Welcome to Botches Off-Road.
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rock landing and all things to do with the outdoors.
We've got a little hour episode today.
We're going to talk about some of our upcoming plans, maybe just kind of chit chat and catch
up.
It's going to be a pretty chill episode today.
I think we'll, I kind of want to start off with Mark because he's had the most entertaining
couple of weeks I guess.
Yeah.
Yeah, it feels like I haven't talked to you guys in so long because we did that radio
chatter episode.
We didn't really talk about updates and stuff, so it just feels like it's been a while.
It has been a while.
That's what I was just thinking about last weekend.
Where do I start?
Well first we were start of our trailer build.
If you're on Insta or is it on Facebook too for a Facebook profile?
You know, I don't think so, but it definitely should be.
Okay.
Well at least on our Instagram page we started, we took some pictures of our progress so far.
But in the middle of that weekend of us starting, I went to go pick up some trailer lights and
that was over by St. John's area.
That day the park was open for the St. John's off-road parks.
Like, well, I'm over here.
I might as well swing by and see the park and see what they added on and all that.
Mind you, I specifically told him, Mark, you probably shouldn't go to St. John's because
you're not going to have a whole lot of time there.
I had more than enough time.
Yeah.
Made that apparent.
Well, okay.
I thought I had enough time, which I did if I didn't mess up stuff.
Alex was helping a neighbor, was it?
Yeah.
We'll go with neighbor.
Yeah.
Helping a neighbor with breaks.
So I was like, ah, I'm going to be a little bit before we even get to the trailer anyways.
So I'm like, ah, I'm going to spend my day over there, which I did.
But now they have a loop now.
It's a little track that they just added at the beginning of the next new section of the
park.
And they have whoops in the one stretch.
My last lap for the day, I was going to just avoid the loops and go around because they
were able to go around and do it.
What it was is that they had a giant tractor tire, mainly, let me iterate on tractors,
like the construction's tractor tires on the side of the one loop or the whoop.
I went to go around it and I thought I cleared it.
Next thing you know, I bounced off it and I guess I sent it flying into the field a
little bit.
Mind you, he hit it with his driver's side.
So somehow he completely missed all of this going on on the side he was sitting on.
Yep.
I proceeded to go another lap thinking I didn't do anything besides just bounce off it.
And then I realized my steering was way out of whack.
And mind you, I just got done with a rack opinion not too long ago.
So I was like, ah, shoot, did I just break tie rods or really miss up my rack opinion?
So I pulled over into the little parking lot and was working on it.
Everyone there that day was trying to help me figure out what was wrong.
I couldn't for the life of me figure out what was wrong.
I think it was either my spindle was bent, which I couldn't tell if it was bent or not
because of where it was at, or my upper control arm got messed up.
But even then I still couldn't tell how it was positioned.
Spoiler alert, it was both.
Did we determine the upper was destroyed besides just the ball joint?
Yeah, the upper was.
Okay.
I didn't think it was.
Yeah, you bent your upper and you bent your spindle.
Okay.
Well, the main one was the spindle, but anyways.
So then I proceeded to wait a little bit after I got done messing around with stuff trying
to get it to be road worthy while I was doing that, I called my brother, told him what was
going on and then he received a get hold of Alex and then Alex got a hold of me.
I'm like, yeah, I think I need to be trailered out.
I don't think this is road worthy at all.
I don't feel like missing up the truck anymore than it already was.
Yeah.
So long story short, we got to working on the trailer at like 10 o'clock at night instead
of five.
Yeah.
But I ended up re this last weekend, end up rebuilding the whole front end.
I got new lower control arms, got new upper, got one new spindle.
Gusseted the spindles.
I wasn't sure if my lower was messed up or the upper, but I was like, Hey, I'm already
here.
I have no idea what's actually broke.
So I might as well replace everything at one go.
Oh, and also I broke a CV axle.
We discovered.
Yep.
He did break a CV axle.
Yep.
Holy shit.
Yeah.
It was quite the impact.
I'm surprised that my inner or outer tie rod on that side did not break though.
I was pleasantly surprised by that one.
Yeah.
So no, no tie rods were fine.
Yep.
Wow.
That's a lot of, a lot of impact for just a tractor tire.
You know, I know that they're big, but damn.
Yep.
Um, while we're at it, we also discovered, I don't know from the accident or was already
bent, but my bill scenes up front or bent.
Oh shit.
So ironically, both of them.
Yep.
Driver side was worse than the driver.
Yeah.
Pastors side was worse than the driver.
That sounds like something that was probably already, already there.
Oh yeah.
We think it was already that way.
Yeah.
It's.
Wow.
Luckily.
Trying to think of when he did that this summer.
Hmm.
I don't think it's from me wheeling personally.
I think it's design quality.
So if you see how the bill scenes are made, they've basically got a stick, the size of
a plastic straw that goes off the bottom of the shock and then goes down to get mounted.
Yep.
Like it is not a durable design at all.
No.
And we'll, uh, we'll just use the picture of a bill scene shock for a chapter art.
Yeah.
But is it, was it the lower side that you said?
Yes.
You said a stick.
So I'm assuming the lower end.
The lower part.
Yep.
Hmm.
It literally looks like a straw.
Yeah.
But which, uh, which bill scenes were these?
I have no idea.
There's 5,100.
5,100.
Yep.
Luckily, Alex has the icon shocks.
He's been talking about for a while.
He discovered that.
He stole my $200 icons.
No, you know, we discovered the front one weren't going to work for the third gen forerunner
like you thought it was going to.
Yeah.
But not without major mods.
I know.
Yep.
So luckily between, cause that was for a fifth gen.
Yeah.
Fifth gen forerunner.
Luckily for fifth gen forerunners and second gen Tacoma's, they shared the same, um, dimension.
So I was able to get the man to the front end about buying new shocks.
Yeah.
Here, Gavin, I got a, I'll send you a link to some so you can look at them.
These are, yeah.
Yeah.
You have bill scenes on yours.
Oh yeah.
So yeah, you, you are a susceptible subset, susceptible.
Wow.
That's a hard word to say.
Yours would very likely do the same thing.
Um, and honestly looking at how that little tiny stick is, it probably wouldn't take a
whole lot of force to cause them to bend.
No.
So yeah, we're compare that to like the icons.
The icons are a solid bit from the bottom of the shock down to the mounting location.
Yeah.
So it can't bend that the way that it does on the, uh, the bill scene.
Yeah.
But as-
That's interesting.
I, uh, I don't remember mine having that, that long on mine.
I guess the bigger question on yours is factory bill scenes.
I know a lot of Toyotas came with factory bill scenes.
No.
But the minor, um, I want to say 6112s, um, which I think they're like a two, two inch.
Um, I'll have to double check on that.
Yeah.
I'm pretty sure.
I'm pretty sure there are 6112.
And I don't think they, I don't think they make 6120s.
The 61, the 6112 has a beefier looking, um, stick on the bottom, but there's still a stick
there.
Yeah.
I mean, uh, yeah, I have the 6112s in the front, 5160s in the back, but I really haven't
had any real issues with them either though.
So I don't know.
I mean, Mark's up until this happened, Mark's only real issue was it was over sprung.
Oh yeah.
So we never, you know, it never noticed that it was bent until he took it off.
But with it being bent, it would have been forcing that lower control arm in a different
angle.
Oh yeah.
Okay.
I see.
That's the other thing I noticed right away after we put the icons on, it's a lot softer
right compared to the Bilstein's.
And it's, it's level now.
Yes.
It does sit level now.
Um, still got Bilstein's in the back and you can feel that back really bad, but it really
shows the difference between brands and shocks and everything.
And those are just there till you buy a new icon.
Well and I'm just, uh, I guess I'm trying to play devil's advocate for Bilstein, but
aren't they valved differently too though?
Well yeah, Bilstein's don't, I don't even think Bilstein's use oil.
I think they're nitrogen charged.
No, they're oil.
Are they?
They're yeah.
I mean, unless you have the stock ones, which are like the yellow and blue, but you said,
uh, they're silver and blue.
They're not that one.
Yeah.
Cause, uh, I, but yeah, um, icon is, yeah, they are valve differently.
Um, he does definitely need to get the icon rears.
Hmm.
Yeah.
I think icon are progressive, aren't they?
Yes.
No, the other one, I thought you said icons were, I don't remember.
Dang it.
I just know that they were a good deal for what I paid for them.
Right.
They're digressive.
Icons are digressive.
Okay.
Then the Bilstein to be progressive.
I believe that is how that works.
But at this point, me and Alex both contest.
If you're going to wheel your Toyota's and wheel like we do, you're going to want to
gust at your spindle arms for sure.
Actually, just in general, if you have a Toyota, you should probably gust at your spindles.
Cause I was just driving on a normal dirt road and broke mine.
You're not going to count everything you've done to it so far.
Bilstein is also digressive.
Hmm.
Oh, they're both digressive.
Yep.
Well, color me purple.
More we learn.
I will be the first one to tell you, I don't know a whole lot about shocks and how they
work.
All I know is I kind of definitely a better ride than the Bilstein's have been.
A hundred percent, dude.
Well and again, maybe you were feeling some of that ride with them being somewhat bent
to.
Who knows?
Right.
Cause at that point with them being with them being bent, wouldn't that further extend them
other way?
It wouldn't allow the control arm to go as low as it should have.
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Okay.
The thing was, I think ever since I got the truck, it was the first thing Alex says like,
man, this kind of rides low sprungy.
Yeah.
Like first thing I told him was these are over sprung.
It felt like you were sitting on a board going over rocks without any type of impact protection.
Yep.
Hmm.
Yeah.
But it's interesting.
That is a thing of the past now, I hope.
Right.
Cause we've got three icon rears, so he's got to buy one new rear for his.
And then we both got icons for the rear.
Yeah.
Right.
And I've got everything to rebuild the back of my truck right now, except for upper and
lower control arms for the rear end, which I'm going to order on Friday.
I just need a new lease springs.
Right.
And a shock.
That too.
That hopefully I'll be able to do before Leatherwood, depending on how some taxes come back.
Yeah.
Dude, Leatherwood's going to be a riot.
I was thinking about this earlier.
I'm pretty sure that Leatherwood is bigger than Drummond Island.
I think we discussed this previously.
Did we?
Yes.
Like discussed this a while ago.
I think we were the first to let Leatherwood got first bought up.
At least you and me discussed it.
Yeah.
And then honestly, Leatherwood has better views than Drummond Island.
I'm looking forward to that because there's a lot more like mountains and stuff.
Yup.
Yeah, I think when I was over at, for beers at one Derek's house, the other Derek.
Yeah.
Jeep Derek.
We were watching some videos because there's not a shit ton of YouTube videos on Leatherwood.
There's a few here and there, but it's a lot more side by sides.
Right.
But we were watching side by sides go through and there's some pretty cool fucking spots
where you're driving up a creek slash river for a while.
So if this puts it into perspective, Drummond Island is 150 square miles, right?
And convert that to acreage comes out to about seven.
What the hell?
Are we talking about the actual trails or the actual island?
No, just the actual island.
So the island comes out to be about 640 acres, whereas Leatherwood is like 50,000 acres or
500,000 acres.
Yeah.
Because I think there's like almost 250 miles worth of trails so far, if I understood correctly.
Yeah.
50,000 acres.
That's just insane, dude.
Like yeah, it's a park, but it's a park you can overland in.
Oh yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
You probably won't get through all the trails in one day either, based off what I've been
told.
Oh, I bet you won't get through all the trails in a weekend.
Yeah, that too.
And they're adding more.
I think, yeah, and there's a lot of really harder technical trails in there too.
So I mean, between that and crawling real slow, recovery, there's no way you'd be able,
I think, to get everything.
Yeah.
Even in the side-by-sides, I was watching those things climb up some of the ledges and
it's like, holy shit.
If you watch Bleepin' Jeep, he does a lot of stuff in Leatherwood.
Yeah.
I was about to say, because I think he mentioned about, there was a side-by-side that went
up on the tower or phone line right-of-ways and they rode it down because of how steep
the hillside was.
It's crazy.
Yeah.
It'll probably be a pretty damn good time.
And I think if we weren't trying to get our finances in the right and we weren't in the
position we were in right now, we'd probably end up going.
But I think for now, it's not going to happen unless something changes any time soon.
Yeah, life sucks.
I get it.
Life sucks.
Although we'll be doing some other trips.
We've got a Western UP exploration trip, some kids camping.
We're going to go up to the UP a few times just to see what we can see.
My year is going to be very boring because I'm just saving up money and getting the truck
ready for Moab next year.
And building the trailer.
Oh yeah, building the trailer out.
Yeah, because you're going to have to have that done before Moab.
All right, we're trying to get most of it done for Leatherwood.
Yep.
Yeah.
The goal is to bring-
What tires are on that?
Are they just regular road tires or like the older military?
Military tires.
Yeah.
We want to keep it military looking as much as possible.
Oh yeah, yeah.
Yeah, for the listeners that don't know, our trailer is a 1950s Air Force woodworking
generator trailer.
Yeah, it's pretty sick.
Took the generator off and whatever the front box was again.
Oh, the breaker box?
The distribution panel.
That's right.
Yeah.
It's really sad.
I bought that generator like four years ago to rebuild it to power my house when the power
goes out.
And I couldn't afford what they wanted to fix it.
So this is a good use for the trailer at least.
Oh yeah.
And very unique build because most people do overland trailers like for overlanding
and camping.
While we are just turning it into a tool shop.
It'll have every tool you could think of straight down to a shop press in case we got to do
wheel bearings in the field.
Yeah, that'll be fucking sweet.
And it will house an entire front end for my truck and an entire front end for Mark's
truck.
Yep.
Yeah, that's going to be some cool stuff, dude.
And a generator and a welder and all the important stuff.
Heck yeah.
Are you going to do like, I don't know, can you run like acetylene and stuff on there
for cutting or is it just going to be like a grinder?
It'll be a grinder for cutting.
Yeah.
I mean, we could probably get acetylene on there.
Could get a plug.
You could probably put like spare fuel on there too, aren't you?
Oh yeah.
To run the generator.
Pretty sure what Allen's welder is.
They have a plasma one that's just electric, but I could be wrong in that statement.
Yeah it's a, it'll be pretty cool.
Lots and lots of money.
That is lots and lots and lots of money.
Lots of money.
It's all coming from Harbor freight.
Just in case something breaks, you can return it anywhere.
It's pretty much the goal except for doing pack out boxes.
Yeah.
Except for that part.
That we're going to paint black so they're not, you know, distracting.
Yeah.
Well, that'll be nice too.
Cause if you need to go and repair something and you just need a box of that certain tools,
you can just grab the pack out box and go.
Yeah.
That that's exactly what the mentality was there.
Yeah. trailer stay at base camp.
The only time we'll be wheeling if we have to go to a campsite and we actually have to
take it off roading.
And that'll, that'll be very cool.
So we probably, you know, most of the like overlanding, well, usually when we're overlanding,
we're not doing the harder stuff anyway.
Yeah.
It's more for like, you know, Moab will want it.
When we go out to Rubicon in a couple of years, we'll want it.
And then obviously, uh, leatherwood, it'll be nice.
Yeah.
Really anything that's like more than eight hours from home, it'll be nice to have the
trailer.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
I have one guy with the, with the car hauler.
I have the other guy pole on the trailer.
Well, the goal is not to need a car hauler because the goal is have everything you need
to fix the truck on the tool trailer.
So the only way I thought, I thought you were looking at doing like a car hauler for like
the forerunner, like for long distance.
I mean, I am, I am, and I'm not, I don't want to have to use it, but I want to have the
option to use it.
Right.
That makes sense.
Yeah.
Cause then if something breaks and it's like, okay, yeah, this isn't gonna, you know, this
isn't going to be a quick thing, but I'm also with the trailers there.
I'm also tossing around the idea of building a off road pop-up.
So that's, that's the thing I've been thinking about.
Yeah.
And at that point I would need the forerunner to pull the pop-up because I can't do a car
hauler with a pop-up on it.
Yeah, man.
I don't know where you got to, you got to figure out a way to get yourself an engine
hoist welded onto that trailer.
We kind of thought about that.
Alex made this giant contraption that was not even worth the time and effort.
I had a whole plan on how to make it powered by the winch of the forerunner and put a crane
on the back.
You know what?
You could look for cheap, uh, those, what are they cheap oil field cranes or whatever
they got mounted on the side of the pickup trucks.
I mean, that would be the simplest way, but Alex was trying to make this like a giant
tow truck that wasn't actually going to tow anything.
Just the whole back end of the tow truck.
Just yeah, it was, it was very much so drunken thoughts.
Like it was not well thought out at all.
Well, no, it wasn't drunk.
We talked about it on the road.
Well it started out drunk because when I first thought it up, I was drunk.
Oh yeah.
I forgot.
This is a conversation before then I just wrote talking about on the way back from Missouri.
And then after I was drunk, it made me actually sit down and think about how could I actually
make this work though?
Yeah.
Well, I like, I don't remember what the front end of that looks like as far as like where
the tongue is, but you'd think you'd be able to put like a weld a plate there in the front
side of that and put a post and like a swiveling engine mount or something or a swiveling engine
cherry picker could type deal.
Basically we're going to put the generator there.
I think the other thing is that we got to have the crane over the axle and not away
from the axle.
So if we did do that.
Yeah.
Well, yeah, my, I mean, it would be more of, yeah, that makes sense too.
Cause then you'd need some like pretty good, uh, yeah.
Does that have a, uh, like a, I don't know what to call it.
Like a, like a wheel for the front to help keep the tongue up.
You know what I mean?
Not does not have a Jack yet, but we are going to put a Jack with a, like a boat trailer
Jack on there.
Yeah.
We'll give it that leveling wheel on the front.
Yeah.
That's what I was trying to think of.
I just couldn't, couldn't get it out.
And our really expensive pintle came today.
Nice.
Yeah.
So we are probably this weekend we'll be welding the, cause someone cut the original military
pintle off and then put like a trailer pin style hitch on it.
So we're going to cut that off and then put a pintle back on it.
Not a military style pintle because I'm not dropping $500 on the damn thing.
Yeah.
Right.
But it'll be an adjustable pintle so you can raise and lower it depending on what vehicle
it's going on.
Um, and then obviously an adjustable hitch as well.
Yeah.
Make up for it.
Is it a tube frame?
No, no.
Okay.
No, it's all box.
Everything's a box.
Oh, yeah.
Like box frame.
Yeah.
You're saying.
Okay.
So it's enclosed.
It's not like an I-beam type thing.
See channel.
I was about to say it's closed.
It just depends on where you're at.
Yeah.
Hmm.
I was just thinking the, uh, I watched one video, a guy completely sealed the frame and,
uh, and used it for pressurized air.
That's like they use it as the air tank.
Yeah.
I've seen that.
Yeah.
And I was just, just a passing thought since we were talking about it.
It'd be kind of cool, but I, uh, used to know a guy who had a Jeep and he did, uh, his,
his two bumper on the front.
He sealed that off and turned it into pressurized air.
That's pretty cool.
And my thought was always, what happens when you get in an accident?
Does it just go, because then, then he, uh, he filled it with nitrogen so that it would
inflate things faster.
Oh yeah.
That's a boom boom.
Exactly.
Man, so fill it for pain at that point.
Is propane faster than nitrogen?
I don't know.
I was just saying you might as well put propane in one of them.
I know it's, I know it's cold.
Yeah, it is colder.
You can use it as a refrigerant.
People put it in there.
Uh, the old R, is it R12?
Yeah.
The old R12 systems.
People tend to put propane in those.
Hmm.
Yeah.
I was watching a guy do that.
He's like, he showed the vents on his car and they're fucking just frosted over.
He's like, yeah, this stuff is cold.
Yeah.
I was like, I think it got to like 20 something degrees in there.
Yeah.
Where it was blowing out of the vent.
I think you have to, if I remember right, you have to change the way the pump works.
Like yeah, because propane doesn't have oil, so it can't lubricate it.
So you have to add some type of oil system to the pump to be able to run propane properly.
Hmm.
I know that.
But I've never ran propane in my R12 system.
So in fact, I don't think that's ever going to be a thing for me.
I converted my R12 system to R134.
I only have one vehicle that had R12.
So yours wouldn't, yours would be R134.
Yeah it is.
My 91, my 91 442 is R12, or was R12.
Now it's R134.
Yeah.
Excuse me.
I have the, in other news by the way, I, as I've already said, I went to Chicago here
the other day, got a winch plate or a winch mount for my FJ and the guy took a hundred
dollars for it.
So it was a pretty damn good deal.
We only went through $60 in gas, so $160 total, not bad.
And just got taxes back and boy, I am picking up a winch soon.
Maybe this weekend.
So other than, I still need to file those.
Someone remind me to file my taxes next week.
Yeah, it is.
The first thing I did.
I was like, I want my money and just got it in today and I'm sitting there talking to
another group from MST or another group member from MST who's got a Badlands winch and probably
just going to pick that up off of him.
It's given me a pretty good deal on it.
I don't think I'm going to buy the other fair lead for it.
He says it's got the original one.
And I'll just stick with that for now just for the sake of the price.
And then it'll just come to mounting it and I'm almost positive it's going to fit on that
winch mount as long as that mount actually is for an FJ Cruiser, which the guy did say.
And the only other thing is there was some kind of relocation bracket for certain piece
in the front.
I don't know if that was an AC line or something like that.
Or control box maybe.
And I don't know, I don't think I have any parts for that so we'll see.
He gave me a bag full of bolts and stuff for it.
He gave me the light bar that came that I think he just had just above it in that little
space.
So got a nice little light bar from it.
Didn't really need it but...
That'll go behind your factory bumper, right?
Yeah.
Yeah, it's kind of a hideaway deal.
So it'll be a...
It just needs to make a hole for the fair lead.
Yeah, that'll be no problem.
As long as I can get it to fit.
Make a note on when...
Last Casey, when he put a new winch line on there, because you're going to want a new
one every year or so.
Yeah, he said three months ago.
So...
Just make a note on that and kind of keep up with it.
The synthetic does break down.
Oh, absolutely.
And I know fair leads, depending on the fair lead, can kind of help the rubbing and stuff
on it.
But I think...
I'll be replacing my line here soon.
On top of that, Alex, I saw a video from the 24-hour four-wheel drive over in Australia.
They were talking about winches and I guess you could turn where the lever's at on some
winches.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
So theoretically, you probably tuck it forward or backwards and you have a flat piece of
metal on top without any issues.
I like this idea a lot because I definitely need to build a flat, hinging door on top
of my winch to protect that winch line.
Yeah.
I just know that you weren't sure about cutting a hole for the lever and came across the video
like, hey, turn this...
Had the lever down the way.
Like, oh.
Well, hopefully that will work with Alex's winch.
Yeah, we'll definitely look at that.
I got to look at how it's going to sit and everything to figure out how I'm going to
be able to get to that.
Oh, that's awesome.
Because if I have to pop the hood every time, it's going to be a pain in the ass with those
limb risers.
So I'm hoping that there's going to be a way or maybe I'll make a way to make like a little
door or something to get in and out of that.
Speaking of which, Mark, yours...
Oh yeah, yours is open.
You'll be able to get to this.
Oh, I got a good opening for that.
Good.
Yeah, I never thought about that because my handle has always just been exposed.
I mean, my whole winch sits in front of my truck.
It's not even in the truck.
Yeah, I was going to say it just sits on your bumper, doesn't it?
Yeah.
And my bumper is terribly designed and hangs way too far in front of the truck.
But it was $200.
So I love it.
It's like $70 for a X-Bolt cover.
Yeah.
I was going to say you could probably have mine.
When I buy that, actually he's got a worn cover that fits it perfectly.
And if it's the same size, you can have it because mine's going to be pretty covered
up anyway with it being behind the bumper and everything.
My goal is to build a flat door right there that hinges up because that also gives me
another spot I can stand on my bumper.
Mark, you're staring intently at your screen.
What's going on there?
Sorry, I was looking at the bumper of the truck that I mocked up on my truck.
Oh yeah.
I was looking at the winch.
I'm trying to decide if it's tall enough for the module being on top of the winch, but
I think we have to figure out how it wants it there.
We'll have to relocate the control box for sure.
Yeah, I'll have to come down on a... Once I pick that winch up, I'll have to come down
on a Friday when I'm not super fucking crazy busy or something and we can tackle that out
together and figure that out.
Hell yeah.
Figure that puzzle out together.
Yeah.
Because it's not... The plates and everything aren't bolted together and I think it's just
like it's two plates, so it's not super hard I'd imagine.
I'll get my brother to weld up something that needs to be welded on.
Yeah.
Yeah, I'm sure it'll be fine.
I just... I don't want to do it myself just because I'm not super inclined.
I just know I have to take the whole front plastics off the bumper and shit.
We put the winch on with the winch plate and then we buy a bunch of tube and we just make
you a tube bumper at the same time.
Oh, we could do that.
We could do that.
I don't mind the look of tube bumpers.
I just don't know if... I don't know.
I guess cross that road and we get there.
I kind of like the idea of the hideaway winch though.
I kind of like the look of the front end because at first, when I first bought the FJ, I really
wanted one of those big ass ARB Australian brush guard bumpers.
Those big steel ones.
I really liked those for a while, but as I started to wheel a little bit more, I was
like, I don't really need that, but I do like... I think it's called Tinker's Design.
He's got a bumper that he designed himself.
He's an FJ guy and it's expensive, but fuck, it's the best looking bumper on the market
for FJs.
It's beautiful.
It looks like it's missing stuff.
What?
It's so small that it looks like the FJ is missing stuff on the sides.
Oh, for the Tinker's Design bumper?
Yeah.
I mean, it's sharp.
Don't get me wrong.
It's so much narrower than the FJ actually is.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
God, look at that mount.
This thing is fucking stout.
The bumper itself?
Yeah.
It's got like... It mounts to the side of his frame for any listeners.
It mounts to the side of the frame and then it's got five bolts on either side to mount
the bumper to the truck.
Yeah.
I mean, this thing is intense.
It's quite the unit.
Yeah.
This guy knows what he's doing.
I believe he's an engineer and he does a lot of Toyota related videos.
Yeah.
And he talks about different kind of lifts, the control arms, the advantages of certain
tires and sizes.
Really check him out.
He's very, very smart.
He does really good testing on this stuff.
And he's... I don't know.
He's very, very informative.
And he kind of thought of everything with this bumper.
He's got dedicated high lift jack points on there.
He's got a... I think what is it?
CNC, one inch thick billet steel, recovery points.
What is that?
I like it with the tri-hoop best.
Oh, that is sexy.
Yeah, the tri-hoop.
The tri-hoop's the only way that I would get it.
Yeah.
$2,700.
Really for what you're looking at though, that's not a bad deal.
It's not.
No.
And this is all... He sells out every single time that he gets more.
But you gotta imagine how long it takes for them to fucking make something like this too.
Next batch, Q3 2025, get notified.
Yeah.
Every time I go to check, they sell out again.
It's crazy.
Does he... He sells them already welded together and everything?
Yeah, yeah.
They're not... Most of these are weld together kits, but this looks like he actually does
all the work.
Yeah, it should be all done.
Yeah.
By the way, Alex, that's not bolted to the side.
That's reinforcement brackets.
Is it?
Yeah, because that's what my bumper's going to get to.
Well, it's sick.
That's smart.
I know what it is.
Yeah, he's a really smart guy.
Like I said, go look at his videos at some point.
Like I said, he talks about all sorts of stuff.
I'm impressed with the approach he's going with that bumper though.
Yeah, I think that's why he made it narrow, kind of like what you're saying, because he's
got that whole... I want to say... No, it's not cut.
He's just got the whole front bumper and everything off of it.
It almost looked like it was cut, because I know there's some bumpers that you have
to do like a windshield washer relocation.
Yeah, I have to do that on mine.
So yeah, I wasn't sure that it was... Install instructions.
Even with the bumper I have now, I need to relocate my windshield washer, because it
hangs way under the bumper.
It hasn't been an issue in two years, so I've been putting it off.
I think if Alan stuck with his Cherokee Trailhawk, he went with a heavy duty bumper, he had to
relocate a lot of reservoirs as well.
Everything.
He had to do major body modifications, and building a Trailhawk just is not a great idea.
I give them props for it, but when you got one store dedicated to it and no one else
to compete with, they're very pricey parts.
I mean they're sick, don't get me wrong.
I have issues with the Trailhawk on its own, but the fact that people are taking these
and starting to build them is fucking sick.
Yeah, for sure.
It's like watching people build trackers.
Trackers are god awful cars.
I've had one, trust me.
They're god awful cars.
But when you see a built tracker, it's just like you have to respect that person.
That's how I feel about terrains and orchidias and stuff.
Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey.
If you see a-
We don't talk about terrains anymore.
We don't talk about brew now.
I actually saw a lifted white Terrain AT4 in Grant today, or yesterday.
Ooh.
Yeah.
And I was like, huh.
It's not just one that's lifted.
There's more than one.
Yeah.
I mean, I don't know.
I am actually more excited to see how Zach's build comes off after watching... I don't
know if you guys saw that video that was posted in MST chat about the other bone stock terrain
that did a quote unquote a diamond trail on Moab.
No.
It was not a diamond trail.
It was not a diamond trail at all.
But it was pretty cool.
I like giving Zach crap because I give everybody crap.
But at the end of the day, what he's doing with the terrain, do I think it's worth it?
No, not at all.
The dude's an idiot.
But, but I give him props because it's really cool to see someone build something that's
so ridiculous.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
Just because.
Yeah.
It's cool.
And watching that terrain do that, and I keep saying quote unquote black diamond trail because
if you see in the video, you're like, I feel like a Sienna could get up that.
But the ride is so low on that terrain, you're watching it hit everything.
It gets stuck.
And then there's just like at one point in the video, there's just a Tacoma just pulling
it up the fucking hill.
It's not a Tacoma, it's a Colorado.
Cause it was like, it was like a Chevy, Chevy group.
It was like two, yeah, it's like two Colorados in a terrain, but stock terrain with all terrains.
Oh my God.
Stock terrain on all terrains, climbing up terrain.
I have seen a terrain get stuck in a wet grass yard and that was a terrain 84.
But you know, I've seen F-150s get stuck in a wet grass yard.
So you know, it's just one of those things.
Like sometimes there's just no traction to be had.
It's just no traction, man.
And it wasn't just one of those like F-150s with the rubber band tires either, man.
I've seen them all.
Cause you always got those videos where you got like a Dodge owner shooting a video of
like a Ford that just can't move anywhere.
And they're like, that's a Ford.
And then you see a Dodge, you know, a Ford guy with a Dodge video of a Dodge doing the
same damn thing.
As a 10 year old, I definitely tore up my dad's yard with his F-250 because I had to
get some hay for the horses and I put it in the bed of the truck and didn't know that
he had unlocked the front hubs.
So I was just in two wheel drive on wet clay, just digging into the yard.
And to this day, you can still feel the tire ruts where I did that.
I miss those old locking hubs, dude.
I remember my dad had a 95 F-150 and he, if we'd go out like trail riding or he'd just
be like, well, we'd be going looking for like morale mushrooms.
He'd go off the trail more to find morale mushrooms than he would just like trail riding
on like the, on parks and stuff.
But he'd be like, Hey, Hey, go turn the hubs.
Because he didn't want to get out.
So I'd go run out and try to turn the hubs like nine years old.
I'm like, yeah, they're not moving.
Here, take these pliers.
I am tossing around the idea of converting the forerunner to locking hubs just so that
if something happens, like I blow a CV axle or something, I can just disconnect the hub
and keep driving.
And you can, I can swap over from Tacoma because some of the Tacomas had locking hubs in that
generation.
So I can collect the parts and build the system, but it's like $1,300 all said and done.
And there's a couple other little upgrades with it, like makes it so you can run some
better wheel bearings.
And it's just a lot of fricking money.
Every time I break my front end, we talk about it.
Yes.
I think I speaking of $1,300, I was looking at a front locking diff for the FJ.
I don't need one right now, but we were just talking about diffs in the chat one time and
like, well, how much is front locking diffs right now?
And I wonder if any, any FJs came with them and not that I know of, but ARB sells a front
locking diff for the, for the FJ and yeah, it's about $1,300 for it.
Is that one an air locker or an E locker?
I think it's an air locker.
Don't quote me on that, but I'm pretty sure it's an air locker.
So then you got to run airlines.
Yeah.
I mean, I was looking for rear diffs because Derek mentioned that he was looking for a
rear axle for an FJ because we have ediffs in the back for his Lexus.
And so I was kind of looking for rear diffs for him because I have a lot of fucking FJs
around me and everybody who's parting their FJs out around me already sold the rear axles.
So have you seen, have you seen the yellow FJ that drives around New Wego?
Yeah.
She's in my Michigan FJ group.
That thing is fucking sick with its, it's with a ladder.
Yeah.
She bought it like that.
She was actually, so she joined or asked to join the Michigan FJs.
I accepted her.
We chatted a little bit because she's from the New Wego area and, and she actually stopped
outside at Gilroy's where I work, saw me in the truck and came up and just talked to me.
I didn't, I've never met her in person, never, didn't even know what she looked like.
She just knocked on the window.
It scared the shit out of me.
I rolled down my window and she's like, Hey, you're, you're Gavin, right?
I was like, uh, yeah.
Like I'm thinking I'm about to get like served or something.
And she's like, and then I look back and I see her, her FJ and I'm like, Oh, I know that
FJ.
So we started chatting and she was, and then I asked you guys, uh, probably a month or
two ago about, uh, the steering issues she was having.
Oh yeah.
So she was talking about driving and she said, you know, she'd just go on like a dirt road
that she lived on or something.
And it felt like her steering was like, her steering wheel was like really yanking left
or right.
And she was talking about that.
And I'm like, yeah, I don't know.
Nothing that I really can tell you.
I don't feel that same.
You know, I was trying to show her on my steering wheel.
I'm like, how hard is it like yanking to the left or right?
And she kind of showed me and it seemed like it was significant enough to be an issue.
And she's like, you don't feel any of that when you drive.
And I said, no, I mean, not really.
Um, you know, and then I asked you guys about it and kind of gave her that same feedback
and she took it to the guy right next to tire wholesalers in New Aigo.
He works on a lot of FJs pretty comp.
He's worked on her stuff a lot.
But he had, he had checked that out originally and said it was fine.
So she's like, I just don't know if there's something going on with it.
I'm like, yeah, I don't know.
And after talking to her, I was like, you know, going on a trail the other day and kind
of felt the pull and I'm like, yeah, you know, I guess it does kind of have that little bit
of pull when you're, you know, on certain obstacles.
But she was just talking about it being on like dirt roads and potholes.
Mind did it like crazy until I did my rack and pinion out in or outer tie rods, welded
my steering column, do whatever that rag, yeah, rag joint.
I mean, I just rebuilt my whole steering system.
So but before that I had that problem like crazy.
Yeah, it's not, it's not enough to really bother me.
It's not like it's, it's not like it's yanking the steering wheel out of my hands by any
means.
So mine would pull the truck right into the other lane.
Like I hit a pothole and it pulled me right into oncoming traffic.
Oh yeah, no, mine wouldn't do that.
But the, but yeah, I mean, she's, she was pretty cool.
I told her she should come out and do some trail riding and she says, like, she said,
like, I'm still paying out.
I don't think my husband would let me.
And I said, that thing's already set up for it, man.
Just fucking go.
And then, so hopefully I can get her out doing something.
She's a, she says she's done some trail stuff before.
And I'm like, yeah, well, I said, come out, man.
We need more people.
My FJ, my Michigan FJ cruiser group is just pretty much dead because nobody, well, and
I, and I, I'm pretty much the only one on it now.
It's like nobody off-roads FJs in Michigan that, that's also on the page.
It's weird.
Yeah.
I see them all the time with off-road setups, but.
Well on, join me.
On that note, do you think we should get off here and go record a half hour episode?
Oh yeah.
I suppose.
Talk about our plans in that one for the weekend.
Then they'll get the half hour episode.
So they'll have already heard the half hour episode.
And then we just said that we're going to go record a half hour episode.
You do this every time.
Yeah.
Yeah, I do.
We definitely record these out of order guys, just so you're aware.
Yep.
Yeah.
We're going to knock the hour one out first.
Yeah.
See if we're willing to do that half an hour one.
Yeah.
And then see.
All right guys.
On that note, we will, we'll talk to you later.
Later.
See you guys next time.