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Howdy everyone, my name is Lancer. I am excited to bring you the first inaugural

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Sand Dhow podcast episode number one. This is basically a podcast we put together, I put together

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very recently and all it is is just an exploration into the Sandbox Dhow from the perspective of a

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community member, Sand Fam myself, and exploring that, what we think, and all the different facets

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because this is the iceberg that was announced not long ago and has so many different factors to it,

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so many different things that we want to explore as we bond together as a community, as we decide

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what we want to do about the Sandbox Dhow and how that's going to end up affecting the Sandbox game.

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So today I'm bringing on HODL Hill and Andy Richie, so two well-known voices in the community,

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and we're going to get into our personal reactions for what has happened since May 28th,

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all this kicked off. So welcome HODL, welcome Andy, glad, thank you very much for doing this.

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Hey, hey, hey, pleasure to be here. Thanks for having us.

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Cool, everything sounds good, all the checks are gone, and let's start. So as you, some of you may

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not be familiar with my style of podcasting, I'm a podcaster before and I like visuals, I'm big into

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data, I'm big into research, so as you all, some of you have seen before now, I was putting a lot of

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of research and things together in order to put these slides, so down here, right down there,

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are the slides where you can follow along with us as we talk. So this is the introduction slide,

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and now we can move to slide two. So, scope of the talk, I always do this because this is the slide

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that helps you and I both agree on what is we're talking about, what we're not talking about.

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What we're doing here in this slide, in this podcast episode, is sharing reactions,

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so Andy's reaction and HODL's reaction and my reaction to the events that have unfolded.

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So that's it in a nutshell, what it isn't, we don't anticipate debating, like you're not gonna,

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I doubt you're gonna see us arguing with each other a whole lot, maybe, but most, we both come,

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all come to the table to discuss and to explore together, so this isn't gonna be meant to be a

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hardcore debate. And yeah, that's the scope, so we're just reacting at this point, trying to

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figure this out, just like everybody else is. And with that, we'll go into introductions,

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and HODL, who are you, where are you from, and what's an interesting fact about yourself?

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HODL? Or HODL Hill? Or whatever your name is. I'm in Canada, west coast. Most people say HODL.

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HODL.

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Been in the sandbox since about alpha number one. Landowner, avatar owner, general pain in the butt,

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bugging all the builders, you know, and in the last year and a bit,

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streamer.

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Yeah, and if you don't know, HODL does streams where she will play people's games. That's where

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she and I met when during Builders Challenge it, we published floor droppers at Matterworlds,

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and HODL played our game, and that's where HODL and I met. So thank you again for doing that,

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HODL. I appreciate that you try to go to people's games and give your comments and your feedback.

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Happy to. Love the Sand Fam. Yeah. Sorry if my audio is breaking up a bit. I'm going to try shutting

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some stuff down. Yeah, no problem. All right. And what's an interesting fact people wouldn't

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guess about you HODL? Oh, an interesting fact that they wouldn't guess? Or just a fact that people

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wouldn't get guessed. I had six wisdom teeth. You broke up there a little bit. You had six

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wisdom teeth pulled. Is that what I just heard you say? Yep. All right. And six bonus ones.

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All right, thanks. And Andy, go ahead. Hey. Yeah, I'm Andy Ritchie. I've been,

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a lot of you know me from the sandbox. I started probably about three and a half, four years ago,

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geez, a long time ago. And I just started by entering one of the game jams and then was

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lucky to finish in the top 10. And from there, everything kind of took off and started streaming,

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building, joined the sandbox, ran the sandbox game jams for a while, and then stepped back and

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started on Boop Goop and been building Boop Goop for now for, geez, about two years. And

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we created an experience for Unstoppable Domains not that long ago. And yeah, we've done a lot of

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stuff in the space and that's about it really. Boop Goop. You said you were a game hand?

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Yeah, well, I finished in the top 10 of game jam number three, which is originally when I entered.

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And I built a game called The Land of Valentina. Gotcha. The Land of Valentina. I don't think I

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played that one. I think it is playable at the moment. It's playable at the moment. Oh, it was

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built in, geez, it was built a long time ago. I have opened it a couple of times. It's still like

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pre-version 10 or 8 or something. No, I think version six. Oh, wow. All right. I think it was.

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I can't remember why it was built in. I think the earliest we came is like version four, I think,

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from the sandbox. Gotcha. All right. Thanks, Andy. And what's a fact about yourself that people

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wouldn't have guessed about you? Oh, gosh. I don't know about that one. I don't know.

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Don't have any interesting facts off the top of my head at the moment. I jumped out of a plate.

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What are your hobbies when you're not doing sandbox stuff?

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Nina. No, I like cars. Nina, my dog. Oh, you're dog. You take Nina out quite a lot.

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And I like to go camping and stuff as well. You know, being so connected to the new technology

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that's going on, it's nice to disconnect from that every now and again. Gotcha.

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Yeah. So yeah, I like doing stuff outdoors and being adventurous. Yeah, I jumped out of a plane

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when I was 16. That was fun. Escape Room says you like soccer. No. Can you ban them please from the

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stream for the use of that word? All right. Okay. Thank you. Appreciate you introduce yourself,

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Andy and huddle. I am Lancer and I am I come from gaming side of the house and eSports stuff.

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I used to be a played Planetside to a lot, which is an MMO FPS game. And I did a lot of podcasting

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streaming that stuff. Now I've been in the crypto space for a while, a sandbox and season one,

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I think midway through season one. So I have avatar, I have lands and, and the like, and

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just been really interested in the space and seen it evolve and develop. My background is

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contract negotiations, contract writing, also program management and product owner. So I,

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I have a Yeah, I'm super interested. The sound out to me is the intersection of

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all of my passions and stuff. So that's one of the reasons why I started this up to get more involved.

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So thank you all. Appreciate your time.

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That's the intros. And let's go into the disclaimer, we wouldn't be

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right if we didn't disclaim all the appropriate stuff. So first thing is, as a group and

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individuals, Andy Hodl and I, we do not represent the sandbox game or the sandbox foundation.

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We speak for ourselves as SanFam community members. All the stuff that goes along with that.

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And last but not least, because we're in the blockchain crypto space alongside the gaming,

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we are not your financial or legal advisor. Do not take anything we say as financial or legal advice.

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Please do yourself that favor. We are not advocating for should you buy this or that or

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where should you put your money and not what we're here to do, not in how any of our comments

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need to be taken. So with that legal administrative via out of the way,

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we can now get to the heart of the matter. The sandbox DAO.

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So this little roadmap is to catch everybody up past, present and future,

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whether you're watching this now or later on.

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It all started May 20. It actually started a long time ago because the white paper and

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the original vision of Seb was that the DAO would eventually be introduced, but it really hadn't

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emerged in any sort of significant way until May 28. Was that two weeks ago?

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Three weeks ago, on a Tuesday, May 28, I get an email in my inbox and a medium article drops

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from sandbox announcing the sandbox DAO. DAO is the centralized autonomous organization.

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It is basically a group surrounding a token cryptocurrency or community that organizes itself

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to govern, whether that be in rules, regulations, processes. It's like an association, you call it

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an organization, a nonprofit, any sort of allegory there that can help you understand it's a group

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that puts rules in places so it can govern itself, usually to govern how it spends money.

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And that is where the interesting thing started taking a turn when this was announced suddenly

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three weeks ago, where I didn't know was going to happen. I don't know, Andy, did you know

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it was going to happen?

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That was in the roadmap for a long time on it, but I didn't obviously didn't predict it was

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going to come upon us so quick. I don't think.

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Yeah. Did you know it was going to get dropped on May 28th?

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No.

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Yeah. HODL, did you?

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No, same like we knew. We all knew it was supposed to be there, but it...

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Right.

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There's a lot of things that are supposed to be there.

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But none of us knew it was going to happen.

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We don't know when they're going to happen.

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Right. So it was dropped on that Wednesday or that Tuesday, excuse me. When it dropped,

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SIPs 1, 2, and 3 were immediately made ready to vote. And that was the Sandbox Foundation.

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It was the initial budget and the approval of... I forget the third one, but

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those three SIPs immediately dropped. SIP 3 was... Oh, that was the budget.

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SIP 2 was the foundation and SIP 1 was introducing the Sandbox Town.

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Right. So that happened May 28th.

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But it didn't count land as voting power. That's an important note for what happens later.

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So that's May 28th. June 12th, SIP 4 and 5, the carbon neutral capture and the supporting the

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Red Cross, those were made available to vote on June 12th. It did count land as voting power

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in the snapshot. All right. So then June 13th, a day later, Sandbox Dow

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revokes SIP 1, 2, and 3 that was introduced in May 28th and then resubmits it to count

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land as voting power. Right. So initial community reaction was swift. Many people were like,

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where in the world did this come from? Why weren't we consulted? And what does this all mean for us?

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People were very quick to note that the voting power was not inclusive of land. It was only

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inclusive of held sand and wallets. So one to one, one sand equals one voting power.

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And then lands come into play where 4.5 thousand voting power was given to one land.

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So that then SIP 1, 2, and 3 were introduced, reintroduced, and then put back to a vote.

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Then everything starts unfurling. People are talking in the forums, but adjacent to that,

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a lot of AMAs and Twitter spaces are opening up. So starting June 1st, Mochaverse Hall hosts their

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first Sandbox Dow Twitter space. All right. So that was on a Saturday. That was three weeks ago.

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And then June 4th, Sandbox Dow hosts its Dow AMA. And that's where Seb and Cyril and Loretta,

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and Shannon, and Fred, and Shannon all answer questions. All the questions that people in the

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community had. I think Andy, you were there for that one. And then June 8th, Mochaverse Hall hosts

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its second Twitter space. So they host them every Saturday at 12 p.m. EST. Then Dr. Metaverse-O hosts

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another Dow AMA. June 12th. So that was this past week, right? Last Wednesday.

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More Q&As, more people trying to discover, explore what's going on with the Dow, how does it come to

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be? Why weren't we consulted? And the whole nine. And again, some people from the special council

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was there to answer. Then June 14th, two days ago, Andy, you host a Twitch interview with Peppa from

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Sandrush. And Sandrush proposed the first community-introduced Sandbox improvement proposal.

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So that's the first one that wasn't introduced from the May 28th announcement and the June

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right after that. And then yesterday, Mochaverse hosts its third Twitter space. And again,

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more community people showed up to talk about what we think. Whoops, I forgot to reorder this one.

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Back at the June 12th. Whoops. Back at June 12th, SIPs four and five close. It passed the first one

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with 88% of the vote and then SIP five passed with 81% of the vote. And then a day later,

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SIP one, two and three close. The first SIP one passes with 89%, SIP two passes with 93%,

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and SIP three passes with 64%. And then we fast forward back to where we are now with yesterday,

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Mochaverse hosting the third Twitter space. And now you're all caught up. That's what happened.

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Now what is what does it mean and everything that's we're about to get into. So some, some

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interesting facts to ground everybody. How many SIPs have been submitted so far for vote five?

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How many SIPs have passed so far? Five. Let's go with what does a SIP mean? Sandbox improvement

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proposal. What is a DAO? Decentralized Autonomous Organization. All right. How many draft SIPs are

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available now for community comment? Two. There's the creator first and then there's a magic palette.

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And that's what Andy yesterday was talking with Pepe from Sandrush was the magic palette. Draft

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SIP. You can find those in the forum. And here is so if you go up here to forum under proposal ideas,

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SIP draft, then you'll find the first two right there.

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All right. Each SIP requires a quorum to be eligible to pass. And that is 1% of the sand

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supply which is 30 million voting power. Each SIP requires a majority to pass. Meaning 51 50% or more,

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which means that when when something goes on the floor to vote, if it doesn't meet the quorum,

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it doesn't matter whether it passes or fails, it will automatically fail. So it's got to reset 30

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million dollar threshold 30 million voting power threshold, then it's allowed to pass or fail.

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And it's only allowed to pass if it receives a simple majority which is more than 50%.

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For voting power, if you own one sand in your wallet, you have one voting power per sand. If

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you own one land that's worth 4500 voting power. So you can do the math and that should equal your

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total voting power when you go to vote in the snapshot. All right. So there we go. Interesting

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facts. Now that we're all level set. Let's start with the discussion.

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Actually, I forgot about the tidbits. Let's read the tidbits. So the vision of the cell for the

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website cell foundation is a steward task with administering the decisions of the Dow and managing

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and managing the company operations, including management of the Treasury and employment of

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the Dallas support team. The special counsel special council members provide guidance,

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self improvement proposals to self improvement proposals ensuring that they align with the

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sandbox Dallas vision and community interests. They also hold decision making power and can veto

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proposals based on legality, redundancy, conflict and community interests. And I forgot about the

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advisory board. So the advisory board sandbox Dow advisory board. They are leaders in their respective

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fields. These ambassadors and strategic advisors leverage their expertise and networks to guide

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the gap Dow towards its vision of a decentralized vibrant metaverse. This multidisciplinary team

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reflects a sandbox is diverse and global reach while fostering a community that values creativity,

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innovation and inclusivity. The way seven all of them describe them and the AMA's was that they

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help advise the the what Seb says he wants to be the cultural epicenter of the metaverse. So this

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advisory board is to to assist the Dow and Seb and the special counsel in achieving that. So those

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are the definitions for the website. And with that, let's jump into it. I went longer than I

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thought. HODL Andy sorry about that. And always. So the discussion here the questions that we want

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to go over and I will highlight them so that you can see as we go. First and foremost, so Andy,

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let's go with you first man. What's your reaction all this good bad and ugly?

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Overall good I think. Now is needed. There's a lot of positivity that come from it. The community

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have been raising their concerns that their voice isn't being heard and this is a chance for them to

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be heard. But obviously the big but there. This is something that is going to have a huge impact on

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everything and rushing it shouldn't be done. Yeah, 100%. And a part of it needs to be rushed because

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you can't sit and dwindle all day, you know, but like the fact that the announcement of the Dow

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went live and like the council members had already been chosen that had already been made public.

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They'd already said that they're joining the sandbox Dow and it feels like very much that

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the first three SIPs were going ahead no matter what. And that's fair enough if the sandbox wanted

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to do that, but I don't know why you'd make the SIP if you're going to do it anyway. If you want

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to do it, you're still in charge of the company do it and then you're going to have to do it.

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And then announce the Dow afterwards. Here's what we're starting with the Dow, the community can have

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input afterwards. And they've made it seem like we have input now and really we don't. The first

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three SIPs were going ahead no matter what. Until they resubmitted them, yeah. Well, yeah, like

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again, there's another thing that is like a small issue, but again, it shows the rushing it and

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they're not paying attention properly. The fact that land wasn't included in the first three SIPs

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and then stakes and is not taken into account either. So the fact that they then extended

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the first three SIPs, why didn't they extend the other two? Four and five. You know, I know

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there weren't issues with them, but it seems silly for stuff to go ahead and be approved before the

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Dow has even been approved to exist, even if it is going to go through no matter what. Gotcha.

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What did you think about Cyril's explanation where they made mistakes, but they needed to

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start somewhere and they acknowledge those mistakes? Sorry. That was the message.

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I come from a background of electrical engineering and you have to make mistakes,

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you know, to learn. But part of learning is making mistakes. And at the end of the day,

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you have to try and mitigate as many mistakes as you can so that you don't have errors. But

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at the end of the day, if you're testing something that's new, then you're going to come across

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errors. As long as you learn from them and react quickly, then that's the way forward.

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So I agree with the mentality, but I don't think they would have.

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Go on, HODL. Sorry. Sorry. I was going to say, do you think they would have admitted

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that it was a mistake if there hadn't been an outcry or if they would have just gone ahead?

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They wouldn't know that there's a mistake if there wasn't an outcry.

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Part of the community's responsibility is to offer constructive criticism. You know,

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if we aren't happy with something, there's no point us throwing the teddy out of the cart.

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We have to come forward and say we aren't happy with this because of this and we would like it to

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happen this way instead. You know, you need to, if you're going to come to them with a problem,

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you need to at least offer a solution you're viable to accept.

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So I think like, if we didn't have the uproar or the issues about the DAO, then the sandbox

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wouldn't know that the issues existed. Gotcha. So your overall reaction is it's good,

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it was needed, but it was rushed. Yeah, I'd say so. Yeah. If they're announcing the DAO,

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I think they should have at least given the community a little bit of time to absorb the

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concept of the DAO before putting in those first three SIPs. Even if it's a week, you know,

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just give them that little bit of time before they feel like stuff is open and they have to vote.

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And they have to vote now and they got to submit the vote within two weeks. It feels

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the pressure was applied and they didn't need to be. Fair. Okay. Thank you. I appreciate you

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sharing that. All right, HODL, what's your reaction? And by the way, self-disclose,

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you didn't really know. You haven't been following along much, right?

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I've been trying to not form an opinion because I haven't read everything, which there's a lot,

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obviously, and I haven't listened to everything. So, but initial reactions, I agree with a lot of

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what Andy's saying. It's needed, but the way that it was rolled out was not great. I don't think

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they necessarily were admitting a mistake. I think they were getting caught trying to sneak

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something through a little bit, especially with the council members. Like, I'm not saying we have

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to do everything the same way other DAOs have done things, but I think council members are usually

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nominated, voted on, chosen by the community, not just appointed. And especially if we're going to

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be paying them out of this fund, I think we should have some say. And the staked sand is an issue

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still, I think, right? Because they've been pushing us to stake our sand. And now the fact

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that we had it staked is preventing us, like most of my sand is staked. So I have some land voting

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points, but not much in the sand department. Got you. Anyways. So you agree with Andy, overall

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it's needed, but the way it was rolled out wasn't great. The board should be voted in and the stake

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sand is still an issue. All right. My reaction is it began like in the same way Chris's did, Andy's

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HODL yours as well. It came out of nowhere. And when I'm reading these things, it's approving,

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it's wanting to approve a budget that it's already spending? So that did feel super rushed. And

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super rushed. And Andy, I think even to this day, I still feel the same way you do about I would

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have wished they had been socialized before May 28. And the sips were rolled out the same day,

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just kind of like surprise vote now. And so there's this there's this learning curve that

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we all have to make, especially for those of us who are just gamers and have no idea what a Dow is.

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I think I've maybe watched like five or six YouTube videos right after May 28. Try and figure this out.

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And, and then attending the mocha verse halls with G and his and the group that joins that

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listening to what they already know about the Dow and their impression given they come from mocha

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and they point out stuff. And so it was interesting to learn. I wanted to know what they knew.

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And, and what I did figure out is all delving into the details was even though in the beginning,

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sandbox did make some obvious mistakes, which Cyril and and Seb openly admit in the AMAs.

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I don't recall if it was just the community outcry that prompted it.

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HODL maybe it was a bit of both that they realized it. But Cyril mentioned many times that he was

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sorry that the way it was rolled out, that they did make some mistakes, namely, they, they didn't

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include land. And then also, they sometimes voted. And that's where I mentioned in the beginning,

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I'm on on the forums that that the vote was already decided with what was it like, some many millions.

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It was

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Yeah, of course, they have the voting power to push through anything that they want.

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1.1 million votes instantly on yes.

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Instantly. And that was like, well, what what real voice do we really have? So that struck out,

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stuck out to me big time. And but they ended up fixing that. When they resubmitted, they fixed it

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and and sandbox declined to vote on the first three. So they just let the community vote. And

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at the end of the day, so here in the latest slide, we have what the results were. But then

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the slide after I have who who are the top voters. And as you'll notice in sips one, two and three,

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sandbox is absent from that voting power. So they let the community vote by themselves.

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Sips four and five, they did vote. So that was pretty much an automatic yes. Sandbox rolling in

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with 27 million voting power. Not much any of us can do about that one, I don't think. So the

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consider the carbon capture and the Red Cross done from the beginning as a yes. So that to me was

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like, but serial, I'm in an AMA mentioned that it was it was a mistake in oversight. So they

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may mention that it was it was a mistake in oversight on their part. Because I think crafter

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correctly pointed out in one of the AMA is like, even though said mentioned he doesn't want and

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the group doesn't want to use their voting power, they did in this case, and in zero said it was an

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oversight. So I'll take them at their word because at this point, they are following through on the

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actions that I see that they're they are proposing that they want to replace themselves eventually

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with the the board members with the elected members. And and now their their initial strong

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here's what it is is to set the doubt on a path of organization and health. And then, you know,

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they get voted out of a job. And to them, that is the goal. So we'll see if that unfolds the way that

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they described these AMA's. I am fascinated to see though that they did not vote sips one, two and

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three. I think that's a step in the right direction toward letting the community decide which is what

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said said he really wanted to do, let the community decide. And and then that will rebound on the

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the game company. So that's my reaction. At the very beginning, I was skeptical,

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skeptical in the beginning, because of all the factors that were at play with sandbox voting

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instantly. And then the sips not, you know, that were predetermined at that point. And, and then

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did not know the board. I knew a few of them, like I'm a while holder. So I knew when I saw Shannon's

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name, I understood that one. And there were a couple others I noticed, but the vast majority of

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the special counsel, or I'm sorry, the advisory board. I don't really know. I haven't really seen

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them in the community much. So I was very skeptical about that, and how we were already voting for

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their approval, like who in the community was voting for them that knew them. It wasn't obvious

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to me that many people from the community was voting for them. So I was very skeptical about

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all that. But then over time in the past three weeks, I'd say my skepticism about the community

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skepticism has turned into healthy optimism. Do you think that's because they're getting paid to be

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more attentive towards the community? Say that again? Do you think that's only because they're

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being paid to be more attentive towards the community? Well, I still haven't seen anything

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from the special board or the advisory board. Right. So these people down here, I haven't seen

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any of them participate. Loretta Chen did. Loretta Chen did attend an AMA. But I don't,

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Anthony Chow, Ina, Mojja, Matthew, Mia, Samuel, Zaf, I haven't seen them. Have you, Hoddle or Andy?

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No. Okay. So that's-

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To be honest, I don't know any. I know Hermit Crab Studios and I've had interactions with Loretta

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previously. Okay. But I don't think any of that has been positive.

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Well, I heard her speak about why she was involved and what she wanted to do. And to me,

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cool. I mean, it's, I'm just gonna wait and see and then give my feedback as things go along.

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I had no opinion one way or the other because I'm still too new to this. So I wanted to give her

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the benefit of the doubt and the rest of the board, but I haven't heard from them except for Loretta.

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And then on the special counsel, the only one I haven't heard from is Jean-Michel and Yatt.

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Yatt, Sue. I'm so sorry if I'm mispronouncing your name. I'm very sorry.

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Yatt, CEO of Anamoka. Anamoka is a huge investor in the sandbox. I've seen Yatt a few times and

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Yatt is, he seems like he's busier than Seb somehow, but he still tries to make time for

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people. So I've had good interactions with Yatt before.

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That's awesome to hear. And I heard Shannon, she spoke a number of times on the AMAs.

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Frédéric heard him as well and then Seb. So I think Shannon's made a positive effort to

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interact with the community. Yeah, I tweeted back to her after I saw her,

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listened to her AMA. I want to do a podcast with her because she talked about how she consulted

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a lot of other DOWs to put research into being a good council member. And I really want to know

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more about that. I want us to hear what she's learned to see how it can apply to us, how can it

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benefit the community. But yes, I was very... Has anyone asked them how they were chosen,

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how they were approached to be part of this council? Yes, I wrote it down. I think under

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the tidbits. So Cyril on the 4 June AMA, he and Seb also explained that they selected the initial

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council members and special advisors based on who they trusted to help guide them through the

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initial stages of bringing the DOW to life. So they were handpicked.

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So they wanted to give their friends some... Hey friends, here's some sand.

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You could use the word friends. I would probably use the word network because I imagine some of

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them are business partners. But I won't disagree with the way you characterize it. I don't know.

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I don't know the relationships between them. I agree with the initial council.

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The Seb, Yat and so on. I agree with that group of people. I think there should be a team that is

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selected by the sandbox, which understand the sandbox values and direction for the future.

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And I think they should have a say in it. A lot of those are big, large investors of the sandbox.

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So I think it's only fair that a group of people, the board that kind of have a final say and dictate

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the direction of the company. Yeah. I don't know much about Jean or Félic, Grail Capital or

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Ariane. I don't know much about them. I didn't get time to do all my data mining that I wanted to

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before this episode, but subsequent podcast will be me doing that. Ariane is a French company.

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I think like a capital investment company again. So they're all basically investors, I feel very

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much sure. That's probably true. Someone who has a stake in it going well. Yeah. So I agree with

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those, but the ones underneath, I think we had the time. Why not vote? Why not? They're getting paid

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a lot of money to do it. And we haven't heard. Go and have a look at the breakdown for the budget

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for the initial government. Wasn't it like 40,000 USD? I remember looking that up. I forgot to put

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it in my slide, but how much are they getting? Let's look at the initial Dow budget was 15.15

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million. This is foundation. Now we want sandbox. The initial budget. It's three, right? Here's the

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budget. Here's SIP 3. And the budget it was is for 15 million, if I recall.

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There it is 15.5 million sand. So divided by two is how many US dollars. And then operations got

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1.8 million. And that's the pay the special council members maintain the Dallas tech stack,

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legal services, compliance, while banking services. So not just for special council members.

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Does it say and in the AMA, I think it was George who wanted a little bit more fidelity on that,

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on that how much was for people being paid specifically. Let's just say the worst case

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scenario. One all 1.8 million sand was being given to the members. Worst case scenario.

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Worst case scenario. Or maybe the best case scenario for them. So that was for was it for

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the board or just the council? I think it's just special council members. So the board, I don't

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think is getting paid. I think I have that in a note somewhere that they weren't taking.

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I think Loretta mentioned that. That changed my perspective on things. I didn't know that.

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But I don't quote me because I remember Loretta when she first came on. I'm like,

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that was really, was really interesting to know compensation maybe.

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Everybody's compensation. No, I'm someone please fact check. I believe Loretta mentioned in her AMA.

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It was AMA for June. When she was talking. So 1.8 million, let's say just for the council members

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of which there are five. So divided by five, 360,000 sand. So $180,000 USD. Okay. No,

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I'm with you on that Andy. This covers it for to the end of next year. So it's 18 months into it

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in total. Right, right. That was another thing that and through the AMA was brought up. Why were

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their term links so long? Zero, I think gave a great explanation for that. And I'd have to read

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it word for word to to make that to not misrepresent him. So it was 2025, right? That's when they

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December 2025. Yeah, they believe six months isn't long enough to make an impact on the direction

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of the dial. Right. And then they had to cross over to the the election cycle, which is I think

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he said, Oh, I don't want to misrepresent him. He gave a month of when in the Constitution, it says

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when the elections are going to have or when the term links will end. And so it just made sense

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for him to push it out all the way to the end of the year. Mike, you know what? That's that sounds

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reasonable. I'm not mad at that. I think it's reasonable. But at the end of the day, it's a

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problem that could easily be avoided. There's a lot of information that the community don't have.

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And they're trying to piece together what made them make the decision that they did. Yeah.

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I think they did a good explanation. They did do the AMA. I think they gave some good explanations.

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And I walked away from it thinking not not not as suspicious as when I first read all this.

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Like if there is a problem with six months not being long enough,

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why not? Why not wait till the end of the year? Why not run it for 12 months and have it end in

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the middle of the year? You know, why not address the problem? Why not just say, oh, well,

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we didn't think six months was enough, so we did 18. You know, why couldn't we do 12 months?

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That's a big jump from six to 18. I'm trying to find where Cyril answered that question,

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because someone asked him that exact thing and I had to write it down.

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I wasn't able to fully comprehend it. I remember the AMA, but I felt very much

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that they just gave us answers that we wanted to hear that were very corporate answers.

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You didn't think that they were sincere? No, not really. Not from the past that I've had.

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If they do it once, yeah, fair enough, you could say sincere. But if they do it twice or three times

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or four times, it loses its sincerity. Oh, I see. Okay, you think there's something

378
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:39,040
else going on there? There's always more information, isn't there? So there's always

379
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:45,600
a bigger picture. Got it. All right, I found it. So it was the 12th June AMA. Crafter asked,

380
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:52,640
why was the 1.5 years implemented for the initial positions? Seems like a long time.

381
00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:59,680
Cyril said, and I'm quoting almost, budget is reset every January, we get an annual

382
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:03,760
allowance from the DAO. It's frustrating for the council members to make any impact

383
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:08,880
in that timeframe. So we forward projected and land at the next January, which is 1.5 years.

384
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:22,880
And that's that. Yeah, it's just a very like, there was a problem. So that was our way of

385
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:26,880
overcoming it was extending it. What's the point of having the DAO if you want the community to

386
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:31,920
vote if when you have situations like this, you don't let the community vote? Fair.

387
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:39,440
You know, all that what they've really done is cement the next 18 months as their direction.

388
00:44:40,720 --> 00:44:46,400
True. I mean, that was their stated goal. Yes, to set it on. Yeah, they've just pushed the

389
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:50,880
problem back again, though. Like, rather than addressing the problem, they they've gone,

390
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:54,960
well, we could extend the problem to six months, or we could extend it to 18 months. It's like,

391
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:58,880
yeah, let's deal with that later. Well, their state of view is they want 1.5

392
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:04,480
years to figure it out. So it's not a problem after that time. What's to figure out though?

393
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:13,040
I guess the whole point of DAO is autonomous. Probably, you know, taking in community reaction,

394
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:17,360
trying to figure out what the SIPs are going to look like, and then incorporating whatever

395
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:23,200
rules they feel they need to protect the DAO, and then let the community take it over after that.

396
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:28,400
And, you know, amend the Constitution. Cyril said many times that after we do this,

397
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:34,560
and we set you all on the path, the Constitution is amendable. You can you can change it after.

398
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:40,880
So, but escape room, I think right on chat, you preferred that we had figured this out before the

399
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:53,440
vote. Right now, it has it has the community's attention. And it may be not the best attention.

400
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:58,240
And in six months, it might still have the community's attention. But in 18 months, I feel like

401
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:10,480
it will have lost a lot of its luster, a lot of its interest. So by then, they'll be able to do

402
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:19,360
whatever they want, because people have stopped fighting. That's my opinion on that. Where do we

403
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:26,240
see this going? So I think I just heard your take on it. You think you're gonna we're gonna eventually

404
00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:31,040
lose our attention on it. And then that'll give them the opportunity to do whatever they want.

405
00:46:32,880 --> 00:46:36,640
Yeah, I mean, they already have the opportunity to do whatever they want. So the opportunity,

406
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:42,720
yes, they're just giving us the illusion of power. Well, I mean, when you when you look at the actual

407
00:46:42,720 --> 00:46:50,080
power of votes going on here, whoever crypto polytons is, and then those other wallets like there,

408
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:58,880
but I don't see a sandbox on that. So there was a chance for that to say no.

409
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:07,840
I don't know who crypto polytons is, I guess. But it's probably just somebody that's close with

410
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:15,760
somebody that's close with Seb or Yad or you know what I mean? You take the more cynical approach.

411
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:26,800
Yeah, I'm a cynic. Okay. The other thing is, if you have the voting power of 4 million,

412
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:31,040
are you gonna vote for this not to go ahead because you have such a large vote?

413
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:40,400
Yeah, I very nearly voted no. I did vote on one of them. If that person has 4 million votes and

414
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:46,000
the quorum is 30 million, they have over 10% of the power needed to make this go ahead. So

415
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:52,960
they're not gonna vote no, because they want to be able to have such that large voting power.

416
00:47:54,400 --> 00:48:00,720
So of course, the big heavy heavy hitters are gonna vote for being able to have more of an

417
00:48:00,720 --> 00:48:04,960
impact. And I don't disagree with that. If you've invested loads of money in the sandbox, then

418
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:07,840
I think you should have more more say, you know?

419
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:19,920
Yeah. Well, I'm I'm interested in helping to bring order. I want I want there to be

420
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:29,440
a healthy approach to this that incorporates fairly big and small. And I've been thinking a

421
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:35,520
lot about what sip I want to I have about seven sips I've scripted out. One of them is a sip for

422
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:42,320
introducing kind of like a, either like a parliamentary or Congress approach, which has

423
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:49,520
based on on numbers and then based on just positions. And that kind of balances out.

424
00:48:51,040 --> 00:48:55,760
We think we does. But I don't know, I've been racking my brain as to what I want to propose

425
00:48:55,760 --> 00:49:03,120
to try and to counter some of the stuff that I'm hearing from other DALs, which I barely know

426
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:08,800
anything about, by the way. I need to get the mocha team in here and other people to

427
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:14,080
to talk about what their experiences with the eight point balance going on with their delegates.

428
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:17,760
And apparently something's blowing up over there. I don't know.

429
00:49:17,760 --> 00:49:23,760
So HODL, you think it's gonna it's gonna die down? Yeah.

430
00:49:26,240 --> 00:49:33,440
I think interest in anything wanes over time. Or like ebbs and flows, like even the sandbox in

431
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:41,280
general. It has been, you know, the biggest metaverse, the most exciting thing. And then

432
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:46,960
it sort of died off a bit and other things took its place or just in general, the metaverse

433
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:57,440
interest is down currently. So it's impossible to see the future six months, 18 months, it doesn't

434
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:06,240
matter. But I think that this will just become another part of the sandbox that people will

435
00:50:06,240 --> 00:50:11,360
either be interested in or they won't. And that's fair. Like, there's so many different facets to

436
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:18,080
the sandbox that you can be involved in. You can be here just to make art, make games, make friends,

437
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:22,480
play games, you know, like, you don't have to be involved in the DAO at all. So

438
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:31,040
that's true. We don't. Yeah, it's gonna be it's gonna be tough to pull interest in this, I think.

439
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:34,880
Andy, what do you think? Where's this going?

440
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:45,520
And one of one of two ways that the DAO is a lot of the SIPs for the DAO are going to be asking for

441
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:52,560
funds. And the DAO at the end of the day is a drain on the sandbox funds. Now, the whole purpose

442
00:50:52,560 --> 00:51:00,080
is that the SIPs that are submitted bring more value to the sandbox than they consume through

443
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:07,120
the initial funding. And if it's not successful in that way, then the DAO is just going to drain

444
00:51:07,120 --> 00:51:11,280
the sand and all of the sand that goes into the DAO is going to be sold. You know,

445
00:51:12,720 --> 00:51:17,200
they're going to sell it. That's the whole purpose of asking for the revenue is to sell it.

446
00:51:18,240 --> 00:51:27,360
And asking for the funds, sorry. So it is either going to go away, go one way of the DAO just sucking

447
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:31,840
sand from the sandbox without bringing that value or two, it's going to be successful in the

448
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:38,640
community, interact and share the same opinions with the large holders of the sandbox and we can

449
00:51:38,640 --> 00:51:45,840
actually have our say. But it requires things like this being done, you know, making sure that

450
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:53,040
everyone's opinions are heard and everyone's perspectives are understood so that people

451
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:56,800
can make a decision that they think is suitable. Because at the end of the day, you're voting for

452
00:51:56,800 --> 00:52:05,200
you, you know, whoever holds the sand, the land, they're voting for what situation they're in

453
00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:11,360
and their circumstances. And that might not be the same as someone else's. So if we can understand

454
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:17,280
where people are coming from, we can hopefully make a vote that suits the community. Well said.

455
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:24,960
Well, for the record, I scripted out seven SIPs that I haven't yet fully

456
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:30,800
created a template for. Only one of them is asking for money. The other six are just things I'm like,

457
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,600
guys, can we please implement this?

458
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:40,640
And I hope a lot more of the SIPs are about that, you know, frustrations from the community and easy

459
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:46,880
fixes are just a slight change of direction in the sandbox approach. The Builders Challenge too,

460
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:54,880
was a great feedback for me because I, Floor Droppers, we put in some deals with nonprofits,

461
00:52:55,440 --> 00:53:00,080
fresh, fresh gamers who have never played sandbox. And I just kept track of all the things you're

462
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:04,880
like, hey, why does it do this? Why don't we have that? And just things that seem obvious to them

463
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:11,520
that we're missing. And so that's where a lot of my SIP ideas are coming from is that and just other

464
00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:16,480
things I've seen over the years. Simple, simple stuff that I wish they would please just do.

465
00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:18,240
Absolutely need those new people.

466
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:19,300
Right.

467
00:53:20,800 --> 00:53:27,360
Well, that's it. If the, if the, if the count, not the council, if the, the group of people that are

468
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:33,520
on the DAW keep forgetting the advisory board or whatever. If they don't understand these

469
00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:38,000
frustrations and for them, everything's working fine and their company is ticking over, this is

470
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:44,640
great, that they're not going to understand the difficulties of the tools or like I say,

471
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:49,760
the frustrations that the developers have and that make it a lot easier for the community or

472
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:51,600
them to interact with their community.

473
00:53:51,600 --> 00:53:57,760
That's why I was so, so interested in and happy to see the Magic Palette, Andy, when you did the,

474
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:04,400
that with Pepe. That was so cool to see because that to me, even it is asking for money. So,

475
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:07,040
you know, that's our first test case for what do we want this to be?

476
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,120
But it was cool to see that him addressing that problem.

477
00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:17,920
I like the, the one from Sandrush because it does bring value to the community. It's not like

478
00:54:18,960 --> 00:54:22,640
they're not funding a private project. They're funding something that they're hopefully planning

479
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:31,760
to like, not open source, but allow the community to use for free. And I think creating a baseline

480
00:54:31,760 --> 00:54:37,200
of better experiences within the sandbox is only going to mean higher retention for players that

481
00:54:37,200 --> 00:54:42,640
are in here and new users coming in. Yeah. So you, so you see it going one of two ways.

482
00:54:42,640 --> 00:54:44,800
It's going to go really well. It's going to go really bad.

483
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:50,480
Yeah. But like Hoddle said, the community are just going to brush it off because like

484
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:56,480
catalysts and other thing after six months, everyone kind of just gave up on them and

485
00:54:56,480 --> 00:55:00,480
no one really knows what's going on with it. I haven't given up. I'm going to do a podcast

486
00:55:00,480 --> 00:55:04,480
episode on it. I think the dow is going to allow us to, I think the dow is going to allow us to

487
00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:10,160
I've got the numbers to back it up too. Yeah. Raise those issues again.

488
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:16,640
But like it just killed my ability as a studio to continue making money.

489
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:26,960
You just, we want to do the marketplace for a group where we have offer tokens to

490
00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:32,000
holders of our NFC collection and they have the ability to spend it on a marketplace where they

491
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:38,960
can claim assets to help improve their experience or, you know, whatever. And little things like

492
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:43,280
that are really important. And just the sandbox saying, Hey, you can submit a request for them

493
00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:49,920
freeware isn't a sustainable channel. Yeah. There the starter pack.

494
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:53,680
I think Hoddle shares the same frustrations in that too.

495
00:55:53,680 --> 00:56:06,880
So now how do we want the dow to help the sandbox? How do let's start with you, the cynic.

496
00:56:10,960 --> 00:56:12,720
That's funny because I feel like that's not my,

497
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:18,560
how people perceive me as a cynic, but I am. Yeah. I don't, I don't think they do either.

498
00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:28,240
I definitely didn't. The truth comes out. Right? Yeah. Speaking, I just, there's so many people

499
00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:33,600
involved in the sandbox that I care so much about and I want to take care of everybody.

500
00:56:36,560 --> 00:56:42,720
And it's really hard when I see them getting steamrolled and not being able to do what they

501
00:56:42,720 --> 00:56:48,720
want to do and should be able to do within the sandbox. Anyway, so it was a question. Sorry.

502
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:54,240
Where, where do you see the dow helping the sandbox game?

503
00:56:57,760 --> 00:57:04,400
I think if some of the community members can get

504
00:57:04,400 --> 00:57:14,960
SIPs going like you with a focus on improving the experience for builders and players,

505
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:21,520
then I think it'll be great. I'm big on the experience for the players. That's what I'm

506
00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:24,240
passionate about. I want there to be a few possibilities possible. Because without the

507
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:32,160
players, there's no point. Right. Right. My heart though, now that I've learned how to build and I've

508
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:39,040
worked with, you know, Meta Theory Studio and DreamJunk, I get it. I'm sympathetic to their

509
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:46,880
plight right now. So I mean, there's an opportunity. That's okay. There's an opportunity

510
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:55,120
to improve the sandbox game, which is what it's supposed to be. But I don't think that the

511
00:57:55,120 --> 00:58:01,120
council, whatever they are advisors, I don't think that's their focus. I think their focus is

512
00:58:01,920 --> 00:58:08,400
making money. And you know, the two can sort of could sort of go hand in hand. Okay.

513
00:58:11,440 --> 00:58:16,080
I've heard I've heard Loretta not Loretta, excuse me. I've heard Shannon speak and I,

514
00:58:16,720 --> 00:58:21,760
and I looked her up on YouTube and saw some of the other places she's attended.

515
00:58:21,760 --> 00:58:28,560
She is big into advocacy. Very big into advocacy. She she stated her goal many times

516
00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:38,720
on many different venues that her goal is to diversify the perspective of the of the

517
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:43,360
I'm gonna get that part wrong, the NFT market and the gamer in the metaverse.

518
00:58:44,480 --> 00:58:49,920
So that's where she came up with World of Women. And so she's interested in the metaverse.

519
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:55,920
And so she's interested in ensuring that other perspectives, you know, from whether they be

520
00:58:55,920 --> 00:59:01,680
minority groups or whatever, they may be underrepresented communities are have a bigger

521
00:59:01,680 --> 00:59:06,720
voice. That's her stated goal. And that's why she said she's mostly I think that's a great goal.

522
00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:15,040
When I had my podcast before it was focusing on women in web three and the NFT space.

523
00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:21,280
And there's absolutely a need for more of that. But that doesn't need to be the focus, especially

524
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:30,080
right off the bat, like build a good platform and then bring everybody in. Okay.

525
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:40,880
So do you see the Dow as a way to help the player in the builder? Is that is that what I'm hearing?

526
00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:48,720
Is that is that what I'm hearing? I would hope so. That's my dream for the Dow, but

527
00:59:49,840 --> 00:59:53,600
it's going to take some work to get there. Because obviously, these first few sips

528
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:56,640
are not really focused on that. I mean, there's some vague

529
00:59:58,800 --> 01:00:04,000
things in the budget about going towards right builders challenges and live ops and all sorts

530
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:07,760
of streamers. I'm like, Hi, I'm a streamer. Do I get a piece of this pie? Or

531
01:00:07,760 --> 01:00:13,680
who are we talking about here? So I'd like to see a lot more clarity about the budget.

532
01:00:14,800 --> 01:00:18,800
And yeah, more sips from the community for sure.

533
01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:24,240
Oh, man, I'm so looking forward to building these these steps out. Although the templates

534
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:29,920
a little long, so I have to come prepared with like, data and it might take me a little bit

535
01:00:29,920 --> 01:00:35,120
to get some of these out. Because I need to demonstrate to the community what it is,

536
01:00:35,120 --> 01:00:42,160
this little tiny thing will do. I mean, I anticipated costing it will cause $0 from

537
01:00:42,160 --> 01:00:47,840
the sandbox fund, at least I'm not gonna request any, unless I thought all the time and effort I

538
01:00:47,840 --> 01:00:53,440
put in, and sometimes I have to buy graphics like, would any be buddy be mad if I asked for like 100

539
01:00:53,440 --> 01:00:56,400
sand or something? Would that be a turn off?

540
01:00:56,400 --> 01:01:01,200
It's like one little scoop of sand on the beach, right? I don't think anybody would notice.

541
01:01:01,680 --> 01:01:07,680
Okay, I just don't want to turn anybody off. But I'm, I am investing time and money into this

542
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:15,120
to make it be as quality as possible. And I don't feel strongly either way. But I'd like to,

543
01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:21,040
if it doesn't turn anyone off, then maybe 100 sand, you know, something like that.

544
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:29,200
But the going my going line is that it's probably zero. Definitely not gonna ask anything for like

545
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:35,440
long term or milestones or whatever. Andy, what do you think about the DAO? How do you want the

546
01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:36,400
data to help the game?

547
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:45,120
Talking about diversification within the space, I think the space has to exist before it's

548
01:01:45,120 --> 01:01:54,160
not diverse enough. Which means that you have to invest the time into developing a place for the

549
01:01:54,160 --> 01:02:03,280
developers and the builders to develop and create those environments. And then if those environments

550
01:02:03,280 --> 01:02:08,320
aren't diverse enough, you can step in and focus on diversifying them. But at the moment,

551
01:02:08,320 --> 01:02:11,760
they're not diverse enough. So I think that's a good thing.

552
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:17,040
There's too many frustrations for either a player or a developer within the sandbox. And those

553
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:22,000
frustrations should be addressed first. You know, I had a simple issue that I've been having for

554
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:27,600
like a week now and such wood, I think it's fixed. But the issue was if I opened up, I tried to

555
01:02:27,600 --> 01:02:33,200
launch a game in the sandbox, it crashed the launcher instantly. Yeah, I'd have to do it 20

556
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:38,240
30. I'd be sat there for 40 minutes. And then I'd be like, I'm gonna do it. And then I'd be like,

557
01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:45,200
I'd have to do it 20 30. I'd be sat there for 45 minutes on stream, trying to load into my own

558
01:02:45,200 --> 01:02:52,960
social hub, just so I could play hide and seek with the community or something. And it took like,

559
01:02:53,920 --> 01:03:00,960
two weeks for the sandbox to fix the issue. And yeah, they did it quite quickly. But at the end

560
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:08,240
of the day, I'm live streaming every day for two weeks. And these issues are getting aired, the issues are

561
01:03:08,240 --> 01:03:15,680
being shown. And I think I'm not saying that they should fix it instantly. But I think that situation

562
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:23,760
highlights the issues that we have in the sandbox. It's difficult for us as developers are builders

563
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:30,000
within the space to be able to use the tools without having some simple frustrations. And those

564
01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:37,360
frustrations turn into us not wanting to do what we want to do. Disliking the passion or so on.

565
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:43,520
So I'd like to see the DAO used to either, like you say, submit small issues or changes in the

566
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:49,040
direction of the development for the future of the sandbox. Or I'd like to see things like

567
01:03:49,040 --> 01:03:54,800
Sandrush where if funds are being asked for or requested, they bring more value to the community.

568
01:03:54,800 --> 01:04:04,400
Sure. I agree with both of you. I think I mostly closely reflect the huddle. I want the DAO to

569
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:11,920
benefit the player and the builder. The builder, let's say the developer. So that's the game maker

570
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:21,840
and the Vox editor. I want them, I want these SIPs to prioritize our frustrations so that they are

571
01:04:21,840 --> 01:04:34,480
addressed first versus I'm not going to, I'll just say versus the interests and designs of those

572
01:04:34,480 --> 01:04:40,560
who maybe don't open the sandbox every day and don't play the games as often as the players do.

573
01:04:41,200 --> 01:04:44,560
The these players, they come and it takes them

574
01:04:46,960 --> 01:04:50,880
a while to get into the game. And I'm not talking about the download speed.

575
01:04:50,880 --> 01:04:58,400
That's give you whatever. But the process that you go from landing on the page to entering into the

576
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:07,280
one, the zero zero hub, too many clicks too long. If you compare that to other competitors, they are

577
01:05:07,280 --> 01:05:17,120
doing it way faster. And we have a player retention policy policy problem. When people come, there's

578
01:05:17,120 --> 01:05:24,240
not enough replayability to keep them here to organize their player events around. I used to

579
01:05:24,240 --> 01:05:31,280
organize a lot of player events like 400 players every week would play a game. In the game I used

580
01:05:32,800 --> 01:05:41,360
to stream for and podcast for. And the organization it took to make that happen was, was

581
01:05:41,360 --> 01:05:50,800
it was because the game made it relatively easy for us to build around them so that we can build

582
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:59,280
like almost like an American NFL or a FIFA around the sport. That was kind of what we were. We

583
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:06,800
broadcasted events and we we refereed them and we held tournaments so that different servers could

584
01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:13,600
play each other. The organization that went into that, the people who were on it, like myself and

585
01:06:13,600 --> 01:06:19,760
others, we were passionate about it. And we were able to organize events around it. Right now that's

586
01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:27,760
super hard to do. Plus the player count and also the barrier to entry to even get into the game.

587
01:06:27,760 --> 01:06:36,880
So I'm interested in bringing that down via SIPs. Finding ways that make sense to prioritize the

588
01:06:36,880 --> 01:06:42,720
game developers time so they can remove that barrier to entry so that people will show up faster

589
01:06:42,720 --> 01:06:49,840
and stay longer. I can't do much about people, you know, going to building more mini games or more

590
01:06:49,840 --> 01:06:57,680
replayability stuff. That's on every developer for themselves. But I'm interested in bringing that

591
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:05,680
down. That's how I see Sandbox DAO helping the game is prioritizing developer time toward our

592
01:07:05,680 --> 01:07:12,160
frustrations that will lower the barrier for new players and keep players coming back.

593
01:07:14,080 --> 01:07:18,560
And then eventually we get to some of the stuff that Seb said, which is pretty exciting.

594
01:07:19,760 --> 01:07:26,000
Working the DAO to where it is self-sufficient and it's not just a drain on the resources. It also

595
01:07:26,000 --> 01:07:32,640
accrues revenue. And that's one of the things he mentioned for that carbon neutral pairing trade

596
01:07:32,640 --> 01:07:39,120
they're going to buy that passed. He said a long-term benefit for that could be a revenue making

597
01:07:39,600 --> 01:07:45,760
contributor. I don't understand it all that much yet until I've delved into it more deeply, but

598
01:07:45,760 --> 01:07:59,120
that's where I'd like it to go. All right, what does it mean for the DAO to be run by SandFam?

599
01:08:03,840 --> 01:08:09,920
What do you think Andy? I don't know if that's a good idea. I don't think the DAO should be run by

600
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:20,160
SandFam. Tell me more. Sandbox is a billion dollar company. You don't just pick random people and

601
01:08:20,160 --> 01:08:26,720
put them in charge of it because they're part of the community. I think it's more important about

602
01:08:28,480 --> 01:08:35,120
making sure that their opinion, their frustration, their perspective is understood and valued and

603
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:40,080
whatever decision the Sandbox DAO makes should have that in mind. That's all be considerate.

604
01:08:42,720 --> 01:08:48,480
I don't think the DAO should be run by the community. I think the community should have

605
01:08:48,480 --> 01:08:54,720
their vote and say, but don't allow the community to run the Sandbox. It's a bad decision.

606
01:08:54,720 --> 01:09:07,280
Okay. How do you see it going wrong? A company has to take risks and not everyone

607
01:09:08,000 --> 01:09:16,880
likes those risks or can understand that. I always talk about Elon Musk and his flamethrower.

608
01:09:16,880 --> 01:09:20,240
Every person, when he was building that flamethrower, every person would have said,

609
01:09:20,240 --> 01:09:25,760
no, no, no, that is a bad idea. That is a stupid idea. What are you doing? Then when it launches

610
01:09:25,760 --> 01:09:34,720
and it's very successful, everyone's like, wow, genius, great idea. The community isn't going to

611
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:39,920
think like that as a whole. They're going to think safer more than riskier. I don't think it's-

612
01:09:39,920 --> 01:09:40,560
Risk averse.

613
01:09:40,560 --> 01:09:51,200
Yes. Seb's got the company to where it is today without us having any input in the direction

614
01:09:51,200 --> 01:09:57,680
and the future of the Sandbox. He knows how to run a company at the end of the day. It's not

615
01:09:57,680 --> 01:10:05,120
the first time he's done it. I think this company is a bit different because it is very much involved

616
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:09,840
in the community. The community have invested almost in it. That's the way that blockchain and

617
01:10:09,840 --> 01:10:18,560
NFT games work. I think with that comes a lot more frustrations, but definitely the community's

618
01:10:18,560 --> 01:10:24,240
input and value should be heard. I hope that's how we utilize the doubt, but I don't think they

619
01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:30,640
should be in charge at the end of the day. Okay. Harald, what do you think?

620
01:10:30,640 --> 01:10:39,600
I think no one entity or group should be in charge of it.

621
01:10:42,080 --> 01:10:49,520
So right now I feel like the Sand Fam, which is just a made up thing that we've all- a name

622
01:10:49,520 --> 01:10:57,600
we've given ourselves, a label. I'd like to see some representation on the council committee,

623
01:10:57,600 --> 01:10:58,400
whatever they're called.

624
01:10:58,400 --> 01:11:03,920
What kind?

625
01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:11,760
Either from Bill or player perspective or bit about so like I know Chris Day, but I think she's a

626
01:11:12,320 --> 01:11:18,800
representative for both sides. And I'd like to see somebody like that involved.

627
01:11:18,800 --> 01:11:20,560
Did you say Tushay?

628
01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:21,440
At least one person.

629
01:11:24,000 --> 01:11:24,480
Okay.

630
01:11:24,480 --> 01:11:25,360
Oh, I said Kristen.

631
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:30,080
Kristen. Sorry. But Tushay is an example. Sorry if I keep cutting out.

632
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:35,840
Yeah, it's all good. Kristen. Oh, candidly Kristen. Okay. You haven't heard from her

633
01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:38,960
since she said she'd be open to it. I hope she's okay.

634
01:11:44,400 --> 01:11:46,640
She's busy, mama. I know the feeling.

635
01:11:46,640 --> 01:11:53,920
Yeah. Okay. So you'd like more representation, but you don't feel that any one group

636
01:11:53,920 --> 01:11:56,320
or person should be in charge of the doubt.

637
01:12:04,080 --> 01:12:07,280
You cut out there. Did you say yes? Did I have that right?

638
01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:11,520
Yeah, sorry. I don't know why internet's struggling right now.

639
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:13,040
All good.

640
01:12:13,040 --> 01:12:14,880
Yes. Yes, yes, yes.

641
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:28,800
Yes, yes, yes. Okay. For me, I'd say what it means is that, Andy, your points will take him, man.

642
01:12:31,120 --> 01:12:37,360
Seb has gotten, Seb and his team have gotten to where they are without our direct input.

643
01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:43,120
But I think what that means for us is that we have a vote in the direction of, so they build the house

644
01:12:43,120 --> 01:12:47,920
for us to live in, and then we vote on where we want the furniture, where we, you know, what color

645
01:12:47,920 --> 01:12:51,440
we want the walls to be painted. We don't vote on whether or not we should knock the house down.

646
01:12:52,080 --> 01:13:02,960
So that's where I see us being. Okay. And I have a real life thing that I need to do.

647
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:10,080
I have a real life thing that I need to go see for a few minutes, but let's start off with the next

648
01:13:10,080 --> 01:13:15,280
question. Andy and Hoddle, what do we know the advisory board and special counsel and maybe

649
01:13:16,080 --> 01:13:20,560
just talk through who you know and what you've seen of them. And I'll be right back.

650
01:13:25,920 --> 01:13:26,480
Andy, go ahead.

651
01:13:27,360 --> 01:13:28,800
You better go, Andy, because I have it.

652
01:13:28,800 --> 01:13:37,600
Okay. I keep getting confused with which one's which. Let's start with the team at the top.

653
01:13:37,600 --> 01:13:39,120
I think it's the advisory board.

654
01:13:39,120 --> 01:13:40,240
I'll pull them up.

655
01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:45,840
I agree with the advisory board.

656
01:13:51,440 --> 01:13:56,000
It's a lot of CEOs on the advisory board.

657
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:00,160
Oh, the special counsel. Sorry, it's what I was going to do first.

658
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:05,200
I agree with all of them. Like,

659
01:14:13,920 --> 01:14:18,320
you can't not put seven, you can't not put yet on there. And then if the other three are heavy

660
01:14:18,320 --> 01:14:26,960
invested, right, you can't not put them on it. I agree with them.

661
01:14:27,840 --> 01:14:29,920
And to be honest, I haven't heard of a board.

662
01:14:33,440 --> 01:14:34,720
You haven't heard of who?

663
01:14:37,520 --> 01:14:40,480
The people, any of the people on the advisory board.

664
01:14:40,480 --> 01:14:45,120
I only have heard of Loretta and Matthews.

665
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:51,520
Hermit crab studio built some stuff very early on.

666
01:14:51,520 --> 01:14:54,880
I've heard of the studio, heard of the studios, but not the people.

667
01:14:55,520 --> 01:15:00,640
Okay. Well, yeah, when Hermit crab studios did something a long time ago,

668
01:15:00,640 --> 01:15:04,960
but I haven't heard from them in like, a year.

669
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:14,000
At least of anything that I've done. I don't think the advisory board should be as it is.

670
01:15:15,040 --> 01:15:21,600
I don't think any of those people have enough knowledge about the sandbox to be able to make

671
01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:25,600
the decisions or advise on it. But at the end of the day, they're only advising.

672
01:15:25,600 --> 01:15:28,560
They're only going, yeah, we think so or no, we don't.

673
01:15:28,560 --> 01:15:31,920
At the end of the day, they're only going, yeah, we think so or no, we don't.

674
01:15:31,920 --> 01:15:35,360
At the end of the day, the community can have their vote and do whatever they want with it.

675
01:15:35,360 --> 01:15:38,080
The advisory board aren't going to be able to reject an SIP.

676
01:15:38,080 --> 01:15:40,560
They're just going to say that they vote negative against it.

677
01:15:41,520 --> 01:15:49,200
Yeah. Well, the way Cyril explained the advisory board is they have no say over the proposals,

678
01:15:50,000 --> 01:15:54,640
only the council does. And the council only get to say whether or not it's legal,

679
01:15:54,640 --> 01:15:56,880
moral, ethical, and should go to a vote.

680
01:15:56,880 --> 01:16:03,600
But the advisory board, they said, is just advisors from different sectors of where Seb

681
01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:09,280
and the special council and the constitution believes the Dao should be oriented towards,

682
01:16:09,280 --> 01:16:13,760
which Seb said many times is centered around he wants to be the cultural epicenter of the

683
01:16:13,760 --> 01:16:20,160
metaverse, cultural capital, I think it was exact words. So he believes these people could

684
01:16:20,160 --> 01:16:22,640
help aid them in going that direction.

685
01:16:22,640 --> 01:16:30,000
That was the way I understood it. I'm pretty sure I got pretty close to what they're saying exactly.

686
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:35,040
Because these are just the smiley face really, aren't they? At the end of the day.

687
01:16:36,880 --> 01:16:43,760
And all that's bad for like when you go and look at the proposals, there's a smiley face at the

688
01:16:43,760 --> 01:16:46,880
top, whether they agree, whether it's positive or negative.

689
01:16:46,880 --> 01:16:54,640
And that's it at the end of the day. That's the advisory council?

690
01:16:54,640 --> 01:16:58,320
That's the group that are on your screen right now.

691
01:16:58,320 --> 01:17:05,840
Oh, yeah, I'm behind it. Yeah. No, not Seb and Yatt, not that team, the other team, the advisory.

692
01:17:05,840 --> 01:17:09,520
Board, board, dang it. You're right. Advisory board.

693
01:17:09,520 --> 01:17:10,720
There's two of them.

694
01:17:10,720 --> 01:17:18,960
The advisory board, board, dang it. You're right. Advisory board. It's so confusing.

695
01:17:20,080 --> 01:17:24,160
Oh, the council, that special council recommendation, not the advisory board.

696
01:17:24,800 --> 01:17:26,400
Oh, is it? Okay. Yeah.

697
01:17:27,120 --> 01:17:31,440
I think I'm just going off the word, Andy. I don't know for sure. But

698
01:17:31,440 --> 01:17:39,040
that falls in line with what Seb and Cyril said is they have no input into the SITs.

699
01:17:42,000 --> 01:17:45,680
Yeah, that's what into the direction of things like,

700
01:17:47,120 --> 01:17:53,680
I actually don't know. I need to go read what they said. They have advice. That's all I know.

701
01:17:53,680 --> 01:18:01,040
Oh, the council, they're the ones who say, yep, this is fits what we're after. And we put it to a vote.

702
01:18:04,080 --> 01:18:11,280
I agree that like the team of Seb and Yatt should be able to say, hey, that doesn't align with the

703
01:18:11,280 --> 01:18:16,000
direction that we want to take in the future, or that'll clash with the direction that we are taking.

704
01:18:16,000 --> 01:18:19,680
And that's why that can't go ahead. Because at the end of the day, it's his company. He should have

705
01:18:19,680 --> 01:18:26,560
the vote of where it goes. Yeah. Well, according to him, though, he wants to eventually off ramp

706
01:18:26,560 --> 01:18:32,480
himself from that place. He wants to give it to where he mentioned this word timeless multiple

707
01:18:32,480 --> 01:18:42,400
times. He wants to create a timeless Dow that leads the direction of the development for the game.

708
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:48,080
I'm pretty sure I got that one right. Yeah, Seb's always for you, GC. Like,

709
01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:54,000
yeah, always. And he said that eventually, like the sandbox will just become its like,

710
01:18:54,000 --> 01:18:59,520
its own little ecosystem that just ticks over. But as you were saying before about the house

711
01:18:59,520 --> 01:19:05,200
metaphor, we got to finish building the house first. And like, this is like,

712
01:19:05,200 --> 01:19:18,000
selecting our family almost is the special council and the advisory board. We lost him.

713
01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:24,000
I maybe didn't agree with that one. He's just got up and left.

714
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:33,360
I think he's got to be good at the end of the day. Totally. We got to build.

715
01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:39,600
Yeah. But it's going to be a while before we get there.

716
01:19:39,600 --> 01:19:48,800
These things take time. Rome wasn't built in a day and neither was the sandbox.

717
01:19:54,480 --> 01:19:59,600
Was that his dog going nuts before? Maybe. Hope everything's OK.

718
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:11,200
I think at the moment, though, there's nothing that has had a negative impact on

719
01:20:12,800 --> 01:20:19,280
us as a community. The Dow going that all of the SIPs that have been approved, I don't think any

720
01:20:19,280 --> 01:20:26,080
of them really have a negative impact on us. And I think if it gets to a point where there is a

721
01:20:26,080 --> 01:20:31,920
decision that say the community don't agree with, but the sandbox wants to do, I think then is when

722
01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:40,880
how they deal with it will determine how the Dow is perceived for the future.

723
01:20:40,880 --> 01:20:57,680
Yeah, well said. That kind of goes with the HODL saying earlier where she when you mentioned

724
01:20:57,680 --> 01:21:02,800
the interest may wane, which gives people free license to do whatever and

725
01:21:02,800 --> 01:21:13,520
and that that negative reaction will just compound on itself.

726
01:21:15,680 --> 01:21:22,400
OK, so we know I think the basic thing here is that we know some of the

727
01:21:22,400 --> 01:21:26,000
special counsel and we don't really know the advisory board at all. Yes.

728
01:21:26,000 --> 01:21:39,840
Yes. Thanks. Thanks, HODL. Did you either of you say that you knew anyone from the advisory

729
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:46,400
council or assuming the advisory board? We know the two on the top, right? I do anyway.

730
01:21:46,400 --> 01:21:57,200
Matthew. Yep. OK, I know the studio names, but I don't know the people. OK. Yeah, Matthew is

731
01:21:58,160 --> 01:22:03,040
the leader of Hermit crab, hermit crab of creative experiences and we're quite active in the sandbox.

732
01:22:03,680 --> 01:22:09,440
OK, cool. But I haven't really heard much from them in the last year. I was saying before.

733
01:22:09,440 --> 01:22:22,800
Gotcha. And you know, Loretta from where? I've had interactions with them before. Got it.

734
01:22:24,400 --> 01:22:33,120
Oh, she was. Consultant to the Kingdom of Japan. OK.

735
01:22:33,120 --> 01:22:41,360
And you said, HODL, that you recognize the studios, but not the people.

736
01:22:44,640 --> 01:22:49,360
Yeah, exactly. Gotcha. I've heard of Smobler, I've heard of Hermit crab,

737
01:22:49,360 --> 01:22:54,320
but the people behind are not names that I recognize. Gotcha. All right, let's look at

738
01:22:54,320 --> 01:23:04,160
the council one more time. So Frederick, what do we know about him?

739
01:23:07,440 --> 01:23:12,320
He owns that company that is an investment company in France, I think. I'm not sure, though.

740
01:23:13,280 --> 01:23:16,560
So have we seen him involved in the community or done anything?

741
01:23:17,280 --> 01:23:24,080
No, you wouldn't. I don't think you've heard from many of these people, probably apart from Seb

742
01:23:24,080 --> 01:23:28,320
or you'll hear from, yeah, because of the involvement with sandbox.

743
01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:35,440
I have heard him. He has shown up at the AMAs. So that was interesting. And then I have a number of

744
01:23:36,240 --> 01:23:43,280
things that he's described. What about Jean-Michel? Sorry if I pronounced that.

745
01:23:44,640 --> 01:23:50,640
Jean-Michael. What do we know about him? Has he been involved in the community?

746
01:23:50,640 --> 01:23:54,880
I couldn't tell you if I've ever spoken to him.

747
01:23:56,240 --> 01:23:59,680
Otto? Oh, wait a minute. Senior executive at Ledger.

748
01:24:00,800 --> 01:24:05,520
Ah, there we go. That was his past job, wasn't it? Yeah, as of last year. Yeah. Yeah.

749
01:24:06,880 --> 01:24:10,480
But I mean, you've all played the Ledger experiences, right?

750
01:24:13,600 --> 01:24:19,520
Yep. Yeah. I'm going to save you the trouble of asking me. I don't know who any of them are,

751
01:24:19,520 --> 01:24:23,840
except for seven. Yeah. Fair, Hoddle. That's fair. That's fine. That's totally fine.

752
01:24:24,640 --> 01:24:31,280
That's fair. I miss that. That he was at Grail Capital is he was senior executive at Ledger.

753
01:24:31,280 --> 01:24:38,160
That makes more sense now. OK. And then Shannon. World of Women. I mean,

754
01:24:39,200 --> 01:24:41,120
I think that one does speak for itself.

755
01:24:43,760 --> 01:24:49,280
She's been involved in the sandbox for a while. World of Women was in the first season, I think.

756
01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:55,120
Yeah. Yeah. They've stuck around since she's become a lot more active. Yeah. No, you're right.

757
01:24:55,120 --> 01:25:00,080
It's been she's been in it for a while. I was in season one. They've been featured in the

758
01:25:00,720 --> 01:25:05,760
we had an area in the social hub. Gotcha. OK. They might not have had their own experience,

759
01:25:05,760 --> 01:25:10,720
but they were like had a little like feature area. Yeah. Well, Shannon, if you're watching,

760
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:21,120
I am a while holder. So thumbs up. Been a big fan for a while. OK. Yet. Animoca Brands. I read

761
01:25:21,120 --> 01:25:29,360
somewhere. I think it was Google that Animoca owns the sandbox. Yeah. How does that work?

762
01:25:30,160 --> 01:25:36,800
You know, Andy? Animoca funds loads of companies. There's quite a lot of Web3 games that

763
01:25:36,800 --> 01:25:43,920
they've funded and they they like I don't know if I don't want to use any words that aren't correct.

764
01:25:44,720 --> 01:25:51,520
Yeah. They have a lot of like child companies. Some pretty Aries. Yeah. And the sandbox,

765
01:25:51,520 --> 01:25:56,800
I believe, is one of those. But the sandbox was bought out by Animoca because it was I think the

766
01:25:57,840 --> 01:26:04,400
the original company was PIXAL or PIXAL. And that's that's what the sandbox was created

767
01:26:04,400 --> 01:26:12,160
under the original 2D sandbox. And I think it's Animoca that bought them. I don't know exactly.

768
01:26:12,160 --> 01:26:15,760
You'd have to read about it. Interesting. Yeah. I'm willing to delve into that.

769
01:26:18,240 --> 01:26:22,720
Interesting. OK. That's probably got a connection in the Mochaverse somehow.

770
01:26:22,720 --> 01:26:33,600
Yeah, they launched Mochaverse. Yeah. Got it. And then Seb. We know Seb. Cool.

771
01:26:35,760 --> 01:26:42,080
So there's that then. So me personally, I don't throw spears at any of them.

772
01:26:42,720 --> 01:26:47,840
I don't know. I didn't listen to the boardroom meeting where they were selected,

773
01:26:47,840 --> 01:26:55,200
what their pitch was, and how exactly each of them fits. I know loosely from what Seb and Serial

774
01:26:55,200 --> 01:27:02,400
described that each one meets a different need of the vision for advising on how

775
01:27:03,520 --> 01:27:10,880
the DAO is going to be the the culture capital of the metaverse. I'm not privy to the details there.

776
01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:16,160
So until I hear a little bit different than my position is, I don't know them much either. And

777
01:27:16,160 --> 01:27:21,920
I haven't seen, except I haven't heard any of them except for Loretta, who appeared in one of the AMAs.

778
01:27:22,480 --> 01:27:29,200
So and thank you, Loretta, if you're watching this for doing that. So I'm just going to watch

779
01:27:29,200 --> 01:27:35,760
and learn and then keep exploring this for the community. But they have made it very clear that

780
01:27:35,760 --> 01:27:43,280
all of them intend to be replaced by the community. And it sounds like that's going to be December 31,

781
01:27:43,280 --> 01:27:52,320
2025, or January 1 when the budget rolls over. Okay, so there's that.

782
01:27:56,320 --> 01:28:04,240
And then special question that I have that popped up during my investigation earlier today,

783
01:28:04,240 --> 01:28:12,320
I noticed that Sandbox, the first three SIPs did not vote. I think they may have voted before,

784
01:28:12,320 --> 01:28:18,160
but I think they nullified their vote like they changed their 10 to a 11. So 50% each way.

785
01:28:18,160 --> 01:28:25,360
I think that's what happened. But but in four and five, they left their vote on Yes. So that's 27

786
01:28:25,360 --> 01:28:30,240
million voting power toward Yes. And I want to know what y'all thought about that.

787
01:28:32,080 --> 01:28:37,680
I do remember Cyril mentioning I think it was in the which one was it?

788
01:28:37,680 --> 01:28:43,520
The four June for June AMA that was a mistake. So because these closed after the fact, they

789
01:28:43,520 --> 01:28:46,800
couldn't have been referring to that. Because otherwise they would have just changed their vote.

790
01:28:48,400 --> 01:28:49,920
But we don't know five of them.

791
01:28:51,280 --> 01:28:56,320
Yeah, I do know they did. But I don't know if they voted on the resubmittals.

792
01:28:57,360 --> 01:29:03,200
They didn't vote on the resubmittals. They said that they weren't going to vote on the on the

793
01:29:03,200 --> 01:29:07,840
resubmitted ones. Okay. Because of the feedback from the community, but they've already voted on

794
01:29:07,840 --> 01:29:12,960
the previous one. So they just left it in place. Yeah. Okay, here was it was the 12 June. He said

795
01:29:12,960 --> 01:29:17,440
that it was an honest mistake that they voted on on four and five and that they weren't able to

796
01:29:17,440 --> 01:29:23,840
resubmit it because snapshot.org only allows you to have three proposals active at the same time.

797
01:29:24,480 --> 01:29:29,360
And they didn't have like the verified account yet. So they couldn't resubmit four and five

798
01:29:29,360 --> 01:29:35,280
four and five and then remove their vote or not vote in the resubmittals. He said it was an

799
01:29:35,280 --> 01:29:41,760
honest, modest mistake, please forgive them. And so now that I reread that maybe we don't have

800
01:29:41,760 --> 01:29:46,160
another question about that anymore. How do you forgive them?

801
01:29:50,240 --> 01:29:56,080
How do you make a mistake like that? How do you accidentally vote?

802
01:29:56,080 --> 01:30:03,600
I don't know when I voted I had to you know, sign it and all that. I'm not sure.

803
01:30:07,360 --> 01:30:09,600
I will refrain from commenting on that.

804
01:30:10,640 --> 01:30:15,200
You're skeptical. You're skeptical. Okay. Got it. Andy?

805
01:30:18,400 --> 01:30:25,520
Um, yeah, I'm a bit the same. I don't know. All right. I just we fixed the issue,

806
01:30:25,520 --> 01:30:29,360
but we didn't fix the issue here. Because we couldn't fix the issue there. But we fixed it

807
01:30:29,360 --> 01:30:39,760
over there. I'm picking up what you're putting down. I get it. Okay. Yeah. And I'm I give them

808
01:30:39,760 --> 01:30:44,640
the benefit of the doubt. At this point, I see their actions starting to align with their words,

809
01:30:45,200 --> 01:30:52,320
you know what they they did not vote for the three. And they rewicked it to where land is there. And

810
01:30:52,320 --> 01:31:00,400
they allowed the first batch of community sips. Um, all right, we keep going. And then I'll just

811
01:31:00,400 --> 01:31:14,080
keep watching and commenting. Okay. And were there any questions that y'all wanted to ask? Andy?

812
01:31:14,080 --> 01:31:24,480
Not really. Not really. So I just I think we just have to stick together a little bit and

813
01:31:24,480 --> 01:31:30,240
I say have these discussions, make sure we're aware of everyone's perspectives and then vote

814
01:31:30,240 --> 01:31:36,960
however you see accorded. Yeah. But I think make it easier for the community to submit SIPs,

815
01:31:36,960 --> 01:31:42,000
offer more support and make the process as easy as possible. And hopefully we'll have a lot of

816
01:31:42,000 --> 01:31:52,960
positive stuff from the community. Yeah, same. No questions. Just like a suggestion. If you

817
01:31:54,160 --> 01:32:02,320
have a proposal, make sure you get it out to the people in the community. Um, and I can definitely

818
01:32:02,320 --> 01:32:09,920
be a point person on that. If you, if you put something out there, I will try and refrain from

819
01:32:09,920 --> 01:32:14,480
swaying people's votes, but I would like people to be able to vote on them and be aware of them.

820
01:32:20,480 --> 01:32:23,680
And if there's anyone in the community who wanted to ask a question,

821
01:32:24,800 --> 01:32:28,800
now's the time. We're getting close to wrapping up.

822
01:32:34,400 --> 01:32:38,480
The best question for you really is what's your thoughts on this? As in like,

823
01:32:38,480 --> 01:32:43,760
if you could recap what your perspective is, because you've done a lot more diving into it

824
01:32:43,760 --> 01:32:52,080
over the last 48 hours and I'm curious to see, has digging into the information changed your

825
01:32:52,080 --> 01:32:56,800
perspective at all and what have you uncovered over the last 48 hours? Because you could imagine

826
01:32:56,800 --> 01:33:02,640
that there's someone here that hasn't dug in and put the effort into uncover and deep dive into it.

827
01:33:02,640 --> 01:33:07,920
So what could you tell them that you learned from it to save them going through that process? Maybe?

828
01:33:08,560 --> 01:33:16,400
Yeah, I began as Hoddle did and Kenley Christen, very critical, very suspicious. It, it's no wrong

829
01:33:16,400 --> 01:33:25,520
to me as the three weeks unfolded and as I wrote down things like this timeline and the interesting

830
01:33:25,520 --> 01:33:35,120
facts, I got more, more of my concerns were, were satisfied. And at the very least, I see Serial,

831
01:33:35,680 --> 01:33:41,680
Serial and Seb's words aligning with their actions after the first week,

832
01:33:43,600 --> 01:33:50,400
after they started changing and reversing things. So I'm, I'm optimistic right now.

833
01:33:50,400 --> 01:33:58,320
I'm optimistic that what they say they want to do, they are doing. And I'm optimistic that we have a

834
01:33:58,320 --> 01:34:05,600
chance to at the ground floor, even if we don't have control over the sips right now, and won't

835
01:34:05,600 --> 01:34:10,160
for some time as a council, I think there's still even room for improvement there.

836
01:34:11,520 --> 01:34:15,760
Everything that Seb and Serial and Shannon and Fred,

837
01:34:15,760 --> 01:34:24,880
Loretta, all of them talked about was giving us a way to take over, to, to contribute as a community,

838
01:34:25,200 --> 01:34:29,760
to draw up our lines of how we wanted to do this in a healthy and responsible way.

839
01:34:30,400 --> 01:34:36,880
And I'm sitting here thinking, I've seen nothing from any of them that would say that they're not

840
01:34:36,880 --> 01:34:41,680
ready for this to happen now, except that the circumstances aren't ready to happen.

841
01:34:41,680 --> 01:34:48,720
That's the, you know, fixing all the bugs and getting us on a pattern, like a set pattern of

842
01:34:48,720 --> 01:34:55,920
how we can, how we can run this now. But what that means to us and me right now is, I'm thinking

843
01:34:55,920 --> 01:35:02,080
that we could even throw in a sip that would, that would do a special early election for a plus one

844
01:35:02,080 --> 01:35:08,240
or plus two on the board, or the council. And I think that's the only way that we can do that.

845
01:35:08,240 --> 01:35:15,680
And I think that's the only way that we can do that. Maybe they would find, they would decide

846
01:35:15,680 --> 01:35:20,800
that it's not quite ready. Maybe. But everything I've heard of Seb and Serial and the way they

847
01:35:20,800 --> 01:35:26,880
describe the way they want this unfold, I think they'd be open to listening. So I'd say I had

848
01:35:26,880 --> 01:35:31,760
seven sips. I probably now have eight. And you can already guess what the eighth one's gonna be.

849
01:35:31,760 --> 01:35:37,680
Is open up a special early election for a plus one or plus two of the board or a plus one on the

850
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:45,120
board and a plus one of the council. And then we start opening up that aperture. So they're,

851
01:35:45,120 --> 01:35:50,400
they're not unwilling in my perspective from what I've uncovered so far delving into this,

852
01:35:50,400 --> 01:35:55,920
they're not unwilling to change. They're not unwilling to consider things they didn't think

853
01:35:55,920 --> 01:36:00,560
of before they think they said they've been lurking on it for the past three months.

854
01:36:00,560 --> 01:36:10,640
Pretty diligently to get to May 28. They seem to be very open to listening to change and the community.

855
01:36:10,640 --> 01:36:17,040
But they want the community to be in a place where it can responsibly contribute Andy. And that goes

856
01:36:17,040 --> 01:36:21,680
to what you were saying how you don't think it's a good idea to hand the community the keys to the

857
01:36:21,680 --> 01:36:29,920
Dow with with the billion dollar company at stake. And what I see from seven to eight,

858
01:36:29,920 --> 01:36:35,440
seven zero is that they are trying to set the community up to be able to responsibly take it

859
01:36:35,440 --> 01:36:43,520
over in a phased approach. That's what I'm seeing happen. Well, they're not as I'm sold.

860
01:36:46,400 --> 01:36:50,880
Go ahead. Sorry. No, no, no, I was I was finished. I was just rehashing because

861
01:36:51,600 --> 01:36:56,720
that that excites me, man. This this is like the perfect intersection between gaming,

862
01:36:56,720 --> 01:37:02,640
business, proper governance, transparency, like this is what I was looking into what I want,

863
01:37:03,440 --> 01:37:08,720
what I wanted out of a metaverse to put all of my resources and time and effort into.

864
01:37:09,280 --> 01:37:14,000
So this is quickly becoming my new passion because of the opportunity that that I have

865
01:37:14,000 --> 01:37:19,600
to contribute. And all the stuff I've been doing on volunteer basis up until this point,

866
01:37:19,600 --> 01:37:28,720
all the volunteering as like a nonprofit organizer of gaming tournaments and non

867
01:37:28,720 --> 01:37:36,880
volunteer podcaster for eSports and for for games. And then all my own business,

868
01:37:36,880 --> 01:37:41,840
like my own novel publishing and music publishing company. And then that's what I added,

869
01:37:41,840 --> 01:37:50,320
you know, meta worlds to that as a game publisher. So I've been a game publisher before way back when

870
01:37:50,320 --> 01:37:56,880
when I was younger. Think of like a website that allowed you to do play Tetris with a thousand

871
01:37:56,880 --> 01:38:01,440
people instead of one or two or pack me with a thousand people. That was my original idea.

872
01:38:01,440 --> 01:38:06,640
And it didn't work out in the end. I was young and inexperienced back then. And now I'm

873
01:38:06,640 --> 01:38:12,000
the benefit of hindsight. So I feel like this has prepared me for this opportunity

874
01:38:12,640 --> 01:38:18,400
to where I can I can be a responsible member and look at it from the communities and as a

875
01:38:18,400 --> 01:38:25,200
community member like, hey, Andy and I'll have a point about the way it was rolled out.

876
01:38:26,240 --> 01:38:31,520
You know, now what can I do on the business end, like proposing a SIP to realize

877
01:38:31,520 --> 01:38:38,640
a responsible approach or a different approach? And that's where I landed on it right now.

878
01:38:38,640 --> 01:38:43,840
I'm excited, man. That's why I have all this set up the way I do and pushing for it on my end.

879
01:38:44,640 --> 01:38:52,160
I intend to contribute. SIPs, nominations, myself, all of it.

880
01:38:52,160 --> 01:38:57,760
I think the community should have saying what goes on with the doubt. But I like trying to

881
01:38:58,320 --> 01:39:02,880
explain a little bit more about what I was saying before about them just not having control over it.

882
01:39:02,880 --> 01:39:07,360
There needs to be something that keeps them in line. Otherwise, the community just

883
01:39:08,640 --> 01:39:13,680
will do stupid things. You know, there's something that happened in the UK along

884
01:39:13,680 --> 01:39:18,240
not long ago, really, but I think it's something that's going to be a big issue.

885
01:39:18,240 --> 01:39:22,240
There's something that happened in the UK along not long ago, really, but

886
01:39:23,600 --> 01:39:27,520
like where they open the name for that the public can name something new.

887
01:39:28,560 --> 01:39:34,880
The public named a boat and they named it Boating at Boat Face. And everyone voted for it.

888
01:39:36,880 --> 01:39:44,560
And like that's a concern about giving the community the keys is that if they do stupid

889
01:39:44,560 --> 01:39:50,400
things, then they'll go ahead. So we need to make sure that there's someone to keep them in line a

890
01:39:50,400 --> 01:39:55,600
little bit. And that's what I mean by not handing the keys over completely. There needs to be that

891
01:39:55,600 --> 01:40:03,040
slow transition period over 10, 20 years where doubt becomes its own thing and it evolves into

892
01:40:03,040 --> 01:40:07,360
something that's sustainable. We got to learn our own power and we got to learn how to use it

893
01:40:07,360 --> 01:40:12,160
responsive. Otherwise, we're like, we're a kid, you've just been given the keys of the kingdom too.

894
01:40:12,160 --> 01:40:15,120
And we could we could wreck it before we even realize what we've done.

895
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:17,520
And this beautiful thing that's been built

896
01:40:19,440 --> 01:40:24,560
comes and we have nothing to blame but ourselves. Yeah, I agree with that.

897
01:40:25,200 --> 01:40:30,000
So you're saying I should cancel my SIP for Sandy McSandface as mascot?

898
01:40:30,640 --> 01:40:35,120
No, because I vote for it. I think we'd all vote for it. Yeah, and that's the problem.

899
01:40:35,120 --> 01:40:42,960
Well, yeah, except to rename himself to Seb Sandy McSand Seb.

900
01:40:46,880 --> 01:40:51,840
Yeah. Well, if you're listening, advisory board and special counsel, none of this was

901
01:40:51,840 --> 01:40:58,480
meant to disparage you at all. I didn't mean it that way. I didn't mean any nothing I said was an

902
01:40:58,480 --> 01:41:07,120
insult or an insult. It is what it is in terms of we do and do not know some members better than we

903
01:41:07,120 --> 01:41:14,560
don't know others. We have seen people being involved before. And for others, we we off the

904
01:41:14,560 --> 01:41:23,040
top our heads and the island I can't recall or or yeah, I can't recall what participation you've had

905
01:41:23,040 --> 01:41:29,920
yet. So I'm looking forward to seeing what is it you all advise on and how the council governs.

906
01:41:30,560 --> 01:41:40,960
And I am I am hopeful and optimistic. And I like what I what I saw in terms of what's changed.

907
01:41:40,960 --> 01:41:47,840
I'd like the improvements made since you announced May 28. So I'm I'm going to involve myself,

908
01:41:47,840 --> 01:41:54,800
I'm going to put in some sips. And I'm going to likely seek a nomination to anything that I can

909
01:41:54,800 --> 01:42:01,040
do to help. But if the project management team that Cyril mentioned is behind the the legality

910
01:42:01,040 --> 01:42:06,320
stuff of the steps or the special counsel or the advisory board or what have you, I'm going to

911
01:42:07,280 --> 01:42:13,680
I intend to be here. Those are my closing thoughts. Andy, what are yours?

912
01:42:13,680 --> 01:42:19,280
All right, just thank you. Yeah, we covered a lot about the doubt. It's been nice to chat about it.

913
01:42:19,280 --> 01:42:24,640
Yeah, I love this man. It's great. We need to keep having more things like this just to air out

914
01:42:24,640 --> 01:42:28,560
issues as long as we're making progress and not just having a rant on the internet, you know,

915
01:42:29,280 --> 01:42:35,760
I think we're all for the doubt. It just we just need to make sure that what the sandbox are telling

916
01:42:35,760 --> 01:42:41,760
us the words and the actions are aligning, like you said, and they continue to happen going forward

917
01:42:41,760 --> 01:42:48,480
and the community can have that value. Right. It's been good. I appreciate it. And I appreciate

918
01:42:48,480 --> 01:42:52,480
everything that you do. And you put a lot of effort into getting all the information there

919
01:42:52,480 --> 01:42:57,280
for the community to be able to go through it. And it's been good to have a chat. Yeah,

920
01:42:57,280 --> 01:43:04,000
I love it, man. I love this. This is my this is my passion is doing stuff like this is organizing

921
01:43:04,000 --> 01:43:11,840
and making it making it effective, efficient for us to make good decisions on. I don't even

922
01:43:11,840 --> 01:43:20,480
the community can choose. I just just I hate the fact when people walk in and and we haven't gone

923
01:43:20,480 --> 01:43:25,280
to them to show them this is what it means to you. And then here's all of our sources that you can

924
01:43:25,280 --> 01:43:31,280
check. And because then people know they heard something somewhere and suddenly that's that's

925
01:43:31,280 --> 01:43:37,600
their perspective. And it's just I don't know, I, I regret it makes me sad every time I see that. So

926
01:43:38,880 --> 01:43:43,040
that's my huddle. What are yours? Your closing remarks?

927
01:43:45,680 --> 01:43:50,800
I'm just glad we have passionate people like you in the space who want to put this work in and

928
01:43:50,800 --> 01:43:54,800
and you get the word out there because that's not no that's not my forte.

929
01:43:54,800 --> 01:44:01,440
I have opinions, but you know, that's my own my own opinion. Yeah. Yeah, and I'll do my best to

930
01:44:01,440 --> 01:44:06,400
keep getting the word out about things. Obviously, I haven't been streaming a lot of the sandbox

931
01:44:06,400 --> 01:44:14,160
lately. But like I said, interest ebbs and flows. So maybe that interest will come back someday.

932
01:44:14,800 --> 01:44:22,400
Yeah. And thank you so much in the chat escape room, Yuma. I'm so glad you're here.

933
01:44:22,400 --> 01:44:29,840
I saw Ian, that faces I've seen definitely before and then all the lurkers. Thank you so much for

934
01:44:30,960 --> 01:44:37,360
showing up and listening and participating. I'd love to host so many of you on the podcast.

935
01:44:37,360 --> 01:44:42,640
There's just there's so many different things I want to hit as a result of this to make it real

936
01:44:42,640 --> 01:44:49,280
to make it to make it transparent to make it run well and healthy, so that we're ready to take that

937
01:44:49,280 --> 01:44:54,640
that assume that mantle when when seven the council, just like they said they want to do for us.

938
01:44:54,640 --> 01:45:00,000
So these future episodes I worked on a little bit before I started the stream. You know, I want to

939
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:04,800
do another part two community reactions. I want to talk about what lessons have we learned from the

940
01:45:04,800 --> 01:45:10,880
Dow I heard crafter and Shannon mentioned that they talked to other dowels to learn. So I want to

941
01:45:10,880 --> 01:45:17,440
hear them and others who have done participate in other dowels. I want to do the best I can.

942
01:45:17,440 --> 01:45:22,880
I want to do the business and the publishing experience and making assets. I have like an

943
01:45:22,880 --> 01:45:29,040
accounting sheet of that when I was putting meta world together to figure out how much money do I

944
01:45:29,040 --> 01:45:34,480
need to make in order to be self sufficient. And then all the problems that started with GMF,

945
01:45:34,480 --> 01:45:42,080
be to 2.0 and then catalyst 2.0 and it just throwing all that in the mix. So I want to share

946
01:45:42,080 --> 01:45:48,240
those results because I've got numbers to back it up, not just anecdotes. So I'm gonna do a podcast

947
01:45:48,240 --> 01:45:53,920
to show that and it won't be a spear throw, but it'll be a interesting revelation that was

948
01:45:53,920 --> 01:46:00,160
unexpected to me. Someone who is new to the trusted partner system, someone who is new to publishing,

949
01:46:00,160 --> 01:46:05,680
I'd never published an experience before or meant to an asset. And then I'm doing all at once trying

950
01:46:05,680 --> 01:46:10,640
to learn how to be part of this community. And then I hit some roadblocks with what I expected.

951
01:46:10,640 --> 01:46:16,560
And I'm struggling as a studio just like everyone else is, just like Pepe said yesterday or a few

952
01:46:16,560 --> 01:46:22,480
days ago for Sanraj. So I want to explore into community members and the different groups in

953
01:46:22,480 --> 01:46:28,400
sandbox. How do we interact? I want to do an episode on reviewing sandboxes, articles and

954
01:46:28,400 --> 01:46:33,760
corporations, like really putting on a legal hat there and then just going through it.

955
01:46:33,760 --> 01:46:39,520
Way forward for developers, that Pepe, I want to talk to Tushay, Geeky's, Meta Theory, Escape Room,

956
01:46:39,520 --> 01:46:45,520
a bunch of other people, probably Andy, you too. Like what is the way forward for you all do you

957
01:46:45,520 --> 01:46:50,560
see right now given the circumstances of where everything is with Catalyst and Builders Challenge

958
01:46:50,560 --> 01:46:55,760
and Game Jam? The new jam they came up with, was it the social jam or something like that?

959
01:46:55,760 --> 01:47:01,360
They just announced a few days ago. Yeah. How can the DAO help sandbox? What was that Andy?

960
01:47:02,320 --> 01:47:03,120
Nothing, nothing.

961
01:47:05,360 --> 01:47:10,160
How the DAO can help the sandbox, which we kind of went today. And then what does it mean for the

962
01:47:10,160 --> 01:47:13,680
sandbox for itself? Also we did today, so I'm just going to strike those off the list.

963
01:47:14,800 --> 01:47:20,240
Catalyst Chain System. Oh my gosh. That's one of the things that upended my studio.

964
01:47:20,240 --> 01:47:25,280
Is the Catalyst Change. So I have some numbers I want to share and get the community's feedback

965
01:47:26,080 --> 01:47:32,000
because that might result in a sip. So I want to get some other people's opinions

966
01:47:32,000 --> 01:47:35,680
other than just my story of how it affected us.

967
01:47:38,960 --> 01:47:42,720
Reward Mechanics for creators. It isn't just Builders Challenge. I heard someone mention that

968
01:47:42,720 --> 01:47:47,920
in one of the AMAs. I thought that was awesome. I thought it was a great idea. I think it was

969
01:47:47,920 --> 01:47:52,160
someone mentioned that in one of the AMAs. I thought that was awesome. And I want to explore

970
01:47:52,160 --> 01:47:59,040
that more. And then different stuff about Mochaverse, how they're involved, AI assets,

971
01:47:59,040 --> 01:48:04,160
which is what Pepe mentioned during your stream, Andy. And then tokenomics. Apparently that has a

972
01:48:04,160 --> 01:48:09,840
part to play. And I want to learn more about how that factors into the DAO. So those are the things

973
01:48:09,840 --> 01:48:21,600
I want to hit. And the current SIP process as old Pepe from Sandrush just experienced. You submit,

974
01:48:21,600 --> 01:48:28,080
if you want to submit a proposal, you submit it to the email address that's on the website,

975
01:48:28,080 --> 01:48:34,880
and you fill out their SIP template. It's a Google Doc that you fill out. And then you include that

976
01:48:34,880 --> 01:48:39,280
in your email. Once that happens, then you go back and forth with the project management team

977
01:48:39,280 --> 01:48:45,360
to improve it. After it reaches a point at which that team feels it's ready, they then give it to

978
01:48:45,360 --> 01:48:52,080
the advisory, excuse me, the special counsel for yes, no, does it meet the intent? Does it not?

979
01:48:52,800 --> 01:48:55,360
Once it goes through them, then it gets put into a vote

980
01:48:57,360 --> 01:49:03,440
at the snapshot.org and sandboxdow.com. So that's the way we know it as of right now.

981
01:49:03,440 --> 01:49:08,960
And yeah, if you're interested, please start submitting your SIPs so we can start learning

982
01:49:08,960 --> 01:49:14,960
what we really want to do about the DAO and how we want to govern it. Thank you all for your time.

983
01:49:14,960 --> 01:49:22,480
Andy, Hoddle, thank you so much for doing this. And at the end of the day, we're all just trying

984
01:49:22,480 --> 01:49:29,200
to figure it out. So thank you all and have a great day. Appreciate you all. Thank you.

985
01:49:29,200 --> 01:49:39,360
Appreciate you. Thanks for putting it out there.