Creeping across the pasture land. Got dirt on
the boots and a working hand. From the milk house
home to the auction call. These are the folks
standing strong and tall. Yeah, this is... Welcome
to the Bullvine Podcast, where we cut through
the milk check noise to what actually pays on
registered dairy farms. Today's episode is something
special, the complete audio from the Pennsylvania
Holstein Association's Market Like a Pro panel
at their recent convention. Huge thanks to PHA
for hosting this live stream session. They're
doing great work supporting Holstein breeders
across the state. Moderated by cattle sales veteran
Chris Hill of MD Hillbrook Sales, you'll hear
straight talk from four powerhouse marketers.
Jenny Thomas of Triple T Holsteins in Ohio, the
35 -cow operation that's boarding showstrings
and running sales. Betsy Bullard of Bragging
Farms in Maine, 10th generation with nearly 600
cows and Holstein Association members since 1943.
Alicia Lamb of Oakfield Corners Dairy in New
York. the 11 ,000 -cow team flushing 8 ,000 embryos
a year while making artisanal cheese. Peter Dupengeesser
of Ransom Rail Farm in New York, now ST Genetics'
Eastern U .S. sales manager, with partnerships
keeping him in more registered cows than ever.
They tackle the real questions, consigner expectations,
selling your best calf, adapting to cow buyer
and COVID, and how to turn registration papers
into revenue when milk's at $16 .65. Stick around.
This is gold for anyone with registered Holsteins,
from 35 head family ops to 11 ,000 cow teams.
Let's jump in. Well, I guess we've got two New
Yorkers, a Maine, an Ohio, and a Marylander,
so they're going to educate us a little bit here.
But we've got some questions to go through that
we already sort of prepared, but then there's
going to be plenty of time for you to ask questions.
So, Flash, I'll turn it over to you. Then later
we're going to have a really cool sale, so stick
around for that. Yeah, that's my speed, so if
I fumble here a little bit, don't get upset with
me. First of all, I'd like to commend PHA and
David for putting on this little roundtable of
marketing and merchandising. And I think we have
not only four very, very knowledgeable couples
and slashing people, but only one of them has
come up here. I understand some of the guys haven't
stayed at home because of the weather, which
is natural. And you've got to run a big period.
You've got to do it. But it is an honor and a
privilege to be up here with these people. I've
not only known them for most of my life, I've
worked for each and every one of them in some
aspect or another. So before we start, and let
me close, I'd like you to give these folks a
round of applause for taking time to come and
share their experience with us. When David first
asked me to do this, I was a little bit hesitant
because public speaking is really not my thing
unless it involves numbers and going really fast.
So it is an honor and a privilege. And most of
you know me. My name is Chris Hill from MD Hillbrook
Sales. And my wife, Jen, and I have a small select
group of heifers. And we buy, we sell, we buy
private, we buy public. We sell semen for Blondin.
My wife is very involved in her home farm in
which we raise heifers now. They did sell their
cows, and we have several heifers there for Jovo,
joining her family, that we raise for them, and
that's going really good. And most of all in
my life, the best thing I have is my wife and
my in -laws, who do a lot for me, and I'm just
very, very appreciative for all they do. With
that said, going from this side to the other,
from Trinity Holstein's in North Lear, North
Spurgo, Ohio, we have Miss Jenny Thomas. She'll
be with us. They're involved in millions and
millions of different avenues of marketing, different
breeds. Jenny's a photographer, does a great
job of civil fisher photography. I think that's
getting less day by day, but she still takes
beautiful pictures. They're very, very involved
with their children. They have three wonderful
children who I know you've seen at the shows,
but not only at home. They're very, very involved
with sports and very good at what they do. But
yet they have time to do chores and have family
time and do very well. Next up is Ms. Betsy Bullard
from Turner, Maine. Back when I was a fitter,
I used to go work the mainstay sale, and they
would sponsor every year. Since that time, They've
added a lot of cows. They've gotten big. I think
they have more mouths to feed now. And her and
her husband do a wonderful job managing Bergeen
Farms. And they have avenues off the farm as
well, have kids that are very, very interested.
And then next in line is Miss Alicia Lamb. Her
and Jonathan manage, along with other family
members, his brother and another partner, Oak
Hill Corners Dairy. And if it's got something
to do with dairy, beef, cheese, Wagyu, they do
it. Basically, they do it all. They do a darn
good job of it. They have a sale coming up, which
is just a short time away. And we appreciate
Alicia being here again. She has her son with
her. She has a son and a daughter. They have
many children running around there, be it from
Kirk, Jonathan, or other members of the family
that are very interested in showing and do a
very good job. Then we have Pete Dupegeiser,
the lone man with me up here. Pete is here with
his wife, Roxanne, from Ransom Rail Farm in Perry,
New York. Pete and his wife and boys, they did
sell out several years ago, but they're still
very active in the dairy industry. They spent
a short time in Wisconsin. Now they're back in
western New York. Their son, Jared, I believe,
is back in western New York, and Jay gets down
there in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. He'll
tell you a little bit about them later. So before
we go any further, I'm going to have each and
one of them, we're going to have several steps
of this conversation. I'm going to go to each
and every one. They're going to explain a little
bit about what they do, how they do it, what
aspects of the dairy business that they're in.
And then we're going to go to step number two.
I have several questions I'm going to ask, and
they're going to answer to the best of their
ability. Then I'll conclude with my portion of
it to a question that, that has something to
do with each and every one of them's marketing
program. And then we'll take questions from Facebook
Live and from the crowd. So without further ado,
this is Ms. Jenny Thomas. She's going to tell
you a little bit about Triple T Holsteins. Thank
you, Jenny. Go ahead. Well, Triple T Holsteins
is a... Our family dairy farm in North Lewisburg,
Ohio. My husband, his brother, and his father,
they founded the farm themselves. It's for coming
up on 20 years of milking there in North Lewisburg.
It wasn't an existing dairy farm. They pretty
much bought a, they were milking cows with a
bucket milker and a heifer barn, but decided
they wanted to expand and build. Went to an auction,
bought a standing building for $3 ,000, tore
it down, moved it to North Lewisburg and put
it up. And it was a weekend project to get that
thing going. So to say it was started from scratch,
that is for sure one of those things. As time's
gone on, we keep trying to continue to build
more buildings and make it more, I guess, our
home what it is today. But it all started with
what we call kind of a 4 -H project gone astray.
And so it's kind of spiraled out of control from
there. Right now we're milking about 35 head
of registered pool scenes jerseys. We do board
the, the era show string at our farm as well.
And that's become a really nice partnership that
we have with them. We've always, that's how Nathan
kind of got started. I guess I'll speak on his
behalf, but he started buying and selling cattle
when he was a fitter. He would try to find one
kind of a diamond in the rough. And, polish it
and and try to resell and it was just that slowly
you know making a thousand dollars here two thousand
there what evolved and kind of grew into where
he is today and what the farm is today um we
were able to kind of afford to you know buy a
couple cornerstones like the dam of page um that's
put us on the map and that's kind of where that
came from um as things kind of went on and we
continued to develop and milk cows and the page
family started doing a lot of great things for
us our good friend michael heath um we decided
to have a start a sale and do a sale with him
and that was the first triple t and uh best triple
t and heat sale that we had and that turned into
a series and then um we kind of just had an annual
sale we managed a couple sales for some friends
but then after that uh after we lost michael
We wanted to continue doing it. We felt there
was a need for it, especially in the Jersey breed
and the Holstein side as well. So we've continued
on and kind of evolved to the Thomas marketing
and consulting and managing some sales, like
the Amplify sale at the Air Dairy and working
with Aaron Eaton out of New York to do the Spring
Select sale for our second year and then continuing
on our Triple T sale as well. There's been lots
of different avenues and things that have kind
of evolved over the last 20 years, but it's definitely
been a team effort on everybody's behalf, not
only just Nathan and mine, but also our family.
Thank you, Jenny. Moving on to Betsy. All right,
I guess it's my turn now. bringing farms is located
in turner maine which is sort of our from here
and everything else as it turns out the farm's
been in existence since 1777 so my husband bill
and i are the 10th generation to farm there he's
not from a farm which is great it's like hybrid
vigor for our kids so if you've met either of
them that will make lots of sense uh bringing
farms has been a member of the Holstein Association
USA for 83 years. So, you know, there's a, you
talk about genetics, there's definitely a genetic
component to, to our business. I'd like the,
I don't know, my grandfather loved registered
Holsteins, got into registered Holsteins. My
parents continued that. My dad spent some time
as a fitter as well. I was reading one of Ron
Hughes' books the other day. He had interviews
that Doug Blair did with some folks like Lowell
Lindsay, and there was one with Dave Younger,
which was fascinating and amusing. And he talked
about Steve Briggs and his fluffy clipping on
the animals in a sale they did in California.
So that was kind of the world that I was immersed
in growing up. Our farm has changed over time.
Milking about 60 when my husband and I moved
up in 2000. We're milking, you know, just shy
of 600 mature cows right now. But cow families
and investing in great cow families, great maternal
lines, and then turning around and figuring out
what do we do with them from there. So that's
been a fun process that has certainly evolved
over time. So we'll enjoy chatting about that
as we go. Thank you, Betsy. Now to Alicia. Hi,
everyone. First of all, thanks for including
me in this panel. I think it's going to be a
lot of fun discussion here. I'm Alicia Lamb.
My husband is Jonathan Lamb. The Lamb family
has been involved in agriculture since they,
yes, emigrated from England back in the 1600s
or 1500s, whenever it was. So Jonathan and his
brother are 12th generation farmers here in the
United States. which is pretty incredible and
something that the Lamb family is very, very
proud of. They moved from where they landed in
Massachusetts out to western New York in the
1800s. I can't remember the exact year. And have
been farming in the St. John, Genesee County,
New York since that time. So over the years,
they have very humble beginnings. Jonathan's
dad and grandfather owned about 50 cows. When
the state of New York, through a minute domain,
came through to purchase their property. So they
had to move. That's now a state park. They had
to move to where the farm is located now in 1965,
which is in Oakfield, New York. And it actually,
from the stories I've heard, it's been a great
thing because the land is so much better in Oakfield
than where they were previously. So it was a
great thing. They've expanded a lot since the
mid -60s. When Jonathan came back to the farm
after college, that was back in 1997, early 1998.
Wait, no. Late 1996, 1997, sorry. He came back
to the farm full -time, and a lot of expansion
occurred since that time. So we're currently
milking at four locations, three in western New
York and one in western Ohio. It's about 11 ,000
milking cows total. Obviously, with that many
cows, there's a lot of people involved, and we
really look at ourselves as a team. So we're
fortunate to have a lot of great people that
we work with. As far as our genetics program,
when I moved, I'm from Florida originally, and
I met this handsome young man when I was in college
and had these romantic visions of cows in New
York. Crazy reason I didn't realize that there
was snow and stuff like that. I'm learning extremely
hard this year after many, many years of being
in New York. But, yeah, so I moved to New York.
And back in the late 90s, we started up our genetics
program. Back in those days, embryo transfer
was kind of still in its infancy, I would say.
And you could buy embryos from, like, the best
joke house in the world for, like, $250. And
that was pretty cheap. And the one thing we were
really good at was making pregnancies and making
calves. So that's really how we got our start
with our genetics program. We would buy, like,
you know, embryos from Daughters of Black Rose
and Elegance at the time for next to nothing.
And we could get, you know, three or four or
half our calves from those cows. And, man, we
had a business going. You know, we could resell
those calves to 4 -H kids, to other breeders.
And that's really how we got our start in this.
than genomics did and so jonathan's dad always
had an interest in index cows and and we really
believed in the science behind genomics and and
started into that pretty heavy as well so currently
uh we blush mostly internally through transova
and i should say completely internally through
transova and mobitech and transfer about 8 ,000
embryos a year through those programs. About
95 % of those embryos are in deaths. So high
GTPI, high net merit cows, we're looking to make
the next great bull, the next great dam of a
great bull. And then about 4 % to 5 % of that
are show -type cattle, show -type embryos, I
should say. And then we do a few beef as well,
some semangas and Wagyu. About a year and a half,
two years ago, We started our Oakfield artisanal
business, just looking for ways to diversify,
I would say. And what better way to do that than
to make product on the farm, right? I don't know.
I'm sure a lot of you are doing that on the farm.
And holy cow, that's a whole different industry.
And it's been a very steep learning curve for
us. But it's been a lot of fun. So we make Mexican
-style artisanal cheeses. We make three of them
now. We just started up. a fourth venue which
Griffin's super excited about making some cheese
curds flavored cheese curds with our nice kind
of cheese so anyhow that's kind of my story we
do have a sale coming up we're going to talk
about marketing we'll get into that more and
more but thank you again for having me I really
appreciate it thank you Alicia now Pete and then
we'll start into some questions Thank you for
having me. I appreciate it and I'm really looking
forward to a good discussion. So I'm kind of
the odd guy here for probably more than one reason,
but we don't have a dairy anymore. Six, seven
years ago, we sold our dairy and moved to Wisconsin.
Both of our sons were working out there managing
large dairies. And so we moved out there, and
I took a job at that time with ST Genetics, working
in primarily Michigan, Indiana, and Wisconsin
with larger dairies. And then from there, moved
to a Central U .S. sales manager position. And
then when we moved back about a year and a half
ago, now I manage the East U .S. sales team for
ST Genetics. But our load for the registered
cow never changed. And we do it now through tremendous
partnerships. So we're just able to stay in the
business because we have six or eight partners.
And we're probably working with more cattle than
we were working with on the registered side.
I'm not going to say how many because my wife
is in the crowd, so I don't really want her to
know exactly. She did see the spreadsheet once,
and she said, I thought we were downsizing this,
and it's sex, semen, and embryo transfer. I'm
working on it, but it just doesn't allow it to
happen. But we're super blessed to work with
fantastic people, and I have to mention O -Source.
They're the ones we work with predominantly on
our best Showtime channel, and just fantastic
partners, and we love doing that. But we have
a couple different partners. Pennsylvania and
several in New York and a couple more even in
Wisconsin yet so it allows us to do what we do
and we all believe it needs to be a win -win
and as long as you have that the partnership
works out very well and it's allowed my sons
and I to continue in this business doing what
we love. Thank you, Pete. If you want to pass
the mic right back up to Miss Jenny, she's going
to be the first one every time. So everybody
has to follow in Jenny's footsteps. Now we're
going to do, I have six questions here. We're
going to ask each and every one of you to answer
that in a short but very informative answer.
And the first question is for you, Jenny. What
is the main approach to marketing your type of
cap? And what outlets do you use, etc.? Like
I would say, time. show, whatever, for my end
of the industry. I would say, obviously, I'd
probably sell them through myself, but I'm not
limited to selling them through other sales management
firms. We all get along. We're all one family.
We've got to work together in order for this
thing to go right. So, Jenny, here you go again.
What is your main approach to marketing your
type of cattle and what outlets do you use? Obviously,
we're into the show industry. We're into the
show type cattle, but also love good pedigrees,
good cow families. And I think it all translates.
But like I said before, we began the Triple T
and Heat sale. We've evolved that. We try to
consign a bulk of our young stock and young cows
and top consignments to our own sales. But we
also find a lot of value in marketing. throughout
the country and all the top sales. I think you
have to spread it around, get in different markets.
And like Chris said, you have to all be friends
and we all have to work together. You know, we
can sign in the sale tonight. We can sign to
Chris's sales. We can sign out to sales all over,
young group sales like the PA. Excuse me. The
PA, I can't say it because I'm a Ohio State fan.
But the youth sale there. It's the college sale.
It's the college sale. You just made your sale.
I know. I know. It was just struggling there.
But, yes, we try to, at all different levels.
And I think that we try to send our best, what
we have, to fit those different sales and those
different platforms. Yeah. Well, I'm not going
to struggle with any college needs or anything
like that. I try not to bias either of my kids.
So for us, it's been sort of interesting as we've
grown the herd over the last 25 years. I think
kind of the number of animals we've been marketing
has shifted over time. We have hosted several
sales at the farm, both... kind of earlier on
when we moved up there in 08 2010 2024 we hosted
another sale and and our goals are always to
sell those deep maternal lines and then really
appealing animals that we know are going to work
in in any sort of operation so that's that's
really been our focus whether we whether we're
calling them crossover cattle or you know certainly
that their current genetics their They're productive
genetics, but that's certainly what we strive
to do. I think over time as we kind of, I don't
want to say plateau on count numbers, but maybe
plateau for veins not on weight anywhere else.
Did I mention that earlier? So we have to get
a little bit more creative. Certainly we have
something in the sale here tonight, and we are
always cognizant of selling those best ones.
looking for the best opportunities to maximize
that value to us and making sure that we're selling
cattle that are going to be successful for somebody
else. I mean, there's nothing cooler than getting
that message that, hey, this one that we bought
as a calf is very good or, you know, she just
went excellent or she's got three daughters and
we couldn't be happier with them. So at the end
of the day, that's certainly what we strive to
do. Want me to read it again, Alicia? You got
it. I think I got it. So with our marketing program,
we have two distinct divisions, the index side
and the show side. So I'll start with our index
side. It used to be pretty easy to move some
index cows, especially when genomics hit and
numbers were high. You could sell and make some
really good money from those index cows. It's
not so easy anymore. There's a lot of restrictions
from studs out there. Our marketing primarily
on our index cattle is bulls going to stuff.
That's about it. We are able to sell some IVF
sessions from time to time. We do a few privately.
We've done a few in sales, not too many because
of the contract restrictions. So that's where
we are with our index animals. It's still obviously
a large portion of what we do, and it is still
financially successful. It's just different than
it used to be. Maybe not quite as fun as it used
to be back in the day, but it is what it is.
For the type side, things are pretty wide open,
how we're able to market those animals. We do
a lot privately. We sell a lot in sales, and
we have our own sale. We try to, like Jenny said,
make sure that we're putting the right type of
animals in the right type of sales, be it a college
sale. via the Pennsylvania Holstein sale or via
like a national convention type of sale. We try
to match those cattle to those markets. But yeah,
it's a lot of fun selling on head cattle. We
have a lot of fun making embryos and trying to
make that next best or great show cow or brood
cow for someone. The embryo market's pretty strong
right now. Chris and Tim have set up Bright Future
Sales and those embryos, we're able to sell those
very successfully in those types of sales. lots
of opportunity for those types called type animals
more appreciated about those markets yeah so
when we had our dairy we were very involved in
the index side of things as well but when you
don't have receipts that gets to be a tougher
tougher situation so we've kind of moved away
from that and uh we're more exclusively in the
type side of things And, you know, we, again,
with our partners, we were looking to fit the
right cattle to the right sale. But we, like
everybody else said, we want to sell our best.
We want cattle to go on and do very well for
people. And, you know, I remember when my boys
were young. Jared is the younger son. He was
probably eight or nine. And we had four sisters
to Robert Cameron. And somebody came in, and
we had sold a pick of one of those, and four
calves were there. And he said to me, he said,
yeah, they're going to pick the best one. And
I said, well, bud, they don't want your sick
cat. They want your best one, right? And so that
kind of stuck with them, right? You have to sell
your best. You have to sell what people want.
and hope they go on and do very well. We use
a lot of social media, not as well as we should,
but that's kind of our outlet. But we're looking
to sales all over the country and see where our
cattle are going to fit best and do well. Okay,
back to question number two for the panel. As
a consigner to an auction, what do you expect
from the sale manager? And number two. What can
you as a consigner do to ensure your animal sells
for market value or higher? What do you as a
consigner expect from the manager for your commission
paid? And what can you do to ensure your animal
brings what it should? That's a tricky question
because I see it from both sides here. But as
a consigner, you definitely want the sale management
to... give your animal or your consignment the
exposure it deserves and to relay that to the
potential customer as clearly and concisely and
as honestly as possible. As a consigner yourself,
I think you need to also assist with that. I
mean, we all are on social media. Most of us
are probably on social media. And I think you've
noticed probably the algorithms. You don't maybe
see things as much as what you used to. And there's
certain words you have to try to stay away from
so that you don't get lost in a feed and things
like that. But the more times that you can. share
or create your own posts to i guess help the
sale management get your animal out there i think
that's a good thing um i think you need to take
responsibility on your own um to also market
your animal and get it down there to the public
whether that be a print ad whether that be a
social media post um there's a lot of different
avenues that you can do um sale management always
tries to they have x amount of lots in the sale
and you're trying to get do the same job for
all of your consignors. So I understand that
and you want to get everybody out there. But
I think as a consigner, if you can step up and
do a little extra, that's going to only help
you in the end. Perfect. That's it. Yeah, I would
echo. I would echo all of that. I mean, certainly
expectations for sale management. I mean, you're
relying on their expertise to have created an
event that buyers are aware that it's happening
and that they're looking forward to it and they're
looking forward to whoever particular. a segment
of cattle, a particular quality of cattle. And
so as a consignor, you're relying on that. You're
relying on them to make sure that they're presenting
information in an accurate manner and certainly
in an easy -to -consume manner that you don't
have to wade through 82 pages of, geez, I don't
even know if that other record was a thing or
not. So that would be my expectations for sale
management. And really, you have a lot of responsibilities
as a consigner. I mean, if you are consistently
sending cattle to a sale that haven't seen a
halter before, haven't ever seen water before,
fitting crews remember that. Sale managers remember
that. And it's really important. It's really
important that you do your part. I mean, that
they're well -grown, that they're healthy, that
you've done everything you can do to build that
pedigree to the point where it's appealing to
a buyer. If you haven't done that work, then
it's really hard for the sales managers to do
their work. Yeah, I don't know that I have a
whole lot to add to what Betsy said, really.
One thing we try to do is take nice pictures.
And honestly, cell phones nowadays take really
good pictures and video. And so I try to do that
as much as I can. Get the poop balls off of them.
Clean them up a little bit just so they're not
nasty looking. Make them look presentable. But,
you know, doing a lot of that, putting it on
social media is a great thing. So Jamie, the
manager of our show, is doing it. He does a lot
of Snapchat. He'll direct that to a few people
that he knows might have interest in certain
animals. So anything that you can do as an designer
to promote yourself, promote your animals that
are selling, that's the best way to do it, I
think. As much as we love our sale managers,
Chris and Tim, they're wonderful. But anything
that you can do really is going to push that
to get the extra few hundred or thousand dollars
that you really want when you sell your animals.
Yeah, everybody's done a great job really laying
out what's important on both sides. The only
other thing I would say is... that we would ask
from a sales manager to help us decide what's
the right fit for the sale, right? They understand
the sale, how it's going to flow, what the customer
base is going to be. And so helping us choose
the right animal for that sale, we really rely
on the sales management for that. And then what
everyone else has said, it's your animal, it's
your responsibility to get her. uh looking the
best that she can or present them the best way
you can so you know we take that very seriously
when we put something and we want them to be
successful so that's on us thanks beaton and
i think uh echoing from that uh as far as what
you expect from the sale manager i think number
one the sale manager is probably the person that
drove in your driveway and selected that and
that's true but what we have all experienced
is you have to do some work at home too They
need to be altar broke. If they come in there
with skis per feet, nobody's going to see the
good part. They're going to see the bad part.
You see her feet? You see her feet? Oh, yeah,
they're getting to her feet. That's all you're
going to hear. She can be a great, great animal
past that. But you know what? Everybody's going
to turn to the negative because it's human intuition.
And I also say, us sale managers, you know, we
often get the question, what are you going to
do for your commission? What are you going to
do for your commission? Well, commissioned same
as it was in 1984, and animals bring the same
price they did, or less, than in 1984. I think
we all know the cost of living, the cost of everything
has gone up. So, we don't have these excitement
sales to get rich. We do it, number one, to market
our own cattle, and number two, is to try and
help all the breeders as much as we can. Coming
to our next... Question. There's probably folks
listening. There's folks in this room and forum
listening to the forum who've never consigned
to a sale or advertised their farm in any sort
of app. We all know that we're good friends with
a lot of them. What advice would you give to
them to start out on merchandising? If you have
registered Holsteins, why not take advantage
of this? Because obviously we know the milk checks
right now eat real good. What are we going to
do to make money off the farm? Because we have
registration papers. Let's use them to our advantage.
Jenny? That's a good point. I think a lot of
people that haven't consigned, whether for whatever
reason it is, sometimes they're not willing to
give their best animal to the people that are
on the driveway and ask for the best animal.
Whether that's a fear that they won't bring enough
or the fear that they won't be able to make another
one. I don't know what that is 100%, but I know
there's a lot of really good breeders out there
that just won't sell. And for whatever reason
it is, but if you're looking to make the extra
money, if you put in a good animal to a sale,
it's going to bring a good price. There's enough
great cow people out there that appreciate good
pedigrees and good type, good index, whatever
it might be, they find value in that. So I think
that for me, one of the things for people getting
started, be open -minded and willing. to trust
a sale manager or whoever to consign your best
sample off the farm. Thanks. I'll let go again
now. I'm not trying to take over. Trust me. But
call us, text us, email us. If we haven't been
to your farm, we'd love to come, but we've got
to know you're interested. Betsy? Yeah, I would
echo that. Just take the jump and consign. Consign
your best. And they're worth what the market
says they're worth. I mean, it's sort of like
classifying. We can imagine that they're all
89 .2 -year -olds, but until somebody unbiased
comes in and tells us, okay, this is where they
fit on the continuum of things, that's eye -opening,
and take that and learn from it. I mean, maybe
your best is an 86 -point effort. That's still
fantastic, but it... can be overwhelming to try
to figure out where you where you fit in the
continuum of things and you know if you haven't
been consigning you haven't been doing that check
out some sales that you enjoy or you felt like
geez where did that the one that taught that
sale what did what did they do that i'm not doing
or what are they what am i doing that they're
not doing why why didn't i get signed on top
of that sale and just kind of have those conversations
maybe So a couple of thoughts with this, and
maybe I should have mentioned it with the, what
does the sale manager do question. But one thing
you can do when you're considering consigning
to a sale is ask the sale manager, ask Chris,
what do you think this animal is worth? Because
if he says, yeah, it's worth about $2 ,500 and
you're expecting $5 ,000, there's a significant
difference there. And either brace yourself for
that or just say no. Yeah, I'd much rather be
the bad guy up front than Andrew the animal.
Yeah, and that's something that we've done a
lot when we consider even just putting it to
our own sale. What is the market value of that
animal? So that's something that Chris and whoever
your sales manager is, has great expertise at
that I don't necessarily have. The other part
of that when we're marketing animals, especially
if you are new to marketing, new kind of to the
industry, if you want to call it, or sales is,
you have to market yourself a little bit too.
And that's one thing that we've worked hard.
at Oakfield Corners is to build a brand, if you
want to call it that. Tell your story. Tell,
you know, hey, we're 12 generations of farmers.
We're big, and that's not always a positive.
We're big, but we also love cows. And just tell
your story. I remember, so the very first cow
Jonathan and I bought when we moved up here was
just in a local, maybe Allegheny, Steuben County,
say, all in New York. You know, we spent like
three grand on our baby. But it was the first
cow that we bought together. And so there's a
story there. We still have members from my cow
family that have done well. We've had, you know,
at least 15 excellent animals from my cow family.
They're still milking in the farm, in the commercial
operation. So I'm going to show them. And just
telling those stories of some of those cows that
you are going to sell and telling that story
of you as the farm and as a breeder, I think
that resonates with buyers. And it makes people
respect you as a breeder and as someone who's
selling. Yeah, I think to add a little bit to
what Alicia said is, you know, working with a
sale manager, but there's, you know, work with
smart people that are marketing up here or your
neighbors who are marketing and get advice from
them. How are you doing this? How do you market
yourself? What fits into this sale? And then,
you know, be willing to let your best go. and
have realistic expectations. I think that's really
important. Really be sure that you know, hey,
this animal's going to fit in this range. And
there are tons of markets, right? We have bull,
we have rat, we have index, we have show, we
have show calf, we have cows. There are so many
markets that you can fit into. What do you have?
that fits into that type of market. And if that's
something that you want to develop, talk to people.
How did you get into this show stuff? How do
you get into that market? Or whether it's pulled
or read or whatever it is, understand what you
have and where they fit and talk to other people
who are good marketers on how to get it done
and be happy when you do it. Hit the nail on
the head. And thanks for all those four very
valuable answers to the question. Now we're going
to get into some real -edit questions, I think.
Next one is, since COVID and the inception of
Calvire, sales have changed. We all know that.
How has your merchandising program been affected
by these changes? And what do you do to adapt?
For example, when COVID hit, My life was turned
upside down. We had cattle at Frederick for a
large man to sale. They were already at the fairground.
They were already tied up. And the world stopped.
I didn't know what to do. They said they were
going to take tractor -trailers off the road.
I was going to have 80 head at the Frederick
Fairgrounds for six months. So obviously we had
to adapt. So we did for that. And then once that
was over, we got all the cattle gone, everybody,
and it was a very successful sale. Then I wondered,
what am I going to do now? I can't be an auctioneer
because there can't be anybody in sales. So that's
when we bought in. I had the idea of this bright
future sale where people could merchandise embryos,
which it takes six people, three people, and
somebody from Calvary there to help us out. And
it worked. And it's still going. There's one
Monday night. But I'm not doing this as an ad
for me. I'm telling you what I did to get through
COVID. And it took a hold. And if Oakville Corner
sends five embryos out of a certain cow, we sell
them that night. Nine times out of ten, another
interested party is going to call them in the
next few days. And you can end up selling 15
or 20 embryos you're not paying commission on.
So that's kind of my story. Jenny? Because COVID
hit us all. Oh, yeah. To go back to the last
question really quick, though, something I thought
of after we kind of got through this, if you're
thinking about selling and you're afraid to send
that great one, I mean, your prefix carries on.
And that's something to be very proud of. I'm
pretty sure Alicia's got a cow out there named
Footloose that they bred that they no longer
own that still puts them on the map. So not to
regress here, but just wanted to touch on that
as well. Your prefix stays on that animal forever.
No better way, like Dundee Page put us on the
map, no better way to build your brand than to
have a Cal family do well for other people. And
life is about a brand. That's right. So back
to COVID, I like to forget about it altogether,
but I guess we were lucky in Ohio, for instance,
that we were able to maybe carry on with life
a little bit more normally than some other states.
And I won't mention any other state names. But
we were able to do some things and move a little
more freely than maybe some other states were
able to do. So we tried to move forward as business
as usual as much as we possibly could, whether
it be having sales, shows, whatever. The reason
I bring up the show aspect was because that carries
over into marketing your brand, your sales, everything
that we do as registered breeders. And that year
with no Madison, that hit a lot of us really
hard. We, I know there's several people in here
and some people on the stage that came together
and we put on a show to try to replace Expo for
that year. And we said we found value in carrying
on and having all American contests and doing
all these things and having recognition because
you lose a year. At that time, we didn't know
how many years we were going to lose, but we
felt like we had to carry that on to keep the
registered business and what we do for a living
alive and well. So that was one of the things
that we decided was very important to us. Again,
we tried to have sales as normal as possibly
we could. Obviously, we all have to do the lovely
bird flu testing and things like that now that
hasn't gone away. But, you know, when that first
came out, we thought that was going to be the
end of the world. And we've all kind of moved
on from there. But Cowbuyer has been a great
tool. But everybody knows with technology, you
have problems sometimes. And we've all been to
sales where there's been some sort of glitch
or this or that at no fault to anybody. But that's
just technology. I think still having a valuable
sales staff and people there and trusting people
that are at sales, maybe so -called the old -fashioned
way. is very, very important. You've got to have
the eyeballs there at the sale that people are
going to trust if those people can't be there
themselves. Thanks. So there's a lot between
COVID and Cowbuyer and when we think of what
sales look like today versus what they looked
like 20 or 25 years ago. I mean, for us up in
New England, COVID. restrictions kind of drove
the need for another show. Again, some of our
usual suspects weren't a thing. So we had a fall
show that's morphed into a really successful
spring show series. So, I mean, I think all of
us are determined to continue moving the business
forward and to be creative in problem solving.
So I think that speaks to the resilience of our
readers and marketers around. around the country.
So that's pretty exciting. I think Calvary has
been a fantastic tool. I think it changes the
vibe of a sale when you're not thinking, geez,
there's not 350 people sitting out here in the
audience. We're not going to have a sale. So
that's pretty different. But that goes back to
one of the earlier questions about what's your
responsibility as a consigner? You better have
done your work at home and figure out how to
use social media. obviously that's a whole other
conversation about whether they're not great
things about social media but you know when i
think of what we do we certainly try to utilize
social media i feel like so you know you all
have some whether it's your cell phone company
or your credit card company where there's like
that two -step authentication or something else
i feel like i have that social media now because
i have a 19 year old daughter who assists on
some of the farm posts so i'll post things and
then she'll help me improve them so to speak
Which is great, and I think that's in the same
vein as just ask people questions. Don't be shy.
One person out of a million is going to be unpleasant
if you ask a question. But the vast majority
of people are happy to answer your questions,
whether it's a sale manager or whether it's somebody
that you admire that's done a lot of marketing
work or is a terrific breeder. I mean, we wouldn't
do any of this stuff if we didn't love it. we'd
love to talk about it too so ask questions and
listen to the answers too that's an important
step so the old days of having sales was a lot
of fun you know we have the big tent Bring out
the animals. You want to come through the ring.
And Rama was our auctioneer. And if anybody's
heard Rama, he gets pretty animated. And actually,
I saw him a couple weeks ago at the New York
Holstein Convention. And he's like, oh my gosh,
that last live sale we had, pre -code, was amazing.
It was so much fun. I wish we could go back to
that. And I'm like, yeah, it was fun. But the
reality is, I don't know. I don't know if I want
to go back to that. Because there's an expense
in a tent. And, yeah, it's cool. But, you know,
the way we've structured our spring cessation
sale series now, it's a little bit of a hybrid
model. So the animals are there. You know, we're
on a farm. They're there. But then we're all
able to kind of go off in almost more of a social
setting, I would say. In their natural habitat.
Yeah, yeah. In the people's natural habitat.
And we're able to, you know. I guess, quote unquote,
compete against each other if you want to buy
that animal like you do in any other sale. But
it's kind of a lot of fun in that way. And we
don't have to have the animals going through
the ring or worry about if the wind's going to
blow the tent down or the storm's going to come
through and find the animals as they're going
through the ring. So I don't know. I kind of
like the way that we have structured at least
our spring sensation sale series now where you
have the option to go out and look at the animal.
Please go look at the animals. And we do have
that big sale crew that comes in, and we ensure
that we've got individuals that are qualified
to look at cattle. So if you're not able to make
it to New York, you can call up, you know, one
of those people that are on the list that have
gone through the animals, and they'll give you
an unbiased, honest opinion of what those animals
are. I don't know. I like it. It's stressful.
Having a sale is always going to be shit. I like
that format. And as sale managers, we have, you're
the sale manager. I was working on work for you.
You have to find ways, just to reiterate what
I said before, we've got to save money because
15 % doesn't go very far. Yeah, it really doesn't.
You know, I mean, you still have to pay fitters
to come in and take care of the animals. You
still have to allocate charges for feed and straw
and housing and the people that do that. But,
you know, it works for us. incredible and being
able to help navigate those sales virtually.
I know there's a sale coming up on Monday. I'll
be sitting behind my computer screen, potentially
making some bids. And it's kind of nice for me
as a potential buyer to do that as I'm still
able to work on the farm. and do my own thing.
But it's, I don't know, I like the way that this
hybrid model has gone. I like having some virtual
sales and still having people that are bidding
live at the same time. I kind of like that format.
And we haven't had complaints of an unhappy buyer
either because most of the time, if they're not
there, they're represented by somebody who's
qualified. Take the complaint. Right. Yes, they'll
take the complaint. They're getting paid. Yeah,
I think obviously times have changed, but all
these folks have been marketing through all those
changes, right? So you just pivot and you find
your way. We have tag sales today. That's something
that has evolved in the last 10 years or so,
and that's a unique approach as well. I do miss
the fun, the camaraderie, the excitement of the
sale, and I love to see live animals in front
of me, but that's less and less. I think we have,
you know, there's a ton of expense to bringing
those animals and trucking them across the country.
And we have health issues and risks and fitting
and all of that. So, you know, we've pivoted
and changed, but it's still great. And Cowbuyer
allows us to connect with people around the world
that would be much more difficult to reach if
we didn't have it. So I think it's been great.
But I still, you know. They have the Nashville
sale and no live animals, but they do such a
great job to keep a high -tempo excitement. That's
still fun when you have sales, right? So I think
you just have to find what fits for you and,
you know, continue to pivot and change. All right.
Now, last question before I give each and every
one of you a personal question, then we'll go
into questions from the crowd. You've all hosted
sales, all four of you. and you sold your own
cattle and you sold consignments along with it.
If someone purchased an animal from you for a
substantial price, what advice would you give
them to make sure that they make profitable returns
on that purchase? And I'm going to add to that
in the second part, what is the most valuable
marketing lesson you've learned over the years?
Something you've sold. You're going to convince
the people or you're going to help them make
money. What's the most valuable lesson you've
learned? I guess that's kind of a loaded question,
but I feel that no matter as a consigner, you
want the same thing in return as a consigner
to whatever sale, to Chris's sale, to the PA
sale. You want to try to get the most out of.
what your animal is and going through the brain.
And we try to treat every consigner that same
way, whether that animal brings $4 ,000 or whether
that animal brings $40 ,000. I want to see a
happy consigner at the end of the day and a happy
buyer. And I think that's true for every sale
management person. As far as helping them out
or what you can do to help them along the way.
You try to do that for everybody. If somebody
needs help, maybe it's somebody getting started
that just bought their first 4 -H calf. If they
need advice on how to feed, you're going to do
that for them or assist that with them. Whether
it's somebody that's well -seasoned in the industry
that bought a really high -priced animal, you
try to follow that animal and help them make
the right decisions. Just have those conversations
about breeding, feeding, whatever it might be.
And I feel like that is one great thing. But
we've developed over, I guess, time with a lot
of our return buyers and even new buyers. It's
kind of that relationship of working with them
and that open conversation that can be had. So
what was the second part of the question? Most
valuable marketing lesson you've learned. Most
valuable marketing. I don't know about lesson,
I guess. As being as much as I. Have a love -hate
relationship with social media. It is a very
important tool. But having the right people,
I guess, surround you, whether it's your fitting
crew, whether it's sales staff, just having the
people around you that you trust and that other
people trust, I think that's a huge, huge component
to a successful sale. Okay, Beth. Yeah, so...
Again, I would echo that. I mean, I think when
you're in the position of consigning an animal,
if this is a long -term kind of thing for you
and something you want to do again, you have
a responsibility again to make sure that you
continue to build that relationship. If you want
it to be something other than just a one -off,
well, I sold that one and I'm going to retreat
back into my corner of the world. Did I mention
Maine's not related? So, you know, I think you
have a responsibility as a consigner and as a
breeder to maintain that connection, to kind
of follow up, you know, are there family members
of an animal that somebody purchased that have
done well, or there's interesting new details,
or just reaching out and asking how an animal
somebody purchased, how is she doing, or what
cool stories do you have about that, and hopefully
that makes the buyer feel a little bit more like
you're... You're invested in the process, and
it wasn't just, well, hey, that's great. I'm
glad I sold that one for that much money, and
thanks a lot. Have a great day. I mean, those
connections, and I think everybody's touched
on it, those relationships, whether it's relationships
with the folks that you have on your sales staff
that are trusted advisors to the buyers and to
you as a consigner and a sale manager. Those
relationships are important. We can do lots of
cool stuff on social media. At the end of the
day, I think a lot of people want to talk to
a human who's seen that animal or who has experience
with that particular consigner and can say, yeah,
that's not just really good editing. You can
be confident in that, and I think that's really
important. I think as far as the biggest marketing
lesson to learn over time, I mean, there's some
of them you have to learn repeatedly. I'm not
super quick that way, but always. I'm always
still your best. And that's fantastic when they
go forth and do really well for somebody. You
know, I mean, it's cool for us to have, you know,
we sold Robin. I don't even know if it's a while
ago now, I guess, but she went on and Integrity
Robin went on and was 95 for her new owners and,
you know, iconic pictures and fun stuff like
that. And that's a thrill. Would it have been
fun to have her still? But it's great to see
them go forward and do well. And somebody mentioned
that that marketing, he said, they'll always
have your prefix. Always, always, always. No
matter what fantastic things they go on to do,
that's always there to pedigree. And that's fantastic,
fantastic marketing. And do your homework. Always.
That's always a lesson. That's, yeah. So as far
as when we sell animals, if the buyer wants us
to, we try to remain in contact. Or if they have
questions, you know, we're pretty open, I think.
And we're always pretty open about history of
the animal. If they flush well, what holes work
in that cow family? Because a lot of times, you
know, we're selling from a cow family. And so
we kind of know what does or doesn't work in
those cow families. and we're about it we try
to be as open as we can with those discussions
if the buyer has those questions and wants that
feedback uh it's kind of fun when you have a
free to get buying the calf because they always
have questions you know what do i do how do i
feed them how do i get a rope to lead you know
what should i you know what kind of pen do they
need to be sometimes you get some wild questions
it's a lot of fun to talk to the kids about that
And, hey, you know, that gives it back to us
to work with. And I see that with our own kids
now. They'll ask these crazy questions once in
a while. I'm like, oh, yeah, you're 9 and 11.
You know, I should expect these crazy questions.
So, yeah, it's a lot of fun when there's little
kids, younger, I should say, people that are
asking those questions because that, you know,
keeps them energized, keeps us watching to keep
tabs on how those animals are doing for them.
We always also stand behind the animals that
we sell. There's been a few times that we've
bought them back or brought them back. You know,
somebody would say, hey, we can't get this cow
pregnant. Like, what do we do? All right, do
you want the beef check? And, you know, how do
you want us to do this? We'll give you the beef
check and just pay you and we'll bring her back
or we'll bring her back to the farm and get her
pregnant. And I think we've only brought two
or three back to the farm and they got pregnant
first or second service. you know whether there
were some issues with feed or whatever at the
buyer's farm it doesn't matter but we get them
pregnant get them far enough along to their second
prep check send them back to the to the buyer
that was there but that's one thing we always
do is we stand behind the animal that we sell
um because if we don't then why are we selling
you know we just don't want that reputation um
as far as marketing lessons um We try to surround
ourselves with really good people. I think people
are key to this whole business, you know. If
you see us at a show, it's usually the same team.
You know, Jack Ross goes with us to every show.
He's our guy. For as long as we're able to have
Jack Ross there, he's our guy. And we want him
with us because, you know, we have that relationship.
We know how to work with him. but he also knows
the cows and so when we start our shows in march
in new york we're going to have the same crew
through the whole year but that's they're our
guys they're our team they're going with this
you know they know the cows and i think it's
really important and that's you know that's just
on the show side of course but any of these marketing
aspects that we we do you know we kind of have
our team you know we work pretty closely with
chris and tim with our sales and and us working
with them with their sales. And I think it's
important that we have those connections with
the people to just build upon those relationships
in this industry. Well, I've got to tell you,
it's tough when you go after three smart ladies
to think of anything intelligent to say that
they haven't already said. And I was going to
mention what Alicia just said about standing
behind Carol because that's something that's...
It's inevitable, right? If you sell a lot of
cattle over time, something's not going to work
out. And we just have always stepped up and said,
how do we want to make this right? And I think
that's really important. And buying from people
that you trust is also really important as well.
I mean, it's about people at the end of the day.
And the cattle are great, but you're buying from
people. So I think that's really important. But
when we had our sale, the registered sale, The
higher price cattle we sold went to people smarter
than us, so we didn't really have to tell them
too much, but we have had situations where they
wanted us to keep cattle for a while or get it
started or whatever, and that's just what you
do. It's just what you do to market your cattle
and to help the buyer of whatever you did sell.
I would say advice, a lot of what these folks
have already said, but... I would say the best
marketing thing that I've ever learned is it
takes a lot of work. It is constant effort, 365,
to have your cattle, to develop the right kind
of cattle that are going to be marketable, that
people want. Because if you're the only one that
wants it, she's going to be in tough sell. And
you can't tell people what they should like,
right? The market will dictate it. And you have
to understand the market, work hard to present
your cattle that fit into that market. and get
them sold. So I think embracing the hard work,
being smart about doing it is something that
we've learned. Thanks, B. To share a little story,
I had a staffer one time that was in a sale and,
you know, everybody goes, give me a range on
her, give me a range on her. I said, $25 ,000
to $40 ,000. Cool. How am I going to get my money
back? So, it was a very prominent breeder that
consigned her, and I called him up and I said,
this guy, he's got the coin, he'll send me a
check the next day, that's no problem. He says,
but his major question is, he loves blue ribbons,
but he wants his money back. The guy on the other
end of the phone, he says, well, you tell him
to get her bred, and I'll give him $750 for every
embryo she makes before it's time to quit IVFing
her. So, that said, Caledon African's bred. And
he went right, started going right to the shoot
every two weeks. She made, I don't know, 20 38s.
Well, lo and behold, he ended up in the bar for
like 22 ,000. And he sold probably 17 5 8s because
of what the seller told him that he would do.
to back up this purchase plus you're getting
the calf that's inside plus you've won some shows
so everybody at the end of the day is happy now
they don't all work out that way as we all well
know but the secret to the whole thing is you
got to make more on your investments than you
lose you got to be you got to try to be at least
60 40 or you have trouble So I'm going to conclude
my portion of this, and then we're going to get
into some questions for people online as well
as in the room, because I'm sure there's a lot
of questions out here for these people. But I've
got one question for each of them, and I'm going
to start with you, Jenny. And I'm sure a lot
of people want to know about this. So obviously
you and your entire family, your three children,
Nathan, play a huge role in the success of Vieira
Derrick. So those of you who don't know who Vieira
Dairy is, go to the 7 -Eleven, fill your cart
up, and go home, because I know you know who
they are. The most prominent showroom in the
Jersey Green today. And they're a great cow share
hotel with Triple T. You're involved with them
in showrooms, sales, et cetera, and your name
is synonymous with theirs. However, you have
not allowed that relationship, not even for a
second, interfere with the continued success
of Triple T, Holsteins, and Jerseys. How do you
maintain that? And how do you keep everybody
smiling? Honestly, it's an open and transparent
conversation. Like we set up, we're very honest
in what our expectations are. They are honest
with their expectations. We've had a great working
relationship. They're good people to work with.
We provide a service. We're going to do it 110
percent. And, you know, again, we have our own
farm, our own cattle, our kids own cattle. Our
kids have bought and sold cattle like we've kind
of brought them into that. And we want to make
sure that we have something at the end of the
day. If beer and dairy and us decide to go different
directions at some point in time, we are going
to quit being us and ourselves. to bring in somebody
else. So we're kind of like a love it or leave
it type of thing, I guess. But luckily in our
situation, we all work great together and it's
working out well. But we kind of, again, we have
X amount of spots in our hotel. We only milk
35 heads. So it's a balancing act. Sometimes
on the triple T side, we sell animals that maybe
we... wouldn't want to sell. Maybe we can sign
a couple extra head just because we don't have
the room that normally we would keep. So we have,
but that's what makes us kind of continue to
move on. And that's kind of our, our place in
the market too. Like we're always trying to IVF
and we have to sell X amount of head to kind
of keep our numbers in balance. We kind of know
where that fine line is of being too crowded
and, and being able to allow those poor cattle
to stay there. So sometimes we sell ones we don't
necessarily want to sell. That kind of goes back
to selling your best. You've just got to be willing
to put them out there and continue that cash
flow and make it work to be able to only milk
30 by pet. Thank you very much, and I'm sure
you'll get more questions about that as we go.
The next question is for Pete. People hand the
mic down to Pete. Pete, in my experience, it's
been clear that deep pedigrees continue to market
and market very well. You were involved with
a cow that was very famous named Covail Dempsey
Dena. We all know who Dina was, Cali Pig Good.
She was granted the Royals. She was nominated
her All -American Reserve several times back
-to -back. But we've been talking about brand
names all day. Now, she herself is a brand name,
but her pedigree, nice, but not a brand name
pedigree. But if you go to sales still today
and you have Dina's name in the pedigree, that
animal, I think, Still works well. I mean, she
breeds true. But isn't it cool how she started
the real true breeding of that family? But didn't
have a brand of pedigree. She made a brand for
herself. Tell us a little bit about Dina and
her story. Yeah, so we've been really blessed
to be able to work with some really special cows.
And Beth is another one of those. And, you know,
Dina was just a really exciting young cow. A
friend of ours that probably many of you know,
Bob Landis, had her and said, hey, I think you
guys ought to take a look at this cow. You know,
she's just fresh a couple weeks, and I bought
her as a calf, and I think she could be pretty
nice. So my son, Jade, was down there. He was
just out of college and looked at her, and he
called me and said, yeah, I think we should partner
with Bob on this cow. So we brought her up to
our place and we had some, you know, we're running
with some show cows at that time. And she came
off the truck and I thought to myself, why did
he think we should burn down this cow? She was,
you know, just a couple weeks fresh and kind
of a narrow rear udder and just a baby, right?
Yeah, just a milking yearling. And the cow just
blossomed incredibly well, just continued to
develop. We did our part, she did her part. And,
yeah, you develop those kind of cows that are
well -known. Everybody wants those genetics,
right? Everybody wants that special one. And
she did a lot of that. She made a lot of great
daughters, a lot of excellent daughters, cows
that have done well in the show ring, pretty
calves. And she really helped get us there. And
then Beth was the next one. Now, Beth had a great
pedigree. And, you know, we bought her dam from
Jenny. and Nathan, and they helped us tremendously
get that dam rolling, and then Bath was born,
and that's another great story for another time,
but yeah, you just have to find the right individuals
sometimes, you know, and develop them, and the
industry will embrace it, and everybody wants
that special one. Thanks, Pete. Betsy, you're
next. And we want to know, and you may have answered
this in a roundabout way, but Take us a little
more in depth about your family farm. How has
your herd's merchandise program changed since
your herd has grown in the past 20 years? And
have you seen limitations on more ways to capitalize?
That's a lot. Thank you. Yeah. So it's a great
question. Absolutely. going from milking 60 cows
in a tie solid having that really finite amount
of space to having a little bit more latitude
on space and you know and maybe we're moving
from needing to sell a set number to being able
to absorb more of those animals and and kind
of just selling selling off the top that you
know that's one change certainly as we change
size and scale uh you know i would say at this
point cow number wise we're pretty we're sort
of set so moving a little bit back into that
so focusing on merchandising a few more so that's
that's definitely changed over time i mean the
dairy population in new england has certainly
shifted over time so 25 30 years ago there were
there were club sales and there was a state sale
chris talked about coming up and working the
main state sale and so there were more local
marketing outlets from that standpoint. So that's
definitely different. That's shifted over time
and have to be a little bit more creative about
whether it's social media or whether it's, you
know, continuing to maintain those contacts,
whether it's going out, showing someplace other
than Maine for us, you know, just again, that
back to that brand sort of idea and making sure
that we're aware of what's going on in the market.
So that has definitely changed over time as our
herd size has changed. There was the second part
to the question, too. Maybe. Have you seen limitations
or more ways to capitalize? That's why I do use
beef scene. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So Maine's
its own little island, so definitely different
things that I don't know that we would have imagined
15 or 20 years ago, whether we breed 30 % of
our cows to beef, so that right now that's more
appealing than the milk check a lot of days.
So that's handy, and that also gets back to that,
what's the number of cattle that we need to either
maintain or grow or herd size or that we want
to put out, need to put out on the market from
that standpoint. We even dabbled in ice cream
for a minute or two. That was like a around COVID
sort of experiment, but it takes a lot of time.
And anyways, I like cows. So there's that. So
again, back to focusing on some of the merchandising,
focusing on some of the marketing, and maybe
being at a point in our lives where we kind of
want to focus on the things that we enjoy doing.
Life is short. Alicia, it's obvious that Oathfield
Corners has a large presence on social media
for all facets of your herd. What are some of
the pros and cons of this tool? How do you ensure
that your post target reaches the target audience
you want to? For instance, you put up, I got
something right now about the sale. I don't know
who's putting it up, but what if I'm a cheese
customer and I'm getting something about, is
it the algorithms? Does somebody control who
sees what? Like your sale advertisement, your
cheese people or your Wagyu buyers, they don't
see it, do they? Or how does that work? How do
you control who sees this is what I'm asking.
Yeah, that's a great question. So we do have
four different pages. There's an Oakville Corners
Dairy page, which I manage, and I've not done
very well with that lately because it's been
a lonely winter, and I've been building and helping
get our catalog done the past couple weeks, so
I've been a little bit slow on getting posts
up on that. But basically the Oakville Corners
Dairy page on Instagram, Facebook. wherever else,
Snapchat, TikTok, YouTube. I don't do Twitter
anymore, whatever it's called now. Basically,
that's focusing on cows, info, genetics, cows
and the herd, management of what we do on the
farm day -to -day. There is a dedicated Oakfield
artisanal page, and Molly, who is our cheesemaker,
she manages that page both with Facebook and
Instagram. I think she's got another social media,
but I'm not for sure which one it is, so I apologize.
But that's dedicated to the production of the
cheese and what we have available for sale in
that regard. There used to be a Wagyu page, and
we kind of morphed that into the artisanal page
because we're doing the Wagyu through the artisanal
brand. And then there is a lamb farms page. And
my sister -in -law manages that. And it's not
like that. I would say that it's more community
based, like Oakfield specific based than like
Oakfield Corners Dairy. We're trying to hit everybody
in the U .S. and internationally. So, you know,
when you think about it in that regard, it's
kind of a lot. And, you know, luckily we are
a big farm and we've got a lot of things going
on. So it's great. So the content is there. The
problem is just that. I asked for help from guys.
It's kind of a one -man show where I'm trying
to keep it somewhat diversified with a little
bit of a focus. I just have to have time to do
that on top of everything else. It can be its
own job. I don't know how everybody else manages
their social media pages, but that can be a full
-time job on a farm when you're marketing. um
cattle food whatever i mean there's a lot that
goes into it and don't ask me about the algorithms
i'm too old for that i don't understand that
it's not only that i just like it thanks for
asking that by the way yeah so um yeah no it's
it's good and it's a great way of marketing Well,
this is going to conclude my part. We still have
45 minutes left for questions, and I'm sure there's
people out there online and in the crowd that
has a question for each and every one of you.
I'll just ask that one person just say, I can
cover that one, and you just kind of pass the
mic around. So my first question we have sent
in is, what is the differences between marketing
animals for show and marketing animals for function
and production? How do the markets and methods
differ? You got the mic, you can answer that
one, Jenny. I think we probably already answered
it. But how do they differ? As far as, I guess
on our end, I think it's a little bit the same.
Show animals, especially the modern show cow,
has to be a cow that milks and it has to be a
functional cow. I think that that is where the
two industries have come closer and closer together.
The days of having 68 -inch two -year -olds that...
their front legs crossed, has slowly, luckily,
started to drift away in the last five, six,
seven, eight years. So I think that those two
worlds have come together a lot more. I think
when you look at sires that are available, sire
selection, yes, there are still some pure type
sires out there, but you look at like a lambda.
for instance, that has kind of crossed into both
worlds. So I think there is a little bit of the
same, but as far as marketing on both ends, obviously
if we have a high type, you know, cow, 89 .2
year old, we're not going to sell it in a commercial,
you know, setting or for a commercial price.
So you kind of navigate and know your own animals
and be honest with yourself and know what is
what and the difference between what. We're probably
the hardest critics on our own animals. We're
pretty critical. There's lots of conversations,
lively conversations that go on at our house,
but we see things a lot the same, but we also
have different opinions, which is a good thing.
It's really fun. We go to Triple D with one life,
one monkey, and standard. So that's a discussion
for another day. But this question a little bit
is we're talking about show animals and functional
animals. Really, in our eyes, we all show and
we love to show, but show and function should
be two words that go together. Now, a lot of
people that are, how should I say, not anti -show,
but they think a show animal is different than
a functional animal. Well, that's what us people
at show are trying to change. We want that show
animal to be medium -sized. We want her to be
functional. We want her to be able to survive
in a freestall slatted floor environment. And
there's nothing wrong with a cow like that winning.
And yes, there's more of those coming out all
the time. There's more great cows found in freestall
herds all the time. And you can go to a sale.
I don't care if it's tonight. where they're selling
a lot of brand -name cows, and brand names are
what sells. Or if you go to, for instance, Brubaker's
in Shippensburg, a great dairy sale. They sell
milk, but a lot of great cows have come out of
there. Cows have been granted Harrisburg. It's
called right out of Brubaker's sale bar. All
you've got to do is just look into a crystal
ball a little bit. Now, do we have any questions
from the floor? I have one that was texted in
that tags onto that topic, and maybe everybody
can address it if they want to. But if you don't
have that quote -unquote show herd, what avenues
are there for you to market those cattle the
best, and how can the value of those cattle be
recognized? In other words, the great barn cows.
Where or how can they be best marked? That might
eventually build you to the greater love. So,
you know, there's a tagline that I use once in
a while in our social media posts, the kind we
love to know. And that's exactly what you're
asking right there. They're cows with deep pedigrees.
They're amazing barn cows, just truly great barn
cows. And they're never going to go win a show
at Madison or Harrisburg or anywhere else like
that. So how do we market from them? I don't
know. It's a great question. You know, we, again,
are trying to promote cow families. And when
we promote cow families, sometimes there's their
buy -in from people. And we have a wheelhouse
right now. She's not high enough. She's like
30. 350 or i don't even know i'll say it wrong
but uh she's not high enough index to make goals
anymore but she has a rerouter that would pop
you in the head like crazy when you see her full
of milk an amazing cow and i took pictures of
her i posted her and guess what we're selling
embryos a year from the cow now um so it's kind
of funny how again some of those things resonate
from you know yes she At one point was an index
cow. She's not anymore. She's, you know, three,
almost four years old. But that's, I guess, how
you're going to have to do it is, you know, push
the cow family side, you know, get a great shot
of those rear. People love rear udder shots.
I mean, it's incredible how many people you put
a great rear udder on that car and people really
are drawn to that. And I think that's how you
promote those cows. I'm not saying any daughter
from her is going to bring $50 ,000 or anything,
but I bet we can sell anything from $5 ,000 to
$10 ,000 from that, which is a nice price. Profit.
Yes, for those animals like that. And especially
if you use a bull that's hot, that's going to
help increase the value of those cows as well.
And for those cows that aren't going to win Harrisburg,
they aren't going to win World Dairy Expo. I
can give you a perfect example. You said five
or six really nice milk cows down to Dan and
Bob's sale in first September. And they all bought
$4 ,000 to $6 ,000. Nothing wrong with that.
And you've got two or three lactations and daughters
out of them already. That's the kind of sale
you put milk cows in that are into that $4 ,000
to $6 ,000 range. Because as we all know, there's
a huge difference between goodness and greatness.
And a good dairy cow with a nice pedigree is
milking a hundred. Now, she can't be a seven
on somatic cell and be pregnant 30 days and been
in 240 days. Now, everything's got to be lined
up right. The somatic cell, stage of lactation,
is she bred back? Is she easy on the eyes? Does
she have a nice pedigree? Automatically, four
to six grain. And that ain't bad after you've
got two or three lactations out of them. Next
question. Chris, the only comment I would make
about that is, you know, maybe she's not going
to win Madison, but she's a pedigree builder.
If she's that kind of cow. Go back in some of
these show cow pedigrees and look at some of
those cows back in there that you never saw on
the show. They didn't win Madison, but they're
90 or 92 or 93 points and they made 35 or 40
,000. They are pedigree makers. So, you know,
don't despair just because she can't win Madison
today. Use that cow. Don't just let her die on
your farm. You didn't make anything out of her.
She's the one that you want to IVF. You want
to make babies. uh make some really unique meanings
from that cow and build your pedigrees and that's
how you get there yeah and if you don't know
there's everybody talks about expo but there's
only 18 winners only 18 sorry folks but that's
it so you can't compare everything to world dairy
expo you gotta have some fun at home first david
okay i have one other that was texted in and
then we'll open it up be proud How does a small
family farm breeding high -type cattle get their
name on the map and get sale selectors to visit
their farm? 8 -6 -7 -5 -3 -0 -9. We're gone.
Chris is right, though. We're not afraid to call.
We're not mind readers. I mean, you pay attention.
Like, we watch social media. I don't know how
many times Nathan's like, yeah, I bought one.
Where'd you see it? Snapchat. I don't know. I
mean, there's random places and things. It just,
you never know what's going to catch somebody's
eye. But the sure bet thing is to reach out to
somebody and let them know you're interested.
Because if you've never sold before or maybe
somebody stopped at your farm, but, you know,
four or five times and you never wanted to sell,
but now all of a sudden you've had a change of
heart. You've got to let people know and let
people be aware. A good picture can sell. Right.
We've all seen the kind of fluffy pictures. I
call them fluffy pictures sometimes. The very
posed, the very professional photos. I did it.
There's still a place for that. There's embryo
interest. There's still professional photos that
you want for your All -Americans, your All -Pennsylvania.
There's places for everything. Just like we did
for this sale here, taking an honest picture
with your phone and putting it on Facebook, letting
people see the different angles of a heifer,
it's very transparent as well. Like there's a
place for everything. And doing all of them is
an important thing as a consigner. Anybody else?
Well, so to me, actually all three of those questions
kind of get at the same thing. We talked about
it earlier. What's your responsibility as a designer
or reader if you want to market? Like maybe that
if it's a show -specific kind of thing you're
doing, well, you've got to get them onto a show.
I mean, that's fairly straightforward. Or get
in touch with somebody who can help you with
that. If it's that fantastic barn cow, I mean,
make sure you do all your homework. Make sure
they're scored. Make sure they're doing the things
that they need to do, that they're calving back
regularly, and that pedigree continues to get
stronger. I think these guys said it pretty clearly.
Pick up the phone or message somebody. Nobody's
mind readers. They don't know that you're interested
in selling something unless you let them know
that. So definitely do that. I got one, and I
don't know who can answer because I can't. I
hear it all the time, too, and this came in on
text. Can somebody tell me the definition of
a free agent? But I think it's a great question.
So I'm assuming the question is in reference
to index animals, yes. So a free agent is anything
that you don't have a contract on. So if you
do not have a contract on an animal, if there's
not a contract on the semen that is used to mate
that animal, she's a free agent. I should have
said beyond Aaron Rodgers. Pittsburgh. Don't
ask me anything about sports. Cows I know, sports
I don't. Yeah, so that would be a free agent.
So it's just like, you know, any of our show
cows that we own outright that, you know, there's
not going to be a contract unless it's a contract
between partners that own an animal. Yeah, you
probably won't hear this at the typeset, but
it's a genomic option to hear, you know, number
one free agent. Yeah, yeah. So no, that just
would mean that there's no, You didn't sign a
paper saying that I can't sell this animal. Okay,
good question to wherever you are. Crown. Dagon.
You'll be second. Okay, a question kind of related
to that. Oakfields and their genomic flushing.
How apt are they more to use a sub that is a
less restrictive PRS contractor? So every stud's
a little bit different. There are some that are
extremely restrictive, as we know. And some of
those restrictions, it's not just the resulting
calf or calves that are born from a mating is
the next generation and potentially the second
generation that are restricted by that stud.
So there's some pretty strict contracts. Other
studs, and I'm not going to name any names because
I'm just not, but other studs are free and open.
And that really is incentive for us as breeders
to use bulls from those studs, especially if
they rank high, because then you have a resulting
potential female. I mean, the bulls are going
to go back to that stud needle. That's no big
deal. But if there's not a restrictive contract
on any resulting females, then that leaves it
open. You could potentially sell that female.
or a decent amount of money if she tests well.
Or you can just keep her and continue building
generations. Yeah, so for us as breeders, as
long as the dam herself does not have restrictions
and there's no restrictions on the seam, that's
what we like if we can make it happen. And unfortunately,
that window of bulls that are available gets
tighter and tighter every day. I'd like to address
that too. I think you really need to understand
what the contracts are from each one of the studs.
What are you signing? What is that going to allow
you and not allow you to do? And the more restrictive
contracts that are out there tend to be for people
who want to accelerate the genetics within their
own herd. They're not traditional marketers.
They're not really necessarily looking to market.
They are looking for tremendous level of genetic
improvement as fast as they can get it for their
herd. And they tend to be people who are doing
some type of mating and genomic testing and just
trying to capitalize and create the most, in
their mind, profitable cattle for their herd.
So that's how they view it. If you're going to
market, that's a different world. You better
understand what you're signing if you want to
be a marketer. Sure. Tying into the genomics
and the index side, if you were talking to a
young breeder that has a passion for index cattle
and the way that whole industry has changed,
how important recipients are and how important
these contracts are, what advice would you give
them trying to tap into an index market? I would
never say there's no hope, right? I mean, there
is. And we might have four different answers
here. But I would say for a young person, I think
the best way, if you really want to, you know,
it really is shots on goal, right? I mean, if
I want to win in the high net merit or TPI world,
I need to throw some darts at the wall. That's
just the way it is, right? Because even the highest
animal isn't always going to make the nest highest
animal. We've seen changes, right? So I think
economically, I would say embryos are a good
way in. Buy some embryos. They might be a little
bit cheaper than going out and buying that $120
,000 high net merit effort, right? And the other
way is maybe an IBS session. Those would be the
ways I think as a young person you can get in.
Partnering with somebody who's got a large herd
and receipts, that's what we do on the type side.
It's a win -win. Again, I think Jenny mentioned
communication with partners. Critical. Have it
written out. This is what I'm expecting. This
is what you're expecting. Everybody has to win
for it to be good, but you're right. Recipes
are expensive, but there may be a nurturer that
has receipts that would love to do what you want
to do. You buy an IVF session or some embryos
and use their uteruses, and you're off and running.
And just to echo a little bit, but you remember
Alicia talking about that cow that she pictured
on Rotary that's 33, 100, mid -33s? That's the
kind of cow you can get in on an index family.
It might not be the next generation. It might
take you two generations, maybe three. But if
you reiterate to the outsiders and they stay
hot, then you're off to the races. But you've
still got to supply the receipts. You've still
got to get the pregnancies. You've still got
to have healthy females. You've still got to
test them. There's a lot that's attached to it.
It's not like you're going to, I don't think
you're going to ring the bell of one generation,
but it's affordable and it's nice index that
people, from a gal people, obviously respect.
And yeah, I would say. IPF sessions are becoming
a little bit easier to work with just because
you can select the bull that you want to use
on that dam and you can select a free agent bull
to use on that dam. And the best way to do that
would probably be to talk to a genetic consultant
that you trust. You know, we work closely with
each of the studs to go through different bowls
that are available. So any of the stud consultants,
you could work with them, or just somebody that
you know that you respect that would be able
to say, hey, you know, this is a free agent one.
Go by the IVF session, work with if you're a
small farm, find that farm to implant, you know,
input and recess. Make sure they understand if
they've never done embryo transfer work, what
is involved. You're not just breeding the cow,
you know, there's some stuff. So you got to make
sure that they know the process and understand
that process. But I would say, yeah, I think
that's probably the easiest way, quickest way
to get into a good family and a good cow that
you can potentially make some money on eventually
and build internally on your own farm. Anybody
else? I got another one texted. Willis said,
you mentioned realistic values to fitting into
the right kind of sale. Could you all cite a
moment where you far exceeded that expectation
and how and why it's been achieved? Well, I can't
really put one into it. I mean, we've had county
sales where you have a genomic one back in when
we could sell genomics for a lot of money and
they weren't tied down that far exceeded our
goals. But I guess, well, stop. Nobody expected
her to bring $1 .9 million in a day, but the
hardest part about that was trying to say it
in my chant. But she's the one that most far
exceeded my expectations, and actually she's
proven she's going to make it back. So, you guys?
I don't know that we have anyone that far exceeded
our expectations. You know, we've had some big
offers privately on a few cows that we've turned
down. There's several that, you know, you think
it's going to bring 5 ,000. It brings 12 ,000,
15 ,000, 17 ,000. It only takes two people. And
that's the thing. Exactly. You know, that's the
exact point. You get guys that go through and
we'll get heifers in the barn when they're prepped
for our sale. All you need is those two guys
that fall in love with that heifer or that young
cow. And they just go. And we're like, okay.
All right, you know, we'll take it. On the other
side, sometimes there's an animal that, like,
you'll really like, and it breaks half of what
you think. So, you know, we look at it as a law
of averages. It all has to average out. But,
yeah, I can't remember any specific examples.
Great job. Thank you, Jenny. Got any? Crown?
No, Crown. I have another one texted in, but
I'm going to put it in. Question, folks. Joy.
Hey, Joy. Joy to the world here. Go ahead. So
this is not necessarily a question about genetics.
It's a question about how long it took you guys
to get to where you are today. So I am a partner
in a family farm. I am the youngest partner.
I love the genetics, but I have to take it back.
My niece is a family farmer. She is younger than
me, but I was the youngest partner. I am in the
genetics. I love the genetics. I love the show
cow world and even the virtual genomic world.
I have my father who, you know, you smell cows.
That's all you do. Nothing. I have my sister
who is in finances and enjoys this part of it.
Supports me but doesn't love it like I do. And
then I have a brother -in -law who is kind of
on the next. I have a brother that supported
me on it who works at a law school a year ago
this time. Now I don't have his 100 % support.
One thing he would always do is back -weave on
every plant I would make. Whether it be 100 %
or 30 % back -weave. How do I convince the rest
of my partners, if you're doing the back -weave
on this, show them that this is a different opportunity
to help us be profitable at the next level? And
how long would you guys say it took you until
you broke into the nation? You're talking about
having other partners. Every one of your partners.
100 % love. Yeah, I'm trying to get my question
heard, but Mark, I'm not sure I'm 100 % sure.
Yeah, so our story, so Jonathan and I started
the genetic side. And, you know, luckily, large
families. So, you know, one partner focuses on
the crops, the manure. One partner focuses on...
you know, the commercial cows, if you want to
call it that. And Jonathan and I do the genetic
stuff. So, you know, it's kind of a distinct
in that regard. So it's nice. And, you know,
we started this back in 1997. We bought our first
animal. And in 2025, we won a brand expo, which
was incredible, right? So that's how, what, about
28 years, something like that, 29 years. You
know, when you start in this business and the
show side, you know, that's the ultimate goal,
I think. I mean, I think if you're showing cows,
that's the ultimate goal, right? And it took
us 28 years to get there. So I think, you know,
as you go through this progression, you got to
look at it incrementally. Like, you know, the
first couple of years, we were like third place
at our county fair. That's awesome. we didn't
lose you know that you know and then you go to
the state fair or regional fair and you do all
that so you really have to look at those things
incrementally so our first champion at a national
show was 2018. nathan was the judge there and
um i'll forever love him because he made my carol
sarah graham there and you know so that took
us 20 something years to get to that point and
then another almost 10 years So you really have
to look at those things incrementally. And I
think set expectations for where you want to
be. And I think those are the discussions that
you have to have with your partners is that,
no, we're not welcome. Yeah, you can go out and,
you know what, you want to buy a candy cane?
Okay, I'll sell it. Let me tell you how much
it's going to cost, though. And that's really
how you have to look at it. Yeah, you can go
in tomorrow if you want. It's going to cost a
fortune to get there. So if you look at those
steps, you know, baby steps, and doing it in
an economically responsible manner, just, you
know, set goals over the years to accomplish
that. And it's about branding. In your case,
you've got a great calf lady, and you've got
to involve brand name. Because every, and I know
what you're looking for. I know exactly what
you're looking for. But you've got to. I want
to enter both goals. I want to someday. It ain't
going to happen overnight. You know that. You
have to convince them. And so that they know
it's just not trying to support a dream. So we're
small, obviously. But everybody on our farm,
to say that they love to show cows is probably
not, that would be a lie. I mean, everybody's
kind of got their thing that they're really good
at. And everybody has a job. And that's small
scale versus your scale. But on the same token,
I think you have to show the value of what you're
doing. And that's merchandising. ever been to
your place you got a great great herd cows great
people just continue to you know market and merchandise
and show the income from those investments make
some investments that's the other part that we
don't maybe talk about we talk about selling
but buying into a good cow family and merchandising
them down the road i think that's where and you
keep the receipts so the investment on what your
return is on your investment and it's going to
take it's not going to happen overnight like
chris said but it's just slowly showing whether
it's selling embryos selling heifers out of that
there's always cost on the investment though
too if anybody's ever said that they've won on
everything only on one animal because it don't
work that way if you're 60 40 you're in a positive
very much i do have a question for alicia um
a little different uh more on your cheese business
what was the decision to go into cheese first
than any other dairy product and specifically
obviously Yeah, that was an interesting discussion.
So, you know, John and I had talked for years
about ways to diversify on the farm. And, you
know, we see neighbors making, you know, different
products, milk, yogurt, whatever. And you also
hear in anybody that's processing milk here in
this room probably knows milk has an expiration
date, right? So we did not want to get into milk.
full of milk because of the expiration day. So
what we do, we went into fresh cheese, which
has an expiration date. But the reality is that
we wanted to do something unique and different.
In New York, there's probably 500 different kinds
of cheddar cheeses that are made artisanally
and on farm. Maybe not 500, but there's a lot.
And there's a lot of yogurts that are made on
the farm. So we wanted to do something that was
very unique and very specific. And, you know,
in our research, you know, we had Molly went
out to grocery stores and said, what are people
asking for? Like, what is something, you know,
and a cheese or whatever? What is a dairy product
that is difficult to get that people are asking
for? And Mexican cheese came up multiple times.
So as we investigated that. And they really looked
into how many cheese processors in the U .S.
and in New York make Mexican -style cheeses.
There's three in New York. I think one shut down.
They're both in the city. And the Hispanic population
in New York State is like 20%. And in rural farming
areas, that population is even higher. And so
large farms, 60 % of our workforce is Hispanic.
where do you guys get your food from yeah it's
it's gross and you know some comes from texas
some comes from wisconsin it's gross it's you
know it's not authentic so little did we know
we had a built -in like a group of people that
could help us design a product that they liked
that was as unique and as representative of their
culture as we could help make it, you know, from
our cows in New York State. So a long answer
to your question, I apologize, but that's kind
of the story of how we got into the Mexican style
cheeses. And yeah, all three are fresh right
now, but we're looking at, Molly's working on
an aged cheese right now. So we'll get there
eventually and not have to have an expiration
date within like four or five weeks. Questions?
Go ahead. In reference to your cheese, are you
using the build from your show herd or from your
commercial herd for that? Yeah, so that's a good
question too. And initially we wanted to do it
from the show cow. So the way our show herd is,
we have 28 and like a little, I think it's a
3 ,000 pound tank or 3 ,000 pound tank. Anyhow,
it's a tiny little tank in there. And so we really
wanted to. process the mill from the show cows
however because of show seasons the the variability
across seasons was going to be way too extreme
so we actually pull it from the commercial herd
and process it right there's a small little area
right in the parlor building that we're processing
it right from the commercial herd any other questions
dwight is that for me or somebody else All right,
Jenny. We'll ask all four of them. Jenny, this
is from Dwight. Everybody knows Dwight. That's
a great question. Who was your greatest mentor?
What was the most valuable wisdom they imparted
to you? Very good question. There's been a lot
of them. I don't know if I can narrow it down
to one. i grew up on my family farm northeast
ohio um my family is there still milk house obviously
uh that's where i got my start um met nathan
out of ohio state fair he broke up with me once
and somehow we ended up back together but if
i tease him about that often that's your goal
yeah but uh you know honestly You know, mentors
are always people you look up to, and there's
been a lot of people that have helped us out
along the way, some with us still and some that
aren't. You know, Michael Heath was a great friend
to both Nathan and I and our whole family, and
we lost him. We had a lot of firsts, I would
say, together in the show world, on the sales
side. We always joked that, you know, a lot of
firsts, he was there, you know. the day after
our wedding, you know, on our couch. He was there,
you know, there was just a lot of things along
the way, but he was probably a big mentor for
us and helped us along the way with our sale
business, but also with the show cattle and helping
us kind of keep moving in the right direction.
Personally, I'd say Nathan, he's my best friend,
but, you know, we see a lot of things the same,
but he's helped me, I guess, along the way of
having a little more confidence in my opinions
and being able to voice those opinions and giving
me, I guess, the act beyond whether it's, you
know, judging or whether it's, you know, the
photography side or whether it's marketing, sometimes
it tells me things I don't want to hear and I
got to be open to that and be able to take it.
And after the first couple of four letter words,
you know, then, you know, accept it, move on
and be better for it. But I think that's. been
a good thing as far as our partnership as husband
and wife but also business partners just can
be tricky sometimes but has pushed us to be better
so where are we going wow we're gonna go down
the line uh so definitely my parents uh you know
they've been immersed in this world for forever
uh you know they met at a show a thousand years
ago approximately so so you know there were some
things that were sort of laid out like that but
uh we've been really fortunate my husband and
i and my parents were very open to be clear about
the things that they were really passionate about
on the cow side cow family side those kind of
things but at the same time being really open
to we want a little more cows okay that sounds
great it would be lovely if we could all buy
groceries every week and and you know not have
to pick a week of the month that So they were
pretty open to doing things differently. And
that's not just on the day -to -day farm activities.
I think that extends to what are we doing with
breeding cows and what are we doing with merchandising
as well. So that's been really important to us
to have their, I was going to say guidance, but
feedback. And somebody commented about lively
conversations. Those definitely happen as well
and are pretty helpful. So Jonathan has been
very fortunate with his business partner from
the farm. His dad is retired now. And there's
a non -family business partner that manages the
crops and the manure. And, you know, you think
about a couple of 20 -something kids back 30
years ago, you know, living on a shoestring and
living a dream or having a dream in your head.
And they kind of said, okay, you know, go for
it. And that's pretty incredible that, you know,
people that have a larger business, it was a
large farm at the time, still have the trust
and, yeah, like I said, a couple 20 -somethings
to be able to do that. So they've been incredible
mentors, especially Jonathan's dad has been so
supportive. You know, he's got Parkinson's. He'll
still, when you read something, when sheep's
ear came out, you know, he's like, oh, that's
so cool. You know, like as a person, you know,
we had a number one bullet, you know, and just
so supportive of the accomplishments that we've
had in this business for, you know, the past
20 something, almost 30 years. So that's, you
know, incredible mentorship for us. From the
marketing side, two of the best friends, two
of the best people, I should say, three. um that
we've ever had were dave and mary rama and horace
bacchus um we started our sale series back when
we had like nothing you know and they came in
and you know rubbed you up and built you up and
you got the greatest thing you know you average
2500 bucks on the sale i was like all right we
did good you know um and then horses uh he always
would say buy the best and breed them better
and that's something that we really took to heart
and that we really worked with and And those
guys, from the marketing standpoint, just, you
know, you can't replace people like that. And
we were so fortunate that they were supportive
of us in our early days and still to this day
they're on us. Yeah, that's a great question
to think about. I had a little time, so I was
glad I was more than on this one. But, yeah,
I would say for me, for sure, my dad, he certainly,
you know, he was a German immigrant. And he worked
hard, and he sure taught us to work hard. You
know, we used to pick on him all the time about,
you know, we'd have to go pitch frozen corn stalks
to bed heifers, and there'd be a five -tine fork
with only two tines on it. But that's what he
believed in, and I never regret that for a minute.
I also had a professor friend at Cornell, Dr.
Galton, with huge influence on me as a young
person to dream big, plan well, and the sky's
the limit. And I don't know that I would have
done some of the things that I did without his
influence, so really appreciate that. And then
as we got into the show world more, my boys and
I do it as a team with my voice. Bussing most
of the time. But we really do. And when there's
disagreement, it's always going to be two boys
against one dad. That's usually how it goes.
But good, wrong, great. We talk about it every
day. We live it every day. And I'm sure they
would tell you that, you know, Jim Olsen and
John Foster's at Milk Source have had a tremendous
influence on them and the business side and what
they do in the show and merchandising world as
well. Thanks, Beaton. And for me, it's obviously
your mother and your father are your number one
mentors. And I certainly echo that. I lost my
dad at a very young age. I was 23 years old.
I lost my dad to cancer. Some of you knew him.
Some of you didn't. But he was an estate auctioneer.
And he's what handed off the love of auctioneering
to me. And my mother, she raised a wild child
for a while. And he got in control of that most
of the way. Definitely my parents. I was brought
up doing the right thing. They taught me to do
the right thing. They taught me to treat everybody
as you treat yourself. I also say that about
my uncle. When my dad died, my uncle Norman kind
of took over keeping me in line, and I worked
with him on a lot of sales. But nobody more important
than my wife, Jen, and her parents, and her cousin,
Chad. Boy, I was so fortunate to marry into that
family. And they've just done me great. And I
love what we've got going now. We've got to have
a small partnership and some cattle and show
cattle. Not family members. Probably one of the
guys that gave me my most chance was Richard
Green, the guy that single -handedly made the
red breed what it is today. Richard was one hell
of a guy. If you happen to know him, he loved
red cattle. And if there was a good red cow,
he was going to buy it. for whatever it cost.
He gave me my chance at managing sales. I managed
Greenlee there for a little while, and the other
one is Curtis and Ann Day. They gave me the opportunity
to manage their dispersal when they quit milking
cows, and that's when Dean and Ashland were hot.
It was a very, very successful sale when they
lived in Shippensburg, and I certainly appreciate
them for giving me that opportunity, but I could
go on and on and on about the people that have
done me well, and I certainly appreciate it.
More questions for the crowd, but more particularly,
I'm thrilled that there's a lot of youth in here.
Are there any juniors that have a question? Don't
be shy. I don't even see any arms up. Anyone?
Okay. I do have one that somebody texted in,
and we can go a little past three if we need
to. I already know the answer, but I'm going
to ask it for everybody to answer. If someone
loves cattle but does not show or have receipts
to market index animals, how can they invest
in the business? Yeah, I think we talked about
that a little bit. You know, there's lots of
ways to get into the business. Partnerships are
a great way. That's allowed us to do things that...
would be absolutely impossible without those
partnerships. We could never be involved in some
of the cattle that we've been involved in without
having great partners. So that takes more work,
and it takes a lot of effort. Communication is
paramount. Having similar goals and direction
is really important in that. but um two people
can get more done than one so i think that's
a great way and then specifically with embryos
or ivf sessions allows you to get into cattle
that maybe you couldn't afford otherwise but
partnerships are fantastic if you're good at
communication yeah i don't quite know how to
answer this i think you could look at it and
go a few different ways so if If, yeah, you don't
have the financial means to buy a big one, try
to partner up with somebody like Pete said. I
think that's one way to do it. The other thing
is, you know, you don't always have to like be
on the farm. There's other ways to be involved
in this industry than working on a farm. You
know, I'm looking, I got Miss Jean out of the
corner of my eye here, who I saw come in crutches
and I'm going to ask you what's going on. But,
you know. You can invest in this industry in
so many ways. You know, Jean works for Dane,
and it's, you know, an amazing thing that she's
doing, promoting, you know, the products that
we make every day. And that's, you know, maybe
not a financial investment in animal, though
she has done that as well. But, you know, there's
different ways to do that. If you want to, you
know, yeah, go work on a farm, we have robots.
you know, working with a robotic company to just,
you know, learn the different aspects of working
in this industry. There's so many different ways
to be involved, ways I definitely did not know
about when I was a young person, and I wish I
did. Not that I regret any decisions or the direction
that my life was taken, but I just, you know,
there's so many opportunities out there for people
to be involved in this industry, and there's
different ways to invest in this industry. Yeah,
be creative. I mean, just think of the raccoon.
It's trash can, not trash can. But I think, you
know, whether it's Mark, that was Scott. It's
one of those, like, there's a little thought
bubble that seems we're going to have to talk
about it. It's all right. But be creative. I
mean, I think if we think about the opportunities
for young people and thinking of the two mirrors
and more of the population is young people, and
I think of my age now, and that's really disconcerting.
Your career path and your involvement in the
dairy industry is going to look different than
ours did. The opportunities are different. I
mean, it's not, I'd like to be a herds person
on a farm, or I'm not going to be on the farm,
or I'd like to be on the show site, I'd like
to be a fitter, or I'm not going to be involved.
I mean, there are a lot of in -betweens, whether
it's partners, but communicating. communicate
on that. And maybe it's some weird opportunity
that you feel like just falls into your lap.
That goes back to the communication and that
goes back to the connections, like the people
that are sitting in this room and the people
that, you know, maybe you follow on social media
or maybe there's some weird connection that you
didn't even realize that you were two people
removed from somebody else and take advantage
of those connections and be willing to take a
little bit of risk. I mean, calculate a risk,
obviously, be aware of what you're getting into,
but take a little risk. I'll try to pick up the
crumbs from everything everybody else said here,
but all good points. I think from the marketing
standpoint or from the sale management standpoint,
there is a buy in every sale, no matter how good
the sale is. We talked about, you know, cattle
that exceeded your expectations, but there's
some that don't meet the expectations of what
you think. We've all done it. There's sold animals
that we thought we sold maybe under value. There
are multiple buys in every sale. Kind of talk
to somebody you trust, pay attention, attend
those sales and pedigrees, great pedigrees are
out there. On another note, I mean, we've had
a lot of interns come to our farm and work for
us and help us over the years. And some have
opted to be paid in embryos. That's one way to
get into families and, you know, do some work.
Get embryos for payment to also make your herd
and create your own herd. Thank you very much,
Jenny. Should be winding this up if there's any
more. I got one over the text line just now that
said, ask the group what animal, they've all
sold animals for a lot of money in public sales.
Which one of your animals that you sold in a
public sale blew you away the most? With the
brown slip -on. It was a jersey. Mac and cheese.
She exceeded our expectations. We knew she was
special, but like you said, it takes a couple
people that get excited about one, and that was
one that... they kind of went at war, and it
was fun to watch, and I don't know if I'll ever
get to see it again. We loved being the generals.
Yeah, I mean, I sat there, and I think I was
lurking and shaking at the same time, and that
was one of our first sales that we had. First
year, I think we did jerseys, and it was pretty
crazy. Yeah, I don't know if there's one special.
Certainly not in the type side. We kind of knew
where they would land. When we did have our sale,
we had consignments. When we had a state picnic
sale, we did our own thing with that. And genomics
were really hot, and we were playing in that
arena. We had an animal that was over 20 ,000,
and she brought 100. So that was a wild day,
and you just never know, right? But we just didn't
expect it. Yeah, there's so many good stories
about public sales. I mean, it's good when you
undershoot them, but sometimes when you overshoot
them, that brings you back down to reality, and
that does happen too. But that's something we
have to accept, and that goes back to what all
these people said. Don't be afraid. If I had
to look back on my life when I'm getting way
old, I would have taken more risk because you
can't look at it in the bank. I mean, if you
take a little bit of risk, see what happens,
but you also have to remember you're dealing
with, a perishable product. Yeah, I do have one
more. I brought up the Genomic Set. I forgot
about it. We sold an IVF session from a sheepster.
It's at 2024 at World Classic and expected. We'll
just say she brought 10 times more than we thought
we'd get from her, which was we were sitting
at dinner and John was like, okay, let's get
another bottle of wine now. So we had a nice
night that night. So it blew us away. You guys
think those were complete lightning strikes?
Or was there something that helped you? And that
was where my question was kind of going. Was
there something that pushed that momentum to
making that lightning strike happen? That's where
I was kind of getting at, Chris. Well, for me,
it was a cow at bread. Sunburst. We sold her
up at the Intrigua. It was a Blondin. And we
knew she was going to break a lot of money. Boy,
would you breed one, and she sells for that much
money. Now, there were several partners, but
it kind of makes you feel great. What was the
way you think, I mean, did you feel the momentum
coming? Yeah, because she was undefeated. She
had won New York Spring Show black and red, and
Jeffrey was all over us wanting to sell her,
so I knew we had her feet on the ground going
into it. Now, that much of what she bought, my
feet were off the ground. I think as a consigner
sale manager, you try to do all the right things.
You're trying, you have that animal broke, you
have them ready, you have them in show shape,
you have them, you did the pictures, you did
the videos, you do everything possible. You make
the phone calls. I mean, everything's kind of,
you got to build everything up, but then there's
a little bit of luck involved. I mean, let's
just be honest. I mean, you try to do all your
homework and do everything you possibly can that's
in your control. But again, until those, you
get in that room and, As sale management, you
try to build an atmosphere that's exciting. If
we all sat here and talked monotone, how exciting
of an atmosphere is that? You got to build an
event and build some excitement, have some hospitality.
It all plays into it. And we all like to come
together. I mean, sales are social events for
people. We all like going to them and talking,
visiting, catching up, seeing good cattle. But
if you bring it and create a buzz and get that
atmosphere going and get all the right people
in the room, I think that's what helps make a
really successful event. And sometimes what else
is cool is you'll be in the sale atmosphere three
hours before a sale starts, you know, and you'll
have a cow there that's trying to get sold for
a lot of money and somebody will walk up to you
and say, Hey, are you here? Jimmy Smith says
he's interested in her. Like, whoa, what the
heck does he want her for? So I don't know, but
he's interested. So some other guys listening
to you say that Jimmy Smith wants that cow. Well,
two guys on staff heard you, too, so they're
calling over. Oh, Jimmy Smith wants that cow.
You know, she must be wanting that other cow.
Oh, yeah, Jimmy Smith wants her. I won't make
you pay. But then, done. See, people are competitive.
I'm not going to say any names, but we know something.
We'll not quit when they want something. I will
be here tonight. Or she will. And up, Joshua.
Sorry, Gene. Oh, Gene, that was nice. You had
a hurt leg and he didn't even pick you. And he
hit me with a chair. It was an accident. Joshua.
The same thing we were just talking about. I
think all of the people in the corral and there's
numerous sales managers, people that have had
their sales. What are some things, maybe, for
example, if you get asked to call the market
sale, what are some things that you can do to
help make those cattle bring money to work inside
the farm to have their own sale? So, whether
hiring a good sale manager, like Chris, or a
manager, or what are some things down that line
that you can do? As far as hiring, like people
to help you, you have to hire the people that
best represent the cattle. You have to match
the product with the man that's selling the product
with his clientele. You know what I mean? Like
you can't have a high -type slash share. I shouldn't
say it that way. I'm just being a high -type
sale and get your top genomic guy in the country.
He's not going to be any good because he don't
represent the kind of people that buy that kind
of cow. And vice versa, if you have a genomic
sale, for instance, the sale on the Sun Series.
None of us guys could have worked that sale because
we don't have genomic clientele. That's just
kind of the way. You've got to match the product
with the person that's selling the product, right?
Yeah, I would say it comes down to presentation
and promotion, right? Do the job with the cattle
at home. Do the job with the cattle at the sale.
Have the right cattle to fit the sale. And promote,
promote, promote. Sell those cattle. Make phone
calls. And get it out there. And I was just going
to say one thing on the last question, too, is
you have to get involved. If you want to get
in, we're a small industry, right? But I bet
most of you know all the people here because
you see them, right? They're involved in things
outside of just their own farm. And you have
to do that because you rub shoulders with others
that think like you do and want to sell cattle
and buy cattle and are involved in what you love.
So I think it's really important to serve on
committees, get involved, meet people, learn
from people, ask lots of questions. That is going
to propel you a lot faster than if you stay in
your own farm and see nothing but your own farm.
And I know it's tough to get off. I get that.
But you have to make that effort if you want
to branch out. And I'll say, like, for us with
our sale, JB. Black. Like I said, I think he
said he manages her shop outside. He's the one
that's making contacts to reach out to people
to work or sale. And when he calls those people,
he knows that they have a built -in, if you want
to call it that, buyers list. That said, yeah,
whatever Joe Bob, whatever he said his name was,
he's got certain people that he's going to call,
you know, to that they know that those people
trust. jim bob here and are gonna you know he's
gonna call them they're gonna say what do you
really think of this animal this is what we want
what do you think of her and you know that's
uh that's how we select or how jane i should
say selects our sale contacts for ourselves and
they're not hard for selling bad cattle either
they're hard because they call the right people
for the right fit and they need to be on staff
just like we were talking I shouldn't say nobody,
but not as many people go to sales anymore. Yeah,
I would agree with that. I think when I think
of sales that we've had, sales that you go to,
and you think of people on sales staff that you
just know, you're 100 % confident that you can
trust their assessment of an animal. I mean,
think back to Raymond LeBlanc, always worried
about a million and a half sales, and you could
be 100 % confident that whatever he told you
about... a lot and a sale was exactly exactly
what she was and you know when when we're on
the buying side i mean that's the kind of person
you want to contact to tell me more about that
animal have you seen them have you what else
what else should i need to know what and on the
selling side you want to be confident that those
are the people that are on sales staff that are
going to make sure that it ends up going mostly
to your expectations As a sale manager, I mean,
we try to put people on staff from geographically
different places. So that way, if somebody in
PA, if we have somebody from this area that people
would trust, that you would know, a familiar
face, somebody that you talk to. But we try and
cover kind of the U .S. and Canada geographically
with a variety of trustworthy people. And I think
it's important, too, that we hire people that
are going to reach out to clientele. They're
not just going to go to your sale, and we have
to give them a check for working a sale promoting
your animal, and they're going to sit there and
say, well, nobody called me because it's not
your job. You're supposed to call people. You're
supposed to create interest. And that was one
of Raymond's best attributes. He would bring
them. Raymond would bring a whole book, and he
would call every single person. That's gone as
far as I'm concerned. There's not many people
that do. There is some, but there's not many.
And it's just like the job of being a ring man.
That's trying to disappear after the first 20.
We have to start recruiting people to be a ring
man. So folks, if you're on staff today, make
sure you keep your job or we'll try to embarrass
you. David? Jean? So mine is more of an observation
and kind of a... sort of a lesson for the kids
and everything, but I, back in 2018, there was
this little white calf, a little December white
calf that was on the outfield sale. I just loved
her, and I thought, I don't need to buy anything,
I don't need to buy anything. It was the end
of the sale, and I commented how many at the
outfield sale. Yeah, you can, yeah, we'll sell
it to you for $2 ,200. Because I saw the video,
because they did such an amazing job, and I just,
I love a white calf and water. for 22 hundred
bucks and it was oakfield theme or frisbee who
is a sister to footloose and that was before
footloose was footloose and so sometimes you
have to think about trusting your gut and like
joy said and same with my swiss i bought from
joy she sent me a picture and i was like i need
that like i have to have that and so and so my
point is too But my other point to tie into was
what I said, was that as the years went by, I
kept in touch with Jamie Black about Frisbee.
And he kept in touch with her. And Alicia knew
who she was. And then when she did well at Harrisburg,
Jamie Black comes over and takes her from me
and takes her to my house. And then she's part
of the senior best three with Footloose. And
so that's, to Joy's point, it takes a long time.
I mean, that doesn't happen overnight. And so
I think these conversations are so great, and
I just think a lot of it is trusting your gut,
too. Like, what you like, and it is luck. I mean,
it is luck that I like a calf who's a sister
to Footloose, who then became Footloose. But
I just, I commend all of you. I think you've
all done a great job, and I just hope everybody
wins something. I think it's so cool. Thank you.
Oh, and I have a granddaughter at Frisbee in
the sale tonight. That's how we know we're able
to do it. We want to promote your own product
because nobody else is going to do it for you.
David, PHA, I don't know in wrapping up, but
what's your... I'm just going to add that after
Footloose brought $350 ,000 at Duck and Sale
that day, the next one in the ring was her daughter
by Denver. Denver is a little... No, not hot,
but she was a good happener. Michael Hughes,
Royal Vista from Wisconsin, bought her. He's
got a whole new franchise. And she's 94 points.
And she's 94 points, and she's a brood cow. He
started his franchise, and if you ask him, everybody
else was buzzing about what Footloose just brought,
and he was the guy who was interested in buying
that effort. He pulled the trigger. Trust me,
you're going to hear a lot more about the name
of Royal Vista. But that's what's cool about
that family. When you buy from the F family,
you've got to remember that it's more bottom
side than top side. Because Footloose is out
of Nebraska, and she's a Denver out in La Sala.
And breeding great stuff. So don't run down all
the bulls before you look at these patterns.
But take advantage of Footloose's top side. Big
rib, wide rump, close rib, flat rump. She had
all the tools. She overcame herself. Thank you.
I think we've had two really nice seminars today.
Hats off to you, David, and your staff. It's
all about the people. Again, it's all about the
people. These cows bring us together, but the
connections, the friendships, the trust, that's
what makes it all great. So we just coached Trump
for two and a half hours. It's pretty awesome.
But before we give them a rousing round of applause,
just a little housekeeping. The pre -sale meal
is going to be a buffet. It's served out there.
If you already have a ticket, you can eat the
food. Otherwise, you can hang out in here, and
we have the sale starting at 7. But the food's
from 6 .30 to 7 .30. But before that, if you
would like to see our best and brightest dairy
bowlers go at it, the finals will be... You can't
go through that door, but it's on the other side
of that wall. It's a series of rooms, fur, hemlock,
elm, and hickory. But if you'd like to check
that out and check out Dairy Bowl and see how
our Pennsylvania kids are doing, you're invited
to do that at 4 o 'clock. The Dairy Bar is excellent,
so enjoy that. We thank you for your questions.
Give these folks a big round. Maybe you can stand
up. That's the full Market Like a Pro panel from
the Pennsylvania Holstein Association Convention.
Again, massive thanks to PHA running this great
session. Be sure to check out polsteins .com
for their events, sales, and youth programs.
Key takeaways, consign your best, stand behind
what you sell, use social, cow buyer, and embryo
sales to beat low milk prices, and build relationships.
Your prefix travels farther than any truck. If
this fired you up, Head to thebullvine .com for
the full article with photos of Footloose, Dundee
Page, Candy Cane, and more, plus our breeding
rankings, TPI lists, and farm profiles. Subscribe
wherever you get podcasts, like, share on Facebook,
and drop a comment. What's your go -to move for
marketing registered cattle? From the Bullvine
team, keep challenging the sacred cows. See you
next time.