Welcome to Botches Off -Road. Join us as we talk
about everything from gear reviews to trail stories,
tent camping to rock landing, and all things
to do with the outdoors. Today's topic is one
that I actually had planned for last weekend,
but it would be absolutely no fun without Gavin.
Today, we're going to talk about how much we
hate our rigs. Yeah. And we'll start with Mark.
Mark, I want you to give us a list. That preferably
takes up to 10 minutes of all the reasons that
you hate your Tacoma and why it's the worst vehicle
to wheel. Okay, let's be a little more specific.
Are we talking about how we bought it or how
just the truck in general as an everyday thing?
Your truck. Yeah. Not 2014 Tacomas. Your truck.
Yeah. Why do you hate wheeling? Yeah, so as is,
and whatever, how you bought it. Yes, and that's
not mods or anything that are on it. It can be.
However it is right now. Okay. Well, you want
to get specific of how I bought it. The mods
that were done to it, mostly the bumpers, I think,
all of what was done to it is what I hate the
most. And those are... I know they're Amazon
bumpers. What's the brand name? Hookie Bumpers.
Yeah, Hookie. Stay away from Hookie Bumpers.
Yep. Yep. The tire carrier is the only one that
I like out of them, but we have modified it so
much from what it used to be. So much reinforcing.
Yeah, everything that was bolted together ended
up welding together like it should have been
from the get -go. Yep. We had to replace the
latch, which we just did, finally, after almost
a year of it being broke. What else? I hated
the rear seat storage system that they have.
The plastic... The back seat beds. Most people
that... overland or off -road usually gets rid
of them and that's what i ended up doing was
getting rid of them i gotta get a molly panel
for the back to get that tight in but that's
not one i need to do right away but it has significantly
increased how much storage i can do now because
i can stack my cot my fire pit probably a couple
other things i can stack right in the back behind
the seat now do you put your tent back there
I can, but I'm actually thinking of putting it
in a pack -out system. Well, okay. I'm just curious.
The $100 tent would probably be put back there,
though, the big one. Let's see here. What else?
What about your cam adjusters for your lower
control arms? How do you feel about those? Well,
so to be honest, you got to remember the factory
probably was not expecting us to be wheeling
these vehicles to begin with. Like really, really
like we are. So to their benefit, it's something
we've done to our own vehicles and not them.
But it's part of why your truck's the worst to
wheel. It is. You got multiple things. You got
that. If you did upgrade a cam, what does it
call it? Cam limiters? No, not cam limiters.
Yeah, cam bolt limiters. Yeah. It's some weird
name. If you did upgrades, you got to get the
upgraded tabs to reinforce it where it's a lot
thicker or else you're going to shear them off
like I almost did or bend them like I actually
did. Glad we didn't shear them off. I'm glad
to shear off, though. Yeah, for sure. Reinforce
your knuckles. Yeah, everyone should reinforce
knuckles. That's just a Toyota thing in general.
Everyone should have a, oh, fuck, I can't even
think of what they're called right now. Gussets.
A reinforcement bracket. Gusset, thank you. Gussets
or get your upgraded Glock or Control R knuckles.
So, like, you did your long travels. Or do both.
Or both. Do both. Or both. What else? How do
you feel about the wheels and tires you've got
on there right now? Well, hmm. They fell out
pretty well. The rims, they're okay. They definitely
have been beaten. To hell and back. Those are
visions, right? Yes, visions. Yeah. Yeah, they
started showing rock damage like the very first
trip we did with them. Yep. Very first trip.
Mind you, we live in Michigan. We're not rock
crawling. No. So for them to be getting rock
rash the way that they are, there's something
going on there. Yep. I do. Say getting a five
-foot Tacoma bed is better than a six -foot Tacoma
bed. I didn't notice a difference. I did notice
a difference. Between having a six -foot and
a five -foot, I do see the difference. What else?
How do you feel about having no lockers? I mean,
they'd be beneficial, but I haven't phased me
a lot. We live in Michigan. There's nothing to
crawl. True, true, true, true. You could have
made it up that trail in Everett, though. I mean,
I've been up that trail before. You got to remember,
I had to air down from where I was. I aired up
a little more because we didn't have an air compressor.
I still think that you could have made it up
that if you had a locker. Yeah. Because even
if you had DB'd it with a locker, you still would
be pushing yourself up. Oh, you're talking about
that hill. I thought you were talking about when
I aired down. No. I mean, that one also would
have been nice with a locker. Yeah. Because that
one you wouldn't have had to air down as far.
Yeah. But I aired down way further than I usually
do for that trail anyways. But, I mean. For the
most part, the Taco's been pretty good for you.
Oh, yeah, it has. You can't... I can't dog it
too much. You can't really shit on it too much.
No. I mean, everyone says IFS is horrible. I
have no experience in saying that because, one,
I've never had a solid axle when it comes to
off -roading, so I can't say if that is really
better or not. Have you ever had a vehicle with
a front solid axle? Uh, no, I don't think so.
I think you've always had front IFS. Yeah. Yeah,
because the Ram didn't. The Ram 1500, I don't
think, comes with solid axles. The old ones did.
Yeah, the old ones, but, like, I think if you
got into the Ram 2500, 3500, when they start
solid axling. Yeah, because my 99, my 99 Gasser.
1500 was solid front and rear. Second gen. But
once you get into third gens, they're all IFS.
Yeah. Not a fan of the head unit that came in,
at least for the second half of the second generation
Tacomas. I didn't mind the old radio that was
in the first Tacoma I had. It was okay. It was
gaudy because of the silver, but I liked it better
than the head unit. Yeah. What else? All right.
I think that's about it, man. Yeah, that's about
it. So we can move on to the Forerunners. So
I will say the 3rd Gen Forerunner is a fantastic
platform to start with. There are very few issues.
With the third gen as a base. Now, mine is a
very beat third gen, which has resulted in...
The reasons that mine are the worst to wheel.
The frame is a patch. Complete patch job. Oh,
yeah. It has... Okay, that just makes it terrible
on -road. Well, on -road reasons is I have no
sway bars, and it is a nightmare to make tight
turns in. Water is the worst. The engine itself
doesn't care. I've got a snorkel. I've had the
snorkel underwater all except for the intake.
It runs through it. But all the electronics in
the 4Runner are not waterproof the way that a
TJR, and I learned it the hard way. Yeah, water
just equals bad to the 4Runner in general. And
then I know Shane gave me some notes. If you
have a later part 4Runner like Shane's, they've
got electric four -wheel drive actuators, and
his gets water in there and quits working all
the time. I don't have that problem with mine,
but mine's a mechanical shift, so there's nothing
wrong there. Other than that, the biggest problem
I see wheeling the third gen is space. It's not
a big car. The trunk area is very small, unless
you fold the seats down. Once you fold the seats
down, you're okay. But you've really only got
about three -ish foot deep by about four -ish
foot wide. So if you need to use your backseat,
you're really limited on what you can put in
the car. The roof rack options for the third
gen 4Runner are basically non -existent. You've
got pretty much two roof racks, and one of them,
there's multiple versions of it, but there's
one that's cloned a lot. But for the most part,
you've only got two roof rack options, and anything
else to add storage, you know, fifth gens, FJs,
Tacomas, they've got a whole list of things you
can do to add space, but... wheeling an older
rig like the third gen that stuff just doesn't
exist yeah so i'd say that's that's probably
the number one reason i would steer someone away
from a third gen especially if they want to do
the overlandy thing if they just want to go out
and wheel a third gen is a great option um then
my next thing would be that the knuckles on the
third gen are very poorly built uh i've got I've
got a diagram somewhere that shows where the
force is applied on the knuckle and why the importance,
that was a big yawn, Gavin, why the importance
of gussets are. Because with a third gen, if
you don't gusset your knuckle, it's going to
break. It might just be on a normal road. It
doesn't matter. It's going to break. Oh, yeah.
And that's just not a preferred situation. And
then for my truck in particular, I would say
that my power steering is a pretty big problem.
Everything's new. The whole system is new. It's
been replaced multiple times and through the
entire replacement cycle and all the new parts
and everything, it's always hard to turn the
truck. Period. Doesn't matter if it's in four
-wheel drive. Doesn't matter if it's in two -wheel
drive. It is such a tight steering wheel, it's
not fun. No. And there's steering upgrades you
can do to kind of help with some of that, and
I've done everything they suggest, and I'm still
stuck in a situation where I'm too handy in my
wheel to get it to turn right. It's an older
rig, and... As cliche as this might sound, older
rigs are a lot harder to wheel because it's harder
to get aftermarket support for them, and it's
a lot harder to maintain them, especially when
they're beat as bad as what mine was. Yep. Oh,
yeah. But, yeah, I'd say, man, I was hoping we
could fill a whole hour with this, but this topic's
pretty light. Yeah. It'd help if Gavin wasn't
just muting himself and could break into some
conversation here. Oh, well, you know, I'm sickly.
So I try to keep myself muted right now unless
a cough sneaks up on me here and there. I mean,
while you guys were talking, I've thought of
a small list, I guess, for mine. Let's see. Alternator
placement. Horrible. It's already horrible. On
all Toyotas, I mean. It's on the bottom. Mine
isn't. My alternator is actually on the top.
I think mine is too. Really? Yours is like middle.
Mine's like middle, closer to the bottom, which
is probably going to be closer to where Mark's
is. Yeah. I mean, it's less than great. I've
already been through one alternator, two technically,
if you're counting the one that blues immediately
after I put it in. You know, that sucks. Obviously,
space is a big one in the back of those. Very
similar to Alex's 4Runner. There's just barely
any space. I have a kid, so unfortunately, he
still has to be in a seat. I can't just throw
him around in the back and have him dongle around
on nothing. So that really limits where I could
have it. Half of the back seat is benched. The
other, well, I guess three -quarters of it is
benched. The other 25 % is like a single. So,
yeah, you got a 40 -60 bench. Yeah, but he only
fits in the center because of how our seats are
aligned. So really hard finding a compact car
seat. to where we could put up maybe behind the
driver and delete the 60 part for more space.
That is what I'm looking to do, though. I can't
recline my driver's seat because of the kid's
seat behind me. So I get it. Mine's stuck, like,
straight up and down. Well, and I guess I could
do that, but it's super uncomfortable. And when
I'm wheeling and driving long periods of time,
I can't. Right. I think you missed the mine is
stuck straight up and down. Right. Yeah, I did
miss that. Because it's an electric system, and
it got wet, and now it doesn't work. Mine is
not electric, which I don't know if that was
all part of their plan with it, that FJ is trying
to do the less amount of electronics as possible.
Because there is no electricity. If mine was,
it's nothing. If mine wasn't a Limited, if I
just had an SR5, I wouldn't have these problems.
There you go. Should have got an SR5. But does
the SR5 not have rear diff? Rear locker, yeah.
Yeah, rear locker. Pretty much just the Limited.
Only some Limiteds in 98 had a rear locker. Right.
Yeah. So, I mean, other than that, the space
issue, that's a huge one. I have a massive, massive
legendary. uh blind spots in my truck very big
yeah so that that sucks i mean like i get used
to it they got big side mirrors so you know it's
not huge anymore but when i first look back there
i'm like where the fuck is my window to look
like you can't barely see any of it um the suicide
doors suck for having kids uh you have to pull
the the seat up you have to totally recline the
passenger seat or incline i guess the passenger
seat and pull it all the way up just to get the
car seat in and out and open the suicide door
so that's like dude to be honest the suicide
doors the suicide doors just suck like i got
nothing nice to say about them that there's no
good part of having half the half doors like
that i if it was four door it would be so much
better so much better but Did anyone ever build
a four -door FJ? I'm sure. I know someone cut
right out behind the front doors and made a bedded
one with a bed, which is super cool. The Brute
version of it, or whatever they call it. Yeah,
like the Ute. Or not Ute, but like the Australian,
because they put one of those big sleeper cabs
on the back. You know what I'm saying? Can't
remember what they're called, like Alucab. Yeah.
The whole back ends. But what else? Windshield
sucks. Windshield's just about a 90 -degree angle,
so every little rock and chip that gets put up
just kind of hits the windshield and finally
got my crack on there. And then the rain that
hits it, it's like the rain doesn't want to go
anywhere. So, in rainstorms, it doesn't matter
if your wipers are going full blast. The range
is there. So, I mean, that kind of sucks. I guess
the good side of it is that it makes me feel
like I'm in a spaceship as big as a windshield
is. You get a lot of clearance out the front,
just so you know. You're sitting in the front
two seats of your truck. It feels huge. Yeah,
it does. It really does. You compare that to
the third gen, dude. I've got no space, and you're
up there living like a king, just, yeah, I'm
fat, and I can fit. And I'm like, man, I could
not drive like that. Wow. Calling me out. Yeah,
well, that's awesome. I'm fat, too. Yeah, right.
But, like, it does. In the front, it feels like
it's got a lot of area. So it is really nice.
I would say stereo -wise, too, that sucked. The
speakers were like paper. They're not even the
full size of what they were supposed to be. They're
like 8 -inch speakers. They're like 6 -inch speakers,
actually, and the rest was like junk housing.
Do you still have your stock radio? No. No, I
pulled that out and put in an aftermarket Amazon.
touchscreen, funny, funny radio, and it's okay.
It works good. It makes up for it. Yeah, because
after I put my Sony in, I can't believe how good
those speakers are in my truck. Oh, yeah, speaker
quality. I was complaining about speakers the
whole time I had it, and then I changed out the
head unit or whatever, the radio. And, yeah,
my speaker quality and everything, everything
went up. I was like, maybe I won't fuck with
the speakers for now. Yeah, because I played
with the speakers in the second -gen Tacomas,
so I thought I was going to have to upgrade them.
And then once I put the new head unit in, I'm
like, oh, I guess I don't have to work on my
speakers yet. Yeah. I need to upgrade mine. Yeah,
so your Zune can really bump. Yeah, dude. The
Zune is the way to go. The DAC is so good. It
blows Bluetooth out of the water, dude. I can't
explain it until you've listened to it. I'll
take your word for it, buddy. I sure will. Let's
see. Other things that I hate. Sometimes I hate
the rear door because it swings out. Sometimes
I wish I had a lift one. No, you're glad you
don't because you want to do a 270 awning, and
with a lift one, you can't do a 270 awning. Well,
now, I would change that. I would only do, like,
not a 270 extended. I'd just do, like, the regular
Batwing if I had the lift. But I do like having
my... Do a 180. Yeah, I do like having my little
tailgate area to set myself. What if you did...
Because a 180 is the one that goes front to rear,
right? Yep. I thought that was a 270, and I thought
there was a 270 extended that wrapped around.
No, a 270 wraps around in general. Yeah, 270
wraps around. A 180 is just the length. It just
goes on one side of your truck. Yeah, so a 180
I would do if I had the flip -up style like yours.
Do you know how sick two 180s on a third gen
would be? One on either side. You'd just have
wings, man. A little bat wing. Yeah, and then
you open your trunk. Then you open your trunk
and all the way around your truck is undercover.
Yeah. Coming around to the awning thing now,
huh? No. It would be all zip -up hard sides,
too. The whole thing would be good. Awnings would
be kind of cool for sun cover, but I still want
an external. This is what I've always said. I
still need an external for every other situation.
Yep. I don't know. I like being able to just
hop in my truck and leave camp behind me. Mark
my words, Mark. Give it another year and a half
or so, and he'll be almost fully dark -sided.
I don't know. I was going down that rabbit hole
with the 720 awning. I think the ones I was looking
at, you could add tents to the side of them.
It was all individual and just a lot of money
for that whole setup. Oh, yeah. That's what it
is. It's all a money thing, dude. That's so much
money. It's just paper that everybody agreed
upon. Don't worry. No, it's not just paper. It's
all ones and zeros. It's just paper that everybody
agreed upon. No. There's no paper. It's all ones
and zeros. I don't know, man. I mean, are we
really paying for paper? Are we using our cards?
It's all digital. I mean, that just means - We're
paying on - It means it's fake. It's not even
real then. It's even worse. That's what I'm saying.
Yeah. It's not like I'm going to a store with
hard cash and buying it. And it's not like any
of these overlaying companies except Bitcoin
or SATs that people could boost into us. Yeah,
you'd have to boost a whole lot of fucking SATs
for that. Holy shit. Okay, I'm looking at a 180
truck awning right now. That's from AliExpress,
so it's a cheaper one. It's $426, right? Let's
just look at how many SATs that would take. $400
,000. I saw a Tacoma, I think it was a third
gen, and they had an awning. I think it was like
a big 720, and he had it so far forward, I wouldn't
want to wheel with it because it hung off the
front of the truck. Yeah, I've seen those. I'm
like, why? Slide to the back. Yeah. But he didn't
have a bed rack, so I think if he had a bed rack,
it might be repositioned different. Yeah. Makes
sense. I guess. What else? Wow. Gavin, you were
like, you were pretty dead on 488 or 489 ,000
sats to buy a one 80 awning. Yeah. So like typical,
typical money, how that kind of goes. And a typical,
the boost that we get are usually like 2000 sats.
It'll take a while. It'll take a little while.
All right, well, let's get back on to... Oh,
wait, what do you got? You got another way to
make money? Or people could buy stuff from our
store. Is there enough cool stuff to warrant?
There's stickers and cups, and you still got
to buy the Hawaiian shirt, and... So we're the
ones funding that, is what you're saying. Just
the Hawaiian shirt is the only one. The rest
is listeners. Yeah. Oh. They should be. The Hawaiian
shirt is just internal for now. Next year, we'll
release the Hawaiian shirt. Yep. We're doing
a botches -only shirt every year. We have a good
one for next year. I'll share the idea with you
later. Yep. Trying to think of whatever, what
else I hate about my truck. The bumpers are completely
plastic, so you can't mount anything. That sucks.
Yeah. That does suck. And I hate, you fixed it,
but when people have their bumper ends on the
front bumper, they look so bad. Oh, on the FJ?
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, those little, yeah, I don't
love those. I took that off. I was going to try
to house some kind of light in that area. They
have cutouts to where you can... They have, like,
3D housings that you can put in. Yeah. Pretty
cool and all. Except I... I mean, you're just
mounting it to plastic, so... Yeah. Yeah, I mean,
it doesn't do you much well. Yeah. I would say
the other thing I hate about it is the pricing.
for just about any aftermarket part for it is
fucking crazy. Crazy for the FJ. At least they
exist. At least they exist. I mean, I'm not,
yeah, I mean, it's there. There's plenty of aftermarket
parts, you know, little storage options, shelves,
stuff like that. But they're just fucking crazy
expensive for any of it, so, you know. It makes
it hard to actually customize it the way I want
to because every time I'm like, fuck, it's going
to be at least $200. So that's a bummer. The
other thing is the back seat's slanted. Yeah.
And storage -wise, such a fucking pain. Yeah.
And there's like a... Dude, that's... That is
such a pain. Yeah, it's pretty dramatic. That
is... Why I have such a terrible time putting
stuff in my truck is because of that slanted
back seat. It takes like four or five inches
off of like where if you take a tape measure
and you measure from back to front, I might have
30 inches. But like from the top of the seat
to the back, I have like 25. It's even less,
but it sucks. I will say the pack outs help solve
that problem. Because there's still space back
there, but I use it for stuff I don't need to
get to a lot. And by having the packouts, it
gave a solid wall where stuff wouldn't be falling
back in there where it's hard to reach. Yeah,
I think when I do delete my seat, that'll be
part of it. And that'll take away some of it.
So we'll see on that. That was just such a killer.
When I measured to see if my fridge could fit
in originally, I was like, yeah, got plenty of
space. Then put my fridge in and realized it
hit the top of the seat every time. And I'm like,
that's a motherfucker. So I had to actually move
the seat up just a tad to actually get the fridge
to fit. I've got those half pack outs in the
back, right? The little ones. And the way I did
it was I stacked the two on top of each other
and then set the base so that I could stack packouts
on top of them. And if I hadn't done that, I
would have went to put another packout in and
quickly realized my error. Because originally
I thought I could fit two full -size packouts
front to back, but I can't because that seat
slants. Yep. Yeah, it's a pain in the ass. I
had to move the seat up just a little bit and
then, like, kind of bolt it down. That way it
would actually sit, and then I could actually
slide my fridge in and out. Because if not, I
was, like, slamming my fridge against the seat
just to try to get it to stop, like, for the
slide to actually lock. So that was a pain in
the ass. I mean, half of that could have been
fixed, I guess, with my slide. So it didn't have
to go as far back, but still kind of a pain.
I mean, it's top -heavy. You know, they're tall.
So they're inherently going to be a little top
-heavier. But if you add any kind of weight to
it, let's say like a rooftop tent or anything
like that, it's only going to make it worse.
Right. I mean, I don't plan on doing a bunch
of off -camera stuff to where I'm worried about
tipping. But if I was, that would be a major
thing for me. So now that we've kind of aired
all our grievances with our rigs, Gavin, would
you buy, would you have rather bought something
other than an FJ? Oh, Gavin's giving me the one
second. Mark, would you have bought something
other than a Tacoma if you had? known about your
challenges ahead of time probably not in all
honesty when but the only thing close to it right
now would have been my dakota and there was a
lot of limiter factors for the dakota than it
does for the tacoma because i mean i had granted
i had a second gen dakota so it's older not a
lot of aftermarket value for it at all Probably
even worse than your war rudder. Would you have
bought something like, say, a Gladiator, something
else in the class of the Tacoma? Probably not.
Probably not. No? The only thing I can think
of, maybe a Ranger, but I think the Tacoma suits
me fairly well for what it is. Well, there's
not that much aftermarket support for the new
Ranger. They're cool, but... The Tacoma and the
Gladiator very much so have cornered the market
on aftermarket support in your class. Yeah. Now,
we were able to get stuff imported. It'd be a
different story. All right. We're talking about
would you have bought something that you actually
could have got your hands on. Yeah. I mean, personally,
if I had an option. If I were to go back and
buy something else, it would be a really hard
sell for anything other than a third gen just
because the money cost versus what I got was
pretty high with the third gen. Maybe a Cherokee.
I would have been pretty happy with an XJ. The
problem with that is I would have spent a lot
more for an XJ in good shape. because when I
bought the 4Runner, it was in good shape, and
then it fell apart. So, I mean, that's kind of
the issue with the XJs. Personally, I probably
would have bought a TJ, and then I fall into
the I have no space situation, because I would
have ripped that backseat out. I would have built
everything into the backseat space, just like
I did with my first TJ. Then I would have gotten
in the situation where I'm at now, where I've
got a 3 -year -old, and I'd have nowhere to put
him. I mean, for me, I've had a four -door JKU.
A JKU is not an option to me because I hate four
-door Jeeps. Jeeps should have two doors unless
they're a Wagoneer or an XJ or a Cherokee. Hot
take. Hot take. Jeeps should not be four doors.
I think the whole having a family thing puts
a hamper on that. So, I mean, it'd be really
hard to fit everything you need for like your
three -year -old without a trailer. Without a
trailer. Like your three -year -old, your dogs,
your wife, everything in the back of a Jeep.
That'd be extremely hard to comfortably. When
I was a kid. It was us four kids in the backseat
of a CJ7. And we didn't do the camping. Like
we went camping, but dad would drive the Jeep
separate and we'd pull the horse trailer out.
Yeah. So it was just a whole different style
situation than what we're in now. Yeah. I think
for me, like the FJ, one of my biggest things
was I always wanted one as a kid. And I finally
got to a point to where I was financially responsible
and had the credit to back it up to get one of
the cars that I've always wanted as a kid. Now,
mind you, I wanted it as a kid, so I didn't know
anything about them. And when I bought it, to
be honest, I didn't really know anything about
it either. I knew to check for rust. I knew to
check to see if it was mechanically sound. But
my mind wasn't off -road capability. And my mind
wasn't on the future with a family. So to be
honest, now, knowing what I know, being through
what I've been through, I probably would not
get an FJ. I love it, and I make it work. But
I would probably go with, like, a GX or a 4Runner.
a four -door forerunner like probably like a
fourth that i don't love fourth gens but i'd
probably do like a fourth or fifth gen yep uh
based off of how i would i know you like the
fourth gens i like the styling of the fifth gen
and i kind of like i want i want everything to
kind of come together the only if i budget wise
i'd probably be able to afford a gx at that time
the thing with for the same thing sorry kind
of off topic here the thing with fourth gens
are i don't necessarily love the way they look
i just love the v8s right and that's why i was
thinking more of like a gx so like the gx that
like derek's got in the in the uh or even the
land cruiser uh they made the v8 land cruiser
right uh just older but yeah yeah yeah but at
the same time If you've ever seen a fourth -gen
built for, like, rock crawling or rock landing,
they are fucking sick, dude. It takes so much
money to get them to that point, but they look
so cool. Arguably, this is arguably, I mean,
if you have money, anything can look good when
you're done with it. I mean, yeah, that's why
I say arguably, because, like, Chevy HHR, like,
stock, they look kind of shitty. but enough money
into it and you might actually get an hhr to
look decent yes the little the little compact
like i'm trying to think of a way i'm trying
to think of a way to make an hhr look good and
there is literally no dirt out and slammed with
like panel version I cannot see a world where
an HHR looks good, regardless of if it's slammed
and murdered out. Like, they are just an ugly
car. See, I thought it was pretty decent looking,
but yeah. It's like the SSR. There's nothing
you can do to an SSR to make it look good. I'll
probably, yeah. Yeah, I can probably go with
that. I mean, obviously there are cars that fit
that, but I have a, there's, by the way, there's
a guy in Grant that switched out a Fiero's. he's
got a fiero and he switched out for a cadillac
big block and he's got a big block in the back
of his fiero and that thing is so fucking sick
dude i i actually uh i think i sent it to the
group chat that uh that quad four um fuck i don't
remember what it was yeah i found a quad four
car this week and i was like oh my god this thing
is sexy yeah what uh what gx is it the 460s that
um i don't know that well i think it's like the
first generation yeah so there's a correctly
there's a 94 beretta for sale in richmond illinois
with a quad four and this thing is so fucking
sexy dude Like, the interior is nice. The exterior
is nice. It's only got 130 ,000 miles on it.
Yeah. All right. But, so, yeah, FJ is great.
Like, if you're a single person, FJ is the way
to go if you want to do, like, Toyota. Like for
off -road, I mean, overlanding, stuff like that,
like FJ would be perfect. Comes with a locker,
rear locker. It's what, mechanical? Mechanical.
Mechanical driveline as far as like 4x4 and stuff
goes, 4 low, 4 high. I think it's a really good
platform to do if you're single. If you have
a wife, you could definitely do it. If you have
a kid or more. it starts getting really hard.
And a GX4... Unless you want the trailer rounds.
Yeah, right. And I just really don't want to
have to go through all that. Like, I like trailers.
I think they're so cool, and I did think about
them. But, like, I also don't want an extra piece
to have to maintain like that on the road. I
don't want to have to back it up. I don't want
the trail issues with having to take tight turns
or... The trailer route only works if you're
doing a base camp style camping trip. Yeah. And
I, and that's not necessarily what we do. So,
but it, I do like, it's not a crazy outlandish
idea for me. I just think that if we were to
do it, it would be more of the overland style.
It'd be like the teardrop style, like the small
teardrops that you can fit a small family in
and then have all the, you know, kitchen and
stuff be able to, on there but yeah i mean i
mean anything anything toyota four door would
have been would have been a better idea for me
at that time even i mean i even thought about
getting a tundra and just to go in full size
and still think a tundra probably would have
been better at that point um because it is just
horrible and then and then my space would be
fixed uh they take turns a little worse their
wheelbase is different so Off -road capability
-wise, there's left to be desired, but FJs have
a decent wheelbase. I mean, I think they're one
of the smallest wheelbase Toyotas, I think. Aren't
they? I mean, I can't remember what it is exactly,
but I think the FJ's got one of the... I was
about to say, as long as you don't find the perfect
amount of logs. Yes. That was the thing. I think
my wheelbase, I don't know if it was slightly
smaller. You guys had a little bigger tires I
could grab. That was funny. I'm trying. We were
doing a little log crawling, and I got stuck
with the perfect amount of logs on either side
of my tire from the front to back. Couldn't get
up nothing. Holy crap, Gavin. You want to hear
this crazy thing? So the FJ wheelbase is 105
.9 inches, right? Okay. The third gen 4Runner
is 105 .3. Oh, there you go. So it's not bad.
I mean, just in general, the... Yeah, it did.
Or .6. Yeah, yeah. The... The FJ and the third
gen, honestly, in size are very, very similar.
We've got very similar wheelbases. We've got
very similar cargo spaces. The big difference
between, I'd say, the third gen and the FJ is
that the third gen has two full -size doors,
and the third gen has the front seats are moved
farther forward than, say, the FJ, so it gives
a larger space in the back seat. than the FJ
has. But actual layout -wise, they're very similar,
man. Like we have, like I said, similar cargo,
similar wheelbase. Yeah, I mean, this is a good
truck. They're really close. It's done me well.
I think I just hit 150, 155 ,000 miles on it.
Mm -hmm. So. My odometer quit working. Low mileage.
My odometer hasn't worked in a year and it quit
working at 263 ,000. So I bet you I'm closer
to like 280 ,000. Yeah, probably. Maybe 300 ,000.
Not 300. Yeah. I forgot you don't drive around
as much as I do, so. Yeah. So when I got in my
truck today to go to a burger night at the VFW,
it's the first time I've driven my truck since
I got back from rigs and coffee. Yeah. Which
makes it nice when you have that kind of downtime
to fix it. I don't have downtime. Not a day.
I don't have downtime. You have like non drive
time where you're not driving like every single
day. I'm not driving it, but I'm, I'm generally
working like 15 hours that day. Yeah, I know.
Like, I'm not saying downtime with your job.
More like downtime where you're not driving.
Like, if you were required to have to, like,
drive it to work the next day. I'd have a second
vehicle. Right, yeah, that would suck. Yeah,
that's the only reason I can do what I do is
that I don't have to drive every day. Otherwise,
I'd have a second vehicle. Uh -huh. I mean, you
have a second vehicle. Okay, so the 442 hasn't
moved since 2022, but it is there. We can pull
it. We can fill the air and just pull it around
the yard while you're behind the wheel. Oh, it's
still holding air. Those brand new tires I put
on it that I put 40 ,000 miles on, they're still
holding air. There you go. We can pull you around
the yard. Yeah. You can make a little. I could
probably. Actually, if I put a battery in it,
I could start it and drive it. It just would
destroy the heads, which are the one thing I
can't replace. Yep. Just do a swap. I can't.
The thing that makes that car special is the
W41. I definitely thought about swapping an HO
in there, though. Just put a 3800 supercharged
in it. That would be slower than what I've got.
That's the craziest part. It would still be nice,
though. Have a running car and everything. And
I don't even know if it would fit, man. The four
-cylinder kind of fills it up. Do a Hellcat swap?
Oh, my God. Take the firewall out and move the
seats all the way back. No, I think probably...
Probably this winter. I'm hoping to get a tent
that we can put by the shed, and we're going
to be pulling that engine and going through it.
Pull the engine, push the car body out of the
tent. You'll find there's like a shop rag in
there, and that was the whole reason it was making
noise. Dude, if that thing drove around for 40
,000 miles with a shop rag in there, I would
be pretty impressed with it. Heck yeah, dude.
It was just... Yeah, now it needs paint and so
much more work that needs done. And then I went
down. That long, man. Oh, no, the paint was already
bad. Yeah, the paint was already bad. So I went
downstairs. I've got the headliner pulled because
I was going to redo it, and I've got it sitting
on easels downstairs, and I found out that my
cat has been sleeping on it, and she's destroyed
the headliner. So now I need to find a new headliner
card, and they're, like, impossible to find.
Probably... The one I had was already in kind
of bad shape, so I'm thinking there's that Star
Customs or whatever in Kent City. I'm thinking
about bringing it to them and seeing if they
can build me a new card for it. Yeah. Probably
cost me, like, $600, but... Yeah, but it's a
new headliner. The rest of the interior is in
really good shape. I've got most of it pulled
out right now for restoration purposes, but the
seats aren't torn. They're not broken down. The
carpet's still nice. I opened the door the other
day, and the car even smells good still. It's
doing all right. Yeah. no living creatures in
there no no none of that not there was a mouse
nest on there was a mouse nest under the hood
and they chewed through some wires so i got some
electrical repair to do but and i climbed underneath
it and stuck my head under there because i had
a dream that i moved it and it was all rotted
out but underneath it still looks pretty clean
so we're still good to go guys but definitely
this winter we need to pull the engine on that
because i would love to have that car on the
road again yeah oh um speaking of carports the
company that we bought the awning through has
carports as well for like 200 i just didn't catch
what size sick Yeah, we definitely dropped the
ball on doing it for this last winter, but we
have to do it for this upcoming winter. Yes,
we do. 100%. Getting out of the shop would be
pretty killer, so we don't have to deal with
having everything out by Monday morning. Yeah.
Yeah. It would be killer. But... This has been
fun, guys. It's nice to have Gavin back. We ended
up doing two hours today instead of an hour and
a half, which is pretty crazy. Yeah, it is pretty
crazy. But we'll sign off, and you guys will
hear from us next week. Yep. We'll see you later.
Later.