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Enjoy the show. Welcome to Soul Decodes. Join

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us as we wander off the path to find the ideas

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that fascinate. We talk about spirituality, the

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mind, the ego, wellness and hidden history with

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tips, travels and tales. Charms for a better

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life. Hello, everybody, and welcome. You're listening

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to Soul Decodes. My name is Dr. Tia Jolie Phillips.

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I'm with my co -host, Sarah Tirri, and we have

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a special guest today. Yes, we do. She's amazing

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in so many ways. And you know why she's amazing?

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I do. Because she's British. So true to form,

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the Americans are outnumbered here. It's a British

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invasion. But I'd like to welcome Sharon Keeble

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to the studio. Welcome, Sharon. Thank you, Tia

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and Sarah. For having me. It's lovely to have

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you. Thank you. So for those of you who love

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this beautiful British, those voices, you're

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going to really enjoy today's episode. Sarah,

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you've known Sharon a couple of times. She's

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been to some gatherings here. The first time

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we met was here, yeah. Yeah, so we've had some

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gatherings. But Sharon, you and I have known

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each other for a couple of years through some

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of the local networking. Yeah, yes, we have from

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the chamber and other networking places, I think

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at least a couple of years. Probably a couple

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of years, yeah. But the more I learn about you,

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the more layers, the more I learn the different

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depth to who you are. But for somebody who doesn't

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know Sharon Cable, what... Give us some background.

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I mean, were you born in America or Britain?

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So I was born in England. I grew up just south

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of Manchester. Most people have heard of Manchester,

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I think, with this soccer team. And then I moved

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around a lot with my job. I'm a journalist and

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an author. So I moved around a lot, got married,

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had children, then visited America when my youngest

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was about one years old. Went to the Keys, fell

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in love. Totally. Bought a little holiday home

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near Orlando that we rented out to other Brits,

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and then decided we wanted to live here. And

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in 2005, we moved here. I actually came over

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thanks to the National Enquirer magazine, who

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gave me a job as a features editor. And no matter

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what anybody says about the National Enquirer,

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I absolutely loved every minute of it. It was

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so fun. I bet they had more truth than the regular

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news. Well, I will tell you, Tia, you're absolutely

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correct there. Because every single story, and

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a lot of people might not believe this, but every

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story that goes in that magazine is really checked

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out. We have to have it passed by lawyers. Really?

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Yes. So if somebody was suing you, it costs $250

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,000 off the bat to defend yourself. So they

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don't want regular $250 ,000 lawsuits. So they

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have their own lawyers and everything has to

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be passed by them. If you read the National Enquirer.

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But there was a headline years ago, and I don't

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know whether it actually was quite a long time

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ago, and I can't remember what it was, but it

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was something like, mermaid gives birth to reptilian

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baby off the coast of Seattle or something. So

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it was like, holy shit, but they cover that because

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that's not liable, is it? They can just say what

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they want as a headline. And it's something,

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I mean, it was like, wow, it got my attention.

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Now, I'm wondering if that was a national examiner.

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Oh, okay. Could have been. Yes, because that's

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like a sister magazine to the Inquirer. So that

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could be that. I think people sometimes get them

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mixed up. So, but I can honestly tell you that

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everything that goes in that magazine is thoroughly

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checked. No matter what politicians say that

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I didn't do that or whatever. yeah to get in

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it's very yeah we're pretty sure you did here

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it is so oh yeah this is fascinating that you're

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a journalist and she's a writer sarah's a writer

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so that's you have that in common as well yeah

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so you say that you say that you loved it i can

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just imagine that so you're with a whole load

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of people putting content for this that's creative

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yeah you've got a mission you've got to get a

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story it's got to be well done and you've got

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to prove yourself a bit i mean and it's quite

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a lot at stake because it's at a weekly or monthly

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magazine weekly so i can imagine and was this

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So you came to America to work in America for

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the National Enquirer. Yeah, they offered me

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a job and they paid for me and the girls and

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my husband to come over. And they said to me,

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you can either work in New York or you can work

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at home. So I'm like, well, I think I'll work

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at home in Florida so I can be with the kids.

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But actually, I was sent out on location a lot.

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So I went. all over the place actually that year

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it was Hurricane Katrina and one of my first

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big jobs was yeah so the National Enquirer had

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got together a fundraising so myself and a photographer

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went out stayed in Mobile Alabama and we helped

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this church put all these care packages together

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and then we drove from Mobile into Louisiana

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and um so that was um a shocking visual for you

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then I mean that wow that was one of your first

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jobs it's like I mean you weren't in Kansas anymore

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at that point were you wow that's a big no no

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it was did you have to interview people that

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had suffered I did I did I worked on that story

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for a long quite a long time actually because

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stories kept coming out of stories you know as

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you can imagine um but it was um I remember it

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So, so vividly because, you know, I'd never seen

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anything like that because we don't get anything

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like that in England, do we? No, it was your

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first hurricane. I mean, now it's a bit of a

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banality, isn't it? But then it would, yeah.

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But I remember, so we were with an army convoy

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and I was sat in the front with this army guy.

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And as we came across into Louisiana. There was

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this smell, like, so weird. I'd never, like,

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smelled anything like it, honestly. And I said

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to the army guy, I'm like, what on earth is that

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smell? And he just looked at me and he's like,

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it's death. And I was just like, yeah. It still

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makes me go shivery. Yeah. And it got so strong

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as we... Oh, wow. Because you wouldn't know what

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that is unless you were in it because it's not

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an everyday thing. No, no. And the devastation,

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you know, I've never seen anything like it. We

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went to several different towns to deliver. But

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there was this lady, I remember, there'd been

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a 12 -foot storm surge and it had wiped out this

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whole... area and there's about 12 houses i think

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that were there and we went in there and um this

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lady was in a tent with um her husband every

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house was gone and rubble everywhere and i handed

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her this uh this care package and she just threw

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her arms around me and she was just so grateful

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for you know and i was just like oh my gosh you

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this woman has lost everything and yet she she

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can be so grateful and... be like this you know

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in this in all this devastation so it was we

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did a podcast we've done a few about gratitude

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but that's a very interesting story everything's

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been taken away but this is meaningful for her

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and that level of gratitude and you were there

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you bothered you cared and that is the human

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spirit isn't it and it's it's a really good lesson

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in gratitude is very very important to the spiritual

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life it really is and that was kind of you know

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it's probably a lot of profound things that happened

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to us As a result of being there. But that's

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an interesting one. And I mean this is just.

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How long were you there for? So I worked for

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them. Let me see. Gosh. Quite a few years. And

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did you have lighter hearted stories. To report.

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So when you went out there it could be. It wasn't

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just that. No. Something like that. No, because

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I, so I was the features editor for the real

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life stories. So I didn't do a great deal of

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celebrity, which of course the National Enquirer

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is known for. I did some, but I predominantly

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did a lot of real life stories. And I had, I'd

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spoke to some incredible people, you know, with

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the most amazing stories that we're quite happy

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to share. Often if there was a lesson in it,

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I find that people want to share their stories

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if they want to help other people. Kind of like

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why you're here. Yeah. I mean, you agreed, like

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you've been through a lot, not just what you're

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talking about with the newspaper, but your personal

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life. We'll get to that in a minute. But would

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you say, I don't really know too much about you

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personally, but would you say you're kind of

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a spiritual person or do you believe your soul's

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having some sort of a journey? Because that's

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very central. to what we do on Soul Decodes.

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The idea is that the premise is that we each

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have a soul, although I might have met some people

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that don't. But, you know, the premise is that

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we have a soul and we're on this journey through

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this earth space. And Soul Decodes is about deciphering

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or decoding what's this experience all about.

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So based on this newspaper experience with Katrina

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and these people, Would you say, how does that

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play into this idea that your soul, you personally

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are going through this journey? How was that

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transformative for you? So I am a very spiritual

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person, for sure. I think I learned lessons there.

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I learned that, you know, even in the most despair,

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there is always a shining light. And that has

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helped me as I've gone, as I've dealt with stuff

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in my own personal life, major events. So, yeah,

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I think my job has been an excellent, has been

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very good for me because I've been talking to

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all these different people and they've kind of

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taught me, if you will, that it's good to share

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because somebody. somebody is always going through

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something and if they can hear how maybe you

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get through something or find the um you know

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if you I don't know what I'm trying to say. I

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just feel it's very helpful for people to know

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that they're not alone. Exactly. I was going

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to say they don't feel as lonely. Yes. Because

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someone else on this planet is dealing with that

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and it eases the burden to some degree. I'm not

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quite sure why, but it does. Yeah. And I'm not.

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And we do go through a lot on this planet. I

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mean, and we've all done in our lives. I mean,

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your situation, which I think you're going to

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talk about, that is. But planet Earth is quite

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a difficult. I refer to it as a training ground.

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that we're here to learn. And then teach as well.

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So sharing, it's not, I mean, I write my book,

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The Star Side Prophecy, which is this one. I

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talk about the first 20 years, 23 years of my

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life. And I share my childhood because it was

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very, very troubling and difficult. And I always

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wanted, because a lot of people, I don't know

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whether you did. I mean, some children do have

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difficult childhoods. And I felt that sharing

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my story and hope that it would be helpful, that

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someone would be able to relate to this. And

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maybe not the whole thing, but aspects. of it

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so and I didn't I don't have a problem sharing

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or writing about myself now some people could

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say that's pretty egotistical Sarah but I think

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I love it when people share and open up and I

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find British people I mean they can be quite

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guarded Can't they? But then some Americans can.

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But I've never been guarded. I'm quite happy

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to talk about things that I've been through.

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And now, you know, you can do that. But then

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people that have spoken about things that they've

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been through have been helpful to you. Right.

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So that's really sweet. Absolutely. So this is,

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I did not know about your experiences with, you

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know, the hurricane in Cortina and the aftermath.

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I've been in the back end of a hurricane when

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I was flying C -141s. I went to Bermuda. Well,

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up in the sky, you mean. No. On the ground? Right,

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okay. I was the first airplane in back in the,

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what, late 80s when there was a hurricane that

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hit Bermuda, a square hit. And we were the first

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ones in, myself and my crew. We're on the backsides

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of the hurricane, the bands, the back bands.

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They had to clear the runway. You couldn't get

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around with cars. It was a mess. You literally

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had to get a moped. and go around these huge

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trees that were uprooted. So my question to you

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is, you know, we share that experience. You know,

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a lot of people would look at that experience

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and say, oh my goodness, how could there be a

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God? What kind of God would let this happen?

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But my question is, can you see a scenario where

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that's evidence that there's a God? Were you

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able to see humanity at its very best in that

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negative situation? Okay, so I don't. I don't

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necessarily believe that there is one God. Okay.

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I will be honest. I do believe that there is

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definitely something. Just not sure what. Some

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creator. Yes. Some source. Yes. Now, whether

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that's one, two, I don't know. You know, let's

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face it. Nobody really knows. Just you know.

00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:30.220
You're in good company because we very much feel

00:14:30.220 --> 00:14:32.700
that way. There's this creative force. It's infinite.

00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:35.659
We don't understand it. We don't want to make

00:14:35.659 --> 00:14:39.340
God look like us because that would limit. We're

00:14:39.340 --> 00:14:42.059
born in his image though, aren't we? That's the

00:14:42.059 --> 00:14:46.379
story. So you're very safe here. So thank you

00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:50.330
for sharing that. Yeah. So so so we believe in

00:14:50.330 --> 00:14:54.090
there's a divine intelligence, a creator. We

00:14:54.090 --> 00:14:56.610
try and work out what that looks like based on

00:14:56.610 --> 00:14:59.190
a lot of things. But yeah, we're not necessarily

00:14:59.190 --> 00:15:02.429
the monotheistic Christian God, but there is

00:15:02.429 --> 00:15:04.370
something. But we agree with you. None of us

00:15:04.370 --> 00:15:05.909
can really know for sure. That's why we have

00:15:05.909 --> 00:15:10.669
to compare notes. So please go ahead. So, however,

00:15:10.909 --> 00:15:15.769
I do believe that there was something going on.

00:15:16.399 --> 00:15:20.840
At that time. And I, and I believe it's, that's

00:15:20.840 --> 00:15:24.799
a big question. Um, cause I don't, I don't also

00:15:24.799 --> 00:15:27.120
don't believe things happen, happen for a reason.

00:15:27.139 --> 00:15:29.179
I don't believe things in our lives are all mapped

00:15:29.179 --> 00:15:31.220
out for us either. Do you believe some things

00:15:31.220 --> 00:15:34.000
are some things, but not everything. Yeah. I

00:15:34.000 --> 00:15:35.740
agree with that. You know, some people. So there's

00:15:35.740 --> 00:15:37.639
a degree of autonomy and free will. We're not,

00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:40.480
we're not robotons. Like, you know, I must do

00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:42.720
this today because it's scripted for me. Yeah.

00:15:42.840 --> 00:15:49.860
Yeah. So, um, There was definitely, though, something

00:15:49.860 --> 00:15:53.840
spiritual going on there. And I feel like people

00:15:53.840 --> 00:15:56.740
who maybe were going through that and were not

00:15:56.740 --> 00:16:01.980
spiritual maybe found something out of it. Because

00:16:01.980 --> 00:16:08.240
a lot of people had a lot of help, say. There

00:16:08.240 --> 00:16:12.240
was a lot of people there trying to give them

00:16:12.240 --> 00:16:16.259
support. And I think when you feel that... It's

00:16:16.259 --> 00:16:20.039
more than just support. It's more of an internal

00:16:20.039 --> 00:16:23.539
thing that you feel. So I do think that there

00:16:23.539 --> 00:16:26.779
was definitely something going on. Spiritual

00:16:26.779 --> 00:16:31.039
movement of some kind. Yeah, I do. I do. In previous

00:16:31.039 --> 00:16:34.000
episodes, I bring that up because I've seen some

00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:37.320
of the best parts of humanity come on the backside

00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:40.820
of devastation. tragic though that we get together

00:16:40.820 --> 00:16:45.120
after a fucking great cataclysm yet in our normal

00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:48.120
waking lives we should be a bit more like that

00:16:48.120 --> 00:16:50.019
and in the whole world heaven on earth would

00:16:50.019 --> 00:16:53.799
be built at that point I mean even I wasn't with

00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:56.299
him but I'm told that Ronald Reagan said that

00:16:56.299 --> 00:16:58.639
the only way to really unify people is to have

00:16:58.639 --> 00:17:03.100
some existential like an like a universal existential

00:17:03.100 --> 00:17:06.680
crisis to unify the people. It seems like we

00:17:06.680 --> 00:17:09.039
rally for each other when we have to rally for

00:17:09.039 --> 00:17:11.319
each other. And you're right. Why don't we just

00:17:11.319 --> 00:17:14.640
rally for each other during peacetime, during

00:17:14.640 --> 00:17:16.720
a beautiful day like this? Why don't we do that?

00:17:16.740 --> 00:17:18.900
If there is a spiritual movement in that, it

00:17:18.900 --> 00:17:21.200
could be that you're surviving that and getting

00:17:21.200 --> 00:17:23.079
through that for a whole host of spiritual reasons,

00:17:23.160 --> 00:17:25.640
each individual to the person participating.

00:17:27.769 --> 00:17:30.250
See, I completely forgot where I was going. Well,

00:17:30.410 --> 00:17:32.490
I want to share one thing while you're recovering.

00:17:33.230 --> 00:17:37.250
So, you know, when I was in Palm Beach, Robin

00:17:37.250 --> 00:17:40.170
and I had this experience where we saw this homeless

00:17:40.170 --> 00:17:42.349
girl. We were having a picnic. We saw this homeless

00:17:42.349 --> 00:17:45.289
girl eating from the trash can. And it's beautiful.

00:17:45.349 --> 00:17:46.869
We're looking at the yachts and the beautiful

00:17:46.869 --> 00:17:50.210
intercoastal. And we're like, oh, my gosh, we

00:17:50.210 --> 00:17:52.710
packed our stuff up to find that lady. We couldn't

00:17:52.710 --> 00:17:55.460
find her. So I was like, oh, but I found like

00:17:55.460 --> 00:17:59.220
six or eight other homeless people. So we took

00:17:59.220 --> 00:18:01.420
the food we had and split it up like eight ways

00:18:01.420 --> 00:18:05.859
and took one eighth to all the different people.

00:18:06.200 --> 00:18:08.599
And I saw one of the guys, like the first guy

00:18:08.599 --> 00:18:11.920
I gave food to was taking his portion of one

00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:15.700
eighth and splitting it off. And I'm like, what?

00:18:16.349 --> 00:18:18.509
And I went to talk to him. I said, that's all

00:18:18.509 --> 00:18:20.369
yours. He says, no, no, my friends need some.

00:18:20.509 --> 00:18:22.730
I said, no, no, no, I took care of you. But I

00:18:22.730 --> 00:18:24.690
just walked away like totally. I get emotional

00:18:24.690 --> 00:18:29.150
every time I tell that story because that's the

00:18:29.150 --> 00:18:30.930
best of the best of humanity. These people have

00:18:30.930 --> 00:18:32.609
nothing. They're homeless and they don't have

00:18:32.609 --> 00:18:37.329
food. And here they are. I give them each what

00:18:37.329 --> 00:18:39.970
I have. They took their stuff and split it up.

00:18:40.089 --> 00:18:42.069
And here's a guy that didn't know I did that,

00:18:42.170 --> 00:18:44.829
splitting up his stuff for the other people.

00:18:46.480 --> 00:18:49.420
This is not like a hurricane, but to me, it's

00:18:49.420 --> 00:18:55.259
evidence that we are here to serve each other.

00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:57.539
We are here to help each other. And even when

00:18:57.539 --> 00:19:00.359
you have nothing, there's still that spark, that

00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:03.279
spirit within us that wants to help other people.

00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:05.480
I agree. So did you think of what you were thinking?

00:19:05.480 --> 00:19:08.079
No, I'm kind of loose on that. I think what I

00:19:08.079 --> 00:19:10.839
wanted to say about that, there's something happening

00:19:10.839 --> 00:19:14.900
spiritual for everyone. And I think it was Douglas

00:19:14.900 --> 00:19:18.779
MacArthur who said there are no atheists down

00:19:18.779 --> 00:19:22.220
the foxholes in Bataan. So at that point, when

00:19:22.220 --> 00:19:24.579
you see all these waters rising, I write science

00:19:24.579 --> 00:19:26.980
fiction and fantasy, so my mind can go there.

00:19:27.140 --> 00:19:28.720
It's kind of, you know, it's a bit of a burden

00:19:28.720 --> 00:19:31.299
sometimes. But you would be praying to a God.

00:19:31.460 --> 00:19:33.869
You'd be like, God, deliver me. God help me.

00:19:34.049 --> 00:19:37.230
And then if that happens, that could just be

00:19:37.230 --> 00:19:40.150
the catalyst to put you into a spiritual realm

00:19:40.150 --> 00:19:42.230
that you wouldn't have been in prior to that.

00:19:42.369 --> 00:19:44.769
But there would be a number of things, each working

00:19:44.769 --> 00:19:48.769
individually on the participant of that. So something

00:19:48.769 --> 00:19:51.569
spiritual is going on. But there's no clarity

00:19:51.569 --> 00:19:53.650
to me because we each got different things that

00:19:53.650 --> 00:19:56.269
we're here to withstand and learn and experience.

00:19:56.710 --> 00:19:59.450
But this idea of God help me, you know, it doesn't

00:19:59.450 --> 00:20:01.210
have to be the outside God. It could be the God

00:20:01.210 --> 00:20:04.220
within you. Yeah. But you would be praying for

00:20:04.220 --> 00:20:06.599
your life, though. You'd be like, spare me. But

00:20:06.599 --> 00:20:09.559
you'd be summoning it from within you. God help

00:20:09.559 --> 00:20:12.980
me means bring forth what I need to survive this.

00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:17.380
It's potentiality. But also I think that when

00:20:17.380 --> 00:20:19.920
we look at other people that are in really a

00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:23.359
bad situation, we see another one of us. We recognize

00:20:23.359 --> 00:20:26.359
them as a divine fractal. And we want to help

00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:28.619
them because they are another one of us. They

00:20:28.619 --> 00:20:30.819
have a soul. They're on the journey. And we want

00:20:30.819 --> 00:20:33.160
to help them on their journey. And so I think

00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:35.019
it helps both people. That's why I say these

00:20:35.019 --> 00:20:37.140
negative things that happen in the world around

00:20:37.140 --> 00:20:40.599
us. They're not negative. It's a good, I mean,

00:20:40.859 --> 00:20:43.779
my brother, he's an atheist and he's a devout

00:20:43.779 --> 00:20:46.539
one. And he has never been able to reconcile

00:20:46.539 --> 00:20:49.500
suffering with the existence of God. He's never

00:20:49.500 --> 00:20:52.000
been able to get through that. But you can't

00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:54.839
if you see God in a certain way. If you expand

00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:57.180
your belief system, that actually gets easier.

00:20:57.319 --> 00:20:59.700
The more you have this, you have a postage stamp

00:20:59.700 --> 00:21:02.839
view. And then when you pull back and start looking

00:21:02.839 --> 00:21:05.150
at... what all the world religions say about

00:21:05.150 --> 00:21:08.269
God, it can get easier to reconcile suffering,

00:21:08.430 --> 00:21:10.789
but it's still a very difficult thing. How could

00:21:10.789 --> 00:21:13.230
there be a God and let this happen? I think so.

00:21:13.269 --> 00:21:16.910
I think that's one of the hardest questions to

00:21:16.910 --> 00:21:21.170
answer. Why would a little child of two years

00:21:21.170 --> 00:21:25.049
old, I did a story on him, he died of a brain

00:21:25.049 --> 00:21:29.829
tumour. Why? He was a little boy who had everything

00:21:29.829 --> 00:21:31.829
to live for, a beautiful family, everything.

00:21:33.439 --> 00:21:38.319
So why does anything terrible happen to anybody?

00:21:38.460 --> 00:21:41.519
I don't know. I really don't. But I do have a

00:21:41.519 --> 00:21:44.819
problem reconciling that if there is a God. I

00:21:44.819 --> 00:21:47.599
must admit, I do. Yeah, it's a very natural thing.

00:21:47.740 --> 00:21:50.400
So we left off, you were talking about there's

00:21:50.400 --> 00:21:52.980
some sort of God. It might be polytheism or it

00:21:52.980 --> 00:21:55.819
might be more than one. It's definitely an infinite

00:21:55.819 --> 00:21:57.940
source. There's some sort of energy. It's palpable.

00:21:58.099 --> 00:22:00.839
But we just can't put our... Our senses are outed

00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:03.279
for now. But continue with your story because

00:22:03.279 --> 00:22:06.140
we're talking about you took us with your history

00:22:06.140 --> 00:22:09.660
through Katrina, but then pick it up from there

00:22:09.660 --> 00:22:11.839
and talk us through it. How old were your children

00:22:11.839 --> 00:22:15.079
at this point? So... And you have three girls.

00:22:15.380 --> 00:22:18.019
Yep, I have three girls. Emily, she's now 26.

00:22:18.339 --> 00:22:23.299
Molly, 24. And Tilly is 18. she wasn't even born

00:22:23.299 --> 00:22:27.759
then. Um, so, uh, so Emily would have been like

00:22:27.759 --> 00:22:34.200
five, Molly three. Yeah. Um, so after that, I,

00:22:34.619 --> 00:22:39.319
we, we worked hard to try and get a green card.

00:22:39.519 --> 00:22:43.759
Couldn't, it's very hard. Um, and then she did

00:22:43.759 --> 00:22:47.799
get a green card, um, through, through my, uh,

00:22:47.859 --> 00:22:53.420
journalism. That was in 2016. And just when we

00:22:53.420 --> 00:22:59.420
thought that everything was good, Dave, my husband,

00:22:59.460 --> 00:23:05.819
started feeling unwell that summer. And so this

00:23:05.819 --> 00:23:12.140
is like 2016. And he used to coach basketball

00:23:12.140 --> 00:23:15.480
and soccer with my middle daughter, Molly. And

00:23:15.480 --> 00:23:20.619
he came to me one day and he said, you know shares

00:23:20.619 --> 00:23:23.140
that's what his nickname for me he said you know

00:23:23.140 --> 00:23:25.539
shares he said sometimes i feel like i'm like

00:23:25.539 --> 00:23:29.500
my legs are not working i'm running through treacle

00:23:29.500 --> 00:23:34.200
after the kids so i was like that's not good

00:23:34.200 --> 00:23:37.660
so we you know we were looking it up on google

00:23:37.660 --> 00:23:39.059
and everything it said all sorts of terrible

00:23:39.059 --> 00:23:44.619
things but um and then it kind of stopped he

00:23:44.619 --> 00:23:49.970
was okay okay okay and then um Then we got the

00:23:49.970 --> 00:23:52.950
green cards came through like about two months

00:23:52.950 --> 00:23:58.650
later and then he he got sick. So, yeah. And

00:23:58.650 --> 00:24:01.529
can I ask a couple of questions? Of course. If

00:24:01.529 --> 00:24:05.430
I'm was it was it grand? I mean, when he got

00:24:05.430 --> 00:24:08.490
sick, was it like he was he was in bed and he

00:24:08.490 --> 00:24:17.579
just I mean, no, no. So he it he. was complaining

00:24:17.579 --> 00:24:20.539
about his walking still a little bit he said

00:24:20.539 --> 00:24:23.119
he had to think almost like really think sometimes

00:24:23.119 --> 00:24:31.019
to walk um so uh we in the i think it was this

00:24:31.019 --> 00:24:34.160
this october of that year we've gone to this

00:24:34.160 --> 00:24:38.700
movie theater And that was at the time when they

00:24:38.700 --> 00:24:40.900
had the windows where you paid in Claremont.

00:24:41.299 --> 00:24:43.420
And we stood there and he was about to pay for

00:24:43.420 --> 00:24:47.059
me, him and Tilly. And he was like, oh my God,

00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:50.599
I'm going to pass out. So I caught him. And then,

00:24:50.599 --> 00:24:53.220
of course, we rushed him to the hospital. And

00:24:53.220 --> 00:24:56.460
while we were there, he was admitted. They thought

00:24:56.460 --> 00:24:58.700
it was something wrong with his heart. And he

00:24:58.700 --> 00:25:01.000
was admitted. And while he was there, his...

00:25:02.720 --> 00:25:04.900
body was like he used to call it body popping

00:25:04.900 --> 00:25:11.339
and it was like he his muscles were like twitching

00:25:11.339 --> 00:25:14.640
twitching so a lot of times when you have a systemic

00:25:14.640 --> 00:25:16.880
issue it's it's something and i don't know anything

00:25:16.880 --> 00:25:19.000
about his history this is the first i'm hearing

00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:21.849
of this But a lot of times the base of the brain,

00:25:21.930 --> 00:25:24.230
anything coordination related has to do with

00:25:24.230 --> 00:25:26.970
the base of the brain, the cerebellum. And a

00:25:26.970 --> 00:25:29.549
lot of times it could be anything from a stroke

00:25:29.549 --> 00:25:32.730
to a clot to a bleed out to inflammation. It

00:25:32.730 --> 00:25:35.329
could be a number of different things, a tumor,

00:25:35.430 --> 00:25:38.829
a growth. Any sort of bias that's going to influence

00:25:38.829 --> 00:25:41.369
that can actually influence everything from the

00:25:41.369 --> 00:25:44.470
base of the brain down, which is virtually everything.

00:25:44.650 --> 00:25:50.099
It's how your heart beats. how your body responds.

00:25:50.539 --> 00:25:53.599
Everything to do with regulating your body is

00:25:53.599 --> 00:25:56.200
done from that center core base of the brain.

00:25:56.519 --> 00:26:00.160
So I'm listening to you from the viewpoint of

00:26:00.160 --> 00:26:02.720
a holistic practitioner saying, this all makes

00:26:02.720 --> 00:26:06.900
sense, like what you're sharing. You're going

00:26:06.900 --> 00:26:10.859
through this and I'm visualizing, you just finished

00:26:10.859 --> 00:26:14.039
talking about Katrina, but here you are with

00:26:14.039 --> 00:26:17.190
a hurricane of your own. right figuratively it's

00:26:17.190 --> 00:26:18.990
yeah you're going through this hurricane and

00:26:18.990 --> 00:26:21.210
there's this did he did he come out of hospital

00:26:21.210 --> 00:26:24.450
yes they what did they diagnose it with did they

00:26:24.450 --> 00:26:27.109
find out no so they didn't diagnose him with

00:26:27.109 --> 00:26:30.309
anything but i said to the nurse i i was like

00:26:30.309 --> 00:26:33.210
why is this why is all this and it was really

00:26:33.210 --> 00:26:38.230
noticeable here and here and she's like i think

00:26:38.230 --> 00:26:43.039
you should see a neurologist so i was like What

00:26:43.039 --> 00:26:44.519
do you think it is? She said, I don't know, but

00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:46.559
you need to see a neurologist. That was my advice.

00:26:46.839 --> 00:26:49.000
So nothing, they could not find anything wrong

00:26:49.000 --> 00:26:52.559
with him. So we booked an appointment with a

00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:56.859
neurologist in Claremont. Very nice guy. And

00:26:56.859 --> 00:27:01.319
he said, I think I know what it is. But he said,

00:27:01.339 --> 00:27:03.259
I need to do these tests. And he did these really

00:27:03.259 --> 00:27:05.759
awful invasive tests where they basically, Tia,

00:27:05.819 --> 00:27:07.660
you might know more about this. I can't remember

00:27:07.660 --> 00:27:10.380
what it was called, electro something, whereby

00:27:10.380 --> 00:27:15.700
they put needles in all your muscles and they

00:27:15.700 --> 00:27:23.720
record what your muscles are doing. I do know

00:27:23.720 --> 00:27:26.700
that. I've experienced that because I had spinal

00:27:26.700 --> 00:27:29.789
stenosis so bad I could barely walk. Really?

00:27:29.789 --> 00:27:32.470
Gosh. It was about 10 years ago. Yeah, it's not

00:27:32.470 --> 00:27:33.930
nice to say. In fact, the chiropractor looked

00:27:33.930 --> 00:27:37.029
and said, how are you still walking based on

00:27:37.029 --> 00:27:39.349
what was going on in the lower part of my spine?

00:27:39.690 --> 00:27:42.329
Same thing. So they stuck the needles in. They

00:27:42.329 --> 00:27:44.849
were doing these sticking voltage in and making

00:27:44.849 --> 00:27:48.109
my leg do stuff. So there was active and passive

00:27:48.109 --> 00:27:52.450
work they were doing. But I had lost 80 % of

00:27:52.450 --> 00:27:55.130
my sensory. So when you talk about not being

00:27:55.130 --> 00:27:57.809
able to walk, I get that because I was usually.

00:27:58.200 --> 00:28:00.619
riding my bike 20, 30 miles a morning, and I

00:28:00.619 --> 00:28:04.069
could barely... get on the bike. Wow. So I understand

00:28:04.069 --> 00:28:08.109
what you're saying here. Yeah. So he's hooked

00:28:08.109 --> 00:28:10.750
up and so they're monitoring his muscle movement.

00:28:10.789 --> 00:28:13.809
Did that give you the clarity? Did that, was

00:28:13.809 --> 00:28:15.630
that what was, I mean, did they tell you what

00:28:15.630 --> 00:28:18.569
was causing that? They're looking for conductivity,

00:28:18.690 --> 00:28:21.190
like how efficiently the neurons are firing.

00:28:21.410 --> 00:28:26.490
That's it. Exactly that. So at the end, the doctor

00:28:26.490 --> 00:28:32.220
said to us, he said, okay, I am so sorry to tell

00:28:32.220 --> 00:28:37.059
you this, but I think he has ALS, motor neurone

00:28:37.059 --> 00:28:40.400
disease. That's what we call it in England. And,

00:28:40.400 --> 00:28:48.079
you know, when somebody says that, I'd looked

00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:50.480
it up. I knew what it was for sure. I knew what

00:28:50.480 --> 00:28:53.779
it was. And so did he. But then the doctor said,

00:28:54.000 --> 00:28:57.920
but with a possible diagnosis of this magnitude,

00:28:58.099 --> 00:29:03.319
and it's rare. I would like you to see two other

00:29:03.319 --> 00:29:08.720
doctors. Specialists. So we went, we saw one

00:29:08.720 --> 00:29:14.119
in Gainesville and he was, he said, this was

00:29:14.119 --> 00:29:15.839
a couple of months later, actually, because we

00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:17.380
were coming up to Christmas. So I think we saw

00:29:17.380 --> 00:29:19.859
him. Oh no, we saw him that year, I think. Anyway,

00:29:19.920 --> 00:29:26.259
and he was just like, so downbeat. He was just

00:29:26.259 --> 00:29:29.500
like. I'm really, you know, I am sorry. It's

00:29:29.500 --> 00:29:35.000
ALS. There is no cure. People with ALS normally

00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:38.619
pass away within three to five years. And I remember

00:29:38.619 --> 00:29:41.180
coming back from Gainesville and Dave could still

00:29:41.180 --> 00:29:44.240
drive then. And I just, I think I just cried

00:29:44.240 --> 00:29:47.980
like nearly the whole way home because. Oh, it's

00:29:47.980 --> 00:29:51.680
so heavy. He'd never, he'd never been sick. It's

00:29:51.680 --> 00:29:55.500
so difficult, especially with your spouse. Like

00:29:55.500 --> 00:29:57.819
Robin and I always say, you know, whenever the

00:29:57.819 --> 00:29:59.579
other one's suffering, it's like, gosh, I wish

00:29:59.579 --> 00:30:02.460
it was me. Like, I wish I could carry that for

00:30:02.460 --> 00:30:07.359
you. It's so difficult being the other person.

00:30:08.059 --> 00:30:10.319
And a lot of times, like we have people in our

00:30:10.319 --> 00:30:13.920
world right now where the spouse is sick and

00:30:13.920 --> 00:30:16.359
they're taking care of, they're exhausted taking

00:30:16.359 --> 00:30:19.019
care of the spouse. So I always take care of

00:30:19.019 --> 00:30:22.519
the caretaker. So I move in to support the support

00:30:22.519 --> 00:30:26.160
system. That's very needed. Yeah, it's so important.

00:30:26.279 --> 00:30:29.420
So if any of you are out there and you know somebody

00:30:29.420 --> 00:30:31.519
that's a caretaker, make sure you take care of

00:30:31.519 --> 00:30:33.980
them. It's so important because I know where

00:30:33.980 --> 00:30:36.240
you were. I know what you're up against. You

00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:37.619
have these expectations because I'm married.

00:30:37.680 --> 00:30:39.680
I have three children as well. And you've just

00:30:39.680 --> 00:30:42.400
assumed you've just got this big, you're going

00:30:42.400 --> 00:30:44.700
to be in your 90s in a rocking chair on the porch.

00:30:44.839 --> 00:30:47.769
And you're told, well, actually. But I mean,

00:30:47.789 --> 00:30:50.390
that's all your expectation. I mean, they're

00:30:50.390 --> 00:30:52.569
just everything is off the table at that point.

00:30:52.589 --> 00:30:54.769
And that's just a devastating, shocking news.

00:30:55.509 --> 00:30:59.170
Well, we had plans like one of our biggest plans

00:30:59.170 --> 00:31:02.890
was to buy a motorhome and just go around America.

00:31:03.269 --> 00:31:04.869
I want to do that. When the kids are done. Yeah,

00:31:04.890 --> 00:31:06.829
when the kids are done. We're going to have to

00:31:06.829 --> 00:31:09.289
caravan because we want to do that, too. We're

00:31:09.289 --> 00:31:11.690
going to get a caravan of these. Beautiful motorhomes,

00:31:11.829 --> 00:31:14.930
right? Yeah, go to Yosemite National Park. Oh,

00:31:14.990 --> 00:31:18.190
yeah. Let's get it done. So from a first -person

00:31:18.190 --> 00:31:21.309
standpoint, you know, today's episode, we're

00:31:21.309 --> 00:31:23.230
talking a little bit about grief and how do you

00:31:23.230 --> 00:31:27.369
deal with grief. So from the drive home from

00:31:27.369 --> 00:31:30.589
Gainesville, this is a whole journey of what

00:31:30.589 --> 00:31:33.190
if, what if, what am I going to do next? I mean,

00:31:33.210 --> 00:31:35.430
there's all of this stuff that you have to deal

00:31:35.430 --> 00:31:41.619
with. How did you do it? Well, it never really

00:31:41.619 --> 00:31:43.559
settled with me, honestly. I didn't, you know,

00:31:43.579 --> 00:31:45.920
I didn't want to, I just didn't want to accept

00:31:45.920 --> 00:31:50.779
it, I guess. So I threw myself into researching,

00:31:50.859 --> 00:31:56.519
research, research, research. In case there's

00:31:56.519 --> 00:31:58.079
something you're missing. Yeah, because I didn't

00:31:58.079 --> 00:32:01.380
believe. Yeah, same. Yeah, I did not believe

00:32:01.380 --> 00:32:05.480
that this was it. I just didn't. I believe there

00:32:05.480 --> 00:32:10.579
has to be something. For ALS, at that time, there

00:32:10.579 --> 00:32:16.319
was one medication that was like 25, 30, 40 years

00:32:16.319 --> 00:32:18.480
old. I can't remember, but it was very old. One

00:32:18.480 --> 00:32:21.619
medication and it would give them maybe six months

00:32:21.619 --> 00:32:25.420
extra life. That was it. So he took it anyway.

00:32:26.460 --> 00:32:30.779
So I think by being really, really proactive,

00:32:31.000 --> 00:32:36.119
like I bought him, we had B12 compound. You know,

00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:40.339
what's that called, Tia? B12 is, there's four

00:32:40.339 --> 00:32:43.180
types of B12. The purest form of it. Methylcobalamin.

00:32:43.480 --> 00:32:46.200
Yes. So we had to, I was getting that shipped

00:32:46.200 --> 00:32:48.099
down from this compound pharmacy in New York.

00:32:48.099 --> 00:32:50.500
Or hydroxycobalamin is one. Those are the two

00:32:50.500 --> 00:32:53.480
most bioavailable forms. I think it was the first

00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:56.359
one, but methyl. Did that help him? Did you see

00:32:56.359 --> 00:33:00.450
anything tangible? No. No. And then there was

00:33:00.450 --> 00:33:03.690
another thing came out, which was I had to learn

00:33:03.690 --> 00:33:06.369
to put an IV in his arm. And it was it was this

00:33:06.369 --> 00:33:09.890
drug from Japan. And after three cycles of that,

00:33:09.950 --> 00:33:11.650
we stopped because it was making him worse. It's

00:33:11.650 --> 00:33:18.130
crazy. It's crazy. Yeah. But I just never. ever

00:33:18.130 --> 00:33:20.690
gave up hope I never thought she was going to

00:33:20.690 --> 00:33:23.809
die now maybe that wasn't a good thing honestly

00:33:23.809 --> 00:33:27.549
I don't know but I just never ever coped yeah

00:33:27.549 --> 00:33:29.529
I don't think I would have been able to do everything

00:33:29.529 --> 00:33:34.769
that I did without that Having the hope that

00:33:34.769 --> 00:33:37.329
there could be some way through this. Yeah. You

00:33:37.329 --> 00:33:38.509
know, because we're watching. It was probably

00:33:38.509 --> 00:33:40.269
your maternal instincts as well. Yeah. Because

00:33:40.269 --> 00:33:42.410
you've got three kiddies to take care of. Well,

00:33:42.410 --> 00:33:45.029
yeah. And for a while we did not tell the girls.

00:33:45.670 --> 00:33:47.849
And for a longer time we did not tell Tilly.

00:33:48.349 --> 00:33:51.240
But then when he... when he couldn't walk and

00:33:51.240 --> 00:33:53.480
then he had to obviously be in a wheelchair and

00:33:53.480 --> 00:33:54.980
then he had to have a different wheelchair because

00:33:54.980 --> 00:33:56.799
he couldn't move he couldn't move his hands to

00:33:56.799 --> 00:33:59.359
work it he had to have one where he had to move

00:33:59.359 --> 00:34:02.720
with his head and then he had they had he had

00:34:02.720 --> 00:34:04.660
a speech machine because he couldn't speak i

00:34:04.660 --> 00:34:08.260
mean this went all the way i mean yeah so sweet

00:34:08.260 --> 00:34:11.119
in general you have two two basic categories

00:34:11.119 --> 00:34:14.739
of neurons one of them is sensory so i could

00:34:14.739 --> 00:34:16.539
you know it's like a feedback loop so the motor

00:34:16.539 --> 00:34:19.340
neurons are the ones that do a muscle contraction

00:34:19.340 --> 00:34:22.739
or a muscle relaxation. So if you have motor

00:34:22.739 --> 00:34:24.940
neurons, those are your neurons that tell your

00:34:24.940 --> 00:34:27.719
body to do something or to stop doing something,

00:34:27.800 --> 00:34:30.460
right? But you need a feedback loop, and those

00:34:30.460 --> 00:34:34.119
are called sensory neurons. So motor neurons

00:34:34.119 --> 00:34:36.059
is going to do something, and sensory is going

00:34:36.059 --> 00:34:38.840
to say, so if I'm touching a stove, the sensory

00:34:38.840 --> 00:34:41.300
neurons are going to go, ooh, hot. The motor

00:34:41.300 --> 00:34:42.980
neurons are the ones that are going to move my

00:34:42.980 --> 00:34:48.960
arm. In a very basic sense, that's it. With ALS,

00:34:48.980 --> 00:34:50.940
we're talking about degradation of the ability

00:34:50.940 --> 00:34:54.340
to move. How was he mentally? He was completely

00:34:54.340 --> 00:34:56.679
understanding you, you could communicate. Oh,

00:34:56.679 --> 00:34:59.380
yeah. So he didn't lose the plot mentally. It

00:34:59.380 --> 00:35:01.519
was just his whole body packing up. Not at all.

00:35:01.519 --> 00:35:05.519
So you could still reach him. Yeah. Yeah, that

00:35:05.519 --> 00:35:08.739
was something. And that's a salient but important,

00:35:08.880 --> 00:35:11.800
that's an important point because it's, here's

00:35:11.800 --> 00:35:15.650
a person that's completely aware. And it's like,

00:35:15.789 --> 00:35:18.530
OK, I can't move my legs. What does this mean?

00:35:18.630 --> 00:35:22.389
You know, so he was a very active guy, very active.

00:35:23.630 --> 00:35:28.449
So for him, it was it was diabolical. I mean,

00:35:28.469 --> 00:35:32.570
it was just it was really, really hard. So another

00:35:32.570 --> 00:35:37.030
way another way that we kind of really got through

00:35:37.030 --> 00:35:39.929
what was happening was we had a great support

00:35:39.929 --> 00:35:43.730
system and we did everything. We went on bucket

00:35:43.730 --> 00:35:49.010
list trips. We had parties. We really lived those

00:35:49.010 --> 00:35:52.710
five years. So it was how many? How many years?

00:35:53.269 --> 00:35:56.210
He did make five. He did. So you had five years

00:35:56.210 --> 00:35:59.130
of really making the most of every time. Wow.

00:35:59.389 --> 00:36:01.369
Yeah. Yeah, that's very lovely. It's sad, but

00:36:01.369 --> 00:36:04.789
it's beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. In terms of the,

00:36:04.889 --> 00:36:07.550
during that time, was there discussions about

00:36:07.550 --> 00:36:10.050
soulfulness or spirituality or the soul's journey

00:36:10.050 --> 00:36:11.989
or any, was there any discussion about that or

00:36:11.989 --> 00:36:15.530
you just stayed in the moment? No. Well, we stayed,

00:36:15.590 --> 00:36:18.570
we definitely stayed in the moment. Couldn't

00:36:18.570 --> 00:36:22.079
look past. The next day at all. It was literally

00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:24.719
lived day by day because also with his condition,

00:36:24.860 --> 00:36:27.460
sometimes it changed, you know, and I had to

00:36:27.460 --> 00:36:30.179
get hospice. He was on palliative care and hospice

00:36:30.179 --> 00:36:32.639
for three years. They were brilliant, by the

00:36:32.639 --> 00:36:36.760
way. But yeah, we did talk about it. You know,

00:36:36.760 --> 00:36:38.780
he used to joke, he'd come back and haunt us.

00:36:41.739 --> 00:36:45.219
And he does. In fact, the other night he did.

00:36:46.139 --> 00:36:50.139
And it was after I'd asked him to as well. Oh,

00:36:50.179 --> 00:36:52.139
we're going to have to get to that because we're

00:36:52.139 --> 00:36:54.619
on Soul Decodes. We would love to hear that.

00:36:54.800 --> 00:36:57.440
That's interesting because, I mean, just from

00:36:57.440 --> 00:37:00.869
my superficial... not superficial, that's not

00:37:00.869 --> 00:37:03.070
the word, but singular perspective. I do believe

00:37:03.070 --> 00:37:05.769
we carry on. I don't think this is the end of

00:37:05.769 --> 00:37:08.309
the road. So it doesn't surprise me that you've

00:37:08.309 --> 00:37:11.250
say, hey, check in. And he found a way that he

00:37:11.250 --> 00:37:13.789
knew that you would recognize. Yeah, I'll tell

00:37:13.789 --> 00:37:16.610
you because it was quite, it was one of the best

00:37:16.610 --> 00:37:20.050
times. Or unless you want to go now, whatever

00:37:20.050 --> 00:37:23.170
pleases you. So keep going because this is fascinating.

00:37:23.369 --> 00:37:26.630
So you're, you can tell as much or as little

00:37:26.630 --> 00:37:28.739
about. like whatever you want to recount but

00:37:28.739 --> 00:37:31.780
i'm interested in your journey i want to know

00:37:31.780 --> 00:37:34.079
a little bit about david david's journey but

00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.840
also your journey did you did you have any conversations

00:37:37.840 --> 00:37:41.639
about wrapping things up and like he said to

00:37:41.639 --> 00:37:44.760
shaz i'm i think i'm on the way out i mean had

00:37:44.760 --> 00:37:48.400
had you had you had those type of practical conversations

00:37:48.400 --> 00:37:52.380
so um in the he made it to his 50th birthday

00:37:52.380 --> 00:37:55.610
party We had a massive party for him. And then

00:37:55.610 --> 00:37:58.909
he got COVID. We'd been so well. And this was

00:37:58.909 --> 00:38:03.150
like a year or two after COVID really hit. And

00:38:03.150 --> 00:38:06.489
it must have been a year, actually. And we thought

00:38:06.489 --> 00:38:10.730
that was it then. And he bounced back. But then

00:38:10.730 --> 00:38:13.769
in the May, he was in his hospital bed in our

00:38:13.769 --> 00:38:18.530
bedroom till he died in the November. And he

00:38:18.530 --> 00:38:23.110
would say to me, it's not going to be long now

00:38:23.110 --> 00:38:25.989
and i'm like you don't how do you know that you

00:38:25.989 --> 00:38:27.849
can't possibly know that and he said i do know

00:38:27.849 --> 00:38:31.090
that speaking through his machine yeah you know

00:38:31.090 --> 00:38:34.449
i do know that shez and i would just say listen

00:38:34.449 --> 00:38:37.489
i don't want to i really don't want to hear it

00:38:37.489 --> 00:38:40.869
because i don't believe it i don't think you

00:38:40.869 --> 00:38:43.550
know i said you've come back from several times

00:38:43.550 --> 00:38:45.909
that year we thought he was going to die and

00:38:45.909 --> 00:38:49.239
he kept coming back i said no But then I think

00:38:49.239 --> 00:38:55.000
it was like in the October, he said to me, I'm

00:38:55.000 --> 00:38:58.920
not going to be here for much longer. And I said,

00:38:58.940 --> 00:39:01.039
how do you know this? He said, I just know this.

00:39:01.480 --> 00:39:08.960
And sometimes he would see like black, like shadows

00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:12.420
in our room. And he was seeing them more and

00:39:12.420 --> 00:39:16.940
more. i don't know because he could he could

00:39:16.940 --> 00:39:21.079
see fine he was completely compass mentis but

00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:24.019
he had a good he had a broad but what he was

00:39:24.019 --> 00:39:26.360
seeing might have been in the spiritual realm

00:39:26.360 --> 00:39:29.219
that he was heading to and you're not capable

00:39:29.219 --> 00:39:31.679
of seeing that with your senses but he was seeing

00:39:31.679 --> 00:39:35.059
something transitional maybe that we're not really

00:39:35.059 --> 00:39:37.760
capable of yeah but he was seeing something it

00:39:37.760 --> 00:39:40.199
could also have been physiological because you

00:39:40.199 --> 00:39:42.300
know when you're in a immunocompromised state

00:39:42.300 --> 00:39:45.340
especially on medications the your ability your

00:39:45.340 --> 00:39:48.360
vision actually narrows like you your field of

00:39:48.360 --> 00:39:50.760
vision can narrow and you can have the similar

00:39:50.760 --> 00:39:53.019
perceptions but he was saying to you i don't

00:39:53.019 --> 00:39:56.380
think it's long something he felt that he that

00:39:56.380 --> 00:40:00.260
the end was nigh yeah he said he knew it he knew

00:40:00.260 --> 00:40:02.840
it so so was your hope at that point that you

00:40:02.840 --> 00:40:05.079
would be this cheerleader encouragement were

00:40:05.079 --> 00:40:09.730
you just in flat -out denial Or hope or hope.

00:40:09.829 --> 00:40:12.030
Okay. There's still, there's always hope. That's

00:40:12.030 --> 00:40:13.750
what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. The

00:40:13.750 --> 00:40:16.809
hope is the expression of hope. It's like, no,

00:40:16.849 --> 00:40:19.690
no, no, we've got this. Right. So was she being

00:40:19.690 --> 00:40:22.070
a cheerleader saying, no, no, no, don't go yet.

00:40:22.130 --> 00:40:27.050
We've got this. Well, I said to him, I don't

00:40:27.050 --> 00:40:30.650
want you to go. Even in this state, even knowing

00:40:30.650 --> 00:40:34.030
that he hated his life, I was, I said to her,

00:40:34.090 --> 00:40:36.409
I don't want you to go. It's a relationship with

00:40:36.409 --> 00:40:39.050
his consciousness, right? You're engaged with

00:40:39.050 --> 00:40:40.929
your best friend, even though your best friend

00:40:40.929 --> 00:40:44.469
is in a different state than when you found him.

00:40:45.110 --> 00:40:46.969
He's still your best friend and you're engaging

00:40:46.969 --> 00:40:50.050
his consciousness. Yeah. So do you believe his

00:40:50.050 --> 00:40:53.469
consciousness goes on after he leaves here? Oh,

00:40:53.469 --> 00:40:55.710
yeah. So there's nothing. So even though his

00:40:55.710 --> 00:40:57.389
body is not here, it doesn't mean you can't.

00:40:57.599 --> 00:40:59.719
have a relationship with him in a different way.

00:40:59.780 --> 00:41:01.780
Right. I totally agree with that. But the proximity

00:41:01.780 --> 00:41:05.099
is just, I mean, you're going to have to go on

00:41:05.099 --> 00:41:10.920
without him. So he passed on and I'm absolutely

00:41:10.920 --> 00:41:12.639
certain that you're going to see him again. I

00:41:12.639 --> 00:41:14.820
mean, I'm really certain. I mean, that's just

00:41:14.820 --> 00:41:16.599
because I don't think God, if there is a God,

00:41:16.659 --> 00:41:18.260
would have it any other way. He's not going to

00:41:18.260 --> 00:41:21.460
give you someone for all that time, snap him

00:41:21.460 --> 00:41:23.639
out of your life and you'll never see him again

00:41:23.639 --> 00:41:25.860
because no considerate God would do that. So

00:41:25.860 --> 00:41:29.400
I'm OK with a larger picture. But now you've

00:41:29.400 --> 00:41:34.570
got three girls and a life without him. just

00:41:34.570 --> 00:41:37.309
the practical side of having a husband I mean

00:41:37.309 --> 00:41:39.289
you're there raising them together you've got

00:41:39.289 --> 00:41:41.570
the bits that you do he's got what he does you've

00:41:41.570 --> 00:41:44.309
had a transition where he's not practically that

00:41:44.309 --> 00:41:47.010
much help because now he's in bed and then he

00:41:47.010 --> 00:41:49.230
passes on to where and then you're just left

00:41:49.230 --> 00:41:53.269
just with everything how in terms of a burden

00:41:53.269 --> 00:41:57.940
did you ever feel this burden um Do you mean

00:41:57.940 --> 00:42:01.039
a burden of him? No, to now the burden is that

00:42:01.039 --> 00:42:02.880
you've got to do both jobs. You've got to be

00:42:02.880 --> 00:42:06.280
mum, dad, provider. You've got everything that

00:42:06.280 --> 00:42:09.079
was being shared is now just falling onto your

00:42:09.079 --> 00:42:12.739
shoulders, isn't it? Yeah, I'm not going to lie.

00:42:12.880 --> 00:42:16.460
It's really hard and it still is because the

00:42:16.460 --> 00:42:24.360
dynamics of our relationship were we shared everything.

00:42:26.599 --> 00:42:28.440
all the you know all the choice he would he would

00:42:28.440 --> 00:42:30.119
do the outside of the house i would do the inside

00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:33.360
and then but the most the biggest thing for me

00:42:33.360 --> 00:42:36.780
and it still is i am one of those people i find

00:42:36.780 --> 00:42:39.659
it very hard to make a decision i was happy and

00:42:39.659 --> 00:42:42.579
we would talk about things and we taught them

00:42:42.579 --> 00:42:45.239
through but very often he would be the one that

00:42:45.239 --> 00:42:49.159
would make the life life potentially life -altering

00:42:49.159 --> 00:42:51.820
decisions or the decisions about the girls and

00:42:51.820 --> 00:42:54.980
or whatever it was the important things and now

00:42:54.980 --> 00:42:58.199
it's just me and i can't bear it wow that's i

00:42:58.199 --> 00:43:01.280
can't bear it so it's been a few years now that

00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:03.400
just you just went over here three years was

00:43:03.400 --> 00:43:06.019
it all right so first of all i want to thank

00:43:06.019 --> 00:43:08.780
you for having the courage Hopefully somebody

00:43:08.780 --> 00:43:11.420
listening to this can find inspiration from you

00:43:11.420 --> 00:43:14.599
and your message. We haven't even gotten to some

00:43:14.599 --> 00:43:16.420
of the messages, but I just want to personally

00:43:16.420 --> 00:43:19.099
thank you for sharing. I think all three of us

00:43:19.099 --> 00:43:22.019
share the idea that we would like to make the

00:43:22.019 --> 00:43:24.159
world a better place, even if it's just in our

00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:27.820
little way of doing a podcast or sharing stories.

00:43:28.639 --> 00:43:32.940
So it's been a few years. About a month or two

00:43:32.940 --> 00:43:35.679
ago, I brought up the idea of you doing this

00:43:35.679 --> 00:43:38.619
podcast and you didn't really respond. But then

00:43:38.619 --> 00:43:41.039
at some point you said, I think I'm at a place

00:43:41.039 --> 00:43:44.659
where I can talk about this now. What would you

00:43:44.659 --> 00:43:48.380
like to share? What experiences would you like

00:43:48.380 --> 00:43:51.840
to share with the people listening to this? So

00:43:51.840 --> 00:43:58.429
when Dave died, I got a job. I had a job before,

00:43:58.510 --> 00:44:00.869
sorry, I was freelancing before. Just tell me,

00:44:00.889 --> 00:44:03.409
refresh my, how old were your girls at this point?

00:44:04.329 --> 00:44:12.929
So Emily was 23, Molly was 22 until he was 16.

00:44:13.090 --> 00:44:15.110
Right, so she was still a teenager. Yeah, yeah.

00:44:17.570 --> 00:44:21.070
So my job had been freelancing and I'd done that

00:44:21.070 --> 00:44:23.130
for years and that was the only way I could possibly

00:44:23.130 --> 00:44:26.469
have, you know, had him at home and looked after

00:44:26.469 --> 00:44:29.809
him and looked after the girls so I completely

00:44:29.809 --> 00:44:32.670
threw myself into my job I got I was offered

00:44:32.670 --> 00:44:35.110
this job at the local newspaper where I work

00:44:35.110 --> 00:44:38.750
now totally threw myself into it concentrated

00:44:38.750 --> 00:44:43.289
on the girls because it was it was awful um particularly

00:44:43.289 --> 00:44:49.090
the youngest two and um and then I so I didn't

00:44:49.090 --> 00:44:53.690
deal with my grief at all But then in summer,

00:44:53.849 --> 00:44:58.650
this summer, I was finding that I was just like

00:44:58.650 --> 00:45:03.710
in the car. I was very angry for one. And I talked

00:45:03.710 --> 00:45:06.869
to Dave. So I was in the car talking to him.

00:45:07.230 --> 00:45:11.429
Like, why the fuck? Yeah. Why the fuck did this

00:45:11.429 --> 00:45:14.010
have to happen to you? Why the fuck did you have

00:45:14.010 --> 00:45:16.989
to leave me? And I would get really freaking

00:45:16.989 --> 00:45:21.150
angry. And then I would get home and I would,

00:45:21.349 --> 00:45:24.750
it would. just speak because my I'm a very um

00:45:24.750 --> 00:45:28.369
I'm normally a very positive person you know

00:45:28.369 --> 00:45:31.550
yeah yeah you know and I was just feeling that

00:45:31.550 --> 00:45:34.050
it just was really affecting every part of my

00:45:34.050 --> 00:45:39.769
life and so a very um very close friend of mine

00:45:39.769 --> 00:45:44.309
said why don't you go and get therapy so I was

00:45:44.309 --> 00:45:47.570
like I don't know. But you recognize that you

00:45:47.570 --> 00:45:50.429
had this anger. Yeah. You know, you weren't just

00:45:50.429 --> 00:45:53.250
in it. You were watching yourself be in that.

00:45:53.590 --> 00:45:56.650
So you had a little bit of a resistance to therapy.

00:45:56.909 --> 00:46:00.409
Like you thought that was, was it because that's

00:46:00.409 --> 00:46:02.210
a bad thing or was that something? I think it's

00:46:02.210 --> 00:46:04.050
English. I think you have a stiff upper lip and

00:46:04.050 --> 00:46:05.989
you keep calm and carry on. Is that right? I

00:46:05.989 --> 00:46:07.750
feel like that. Well, it's not just English because

00:46:07.750 --> 00:46:12.460
I, you know, I went to marriage counseling. Prior

00:46:12.460 --> 00:46:14.579
to my divorce, I went to marriage counseling

00:46:14.579 --> 00:46:16.960
by myself for a year. I just don't remember.

00:46:17.039 --> 00:46:18.760
And I felt really bad about it. In England, it'd

00:46:18.760 --> 00:46:21.800
be a thing. I didn't want to be broken. I didn't

00:46:21.800 --> 00:46:24.619
tell anybody I was doing that because there's

00:46:24.619 --> 00:46:27.460
a stigma. associated with going to a therapist.

00:46:27.500 --> 00:46:29.840
I don't know now because I've been over here

00:46:29.840 --> 00:46:31.559
for 30 years, but I always felt there was more

00:46:31.559 --> 00:46:33.679
of an American thing and very enlightened, actually.

00:46:33.900 --> 00:46:36.480
I mean, why keep calm and carry on? Why not talk

00:46:36.480 --> 00:46:39.679
to someone? Why not express yourself? Why not

00:46:39.679 --> 00:46:42.059
get the wisdom that someone else could give you

00:46:42.059 --> 00:46:44.440
to help you get through it? But you could do

00:46:44.440 --> 00:46:46.719
that. You could do that without a psychologist

00:46:46.719 --> 00:46:49.019
or psychiatrist. I think that's what girlfriends

00:46:49.019 --> 00:46:52.960
are for. That's what good siblings would do.

00:46:53.469 --> 00:46:55.050
Right. If you had a sibling or somebody that

00:46:55.050 --> 00:46:58.090
cared about you or even a neighbor that gave

00:46:58.090 --> 00:47:01.170
a shit. Right. You would just be able to go and

00:47:01.170 --> 00:47:03.750
talk and just go, oh, man, can we just have a

00:47:03.750 --> 00:47:06.429
cup of coffee? I think I think that there's venting,

00:47:06.429 --> 00:47:09.090
which is very necessary. But I also think it

00:47:09.090 --> 00:47:11.889
would be very useful. So was this a grief counselor?

00:47:12.110 --> 00:47:15.750
Was she trained in helping you overcome this

00:47:15.750 --> 00:47:18.710
loss? That was her background. Yeah. Or his.

00:47:18.769 --> 00:47:22.590
I don't know. Yeah. So it was a lady. I am absolutely

00:47:22.590 --> 00:47:26.610
not against therapy whatsoever. I went to grief

00:47:26.610 --> 00:47:29.949
share for a little bit after he died. I didn't

00:47:29.949 --> 00:47:32.750
like it. What was that? Grief share. What is

00:47:32.750 --> 00:47:36.130
that? So it's like a church, a religious base.

00:47:37.349 --> 00:47:39.190
So if somebody's been through stuff, they go

00:47:39.190 --> 00:47:41.880
to this church. Yeah, but it was like a group

00:47:41.880 --> 00:47:43.940
within the church. And I think it's like a national

00:47:43.940 --> 00:47:46.920
thing. Personally, I didn't find it very helpful.

00:47:47.380 --> 00:47:49.760
So then I was just like, you know what, I don't

00:47:49.760 --> 00:47:53.659
want anything else. But I'm definitely not against

00:47:53.659 --> 00:47:57.019
it. So when my friend was like, I really think

00:47:57.019 --> 00:47:59.699
that it would help you because you've obviously

00:47:59.699 --> 00:48:04.980
got like unresolved grief and you need to do

00:48:04.980 --> 00:48:06.920
something because it's now, it's like really

00:48:06.920 --> 00:48:10.820
permeating my life. my relationship with my girls,

00:48:10.940 --> 00:48:13.519
you know, I just wasn't happy at all. I think

00:48:13.519 --> 00:48:16.500
it was Elizabeth Kubler -Ross wrote a book called

00:48:16.500 --> 00:48:18.960
On Death and Dying. I read it after my mum passed

00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:21.380
away. And there are, I think it's four, I think

00:48:21.380 --> 00:48:23.500
it's five stages of grief. And I don't remember

00:48:23.500 --> 00:48:25.500
what they were. Denial was one, but anger was

00:48:25.500 --> 00:48:28.920
another one. This is absolutely known to be something

00:48:28.920 --> 00:48:31.500
that you'll experience. Yeah. Quite, I mean,

00:48:31.500 --> 00:48:33.940
and quite, I mean, like you just get dumped with

00:48:33.940 --> 00:48:36.739
all this, don't you? Yeah. So you found this

00:48:36.739 --> 00:48:40.000
therapy to be quite transformative? I did. I

00:48:40.000 --> 00:48:42.500
did. I think I got lucky in that I found a lady

00:48:42.500 --> 00:48:46.400
who was very much on my wavelength, you know,

00:48:46.400 --> 00:48:51.199
very open minded, very much. And I just I start

00:48:51.199 --> 00:48:56.539
I definitely started to feel better. But of course,

00:48:56.539 --> 00:48:59.900
with anything, it is a journey. I'll probably

00:48:59.900 --> 00:49:01.960
be on this journey forever. Well, you still might

00:49:01.960 --> 00:49:03.820
have good and bad days for the rest of your life.

00:49:03.880 --> 00:49:06.119
It might always be like that. It's just how you

00:49:06.119 --> 00:49:08.980
can filter through those. Do you find that now

00:49:08.980 --> 00:49:11.500
that some days you can have that heavy feeling?

00:49:12.239 --> 00:49:14.719
Oh, absolutely. Yeah, nowadays you feel a bit

00:49:14.719 --> 00:49:16.639
easier. Yeah. Because it's still, what, only

00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:18.280
three years? I mean, it's not that long ago.

00:49:18.380 --> 00:49:20.039
Yeah, and I mean, there's constant reminders

00:49:20.039 --> 00:49:22.739
for one. Everywhere I go, I feel like there's

00:49:22.739 --> 00:49:25.360
a reminder. And then when some of them, like

00:49:25.360 --> 00:49:27.440
a song will come on and I'm like, oh my gosh,

00:49:27.539 --> 00:49:30.840
that was that song whenever. You know, that's...

00:49:30.840 --> 00:49:33.500
Just triggering a past memory. Yeah. Oh, you'll

00:49:33.500 --> 00:49:37.320
talk to somebody and they'll... bring him up

00:49:37.320 --> 00:49:40.599
bring something up and it and it hurt it hurts

00:49:40.599 --> 00:49:45.980
my heart I'm not gonna lie it's like um like

00:49:45.980 --> 00:49:49.159
I honestly feel like when he died part of my

00:49:49.159 --> 00:49:52.139
heart broke off that's the pain I felt and I

00:49:52.139 --> 00:49:58.000
still do but having therapy and having close

00:49:58.000 --> 00:50:02.159
friends who I do talk to it's just how you deal

00:50:02.159 --> 00:50:06.800
with it so so now Whenever I feel like that,

00:50:06.840 --> 00:50:09.739
yeah, I still yell in the car at him and have

00:50:09.739 --> 00:50:13.139
a go at him. You son of a bitch. He's up there

00:50:13.139 --> 00:50:15.440
partying and you've got to get home and cook

00:50:15.440 --> 00:50:21.360
dinner. Exactly. My thoughts exactly. Bastard.

00:50:21.440 --> 00:50:28.199
You like me. But now I can look at those memories

00:50:28.199 --> 00:50:32.059
and be grateful. And I tell you, that is the,

00:50:32.059 --> 00:50:36.460
that is the key. I am grateful for all the, you

00:50:36.460 --> 00:50:38.639
know, we were like any other married couple.

00:50:38.699 --> 00:50:42.659
We had ups and downs all the time, but all of

00:50:42.659 --> 00:50:46.000
it, I can now look back and I am grateful that

00:50:46.000 --> 00:50:50.280
I was his person for 20, I think it was 25 years.

00:50:51.449 --> 00:50:54.829
And I am good with that. And that gratitude is

00:50:54.829 --> 00:50:58.329
making you lighter. It's just lifting you enough

00:50:58.329 --> 00:51:00.610
where this is now easier to cope with. And that's

00:51:00.610 --> 00:51:03.829
another thing about gratitude. We were going

00:51:03.829 --> 00:51:06.130
to be talking about grief, but this is fascinating.

00:51:06.289 --> 00:51:08.289
This is back -to -back episodes about gratitude.

00:51:09.170 --> 00:51:13.309
Grief, gratitude. They almost go together. It's

00:51:13.309 --> 00:51:15.969
interesting. We talk about loss of a loved one.

00:51:16.130 --> 00:51:20.059
I struggled when my mom passed. I was at the

00:51:20.059 --> 00:51:23.099
time I was a captain for JetBlue. I was in Boston

00:51:23.099 --> 00:51:26.880
and my sister calls me. It's like, mom, mommy

00:51:26.880 --> 00:51:29.820
has a routine thing. She had like a stint already

00:51:29.820 --> 00:51:31.739
and she was going to go in and she's feeling

00:51:31.739 --> 00:51:33.940
weak. And she just she was asking if you could.

00:51:34.079 --> 00:51:36.760
So I finished a four day trip, jumped on an empty

00:51:36.760 --> 00:51:39.320
airplane and went on an empty seat and went to

00:51:39.320 --> 00:51:43.199
Detroit at the end of a trip. Just thinking I

00:51:43.199 --> 00:51:45.179
was going to help my mom, I ended up spending

00:51:45.179 --> 00:51:48.639
the next 72 hours in an ICU with her and she

00:51:48.639 --> 00:51:53.480
passed. So in one regard, you had five years

00:51:53.480 --> 00:51:56.480
run time. I had the end of a trip with three

00:51:56.480 --> 00:52:00.960
days and my mom's gone. So it's like all those

00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:04.960
feelings compressed into, you know, in this short

00:52:04.960 --> 00:52:07.639
period of time. But it's interesting because...

00:52:09.070 --> 00:52:11.130
You get out the back end and you have time to

00:52:11.130 --> 00:52:13.989
sort it out and figure out like, okay, I just

00:52:13.989 --> 00:52:17.869
lost this really cool lady. What's it mean? How

00:52:17.869 --> 00:52:21.690
do I deal with that? And it took me weeks, but

00:52:21.690 --> 00:52:24.630
ultimately it was gratitude. I thought out of

00:52:24.630 --> 00:52:26.909
all the people I could have selected for a mom.

00:52:27.769 --> 00:52:31.469
Yeah. I chose the right one. Yeah. I lost my

00:52:31.469 --> 00:52:34.409
mom when she was 59 and I had five weeks and

00:52:34.409 --> 00:52:36.389
then we didn't know she was dying and then she

00:52:36.389 --> 00:52:40.389
did. And I'm not diminishing your loss or mine,

00:52:40.530 --> 00:52:43.630
but your mum is supposed to go first. And although

00:52:43.630 --> 00:52:45.550
I was very young with my mum. Yeah, fair. But

00:52:45.550 --> 00:52:48.309
the husband, I mean, you'll think you're going

00:52:48.309 --> 00:52:51.210
to be with each other right until you're in your

00:52:51.210 --> 00:52:54.510
80s or 90s and raising these children that you

00:52:54.510 --> 00:52:57.789
have produced together. And that's a different

00:52:57.789 --> 00:53:00.409
order and different magnitude, isn't it? Because

00:53:00.409 --> 00:53:04.309
you feel that they've just been, there's no orderliness

00:53:04.309 --> 00:53:07.690
about that. I mean, I knew my mum was going to

00:53:07.690 --> 00:53:10.489
die first at some point, but now you're at 50

00:53:10.489 --> 00:53:14.050
and he's just gone and you've got the rest of

00:53:14.050 --> 00:53:15.769
your life. I mean, it's not like this happened

00:53:15.769 --> 00:53:17.449
when you're in your 70s. I mean, you're still

00:53:17.449 --> 00:53:19.489
young and vibrant with these young children.

00:53:20.380 --> 00:53:22.780
Do you, so you mentioned that you talk to him,

00:53:22.820 --> 00:53:25.619
which I love because I have these crazy conversations

00:53:25.619 --> 00:53:27.659
with my mum and she'll come to me sometimes,

00:53:27.880 --> 00:53:30.219
like I'm not even thinking about her. And then

00:53:30.219 --> 00:53:33.079
I'll hear like a Neil Diamond song play. I'm

00:53:33.079 --> 00:53:35.599
transported back to where we were in England,

00:53:35.659 --> 00:53:38.219
in Dorking in the seventies. And now I've got

00:53:38.219 --> 00:53:40.880
this dialogue and I don't really share, well,

00:53:40.920 --> 00:53:42.780
I'm sharing it now on Soul Deep Coast, but it's

00:53:42.780 --> 00:53:46.039
very personal. And I say, am I losing the plot?

00:53:46.119 --> 00:53:49.500
But it does feel that I'm communicating with

00:53:49.500 --> 00:53:52.679
him. her and it does give me solace and I do

00:53:52.679 --> 00:53:55.940
think that she's around in and I don't know what

00:53:55.940 --> 00:53:58.460
that looks like but I do feel her around and

00:53:58.460 --> 00:54:01.360
then for weeks sometimes I don't and then I'll

00:54:01.360 --> 00:54:03.579
hear from her but you've still got your husband

00:54:03.579 --> 00:54:06.659
somewhere in your life although it's not where

00:54:06.659 --> 00:54:09.019
he was at home is that is that right absolutely

00:54:09.019 --> 00:54:14.739
absolutely yeah I um when I'm talking to him

00:54:14.739 --> 00:54:20.059
I definitely feel that he's listening And he

00:54:20.059 --> 00:54:24.840
can't always communicate back. But I just feel

00:54:24.840 --> 00:54:27.300
like he is there. Well, tell us this episode

00:54:27.300 --> 00:54:31.519
where you asked to hear from him. How did he

00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:34.460
get your attention? You don't have to tell me.

00:54:34.460 --> 00:54:39.139
No, I'll tell you. If it's personal. He's X -rated,

00:54:39.179 --> 00:54:45.179
darling. This is from family audience. And this

00:54:45.179 --> 00:54:48.059
was recently? This was on Thanksgiving. Oh, okay.

00:54:48.139 --> 00:54:53.159
Oh, good. Wow. So I had not felt him for ages

00:54:53.159 --> 00:54:56.420
and I'd gotten really cross. You know, I was

00:54:56.420 --> 00:54:59.179
talking to him and I'm like, can you please just

00:54:59.179 --> 00:55:01.139
let me know you're here? Because it's really

00:55:01.139 --> 00:55:05.780
upsetting me. And I just need to know that you're

00:55:05.780 --> 00:55:11.539
around and nothing. So on that Tuesday of, no,

00:55:11.639 --> 00:55:13.019
Wednesday, actually, the day before Thanksgiving,

00:55:13.179 --> 00:55:15.420
I was with my therapist and she's like, how are

00:55:15.420 --> 00:55:17.179
you doing? Because she knew it was the anniversary.

00:55:17.789 --> 00:55:20.130
it's just been the anniversary he died on november

00:55:20.130 --> 00:55:25.449
22nd and uh i'm like i'm okay i said but honestly

00:55:25.449 --> 00:55:28.309
i really thought i'd hear from him particularly

00:55:28.309 --> 00:55:30.690
because it's the time of the year and i don't

00:55:30.690 --> 00:55:33.230
feel anything and i said that's really been upsetting

00:55:33.230 --> 00:55:38.250
me she's like listen we don't know we don't know

00:55:38.250 --> 00:55:41.690
how it works or anything like that she said but

00:55:41.690 --> 00:55:44.510
just let's just keep practicing our gratitude

00:55:44.510 --> 00:55:49.389
and you know so I'm like okay I'm okay so we

00:55:49.389 --> 00:55:52.050
went to Thanksgiving at my daughter's boyfriend's

00:55:52.050 --> 00:55:58.329
family and that night um we heard this massive

00:55:58.329 --> 00:56:02.349
bang outside and Dave my Saint Bernard went was

00:56:02.349 --> 00:56:06.429
going berserk so we're like let's let's because

00:56:06.429 --> 00:56:08.349
there's me and the two girls living in the house

00:56:08.349 --> 00:56:11.449
so we're like let's check every room so we went

00:56:11.449 --> 00:56:15.230
in my daughter's room Open the door. That light

00:56:15.230 --> 00:56:19.289
was just like this, like flashing, flashing,

00:56:19.329 --> 00:56:22.070
flashing, flashing, flashing so fast. So I turned

00:56:22.070 --> 00:56:24.590
it off. I'm like, what on earth is going on here?

00:56:25.610 --> 00:56:27.329
Turned it back on. Flash, flash, flash, flash,

00:56:27.329 --> 00:56:31.590
flash again. So I'm like, what on earth? So we

00:56:31.590 --> 00:56:34.070
go out and I joked. I said, hey, I said about

00:56:34.070 --> 00:56:36.269
your dad telling us, you know, don't worry about

00:56:36.269 --> 00:56:39.869
the bang. Everything's fine. I went to go to

00:56:39.869 --> 00:56:43.099
bed. put my phone, my phone had been next to

00:56:43.099 --> 00:56:46.500
my bedside. I went to go to bed, got in bed,

00:56:46.659 --> 00:56:51.739
picked my phone up, and his contact page was

00:56:51.739 --> 00:56:56.480
there. So it said, Dave, phone number. Wow. He

00:56:56.480 --> 00:56:58.840
had, I hadn't seen that since before he died.

00:56:58.860 --> 00:57:00.880
Why would you? Yeah. Why would you, right? Yeah,

00:57:00.960 --> 00:57:05.300
just there, and I, oh my God. God! I called the

00:57:05.300 --> 00:57:08.809
guard. i'm like your daddy's definitely here

00:57:08.809 --> 00:57:12.650
because i haven't seen that since before like

00:57:12.650 --> 00:57:14.949
probably two years before he died because of

00:57:14.949 --> 00:57:16.829
course he didn't have a phone for that time because

00:57:16.829 --> 00:57:20.489
he couldn't use it so holy shit and then you've

00:57:20.489 --> 00:57:23.269
correlated it to this light flashing yeah because

00:57:23.269 --> 00:57:25.590
i mean i'm not really big into that there's a

00:57:25.590 --> 00:57:27.650
lot of shows about the paranormal and i'm a little

00:57:27.650 --> 00:57:30.190
bit into it i'm definitely curious but apparently

00:57:30.190 --> 00:57:34.199
electricity is And you might know more about

00:57:34.199 --> 00:57:37.480
electromagnetic frequencies or something, but

00:57:37.480 --> 00:57:40.780
electricity is how the other side can communicate.

00:57:40.940 --> 00:57:43.900
It's a known method, apparently. Yeah, yeah.

00:57:44.260 --> 00:57:48.599
And before, if we've been having a big argument,

00:57:48.739 --> 00:57:51.199
which me and my girls have gone through a lot

00:57:51.199 --> 00:57:56.239
since he died, and the lights would flash when

00:57:56.239 --> 00:57:59.199
we were screaming at each other, and it would

00:57:59.199 --> 00:58:03.449
stop us. And we were like... I think that or

00:58:03.449 --> 00:58:05.650
Tilly would be, or whoever it was, would be like,

00:58:05.769 --> 00:58:09.349
that's telling us to stop. Right. So it's reaching

00:58:09.349 --> 00:58:13.670
you. Yeah. So that was that. And then the next

00:58:13.670 --> 00:58:17.550
morning we got up and there was a big white feather

00:58:17.550 --> 00:58:21.510
in the lounge. What? Was white feather, was that

00:58:21.510 --> 00:58:24.349
significant for something? Where was it? Like

00:58:24.349 --> 00:58:27.710
just a big white, the doors were closed? Yeah.

00:58:27.769 --> 00:58:31.409
Yeah. It was just there in the dining room on

00:58:31.409 --> 00:58:34.909
the floor. So I picked it up and I'm like, it

00:58:34.909 --> 00:58:37.369
has to be... Well, how else would it get? I mean,

00:58:37.369 --> 00:58:41.670
a white feather, that's... Yeah. I think that's

00:58:41.670 --> 00:58:47.000
cool. Yeah. Yeah, so nothing crazy, but... Well,

00:58:47.019 --> 00:58:50.519
he found a way of reaching you and that was confirmation

00:58:50.519 --> 00:58:52.880
because you'd been asking for that. Yeah. So

00:58:52.880 --> 00:58:55.780
he'd used the phone, a feather and the electricity.

00:58:55.940 --> 00:58:58.179
I mean, he'd somehow got your attention. Did

00:58:58.179 --> 00:59:00.559
it give you the comfort that you were hoping

00:59:00.559 --> 00:59:02.960
for as a result of asking? It did. It did. Because

00:59:02.960 --> 00:59:05.780
there was absolutely no way on this earth. Because

00:59:05.780 --> 00:59:08.320
my phone had been in my room since I'd got home.

00:59:08.460 --> 00:59:13.500
I'd left it there. you know obviously I hadn't

00:59:13.500 --> 00:59:15.940
like picked his number up well you'd have to

00:59:15.940 --> 00:59:17.800
go into your phone you'd have to go to messages

00:59:17.800 --> 00:59:20.019
you'd have to put you'd have to scroll then you'd

00:59:20.019 --> 00:59:21.880
have to I mean there's lots of steps to get yeah

00:59:21.880 --> 00:59:24.739
to come up yeah and I picked it up and there

00:59:24.739 --> 00:59:36.460
it was that's so and the dog comes running in

00:59:36.460 --> 00:59:39.760
so a lot of times when we spend so many years

00:59:39.760 --> 00:59:44.949
with somebody we we tend to almost emulate or

00:59:44.949 --> 00:59:48.170
replicate their thought processes and their mannerisms.

00:59:49.010 --> 00:59:52.969
To what degree or to what extent do you find

00:59:52.969 --> 00:59:56.070
yourself thinking the way he did or using his

00:59:56.070 --> 01:00:00.969
little speech, little characteristics and things?

01:00:01.070 --> 01:00:04.170
Do you find on your day -to -day -to -day basis

01:00:04.170 --> 01:00:08.929
that there's a gift that he gave you? Like you

01:00:08.929 --> 01:00:11.260
said initially that... I'm not good at making

01:00:11.260 --> 01:00:13.559
decisions. But then at the flip side, you're

01:00:13.559 --> 01:00:17.099
making all the decisions. Do you find his voice

01:00:17.099 --> 01:00:19.139
in your brain walking you through the decision

01:00:19.139 --> 01:00:28.469
process? So I, yeah, not, not always, but. What

01:00:28.469 --> 01:00:31.829
I try and do now is I try and think like he thought.

01:00:32.010 --> 01:00:35.309
That's what I'm saying. What would Dave do? Because

01:00:35.309 --> 01:00:37.429
it's almost like you're having the same conversation.

01:00:37.510 --> 01:00:39.070
It's like, okay, I'm going to say this to Dave.

01:00:39.090 --> 01:00:40.809
Dave's going to say this. And we're going to

01:00:40.809 --> 01:00:43.690
go back and forth. What would Dave come to? What

01:00:43.690 --> 01:00:46.070
would he suggest? And then you put it out there.

01:00:46.230 --> 01:00:48.789
To me, that's still a gift. And that's, even

01:00:48.789 --> 01:00:50.369
though he's not here in the three -dimensional

01:00:50.369 --> 01:00:53.849
space. That to me is a very real communication.

01:00:54.130 --> 01:00:57.349
Yeah. Yeah. I definitely go through something

01:00:57.349 --> 01:01:00.269
and be like, well, he would have, he would have

01:01:00.269 --> 01:01:02.869
probably said this and he would have wanted this.

01:01:04.469 --> 01:01:06.429
So yeah. Or he wouldn't have wanted this. Or

01:01:06.429 --> 01:01:08.449
he wouldn't have wanted this. Yeah. Yeah. And

01:01:08.449 --> 01:01:12.050
it, it definitely helps me to make a decision.

01:01:12.690 --> 01:01:16.789
Yeah. So when I was in my early forties, my best

01:01:16.789 --> 01:01:20.599
friend had committed suicide. Sorry. And we had

01:01:20.599 --> 01:01:22.039
not been in touch for a while. He got involved

01:01:22.039 --> 01:01:25.280
with drugs and such, alcohol and all. But there

01:01:25.280 --> 01:01:27.079
was part of me that was like, what could I have

01:01:27.079 --> 01:01:28.760
done differently? And you went through all of

01:01:28.760 --> 01:01:31.539
that. But I made a decision because I had a hard

01:01:31.539 --> 01:01:35.659
time dealing with the grief. For weeks, I was

01:01:35.659 --> 01:01:38.380
like, how could I have stopped this? And knowing

01:01:38.380 --> 01:01:41.139
what I know now, it's like, well, I shouldn't

01:01:41.139 --> 01:01:42.889
have stopped this. I couldn't have. I can only

01:01:42.889 --> 01:01:45.309
do my best and be there. But if that's part of

01:01:45.309 --> 01:01:48.150
his contract or his journey or that was his sovereign

01:01:48.150 --> 01:01:51.650
divine decision, then it's not my place to stop

01:01:51.650 --> 01:01:55.230
that, right? But from a first -person standpoint,

01:01:55.389 --> 01:01:58.170
what I decided to do is whenever I lost somebody

01:01:58.170 --> 01:02:01.769
that was close to me, I would just be reflective

01:02:01.769 --> 01:02:05.510
and peaceful and find out, just discover, what

01:02:05.510 --> 01:02:09.230
was it about my experience with that person that

01:02:09.230 --> 01:02:11.840
was just amazing? And it doesn't have to be a

01:02:11.840 --> 01:02:13.539
person. It could be a pet. It could be really

01:02:13.539 --> 01:02:17.400
any experience. But people are special. And so

01:02:17.400 --> 01:02:20.739
what is it that about, like for my friend's name

01:02:20.739 --> 01:02:24.019
was PJ and then my mom, you know, what was special

01:02:24.019 --> 01:02:28.260
about them? Like with my mom, she was a good

01:02:28.260 --> 01:02:31.139
teacher. She was not a formal teacher in school,

01:02:31.199 --> 01:02:33.539
but a life teacher. And she was also a great

01:02:33.539 --> 01:02:36.460
hostess. So every time I do something, I want

01:02:36.460 --> 01:02:39.989
to do it to the next level to honor my mom. And

01:02:39.989 --> 01:02:42.389
just say, okay, how would my mom do this event?

01:02:42.650 --> 01:02:44.869
How can I be a better hostess when I do this?

01:02:45.429 --> 01:02:50.429
How can I teach this better? So I take the best

01:02:50.429 --> 01:02:53.010
of the person I lost and I keep it alive within

01:02:53.010 --> 01:02:57.570
me. PJ was a very freaking awesome inventor,

01:02:57.929 --> 01:03:01.690
innovator, tangential thinker. So whenever I'm

01:03:01.690 --> 01:03:04.809
inventing, I'm thinking, okay, I got the spirit

01:03:04.809 --> 01:03:08.639
of PJ kind of going in my brain. How can we make

01:03:08.639 --> 01:03:11.679
this work better or different? Or what am I missing,

01:03:12.440 --> 01:03:16.119
right? With that as a backdrop, what are some

01:03:16.119 --> 01:03:18.619
of the special characteristics of Dave that you

01:03:18.619 --> 01:03:24.639
find yourself keeping alive? Like Sarah was talking

01:03:24.639 --> 01:03:27.340
this morning, when you came into the studio before

01:03:27.340 --> 01:03:31.230
the show, You were talking about doing donuts.

01:03:32.389 --> 01:03:36.050
My daughter was doing donuts on my front. But

01:03:36.050 --> 01:03:38.849
you brought that up, and I immediately thought

01:03:38.849 --> 01:03:43.130
of PJ because PJ brought out of me, because I

01:03:43.130 --> 01:03:47.690
was a very reserved person. My family had this

01:03:47.690 --> 01:03:50.389
strict set of behaviors, the church, this, that,

01:03:50.469 --> 01:03:52.530
blah, blah. Everything was strict and standardized,

01:03:52.570 --> 01:03:56.710
and you had to comply. But PJ brought this wildness,

01:03:56.750 --> 01:03:58.849
you know, jump off the roof of the garage and,

01:03:58.869 --> 01:04:02.170
you know, do every sort of wildness, including

01:04:02.170 --> 01:04:07.269
doing donuts, going freaking crazy, just taking

01:04:07.269 --> 01:04:09.849
the snowmobile and opening it up, flooring it

01:04:09.849 --> 01:04:12.809
full on, you know, just this crazy ass stuff.

01:04:13.050 --> 01:04:14.829
That's why I tell people, it's like, I don't

01:04:14.829 --> 01:04:16.750
even know how I'm still alive. Cause we would

01:04:16.750 --> 01:04:20.030
do, if my mom and dad knew what I was doing,

01:04:20.070 --> 01:04:22.739
I'd be like. murdered and they were just like

01:04:22.739 --> 01:04:26.119
what so but there's this do you find that with

01:04:26.119 --> 01:04:28.980
dave that there's certain things that he did

01:04:28.980 --> 01:04:31.039
that brought you joy and happiness that represented

01:04:31.039 --> 01:04:33.820
his character that you find yourself keeping

01:04:33.820 --> 01:04:37.760
alive were you alike or were you opposites we're

01:04:37.760 --> 01:04:40.840
actually complete opposites right total opposite

01:04:40.840 --> 01:04:43.000
that's interesting that's even better yeah it

01:04:43.000 --> 01:04:45.320
is because now you're missing you're missing

01:04:45.320 --> 01:04:49.630
that that's gone so That might make it more of

01:04:49.630 --> 01:04:51.309
a struggle because you were opposite because

01:04:51.309 --> 01:04:53.090
you were now blending as well. Well, struggle,

01:04:53.269 --> 01:04:56.150
but also a gift. A gift as well, yeah. But getting

01:04:56.150 --> 01:04:58.130
over it would be harder. Getting over it, right,

01:04:58.170 --> 01:05:00.730
because that's a loss of a piece. Yes, exactly.

01:05:00.789 --> 01:05:02.949
Yeah, I get what you're saying. So do you find

01:05:02.949 --> 01:05:04.570
that there were certain aspects of Dave that

01:05:04.570 --> 01:05:07.409
you're able to keep alive in terms of his character

01:05:07.409 --> 01:05:10.929
living within you? Yeah, I mean, he was very

01:05:10.929 --> 01:05:16.909
adventurous. He was very much live no matter

01:05:16.909 --> 01:05:20.000
what. If we want to do something like this big

01:05:20.000 --> 01:05:24.019
family holiday, this whatever, let's do it. He

01:05:24.019 --> 01:05:30.559
was very much live, I think. And I still try

01:05:30.559 --> 01:05:32.519
to be like that, even though he's not here. I

01:05:32.519 --> 01:05:35.380
definitely still try to be like that. But I can't

01:05:35.380 --> 01:05:39.539
help thinking we did everything we wanted. We

01:05:39.539 --> 01:05:42.360
were lucky. We both had really good jobs. So

01:05:42.360 --> 01:05:46.420
financially, we could. We moved here. We did

01:05:46.420 --> 01:05:49.139
that adventure. We had many, many adventures.

01:05:49.860 --> 01:05:53.320
And I can't help thinking that sometimes that

01:05:53.320 --> 01:05:55.539
maybe that's how we were supposed to live our

01:05:55.539 --> 01:06:00.880
lives together. But I'd also try to carry that

01:06:00.880 --> 01:06:02.280
on. That would be the acceptance part. You've

01:06:02.280 --> 01:06:05.059
accepted that. Yeah. Maybe we were supposed to

01:06:05.059 --> 01:06:08.860
do, cram all that life together in that short

01:06:08.860 --> 01:06:10.860
space of time. Well, it wasn't that short, but

01:06:10.860 --> 01:06:14.380
you know, all of it. comparatively yeah so you

01:06:14.380 --> 01:06:16.519
can look back with gratitude instead of regret

01:06:16.519 --> 01:06:19.400
yeah because if you were if you're just couch

01:06:19.400 --> 01:06:21.539
potatoes surfing you know cooking channel or

01:06:21.539 --> 01:06:23.739
something and And then this happens, you're like,

01:06:23.780 --> 01:06:25.920
holy crap, now we've got to catch up. But you

01:06:25.920 --> 01:06:27.699
didn't have to do that. You were actually actively

01:06:27.699 --> 01:06:30.739
living. We lived. I can honestly say that we

01:06:30.739 --> 01:06:32.420
really lived. I mean, I believe, and I write

01:06:32.420 --> 01:06:34.760
about this, that we have a life plan, but I don't

01:06:34.760 --> 01:06:37.280
believe everything is predetermined. Some things

01:06:37.280 --> 01:06:40.139
are. Now, for me, the death of your husband could

01:06:40.139 --> 01:06:42.539
be, could be predetermined, or it could be. But

01:06:42.539 --> 01:06:45.320
I would go in my belief system, which is reincarnation,

01:06:45.340 --> 01:06:47.320
that we're coming and cycling on and off this

01:06:47.320 --> 01:06:50.340
planet over and over again. That would feel...

01:06:50.960 --> 01:06:53.360
Okay, this and you're going to learn something.

01:06:53.400 --> 01:06:55.280
He's not gone. You're going to see him again.

01:06:55.800 --> 01:06:58.920
And you're almost having two lifetimes in one,

01:06:58.980 --> 01:07:00.480
aren't you? You've had the one with him and your

01:07:00.480 --> 01:07:03.579
kids. Now, this is another whole part of your

01:07:03.579 --> 01:07:06.860
life without him. So you've got these two things

01:07:06.860 --> 01:07:09.059
going on in your life. And that could have been

01:07:09.059 --> 01:07:10.960
something that you chose prior to coming here.

01:07:11.280 --> 01:07:15.059
And you don't know what's in store in the future.

01:07:15.139 --> 01:07:16.639
You're just going to live your life the best

01:07:16.639 --> 01:07:19.000
you can and be with your family. Now, you've

01:07:19.000 --> 01:07:22.019
got three girls. you're close to them does that

01:07:22.019 --> 01:07:24.940
bridge the loneliness gap at all because I think

01:07:24.940 --> 01:07:27.039
it would be I know that I would be lonely with

01:07:27.039 --> 01:07:30.039
my husband was gone yeah does that help having

01:07:30.039 --> 01:07:32.719
a larger family yeah for sure it definitely has

01:07:32.719 --> 01:07:36.679
and we've got animals as well and um yeah but

01:07:36.679 --> 01:07:39.480
I think having the girls because for the first

01:07:40.059 --> 01:07:42.340
Two years he was gone, they were my complete,

01:07:42.679 --> 01:07:45.960
I focused on them, which is probably why I did

01:07:45.960 --> 01:07:48.639
not go through my own grieving. But I feel like

01:07:48.639 --> 01:07:50.280
that's how it should have been. Good for you.

01:07:50.500 --> 01:07:53.159
Yeah, I do. I feel like that's exactly how it

01:07:53.159 --> 01:07:58.500
should have been. And now I'm kind of, I'm more

01:07:58.500 --> 01:08:01.159
equipped to deal with myself. Right. You know.

01:08:01.260 --> 01:08:03.119
Do you still live in the same house you shared?

01:08:03.440 --> 01:08:07.500
We do. And is that a comfort? Yes, it is. It

01:08:07.500 --> 01:08:08.960
is, you know, because he died in my bedroom.

01:08:09.969 --> 01:08:16.350
and um it's it's nice to see you know stuff that

01:08:16.350 --> 01:08:19.729
he did to the house the familiarity yeah i think

01:08:19.729 --> 01:08:22.489
but i don't think i want to stay in there forever

01:08:23.310 --> 01:08:26.170
I don't. Well, if you're having a hard time making

01:08:26.170 --> 01:08:28.750
decisions, that would actually be the biggest

01:08:28.750 --> 01:08:30.970
one of your life, wouldn't it? It would. To get

01:08:30.970 --> 01:08:36.130
rid of that. I wish you well on that one. You'll

01:08:36.130 --> 01:08:39.409
have to pray for the strength and you'll have

01:08:39.409 --> 01:08:41.829
to say to Dave, OK, I need to see this, this,

01:08:41.869 --> 01:08:46.590
this and this. Yeah, just give me these two signs

01:08:46.590 --> 01:08:48.949
that I have to move and it's a good decision.

01:08:48.970 --> 01:08:52.329
I want two and a confirmation three days later.

01:08:52.880 --> 01:08:55.020
Would you always stay in Florida? Have you thought

01:08:55.020 --> 01:08:58.020
about it? Yes. Yes. I would. I would. When he

01:08:58.020 --> 01:09:00.020
was alive, we thought about going to Georgia,

01:09:00.079 --> 01:09:01.960
but I don't think I'm going to go anywhere like

01:09:01.960 --> 01:09:04.420
that. No. No, I think this is it now for me.

01:09:04.520 --> 01:09:07.539
Well, selfishly, I'm glad to hear that. Because

01:09:07.539 --> 01:09:10.060
you're always a light, like even in the networking.

01:09:10.180 --> 01:09:12.260
You've been to my house for some gatherings.

01:09:12.460 --> 01:09:15.899
We just love to see you. And, you know, I'm always,

01:09:15.979 --> 01:09:19.260
I was that person growing up where I was always

01:09:19.260 --> 01:09:21.819
happy, but there was so much darkness within

01:09:21.819 --> 01:09:24.770
me. And so I'm always when I see somebody as

01:09:24.770 --> 01:09:27.789
happy as you and I'm always aware that there's

01:09:27.789 --> 01:09:30.409
there might be something else going on. So I

01:09:30.409 --> 01:09:31.970
just want to tell you that you're always safe

01:09:31.970 --> 01:09:37.329
here. I know. And Tia is so kind to me. She always

01:09:37.329 --> 01:09:40.010
asked me to come over like on holidays or or

01:09:40.010 --> 01:09:42.949
whatever. So I'm grateful for your friendship.

01:09:43.090 --> 01:09:45.810
I really am. It doesn't have to be a holiday.

01:09:45.909 --> 01:09:49.390
You can just pound on my door. I know. Hey, can

01:09:49.390 --> 01:09:53.750
we talk? I know. So as we look forward, you know,

01:09:53.789 --> 01:09:57.130
this is going to air probably between the holidays.

01:09:58.529 --> 01:10:01.189
What guidance, and Sarah, chime in, you know,

01:10:01.189 --> 01:10:02.750
what guidance would you have for people that

01:10:02.750 --> 01:10:05.789
have experienced loss? Or maybe they're, I know

01:10:05.789 --> 01:10:09.050
a personal friend of mine whose husband is really

01:10:09.050 --> 01:10:10.810
going through some difficulty right now. You

01:10:10.810 --> 01:10:13.949
probably know who that is. But, you know, what

01:10:13.949 --> 01:10:17.840
guidance can you give them? Would you like to

01:10:17.840 --> 01:10:24.579
share? I think you definitely fall on your friends,

01:10:24.600 --> 01:10:30.260
for one. If you are invited somewhere, try and

01:10:30.260 --> 01:10:32.979
go. Because there's been many times that I've

01:10:32.979 --> 01:10:34.779
been invited somewhere and I've just been like,

01:10:34.859 --> 01:10:37.380
I don't know whether I should go or I go. And

01:10:37.380 --> 01:10:41.220
ultimately, I'm glad I went. So rely on your

01:10:41.220 --> 01:10:45.539
friends. And give yourself time also. You have

01:10:45.539 --> 01:10:50.079
to. If you're having a bad day, let yourself

01:10:50.079 --> 01:10:52.119
have that bad day. I know people say that all

01:10:52.119 --> 01:10:55.840
the time, and it's hard. But I always think,

01:10:55.939 --> 01:10:59.420
if I'm having a bad day, you know what? I'm going

01:10:59.420 --> 01:11:02.539
to go to bed, and the sun will come up. The sun

01:11:02.539 --> 01:11:06.399
always comes up the next day. And very often,

01:11:06.600 --> 01:11:12.260
I feel better. I have gone through whatever feelings

01:11:12.260 --> 01:11:15.460
I had to go through in that awful day. But now

01:11:15.460 --> 01:11:20.220
I don't want that. That's gold. I struggled with

01:11:20.220 --> 01:11:22.979
depression growing up. They didn't label it that,

01:11:23.119 --> 01:11:25.279
but I know I was always dancing with darkness.

01:11:25.760 --> 01:11:29.720
And the one decision I made thousands of times

01:11:29.720 --> 01:11:33.699
was to just wait one more day. Just wait. It

01:11:33.699 --> 01:11:36.560
works. And it works. It absolutely works. I love

01:11:36.560 --> 01:11:39.600
that. Yeah. And I had to learn that. There was

01:11:39.600 --> 01:11:43.560
a song by Daniel Powder. Bad day. I had a bad

01:11:43.560 --> 01:11:47.739
day. It was a big hit. Oh, I know. That's an

01:11:47.739 --> 01:11:50.460
anthem for me. Not that I have that many bad

01:11:50.460 --> 01:11:53.479
days, but sometimes I'm aware that my day isn't

01:11:53.479 --> 01:11:56.020
like it was yesterday. Yeah. And it's like, it's

01:11:56.020 --> 01:11:58.899
just, it's the rhythm of life. It's not personal.

01:11:59.000 --> 01:12:00.520
It's not anything you're doing, but you have

01:12:00.520 --> 01:12:04.079
to accept the rough with the smooth. And it's

01:12:04.079 --> 01:12:06.140
quite extreme in your cases because of your loss,

01:12:06.239 --> 01:12:09.220
but everyone is going to have a bad day and it's

01:12:09.220 --> 01:12:11.000
just a bad day. You're going to be tomorrow.

01:12:11.340 --> 01:12:13.119
you're going to wake up and then you're going

01:12:13.119 --> 01:12:15.920
to have that smile again. It is. It's definitely

01:12:15.920 --> 01:12:20.060
exactly that. It is just a bad day. Yeah. The

01:12:20.060 --> 01:12:23.779
majority of them are just a bad day. And the

01:12:23.779 --> 01:12:28.039
sun, the light, it's there the next morning.

01:12:28.560 --> 01:12:30.779
And it's up to you, of course, whether you decide

01:12:30.779 --> 01:12:34.920
to have a good day. Is that kind of a choice

01:12:34.920 --> 01:12:37.199
for you now? You can say, you know what, I'm

01:12:37.199 --> 01:12:39.520
going to try and have a good day. You're choosing.

01:12:39.579 --> 01:12:42.840
I'm not going to fall into the darkness of what

01:12:42.840 --> 01:12:45.640
that is. Can you make it a choice? Sometimes

01:12:45.640 --> 01:12:50.159
it is a choice. But I feel like I'm in a situation

01:12:50.159 --> 01:12:56.600
now, a mindset maybe, that... I just do enjoy

01:12:56.600 --> 01:13:00.159
my life. I love my friends. I love my job. So

01:13:00.159 --> 01:13:04.460
it's not as much of a choice. It's already set.

01:13:04.659 --> 01:13:07.000
You have a good life and you recognize that.

01:13:07.279 --> 01:13:11.439
Yeah. I do definitely want people to know, though,

01:13:11.460 --> 01:13:17.140
that nothing is forever. Just like being married

01:13:17.140 --> 01:13:20.359
to your husband may not be forever. In my case,

01:13:20.359 --> 01:13:26.680
it wasn't. A bad day isn't forever. And I have

01:13:26.680 --> 01:13:30.880
to really come to terms with that as well. A

01:13:30.880 --> 01:13:34.439
relationship might not be forever. Nothing is

01:13:34.439 --> 01:13:37.060
forever. The impermanence, the Buddhists talk

01:13:37.060 --> 01:13:40.060
about impermanence. It's all subject to change

01:13:40.060 --> 01:13:43.079
at any given moment. Yeah. And that's a hard

01:13:43.079 --> 01:13:45.039
thing to accept, I think. It is. It's scary,

01:13:45.159 --> 01:13:48.439
isn't it? It is scary. It also could be exhilarating

01:13:48.439 --> 01:13:51.409
because... anything could change at any moment

01:13:51.409 --> 01:13:53.810
and there's a certain talk that puts on life

01:13:53.810 --> 01:13:55.850
there's a certain edginess that that gives you

01:13:55.850 --> 01:13:58.710
yeah it is quite and it could it could just be

01:13:58.710 --> 01:14:01.350
here today gone tomorrow I loved it when you

01:14:01.350 --> 01:14:04.630
talked about putting so much into your five years

01:14:04.630 --> 01:14:07.510
together and you did your bucket list stuff and

01:14:07.510 --> 01:14:10.210
then we should do that anyway yeah you just do

01:14:10.210 --> 01:14:12.710
that anyway live life to the fullest yeah we

01:14:12.710 --> 01:14:15.270
hear that a lot we think oh yeah but it's absolutely

01:14:16.380 --> 01:14:18.760
don't get complacent and don't take each other

01:14:18.760 --> 01:14:22.100
for granted and just live. And Dave sounds like

01:14:22.100 --> 01:14:24.640
someone that was press enter, let's just do it.

01:14:24.659 --> 01:14:27.779
Yeah, he was, he was. And even when he was like

01:14:27.779 --> 01:14:31.039
terribly sick, we'd take, his big joy was going

01:14:31.039 --> 01:14:34.159
to watch my daughter Tilly at the barn with her

01:14:34.159 --> 01:14:39.869
horse. And we made that happen every time. And

01:14:39.869 --> 01:14:43.050
it was, you know, you can imagine trying to make

01:14:43.050 --> 01:14:46.350
all this stuff happen. It was hard, you know,

01:14:46.350 --> 01:14:49.229
but we did it. And sometimes he'd say to me,

01:14:49.289 --> 01:14:52.890
gosh, he'd be like, oh, I don't want to go out

01:14:52.890 --> 01:14:55.270
today. And I'd be like, tough, we're going out.

01:14:55.949 --> 01:15:00.100
And then he'd come home and I'd say... It was

01:15:00.100 --> 01:15:02.819
good, wasn't it? And he'd be like, yes, I was

01:15:02.819 --> 01:15:06.140
ready to go. You're welcome. Exactly. You're

01:15:06.140 --> 01:15:10.760
welcome. So, Sharon, anything else you want to

01:15:10.760 --> 01:15:13.319
share with the people before we wrap up? I think

01:15:13.319 --> 01:15:17.979
that's probably most of my thoughts, my thinking.

01:15:19.479 --> 01:15:25.239
Just, it's not easy. Grief is not easy. But there

01:15:25.239 --> 01:15:31.630
are people out there to help. And it's just a

01:15:31.630 --> 01:15:34.310
journey, I guess. It's a journey. You're going

01:15:34.310 --> 01:15:35.489
to have good days, you're going to have really

01:15:35.489 --> 01:15:38.170
bad days. I think the journey might be, and I

01:15:38.170 --> 01:15:39.869
don't know because I'm just speculating, but

01:15:39.869 --> 01:15:43.329
it might be easier to recognise when we get back

01:15:43.329 --> 01:15:46.050
to where we came from because you'll look at

01:15:46.050 --> 01:15:48.850
the whole bigger picture in reverse. Yes. But

01:15:48.850 --> 01:15:51.670
when you're in it, it's just inexplicable sometimes

01:15:51.670 --> 01:15:54.029
and you just have to accept that. I don't know.

01:15:54.750 --> 01:15:59.130
And it's just this big mystery. I'm absolutely

01:15:59.130 --> 01:16:01.569
certain that you'll see him again. Yeah. Absolutely

01:16:01.569 --> 01:16:04.970
certain. I'd lay my life on it. So, and time,

01:16:05.010 --> 01:16:06.609
we don't know what time is. I mean, when you

01:16:06.609 --> 01:16:08.510
see him again, it might feel like it did five

01:16:08.510 --> 01:16:11.569
minutes ago. So I have faith in that. That's

01:16:11.569 --> 01:16:14.789
so true. Well, just after one last thing, I think

01:16:14.789 --> 01:16:17.850
just after he died. So he died in the November

01:16:17.850 --> 01:16:20.829
and in the January, I had this very vivid dream

01:16:20.829 --> 01:16:23.449
and he was in this wheelchair. We were friends.

01:16:23.670 --> 01:16:26.310
He was in this wheelchair and he got up and he

01:16:26.310 --> 01:16:30.189
walked towards me. And he came over to me and

01:16:30.189 --> 01:16:35.069
he said, look, he said, I can walk again. I'm

01:16:35.069 --> 01:16:39.329
fine. And he gave me this hug and I woke up and

01:16:39.329 --> 01:16:42.029
I was just, it was so vivid. I've never forgotten.

01:16:42.109 --> 01:16:44.630
I can still see it now. So going back to what

01:16:44.630 --> 01:16:48.520
you said, Sarah. I do think he's up there and

01:16:48.520 --> 01:16:50.380
he's walking around and he's just waiting. He's

01:16:50.380 --> 01:16:52.779
doing absolutely fine. What if that's reality

01:16:52.779 --> 01:16:55.960
and this is the dream? Yeah. Well, I have thought

01:16:55.960 --> 01:16:59.800
about that, Tia. What if I don't exist? I'm just

01:16:59.800 --> 01:17:03.239
like this. make -believe puppet that's that's

01:17:03.239 --> 01:17:06.060
our real that's your home and everything and

01:17:06.060 --> 01:17:08.260
this is just something we come in and out of

01:17:08.260 --> 01:17:10.560
yeah for whatever reason we might not understand

01:17:10.560 --> 01:17:13.439
it and he's doing just fine your goal and you're

01:17:13.439 --> 01:17:16.260
all in eternity specific in the bigger picture

01:17:16.260 --> 01:17:18.720
you're all going to be reunited and it won't

01:17:18.720 --> 01:17:22.239
feel then like it does now so um some of our

01:17:22.239 --> 01:17:25.020
past episodes i've talked about lucidity and

01:17:25.020 --> 01:17:27.020
i really would like to have you dive into that

01:17:27.020 --> 01:17:29.100
a little bit in the future i'll teach you a little

01:17:29.100 --> 01:17:32.420
bit about it some tech It's lucid dreaming where

01:17:32.420 --> 01:17:35.220
you can summon the dream. You're actually in

01:17:35.220 --> 01:17:38.180
the dream. You're midway between this reality

01:17:38.180 --> 01:17:41.960
and the alternative realities, or that reality

01:17:41.960 --> 01:17:45.060
and this fake reality, whatever this is. But

01:17:45.060 --> 01:17:48.460
you're able to still be semi -conscious and semi

01:17:48.460 --> 01:17:50.720
-control your involvement in your dream. In your

01:17:50.720 --> 01:17:53.149
dream. You can direct it. You kind of direct

01:17:53.149 --> 01:17:55.550
it. Now, it's taken me years to do, but I do

01:17:55.550 --> 01:17:57.729
it almost every night now. Really? It's really

01:17:57.729 --> 01:17:59.590
fun. Oh, I've been very interested. And I learn,

01:17:59.770 --> 01:18:03.470
like, Sarah gets downloads from her dreams. I

01:18:03.470 --> 01:18:05.289
actually... I had a dream about you this morning.

01:18:05.350 --> 01:18:06.569
Do you want me to tell you real quick? It's very

01:18:06.569 --> 01:18:10.130
brief. Go ahead. So it was just a scene. And

01:18:10.130 --> 01:18:12.869
my family was there and you'd climbed up quite

01:18:12.869 --> 01:18:16.010
high and then you had to climb back down again.

01:18:16.130 --> 01:18:18.210
And I can't remember, it was like boxes or it

01:18:18.210 --> 01:18:19.890
might have been a barn. It might have been bales

01:18:19.890 --> 01:18:21.550
of hay, but you were climbed up. It's about 12

01:18:21.550 --> 01:18:23.970
feet. I was waiting for you to come back down.

01:18:24.109 --> 01:18:26.789
And then you just did this backflip, two circles

01:18:26.789 --> 01:18:29.250
and landed next to me. Stuck the landing. Holy

01:18:29.250 --> 01:18:32.210
shit. I just stuck the landing. And then I went

01:18:32.210 --> 01:18:34.670
on to the next sequence in my dream. You were

01:18:34.670 --> 01:18:40.159
like... I just wanted to show off. That was this

01:18:40.159 --> 01:18:42.939
morning. I was really hoping you'd say I was

01:18:42.939 --> 01:18:46.359
in a helicopter. No, you were just like an acrobat.

01:18:47.520 --> 01:18:50.579
That sounds like me, totally. So it's going to

01:18:50.579 --> 01:18:53.560
be such a celebration. But I like the idea of

01:18:53.560 --> 01:18:56.960
us convening or coming to agreement that, hey,

01:18:56.979 --> 01:18:59.579
tonight let's meet in our dreams. Wouldn't that

01:18:59.579 --> 01:19:03.279
be kind of cool? Wow, that would be. I say this

01:19:03.279 --> 01:19:05.750
because sometimes Robert and I, we have... dreams

01:19:05.750 --> 01:19:08.170
that are so complimentary it's like wait wait

01:19:08.170 --> 01:19:11.229
what you did what where and i said well i was

01:19:11.229 --> 01:19:13.390
here doing this and like so was i like it was

01:19:13.390 --> 01:19:16.539
freaking weird My friend Charlene, she's from

01:19:16.539 --> 01:19:19.800
South Africa. I've apparently visited her in

01:19:19.800 --> 01:19:22.899
her bedroom over the years, maybe like five or

01:19:22.899 --> 01:19:25.399
six times. And she said, Sarah, you were sitting

01:19:25.399 --> 01:19:27.460
here, you were on the bed and we were talking.

01:19:27.579 --> 01:19:30.560
I have no recollection of that. But she said

01:19:30.560 --> 01:19:33.800
that your soul has come to like, wow. So I think

01:19:33.800 --> 01:19:35.899
we need to be open. We need to be open to those

01:19:35.899 --> 01:19:39.260
conversations, you know, so. But Sharon, again,

01:19:39.479 --> 01:19:41.600
I want to thank you for Sharon Keeble for being

01:19:41.600 --> 01:19:44.680
our guest in Treehouse Studio. I admire you for

01:19:44.680 --> 01:19:47.939
what you're going through. Your friendship's

01:19:47.939 --> 01:19:52.029
a gift to a lot of people, including me. Sarah,

01:19:52.090 --> 01:19:54.649
any closing thoughts about our visit with Sharon?

01:19:54.909 --> 01:19:58.550
I've got a little funny story after my mum died,

01:19:58.689 --> 01:20:01.689
talking about other side communication. And I

01:20:01.689 --> 01:20:04.590
wrote about this in my first book, because it's

01:20:04.590 --> 01:20:07.510
the best God could do. So my mum had been dead,

01:20:07.729 --> 01:20:11.409
and I was having conversations with God at that

01:20:11.409 --> 01:20:14.329
point, and I was being really demanding. And

01:20:14.329 --> 01:20:17.090
I say, you need to give me a sign that my mum

01:20:17.090 --> 01:20:19.430
is okay, because I was really worried about her

01:20:19.430 --> 01:20:21.239
soul. And this was a whole big... journey that

01:20:21.239 --> 01:20:24.960
I went on and I was quite demanding that's putting

01:20:24.960 --> 01:20:27.659
it mildly and I had taken my daughter to the

01:20:27.659 --> 01:20:29.939
doctors this is about six weeks after she died

01:20:29.939 --> 01:20:32.840
and I was coming back on 474 which is a country

01:20:32.840 --> 01:20:35.939
road down near me it goes on for about 13 miles

01:20:35.939 --> 01:20:38.079
and it's just through I know it's through through

01:20:38.079 --> 01:20:41.380
the swamp basically to the 33 right yeah 33 to

01:20:41.380 --> 01:20:45.539
27 sorry yes and so I'm down there and um I'm

01:20:45.539 --> 01:20:47.800
coming back from the doctors and then I see this

01:20:47.800 --> 01:20:50.180
dog wandering in front of me. It's this big old

01:20:50.180 --> 01:20:54.109
tick hound. And then I pulled over. And then

01:20:54.109 --> 01:20:58.310
a police car came up behind me. And I thought,

01:20:58.350 --> 01:20:59.970
well, that's good. At least he can take care

01:20:59.970 --> 01:21:03.029
of this dog. And he said to me, he said, this

01:21:03.029 --> 01:21:06.869
dog's got to go to animal control. And I already

01:21:06.869 --> 01:21:09.590
had, at that point, I had four dogs. And he said,

01:21:09.649 --> 01:21:13.010
would you be willing to keep it tonight and then

01:21:13.010 --> 01:21:15.930
call animal control in the morning? And then

01:21:15.930 --> 01:21:17.770
I'm kind of like, well, isn't that your job?

01:21:17.810 --> 01:21:20.770
You're a police officer. But my daughter, who's

01:21:20.770 --> 01:21:22.890
three, she's like, yeah, mummy, yeah, mummy.

01:21:22.920 --> 01:21:28.279
So we get the dog back and he was probably weighed

01:21:28.279 --> 01:21:30.520
about 100 pounds. He was old. He had this big

01:21:30.520 --> 01:21:32.880
cancerous growth hanging from his throat and

01:21:32.880 --> 01:21:35.859
all the rest of it. So I get these blankets and

01:21:35.859 --> 01:21:37.899
I put him in the garage. I put a bucket of water

01:21:37.899 --> 01:21:40.319
and a big thing of food and then he's lying there.

01:21:40.460 --> 01:21:44.000
And then I went to bed and then I woke up about

01:21:44.000 --> 01:21:47.819
midnight and I just hear in my spirit, go and

01:21:47.819 --> 01:21:51.810
look at that dog. And so he's lying down. And

01:21:51.810 --> 01:21:54.149
he'd been branded because he was a hunting dog.

01:21:54.229 --> 01:21:57.010
So someone had branded initials and they had

01:21:57.010 --> 01:21:59.949
branded LD. Right. It was black. So it was kind

01:21:59.949 --> 01:22:01.970
of. Actually, it was white. And then you could

01:22:01.970 --> 01:22:05.229
see the LD in black. And they're my mum's initials,

01:22:05.229 --> 01:22:08.909
Linda Durham. And so that was the sign. That's

01:22:08.909 --> 01:22:11.510
incredible. It was mind -blowing. I've been keeping

01:22:11.510 --> 01:22:14.409
this dog for a year and a half. Of course you

01:22:14.409 --> 01:22:19.350
did. And he had my mum's eyes. I'd look at his

01:22:19.350 --> 01:22:21.569
eyes and they were exactly the same as mine.

01:22:21.569 --> 01:22:25.350
These brown, hazel eyes. Oh, I love that. And

01:22:25.350 --> 01:22:27.630
he was such a pig, this dog. He would piss and

01:22:27.630 --> 01:22:31.180
shit everywhere next to me. His food bowl. But

01:22:31.180 --> 01:22:34.119
I loved him so much. And that was the comfort

01:22:34.119 --> 01:22:36.720
that I got after my mum died for that year and

01:22:36.720 --> 01:22:39.659
a half. And I called him Swiper because my daughter

01:22:39.659 --> 01:22:42.539
was into Dora the Explorer. Swiper, not swiping.

01:22:43.039 --> 01:22:48.659
Swiper, not swiping. And so that was my encounter

01:22:48.659 --> 01:22:52.119
with demanding something from, give me a sign.

01:22:52.279 --> 01:22:54.539
And he's like, well, here you go, Sarah. Careful

01:22:54.539 --> 01:22:59.119
what you ask for. I'm giving you a damn sign.

01:22:59.260 --> 01:23:04.880
Okay. I want to thank everybody for listening.

01:23:05.529 --> 01:23:07.210
Month over month, we're growing. We'd like to

01:23:07.210 --> 01:23:08.970
have our numbers much bigger, but we're just

01:23:08.970 --> 01:23:11.010
grateful for those of you sharing our show with

01:23:11.010 --> 01:23:14.869
others. If this brought you benefit and you feel

01:23:14.869 --> 01:23:17.569
like it can benefit somebody, please share. I

01:23:17.569 --> 01:23:19.789
do want to give a heads up for those of you loyal

01:23:19.789 --> 01:23:22.949
listeners that the character of Soul Decode is

01:23:22.949 --> 01:23:25.489
moving forward. We're going to change up a couple

01:23:25.489 --> 01:23:29.289
things with the new year. Sarah's really getting

01:23:29.289 --> 01:23:31.989
deep into some of her creative work. I'm getting

01:23:31.989 --> 01:23:34.449
deep into my creative work. So we still want

01:23:34.449 --> 01:23:38.470
to keep Soul Decodes going. We just haven't navigated

01:23:38.470 --> 01:23:42.010
what the next, what version 3 .0 is going to

01:23:42.010 --> 01:23:44.689
look like. But we've left it up to the universe

01:23:44.689 --> 01:23:48.989
for inspiration. So we don't know if we're going

01:23:48.989 --> 01:23:50.670
to go less frequently or if we're going to bring

01:23:50.670 --> 01:23:53.850
in some other hosts or hostesses. But the one

01:23:53.850 --> 01:23:56.630
thing we can guarantee is that the messages will,

01:23:56.710 --> 01:24:00.819
it'll be about the message. of soul decodes we

01:24:00.819 --> 01:24:04.060
we know where the essence of this show will always

01:24:04.060 --> 01:24:07.380
be about your soul's journey and what's it mean

01:24:07.380 --> 01:24:10.399
and what what does it not mean right so any thoughts

01:24:10.399 --> 01:24:13.439
on that sarah um i've left it up to the universe

01:24:13.439 --> 01:24:16.800
and i have absolute faith that the way forward

01:24:16.800 --> 01:24:19.359
is going to be magnificent and i try and live

01:24:19.359 --> 01:24:22.699
like that and it's exciting it's a new revamp

01:24:22.699 --> 01:24:25.119
and that's always good and i am interviewing

01:24:25.119 --> 01:24:28.359
not interviewing having a meaningful discussion

01:24:28.359 --> 01:24:32.279
with somebody, all three of us know, and she

01:24:32.279 --> 01:24:37.539
seems very amenable to the idea of being a fill

01:24:37.539 --> 01:24:39.979
in host. So even if it's just for a couple months,

01:24:40.260 --> 01:24:42.399
we're going to have, we're going to always keep

01:24:42.399 --> 01:24:44.619
the show going. So anyway, thanks for joining

01:24:44.619 --> 01:24:46.340
us and please share and have a great holiday

01:24:46.340 --> 01:25:09.369
season. We love you all. Thank you. Soul Decodes,

01:25:09.510 --> 01:25:12.409
a featured presentation, airs every Friday on

01:25:12.409 --> 01:25:16.850
the Earth Angel Media Network. This episode of

01:25:16.850 --> 01:25:19.130
Soul Decodes is sponsored and produced by Live

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01:25:21.770 --> 01:25:24.289
to the next level. Listen now to learn how Live

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Pure will make your world better. Live Pure is

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an American -based distribution system of online

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portals that give discounted access to clean,

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Potent, natural, and ethically sourced healthy

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solutions for fat loss, muscle gain, clean skin

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care, immune system support, whole body cleanse,

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physiological balance, and performance support

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for athletes of all ages. Live Pure handpicks

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the best products and nutrients from world -class

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companies, always adding to their quickly growing

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wellness lineup that now includes Korean skin

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care, no injection weight loss alternatives,

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medical -grade nutraceuticals listed in the physician's

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desk reference, and healthy coffee that rivals

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the world's best, but for only about a dollar

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per cup. Soul Decodes listeners looking for youth,

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beauty, and better health can get wholesale pricing

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by visiting livepure .com forward slash gateway

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and signing up for free as a preferred customer.

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Content creators, influencers, and virtual entrepreneurs

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looking for passive cash flows from emerging

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markets can profit from Live Pure's State of

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the Industry affiliate program, which provides

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up to seven different payment vectors. Content

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creators aligned with Live Pure and Earth Angel

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Media will enjoy massive co -marketing benefits,

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including a personally branded website. Sign

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up as an affiliate brand partner at livepure

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.biz forward slash gateway. Or drop us a note

01:26:58.340 --> 01:27:01.600
at earthangelproject .com. Check out the show

01:27:01.600 --> 01:27:02.520
notes for more details.