WEBVTT 00:00:11.720 --> 00:00:15.060 Breaking free from the chains of the past Where 00:00:15.060 --> 00:00:18.820 truth moves faster than a Holstein calf No law 00:00:18.820 --> 00:00:21.660 waiting on some printed page We're charting new 00:00:21.660 --> 00:00:25.300 ground in the digital age From genomic codes 00:00:25.300 --> 00:00:29.120 to robot facts We cut through the noise, no hold 00:00:29.280 --> 00:00:32.460 them back not your daddy's dairy news tonight 00:00:32.460 --> 00:01:02.960 we're sparking This is the Bullvine Podcast, 00:01:03.460 --> 00:01:05.900 where dairy pros come for straight talk, hard 00:01:05.900 --> 00:01:08.819 data, and no -nonsense know -how from the people 00:01:08.819 --> 00:01:12.659 who actually do the work. Today's episode, judge 00:01:12.659 --> 00:01:15.480 the cow in front of you, not the crowd. We're 00:01:15.480 --> 00:01:17.620 bringing you ringside with internationally renowned 00:01:17.620 --> 00:01:20.299 judge Callum McKinvan, recorded live in Ecuador. 00:01:21.019 --> 00:01:23.420 Callum's judged in more than 30 countries and 00:01:23.420 --> 00:01:26.519 four decades of shows. His message is simple, 00:01:26.599 --> 00:01:30.230 and it hits home. Arrive prepared. Keep the ring 00:01:30.230 --> 00:01:32.969 moving, stick to a repeatable evaluation pattern, 00:01:33.129 --> 00:01:36.569 and when it's time to talk, don't memorize. See 00:01:36.569 --> 00:01:40.390 it, say it. Three clear, positive, trait -based 00:01:40.390 --> 00:01:43.489 reasons. If you're a young judge, this is your 00:01:43.489 --> 00:01:45.930 playbook for the next show. If you've judged 00:01:45.930 --> 00:01:48.430 for years, it's the tune -up that keeps exhibitor 00:01:48.430 --> 00:01:51.569 trust high and politics out of the ring. In this 00:01:51.569 --> 00:01:53.890 session, you'll hear why distance viewing matters. 00:01:54.430 --> 00:01:56.810 how to manage class speed without losing confidence, 00:01:57.069 --> 00:01:59.250 what to say in youth classes so kids leave wanting 00:01:59.250 --> 00:02:01.670 to come back, and how to place the famous cow 00:02:01.670 --> 00:02:04.629 that's off her game without flinching. Grab a 00:02:04.629 --> 00:02:07.609 notebook. We're going to talk balance, locomotion, 00:02:07.750 --> 00:02:10.830 rib and angularity, utter attachments, clear 00:02:10.830 --> 00:02:13.550 pointing, and that bottom six strategy every 00:02:13.550 --> 00:02:17.449 youth judge should use. Let's get into it. We're 00:02:17.449 --> 00:02:20.610 going to touch on a little bit before the animals 00:02:20.610 --> 00:02:25.830 come on maybe ethics of a judge. And some of 00:02:25.830 --> 00:02:30.310 these things are as I say and not as I do. I'm 00:02:30.310 --> 00:02:32.469 not the most organized person in the world, so 00:02:32.469 --> 00:02:35.349 when I get asked to judge a show, it's great 00:02:35.349 --> 00:02:37.490 that I have an incredible wife that she'll mark 00:02:37.490 --> 00:02:40.270 down the date and everything, but sometimes I 00:02:40.270 --> 00:02:43.030 don't do that. And as advice, when you get asked 00:02:43.030 --> 00:02:45.669 to judge a show, put it somewhere, mark it down 00:02:45.669 --> 00:02:48.229 so you don't miss that event or forget that event. 00:02:48.830 --> 00:02:53.110 I've been fortunate enough to judge for, I guess 00:02:53.110 --> 00:02:57.150 it's pretty close to, 40 years, a little more 00:02:57.150 --> 00:03:00.430 than 40 years. I started judging when I was 19. 00:03:00.550 --> 00:03:03.530 I did my first show. And when the show asked 00:03:03.530 --> 00:03:08.270 me, official letter, they thought I was a man 00:03:08.270 --> 00:03:10.969 of 40 years old. So when I showed up and I was 00:03:10.969 --> 00:03:13.889 judging the young people that were older than 00:03:13.889 --> 00:03:17.689 me, it was pretty... When I saw that, I'm like, 00:03:17.789 --> 00:03:21.490 wow, this is kind of scary. But the big thing, 00:03:21.530 --> 00:03:25.229 I guess, is when you're judging... Try to have 00:03:25.229 --> 00:03:29.090 the most confidence you can. And by that I mean 00:03:29.090 --> 00:03:34.210 there's a fine line between confidence and arrogance. 00:03:34.830 --> 00:03:37.550 So you want to be confident, but don't look... 00:03:37.550 --> 00:03:40.750 In English we call it cocky. Don't look cocky. 00:03:40.770 --> 00:03:44.610 Just be yourself with the people. Be nice with 00:03:44.610 --> 00:03:47.610 the people in the ring. Don't give the impression 00:03:47.610 --> 00:03:51.370 that you're the scary guy or scary person. But 00:03:51.370 --> 00:03:56.159 be confident, but friendly. Then we'll touch 00:03:56.159 --> 00:04:01.780 on the day you're judging. You should dress up 00:04:01.780 --> 00:04:03.419 a little bit when you're a judge. I think you 00:04:03.419 --> 00:04:08.000 should be recognizable to the exhibitors that 00:04:08.000 --> 00:04:11.819 you're a judge and not just be maybe wearing 00:04:11.819 --> 00:04:14.340 jeans and a t -shirt. You should maybe have, 00:04:14.520 --> 00:04:17.339 it doesn't have to be a tie or shirt depending 00:04:17.339 --> 00:04:20.420 which country you're in, but at least dress up 00:04:20.420 --> 00:04:22.279 a little bit so that you say, oh yeah, that's 00:04:22.279 --> 00:04:25.040 the judge. I've gone, I've I've been lucky enough 00:04:25.040 --> 00:04:28.959 that this would have been the 32nd country I've 00:04:28.959 --> 00:04:32.040 judged in the world. And there's one country 00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:36.220 I've gone 25 times. And every country is a little 00:04:36.220 --> 00:04:39.560 different. Some countries I go, it's very efficient. 00:04:40.220 --> 00:04:44.800 Some countries I go, it's more relaxed. And I 00:04:44.800 --> 00:04:47.240 guess through the years I've learned that, and 00:04:47.240 --> 00:04:51.060 for anybody who's going international judging, 00:04:52.300 --> 00:04:56.560 I always try to check before what it is like 00:04:56.560 --> 00:04:59.279 there as far as the judges are expected, what 00:04:59.279 --> 00:05:02.060 they're expected of. So if I'm going to England, 00:05:02.259 --> 00:05:05.519 I know it's very official. They don't want you 00:05:05.519 --> 00:05:10.600 to see anybody except the day you arrive, the 00:05:10.600 --> 00:05:13.079 judge counts. I go to South America, they want 00:05:13.079 --> 00:05:15.339 to take you out for dinner, meet all the exhibitors, 00:05:15.660 --> 00:05:18.879 have a few drinks. It's just a little different. 00:05:18.980 --> 00:05:22.610 So I try to fit in whatever country I go. The 00:05:22.610 --> 00:05:26.670 day of the show, try to arrive at least 30 minutes 00:05:26.670 --> 00:05:30.449 before you're judging that show. So you have 00:05:30.449 --> 00:05:32.850 time to talk to the people in the ring how to 00:05:32.850 --> 00:05:35.089 set it up, where you're going to stand to give 00:05:35.089 --> 00:05:40.269 your reasons, all that stuff. And that's, I've 00:05:40.269 --> 00:05:43.649 cut it close a few times. Sometimes you end up 00:05:43.649 --> 00:05:46.810 being delayed in traffic. So I always try now 00:05:46.810 --> 00:05:50.069 to leave myself lots of time to get there plenty 00:05:50.069 --> 00:05:54.209 of time before the show. And one thing, when 00:05:54.209 --> 00:05:57.389 you do start judging and you've judged some shows, 00:05:57.610 --> 00:06:03.829 try never to look to the crowd. Try to just focus 00:06:03.829 --> 00:06:06.810 on the ring because if you look at the crowd 00:06:06.810 --> 00:06:09.250 and you see somebody shaking their head no, it 00:06:09.250 --> 00:06:12.569 just takes away your confidence. And so you're 00:06:12.569 --> 00:06:15.629 the person judging that day, so just ignore what 00:06:15.629 --> 00:06:18.629 the people on the outside are acting like and 00:06:18.629 --> 00:06:21.540 just go ahead. and place them the way you see 00:06:21.540 --> 00:06:24.600 them, and keep your confidence. And if you're 00:06:24.600 --> 00:06:27.920 asked to judge the young handlers, the younger 00:06:27.920 --> 00:06:32.259 children, it's pretty hard for those children 00:06:32.259 --> 00:06:35.600 going in a ring. It takes a lot of confidence. 00:06:35.720 --> 00:06:38.100 Like, they're intimidated. So if you come in 00:06:38.100 --> 00:06:41.519 with this stern look on your face, like you're 00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:44.319 scary, they're not going to relate to you. So 00:06:44.319 --> 00:06:47.060 I always... try to really let the children know 00:06:47.060 --> 00:06:49.620 I'll say good morning, and I'll try to have a 00:06:49.620 --> 00:06:52.319 smile and let them know you're not this bad person, 00:06:52.420 --> 00:06:55.300 you're just there to judge them. And so that 00:06:55.300 --> 00:06:58.000 sets up a good relationship with the kids right 00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:00.579 off, and they know they can actually talk to 00:07:00.579 --> 00:07:04.939 you and relate to you. They're a lot more comfortable. 00:07:05.300 --> 00:07:07.800 And before we go too much farther, I want to 00:07:07.800 --> 00:07:12.350 say for the younger judges, I was very fortunate. 00:07:12.449 --> 00:07:16.170 I grew up with a father that was a judge. And 00:07:16.170 --> 00:07:18.930 I learned so much from my father. When I was 00:07:18.930 --> 00:07:21.470 like eight, nine years old, we were judging a 00:07:21.470 --> 00:07:24.689 cow class in a magazine. He'd say, just give 00:07:24.689 --> 00:07:27.910 me a set of reasons. And that's how I learned 00:07:27.910 --> 00:07:32.769 to give reasons. And then I met my wife at a 00:07:32.769 --> 00:07:35.829 very young age. We were together. And her father 00:07:35.829 --> 00:07:38.610 was recognizable as one of the best judges in 00:07:38.610 --> 00:07:42.160 the world. And he really is my mentor. He's taught 00:07:42.160 --> 00:07:47.360 me so much about judging. And I always took his 00:07:47.360 --> 00:07:50.339 advice to heart every time he told me. So for 00:07:50.339 --> 00:07:54.220 you younger people, and you know somebody that's 00:07:54.220 --> 00:07:56.839 a judge in your country, don't be scared to go 00:07:56.839 --> 00:07:59.360 up and say, how should I act? What should I do? 00:08:00.240 --> 00:08:04.019 Ask for advice. They're going to help you. I 00:08:04.019 --> 00:08:06.819 remember when I started judging at a young age, 00:08:06.839 --> 00:08:09.620 that first show I judged, I never talked on the 00:08:09.620 --> 00:08:15.100 microphone. And I did. I wasn't comfortable with 00:08:15.100 --> 00:08:18.500 it. And every time I brought it too close, it 00:08:18.500 --> 00:08:21.060 would squeal. And so I started my first class, 00:08:21.079 --> 00:08:24.639 and I'm like, my heart's going like this. So 00:08:24.639 --> 00:08:26.420 I learned where to hold it, where people could 00:08:26.420 --> 00:08:28.759 hear me, and I wasn't making a noise, and where 00:08:28.759 --> 00:08:31.079 to stand in the rain that that didn't happen. 00:08:31.259 --> 00:08:35.129 That's important. And I remember... I was lucky 00:08:35.129 --> 00:08:37.070 with those animals. I think the first class I 00:08:37.070 --> 00:08:40.750 had, it was 36. And my father always said, get 00:08:40.750 --> 00:08:42.750 them in and get them out, but look at them all 00:08:42.750 --> 00:08:46.110 equally. My friend was judging in the other ring, 00:08:46.190 --> 00:08:49.169 experienced judge. He had five animals, and he 00:08:49.169 --> 00:08:51.529 had judged for years. And I was given my reasons 00:08:51.529 --> 00:08:54.009 on my 36, and his five were still going around. 00:08:54.250 --> 00:08:57.570 So it was maybe a little bit too fast. But I 00:08:57.570 --> 00:09:01.669 think if you take too long, you lose the confidence 00:09:01.669 --> 00:09:05.190 of the examiners. And if you go too fast, they 00:09:05.190 --> 00:09:07.549 don't think you're looking at the animals enough. 00:09:08.129 --> 00:09:13.169 So you'll know when you judge how quick you should 00:09:13.169 --> 00:09:16.110 be. But if you're scratching your head and you're 00:09:16.110 --> 00:09:17.870 out there scratching your head and you're like, 00:09:17.990 --> 00:09:22.490 you're losing their confidence in your job. So 00:09:22.490 --> 00:09:24.350 try it. That's what I mean by have confidence. 00:09:25.210 --> 00:09:28.250 And the speed is very important. And you've got 00:09:28.250 --> 00:09:31.110 to make sure you're not racing through, but you 00:09:31.110 --> 00:09:33.669 don't want to take all day to do a class. And 00:09:33.669 --> 00:09:35.889 the best piece of advice I can give you today, 00:09:36.090 --> 00:09:40.330 don't try to memorize your reasons. I did that. 00:09:40.509 --> 00:09:44.210 And I'm like, oh, these were six. I go to the 00:09:44.210 --> 00:09:45.730 mic and I'm trying to remember what I was going 00:09:45.730 --> 00:09:49.610 to say. Your eyes tell you. So when you judge 00:09:49.610 --> 00:09:52.070 those animals, you go out to the mic, you're 00:09:52.070 --> 00:09:54.200 comfortable. When those animals come out, You 00:09:54.200 --> 00:09:57.100 know why you did it. Talk about what you see. 00:09:57.980 --> 00:09:59.860 Don't talk about what you're trying to memorize. 00:10:00.159 --> 00:10:03.200 And that is the best piece of advice I can give 00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:05.899 you as a judge. Even for the experienced judges, 00:10:06.000 --> 00:10:09.590 sometimes you like to turn your back and face 00:10:09.590 --> 00:10:13.230 the crowd in the class behind you, I say, look 00:10:13.230 --> 00:10:15.629 at what you're talking about. Look at the animals 00:10:15.629 --> 00:10:19.009 as they're coming out. You'll know. She's flatter, 00:10:19.330 --> 00:10:21.769 nicer in her bone quality. She's longer in her 00:10:21.769 --> 00:10:24.409 neck, or she's got a better foreattachment, longer 00:10:24.409 --> 00:10:28.029 foreattachment. You'll know why you did it. And 00:10:28.029 --> 00:10:31.429 that is something that probably is the best piece 00:10:31.429 --> 00:10:34.490 of advice. Just a couple more things so we don't 00:10:34.490 --> 00:10:38.529 go too long, but be concise when you're choosing 00:10:38.529 --> 00:10:41.179 your animal. I show them their judges, and they'll 00:10:41.179 --> 00:10:44.519 go around like this. And you're like, did he 00:10:44.519 --> 00:10:48.580 point to me? So make sure they know you're pointing 00:10:48.580 --> 00:10:51.399 to them. Because if you're not concise, you're 00:10:51.399 --> 00:10:53.740 going to end up with somebody in the middle that 00:10:53.740 --> 00:10:56.320 shouldn't be there, and then you're in a bad 00:10:56.320 --> 00:11:00.120 situation. So then the bad part is you don't 00:11:00.120 --> 00:11:03.639 want to make those people leave. So usually I'll 00:11:03.639 --> 00:11:05.259 just say, you might have to stand here a while. 00:11:05.340 --> 00:11:06.879 I'm going to bring some and send them ahead. 00:11:07.480 --> 00:11:09.710 Okay. Because you're not there to embarrass anybody. 00:11:10.049 --> 00:11:12.649 So if you're concise, you're not going to get 00:11:12.649 --> 00:11:15.230 in that situation. You're going to say, you, 00:11:15.429 --> 00:11:19.730 you, you. Even if I have a ring person, when 00:11:19.730 --> 00:11:22.350 I'm judging them, I watch out my eye to make 00:11:22.350 --> 00:11:24.509 sure the right ones are coming in. Because if 00:11:24.509 --> 00:11:26.549 they've got 10 feet and they're not moving, I'll 00:11:26.549 --> 00:11:29.129 just say, no, no, just stay. Before they get 00:11:29.129 --> 00:11:32.509 embarrassed of coming in. So that's really important. 00:11:32.789 --> 00:11:34.789 It's like a traffic director in life. You've 00:11:34.789 --> 00:11:36.889 got to be concise. You've got to know you're 00:11:36.889 --> 00:11:39.409 the one to get in. pointing to whoever you are. 00:11:39.570 --> 00:11:43.570 Just one little, it sounds silly, but it's true. 00:11:44.830 --> 00:11:48.409 Wear something on your feet that looks proper, 00:11:48.610 --> 00:11:52.509 but it's comfortable. Don't do like I did. I 00:11:52.509 --> 00:11:55.990 just, World Air Expo the first time, I did two 00:11:55.990 --> 00:11:58.529 breeds, and it was 900 pounds, and I bought brand 00:11:58.529 --> 00:12:01.909 new shoes. My wife had to pull them off my feet 00:12:01.909 --> 00:12:03.269 at the end of the day because I had blisters 00:12:03.269 --> 00:12:05.570 on my toes because they were brand new. So wear 00:12:05.570 --> 00:12:08.580 something that you know It's comfortable on your 00:12:08.580 --> 00:12:10.799 feet because you're not going to be in the middle 00:12:10.799 --> 00:12:13.039 of class at, oh, my feet hurt. You don't want 00:12:13.039 --> 00:12:15.620 that. You want to be focusing on the couch. So 00:12:15.620 --> 00:12:19.639 that is a silly little thing, but it is a very 00:12:19.639 --> 00:12:22.299 important thing. And the other important thing 00:12:22.299 --> 00:12:25.639 is when you're judging, and that will happen 00:12:25.639 --> 00:12:28.860 in North America sometimes a lot at the bigger 00:12:28.860 --> 00:12:31.720 stormy shows, but it can happen in your own country. 00:12:32.240 --> 00:12:34.019 There's a cow that might have been grand champion 00:12:34.019 --> 00:12:38.200 at four or five shows. You know she is. And you're 00:12:38.200 --> 00:12:42.059 judging that show. Forget about that. Forget 00:12:42.059 --> 00:12:44.179 about if she was grand champion. You're there 00:12:44.179 --> 00:12:47.120 to place her that day. And if she's not the best 00:12:47.120 --> 00:12:50.419 cow, don't win with her just because she's been 00:12:50.419 --> 00:12:53.379 winning before. If you think she's third place 00:12:53.379 --> 00:12:55.379 that day or second place and you can support 00:12:55.379 --> 00:12:58.740 it with reasons, you do it. But don't beat her 00:12:58.740 --> 00:13:02.330 just to beat her. if she's not deserving to win, 00:13:02.470 --> 00:13:05.210 don't be intimidated because I'm going to be 00:13:05.210 --> 00:13:07.309 not asked to judge again because all these people 00:13:07.309 --> 00:13:10.250 know this cow never gets beat. You might get 00:13:10.250 --> 00:13:13.190 asked to judge more because you recognize she 00:13:13.190 --> 00:13:16.990 wasn't the winner that day. So just remember 00:13:16.990 --> 00:13:20.070 that. That's very important. You've got to forget 00:13:20.070 --> 00:13:23.210 about what they've done before. If you know the 00:13:23.210 --> 00:13:25.370 cows, forget about it. You're judging them that 00:13:25.370 --> 00:13:29.769 day. I haven't talked to every person in every 00:13:29.769 --> 00:13:33.590 class. Madison, 16th class, I've talked to. I'm 00:13:33.590 --> 00:13:37.190 known as one of the fastest judges because I 00:13:37.190 --> 00:13:39.909 allot my time through my experience of judging 00:13:39.909 --> 00:13:44.070 to be able to explain why you're in 25th or 30th 00:13:44.070 --> 00:13:46.710 rather than have to explain it in the barn when 00:13:46.710 --> 00:13:50.809 you judge 600 head. And you're like, oh, yeah, 00:13:50.830 --> 00:13:54.389 okay. So that's kind of a, that's just a little 00:13:54.389 --> 00:13:56.559 piece of advice. Not everybody's going to, be 00:13:56.559 --> 00:13:59.980 comfortable doing that. But you really should, 00:14:00.019 --> 00:14:02.679 when you're judging young children, you better 00:14:02.679 --> 00:14:05.759 take the time, no matter what people say, to 00:14:05.759 --> 00:14:09.000 tell them why they are where they are. And that 00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:11.279 is very important. And if it's a really young 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:16.240 class, I'll even get on my knee and relate to 00:14:16.240 --> 00:14:18.919 that young showman so they don't feel intimidated. 00:14:19.519 --> 00:14:22.299 If I see them start to cry, I make sure I say, 00:14:22.340 --> 00:14:24.639 you did a great job. You could be up the line 00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:28.340 very easily. It's just that little thing. I judge 00:14:28.340 --> 00:14:31.159 young people to make sure they don't cry. So 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:33.360 if you don't want to be there hiding like your 00:14:33.360 --> 00:14:36.559 cat, she's really bad, then they'll start crying. 00:14:36.700 --> 00:14:38.340 And that's not what you want. You want to make 00:14:38.340 --> 00:14:41.580 them feel confident to come back to you. If you've 00:14:41.580 --> 00:14:43.580 got a large class, this will be the last thing, 00:14:43.720 --> 00:14:46.340 a large class of young people, and there's like 00:14:46.340 --> 00:14:51.029 25 in there, Those last five or six, that's pretty 00:14:51.029 --> 00:14:53.690 scary to think to yourself, I'm going to be the 00:14:53.690 --> 00:14:56.750 last place. I'll usually just say, last six, 00:14:56.830 --> 00:15:00.110 just come on in. Come on in the middle. And I'll 00:15:00.110 --> 00:15:01.490 go down and talk to them and say, you're all 00:15:01.490 --> 00:15:03.850 equal here. You just need improvement in these 00:15:03.850 --> 00:15:06.789 things to be up to life. So that one standing 00:15:06.789 --> 00:15:10.289 on the end doesn't say, well, I was last. Oh, 00:15:10.350 --> 00:15:12.309 we were all kind of equal in the bottom six. 00:15:12.529 --> 00:15:14.850 It's just a good piece of advice to young people. 00:15:15.789 --> 00:15:18.070 to not pick on them when they're down on that 00:15:18.070 --> 00:15:20.850 end. You've got to make them feel that they're 00:15:20.850 --> 00:15:23.870 all about equal right now. And that's the way 00:15:23.870 --> 00:15:26.409 I try to do it. Probably got a class of five, 00:15:26.409 --> 00:15:28.750 it's not the same. And when you've got a class 00:15:28.750 --> 00:15:31.490 of 30, and they realize they're going to be at 00:15:31.490 --> 00:15:34.529 the bottom, they'll feel pretty bad. So I always 00:15:34.529 --> 00:15:36.730 make sure in the last six or seven, I'll just 00:15:36.730 --> 00:15:39.730 signal the lineup. We're going to go on to the 00:15:39.730 --> 00:15:43.409 cow and what we're looking for when I'm touching. 00:15:45.659 --> 00:15:48.879 So, first of all, when you're judging, you see 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:53.159 the animals come in. I don't like to stand and 00:15:53.159 --> 00:15:56.559 look this close. I like to look back. And if 00:15:56.559 --> 00:15:59.379 you watch them come in, the farther you're back, 00:15:59.460 --> 00:16:03.340 the better you get to see them. So I'll kind 00:16:03.340 --> 00:16:05.679 of look quick, and the next one's going by, and 00:16:05.679 --> 00:16:10.019 I look quick. I can tell right off, yeah, that 00:16:10.019 --> 00:16:11.799 one's going to be right there, that one's not. 00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:14.360 It's just I'm used to judging. And I know what 00:16:14.360 --> 00:16:17.220 I'm looking at. So the first thing just when 00:16:17.220 --> 00:16:19.019 I was talking to you guys, this cat was standing 00:16:19.019 --> 00:16:20.820 there. I looked at her chest. I'm like, wow, 00:16:20.879 --> 00:16:23.440 that's a good example of a good cow in this country. 00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:28.919 Look at her chest. So when I go in close looking 00:16:28.919 --> 00:16:31.940 at the cow, and I look at the side profile, when 00:16:31.940 --> 00:16:35.019 I come around, I'm checking that out. Man, that 00:16:35.019 --> 00:16:37.279 cow's going to do pretty well if everything else 00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:39.960 is right. She's got a white, dead white in her 00:16:39.960 --> 00:16:42.940 front. She's gone. And I think in this country, 00:16:43.000 --> 00:16:47.139 that's true. When I'm dredging, I always have 00:16:47.139 --> 00:16:51.360 a pattern. And at the end of the show, people 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:54.740 know what I want. And I want balance. And my 00:16:54.740 --> 00:16:59.059 balance, it's the rib structure. Michelle's not 00:16:59.059 --> 00:17:01.360 too extreme up to the front. It looks like she's 00:17:01.360 --> 00:17:04.660 going to dip over. The floor rib, the rear rib. 00:17:04.940 --> 00:17:07.779 She doesn't let her top motion. She's balanced 00:17:07.779 --> 00:17:10.259 from the front to the rear. This isn't very balanced 00:17:10.259 --> 00:17:15.519 at all. And that's what I want at the end of 00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:19.359 the day. I don't want a cow with a very low capacity, 00:17:19.680 --> 00:17:24.500 a linear top, or not the rib structure I like. 00:17:25.900 --> 00:17:28.200 But then you have a situation where a cow will 00:17:28.200 --> 00:17:31.059 have a great mammary system and not a capacity. 00:17:31.960 --> 00:17:34.460 You've got to admire the mammary system so you 00:17:34.460 --> 00:17:37.519 don't just put that cow down hard because she 00:17:37.519 --> 00:17:39.720 maybe lacks a balance. She might even fit in 00:17:39.720 --> 00:17:42.730 a third or fourth in the box. So I like to count 00:17:42.730 --> 00:17:45.289 balance. And that's one of the first things I 00:17:45.289 --> 00:17:48.509 notice on a count. And I look quickly across 00:17:48.509 --> 00:17:50.529 the range and I say, well, what's the neck like? 00:17:51.430 --> 00:17:56.410 Long, very neck, very head, balance. Feet, legs 00:17:56.410 --> 00:18:02.109 look great. Chest looks great. So I can feel 00:18:02.109 --> 00:18:04.369 pretty good already when I go on to look at the 00:18:04.369 --> 00:18:06.529 next count. I already got a really good count. 00:18:11.159 --> 00:18:14.799 So, that's, you look at it quickly. First, if 00:18:14.799 --> 00:18:19.619 you've got a class of 5, 8, you can say, man, 00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:24.559 watch it. If you have a class of 12 or 5, we're 00:18:24.559 --> 00:18:26.460 going to be all day done. So what I'm trying 00:18:26.460 --> 00:18:30.140 to do, I look at the first 3 or 4, and leave 00:18:30.140 --> 00:18:34.839 them out. 43 to the right. I'm already walking 00:18:34.839 --> 00:18:48.140 around. And I go to the side. I look to the side. 00:18:48.380 --> 00:18:51.059 I look to the front. I look to the side. I look 00:18:51.059 --> 00:19:00.000 to the rear. And I might do five. Everybody judging 00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:03.319 isn't going to be in the same situation. So if 00:19:03.319 --> 00:19:05.839 you've got five cows, you let those five cows 00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:08.900 come in and look at them as long as they have 00:19:08.900 --> 00:19:11.539 room to move. Because there's nothing worse than 00:19:11.539 --> 00:19:14.720 getting 25 to the main and all stopped and you're 00:19:14.720 --> 00:19:16.940 not going to have a chance to see them really 00:19:16.940 --> 00:19:19.900 move. So that's why I do it that way. So if I 00:19:19.900 --> 00:19:23.539 get a small head and it's not big enough, I want 00:19:23.539 --> 00:19:25.059 to make sure I see them all moving. So those 00:19:25.059 --> 00:19:28.420 first five come in, then I'll go on to the rest 00:19:28.420 --> 00:19:31.359 and I'll look at those five. And then I'll see 00:19:31.359 --> 00:19:36.480 them all moving. And I'm preparing so every animal 00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:39.619 gets seen. That's the only reason I say that. 00:19:39.859 --> 00:19:41.799 You don't even have to fight a bus. You can stand 00:19:41.799 --> 00:19:43.359 in the middle of the day and get in and see them 00:19:43.359 --> 00:20:07.829 all moving and go look at each other. This is 00:20:07.829 --> 00:20:11.880 a great example of a really good cat. She came 00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:13.859 to show the other day. I would like their mom. 00:20:13.980 --> 00:20:17.519 So that's the kind of cow she is. If you look 00:20:17.519 --> 00:20:20.819 at the mammary system, check how high the rear 00:20:20.819 --> 00:20:24.980 udder is. That's what they give in. Even the 00:20:24.980 --> 00:20:28.640 front teeth placement at 400. It's exactly what 00:20:28.640 --> 00:20:30.579 I would be looking for with a really good mammary 00:20:30.579 --> 00:20:35.039 system. Feet length, perfect. Bone quality, perfect. 00:20:35.660 --> 00:20:39.940 Flat bone, beautiful. Rubbed stretcher to rewind 00:20:39.940 --> 00:20:43.849 it. That's good. Pin placement. If anything, 00:20:43.970 --> 00:20:46.710 it's a little down. That's more functional than 00:20:46.710 --> 00:20:50.730 a high. So that's good. Bone structure, very 00:20:50.730 --> 00:20:55.069 good. See, angularity. My angularity, I look 00:20:55.069 --> 00:20:57.910 at the way the cow is up to her front end, which 00:20:57.910 --> 00:21:01.490 is angular. I look at the way the ribs are. Spring 00:21:01.490 --> 00:21:05.069 rib, hairy rib, drop to the rib. That all ties 00:21:05.069 --> 00:21:08.930 in as angularity. She is excellent with this 00:21:08.930 --> 00:21:11.529 as well. She has a beautiful head, very feminine, 00:21:11.690 --> 00:21:14.950 very feminine. And with the head, I also look 00:21:14.950 --> 00:21:17.529 at the muzzle. When you've got a cow with a really 00:21:17.529 --> 00:21:20.589 narrow muzzle, usually it goes narrow in the 00:21:20.589 --> 00:21:23.390 head. She's got a really good muzzle and a really 00:21:23.390 --> 00:21:26.269 good width ahead. We've covered what we're looking 00:21:26.269 --> 00:21:30.730 for on the animal. It's how to give the reasons, 00:21:30.890 --> 00:21:36.630 how to explain what you're looking for. You just 00:21:36.630 --> 00:21:40.910 don't say, she's got really nice legs. I give 00:21:40.910 --> 00:21:45.069 the first cow advantage. Nicer legs than the 00:21:45.069 --> 00:21:47.490 second cow, nicer memory than the second cow. 00:21:47.630 --> 00:21:50.410 That's a no -no. Because you need to be able 00:21:50.410 --> 00:21:53.210 to say why the legs are nicer, why the others 00:21:53.210 --> 00:21:57.089 are nicer. I'd say, just pretend there's a second 00:21:57.089 --> 00:22:01.369 cow in there and her other is gapping in the 00:22:01.369 --> 00:22:04.819 front. You would say, the first cow is a nicer 00:22:04.819 --> 00:22:08.440 blending for outer to the body wall. The first 00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:10.900 cow is higher and wider at the rear attachment. 00:22:11.960 --> 00:22:14.119 And the thing I remember when you're talking 00:22:14.119 --> 00:22:17.599 about and looking for those traits, you don't 00:22:17.599 --> 00:22:20.460 say bad about the next cow. You don't say bad 00:22:20.460 --> 00:22:23.099 about the next cow. You never talk bad about 00:22:23.099 --> 00:22:26.079 the cows. You talk positive about the cows. I 00:22:26.079 --> 00:22:27.759 don't know. I was trying to say something positive 00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:30.799 about every cow. So I'll say how much I love 00:22:30.799 --> 00:22:33.359 the first cow. I'll explain why I like, and then 00:22:33.359 --> 00:22:36.599 I'll move right on and say she blends better 00:22:36.599 --> 00:22:39.539 or better attached into the body wall. She's 00:22:39.539 --> 00:22:42.700 flatter in her bone quality in her leg, or she's 00:22:42.700 --> 00:22:45.240 stronger in her pasture. Three reasons. That's 00:22:45.240 --> 00:22:47.119 a lot. That's enough. You don't have to do 10 00:22:47.119 --> 00:22:50.299 reasons. Pretend there's the same cow. I take 00:22:50.299 --> 00:22:52.880 this first cow. She's longer in her forehead. 00:22:53.019 --> 00:22:55.180 She blends better in her body wall. She's flatter 00:22:55.180 --> 00:22:59.319 in her bone. Over this really nice... Dairy cow 00:22:59.319 --> 00:23:01.480 we have in second. So I've already noticed the 00:23:01.480 --> 00:23:04.720 second cow's dairy. And I've said why I had the 00:23:04.720 --> 00:23:06.559 first cow in second. And I would say the dairy 00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:09.359 cow in second has the advantage of wider chest 00:23:09.359 --> 00:23:12.599 over the deep rib cow we have in third. I always 00:23:12.599 --> 00:23:15.380 try to talk positively about each cow below. 00:23:15.740 --> 00:23:18.099 But give the right reasons why you're eating. 00:23:18.859 --> 00:23:21.079 You've only got five cows. If you get down to 00:23:21.079 --> 00:23:23.759 your fifth cow, the fourth over fifth, you can 00:23:23.759 --> 00:23:27.259 say the cow in fifth I recognize she's very angular. 00:23:27.339 --> 00:23:29.720 I'd just like to give her more width of chest, 00:23:30.019 --> 00:23:33.180 more depth of rib. But she is a very angular, 00:23:33.440 --> 00:23:36.220 or very wide -chested cow. You can say something 00:23:36.220 --> 00:23:39.180 positive if you can find out the last cow. Because 00:23:39.180 --> 00:23:41.799 that farmer, standing in the barn, if you say, 00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:44.539 I got the fourth cow and the very ninth cow and 00:23:44.539 --> 00:23:47.559 fifth, that's not good. You don't talk that way 00:23:47.559 --> 00:23:51.539 to your judge. So you need to be honest, but 00:23:51.539 --> 00:23:55.529 concise. It's any judge's dream. you can find 00:23:55.529 --> 00:23:58.750 the cow you absolutely love. And if they can't 00:23:58.750 --> 00:24:00.930 walk through the first class or second class, 00:24:00.970 --> 00:24:03.130 I already said, well, I'm pretty safe. I got 00:24:03.130 --> 00:24:05.349 a really good job at the end of the day. And 00:24:05.349 --> 00:24:07.390 even though I said that, when I'm judging, I'll 00:24:07.390 --> 00:24:09.869 say, wow, again, they scammed me at the end of 00:24:09.869 --> 00:24:12.210 the day. And sometimes that happens in the last 00:24:12.210 --> 00:24:16.029 class and they're like, wow, I'm safe. And it's 00:24:16.029 --> 00:24:18.430 a nice feeling as a judge because you feel confident 00:24:18.430 --> 00:24:22.750 about what you're going to do. And the last thing, 00:24:22.809 --> 00:24:25.869 I don't want to drag it out. Like I said the 00:24:25.869 --> 00:24:29.049 other day in the show, if you don't have the 00:24:29.049 --> 00:24:31.869 exact placings of the official, then you can 00:24:31.869 --> 00:24:34.529 argue, well, the second count, I prefer the rock 00:24:34.529 --> 00:24:39.130 structure, the loin strain over the one that 00:24:39.130 --> 00:24:41.490 was first, and you give a substantial reason, 00:24:41.789 --> 00:24:45.509 you're not necessarily wrong. If that judge's 00:24:45.509 --> 00:24:49.289 opinion at me, and you can make your reason supportive, 00:24:50.319 --> 00:24:53.299 But if you got the last list count first, and 00:24:53.299 --> 00:24:56.180 it was really obvious, then you're really going 00:24:56.180 --> 00:24:59.519 to have to come up with reasons. So you try to 00:24:59.519 --> 00:25:02.259 get it fairly close. It might be class of six, 00:25:02.339 --> 00:25:04.799 and you might be, oh, I had the first three mixed 00:25:04.799 --> 00:25:07.660 up, but I had the last three exactly right. That's 00:25:07.660 --> 00:25:11.619 okay. You're not losing a lot of points. As long 00:25:11.619 --> 00:25:13.759 as you gave the reason why those first three 00:25:13.759 --> 00:25:17.200 were the way they were. When I'm judging, I'm 00:25:17.200 --> 00:25:20.690 always thinking, This cow is my pack. That's 00:25:20.690 --> 00:25:23.670 what I like. So I'm comfortable with putting 00:25:23.670 --> 00:25:26.910 that in. Somebody might be comfortable with a 00:25:26.910 --> 00:25:30.089 cow without as much capacity, but I have a hard 00:25:30.089 --> 00:25:32.309 time winning the show with a cow without capacity. 00:25:32.470 --> 00:25:35.509 So I'm going to rely on myself. That's very important. 00:25:36.309 --> 00:25:38.490 You can have a cow with great capacity, but you're 00:25:38.490 --> 00:25:39.710 not going to have a cow with great capacity. 00:25:40.170 --> 00:25:41.769 You're going to have a cow with great capacity. 00:25:43.419 --> 00:25:45.000 The first cow has better legs than the second 00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:49.859 cow. So you've got to weigh it. It's that opinion 00:25:49.859 --> 00:25:52.359 on the day. If you can learn to give reasons, 00:25:52.619 --> 00:25:57.019 just ignore it. Descriptive reasons. It's not 00:25:57.019 --> 00:25:59.539 just the first cow has better legs than the second 00:25:59.539 --> 00:26:02.059 cow. It's the same as better udder. It's the 00:26:02.059 --> 00:26:09.480 same as wine. It's not really descriptive about 00:26:09.480 --> 00:26:12.319 the cow. When you're judging or replacing those 00:26:12.319 --> 00:26:17.779 cows, I usually go off. I mean, I should say 00:26:17.779 --> 00:26:20.039 this, but some countries, you know, the certain 00:26:20.039 --> 00:26:23.980 showmen, they're fine, and they're not happy. 00:26:35.299 --> 00:26:40.079 I look at everybody, and I know when the guy's 00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:42.500 mad, the guy's just mad at himself. But for a 00:26:42.500 --> 00:26:46.380 young judge, it can scare you. So for a young 00:26:46.380 --> 00:26:48.500 guy to come around, there could be a reason for 00:26:48.500 --> 00:26:52.839 that for anybody. So get that one person. Like 00:26:52.839 --> 00:26:56.180 this, it can take it off. So just, if you're 00:26:56.180 --> 00:26:58.680 worried about it, I just, this cow, this cow, 00:26:58.740 --> 00:27:03.299 this cow. Move on. And the reason that occurs, 00:27:03.460 --> 00:27:09.319 that's it. If one guy's always showing great 00:27:09.319 --> 00:27:12.579 cows, and he comes in the rain, don't look what 00:27:12.579 --> 00:27:14.740 he's showing. You're looking at the animal. You're 00:27:14.740 --> 00:27:17.880 not looking at the showing. So it can be, somebody 00:27:17.880 --> 00:27:19.900 that doesn't even show well has the best cow. 00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:21.619 You'd be scared to leave them without a cow. 00:27:26.549 --> 00:27:32.430 As far as the confirmation part, utter and lengths. 00:27:32.910 --> 00:27:39.789 Utter and lengths are very important. I always 00:27:39.789 --> 00:27:47.630 find it hard to judge as a percentage when I'm 00:27:47.630 --> 00:27:50.569 judging. The percentage of declassification, 00:27:50.769 --> 00:27:54.750 as a judge, I don't, I mean, if the udder's a 00:27:54.750 --> 00:27:57.990 great udder or a really good udder, then it's 00:27:57.990 --> 00:28:00.529 good enough to be up top. But if it's not a good 00:28:00.529 --> 00:28:02.630 udder, she's probably going to be up top. I don't 00:28:02.630 --> 00:28:06.190 really, but if I had a cow with really not good 00:28:06.190 --> 00:28:09.430 legs and not a good udder on the same cow, she's 00:28:09.430 --> 00:28:12.109 not going to be up top. I'll tell you that. Easy. 00:28:14.839 --> 00:28:18.599 And as far as the memorizing part goes, you're 00:28:18.599 --> 00:28:25.180 at university level. You're going to class. So 00:28:25.180 --> 00:28:28.380 you've got to do that in that situation. When 00:28:28.380 --> 00:28:31.700 you're a judge at a show, like a big show, I 00:28:31.700 --> 00:28:35.759 give the advice, let your eyes talk. You've seen 00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:38.299 those doubts. And I talk to them in a different 00:28:38.299 --> 00:28:52.890 way. And then I realized, just look at the cows. 00:28:57.750 --> 00:29:01.289 Oh yeah, the last place, there's an August house. 00:29:01.789 --> 00:29:05.230 The last really should happen. I really make 00:29:05.230 --> 00:29:08.490 sure these guys are trying to have the right 00:29:08.490 --> 00:29:12.269 August house for this. If there's three cows 00:29:12.269 --> 00:29:15.150 and they're all kind of close, and you're not 00:29:15.150 --> 00:29:19.150 sure, What weighs more in your mind? The udder 00:29:19.150 --> 00:29:21.269 was better on this one than the udder on that 00:29:21.269 --> 00:29:23.789 one. The leg was better. That's why she's third. 00:29:24.250 --> 00:29:27.849 But if you've got an obvious last, try to ensure 00:29:27.849 --> 00:29:31.009 you've got the obvious last. I really don't change 00:29:31.009 --> 00:29:36.109 my settings because of the competition. Because 00:29:36.109 --> 00:29:40.130 if you've got a cow with a grass and she's not 00:29:40.130 --> 00:29:42.849 as deep, it's probably because she doesn't quite 00:29:42.849 --> 00:29:46.339 have the right rim structure. My cows are great. 00:29:47.640 --> 00:29:51.140 I got green cream from all those cows. And a 00:29:51.140 --> 00:29:54.720 cow with a natural rib structure, it's natural. 00:29:54.940 --> 00:30:01.319 You know, she doesn't eat meat. So, I mean, in 00:30:01.319 --> 00:30:04.519 a country that all the cows are in the same condition, 00:30:04.720 --> 00:30:06.759 you're going to see the same thing. You're going 00:30:06.759 --> 00:30:08.579 to have this one cow maybe walk in with that. 00:30:12.970 --> 00:30:16.450 Even though she's not had any hay, she's a great 00:30:16.450 --> 00:30:19.750 cat. I mean, I still look for the same pattern 00:30:19.750 --> 00:30:23.230 in every country I go, but it's a country that 00:30:23.230 --> 00:30:25.490 says it's a pattern. Maybe their calves aren't 00:30:25.490 --> 00:30:27.710 going to be as deep, so I pick in the best of 00:30:27.710 --> 00:30:32.710 what I find. When you're worried about getting 00:30:32.710 --> 00:30:34.549 reasons, and you just come to the show and you've 00:30:34.549 --> 00:30:37.869 never practiced, it's like, wow. You could be 00:30:37.869 --> 00:30:40.009 looking at cows in your barn and saying to yourself, 00:30:40.069 --> 00:30:56.000 oh yeah, That's a wrap on this Bullvine podcast 00:30:56.000 --> 00:30:58.980 episode with Callum McKinvan. If one idea sticks, 00:30:59.279 --> 00:31:02.359 make it this. Judge the cow that walked in today. 00:31:02.859 --> 00:31:06.680 Eyes on cattle, not on the crowd. Move, see, 00:31:06.900 --> 00:31:10.700 decide, explain. Want the full written playbook 00:31:10.700 --> 00:31:12.980 from this clinic? Head to The Bullvine and look 00:31:12.980 --> 00:31:15.519 for Judge With Confidence, the ultimate playbook 00:31:15.519 --> 00:31:18.140 for dairy cattle judging. It's loaded with the 00:31:18.140 --> 00:31:20.519 evaluation pattern, the three reasons framework, 00:31:20.839 --> 00:31:23.359 and a next show checklist you can use this weekend. 00:31:23.579 --> 00:31:26.500 If this helped, share it with a new judge, a 00:31:26.500 --> 00:31:29.079 4 -H leader, or the friend who always gets asked 00:31:29.079 --> 00:31:32.319 to sort county fair classes. And subscribe to 00:31:32.319 --> 00:31:34.839 The Bullvine podcast for more bold, practical 00:31:34.839 --> 00:31:37.740 episodes that move the industry forward. For 00:31:37.740 --> 00:31:40.480 The Bullvine. I'm your host. Thanks for listening. 00:31:40.859 --> 00:31:41.900 See you ringside.