WEBVTT

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I didn't really know what I was gonna do with

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my life. It just didn't feel like I was gonna

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have a very bright future. So in high school,

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I decided pretty early on that I wasn't gonna

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go to college. It just didn't know what I wanted

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to do with my life. It didn't make sense to pay

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somebody thousands of dollars to help me try

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to figure it out. So I'll just, I'll go out on

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my own and I'll figure it out. What struggles

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did you feel like you gave up when when things

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kind of turned for you? What struggles that I

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give up in terms of like not having them anymore

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not having them yet. Oh, man One I think one

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was I gave up the not all of it, but a big piece

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of the fear of judgment mm -hmm that was I had

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I had become accustomed to a certain level of

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Lifestyle, but not even that a certain level

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of reputation that I was afraid to lose I would

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say listen to the voice that's trying to extend

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you not to contract you So I think all resilience

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in general is pushing through pain discomfort

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and uncertainty Mm -hmm mental resilience is

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pushing through mental pain mental discomfort

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and mental uncertainty. It's the same thing.

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It's the same You have to put yourself in places

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where you don't know if you can hang to a constructive

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amount. How can entrepreneurs start building

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impact today, even if they have no audience or

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no capital or little experience? You're not going

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to like the answer if you're out there and you're

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an entrepreneur. It's going to be opposite to

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what most people are telling you. What if the

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darkest moment of your life was the doorway to

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everything you were meant to become? From rock

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bottom to building a global mission rooted in

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purpose, today's guests turned pain into power

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and never looked back. This is the journey of

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Kevin Palmieri. Hey family, this is the Throg

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Word Journey. Look. Life's too short to just

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get by. And 2025 is the year to persist. We're

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here to grow, build, and thrive. This podcast

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is all about powerful stories, real talk, and

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practical steps to help you level up in every

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area of your life. Now, if that sounds like something

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you need, don't just watch. Be a part of the

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journey. Let us know you're here. Do us a favor.

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If you're listening on the podcast platform,

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download the episode. And if you're watching

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on YouTube, You know what to do hit that like

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button subscribe and turn on those notifications

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So you never miss an episode and as we always

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say Let's make thriving our new norm What if

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the moment you wanted to end your life was actually

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the beginning of your greatest purpose. On today's

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episode of The Thravo Journey, we're sitting

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down with Kevin Plamary. He's the co -founder

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of Next Level University, a global top 100 self

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-improvement podcast with over 2 ,000 episodes

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and millions of listeners worldwide. And so after

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hitting rock bottom and nearly ending it all,

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Kevin made some radical choices, you know, like

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to live with purpose, build with heart and hustle.

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without BS, right? So now he's a seven figure

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entrepreneur and transformational speaker. He's

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here to share how pain, purpose, and consistency

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can change everything. So this one's for every

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dreamer, striver, and soul that's searching for

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your next level. So let's go and let's get into

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it with Kevin. Kevin, nice to have you here,

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man. Michael, I appreciate you having me. Thank

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you for the wonderful introduction. Hopefully

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I can live up to a percentage of it. That's the

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goal. You will. And I know we talked about your

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partner, Alan Lazarus, and he was on, and if

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he's a preamble to the next stage, you, I think

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it's going to be a great conversation. I hope

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so. I look forward to it very much. Yeah. So

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before we get into it, I always like to know

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what's on your mind or your heart that you've

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been kind of thinking about, what's been percolating

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your thoughts that you want to share. with the

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world. Yeah. I feel like if you are an entrepreneur,

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if you are a dream chaser, if you are a business

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owner, your mental health should probably be

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as much, if not more of a focus than anything

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else. Yeah. That I've, it has just been a heavy

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season of growth and with growth comes feedback

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and with feedback comes shame and triggers and

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fight, flight, freeze, fawn. So I'm in this deep

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understanding that entrepreneurship is, it's

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great and there's so much opportunity, but it

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is, I mean, it's going to do stuff to you that

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you might not be prepared for yet. Yeah. There's

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a huge level of growth, um, uncomfortability

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and some soul checking and searching in that,

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in that journey. Yeah. Yeah, and before we actually

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get to where you are now, I want to kind of go

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back to kind of like your origin story, right?

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You talked about how you you found rock bottom,

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but that rock bottom had a basement. And that's,

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I found that very interesting, because many people,

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and I'll put myself in there found a rock bottom,

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right? And Sometimes that rock bottom has a basement.

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So you go you go even lower. Can you talk about

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that? Of course. Yeah, yeah. So just for context,

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was raised by my mom and my grandmother. Didn't

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know my dad didn't meet my dad with the understanding

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that he was my dad until I was 27. So grew up

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lower middle class did not have a lot of money.

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It didn't seem like I had a lot of options. I

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didn't have a lot of guidance. I didn't really

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know what I was going to do with my life. I It

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just didn't feel like I was going to have a very

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bright future. So in high school, I decided pretty

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early on that I wasn't going to go to college.

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It just didn't know what I wanted to do with

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my life. It didn't make sense to pay somebody

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thousands of dollars to help me try to figure

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it out. So I'll just I'll go out on my own and

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I'll figure it out. Yeah. So I got a job at the

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local gas station. That was my first big boy

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job I ever had. And then from there, Michael,

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I just went on a journey of just job hopping.

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So gas station attendant, I was a personal trainer,

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truck driver, forklift operator, cleaned bathrooms

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and floors at a hospital overnight. I did tiling.

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I did construction. I did HVAC. I did a bunch

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of stuff. You're hustling. I was hustling. I

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was hustling. And I think a lot of it was because

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I just never thought I was going to be successful.

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So I was always looking for the next thing that

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might make me more successful. Eventually, I

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got a job in an industry called weatherization.

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All that means is you go into buildings and it's

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your job to make them more energy efficient.

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So you're working in attics, windows, doors,

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that type of stuff. Okay. I went from making

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$15 an hour as a construction laborer to $50

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an hour on my first job with this company. In

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my mind, Michael, I made it. Here we go. You

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probably like I hit it. That was it. It was like

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Oh my goodness, all of the suffering and all

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of the sacrifice and all of the sleepless nights

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and limiting beliefs have led me to this. This

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is the new chapter. I'm going to be successful

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now. So fast forward a couple of years. I still

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have this job. I have a girlfriend who's a model.

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I have a brand new apartment. I'm living with

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her getting ready to compete in a bodybuilding

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show. So I'm quite literally in the best shape

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I will ever be. And I went on to win my class

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for that bodybuilding show. Nice, nice car, great

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friends, all the stuff you could ever want. One

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day, she sits me down after my bodybuilding show.

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And she says, I'm leaving. Oh, you're depressed,

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you're anxious, you aren't nearly as supportive

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of my goals and dreams as I need someone to be.

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And I'm going to go do my thing. I'm gonna go

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chase my dreams. And she was right. She was right

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with saying all that. Yeah, the thing that really,

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for me was rock bottom was she said, I'm telling

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you this, not because I want to hurt you, but

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because I want you to know, I was going to leave

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you a month ago, but I thought you might kill

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yourself. Oh, and I remember thinking, Oh, my

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God, how did we get here? How did we get here?

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I felt like I was fine. Yeah. So that was my

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initial rock bottom. Then work got slow. I had

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an eating disorder from my bodybuilding show.

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So now I'm kind of like broke again, and my hormones

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are all messed up and I have an eating disorder.

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It's like, what is happening here? How did we

00:09:21.139 --> 00:09:23.519
get even further? How do we continue to go down?

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I fell into the trap that I think a lot of people

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fall into. I said, Well, I just got to go make

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a boatload of money and then all these problems

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will just dissolve. So the next year I got a

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promotion at my job. I proceeded to spend the

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next 10 months living on the road because all

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of our contracts were in other states. Get to

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the end of the year. And I remember I opened

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up my final pay stub of the year and I made $100

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,000 at 26 with no college degree. And this was

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2017. $100 ,000 went a lot further in 2017. That

00:09:55.830 --> 00:09:57.409
was actually good. That was really good money

00:09:57.409 --> 00:10:00.389
back then. Today won't go too far. Yeah, it doesn't

00:10:00.389 --> 00:10:03.289
go as far today, unfortunately. But I remember

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thinking to myself after I opened up my pay stub,

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I don't feel any different internally. I'm still

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insecure. I'm still self conscious. I'm still

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depressed. I'm still anxious. I feel like I've

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lived most of my life, unconsciously. The opposite

00:10:20.940 --> 00:10:23.879
of unconscious is hyper conscious. So I did what

00:10:23.879 --> 00:10:25.980
any young man would do. I started a podcast called

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hyper conscious podcast. That was the next logical

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step. It made sense. So I did that. fell in love

00:10:32.820 --> 00:10:36.860
with podcasting. As I started to loathe my job.

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The reason I liked my job is because I liked

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the money. I did not like what I was doing. I

00:10:42.539 --> 00:10:44.500
didn't like traveling. I wasn't passionate about

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it. I didn't find purpose in it. Yeah. So I start

00:10:47.340 --> 00:10:49.659
calling out of work. I start leaving the job

00:10:49.659 --> 00:10:53.740
sites early showing up late. Every time I would

00:10:53.740 --> 00:10:56.039
be packing my bag to leave for the week, I would

00:10:56.039 --> 00:10:59.059
be depressed and anxious and homesick and it

00:10:59.059 --> 00:11:03.690
just It kept getting worse Rock bottom basement

00:11:03.690 --> 00:11:06.610
moment. I woke up in a hotel room getting ready

00:11:06.610 --> 00:11:09.370
for work one morning Alarm clock went off. I

00:11:09.370 --> 00:11:12.429
sat up slid to the edge of the bed and the best

00:11:12.429 --> 00:11:14.409
way to explain it Michael is there's ten televisions

00:11:14.409 --> 00:11:17.330
on in my head at the same time and Every single

00:11:17.330 --> 00:11:20.690
one is on a different station. Mmm You're stuck

00:11:20.690 --> 00:11:24.429
here forever You got lucky remember things were

00:11:24.429 --> 00:11:26.129
trending down and then you got this opportunity.

00:11:26.129 --> 00:11:29.470
Do not mess this up Do not mess this up. Yeah

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If you ever left, what would your friends say?

00:11:32.240 --> 00:11:34.059
You make more money than any of your friends.

00:11:34.139 --> 00:11:36.659
A lot of significance there. What would your

00:11:36.659 --> 00:11:38.940
family say? You make more money than anybody

00:11:38.940 --> 00:11:40.799
in your family and your family is super proud

00:11:40.799 --> 00:11:44.240
of you. And do you really think this podcast

00:11:44.240 --> 00:11:46.460
thing is gonna pan out? That's where we're gonna

00:11:46.460 --> 00:11:49.360
go. And it was in that moment where I thought

00:11:49.360 --> 00:11:51.019
to myself, well, if I was just to take my life,

00:11:51.039 --> 00:11:53.980
I would take all my problems with me. And that

00:11:53.980 --> 00:11:57.139
was the rock bottom basement. There is really

00:11:57.139 --> 00:12:00.840
nowhere lower to go from there. Yeah, luckily.

00:12:01.860 --> 00:12:04.940
I reached out to Alan and Alan gave me some really

00:12:04.940 --> 00:12:07.860
good advice and some support and some perspective

00:12:07.860 --> 00:12:10.679
and I saw the light at the end of the tunnel

00:12:10.679 --> 00:12:12.980
at the job. I stayed there for I don't know two

00:12:12.980 --> 00:12:16.120
or three more months and then I ended up leaving

00:12:16.120 --> 00:12:18.379
and then him and I partnered up and we've been

00:12:18.379 --> 00:12:22.600
doing this full time since 2018. That's where

00:12:22.600 --> 00:12:25.039
you guys connected Lex next level you and all

00:12:25.039 --> 00:12:27.840
that came up before that. What was the thing

00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:30.639
that because there are many people that go through

00:12:30.639 --> 00:12:34.220
that basement of rock bottom right where they

00:12:34.220 --> 00:12:36.440
feel like they they have nothing to live for

00:12:36.440 --> 00:12:39.799
but the 10 TVs on and the head and all that different

00:12:39.799 --> 00:12:43.919
stations and there's no clarity there right you

00:12:43.919 --> 00:12:47.379
had a you had your boy Alan who reached out to

00:12:47.379 --> 00:12:48.860
you or you reach out to him and he was there

00:12:48.860 --> 00:12:50.960
for you uh what would you say to say to say to

00:12:50.960 --> 00:12:52.559
somebody that's in that space right now that's

00:12:52.559 --> 00:12:55.179
listening and like and they won't reach out to

00:12:55.179 --> 00:12:57.720
somebody because not everybody does that This

00:12:57.720 --> 00:12:59.539
is always the part I have a lot of trouble with

00:12:59.539 --> 00:13:02.379
because the analogy I always use is you have

00:13:02.379 --> 00:13:04.299
to build the umbrella long before the storm.

00:13:05.460 --> 00:13:07.740
It's really hard to be in the storm and then

00:13:07.740 --> 00:13:10.639
imagine building an umbrella. So I would give

00:13:10.639 --> 00:13:13.620
two pieces. One piece I would give is if right

00:13:13.620 --> 00:13:18.279
now life is going great, be vulnerable with the

00:13:18.279 --> 00:13:20.679
people around you because you never know if they're

00:13:20.679 --> 00:13:22.259
going to need you and you never know if you're

00:13:22.259 --> 00:13:26.559
going to need them. That's one. The second one

00:13:26.559 --> 00:13:29.639
is, if you haven't built the umbrellas yet, and

00:13:29.639 --> 00:13:34.879
you're in that moment, who is out there that

00:13:34.879 --> 00:13:39.360
you feel like might just listen? Who is out there

00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:42.500
that you feel won't judge you? Maybe they don't

00:13:42.500 --> 00:13:45.600
have advice necessarily, but maybe they are a

00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:48.320
shoulder that you can lean on momentarily to

00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:50.720
get your bearings and to get new perspective.

00:13:51.059 --> 00:13:53.950
I think that's a piece of it. And I think the

00:13:53.950 --> 00:13:57.389
other piece of it is so much of what I was dealing

00:13:57.389 --> 00:13:59.789
with in that moment was just it was emotions.

00:14:01.169 --> 00:14:05.389
A lot of it wasn't logical. Yeah. If I would

00:14:05.389 --> 00:14:08.049
have maybe tried to sit on it and think about

00:14:08.049 --> 00:14:10.429
it and sleep on it for a day, I'm sure a lot

00:14:10.429 --> 00:14:13.490
of those feelings might have subsided. But to

00:14:13.490 --> 00:14:15.490
your point, unfortunately, I think we get to

00:14:15.490 --> 00:14:18.529
a place where it seems like it's real and it

00:14:18.529 --> 00:14:21.769
seems like there's no other answers. All of that

00:14:21.769 --> 00:14:24.090
and this is always something I say because this

00:14:24.090 --> 00:14:26.710
changed my perspective on that forever We interviewed

00:14:26.710 --> 00:14:30.889
somebody one time named Kevin Hines Kevin is

00:14:30.889 --> 00:14:34.110
one of the rare People who jumped off the Golden

00:14:34.110 --> 00:14:38.710
Gate Bridge and survived well Yeah, that's why

00:14:38.710 --> 00:14:42.190
perspective perspective He jumped off the Golden

00:14:42.190 --> 00:14:43.769
Gate Bridge with the intention of taking his

00:14:43.769 --> 00:14:48.629
life He said the second my foot left the railing.

00:14:48.629 --> 00:14:53.500
I regretted it You know, I'm willing to bet Unfortunately

00:14:53.500 --> 00:14:57.340
or yeah, unfortunately, that's what many people

00:14:57.340 --> 00:14:59.840
feel but most people aren't able to tell us that

00:14:59.840 --> 00:15:02.740
mm -hmm I always share that with the fact that

00:15:02.740 --> 00:15:06.100
this person felt that way He did the thing that

00:15:06.100 --> 00:15:09.440
he thought he was Needing to do and he regretted

00:15:09.440 --> 00:15:12.100
it. I Feel like they probably would have been

00:15:12.100 --> 00:15:14.019
the same for me. I would have regretted it too,

00:15:14.179 --> 00:15:15.940
right? I would have regretted it and I think

00:15:15.940 --> 00:15:19.299
most people do so I share that as perspective,

00:15:19.539 --> 00:15:22.039
as I don't necessarily have a great answer, but

00:15:22.039 --> 00:15:25.059
I do think perspective is helpful. Yeah, perspective

00:15:25.059 --> 00:15:32.919
does initiate, it initiates change. And, and

00:15:32.919 --> 00:15:37.139
everything really, I just can't imagine, wow,

00:15:37.259 --> 00:15:40.899
like jumping off a bridge, that moment regretted

00:15:40.899 --> 00:15:43.480
it, and then actually being able to tell the

00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:48.460
story afterwards. It was one of the most proud

00:15:48.460 --> 00:15:50.539
profound things I've ever heard in my entire

00:15:50.539 --> 00:15:54.460
life. Yeah, I can't imagine I'm I've been across

00:15:54.460 --> 00:15:58.059
that bridge and it's it's huge. You know what

00:15:58.059 --> 00:16:02.460
I mean? And I'm good with you know, driving on

00:16:02.460 --> 00:16:06.279
it and that understandable same same same. When

00:16:06.279 --> 00:16:08.279
you had that turning point though, like what

00:16:08.279 --> 00:16:12.039
was the what struggles did you feel like you

00:16:12.039 --> 00:16:14.620
gave up when when things kind of turned for you?

00:16:15.639 --> 00:16:17.779
What struggles that I give up in terms of like

00:16:17.779 --> 00:16:19.539
not having them anymore and not having them.

00:16:19.539 --> 00:16:24.580
Yeah. Oh, man One I think one was I gave up the

00:16:24.580 --> 00:16:27.740
not all of it, but a big piece of the fear of

00:16:27.740 --> 00:16:31.980
judgment mm -hmm that was I had I had become

00:16:31.980 --> 00:16:36.120
accustomed to a certain level of Lifestyle, but

00:16:36.120 --> 00:16:39.379
not even that a certain level of reputation that

00:16:39.379 --> 00:16:42.759
I was afraid to lose So I had to let go of that

00:16:42.759 --> 00:16:46.529
almost immediately. Yeah That was one. I would

00:16:46.529 --> 00:16:53.049
say another one was. I had to be very. I had

00:16:53.049 --> 00:16:56.509
to let go of not setting and keeping boundaries.

00:16:57.950 --> 00:17:00.090
Because when you become an entrepreneur, yes,

00:17:00.090 --> 00:17:02.190
you have all the time in the world, but all of

00:17:02.190 --> 00:17:04.410
that time needs to be dedicated towards you doing

00:17:04.410 --> 00:17:06.210
something constructive in the business where

00:17:06.210 --> 00:17:08.809
you're going to end up broke. Right. And then

00:17:08.809 --> 00:17:13.809
I tried my best to let go of as much ego as I

00:17:13.809 --> 00:17:18.039
could. Alan has been mentoring me since we started

00:17:18.039 --> 00:17:21.799
working together. So it was very important for

00:17:21.799 --> 00:17:26.039
me to say, I think you know better in this. Oh,

00:17:26.140 --> 00:17:28.119
you think I should start tracking habits? Okay,

00:17:28.119 --> 00:17:30.299
I don't want to it sounds terrible, but I feel

00:17:30.299 --> 00:17:33.259
like you probably know better. So I had to put

00:17:33.259 --> 00:17:36.259
on the student hat and I had to let go of the

00:17:36.899 --> 00:17:38.900
You have to look good. You have to pretend you're

00:17:38.900 --> 00:17:41.440
better than you are you have to allow your ego

00:17:41.440 --> 00:17:43.839
to keep you safe I had to let go of so much of

00:17:43.839 --> 00:17:47.119
that and it was really really really hard because

00:17:47.119 --> 00:17:50.319
my Core wounding is not good enough not smart

00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:53.039
enough. Mm -hmm. So it was really important for

00:17:53.039 --> 00:17:54.640
me to lean into that So yeah, that was probably

00:17:54.640 --> 00:17:57.559
the biggest one is just let yourself be vulnerable

00:17:57.559 --> 00:17:59.900
to the fact that you need to be coachable If

00:17:59.900 --> 00:18:02.440
you're gonna succeed here, let go of all of the

00:18:02.440 --> 00:18:06.660
ego around that How does one? And this is this

00:18:06.660 --> 00:18:10.440
is a good point that a lot of people operate

00:18:10.440 --> 00:18:13.500
from the I'm not good enough or I'm not loved

00:18:13.500 --> 00:18:17.440
enough or whatever that that that thing may be

00:18:17.440 --> 00:18:22.940
for them that drives them. How do you first identify

00:18:22.940 --> 00:18:27.519
acknowledge that and then how does someone begin

00:18:27.519 --> 00:18:30.380
to not operate from that space or will somebody

00:18:30.380 --> 00:18:33.420
always operate from that space? I think we have

00:18:33.420 --> 00:18:37.539
a home. But I think you can leave home for longer.

00:18:37.859 --> 00:18:39.619
So I don't I don't know that you always will

00:18:39.619 --> 00:18:41.480
operate from it I think it's it's a tendency

00:18:41.480 --> 00:18:45.599
that it's easy to fall back into I would say

00:18:45.599 --> 00:18:49.140
on a scale of zero to ten How much do you believe

00:18:49.140 --> 00:18:52.119
in your own unique capability to build something

00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:57.400
in the external world? Hmm like Do you believe

00:18:57.400 --> 00:19:00.500
that you can build the business? Do you believe

00:19:00.500 --> 00:19:03.000
that you can lose X amount of pounds and X amount

00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:06.490
of time? All you were saying is I feel I'm a

00:19:06.490 --> 00:19:09.609
level five competent. And that's like, good enough.

00:19:09.829 --> 00:19:11.829
I feel I'm level five good enough to accomplish

00:19:11.829 --> 00:19:15.029
that goal. That's usually where we start from.

00:19:16.529 --> 00:19:20.769
What is very helpful is let's say you come up

00:19:20.769 --> 00:19:24.450
with a number, okay, on a scale of zero to 10.

00:19:24.849 --> 00:19:27.990
I feel level four confident that I can accomplish

00:19:27.990 --> 00:19:33.049
this goal. Awesome. Why don't we lower the goal

00:19:33.049 --> 00:19:36.990
so you feel level 10 confident you can do Then

00:19:36.990 --> 00:19:39.990
when you do it we can set another goal that now

00:19:39.990 --> 00:19:41.829
you'll be it'll be a bigger goal, but you'll

00:19:41.829 --> 00:19:44.549
be able to set Something bigger and feel level

00:19:44.549 --> 00:19:49.150
10 confident rinse and repeat that so Essentially

00:19:49.150 --> 00:19:51.950
if you want to build belief you state you're

00:19:51.950 --> 00:19:54.990
gonna do something You prove to yourself that

00:19:54.990 --> 00:19:57.099
you're capable of doing it And then this is a

00:19:57.099 --> 00:19:59.319
big one that a lot of people miss. You self -assign

00:19:59.319 --> 00:20:01.359
the fact that you said you were gonna do it,

00:20:01.420 --> 00:20:05.859
you did it, and now it's done. If you, go ahead.

00:20:06.180 --> 00:20:08.279
No, no, no, go ahead. I was just gonna say, if

00:20:08.279 --> 00:20:11.559
you resonate with, maybe you're really good at

00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:15.400
saying you're gonna do it. Maybe you're struggling

00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:17.920
with actually proving it and self -assigning.

00:20:18.279 --> 00:20:20.759
That's hurting your self -belief day on day on

00:20:20.759 --> 00:20:24.759
day on day. If you are really good at proving

00:20:24.759 --> 00:20:27.640
it, But you never state you're gonna do it. You

00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:30.859
probably feel like you're getting lucky And then

00:20:30.859 --> 00:20:34.640
if you never self assign You're not giving yourself

00:20:34.640 --> 00:20:37.299
the good vibes the good feelings the good emotions

00:20:37.299 --> 00:20:39.339
that you said you were gonna do it You prove

00:20:39.339 --> 00:20:41.420
to yourself that you're gonna do it You need

00:20:41.420 --> 00:20:43.180
to take ownership for the greatness that you

00:20:43.180 --> 00:20:45.960
just accomplished So usually we're missing out

00:20:45.960 --> 00:20:48.380
on at least one of those if we feel like we don't

00:20:48.380 --> 00:20:51.880
believe in ourselves Yeah And so what I was actually

00:20:51.880 --> 00:20:54.339
what I was hearing you're saying that is it's

00:20:54.339 --> 00:20:56.180
it's almost like I'm gonna use your your your

00:20:56.180 --> 00:20:59.720
terms like next level confidence builder when

00:20:59.720 --> 00:21:01.660
you actually do those things, but you need to

00:21:01.660 --> 00:21:05.180
do those things and be integrists or have integrity

00:21:05.180 --> 00:21:09.500
with your word. Yeah. And I think most people

00:21:09.500 --> 00:21:12.539
are just told to set goals that don't serve them.

00:21:13.019 --> 00:21:15.619
If you came to me and you said, Hey, man, I want

00:21:15.619 --> 00:21:18.940
to be a more successful podcasters. Cool. I think

00:21:18.940 --> 00:21:23.200
you should do seven episodes a week. You have

00:21:23.200 --> 00:21:25.500
a life outside of this, you have other things

00:21:25.500 --> 00:21:27.140
you're doing, you have other responsibilities.

00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:31.099
If you set that goal, and you couldn't accomplish

00:21:31.099 --> 00:21:34.339
it, you would lose belief in yourself. It's not.

00:21:34.660 --> 00:21:36.900
That's not a you thing. That's a goal problem.

00:21:40.940 --> 00:21:43.259
That's a limit yourself, but there are limits

00:21:43.259 --> 00:21:47.579
to certain things. I think If we're we have to

00:21:47.579 --> 00:21:50.960
be accurate with our limits Yeah, I if one of

00:21:50.960 --> 00:21:53.220
my goals is to beat Michael Phelps and swimming.

00:21:53.339 --> 00:21:57.759
I'm not going to it's not Five foot four that

00:21:57.759 --> 00:22:05.940
means he there's no way But a goal maybe a goal

00:22:05.940 --> 00:22:08.779
for me that's not constructive is I'm gonna tread

00:22:08.779 --> 00:22:11.299
water for 13 seconds like that might not build

00:22:11.299 --> 00:22:14.339
belief So I just think it's about it's the Goldilocks

00:22:14.339 --> 00:22:18.049
thing Some goals are too big, and they're going

00:22:18.049 --> 00:22:20.549
to break our self belief. Some goals are just

00:22:20.549 --> 00:22:22.170
too small, and they're not going to build it.

00:22:22.170 --> 00:22:23.930
But we have to find what the right amount for

00:22:23.930 --> 00:22:26.990
you is based on what your self belief is. Is

00:22:26.990 --> 00:22:31.589
that a lot of testing oneself or is that starting

00:22:31.589 --> 00:22:35.009
from like, I need to find out who I am in a certain

00:22:35.009 --> 00:22:36.789
space or just basically need to find out who

00:22:36.789 --> 00:22:40.589
I am before I kind of challenge myself in whatever

00:22:40.589 --> 00:22:43.369
area? I think it's a test and then a measure.

00:22:44.169 --> 00:22:48.130
Okay, so if you let's throw let's throw the dart

00:22:48.130 --> 00:22:49.930
at the board see where it lands and then see

00:22:49.930 --> 00:22:52.230
what happens you can start you can start there.

00:22:52.970 --> 00:22:55.410
I would rather somebody undershoot on a goal

00:22:55.410 --> 00:22:58.690
than overshoot. Yeah, depending on their their

00:22:58.690 --> 00:23:01.029
self belief. Again, you interviewed Alan, Alan

00:23:01.029 --> 00:23:02.990
has the most self belief out of any human I've

00:23:02.990 --> 00:23:05.829
ever met. He needs to lose. He just needs to

00:23:05.829 --> 00:23:07.910
go lose because it doesn't affect his self belief

00:23:07.910 --> 00:23:10.910
almost at all. If anything, it makes him believe

00:23:10.910 --> 00:23:14.059
in himself more. Yeah. That prescription for

00:23:14.059 --> 00:23:19.980
me, Michael is detrimental. Very detrimental.

00:23:20.680 --> 00:23:23.900
Well, you know, I had it when I had Alan on.

00:23:24.819 --> 00:23:27.900
First of all, I mean, even though we're we're

00:23:27.900 --> 00:23:31.460
on camera, like certain people like yourself

00:23:31.460 --> 00:23:36.039
exude a certain air of confidence about who they

00:23:36.039 --> 00:23:39.940
are and do he stands tall? You know, I don't

00:23:39.940 --> 00:23:41.539
know how tall he is, but he stands taller than

00:23:41.539 --> 00:23:43.799
that, you know, because of the level of confidence

00:23:43.799 --> 00:23:49.099
that he he he lives in, really. And so you're

00:23:49.099 --> 00:23:52.180
saying that there are some people that can challenge

00:23:52.180 --> 00:23:54.819
themselves beyond who they are, or some people

00:23:54.819 --> 00:23:57.259
just need to just kind of find out where they

00:23:57.259 --> 00:24:00.720
are first and then kind of set goals that match.

00:24:01.019 --> 00:24:03.900
Yeah. The hardest part is it's usually this is

00:24:03.900 --> 00:24:06.119
the weird thing. It's usually people like Alan

00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:11.000
giving advice to people like me. That I remember

00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:12.759
in the beginning. He'd just be like well kev

00:24:12.759 --> 00:24:16.680
just believe in yourself more Thanks, man. I

00:24:16.680 --> 00:24:20.660
appreciate that so much. Tell me how Right right

00:24:20.660 --> 00:24:22.880
that it there's something weird about that like

00:24:22.880 --> 00:24:25.240
a lot of the people that are giving advice To

00:24:25.240 --> 00:24:27.240
the vast majority of people don't understand

00:24:27.240 --> 00:24:29.400
how the vast majority of people think it's weird.

00:24:29.740 --> 00:24:33.299
It's this weird paradox of Many of us have to

00:24:33.299 --> 00:24:35.519
have a super high level of self -belief to accomplish

00:24:35.519 --> 00:24:38.789
what we want But then we're talking to a group

00:24:38.789 --> 00:24:40.789
of people who statistically have much lower self

00:24:40.789 --> 00:24:45.009
-belief. Mm -hmm. I don't Yeah, I don't know

00:24:45.009 --> 00:24:47.630
how you help someone if you don't understand

00:24:47.630 --> 00:24:50.109
where they kind of are. It's it's very hard to

00:24:50.109 --> 00:24:54.269
do that. Yeah Yeah, I find that when I hear it

00:24:54.269 --> 00:24:56.450
sometimes I'm like even for me. I'll just put

00:24:56.450 --> 00:25:01.069
myself in it I'll even challenge myself to like

00:25:01.069 --> 00:25:05.480
things that are just beyond me, but I just feel

00:25:05.480 --> 00:25:08.640
like I have it within me to just challenge myself

00:25:08.640 --> 00:25:12.019
that way. But if I don't necessarily reach it,

00:25:12.160 --> 00:25:15.279
I don't get down on myself now. I think I think

00:25:15.279 --> 00:25:19.059
it's age and time. But I just kind of pivot and

00:25:19.059 --> 00:25:21.700
say, you know, let's do it this way. Let's do,

00:25:21.700 --> 00:25:25.500
you know, change, change strategy. Because I

00:25:25.500 --> 00:25:29.720
don't like to give up. You know, and you talk

00:25:29.720 --> 00:25:34.670
about heart driven, but no BS. Um, and I think

00:25:34.670 --> 00:25:37.250
that's probably what I, what I am to myself.

00:25:37.769 --> 00:25:40.569
What does that mean to you and how do you embody

00:25:40.569 --> 00:25:45.170
that in your work? Heart -driven to me means

00:25:45.170 --> 00:25:53.609
just giving you the truth because I care and

00:25:53.609 --> 00:25:58.230
because I, I love you. And the no BS part is

00:25:58.230 --> 00:26:00.930
I'm not going to lie about the good parts or

00:26:00.930 --> 00:26:04.019
the bad parts. Yeah. The heart driven is, I mean,

00:26:04.180 --> 00:26:06.299
everything we do is with the intention of helping

00:26:06.299 --> 00:26:08.920
someone. Right. Right. Does it always feel that

00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:12.079
way? Probably not. No. But the no BS is I've

00:26:12.079 --> 00:26:15.680
been lied to enough by mentors and coaches and

00:26:15.680 --> 00:26:19.880
influencers and entrepreneurs. I've seen behind

00:26:19.880 --> 00:26:21.740
the curtains on some of the most successful people

00:26:21.740 --> 00:26:24.420
in the world. And many of them are not who I

00:26:24.420 --> 00:26:27.900
aspire to be. I got to keep it real. And I want

00:26:27.900 --> 00:26:31.299
to be a real authentic version of myself and

00:26:32.029 --> 00:26:35.329
that. So yeah, that's what it means to us. It's

00:26:35.329 --> 00:26:39.809
I saw something the other day that was just encompassing

00:26:39.809 --> 00:26:41.769
encapsulating of what I've been thinking a lot

00:26:41.769 --> 00:26:44.809
recently. They said most self improvement most

00:26:44.809 --> 00:26:47.869
personal development is like a snuggie. It was

00:26:47.869 --> 00:26:52.029
like, yeah, like a snuggie. Okay. It feels good.

00:26:52.170 --> 00:26:56.410
It feels warm. It keeps you safe. But it's never

00:26:56.410 --> 00:27:00.859
going to help you grow a snuggie. If you're cold,

00:27:01.099 --> 00:27:05.380
you can put on a snuggie. Awesome. Or you can

00:27:05.380 --> 00:27:07.619
learn how to build a fire, which one of those

00:27:07.619 --> 00:27:10.940
sucks worse building a fire in the cold, you

00:27:10.940 --> 00:27:12.799
got to go source the material and you got to

00:27:12.799 --> 00:27:13.940
figure it out, you're gonna get cold, you're

00:27:13.940 --> 00:27:18.039
gonna get wet. I think for a lot of us, personal

00:27:18.039 --> 00:27:22.819
development has become how to feel good momentarily,

00:27:23.960 --> 00:27:28.079
as opposed to how to grow into somebody who's

00:27:28.079 --> 00:27:31.589
more capable. of dealing with the feelings that

00:27:31.589 --> 00:27:33.650
aren't always good. I think those are two very

00:27:33.650 --> 00:27:36.269
different approaches. So we take the second one.

00:27:36.309 --> 00:27:40.230
We are built on the fundamentals, extremely unsexy,

00:27:40.490 --> 00:27:43.890
but I think it works. And the vast majority of

00:27:43.890 --> 00:27:45.930
the time, after listening to us, you probably

00:27:45.930 --> 00:27:49.509
will not feel better, but I do believe you will

00:27:49.509 --> 00:27:51.910
have the opportunity to get better. Here on the

00:27:51.910 --> 00:27:54.369
Thrival Journey, we talk a lot about not just

00:27:54.369 --> 00:27:57.769
surviving, but thriving. And a big part of that

00:27:57.769 --> 00:28:00.230
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00:28:00.230 --> 00:28:02.950
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00:28:02.950 --> 00:28:05.529
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00:28:05.910 --> 00:28:07.970
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00:28:07.970 --> 00:28:10.390
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00:28:10.910 --> 00:28:12.950
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00:28:12.950 --> 00:28:16.529
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00:28:16.849 --> 00:28:20.210
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just a sponsorship, it's part of my mission through

00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:02.079
Orion's Health to help people thrive in body,

00:29:02.420 --> 00:29:05.720
mind, and spirit. Of course, of course, always,

00:29:05.720 --> 00:29:07.539
always, always consult your physician before

00:29:07.539 --> 00:29:09.619
starting any new supplement or health regimen.

00:29:09.940 --> 00:29:12.200
Your body is unique and your healthcare provider

00:29:12.200 --> 00:29:14.680
should always be part of the conversation. The

00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:17.420
links are in the show notes. Now tap in and take

00:29:17.420 --> 00:29:22.799
your next step toward thriving. There's a lot

00:29:22.799 --> 00:29:26.539
to be said about the pain that you go through.

00:29:27.579 --> 00:29:31.380
It feels physical, but it's not necessarily physical,

00:29:31.400 --> 00:29:34.200
but it's something to be said about the growth

00:29:34.200 --> 00:29:38.319
that we go through on a journey to whatever aspiring

00:29:38.319 --> 00:29:44.019
to be. What I realize is that the person today

00:29:44.019 --> 00:29:47.859
that I am, and I'm pretty sure yourself and anybody

00:29:47.859 --> 00:29:50.859
who's listening or watching, that the person

00:29:50.859 --> 00:29:53.730
that we are today that we aspire to be was different

00:29:53.730 --> 00:29:58.809
than the person 10 days ago, 10 years ago. And

00:29:58.809 --> 00:30:01.069
when we look, when I look back and I'm like,

00:30:01.190 --> 00:30:02.990
there was some growth and there was some pain

00:30:02.990 --> 00:30:05.369
and there was some circumstances that I had to

00:30:05.369 --> 00:30:07.829
get through in order to be the person I am today.

00:30:08.509 --> 00:30:11.869
And when I'm here at this moment, I'm not satisfied.

00:30:12.869 --> 00:30:16.309
Right. And I have to grow in order to be the

00:30:16.309 --> 00:30:18.869
next level of the person that I'm, you know,

00:30:19.029 --> 00:30:28.160
creating myself to be. Should it ever stop? I

00:30:28.160 --> 00:30:30.920
think it is a deeply personal question. Should

00:30:30.920 --> 00:30:34.920
it ever stop? I don't know if you can really

00:30:34.920 --> 00:30:38.759
be fulfilled if you're not growing. Yeah. Again,

00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:41.079
I always use like the Paris Hilton's of the world,

00:30:41.160 --> 00:30:44.200
nothing against Paris Hilton. But a lot of people

00:30:44.200 --> 00:30:46.240
would see somebody like that who has access to

00:30:46.240 --> 00:30:49.279
infinite money, infinite opportunities. That

00:30:49.279 --> 00:30:52.900
person is most likely not fulfilled. Maybe now

00:30:52.900 --> 00:30:55.579
if they experienced, okay, all of this, this

00:30:55.579 --> 00:30:57.960
pleasure and all of this opportunity didn't make

00:30:57.960 --> 00:31:00.799
me feel good. Why? Okay, let me go grow and contribute

00:31:00.799 --> 00:31:06.619
to something greater than myself. I think, I

00:31:06.619 --> 00:31:09.880
don't think it always has to be the same size

00:31:09.880 --> 00:31:13.700
of aspiration. But I think the direction is important.

00:31:13.859 --> 00:31:16.839
Yeah. Am I always going to want exactly what

00:31:16.839 --> 00:31:19.640
I want today? Probably not. Maybe I want more.

00:31:19.779 --> 00:31:23.309
I don't know. But I think the direction of growth

00:31:23.309 --> 00:31:28.809
if if growth is an ingredient that creates fulfillment,

00:31:28.809 --> 00:31:31.750
I think when you lose growth, you probably also

00:31:31.750 --> 00:31:33.869
lose fulfillment, I would say. But it doesn't

00:31:33.869 --> 00:31:36.990
have to be in the same dose forever. It can change

00:31:36.990 --> 00:31:43.309
depending on you. I agree. I agree. Now. This

00:31:43.309 --> 00:31:46.769
is who you are today. We talked about you before,

00:31:47.450 --> 00:31:54.230
like in that space. What do you feel transpired

00:31:54.230 --> 00:31:56.470
in your growth and and what are the things that

00:31:56.470 --> 00:31:58.650
you could call out to say? These are the things

00:31:58.650 --> 00:32:00.529
that helped me grow to who are to where I am

00:32:00.529 --> 00:32:08.230
today. Oh man some of the Hardest times have

00:32:08.230 --> 00:32:11.609
been the greatest facilitators of growth Because

00:32:11.609 --> 00:32:13.890
I think the necessity was great enough for me

00:32:13.890 --> 00:32:16.269
to work through the discomfort that I was avoiding

00:32:16.269 --> 00:32:20.460
for most of my life So as an example When I learned

00:32:20.460 --> 00:32:25.500
the most about money, I was the brokest. If I

00:32:25.500 --> 00:32:29.299
learned about money before then, Michael, I might

00:32:29.299 --> 00:32:33.579
not have been broke. So when I when I learned

00:32:33.579 --> 00:32:36.180
the most about leadership is when I felt the

00:32:36.180 --> 00:32:40.940
worst about being a leader. I think oftentimes,

00:32:41.839 --> 00:32:45.640
the feelings that we have are the suggestion

00:32:45.640 --> 00:32:48.250
of the direction we should grow in. but it's

00:32:48.250 --> 00:32:52.069
up to you to answer the call. But that's the

00:32:52.069 --> 00:32:55.269
hardest thing ever. You already feel like you're

00:32:55.269 --> 00:32:56.829
digging a hole. It's like, I don't want to fill

00:32:56.829 --> 00:32:58.910
this hole in and then build on top of it. I think

00:32:58.910 --> 00:33:02.470
that's kind of what we have to do. So anytime

00:33:02.470 --> 00:33:04.829
there's been a shame, anytime there's been an

00:33:04.829 --> 00:33:07.069
insecurity, or anytime there's been a glaring

00:33:07.069 --> 00:33:10.130
weakness, that has been a highlight of this is

00:33:10.130 --> 00:33:14.490
what you need to work on. That might be the biggest

00:33:14.490 --> 00:33:19.660
lesson I have. That's one. The other thing is,

00:33:22.140 --> 00:33:26.079
I don't know if I will ever look back and not

00:33:26.079 --> 00:33:32.299
think I sucked. Yeah, so it's weird. It's okay.

00:33:32.619 --> 00:33:35.420
The other the other night, I was in my feels.

00:33:36.720 --> 00:33:39.420
And when I'm in my feels, Michael, I go watch

00:33:39.420 --> 00:33:41.440
old content. That's like my go to for whatever

00:33:41.440 --> 00:33:43.539
reason. Oh, really? Yeah, it's weird. I don't

00:33:43.539 --> 00:33:45.940
know why I do it. But I was watching Episode

00:33:45.940 --> 00:33:50.539
1000. You got to imagine I've done a thousand

00:33:50.539 --> 00:33:52.720
episodes. I got to be pretty good at podcasting

00:33:52.720 --> 00:33:55.339
I couldn't even watch the whole episode. It was

00:33:55.339 --> 00:34:03.700
terrible Hey, you know what? Now now is it terrible

00:34:03.700 --> 00:34:06.339
compared to average the average person or is

00:34:06.339 --> 00:34:10.159
it terrible compared to what I am now? Yeah capable

00:34:10.159 --> 00:34:13.840
of yeah Probably the second I mean, I think we

00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:15.780
were good a thousand episodes in but not two

00:34:15.780 --> 00:34:19.699
thousand episodes good. Mm -hmm This this quote

00:34:19.699 --> 00:34:23.619
changed my life and I say it as often as people

00:34:23.619 --> 00:34:28.179
will listen from day to day progress is invisible

00:34:28.179 --> 00:34:33.820
ceases to exist from year to year progress both

00:34:33.820 --> 00:34:39.219
positive or negative impossible to miss that

00:34:39.219 --> 00:34:42.559
and I just am blessed and privileged enough to

00:34:42.559 --> 00:34:46.139
have such a feedback loop of every day we do

00:34:46.139 --> 00:34:48.780
an episode and I did an episode yesterday and

00:34:48.780 --> 00:34:50.699
I did one today I'm no better I might be worse

00:34:50.699 --> 00:34:53.320
better how much sleep I got yeah right compared

00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:56.380
compared to last year though it's it's night

00:34:56.380 --> 00:35:00.599
and day so just being able to see the incremental

00:35:00.599 --> 00:35:03.260
improvement over time has helped me build so

00:35:03.260 --> 00:35:07.860
much belief because unless you have checkpoints

00:35:07.860 --> 00:35:12.860
it's really hard to it's really hard to feel

00:35:12.860 --> 00:35:16.699
growth like is a hundred dollars expensive compared

00:35:16.699 --> 00:35:19.969
to what Right? What's the con? I mean, no, not

00:35:19.969 --> 00:35:23.130
if it's a car. But yes, if it's, you know, a

00:35:23.130 --> 00:35:26.250
glass. So yeah, I think the perspective pieces

00:35:26.250 --> 00:35:29.429
is super big. So I would say those are all of

00:35:29.429 --> 00:35:32.449
those. And then I think I had this really challenging

00:35:32.449 --> 00:35:35.610
phase. And I always have this phase is just different,

00:35:35.889 --> 00:35:41.409
where I get a new insecurity that pops up. So

00:35:41.409 --> 00:35:43.630
like we talked about in the beginning, my insecurity

00:35:43.630 --> 00:35:47.599
was I am interviewing millionaires. bestselling

00:35:47.599 --> 00:35:49.840
authors, professional athletes, professional

00:35:49.840 --> 00:35:53.079
rappers and billionaires. I do not feel good

00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:55.460
enough. And everybody knows I'm an imposter.

00:35:55.659 --> 00:35:58.840
That was like the very vast majority of the time.

00:35:59.320 --> 00:36:03.039
Then it was Alan's way smarter than me and he's

00:36:03.039 --> 00:36:06.699
gonna outgrow me. Then it was he's leading the

00:36:06.699 --> 00:36:10.159
company even though I started it. And it's always

00:36:10.159 --> 00:36:13.440
been I don't know if insecurities are ever gonna

00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:16.380
go away. I think I'll just be insecure at a different

00:36:16.380 --> 00:36:21.199
level. And it'll be faster to face it. So I've

00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:23.760
kind of sort of come to terms with, I don't know

00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:26.780
if imposter syndrome is ever gonna go away. I

00:36:26.780 --> 00:36:28.639
don't know if limiting beliefs ever fully go

00:36:28.639 --> 00:36:32.960
away. I think you make friends with them. And

00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:35.880
then you know, when this friend says this thing,

00:36:35.900 --> 00:36:37.739
you say this thing back and then that friend

00:36:37.739 --> 00:36:40.059
goes and sits in the corner for a while, I think.

00:36:40.170 --> 00:36:42.010
That's what that's what I've experienced so far

00:36:42.010 --> 00:36:44.329
at least. No, you know, I'm with you with that.

00:36:45.469 --> 00:36:49.289
First of all, it cracks me up when, okay, you

00:36:49.289 --> 00:36:51.650
guys, you were like 2000 and something episodes

00:36:51.650 --> 00:36:54.829
in, you know, big audience, everything where

00:36:54.829 --> 00:36:58.210
I mean, by the time this airs, it'll be, I don't

00:36:58.210 --> 00:37:04.590
know, maybe 50 maybe. And I go back and I look

00:37:04.590 --> 00:37:09.639
at one of the persons I had on was wanting to

00:37:09.639 --> 00:37:11.659
get some, you know, some of the assets or whatever

00:37:11.659 --> 00:37:15.099
they wanted to the podcast itself to, you know,

00:37:15.239 --> 00:37:17.280
do some marketing for their for their stuff.

00:37:17.300 --> 00:37:21.039
And I'm like, sure. And when I looked back at

00:37:21.039 --> 00:37:22.760
it, when they put it up on the Instagram, I was

00:37:22.760 --> 00:37:25.619
like, Oh, my God, this is absolutely terrible.

00:37:26.280 --> 00:37:29.760
You know, you know, lighting was dark. I mean,

00:37:29.920 --> 00:37:32.460
greasy skin. It was just, oh, my God, it was

00:37:32.460 --> 00:37:38.579
just absolutely terrible. And I know this time,

00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:41.280
you know, as we grow, you know, you do better.

00:37:42.119 --> 00:37:47.440
You learn more. And I had the imposter syndrome

00:37:47.440 --> 00:37:51.500
as well. And I didn't even know I didn't need

00:37:51.500 --> 00:37:53.579
to know like who was a millionaire and who wasn't.

00:37:53.800 --> 00:37:55.659
You know what I mean? I didn't need to know because

00:37:55.659 --> 00:37:58.179
I would have this thing, this guttural feeling

00:37:58.179 --> 00:38:01.460
in my stomach, right? Like, Oh, God, you know,

00:38:01.539 --> 00:38:04.480
and it will come across that way as well. And

00:38:05.099 --> 00:38:10.099
I had to find myself within the space. And once

00:38:10.099 --> 00:38:13.460
I did that, because I know myself old enough

00:38:13.460 --> 00:38:18.559
to know myself well, things shifted and I had

00:38:18.559 --> 00:38:22.519
allowed my mindset to shift. And you talk about

00:38:22.519 --> 00:38:26.739
your mindset and building mental resilience.

00:38:29.099 --> 00:38:31.599
How did how does one do that when they're in

00:38:31.599 --> 00:38:34.019
the space where they're doubting themselves and

00:38:34.019 --> 00:38:37.119
they're trying to find? You know themselves when

00:38:37.119 --> 00:38:40.099
in whatever area they're in I would say listen

00:38:40.099 --> 00:38:42.659
to the voice that's trying to extend you not

00:38:42.659 --> 00:38:46.579
to contract you So I think all resilience in

00:38:46.579 --> 00:38:49.219
general is pushing through pain discomfort and

00:38:49.219 --> 00:38:52.539
uncertainty Mm -hmm mental resilience is pushing

00:38:52.539 --> 00:38:56.059
through mental pain mental discomfort and mental

00:38:56.059 --> 00:38:57.900
uncertainty. It's the same thing. It's it's the

00:38:57.900 --> 00:39:01.429
same You have to put yourself in places where

00:39:01.429 --> 00:39:03.670
you don't know if you can hang to a constructive

00:39:03.670 --> 00:39:09.210
amount. You have to ignore the first voice that

00:39:09.210 --> 00:39:10.949
says you can't do this and say, well, let me

00:39:10.949 --> 00:39:14.409
try it for a minute and see what happens. That's

00:39:14.409 --> 00:39:17.610
really all it is. But I think it's a huge piece

00:39:17.610 --> 00:39:20.829
of it that just goes under the radar is personal

00:39:20.829 --> 00:39:23.630
development makes you capable of carrying a heavier

00:39:23.630 --> 00:39:28.119
weight, but making it look lighter. Well, I think

00:39:28.119 --> 00:39:31.480
the only not the only the main reason I'm capable

00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:37.260
of handling pressure With somewhat grace, I won't

00:39:37.260 --> 00:39:39.280
say it's full grace but somewhat grace Yeah,

00:39:39.679 --> 00:39:41.940
is because I've done so much work on shirring

00:39:41.940 --> 00:39:44.360
up the ship. So when the waves get rough, which

00:39:44.360 --> 00:39:47.480
they will The ship just doesn't bounce as much

00:39:47.480 --> 00:39:49.800
as it used to ship. Okay, I thought you said

00:39:49.800 --> 00:39:56.389
sure enough the shit Whatever I've tried to sure

00:39:56.389 --> 00:39:58.869
it up. So when the storm comes, it doesn't rock

00:39:58.869 --> 00:40:01.829
the boat as much. And I think that's how you

00:40:01.829 --> 00:40:05.369
build mental resilience is you put yourself in

00:40:05.369 --> 00:40:08.349
a little bit over your head. And then you do

00:40:08.349 --> 00:40:11.349
all the ancillary things you exercise when you

00:40:11.349 --> 00:40:15.570
don't want to. You meditate when it's hard. You

00:40:15.570 --> 00:40:17.590
set boundaries when you don't want to you have

00:40:17.590 --> 00:40:19.389
the conversations with your partner when you

00:40:19.389 --> 00:40:21.329
don't want to you look at the stuff that you

00:40:21.329 --> 00:40:24.019
don't necessarily want to look at. And then the

00:40:24.019 --> 00:40:26.519
next day you wake up and you're still here and

00:40:26.519 --> 00:40:28.420
you get to do it all over again. And when you

00:40:28.420 --> 00:40:32.219
do that for a year, you're a drastically different

00:40:32.219 --> 00:40:35.539
human. So I think it's all those things. It's

00:40:35.539 --> 00:40:37.579
you practice personal development. That's if

00:40:37.579 --> 00:40:41.099
you want to build mental, physical, emotional

00:40:41.099 --> 00:40:43.139
resilience, you practice personal development

00:40:43.139 --> 00:40:46.360
because all personal development is, is you looking

00:40:46.360 --> 00:40:48.820
at the bright spots, you looking at the dark

00:40:48.820 --> 00:40:52.429
spots, you improving those things. Getting feedback

00:40:52.429 --> 00:40:55.030
from yourself then the proverbial mirror and

00:40:55.030 --> 00:40:56.469
then saying all right cool. Let me see what I

00:40:56.469 --> 00:40:58.210
can do about that That's that's all personal

00:40:58.210 --> 00:41:02.170
development really is yeah, I totally agree I

00:41:02.170 --> 00:41:08.030
think for myself. I've been on a journey Years

00:41:08.030 --> 00:41:10.909
of personal development, I don't think we we

00:41:10.909 --> 00:41:13.170
ever stop and we shouldn't stop I think when

00:41:13.170 --> 00:41:17.250
it comes to developing yourself as a human being

00:41:17.250 --> 00:41:20.599
But I love what you said is that I'm probably

00:41:20.599 --> 00:41:22.559
gonna ask you to say it again. But personal development

00:41:22.559 --> 00:41:27.300
is when the load is heavy, carry feels like it's

00:41:27.300 --> 00:41:31.280
light. Yeah. Yeah, I can't. Certain things come

00:41:31.280 --> 00:41:33.059
out and people say like, Hey, what was that?

00:41:33.079 --> 00:41:35.460
Say it again. It's gone, Michael is I couldn't

00:41:35.460 --> 00:41:37.059
even tell you what we're talking about anymore.

00:41:37.320 --> 00:41:40.980
I felt like it was. I'll bring us in. I felt

00:41:40.980 --> 00:41:42.639
like it was just kind of it just kind of flow

00:41:42.639 --> 00:41:45.260
from you and I was like, dang. But the great

00:41:45.260 --> 00:41:49.059
thing is I get to listen back. and write my notes.

00:41:49.219 --> 00:41:52.059
I try to write notes when I hear things for people

00:41:52.059 --> 00:41:55.179
and be present at the same time. So I'm working

00:41:55.179 --> 00:41:57.840
on that. But it's all good. Don't wait too long

00:41:57.840 --> 00:41:59.820
to listen back because it'll be terrible if you

00:41:59.820 --> 00:42:01.320
do if you wait too long, you won't be able to

00:42:01.320 --> 00:42:04.199
listen through. No, I'm not. No, we you know

00:42:04.199 --> 00:42:09.019
what we do is we after after we, you know, finish

00:42:09.019 --> 00:42:12.039
the episode or finish the show, myself and the

00:42:12.039 --> 00:42:15.739
producer, we go through them. And we get to it

00:42:15.739 --> 00:42:19.139
right away because we don't want to lose what's

00:42:19.139 --> 00:42:22.599
there. Because we get personal development out

00:42:22.599 --> 00:42:24.800
of each and every podcast that we listen to.

00:42:25.159 --> 00:42:28.960
So it's pretty good. And I wanted to talk to

00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:32.159
you about, you talk about Alan and the confidence

00:42:32.159 --> 00:42:36.119
that you guys share and have. How do you maintain

00:42:36.119 --> 00:42:39.840
confidence without being, you know, arrogant

00:42:39.840 --> 00:42:43.500
or disconnected even? You go to the gym and lift

00:42:43.500 --> 00:42:45.960
heavy weight. That's the number one way to do

00:42:45.960 --> 00:42:51.679
it for me, at least. You know, I think it's two

00:42:51.679 --> 00:42:54.679
things. We have a client one time, he's a TEDx

00:42:54.679 --> 00:42:58.119
speaker, he's a leadership coach, just a very

00:42:58.119 --> 00:43:02.400
down to earth, intelligent, good human. And he

00:43:02.400 --> 00:43:04.260
said to me one time, he said, Kev, you got to

00:43:04.260 --> 00:43:06.500
know the press is never right. You're never as

00:43:06.500 --> 00:43:08.079
good as they say, you're never as bad as they

00:43:08.079 --> 00:43:11.239
say, you're always somewhere in between. Oh,

00:43:11.239 --> 00:43:13.719
okay. Is that going to be like my mentor lesson

00:43:13.719 --> 00:43:16.739
that I got from you? This is awesome. Okay. So

00:43:16.739 --> 00:43:20.139
I always, I always think about that. That's a

00:43:20.139 --> 00:43:24.300
piece of it. The other piece of it is the way

00:43:24.300 --> 00:43:29.579
we got here was through humility, work ethic,

00:43:29.880 --> 00:43:34.460
grit, consistency, and perseverance. When you

00:43:34.460 --> 00:43:36.199
stop doing what got you to the dance, you do

00:43:36.199 --> 00:43:38.320
not get to dance anymore. If we lose sight of

00:43:38.320 --> 00:43:41.340
that, we will lose all of this. That is a Alan

00:43:41.340 --> 00:43:44.500
and I talk about that all the time all the time.

00:43:44.500 --> 00:43:46.280
I mean that is like an everyday conversation

00:43:46.280 --> 00:43:49.699
So it is something that's really on top of our

00:43:49.699 --> 00:43:54.280
minds. I think I probably balance Alan out because

00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:58.159
Alan is not arrogant. I Think the typical sense

00:43:58.159 --> 00:44:00.760
of arrogance that a lot of people think is that

00:44:00.760 --> 00:44:05.679
person Talks about stuff they don't walk the

00:44:05.679 --> 00:44:11.460
walk mm -hmm Alan's walk is already so high.

00:44:12.539 --> 00:44:14.599
So it's really like when if anybody thinks he's

00:44:14.599 --> 00:44:16.900
arrogant, it's most likely because he's not communicating

00:44:16.900 --> 00:44:20.039
properly. I do believe he's probably capable

00:44:20.039 --> 00:44:22.559
of almost anything he says. Yeah, because he

00:44:22.559 --> 00:44:25.159
he knows so it's not like he's not saying it

00:44:25.159 --> 00:44:27.099
from a place of arrogance. I just think it's

00:44:27.099 --> 00:44:30.880
at times lack of communication. I've always tried

00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:34.320
to be extremely humble because honestly, I think

00:44:34.320 --> 00:44:36.500
that's what's gotten me in so many rooms is like,

00:44:36.659 --> 00:44:40.900
hey, I'm not The best I'm not the fastest. I'm

00:44:40.900 --> 00:44:43.820
not the smartest but like I'll work really hard

00:44:43.820 --> 00:44:46.159
and I'll support you and I'll be a really good

00:44:46.159 --> 00:44:48.619
number two and I'll know my place and all that

00:44:48.619 --> 00:44:52.780
So I think we balance each other out Really really

00:44:52.780 --> 00:44:55.880
really well where he'll shoot for the moon and

00:44:55.880 --> 00:44:59.880
miss I'll remind him that that's fine for him.

00:44:59.880 --> 00:45:01.940
But if we miss with the team, we're all gonna

00:45:01.940 --> 00:45:04.639
die and This this is not gonna work anymore.

00:45:04.639 --> 00:45:07.110
So we balance each other out really well. And

00:45:07.110 --> 00:45:09.110
I think at the end of the day, we have a really,

00:45:09.650 --> 00:45:12.269
a really, really vulnerable relationship where

00:45:12.269 --> 00:45:16.150
we talk about what's real. Yeah, sometimes like

00:45:16.150 --> 00:45:17.829
the stuff that you don't want to talk about.

00:45:17.929 --> 00:45:20.349
Yeah. And that helps keep you humble because

00:45:20.349 --> 00:45:23.150
you're always up against the weight of the mission.

00:45:23.210 --> 00:45:25.889
I mean, this is we're never going to actually

00:45:25.889 --> 00:45:28.570
accomplish what we want. Right? It's never going

00:45:28.570 --> 00:45:29.989
to get an award that says, Hey, you're the most

00:45:29.989 --> 00:45:32.289
successful personal development company on the

00:45:32.289 --> 00:45:35.519
planet. Like that's gonna happen. Yeah. So The

00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:38.179
journey of that will, in theory, always be humbling

00:45:38.179 --> 00:45:40.860
as long as we keep our eyes on that. That brings

00:45:40.860 --> 00:45:43.519
me to a point where do you believe confidence

00:45:43.519 --> 00:45:46.019
comes before clarity? You guys have it just seems

00:45:46.019 --> 00:45:51.119
like you're you're the way you guys are going

00:45:51.119 --> 00:45:53.019
and what you've created. There's a lot of clarity

00:45:53.019 --> 00:45:57.719
there. Yeah. Can you talk about that? Do I think

00:45:57.719 --> 00:46:00.320
confidence comes before clarity or vice versa?

00:46:02.760 --> 00:46:08.690
No, I think I think clarity. Yeah, no, I think

00:46:08.690 --> 00:46:11.309
it depends on the person. I think either either

00:46:11.309 --> 00:46:13.809
order. So if you let's say you just start out

00:46:13.809 --> 00:46:15.590
naturally somewhat confident, you're probably

00:46:15.590 --> 00:46:19.110
going to go do stuff that's misaligned. That's

00:46:19.110 --> 00:46:20.829
going to create clarity. And then that'll double

00:46:20.829 --> 00:46:23.710
down the confidence. If you're somebody who is

00:46:23.710 --> 00:46:26.050
afraid to take action, you'll probably need a

00:46:26.050 --> 00:46:29.230
little bit of extra clarity. When you do the

00:46:29.230 --> 00:46:31.550
thing, you'll probably get better results. And

00:46:31.550 --> 00:46:34.550
then that will re clarify. rinse and repeat.

00:46:34.550 --> 00:46:37.690
So I think it all depends on where your self

00:46:37.690 --> 00:46:40.809
belief is where your self worth is. That's why

00:46:40.809 --> 00:46:43.289
success is so hard, because it is a very unique

00:46:43.289 --> 00:46:48.010
equation based on your attributes. Like the,

00:46:48.010 --> 00:46:50.170
the equation is so hard, because none of the

00:46:50.170 --> 00:46:52.909
numbers are the same for any of us. Yeah, that's

00:46:52.909 --> 00:46:55.409
that's why it's so challenging. I know for me,

00:46:55.809 --> 00:47:00.030
I needed clarity first. Then that helped me build

00:47:00.030 --> 00:47:04.400
confidence. Alan was confident. he needed clarity.

00:47:04.800 --> 00:47:07.619
So he would take action, it would go horribly

00:47:07.619 --> 00:47:11.559
wrong, boom, more clear, I would research and

00:47:11.559 --> 00:47:16.579
prep. The first speech I ever gave, I did so

00:47:16.579 --> 00:47:22.219
many test runs of it, that I knew, okay, 70 75

00:47:22.219 --> 00:47:24.500
% of the way through, I should be at 15 minutes

00:47:24.500 --> 00:47:26.739
and 30 seconds. And I should be on this point.

00:47:27.860 --> 00:47:32.159
Alan finished his speech on like in the bathroom

00:47:32.159 --> 00:47:36.019
stall on the day we were doing it. I did really

00:47:36.019 --> 00:47:39.900
well. He didn't do very well. He was like, I

00:47:39.900 --> 00:47:41.519
should probably prep a little bit more. I was

00:47:41.519 --> 00:47:45.320
like, I'm the man. This is this is awesome. I

00:47:45.320 --> 00:47:47.820
bombed the next speech because I got arrogant.

00:47:48.380 --> 00:47:51.420
He prepped more. So it's always a it's always

00:47:51.420 --> 00:47:53.559
a pendulum swinging back and forth. I think the

00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:56.760
ultimate goal is just to to slow the swings down

00:47:56.760 --> 00:47:59.300
so they don't go as far each time. Yeah, yeah.

00:48:00.420 --> 00:48:03.599
balance of the both. I think I'm listening to

00:48:03.599 --> 00:48:06.420
you and I'm putting myself in your shoes and

00:48:06.420 --> 00:48:08.820
I'm still trying to figure a lot of I know I

00:48:08.820 --> 00:48:10.760
need some clarity on my side. I think I have

00:48:10.760 --> 00:48:14.980
more confidence than I do have clarity and ask

00:48:14.980 --> 00:48:19.119
that question because you know for me it's like

00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:22.599
what do I need most you know to help me forge

00:48:22.599 --> 00:48:26.530
forward with my business and with what I'm creating

00:48:26.530 --> 00:48:30.230
for myself. And so that's why I wanted to know

00:48:30.230 --> 00:48:35.030
your point or your view on what do you what do

00:48:35.030 --> 00:48:36.929
you look at more your strengths or your weaknesses?

00:48:38.289 --> 00:48:46.110
Um, man, I think I look at probably my weaknesses

00:48:46.110 --> 00:48:50.829
when I don't achieve a certain thing. Like if

00:48:50.829 --> 00:48:55.800
I if I'm I'm trying to look at real life situations

00:48:55.800 --> 00:48:57.940
here. I can't even think of anything right now.

00:49:00.199 --> 00:49:02.820
I tend to go more to my weaknesses than I do

00:49:02.820 --> 00:49:08.980
too much to my strengths. And then I'll mull

00:49:08.980 --> 00:49:11.199
it over and be like, well, let me let me get

00:49:11.199 --> 00:49:17.539
stronger in the area of whatever it is. And then

00:49:17.539 --> 00:49:21.579
I'll go for that and then make that strike major.

00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:24.320
try to make that strength work for me. Yeah,

00:49:24.559 --> 00:49:25.980
or that weakness turn into a strength of work

00:49:25.980 --> 00:49:29.320
and have that work for me. Yeah. So yeah, that's,

00:49:29.320 --> 00:49:32.199
I think that's kind of I think what usually works

00:49:32.199 --> 00:49:34.699
is sitting down and writing out a list of your

00:49:34.699 --> 00:49:36.619
core values, your core beliefs and your core

00:49:36.619 --> 00:49:40.960
aspirations. So core values, what do you value

00:49:40.960 --> 00:49:43.179
about yourself about the world about people?

00:49:43.679 --> 00:49:47.199
What are you attracted to not relationally or

00:49:47.199 --> 00:49:49.440
sexually but like what You meet someone and they're

00:49:49.440 --> 00:49:50.780
super humble and you're like, I want to be around

00:49:50.780 --> 00:49:52.940
that person more. Well, I'm guessing humility

00:49:52.940 --> 00:49:55.539
is probably one of your core values, core beliefs.

00:49:55.619 --> 00:49:57.079
What do you believe about yourself? What do you

00:49:57.079 --> 00:49:58.559
believe about the world? Like, what do you believe

00:49:58.559 --> 00:50:01.300
the human experience should be? And then core

00:50:01.300 --> 00:50:03.460
aspirations? What in the hell do you want to

00:50:03.460 --> 00:50:06.980
accomplish? Yeah. Oftentimes, what you find is

00:50:06.980 --> 00:50:09.940
your core values, your core beliefs are in conflict

00:50:09.940 --> 00:50:14.019
with your core aspiration. And a lot of people

00:50:14.019 --> 00:50:18.690
get stuck in that zone of Just a quick story.

00:50:19.030 --> 00:50:22.050
I was working with a podcaster one time and I

00:50:22.050 --> 00:50:23.710
said, what do you want? I mean, what's the point

00:50:23.710 --> 00:50:26.050
of this? He's like, I want to be like you guys

00:50:26.050 --> 00:50:29.369
but way more successful. Okay, love it. Love

00:50:29.369 --> 00:50:31.610
that for you. I don't know what it's gonna take

00:50:31.610 --> 00:50:33.489
to be beyond where we are because I can only

00:50:33.489 --> 00:50:36.829
tell you what we've done. But internally, I'm

00:50:36.829 --> 00:50:39.289
already thinking Michael, no, you don't. They

00:50:39.289 --> 00:50:43.050
don't. You want what we have. You do not want

00:50:43.050 --> 00:50:45.699
what we've done. So let me let me let me run

00:50:45.699 --> 00:50:47.139
a test on you without you know, and I'm running

00:50:47.139 --> 00:50:50.139
a test. That makes sense. I mean, on a scale

00:50:50.139 --> 00:50:52.860
of zero to 10. How important is it for you to

00:50:52.860 --> 00:50:56.900
be able to get your kids off the bus every day?

00:50:56.900 --> 00:51:01.599
And he smiled 10 out of 10. Nice. I know. On

00:51:01.599 --> 00:51:03.019
a scale of zero to 10. How important is it for

00:51:03.019 --> 00:51:05.699
you to be at the recitals, parent teacher conferences,

00:51:05.940 --> 00:51:08.239
all that stuff? 10 out of 10. You want to be

00:51:08.239 --> 00:51:10.000
home for dinner every night? Yeah, 10 out of

00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:11.719
10. I said, brother, with all the love in the

00:51:11.719 --> 00:51:17.099
world, this ain't it. This ain't it. What happens

00:51:17.099 --> 00:51:21.960
is we set a goal based on what the result of

00:51:21.960 --> 00:51:24.760
the goal will be, not the process of accomplishing

00:51:24.760 --> 00:51:28.380
the goal. The process of accomplishing the goal

00:51:28.380 --> 00:51:31.900
is like 99 % of it. And then one day you get

00:51:31.900 --> 00:51:33.760
it, but it doesn't really work like that. You

00:51:33.760 --> 00:51:37.199
still have to sustain it. So that's always something

00:51:37.199 --> 00:51:39.000
that has, it's been super helpful for me and

00:51:39.000 --> 00:51:40.840
it's been helpful for a lot of clients because

00:51:41.070 --> 00:51:44.769
Your core aspirations, you're not really factoring

00:51:44.769 --> 00:51:46.590
in how that's going to affect your lifestyle.

00:51:46.650 --> 00:51:48.590
You're only factoring in how that's going to

00:51:48.590 --> 00:51:52.389
affect The highlights for the most part. So that

00:51:52.389 --> 00:51:54.829
would be I don't know do that and see if anything

00:51:54.829 --> 00:51:57.909
comes of it. Hopefully something will Yeah, making

00:51:57.909 --> 00:52:01.730
a list and actually seeing it not only having

00:52:01.730 --> 00:52:04.690
it inside but seeing it and then maybe internalizing

00:52:04.690 --> 00:52:09.329
that yeah, see Yeah, I could see that. All right

00:52:09.369 --> 00:52:14.070
See, that's why that's why we're podcasting.

00:52:15.010 --> 00:52:17.630
And talking about that, just trying to connect

00:52:17.630 --> 00:52:22.010
that with with what's next is your purpose. What

00:52:22.010 --> 00:52:24.550
is like if you have to state what your purpose

00:52:24.550 --> 00:52:26.989
is, or I know we have multiple purposes, but

00:52:26.989 --> 00:52:30.230
your overall purpose, what is your overall purpose?

00:52:30.710 --> 00:52:32.610
To be the type of person I needed at my lowest

00:52:32.610 --> 00:52:36.059
point. That is that is why I show up the way

00:52:36.059 --> 00:52:38.719
I show up my hair is popping through my hat I

00:52:38.719 --> 00:52:41.880
don't care like this is how the version that

00:52:41.880 --> 00:52:44.320
kev the person that kev needed This is how he

00:52:44.320 --> 00:52:47.360
would show up He would have this energy. He would

00:52:47.360 --> 00:52:50.780
be proud to be here. He'd be appreciative. He'd

00:52:50.780 --> 00:52:55.199
be grateful like that is but I think where a

00:52:55.199 --> 00:52:59.559
lot of us get stuck is I Got so many people say

00:52:59.559 --> 00:53:01.880
how do you find your purpose? I think you know

00:53:02.670 --> 00:53:06.170
Do I think if you've had something deeply meaningful

00:53:06.170 --> 00:53:08.489
happen to you You most likely want to help a

00:53:08.489 --> 00:53:10.849
certain person avoid a certain pain in a certain

00:53:10.849 --> 00:53:15.409
way Where it where things get wonky is when somebody

00:53:15.409 --> 00:53:18.309
says well, what's the vehicle? How am I gonna

00:53:18.309 --> 00:53:22.150
do it? My purpose is not to be a podcaster My

00:53:22.150 --> 00:53:25.090
purpose is to use my voice and my words to help

00:53:25.090 --> 00:53:27.269
people raise awareness to avoid the pains that

00:53:27.269 --> 00:53:30.780
I could yeah podcasting is just a vehicle for

00:53:30.780 --> 00:53:34.000
that is just a vehicle. I think that's where

00:53:34.000 --> 00:53:35.840
a lot of us get stuck is because the vehicle

00:53:35.840 --> 00:53:38.619
doesn't seem realistic or the vehicle doesn't

00:53:38.619 --> 00:53:42.059
seem sustainable, whatever, whatever it is. So

00:53:42.059 --> 00:53:45.400
yeah, I think for a lot of us, it's like, there's

00:53:45.400 --> 00:53:47.800
a bunch of questions. What would I find you talking

00:53:47.800 --> 00:53:50.320
about on a Friday night? If you were like the

00:53:50.320 --> 00:53:53.239
most passionate? What pisses you off the most?

00:53:53.340 --> 00:53:55.179
What makes you the saddest? What makes you the

00:53:55.179 --> 00:53:57.570
happiest? What have a bunch of people told you

00:53:57.570 --> 00:53:59.489
that you're really, really good at without any

00:53:59.489 --> 00:54:02.309
of your solicitation? There's a lot of ways to

00:54:02.309 --> 00:54:05.289
talk about that. But I think finding your purpose

00:54:05.289 --> 00:54:07.409
is one piece. And I think attaching your purpose

00:54:07.409 --> 00:54:10.989
to a vehicle might be maybe even more important

00:54:10.989 --> 00:54:15.110
than finding it in the first place. That is a

00:54:15.110 --> 00:54:19.949
distinction. It's connecting your purpose to

00:54:19.949 --> 00:54:23.530
a vehicle that can move that thing forward. I've

00:54:23.530 --> 00:54:25.449
never looked at it that way. But I think it's,

00:54:25.530 --> 00:54:28.849
that's, that's a really good point. For people

00:54:28.849 --> 00:54:32.809
to look at, like, you know, after you find your

00:54:32.809 --> 00:54:34.550
purpose, or you know what that is, it's like,

00:54:34.769 --> 00:54:38.110
how do you get that, that purpose to live within

00:54:38.110 --> 00:54:40.210
the world sustainably, right? We all want to

00:54:40.210 --> 00:54:44.409
do it sustainably. That's, that's why it's like,

00:54:44.929 --> 00:54:47.590
I used to be the guy, I've said some dumb stuff.

00:54:48.010 --> 00:54:49.610
I used to be the guy who said like, yeah, if

00:54:49.610 --> 00:54:51.630
you chase your passion or if you chase your purpose,

00:54:51.849 --> 00:54:54.929
it'll happen. I don't know. There's got to be

00:54:54.929 --> 00:54:56.670
some strategy in there. You know, we got to have

00:54:56.670 --> 00:55:01.269
some strategy. If you love what you do, you never

00:55:01.269 --> 00:55:04.909
work a day in your life. I don't think so. That's

00:55:04.909 --> 00:55:09.329
overrated. So it's easy to say like, yeah, when

00:55:09.329 --> 00:55:11.389
you're living in your purpose, everything comes

00:55:11.389 --> 00:55:14.050
easy. It's like, ah. I think that's oversimplified.

00:55:14.170 --> 00:55:17.690
I think most any like, even the quotes that I've

00:55:17.690 --> 00:55:19.429
said today, like they're oversimplified, they're

00:55:19.429 --> 00:55:21.070
not going to work in every situation, they'll

00:55:21.070 --> 00:55:24.630
work in very select specific. How do you stay

00:55:24.630 --> 00:55:28.909
connected to your purpose? That is a wonderful

00:55:28.909 --> 00:55:30.809
question. Because I think as you're building

00:55:30.809 --> 00:55:35.469
a business, it's easy to forget the purpose of

00:55:35.469 --> 00:55:43.760
the business. For me, I try to think of how much

00:55:43.760 --> 00:55:47.480
pain I was in when we started. I always try to

00:55:47.480 --> 00:55:51.619
connect to like, yes, we have payroll and yes,

00:55:51.639 --> 00:55:54.039
we have financial goals and we have things we're

00:55:54.039 --> 00:55:56.739
trying to do. But at the end of the day, if we

00:55:56.739 --> 00:55:59.079
ever lose sight of why this started in the first

00:55:59.079 --> 00:56:02.059
place, we this is all for nothing. If we do.

00:56:02.380 --> 00:56:05.400
And I know that's drastic. But like, we started

00:56:05.400 --> 00:56:10.949
this to help people. That is one thing. The other

00:56:10.949 --> 00:56:13.989
thing that I'm always thinking about is I want

00:56:13.989 --> 00:56:18.309
to try to be as accessible as I can be I Told

00:56:18.309 --> 00:56:21.329
Alan this the other day Okay, this is this is

00:56:21.329 --> 00:56:24.170
a good. This is a story that will connect Alan

00:56:24.170 --> 00:56:26.070
as a client. He's been working with for a long

00:56:26.070 --> 00:56:29.389
time Member of our community listens to our podcasts

00:56:29.389 --> 00:56:32.070
every day just a humble man Huge fan of humble

00:56:32.070 --> 00:56:33.670
men like I love working with humble men here.

00:56:33.710 --> 00:56:35.309
You're a super humble man. I could talk to you

00:56:35.309 --> 00:56:39.179
all day So I reached out to him And I said, Hey,

00:56:39.280 --> 00:56:40.920
I want to hop on a call with you to help you

00:56:40.920 --> 00:56:43.699
with your podcast. And when I told Alan, I was

00:56:43.699 --> 00:56:45.099
going to do that. He's like, I dude, honestly,

00:56:45.199 --> 00:56:48.219
like there, there's no budget. He's already super

00:56:48.219 --> 00:56:50.139
overwhelmed. And I said, Oh, I don't want anything.

00:56:50.139 --> 00:56:51.539
I just want to talk to him. I just want to add

00:56:51.539 --> 00:56:54.579
value. I don't ever want to not have the opportunity

00:56:54.579 --> 00:56:57.360
to do that. Because that's why I started this

00:56:57.360 --> 00:56:59.139
in the first place. I started this in the first

00:56:59.139 --> 00:57:02.900
place. So I could message someone who couldn't

00:57:02.900 --> 00:57:04.880
get anybody else to answer them and say like,

00:57:05.000 --> 00:57:07.099
yeah, I'll, yeah, let's hop on a 30 minute call,

00:57:07.119 --> 00:57:09.469
whatever. was 30 minutes. Am I gonna get that

00:57:09.469 --> 00:57:11.969
30 minutes back? No. But am I gonna get fulfillment

00:57:11.969 --> 00:57:15.449
in that 30 minutes? Of course. Of course. So

00:57:15.449 --> 00:57:18.829
I try to never lose sight of the human aspect

00:57:18.829 --> 00:57:23.030
of this. It's very easy to focus on scaling and

00:57:23.030 --> 00:57:26.369
say that's a waste of your time. A waste of your

00:57:26.369 --> 00:57:29.510
time is not always equating how much fulfillment

00:57:29.510 --> 00:57:31.869
you'll get from it. So I'm always trying to work

00:57:31.869 --> 00:57:35.190
on that equation. But again, easier said than

00:57:35.190 --> 00:57:37.940
done when you have financial goals and payroll

00:57:37.940 --> 00:57:41.000
and expenses and all that. But that's, that's

00:57:41.000 --> 00:57:43.300
probably the best answer I could give. Yeah.

00:57:43.440 --> 00:57:50.599
Yeah. I think I'm not even gonna go there. Nevermind.

00:57:50.840 --> 00:57:54.920
But what you said is, is very, very real, first

00:57:54.920 --> 00:58:00.579
and foremost. But I think, for me, it's also

00:58:00.579 --> 00:58:03.880
like, sometimes I need to take a moment. And

00:58:03.880 --> 00:58:07.599
just to stay like restate who I am for myself.

00:58:08.639 --> 00:58:15.900
So that I, because, you know, life can be, I

00:58:15.900 --> 00:58:20.659
don't, this is a word, but bombardastic. It bombards

00:58:20.659 --> 00:58:23.199
you with a lot of things, right? I made that

00:58:23.199 --> 00:58:28.239
word up. And sometimes it just takes just a moment

00:58:28.239 --> 00:58:31.139
just to kind of just separate from all the stuff

00:58:31.139 --> 00:58:34.699
and just to sit and be with, you know, yourself.

00:58:34.969 --> 00:58:40.269
and just to remember who I am in the day and

00:58:40.269 --> 00:58:43.829
who I am for myself and for other people. That's

00:58:43.829 --> 00:58:50.670
what I have to do. Just to keep steady. I feel

00:58:50.670 --> 00:58:53.429
you, man. I feel you. It's hard because you have

00:58:53.429 --> 00:58:57.909
one really, really, really big goal, which is

00:58:57.909 --> 00:59:01.050
like the purpose, and then you have a bunch of

00:59:01.050 --> 00:59:04.539
seasonal goals that make up the big goal. That's

00:59:04.539 --> 00:59:06.519
why it's so hard is like, well, we have to hit

00:59:06.519 --> 00:59:10.579
x amount of revenue this quarter. That's the

00:59:10.579 --> 00:59:12.219
goal this quarter, but it has to be done through

00:59:12.219 --> 00:59:15.099
the lens of the massive purpose goal. Right.

00:59:15.360 --> 00:59:17.360
So but I think that I think your answer is spot

00:59:17.360 --> 00:59:19.880
on, you have to you have to zoom out, zoom out,

00:59:19.920 --> 00:59:23.179
zoom out of this quarter to the goal, zoom out

00:59:23.179 --> 00:59:26.079
of the goal into the purpose. And then if you

00:59:26.079 --> 00:59:28.739
do that enough, but yeah, that's that's a tough

00:59:28.739 --> 00:59:30.599
one. That is a philosophical question for sure.

00:59:30.760 --> 00:59:35.340
It is it is Last question. How do entrepreneurs?

00:59:36.119 --> 00:59:39.760
How can entrepreneurs start building impact today?

00:59:41.159 --> 00:59:44.920
Even if they have like no audience or no capital

00:59:44.920 --> 00:59:49.300
or little experience You're not gonna like the

00:59:49.300 --> 00:59:50.840
answer if you're out there and you're an entrepreneur

00:59:50.840 --> 00:59:52.900
It's gonna be opposite to what most people are

00:59:52.900 --> 00:59:58.590
telling you do more free stuff that I still do

00:59:58.590 --> 01:00:01.190
free stuff. I will probably always do free stuff.

01:00:01.230 --> 01:00:04.170
It is one of the best ways to directly impact

01:00:04.170 --> 01:00:06.670
people. Now I know what you're thinking. Well,

01:00:06.670 --> 01:00:09.070
if I can get on a stage in front of 5 ,000 people,

01:00:09.070 --> 01:00:12.030
I can impact 5 ,000 people. Yeah. Getting on

01:00:12.030 --> 01:00:15.610
a stage like that takes time though. In the beginning,

01:00:16.190 --> 01:00:19.929
I think we drastically underestimate. If you

01:00:19.929 --> 01:00:22.369
were to do a free webinar that had no strings

01:00:22.369 --> 01:00:26.389
attached and 15 people came, 15 people is a lot

01:00:26.389 --> 01:00:29.000
of people. It just doesn't feel like it when

01:00:29.000 --> 01:00:30.860
you compare to social media land with people

01:00:30.860 --> 01:00:33.619
with millions of followers So I would say focus

01:00:33.619 --> 01:00:37.440
way less on scale and focus way more on impact

01:00:37.440 --> 01:00:39.579
That's I think that's one of the most common

01:00:39.579 --> 01:00:42.539
things. It's like well, that's not scalable We

01:00:42.539 --> 01:00:43.960
don't worry about that. You don't have to worry

01:00:43.960 --> 01:00:45.539
about that now worry about that when it's not

01:00:45.539 --> 01:00:47.119
scalable You're not you're not even doing it

01:00:47.119 --> 01:00:50.860
yet Go go get out there and make some friends

01:00:50.860 --> 01:00:52.619
and make some noise and connect with people.

01:00:52.619 --> 01:00:56.400
I think if I can say anything about the quote

01:00:56.400 --> 01:00:59.559
unquote success we've had. In the beginning,

01:01:00.320 --> 01:01:03.280
if somebody dm'd me, like, Michael, if you dm'd

01:01:03.280 --> 01:01:05.139
me and said, Hey, just listen to episode number,

01:01:05.579 --> 01:01:08.679
whatever, I loved it, I would send you my personal

01:01:08.679 --> 01:01:10.340
cell phone number. And I would ask you to get

01:01:10.340 --> 01:01:12.099
on a FaceTime call, because I would want to learn

01:01:12.099 --> 01:01:15.119
about you. What resonated? What didn't? What's

01:01:15.119 --> 01:01:18.179
your experience like, so I can make better content?

01:01:18.500 --> 01:01:21.239
That a waste of time? A lot of people told me

01:01:21.239 --> 01:01:23.199
it was but I think it was one of the best uses

01:01:23.199 --> 01:01:26.219
of time I could I could do. So it would be that

01:01:26.219 --> 01:01:31.760
yeah, go out one on one. It there's there's not

01:01:31.760 --> 01:01:34.719
a lot of people doing that anymore. Yeah, right.

01:01:34.820 --> 01:01:36.619
Because the internet has made things so scalable,

01:01:36.619 --> 01:01:38.980
there is there is an opportunity for you to be

01:01:38.980 --> 01:01:42.239
face to face or one to one. And you can impact

01:01:42.239 --> 01:01:46.039
people to a really deep degree. And then it's

01:01:46.039 --> 01:01:48.719
ultimately a conversation of breadth versus depth.

01:01:48.780 --> 01:01:52.519
So How many people can I impact his breath? To

01:01:52.519 --> 01:01:55.880
what degree can I impact them is depth? It depends

01:01:55.880 --> 01:01:57.440
on which one you want to optimize for two. That's

01:01:57.440 --> 01:02:01.199
a big piece of it. Very good. Every time you

01:02:01.199 --> 01:02:02.619
say something is like a whole bunch of questions.

01:02:04.579 --> 01:02:06.820
But I'm not going to do that. So we're going

01:02:06.820 --> 01:02:11.780
to wrap up with this. What I like to ask guests

01:02:11.780 --> 01:02:13.940
on the podcast is, you know, we go through all

01:02:13.940 --> 01:02:17.320
these questions and we, you know, it's kind of

01:02:17.320 --> 01:02:21.139
particular to what whatever topic but As your

01:02:21.139 --> 01:02:24.079
last words on this podcast, not necessarily about

01:02:24.079 --> 01:02:26.599
the topic itself, but as your last words on this

01:02:26.599 --> 01:02:30.019
podcast, what is on your heart and your mind

01:02:30.019 --> 01:02:32.719
that you want to share different from the top

01:02:32.719 --> 01:02:35.460
of the podcast, but your lasting words that you

01:02:35.460 --> 01:02:44.840
want to live on a podcast for someone. If you

01:02:44.840 --> 01:02:47.440
are somebody right now who is out there and you're

01:02:47.440 --> 01:02:51.760
growing a ton, And it doesn't feel good. Doesn't

01:02:51.760 --> 01:02:53.960
mean you're doing it wrong. It probably means

01:02:53.960 --> 01:02:57.059
you're doing it right. Growth is uncomfortable.

01:02:57.639 --> 01:03:01.059
Growth is scary. Growth is uncertain. But it

01:03:01.059 --> 01:03:03.280
probably will be one of the most fulfilling things

01:03:03.280 --> 01:03:06.059
you could ever possibly do. So yeah, it might

01:03:06.059 --> 01:03:07.539
be scary and you might feel like you're doing

01:03:07.539 --> 01:03:10.599
it wrong. But I would say if you recognize any

01:03:10.599 --> 01:03:13.659
level of evolution yourself, I would keep going.

01:03:14.179 --> 01:03:16.659
It's worth it. It's worth it. What's the alternative?

01:03:17.389 --> 01:03:20.269
What's the alternative? You don't want to wake

01:03:20.269 --> 01:03:22.710
up in 30 years and regret the last 30 years?

01:03:23.250 --> 01:03:25.809
You don't want to do that, right? So yeah, it

01:03:25.809 --> 01:03:29.130
would be that. A lot of what we talk about is

01:03:29.130 --> 01:03:31.710
the challenges and it is the overcoming and it

01:03:31.710 --> 01:03:34.030
is the limiting beliefs and the fears and the

01:03:34.030 --> 01:03:36.690
uncertainties. But I'm the most fulfilled I've

01:03:36.690 --> 01:03:39.769
ever been. And I'm not. It's not a coincidence.

01:03:40.250 --> 01:03:42.530
That's not a coincidence. So keep growing. You

01:03:42.530 --> 01:03:45.809
will be grateful you did. And last, last, last

01:03:45.809 --> 01:03:49.010
thing. Unfortunately, oftentimes, when you're

01:03:49.010 --> 01:03:51.530
growing, the people around you are villainizing

01:03:51.530 --> 01:03:54.530
you. That speaks more about the people around

01:03:54.530 --> 01:03:56.909
you than it does you, because you're literally

01:03:56.909 --> 01:03:58.710
working on yourself. And I don't think there's

01:03:58.710 --> 01:04:00.789
a more noble thing a human can do than work on

01:04:00.789 --> 01:04:05.869
themselves. Love it. Love it. Kevin, man, I appreciate

01:04:05.869 --> 01:04:09.230
you being here. Long awaited. And I'm so glad

01:04:09.230 --> 01:04:13.969
that that we made this conversation happen from

01:04:13.969 --> 01:04:18.789
both you and Alan, I mean, it's a pleasure to

01:04:18.789 --> 01:04:20.989
have, you know, have you both on this podcast,

01:04:21.030 --> 01:04:24.650
and hopefully we'll do something in the future.

01:04:24.809 --> 01:04:28.329
And how do I know we did it before, but let's

01:04:28.329 --> 01:04:30.210
do it again. How do people get in touch with

01:04:30.210 --> 01:04:33.989
you? If they want to get to the next level them.

01:04:34.730 --> 01:04:37.710
I appreciate it very much. And I mirror those

01:04:37.710 --> 01:04:40.170
words back. This has been wonderful. I you're

01:04:40.170 --> 01:04:41.769
an ally in the mission. I love what you're doing.

01:04:41.809 --> 01:04:44.829
And I appreciate your time so very much. Thank

01:04:44.829 --> 01:04:47.320
you. Of course, of course. The podcast is Next

01:04:47.320 --> 01:04:49.340
Level University. We do an episode every day.

01:04:49.400 --> 01:04:52.159
So after you listen to Michael's episodes, you

01:04:52.159 --> 01:04:55.179
can come check us out. My handle on Instagram

01:04:55.179 --> 01:04:58.739
is at never quit kid. That's where I'm most active.

01:04:59.059 --> 01:05:02.559
And then my email is Kevin at next level universe

01:05:02.559 --> 01:05:06.099
.com. If you have questions, comments, concerns,

01:05:06.320 --> 01:05:08.460
anything I can do to add value, seriously shoot

01:05:08.460 --> 01:05:11.159
me an email. You would be mind blown how often

01:05:11.159 --> 01:05:13.039
I say it and how little people do it. You're

01:05:13.039 --> 01:05:14.900
not going to bother me. I promise I wouldn't,

01:05:14.900 --> 01:05:16.440
I wouldn't say it if I didn't want you to reach

01:05:16.440 --> 01:05:19.280
out. So anything I can do to add value, let me

01:05:19.280 --> 01:05:23.440
know. Just say, thrive well in the, in the subject.

01:05:23.500 --> 01:05:25.019
I'll know where you came from and we'll party.

01:05:25.960 --> 01:05:29.159
Nice. I love it. And the question of the week

01:05:29.159 --> 01:05:32.039
that I have here for all your listeners and watchers,

01:05:32.380 --> 01:05:34.860
what's one decision that you made that completely

01:05:34.860 --> 01:05:38.650
changed your life and what decision do you? the

01:05:38.650 --> 01:05:42.869
viewer, the watcher need to make today. Your

01:05:42.869 --> 01:05:46.989
next level. All right. And again, I want to say

01:05:46.989 --> 01:05:50.690
thank you to Kevin and the next level. You group

01:05:50.690 --> 01:05:54.889
people team for, uh, just for just blessing us

01:05:54.889 --> 01:05:58.090
with your presence. And as we always say, let's

01:05:58.090 --> 01:06:02.030
make thriving our new normal. See you next week.

01:06:02.889 --> 01:06:04.809
Before you go, I just want to say thank you.

01:06:04.909 --> 01:06:06.869
Thank you for being a part of the travel journey.

01:06:07.239 --> 01:06:09.659
Every time you show up here, you're choosing

01:06:09.659 --> 01:06:12.800
growth, clarity, and the deeper work of becoming

01:06:12.800 --> 01:06:15.079
who you're meant to be in this world. And if

01:06:15.079 --> 01:06:17.840
you're ready to reconnect with what truly lights

01:06:17.840 --> 01:06:20.500
you up, I created something powerful that can

01:06:20.500 --> 01:06:23.800
help you. It's called The Empowered Path, Seven

01:06:23.800 --> 01:06:26.840
Days to Reclaim Your Purpose and Passion. It's

01:06:26.840 --> 01:06:29.579
a beautifully designed guided workbook that walks

01:06:29.579 --> 01:06:32.250
you through a week of powerful prompts. clarity

01:06:32.250 --> 01:06:35.650
building tools, and real mindset shifts. Now

01:06:35.650 --> 01:06:38.409
you can get instant access to it today. It's

01:06:38.409 --> 01:06:41.670
a small investment for a huge return, your energy,

01:06:42.170 --> 01:06:45.429
your clarity, your alignment. And if you want

01:06:45.429 --> 01:06:48.110
to take it deeper, check this out. I'm offering

01:06:48.110 --> 01:06:51.250
a limited number of free 30 minute purpose coaching

01:06:51.250 --> 01:06:54.119
sessions. No pressure. No pitch, just space for

01:06:54.119 --> 01:06:56.820
you to reconnect with your direction, your gifts

01:06:56.820 --> 01:06:59.739
and what's next. So you can grab the guide and

01:06:59.739 --> 01:07:02.219
book your session at the link in the show notes.

01:07:02.940 --> 01:07:05.539
Let's not just go through the motions. Let's

01:07:05.539 --> 01:07:08.780
really walk this path on purpose. I appreciate

01:07:08.780 --> 01:07:11.559
you. And like we always say, let's make thriving

01:07:11.559 --> 01:07:13.820
our new normal. And I'll talk to you soon.