Breaking free from the chains of the past Where
truth moves faster than a Holstein calf No law
waiting on some printed page We're charting new
ground in the digital age From genomic codes
to robot facts We cut through the noise, no hold
them back not your daddy's dairy news tonight
we're sparking That was Dr. Jeremy Hill, Fonterra's
chief science and technology officer and author
of the book Legendary. If dairy was invented
today by some agri -tech startup, it would be
seen as the greatest blockbuster in the history
of food. Hill said that. And the data backs him
up. The full written feature is live now on thebullvine
.com with the complete... DIAAS Protein Quality
Table, the demand numbers from CoBank, and the
new U .S. Dietary Guidelines, and what all of
this means for your operation. If you think the
dairy industry needs to get louder about its
own protein quality story, share this episode
with your MP, your congressman, or the next person
who tells you oat milk is just as good. Whole
milk scores 108. Oat scores 44. That's not a
gap. That's a canyon. This is the bullvine. Cool.
So let's begin with you've described the moment
you chose dairy science over continuing a medical
research or simply turning right instead of left
at Massey University. Take me back to the crossroads.
What was actually going through your mind? What
did you see in dairy that you didn't see in medicine?
And why did you choose dairy? Well, in reality.
I started my first postdoc for the dairy industry
in the UK. So I did my PhD in the UK in medical
research. But I had a year -long honours project
while I was doing my degree, which looked at
the use of Candida cavatidae, which is an indigenous
yeast, and trying to modify that yeast using...
various stone age techniques compared to today
so that it would produce a fat profile more similar
to cocoa butter using whey as a growth feedstock,
right? And when I finished my PhD, the department
I did my PhD in mainly did microbial biotechnology
and biochemistry. The lab I did my PhD in was
a bit of an exception in doing medical research.
So the head of the department said, hey, we've
got this postdoc we'd like you to do. And it's
based on your honest project. So I. I agree to
do that. And that was my first foray into the
New Zealand dairy industry. And it's essentially
a forerunner of what you call precision fermentation
today. Although, you know, obviously with, you
know, techniques that were 20 or 30 years ago,
the. That gave me a bit of knowledge of the dairy
industry, but to be quite frank, I saw that as
just a temporary gig before I would move back
into medical research and then went in pursuit
doing other postdocs, basically looking at this
area I specialised in, which was the impact of
a particular drug on the enzymes involved in
the. degradation of alcohol in the liver. Anyway,
that took me to Massey University, still doing
the liver research, which happens to be across
the road from what has become the Fonterra Research
and Development Centre. So that road is, you
turn right to go to the Fonterra Research and
Development Centre and left to go to Massey University.
Now, when I was at Massey, the Fonterra Research
and Development Centre had a lot more equipment.
the Massey University that I could utilise because
of my relationships, actually the strong relationship
between Massey and the centre anyway, but certainly
the history I had with the dairy industry at
that point. And so I went over there to use some
of the equipment for my own research that I was
doing at Massey. And I had coffees with people,
got to know people a lot better. And the head
of the protein chemistry department said, hey.
We've got a job in a scientist role in protein
chemistry. Would you be interested in it? Well,
my postdoc was coming to an end at that point.
And my wife had got a temporary teaching job
in a museum at the time. Well, we'll give it
another couple of years because we quite like
the lifestyle. And I thought the projects looked
interesting. I thought I'd learned some new things.
But again, with the intention of eventually going
back into medical research. i think 35 36 years
later i've probably uh i've become a dairy person
um and it and it really you know turning right
was absolutely the right thing to do for me because
i have learned so much at the opportunities to
be involved in so much meaningful work through
doing that uh progressed out of research into
into research leadership and then executive research
and science leadership and not just with Fonterra,
but obviously getting some opportunities on a
global basis as well. Now, you mentioned about
the studying of the biochemistry with the function
in the liver and the function in disease. How
do you feel that that has affected or changed
or you bring a different perspective to dairy?
Instead of saying, hey, it's a commodity, it's
this, you come at it with a different lens. How
has that affected your career? How do you feel
that's helped? Although I'm very fortunate to
have worked in a very broad range of areas that
lets me look at opportunities and problems through
a number of lenses. And I think that's some of
the value I bring, but also a privilege that
I've had to do that. And that includes looking
at the things with that, if you want, biochemical
or medical -facing lens. And again, it... you
know the dairy is the world's number one commodity
by value so there's no question about that but
it's also the number one source of a wide range
of nutrients which you know we we've published
widely on and it's also got a lot of bioactive
you know compounds you know for example lactoferrin
which has got you know antiviral antibacterial
immune stimulatory gut development and so on
and so forth And when I say to people, we shouldn't
be surprised at this because 60 million years
of evolution has evolved this food to be the
sole source of food when we're at most vulnerable
from a developmental perspective of body, mind
and everything. So it shouldn't be surprising,
right? That it's full of these great nutrients
and bioactivities. And you mentioned that, and
you mentioned I go through and in doing the homework
here, I see a lot of achievements that you've
achieved over the years in a few different areas.
But when you look back at your career, you look
at what you've been able to achieve, what would
you say is the one that you would say that you
most want to be remembered for or you feel is
the most impactful of the achievements you've
been able to do while working in different groups
and aspects? It's actually the people. So, you
know, I've achieved quite a lot in terms of the
things that I've been associated with. Quite
frankly, I've had a big hand in some of them,
less in others. It's always a team effort these
days in most things you do. But the real legacy
is the impact that you've had on the people and
perhaps the way they're thinking in the future.
My son, when he was young, said to me, he was
a really, really good swimmer. I mean, setting
New Zealand records and numerous titles. And
he was only in his mid -teens, perhaps 14 or
15. He said to me, you know, Dad, he said, all
the sports people have forgotten, he said, but
those scientists that have something named after
them, they're remembered. I thought, oh, my goodness,
he wants to be Dalton or Newton or Kelvin. And
I thought, wow, what a mature thing to say. Now,
joking aside, he's actually now graduated with
two degrees. He's got a degree in biotechnology
and a degree in chemical engineering. So I'm
going to have to leave it to him if there's ever
going to be a unit called a hill. But I do, my
cheeks swell up when I think about what that
might be, because if innovation... is a little
bit of inspiration followed by a lot of perspiration,
which quite frankly it is, then perhaps a unit
of hill could be their level of perspiration
associated with innovating. Just like your family,
your son or your kids, your biggest legacy is
what you leave, the impact that you have on the
people, right? Proud of what I've done in milk,
proud of what I've done in manufacturing products,
food safety, insurance, etc. But quite frankly,
at the end of the day, those are the biggest
impacts anybody can have. Technology patents
fundamentally changed quick service and fast
food industry sources products. What would you
say helped? I'm reading, as I said. How has that
changed the artisan cheese? I've got to make
a note of the time because I've got to make an
edit because I'm humbled. Some would say you've
turned artisan cheese craft into material science.
How would you respond to those? How would you
respond to those? That it's not a loss, but rather
a gain. Okay. It's not the first time I've been
asked a similar question. So Ontario's work on
cheese technology and turning that as much into
a science based on fundamental principles as
an art or an artisan approach is important because
we can produce consistent, safe product doing
that. That provides choice to consumers to buy
that product. it doesn't stop them buying artisan
produced cheese right they've still got the choice
of doing that right so at the end of the day
i think we added to the capability of the world
in cheese and certainly we exploited right but
at the end of the day people you know we've not
forced others to use our technology in fact we
don't for some of it it's it's our trade secrets
as well as our patents right so it's not necessarily
something others can use uh they can use their
own technology and of course it comes down to
choice So I don't think we've forced the world
to adopt our technology at all. Right. We think
it's brought some great advantages, both for,
you know, efficiency of manufacture, consistency
of manufacture, safety of manufacture, but also,
you know, consumer choice. Now, you mentioned
and you said earlier about some of the work you've
done outside of Fonterra. One of the neat things.
I saw was that you were one of the first or I
think even the only IDF president from New Zealand.
And so it's kind of neat. But in looking in some
of the stuff you did with IDF, I noticed the
DIAS protein quality standard that you helped
champion while you're there. A lot of people
kind of credit that for the greatest tool against
plant based competitors. it's been described
as saying you didn't win the war the nutrition
war you helped change the battlefield um in doing
that what was the strategy from the beginning
how do you respond to the charge that the timing
uh or how do you respond to what it did and the
timing of it and what it's contributed so um
i think it it it's rather convenient that it's
available as the plant -based movement had started
to take off and alternatives etc but actually
the work started 15 to 20 years ago so it was
so it's not something that is sort of being cooked
up or delivered you know in a short period of
time it's involved a lot of work right and it's
it's something that uh we supported through a
partnership with the riddett institute at massey
university uh that we made part of a big program
of work that we did as part of the public private
partnership with the new zealand government called
the primary growth partnership which developed
it further we then uh sponsored it into the global
dairy platform to globalize this uh approach
And it requires a lot of work because you've
got to for it to be credible. It can't just be
this is how it works with milk. You have to do
it across different sources of food and you have
to move it from, you know, if you want animal
models into into confirm that it works from a
human nutrition perspective, et cetera, et cetera.
That takes a lot of time. It's also expensive.
It's something you do in collaboration with not
just the rest of the global dairy sector, but
what you would do with the food industry overall.
That took a lot of time. So really, the timing
of its arrival and being able to be used to to
provide a more accurate assessment of the quality
of at least the protein component that is in
is in foods and that that. is useful today is
is is not that it was planned to be available
today it's actually evolved over a very long
period of time through quality science discussions
with the food and agricultural organization of
the un etc another key topic is sustainability
uh one of the key parts of that is methane methane
vaccines and i read a quarter you were saying
that how methane vaccines are a game changer
for our industries but some people are critical
of the vaccines and the effect that they will
have what are your comments or how do you answer
the charge that this is a beneficial progress
versus a bigger issue for the industry um well
the advantage of a vaccine is its ubiquity of
use so um Many of the other solutions may be
more specific to a species or a particular farming
system. So they're very context specific. So
the vaccine has the potential to work across
different ruminant species. So if you think in
dry stock as well as dairy, it also has the opportunity,
you know, the potential to work in, you know,
scaled farming systems. So, you know, the, you
know, the big. scale pasture systems that we
have here in New Zealand or even dry stock based,
you know, containment systems elsewhere in the
world. I mean, but it can work in smallholder
systems and there's very, very few solutions
for smallholders, you know. As you're probably
aware, one of the big vaccine, animal vaccine
developing entities is in India and sponsored
through the Indian, National Indian Dairy Development
Body. uh you know i i see that as as why a vaccine
has a powerful potential probably not the only
tool right we we may need a number of tools to
stack them and of course in concert with practice
improvements um but i i think that the root of
this though is is is something else i'm particularly
passionate about is is the role of dairy and
nutrition and the fact that it plays such an
important role nutritionally in society Also,
in terms of economics and livelihoods, and, you
know, not my figures, you know, when we did the
Dairy Declaration of Rotterdam, the figures from
FAO that there's probably a billion livelihoods
supported to a large extent globally by dairy.
I mean, that's huge. But also, you know, it's
the number one source of half a dozen nutrients
in our diet, essential nutrients, right, not
ones that can be replaced. uh it's in the um
top five for um or of the modeling work i've
been involved in involving you know dozens of
nutrients it's in the top five for 20 to 30 of
them so this this has a disproportionate contribution
to nutrition it's really interesting that when
i i wrote my book legendary i did a bit of background
work and there was a paper in the 1800s by a
gentleman called lancaster and he talked about
the role that milk played in society and it's
it's you know um it's like a modern read And,
you know, 150 years later, we published a paper
on when we analyse the role of dairy in the global
food system that really echoes those points made
by Lancaster. You know, so over those 150 or
more years, it's continued to sort of have that
role. Now, it's not a role we can take for granted,
though, right? We need to be improving. And that's
certainly something I've been a strong advocate
for. but you've got to recognize the role and
with that the fact that we need to recognize
the importance of the dairy sector the importance
for it to improve including environmental performance
and therefore we do need practice improvements
but we only also need techn technological fixes
where they can step change what we do and you
know whether it's whether it's a vaccine or some
of the other solutions i I think I would be a
strong advocate that we need those in order to
enable dairy to continue to play the role it
plays in society. And in that Rotterdam Declaration,
you frame dairy as an essential component to
nutrition. And with that, there's both the scientific
significance of that, but also kind of the political
or the perception significance of that. Why do
you think it was important to get that message
out there? And what do you believe that true
message is? So it's important that we, you know,
we're in a world. Why? I think that why would
we do that? The world's bombarded with messages
these days, particularly with social media. And,
you know, it's changed from, you know, it's changed
from when I first started communicating, you
know. And therefore, it is always important to
keep the broader context in the headlights, right?
And the Dairy Declaration of Rotterdam was a
step towards that. It's not the end of the process,
right? We need to continually do this. But it
was an important recognition. And it wasn't a
self -declaration. It was a joint declaration
with the UN, which was very important, right?
So having the statistics that are associated
with the dairy declaration essentially vetted
and committed to by the UN agency was an important
part of this process. And it's the context for
improvement. It's not a commitment. It's a declaration
on the role that dairy plays and therefore why
it is important to consider how we improve it.
And another aspect of this is some people would
argue dairy is optional. individuals can manage
without dairy I would argue the world will struggle
from a nutritional point of view and other points
of view and I am open to evidence that that might
not be the case but I need to see something that
has that can make a difference to that amount
of impact within a practical time frame with
practical solutions and I've yet to see that
One of the things, the key subject that we've
come across a few times is the feeding the world
or feeding the world with efficient proteins.
And obviously, dairy is an efficient protein.
And there's a lot of people who will highlight
the alternatives. And they say that these are
a better option to feed the world. But one of
the key things I think comes up, and I would
be interested to see your perspective on this,
They may, I say may, offer similar nutritional
values, but I really don't think they offer the
same efficiency of protein production as dairy
does. And how efficiently we can help feed people
is kind of one of the biggest challenges this
world faces. And I think dairy will have a key
part in that. And I wonder how you see that happening
and why you would say it is key. Absolutely.
First, though, I think it's really important.
I actually gave a keynote. address at the international
union of food science and technology on this
topic it's called narratives for nutrition it
was in october 22 in singapore and the and the
point of my talk was this protein is super important
right it's it's uh we can't you know uh we synthesize
proteins in our body but we can't synthesize
10 of the 20 amino acids right so we have to
consume protein in order to get the essential
amino acids you know we can synthesize A lot
of other things that we obviously can't synthesize
vitamins. That's why they vital. Right. So you've
got to think of the essential amino acids in
protein in the same way that you consider, you
know, vitamins. Right. If you don't have them.
And also the most limiting one limits protein
synthesis. When you run out of one, you can't
make protein because that one can't be present.
And therefore you can't you can't make proteins.
But we need dozens of nutrients. Right. And so
the reason dairy is so powerful and again, pointing
out to the fact that it is the sole source of
nutrition when we're most vulnerable from a developmental
point of view. So we shouldn't be surprised it's
full of all this great stuff, including the quality
of protein. But I said, as I said, in narratives
for nutrition, it's naive to look at nutrition
with just a protein paradigm. Right. It is much
more than that. And the value of dairy is is
the great protein and what comes with it. Right.
you've got all the other nutrition right and
so dairy protein on its own is great but the
source of that dairy protein and the other nutrients
are very important as well and quite frankly
we try not to throw anything away it's valuable
so even if we're making proteins we're trying
to you know make the most out of the rest of
the um the milk that we produce etc so So that's
the important point. And then that also ties
down to what we discussed previously. Protein
is not all the same. The quality of protein relates
to how many of those essential amino acids, those
we can't synthesize in our body, are present
in the protein and in what ratios, right? And
dairy is a fantastic balance of those things.
Again, we shouldn't be surprised because we wouldn't
grow and develop. it wasn't right because that's
all we're getting at that stage of life um and
of course we shouldn't be surprised that meat
is actually a super source of protein for muscle
because at the end of the day it is muscle right
but dairy is produced as food meat's actually
produced as a muscle and only becomes food when
it doesn't move fast enough if i can but no but
the point is um We do need meat. Meat's a rich
source of zinc and iron and so on and so forth,
the appropriate quantity. But I would also emphasize
we need plant -based sources of nutrients. They're
really valuable. You're not going to get high
quantities of fiber. You're not going to get
vitamin C out of animal sources. And when you
look at the global production, and I'm on record
saying this many times, essentially it's already
plant -based and animal optimized, right? We
can do a lot more. It needs to be a lot better.
But 75 percent of what's consumed globally is
plant based material. Twenty five percent is
animal. Right. And the animal nutrition is important.
And dairy has this particularly important role,
again, which I've discussed at length in various
forums and publications. One of the things I'd
be interested to get your perspective on is in
our world or in my world, we talk a lot about
production efficiency. How do you produce more
milk cheaper because the industry? It seems to
be at a race to zero is a lot of the discussion
or who can produce it the cheapest. But I don't
think we talk enough about how can we grow the
dairy market? How do we like take lessons from
other industries or what your perspective would
be? How can we grow consumption, not just fluid
milk? What do you see as the future of how we
can actually increase the amount of? dairy -based
protein consumption uh what innovation do you
see that way or where do you see that heading
or how can we do that well we're in a bit of
a sweet spot at the moment because that the you
know protein demands there is a protein trend
and it's it's not a basing right and and dairy
is is is benefiting it hugely from from that
i mean uh i mean as you'd be well aware cottage
cheese just exploded in in the u .s because you
know But also protein as an ingredient going
into a whole range of foods is, you know, the
demand is enormous at the moment. So we are benefiting
from that. And look, you know, this is what gives
me optimism about, you know, the future of the
sector. And, you know, I think there's a better
recognition of protein nutrition. and the importance
of protein nutrition and it's this the second
thing is is uh dairy and high quality protein
including the other and the other dairy components
as i mentioned in that talk i gave in in singapore
and in singapore the trend hadn't really taken
off but it has now so so the glp -1 effect um
this could be important as well because people
now if we're going to eat less than nutrient
density and richness quality of the diets becomes
really important right so again i think that's
that's that's uh uh something that we um we won't
necessarily get by right but i also think there
is there is a right for dairy in that space and
a big one so i i see that as a an important thing
as for production um it's actually quite staggering
if you look back at um i mean Always room for
improvement on how we do it and where we do it
and all of those things. But if you look at what's
happened in the US over the last. So if you look
forward 30 years, a good way of looking forward
at what might happen from a productivity point
of view is to look back 30. Right. And, you know,
I know you can go back 100 years and look at
what was happening in New Zealand and the US.
And there's staggering figures. But if you just
look back 30 years. And I'll do it in milk solids
because that's what we do in New Zealand. If
you look in the U .S., the U .S. has actually
increased milk solids per cow from 1990 through
to 2020 by 72 percent. And we've done 60 percent
plus in New Zealand. Right now, that gives me
some hope, actually, you know, that, you know,
so this efficiency, you know, the cow's inefficient.
Well, the cow's efficiency has certainly. or
productivity per cow obviously it's got to have
inputs but that's you know it's certainly not
topped out um and so you know with demand side
or with production side if you look at the extremes
you know milk how do we produce more of it you
know more concentrates more more solids on the
other side what's what do we think might happen
with demand Dairy is looking pretty good. It's
not something that we should sit back and take
as a given. I think we need to make sure we work
hard to realize that. But it looks pretty good.
One of the neat things I think I find when we
look into it and we've learned more and we're
doing obviously so much more research into it
is the correlation between sustainability and
the efficiency of production and how the emissions
that come from cows. Absolutely. Yeah. High producing.
And I mean, when I mean high producing, I mean
a high producing component cow is also a high
efficiency from a methane and emissions. So the
correlation speaks very well about what we could
do because the goals think with each other, we
can be more sustainable and we can produce that.
And I think when you look at it, as you pointed
out, the, sheer mass improvement on the component
-based production. Yeah, maybe the cows aren't
still producing. The speed of which we're increasing
production maybe isn't there, but if you look
at on the kilos of fluids, but if you do it on
components, you see that, holy smokes, we're
still making, and you'll see that, and I think
you know better than I do, that the payment system
to farmers is showing more of that now. I think
you guys are a little ahead of us there. In North
America, especially in the U .S., it's a little
behind on that. It's coming quickly. Canada,
because our system is different, we're ahead
on it a little bit. But that is where the biggest
change is coming to. I see it as the industry
is paid by components, not paid by fluid milk.
Absolutely. Of course, that's a financial driver.
But let's turn it around to societal contribution.
It is the components or the concentration of
those components that is the nutrition. So, you
know, so we're increasing nutritional efficiency
with that productivity as well. Yeah. And I think
you correlate it there and you talk about the
Ozempic or whatever ones you want to talk about,
the JLP ones, and the correlation to cottage
cheese increase. And I think we just have to
look at our industry different. Don't measure
it by how many glasses of milk. as a person consuming
look at it on as a hey as a dairy protein source
how much are we are of the market share or of
the nutritional value and i think that's where
the big future is yeah and and actually milk's
bounced back a bit even as a even on a you know
milk itself but but again you're absolutely right
i think we've got to look at dairy are we getting
dairy nutrition and it you know and that's the
great thing about dairy it's utility right There's
very few things can go into so many different
tasty consumer acceptable formats, even as dairy
is a category. And then, of course, you've got
the opportunity to pull out the ingredients and
the functionality of those new ingredients. Again,
a feature I talk about in the book. Right. One
of the great sweet spots of dairy is its utility.
Right. Its ability to go into so many different
foods and have an important role. nutritionally
and functional from physical functional performance
um you know i i finished the book by saying if
dairy was invented today by some agri -tech starter
it will be this seen as the greatest blockbuster
in the history of food i deal in my outside of
this i deal in the tech world and when they talk
about this creating synthetic dairy or fermentation
of dairy and stuff i always i see how much money
is going into that. And I'm like, we already
have almost the perfect system and yet all this
money is going because it's new and trendy. But
dairy is already doing all that at a much more
efficient rate. Well, it's hard to beat the efficiency
of the mammary epithelial cells, which is actually
a small part of the bovine udder in the amount
of just in protein, of course, they're producing
all the other milk components. But those things
are producing their weight in protein, you know,
every day, right, that they're pumping out. But
I do think there is a role for the alternatives
as well. Right. So, you know, again, it's public
record that I've been involved in this area and
I'm deeply involved. And of course, it goes by
ironically to decades ago when I first had a
foray into the dairy industry when I was still
in the UK. But it's going to be complementary.
It's not going. So as long as we've got this
protein demand out there and I think there is
a complementary role that. the uh alternatives
can play right um and uh but i um i do not um
i do not believe and i haven't seen the evidence
that this uh technology will disrupt the dairy
industry right i i just don't believe that even
though we're you know heavily involved in it
so we see it playing a nice complementary role
um and it's got some improvements to make even
to get to that stage quite frankly but that's
that's where it will play it's it's not going
to supersede or replace dairy and in this in
this world of demand that we're looking at that
we discussed previously i think it can have a
role to play and you talk about looking back
to look forward if we look at the alternatives
that we're supposed to change our industry on
some of the alternatives that have been in market
for 10 15 20 years and yet i think it fits that
model you're saying of They've complimented.
They haven't changed it, but they become a nice
compliment or an alternative for certain circumstances.
But they haven't taken it and taken over. Absolutely.
And this is a food industry. So that Lancaster
article I talked about in the 1800s is actually
about sweetened condensed milk. And which was
one of the few ways they could preserve it back
then. Right. And so, you know, we're talking
about. When we were first trying to preserve
milk through various methods, and again, I'll
cover a little bit of a history of that because
it's so critical to the long -term development
of the dairy sector. But the key thing is, swing
condensed milk is still on the supermarket shelves.
I don't know what software I was using 20 years
ago, but it ain't available now. It's not the
same, right? And I would also say a lot more
sweetened condensed milk is sold today than it
was in the 1800s when they were producing it.
Well, that's what I was going to say. If you
look at it, there are certain cultures and some
of them, one of them is like the Indian culture.
It's a staple in there and it's a growing population.
Like we're not like it's decreasing. It's actually
increasing good on total volume of consumption.
Yeah. I mean, that's the other thing is. You've
got to look at the, you know, the traditional
countries that have had dairy and then those
countries that have taken on dairy that weren't
traditional, you know. So and look, Japan doesn't
have the consumption of Iceland, for example.
But if the rest of Asia got to Japan, right,
if China got to the level of consumption in Japan,
the demand is just unbelievably high, right,
because it's just population based across the
rest of Asia. and so on india of course has been
a traditionally high consumer of dairy and producer
of dairy is the world's biggest producer of dairy
um you know well over 150 billion i know it's
hard to say liters produced in india in a very
different i'll call it production system than
maybe New Zealanders or North Americans, I think,
when you consider the average herd size and the
logistic challenges, and yet they produce more
milk with much more logistic challenges than
we could ever imagine. But they've got a system
that works, and it's a key part of the diet.
So we're proud of our 8 ,000 -plus cooperative
shareholders in Fonterra. We're a cooperative.
We're owned by farmers. And I used to know Mr.
Sodi. He's now no longer in the role. He was
the CEO of Ammo. And he says, well, yeah, I've
got 3 ,900 ,000. On daily pickup and not a few
big tankers. So, you know, so, yeah, just I think
I saw a statistic once that there was 70 million.
involved in smallholder dairying in India. So
you've spent your career kind of at an interesting
intersection. You've had the science, you've
worked with Fonterra, and you've had the commerce,
and then you've worked with the policy side.
When you look at looking forward, and we talked
about looking forward 15, 20 years, what are
the key decisions or what are the key aspects
that we need to kind of think of now in order
to kind of be in the right position down the
road? What are the key issues you're seeing that
we kind of need to really think about? Well,
one of the key, I mean, essentially we discussed
it a little earlier. So productivity needs to
remain key, right? I mean, and that's just, that's
just, that's not just about providing more nutrition.
It's actually so that, you know, the cost, the
efficiency with which we can do that still means
that we can be a viable. part of the food sector
in the future right um and so uh if i was if
if i look out 30 years you know um i mean getting
to those 30 years is a different matter but if
i look at 30 years i think um uh productivity
sustainability are important. I'd like to think
that we've done an excellent job and we're not
constantly having to sort of re -justify why
dairy. But getting there, I think, Andrew, is
the bigger challenge through what could be quite
a turbulent period for economies, for production
systems. as we have to adapt to different demands,
different weather events, and so on and so forth.
So I think one of the things I see as critical
between where we are today and, you know, not
necessarily a rocket science future of productivity.
And yes, there might be lots of different ways
in which we're producing products and justifying
the nutritional benefits and so on. But fundamentally,
the productivity and the sustainability of that
milk production is going to be key and the whole
chain for that matter. But resilience is going
to be a key feature of how we get there. Right.
So. Building resilient systems that enables us
to get to that future, I think is going to be
equally as important. As I say, there's some
lovely tailwinds. If you look at, you know, demand,
protein demand, if you look at, you know, certainly
the potential, it's not happened yet, but it's
certainly happening. Impact of G, you know, hot.
appetite suppression. I'll put it that way because
who knows what we'll be using for appetite suppression
in 10 or 15 or 20 years' time as well. It may
not be the current round of treatments. And actually,
you know, dairy components can have a GLP -1
effect. So it has been known for some time that
there's a satiety effect of dairy consumption,
right? So some of those things I think are going
to be interesting. But again, coming back to
the macro picture, I think great tailwinds, very
bright future, got to keep that focus on productivity
and sustainability, but resilience is going to
be so important as we go through that process.
The plant protein lobby pushed for a rule change
that would have cut billions from milk payments
worldwide. One scientist stopped it. Most producers
have never heard his name. This is The Bullvine.
Today you're going to hear directly from Dr.
Jeremy Hill. He's Fonterra's chief science and
technology officer, the only New Zealander to
ever lead the International Dairy Federation,
and the man behind the protein quality standard
that is now dairy's strongest weapon against
plant -based competitors. Hill spent 35 years
turning a temporary research gig into the science
behind your component premiums. He rewrote how
protein quality is measured globally, fought
off attempts to rig how your milk protein is
counted, and built the case that dairy is the
most nutritionally dense food on Earth. He was
supposed to go back to medical research. He was
studying liver enzymes. Instead, he turned right
instead of left on a road in Palmerston North,
New Zealand.