WEBVTT 00:00:16.969 --> 00:00:19.890 Welcome back to Networking Unleashed, building 00:00:19.890 --> 00:00:23.070 profitable connections. I'm your host, Michael 00:00:23.070 --> 00:00:27.089 Foreman, speaker, strategist, and believer that 00:00:27.089 --> 00:00:29.429 the right conversation can change your future. 00:00:30.109 --> 00:00:33.570 Today's episode is a game changer. If you've 00:00:33.570 --> 00:00:36.530 ever felt awkward walking into a room full of 00:00:36.530 --> 00:00:39.609 strangers and unsure of how to make the first 00:00:39.609 --> 00:00:43.070 connection, this one's for you. My guest is a 00:00:43.070 --> 00:00:46.710 true master at taking the fear out of networking, 00:00:46.850 --> 00:00:50.369 and replacing it with a simple, powerful, practical 00:00:50.369 --> 00:00:54.710 step that can move you towards your next, whether 00:00:54.710 --> 00:00:58.450 that's a new opportunity, partnership, or breakthrough. 00:00:58.810 --> 00:01:02.609 Get ready for real talk, actionable advice, and 00:01:02.609 --> 00:01:05.549 the kind of insight that turns handshakes into 00:01:05.549 --> 00:01:09.969 high -impact connections. Let's dive in. Giselle? 00:01:10.540 --> 00:01:14.040 How are you today? And welcome to the show. And 00:01:14.040 --> 00:01:16.040 if you don't mind, give us a little bit about 00:01:16.040 --> 00:01:18.620 your background and what you like to talk about. 00:01:19.060 --> 00:01:21.480 Sure. Michael, thank you so much for having me. 00:01:21.500 --> 00:01:24.359 Glad to be here. A little about my background. 00:01:24.799 --> 00:01:30.159 I grew up in New York City, raised by a... My 00:01:30.159 --> 00:01:33.340 parents separated when I was single digits. Of 00:01:33.340 --> 00:01:34.980 course, I was single digits. I was primarily 00:01:34.980 --> 00:01:37.140 raised by my mother and my grandmother in New 00:01:37.140 --> 00:01:39.019 York City, in Harlem. The old Harlem, not the 00:01:39.019 --> 00:01:44.120 new. And my mom always had me reaching for excellence, 00:01:44.280 --> 00:01:46.280 right? So everything, I'll never forget like 00:01:46.280 --> 00:01:48.920 growing up, if I would get a hundred on the test, 00:01:49.120 --> 00:01:51.099 I would be able to go to this little store in 00:01:51.099 --> 00:01:53.439 our neighborhood and get like a little prize. 00:01:53.859 --> 00:01:56.799 And even once she took the incentive away, I 00:01:56.799 --> 00:01:59.760 still wanted to be a superstar in terms of whatever 00:01:59.760 --> 00:02:04.469 it was that I was doing. When I, after college 00:02:04.469 --> 00:02:07.370 and all the things, she would always tell me, 00:02:07.370 --> 00:02:09.889 when you go to work, keep your head down, be 00:02:09.889 --> 00:02:12.310 the smartest person in the room. This is how 00:02:12.310 --> 00:02:14.669 you get promoted. And I was like, I get that. 00:02:14.969 --> 00:02:18.229 And then out of college, I go and work at what 00:02:18.229 --> 00:02:19.990 was Anderson Consulting, it's Accenture now. 00:02:20.629 --> 00:02:24.330 And I never forget the first time when I saw 00:02:24.330 --> 00:02:27.550 a networking opportunity, someone had wheeled 00:02:27.550 --> 00:02:30.650 out like a bar after work, it's like a Friday. 00:02:30.750 --> 00:02:33.000 And I was like. clutching my pearls. I was like, 00:02:33.039 --> 00:02:35.520 oh my God, people are drinking at work. I can't 00:02:35.520 --> 00:02:37.500 be seen doing that. So I'm like trying to be 00:02:37.500 --> 00:02:40.860 on the peripheries so that no one sees me. And 00:02:40.860 --> 00:02:43.680 I'm trying not to be seen with a drink in my 00:02:43.680 --> 00:02:46.439 hand. And then also numerous occasions where 00:02:46.439 --> 00:02:49.020 employees would say, hey, we're going out after 00:02:49.020 --> 00:02:50.680 work. You want to join us? I'm like, no, I'm 00:02:50.680 --> 00:02:52.680 so busy. I have so much to do. I can't, I don't 00:02:52.680 --> 00:02:54.259 have the time. How do they have the time for 00:02:54.259 --> 00:02:56.840 this? I just didn't see it was important. And 00:02:56.840 --> 00:02:59.979 then over time, Michael, I learned. that what 00:02:59.979 --> 00:03:03.379 my mother told me wasn't exactly accurate about 00:03:03.379 --> 00:03:05.960 you get the promotion by keeping your head down 00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:07.439 and doing the work. I was like, I saw a lot of 00:03:07.439 --> 00:03:09.400 people getting promotions, but I didn't see them 00:03:09.400 --> 00:03:13.000 having their head down necessarily. So just on 00:03:13.000 --> 00:03:16.479 my career journey, I learned that networking 00:03:16.479 --> 00:03:19.780 is not a bad word and that it can help take you 00:03:19.780 --> 00:03:23.439 from here to there. But I learned it at a late, 00:03:23.479 --> 00:03:25.960 I feel like a late age. By the time I was 39 00:03:25.960 --> 00:03:28.879 is like when it really cemented in. And because 00:03:28.879 --> 00:03:31.740 of that, I enjoy sharing what I've learned with 00:03:31.740 --> 00:03:34.379 others. I have a TEDx on the topic called Networking 00:03:34.379 --> 00:03:36.539 Made Easy. And I just figured, hey, I'm going 00:03:36.539 --> 00:03:39.319 to spread good cheer like you do in regard to 00:03:39.319 --> 00:03:42.039 the hows of networking with practical tips that 00:03:42.039 --> 00:03:44.199 people can use to really take the stigmatism 00:03:44.199 --> 00:03:48.479 and the fear out of it. Fantastic. And I can 00:03:48.479 --> 00:03:51.280 understand, first of all, I come from New York. 00:03:51.580 --> 00:03:54.960 So I understand it. I come from Rockland County. 00:03:55.000 --> 00:03:58.259 It's about 30 miles north of New York City. And 00:03:58.259 --> 00:04:00.280 I spent my life, I moved down to Georgia about 00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:03.180 seven years ago. It's a whole different life 00:04:03.180 --> 00:04:06.240 down here. But I find that the networking that 00:04:06.240 --> 00:04:09.080 you were talking about, it's true, your mother 00:04:09.080 --> 00:04:13.000 was right. Okay, to a certain point, she was 00:04:13.000 --> 00:04:15.139 to get you started to get you into the business 00:04:15.139 --> 00:04:19.060 world. But knowing what we know, it's the social 00:04:19.060 --> 00:04:23.660 activity, also keeping it in check. But that's 00:04:23.660 --> 00:04:26.220 what helps get you ahead. So let me just start 00:04:26.220 --> 00:04:29.920 off by asking. What's the most unconventional 00:04:29.920 --> 00:04:33.959 networking strategy you've ever used that actually 00:04:33.959 --> 00:04:39.019 worked? Unconventional that actually worked. 00:04:39.160 --> 00:04:46.579 I would say the most unconventional is recognizing 00:04:46.579 --> 00:04:55.279 people by doing something different about birthdays. 00:04:56.120 --> 00:04:58.699 And what I mean by that, with social media now, 00:04:58.939 --> 00:05:02.000 your birthday is everywhere. Facebook, LinkedIn, 00:05:02.399 --> 00:05:05.980 et cetera, to the point that it's almost overwhelming, 00:05:06.300 --> 00:05:08.980 right? That I can't even keep up with it all. 00:05:09.639 --> 00:05:12.459 And what I came up with, I was like, well, the 00:05:12.459 --> 00:05:16.240 field is really crowded. So I started doing these 00:05:16.240 --> 00:05:21.980 half yearly birthday acknowledgements. So if 00:05:21.980 --> 00:05:24.160 your birthday is in December, I'm reaching out 00:05:24.160 --> 00:05:27.360 to you in June and I'm saying happy half yearly 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:31.300 birthday, Michael Foreman. And when you do that, 00:05:31.399 --> 00:05:33.899 all of a sudden it's unconventional because first 00:05:33.899 --> 00:05:36.519 of all, Michael, who's doing that? So it gives 00:05:36.519 --> 00:05:40.079 you the opportunity to actually stand out. And 00:05:40.079 --> 00:05:44.899 if you can be consistent in doing that, people 00:05:44.899 --> 00:05:48.360 come to expect it. And it's a way to submit yourself 00:05:48.360 --> 00:05:52.399 into the minds of others. And then to actually 00:05:52.399 --> 00:05:55.319 help make that automatic and automated, there 00:05:55.319 --> 00:05:59.540 is this application that I use called Send Out 00:05:59.540 --> 00:06:03.579 Cards, where you can actually program it to send 00:06:03.579 --> 00:06:06.060 cards. You don't even have to think about the 00:06:06.060 --> 00:06:08.600 day. It just does it automatically for you. So 00:06:08.600 --> 00:06:11.779 I think also some people sometimes forget that 00:06:11.779 --> 00:06:14.860 networking is not just the physical, but sometimes 00:06:14.860 --> 00:06:18.120 you can use automation to help you as well. I 00:06:18.120 --> 00:06:21.079 love that you send out cards. I used handywritten 00:06:21.079 --> 00:06:25.160 .com. Okay, it's the same concept, but handywritten 00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:28.740 .com is one that I use for my thank you notes. 00:06:29.060 --> 00:06:33.180 And I always use a thank you note for every event 00:06:33.180 --> 00:06:36.980 coordinator or something else because that gives 00:06:36.980 --> 00:06:40.360 that homey touch. That's part of my follow -up 00:06:40.360 --> 00:06:43.660 that I always suggest because I have a secret 00:06:43.660 --> 00:06:46.720 sauce for the follow -up. And I tell everybody 00:06:46.720 --> 00:06:52.279 what it is. But I raise the possibility of getting 00:06:52.279 --> 00:06:56.540 a response, positive or negative. But I raised 00:06:56.540 --> 00:07:01.660 the possibility of a response to about 75%. Yeah, 00:07:01.839 --> 00:07:04.639 so it's really incredible. So we'll go over the 00:07:04.639 --> 00:07:07.100 secret sauce afterwards. Let me ask you another 00:07:07.100 --> 00:07:10.259 question. How do you recommend people overcome 00:07:10.259 --> 00:07:14.600 their initial networking anxiety or fear of rejection? 00:07:16.209 --> 00:07:20.490 Sure. This is what I tell individuals. And this 00:07:20.490 --> 00:07:23.670 can be, it's what I tell introverts, but it works 00:07:23.670 --> 00:07:28.209 for anyone. And one way to overcome the fear 00:07:28.209 --> 00:07:33.670 is to set a goal in mind. I happen to live here 00:07:33.670 --> 00:07:37.029 in St. Louis. It's a very generous region. So 00:07:37.029 --> 00:07:40.769 we have a lot of meal events, dinner events, 00:07:41.009 --> 00:07:44.209 receptions on the front end. And people always 00:07:44.209 --> 00:07:48.569 gathering. And sometimes it can be overwhelming 00:07:48.569 --> 00:07:50.670 when you see groups of people that appear to 00:07:50.670 --> 00:07:52.689 know each other that are chatting it up. And 00:07:52.689 --> 00:07:56.430 then you're like on the outside looking in. And 00:07:56.430 --> 00:07:59.350 what I tell people in that situation to take 00:07:59.350 --> 00:08:03.170 the fear out, find someone like yourself, right? 00:08:03.290 --> 00:08:06.610 So the other person that's in the room who isn't 00:08:06.610 --> 00:08:08.910 talking to someone. It's thinking the same thing 00:08:08.910 --> 00:08:10.889 you're thinking. Oh my gosh, don't want to do 00:08:10.889 --> 00:08:14.149 this. Fearful of doing this. But when you're 00:08:14.149 --> 00:08:15.970 approaching someone that's in the same situation, 00:08:16.269 --> 00:08:19.189 it's not as difficult. And I can understand how 00:08:19.189 --> 00:08:20.870 it's difficult to approach a group of people 00:08:20.870 --> 00:08:23.350 who seem user -friendly with each other. So that's 00:08:23.350 --> 00:08:26.129 one thing that I would suggest. The second thing 00:08:26.129 --> 00:08:30.550 is in these type of situations to take the fear 00:08:30.550 --> 00:08:35.450 out, give yourself a goal. Maybe that is you 00:08:35.450 --> 00:08:39.799 meet two people. three people. And that's it. 00:08:39.899 --> 00:08:43.600 And once you've done it, be done with it. And 00:08:43.600 --> 00:08:45.740 then you can just check the box and enjoy the 00:08:45.740 --> 00:08:47.840 rest of your evening the way that you want to 00:08:47.840 --> 00:08:49.940 enjoy it. But I think the important piece about 00:08:49.940 --> 00:08:54.019 that is if you focus on that two or three, then 00:08:54.019 --> 00:08:56.909 what's going to be important is what you were 00:08:56.909 --> 00:08:59.230 getting into before we were talking about handywritten 00:08:59.230 --> 00:09:02.610 .com is to make sure that you keep connected 00:09:02.610 --> 00:09:05.110 with that person somehow. We can talk about strategies 00:09:05.110 --> 00:09:08.149 to do that because once you've made that introduction, 00:09:08.230 --> 00:09:12.750 once you've broken that ice, do not be a one 00:09:12.750 --> 00:09:15.909 -hit wonder. Make that work for you. And I feel 00:09:15.909 --> 00:09:18.370 if you do that at every event, you know, you 00:09:18.370 --> 00:09:20.669 will build up a network, particularly if you 00:09:20.669 --> 00:09:23.929 follow up with them. That's very true. And I 00:09:23.929 --> 00:09:26.929 always feel that the follow -up is probably more 00:09:26.929 --> 00:09:29.929 important than even meeting the person, but it's 00:09:29.929 --> 00:09:32.470 how you follow up. So when you first approach 00:09:32.470 --> 00:09:35.409 that person in the networking event, that's like 00:09:35.409 --> 00:09:39.769 you. Think about something other than the networking 00:09:39.769 --> 00:09:43.269 event, other than, oh, something, Giselle, that's 00:09:43.269 --> 00:09:45.789 a beautiful blouse you have on. Say, oh, where'd 00:09:45.789 --> 00:09:48.289 you get that? And just break the ice that way. 00:09:48.409 --> 00:09:51.960 And you'll have a small talk, a laugh. and say, 00:09:52.039 --> 00:09:54.139 hey, who are you looking for around here? Oh, 00:09:54.159 --> 00:09:57.759 I'm just looking for X, Y, Z. You know, what 00:09:57.759 --> 00:10:00.059 do you do? And have them start talking about 00:10:00.059 --> 00:10:04.240 themselves because you and I both know that people 00:10:04.240 --> 00:10:08.379 love to talk about themselves. And I have a very, 00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:13.240 have something called F -O -R -M that I remember 00:10:13.240 --> 00:10:16.919 whenever I'm trying to build rapport with somebody. 00:10:17.519 --> 00:10:22.669 It's family, occupation. recreation, and a message. 00:10:23.169 --> 00:10:27.110 I just think of that word form. And it goes with 00:10:27.110 --> 00:10:29.090 foreman. Isn't that interesting? And it goes 00:10:29.090 --> 00:10:31.909 with foreman. That's right. So it's very easy 00:10:31.909 --> 00:10:36.809 for me to remember. Okay. So how about first 00:10:36.809 --> 00:10:40.809 impressions? What are your top tips for making 00:10:40.809 --> 00:10:44.090 a memorable first impression at networking events? 00:10:45.410 --> 00:10:48.070 So one of those, it gets back to what you're 00:10:48.070 --> 00:10:50.129 sharing that people like to talk about themselves. 00:10:50.610 --> 00:10:54.549 So one way to make an impression, if you're at 00:10:54.549 --> 00:10:57.370 an event where, because sometimes this does happen, 00:10:57.450 --> 00:10:59.590 where they give you a list of the people that 00:10:59.590 --> 00:11:02.429 are going to be there, right? So one way to make 00:11:02.429 --> 00:11:05.090 a great impression is to take that list and see 00:11:05.090 --> 00:11:06.429 if there's someone that you're interested in 00:11:06.429 --> 00:11:09.230 meeting. Then do what I call double click on 00:11:09.230 --> 00:11:12.679 that person. Go. The internet is our friend. 00:11:12.779 --> 00:11:15.419 There was a time when we didn't have this, but 00:11:15.419 --> 00:11:18.059 now that we do, use it to your advantage. So 00:11:18.059 --> 00:11:20.980 I'll go there, find out information about the 00:11:20.980 --> 00:11:22.740 people that I want to meet. So maybe I pick three 00:11:22.740 --> 00:11:26.820 or four and make sure I have their photo, look 00:11:26.820 --> 00:11:31.700 for them and introduce myself. And individuals 00:11:31.700 --> 00:11:34.860 love nothing more than to know something about 00:11:34.860 --> 00:11:37.559 them. What a way to make an impression because 00:11:37.559 --> 00:11:40.259 you've actually done some homework. So I would 00:11:40.259 --> 00:11:42.919 say that's one way to make an impression. The 00:11:42.919 --> 00:11:46.539 other is what you were saying, Michael, in terms 00:11:46.539 --> 00:11:50.080 of when you meet individuals. I like that form, 00:11:50.259 --> 00:11:53.320 the family occupation, recreation message. And 00:11:53.320 --> 00:11:56.019 what was the M for? Message. A message that you 00:11:56.019 --> 00:11:58.980 can get onto the same level as them. Correct. 00:11:59.139 --> 00:12:05.539 So what you want to do is we, surprisingly, you'd 00:12:05.539 --> 00:12:10.019 be surprised that you. very likely have something 00:12:10.019 --> 00:12:13.740 in common with the other person. It's just a 00:12:13.740 --> 00:12:16.799 matter of actually uncovering what that is. So 00:12:16.799 --> 00:12:20.320 to your point about the first impression and 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:23.399 having these, what I call conversation starters, 00:12:23.460 --> 00:12:26.039 so to speak. And one thing you have in common, 00:12:26.100 --> 00:12:29.360 you're at the same event, right? So what brought 00:12:29.360 --> 00:12:31.740 you here? So that's somewhere, something that 00:12:31.740 --> 00:12:35.159 you can talk about. I like the recreation part. 00:12:35.340 --> 00:12:39.049 What types of things do you enjoy? And once you 00:12:39.049 --> 00:12:42.490 know these things about other people, it then 00:12:42.490 --> 00:12:47.029 allows you to focus in on that thing and ask 00:12:47.029 --> 00:12:50.610 them particular questions about that. Make them 00:12:50.610 --> 00:12:53.350 know that you are sincerely and authentically 00:12:53.350 --> 00:12:56.809 interested in them as a person. I think that 00:12:56.809 --> 00:12:59.289 is a good way to make an initial impression because 00:12:59.289 --> 00:13:03.870 people will remember that. Oh, I am into working 00:13:03.870 --> 00:13:08.600 with youth and sports, for example. And if I 00:13:08.600 --> 00:13:10.039 had a conversation with you about that, you'd 00:13:10.039 --> 00:13:12.899 probably remember that. And people are being 00:13:12.899 --> 00:13:15.879 bombarded with so much information today. So 00:13:15.879 --> 00:13:18.279 in order for you to break that ice and make that 00:13:18.279 --> 00:13:20.080 impression, it needs to be something that they're 00:13:20.080 --> 00:13:22.820 going to remember. And it's more likely they're 00:13:22.820 --> 00:13:25.200 going to remember something related to something 00:13:25.200 --> 00:13:27.700 that they enjoy and that they love. And if you're 00:13:27.700 --> 00:13:30.879 on the same page. That's very good. Very astute. 00:13:30.899 --> 00:13:33.299 Very good. I have to tell you, when you brought 00:13:33.299 --> 00:13:36.669 up youth sports. That's usually what I try to 00:13:36.669 --> 00:13:39.529 get the people, depending on their age, what 00:13:39.529 --> 00:13:42.590 I get them to because I was a baseball manager 00:13:42.590 --> 00:13:46.289 for 16 years. I was an umpire for three years. 00:13:46.409 --> 00:13:49.429 I coached three years of football, basketball, 00:13:49.669 --> 00:13:53.169 because for my children, I did that. So if I 00:13:53.169 --> 00:13:56.120 can get them to the youth sports. I can have 00:13:56.120 --> 00:13:58.919 them talk all day long and I can give them something 00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:02.539 intelligent, but that's what I try to do. And 00:14:02.539 --> 00:14:05.519 one other thing that you said was you have to 00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:09.340 be authentic, right? Because what happens if 00:14:09.340 --> 00:14:13.259 you meet this person three months from now in 00:14:13.259 --> 00:14:16.419 a different environment, are you the same person? 00:14:16.940 --> 00:14:20.200 Are you as authentic? And if you're not, that 00:14:20.200 --> 00:14:22.580 just shoots you in the foot right there. And 00:14:22.580 --> 00:14:26.690 that'll, again, goes to your follow -up and how 00:14:26.690 --> 00:14:30.509 important it is and how you do it. Let's move 00:14:30.509 --> 00:14:33.070 the conversation a little bit to online marketing 00:14:33.070 --> 00:14:35.909 or online networking. How has digital networking 00:14:35.909 --> 00:14:39.350 changed the game and what are some best practices 00:14:39.350 --> 00:14:43.370 for virtual connections? So it's changed the 00:14:43.370 --> 00:14:48.169 game in that it helps you connect with people 00:14:48.169 --> 00:14:51.990 faster than you could in person in terms of like 00:14:51.990 --> 00:14:55.870 volume. So that's the plus. And it's so great 00:14:55.870 --> 00:14:58.730 you're asking me this because we just did a podcast. 00:14:58.870 --> 00:15:02.649 I'm in higher education. And at my institution, 00:15:02.889 --> 00:15:06.690 we just had a session about networking specifically 00:15:06.690 --> 00:15:08.850 related to online. So I'm so glad you're asking 00:15:08.850 --> 00:15:13.470 this question. And one way, so it changes the 00:15:13.470 --> 00:15:15.289 game in that it increases the number of people 00:15:15.289 --> 00:15:18.830 you can get to know. However, let's go back to 00:15:18.830 --> 00:15:23.570 your word authentic. Is it authentic? If you're 00:15:23.570 --> 00:15:27.649 going after quantity and you don't know the people 00:15:27.649 --> 00:15:31.370 that you're connecting to, I would suffice to 00:15:31.370 --> 00:15:34.730 say that it's not necessarily an authentic connection. 00:15:35.330 --> 00:15:39.610 And if you saw that person walking down the street, 00:15:39.809 --> 00:15:44.409 would you be able to have a dialogue, know something 00:15:44.409 --> 00:15:47.090 about them? You probably wouldn't. And I have 00:15:47.090 --> 00:15:50.370 to say, what gets my goat is this. LinkedIn is 00:15:50.370 --> 00:15:53.549 a platform that many of us use. People I subscribe, 00:15:53.789 --> 00:15:56.169 whenever you connect to someone, send them a 00:15:56.169 --> 00:15:58.610 note if you don't know who they are. Because 00:15:58.610 --> 00:16:00.450 it happens to me all the time. People will get 00:16:00.450 --> 00:16:03.230 linked. Send me a note. I say, oh, nothing. Just 00:16:03.230 --> 00:16:06.049 say connect. And then I look and I see, oh, they're 00:16:06.049 --> 00:16:08.669 connected to 20 people that I know. So in my 00:16:08.669 --> 00:16:11.730 head, I'm thinking maybe I know them, don't remember 00:16:11.730 --> 00:16:15.750 them. And I don't want to say something that 00:16:15.750 --> 00:16:18.490 might turn them off. So then I go to two or three 00:16:18.490 --> 00:16:22.129 people, shared contacts. I say, hey. Jim Smith 00:16:22.129 --> 00:16:26.330 reached out to me in LinkedIn. Tell me how you 00:16:26.330 --> 00:16:28.289 know them or how you know them. Maybe that's 00:16:28.289 --> 00:16:30.389 how I know them. And they say, oh, I don't know 00:16:30.389 --> 00:16:35.009 that person. That is not helpful at all. So I 00:16:35.009 --> 00:16:40.309 pride myself on, in LinkedIn, I would say a good 00:16:40.309 --> 00:16:43.490 95 % of the people I'm connected to, I'm going 00:16:43.490 --> 00:16:46.269 to know something about them beyond the fact 00:16:46.269 --> 00:16:48.700 that I'm connected to them. And let me tell you 00:16:48.700 --> 00:16:50.340 a secret, Michael, you can't tell everybody, 00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:52.279 but let me tell you, you and your listeners, 00:16:52.440 --> 00:16:56.279 giving you this for free. And that is what I 00:16:56.279 --> 00:17:00.360 do is I always make sure in that first LinkedIn 00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:05.859 connection that I talk about how we met. For 00:17:05.859 --> 00:17:07.339 example, I just finished teaching an executive 00:17:07.339 --> 00:17:10.019 education class earlier this week. So there were 00:17:10.019 --> 00:17:11.859 people who just linked and I remembered them. 00:17:11.940 --> 00:17:14.400 So when I responded, I accepted and I said, it 00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:18.150 was so great. having you in my inclusive leadership 00:17:18.150 --> 00:17:21.970 course in executive ed yesterday. So at least 00:17:21.970 --> 00:17:24.809 that starts with whenever I have to go back to 00:17:24.809 --> 00:17:28.809 that person, I know how we met. Then I look and 00:17:28.809 --> 00:17:32.470 see who else do we have in common? Ah, I see 00:17:32.470 --> 00:17:36.990 so -and -so. I know them this way. So just trying 00:17:36.990 --> 00:17:41.430 to further solidify. And then I often add, based 00:17:41.430 --> 00:17:46.619 on what you do, let me know. how I might be helpful. 00:17:46.839 --> 00:17:49.759 I'm in the higher ed space. I work in inclusive 00:17:49.759 --> 00:17:53.299 leadership. However, I come from corporate, Fortune 00:17:53.299 --> 00:17:56.299 250 companies, being a P &L owner where I ran 00:17:56.299 --> 00:17:58.980 businesses up to $800 million. So if there's 00:17:58.980 --> 00:18:00.960 anything that I can do to help you, let me know. 00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:03.140 Or if there's someone in my network who can be 00:18:03.140 --> 00:18:05.059 helpful to you, let me know. So it might be that. 00:18:05.200 --> 00:18:08.380 Or depending on if it's someone who I want to 00:18:08.380 --> 00:18:10.920 further advance the relationship with, I may 00:18:10.920 --> 00:18:13.660 say, how about a virtual coffee? Or how about 00:18:14.029 --> 00:18:16.150 a virtual tea, whatever your favorite daytime 00:18:16.150 --> 00:18:19.769 beverage is. So that's how I believe that the 00:18:19.769 --> 00:18:23.430 online networking kind of changes the game. But 00:18:23.430 --> 00:18:26.170 I think it's up to us. It gets you so far, but 00:18:26.170 --> 00:18:28.950 I think it's up to you to make sure that relationship 00:18:28.950 --> 00:18:32.069 is authentic and to make sure that everyone that 00:18:32.069 --> 00:18:35.349 you add to your network, that you're adding value 00:18:35.349 --> 00:18:37.930 to them as well. It's really all about a two 00:18:37.930 --> 00:18:40.410 -way relationship. Any relationship that's one 00:18:40.410 --> 00:18:45.230 way, you can't use the word relationship. That's 00:18:45.230 --> 00:18:47.930 true. And you keep going back to the follow -up 00:18:47.930 --> 00:18:51.230 of the person. And we keep stressing that the 00:18:51.230 --> 00:18:54.170 follow -up is just as important. And here's a 00:18:54.170 --> 00:18:56.589 little tip that I give my listeners probably 00:18:56.589 --> 00:18:59.769 every other podcast. But at a networking event, 00:19:00.029 --> 00:19:03.450 when you finally get their business card, on 00:19:03.450 --> 00:19:05.809 the back of their business card, write down the 00:19:05.809 --> 00:19:08.890 date, the name of the function, and something 00:19:08.890 --> 00:19:11.619 you talked about. because that will help you 00:19:11.619 --> 00:19:14.180 in your follow -up. Now, I was in the mortgage 00:19:14.180 --> 00:19:16.579 industry. I used to go to networking events. 00:19:16.700 --> 00:19:19.339 I used to come home with a shoebox filled with 00:19:19.339 --> 00:19:22.480 business cards. And I said, look how good I did. 00:19:22.700 --> 00:19:25.400 And I'm like, I didn't do well at all, okay? 00:19:25.579 --> 00:19:28.140 But now if you go to a three or four hour networking 00:19:28.140 --> 00:19:32.039 event, come home with about 15 or 20 business 00:19:32.039 --> 00:19:34.980 cards, but those are actually people you connected 00:19:34.980 --> 00:19:38.079 with that you're gonna follow up with. And when 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:40.660 you follow up using LinkedIn, I'm a big LinkedIn 00:19:40.660 --> 00:19:44.619 user, but you always find an article or something 00:19:44.619 --> 00:19:48.099 and attach it and say, look, I thought you might 00:19:48.099 --> 00:19:53.480 be interested in this. So anyway, yep. So that 00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:56.759 falls right into my next question of follow -up 00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:01.200 strategies. What's your foolproof method for 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.119 following up? after making a new connection. 00:20:04.279 --> 00:20:06.920 You went into that, but delve into it a little 00:20:06.920 --> 00:20:11.579 bit further. Sure. So this might be considered 00:20:11.579 --> 00:20:15.339 old hat, what I'm going to say I do. And I welcome 00:20:15.339 --> 00:20:19.019 you or any other listener to tell me how I can 00:20:19.019 --> 00:20:21.779 be more efficient at doing it. So what I do, 00:20:21.880 --> 00:20:24.700 because I know if I don't calendar it or write 00:20:24.700 --> 00:20:27.440 it somewhere, it's not going to happen, right? 00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:31.220 So what I do, I actually keep an Excel spreadsheet. 00:20:32.279 --> 00:20:36.559 And as I meet individuals, I create a cadence 00:20:36.559 --> 00:20:39.220 in terms of how often I'm going to get in touch 00:20:39.220 --> 00:20:42.180 with them. So say I say I'm going to touch base 00:20:42.180 --> 00:20:45.079 with this person quarterly. I'll put that in 00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:47.789 my spreadsheet. And then I'll even, when I first 00:20:47.789 --> 00:20:49.569 meet them, talk about how I'm going to do that. 00:20:49.630 --> 00:20:51.289 So therefore I don't have to think about it when 00:20:51.289 --> 00:20:54.049 the time comes. So maybe when I get in touch 00:20:54.049 --> 00:20:57.529 with them three months from now, it may be that 00:20:57.529 --> 00:21:00.750 I know something that they're interested in. 00:21:00.910 --> 00:21:02.769 And like you, and you mentioned the article, 00:21:02.869 --> 00:21:05.950 that's another thing I like to do too. Google 00:21:05.950 --> 00:21:08.269 can be your friend or any other type of search 00:21:08.269 --> 00:21:10.670 engine. And you can put in whatever that thing 00:21:10.670 --> 00:21:13.509 is. Like I had a mentor who was into like triathlons. 00:21:14.009 --> 00:21:16.430 So I would put, and he would do them all over 00:21:16.430 --> 00:21:19.349 the world. So I would actually put that into 00:21:19.349 --> 00:21:22.289 a Google search and then have it let me know 00:21:22.289 --> 00:21:24.869 about these triathlons that are going on in places 00:21:24.869 --> 00:21:27.609 around the world. And then I would just put myself 00:21:27.609 --> 00:21:30.930 a note to say, if I haven't gotten any lately, 00:21:31.109 --> 00:21:33.829 to just go online and see, are there any going 00:21:33.829 --> 00:21:35.970 on abroad? And then I can just send a note and 00:21:35.970 --> 00:21:39.210 say, hey, I see this is going on in Spain. Are 00:21:39.210 --> 00:21:42.230 you participating? So that might be the first. 00:21:42.700 --> 00:21:46.000 The second might be the half yearly birthday, 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:53.140 right? The third may be, how about you pick up 00:21:53.140 --> 00:21:57.640 the phone? I recognize that it's so easy these 00:21:57.640 --> 00:22:01.960 days to text, to email, but I do believe that 00:22:01.960 --> 00:22:04.380 nothing replaces just a voice. And even if you 00:22:04.380 --> 00:22:10.799 leave a voice note by way of text. It's a little 00:22:10.799 --> 00:22:12.319 different. So something a little bit different. 00:22:12.380 --> 00:22:14.960 Just say, hey, I was thinking about you, hadn't 00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:16.859 talked to you lately. And then maybe that fourth 00:22:16.859 --> 00:22:19.779 one is a virtual coffee. So I always just try 00:22:19.779 --> 00:22:22.859 to lay out a cadence in terms of the how. So 00:22:22.859 --> 00:22:25.539 when that time comes, I'm like, oh, what do I 00:22:25.539 --> 00:22:27.319 do? What do I say? What have I done in the past? 00:22:27.440 --> 00:22:29.680 Then I have a record also of what I have done. 00:22:31.039 --> 00:22:36.200 Have you looked at CRMs? I have, but I haven't 00:22:36.200 --> 00:22:40.339 found one that I feel is simple enough. Talk 00:22:40.339 --> 00:22:46.059 to me, Michael. I use HubSpot. OK, now they have 00:22:46.059 --> 00:22:48.420 a free version so you can get used to it and 00:22:48.420 --> 00:22:51.759 see all the makings of it. But look into HubSpot 00:22:51.759 --> 00:22:55.480 because that's what I use and it serves me pretty 00:22:55.480 --> 00:23:00.220 well. And that serves me well because of my follow 00:23:00.220 --> 00:23:03.599 up. OK, and how I follow up with the people. 00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:08.559 And it has tasks. so that I set a task. So all 00:23:08.559 --> 00:23:10.960 I do, the first thing every day is I go and I 00:23:10.960 --> 00:23:13.880 set, I see all my tasks that I have to do for 00:23:13.880 --> 00:23:16.759 that day. And it just keeps going and going. 00:23:16.880 --> 00:23:19.960 So that is one that I would strongly suggest. 00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:23.420 You heard it here first, listeners. You heard 00:23:23.420 --> 00:23:27.559 it here first. Okay, quality versus quantity. 00:23:28.599 --> 00:23:31.660 How do you balance building a large network with 00:23:31.660 --> 00:23:37.720 cultivating meaningful relationships? The word 00:23:37.720 --> 00:23:40.940 would just be intention. So I feel that if you 00:23:40.940 --> 00:23:45.500 have quantity, it's difficult to be intentional 00:23:45.500 --> 00:23:49.220 because it's too many people with which to keep 00:23:49.220 --> 00:23:53.039 up with. So the quality component comes out of 00:23:53.039 --> 00:23:55.480 the, I would call it the care and feeding that 00:23:55.480 --> 00:24:00.039 you actually give to your network by ensuring 00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.579 that they see that you see them, so to speak. 00:24:04.559 --> 00:24:09.309 Quantity. If you are going for quantity, I guess 00:24:09.309 --> 00:24:11.950 there are ways that you can make that work. So 00:24:11.950 --> 00:24:16.490 say, for example, if these individuals are all 00:24:16.490 --> 00:24:20.730 interested in a similar type of pastime, maybe 00:24:20.730 --> 00:24:24.029 something like a meetup, you know, where you 00:24:24.029 --> 00:24:27.529 invite these individuals and add others. So I 00:24:27.529 --> 00:24:30.309 think from getting at big groups, if you find 00:24:30.309 --> 00:24:33.569 something that everyone has a commonality around. 00:24:34.359 --> 00:24:36.680 and structure something around, that could be 00:24:36.680 --> 00:24:39.579 a way to get at quantity just based on a factor 00:24:39.579 --> 00:24:44.579 or two of interest. But I would suffice to say 00:24:44.579 --> 00:24:47.900 that's still a form of quality because you're 00:24:47.900 --> 00:24:52.039 actually giving them something of value. I think 00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:55.680 the quantity, I haven't seen someone, you tell 00:24:55.680 --> 00:25:00.480 me, Michael, of how you make quantity successful 00:25:00.480 --> 00:25:05.619 in terms of networking. Quantity really goes, 00:25:05.880 --> 00:25:10.380 I equate that to customers. Okay. I have three 00:25:10.380 --> 00:25:13.039 widgets. You should buy them. You bought them. 00:25:13.160 --> 00:25:16.259 That's a customer. Okay. Ever since the pandemic, 00:25:16.440 --> 00:25:20.680 we've gone to relationships rather than customers. 00:25:20.960 --> 00:25:25.380 So that's where my mortgage thing was. I came 00:25:25.380 --> 00:25:28.500 back with a shoebox full of cards. That was the 00:25:28.500 --> 00:25:33.170 quantity. Now, the quality is where I've evolved 00:25:33.170 --> 00:25:37.490 to, and that's the 15 or 20 business cards. And 00:25:37.490 --> 00:25:40.690 I think you'll get so much further when you go 00:25:40.690 --> 00:25:46.069 quality over quantity. Now, that's not for everybody, 00:25:46.250 --> 00:25:51.369 but for a very good salesperson that sells X, 00:25:51.470 --> 00:25:55.710 Y, or Z, quantity, that's perfect. But something 00:25:55.710 --> 00:25:58.910 for you and I, quality is a whole different ball 00:25:58.910 --> 00:26:01.799 of wax. Okay, let's go a little bit to personal 00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:04.920 brand. How important is personal branding in 00:26:04.920 --> 00:26:09.220 networking and how can one effectively communicate 00:26:09.220 --> 00:26:13.680 their unique value? Good one. Personal branding 00:26:13.680 --> 00:26:16.359 is also important. I think if we go back to your 00:26:16.359 --> 00:26:18.779 question before about making a memorable impression, 00:26:19.099 --> 00:26:22.039 branding is one way by which to do that. So for 00:26:22.039 --> 00:26:25.880 example, I'm admiring your tagline, building 00:26:25.880 --> 00:26:29.180 profitable connections, for example. I'm like, 00:26:29.259 --> 00:26:32.599 oh. wow, I can actually, I'll remember that, 00:26:32.700 --> 00:26:36.380 right? If I need something or a service that 00:26:36.380 --> 00:26:40.359 would align with that. I worked with a marketing 00:26:40.359 --> 00:26:43.819 company to help me with my branding. And when 00:26:43.819 --> 00:26:46.000 I think of all the things that I've done and 00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:49.400 how I combine what I do around inclusive leadership 00:26:49.400 --> 00:26:53.779 at work, pulling in this networking expert piece 00:26:53.779 --> 00:26:57.400 as well, at first I thought they were so diametrically 00:26:57.400 --> 00:26:59.700 opposed. Oh, it's two different things. And by 00:26:59.700 --> 00:27:03.180 working with a marketing person, she helped me 00:27:03.180 --> 00:27:07.400 see a way to pull it together and came up with 00:27:07.400 --> 00:27:11.539 the tagline, I make organizations hum. And I 00:27:11.539 --> 00:27:15.420 said, that's perfect because it aligns with inclusive 00:27:15.420 --> 00:27:19.140 leadership at the office. It aligns with my TEDx 00:27:19.140 --> 00:27:23.200 on networking. And it aligns with when I think 00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:26.119 about when I was in corporate and I've been like 00:27:26.119 --> 00:27:28.339 a five -time general manager running businesses. 00:27:29.150 --> 00:27:32.130 And I had a lot of success around turning around 00:27:32.130 --> 00:27:36.650 failed relationships. So I make organizations 00:27:36.650 --> 00:27:40.269 hum, fits there. You know, in higher education, 00:27:40.569 --> 00:27:43.990 I teach all about inclusive leadership, belonging. 00:27:44.390 --> 00:27:47.930 Again, that's really, it's people, right, that 00:27:47.930 --> 00:27:52.049 make organizations work. So again, I make organizations 00:27:52.049 --> 00:27:56.180 hum. When I meet individuals and they introduce 00:27:56.180 --> 00:27:57.880 themselves, I say, you know, I'm Giselle Marcus. 00:27:58.319 --> 00:28:02.819 I am in higher education. I teach around inclusive 00:28:02.819 --> 00:28:07.000 leadership. And also networking is something 00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:10.660 that along the way I've learned and have a TEDx 00:28:10.660 --> 00:28:13.759 on that topic. And really, I work at the intersection 00:28:13.759 --> 00:28:16.700 of inclusive leadership and networking, putting 00:28:16.700 --> 00:28:19.480 the two together. And my tagline is I make organizations 00:28:19.480 --> 00:28:22.059 hum. And oftentimes people say, oh, I really 00:28:22.059 --> 00:28:24.039 like that. And if you go to LinkedIn, you'll 00:28:24.039 --> 00:28:26.200 see that there as well. I think it helps you 00:28:26.200 --> 00:28:29.140 be memorable. So it's important to brand yourself. 00:28:29.359 --> 00:28:32.759 It's important to have that 30 second pitch so 00:28:32.759 --> 00:28:35.759 that people can understand what it is that you 00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:38.000 do and they can help identify how they can help 00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:41.660 you and vice versa. If they have a brand as well. 00:28:42.160 --> 00:28:45.079 That's very good. And the 30 second elevator 00:28:45.079 --> 00:28:48.640 speech. Now, when I lived in New York, I had 00:28:48.640 --> 00:28:52.049 two networking groups that I created. I created 00:28:52.049 --> 00:28:54.430 two, one in New York, one in New Jersey, and 00:28:54.430 --> 00:28:57.829 both had about 30 businesses in each. But the 00:28:57.829 --> 00:29:01.930 whole idea with that branding, with your elevator 00:29:01.930 --> 00:29:06.130 speech, is to not say the whole thing all at 00:29:06.130 --> 00:29:09.549 once. Say the first half and just make the other 00:29:09.549 --> 00:29:14.119 person say, what do you mean by that? What about 00:29:14.119 --> 00:29:16.599 that? And once you get them into the conversation, 00:29:16.940 --> 00:29:20.099 then you can expand your 30 second speech and 00:29:20.099 --> 00:29:23.400 go into further what you talk about. So that's 00:29:23.400 --> 00:29:25.799 all it is. You're just trying to grab the attention 00:29:25.799 --> 00:29:30.079 of them and have them ask you a question. Once 00:29:30.079 --> 00:29:33.359 they ask you a question, you really have them. 00:29:33.660 --> 00:29:35.759 I like that because really what you're saying 00:29:35.759 --> 00:29:37.660 is you're able then to make it more of a dialogue 00:29:37.660 --> 00:29:42.599 than a monologue. Absolutely. Absolutely. Okay. 00:29:43.460 --> 00:29:47.900 networking mistakes. You ready? Ready. What are 00:29:47.900 --> 00:29:51.299 some common networking mistakes that you've observed 00:29:51.299 --> 00:29:56.480 and how can listeners avoid them? One of them 00:29:56.480 --> 00:30:00.259 is asking people for things and you don't know 00:30:00.259 --> 00:30:03.240 them from a can of paint. And if you don't know 00:30:03.240 --> 00:30:04.599 what I mean by that, that means if you don't 00:30:04.599 --> 00:30:07.160 know the person, you probably shouldn't be asking 00:30:07.160 --> 00:30:11.240 them for a favor, right? So sometimes People 00:30:11.240 --> 00:30:14.980 have not yet done what we're talking about, developed 00:30:14.980 --> 00:30:18.519 an authentic relationship, right? So let's say, 00:30:18.559 --> 00:30:20.940 for example, someone wants to get their child 00:30:20.940 --> 00:30:25.339 into some esteemed private school, right? And 00:30:25.339 --> 00:30:28.079 you know how hard that can be, right? The list 00:30:28.079 --> 00:30:31.680 along and you meet someone who has their child 00:30:31.680 --> 00:30:35.539 at that school. You just met that person and 00:30:35.539 --> 00:30:39.740 you grab their card. and you're on the fly at 00:30:39.740 --> 00:30:43.299 a networking event, you reach out to them afterwards 00:30:43.299 --> 00:30:47.759 and you say, hey, I met you at XYZ event. Hey, 00:30:47.900 --> 00:30:49.339 I love, I know you're a kid at such and such. 00:30:49.359 --> 00:30:50.539 I'd love to get my kid in there. Can you help 00:30:50.539 --> 00:30:53.319 me with that? Do not ask people for favors when 00:30:53.319 --> 00:30:55.519 you don't know them. So I think that's a networking 00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:57.980 mistake because if you do that, I'm looking at 00:30:57.980 --> 00:31:01.480 you with one raised eyebrow. So I think that's 00:31:01.480 --> 00:31:05.140 a networking mistake. The other networking mistake. 00:31:05.710 --> 00:31:07.609 is when you're reaching out to people that you 00:31:07.609 --> 00:31:11.269 don't know, if you don't give them a reason to 00:31:11.269 --> 00:31:15.069 grab onto why they should be interested, I think 00:31:15.069 --> 00:31:17.829 that's a flaw. If you're going to connect with 00:31:17.829 --> 00:31:20.089 someone, tell them why. And it could just be 00:31:20.089 --> 00:31:23.490 something complimentary. Hey, I see that you 00:31:23.490 --> 00:31:27.450 and I have a commonality in terms of we like 00:31:27.450 --> 00:31:32.170 purple elephants. Give them something. I saw 00:31:32.170 --> 00:31:35.440 you speak at. And I thought what you had to say 00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:39.599 was amazing. Give them something. So those are 00:31:39.599 --> 00:31:42.599 the two, what I would call, no, I add one more, 00:31:42.700 --> 00:31:46.779 three, the threesome here. The third one is just 00:31:46.779 --> 00:31:50.359 trying to collect as many contacts as you can. 00:31:51.140 --> 00:31:55.319 This speed dating, I would call it, right? Speed 00:31:55.319 --> 00:31:57.920 dating where you're just gathering information, 00:31:58.119 --> 00:32:01.279 but you're not doing anything with it. And then. 00:32:01.720 --> 00:32:04.000 Six months later, you decide that you're going 00:32:04.000 --> 00:32:06.480 to open the shoebox with all these cards in it, 00:32:06.500 --> 00:32:08.740 not knowing how you know this person and just 00:32:08.740 --> 00:32:11.000 aimlessly reach out to them, not knowing how 00:32:11.000 --> 00:32:13.640 you met them. So I think those are three fatal 00:32:13.640 --> 00:32:18.180 flaws of networking. Michael. Very good. There 00:32:18.180 --> 00:32:21.019 are so many points in all of those mistakes. 00:32:21.609 --> 00:32:24.809 which I've made. Okay. I've made all of those 00:32:24.809 --> 00:32:27.269 same mistakes and I've learned from them and 00:32:27.269 --> 00:32:29.890 I've learned what not to do, but there is so 00:32:29.890 --> 00:32:33.289 much I can't even go into it now. But we're going 00:32:33.289 --> 00:32:36.650 to save the listeners time, right? Save the listeners 00:32:36.650 --> 00:32:39.890 time. Okay. Because there's way too much for 00:32:39.890 --> 00:32:43.369 me to say. Can you share a specific example of 00:32:43.369 --> 00:32:45.930 how networking led to a significant professional 00:32:45.930 --> 00:32:51.200 milestone for you or a client? I can. So this 00:32:51.200 --> 00:32:54.740 is, yes, this is wow. Every time I think about 00:32:54.740 --> 00:32:58.099 it, I get goosebumps. So when I was working at 00:32:58.099 --> 00:33:00.680 Johnson Controls, I was a general manager and 00:33:00.680 --> 00:33:04.440 I was so interested in, I wanted to work abroad 00:33:04.440 --> 00:33:06.740 because I had an interest to be a general manager 00:33:06.740 --> 00:33:10.019 running like a large global business. But I knew 00:33:10.019 --> 00:33:11.859 my company wasn't going to allow me to do that 00:33:11.859 --> 00:33:14.460 if I could not evidence that I'm able to work 00:33:14.460 --> 00:33:17.980 outside of my home country successfully. So we 00:33:17.980 --> 00:33:19.940 went through this whole diatribe where they were 00:33:19.940 --> 00:33:21.900 like, hey, you're going to London. It was like, 00:33:21.900 --> 00:33:24.099 you're going to Egypt. And both of those things 00:33:24.099 --> 00:33:25.740 fell apart. Then, hey, you're going to South 00:33:25.740 --> 00:33:28.880 Africa. And that one actually stuck. So I was 00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:31.200 like, okay, great. But what I started thinking 00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:33.160 about was, and this was supposed to be a year 00:33:33.160 --> 00:33:36.859 to 18 months. So I was curious about, okay, so 00:33:36.859 --> 00:33:39.180 I have to give up the role that I'm in now to 00:33:39.180 --> 00:33:42.579 take on this role. So that's one thing. But when 00:33:42.579 --> 00:33:47.420 I get back. How would I be edged back into a 00:33:47.420 --> 00:33:49.200 role? Because clearly I can't go back to what 00:33:49.200 --> 00:33:51.220 I'm leaving because they're going to put someone 00:33:51.220 --> 00:33:53.880 else in this role and they're not going to say, 00:33:53.920 --> 00:33:55.240 hey, we're just going to keep your seat warm 00:33:55.240 --> 00:33:57.279 while you're gone. So I was just curious. I went 00:33:57.279 --> 00:33:59.220 to my HR person. I said, how would I go about 00:33:59.220 --> 00:34:03.079 finding, getting reoriented back into the company? 00:34:03.359 --> 00:34:05.140 I said, because I'm a little concerned about 00:34:05.140 --> 00:34:07.000 that, but I wouldn't want to say that out loud 00:34:07.000 --> 00:34:08.599 to too many people. So I was hoping and saying 00:34:08.599 --> 00:34:11.159 that to the HR person. She would give me some 00:34:11.159 --> 00:34:13.320 nuggets that I could hold on to. And her answer 00:34:13.320 --> 00:34:15.000 was, she said, you probably need to talk to Ian 00:34:15.000 --> 00:34:18.139 Campbell. And Ian Campbell was this amazing leader 00:34:18.139 --> 00:34:20.159 in my business who reported to our business unit 00:34:20.159 --> 00:34:21.940 president. He was the person that signed off 00:34:21.940 --> 00:34:24.519 on all the expat assignments. I came to know 00:34:24.519 --> 00:34:27.760 him because he was the sponsor of one of our 00:34:27.760 --> 00:34:30.280 employee resource groups. So I knew of him just 00:34:30.280 --> 00:34:32.039 that way. She said, well, go talk to him. She 00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:33.639 said, he can probably give you some advice. So 00:34:33.639 --> 00:34:36.239 now I'm like, how do I ask this question? Because 00:34:36.239 --> 00:34:39.019 I don't want him to think that. I don't know. 00:34:39.039 --> 00:34:40.579 I just didn't want it to be negative. I didn't 00:34:40.579 --> 00:34:42.840 want him to feel that I was worried, though I 00:34:42.840 --> 00:34:46.159 was worried. And he's very high in the pecking 00:34:46.159 --> 00:34:49.000 order in the company. So I go and I meet with 00:34:49.000 --> 00:34:52.460 him and I tell him about where I'm going. And 00:34:52.460 --> 00:34:54.219 he's like, yeah, I know. I'm excited because 00:34:54.219 --> 00:34:56.659 South Africa is one of, he's from the UK. And 00:34:56.659 --> 00:34:58.280 he said South Africa is one of the favorite places 00:34:58.280 --> 00:35:00.980 for him and his wife. So that was a good opportunity 00:35:00.980 --> 00:35:03.920 to have some great dialogue. So then I said to 00:35:03.920 --> 00:35:05.400 him, I said, yeah, I said, I was thinking about 00:35:05.400 --> 00:35:08.079 when I get back. How's the best way for me to 00:35:08.079 --> 00:35:09.800 position myself? I said, I think about companies 00:35:09.800 --> 00:35:12.780 like GE because traditionally a GE would tell 00:35:12.780 --> 00:35:15.420 you you're going to have this role. Then you're 00:35:15.420 --> 00:35:17.199 going to have this role. They can give you two 00:35:17.199 --> 00:35:19.880 or three roles forward. And in my organization, 00:35:20.019 --> 00:35:21.760 we didn't necessarily do that. I said, so what 00:35:21.760 --> 00:35:23.739 would you advise? I said, because I want to make 00:35:23.739 --> 00:35:25.739 sure that I position myself well when I return. 00:35:25.860 --> 00:35:29.139 He said, so glad you asked. And he told me a 00:35:29.139 --> 00:35:31.840 story, Michael, of someone talking about mistakes. 00:35:32.280 --> 00:35:34.500 He told me about someone who went on an expat 00:35:34.500 --> 00:35:38.860 assignment for three years. to Europe, came back 00:35:38.860 --> 00:35:43.280 three years later. Leadership had changed. People 00:35:43.280 --> 00:35:46.679 had pretty much forgot that he was away. So they 00:35:46.679 --> 00:35:50.039 had to scramble around when he got back to find 00:35:50.039 --> 00:35:52.300 him something. He had to wait until something 00:35:52.300 --> 00:35:54.019 was found. So it was somewhat uncomfortable. 00:35:54.139 --> 00:35:55.960 And I was like, oh my gosh, I really don't want 00:35:55.960 --> 00:35:59.239 that. So I said, how can I avoid that? So he 00:35:59.239 --> 00:36:01.340 said, what you should do, he said, because it's 00:36:01.340 --> 00:36:04.159 really, things change quickly. He says, you want 00:36:04.159 --> 00:36:08.000 to keep yourself in front of leaders. He said, 00:36:08.059 --> 00:36:10.599 so come back every quarter and make sure that 00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:13.820 you talk to your mentors and your sponsors. He 00:36:13.820 --> 00:36:16.179 said, then he said, of which I will be one. So 00:36:16.179 --> 00:36:18.820 he gave me the opportunity for him to be a sponsor, 00:36:18.940 --> 00:36:21.039 which is amazing. That's a whole nother podcast, 00:36:21.380 --> 00:36:24.760 right? So I said, okay, I'm going to do that. 00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:28.460 So I did what he asked me to do. And then I knew 00:36:28.460 --> 00:36:31.260 back to networking. He's someone that loves, 00:36:31.500 --> 00:36:35.000 he's a triathlete. And every time, and then he 00:36:35.000 --> 00:36:36.860 loves South Africa. So every time I would come 00:36:36.860 --> 00:36:38.860 back every quarter, I would bring him something 00:36:38.860 --> 00:36:42.619 like a water bottle about South Africa. FIFA 00:36:42.619 --> 00:36:45.739 was in South Africa the year I was there. So 00:36:45.739 --> 00:36:47.280 I brought him like a t -shirt back from that. 00:36:47.340 --> 00:36:49.500 So just things that would resonate with him. 00:36:50.039 --> 00:36:52.719 And he was reminding me, he said, then when you 00:36:52.719 --> 00:36:55.900 get, when you know six months in advance, when 00:36:55.900 --> 00:36:57.980 you're coming back, let me know. He said, because 00:36:57.980 --> 00:37:00.579 we need to start thinking about roles for you. 00:37:00.599 --> 00:37:01.980 He says, a lot of times we'll have things in 00:37:01.980 --> 00:37:04.010 incubation. And we can start saying, hey, we 00:37:04.010 --> 00:37:05.849 know Giselle's coming back. So I said, okay, 00:37:05.889 --> 00:37:08.409 great. So I did all the things he asked me to 00:37:08.409 --> 00:37:09.570 do. So that's the other thing I would say in 00:37:09.570 --> 00:37:11.750 relationships, follow people's instructions, 00:37:11.989 --> 00:37:15.369 right? When they give them to you. And what happened, 00:37:15.389 --> 00:37:18.349 Michael, was amazing. I was concerned about having 00:37:18.349 --> 00:37:21.030 a single job when I got back. I actually had 00:37:21.030 --> 00:37:27.250 11 internal offers for roles. That's nice. That's 00:37:27.250 --> 00:37:30.510 very nice. And it's so much more comforting when 00:37:30.510 --> 00:37:32.630 you know you have something to come back to. 00:37:32.989 --> 00:37:35.909 Correct. Because you can very quickly, especially 00:37:35.909 --> 00:37:38.050 in the corporate world, you can be forgotten 00:37:38.050 --> 00:37:41.469 about. And you don't want that ever to happen. 00:37:41.630 --> 00:37:46.550 So very quickly, give me three actionable steps 00:37:46.550 --> 00:37:49.969 our listeners can take today to improve their 00:37:49.969 --> 00:37:52.010 networking skills. Give me three quick ones. 00:37:52.269 --> 00:37:56.829 Sure. So the first one I would say is. make a 00:37:56.829 --> 00:38:01.829 plan in terms of how you are going to follow 00:38:01.829 --> 00:38:05.309 up with your network, your general plan, how 00:38:05.309 --> 00:38:07.250 are you going to make it happen? I would start 00:38:07.250 --> 00:38:11.070 with that. Second of all, I would think about 00:38:11.070 --> 00:38:16.909 what is your goal or goals so that you can then 00:38:16.909 --> 00:38:20.280 start to think about Where can I find individuals 00:38:20.280 --> 00:38:24.119 that can assist me on this journey? That might 00:38:24.119 --> 00:38:29.300 be organizations, that might be different geographies, 00:38:29.340 --> 00:38:33.659 et cetera. And number three, I would say, begin 00:38:33.659 --> 00:38:36.940 to think about the network you already have. 00:38:37.179 --> 00:38:39.639 So for example, if you have an undergraduate 00:38:39.639 --> 00:38:43.119 degree, those alum, that's a network for you. 00:38:43.389 --> 00:38:46.269 Think about networks that are already easy for 00:38:46.269 --> 00:38:49.349 you to actually get into. It could be if you 00:38:49.349 --> 00:38:54.590 are in a, for example, I am in like a National 00:38:54.590 --> 00:38:56.489 Black MBA Association, for example, and they 00:38:56.489 --> 00:38:58.090 have 33 different chapters around the country. 00:38:58.449 --> 00:39:01.590 So if I wanted to expand knowing people in that 00:39:01.590 --> 00:39:05.590 industry, in a particular segment, I could use 00:39:05.590 --> 00:39:08.429 that organization. So use what you already have 00:39:08.429 --> 00:39:15.469 first. That is absolutely fantastic. You are 00:39:15.469 --> 00:39:19.389 such a great guest. Giselle, if somebody wanted 00:39:19.389 --> 00:39:22.909 to get hold of you, either for a talking speech, 00:39:23.230 --> 00:39:26.889 even for you to coach them, how would they get 00:39:26.889 --> 00:39:29.690 hold of you? Sure. You can find me on LinkedIn 00:39:29.690 --> 00:39:35.070 at Giselle Marcus, G -I -S -E -L -E Marcus, M 00:39:35.070 --> 00:39:38.309 -A -R -C -U -S. And I also have a website, www 00:39:38.309 --> 00:39:43.969 .gisellemarcus .com. On Facebook, I am IamGiselleMarcus. 00:39:44.230 --> 00:39:47.849 See you there. All right. That's good. Giselle, 00:39:47.989 --> 00:39:50.590 I'll speak with you soon. Look forward to it, 00:39:50.650 --> 00:39:52.550 Michael. Thanks for having me. This was awesome. 00:39:53.710 --> 00:39:56.889 Well, hold on, folks. Don't go anywhere. Let 00:39:56.889 --> 00:39:59.050 me just read a few of our sponsors that we have. 00:39:59.889 --> 00:40:02.429 Struggling to reach success? Maybe it's time 00:40:02.429 --> 00:40:06.539 to quit. In Quit Your Way to Success. by Rodney 00:40:06.539 --> 00:40:10.420 Davis. This reveals 27 steps to breaking bad 00:40:10.420 --> 00:40:13.480 habits that hold you back. This powerful book 00:40:13.480 --> 00:40:17.199 helps you rewire your mindset, take control of 00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:19.980 your actions, and turn setbacks into stepping 00:40:19.980 --> 00:40:23.159 stones. With real -life examples, motivational 00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:27.219 quotes, and actionable lessons, especially for 00:40:27.219 --> 00:40:29.460 sales professionals, you'll gain the tools to 00:40:29.460 --> 00:40:32.760 quit what's stopping you and start winning. Transform 00:40:32.760 --> 00:40:36.050 your future today. So Quit Your Way to Success 00:40:36.050 --> 00:40:40.969 by Rodney Davis, available now on Amazon. And 00:40:40.969 --> 00:40:44.570 this is a nonprofit called Revved Up Kids. This 00:40:44.570 --> 00:40:47.829 is something I believe in wholeheartedly. Revved 00:40:47.829 --> 00:40:51.010 Up Kids is on a mission to protect children and 00:40:51.010 --> 00:40:54.849 teens from sexual abuse, exploitation, and trafficking. 00:40:55.090 --> 00:40:57.750 They provide prevention training programs for 00:40:57.750 --> 00:41:01.420 children. teens, and adults. To learn more, go 00:41:01.420 --> 00:41:06.280 to revvedupkids .org. That's R -E -V -V -E -D 00:41:06.280 --> 00:41:12.019 -U -P -K -I -D -S .org. A huge thank you to our 00:41:12.019 --> 00:41:14.699 guests for sharing such incredible insights today. 00:41:15.000 --> 00:41:18.460 And of course, a big shout out to you, our amazing 00:41:18.460 --> 00:41:21.480 listeners, for tuning in and spending your time 00:41:21.480 --> 00:41:24.579 with us. If you're interested in my digital courses, 00:41:25.309 --> 00:41:27.710 being coached, or having me come and talk to 00:41:27.710 --> 00:41:31.170 your company, just go to Michael and fill out 00:41:31.170 --> 00:41:34.690 the request form. Remember, networking isn't 00:41:34.690 --> 00:41:37.409 about being perfect. It's about being present. 00:41:37.829 --> 00:41:40.570 So take what you've learned today, get out there, 00:41:40.670 --> 00:41:43.690 and make some meaningful connections. If you've 00:41:43.690 --> 00:41:46.429 enjoyed this episode, please don't forget to 00:41:46.429 --> 00:41:49.630 subscribe. Leave us a review and share it with 00:41:49.630 --> 00:41:51.949 someone who could use a little networking inspiration. 00:41:52.769 --> 00:41:55.840 Let's keep the conversation going. You can find 00:41:55.840 --> 00:42:00.179 me on Apple, Spotify, Pandora, YouTube, or my 00:42:00.179 --> 00:42:04.079 website, foreman .com slash podcasts.