 took a lot longer than I thought that it would. 00:05:22.300 --> 00:05:27.170 Yeah. And then. But there's some good goals, 00:05:27.290 --> 00:05:29.509 right, that I've actually brought the handout 00:05:29.509 --> 00:05:32.550 that we used. Actually, Mason was the one that 00:05:32.550 --> 00:05:34.269 put this together, but I borrowed it from my 00:05:34.269 --> 00:05:36.930 class. And so there's just a list of goals that 00:05:36.930 --> 00:05:38.610 students have kind of mentioned over the years 00:05:38.610 --> 00:05:40.449 and then that maybe came up in journaling in 00:05:40.449 --> 00:05:42.610 class that were compiled here. Yeah, this whole 00:05:42.610 --> 00:05:45.529 list came from, you know, asking them what their 00:05:45.529 --> 00:05:47.790 goals were, and they, like, turned that in on 00:05:47.790 --> 00:05:51.069 a loose -leaf sheet of paper, and I sort of compiled 00:05:51.069 --> 00:05:53.829 all this. Some of these are from, like, maybe 00:05:53.829 --> 00:05:55.670 what one student wrote. So some of these are 00:05:55.670 --> 00:05:57.689 like combinations. Several students said something 00:05:57.689 --> 00:06:00.430 along the lines of this. So, yeah, for example. 00:06:00.569 --> 00:06:02.810 Yeah. So there's everything from understanding 00:06:02.810 --> 00:06:06.129 language better to having more confidence when 00:06:06.129 --> 00:06:10.449 reading or writing, thinking bigger, writing 00:06:10.449 --> 00:06:15.170 longer works, focusing on my mental health, testing 00:06:15.170 --> 00:06:17.490 myself, pushing myself out of my comfort zone, 00:06:17.730 --> 00:06:19.850 finding freedom. Like there's some real philosophical 00:06:19.850 --> 00:06:24.430 goals here. kind of cool coming from our students 00:06:24.430 --> 00:06:28.569 yeah do you guys find that those to to circle 00:06:28.569 --> 00:06:33.850 back to this key word that i uh um do you find 00:06:33.850 --> 00:06:35.949 that that's those are authentic answers are those 00:06:35.949 --> 00:06:38.610 answers that people have told them in their lives 00:06:38.610 --> 00:06:41.290 that they should like wanting to read and write 00:06:41.290 --> 00:06:43.209 better is that what they act is that true is 00:06:43.209 --> 00:06:46.399 that a authentic statement I think for some of 00:06:46.399 --> 00:06:49.560 them it really is. They really do want to improve 00:06:49.560 --> 00:06:51.100 their writing. They feel like they're not good 00:06:51.100 --> 00:06:53.779 at it. And they know this is a composition class. 00:06:53.860 --> 00:06:56.180 I think maybe on some level, maybe this is what 00:06:56.180 --> 00:06:57.839 you're getting at with this question, is that 00:06:57.839 --> 00:07:00.639 they feel like that's what we're supposed to 00:07:00.639 --> 00:07:03.420 be doing. But I do think that for some of them 00:07:03.420 --> 00:07:07.259 it is a genuine goal. And I think I've seen that 00:07:07.259 --> 00:07:09.360 kind of realized even as we've been working on 00:07:09.360 --> 00:07:13.759 these projects. So I think that, yeah. Yes and 00:07:13.759 --> 00:07:18.120 no. I mean, it's a general enough phrase that 00:07:18.120 --> 00:07:19.860 they may not really understand what it means 00:07:19.860 --> 00:07:23.319 to be better at reading and writing. Right. But 00:07:23.319 --> 00:07:26.199 I think even the ones that are sort of just throwing 00:07:26.199 --> 00:07:29.319 that out as a, sure, I'm in English class. I 00:07:29.319 --> 00:07:33.420 want to get better at English. You know, I think 00:07:33.420 --> 00:07:36.279 even though they may just be saying that on some 00:07:36.279 --> 00:07:39.300 level, those students also acknowledge that that 00:07:39.300 --> 00:07:41.920 is a real skill that they could perhaps improve 00:07:41.920 --> 00:07:45.519 in. Yeah. And that that's and that they're in 00:07:45.519 --> 00:07:48.019 the environment, the classroom to do. That's 00:07:48.019 --> 00:07:50.720 like what we're here to do. So lying authenticity, 00:07:50.959 --> 00:07:52.839 I guess, in that instance, doesn't even it doesn't 00:07:52.839 --> 00:07:54.220 even matter because it's like that's the end 00:07:54.220 --> 00:07:58.600 game anyways. Right. To be better. Yeah. As I 00:07:58.600 --> 00:08:00.899 said, it took longer than I thought for students 00:08:00.899 --> 00:08:02.879 to establish goals because I think maybe there 00:08:02.879 --> 00:08:06.019 was some of that. Like, oh, I put goals I thought 00:08:06.019 --> 00:08:09.560 you wanted me to put. But you actually want me 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:13.800 to put my own goals. I think that it was just 00:08:13.800 --> 00:08:16.180 kind of hard for them to wrap their minds around 00:08:16.180 --> 00:08:19.579 the idea that they were totally in charge. Your 00:08:19.579 --> 00:08:22.620 education is for you. It's not for me. Your education 00:08:22.620 --> 00:08:24.360 is for you. What do you want to get out of the 00:08:24.360 --> 00:08:27.899 class? Did you guys see some break? through moments 00:08:27.899 --> 00:08:31.060 probably so like you you see the canned answer 00:08:31.060 --> 00:08:34.440 like uh english and then like a week or two after 00:08:34.440 --> 00:08:35.940 journaling you're like holy shit this person 00:08:35.940 --> 00:08:38.080 actually came up with a like legitimate goal 00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:40.299 in their in their specific like experience or 00:08:40.299 --> 00:08:44.080 whatever yeah yeah and so that's like there was 00:08:44.080 --> 00:08:46.059 a whole process of starting with goal setting 00:08:46.059 --> 00:08:51.559 and then helping them connect goals to projects 00:08:51.559 --> 00:08:54.940 and then to actions for completing those projects 00:08:54.940 --> 00:08:58.909 so To come back to the question about projects, 00:08:59.169 --> 00:09:02.190 what are some of the projects, Mason, that we 00:09:02.190 --> 00:09:04.529 kind of gave as examples, which some of my students 00:09:04.529 --> 00:09:06.870 took them and ran in a different, you know, just 00:09:06.870 --> 00:09:12.210 as a springboard. Right. Yeah, I've edited this 00:09:12.210 --> 00:09:14.690 list a bit, I think, for future semesters. But, 00:09:14.690 --> 00:09:20.250 gosh, from memory, totally from memory, I'm thinking 00:09:20.250 --> 00:09:24.279 there was something about... Writing a... Actually, 00:09:24.419 --> 00:09:28.440 you don't have to use your memory. Paper. I'm 00:09:28.440 --> 00:09:31.580 a fan of a helpful handout. So there are lots 00:09:31.580 --> 00:09:33.360 of letters that people have to write. You might 00:09:33.360 --> 00:09:35.620 be a personal letter, sure, but job application 00:09:35.620 --> 00:09:39.059 letters. We have to write letters of recommendation. 00:09:39.220 --> 00:09:42.120 That's like a skill that you... Cover letters. 00:09:42.120 --> 00:09:45.720 Cover letters, business letters, things like... 00:09:45.720 --> 00:09:48.799 So what I've always loved about letters as an 00:09:48.799 --> 00:09:50.950 assignment is it has a... extremely specific 00:09:50.950 --> 00:09:53.470 audience, the most specific audience perhaps 00:09:53.470 --> 00:09:57.529 that any piece of writing can have. What else? 00:09:57.549 --> 00:10:02.110 We talked about writing the first chapter of 00:10:02.110 --> 00:10:03.970 that novel you've always wanted to write. Joe, 00:10:04.129 --> 00:10:06.250 you've got that novel. We've all got that novel. 00:10:06.549 --> 00:10:10.129 It's all in there somewhere. Writing a freelance 00:10:10.129 --> 00:10:13.990 article for a local website, newspaper, magazine. 00:10:16.090 --> 00:10:18.409 Restaurant reviews is one that a lot of the students 00:10:19.279 --> 00:10:22.779 really latched on to. I had in one section at 00:10:22.779 --> 00:10:27.600 least several students want to compile a cookbook 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:32.039 of family recipes, stuff like that, you know, 00:10:32.059 --> 00:10:36.700 stuff that doesn't just sit on a database or 00:10:36.700 --> 00:10:38.860 in a cloud or in a desk drawer, like stuff that 00:10:38.860 --> 00:10:42.059 actually applies to something outside of Delgado. 00:10:42.659 --> 00:10:45.990 Yeah, because that is one of the... if we want 00:10:45.990 --> 00:10:48.730 to call it a requirement, is that they do have 00:10:48.730 --> 00:10:53.210 to deliver their compositions to the audiences 00:10:53.210 --> 00:10:57.049 that they're intended for. So yeah, I have also 00:10:57.049 --> 00:10:59.129 have, the cookbook one is really, I have a couple 00:10:59.129 --> 00:11:03.029 of students, one in my 8 o 'clock English 101, 00:11:03.250 --> 00:11:08.049 compiling a cookbook that is family recipes, 00:11:08.110 --> 00:11:10.490 but it's also connected to mental health. So 00:11:10.490 --> 00:11:14.559 for each recipe, there's a... an explanation 00:11:14.559 --> 00:11:17.019 of how these ingredients like contribute to your 00:11:17.019 --> 00:11:20.200 health and how that, um, and there's a lot of 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.659 punning, like, you know, there's banana nut bread 00:11:22.659 --> 00:11:24.720 and then it's all about like, you know, being 00:11:24.720 --> 00:11:26.740 nutty. Like it's just really, it's really fun. 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:30.879 And then another student is, uh, it's a cookbook 00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:33.200 of Turkish recipes that she wants to pass down 00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:36.440 to her children. Um, so she's including some 00:11:36.440 --> 00:11:38.879 narrative in there and kind of the significance 00:11:38.879 --> 00:11:41.480 of these meals and in the context of their culture. 00:11:46.179 --> 00:11:50.720 I will say that I have been enjoying the variety 00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:56.899 of projects. I'm not looking at 25 of the same 00:11:56.899 --> 00:12:02.299 exact thing within a one -week period. Only 24 00:12:02.299 --> 00:12:06.500 cookbooks in that class. Also, you could sell 00:12:06.500 --> 00:12:08.259 those. Cookbooks is something you could sell. 00:12:09.279 --> 00:12:12.179 That's like a legitimate, like lucrative. Totally. 00:12:12.539 --> 00:12:16.419 I even had one student looking at Amazon Publishing. 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:19.340 Oh, yeah. For their project, which would be really 00:12:19.340 --> 00:12:20.759 awesome. I think it might have been a cookbook, 00:12:20.820 --> 00:12:26.889 yeah. Yeah. That's as outside of Delgado as real 00:12:26.889 --> 00:12:30.610 world as it can get. So I just met with a student 00:12:30.610 --> 00:12:36.110 today to go over her draft and she reviewed 52 00:12:36.110 --> 00:12:41.529 articles and synthesized them to address some 00:12:41.529 --> 00:12:43.649 of the problems with current cancer research 00:12:43.649 --> 00:12:47.809 and to try to kind of push forward to a solution. 00:12:49.480 --> 00:12:53.000 It was over my head. Is this 102? Is this 110? 00:12:53.259 --> 00:12:54.940 This is in your graduate class? This is my ENRI. 00:12:55.799 --> 00:13:00.639 This is in my English 101 for non -native speakers. 00:13:01.580 --> 00:13:05.960 She already works in the field, but she's working 00:13:05.960 --> 00:13:08.299 on her degree. Of course, that's what she's trying 00:13:08.299 --> 00:13:11.059 to do. But yeah, it's very, I was just really 00:13:11.059 --> 00:13:13.580 impressed. And initially, she had planned to 00:13:13.580 --> 00:13:15.879 do two projects, and I told her, no, you just 00:13:15.879 --> 00:13:19.649 focus on this one. You read 52 articles. Oh, 00:13:19.730 --> 00:13:22.669 you're done. Yeah. So we're working on she wants 00:13:22.669 --> 00:13:24.909 to publish it in a medical journal. So now we're 00:13:24.909 --> 00:13:27.190 kind of the next phase is I wanted her to send 00:13:27.190 --> 00:13:29.169 me the list of journals that she's looking at 00:13:29.169 --> 00:13:31.230 so that I can help her to kind of revise and 00:13:31.230 --> 00:13:34.450 finalize according to those standards. Yeah. 00:13:34.590 --> 00:13:38.309 I mean, how awesome will it be if she gets public? 00:13:38.470 --> 00:13:40.690 You know, like that's just yeah, it's really 00:13:40.690 --> 00:13:45.850 it's very exciting. Very satisfying. So after 00:13:45.850 --> 00:13:49.639 we have. sort of help the students develop their 00:13:49.639 --> 00:13:53.580 composition project ideas, sort of the next phase 00:13:53.580 --> 00:13:57.960 of that was creating what we, the language that 00:13:57.960 --> 00:14:02.500 we landed on was an action plan. You know, we 00:14:02.500 --> 00:14:04.779 had thrown around the idea of like calling it 00:14:04.779 --> 00:14:12.799 a proposal or a compass. And action plan, I liked 00:14:12.799 --> 00:14:18.730 because it's a Google -able. that shows you real 00:14:18.730 --> 00:14:21.129 -world examples of something called an action 00:14:21.129 --> 00:14:23.509 plan spreadsheet, like a spreadsheet kind of 00:14:23.509 --> 00:14:27.450 thing that breaks a project down into tasks. 00:14:27.649 --> 00:14:32.889 Every task has a target completion date, has 00:14:32.889 --> 00:14:35.169 like a little progress bar, all that kind of 00:14:35.169 --> 00:14:38.649 stuff. Wait, a progress bar? Is there like an 00:14:38.649 --> 00:14:41.419 app for this? It's an Excel spreadsheet, baby. 00:14:41.500 --> 00:14:43.539 Oh, just an Excel spreadsheet. It doesn't have 00:14:43.539 --> 00:14:46.379 to be advanced. It can just be an approximation. 00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:49.220 But who doesn't like a progress bar, right? You're 00:14:49.220 --> 00:14:53.179 speaking the language of the masses, man. So 00:14:53.179 --> 00:14:56.440 yeah, how did that go in your classes, Monica, 00:14:56.659 --> 00:14:59.639 the action plans? Right, so one thing that I 00:14:59.639 --> 00:15:01.679 learned that I will do differently next time 00:15:01.679 --> 00:15:05.039 is to maybe help spend a little more time, maybe 00:15:05.039 --> 00:15:07.960 workshop some of the action plans so that... 00:15:08.220 --> 00:15:10.019 because there was kind of some confusion about 00:15:10.019 --> 00:15:14.200 the goal and the action. And some of their goals 00:15:14.200 --> 00:15:15.820 were ending up where there should have been actions. 00:15:15.919 --> 00:15:18.200 And so I think we need to talk a little bit more 00:15:18.200 --> 00:15:20.820 about verbs and what kind of verbs we use when 00:15:20.820 --> 00:15:23.679 we're talking about completing something. But 00:15:23.679 --> 00:15:26.200 once we've sort of worked through that, having 00:15:26.200 --> 00:15:28.440 them transfer those actions to the spreadsheet, 00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:31.440 putting in a time, like... You should have seen 00:15:31.440 --> 00:15:33.059 their faces when they were like, I can set my 00:15:33.059 --> 00:15:34.679 own deadlines. And I said, yeah, there's only 00:15:34.679 --> 00:15:36.659 two deadlines we can't negotiate with, and that's 00:15:36.659 --> 00:15:38.879 the midterm grade and the final grade. So we 00:15:38.879 --> 00:15:41.580 need to keep that in mind. And we decided as 00:15:41.580 --> 00:15:44.019 a class when we wanted to make sure everybody 00:15:44.019 --> 00:15:47.279 was done with projects. So our kind of end date 00:15:47.279 --> 00:15:49.139 is that Monday before the Thanksgiving break. 00:15:49.580 --> 00:15:53.679 So everybody should have delivered their compositions 00:15:53.679 --> 00:15:57.899 to their audiences by then. But I think, yeah, 00:15:57.960 --> 00:16:00.840 it's like I said, this part took a lot longer 00:16:00.840 --> 00:16:03.019 than I anticipated, but probably because none 00:16:03.019 --> 00:16:07.279 of us have ever done this before. But I think 00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:09.820 I've noticed them like they come in and when 00:16:09.820 --> 00:16:12.399 they have time to be working on their projects, 00:16:12.580 --> 00:16:15.019 like I see them opening up these timelines and 00:16:15.019 --> 00:16:19.320 checking off that this is done or updating. And 00:16:19.320 --> 00:16:23.340 I think it's really been a helpful tool for them 00:16:23.340 --> 00:16:26.139 to keep track of themselves and to kind of keep 00:16:26.139 --> 00:16:30.440 the end goal in mind without me even having to 00:16:30.440 --> 00:16:34.519 remind them. So what comes up? So you've got 00:16:34.519 --> 00:16:37.120 to do an action plan for 15 or whatever, 14 weeks, 00:16:37.220 --> 00:16:41.539 whatever, 13. What if a student says, and I know 00:16:41.539 --> 00:16:44.399 this came up, I'd had to have, okay, here's my 00:16:44.399 --> 00:16:46.419 action plan, four weeks, done. See you guys in 00:16:46.419 --> 00:16:48.500 December. What do you say to that? I say you 00:16:48.500 --> 00:16:51.679 have time for another project. Yeah, yeah. But 00:16:51.679 --> 00:16:54.399 what if they argue that this project completes 00:16:54.399 --> 00:16:57.820 all the goal, right? Do they keep pressing? Have 00:16:57.820 --> 00:17:01.419 they pressed that? So one of the things that 00:17:01.419 --> 00:17:04.240 we did, both of us, Mason and I, with our students, 00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:06.680 was we spent a time at the beginning when we 00:17:06.680 --> 00:17:09.059 were helping them to develop their ideas and 00:17:09.059 --> 00:17:12.119 their action plans, talking about equity, talking 00:17:12.119 --> 00:17:16.059 about how much work should be involved, and talking 00:17:16.059 --> 00:17:18.579 about the work that's expected. across English 00:17:18.579 --> 00:17:22.140 101 classes in the college? And how do we make 00:17:22.140 --> 00:17:25.859 sure that we're doing that work too? And they 00:17:25.859 --> 00:17:28.400 talked with each other and we talked as a class. 00:17:28.599 --> 00:17:31.140 And after those conversations, everybody kind 00:17:31.140 --> 00:17:34.829 of felt like they were. you know, they were on 00:17:34.829 --> 00:17:36.410 track, they were doing the same amount of work. 00:17:36.549 --> 00:17:38.609 They made suggestions to each other. If somebody 00:17:38.609 --> 00:17:40.250 was like, I'm just, I'm going to write a college 00:17:40.250 --> 00:17:41.910 admission essay, or I'm going to write a cover 00:17:41.910 --> 00:17:44.190 letter. Then I could hear classmates saying, 00:17:44.269 --> 00:17:46.230 well, maybe you should also do this too, because 00:17:46.230 --> 00:17:48.109 it's not going to take you, you know, eight weeks 00:17:48.109 --> 00:17:50.369 to write a college admission letter. So they 00:17:50.369 --> 00:17:52.190 were really encouraging each other to develop 00:17:52.190 --> 00:17:55.769 additional projects for the, to kind of make 00:17:55.769 --> 00:17:58.289 sure that everybody's doing an equal amount of 00:17:58.289 --> 00:18:03.309 work. Nice. Yeah. And, you know, as far as, Are 00:18:03.309 --> 00:18:06.549 they composing enough and enough of academic 00:18:06.549 --> 00:18:09.609 kind of work for English 101? I think part of 00:18:09.609 --> 00:18:10.970 this action plan, part of the beauty of this 00:18:10.970 --> 00:18:13.630 action plan for us is that without ever really 00:18:13.630 --> 00:18:16.990 saying it to them, your action plan is something 00:18:16.990 --> 00:18:19.849 that you've composed. And it's a very professional 00:18:19.849 --> 00:18:22.829 academic thing that you've composed. Yeah. I 00:18:22.829 --> 00:18:25.849 mean, they probably spent more. man hours, labor 00:18:25.849 --> 00:18:29.069 hours than they would on a traditional narrative 00:18:29.069 --> 00:18:31.369 essay or whatever, right? They've spent weeks 00:18:31.369 --> 00:18:34.930 on this because it's a living dot, right? It's 00:18:34.930 --> 00:18:37.690 continually revised and edited. The action plan 00:18:37.690 --> 00:18:39.589 itself could be the final product. What if someone 00:18:39.589 --> 00:18:43.289 got that meta? Oh, wow. For my first project, 00:18:43.430 --> 00:18:44.930 I'm going to create an action plan. To create 00:18:44.930 --> 00:18:46.789 this action plan, I will create an action plan. 00:18:51.039 --> 00:18:53.960 I'm going to deliver it. My target audience will 00:18:53.960 --> 00:18:56.920 be a class in the next semester. I will be doing 00:18:56.920 --> 00:18:59.319 this for the class in the next semester. See, 00:18:59.460 --> 00:19:01.420 this is why you need to join our experiment, 00:19:01.640 --> 00:19:05.369 Joe. Yeah, man. I like this meta stuff. But I 00:19:05.369 --> 00:19:07.890 imagine I will have some of my students again 00:19:07.890 --> 00:19:10.910 next semester for English 102. And that action 00:19:10.910 --> 00:19:13.349 plan is going to come up again. And I hope that 00:19:13.349 --> 00:19:15.849 this time they'll know what I'm asking them to 00:19:15.849 --> 00:19:20.009 do. Because I think even this semester, having 00:19:20.009 --> 00:19:23.650 my students do their research proposal was just... 00:19:23.650 --> 00:19:26.950 It was, what the F is this? I don't even know 00:19:26.950 --> 00:19:28.630 what you're turning in. This isn't even what 00:19:28.630 --> 00:19:31.839 I've asked. So I think that... This is something 00:19:31.839 --> 00:19:35.019 students need to know how to do. Especially for 00:19:35.019 --> 00:19:37.640 a research paper. For any kind of big project 00:19:37.640 --> 00:19:40.180 that's time -consuming and has many parts, you 00:19:40.180 --> 00:19:42.180 need to be able to break it down. You need to 00:19:42.180 --> 00:19:44.519 be able to understand that you don't wait until 00:19:44.519 --> 00:19:48.900 the night before to try to get chat GPT to write 00:19:48.900 --> 00:19:54.839 you some bullshit. You have to think about it 00:19:54.839 --> 00:19:57.400 and be responsible. Foresight. You've got to 00:19:57.400 --> 00:20:00.559 have some foresight. So Monica Jo had also asked 00:20:00.559 --> 00:20:03.039 about how we are monitoring these projects. You 00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:08.140 want to take a first stab at that? Yeah. Monitoring. 00:20:09.019 --> 00:20:11.640 It sounds so clinical. Not to be conflated with 00:20:11.640 --> 00:20:14.279 evaluation, which is what I mistakenly did. So 00:20:14.279 --> 00:20:17.339 I'm guessing with monitoring, I guess that's 00:20:17.339 --> 00:20:19.359 kind of like how are we helping keep students 00:20:19.359 --> 00:20:22.599 on track? How are we checking progress? So this 00:20:22.599 --> 00:20:25.180 is happening like almost every day in class and 00:20:25.180 --> 00:20:28.700 also through conferencing. So, yeah, students 00:20:28.700 --> 00:20:32.309 have had time to work in class on. drafts we're 00:20:32.309 --> 00:20:34.890 now kind of we're workshopping drafts we're workshopping 00:20:34.890 --> 00:20:36.630 so we're doing things on like a micro and macro 00:20:36.630 --> 00:20:39.450 level um where we are workshopping entire pieces 00:20:39.450 --> 00:20:42.250 but i'm also i've also had them start to like 00:20:42.250 --> 00:20:44.670 just pull sentences out of what they're working 00:20:44.670 --> 00:20:48.069 on so that we can kind of focus on sentence you 00:20:48.069 --> 00:20:52.089 know strengthening our sentences um in the context 00:20:52.089 --> 00:20:54.210 of the larger purpose of our of our projects 00:20:54.210 --> 00:20:59.480 um so it's just like i it's Right now, it feels 00:20:59.480 --> 00:21:01.920 very smooth. It feels like things are humming 00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:05.339 along for the most part. I can't say it will 00:21:05.339 --> 00:21:08.140 feel like that next week, but I am meeting right 00:21:08.140 --> 00:21:10.119 now, too, with students with their Checkpoint 00:21:10.119 --> 00:21:12.460 3 conference. That's the purpose of the girl 00:21:12.460 --> 00:21:15.509 that I met with today who did the amazing. cancer 00:21:15.509 --> 00:21:20.750 research right synthesis uh so yeah so they are 00:21:20.750 --> 00:21:23.549 and the thing is like they're eager to check 00:21:23.549 --> 00:21:26.829 in they want to show me what they're doing they 00:21:26.829 --> 00:21:28.890 want to show each other i when i was leaving 00:21:28.890 --> 00:21:31.950 my 101 this morning they were hanging out with 00:21:31.950 --> 00:21:33.690 each other in class like they weren't leaving 00:21:33.690 --> 00:21:35.690 and they were like talking to each other like 00:21:35.690 --> 00:21:37.190 people who don't even sit next to each other 00:21:37.190 --> 00:21:39.670 in class were like getting together because they 00:21:39.670 --> 00:21:42.509 had read each other's drafts that are in our 00:21:42.509 --> 00:21:45.470 canvas discussion forum and they were like giving 00:21:45.470 --> 00:21:49.869 each other feedback just because nice you know 00:21:49.869 --> 00:21:53.029 so they're kind of also keeping each other on 00:21:53.029 --> 00:21:56.549 you know engaged and and moving forward yeah 00:21:56.549 --> 00:21:59.750 yeah at the i think before the semester started 00:21:59.750 --> 00:22:03.349 monica and i had outlined um four four specific 00:22:03.349 --> 00:22:05.630 checkpoints and and maybe maybe we'll renew re 00:22:06.299 --> 00:22:10.160 negotiate that but uh um but like so first checkpoint 00:22:10.160 --> 00:22:13.240 and by checkpoint uh this would be a one -on 00:22:13.240 --> 00:22:15.140 -one conference required one -on -one conference 00:22:15.140 --> 00:22:19.579 right um as for me i think was uh was sort of 00:22:19.579 --> 00:22:22.380 shoring up their their composition ideas you 00:22:22.380 --> 00:22:25.160 know in connection to their goals um their personal 00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:30.000 goals uh um checkpoint two is like you've done 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:32.940 your action plan. It's time for me to look at 00:22:32.940 --> 00:22:35.420 it and say, all right, so I see you've got, maybe 00:22:35.420 --> 00:22:38.359 consider adding more tasks here pertaining to 00:22:38.359 --> 00:22:41.220 obtaining feedback on this draft. And so sort 00:22:41.220 --> 00:22:47.240 of our opportunity to offer feedback on the action 00:22:47.240 --> 00:22:51.019 plans, checkpoint three is sort of like draft 00:22:51.019 --> 00:22:54.000 time. We're looking at rough drafts and that's 00:22:54.000 --> 00:22:56.839 where I'm at currently in the process. And checkpoint 00:22:56.839 --> 00:22:59.660 four is going to be like the final, conference 00:22:59.660 --> 00:23:04.819 where where we talk to the student about what 00:23:04.819 --> 00:23:06.440 they've composed over the course of the semester 00:23:06.440 --> 00:23:08.400 how they've delivered those those compositions 00:23:08.400 --> 00:23:11.900 um how how much they felt like they achieved 00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:15.240 their goals uh and uh yeah and it's kind of it's 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:18.500 an opportunity for them to self -evaluate so 00:23:18.500 --> 00:23:21.319 the grade will be i i'm kind of thinking of it 00:23:21.319 --> 00:23:23.480 as a collaboration between me and the student 00:23:23.480 --> 00:23:25.500 the student kind of the whole point here was 00:23:25.500 --> 00:23:28.319 to give them more agency and i think By the end 00:23:28.319 --> 00:23:30.000 of the term, they should know what their grade 00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:33.279 is without me having to tell them. So, I mean, 00:23:33.299 --> 00:23:36.059 of course, I'm there as the heavy if I have to 00:23:36.059 --> 00:23:39.460 be, but I don't foresee a lot of trouble with 00:23:39.460 --> 00:23:42.200 that. Yeah, I think co -evaluation is something 00:23:42.200 --> 00:23:46.799 I'm interested in exploring in those final conferences. 00:23:48.910 --> 00:23:52.089 Co -evaluation. Okay. Yeah, yeah. I find that 00:23:52.089 --> 00:23:54.009 students are usually pretty honest with what 00:23:54.009 --> 00:23:55.930 they want. Or, you know, if they want an A, just, 00:23:56.049 --> 00:23:57.609 you know, and they're vocal about it. Hey, I 00:23:57.609 --> 00:24:01.049 want an A. Sure. That's usually enough. If they're 00:24:01.049 --> 00:24:03.509 aware that they want the A, they usually understand. 00:24:03.509 --> 00:24:05.769 Hopefully, yeah, they've been aware enough that 00:24:05.769 --> 00:24:07.029 they did what they needed to do. That they did 00:24:07.029 --> 00:24:08.970 what they needed to do. Yeah. They're not just 00:24:08.970 --> 00:24:14.069 saying it blankly. But I imagine in a week or 00:24:14.069 --> 00:24:16.910 two, we will start to discuss as a class, how 00:24:16.910 --> 00:24:20.490 do we evaluate a body of work? And how do we 00:24:20.490 --> 00:24:22.829 do that in the context of academic requirements 00:24:22.829 --> 00:24:25.490 and what the purpose of the class is? You had 00:24:25.490 --> 00:24:28.670 your own goals, but there's also what constitutes 00:24:28.670 --> 00:24:32.250 an A, a B, a C, and really kind of have those 00:24:32.250 --> 00:24:35.529 conversations with them about the work itself. 00:24:35.529 --> 00:24:38.680 But I think also as... for like a course grade 00:24:38.680 --> 00:24:42.039 because as we know we don't just evaluate it's 00:24:42.039 --> 00:24:44.539 not just the products that students produce that 00:24:44.539 --> 00:24:46.980 you know leads them to pass or fail there's other 00:24:46.980 --> 00:24:50.180 factors that play into that so I like I'm looking 00:24:50.180 --> 00:24:52.019 forward to having those conversations with them 00:24:52.019 --> 00:24:56.799 in a week or two what about the um at the end 00:24:56.799 --> 00:24:58.140 of the semester how are they going to share are 00:24:58.140 --> 00:24:59.259 they going to share all this with each other 00:24:59.690 --> 00:25:02.049 So some of them, I think they are like the class 00:25:02.049 --> 00:25:04.650 will be the audience because they're that's who 00:25:04.650 --> 00:25:06.990 they're composing for is other people that are, 00:25:06.990 --> 00:25:10.990 you know, of the same age or their peers. But 00:25:10.990 --> 00:25:12.750 other people like I think there'll be a lot of 00:25:12.750 --> 00:25:15.230 submissions to Images magazine, which is Delgado's 00:25:15.230 --> 00:25:18.670 student literary magazine. I'll be in the show 00:25:18.670 --> 00:25:23.089 notes. Yeah. So. And then other, yeah, I have 00:25:23.089 --> 00:25:25.930 some, some people are giving presentations or 00:25:25.930 --> 00:25:28.309 they're, it fits in the context of their job. 00:25:28.349 --> 00:25:30.869 So they're, they would be delivering it to their 00:25:30.869 --> 00:25:34.809 coworkers at their job. Yeah. So, and that's 00:25:34.809 --> 00:25:36.170 something we need to start talking about too. 00:25:36.289 --> 00:25:37.769 Like it's just kind of a reminder of how are 00:25:37.769 --> 00:25:42.069 we going to deliver these projects to their audiences. 00:25:42.670 --> 00:25:46.170 So, yeah. And just a reminder of like, that's 00:25:46.170 --> 00:25:51.250 the final step. So, yeah. Yeah, delivering it 00:25:51.250 --> 00:25:53.869 is not like pressing submit to Canvas. Right, 00:25:53.890 --> 00:25:56.289 yeah. What about this? What about this? What 00:25:56.289 --> 00:25:59.930 is it? Week 11, right? Mm -hmm. Okay, so there's 00:25:59.930 --> 00:26:02.269 always this one student, right? Like who shows 00:26:02.269 --> 00:26:04.630 up, you know, haven't been there in 10 weeks, 00:26:04.789 --> 00:26:07.049 showing up week 11. Okay, what do I need to do? 00:26:07.690 --> 00:26:11.990 How is that different than like a normal semester 00:26:11.990 --> 00:26:13.470 where I'm like, okay, you just need to do all 00:26:13.470 --> 00:26:16.190 these things or whatever, the inverse of that. 00:26:16.230 --> 00:26:17.829 You can't. The door is closed. Whatever it may 00:26:17.829 --> 00:26:20.390 be. How are you guys approaching that? Have you 00:26:20.390 --> 00:26:23.890 approached that? Has that come up? I mean, I've 00:26:23.890 --> 00:26:27.690 had a lot of, not so much like somebody who hasn't 00:26:27.690 --> 00:26:29.990 been here at all and is now showing up, but I've 00:26:29.990 --> 00:26:34.809 had a lot in my 101 students who are present 00:26:34.809 --> 00:26:40.430 either literally in person or digitally. They're 00:26:40.430 --> 00:26:43.109 only present maybe once every couple of weeks. 00:26:43.269 --> 00:26:47.390 Right. I've had a lot of that. Right. And yeah, 00:26:47.450 --> 00:26:49.569 honestly, I don't have an answer to that question, 00:26:49.690 --> 00:26:52.049 Joe. I'm still figuring that out, I think. Yeah. 00:26:52.130 --> 00:26:56.750 Yeah. Monica, what do you think? So I I most 00:26:56.750 --> 00:27:01.869 of my students are pretty consistent and the 00:27:01.869 --> 00:27:04.390 ones who are not know what they should be doing 00:27:04.390 --> 00:27:08.710 because they created their plan. So there isn't 00:27:08.710 --> 00:27:11.529 a whole like, what did I miss? What are we doing? 00:27:12.329 --> 00:27:15.970 Because. They know what they know, what they 00:27:15.970 --> 00:27:18.450 should take them back to the top step. OK, start 00:27:18.450 --> 00:27:21.230 creating an action plan. Yeah. And I I made it 00:27:21.230 --> 00:27:23.089 very clear at the beginning that this course 00:27:23.089 --> 00:27:26.190 is progressive. So there will be no showing up 00:27:26.190 --> 00:27:28.910 at week 11 and turning in all your work from 00:27:28.910 --> 00:27:30.329 the beginning. I mean, that doesn't work in any 00:27:30.329 --> 00:27:33.750 in any. No, but I think radical. I think, though, 00:27:33.789 --> 00:27:35.549 like, you know, when you have like, oh, we do 00:27:35.549 --> 00:27:37.970 the narrative essay and then we do an analysis 00:27:37.970 --> 00:27:40.369 essay and then we do. Students kind of do think 00:27:40.369 --> 00:27:42.250 that those things are not connected and that 00:27:42.250 --> 00:27:45.279 there's no. progression happening so they think 00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:47.519 that oh well i just i can just turn that narrative 00:27:47.519 --> 00:27:50.380 essay in in week 12 because it's not connected 00:27:50.380 --> 00:27:53.079 to what we're even doing but it's and of course 00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:55.380 we know that's not true but it's it's that kind 00:27:55.380 --> 00:27:58.509 of structure to me is part of the problem it 00:27:58.509 --> 00:28:01.190 create where this is really emphasizing process 00:28:01.190 --> 00:28:04.049 in such a way that like students know that like 00:28:04.049 --> 00:28:06.289 if they haven't written anything by now they're 00:28:06.289 --> 00:28:10.269 in they're in trouble um but i don't i have some 00:28:10.269 --> 00:28:11.990 students who kind of i just sent some emails 00:28:11.990 --> 00:28:14.009 yesterday to kind of reach out to students that 00:28:14.009 --> 00:28:16.630 i haven't seen for a couple class meetings but 00:28:16.630 --> 00:28:19.049 that we're kind of on a good track and i don't 00:28:19.049 --> 00:28:21.369 know what's happened to them um and there's still 00:28:21.369 --> 00:28:23.740 time it's still that kind of like They could 00:28:23.740 --> 00:28:25.960 still do it if they show up this week and I can 00:28:25.960 --> 00:28:29.680 see what they've composed. But it is kind of 00:28:29.680 --> 00:28:31.940 getting to that make or break point where you 00:28:31.940 --> 00:28:34.240 just are out of time. And that means you didn't 00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:38.539 keep up with your own timeline. Would you say 00:28:38.539 --> 00:28:41.839 that this is a more, do your students in this 00:28:41.839 --> 00:28:46.259 framework of class, is it a more independent? 00:28:46.799 --> 00:28:51.559 Do they have more independence than the traditional? 00:28:52.640 --> 00:28:55.240 other class are they more independent do you 00:28:55.240 --> 00:28:56.920 guys take it how about this let me give you an 00:28:56.920 --> 00:28:59.019 exact example do you guys take attendance oh 00:28:59.019 --> 00:29:02.480 yeah very much okay it's 20 of the great so the 00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:04.619 way the grade is determined the overall course 00:29:04.619 --> 00:29:09.420 grade is 20 is attendance uh and i'm calling 00:29:09.420 --> 00:29:12.900 it presence um that's good and the journal uh 00:29:12.900 --> 00:29:15.039 yeah so it includes their journal and they have 00:29:15.039 --> 00:29:18.119 to be present in class Then I think 10 % was 00:29:18.119 --> 00:29:21.039 the action plan and timeline and 20 % are the 00:29:21.039 --> 00:29:23.819 conference checkpoints. And then 50 % will be 00:29:23.819 --> 00:29:28.259 the final compositions with their self -evaluation 00:29:28.259 --> 00:29:32.140 included in that. So I guess to answer the question 00:29:32.140 --> 00:29:35.779 of attendance, yes, it matters. Yeah, you can't... 00:29:35.779 --> 00:29:38.759 But what if you're an independent superstar and 00:29:38.759 --> 00:29:40.960 you... Is there like a way to circumvent that 00:29:40.960 --> 00:29:44.160 in the sense of... Like, hey, I just want to 00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:45.519 work with Mason. I just want to go to Mason's 00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:47.240 office like once a week, chit chat with him. 00:29:47.319 --> 00:29:49.920 I'm just like, you know, I'm reading 52 articles 00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:53.690 and synthesizing the information. Are they kind 00:29:53.690 --> 00:29:56.450 of left to their own devices, or do they have 00:29:56.450 --> 00:29:58.930 to come in and sit there for the lecture on how 00:29:58.930 --> 00:30:01.670 to summarize a paragraph or something? Well, 00:30:01.690 --> 00:30:03.670 there are no lectures on how to summarize a paragraph. 00:30:04.049 --> 00:30:07.950 But we might save that for the next episode. 00:30:09.349 --> 00:30:11.509 Which is the day -to -day, what happens in the 00:30:11.509 --> 00:30:12.690 classroom. Yeah, what we're going to do day -to 00:30:12.690 --> 00:30:14.529 -day. And we're doing the grades. I'm like, I'm 00:30:14.529 --> 00:30:17.410 sorry. It's okay. There's a lot to talk about. 00:30:17.490 --> 00:30:20.410 That's kind of why we broke it up. But I do think 00:30:20.410 --> 00:30:23.569 we are... out of time, so I don't know if we 00:30:23.569 --> 00:30:26.690 want to just have a final thought. Final thoughts, 00:30:26.730 --> 00:30:34.680 Joseph? Cool stuff. I don't have anything grand 00:30:34.680 --> 00:30:39.759 to say. It's all just conjecture. It's all theory 00:30:39.759 --> 00:30:43.000 crap, whatever. All that stuff. It's cool stuff. 00:30:43.079 --> 00:30:45.599 Thank you for inviting me. Thanks for joining 00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:47.660 us. We definitely appreciate you taking the time 00:30:47.660 --> 00:30:50.859 out of your... You could be grading some stuff, 00:30:50.980 --> 00:30:52.920 but you're here with us instead. I'm pretty much 00:30:52.920 --> 00:30:56.119 halfway to solving world hunger, but now I'm 00:30:56.119 --> 00:30:59.220 a little bit behind. 30 minutes behind. No big 00:30:59.220 --> 00:31:01.759 deal. All right. Thank you, Joe. Thank you, listeners. 00:31:02.119 --> 00:31:17.059 All right. Yeah, thanks, everyone. Thank you 00:31:17.059 --> 00:31:19.019 for tuning in to this episode of the English 00:31:19.019 --> 00:31:22.440 101 Experiment. Special thanks to Christopher 00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:25.119 Nicotera, instructor of music business at Delgado 00:31:25.119 --> 00:31:27.240 Community College, for his recording assistance. 00:31:28.299 --> 00:31:31.420 All music heard during this episode comes from 00:31:31.420 --> 00:31:34.960 the free music archive. Specific titles and artists 00:31:34.960 --> 00:31:38.079 are listed on the English 101 Experiment website.