1
00:00:09,510 --> 00:00:15,900
Welcome to Moore in the Word, a podcast of Moore Theological College in Sydney, Australia, that seeks

2
00:00:15,900 --> 00:00:21,990
to glorify God through biblically sound, thought-provoking and challenging talks and interviews.

3
00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:32,145
In this episode, from an interview that I, Karen Beilharz, conducted in August 2024, Sarah Rootes, Assistant Pastor for Kids

4
00:00:32,175 --> 00:00:39,045
and Youth at Crossroads Christian Church in Canberra, Australia, tells the story of how she was introduced to Jesus, how

5
00:00:39,045 --> 00:00:45,285
she came to do children's and youth ministry, and how her study at Moore Theological College has helped her in her work.

6
00:00:45,885 --> 00:00:47,385
We hope you find the episode helpful.

7
00:00:53,895 --> 00:00:59,640
So, Sarah, can you tell us a little bit about yourself, like where you grew up, who lives in your family, that sort of thing?

8
00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:00,210
Yeah.

9
00:01:00,630 --> 00:01:03,660
I grew up out in Central West, New South Wales.

10
00:01:03,660 --> 00:01:12,510
So I was born in Parkes, but grew up mainly in Dubbo, where dad worked as an electrician and mom worked in one of the local schools.

11
00:01:13,050 --> 00:01:16,770
We lived on a, not a property, but like five acres outside of town.

12
00:01:16,770 --> 00:01:23,940
And so it was kind of nice to have a bit of that peace and quiet of not being in the hustle and bustle of a country town or country city.

13
00:01:24,270 --> 00:01:26,250
It was me and my three siblings as well.

14
00:01:26,310 --> 00:01:30,240
And so was there up until the time I came to Canberra for university.

15
00:01:30,300 --> 00:01:30,630
Wow.

16
00:01:31,020 --> 00:01:32,910
And are you family Christian, non Christian?

17
00:01:33,285 --> 00:01:39,134
We were raised in a Christian household, but since I was a child, things have kind of, I guess, become complicated

18
00:01:39,134 --> 00:01:46,545
for some of us, and so mom and dad raised us to know who God is and have a personal relationship with him.

19
00:01:46,545 --> 00:01:56,895
But since then, it's only my mom and my younger brother and I who still follow Jesus and the others have slightly complicated relationship.

20
00:01:58,845 --> 00:02:05,685
So basically, has there ever been a time when you haven't known about Jesus—haven't known the gospel?

21
00:02:05,985 --> 00:02:09,764
Yeah, I can't recall a time not knowing about him, but.

22
00:02:10,425 --> 00:02:16,305
They're having key moments in life where I guess there were giant leaps forward

23
00:02:16,305 --> 00:02:21,945
maybe or big aha moments of understanding who Jesus is and what he's done for us.

24
00:02:21,945 --> 00:02:26,985
So like I think one of the clearest moments as a child was I was around eight and they kind of were.

25
00:02:27,225 --> 00:02:31,575
Speaking about heaven and our sin and the realities of those things.

26
00:02:31,575 --> 00:02:39,525
And I was at church and they invited us to kind of make that decision to follow Jesus and have eternity secured and taken care of.

27
00:02:39,525 --> 00:02:44,355
And that really appealed to an anxious mind that I had as a child and thought if I know

28
00:02:44,355 --> 00:02:48,255
the future's taken care of, maybe that will, that's just one less thing on my mind.

29
00:02:48,255 --> 00:02:56,265
But I do remember wanting that really clearly, like wanting to know Jesus and wanting part of that family and that trusting him.

30
00:02:57,165 --> 00:02:58,155
Of his death on the cross.

31
00:02:58,155 --> 00:03:01,965
And so it was that kind of really clear gospel, will you follow him moment.

32
00:03:02,415 --> 00:03:11,655
But it wasn't until very late in high school or early uni years where I started to understand that grace of being saved meant for how I live now.

33
00:03:12,105 --> 00:03:17,595
And so got to have some of those aha moments of like, oh God, God's not only faithful and takes care

34
00:03:17,595 --> 00:03:23,595
of our future, but he's actually had to forgive what's happened in the past and like, forgive my sin.

35
00:03:24,255 --> 00:03:28,665
And so recognizing it wasn't just like behaving well because I was a Christian, but

36
00:03:28,665 --> 00:03:33,705
actually wanting to please God because of the undeserved gift of grace that he's given us.

37
00:03:34,245 --> 00:03:39,885
And so that was really awesome because it just exploded my life in terms of that personal relationship with God and like

38
00:03:40,095 --> 00:03:47,685
wanting to be in the word and kind of going, oh, I can act differently in this situation now as I relate to my friends.

39
00:03:47,685 --> 00:03:52,515
Or it's not just to be good, but actually there's that love and grace that's driving us.

40
00:03:53,175 --> 00:03:59,235
I think from that moment, there was a moment in uni where it was like, all right, well I keep following Jesus or maybe I'll go my own way.

41
00:03:59,685 --> 00:04:06,435
And I kind of decided to go all in with Jesus, I suppose, or really kind of say no to the other way of life.

42
00:04:06,735 --> 00:04:13,275
And yeah, I think since then that it's been really good to see how God continuously reveals himself to me.

43
00:04:13,275 --> 00:04:15,435
But in doing that, I understand myself better.

44
00:04:15,525 --> 00:04:19,755
And so anyway, I think that's what I'm learning in the last five years.

45
00:04:22,790 --> 00:04:28,350
I, I do that by knowing God well, and that helps me just be a part of his

46
00:04:28,350 --> 00:04:32,220
family and community and kind of serve in those ways and it's been really nice.

47
00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:33,030
Yeah.

48
00:04:34,260 --> 00:04:36,510
So what were you doing at uni study wise?

49
00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:38,910
I went to do sports management, which.

50
00:04:38,985 --> 00:04:43,455
I wasn't because a great desire to become like Jerry McGuire or something like that.

51
00:04:43,455 --> 00:04:46,185
But I really loved sport.

52
00:04:46,215 --> 00:04:51,165
I love the competition and community of that and I didn't think I could do physio.

53
00:04:51,315 --> 00:04:55,245
So anyway, ended up there doing sports management mainly I wanted to be in Canberra.

54
00:04:55,245 --> 00:05:00,195
I know God thing maybe, or I just kind of knew would be a good fit.

55
00:05:02,580 --> 00:05:09,315
Started sports management but cared more about the atheist group on campus and church things more than I ever did what I was studying.

56
00:05:10,065 --> 00:05:12,330
What particular sports are you into?

57
00:05:12,330 --> 00:05:16,740
I grew up playing soccer and cricket and so really enjoyed those.

58
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,880
I got into touch while I was at uni and a bit of ultimate Frisbee.

59
00:05:21,660 --> 00:05:23,490
I kind kind of had the attitude of, I

60
00:05:25,620 --> 00:05:29,370
kind of test skills, the strategy of sport too.

61
00:05:31,905 --> 00:05:32,115
How

62
00:05:34,815 --> 00:05:35,475
living best

63
00:05:39,945 --> 00:05:41,055
in and like,

64
00:05:42,495 --> 00:05:45,990
at what point did you start thinking, oh, I should be doing.

65
00:05:47,685 --> 00:05:53,385
You did say that you cared more about what was going on with the A group and at church and stuff rather than studying.

66
00:05:53,835 --> 00:05:53,865
Mm.

67
00:05:54,045 --> 00:05:57,705
But at what point did somebody tap you on the shoulder and say, Hmm, have you thought about ministry?

68
00:05:57,735 --> 00:05:58,005
Yeah.

69
00:05:58,005 --> 00:05:58,935
Was a tap on the shoulder.

70
00:05:58,935 --> 00:06:03,105
I think I kind of started to get involved with leadership things at church, so

71
00:06:03,435 --> 00:06:09,044
I was leading a bible study for church and teaching kids on Sunday mornings.

72
00:06:09,405 --> 00:06:13,544
I was kind of involved in the leadership stuff with the A PS group.

73
00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,610
And being to read the Bible with people and think about it in that way.

74
00:06:18,270 --> 00:06:23,190
And I think I probably would never have considered it until someone I'd been reading the Bible with.

75
00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:31,260
She sat me down, well, she was doing Ts, so she was probably on the lookout for people like me, but sat me down and said, you thought about this.

76
00:06:31,470 --> 00:06:39,570
And I honestly hadn't, because I think for lots of reasons, but growing up, I don't think I'd seen that many people in formal ministry roles.

77
00:06:39,810 --> 00:06:42,180
I don't think I'd seen that many women in formal ministry roles.

78
00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:48,210
And so I really thought it had to be this thing that like God had this call on your life from the time you were a child.

79
00:06:48,660 --> 00:06:54,060
Like I think, I believe the Amy Carmichael type of stories of like, I'm gonna go and be a missionary overseas or something.

80
00:06:54,060 --> 00:06:55,290
And I'm like, that's not me.

81
00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:57,270
So I can't be me in this space.

82
00:06:57,420 --> 00:07:05,460
But I always had a deep love for kids and seeing kids learn the Bible and had kind of grown so much myself through others reading the

83
00:07:05,460 --> 00:07:11,250
Bible with me so that when someone kind of tapped me on the shoulder, I was like, oh yeah, I mean, if God could use me in that way.

84
00:07:11,655 --> 00:07:12,284
I'd be keen.

85
00:07:12,284 --> 00:07:19,935
And then did attend like some like MTS Mission-Minded style, I think it was called Spur back in the day, but went to those and kind

86
00:07:19,935 --> 00:07:27,015
of got reminded of the reality of heaven and hell and the brevity of life and the centrality of the cross and those types of things.

87
00:07:27,015 --> 00:07:30,825
And so came away from those going, well, if not me, then who?

88
00:07:31,034 --> 00:07:33,344
And I'm kind of willing, so lets go.

89
00:07:34,275 --> 00:07:38,085
And so year after uni to honor my parents.

90
00:07:41,340 --> 00:07:45,270
Wanted me to use the degree they had helped pay for when, that's fair enough.

91
00:07:45,690 --> 00:07:50,580
But yeah, began MTS in 2014 just after I'd done that one year of work.

92
00:07:50,820 --> 00:07:55,980
So Canberras was at that time, linked with Crossroads Christian Church.

93
00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:58,260
And so you did a dual MTS.

94
00:07:58,260 --> 00:08:01,020
So I was on the campus of a NU with students.

95
00:08:06,104 --> 00:08:10,664
On a Sunday morning with Crossroads and yeah, learning how to coordinate a

96
00:08:10,664 --> 00:08:14,955
ministry like that and write programs and train leaders and things like that.

97
00:08:15,255 --> 00:08:17,445
And so yeah, it was a really good two years.

98
00:08:17,445 --> 00:08:22,034
I learned there's a lot of like self reflect and learning how the behind the

99
00:08:22,034 --> 00:08:25,544
scenes of church and ministry works, that there's a lot questions you need to ask.

100
00:08:28,065 --> 00:08:28,485
Yeah.

101
00:08:29,850 --> 00:08:33,240
I wouldn't have used these words back then, but you know, learning that God's at work

102
00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:37,860
and we trust him to be at work, but we also need to plan and do work alongside that.

103
00:08:37,860 --> 00:08:40,260
And so, yeah, it was really helpful in that way.

104
00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:46,650
And as I was coming to the end of MTS, I wasn't quite ready to come to College for various

105
00:08:46,650 --> 00:08:53,070
reasons, so God provided a job at another church here in Canberra to be their kids minister.

106
00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:55,770
And so I worked there for two years.

107
00:08:57,359 --> 00:09:00,270
Program training, being in the youth ministry.

108
00:09:00,359 --> 00:09:01,229
So that was really helpful.

109
00:09:01,229 --> 00:09:03,660
By the time I end, like I College,

110
00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:06,900
College at point in.

111
00:09:07,829 --> 00:09:07,890
Yeah.

112
00:09:08,790 --> 00:09:12,300
So you obviously have a heart for kids and youth ministry.

113
00:09:12,300 --> 00:09:12,660
Yes.

114
00:09:12,700 --> 00:09:17,290
And you did mention you got a deep love for kids and seeing kids learn the Bible.

115
00:09:17,620 --> 00:09:23,230
Is there other things in particular that make you really love that area of ministry and have the passion for it?

116
00:09:23,380 --> 00:09:32,140
When I remember the people who taught me the Bible, like as a kid, and it was my parents, but I watched my mom serve in the kids' ministry,

117
00:09:32,620 --> 00:09:38,770
so that model, but like the other older people in church, she taught me from the Bible as well and wanted us to learn about these things.

118
00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:42,390
When I was growing up, I didn't actually benefit from her ministry, but there

119
00:09:42,390 --> 00:09:46,349
was a woman at my church in Dubbo who I think reflected this deep love too.

120
00:09:46,349 --> 00:09:49,050
She just cared for the young people in the church.

121
00:09:49,050 --> 00:09:55,920
And so they would do very creative term programs, but would bring on the youth to be junior leaders

122
00:09:55,920 --> 00:10:01,290
and things like that, and cared about them loving church as well and learning from the Bible.

123
00:10:01,290 --> 00:10:04,079
And so I think those things were kind of like the building blocks.

124
00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:11,250
Crossroads, that idea that they really wanted to see kids, not just learn

125
00:10:11,250 --> 00:10:16,620
stories from the Bible, but actually learn the God of the, and learn about Jesus.

126
00:10:16,740 --> 00:10:18,875
And so at.

127
00:10:20,339 --> 00:10:26,219
Which I think I would've believed for myself, but when I look back, I was like, oh, I think I just learn stories about kilter.

128
00:10:26,219 --> 00:10:28,349
And it was very much like Jesus focused.

129
00:10:28,349 --> 00:10:35,160
And so this idea that we could teach the Bible in its entirety and like teach kids about

130
00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,420
Jesus from all through the Bible and with biblical theology and stuff was new to me.

131
00:10:39,870 --> 00:10:47,370
And so I think I just fell in love with the idea of creatively teaching and age appropriately teaching the Bible to people so that at any age.

132
00:10:49,755 --> 00:10:50,474
Is and.

133
00:10:59,324 --> 00:11:01,964
So I just love being able to walk alongside them.

134
00:11:01,964 --> 00:11:08,655
And lately at church there's a young girl who just loves to tell us how much she's encouraged by her leaders and the impact that

135
00:11:08,655 --> 00:11:16,185
they're having on her life and other kids who drag their parents home early to come to our after school kids club and things like that.

136
00:11:16,275 --> 00:11:21,224
Again, because of the leaders and the friends that are there, and there's just something special in their enthusiasm too.

137
00:11:21,614 --> 00:11:24,104
They see a good thing and they know after it.

138
00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:29,550
You said you weren't quite ready for College after MTS, and so you took that other job.

139
00:11:29,940 --> 00:11:29,970
Mm.

140
00:11:30,030 --> 00:11:32,970
Was it that made you not feel like you were ready for College?

141
00:11:33,270 --> 00:11:34,500
Yeah, it was various things.

142
00:11:34,500 --> 00:11:41,370
I think largely I'm not great with change, and so there were a few decisions behind going, what do I do

143
00:11:41,370 --> 00:11:48,900
at the end of MTS that were, I guess, overwhelming me in a sense, but one, it was like, am ready move.

144
00:11:51,750 --> 00:11:52,080
Right.

145
00:11:54,390 --> 00:11:56,010
Which College do I choose to go to?

146
00:11:56,970 --> 00:12:00,750
I think a little bit of question of self confided of do I actually have what it takes?

147
00:12:01,020 --> 00:12:02,430
Like College is a big investment.

148
00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:04,319
What if I'm just faking it or something?

149
00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:10,860
Im like, maybe I'm faking in ministry and people are saying I'd be, but maybe I wouldn't actually be.

150
00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:19,454
I think I wasn't quite convinced of the need for theological education doing two.

151
00:12:22,845 --> 00:12:26,475
I couldn't quite see how it was benefiting those who were training me.

152
00:12:26,565 --> 00:12:32,085
And I think I needed to kind of, well, in the end, being in the role of the kids minister, kids in youth space, it

153
00:12:32,085 --> 00:12:37,605
was like, oh, I need this foundation in this grounding myself, because I was always having to go to someone else.

154
00:12:37,605 --> 00:12:40,425
And so my work was just twice as hard most of the time because.

155
00:12:40,950 --> 00:12:44,790
I couldn't start the process of working out how to help somebody by myself.

156
00:12:44,790 --> 00:12:48,240
I kept needing one of the other pastors to help me out or something like that.

157
00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:55,350
And then just some self-growth stuff I think in there was just still working through how to do life well and things like that.

158
00:12:55,440 --> 00:13:02,130
So going into College, did you have any particular expectations of how it would be or any anxiety or that sort of thing?

159
00:13:03,330 --> 00:13:08,370
I hadn't studied in a long, it was five years since I finished my, when I got there.

160
00:13:09,420 --> 00:13:15,390
I hadn't been great at study during university, and I thought that I had been because I was

161
00:13:15,390 --> 00:13:21,480
distracted by other things, or I guess a belief that maybe I'm just not great academically.

162
00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:26,280
And so I was a bit nervous about just the study side of it, and it did take me probably

163
00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:30,210
the better half of the first semester to work out actually how to get content in.

164
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,870
Everyone was convinced you'd kind of make friends for life there and I was a bit

165
00:13:40,290 --> 00:13:46,350
skeptical at that at first, or, yeah, or just like the in community side of it.

166
00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:51,180
I could understand the benefits of, but also I was nervous of what that would be like.

167
00:13:51,780 --> 00:13:56,400
I just had come out of a very difficult house situation in 2017 beforehand, so it.

168
00:13:57,630 --> 00:13:59,370
What will my roommates be like?

169
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:06,810
Mm. But yeah, I probably, for the most part, and probably throughout my entire college degree, was always mostly fearful or anxious

170
00:14:06,810 --> 00:14:13,949
about that being found out as like being a fake amongst the real people or something like, so just the imposter syndrome of like.

171
00:14:14,385 --> 00:14:16,454
Am I really on the right path here?

172
00:14:16,454 --> 00:14:23,415
Like could it be that I love God enough or have a heart for a certain type of people and for the whole time that was there.

173
00:14:23,415 --> 00:14:29,235
And then it probably took about the four years to work through the fact that we've all a for God and it's gonna express itself differently.

174
00:14:29,235 --> 00:14:34,665
And so you can just love people's strengths and be proud of your own and those kinds.

175
00:14:40,425 --> 00:14:44,392
People, again, their strengths and weaknesses and my own and things like that.

176
00:14:44,895 --> 00:14:45,105
Yep.

177
00:14:45,195 --> 00:14:45,525
Yeah.

178
00:14:45,615 --> 00:14:52,335
So during your time at College, did it work out that the study aspect was the most challenging thing?

179
00:14:52,455 --> 00:14:53,295
Was there something else?

180
00:14:53,655 --> 00:14:56,745
Did your time overlap with Covid slightly as well?

181
00:14:56,925 --> 00:14:57,495
Yeah, it did.

182
00:14:57,495 --> 00:15:01,365
So I suppose you could say study in some ways was the least of my worries.

183
00:15:01,695 --> 00:15:04,305
My first year we were moved outta Carilion.

184
00:15:04,845 --> 00:15:07,965
Second year there was like carilion stuff kind of being finalized.

185
00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:12,030
And fourth year was Covid 2.0.

186
00:15:12,150 --> 00:15:16,770
So yeah, disrupted kind of study patterns and community life, you could say.

187
00:15:17,250 --> 00:15:23,700
I think I also over the time, had to come to terms with living with anxiety.

188
00:15:24,330 --> 00:15:28,170
Kind of knew I had anxiety before I got to College, but hadn't really accepted it yet.

189
00:15:30,510 --> 00:15:38,340
Over those four years where reaching like rock bottom and trying to work out how my brain works and interprets the world and things like that.

190
00:15:38,580 --> 00:15:40,110
And so, yeah.

191
00:15:40,110 --> 00:15:44,970
And normally brought on by fairly considerable stresses outside of that.

192
00:15:44,970 --> 00:15:52,605
So yeah, things like moving or not knowing how we're gonna study or Yeah, in fourth year was a combination of.

193
00:15:55,110 --> 00:16:00,630
In two weeks and my nan was dying and something was happening anyway, was full on.

194
00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:03,930
Again, living through it, not great on the other side of it.

195
00:16:04,620 --> 00:16:07,680
Really thankful for what God was doing in that time.

196
00:16:08,130 --> 00:16:16,200
Really great to be able to be learning about while you cope with anxiety in some ways and around you.

197
00:16:17,700 --> 00:16:18,900
The study essay.

198
00:16:19,665 --> 00:16:29,834
So helpful just to kind of be reflecting on those aspects of the Christian life or on a certain aspect of God's character or like the work of

199
00:16:29,834 --> 00:16:38,625
Christ, or even just your death, maybe like you're just doing Greek, you kind of marveling at all that God's actually given us in those ways, but.

200
00:16:38,969 --> 00:16:43,439
It was just like the perfect combination of like you're studying, but then I did have this space to actually be working through the

201
00:16:43,439 --> 00:16:51,689
personal stuff as well, to kind of come out the other side with a much more realistic view of the way my mind works and approaches

202
00:16:51,750 --> 00:16:58,574
things, but then having the foundation of, uh, really strong understanding of the Bible to kind of work that through as well.

203
00:16:58,829 --> 00:17:02,189
Was there anything that surprised you about College while you were here?

204
00:17:02,310 --> 00:17:02,854
Probably a lot.

205
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:08,780
Part of the quick decision making was that I did no research into more at all when I first got there.

206
00:17:08,810 --> 00:17:10,190
This is gonna sound so silly.

207
00:17:10,670 --> 00:17:16,490
I was surprised at the Anglican ness of it, which is just like, it's the Anglican training College.

208
00:17:16,490 --> 00:17:20,240
So I dunno what I expected, but I didn't grow up in an Anglican church.

209
00:17:20,450 --> 00:17:24,680
I knew of it as a denomination and kind of what they believed.

210
00:17:25,260 --> 00:17:31,919
So I think that was surprising to me to learn about the history of the Anglican Church and their place in history.

211
00:17:31,919 --> 00:17:37,530
Like not only as a denomination, but just kind of coming outta the English reformation and things like that.

212
00:17:37,919 --> 00:17:42,600
And then just getting used to chapels and prayer book services and things like that, which was really great.

213
00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:47,639
Uh, I really enjoyed them and felt enriched by them, so that was a nice surprise.

214
00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:50,280
I think the community again.

215
00:17:54,855 --> 00:18:01,695
People or maybe like the extracurriculars of being at College, like it's really different to your university experience

216
00:18:02,055 --> 00:18:09,405
and even more so now you can kind of tap in and out uni, watch things online, you go to yours and things like that.

217
00:18:09,405 --> 00:18:13,905
But the community adds a richness that also adds trickiness, I suppose.

218
00:18:14,355 --> 00:18:21,254
You've got lots of different desires and expectations, not your but, and.

219
00:18:22,035 --> 00:18:22,065
I.

220
00:18:35,415 --> 00:18:38,085
Two minutes call.

221
00:18:46,270 --> 00:18:49,030
Way it its way into my heart a little bit.

222
00:18:49,120 --> 00:18:53,080
What were some of the big things God was teaching you during your College time?

223
00:18:53,110 --> 00:19:00,280
Because you already talked a little bit about how you were learning about God and learning about yourself and how the two have fed into each other.

224
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:01,540
Do you wanna add to that at all?

225
00:19:02,410 --> 00:19:05,889
I think I, that you can never learn enough about God.

226
00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:11,880
A bottomless ocean or something like that.

227
00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:13,110
Like it just keeps going.

228
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:20,310
I think came away with a deeper appreciation of, I talk about this to you in in orientation week, but like you've

229
00:19:20,310 --> 00:19:26,910
got biblical studies and then Christian thought and then Christian ministry to cover the, that you're doing.

230
00:19:27,300 --> 00:19:36,000
And I think maybe if you'd asked me beforehand what I thought I was gonna be learning at College again, I probably thought up in biblical.

231
00:19:39,120 --> 00:19:45,840
But actually because God is so relational preparing for ministry, it wasn't just about filling up the knowledge

232
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:51,659
tank and knowing the original language or being able to sound like a commentary when you come outta it, but

233
00:19:51,750 --> 00:19:59,520
that College was really keen to shape our character alongside that and to shape our thinking so that we could.

234
00:20:01,410 --> 00:20:01,980
Up in that.

235
00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:03,570
And so that's being reminded.

236
00:20:03,570 --> 00:20:05,955
God is the God of the, and then he works

237
00:20:06,120 --> 00:20:07,080
through all these different ways.

238
00:20:07,140 --> 00:20:07,470
Yeah.

239
00:20:07,815 --> 00:20:13,560
Now that you've finished up at More, so you're Crossroads Christian Church in Canberra, what do you do there?

240
00:20:13,860 --> 00:20:15,450
And also what is the church like?

241
00:20:15,930 --> 00:20:19,140
So I am a kids in youth pastor at Crossroads.

242
00:20:19,290 --> 00:20:21,690
We really wanna reach Canberra.

243
00:20:22,110 --> 00:20:23,610
We are based in North Canberra.

244
00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:32,250
We wanna see disciples of Jesus in Canberra and beyond, but based in North Canberra, we have four services that meet concurrently on a Sunday.

245
00:20:32,250 --> 00:20:35,580
So two in like the inner north over the four services.

246
00:20:35,580 --> 00:20:38,310
We might have like close to 800 each week.

247
00:20:38,610 --> 00:20:40,290
That's including our kids in youth.

248
00:20:40,530 --> 00:20:46,260
I work with Andy Copeman, who's also in the youth space, and Ru, who's in the kids space.

249
00:20:46,260 --> 00:20:49,260
And so not quite right share, but we have.

250
00:20:52,020 --> 00:20:55,560
Between the three of usm, kind of this connection link between the two.

251
00:20:56,250 --> 00:21:02,160
I think that goal when I first came on was to help give unity to the kids in ministry overall.

252
00:21:02,220 --> 00:21:08,100
But in reality it's a little bit different to that, but it's lot of fun trying to work out how to do that with one another.

253
00:21:08,530 --> 00:21:12,585
So how has your training at Moore helped you in this role?

254
00:21:19,500 --> 00:21:21,420
And recognizing that missing foundation.

255
00:21:21,570 --> 00:21:27,030
Like I knew how to read my Bible and I knew how to read it well, but there was just this of like, how do you piece

256
00:21:27,030 --> 00:21:33,480
together doctrine and how do you know where to go for certain questions that people have and things like that.

257
00:21:34,140 --> 00:21:42,630
And I think the training at MORE really helped me to, I guess, fit all of those pieces that I've already had into a package.

258
00:21:43,020 --> 00:21:45,390
But I think about them for.

259
00:21:47,534 --> 00:21:53,774
I grew in my confidence of knowing the history behind why we think that certain things or the traditions

260
00:21:53,774 --> 00:21:59,865
we follow or thinking about, oh, there's this heresy of modalism, but that's actually not a new thing.

261
00:21:59,865 --> 00:22:02,175
It happened all the way back with the early church fathers.

262
00:22:02,355 --> 00:22:06,805
It helps you kind of piece together how we've been wrestling with God's revealed word the whole time.

263
00:22:06,805 --> 00:22:12,315
And so when it comes to questions that the youth or kids have, or trying to teach something.

264
00:22:13,055 --> 00:22:16,035
Practically, my program writing is much more filled out now.

265
00:22:16,335 --> 00:22:19,335
I'd be like, passage, teach it this way.

266
00:22:19,365 --> 00:22:26,925
But now I actually know how to help piece together a program in a more kind of—it has more and IT unit as opposed to.

267
00:22:28,649 --> 00:22:31,800
I mean, they're not embarrassing because I just haven't been trained yet.

268
00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:34,620
But the ones I wrote beforehand, I'm like, oh, what was I thinking?

269
00:22:35,159 --> 00:22:36,419
They're just missing things.

270
00:22:36,419 --> 00:22:43,620
They're missing that depth and that grounding that I think I only have now because of College and because of the things I learned there.

271
00:22:43,919 --> 00:22:50,429
To be able to hold the bigger picture together while zooming in, I think pastorally in.

272
00:22:54,554 --> 00:22:56,024
Probably College has helped me in that.

273
00:22:56,205 --> 00:23:03,405
Going back to that I know myself better and I know who I'm in God with greater confidence, and so it just

274
00:23:03,405 --> 00:23:08,205
means I'm thinking about myself less maybe when I wanna be thinking about the youth and caring for them.

275
00:23:08,834 --> 00:23:17,925
Just being able to spend that time at College to reflect on who God is and reflect on that in myself, I think has had great benefit.

276
00:23:18,330 --> 00:23:21,450
The first couple years, still a bit dicey after College, but now that I'm three years

277
00:23:21,450 --> 00:23:25,770
out, like much more settled and I think it just helps me be able to train my leaders.

278
00:23:26,340 --> 00:23:33,990
It helps me be able to direct them in discipling the youth or kids underneath them well, and thankful for that.

279
00:23:34,500 --> 00:23:35,100
Wonderful.

280
00:23:35,310 --> 00:23:43,170
Last question, what are the things that you love about serving in Canberra as opposed to the big cities or whatever?

281
00:23:43,350 --> 00:23:43,740
Yeah.

282
00:23:43,860 --> 00:23:45,540
What is it about this kind of ministry?

283
00:23:48,825 --> 00:23:52,305
The reason Canberra specifically is because I knew the team here.

284
00:23:52,725 --> 00:23:53,805
Again, that's that project thing.

285
00:23:53,805 --> 00:23:58,455
I was like, I could see myself serving here, the team I trusted and I knew I could work with them.

286
00:23:59,025 --> 00:24:05,505
But missionally, or I guess that what compelled me to actually come here, one reason I think I keep

287
00:24:05,505 --> 00:24:12,285
thinking about is because Canberra was so pivotal in my own walk with God or my own faith journey that

288
00:24:12,285 --> 00:24:17,055
like I often say, you know how they talk about developmental years with children and things like that.

289
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:23,850
I often say I had my developmental years here in Canberra, so like I grew up as a Christian here, and it only happened because

290
00:24:23,850 --> 00:24:32,400
of people serving here wanting to see young kids come in for uni leave with a love for Jesus, and serving him their whole lives.

291
00:24:33,030 --> 00:24:36,630
And so I'm really on board with that and I wanna see.

292
00:24:36,780 --> 00:24:41,010
I mean, everywhere you live is a type of bubble, but Canberra has a real public service,

293
00:24:41,250 --> 00:24:45,510
comfortable, because we're called the most comfortable city in the world or something like that.

294
00:24:46,110 --> 00:24:48,180
People's incomes are crazy high.

295
00:24:48,750 --> 00:24:54,389
There's a lot of political correctness in terms of people are thinking about policy and red tape and things like that.

296
00:24:54,389 --> 00:24:57,270
So there is this Canberra bubble we think in a very unique way.

297
00:24:57,899 --> 00:25:00,780
First thing that bubble when I went to Sydney was a real shock too.

298
00:25:00,780 --> 00:25:01,800
Like, yeah, I know.

299
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:05,010
I know, but actually it's, and so it's hard work in that sense.

300
00:25:06,780 --> 00:25:13,199
Move slower than in other areas, but just again, wanting to see kids and youth not despairing at the state

301
00:25:13,199 --> 00:25:19,830
of the world or being drawn into political correctness or even that desire to follow jobs and career.

302
00:25:21,030 --> 00:25:22,979
You just wanna see them on fire for Jesus.

303
00:25:22,979 --> 00:25:29,969
And so like a goal for youth is to see kids leave school on Jesus and come.

304
00:25:35,580 --> 00:25:37,379
And wanting to serve him from a young age.

305
00:25:37,889 --> 00:25:40,679
Being able to do that with a team that I love and trust is really great.

306
00:25:40,679 --> 00:25:44,730
Yeah, growing up regionally too, it's just like resources.

307
00:25:45,060 --> 00:25:49,139
People who are there to stay, people who wanna invest in your life.

308
00:25:49,770 --> 00:25:54,300
I mean, you need that everywhere, but it's just harder to get in regional areas and so.

309
00:25:55,290 --> 00:25:55,649
College.

310
00:25:55,649 --> 00:26:02,250
I was considering jobs in Queensland or like out in Armadale, or if I knew people out there, I'd probably have gone anywhere.

311
00:26:02,639 --> 00:26:07,979
It's kind of that I don't want kids to miss out on what I missed out on, but I don't think I actually missed out on anything too much.

312
00:26:07,979 --> 00:26:11,370
But you wanna be that person, the people I had.

313
00:26:11,370 --> 00:26:13,169
You wanna be that for them too.

314
00:26:20,235 --> 00:26:24,925
Thank you for listening to Moore in the Word, a podcast of Moore Theological College.

315
00:26:25,515 --> 00:26:30,165
Our vision as a College is to see God glorified by men and women living for

316
00:26:30,165 --> 00:26:34,875
and proclaiming Jesus Christ, growing healthy churches and reaching the lost.

317
00:26:35,415 --> 00:26:40,725
This interview is just one of many from the College's 100 Ministry Stories project.

318
00:26:41,325 --> 00:26:46,740
For more than 160 years, Moore Theological College has been sending men and women into a wide

319
00:26:46,740 --> 00:26:52,140
range of ministries in Sydney, every state of Australia and almost every continent in the world.

320
00:26:53,310 --> 00:26:59,490
The 100 Ministry Stories project helps us to remember and praise God for the work that he has been doing in the world in our times.

321
00:27:00,090 --> 00:27:04,650
Remembering what God has done in our lives helps us respond to our world steadfast hope.

322
00:27:05,490 --> 00:27:12,030
It is our prayer that as you hear how the Lord is at work, you'll be encouraged in your faith and built up in joyful assurance.

323
00:27:13,095 --> 00:27:14,804
Find out more on our website.

324
00:27:15,165 --> 00:27:21,925
That's more moore.edu.au/100, spelled out in numerals.

325
00:27:22,485 --> 00:27:28,245
If you are a graduate and keen to contribute to the 100 Ministry Stories project, we would love to hear from you.

326
00:27:28,725 --> 00:27:33,195
Get in contact with the Communications Team to express your interest or to find out more.

327
00:27:39,075 --> 00:27:43,935
You can find out more and register by going to the Moore College website: moore.edu.au.

328
00:27:44,055 --> 00:27:45,575
That's moore.edu.au.

329
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:52,185
If you have not already done so, we encourage you to subscribe to our podcast

330
00:27:52,185 --> 00:27:55,815
through your favourite podcast platform so that you'll never miss an episode.

331
00:27:56,774 --> 00:28:01,814
For past episodes, further resources, and to make a tax deductible donation to support

332
00:28:01,814 --> 00:28:09,635
the work of the College and its mission, please visit our website at moore.edu.au.

333
00:28:10,905 --> 00:28:16,665
If you found this episode helpful, please share it with a friend and leave a review on your platform of choice.

334
00:28:17,495 --> 00:28:25,665
We always benefit from feedback from our listeners, so if you'd like to get in touch, you can email us at comms@moore.edu.au.

335
00:28:27,064 --> 00:28:35,024
The Moore in the Word Podcast was edited and produced by me, Karen Beilharz, and the Communications Team at Moore Theological College.

336
00:28:35,645 --> 00:28:39,495
The music for our podcast was provided by MarkJuly from PixaBay.

337
00:28:40,235 --> 00:28:41,135
Until next time.