I think parents are dealing with so much, not just the actual paperwork and the forms and all those things that are constant. You have to remember that they're dealing with the daily challenges. And so I feel like for parents, the unknown for them is tremendous. And I think that they need to have somebody that they know is on their side from the start. Welcome to the Classroom Narratives Healing and Education Podcast. The space for Education Meets Resilience. I'm Dr. Joey Weisler, and in each episode we dive deep into the personal stories of educators, students, leaders, and frontline advocates who are navigating the complexities within modern education. Whether you're just starting your teaching journey or are a seasoned professional looking for inspiration, we'll explore how to foster meaningful change, prevent burnout, and build trauma-informed communities within our schools. Now, let's take a seat at the front of the classroom as we get started. Today's conversation is for every parent, teacher, and [00:01:00] school leader who has ever felt overwhelmed by the special education system and still choose to show up for it anyway. My guest, Mark Ingrassia, is a longtime special education advocate, parent, coach, and the founder of Special Ed Rising, which is a platform and podcast dedicated to ensuring that no parent feels alone in their process. Mark brings both professional experience and lived reality into his work, which helps families navigate advocacy, access, and hope with clarity and compassion. And in this conversation we want to talk about what families are really facing right now and how educators can better partner with parents in what rising actually looks like when the system starts to feel impossible. I'm honored to share the space with Mark, and I'm glad that he's here with us today. Welcome. Thank you so much, Joey. It's a pleasure to be here today. Thanks for having me. Thank you for being here again. So, Mark, you tend to work with families at their most vulnerable moments, when they're scared, when they're confused, and when you're trying to make sense of the special education system. So [00:02:00] from where you stand right now, what do you think families are most overwhelmed with that schools don't fully see? You know, I think parents are dealing with so much, not just the actual paperwork and the forms and all those things that are constant. You have to remember that they're dealing with the daily, whatever's going on in their home. The daily challenges. Mm-hmm. The fears, having hopes for the future. Wondering what those hopes, you know, are they realistic or not? Um, burnout. And I think that those things make them very vulnerable. And it creates a huge opportunity for doubt for them in how they're approaching things. And I think what needs to be, the key is the school home connection. And for me as a teacher, that was always really important and I always found that to be the thing that helped progress their child to another level of success. And a lot of times I was dealing with behavior issues with my students, and just life management. So for [00:03:00] that to work, really the connection between school and home was critical. And so there was direct follow through what I was doing in school, the parents were doing at home and vice versa. And I think that we need to also remember to include the parents' voice much more because they're the true experts on their child, and we need to let them have a place at the table without feeling that the school is adversarial towards them. I think that for me, gaining the trust with the family was always number one, and knowing that I may have a little more information than them, but this is a journey. We're gonna travel together if we're working together. And so I feel like for parents, the unknown for them is tremendous. And I think that they need to have somebody that they know is on their side from the start. Yeah. Families, I feel like when they are approaching the way education works, that there's a lot of information that is sometimes withheld from them. Sometimes it's censored, [00:04:00] and even when we talk about, for example, like school outcome reports, I know that my own high school at its time was rated as an A school and it is very strong in academics. But there was some discipline circumstances that might have gone unreported, and as a result that information was withheld to the community, which ultimately led to our school's massacre in 2018, for example. And when we think about just information that is withheld from parents or not communicated in its full, what can parents do, to combat that and just learn about ways to understand their entire school from the inside out? I think that schools obviously have to be more open, more transparent and as far as the IEP goes and the scaffolding of the IEP from the beginning of their child's school career, there needs to be consistency with that and that needs to be followed through and parents need to feel empowered to be able to stay on top of that process as well, so teachers aren't dropping the ball along the way. Administrations aren't dropping the ball. I want to throw into a [00:05:00] qualifier that I know schools, teachers are overwhelmed and there's a lot to manage, so I don't try to cast too much of a negative on the schools and the teachers. 'cause I know most of them are well intentioned, but the ball gets dropped along the way, somewhere along the line oftentimes. And for parents who really just don't know, advocacy is the thing to be able to find an advocate who can help guide you. They don't necessarily have to go to all your meetings with you, but you can meet with them and the advocate can educate you on your rights, the process, what should be happening next? The IEP is a legal document that's adding up over the years to hopefully arrive at a place with not expectation, but with a clearer idea of our options when we're about to graduate out of high school. And that process needs to start around 14 years old. And sometimes it doesn't, and sometimes families don't even know about it. I had, I had a friend whose daughter was [00:06:00] neurodivergent and she was about to graduate and she hadn't been even aware, right? So going through all the things that need to happen in order to be able to put your child in the best position once they leave school has to start very early because it can take a couple of years as we've learned and families have to fight for a lot. So the advocacy, I believe is one of the keys to getting the ball rolling. 'cause the advocate can put little pressure on the school in ways that parents may not realize and then they can get educated and they can follow through themselves. And when you talk about the advocate, who could that person look like? An advocate can be another parent, it could be a retired teacher, there's plenty of organizations that are literally just advocates and they're people who've worked in the profession before and have knowledge of the law. Lawyers can be advocates and so there are people that you can pay more money to and through my interviewing process, I've discovered that there are advocates that you probably could get for not a lot of money and maybe there's some pro bono [00:07:00] people out there that do it. And, and certainly, you know, schools will provide parents to do that for you as well. But if you really wanna find somebody who's gonna be on your side, you might have to pay a little bit, but I'm not exactly sure what that entails specifically right now. So I don't want to represent that falsely, but there are advocates out there who have this experience that would be really just a huge benefit to parents in helping to educate them and guide them. And when we do talk about that advocate, I think we can say it's pretty clear in education that every person involved, every, I guess we can say the word stakeholder involved is always looking out for the best interest of the student. I always say that whenever something goes wrong, the student is always the one who is the victim to that. But we always wanna make sure that students are the ones who are succeeding. They are the product of the system. We wanna represent them the best that we can as our educators, leaders, and facilitators, to have them be our best outcome and our best work. Mm-hmm. So what have you learned in the work that [00:08:00] you've done about what is actually helping parents and educators despite the opposition and resistance that can be seen in getting the best outcomes for our students? Well, I have to say that I taught students from age two through 17, probably at different times, and I tended to be in the elementary, preschool area for most of my time there. And so I didn't have a real true opportunity to see the follow through process beyond a certain stage. And I didn't work in a public school either, and so my experience is from a private school for the deaf that was state funded, part of these 42 0 1 schools, and so the population was smaller. My sample size of what my experience is, speaking from my personal experience, I feel like I was able to have better relationships with families because it was smaller. I don't wanna speak for other teachers because I know classrooms are larger in a lot of places and in public [00:09:00] schools, obviously there's kids that are mainstreamed into regular classrooms and that's a whole other topic to talk about how regular ed teachers are trying to manage that without a lot of skills and experience and I know some personally who are struggling. And I love to be able to help them because the school isn't educating the teachers. The school, I feel bottom line needs to educate parents more. They need to be much more open to sharing information. And as you said, a lot of that information isn't always shared. To me without that being the first priority, parents are always gonna be behind the ball and I think that it's always gonna be a catch up situation with them and I know administration, certain administrations are gonna try to save themselves from counter, you know, suing from families and, and lawyers and challenges to their decision making process. And, as far as the parent goes, their education background, if they're not from this country originally, there's language barriers. [00:10:00] And I've seen a lot of families just accept whatever the school says and not really be able to follow through with questions or maybe they're too afraid to follow through with questions. And so I think that the schools need to be way more involved in bringing the families in to be more involved. And that collaboration is critical. And that's on a day-to-day basis too. Like families need to be able to be in communication with the school. And you probably experienced too, where families that really are inquiring a lot can kind of start to be considered obnoxious or annoying to teachers and school. Disruptive. Yeah. Right. They don't wanna deal with that, so they get a bad reputation, but there's ways to go about it civilly and be able to respect each other in the process. And so that process of respect and open resource is I think the first most important thing. I'm also thinking about what you just said with mainstreaming and in my first year of being an eighth grade ELA instructor I was dealing with, first [00:11:00] of all, being brand new and all I had was my certificate in English education, grade six through 12, that's all I had. And in that opening year, they gave me a split schedule where I had half Cambridge accelerating students which was quite a privilege to work with. But then the other half of my day, my other two classes were remedial. And in those classes I had quite a few students who were mainstreamed. And I even had colleagues come to me at the beginning of the year and say, by the way, you have students that we have had that deserve to be in self-contained classrooms instead of being in the mainstream caliber and for eighth grade, ELA. In this remedial class, the average student read somewhere between first grade and seventh grade. They were all below level, but I did have a handful of first grade levels in that one class, and there did come a point pretty quickly in maybe by October i'm just like, I [00:12:00] don't know how to help them because I was never equipped with the skills and training to regulate this type of student. Mm-hmm in getting to be where they need to be with your peers and pretty much with admin, and I talk about this on several of my podcasts, the conversation instead, it became a of support with, let's give you the tools to help you, it kind of came to this conversation constantly like, well then why don't you know how to do this? Why were you never given those skills? Right. So what would you say to other teachers and leaders currently to help bridge that gap that for others that are also dealing with such a circumstance? Obviously there needs to be an open communication and collaboration between the teachers and the administrators. The teachers need to feel comfortable to be able to voice their needs to the administration. There's a lot of pressures from states and the federal government as far as we know what's going on with education now and the Department of Education being closed down, and who knows what's coming around the corner. So there's a lot of fear out there, and I think that [00:13:00] teachers also are under so much pressure to be able to meet certain standards that when it comes to being able to go to a place where they can get that kind of help and the administration being able to avail the time to it, there doesn't seem to be, and this is an assumption on my part because I'm not in it, it seems like there might be a time element problem as far as being able to meet standards and also take care of management in a classroom. But management is how it all starts, right? You need to start with management. How are you gonna manage your classroom, and what does that mean? And I think that if you can find that open communication and that collaboration, then yes, teachers can go and say, this is what I need. But I know it's not happening necessarily in a lot of places. I, I know teachers that are struggling and it's unfair to them, and it's unfair to all the students. Your first grade reading level students and your students who are excelling. And so I think that if we don't listen to each [00:14:00] other, we're gonna continue down this road. But I think it even starts sooner because I think it starts with the education of teachers in their master's programs and things like that. Mm-hmm. Learn how to be a teacher by actually, yes you can go and you can be student teaching and in a classroom and that's one thing. But in the classroom classroom, actually talking about what would you do in this situation? Because as you mentioned, and as I know personally too, when you start, oftentimes you're given more challenging classes. Mm-hmm. And that never made any sense to me. You gave the teachers with the least experience the kids who needed the teacher with the most experience. It never made any sense to me. I don't know what that's like around the country, if that's consistent like that, but that was my experience. It was my experience with assistants as well. They always put the brand new green assistant in a classroom with a child who was behavior was outta control and really was dangerous at times, but that person had no idea what to do. And so there needs to be that switch where you put the more experienced people with the [00:15:00] more challenging situations because they're gonna be able to better handle those situations. I also think that teacher collaboration too, like buddies, teacher buddies where you're helping each other, where you can actually maybe meet however often the school decides where you can sit with your teacher and talk about each other's situations and try to give your experience and some help with that and maybe a, a big brother, big sister kind of thing, you know? I think that kind of internal working together is if you're not gonna start in colleges and teach teachers how to actually handle situations, because that whole mainstream situation is the goal, right? You want everyone to be included, and I fully am behind that. But you also need to have, if you're not gonna have one teacher trying to manage all that, is it possible to have a teacher who can be that resource in the classroom as well? A lot of people don't wanna be teachers anymore. A lot of people are resigning because of the pressures. So how [00:16:00] realistic is that? It's a real quandary. And I think we've backed ourselves into a little bit of a corner at this point too, but I don't think it's hopeless. I really do think that if you're looking at this as a business and the students, the product mm-hmm. You know, schools can be a pretty failing business oftentimes because there is not that clear sharing of information. And I found with different administrators, in my experience, there were some that were way more open than others, and others that just kind of kept to themselves. And you were always a mystery and then all of a sudden something would happen and you'd be like blindsided. And that was not a comfortable way to live and go to work every day and feel like you were being effective because you were kind of also thinking about that, that what's the ball's gonna drop next, you know? Yep, yep, yep. No, in that same opening year, so I started at the school in January and I started off with full accelerating Cambridge gifted students because I had came in in the middle of the year to replace somebody. But then in my first full year, that [00:17:00] August, and it was my time to start from zero, if you will, that's, they gave me those integrated groups, and I'm pretty sure I got those students because a colleague must have said in June, i've done my time and I do not wanna teach these kids anymore, give them to somebody else. And as the newest member of the team, the leadership actually said to me, listen, we just want you to know that you have some of the most challenging students in our entire K through eight school about to enter your room. And you know what they did in November? They did my formal observation in that class period. Of course. Naturally, you've had two whole months to try to figure this out. Exactly. And the whole, I guess, post conversation from the observation was, let's talk about what you haven't figured out in terms of reaching those students yet. Mm-hmm. And. When it comes to, like you said, needing the teacher with the most experience to work with those types of students, but they're not willing, what should leadership do to help bridge that gap? To make sure that we keep the new teachers interested in education? Because I [00:18:00] left after that year. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's the problem right now with teachers just leaving in general, how do you keep them there? They're not being appreciated. They're being overworked and in many cases not paid enough. I think we could talk about the imbalance of what's valued in this country over what's not. And teachers are certainly, they're frontline workers. Number one, their lives are on literally online every day with their students. So that's something that really flies under the radar and needs to be appreciated, just as you know, civil servant workers, policemen and firemen, their lives are on the line every day and they get to retire at 40 or whatever it is at 25, 30 years and get their full pension. You know, teachers have to struggle to get to that place because there's so many things coming at them left and right, changes constantly. And they're expected to just be able to deal with everything. You're just supposed to be able to deal with everything naturally. So obviously [00:19:00] in incentivizing, how do you incentivize any worker, right? I mean, certainly money is incentive. And so there needs to be a reworking of that, but I don't see that happening, that coming down the pike. So how do you do that? I think for me, what I always wondered, like the simplest way to motivate a teacher was just to say, great job. Mm-hmm. I mean, there needs to be more of that because teachers innately, the good teachers and the teachers that feel the calling. They're not doing it necessarily for the money. Right. Because it's not a business where you're making a lot of money. So you do it because you want to, because you want to help these kids. You want to be a value and you feel like you've got something to offer. And all I ever needed was a pat on the back. If I was told I did a good job, I'm gonna come in the next day and try to do 10 times better. Mm-hmm. Right. So if we can have administration valuing their staff in a very realistic way. And [00:20:00] where there's motivations beyond finance, however, that's gonna be, be creative, get creative with it. But I feel like teachers need to feel appreciated and, and I think it's really lacking now. When I went out in the real world after being in the classroom 30 years, I didn't realize how much knowledge I had to share. If people feel they're valued like that and they're allowed to share it, so maybe they get opportunities where you can be a leader in the school and you can lead a group of other teachers and you can be a mentor and start a mentor program. So many possibilities as far that I can't even think of off the top of my head. I can just imagine getting creative with it to try to incentivize teachers. I really do believe that bottom line, if a teacher feels appreciated, they're gonna show up and want to do the job, and know that there's support there when they're struggling. Absolutely. And a lot of the work that you're doing now is literally built in this idea of rising, like rising through exhaustion, rising through the grief, rising through the advocacy and the [00:21:00] fatigue and the uncertainty. And like you even mentioned, and I'm one who's been a community witness to it, where teachers do enter the classroom with their lives literally on the line every single day. And if worst case scenario comes to pass, like what happened to my hometown of Parkland, then the teachers are the ones that are there to guide and I would even say shepherd the rest of the community through the grief that they're feeling as well. Mm-hmm. So what does rising look like to you in real life and the work that you're doing? Not like the Instagram version that we see. Yeah, yeah. Like the real, honest, everyday version of rising in schools right now? Mm-hmm. You're talking about parents or you're talking about the classroom, like teachers? We'll talk about all the above. Above on, on an individual level as you see it. Yeah, sure. I think rising to me literally means getting out of bed and moving forward. And going with your intention that day to do the best you can and try to do something good. I think rising to me is rising to meet the moment as best you can, but know that we're [00:22:00] imperfect, right? Mm-hmm. And that's why we need each other. We need community. And for me, empowering families with knowledge is a way for them to rise up. Every time they gain a little bit more information, they're rising higher and higher. And to me, you know, rising for me was when I left my job, I was coming home and I was thinking, well, what's next? And, "The Rising", the song came on the radio, Bruce Springsteen, and then as I pulled up to a stoplight while the song was on, somebody walked by with a bag and it said, "rise" on it. And I went for an interview and I didn't play my radio the entire time until I pulled in the driveway of the school. 'cause I was thinking about maybe going back and teaching again for a bit before I changed my mind. And the rising came back on. So I'm like, okay, this is, this is sending me a message. Right? So what more positive thing can I think of than to rise above whatever we're dealing with? And so parents constantly are dealing with challenges and so that's why I develop more of a mindful approach when it comes [00:23:00] to parent training because really the bottom line is about being present and meeting your child where they are. And that to me is where it starts, and you don't have to be perfect because you can't be. So you're honestly walking in and you're present, there's a lot of things going on in your life, but in the moment everything's gone and you're just dealing with the child in front of you. Who is that child? Right? What are their needs? What are their interests? What are they like? Right? Really, really taking that time and taking that space when something happens, taking that pause. And I just interviewed a wonderful yoga guru special needs yoga instructor who started a school in England many years ago, and she trains teachers. To carry forth their mission. And we talked a lot about pause in my recent episode and it's definitely one I would recommend listening to 'cause it's, I think it's really, really enlightening and that place to take that pause is an opportunity to choose your response as opposed to just reacting [00:24:00] to a situation. When we know we have the opportunity to make a choice, it empowers us. So that also allows us to rise to the moment and say, okay. I'm going to look to the higher power in myself and how can I meet this moment as the best me with compassion? So it's about rising and becoming equipped with knowledge. Yeah. I think, you know, getting off the floor, getting off the mat and trying is the most clear vision of what rise means to me. Just actually going and trying. And despite the fears and the doubts and the risks that come with all of it, and believing in life that if I can put the energy out there and I can move with intention that is honest and empathetic, yeah. Then I win every time. Absolutely. So tell us one more time what Special Ed Rising is and how can we continue to follow and support the work that you're doing? [00:25:00] So, special ed Rising, you know, special ed, the term came out because I was a special education teacher and it, it's kind of broadened. I mean, the podcast now takes on a lot of different faces. It's really bottom line and information platform for families and for teachers and caregivers. And so special ed rising is now respecting disability rights. It's respecting disability politics, and it's also dealing with everyday management in life for these families, and I've talked to people who have worked in the modeling industry, I've talked to people who have made animatronic dogs to help comfort. You know, I've, across the board just tons of different things. Dance teachers, our, our mutual friend Guiliana Conti, who's with Music Workshop and the relevance of music and how important the role of that is in how it can be such a life-changing experience for these students. So things like that. I have a lot of interests, so I'm trying to broaden [00:26:00] it, but stay within bottom line, the arena of helping people and helping families in this area, as best I can. And so my podcast is called Special Ed Rising: No Parent Left Behind, and that's still the case. It's for parents, first and foremost, and you can listen to that on any podcast platform. My website is special ed rising.com and I also have on Facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn at special ed Rising. So you can find me there and if you're interested in parent training, please reach out. You can reach out through my website. Well, Mark, I'm so grateful for your honesty and steadiness in this work. And what you've done today is remind us that efficacy often looks like consistency, listening. Just the refusal to let families disappear inside a system that can sometimes move very quickly for them. So for everyone listening, if today's conversation spoke to you as a parent, or an educator, or a caregiver, or even a student, I strongly encourage you to connect with Mark and the special Ed [00:27:00] rising community to know that you are not meant to do this work by yourself. Now, as always, thank you for tuning into the Classroom Narratives podcast where we hold space for stories, struggle, and hope. Thank you for joining us on the Classroom Narratives Healing and Education podcast. If today's episode inspired you or made you think differently, I'd love to hear from you. Drop a comment or review wherever you listen to podcasts and stay connected with us on the at Classroom Narratives podcast over Instagram and Facebook. Remember, together we can transform our scars into stars and education, one conversation at a time.