WEBVTT 00:00:00.170 --> 00:00:03.029 Welcome to Drumbeats, the must -listen -to podcast 00:00:03.029 --> 00:00:05.710 which explains why Indigenous partnerships are 00:00:05.710 --> 00:00:08.689 the key to securing successful outcomes in natural 00:00:08.689 --> 00:00:11.070 resource and infrastructure investment in Canada. 00:00:12.250 --> 00:00:14.849 I'm Mark McNack and my co -host Robert Brant 00:00:14.849 --> 00:00:17.769 and I are joined today by Marissa Nobauer, Director 00:00:17.769 --> 00:00:20.510 of Reconciliation, Community Engagement and External 00:00:20.510 --> 00:00:23.390 Relations at TELUS. We're also joined today by 00:00:23.390 --> 00:00:26.429 Carol Ann Hilton, CEO and founder of the Indigenous 00:00:26.429 --> 00:00:29.280 Alamak Institute. to discuss a critical issue 00:00:29.280 --> 00:00:32.520 for investors in Canada, how corporate reconciliation 00:00:32.520 --> 00:00:35.100 with Indigenous communities is shaping governance, 00:00:35.340 --> 00:00:38.719 risk, and long -term value. TELUS, a leading 00:00:38.719 --> 00:00:41.380 Canadian telecommunications and technology company, 00:00:41.579 --> 00:00:44.060 has created the Indigenous Advisory Council, 00:00:44.340 --> 00:00:47.759 IAC, to ensure that reconciliation is embedded 00:00:47.759 --> 00:00:50.960 in its business strategy. Through ongoing engagement 00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:53.280 with Indigenous leaders and subject matter experts, 00:00:53.850 --> 00:00:56.750 The IAC provides a structured framework for aligning 00:00:56.750 --> 00:00:59.409 corporate practices with the legal rights, expectations, 00:00:59.729 --> 00:01:02.329 and economic aspirations of Indigenous communities 00:01:02.329 --> 00:01:05.829 across Canada. This discussion provides key insights 00:01:05.829 --> 00:01:08.170 for investors seeking to understand how Indigenous 00:01:08.170 --> 00:01:11.150 partnerships and reconciliation commitments can 00:01:11.150 --> 00:01:14.150 mitigate uncertainty, facilitate regulatory compliance, 00:01:14.489 --> 00:01:17.450 and enhance ESG performance in the Canadian investment 00:01:17.450 --> 00:01:27.359 landscape. Tell us and Caroline Hilton from Indigenomics. 00:01:28.359 --> 00:01:30.799 Thanks for having me. Yeah. Good morning, Marissa 00:01:30.799 --> 00:01:34.040 and Caroline. Great to have you with us. Thank 00:01:34.040 --> 00:01:37.879 you. Looking forward to the conversation. So 00:01:37.879 --> 00:01:40.939 really exciting time with, you know, the changes. 00:01:41.019 --> 00:01:43.620 We have a new government in Canada. Cabinet's 00:01:43.620 --> 00:01:48.239 been announced and everybody in Canada and beyond 00:01:48.239 --> 00:01:50.280 is looking, okay, how are we going to develop 00:01:50.280 --> 00:01:52.829 successfully? continue to be a strong, attractive 00:01:52.829 --> 00:01:56.349 economic destination where the Indigenous peoples 00:01:56.349 --> 00:01:58.269 have a seat at the table, which is, I think, 00:01:58.290 --> 00:02:00.650 one of the really exciting times that we're at 00:02:00.650 --> 00:02:03.870 this stage in our development. And Indigenous 00:02:03.870 --> 00:02:07.670 peoples are at the table as title holders, investors, 00:02:07.890 --> 00:02:12.370 and equity partners. But before we get into some 00:02:12.370 --> 00:02:14.389 of those bigger discussions, why don't each of 00:02:14.389 --> 00:02:17.250 you give a little bit of background? on yourself 00:02:17.250 --> 00:02:21.150 and perhaps Marissa, as you're from TELUS and 00:02:21.150 --> 00:02:25.349 Caroline also is part of that organization as 00:02:25.349 --> 00:02:27.909 an advisor, why don't you tell us a little bit 00:02:27.909 --> 00:02:31.789 about TELUS as an organization and then what's 00:02:31.789 --> 00:02:33.770 set up there and then we can switch over to Caroline. 00:02:34.509 --> 00:02:38.430 Sure, that would be lovely. Wonderful to be here 00:02:38.430 --> 00:02:42.849 today. So my name is Marissa Nobauer. So I am 00:02:42.849 --> 00:02:46.259 the Director of Reconciliation. Community Engagement 00:02:46.259 --> 00:02:50.199 and External Relations here at TELUS. Privilege 00:02:50.199 --> 00:02:52.780 of calling in to you today from the Unceded Territory, 00:02:52.780 --> 00:02:55.139 the Kwikwetlem people, where I get to live with 00:02:55.139 --> 00:02:58.120 my son and my husband. It's also known as Kwikwetlem. 00:02:58.240 --> 00:03:00.560 And as I speak to you today, I'm so thrilled 00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:03.400 because I'm looking out the window and I see 00:03:03.400 --> 00:03:06.139 green. And it's just such a beautiful time of 00:03:06.139 --> 00:03:10.879 year to be here and in this territory. I'm settler 00:03:10.879 --> 00:03:14.599 heritage on both sides of my family. My dad's 00:03:14.599 --> 00:03:16.860 family were German -Dutch migrants who migrated 00:03:16.860 --> 00:03:19.879 from Europe to Canada after the Second World 00:03:19.879 --> 00:03:23.439 War. And my mom's family were what we thought 00:03:23.439 --> 00:03:26.759 were Ukrainian Jews, but now maybe we're learning 00:03:26.759 --> 00:03:30.740 we're Lithuanian Jews, still learning, that left 00:03:30.740 --> 00:03:33.460 Europe in the late 1800s. And I had the privilege 00:03:33.460 --> 00:03:35.500 of actually growing up in the lower mainland 00:03:35.500 --> 00:03:38.689 here. So I'm a West Coast girl through and through, 00:03:38.849 --> 00:03:43.110 webbed toes. In my role at TELUS, I have the 00:03:43.110 --> 00:03:46.969 immense responsibility and opportunity to support 00:03:46.969 --> 00:03:50.949 TELUS's reconciliation strategy. TELUS is a Canadian 00:03:50.949 --> 00:03:54.909 telecom and technology company here in Canada. 00:03:55.629 --> 00:03:59.689 We provide not only wireline or mobility services 00:03:59.689 --> 00:04:04.330 to citizens and people in Canada across the country. 00:04:04.349 --> 00:04:06.610 We've actually invested more than any other telecom 00:04:06.610 --> 00:04:10.469 operator in Canada over the last several years. 00:04:10.789 --> 00:04:13.629 But in addition to that, Telus at its core is 00:04:13.629 --> 00:04:17.129 a company that believes in leveraging connectivity 00:04:17.129 --> 00:04:20.149 for good, right? When you think about what connectivity 00:04:20.149 --> 00:04:23.899 is, connectivity... Once you have connectivity, 00:04:24.279 --> 00:04:27.879 the remarkable outcomes that it drives are numerous. 00:04:27.980 --> 00:04:30.720 You can access virtual healthcare, right? Think 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:32.139 about the fact that you don't actually have to 00:04:32.139 --> 00:04:35.620 drive six hours from your community. To the doctor, 00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:38.180 you can actually stay at home in your community 00:04:38.180 --> 00:04:40.899 to see the doctor. You can leverage technology 00:04:40.899 --> 00:04:44.220 for education. You can leverage technology for 00:04:44.220 --> 00:04:47.279 agriculture. Think about the massive food instability 00:04:47.279 --> 00:04:50.079 we have across the world today. How can you leverage 00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:53.439 technology to drive better food security outcomes? 00:04:53.879 --> 00:04:56.079 So as an organization, when you actually look 00:04:56.079 --> 00:04:58.600 at what we've done over time, we started as a 00:04:58.600 --> 00:05:01.620 telecommunications company in Canada. And over 00:05:01.620 --> 00:05:03.980 the years, we've really focused on how do we 00:05:04.199 --> 00:05:07.360 broaden that scope to support customers beyond 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:10.600 just broadband, but also leverage that technology. 00:05:11.240 --> 00:05:16.240 We have now invested in healthcare. We are currently 00:05:16.240 --> 00:05:18.720 enhancing the lives of 76 million people worldwide 00:05:18.720 --> 00:05:21.579 through an innovative preventive medicine. And 00:05:21.579 --> 00:05:23.779 our TELS agriculture and consumer goods business 00:05:23.779 --> 00:05:27.199 actually utilizes digital technologies and data 00:05:27.199 --> 00:05:29.279 insights to optimize that connection between 00:05:29.279 --> 00:05:33.019 producers and consumers. And lastly, we're a 00:05:33.019 --> 00:05:35.300 give where we live company. Everything we do 00:05:35.300 --> 00:05:37.920 comes back to how are we supporting the people 00:05:37.920 --> 00:05:40.579 that are living in the communities where we live 00:05:40.579 --> 00:05:43.259 and serve. And that all comes back to the work 00:05:43.259 --> 00:05:45.000 that we get to do through our reconciliation 00:05:45.000 --> 00:05:47.879 commitments, which is the opportunity and responsibility 00:05:47.879 --> 00:05:51.660 we have as a corporation to be working partnership 00:05:51.660 --> 00:05:54.139 hand in hand with Indigenous peoples and communities. 00:05:55.000 --> 00:05:57.959 to advance the opportunities that exist in this 00:05:57.959 --> 00:06:00.639 country for everybody. So a little bit about 00:06:00.639 --> 00:06:03.439 me and Coraline's Indigenous Advisory Council 00:06:03.439 --> 00:06:06.959 member and a key part of helping TELUS maintain 00:06:06.959 --> 00:06:09.699 our commitments. Super, Marissa. Thank you for 00:06:09.699 --> 00:06:12.060 that background. Great to hear about yourself 00:06:12.060 --> 00:06:16.019 and about TELUS, which is a great purpose -driven 00:06:16.019 --> 00:06:19.170 firm. I was really interested, and I'm sure our 00:06:19.170 --> 00:06:20.970 listeners here in the UK, when you mentioned 00:06:20.970 --> 00:06:23.129 about driving six hours for a medical appointment, 00:06:23.290 --> 00:06:25.649 because if you drive six hours in this country, 00:06:25.709 --> 00:06:29.110 you can go from London up to Scotland. So it 00:06:29.110 --> 00:06:33.110 reinforces the vastness of Canada, which I think 00:06:33.110 --> 00:06:36.529 a lot of people don't appreciate so much. And 00:06:36.529 --> 00:06:38.170 when you talk about those challenges, because 00:06:38.170 --> 00:06:41.170 the population is spread out across the country, 00:06:41.310 --> 00:06:43.310 especially the Indigenous peoples, there are 00:06:43.310 --> 00:06:46.399 a lot of challenges. and opportunities that go 00:06:46.399 --> 00:06:49.160 with that. But that's a great intro. Marissa, 00:06:49.180 --> 00:06:51.920 thank you very much. Yeah, pleasure to have you 00:06:51.920 --> 00:06:55.160 with us. Marissa, I've got colleagues at McCarthy 00:06:55.160 --> 00:06:57.439 Tetra who've worked with TELUS and have been 00:06:57.439 --> 00:07:00.639 quite involved with TELUS over the years, and 00:07:00.639 --> 00:07:02.600 they have nothing but good things to say about 00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:10.579 the culture at TELUS. And Carol Ann. You're part 00:07:10.579 --> 00:07:12.720 of that culture too. You're an advisor and part 00:07:12.720 --> 00:07:15.120 of the Indigenous Advisory Committee. Why don't 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:17.740 you tell us a little bit about yourself and that 00:07:17.740 --> 00:07:21.180 committee? Wonderful. Thank you. My name is Caroline 00:07:21.180 --> 00:07:25.060 Hilton, and I am the CEO and founder of the Indigenomics 00:07:25.060 --> 00:07:27.819 Institute, the Global Center of Indigenomics, 00:07:27.819 --> 00:07:30.459 and the Global Indigenous Technology House. We 00:07:30.459 --> 00:07:33.800 keep very busy here in our inspiration. I am 00:07:33.800 --> 00:07:36.160 Nuchamal from the west coast of Vancouver Island 00:07:36.160 --> 00:07:39.060 in British Columbia, Canada. It's on the far, 00:07:39.120 --> 00:07:43.079 far west coast, ocean people. I actually did 00:07:43.079 --> 00:07:46.319 my international MBA through the University of 00:07:46.319 --> 00:07:50.420 Hertfordshire in the UK. The development of the 00:07:50.420 --> 00:07:53.920 concept of Indigenomics as a platform for modern 00:07:53.920 --> 00:07:58.240 Indigenous economic design. The understanding 00:07:58.240 --> 00:08:02.370 of Indigenomics as a design platform. We are 00:08:02.370 --> 00:08:06.209 a financial, economic and technology innovation 00:08:06.209 --> 00:08:10.389 platform. And being able to shape a narrative 00:08:10.389 --> 00:08:13.850 around this metaphor of Indigenous peoples taking 00:08:13.850 --> 00:08:16.790 our seat at the economic table, of the rise of 00:08:16.790 --> 00:08:21.250 Indigenous economic power and the required understanding 00:08:21.250 --> 00:08:25.389 of the participation of Indigenous peoples in 00:08:25.389 --> 00:08:28.629 the value chain and how that is occurring and 00:08:28.629 --> 00:08:31.550 how that is leveraging. and creating a foundation 00:08:31.550 --> 00:08:36.230 of Indigenous economic power today. That concept 00:08:36.230 --> 00:08:40.649 of the rise of Indigenous economic power is central 00:08:40.649 --> 00:08:44.009 to understanding the increasing visibility of 00:08:44.009 --> 00:08:47.690 Indigenous economic participation, both nationally 00:08:47.690 --> 00:08:51.129 and internationally. Thank you. Great to have 00:08:51.129 --> 00:08:53.370 you with us, Caroline. I've heard a lot about, 00:08:53.529 --> 00:08:55.730 and of course, across Canada, everyone knows 00:08:55.730 --> 00:08:59.450 about your firm, which is doing great leadership 00:08:59.450 --> 00:09:02.379 work. Thank you. To help raise this profile. 00:09:02.519 --> 00:09:04.019 And I guess that's one of the points that come 00:09:04.019 --> 00:09:06.759 back to it in terms of the stage that we're at 00:09:06.759 --> 00:09:11.360 in Canada or Canadians are at with the participation 00:09:11.360 --> 00:09:13.740 of the Indigenous peoples. And coming back to 00:09:13.740 --> 00:09:16.840 TELUS as the organization we're speaking about, 00:09:16.919 --> 00:09:20.279 you're also on the advisory board. And how does 00:09:20.279 --> 00:09:23.539 the advisory board play a role in TELUS? Can 00:09:23.539 --> 00:09:26.830 you tell us a bit more about that? I think that 00:09:26.830 --> 00:09:30.669 TELUS was an early mover in leadership of demonstrating 00:09:30.669 --> 00:09:34.950 accountable, transparent action in building reconciliation 00:09:34.950 --> 00:09:39.309 outcomes. And in demonstrating that early leadership 00:09:39.309 --> 00:09:43.129 has created and opened the floodgates of positive 00:09:43.129 --> 00:09:47.389 peer pressure among corporations to engage in 00:09:47.389 --> 00:09:51.009 building tangible, visible outcomes and accountable 00:09:51.009 --> 00:09:55.720 pathways to those results over time. Big respect 00:09:55.720 --> 00:09:58.559 for the work of TELUS and always an honour to 00:09:58.559 --> 00:10:02.720 participate in the pioneer work of building economic 00:10:02.720 --> 00:10:07.740 outcomes in Indigenous economy. Thank you. Great. 00:10:07.919 --> 00:10:10.700 And Marissa, you've been with TELUS for about 00:10:10.700 --> 00:10:16.460 seven years, I think you said. And how has TELUS's 00:10:16.460 --> 00:10:20.340 relationship with Indigenous people changed over 00:10:20.340 --> 00:10:24.299 that time? Yeah, I think. When I look at what's 00:10:24.299 --> 00:10:27.600 happening across the landscape of Canada and 00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:29.720 Indigenous economics and Indigenous participation, 00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:33.799 the difference between 10 years... ago and now, 00:10:33.879 --> 00:10:35.720 the difference between five years ago and now, 00:10:35.860 --> 00:10:40.100 it's evolving at such a rapid, light speed pace 00:10:40.100 --> 00:10:43.279 because of the work of pioneers like Caroline 00:10:43.279 --> 00:10:46.059 Hilton and others who are really pushing the 00:10:46.059 --> 00:10:48.940 needle to say, we need to do more, we need to 00:10:48.940 --> 00:10:52.700 move faster. Because when we all work together 00:10:52.700 --> 00:10:55.799 economically, it benefits every single one of 00:10:55.799 --> 00:10:58.779 us that are living here today. You know, when 00:10:58.779 --> 00:11:03.580 I started at TELUS, Seven years ago, the focus 00:11:03.580 --> 00:11:06.299 that we were on was about how do we work together 00:11:06.299 --> 00:11:09.679 to connect Indigenous communities to advanced 00:11:09.679 --> 00:11:12.860 broadband internet. Rob or Mark, one of you made 00:11:12.860 --> 00:11:15.220 the comment about the vastness of Canada, right? 00:11:15.299 --> 00:11:17.840 When you think about it. I can't remember the 00:11:17.840 --> 00:11:21.419 exact stat, but somewhat between 95 and 98 % 00:11:21.419 --> 00:11:24.220 of the population of Canada lives within 100 00:11:24.220 --> 00:11:27.379 kilometers of the American border, right? The 00:11:27.379 --> 00:11:31.759 vastness of this country is significant. And 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:34.919 when we look at connecting communities, when 00:11:34.919 --> 00:11:38.460 you look at connecting small and remote communities 00:11:38.460 --> 00:11:43.720 with only 100, maybe 100 homes or 30 homes that 00:11:43.720 --> 00:11:47.409 are, let's say, six -hour drive from the nearest 00:11:47.409 --> 00:11:51.009 medium -sized city, it's very expensive proposition 00:11:51.009 --> 00:11:53.929 to be able to connect those communities to the 00:11:53.929 --> 00:11:56.049 same advanced broadband network that you would 00:11:56.049 --> 00:11:59.309 have in London. or any other major city. And 00:11:59.309 --> 00:12:02.750 so TELUS recognized really early on that we needed 00:12:02.750 --> 00:12:05.190 to ensure that we were playing our role as a 00:12:05.190 --> 00:12:08.269 telecommunications provider in supporting Indigenous 00:12:08.269 --> 00:12:11.529 connectivity. So when I started in my role, I 00:12:11.529 --> 00:12:14.110 really started on how are we working? How do 00:12:14.110 --> 00:12:16.590 we do it in a respectful manner to work with 00:12:16.590 --> 00:12:19.269 Indigenous communities to get them connected 00:12:19.269 --> 00:12:22.990 to pure fiber, to this lightning fast gigabit 00:12:22.990 --> 00:12:26.470 speed internet? And how do we do it in a reciprocal? 00:12:26.669 --> 00:12:29.129 manner how do we do it based on relationships 00:12:29.129 --> 00:12:31.769 and based what meets the needs of communities 00:12:31.769 --> 00:12:35.590 because not all communities will want the same 00:12:35.590 --> 00:12:38.470 things and so we need to really meet each community 00:12:38.470 --> 00:12:41.409 at that level and partner with them one by one 00:12:41.409 --> 00:12:43.769 by one and so that's a big part of what I did 00:12:43.769 --> 00:12:47.870 and as we went through it we went you know there's 00:12:47.870 --> 00:12:51.100 a big economic problem here, TELUS as a privately 00:12:51.100 --> 00:12:53.360 held shareholder company has certain business 00:12:53.360 --> 00:12:56.320 outcomes that we need to meet. And we need to 00:12:56.320 --> 00:12:59.580 develop rich partnerships in order to support 00:12:59.580 --> 00:13:02.980 Indigenous connectivity. So we've partnered with 00:13:03.259 --> 00:13:05.620 Indigenous communities, the federal government 00:13:05.620 --> 00:13:08.580 here, as well as provincial governments to work 00:13:08.580 --> 00:13:11.519 together in public -private partnerships to be 00:13:11.519 --> 00:13:14.720 able to connect communities to advance broadband 00:13:14.720 --> 00:13:18.740 internet so we can bring in our expertise. with 00:13:18.740 --> 00:13:21.320 funding support, the expertise of Indigenous 00:13:21.320 --> 00:13:24.179 communities to be able to connect them to advanced 00:13:24.179 --> 00:13:27.200 broadband network. And I, you know, one of the 00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:29.559 things, the great privileges of my life has been 00:13:29.559 --> 00:13:32.259 this work that we've done in this space. And 00:13:32.259 --> 00:13:35.340 over the past eight years, seven years that I've 00:13:35.340 --> 00:13:39.429 been with this company, we have... invested over 00:13:39.429 --> 00:13:46.629 $22 million to connect over 200 Indigenous lands 00:13:46.629 --> 00:13:49.590 to our Advanced Broadband Connectivity Network. 00:13:49.830 --> 00:13:53.210 And the real -time impact that's having is just 00:13:53.210 --> 00:13:55.950 phenomenal. The minute you have connectivity, 00:13:56.509 --> 00:14:00.320 you can stay in your community. And you can encourage 00:14:00.320 --> 00:14:02.399 people to come home from the community and people 00:14:02.399 --> 00:14:04.860 are actually traveling home to community to live 00:14:04.860 --> 00:14:07.700 in community because they can work their jobs 00:14:07.700 --> 00:14:11.059 there as well as they can in an urban center. 00:14:12.039 --> 00:14:17.200 It does sound amazing and it sounds maybe simpler 00:14:17.200 --> 00:14:19.879 than it probably is to get that connectivity. 00:14:20.440 --> 00:14:23.639 You've got to build things like towers. I assume 00:14:23.639 --> 00:14:28.240 you've got to dig through territories. Delay, 00:14:28.279 --> 00:14:33.860 fiber, all of that requires cooperation and buy 00:14:33.860 --> 00:14:36.700 -in and engagement. The local community, that 00:14:36.700 --> 00:14:42.200 must be some exercise. It is. It's a lot of work, 00:14:42.240 --> 00:14:45.779 but I think it's also part of how you live and 00:14:45.779 --> 00:14:49.379 work. In any jurisdiction, in any jurisdiction, 00:14:49.399 --> 00:14:52.120 when you're building projects, you need to engage 00:14:52.120 --> 00:14:55.100 with those who it's going to impact. Right. And 00:14:55.100 --> 00:14:57.220 I think one of the things that we don't think 00:14:57.220 --> 00:14:59.980 about or we don't talk about enough is how the 00:14:59.980 --> 00:15:02.320 importance of Indigenous knowledge and making 00:15:02.320 --> 00:15:05.259 these projects better. Right. When you engage 00:15:05.259 --> 00:15:08.139 with the rights holders and when you engage with 00:15:08.139 --> 00:15:10.960 those who are on the ground, they can tell you 00:15:10.960 --> 00:15:14.700 exactly. where the rocks are better and this 00:15:14.700 --> 00:15:17.220 is me as a non -engineer where the rocks are 00:15:17.220 --> 00:15:19.559 better to site that tower because things over 00:15:19.559 --> 00:15:22.700 here always sink but things here never sink or 00:15:22.700 --> 00:15:25.779 in a stable stable spot people can tell me and 00:15:25.779 --> 00:15:28.159 we've had we've been able to move entire lines 00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:31.909 because A community was able to provide their 00:15:31.909 --> 00:15:34.110 knowledge that said, hey, look, this is going 00:15:34.110 --> 00:15:36.269 to be rehabilitated from a salmon perspective 00:15:36.269 --> 00:15:38.529 because in the past they weren't there. And so 00:15:38.529 --> 00:15:41.289 we've moved entire lines that actually have allowed 00:15:41.289 --> 00:15:45.509 us to have a better and cheaper connectivity 00:15:45.509 --> 00:15:48.889 line than what was before. And then just my last 00:15:48.889 --> 00:15:51.700 example is. You know, sometimes you're right. 00:15:51.740 --> 00:15:53.820 It can be difficult getting things and we have 00:15:53.820 --> 00:15:58.440 to be really creative. And we worked and hired 00:15:58.440 --> 00:16:02.240 a local fisherman who knew the Fraser Canyon, 00:16:02.440 --> 00:16:05.299 which is like a really remote area here in BC, 00:16:05.460 --> 00:16:07.879 so well that he can predict where the water is 00:16:07.879 --> 00:16:10.720 going to go. And he was able to take our technicians 00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:15.090 and help bring a fiber line over. you know, a 00:16:15.090 --> 00:16:18.769 300 foot canyon to be able to connect these two 00:16:18.769 --> 00:16:21.309 remote communities on the other side of the canyon 00:16:21.309 --> 00:16:24.429 to high speed internet. So I think, yes, it's 00:16:24.429 --> 00:16:26.710 a lot of work, but the outcomes that we get out 00:16:26.710 --> 00:16:29.470 of it and the learnings that our team gets out 00:16:29.470 --> 00:16:32.289 of it because of local Indigenous knowledge makes 00:16:32.289 --> 00:16:36.070 everything that much better. Wow, that is impressive. 00:16:36.110 --> 00:16:37.330 And that's the difference because there's on 00:16:37.330 --> 00:16:39.190 the ground knowledge that the Indigenous people 00:16:39.190 --> 00:16:41.549 still have that in most of the rest of the world 00:16:41.549 --> 00:16:44.169 are some of the more. developed countries like 00:16:44.169 --> 00:16:46.389 the UK, which is a nation of immigrants from 00:16:46.389 --> 00:16:50.570 1066 onwards, they've lost that local knowledge 00:16:50.570 --> 00:16:53.409 that was here, you know, 1000, 2000 years ago. 00:16:54.169 --> 00:16:56.629 So but Carol Ann, it's all those sort of small 00:16:56.629 --> 00:16:59.629 projects, and 22 million is a big number. But 00:16:59.629 --> 00:17:01.649 you talk a lot about how we go and get to the 00:17:01.649 --> 00:17:04.549 $100 billion indigenous economy. So do you want 00:17:04.549 --> 00:17:06.450 to kind of pull all that together and put that 00:17:06.450 --> 00:17:09.630 in perspective of what you're identifying needs 00:17:09.630 --> 00:17:13.579 to be done in that regard? Yes, absolutely. Thank 00:17:13.579 --> 00:17:18.039 you. So in 2019, the Canadian government with 00:17:18.039 --> 00:17:20.799 limited data had identified the size of the Indigenous 00:17:20.799 --> 00:17:24.460 economy was around 32 billion. In understanding 00:17:24.460 --> 00:17:26.720 the limitations of the data, in understanding 00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:31.880 the limitations of the uptake of the perspective 00:17:31.880 --> 00:17:34.599 of an increase of Indigenous economic activity, 00:17:34.940 --> 00:17:38.319 the shortcomings of measurement and the shortcomings 00:17:38.319 --> 00:17:41.690 of insight into the rise of the Indigenous economy 00:17:41.690 --> 00:17:45.049 was paramount. At that time, I had identified 00:17:45.049 --> 00:17:47.849 through this concept of Indigenomics that $100 00:17:47.849 --> 00:17:52.490 billion Indigenous economy was essential to Canada's 00:17:52.490 --> 00:17:54.849 economic future, and that Indigenous participation 00:17:54.849 --> 00:17:59.069 was center to that. In looking at the tripling 00:17:59.069 --> 00:18:01.950 of Indigenous economic value since that timeframe, 00:18:02.410 --> 00:18:05.369 it has become readily apparent with the ever 00:18:05.369 --> 00:18:09.269 -consistent demonstration of Indigenous -led, 00:18:09.430 --> 00:18:12.450 Indigenous -owned projects over a billion -dollar 00:18:12.450 --> 00:18:16.700 level of project value. The demonstration of 00:18:16.700 --> 00:18:20.480 the reality of $100 billion of Indigenous economic 00:18:20.480 --> 00:18:23.660 activity is not only achievable, what we're looking 00:18:23.660 --> 00:18:26.619 at is essentially what it means to be ready for 00:18:26.619 --> 00:18:29.849 Indigenous economic power. There's a difference 00:18:29.849 --> 00:18:33.269 in perspective of the experience of the Indigenous 00:18:33.269 --> 00:18:35.630 people, Indigenous business and the Indigenous 00:18:35.630 --> 00:18:39.390 economy at $32 billion versus really what does 00:18:39.390 --> 00:18:42.009 it mean to get ready beyond $100 billion Indigenous 00:18:42.009 --> 00:18:44.809 economy. And that's what we're looking at here 00:18:44.809 --> 00:18:48.529 in Canada. To understand this perspective of 00:18:48.529 --> 00:18:51.369 Indigenous people taking our seat at the economic 00:18:51.369 --> 00:18:54.789 table, taking our rightful place essentially 00:18:54.789 --> 00:18:57.789 means that that push and pull between the economic 00:18:57.789 --> 00:19:00.930 and the legal happens in a way that as Indigenous 00:19:00.930 --> 00:19:04.029 people advance rights and advance legal jurisdiction, 00:19:04.430 --> 00:19:07.450 it establishes the requirement for everyone to 00:19:07.450 --> 00:19:09.849 move over at the economic table. And that's what 00:19:09.849 --> 00:19:11.890 we're seeing here in Canada is a fundamental 00:19:11.890 --> 00:19:14.910 shifting of the increase of jurisdiction, authority. 00:19:15.529 --> 00:19:18.569 and increase of Indigenous economic activity. 00:19:20.049 --> 00:19:22.890 Caroline, maybe talk a little bit about how the 00:19:22.890 --> 00:19:26.950 advisory committee works and what role you play, 00:19:27.009 --> 00:19:32.670 what sort of issues you advise, tell us on. I 00:19:32.670 --> 00:19:36.730 think that the advancement of corporate reconciliation 00:19:36.730 --> 00:19:40.750 action planning is creating a field that demonstrates 00:19:40.750 --> 00:19:44.569 essentially what leadership looks like, what 00:19:44.569 --> 00:19:47.029 ethics looks like, what outcomes looks like, 00:19:47.049 --> 00:19:52.690 what data supports that, and how the value uptake 00:19:52.690 --> 00:19:56.609 across a company becomes essential to understand 00:19:56.609 --> 00:20:01.630 that a top -down perspective and an actual cultural 00:20:01.630 --> 00:20:05.829 foundation of valuing the Indigenous economic 00:20:05.829 --> 00:20:09.769 relationship. I think to define what is economic 00:20:09.769 --> 00:20:13.069 reconciliation is best understood in action. 00:20:13.470 --> 00:20:17.170 And to be able to reflect on the ability to speak 00:20:17.170 --> 00:20:19.750 to a story of positive commitments, positive 00:20:19.750 --> 00:20:22.730 values, positive ethics and tangible outcomes. 00:20:22.950 --> 00:20:27.210 I think that TELUS has been leading in a clear 00:20:27.210 --> 00:20:31.210 demonstration of building a solid plan, building 00:20:31.210 --> 00:20:34.089 accountability to that plan and building visibility. 00:20:35.160 --> 00:20:37.640 that demonstrates commitment across the value 00:20:37.640 --> 00:20:40.519 chain of the company. And I think it's in that 00:20:40.519 --> 00:20:43.960 space that the demonstration of economic reconciliation 00:20:43.960 --> 00:20:48.619 and tangible economic metrics are becoming increasingly 00:20:48.619 --> 00:20:51.940 visible in this narrative of the rise of Indigenous 00:20:51.940 --> 00:20:56.240 economic power. With that Indigenous Reconciliation 00:20:56.240 --> 00:20:59.339 Action Plan, you've had that opportunity to work 00:20:59.339 --> 00:21:02.920 with TELUS over a number of years now to... really 00:21:02.920 --> 00:21:04.859 embed that in the company. What were some of 00:21:04.859 --> 00:21:07.319 the challenges? So, you know, you could be a 00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:10.200 UK corporate here. Okay. They've got subsidiaries 00:21:10.200 --> 00:21:12.359 in Canada. They may or may not have gone through 00:21:12.359 --> 00:21:15.420 that process. So how would you direct a UK corporate 00:21:15.420 --> 00:21:19.039 with their subsidiaries in Canada who perhaps 00:21:19.039 --> 00:21:21.240 they haven't talked about this at the top table 00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.940 back to the head office, right? Obviously they 00:21:23.940 --> 00:21:26.339 should be because it's fundamental success in 00:21:26.339 --> 00:21:29.440 Canada now. Could you outline that a little bit, 00:21:29.519 --> 00:21:33.059 Caroline? Yeah, absolutely. It comes down to 00:21:33.059 --> 00:21:36.119 the fundamentals of understanding and creating 00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:38.140 the commitment to understand the significance 00:21:38.140 --> 00:21:41.539 of the Indigenous relationship in Canada, to 00:21:41.539 --> 00:21:44.700 have the foundation elements of that evolving 00:21:44.700 --> 00:21:48.299 spectrum of understanding and the base foundation 00:21:48.299 --> 00:21:51.680 of concepts such as the evolution of Indigenous 00:21:51.680 --> 00:21:54.259 rights, the recognition within the Constitution. 00:21:55.390 --> 00:21:58.250 international Indigenous rights frameworks, to 00:21:58.250 --> 00:22:01.109 look at that as a toolkit to understand the foundational 00:22:01.109 --> 00:22:04.490 elements of understanding. I think to look to 00:22:04.490 --> 00:22:07.970 the UK to build that understanding is to fill 00:22:07.970 --> 00:22:12.269 that toolkit with key documents, key frameworks, 00:22:12.410 --> 00:22:15.569 and key understandings of the significance of 00:22:15.569 --> 00:22:18.269 the Indigenous relationship in Canada itself. 00:22:19.569 --> 00:22:22.349 Yes, and the Indigenous peoples have a special 00:22:22.349 --> 00:22:24.349 relationship with the Crown, and sometimes in 00:22:24.349 --> 00:22:28.170 the UK. It's not really appreciated or understood 00:22:28.170 --> 00:22:32.009 when that relationship, but also Canada being 00:22:32.009 --> 00:22:35.130 a parliamentary democracy with a constitution, 00:22:35.329 --> 00:22:39.190 which was one of the huge changes when the constitution 00:22:39.190 --> 00:22:41.509 was repatriated back in Canada, the rights of 00:22:41.509 --> 00:22:44.210 the indigenous people were recognized because 00:22:44.210 --> 00:22:46.609 up till now, the UK does not have a written constitution. 00:22:46.829 --> 00:22:49.289 There's been discussion in the recent past, maybe 00:22:49.289 --> 00:22:51.130 that is something that should be happening. So 00:22:51.130 --> 00:22:53.990 I think Canada has a unique... model with parliamentary 00:22:53.990 --> 00:22:56.670 democracy, that written constitution. And we've 00:22:56.670 --> 00:23:00.170 seen over the past number of years, you know, 00:23:00.170 --> 00:23:03.390 in terms of the Supreme Court ruling on the rights 00:23:03.390 --> 00:23:04.910 of the Indigenous people, and they have to be 00:23:04.910 --> 00:23:06.829 recognized. And when you were introduced, you 00:23:06.829 --> 00:23:09.289 talked about unceded territories and Treaty No. 00:23:10.049 --> 00:23:14.049 6, perhaps, as an example. So it's a complex 00:23:14.049 --> 00:23:18.470 business issue that has to be dealt with. This 00:23:18.470 --> 00:23:23.339 is not ESG. and some other issues that, oh, you 00:23:23.339 --> 00:23:25.480 can maybe go in this direction. In Canada, you 00:23:25.480 --> 00:23:27.880 have no choice, which is for the good of the 00:23:27.880 --> 00:23:30.119 country, in my opinion, because I think it'll 00:23:30.119 --> 00:23:32.980 put us at a leading edge and where Canada, we 00:23:32.980 --> 00:23:35.319 can reach the full potential that this land has 00:23:35.319 --> 00:23:38.440 always offered now that we have a true partnership 00:23:38.440 --> 00:23:41.740 between the Indigenous people and the settlers. 00:23:42.079 --> 00:23:45.769 And I think when Mark Carney... and was traveling 00:23:45.769 --> 00:23:47.829 before the election just after his installed 00:23:47.829 --> 00:23:50.730 first time and came over and said you know canada 00:23:50.730 --> 00:23:53.910 is the most european most european of non -european 00:23:53.910 --> 00:23:57.250 countries you know i thought that does that's 00:23:57.250 --> 00:23:59.690 not who we are that's looking at things through 00:23:59.690 --> 00:24:02.630 the old perspective of canada is about the french 00:24:02.630 --> 00:24:05.049 and the english of course not first of all it's 00:24:05.049 --> 00:24:08.369 the indigenous people and then the settlers as 00:24:08.369 --> 00:24:12.660 marisa mentioned earlier came after so rob Do 00:24:12.660 --> 00:24:15.259 you want to talk about some of those bigger constitutional 00:24:15.259 --> 00:24:18.519 issues? Yeah, well, you mentioned partnerships, 00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:22.619 and I was curious, Marissa, it sounds like TELUS 00:24:22.619 --> 00:24:26.180 is not just providing a service or building things 00:24:26.180 --> 00:24:30.200 in nations, territories, but it sounds like you're 00:24:30.200 --> 00:24:34.640 in partnership in some cases supporting local 00:24:34.640 --> 00:24:36.779 businesses, whether that's through procurement. 00:24:37.690 --> 00:24:40.789 Or maybe other means? Are you seeing nations 00:24:40.789 --> 00:24:45.529 take an equity stake in parts of the business 00:24:45.529 --> 00:24:50.109 that maybe affect their territories? Yeah, I 00:24:50.109 --> 00:24:56.109 think I wanted to add on one comment about companies 00:24:56.109 --> 00:24:59.630 in Europe or in England, excuse me, coming over 00:24:59.630 --> 00:25:01.970 here and what they need to know. It just doubled 00:25:01.970 --> 00:25:04.089 down on what Caroline said. Fundamentally, at 00:25:04.089 --> 00:25:06.980 the end of the day, Anytime you go into any country, 00:25:07.099 --> 00:25:08.980 you need to learn and you need to understand 00:25:08.980 --> 00:25:11.940 who it is that you're engaging with. You know, 00:25:11.960 --> 00:25:14.700 if you're going to travel to Japan, I bet you're 00:25:14.700 --> 00:25:16.519 going to sit down and really understand the customs 00:25:16.519 --> 00:25:18.819 of working in Japan. And I think traditionally, 00:25:19.059 --> 00:25:21.359 and you speak to this, you know, people come 00:25:21.359 --> 00:25:23.440 to Canada and they're like, oh, Canada. you know, 00:25:23.480 --> 00:25:26.119 Canada, they speak English. It's just in French, 00:25:26.180 --> 00:25:29.579 excuse me. It's just, you know, like, like, like 00:25:29.579 --> 00:25:31.799 working here, but it's not. And I think that 00:25:31.799 --> 00:25:34.579 comes back to just the fundamental lack of understanding 00:25:34.579 --> 00:25:39.480 that we have globally on the fundamental basis 00:25:39.480 --> 00:25:43.119 of who Canada is and where it's evolved over 00:25:43.119 --> 00:25:45.819 time. And so I think starting with what. the 00:25:45.819 --> 00:25:47.880 shared history of this country is. And I call 00:25:47.880 --> 00:25:50.039 it the shared history because it is a collective 00:25:50.039 --> 00:25:51.859 shared history when you're living here today, 00:25:51.940 --> 00:25:54.259 what that shared history of this country is. 00:25:54.339 --> 00:25:57.220 And that's really part of what we did at TELUS 00:25:57.220 --> 00:25:59.759 to be able to advance our reconciliation commitments 00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:03.630 is we need to start with. The what? What is our 00:26:03.630 --> 00:26:06.650 shared history? Why do we have Section 35 of 00:26:06.650 --> 00:26:09.250 the Constitution, right? Why do we have all of 00:26:09.250 --> 00:26:11.869 this case law? We need to start with that and 00:26:11.869 --> 00:26:14.210 understand, to your point, this is not ESG. It's 00:26:14.210 --> 00:26:16.970 not DNI. It's a completely separate thing that 00:26:16.970 --> 00:26:18.890 stems from the fact that Indigenous peoples were 00:26:18.890 --> 00:26:21.170 on the land first. And we need to understand 00:26:21.170 --> 00:26:23.170 that. We need to recognize it. And Indigenous 00:26:23.170 --> 00:26:25.809 peoples, they have built the way for how to do 00:26:25.809 --> 00:26:28.529 it, right? All you have to look at is all of 00:26:28.529 --> 00:26:30.569 these documents that Indigenous people have built. 00:26:31.019 --> 00:26:32.920 for those non -Indigenous peoples to understand 00:26:32.920 --> 00:26:36.240 how to do that work. UNDRIP is a great one. And 00:26:36.240 --> 00:26:39.799 in Canada, we've actually implemented both federally 00:26:39.799 --> 00:26:43.900 and here in BC, where I live. The 231 Calls for 00:26:43.900 --> 00:26:46.839 Justice, which was established as a result of 00:26:46.839 --> 00:26:48.380 the missing and murdered Indigenous women and 00:26:48.380 --> 00:26:52.670 girls epidemic here. 231 calls on ways that individuals, 00:26:52.910 --> 00:26:55.470 corporations, governments, you name it, can play 00:26:55.470 --> 00:26:58.029 a role. And then I'm getting to your point, Rob, 00:26:58.130 --> 00:27:01.670 around procurement. 94 calls to action. So the 00:27:01.670 --> 00:27:04.029 94 calls to action came out of the Truth and 00:27:04.029 --> 00:27:06.809 Reconciliation Commission here in Canada. The 00:27:06.809 --> 00:27:08.710 Truth and Reconciliation Commission went around 00:27:08.710 --> 00:27:11.329 the country to talk to survivors and to talk 00:27:11.329 --> 00:27:14.640 to Indigenous people. And out of that... You 00:27:14.640 --> 00:27:17.940 have 94 calls to action on what we can do as 00:27:17.940 --> 00:27:21.519 organizations, as humans, as citizens, as non 00:27:21.519 --> 00:27:25.119 -citizens and play our role. And call to action 00:27:25.119 --> 00:27:28.400 number 92 was a specific call to corporate Canada 00:27:28.400 --> 00:27:31.819 or corporations operating Canada. And underneath 00:27:31.819 --> 00:27:34.660 that, there's three ways that it says you can 00:27:34.660 --> 00:27:37.960 start. in advancing reconciliation. Number one 00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:40.079 is ensure that you understand what the shared 00:27:40.079 --> 00:27:43.900 history of this country is. Number two is ensuring 00:27:43.900 --> 00:27:47.220 that Indigenous people are participating in projects 00:27:47.220 --> 00:27:50.480 that affect their lands. And number three is 00:27:50.480 --> 00:27:54.140 how... How are you supporting Indigenous participation 00:27:54.140 --> 00:27:57.019 in your organizations, whether that's through 00:27:57.019 --> 00:27:59.700 procurement or whether that's through employment 00:27:59.700 --> 00:28:03.400 or other various ways? I think every corporation 00:28:03.400 --> 00:28:05.940 in Canada has a different way in which they're 00:28:05.940 --> 00:28:08.940 going to be supporting economic growth. in Indigenous 00:28:08.940 --> 00:28:11.380 communities, right? You have resource extraction, 00:28:11.619 --> 00:28:15.220 which has a very specific impact on the land. 00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:17.880 You have telecommunications, which, and you know, 00:28:17.880 --> 00:28:19.819 I have to correct my comment from earlier, we're 00:28:19.819 --> 00:28:23.299 spending $22 million this year. We've spent over 00:28:23.299 --> 00:28:27.200 $122 million connecting communities, right? That's 00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:30.200 an investment, just a capital investment into 00:28:30.200 --> 00:28:32.799 the communities, let alone the ongoing operational 00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:36.000 impacts of keeping these networks running and 00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:39.230 continuing to invest in those. as an organization, 00:28:39.630 --> 00:28:42.450 TELUS has many ways in which we can do it, right? 00:28:42.529 --> 00:28:44.130 It's through the investment that we're making. 00:28:44.230 --> 00:28:46.250 And we've done some really cool things, Rob, 00:28:46.329 --> 00:28:48.890 to your point. We actually partnered with Nisga 00:28:48.890 --> 00:28:51.230 'a Nation. So Nisga 'a Nation, which is the first 00:28:51.230 --> 00:28:53.329 modern treaty nation here in British Columbia, 00:28:53.589 --> 00:28:56.569 which is the province that I live in. And they 00:28:56.569 --> 00:28:57.990 came to us and they said, you know, what's really 00:28:57.990 --> 00:29:01.569 important to us is actually ownership of the 00:29:01.569 --> 00:29:03.890 network, ownership of the assets. That's what's 00:29:03.890 --> 00:29:07.019 most important to us. as a nation. So we spent 00:29:07.019 --> 00:29:09.859 18 months sitting, listening, learning, understand 00:29:09.859 --> 00:29:12.339 how it is that we can work with one another that 00:29:12.339 --> 00:29:14.299 meets the needs of TELUS, but also meets the 00:29:14.299 --> 00:29:16.420 needs of the nation. And coming out of that, 00:29:16.460 --> 00:29:20.539 what we've developed is a wireless project that 00:29:20.539 --> 00:29:22.940 has just wrapped up this year where Nisga 'a 00:29:22.940 --> 00:29:26.900 Nation actually owns the physical wireless towers 00:29:26.900 --> 00:29:29.859 in their community. And then as part of that, 00:29:30.059 --> 00:29:34.119 we've committed to training. the LITS, which 00:29:34.119 --> 00:29:37.779 is NISQA's ISP, to be able to support maintenance 00:29:37.779 --> 00:29:40.640 of those towers, to be able to support how do 00:29:40.640 --> 00:29:43.039 we co -locate other providers on these towers, 00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:45.519 right? So that's the way in which NISQA wanted 00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:48.700 to participate with us. And then some communities 00:29:48.700 --> 00:29:51.119 want to engage with us in a more traditional, 00:29:51.220 --> 00:29:54.759 we are a connectivity provider. The other thing 00:29:54.759 --> 00:29:58.460 that I'll add too is that I think we need to 00:29:58.460 --> 00:30:01.299 look at What are the intersection points between 00:30:01.299 --> 00:30:03.460 your business and what you can do in this space? 00:30:03.680 --> 00:30:06.380 So TELUS is a leader in technology. And one of 00:30:06.380 --> 00:30:09.619 the things that we are a leader in is data ethics 00:30:09.619 --> 00:30:12.440 and responsible AI development. We have our Fuel 00:30:12.440 --> 00:30:16.720 IX AI engine, which we have built. But we recognize 00:30:16.720 --> 00:30:19.059 that we need to be responsible in the development 00:30:19.059 --> 00:30:21.759 of our AI. And to be responsible in the development 00:30:21.759 --> 00:30:24.539 of our AI is making sure that we're incorporating 00:30:24.539 --> 00:30:28.430 Indigenous perspectives into AI. AI is inherently 00:30:28.430 --> 00:30:31.529 biased because it's made by humans and then humans 00:30:31.529 --> 00:30:34.490 inherently have bias. So we as an organization 00:30:34.490 --> 00:30:37.849 are working at different levels with Indigenous 00:30:37.849 --> 00:30:41.289 peoples and companies to understand what is Indigenous 00:30:41.289 --> 00:30:44.529 data in the context of TELUS? What role can we 00:30:44.529 --> 00:30:48.089 have in ensuring that our AI engine isn't perpetrating 00:30:48.089 --> 00:30:51.690 harmful beliefs about who Indigenous people are? 00:30:51.809 --> 00:30:55.170 And in fact... plays a positive role in reframing 00:30:55.170 --> 00:30:58.950 the narrative around the negative language that 00:30:58.950 --> 00:31:01.250 you tend to hear, right? So when you asked me 00:31:01.250 --> 00:31:03.710 those questions about the opportunity, I think 00:31:03.710 --> 00:31:06.130 every company needs to sit down and think, who 00:31:06.130 --> 00:31:09.210 am I and what role do I have? Some companies 00:31:09.210 --> 00:31:11.349 will have an amazing role for procurement because 00:31:11.349 --> 00:31:14.049 of who they are and what they do. And other companies 00:31:14.049 --> 00:31:15.890 will have an amazing role from an employment 00:31:15.890 --> 00:31:18.690 perspective. So that's one of the things that 00:31:18.690 --> 00:31:20.930 I always encourage folks is think about who you 00:31:20.930 --> 00:31:23.759 are as an organization. what you do really well 00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:26.619 and how you integrate Indigenous perspectives 00:31:26.619 --> 00:31:29.980 into those things. Well, we'll have a separate 00:31:29.980 --> 00:31:32.779 conversation on AI in the future because it's 00:31:32.779 --> 00:31:35.359 a whole, we could have many conversations on 00:31:35.359 --> 00:31:37.880 AI, but it's certainly an important point you 00:31:37.880 --> 00:31:42.160 made. Karan, so I'm a global investor. I'm, you 00:31:42.160 --> 00:31:44.039 know, Canada's on my radar, but after listening 00:31:44.039 --> 00:31:47.470 to all this, it sounds really complicated. And 00:31:47.470 --> 00:31:49.430 it sounds like I'm going to have a lot of upfront 00:31:49.430 --> 00:31:52.069 costs. Why don't I just go to another country 00:31:52.069 --> 00:31:56.170 who has similar resources and develop there? 00:31:56.230 --> 00:31:59.190 Why should I make that extra effort to invest 00:31:59.190 --> 00:32:05.950 in Canada with these additional challenges? Yeah, 00:32:05.990 --> 00:32:08.009 absolutely. I think that's a great question. 00:32:08.089 --> 00:32:10.289 And that's the work that's in front of companies. 00:32:10.369 --> 00:32:12.710 That's the work that's in front of governments 00:32:12.710 --> 00:32:16.470 to answer that and to do the foundational work 00:32:16.470 --> 00:32:19.710 of understanding the significance of the rise 00:32:19.710 --> 00:32:22.369 of Indigenous economic power in a Canadian context 00:32:22.369 --> 00:32:26.460 specifically. I think the recognition of the 00:32:26.460 --> 00:32:29.200 increase of Indigenous economic activity and 00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:33.339 the cause of that, that the foundation for Indigenous 00:32:33.339 --> 00:32:35.980 rights, the leveraging of that into increased 00:32:35.980 --> 00:32:38.900 Indigenous economic activity provides a significant 00:32:38.900 --> 00:32:43.339 opportunity for national and international governments 00:32:43.339 --> 00:32:47.420 to engage and invest into Indigenous businesses 00:32:47.420 --> 00:32:52.049 in an environment that is supporting significant 00:32:52.049 --> 00:32:57.069 opportunity across multiple sectors. And I guess 00:32:57.069 --> 00:33:00.029 there are a few reasons that make Canada as a 00:33:00.029 --> 00:33:04.369 jurisdiction attractive. It is a developed nation 00:33:04.369 --> 00:33:09.970 within G7 with rule of law still governing and 00:33:09.970 --> 00:33:14.490 respected. North of the border, of course. Yeah, 00:33:14.529 --> 00:33:18.180 we're talking. Absolutely. That's one of the 00:33:18.180 --> 00:33:20.039 things that makes us different and why you want 00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:23.359 to do business in Canada. And when it comes to 00:33:23.359 --> 00:33:28.039 the Indigenous community, it's not a cost really 00:33:28.039 --> 00:33:31.579 of doing business, it's an investment. And it's 00:33:31.579 --> 00:33:35.480 the way to get things done and the value that 00:33:35.480 --> 00:33:38.140 companies are now seeing, regardless of what 00:33:38.140 --> 00:33:40.880 the law says, the value companies are seeing 00:33:40.880 --> 00:33:45.089 in involving Indigenous communities. in those 00:33:45.089 --> 00:33:48.769 businesses and taking advantage of the local 00:33:48.769 --> 00:33:51.809 learnings over hundreds of years. And Marissa 00:33:51.809 --> 00:33:56.009 touched on some examples. I can think of lots 00:33:56.009 --> 00:33:59.630 of reasons why a foreign company would want to 00:33:59.630 --> 00:34:03.190 make that extra effort, Mark. Yes, yes. Well, 00:34:03.289 --> 00:34:05.210 that's why we hold the summit every year, because 00:34:05.210 --> 00:34:08.929 we think it demonstrates that. And as Caroline 00:34:08.929 --> 00:34:12.769 and Marissa have been talking, the way to succeed. 00:34:13.340 --> 00:34:16.639 to get these returns for seven generations. Because 00:34:16.639 --> 00:34:18.840 once you start working with Indigenous peoples 00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:22.860 and working in partnership with them as title 00:34:22.860 --> 00:34:25.900 holders and investors and equity partners, you're 00:34:25.900 --> 00:34:27.840 building a long -term business, which is what 00:34:27.840 --> 00:34:30.639 every business wants, which will actually have 00:34:30.639 --> 00:34:34.400 lower risk over time because insider knowledge, 00:34:34.659 --> 00:34:36.900 because the Indigenous peoples know the lay of 00:34:36.900 --> 00:34:40.639 the land, literally. And you're building strong 00:34:40.639 --> 00:34:42.659 community association, which companies want to 00:34:42.659 --> 00:34:44.460 do everywhere because they know they have to 00:34:44.460 --> 00:34:47.260 live there for a long time with those communities. 00:34:47.440 --> 00:34:51.679 So I think it does speak to that as well. Yes. 00:34:51.920 --> 00:34:54.219 Now, Marissa, you had something you wanted to 00:34:54.219 --> 00:34:57.019 add? Can I just add, Carolyn, I can't remember 00:34:57.019 --> 00:34:59.539 if it was you who said this at our last advisory 00:34:59.539 --> 00:35:02.320 meeting or somebody else, but I think we need 00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:05.920 to reframe the narrative away from this work 00:35:05.920 --> 00:35:09.059 being extractive. Right. This is an extractive 00:35:09.059 --> 00:35:12.159 work. Working with Indigenous peoples provides 00:35:12.159 --> 00:35:15.539 significant opportunity for companies. And I 00:35:15.539 --> 00:35:17.800 know I talked about how it can make our projects 00:35:17.800 --> 00:35:21.099 better and save money for projects and reduce 00:35:21.099 --> 00:35:24.699 time. But also think about employees. Right. 00:35:24.780 --> 00:35:28.119 Indigenous people are the fastest growing demographic 00:35:28.119 --> 00:35:33.039 in Canada today. Right. You need companies everywhere 00:35:33.039 --> 00:35:36.579 are faced with challenges around long term employment. 00:35:36.739 --> 00:35:42.139 And as companies grow and we have boomers retiring, 00:35:42.360 --> 00:35:44.179 I don't know if I'm allowed to say that. So somebody 00:35:44.179 --> 00:35:48.199 is going to have to tell me. Can't do that. Can't 00:35:48.199 --> 00:35:51.420 do that, Marissa. We're not into that. But, you 00:35:51.420 --> 00:35:54.179 know, when you think about it, like this is a 00:35:54.179 --> 00:35:57.059 huge employee engagement opportunity. It's the 00:35:57.059 --> 00:35:59.360 opportunity to bring in new people, new perspectives 00:35:59.360 --> 00:36:02.059 into your organization. It's the opportunity 00:36:02.059 --> 00:36:04.300 to bring in more clients into your organizations. 00:36:04.340 --> 00:36:07.519 When you have when you do things right, when 00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:09.340 you engage with Indigenous peoples, you have 00:36:09.340 --> 00:36:11.719 an increased client base that's going to come 00:36:11.719 --> 00:36:15.570 to you as an organization. Right. When you understand 00:36:15.570 --> 00:36:17.989 how to support Indigenous people better, you're 00:36:17.989 --> 00:36:20.690 going to get more Indigenous clients and all 00:36:20.690 --> 00:36:22.929 of the things that come out of that. Not to mention 00:36:22.929 --> 00:36:25.869 the GDP that filters back into the economy, that 00:36:25.869 --> 00:36:28.570 filters back into your organization. And I just 00:36:28.570 --> 00:36:31.730 want to add one thing. I don't like engaged employees 00:36:31.730 --> 00:36:34.510 are so important to long term success of our 00:36:34.510 --> 00:36:37.969 organizations. We need team members to be successful. 00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:41.280 And one of the commitments that TELUS made was 00:36:41.280 --> 00:36:44.059 to integrate Indigenous placekeeping into our 00:36:44.059 --> 00:36:46.559 offices as we renovate it. So what does that 00:36:46.559 --> 00:36:48.880 mean? We were renovating our office in Toronto. 00:36:49.199 --> 00:36:51.579 And so we actually partnered with an Indigenous 00:36:51.579 --> 00:36:54.000 organization and did a series of engagements 00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:56.380 to go, how do we incorporate Indigenous perspectives 00:36:56.380 --> 00:36:59.320 into this office, right? How do we make this 00:36:59.320 --> 00:37:01.639 office a little less corporate and a little bit 00:37:01.639 --> 00:37:04.340 more reflective of the Aboriginal host nations 00:37:04.340 --> 00:37:08.820 in Toronto? As a result of that, We have this 00:37:08.820 --> 00:37:11.739 amazing space. It's oriented true north, east, 00:37:11.840 --> 00:37:14.340 south, west. You know, you can see the water 00:37:14.340 --> 00:37:17.840 at all angles. There's a longhouse inside this 00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:22.199 space. And that is one of the most popular floors 00:37:22.199 --> 00:37:24.800 at TELUS because TELUS team members want to work 00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:27.179 there. So we're incorporating Indigenous perspectives 00:37:27.179 --> 00:37:30.199 into our business, which is making our team members 00:37:30.199 --> 00:37:33.900 happier and also reframing ways in which we do 00:37:33.900 --> 00:37:35.639 business. Can you imagine if more board meetings 00:37:35.639 --> 00:37:38.300 happen in a longhouse? what the ultimate outcomes 00:37:38.300 --> 00:37:40.239 would be for our business, right? So I think 00:37:40.239 --> 00:37:42.480 we need to just start thinking about this more 00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:46.800 globally around all of the opportunities that 00:37:46.800 --> 00:37:49.619 come from this work, as opposed to just, you 00:37:49.619 --> 00:37:52.300 know, an extra step that you have to do in order 00:37:52.300 --> 00:37:55.679 to do work here. Yes. Thank you. That's great 00:37:55.679 --> 00:37:58.059 insight. Great. Can't wait to come to the Longhouse. 00:37:58.179 --> 00:38:01.260 Tell us in Toronto. In Toronto, you're invited. 00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:03.840 Let me know. Super. Thank you. Caroline, is there 00:38:03.840 --> 00:38:06.739 anything you'd like to add? Yeah, thank you. 00:38:06.760 --> 00:38:10.219 I think I'll close with the demonstration of 00:38:10.219 --> 00:38:12.659 Indigenous economic value and increased Indigenous 00:38:12.659 --> 00:38:15.460 economic activity needs to be paid attention 00:38:15.460 --> 00:38:18.679 to nationally and globally. I think the metric 00:38:18.679 --> 00:38:22.010 system of that... traditionally defined within 00:38:22.010 --> 00:38:25.730 GDP. But if you look at the space of where economic 00:38:25.730 --> 00:38:28.650 value creation is happening with Indigenous businesses 00:38:28.650 --> 00:38:31.510 and how that's being leveraged, there's a story 00:38:31.510 --> 00:38:34.809 to be told. And what that story is, is around 00:38:34.809 --> 00:38:39.400 designing for versus happening to. The significance 00:38:39.400 --> 00:38:43.880 of exclusion of 150 plus years of exclusion versus 00:38:43.880 --> 00:38:47.099 the designing for inclusion and designing for 00:38:47.099 --> 00:38:49.820 the increase of Indigenous worldview in business 00:38:49.820 --> 00:38:53.000 and how that in itself is leveraging increased 00:38:53.000 --> 00:38:55.880 ownership and placing and centering Indigenous 00:38:55.880 --> 00:38:59.780 peoples and businesses. from a power perspective, 00:39:00.039 --> 00:39:03.900 and also the realization of the significance 00:39:03.900 --> 00:39:07.460 of, in a very, very short time, the recognition 00:39:07.460 --> 00:39:11.179 of Indigenous peoples as economic powerhouses 00:39:11.179 --> 00:39:13.840 within the Canadian economy. And that's a story 00:39:13.840 --> 00:39:18.519 to be told and demonstrated across other G7 economies, 00:39:18.639 --> 00:39:22.900 across other emerging, developing economies of 00:39:22.900 --> 00:39:25.269 centering the Indigenous relationship. and what 00:39:25.269 --> 00:39:27.909 Indigenous economic power looks like in 2025. 00:39:28.250 --> 00:39:32.210 Thank you. Thank you. That is a very powerful 00:39:32.210 --> 00:39:36.849 summary. I think that is a great way to wrap 00:39:36.849 --> 00:39:40.230 up our podcast today. Rob? Yeah, no, I want to 00:39:40.230 --> 00:39:43.369 thank you both. Marissa, love your enthusiasm 00:39:43.369 --> 00:39:46.650 and the way you've articulated the benefits and 00:39:46.650 --> 00:39:52.760 what you've seen happen in the practical. benefits 00:39:52.760 --> 00:39:56.079 at TELUS and their experience working with Indigenous 00:39:56.079 --> 00:40:01.260 people. And Carol Ann, always a pleasure to talk 00:40:01.260 --> 00:40:04.199 to you. I know you've just released your second 00:40:04.199 --> 00:40:08.159 book on the rise of Indigenous economic power, 00:40:08.260 --> 00:40:12.480 and we'll look forward to your series of conferences 00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:14.980 throughout the year, including Indigenomics on 00:40:14.980 --> 00:40:20.039 Bay Street in November, and your further research 00:40:20.039 --> 00:40:23.150 in the area. A real pleasure to speak to both 00:40:23.150 --> 00:40:29.050 of you today. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you 00:40:29.050 --> 00:40:31.750 to Marissa Neubauer and Caroline Hilton for sharing 00:40:31.750 --> 00:40:34.210 their insights with us. And thank you for viewing 00:40:34.210 --> 00:40:37.630 and listening. Be sure to share, subscribe, and 00:40:37.630 --> 00:40:39.670 leave a review on your favorite podcast channel. 00:40:40.489 --> 00:40:42.949 Thanks for listening to Drum Beats. Until next 00:40:42.949 --> 00:40:43.289 time.