Welcome to Drumbeats, the must -listen -to podcast
which explains why Indigenous partnerships are
the key to securing successful outcomes in natural
resource and infrastructure investment in Canada.
I'm Mark McNacken. My co -host Rob Brant and
I are joined today by Dan Adams, head of the
Bank of Montreal Office of Reconciliation. BMO
is Canada's oldest bank and one that has been
banking Indigenous communities since 1992. Dan
has spent his career turning Indigenous finance
into commercial reality. Under his leadership,
BMO's Indigenous portfolio has grown by over
400%, with assets under administration now exceeding
20 billion Canadian dollars, and the bank has
issued Canada's first ever Indigenous bond. In
today's conversation, you'll learn why Dan believes
capital markets are the next frontier for Indigenous
equity participation in major Canadian projects.
what the shift from consultation to ownership
means for project finance, and what foreign investors
need to understand about trust, relationships,
and due diligence before deploying capital into
the space. Welcome, Dan Adams, head of Bank of
Montreal, BMO's Office of Reconciliation. Pleasure
to have you with us here today, Dan. Thank you
very much. It's nice to be here. So that meant,
hello Gradients, my name is Dan Adams and I'm
coming from Thunder Bay, Ontario. Well, thanks.
Hi, Dan. Thanks for taking the time to join us.
Why don't you start by telling us a little bit
about your personal story and where you grew
up and how you ended up at BMO and in financial
services generally, I guess, many, many years
ago. Yeah, for sure. So I guess it is personal
to me, and it is where I grew up and where my
family is and where I live. So I grew up in really
small communities in the North. Every community
was under 1 ,000 people. In Canada's North, Indigenous
peoples are not the minority, but in fact, we
really didn't think of it that way. We're just
friends and neighbors and family. I married an
Indigenous woman, so our children are members
of Sikeen First Nation, where their grandfather
was born, and that's in Treaty 1, just north
of Winnipeg. When I became a commercial banker
for BMO in 2010, I had some First Nations in
my portfolio. And to be honest with you, I just
enjoy working with them more than my other customers.
So I naturally just grew that side of the portfolio
to one of the largest in Canada. In 2016, I was
promoted to Vice President of the Indigenous
Banking Unit, and I absolutely loved it. I was
in communities most of the time, working with
councils, administration. We built infrastructure,
housing, economic development. We even banked
ice roads. It was a lot of fun, and it was full
of purpose. Wow. Why don't you talk a little
bit about ice roads? Because for our listeners
and viewers over here in the UK, when there's
a few snowflakes, everything shuts down and you're
talking about ice roads. So share them the joys
of living in the North. So in Northern Ontario,
especially in the further North you go in Ontario
and many other parts in Northern Canada as well,
a lot of the First Nation communities and Indigenous
governments are located where there isn't all
season roads so for the most part it's fly -in
only and for a couple short months and that window
is getting smaller and smaller every year, they
build an ice road. So what that ice road really
means is it's over the snow. It's when, you know,
it's when lakes and muskeg and everything freezes,
they're able to put a road on it. And it's during
that small window where most of everything has
to be transported up to that community and anything
large, you know, for it could be it could be
fuel for power, but also. So any building material,
you know, for houses or anything like that usually
comes up on the winter ice roads ready to be
built during that next summer season. And you
said the season is shortening and those are vital
lifelines, but at least the Ontario government
and in the far north too, there's plans to build
all season roads through some pretty remote.
communities. Right. Yeah. Sometimes industry
builds some roads that could be connected to
a community. It could be, you know, it could
be a mine, it could be forestry, it could be,
you know, something like that. But a lot of the
communities, especially where I am looking to
Northern Ontario, and we call that Treaty 9 or
NAN communities, most of them are still fly -in
only. There's some great... air companies that
service that. One of our customers is Waseya
Airways. They do a great job as well as some
others went as well. And it's really a lifeline
to those communities where, and that's the only
place they could, you know, like I said, bring
a food or sometimes even fuel for power and electricity.
Yes. And thank you for that. And maybe just for
context, and I should have asked this earlier,
how far from Toronto is Thunder Bay? By plane.
So, well, by plane, it's not too bad. It's only
a couple hours. And there's several flights a
day. So it is an easy commute to Toronto. And
I go there often. However, to drive it would
probably be about 16 hours of straight driving.
So usually a couple days. And some of the communities
I was telling you about, that's still another.
between say 400 and 1200 kilometers north of
Thunder Bay even. So Ontario is a big place and
Canada is a big place. And again, it's not even
just Northern Ontario. It's much of Canada's
north. Yes. So thank you for that context because
when we drive up here to Scotland and it's a
five hour, six hour drive going to the north.
So just so our listeners understand the scale
of it. But let's come back to what you've been
doing. BMO announced the creation of the Office
of Reconciliation in June 2025. It was a step
up from unit level banking to enterprise wide
mandate. Can you talk about that structural shift
and what it means in practice and why BMO decided
the moment was right to do this? Because you've
been part of this journey the whole way. Yeah,
I have. And we're proud. of the creation of the
Office of Reconciliation in 2025. Though the
milestone was years in the making, Mark, our
journey began much earlier when we established
BMOS Indigenous Banking, and that was in 1992.
And that was the first of its kind in Canada,
and that was with Ron Jameson. Through deep engagement
with Indigenous clients and communities, and
by learning through really immersion into that
culture, we came to recognize both clients and
communities And the responsibility of the broader
need for all of society, and definitely including
us, is we need to learn. We need to evolve. We
need to reconcile. This work compelled us to
confront and remove a lot of policies that we've
had that was rooted in systemic discrimination.
And we needed to replace them with approaches
that was grounded in knowledge, respect, and
inclusion. Examples would include recognizing
First Nations governments and providing 100 %
financing for community infrastructure without
requiring any physical security, which is really
circumventing Section 89 of the Indian Act. But
I always look back to really, you know... The
most groundbreaking work was done by the Center
of Truth and Reconciliation and that commission
and the work that they did between 2008 and 2015.
And what they gifted Canada in 2015 was the 94
Calls to Action. That was really a national roadmap
that opened the hearts and the minds across the
country, again, including BEMA with over 40 ,000
employees just in Canada. Since then, our efforts
have accelerated, beginning with a lot of internal
education and expanding into more inclusive policies
and financial products and programs. In 2019,
we launched the Indigenous Personal Banking Program,
which is essentially free banking for all Indigenous
people for a year. In 2020, we established our
Indigenous Advisory Council, and then we've even
created an Indigenous Virtual Banking Group.
And what that does is it overcomes the geographic
barriers that we're just talking about, you know,
the huge geography in Canada, right? If you look
at all the maps. Can't really say come and see
us at the branch, right? Yeah, you know, it's
true. If you look at the map of Canada and we're
not just BMO branches, we're like whole bank
branches are, you know, the true access to banking.
They're around. populated areas and you know
that makes sense you you need enough customers
you need enough employees you know to make a
branch viable but then if you overlay that map
of where the first nations are located and in
canada they're often not in the same place and
often a lot of the first nations that are again
in north or just more um at a distance you know
from branch networks. So what our virtual banking
group has done is they're able to service all
of our Indigenous customers no matter the geography.
And that includes opening up bank accounts. Before
we would have customers say in Attawapiskat or
Ksheshawan, they would have spent thousands of
dollars to fly to Timmins to open up a bank account.
And that wasn't right. And we needed to be better
on that. So we're quite... you know proud that
we we created this to provide more access to
banking we also created the first indigenous
entrepreneur program and what that is is um we
could service all indigenous entrepreneurs no
matter where they live um whether it's on or
off reserve we're not gonna um ask for physical
security which again you know circumvents 89
of the indian act yeah and you know when we just
created you know the first ever Indigenous bond
as well, too, plus many other initiatives. So
saying that reconciliation has always been part
of our work and we have been doing some good
work there. But to be honest, it was much of
that was carried out on the sides of our desks.
And for several years now, we talked about, you
know, what if we had a dedicated team? You know,
how much more could we do? How much more work
could we accomplish? So I am proud of this investment
that we made. We're fully committed. We're all
in to advancing reconciliation. But now it's
in a real deliberate and consultative and meaningful
way. Dan, that's an impressive record of a lot
of firsts in the Indigenous financial services
world, starting with the legendary Ron Jameson.
Yeah. Who's well known in Canadian Indigenous
and banking. So he was BMO and focused on Indigenous
communities, helping bank them. And right up
to the most recent bond that was issued. We want
to talk a little bit more about each of those
things, but it's great to see the evolution of
the services that BMO has provided. And you talk
about what has changed in Canada over... say,
just the last 10 years. And we get that question,
especially from foreign investors, what's different
about Canada? One of the things that's different
is the financial tools that are now available
to assist in economic development in Indigenous
communities. So that bond you mentioned was very
cool. Tell us a little bit more about that. Yeah,
so the bond's interesting and it's a little bit
different than what a traditional sense of a
purpose of a bond. So often, bonds are created
to raise money through that debt instrument.
And once that... pool of money is raised then
it could be you know put out into the market
so our bond is a little bit different where it's
from already our existing portfolio and a lot
of this conversation came from you know years
in the making where we would have it you know
with our peers in the investment world whether
it's you know it's a pension plan or or just
anywhere else in corporate canada when we're
talking about our reconciliation journey um sometimes
we would say yeah but you know you're a bank
you're you're able to provide a loan to a first
nation so they could build a house or you're
able to you know to invest um directly into that
economic development corporation that's owned
by an indigenous government um you know and then
they would say you know that's not our line of
business so we we can't participate in that economic
reconciliation so through lots of different conversations
and just through our own um track record of of
creating sustainable bonds and through that framework
we thought well what if we were to have an indigenous
bond what if we and and that would be available
to to all investors to say that this is an opportunity
that you as well could participate in economic
reconciliation um and uh we're just fortunate
and grateful that we do have a long track record
of having some you know some some great customers
um who trusted us to finance community infrastructure
economic development um and all those great things
so we we carefully packaged up some of that term
debt and we were quite curious to see what the
market would be like. And as we thought, it was
received really well and institutional investors
purchased it almost immediately. So that's something
that we would like to continue doing and we hope
others will do as well. And how will that money
be deployed then? Yeah, so like I said, it's
already basically have been deployed, right?
So that money, those term loans are already in
community and it's already, you know, built houses
and used for, you know, operating for own source
revenue and in community infrastructure and economic
development and things like that. So the track
record was already there and the purpose was
already met. And it was just, and again, opportunity
for others to participate in some of that debt
and those loans. With that, did you have also
international institutions participate or it
was just in the Canadian domestic market? Yeah,
our capital markets folks would probably know
the answer to that more than I would. However,
I believe that it was purchased so quickly and
it was all Canadian investors. Yes. Okay, well,
closest to the market, that's what happens when
you understand the market you're in and something
like that comes out. So that is an important
step. Sounds like there may be more coming, more
opportunities. Yeah, for sure. So I think that
was one of the initiatives that you've talked
about in terms of enterprise -wide across BMO.
When you're walking a business line in your new
role that has historically had little direct
Indigenous engagement, how do you make the case
to them? how do they understand besides it's
a corporate mandate and we're doing this how
do you bring them along because you also you
have you have a great personal background to
be able to understand both perspectives right
and i guess that's true for a lot of the um the
folks that work within the most indigenous banking
unit i mean we're all commercial bankers um by
background and we've all you know um been doing
it you know, the groundwork, so to speak, in
communities and so on. So when we get promoted
to other positions, we're able to try to bring
in more support and more commitment from the
broader enterprise. But what I, as I mentioned
before, is really the Indigenous Banking Unit.
I mean, and we talked about Ron Jamieson, Rob,
he started 34 years ago. and and when ron started
and this is ron's story and i love telling it
because uh he told me so many times um when he
first started he would he would basically just
ask questions he would say you know well why
are you doing it this way why are you doing it
that way and how ron tells the story is he would
get the same answers back is like well ron we're
a bank that's how we do things and then ron would
say well don't you know how it works Right. And
then Ron would start educating. Right. And that
was really the 34 years ago is when we started
our journey of knowledge and learning really
how things work. And when you think of like Indigenous
people across Canada, just like Ron. always been
leaders in business governments and within their
own communities and within our own employees
our indigenous employees our customers and partners
they're highly capable and forward -thinking
and they're all very deeply entrepreneurial which
has always been helpful and canada is strongest
when indigenous knowledge leadership and full
participation are fully engaged over the last
five years be most indigenous portfolio grew
over 400 percent reflecting both the momentum,
but also within Indigenous communities, but also
within the trust, you know, that we were able
to build in the longstanding relationships. Indigenous
peoples represent the fastest growing demographic
in Canada, and some of the most educated as well.
So global. You know, when we look at markets,
I think they are taking notice as Indigenous
communities, especially now they're starting
to assert their legal and their treaty and their
territorial rights. And doing so through these
approaches, especially when they're grounded
in relationships and environmental stewardship
as well, too. They are stewards of the land and
also social development. the whole country a
better place. These principles are not only value
-based, but they create sustainable long -term
economic growth that benefits communities, partners,
but the overall broader economy. And I think
this story you've shared with us when Ron started
out this process, and I think this is what international
investors are seeing. This isn't new. It's been...
Under the surface, and it's been a long, hard
journey, as it always has been, unfortunately,
for the Indigenous people in Canada, but is now
coming out to fruition, where all of a sudden
you have this base of knowledge, you have some
very successful entrepreneurs. You know, we've
talked about some of the most successful entrepreneurs
in Canada today are Indigenous because they've
always had the system against them. So that's
kind of changing around. So I think that was
an interesting background. one other thing on
on that too mark is yeah it has been you know
it has really been decades in the making you're
correct on that but i i feel that we were growing
together in many ways where you know where the
nations themselves they were creating capacity
and they were you know on changing um even the
mindsets within their own community about you
know growing businesses and own source revenue
and on in and out of their even their traditional
territory sometimes right that's a good a good
business is a good business no matter where it
is um at the same time we were we were fine -tuning
our own policy and we were getting better too
and we were we were learning her ourselves and
i always look to our customer as saying it's
like you know every year i think they look at
look to us and all the banks really is to be
better and and that always gave us the motivation
it's like okay you know we did good work last
year but we gotta keep going there there's more
to be done and we gotta get better we gotta we
need better policies we need better products
and every year i i think we we do a lot of that
but there's still a long ways to go yeah i can't
wait to see what's next dan for BMO. It's obviously
talked a lot about doing the right thing for
Indigenous communities and how to assist, but
it's pretty clear it's been good for business
too for BMO. You wouldn't see those tools that
you've helped develop over the years if it didn't
make good business sense for the bank. Absolutely.
It is great business. And it's, you know, sometimes
you see you know, being mentioned at the same
time as like DE &I. It's not, not at all. I mean,
this is good business. They're amazing customers.
Great track record of, you know, loyal, long
lasting relationships on both sides. And I just
look at, you know, some of the other lines of
business that might not have that. the tenure
as you know if you look at say personal banking
or commercial banking commercial banking has
always been like you know the main relationship
of the indigenous government right and then the
personal banking was was always taking care of
the individuals the members no matter where they
live across canada um but now you see you know
capital markets you see investment banking you
see wealth so that's really interesting because
they might not have that tenure um however the
way that bmo has always operated is that we have
always looked at everything as it's one bank
one client um so we're able to take that track
record that we have another lines of business
and it really transcends right across the whole
enterprise um that it is you know valuable business
it's good like we love our customers as well
as um Lots of growth potential as well, too.
So the Indigenous Banking Unit and the Office
of Reconciliation is right across the whole enterprise
of BMO. That's what I was just going to ask that.
Yeah. Are you into the investment banking, wealth
management, asset management across the bank?
Is your group involved in some way in assisting
some of those initiatives? Yeah, we really are.
And it's not to say that, you know, we go into
capital markets and we tell them how to structure
a deal. But what we do is we provide education
and we help them to understand how to have a
long lasting relationship built on trust. And
you got to earn that trust and you got to go
on community. And sometimes it takes time, but
it's worth it. And you have to do things. right
and properly and respectfully. And that doesn't
matter what line of business you're in, whether
it's commercial banking, corporate finance, capital
markets, wealth. It really doesn't matter. Relationships
are the cornerstone of that. We're seeing now
also Indigenous nations moving from being consulted
to having equity stakes. And what are you seeing
now in terms of institutional financing infrastructure?
to enable that and how far along is canada building
it so if it outside investors looking at canada
and thinking should i be working at this now
or do i wait a bit more or well i know investors
look for growth and they look for value right
so i did mention that our portfolio grew 400
percent just in a handful of years. I don't know
if there's any other part of the bank that could
say the same. And including assets under administration,
our balance has now exceeded over $20 billion.
So to me, that's clear evidence of both scale
and the speed of progress among our customers.
So 15 years ago, if you look at what we would
normally provide service for an Indigenous government
customer, it was largely based on bridging government
funding to meet basic operating needs. Sometimes
it was just meeting a payroll or to build a modest
level amount of houses or maybe a community center.
That reality has changed profoundly. Today, our
customers are generating meaningful own source
revenue, offsetting what I would say that the
chronic government underfunding and investing
in economic development, both within and beyond
their community and their traditional territory.
Their needs have evolved accordingly. many years
ago too it was often just loans right um and
and so i would say from primarily borrowing they're
seeking sophisticated uh wealth management now
and it's long -term planning and capital preservation
strategies uh this evolution is also a tangible
expression i believe of reconciliation Economic
participation in financial self -determination
and access to the full spectrum of financial
tools are fundamental to rebuilding that prosperity
and correcting really a lot of historical inequities.
So supporting Indigenous governments and enterprises
as they transition from fiscal constraint. to
economic leadership, sometimes in the whole region,
is not only good for banking, but it's central
to advancing reconciliation through sustained
and measurable outcomes. I think you mentioned
like capital markets, and I find that really
interesting because I believe that capital markets
are probably the next phase of the journey, and
that will be the next evolution of Indigenous
participation in the major projects. So bank
capital, market teams could play a critical role
in actually offering a financing for a transaction.
But then you could also have financial equity
positions on either side of that transaction.
And those are both needed. you know whether whether
it's first nation you know participation in some
sort of equity but also on the industry side
too so both sides of the equation needs financing
um and then i think what we could do a little
bit more of is traditional but also innovative
capital raising structures as well too um and
even more so than that is advisory right um we
gotta together on, you know, as a relationship
that you have to navigate some pretty complex
transactions, but also some regulatory frameworks
and now government guarantees as well. So in
this space, reconciliation, I believe, is built
on trust, consistency, and it's that partnership
ensuring Indigenous participation is not symbolic.
It's more substantive and enduring that value
creating. So it always comes down to, I believe
that trusted relationships will really be the
success and moving forward for the next chapter.
Yeah, right on, Dan. And you've got so much experience
banking Indigenous projects and communities,
living in the communities yourself. What advice
would you have for? foreign investors in particular
who are looking at Canadian projects involving
Indigenous people and needing to understand what,
well, not knowing what they don't know, I guess.
Any top tips? Sure. Yeah, there are a few. When
I think of, like, just if I were to say just
a few different things, you know, first, I would,
for an investor, I would say that make sure the
Indigenous government supports the project. through
and through. And that consultative process is
done in a respectful and fulsome way with community
engagement. Just to ensure that all that regulatory,
the environmental, the compliance, the UNDRIP
ethic, everything that has been satisfied. The
second thing I would say is make sure the project
makes sense long -term, extending beyond those
current political cycles. both you know locally
but but also federally as well too and earning
the support of local residents for generations
to come because all of these projects are for
many many generations right and yeah it could
make sense now but will it make sense in 20 years
just to make sure the community is actually supportive
of that as well um and finally i'm going back
to relationships matter so indigenous partnerships
are not a box the checking exercise they require
time and they require trust and you have to earn
that to be successful great lessons and you know
coming back to that relationships when we go
back and look at ourselves or talk to our parents
and grandparents business used to be done based
on relationships yeah so you're kind of coming
back and the indigenous people talk very much
about relationships whereas the non -indigenous
have had to suffer relationships don't count
anymore. It's a transaction. Here's a price.
Do you want it or not? Indigenous are coming
and saying, rightfully, as rights holders, hey,
we're going to work on this together because
if you don't start with us, you're going to end
up with us at the end of the process. And if
you wasted all that time, we're just going to
start from zero whenever you get to us. So it's
important to have those early conversations to
just introduce yourself and your project and
what you're trying to achieve and get the input
from the Indigenous people. They want to have
the opportunity as much as anyone. And now that
they're rights holders, it's no longer clear,
oh, do we just have to ask them what can we do?
It's no, they've got a seat at the table, right?
So treat them as the partners they are that have
been reinforced by the Supreme Court and the
Constitution and the attitude now of the progressive
organizations, the banks, BMO. You know, nobody's
going to be able to go and say they weren't told.
Oh, that's a surprise. I didn't know I needed
to do that, right? The duty to consult, I mean,
that's not new. That was part of Section 35,
you know, going back into the 1980s. And that
really is a government duty. But historically,
that was delegated, you know, from government
to industry. And that wasn't always done. in
a good way, right? A lot of times it was just
industry informing of the decisions and then
saying, well, you know, I told them and consulted
and it wasn't done in a meaningful way. And now,
you know, nations have that opportunity to shape,
you know, the project and to be on the, not the
decisioning, but to be an owner. being on the
owner's table of that is absolutely huge and
it's needed. So I look at like today, the model
is changing in a fundamental way. The Indigenous
governments have really moved beyond the consultation
part of it to the ownership and governance of
projects. Equity participation, I think, not
only aligns the interest but it also ensures
long -term community benefit and and accountability
so I think industry has come a long way as well
too not only with government and especially you
know accepting the legislation of Vendrick certainly
will help and will mandate some of these things
but I think of also even public policy so public
policy has been a critical enabler of that shift.
One great example, and I'm sure they won't mind
me saying it, is Ontario Hydro One. So they now
actually have a framework and within policy for
all new transmission lines, there is Indigenous
ownership. So they're normalizing it. And it's
now becoming a part of ownership of major infrastructure
development. And I think that's great. Government
guarantees have also... going to play and will
play an important role. And there's a couple
under their belt right now, which is good, but
particularly with projects with some construction
risk as well, too. So so that's going to play
an important role for banks to look at, you know,
whether or not you finance these. They always
look at risk, do their due diligence. And and
with that comes from, you know, well, What if
there is a hiccup? Where's the recourse, right?
And many of these projects now, they're in hundreds
of millions of dollars, and it could involve
a small community. And that is now out of scope
of what they're able to provide, some sort of
recourse. So that government guarantee actually
makes that recourse, makes a financer look at
the actual merits. of that project itself. And
instead of looking at a small community saying,
well, what other revenue, you know, could you
use? That revenue really should be for the community.
It should be for social services, for infrastructure,
for economic development, not so much for recourse
because, you know, their land is being impacted
in their traditional and within their traditional
territory. So that guarantee is going to be big.
And I think this Canadian banks in general. remain
eager in supporting it. And there is a growing
sentiment of the alignment within different governments
as well, being both federal and provincial. Yeah,
so many great things going on, Dan. And you've
got a unique position in Thunder Bay, unique
view into the north, not just northern Ontario,
but northern Canada and the far north. Are you
seeing an uptick in interest? It's certainly
an uptick in activity and Indigenous communities
are at the center of it all in the North. Yeah,
100%. And it's well diversified. So it's energy,
it's mining, it's forestry. And then also, too,
a lot of the First Nations, no matter where they're
geographically located, you know, they're part
of the urban. infrastructure as well too, like
within the cities, whether it's Thunder Bay,
Sault Ste. Marie, Sudbury, Winnipeg, many of
those communities now that they have their offices
located in the city, many of their members live
in the city. So they're investing in housing
and businesses and economic opportunities all
over the place, which is really great to see.
Yes, it is. And we're very pleased that we have
One of your colleagues from BMO will be joining
us in London this year at the summit coming up
on April 7th in the Square Mall, which is very
good. But I know every June you have an annual
report, your Indigenous Partnerships and Progress
report. Can you just talk a little bit about
that? So our audience will remember to pick it
up and we'll probably highlight it when it comes
out. So it's this one right here. Every year.
We create an Indigenous Partnership and Progress
Report. We try to make it as transparent as possible.
We actually even put our portfolio numbers on
there as well. But it's really an opportunity
to provide an update of what we've been doing
the last few years, or sorry, the last 12 months.
And within that report, we give the opportunity
for our customers to tell their stories. And
that's always my favorite part. Great. Well,
I look forward to reading that when it comes
out. Thank you. Well, I just want to say thank
you for that. You're keeping the conversation
going. You're making the conversation mainstream.
And I always say that we should be normalizing
this. This shouldn't be a specialization of banking.
Everyone should have this knowledge and this
education. So we're within the Office of Reconciliation.
We're all in on education. We're doing a lot
of different things because knowledge does matter
and it does help inform policies and practices.
So thanks for the conversation. Thanks for inviting
me. Yeah, thanks again for the time. Dan, and
running through so many interesting initiatives
that you've been involved with, helped lead,
and sounds like you're going to continue to lead
for some time to come. Well done. Much appreciated.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you to Dan Adams
for sharing his insights with us, and thank you
for viewing and listening. Mark your calendars
for the upcoming 2026 Summit taking place on
the 8th of April. Be sure to share, subscribe,
and leave a review on your favorite podcast channel.
Thanks for listening to Drum Beats. Until next
time.