I just want to apologize to all the listeners.
I didn't realize my mic gain was turned up super high before we started this episode.
So if I'm really loud at the beginning, that's why I do turn it down and somewhere in the
middle.
Welcome to botches off road.
Join us as we talk about everything from gear reviews to trail stories, tent camping to
rock landing and all things to do with the outdoors.
I guess happy new year everybody.
It's 15 days past and we've had quite an exciting new year already.
We have Alex and his newly fixed truck.
We did a poker run.
We use the term fixed very loosely.
We have Mark here.
Have you fixed anything on your truck yet?
I got my tires reseated.
Tires reseated.
Perfect.
So and some nice apex quick releases.
Yeah.
They came and borrowed my air compressor one day and then came back for another part because
my Anderson connector, how I have it set up through the front of my FJ.
They didn't really have a connector for that.
So they had to kind of work around it to.
Oh no, I totally had a connector for that and plugged it in and then it melted all my
wires.
Yeah.
So one, they either need to get their own air compressors, which they're going to work
on or two, maybe we should all have Anderson connector to battery terminals.
Either way.
Or Alex just needs to pay attention.
What grade of wire he was using.
Yeah.
I totally use the wrong grade wire for that one.
What was it?
I don't know.
Just somewhere I found it the in the shed.
It's like 30 gauge.
No, it was like, it was like probably eight gauge.
Really?
You didn't that melt?
Oh yeah.
It melted really bad.
Yeah.
What was mine for?
Yeah.
Yours is four.
Yeah.
Yours is four.
And that was enough to melt it.
Huh?
That's crazy.
Yep.
I've got two running from my old battery location to the new one.
Hmm.
Well, you're living there.
I guess.
Yeah.
I really melted the hell out of my Milwaukee box.
Yeah, that's all right.
It'll look really cool though.
It's a story.
Yeah.
It's that.
Yeah.
What else we had?
Alex and I had a fun night here the other night.
I was taking a piss, just checking my phone and I saw that there was someone stuck.
They dropped a pin, said they had 1% and that was all we heard of them for a while.
So I was kind of honestly, I, you know, I always like to tell people like, Hey, if you
ever stuck, anyone ever needs help, just let me know.
I want to be that guy that helps.
But at the same time, it was like 12 45 that night and I was like, I got to work in the
morning.
I'm really sleepy.
So I was kind of looking for any excuse to go that made sense.
And I sent the group text or that, that picture to Alex and the group text and he was like,
well, fuck it.
I'm throwing my pants on him.
You know, I'm off, I'm going.
I'm like, well, sweet.
That means I can go cause so I woke my wife up.
We got a little bit more information from the guy before radio silence and we headed
out and had what time did we get back?
Probably 3 AM.
We got, we, we got, we got very close to him and right as we got very close to him, he
texted, say, Hey, I'm out.
Thanks for the help.
And I was like, well, all right, well, time to turn around.
So it's a good 50 minute drive.
I think, I think I got back at like three.
Yeah.
Well, that's, I got pretty close to, so we, we filled up in New Aigo and came back, but
you know, the roads are pretty schlitz.
See, it was pretty fucked.
Oh yeah.
The roads are terrible.
Why was anyone on a night like that?
Why would anyone have been on a trail at that late at night?
Nice and warm in the car.
Because it was like, well, it was a Tuesday, right?
Or a Monday.
Sunday.
Sunday night.
Yeah.
So it's a Sunday night.
So they work the next day.
It was icy as hell.
Yeah.
Well, it was 12 o'clock at night.
Right.
So here's my super sleuth, investigative prowess and tell you that when I looked at his Facebook
profile after I had sent this, I said, well, this guy is not like us.
He looks like the kind of guy that brings two 30 packs in the passenger seat, tosses
them out while he's wheeling and does illegal stupid shit out on the trail.
And you know what?
I don't think I was all that wrong.
I found this out in Hindsight after everybody woke up from me posting that and said, hey,
you know, I got a message from I think Mike who actually wheels around there, does a lot
of wheeling and stuff in that area.
He goes, hey, just so you know, that south area over there next to the power lines, that's
all illegal, all trespassing.
He was not supposed to be there.
So it was a good thing you guys did not go and get him because you guys could have got
in trouble for it.
And I said, well, I guess it was just meant to be then.
So yeah, I had no idea that that was trespassing area.
Yeah.
Well, and I saw that it wasn't government, but you know, there are some areas around
here that are kind of like that too.
That's not necessarily the kind of gray area spots.
You know what I mean?
Yep.
So I wasn't really all I kind of saw at that time was there was a guy that needed help
and he was at 1%.
He was, he seemed pretty desperate.
He said he was willing to pay whatever just to get us out there, get someone to help.
So that's all I really cared about at that moment.
But yes, in hindsight, he looked like he was a side by side driver.
If you know what I mean.
Side by side drivers should not own cars.
And it looked like a side by side driver that lived in Muskegon Heights.
I hate to judge.
Oh, yeah, I hate to judge.
He just looked like the kind of guy that would leave beer cans on the trail.
It's one of those put boxes on the branches.
You know what I mean?
Of course, you know, now we're going to find out he listens and he's going to reach out
and be like, yo, what the fuck?
I'm going to be like, well, you, uh, the proof is in the pudding, buddy.
If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck.
Sorry, buddy.
Was he in a Jeep?
No, he was in a Chevy Silverado.
Then why are we talking about ducks?
Oh, that's true.
I don't know if it looks like a methed out redhead that walks like a methed out redhead.
But either way, we attempted to do a good deed.
So we cashed in some good karma and went home and, and it was a fun little drive.
I was fun drive.
Yeah.
I mean, I got to, uh, actually physically, I don't know.
Maybe not physically, but you know, test out the tires in a, in a real scenario, I guess
would be the better way to put it, you know, on the roads out there.
And they did very well.
So I'm done, done talking about the tires as far as that goes, because I haven't really
had any, uh, you know, real life, um, use out of them to, to really get an idea.
So we haven't wheeled with them yet.
Yeah.
I've done like, you know, I've done Prairie Trail or whatever, so it's not really just
bumpy, you know?
Yep.
Nothing, nothing crazy, but it was nice to see the handling on an actual road, which
is honestly, I hate to say it, but because I daily drive it and my son usually is with
me, it was more important for me to know and feel how they handle on a road versus off
road.
You know what I mean?
That trip reminded me, I'll reiterate this for everyone, mud terrains are garbage on
ice.
Yeah.
Um, you know, I, I had to slow down quite a bit for Alex.
He was sliding everywhere.
I mean, everywhere.
Dude, I could watch your headlights behind me just go, whoop, whoop.
No one said that mud terrains are good, uh, winter tires.
They're good in deep snow.
At least mine are.
I think that actually solidified for me to not get mud terrains.
I think, I think that all terrains will be it from now on.
I really like the look of mud terrains, but after seeing the performance there, no.
They're only good on trails and in mud and they're fine on dry.
They're fine on dry summer roads, right?
But winter time there, honestly, the best bet would be to have a good set of winter
tires for winter time and a good set of mud terrains for summertime.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
If we were all that, uh, fortunate monetarily, that would be nice.
But.
Yeah.
So, well, that was a good kind of a recap, I guess, of our last 15 days of the new year.
Um, I think we're actually going to start a little something different than what we
typically do.
I think we're going to start doing this somewhat regularly.
Um, and one of them is going to be reading some articles and kind of talking about it.
And we figured after interviewing Sydney Pope and, and talking about her Northology adventures
that probably one of the best things to do is talk about articles from her magazine.
So it's, it's directly overland and off road related.
If you guys haven't taken a look at it, um, go to Northologyadventures.com and take a
look at her magazines.
She releases them what?
Monthly?
Yep.
Every month.
Yep.
And hopefully soon on RSS and not just email.
Right.
So I think the article we're going to do today, um, is titled what I wish I knew back then.
Um, and then, you know, there's a little, little, uh, description down underneath that
that says we asked newbie overlander group members what they wish they had known when
they first started getting into overlanding and vehicle assisted adventure travel.
So we're going to start that up here and we're going to start with a quote from Dan Hagstad
and in advance, I'm sorry if I mess up your names.
Uh, and he says, don't buy every piece of equipment that people suggest.
Start with the minimum, the basics and do some practicing.
Find out what you need and buy that.
Everybody needs and styles are different.
I say by the second one first.
Um, I think the second one first.
I think it's supposed to be B UI by the second one first, but it's not easy because you don't
know when you just starting out.
Yeah.
Okay.
I just wanted to make sure I was like that threw me off a little bit.
Um, yeah, I just pretty much, uh, I think something that we try to articulate as well
is very much so number and don't fall into the overland tax bracket where everybody's
trying to sell you everything you need to overland.
Buy different things.
Um, you know, Alex is really good at trying, uh, trying things that aren't branded for
overlanding, but work for it.
Um, I'm very cheap.
So I try to like make all my own stuff out of wood or I like, I use a shower caddy to
hold my salt and pepper shakers and stuff to my windows.
So yeah, and I'm, I'm kinda wasting money right now because I'm trying things that should
work the way they are and I'm trying to find the cheapest way to do certain things like
air compressors.
I'm on what my third air compressor right now, because I'm trying to find the cheapest
way to build a decent onboard air system.
Right.
Without just surviving through that overlanding, right.
Four and $500 ARB system.
So there's gotta be a decent setup that's less than that.
So that's what I'm searching for.
And you know what?
And if, and I'm sure there is, but if you get to a certain point to where you're searching
and searching and going through multiple air compressors and you get to a point to where
it's like, wow, you know, maybe there's really not all that much out there.
Then it kind of also answers a question for us that we kind of need to know too.
Right.
How long are we searching?
Is it worth the extra money to just land on that first instead of air?
Especially with the onboard air stuff, I'm doing it more to better the community because
there's going to be something that's cheaper.
So I'm willing to be the, the guinea pig who wastes all his money to figure out what the
right answer is.
Yeah.
And that's, that's what I mean is like, it's once we, you get done experimenting and doing
this, it'll, it'll help us define an answer to that.
Yeah.
So we have another quote from a Rob Krupa says, whether it's camping gear or vehicle
accessories, wait until you find a problem with what you have and then figure out what
you need to add or change to solve that problem.
Don't spend money on gear or modifications that you don't need when you could be spending
that money to actually travel.
I think that's, I think that's a pretty good advice actually.
Me too.
I think, I think a lot of people keep buying things that they think they might need.
And I think I was kind of guilty of that at first, just to make sure I was prepared, never
ended up using it.
And I could have used that money definitely for at least gas to travel to the other side
of the state.
So good advice there.
Then we have a Jared pace that says, I didn't know how to find or get some of these amazing
camping spots.
Thanks to the Onyx off road app, I could see where I can go without being on private property.
And that is pretty important, I guess, what I wish I knew back then in that case.
But I will say that Onyx isn't necessarily the only way that you can find that out.
No, no.
So joining a group, joining a group like Mitten state tours.
That's a really good spot for that information.
Onyx has a lot and it's getting better.
But any of the spots that you find on Onyx, they might be good spots.
But that also means that anybody knows where they're at.
Yeah.
So these are these are public spots that everybody knows about what they're on.
Right.
So the really, really good spots are going to be those ones that someone gives you.
Yeah.
Or you find yourself.
And it's also important to and I'll touch on this a little bit.
If you find a really good spot, maybe don't advertise it to the world.
At first, I was very, very against that kind of mind thought, because at the same time,
you're like, hey, that's what this community is about.
But as I've wheeled more and met different varieties of people that use the same app,
if you advertise a certain spot that is a gorgeous spot, it's hard to get to.
The more that you advertise, how beautiful it is, the more trashed it becomes almost.
So I guess what I'm saying is to pick your pick the people that you choose to share the
spot with, because it's an open app.
Everybody can find it.
So yeah.
But yeah, no, I mean, there are other apps like Gaia.
Gaia is another good app.
They just raise their subscription price, I think, up, which has got a lot of people
switching off of it to on X.
The other thing with Gaia is Gaia doesn't just inherently know what kind of stuff you
want to see.
You have to put that information into Gaia.
Right.
Yep.
So guys, just a blank map.
But then you add your GPX files to get those locations.
Right.
I do.
I will say I do like on X better, preferably just for me.
And we've talked about this a couple of times, so we won't stay on it too long.
But just user interface, being able to see already done trails to get an idea of what
you, you know, what you potentially have in front of you.
So for me, solo over landing with my family, maybe I don't want to do like a red trail
by myself.
And knowing that it's a red trail or marked as a red trail gives me kind of an idea of,
hey, maybe this isn't something that I want to do by myself if I don't have a winch or
proper recovery gear.
So just keep that in mind.
And then let's keep moving here.
We have a quote from Adam Rubin says there is no right or wrong way to do it.
And finding what makes your life easier is the way that you should be pursuing the hobby
slash lifestyle.
And I think the more that we talk about this in our podcast, and the more that we talk
about this with other people that is becoming truer and truer, the definition of over landing
has changed so much.
And as, as we've all kind of known, or if you talk to anybody, you know, about over
landing, there's such a skewed definition.
So it's definitely important to just do however it works for you.
Don't necessarily worry about if you're actually doing it, you know, per definition or not.
I mean, are you in your car?
And are you driving your car to cool camp spots?
Congrats, you're over landing.
Yeah, I just don't don't think too hard on it.
No, I mean, well, yeah, budget over landing and what is it United, United, United by overland.
Yeah, and those were, you know, originally created for that same kind of purpose.
And, and the founders have kind of moved away from even trying to define it anymore because
of that.
So it's like, it's, it's a weird sticky situation, I guess, for the people that overpay to overland.
You know, if I think back to 2017, 2016, I was, quote unquote, over landing in an open
bed pickup, and I would throw a tarp over the bed.
And that was my overland setup.
Yeah, yeah.
And it can be anything, literally anything.
It's very important not to get hung up on the details.
And just remember that you're, it's more of a it's more of a just a word to define the
lifestyle or the hobby that you like.
So don't worry about what other people think about that.
So moving on, and by the way, the pictures and photography in this Northology magazine
are gorgeous.
Oh, yeah, definitely take a look at this.
I have a quote from Bill Warwick, it says it's all a big advertisement, slow down with
the purchasing, make sure you're getting what you need, not what is the latest thing.
Make sure you're making large investments with the future in mind, and don't buy too
small or too large.
Man, I think we're seeing a theme on these.
Yeah, exactly.
And these, and this is from people like us that have done the same thing, and all have
the same advice.
So when you're hearing it over and over and over, it only solidifies, hey, don't buy into
this overland, not scam, but the overland tax scam in a way it's kind of a scam if you
think about it, but no, it's totally a scam.
You know, chasing.
Yeah, yeah.
Use what you need and and find out what works for you.
And by doing that, you're gonna end up spending money trial and error.
Don't just jump straight to an expensive fridge.
Like let me give you an example.
I jumped straight to a fridge that I thought that would be perfect for the price.
It seemed really good.
I didn't measure as much as I thought I should.
And my slide isn't measured as much as I thought.
So it didn't really match up.
And because of that, I've had to modify and move things around.
If I were to have measured a little differently and thought about the future and how I was
going to set up my rig eventually, my setup might have changed a little bit.
My fridge might be a little different looking and my slide would operate and be different.
But I had to figure that out.
I had to buy it to figure that out and to have that expertise and knowledge.
So this is why we're talking about this stuff to you guys is so that you hopefully don't
have to do that first.
Oh yeah.
I mean, you can start like me and Alex do with our storage solutions.
We did the military crates first and now we're going to pack outs.
Yeah.
The military crates were only good because they were twenty five dollars and could store
a boatload of stuff waterproof.
Yes.
Yeah.
So, so as you, as you do it more though, you start to realize the needs and like Alex and
Mark, their needs are evolving and the way that they're thinking about this evolves to
what they kind of need more.
So it's going to be really interesting watching all of our pack outs and, and overlanding
kits changed throughout time.
Mine last year changed probably 50, like 50 times.
Like I have pictures of different, I mean, it's like different configurations to test
and try it out.
I think that's like my favorite part.
Yeah, that's, that's up there with my favorite part.
I love building.
We have a, we have a simple quote from a Teresa Nelson in, and this is in regards and I'll
remind everybody what the quote topic is or the topic is what I wish I knew back then.
And she says the money that hubby spends on gear, that should know.
It's no joke.
That's why I'm so single.
If our wives knew if they, if they could put it together as a total, I'm sure they wouldn't
be as happy.
Thankfully, my wife likes doing it too.
So she's like, I won't tell you know, as long as it makes sense.
And so all I have to do is be a good salesman, but, but that's definitely, there's a lot
of money into it.
And I think that's what's really important about how Alex is Mark are doing.
This is that they're trying to get around that whole, you know, that whole thing.
So we have a quote from Stephanie King that says that my daughter thinks I have an addiction
now that I am building out my dream.
I would like to have my Tacoma finished when I retire so that I could travel and overland
full time and, oh, poor Stephanie.
Yeah.
I think that we could, that's something that we all would like to do.
Poor Stephanie doesn't realize she does have an addiction.
And, and it won't stop as soon as you say once my Tacoma is finished with air quotes
that I'm putting up at the same time, nothing's ever finished.
It can always be fine tuned.
And then eventually you'll get it like you after a while you'll get a trailer and then
you'll move up to like a, you know, a larger over landing vehicle.
It'll just change as you go.
And that's part of the fun.
Oh yeah.
Cause there's a guy, Alpine tactics.
Yup.
He has rebuilt the Tacoma like three or four times down in the last five years.
Yeah.
And I think that also, that also kind of reinforces what we say as far as like, as you do it more
and more, you start to realize what you need and don't need.
And then you refine and fine tune your vehicle to meet those needs.
So yeah.
And go ahead.
If you drive like a Honda CRV or something, you don't need more than like two gallons
of spare fuel.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
You don't need six or seven gallons.
We saw a Honda CRV with a six or seven gallons of spare fuel.
And you know what I have in response to that is much like if someone else, we were just
talking about SUV wise and the poor fuel economy, all that added gear and weight probably affects
that so much worse that it might need it.
I bet you that thing gets 12 miles of the gallon now because all that extra weight,
but then you're adding weight with all this fuel and that just compounds the problem.
It sure does.
But hey, you know what?
It looks, he had what?
Three.
He had four on the sides hanging on the windows.
He had three on the tire carrier and one on the roof, I think, or something like that.
Like there were so many cans and they were all, what are they?
Rotopacks, the ones that probably have the hole in the middle.
It was, I mean, thousands of dollars just in fuel storage.
And I can't, I can't see it.
It's just as touring set up.
He was set for going thousands of miles between gas stations.
What does that say?
Is he going to do the Alaskan Highway?
That would be the only place that that would remotely make sense or that he was kitted
out with extra fuel to help other people who don't carry spare fuel.
I've seen certain groups where certain group members carry certain things.
So one vehicle is rigged up for spare parts.
Another one's more recovery.
The other one is more of the kitchen.
So I've seen, I've seen groups that do that kind of thing too.
I doubt.
Okay.
Do you want to, do you want to hear something really funny?
So on the Alaskan Highway, the longest stretch without fuel stops is a hundred miles.
I thought there was a longer stretch than that, but I guess I was wrong.
Well, so what time of year you're at, because there is some gas station that calls for the
winter time.
This is, this is a January report.
Okay.
So there is no, almost no vehicles that need to carry spare fuel even for the Alaskan Highway
as long as you're smart with it.
Now should you?
Yeah, probably.
What if you get stuck and you got to run at it, you know, all the time?
But I, I wish he completed it.
He didn't complete got overheated.
Weston Chaplin was taking one of the little K trucks.
Yeah.
I saw that.
Lucky it was doing a middle of the summer, but it was, it was very cool to see that K
truck.
Um, and, and that's stuck that it overheated.
I was really hoping he was going to get to finish that.
I know.
Um, so we have another one by Jill Carr that says how addicting it is and how many great
people we would need.
It's a pleasant surprise.
I also agree with what everyone else is saying about start slow, by practical and only what
you need.
So we'll, we'll move past all that again, because we've been saying it over and over,
but I will, I will touch on this and say that it is crazy how many great people you do meet
while you're doing this.
That's one of the reasons why MST is such a nice group for that.
Um, when we first started as a family, we were kind of worried to finding rant rowdy
rambunctious partiers that would just drink all night and, and, and do irresponsible things.
And, uh, we were kind of worried about that because that's just not who we are.
And thankfully most of the group or parents, they have, they have typical bedtimes.
They don't like to, they don't like to get crazy.
Like how we're kind of thinking, you know, like back when we were like 16 and, and, and
stupid kids.
So I'm usually the party group.
Yeah.
And he's not too bad.
He just loud sometimes.
So like, uh, earlier in the podcast, sorry, everyone, my game was turned way the hell
up.
Yeah, that's okay.
But, uh, but yeah, no, it's, uh, I think that's really good.
We met a lot of really good people.
I've met Alex and Mark through this.
I've met, uh, you know, Mike and his family, Drew, Ed, you know, of course, Joe's all the
Joe's, uh, speaking of Ed, I know I've already told him, but I just want to say congrats
on the baby.
Ed and grass.
Yes.
Congrats.
And good luck.
Cutest little kid ever.
Yep.
And I hope to see that all of you guys out camping with the dogs and everything.
Hope to see you guys out this year.
So, uh, yeah, that's super exciting.
We always, you know, I haven't been a part of this group for more than a probably a year
now, but it's really exciting to see the families grow that you care about.
You know what I mean?
So, let's see, we got a David Rui.
He says you just need a vehicle, a shelter, food and water.
Yep.
Pretty much.
Yeah.
Don't think too hard on it.
No, anything beyond that is luxury.
Right.
Yeah, exactly.
Um, we have, let's see.
Think that's, uh, we, uh, Christina Goodwin.
Yep.
We got that one.
That's, uh, how much it can make you hate reentering society.
The only bad part of an overlanding trip is the first tire back on the interstate heading
home.
And that is really true.
100%.
I don't know.
I like the interstate drives back just as much.
It's when I get back into grant that I'm like, God damn it.
You know, the first, the first trip that I took out on Superior, um, with Sienna, the
first big one we took in our two wheel drive escape.
Um, I won't lie.
We had such a fun time.
And on the way back coming through the, the, the bends and the little road next to the
lake, I, I kind of looked at it and I said, you know, it's weird.
I said, we live in a beautiful area.
She goes, yeah.
I was like, no, I mean, like we really do.
I said, if you think about this from our vacation brain, almost our overlanding brain, I said,
if you think about coming through this area and what we would have thought if this was
somewhere up in a different area.
I said, this is a beautiful area.
She goes, yeah, you know, I guess it is.
I'm like, you know, the town's gorgeous.
So it is, it sucks getting back into, into what we were going in.
But I think it's important to know too, that a lot of the times where we are in the closest
areas next to us are actually still gorgeous.
You know, I, I will honestly say that coming into New Waco in the winter time is probably
one of my favorite things to do.
That's why I always, if I'm coming from up North, you'll always see me take M37.
It's solely for that drive.
It's solely for that drive into New Waco.
Coming in the hill, going over the bridge is beautiful in the middle of like a snow
storm or something in the Christmas, all night drawn.
Gorgeous.
You have the, you have the three guys on the camels, the three wise men, the three guys
up on top of the school with the star, David, two guys, five guys.
Yeah.
You know, and I've, I I've been doing this, you know, all over the country and I can honestly
say that there's a reason that other people come to our area to do this because our area
is just so fricking pretty, man.
Yeah.
It's just what we're used to.
So we want to see something new.
Yeah.
And that's what I'm trying to get at is, is it, what's important is to also rethink how
your area is and to reshape that part of your mind to say, Hey, you know, we're in a good
area to get out and explore it.
We found things in our own area within 10 miles of us that we didn't ever think that
we'd ever find, you know, just cool stuff.
Yeah.
So that's, that's kind of something to help ease your mind a little bit, especially in
the winter months right now when we're all like, gnawing at the cage to get out.
But then as a side point to that, if you do live somewhere that doesn't have that, don't
be discouraged.
There's always somewhere to go.
Yeah.
I have a, I have a buddy in Tennessee.
He goes, he goes, Oh, well, I don't, I don't have anything close to me.
There's no trails or there's no nothing.
I said, is there wilderness?
Is there country?
Like how long does it take you to get out in the middle of nowhere?
And he's like, well, and I'm like, yeah, exactly.
I said, just drive around, dude.
Go find a yard.
We'll find a river.
There's plenty of areas down there.
And it's like, it's like, you just need to go out and look and that's the thing.
Even, even here in Michigan, pretty much anything south of us, they're looking at like 30 minutes
before they hit a national forest at least.
But then you get down towards like, like Hamilton, they're looking at two or three hours.
Sure.
Yeah.
Like there is no wheeling in that area.
So if you live in one of those spots, don't get discouraged.
There's so much stuff to see.
You just have to be able to make time.
Yeah.
So we have a quote from Jim Caldwell that says, make a list and take what you think
you might need to a nearby state park type campground.
Make a second list while you're camping of what you wish you had with you.
Keep refining those lists and you'll soon learn everything that you really need and
nothing that you don't.
I actually love this.
And this is actually what we did with our son when we first took him out.
This is a, this is a great way to get out, a great way to do it safely.
And it's still pretty fun.
You can find some really gorgeous state park campgrounds.
There's nothing wrong with staying at one.
And sometimes, sometimes they have showers.
So yeah, which is nice.
But it's perfect for that.
You could sit there.
Honestly, I'm a lot less worried about what other people think when I'm at a state park
campground because you're like, you're paying to be there.
You know that you're close to other people.
So I'm like, I'm like, they don't care.
They know what they're getting into.
It's like, so I'm not necessarily worried about my baby crying as much, although, you
know, obviously you're not trying to make it happen a lot, but it's a really good way
to do like your spring shakedowns.
To go out to like a campground like that and to just, and I don't mean spring shakedowns
for your vehicle, but more for your camping gear and how you have it set up.
Yeah.
Like go out, see if you got a leak in your tent.
Yep.
Exactly.
You don't have to go out in the middle of a trip and you're out in the middle of nowhere.
Then you have to find a way back to a DMC or a sporting goods store to find one.
Absolutely.
Yep.
That's a really good point.
That actually brings me back to, I remembered I used to, when I used to camp by myself,
I would actually bring waterproofer and stuff for my tent because I rarely would set up
my tent at my house other than to dry every few times.
So while I was camping, when I actually set my tent up, I'd waterproof it and clean it
out at the same time while I was there.
I mean, you're there all day anyway.
Yeah.
That's a good point.
Very good point.
Yeah.
So we have, let's see, another quote from Brendal Gantt or Jantt that says, how obsessed
you can become with the peacefulness of nature.
I find myself constantly staring out of my work window, ready for my next adventure and
definitely learning to take my time with building up my vehicle to my needs instead of trying
to look like everybody else's vehicles.
I've come across the last three years.
It's been a slow process and it has taught me patience.
Yeah.
It has taught me that patience and has taught me that all kinds of things about my vehicle
and what can handle without anything fancy or what she can handle without handle anything
fancy.
So yeah, it's a lot of the same and, but it's very important.
And I find myself doing the same thing, looking out the window.
I'm sitting at work and I'm looking at Onyx looking for the next spot, you know, or I'm
perusing online looking for the next upgrade that's going to help me do this a little bit
easier, a little bit better or whatever, you know.
So I think it is, it gets to be, you know, lately it's been, how can I, how can I find
a job that makes me do this more?
So I mean, so it's one of those kinds of things where like you love doing it so much that
you're, you're looking forward to doing it at all costs.
So we got another quote from Brian Havelock that says the best way to start is to just
take what you have and go, even if it means going to campground just to see if you like
it as you go, you know what you need and know and what you don't and won't use.
So just like the quote we read earlier, especially if you're a new camper, that's like, that's
the biggest thing is just go, you know, just make sure you have what you need.
You need, you know, your tent, you need, or a some kind of sort of, you know, way to protect
yourself at night or an enclosure.
You need food, water, and just go and then find out what you wish you had.
And that's just the easiest way to do it.
And then build from there.
Right.
We have Jay Jackson.
I never expected how big my, how my rig can get me to quiet places where I can leave the
noise of life behind, hike, cook, read, and just be.
And I'm sorry, that was Kelly Dreenan, not Jay Jackson.
That was the quote on her.
But yeah, it's a good way to disconnect.
Alex does a really good job, although he fights it a little bit sometimes, but he does a really
good job of staying off his phone and being just a part of it.
And I do envy, envy that kind of part.
I like to collect the memories on camera and stuff.
So a lot of the time I'm on my phone taking pictures of Jasper and my family, but I do
wish sometimes I could just turn it off and be, but the want to have them.
Buy yourself a crappy little digital disposable and just stick your phone.
Laziness is the biggest reason why I don't do that is because if I do that, then I also
have to transfer and then I have to like, you know, it's, it's for me, it's like, I
have it on my phone, take the picture and it's a very good quality picture.
And then when I want to upload it, I just get home and I upload it.
So that's, that is really nice, but it's, it's important to disconnect.
I have to get home, transfer them to my computer, then upload them from the computer.
Yeah, I get it.
Yep.
And I will say Jay Jackson's quote real quick too.
Overlanding is not a thing in every state.
Texas is most privately is mostly privately owned.
So yeah, I guess it is important to look at your state and what kind of potential there
is most states, bigger states, there is potential for it.
Oddly enough, Texas is not one of them, but, you know, some of your smaller states like
New Jersey and stuff, maybe not so much, but it's pretty much the whole East coast.
Yeah, it's pretty much the whole East coast is shot.
I think Maine has got some good spots.
I've seen some videos they do that have been gorgeous.
And if you're in the East coast, Maine's not too crazy.
And I think New York has some good spots to the countryside of New York.
Yeah.
But say Maine's got Maine's got the Acadia national forest and that place is absolutely
beautiful.
Right.
Then we have a quote from Brian Adler.
He says, try to get involved with the community and attend a few events from different areas.
I found really nice down to earth people all over the country and these overlanding camping
groups.
And yeah, that's, that's, I think the main reason why we're in MST, we go to these, uh,
Riggs and coffee events or the poker run events to meet these kinds of people that are all
like minded and we all get along really well.
And then we kind of form a little community and we, we go camping together and we all
have each other's backs and, and we don't really have to worry about the type of person
I'm somewhere with, you know what I mean? Cause a lot of the times there's nothing to
worry about.
Yeah.
Oh no, they're all weirdos.
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
If you were to explain this, uh, you know, hobby to somebody else, which I have a few
times and they're very different type of people, you know, live in subdivisions, never leave
their house, don't really go anywhere outside.
They're not really outside people.
And you go to explain to them that you go off road on purpose to get lost on purpose
and you meet strangers that you've never met in your life to hang out in the woods.
And then you trust them with your son and your wife in tents, four feet across from
each other in the middle of nowhere where you could easily be killed.
And they look at you like you're fucking crazy.
And you know what?
I don't, there's a lot of trust that goes into that.
It is.
There's a lot of trust.
I mean, obviously having some kind of backup plan is important too, but there, there is,
there's a lot of trust that goes into that.
And that's why it's important to find these communities and find these good people that
you can trust and make sure that you have semi-automatic bear spray.
Usually I prefer the nine millimeter variety.
Yes.
I do like my nine millimeter tent hole puncher.
So, uh, let's see.
We have a Craig and I'm going to mess this back last name up, but Craig Gilead.
Gillett.
Gilead.
Gillow.
If you're trying to go past that.
Sounds good.
Gillow.
Gille.
Anywho.
You can rent overlanding vehicles all over the world.
So fly places and rent to see what you can, uh, yeah.
So fly places and rent to see what you like before you buy and get into it.
Plus, even when you get your own gear, renting offers many benefits.
Why limit yourself to road trips from your house when you can just do it on a different
continent every trip.
I have fair, I have fairly well equipped forerunner, but I've taken trips in Costa Rica, Jordan,
Scotland, and other places in Land Rovers, FJs and others.
Renting opens so many more doors.
I'm in New Orleans, so I have a, so I have to drive two days to get somewhere real.
Meanwhile, I can hop on a flight to Costa Rica and be in the jungles in the Land Cruiser
that afternoon.
That's crazy.
I kind of laughed in the beginning because I'm like, yeah, that's, that seems like a
lot of money, but at the same time, I mean, the money that you spend to build your rig
versus the money that you're spending on a plane ticket to rent a rig, it could even
out in a way.
My only argument to that is I like collecting stickers for my forerunner to see where she's
been.
Yeah.
I like doing it in something I've built because again, to me, building is a big part of the
hobby.
Yeah.
I think the traveling in your vehicle for me is part of that.
I think that there is something to be said about, let's say if we were to go to Alaska,
because I like very, a very long way.
And if I've never been to Alaska before, maybe renting it and doing, you know, maybe a guided
tour with someone like Mint State Tours in Alaska to get a feel for the area first.
And what I totally need.
The opposite.
Yeah.
I've never been there, but man, I want to drive there.
Yeah, no, I want.
So don't get me wrong.
I want to drive there.
But for me, if I'm driving from Michigan to Alaska, I want to know that I have the right
shit in the right gear pack for that.
So my my reason is maybe first more of a scouting adventure.
I go there.
I rent a vehicle.
I do it for a week or so.
And then I realize, OK, this is what I'm going to need while I'm here.
And that's kind of where I'm at with that.
I would definitely still take my vehicle there when I'm ready.
And I I would be the guy you find frozen in a snowbank next to his truck.
Yeah, he's the guy that's like, all right, let's go.
So very that was a very interesting quote.
I, you know, wasn't really expecting something like that.
We have another quote from James McMillan and it says, not sharing locations of remote
camping spots on social media.
Irresponsible posting leads to the overuse and abuse of public lands.
That is a lot like what we talked about earlier.
And it's very true.
It happens a lot.
It's somebody who overlands and any of our off roaders that listen to our podcast.
I'm sure that you've driven on a trail somewhere.
I think that you got out in the middle of nowhere.
Find a cool camp spot and then find a couch and beer cans around it.
So oh, yeah, that's that's kind of that's kind of why we don't share as much anymore
is because because with sharing the locations get passed around.
People realize they can get to them and then they're irresponsible.
Unfortunately, you can't just trust people to do the right thing.
So until that happens, that's a kind of one of those things.
So I just wanted to thank Cindy for her.
We're going to ask for forgiveness kind of situation here for letting her read the Northology
magazine out under this.
And I hope that she's OK with us kind of bringing her magazine back into this and talking about
what a great source of information, a source of products and stuff that are in this.
And we're hopefully going to keep doing little sections like this.
We'll do this maybe once every couple of weeks, maybe once a month.
We're going to kind of feel that out, too.
And it's a lot of fun to kind of talk about this and and add a little segment onto our
onto our podcast.
So what did you guys think?
Is this something that we want to do a little bit?
Dude, I I like this a lot.
Not to say it's like low quality content, it's really high quality content.
But absolutely to have to have at least one week a month where we don't have to think
through a topic and it's kind of laid out for us.
Yeah, I'm all for it.
Well, I like I like reading the articles and then talking about how we think about that.
Obviously with that with that question, that's a pretty widely used question around the overlanding
community.
So you're going to get a lot of that repetition and answer.
But yeah.
But but you know, next week or next month when we choose to read a different article,
it could be top five destinations in the Middle East or whatever.
And you know, maybe maybe it brings a little more knowledge to something else that we didn't
know about.
So yeah, I think that's something that we can definitely do in the future.
And with Cindy Pope's continued hopefully permission.
Yeah.
And yeah, yeah.
Well, we'll double check with her after this.
We figured that she wouldn't mind, you know, the extra publicity, I guess.
And it's not negative publicity at all, by any means.
Definitely the opposite.
But so.
But what do you guys think?
She lists us and her podcast things on her magazine.
So I guess us giving some shoot back to Northology isn't a half bad idea.
Only fair, only fair.
Yeah.
But she's a great person.
So I have no doubt that she would would not mind.
So with that, I think we are we're going to move now from this segment on to our next
segment.
Yes, which are booze.
Yes.
And we're going to move that over to the very first.
For the very first time on the botches off road podcast, a listener has decided that
we deserve just a little bit of kickback for the content we make.
Yeah.
So from our dear, dear friend, Magnolia Mayhem, who he he's a co listener to another podcast
that I listen to, which is Jupiter Broadcasting.
They do a lot of Linux based stuff and open source stuff.
If that's anything anyone here likes to listen to.
But Magnolia says, did I hear that nobody has boosted the show yet?
Well, if that's true, let me have the honor of not only the first to listen to the show
using a flamethrower, but also the first to boost in man, a flamethrower.
I we almost need him to boost in and tell us the story behind that.
Also, also from the few peaks behind the curtain I've had.
Oh, this is talking about I think it was last week's episode where we did the conspiracy
stuff.
Yeah.
He goes from the few peaks behind the curtain I've had, the stuff the government has is
nothing like what he's describing.
I wish they had gravity drones or whatever, but instead I almost got get arrested for
looking at a completely mundane white plane.
I mean, if they didn't want me to look at it, they should have parked it right next
to me.
What was I talking about again?
So there's some mystery there.
He didn't go really into detail as far as what the white plane is, but it gets me all
thinking about all the conspiracies and what's going on.
Maybe that plane was gravitically driven.
Yeah.
I was saying about how the propulsion worked on it.
So I'd have to agree with him.
The the gravitic propulsion seems kind of out there.
It is crazy.
But yeah, at least when it comes to communications, I'd say that the community.
Well, I was a communications guy in the army for anyone who was listening.
I'd say they're 10 to 15 years ahead of what the consumer market has.
In most areas and then in other areas, they're like 50 years behind the consumer market.
When it comes to like when it comes to like outfitting their soldiers and actual like
vehicles and stuff.
Yeah.
Yeah, probably.
But probably a lot closer.
I mean, look at how big mesh radios are getting today.
When I was in the army, we were starting to experiment with them and that was 10 years
ago and they were about on par with what we have now.
So I would say that about 10 to 15 years is where I'd place them.
Yeah.
I mean, I think I would say that every year.
And this is probably just being nice, but every year that we advance in future, just
in general, just every year that we advance, I feel like that timeline actually gets moved
up every, you know, it goes from maybe.
We're 10 to 15 years, one year.
But after we unlock a certain understanding, it goes from, you know, you know, 12 to 20
years and then 20 to 25.
And I might.
My only reasoning is, you know, from the 40s or the 30s till now are.
I guess our evolution as far as understanding technology and stuff has been greatly increased
by year.
And I almost refuse to believe that the greed has been so bad in our country that it is
almost negated all kinds of, you know, kind of R&D.
And I just feel like there's everybody's so worried about losing money now that they don't
want to make anything public because they're worried about other people stealing ideas.
And I think I think it's the opposite.
I think that every year the consumer market moves forward, they're getting closer and
closer to having a matched technology level with the government because the government
moves very, very, very slow.
Yeah.
So, yeah, I was going to say, let me rephrase as far as not necessarily just the government,
but I do mean technology as a whole.
Yeah.
You know, like Lockheed, like obviously we don't know everything Lockheed's got or some
of these other large tech companies like this that let me just open up my Lockheed.
I've got everything.
Yeah.
Alex disappears.
What do you mean?
Who's this Alex?
Let me see this file.
I've never seen it.
I've never heard of in my life.
I mean, you think about it.
Look how far gunpowder has come from just being a cannonball launcher.
Yeah.
Firewall in China.
Yeah.
Fireworks in general.
But yeah, look how far that took for the most part.
You know, but yeah, look how far that took for them to evolutionize that.
Now we have advanced rifling and certain projectiles that do certain things at certain distances
that are smart.
You know, so it's like for me, that's how I see it is every year it's different.
And then of course there was experiments in the forties and I, you know, unfortunately
what Germany did was crazy wrong and unfortunate.
But I will say with that and with that in mind, the science and the things that they
were doing as far as propulsion, as far as weaponry was crazy, crazy stuff.
If you've seen the cannon they've made the type of propulsion systems they've tried to
make as terrible as the human experiences or experiments were, look at what we gained
from those experiments because we know so much more about how the human body works or
the human mind thinks solely based off of Nazi experimentation.
Right.
And we're not condoning this by any, but we're trying to see the light in a very dark situation.
You know, we're still the devil.
Yeah.
We just want to, I just want to say that, you know, we were not saying that any of this
is good.
We're not saying that we condone any of this, but we are trying to make light of all the
sacrifices that were unfortunately made.
So there was a lot of, there was a lot of advancements made from that.
And if you've seen some of the videos and some of the things that Germany was trying
to do, it, they were so far ahead in certain areas.
And now that those, a lot of those scientists were moved around the world to different countries
like America, it's hard for me to think that if that's what they were doing in the thirties
and forties, and if you believe the Roswell incident to have any kind of truth to it,
then you have to kind of think that, man, there's gotta be between the two, there's
gotta be something more that we don't know.
I mean, hell, they have the SR-71, one of the fastest flying aircrafts in the world,
if not the fastest flying.
And that was what back in the, what was that, late seventies, the early eighties?
When was that made?
The SR-71?
Late seventies.
So you're telling me that they haven't made something faster from the seventies, more
efficient, faster.
There's no way, dude.
Yeah.
I mean, look at planes.
We just don't know about it.
Yeah, planes have come a long way.
Right.
So, so you gotta think about it.
And that's how I think about it, is if Roswell was true, if the SR-71, just, just the, how
our advancements have come since then, how microchips have gotten smaller, how everything
has changed.
Yeah, there's no way.
I just think that the biggest, the biggest weapon is not telling other people who's got
the biggest gun and the quickest gun, you know?
I'm telling you, the two things that have to happen before I'm happy is the Concorde
has to be flying across the Atlantic again and I have to go to space.
There you go.
You heard it here first, folks.
Alex wants the Concorde flying across the Atlantic while he's in space.
I want to watch it.
I want to watch it go across.
While he's in space.
While I'm in space.
In the ISS.
Maybe not the ISS.
Yeah.
My own private, my own private transporter ship.
Now you're, now you're just picking at like pipe dreams there.
But I'm gonna, I'm gonna put some rockets on the forerunner and make sure the earth
is round.
Yeah.
Well, when you fall off, let us know, buddy.
With that, guys, I'll, we're going to wrap up this episode.
Thanks for listening.
We want to thank our boosters for coming in and leaving a booster for us.
We want to thank Sid and Hope and we'll see you guys next time.
Later.
So thanks for listening.