All right, hello everyone.
This is podcast number 19.
Today, today we'll be going over a reaction to an Ask Me Anything between Mia Bao, who's
from DAO Base AI, to Sebastian Ogier, who is the co-founder and CEO of the Sandbox.
This happened Friday, August 23, 2024.
It's very fresh, it just happened.
And I thought the questions that Mia asked, Mia also is on the advisory board for the
Sandbox DAO, and she asked really good questions.
And it was very, very timely to what's going on in the Sandbox DAO forums, as well as some
sips that I have underway.
So I wanted to do a reaction to this video, it's about 15 minutes long, and I had immediate
thoughts.
It was almost all of us positive.
I really liked this AMA.
I thought it confirmed a lot of stuff that needed to be said and things that we can use
as the DAO and the Sand Fam to be a DAO.
So without further ado, let's go.
Scope of the talk today is a reaction.
It'll also be part opinion, so I'll offer my thoughts as we go along.
Disclaimer is that I do not represent the Sandbox game or the Sandbox Foundation, which
is the DAO.
I am not your legal or financial advisor, and nothing I say is to be taken as legal
or financial advice.
My name is Lancer.
I'm the SandDAL podcast host.
SandDAL is a podcast all about the Sandbox DAO.
News, updates, opinions, interviews.
I lead the MetaWorlds team.
We have two experiences up on Sandbox and been a part of the Sandbox since mid-season
one, midway through season one.
And I love the DAO, its intersection of business, community, and gaming.
And it's right up my alley in my professional world.
So I love it.
Scoreboard nothing's changed.
Still have two SIPs that are in vote right now, SIP 11 and 12, Sandbox Academy in the
Philippines with Mark Baggo and the Sandbox Ambassador Program by the Sandbox team itself.
Mark and I did our interview on his SIP.
That's SandDAL podcast episode 12.
So go check that out.
Really, really good speaking with Mark.
Loved speaking with Mark and what he's trying to do in building the Sandbox Academy in the
Philippines.
Then we have one SIP in the draft and draft on forums.
That's the NFT Evolution, Crafting and NFT Drops by Crypto Diplo.
So that one we are scheduled in the next couple weeks between Diplo and I.
So we're looking forward to that.
And that brings us to seven SIPs approved, three SIPs not approved, and one SIP withdrawn.
The SIP 9 and 10 both did not pass because neither of them met quorum.
So the 30 million that we need for a SIP to be approved or disapproved.
In which case, it didn't meet that so it was automatically disapproved.
Checkbook we're still at 1.9 million SAN spent, which is 13% of the 15.5 million SAN budget.
DAOBase.ai statistics.
There are 1,808 voters in the Sandbox DAO, 211,000 token holders.
And just really, really cool stats.
Go check them out, DAOBase.ai and search for a Sandbox DAO.
So without further ado, let's get after what we're here for today, which was the AMA between
Sebastian who runs the Sandbox company and Mia Bao who runs DAOBase.ai.
She's also on the advisory board.
She has some Q&A for him and really, really cool.
So without further ado.
Here we go.
I'll be commenting as this goes along.
All right.
So let's get the Twitter space started.
So hi, everyone.
Thank you so much for joining today's Twitter space with us.
And this is Mia from DAOBase.ai.
We are super excited to have our honored guest Sebastian, co-founder and CEO of the Sandbox
and also the honored council member of the Sandbox DAO.
So welcome, Sebastian.
How are you doing?
And yeah, please say hi to our audience here.
Thank you, Mia.
And hello, everyone.
And I had a Sam Bao podcast with Sebastian.
Was that not long ago?
All right.
Let's get started with today's Twitter space.
So, Sebastian, can you tell us a little more about the Sandbox DAO?
Episode eight was my interview with him.
So you actually got into the office space and then decided to bring the Sandbox game
into the crypto world.
Well, so as far as I remember, as a child, I received my first video game console as
a gift.
It was a Super Nintendo and I played Super Mario World.
And at that time, I really got hooked into it.
And I said, oh, one day I'll love to make my own video game.
And I figure out like, okay, what kind of studies do you need to do to make your own
video game without the jobs leading to that industry?
And I said, oh, I'm going to do a video game.
And I figured out like, okay, what kind of studies do you need to do to make your own
video game without the jobs leading to that industry?
And I found it was quite actually difficult to require long study, special schools.
And that's an industry where like the barrier to entry to make video games back then on
console and PC was very high, both in terms of like a cost of development, skills required
and so on.
So yeah, big studios,
big studios like BioWare, Bungee, they dominated the market.
And when I saw those devices, and I saw like people started to make games and they were
again like small team, or even like just one individual person doing the game, I felt like,
well, that's the right moment, you know, like, let's get into this, into gaming again, and
let's see what kind of game we can do on those new devices, leveraging the different things
like the touch screens, the accelerometer and so on.
And in 2011, we co-founded a first mobile game studio that was implementing like free
to play and brands and IPs to create like storytelling character driven video game,
as well as what became sandbox our first big success.
It co-founded that with Arthur Madrid.
If you search in Google, you can still find all the original pitches that he did.
The both of them did together.
I hope I can get him on the podcast, interview him in the early days as well.
Because he spoke quite a bit on the white paper and how he wanted the sandbox to be
run.
He was there as it was acquired by Animoca.
So he had quite a cool perspective.
So they found it in 2011, 2012, and it wasn't until 2017 that they switched over to NFTs.
They were already passionate about the game, they loved creating, but because we didn't
provide a form of monetization and only social recognition by featuring their content on
the gallery, that wasn't sufficient to keep them hooked over a long time.
And I didn't find a solution to that problem.
Like sometimes I could make a contract, I could contact a few of them and we worked
with a hundred, but that became quickly unmanageable to many creators.
And until 2017, and I found about blockchain and NFTs, like discovering crypto hities and
seeing as a game that people could actually buy content, virtual cat from each other.
It's interesting to think crypto can set all this off for him.
Set him on a path to where we are today in the sandbox.
For the first time I could make payments to those creators, they could sell that content
outside of the game and make some revenue.
And that's how we say, let's apply NFTs to the sandbox.
Not just making virtual cat, but any content could become an NFT and could allow those
creators to monetize.
And it became the version that we know today.
We started from scratch, we built a platform, a game maker tool that's no code, a 3D editor,
a marketplace, a map.
And we've grown it applying all the experience we accumulated working with the brands.
Today we have over 400 brands.
We have six million users with a wallet and proud to already count the thousand three
hundred user generated content games on the map.
Yeah, amazing story.
So basically from first to get connected with blockchain back to 2017 and to grow such a
like a matter of a giant in the space.
So I'm kind of curious, how do you feel like from the first beginning until now, like the
same was it one of the largest metaverse project in the space.
Do you think from the people side and also from the technology side and from the community
side, is there any changes during this period of time, especially for those kind of three
circles already?
I feel like yes, we've seen various cycles.
I think like when we launched sandbox originally, we were already we kind of miss like the bull
market of 2015, 16 and 2017, maybe in 2018, 19 were more like a bear market already.
So we didn't.
So these opening questions are all about I don't think it was a bad thing because it
really is history in the build up to where we are today.
Like we have to first build a product, soft launch it or launch some product and then
grow a community of users.
Our target was a creator.
So we launched a three day tour first and we launched a game maker.
Then we introduced land for the first time in December 2019.
Back then they were not even in our own token.
If you're listening to this on podcast and Spotify, just check the link or watch the
VOD on YouTube and you can see where the broadcast was held on X Twitter.
Probably known as Twitter.
And like the exchanges were actually listing new tokens.
At that time, Binance didn't do any new token launch for close to a year.
And when they reopened their launch pad, which was one of the most successful platform they
had for introducing new tokens, they did it with one key thematic, which was gaming.
They wanted to show how gaming could drive adoption of cryptocurrencies and FT and send
and Axie AXS, the Axie Infinity token.
We were the two gaming tokens that were launched at that time.
And I'm really excited and happy that we made the choice to wait, to choose the right partner,
the right moment and the fact that we had the product already ready for the users who
discover sandbox for the first time to be onboarded, to have something to do, to participate
in the building the vision together with us.
And today we are ready like four years later and it's amazing to see like the community
has grown, the creators have grown all around the world.
And we continue to update the product, add more capabilities, more feature and launch
the DAO just three months ago, pursuing the vision of decentralization as well that NFTs
and blockchain alone.
So I pause it.
It's been really since I started December 2021, I think that's when I started.
It's grown a lot.
Even as just a gamer when I first played, this has improved big time.
And now that I'm on the backend of GameMaker, where I've helped put together some experiences,
it I can tell the difference, especially between point eight and point 10 big changes.
And it even feels more stable doing it that way now with the with the new additions.
So I'm pretty, pretty happy with where and the progress that it's been making.
And you can just see the trajectory just go up and up and up and up and up.
And to me, when before I started really investing in the sandbox, I was just a gamer, I saw
this trajectory.
You could see all the improvements each time the login that you logged in.
There was more updates, there were events, there were always new partners.
And so it wasn't until I got into GameMaker where I felt some of the pain of the other
artists and GameMaker creatives usually talk about like Andy, Richie, Touche, HODL, Vision,
Joseph, many, many others.
AU24K speak frequently, OG Shakespeare speak about the some of the difficulties with GameMaker.
But each each iteration, it is going upwards in a positive trend.
So that that makes a lot of sense what he's saying right now about how the trend is up.
It's getting better over time, it's just iterative success or improvements.
Yeah, I mean, like especially for the project, to have a sustainable and long term plan is
definitely important.
And also to wait for a really good moment to launch a token or launch a project is also
one of the priority within the entrepreneurs.
Kind of curious, how do you guys to determine which is actually the right moment to no matter
for launch your project and also launch a token?
How do you guys to value this kind of process?
I think like we because I'm very my experience as a serial entrepreneur is like we we focus
on like what's the what can people do with what you're launching?
Actually, like it's very important for me to have a.
This is where you really start to get into the mind.
And the cool part where I started really perking up what he said there was that it was how
did he know when to launch the token?
So he's talking about the San token that launched in 2020, I believe.
And Joseph will talk about this because he was one of the main people who helped with
that.
But and they had launched on Binance.
When was the right time to launch it?
Well, Seb just revealed that one of the main things that he looks for is.
Who's going to use it and what are they going to do with it?
And so that's a pretty key business insight for if you want to launch your own token,
but for one of the gates that Seb was looking for in order for Sand to launch, which right
now I think there's third, there's 30.
Billion tokens, right?
Yeah, 30 billion, I think, tokens and full.
And not in circulation, but in full total supply right now is trading at 29 cents, whereas
its high was over, I think over.
It was $4 something like that.
So in its prime, it was trading quite high.
But successful token launch by any count.
And right now it's top 100 tokens on CoinMarketCap.
Right?
Go to CoinMarketCap and you search Sand.
Number 94 of all time is number 94.
And how many are there?
There are.
I don't know that.
I see 9000 right now just in the search bar.
So there's over 9000.
I didn't even mean to do that right there.
Over 9000.
So it's the top 100 of all time right now.
And for gaming, it's top 10.
So still an impressive showing.
A product or a form of MVP, first version of the product, and to understand exactly
who is the target audience for that product.
And we apply that both to the product, but also to the content.
When we announce an IP or partnership at Sandbox, we really shorten the amount of time that
people have to wait until between the announcement and the moment they can do something with
that IP is actually happening.
And we've been shortening from a couple of months when we were first doing those land
sales with the brand and then later on introducing an avatar collection or experience to play
to less than a few days or hours.
We announced a brand, we already have an avatar collection for people to start pre-restoring
or buying it straight away.
And then next week they can launch and play the experience and collect reward.
And a few months later they can enter a game jam with the brand where they have this unique
opportunity to co-create their own game with their favorite brand and official NFTs.
And that's exciting because it really highlights that there is always a utility.
It creates a pattern where if you enter Sandbox and you buy something on Sandbox, you should
be able to trust that something concrete will happen with that.
It's very important as well to establish that trust over a long time and keep delivering
behind.
This is one of the reasons why I'd say he's a successful chief operating officer, COO.
You hear his language, how he keeps talking about how driving at the product, driving
at the deliverable, driving at saying you're going to deliver and then delivering on that.
So it builds trust, it builds a pattern of success.
And for people who want to invest their time, effort, money into this, they can be reasonably
certain that even if the progress isn't as fast as they would like it to be, it is progress
and they can expect results.
And we've done as well at Derry when we launched season one, season two, season three, and
soon season four of Sandbox.
It's coming quite soon.
Be excited.
A lot of great stuff there.
And every time we've updated the game maker, we've opened the publishing, we've opened
the marketplace, everything we planned for has happened so far in the roadmap.
Amazing.
That's definitely a super amazing journey for you and also for the Sandbox.
So I would say for this year, 2024, one of the biggest milestones or the biggest launch
for the Sandbox, besides the Metaverse site, that is the news that the Sandbox is launching
a DAO.
So we actually launched the DAO back in the...
So here's where she starts talking about the DAO.
And I really enjoyed the Q&A, especially from this point on.
You'll see why.
...later in May, right?
So it has been running successfully for almost three months now.
We know that when we first get started with something new, everybody will be super excited.
And then when things getting growing, some of the questions and also problems will follow
as well.
So how has been the journey for you so far and how do you like responding to the feedbacks,
especially from the DAO community right now?
So we did introduce the first phase of the DAO back in May.
And for us, it was a great moment because we've been waiting almost four years after
the project started.
So what he's referring to there is the white paper.
The white paper references the Sandbox DAO and this was published in 2020.
So he and I talked about this in our podcast interview.
That was podcast episode.
Podcast episode.
It was like a lifetime ago, but it really wasn't that long ago.
Because episode eight, Sebastian and I talk about this, when was the right time?
How did you know it was the right time and why was the gap between 2020 and now?
And he'll say, he'll expand upon that here.
But what he still told me at the time, just this time last month, was that he didn't feel
comfortable with what they had offered.
And he waited for them to be able to offer something that felt equal to what the DAO
was supposed to be.
He wanted to make sure that there was enough experiences, enough partners, enough value
ready to receive the DAO and all of the expectations and stuff that goes along with it.
So that's what he's referring to.
And that's why he waited for four years before wishing to have a DAO implemented like they
did in May.
To introduce decentralization, we took our time to analyze how other DAOs were actually
working, performing, what worked, what didn't work for them, how we could balance the voting
power between the different holder of the token.
Something unique on the sandbox DAO is that, for example, you don't just need the sandbox
token to vote, but also people who own land have actually more voting power with the 4500
voting power versus one for one land.
So one sand equals one voting power, one land equals 4500 voting power.
Unique to sandbox, those lands represent owning a piece of the metaverse and building it together
with us.
We also wanted to introduce progressively the different features and have the transparency
on how the budget is actually being spent, which is the first thing you can see on the
dashboard.
We selected the council member, Yatsu, the chairman of Animoca Brands, Shannon Snow,
the CEO of World of Women, as well as Jean-Michel Payon, executive as ledger, Frédéric Montagnon
and myself.
And then the advisors, which Mia is part of, we wanted people who are very involved already
from the beginning in the space that are familiar with sandbox, all now have been building projects
in sandbox and even better with Mia, which is like an amazing person.
We all love her.
She's been representing the committee of sandbox in greater China for many years.
She's been close to committees and orders in educating the committee.
She and I did our interview just a couple of weeks ago and that was podcast episode
14.
We had a lot of feedback from the commission and the staff of all those, which provide
very valuable feedback for us as well.
So far, we have 12 SIP sandbox improvement proposals that are live.
10 of them have been voted.
I think we were able to get approval and chrome around six or seven already.
There's been some learning as well and already we're iterating very fast by introducing
the SIPs, the sufficient level of participation.
So all the SIPs will be moving forward.
SIPs covered the constitution, the budget, the type of project education charities we
could support.
Right now there is a SIP live about ambassador and academy on sandbox for training creditors
in Philippines.
Which neither have reached quorum yet.
We just to see like the committee is starting to be involved progressively more and more.
And I think we will give ourselves a year until we can really assess the results of
the impact of the DAO and the decentralized governance on the project.
Yeah, we've seen a lot of progress within the DAO community and a lot of proposals coming
out already.
So basically DAO and also this kind of decentralized governance is part of the native crypto space
and also the native Web3 projects.
That's definitely one of the core things within the community.
So how do you guys first get this kind of idea that the sandbox kind of launch at DAO?
Is there any specific rhythm for you guys to have this kind of idea and actually make
it happen?
I think like we our role is we need to encourage people when they want.
Here it is.
Here's where I really, because it's not the first time Seb has said this, but it's it
is a recent reaffirmation, a re-acknowledgement of what he said a while ago.
And I think some of us when he first said what he's about to say again, when we first
say that back in May, so May 28th is when they launched the DAO and it came out of nowhere,
by the way, we didn't none of us had any any inkling this was going to happen.
But in any case, when when this happened, Seb came on to a bunch of AMAs.
So did Cyril, who's the DAO administrator.
And they they were asked questions about what is what's going on?
How is this going to be?
And you'll when you go back to those AMAs, you'll hear a lot of they use the term progressive
decentralization.
And I had first heard that a couple of months ago, a few months ago when they did this AMAs.
But when I did research into Mia and I watched some of her videos, I realized she'd been
saying that word for years.
I think she said it like two years ago and where she did her own videos about the DAO
and the emergence of the DAO is not sandbox DAO, but DAO's as a generality and her YouTube
channel.
So she had been saying this word for a while now.
And I had not known that until I I didn't know who she was until started researching
into the different advisory board members.
So he's going to explain again and reaffirm what his vision is for the DAO.
So this is super, super important.
Listen to this.
We want to do something for sandbox when they have an initiative, a project, whether it's
global or very localized in different regions of the world, like we were talking about
Philippine before, et cetera, to instead of always coming to the sandbox and ultimately
to me in a very vertical structure where some of the team members will ask finally for an
approval, we'll encourage them to know to do that.
It's amazing what you want to do, but ultimately shouldn't be us as sandbox to decide what's
best for the platform.
It should be the community self and you should use their voting power through the sun and
the land to decide if they think like you're suggesting that what you propose is going
to drive an impact.
What kind of impact can you drive?
Can it bring more users, more creators, more awareness?
Can it help the product to become better by deciding on features of the roadmap, supporting
the development of custom tools that make the life of the creator easier?
That was one of the CIP before.
To drive initiative like participating at a conference around the world like DEFCON that's
coming or Token 2049 in a matter of a few weeks, how much reward should be distributed
during the value season and events and so on.
Ultimately, all of those decisions that we are making internally as a sandbox team will
be progressively allocated and handed over to the community to decide.
And I think it's not something for granted.
I'm really new to this idea that I can decide as a player, as a creator, as a member of
the community, how the project is going to evolve and what should be the priority.
We also need to educate more that you have that power.
But that power is only effective if you actually go there to check, to read, to discuss, to
challenge sometimes and to vote to say yes, no, abstain or whatever the CIP, the improvement
proposal will require in terms of feedback.
All right.
Yeah, from the end of the presentation.
Okay, that was it.
Seb just said on repeat.
So he said this back in May in NSC Lisbon with Cyril.
He said that progressive decentralization, right?
So they're started out right now, fairly centralized.
They have a special council that can veto CIPs and the CIPs go through Cyril's DAO team
and the DAO team heavily scrutinize the CIPs to ensure that it's complete.
And as I mentioned in podcast 18, I have five CIPs that are going through his team right
now.
And one of them is to fund this podcast.
And I've had to spend a lot.
We think we're on our fourth or fifth back and forth right now.
It's been over a month since I started this with them.
Just on this CIP, I'll say alone.
It's been a lot of scrutiny.
I've had to really bear it bore down on the cost sheet to the nth degree itemize costs
and that sort of thing.
And then we're currently discussing the metrics of success metrics.
So I submit a CIP and then they say, hey, what we'd like to see this or we recommend
this change.
And then it's been going back and forth like that for a while now.
And some of the other CIP authors are experiencing the same thing.
So right now it's more centralized.
It's going through that funnel.
But what Seb just said is that his goal, his intent is through the process of progressive
decentralization, he is handing responsibility that right now exists within the hands of
the sandbox game company to the DAO.
So he said it shouldn't just be us deciding what's best for the platform.
It should be the community and their voting power to decide if what others are suggesting
is good for driving impact.
And to reinforce what I just summarized, he then said all the decisions that we're making
internally as a sandbox team will be progressively handed over to the community to decide.
And he specifically mentioned development decisions.
He specifically mentioned features on the roadmap and the custom tools and participating
in events around the world.
He intends for that to be decentralized and given to the DAO.
So that's bold.
And he mentioned that similar in my podcast with him.
So he's been consistent about it.
Since May 28th when the DAO launched that progressive decentralization for him means
giving responsibility duties and tasks that currently exist within the sandbox company
over to the DAO, which and I remember saying this during my podcast with him that said
that that's a bold vision.
That is bold.
And Andy Richie on podcast number one disagreed that the DAO should have that power because
he believed the DAO will mess it up.
That was the very first podcast which was a community reaction.
And yeah, wow, that's cool.
And right now we got to be, we got to get ready.
If that's the goal and that's where this is going, we got to get ready for that.
Right now we don't have a governance structure outside of the sandbox DAO admin team.
We're all disorganized.
The sandbox sand fam itself is disorganized.
We don't really have we don't have delegations yet.
But even if we do get delegations, there aren't central places by which we organize ourselves.
So that's one of the reasons why this podcast exists because there wasn't anything like it.
There isn't anything like it right now.
The only way that we can convey thought, not the only way, but one of the ways I want to convey
thought because I don't feel like this conversation is narrative is happening.
And since I started, I've had a lot of conversations and been able to use these sorts of things
that are being said to help further the conversation and contribute to the community.
And when I start really delving into stats and figures and some of these, like the business of catalysts
that I'll bring when I screen share flowcharts and stuff like that,
that's where I'm going to really start contributing in my own way to furthering and helping us get ready
for this responsibility that Seb intends to to progressively decentralize over to the DAO.
That right there made this whole AMA just juicy. It's great.
I love the questions that me are asking.
The answer you just you just did. So there are a lot of initiatives that the sandbox has already started supporting.
So from the console's perspective, what type of proposal does you guys or the sandbox particularly encourage
the users to actually propose proposals? Is there any specific dimensions that you guys will encourage?
There's a few dimensions that we definitely encourage. The way we see the sandbox and Metaverse,
like this is an open platform that supports like culture. So everything that touch around art, around sport.
He says that a lot. Seb does. He wants to be the cultural capital of the Metaverse.
He said that so many times he links culture with gaming.
And I just watched a podcast with Jean-Michel Pauin, who is on the special council.
He also founded Ledger and Grow Capital. And he said something very similar.
However, he made a distinction that art is like photography, paintings, and culture is like profile pictures.
So he considers board eight yacht clubs to be cultural things, cultural significance, as well as gaming is culture.
So where where Seb is saying the cultural capital, I think he's using that he is using that in a broader term.
And yet Sue also talks about culture when he speaks.
Yet Sue is the founder and chairman. CEO, CEO of Animoca Brands, which is one of if not the largest Web3 company in the whole Web3 industry.
I think they have over like 350 companies that they own.
And so they are all all in. And Sandbox is one of those companies Animoca Brands own.
They acquired it in 2018. I think it was 2018. They acquired the Sandbox.
On fashion, around music, around gaming is an encourage in terms of content.
Also, we see ourselves as a platform that drives impact. So if you have projects that want to help charities, NGOs, you want to make like the more people can donate to a certain cause while being engaged on Sandbox.
I think like we've proven with one of the SIPs with the Red Cross that the community wants to do that.
And like a lot of projects in Sandbox have been driven by the impact we can make in the physical world.
We've seen values SIP around as well as education.
The more we can onboard creators in various regions of the world, in India, in the Philippines, in Thailand, the more we can give access to that opportunity to people based in countries which in the Web2 and free to play industry have been for a long time considered as tier 2 countries, tier 3 countries where like the quality of the user doesn't matter because they don't have the same spending power.
All of that is being erased and it doesn't matter the country for us as long as the quality thing there is an opportunity to bring new users will go forward.
We are also really interested to see how the representation, the events, the activities that we are doing to promote Sandbox can be conducted not only by our core team, the marketing team, event team, but also anyone around the world if they want to launch their own meetup, if they want to like be present at the major
conference there in that country in their city, if they want to have a booth and so on, why don't they propose it, explain to the country what they want to do and let's vote.
And I think like we've seen positive voting, like the committee wants to see those kind of opportunities. So this is really what we want to encourage.
We also want to encourage like the participation to vote who would be the next ambassadors, next influencers, the next community manager of the DAO will be someone elected by the community.
I assume he means the next next one, because the one that's being hired right now is being selected by the DAO administration team.
I think Cyril is selecting it. They made a post, they being the Sandbox DAO team made a post about the community manager and they're currently being selected by the Sandbox DAO team.
It was Joseph, I don't think that's there anymore. I think they're trying, they're trying, they're selecting someone else.
But so not this one, they must mean the next one. But that was interesting to me when I heard that.
He said once the and expects that the DAO, the DAO meaning Sandfam, DAO members vote on the community manager.
That's not happening this time around, not that I know of.
It's great to see that anyone who contributes in a way can be can propose himself as well to help and be recognized.
And also right now the SIP for the ambassadors, which I just finished in podcast 18.
So that's not being chosen by the community either.
The SIP itself is to fund the next wave of ambassadors for 400,000 sand.
So it's to approve 400,000 sand for those new ambassadors, those ambassadors being chosen by the Sandbox game company and will answer to the game company, not the DAO.
So this kind of puts into a weird perspective of when is this supposed to happen?
Is this supposed to happen the next time around?
Or was it supposed to happen this time, but a miscommunication happened?
I don't know. I don't know. But Seb clearly wants the community to choose.
The community being Sandfam, not the centralized entities that are around the DAO, the DAO administration team or the Sandbox game company.
That speaks to the previous question where he really wants to hand those responsibilities to the DAO itself.
But maybe he's referring to the next wave because the DAO being so new and Sandfam having trouble making quorum.
Maybe he doesn't feel that we're ready yet or maybe it's just timing that it happened the way it did.
In other case, I give him the full benefit of the DAO and I look forward to improving, seeing this improved.
Connized by the community itself for their merits. Amazing. So it's basically kind of like everybody within the community can be ambassador and advocate of the Sandboxes that way.
I want to see this one. Yes, but not right now. I mean, everyone can go to the link and apply, but it seems they have no intention of accepting everyone.
And will down select to a very specific. I mean, even when I asked them, them being the Sandbox SIP authors for the Sandbox Ambassador proposal, they're from the Sandbox game company.
The ones who authored that I asked them, what would it take, you know, to be I think I asked them what were the expectations on a content creator?
And then they said that the implied that the bar is pretty high. They have to have a set number of followers and then blah, blah, blah. Definitely not chosen by the community at that point.
So maybe that's just because this round or this this wave of ambassadors is being chosen by the company.
But even so, it seems like what Seb is saying and what is happening beneath him is not the same thing.
It's I don't know. I don't know what's going on there. But what's happening and what Seb is saying doesn't exactly line up right now.
And maybe it's just because everything's so new and we're trying to figure it out together. It would be super powerful if we actually like activated everybody was in the community.
So there's a question that's because like the quality is portions of the direction directly and also the community is doing some similar stuff, probably at the same time.
So how do you balance the work between the court team and also the community? And also I've noticed there's some of the proposals that are coming from part of the court team. Right.
So does all of these kind of like operational activities actually portion to the doubt and get approved and some of the larger they are not getting the budget from the cartoon directly.
I don't I don't know what words he's using there. I couldn't figure it out. I think she's saying court team court team the work between the court team and the community. I'm not sure what that word is.
But but but Seb's answer to this is super, super interesting. I love I love this answer.
I love how this thing kind of get balanced eventually. Well, I believe like just thinking I always believe like in the greater good like that.
If you your mission, if you're committed to like drive positive impact, if you're committed to show that creator can actually make a revenue on the platform and share those stories.
If we've been able to do the journey of sandbox for many years to drive like new job new for people to earn, etc. Like good things spread out and they spread out, not just because they get very viral, but because like you want to recommend something that has done a good impact on yourself to other people.
So I believe, again, in that notion of greater good and like if we show like we've done until now the cap direction in a centralized manner and progressively we've been educating our community to about that and we hand over that forward that committee, hopefully, like, just like a child that you've been educating as a parent, they would have a quite certain value, they would have a quite certain concept, and hopefully they will also carry those by themselves because of that education.
Like, we are not here to speculate on the back of all the people to scam others that are we are here to actually make fun games to express our creativity to express our culture to bring unique and original content you don't find on the platform to help people to drive in various cause around environment, climate change, poverty, hunger, etc.
And I love to see the community, respect those and we'll carry on for.
Amazing.
So, cool.
Very, very cool answer.
Whether or not you agree.
Or I agree and I do I do mostly agree with that.
I think that's really cool perspective. That's exactly one of the reasons why I invested in the sandbox and I commit to it the way I am is because it's very clear that said believes what he's saying, and that he's acting on those beliefs, and that I trust that he will continue to act on those beliefs.
And if he does follow through it to the very, very, very end.
Then, I don't see anything but positive positivity happening for the sandbox to see its trend continue.
Continue to go in that direction.
And what he said though about the parent and child thing is exactly what I. That's exactly what he was saying very similar things. At the beginning, when he was at NFC Lisbon and all the am a that he did and the Twitter spaces thereafter was that that was like the implied intent around and progressive decentralization
didn't quite say it like that until now that they're what they're trying to do is in through the progressive decentralization is show us the way.
And then hope that we continue following that way. So that's why I think they're being the way they are about the sips and really really scrutinize it to the nth degree, because they want the sips.
And the way the steps are written to be to come out as really specific and measurable like smart goals, specific measurable.
Shoot, realistic and timely. What's the a, a was my gosh, how did I forget the a specific measurable achievable achievable relevant and timely.
So I think they're they're doing it that way, because they want everyone else to read those steps and be like wow those steps are really specific and I my steps should be like that too.
But that's not what's happening right now, it seems like the community steps have to be that way, but not the CSP steps we just did in podcast 18, a review of sip number 11, which was the sandbox ambassador when the one they're talking about just a few minutes ago.
And it was very generic.
Very, very generic. The, the price that the resources asked was it's just flat 400,000 sand.
And I just finished a couple days ago, breaking down my cost estimate for the sand out podcast tip for the third time. I had to break it down even further to the exact or not the exact but the the amount that I intend on paying individual people on the team.
So instead of rolling it up to labor. I now have to, I have to break it down to to sound engineer to video editor to researcher, all the people that I proposed to be on the team and the sip.
That's not what happened for a lot of these steps so far.
And so, yeah, maybe it's just a matter of they're they're trying to implement that as time goes on. And and so, the first ones got through because they got through and they weren't applied the same scrutiny that that's happening right now to mine.
And that just might be because they're trying to do better over time. And that's the best they could do in the very beginning. So, if that's the truth is that's what it is and okay, that makes sense. But definitely not the same standard.
During this kind of period of the proposal voting we also find some of the challenges, especially for a doctor started on so one of the challenges like common challenge not only for the samples down but also for some other like, like, newly started does the property that
the first when the proposal get like proposed. Sometimes the voting power is a little bit low and the participation is also a ratio is a little bit low. So, as for those kind of challenges, how does the doubt and also how that the council members decided to tackle this kind of
challenges. Is there any like updates from that side I can share with everybody. Absolutely. Well, it's exactly the kind of learning and takeaway after like running the dog for three months, whether there is a certain fatigue where there's certain people like you don't feel
concerned by the voting of certain decision, whether like, we need to spend to give more time for people to learn to be informed across different channel and vote, or we should reward people who are voting so we create like a positive behavior and
I think like those are great feedback to see that certain SAP didn't pass by, not just because people didn't want to but by lack of minimum number of participating 30 million quorum, which is also very important to pass to fail because they didn't even get
about 16 million core voting power. Even that they are not necessarily fair or positive for the community. And to prevent that what we're going to do is we continue to continue to do more education, talk more about every step.
Like we're doing right now, we can go in details, maybe time them better, but the middle of the summer is actually August is probably, I don't think timing is the issue.
August is not a great period of time. It's not reaching the voters you need.
And we're going to introduce delegation, which is a mechanism where you can actually give your voting power to someone else that will represent you and hopefully share the same value and vision so they could vote on your behalf.
And those delegators will become a little bit like super electors in the US where like they will gather more voting power, and probably because of that, it's a responsibility for them, they will be very more, more active following and discussing the SAP, because
like if not people will not give them the voting power, and almost like in the political system. So it's quite interesting to see that some of the core principle of democracy are happening as well in the main members.
And in my mind, democracy is a very young political system versus orders that we lead through the human history and civilizations. It's interesting to see it apply in gaming and metaverse as well.
Yeah, that's super cool. I'm kind of curious, so after the delegation function is out.
So, I mean like for the delegation function, within all of this kind of material or sophisticated DAO, the delegation ratio is actually pretty high. For example, A.DAO, they have over 70% of the delegation ratio for wasting the voting period.
And also for some of the defied DAO's like Uniswap maker, they also have a very high delegation ratio.
So this is very cool. So this is Mia is from, she founded the DAObase.ai, they use analytics, statistics, and aggregation to pull together statistics.
So what she's saying is, in their research, they found that APECOINDAO, their wallets are over 70% delegated.
The wording, I think, because of the language vocabulary there, I think that's translating to over 70% of the wallets, APECOINDAO, are delegated.
That is...wow.
And that Uniswap also has a very high delegation ratio, meaning that a lot of its wallets are delegated as well.
That's fascinating. I wonder if Sandbox would do the same thing.
I guess we'll find out.
In the community, it's a little bit lazy in terms of decision making. So I think that definitely makes sense if we introduce this kind of delegation feature.
So when can we actually expect this kind of delegation feature to be live and everybody can participate eventually?
Well, you see that's exactly the value of having information, data, that proves that it's effective. Thanks to DAObase and what you just said, we now have even more confirmation that this will hopefully drive impact and see the right priority to apply.
We're defining exactly how we will work, how much votes on delegator minimum person is to acquire to become themselves a superdelegator.
And we hope that within a month or two, the technical implementation will be ready. So before the end of the year, we're back on track, actively proposing, actively voting.
And I think it's a great step for the better benefit of the community.
He says, OK, got it. Yeah, that's how looking forward to this feature implemented to the Sandbox.website. So excited. I believe that a lot of especially wise minds will take over this kind of control.
But there's also one thing, every thing has two sides, right? So as for the delegation feature, so some of the people actually raising up this kind of question.
So, for example, it went down, there are some of the delegators over there, they are taking a lot of voting power.
The community is kind of questioning, OK, is another different, another way of centralization.
So because like all of the voting power, voice power actually controlled by a small group of people.
So how do you guys responding to this kind of like questions within the community? And probably we'll raise a question like later on.
Well, we're going to see how effectively it unfolds. I think, again, like we, it's always, there's always an experimental part to that.
I cannot predict how it always we wish for the best. We try to think of all the different bad scenarios that could happen and prevent them.
I hope that it will give it will rise interest as well for new community leaders to emerge because they will feel like, oh, now, like, because I own a lot of land or I'm part of this neighborhood.
I want to be like the mayor of that neighborhood and represent the voting powers, for example, all the landowners in my neighborhood, something like that.
That can be a very likely scenario if we were to compare what's the virtual world like versus what the physical world and like metropolis and small different urban hubs are.
I also feel like people who concentrate already a lot of some token will start to feel like and they they can wait as much without necessarily having all the financial that they can control.
They will probably not as much voting power as people that hold a lot of sound, but maybe have not been as active in the project.
So it's also a way to create a new equilibrium that's for people who are very involved in the actual building of sandbox, its development, what's happening with the community, with the different activation we are doing, builder challenge,
the boot camp, builder launch pad, seasons, and so on. All right, super cool. So as for the Dell side and also for the project side, what do you think, well, like, what will be the next several milestones for the Dell and also what can we expect for the next several months, especially like till next year?
So, as you know, there's always a lot of things ongoing at sandbox, our priority is to keep improving the user. So in the previous question she asked, isn't delegation just another centralization of voting power?
Seb said that they try to think of all the negative things, the bad things that can happen and then prevent them, but they're not going to be able to prevent everything.
And he referred to delegation as one of those things that it might be a necessary evil.
And then he said something, he started talking about how this delegation is an opportunity to give rise to new community leaders who look to do what they can when they can.
And then maybe that will give rise to other people. And the analogy he gave was to become the mayor of a community. So sandbox still has neighborhoods. So he mentioned either here or in the future, not long from now, he mentions how neighborhoods may play a part where the mayor of a neighborhood gets elected or stays some Dell, sometimes elects, self-elects, a metro police.
So like a law enforcement or a Dow enforcement type thing. So he's he's he's theory crafting here that perhaps the community will come up with a solution that they don't even think of yet.
But in order to counter the good point that Mia raised that delegation may just be another centralization of power and it might be a necessary evil. But how do you account for the evil that it does create?
And Seb says, well, I'm hoping that new thought leaders emerge to solve that issue. Pretty cool. Pretty cool. He, as far as I'm concerned, he is he's putting his money where his mouth is.
He has he has articulated that he wants the community to decide and then he he does it.
So I think that's cool. It's very cool. Experience for the players and the creators. So we ship new version of the game maker that keeps adding exciting opportunities and possibilities for creators.
We're introduced new gameplay mechanics soon that allows people to play multiplayer to have more actions and gameplay capabilities with the avatars.
The season four is a major milestone for this year that's coming, and we'll offer a lot of content to explore and we want to stay tuned about that one.
And just recently, like, actually this week yesterday we announced, I just come back from Gamescom in Germany, leading video game conference, and we announced the launch of a new program called the Voxel games program, which essentially
extends what the sandbox is right now. You know sandbox as like this platform where there is a no code game maker, you can make games and experience without any programming, and you need, and you can only play the experience that are on the lens made with that no code game maker.
But it's a very powerful tool that's on board with a lot of people first time creators make content creation accessible. At the same time, it was not necessarily fitted for the existing video game industry, the indie developer, the game studios that are making those mobile or console or PC hits.
So the Voxel games program, we started to partner with third party studio who are making games with Unreal, with Unity, on HTML file and publish them, those games on the App Store, Google Play Store, Epic Stores, Steam and so on.
They can be free to play with micro transaction with ads. And those games, the only requirement they have is like they will have the Voxel style, the Voxel graphic that are specific to sandbox, but they can have their own monetization, they can have their own gameplay made with those engines, and they will be able to
connect to the sandbox. And they will be offering the possibility to connect to the six million sandbox accounts. And if you connect your sandbox account and you can see your, your data, your avatar, your land, and you can use them in the gameplay.
But so that means like you will have traditional games, popular gameplay that attract regular audiences as an onboarding way to our web free. And it's true to the vision of what metaverse is like as a player I can use my digital asset and identity across
the platforms, like we've been saying before. We announced partnership with two game studios already, the Frag Games and the Devils Agency, they will be building dungeon game, vampire survival game, and we're already talking with a lot of other studios so progressively you're going to see
proven gameplay from mobile, from PC, where you can start enjoying sandbox, the younger game maker platform.
Amazing. So I tried searching for this on blockchain Alliance, couldn't find any any YouTube videos or something where he spoke to this so I don't know exactly what he's referring to this is the first time I've heard of a Voxel games program, but I think so what I wrote down was that
it acts as a separate thing that on boards web two games to web three by allowing them access to their own game engine like unity, or unreal engine, plus monetization, and that it gives them access to the $6 million sandbox gaming accounts, that gives them access to the
sandbox player base and and still allows them to somehow use Unreal Engine and unity. So their own game, game engines, and then their own monetization. Not exactly sure what that means or what that looks like.
I can't I can't tell, does that mean my lands are going to be useless for that I'm not sure. But fascinating. Fascinating thing so trying to look for a YouTube video or something I can find that helps explain that.
Looking forward to everything that you just described.
Um, so thank you so much for all of these kind of description about the symbols down and also the project. I think yeah we are in the like last period of time for the last three so kind of curious, how do you think these, the samples like eventually stand out as one of the biggest
project at the end, and what's actually you think is the most like, like important qualities, no matter for the entrepreneurs and also for the project itself to stand out.
So, the, the voxel graphic and aesthetic has become very recognizable, not just in web free but in general in the gaming industry and by many brands. Second is like we're known for lands, virtual land we've become the largest decentralized virtual world with this map 166 164 lands part of different neighborhoods
and top brands from part of the world of automatic to bring together some token has become one of the top 10 gaming tokens and the top 100 cryptocurrencies according to coin market cap by market capitalization.
And there's no other place, where free or not where like you can have all that mashup of brand and IPs and content that you can play just like you can see right behind me or different characters that come together, that can become your identity, and we are accessible
to everybody, and we are attracting the complexity of blockchain, meaning like when you enter sandbox you can claim an FD you can receive reward you can meet your own content, without a single line of code you never brought a smart contract you just connected and even
creating your wallet has been super simplified.
We've been over the years, launching season launching events launching game jams and values program that well there's a lot of things to do and to explore on sandbox now with over 1300 games and experience made by the creators, and we want to keep
that being consistent, being focused, year after year improving the user experience and the creation process, opening ourselves to more possibilities, we just announced with the voxel games program.
So we can create new environments in the space and attract both like new creators and top creators already in the industry.
I think it's a bit too early to say in three months because we only see 12 proposal, or it doesn't take in my opinion, we haven't yet seen the full potential of what DAO means like, I can't wait to see like the delegation and new community leaders emerge
represent talk, do the job to explain, maybe even better than myself what sandbox is and what can sandbox do and how to make sandbox even better. That's kind of my dream of what the DAO could achieve one day.
The idea that they could also influence the roadmap of development and to say, like, this is that feature we absolutely want, and like we need to develop it, or even one day to develop new creation tools out of the box.
That's also a possibility that the community can vote upon.
And I hope that by next year as well because with the constitution that was voted and the council member I elected for one year will be a new election so people will actually present themselves voted by the community.
And we're going to start also like the impact of different, I would say management of the DAO, just like we've seen with Epcot and a few other and like how that impacts the different dynamics, the market of sandbox, the content we're going to see and so on.
All right, so I want to see the.
So I didn't, I didn't pause him.
I wanted him to go through his whole thing there. This is, this is what really convinced me to do this, this podcast episode is that answer right there. And what impresses me impresses is too, too grand grand of a word.
It's
yet again.
I see evidence that
Seb is clearly lining up the DAO to be the successor for what he's built.
He keeps, like when he said that this is, you know, I'm going to go, I'm going to go back a little bit.
Let's go through this again.
The idea that
I think.
I think it's a bit too early to say in three months, we only see 12.
Okay.
Three months.
So May 28 is when the DAO was announced.
He thinks it's too early within three, first three months to say whether or not that his question was,
do you think the vision of the DAO should change for the mission? He says too early to tell.
Okay.
Proposal.
It doesn't take, in my opinion, we haven't yet seen the full potential of what DAO means.
Okay.
We haven't yet seen the full potential of what DAO means.
They, they're referring not just to Sandbox DAO. He's referring also to Apecoin DAO.
Sady DAO, Maker DAO, Uniswap DAO.
DAO is still a super early concept within like the past few years.
And it started first with Ethereum.
So I didn't know what DAO was before May 28.
I had no idea.
Me, like many others, the DAO was suddenly announced.
And I'm like, the first most of us were like, what the heck is a DAO?
So I start going on a YouTube's free.
I start going on Twitter spaces like a Mocha verse hall and holes on the block.
I just start connecting and figure out the DAO is actually just a bunch of people trying to figure out how to work together to build a community.
And that they're just as confused about it as we are.
And we're all just trying to figure it out.
Even the ones that have been around since the beginning, which was like three years ago, not even.
But the very first DAO was Ethereum DAO.
And it failed.
It got hacked and it had to get forked over.
It had to do a fork in order to survive, so it had to fork because there was a bad actor who, I think, took over the Ethereum DAO and had full control over it.
So the community decided to fork and remove that power and plug in, plug up or shore up the hack exploit so that it couldn't happen again.
But that was the start of it all.
Ethereum.
And the start of it was a failure.
Very, very high profile failure.
And so if you Google or YouTube it, you'll find it is one of the first videos that I found, which is what is a DAO?
And so what he's saying is we don't yet know.
And we don't even know yet what the potential is of the sandbox DAO.
The sandbox DAO is even more unique than some of these other ones because the sandbox is the intersection of gaming and business and creators.
And this utility stands at the forefront of not only do they have a product, but they have a service and they have multiple career fields involved in this.
It's not like where an Apecoin DAO, it's mostly revolving around profile pictures and then out of that was born all these different services and initiatives that are trying to keep that value around the brand of Apecoin DAO.
Sandbox doesn't have that issue.
It has a product.
A workable, deliverable product.
The game.
So people can play a game and people have been playing games for a long time.
And so the blockchain supports the game.
The artists support the game.
The game makers support the game.
The serial entrepreneurs support the game.
And the DAO is here.
You're talking about business people and business interests and actual entrepreneurship.
That is powerful.
All of it together is what makes that powerful.
So he's speaking to, we don't even know yet where all of this is going to go.
Not yet.
I can't wait to see the delegation and new community leaders emerge, represent, talk, do the job to explain maybe even better than myself what sandboxes and what can sandbox do and how to make sandboxes.
That right there. That's what convinced me of this episode that I'm doing right now.
When he said the words, my dream is for someone to do it better than I'm doing it.
To explain it better than I can explain it.
That is not only humility, but also to me the sign of a good leader.
The sign of someone who can be trusted is someone who can acknowledge that there are others who know things that you don't.
There are others who can do things better than you can.
You don't know everything.
And it's a fool's errand to think that you do.
I see Seb, when he said that, that convinced me that I still had lingering doubts, especially how the Dow rolled out.
It was just, it was, I wish they had put a little bit more forethought, foresight into not communicating a Dow to the SanFam.
It just set everything, almost everybody off on the wrong foot. And right now there's this big suspicion.
It's a humongous hill to fight for SanFam who just viewed the Dow as nothing but a cash grab or this dictator's regime of why are we even here participating?
Because the sandbox has, the sandbox has 27 million voting power, which even though they promised not to use, they accidentally used it in the first few sips, which is why they had to resubmit them.
And then just people don't follow up with the apologies. And please forgive us, we didn't mean to do that sort of thing.
And this communication mounts and mounts and mounts. And this is why this podcast exists.
Because I wanted to start documenting the process by which these things were developing.
They're not developing in a vacuum or in the secret lair.
It's if you put the dots together, you can see how Seb is trying to communicate that I'm sorry we messed up.
I didn't mean for that to happen. Cyril saying I'm sorry we messed up. Didn't mean for that to happen.
The advisory board members are saying, hey, we didn't actually know each other before all this happened.
We just knew Seb. And and so that kind of goes against where people are saying that, oh, this is collusion going on.
Well, not exactly. Not exactly. There there might be.
It's true that Seb did want these people there and they got it and that the votes were rushed.
Brushed is the wrong word. The day the Dow was announced, the voting for the first sips happened.
And the first sips was approve a budget, approve a constitution, approve this, approve that, approve that.
And just it was so overwhelming that things things got approved.
And I haven't done a podcast episode yet on the on the Constitution and the bylaws and our association.
But I have a contract writing background and contract negotiation background.
And I have questions. I have questions, comments and concerns about the way this stuff is worded.
There's massive loopholes and these bylaws, things that can be exploited, things that are exist outside of what a Dow can agree to.
They are illegal loopholes for the legal company that runs all of this.
And and I'm going to I did some early, early stream episodes where I was putting together.
Should actually make those podcast episodes, but I'm going to do a podcast episode on my findings.
And I've been trying to get Cyril on the podcast so that we can talk about this before I yield my analysis.
Because right now it's not looking good.
And I want to talk to him and give him the benefit of the doubt.
And I would think it's best if we hear from him first before I render my my observations, because my observations are pretty harsh coming from over 10 years doing contract writing and clauses, introducing clauses and enforcing of contracts and that sort of thing.
And so I think it will be easier on my analysis.
I think my analysis will go a lot better and it'll be less harsh if I can talk to him and understand his mindset and how it all came to pass before I do that.
But Seb, bring it back here to this is AMA.
Seb is saying, I can't wait for leaders to emerge out of this.
I can't wait for someone to do better than me.
And I agree completely.
I hope people do things better than me.
I hope someone does a podcast better than me.
I hope someone does sips better than me.
If, if people are doing better than each other and we're improving constantly, then this is all going to work out.
The Dow is going to work out the game is going to work out the community is going to work out if we're all working together and we're propping each other up and we're not fighting each other and not.
Some people call PVP each other trying to take away like it's a zero sum game.
If we prop each other up, help each other and for me, help others be better than me.
We got nothing to worry about.
And nothing but time.
So loved his answer.
Very wise answer to me.
My opinion, even better.
That's kind of my dream of what the dog could achieve one day.
The idea that they could also influence the roadmap of development and to say, like, this is that feature we are is again, and like influence the roadmap of development or even one day to develop new creation tools out of the box.
That's also a possibility that the committee can vote upon.
And like I hope that by next year as well because with the Constitution that was voted and the council member I elected for one year will be a new election so people will actually put in half years by the community close enough.
So they don't get reelected until December of 2025.
All right, so I would see the last question from the formal interview that I asked for a new like you those ways in the sample style ecosystem or the same boss ecosystem, what would be the like the lessons that you will give out to them to get started was in the ecosystem.
There's one part of this answer that I that I want to talk about the thing that you can do in sandbox at the end of the day, you can be a creator, you can play you can have an avatar, you can be a fan of nice off ramp as an interviewer I appreciate this question, I guess.
So, yeah, we give an FDs as we want 21 creating an account on sandbox play some of the events to get a feeling of what it is now, then think like okay, it looks like this now but a year ago it was so much more ugly, slow, not as bad, and so on.
So what can it be in one year again in two years again and so on. And that's, that's really how I approach it, because sometimes we are so hands down on it, I sometimes I look back at it, oh, it's been five years already.
It's so much sometimes I Google previously made. Yes, so that right there was a part I wanted to key in on this answer was, take a look at what it was a year ago and what it is now, and see how much progress we made.
We, Sand Fam, the game, the community.
It's great to see how we've evolved.
And I agree with that. I remember what it was like when we first played how rough it was. But, but you could see the passion, the devotion, the drive for success, and all the partnerships they were bringing in and now it's starting to really come to fruition.
You can start to see the technology of the sandbox start to take shape with and start enable all of the pre existing foundations are starting to really enable each other. And that is, to me, just where compounding success starts to happen.
I don't think we've reached it yet. I think we're almost there.
Almost there.
I remember myself talking three years ago and I say, Wow, okay, like, it's great to see as well. That was also cool. I saw I watched videos from many years ago for him on YouTube, and I did that in trip in preparation of trying to interview his co founder
Arthur Madrid.
You can tell the difference. Arthur spoke a lot in the early years. You can sell from like seven years ago, Arthur was the one speaking mostly and said was sitting in that city but he was standing there to support, but he sometimes spoke but most mostly Arthur talking about what
the sandbox is and could be and, and the decentralization of it and the NFTs and the tokens and, and he was the one who spoke a lot, and then mentioned the white paper and all that. And then, and then now you see Seb Seb is very comfortable or at least appears very comfortable
talking and doing all the conferences and Arthur is no longer at the forefront. So that switch. You can tell the difference he looks different he sounds different. He carries himself much more confidently now than, than years past when he was standing, waiting for his turn to speak and, and
yeah, represent the sandbox, how much it evolved and so the potential of what we're building is important, it gives us like the North Cape, where we want to go. And being in there being part of the community, understanding that ownership matters.
And there's true UTZ behind even more with the DAO. I think that's what I would recommend to the first time creators.
All right, thank you so much Sebastian for everything. And we still got several minutes so we will do another round of lightning round.
So I'll just kind of turn it down a little bit here because it's going to go over things like, what's your favorite food and who what books do you recommend, and all that.
So while while they're talking about that I'll just kind of outro here.
I was very pleasantly surprised to watch this one.
I think, I think it kind of solidified now that that, you know, when I first heard all this stuff in different AMA is and it was kind of all scattered and pieced together.
But it wasn't super super obvious what was being said. But now that I kind of have the benefit of hindsight I see what the DAO, how the DAO was rolled out and what they're trying to do to maintain momentum and all the product improvements that they're making.
This to me took on a new light. It connected new dots, and the dots to me were clear, and that SEB intends to hand responsibility over to the DAO that the game company currently does.
He intends for the DAO to elect ambassadors, the DAO to elect the community manager, and, and that he really believes.
He seems to really really believe in empowering the community to own the sandbox.
Now, there might be some legality things that get in the way of a DAO owning an actual game company. We'll see.
Don't know. There were some really interesting case law that's developing around DAOs.
One of them got sued. Who was it? Which DAO? One of them got sued and in the American court by, was it the SEC or the CFTC or someone sued a DAO, right?
And what they found was that a DAO can be sued because of some legal ways in which it wasn't formed.
So it wasn't an LLC or anything like that, but it was sued as a person. And then that drug into it, all the wallet holders.
So that's one of the reasons why I think Cyril created the Sandbox Foundation as a legal entity to protect the members and us from being sued, litigated from anyone in the world.
Because the international court system and the way things work like that, we're not just, just because people don't know who you are, doesn't mean you can't get drug into the courts.
That's what's starting to emerge now and why it's important to think about this stuff now.
Why it's important for us to start doing what we can to solve these problems and be proactive and discuss what do we want of the DAO?
And then once we know what we want, or at the very least, we start talking about what it means for us to vote into existence goals and even just talking about what we want to do.
That is the road we need to take. That's the way we got to go.
It's clear that regulations all over the world are trying to face cryptocurrency and already some regulations are starting to face DAOs.
You do not want to be on the receiving end of regulation on the DAOs. You want to be on the proactive end of it.
Just take my word for it. I've been in government for a while. Take my word for it.
You want to be on the proactive side. You want to do what you can to be at the table.
Because if you're not at the table, you're on the menu.
And that's not good for us if we're on the menu. So I think who was it I just tried to schedule an interview with.
Where'd he go? Where'd he go?
Davivi. So Davivi, I just heard from Bulls on the Block this past Saturday, Davivi was talking about from CityDow.
How, I can't even think of it. So cool listening to him talk about Dow.
Dang. Had my thought in it. Went right out. Right out.
Yeah, I don't remember. But in any case, the Dow is, the Dow is, you want to be on the proactive side of this.
And the sandbox has a lot to lose if it gets this wrong. It's got a game. It's got an actual product.
Some of these other DAOs can, you know, if they disappear, some of them, they don't really have a ton of assets to lose.
But we have a physical game. So I'm going to do everything I can to be a proactive community member.
And I hope you do too. So I'll end it there. Thank you all for your time.
And I hope you found this just as interesting as I did. I will post the link in the VOD and everything else.
So you can look at it yourself and watch it. It was super cool. Super cool. Loved it, Mia.
Thank you so much for asking the questions and for Sebastian for being open about what his thoughts were on.
So and there. All right. See you.
All right. Thank you so much. And thank you so much, everybody for listening to the Twitter space.
Let's see you guys next time. All right. Bye. Thank you. Thank you.