WEBVTT 00:00:00.170 --> 00:00:03.069 Welcome to Drumbeats, the must -listen -to podcast 00:00:03.069 --> 00:00:05.730 which explains why Indigenous partnerships are 00:00:05.730 --> 00:00:08.689 the key to securing successful outcomes in natural 00:00:08.689 --> 00:00:11.070 resource and infrastructure investment in Canada. 00:00:11.830 --> 00:00:14.630 I'm Mark McNack and my co -host Robert Brandt 00:00:14.630 --> 00:00:16.929 and I will discuss the highlights from today's 00:00:16.929 --> 00:00:20.210 2025 Canadian Indigenous Investment Summit. We 00:00:20.210 --> 00:00:22.510 will discuss powerful sessions covering topics 00:00:22.510 --> 00:00:25.350 such as Indigenous economic sovereignty, capital 00:00:25.350 --> 00:00:27.850 access for Indigenous projects, and infrastructure 00:00:27.850 --> 00:00:32.250 development. Well, Mark, what a day it's been. 00:00:32.369 --> 00:00:36.490 The second annual Canadian Indigenous Summit 00:00:36.490 --> 00:00:40.549 is in the books. And from my perspective, it 00:00:40.549 --> 00:00:43.689 couldn't have gone better. I don't know about 00:00:43.689 --> 00:00:46.570 you and what your highlight from the day was. 00:00:46.729 --> 00:00:49.130 It was a great day, Rob. And of course, you being 00:00:49.130 --> 00:00:51.630 our Indigenous, my Indigenous partner on this, 00:00:51.770 --> 00:00:54.729 it's really important to hear what you think. 00:00:54.789 --> 00:00:57.670 But I thought it was a great day. Really exciting. 00:00:58.189 --> 00:01:01.090 I think it built on what we did very quickly 00:01:01.090 --> 00:01:07.409 for our first summit. And we had 40 % more delegates 00:01:07.409 --> 00:01:11.849 here this time, which was great, from different 00:01:11.849 --> 00:01:16.870 businesses, from the city in the UK, from well 00:01:16.870 --> 00:01:20.790 -known industrials to some of the banks and other 00:01:20.790 --> 00:01:23.510 financial services firms in the UK. So I thought 00:01:23.510 --> 00:01:26.680 it was a great day. And I think everybody was 00:01:26.680 --> 00:01:30.840 really, really enthusiastic. And I thought it 00:01:30.840 --> 00:01:33.219 was very special, too, because I think also in 00:01:33.219 --> 00:01:35.799 terms of the timing of this with what's gone 00:01:35.799 --> 00:01:39.019 on with our southern neighbor back in Canada, 00:01:39.519 --> 00:01:44.060 it's really changed the world. And I think for 00:01:44.060 --> 00:01:47.659 me, one of the highlights of it, hearing the 00:01:47.659 --> 00:01:50.780 Indigenous people speak and tell their stories. 00:01:51.659 --> 00:01:55.640 These are the, once again. The people are going 00:01:55.640 --> 00:01:59.400 to really contribute to the success of Canada. 00:01:59.640 --> 00:02:03.640 And I think the definition of who a Canadian 00:02:03.640 --> 00:02:07.819 is and what a Canadian is is actually going to 00:02:07.819 --> 00:02:11.879 be very much rooted in the Indigenous people 00:02:11.879 --> 00:02:15.840 because they are essential to the story of Canada. 00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:18.060 And for a long time, they haven't been perceived 00:02:18.060 --> 00:02:20.539 as that. Things are changing quickly in Canada, 00:02:20.639 --> 00:02:26.280 and we've seen the progression. of our own summit 00:02:26.280 --> 00:02:30.020 and the idea you and I had just two years ago 00:02:30.020 --> 00:02:33.460 to bring the message of what's happening in the 00:02:33.460 --> 00:02:39.060 Canadian Indigenous economy to London. And from 00:02:39.060 --> 00:02:44.639 that idea two years ago, and we had our supporters 00:02:44.639 --> 00:02:48.560 last year, and this year there's even more momentum. 00:02:48.659 --> 00:02:51.759 We had more people, as you said, we had lots 00:02:51.759 --> 00:02:56.120 of... uh, money from London in the room. Yes. 00:02:56.240 --> 00:02:59.379 And, uh, and we had a really, an A -list team 00:02:59.379 --> 00:03:02.780 of indigenous chiefs and leaders, business leaders, 00:03:02.900 --> 00:03:06.360 all with their own perspectives because we literally 00:03:06.360 --> 00:03:10.840 had coast to coast to coast, um, covered different 00:03:10.840 --> 00:03:14.520 perspectives, but a common voice, uh, and, uh, 00:03:14.740 --> 00:03:21.310 and really progressive thinking. Um, business 00:03:21.310 --> 00:03:24.830 leaders who want to do things, who want to develop, 00:03:24.969 --> 00:03:26.849 want to progress, who want to do it in the right 00:03:26.849 --> 00:03:29.770 way, though. And so I thought there were a lot 00:03:29.770 --> 00:03:32.650 of great messages that came out loud and clear 00:03:32.650 --> 00:03:34.990 from that day. Yes, I think, as you said, we 00:03:34.990 --> 00:03:37.969 covered the three oceans, right? The Pacific, 00:03:38.270 --> 00:03:42.189 the Arctic, and the Atlantic, and all the land 00:03:42.189 --> 00:03:45.949 in between. And I think if you're sitting in 00:03:45.949 --> 00:03:49.330 the audience listening to what went on today, 00:03:51.829 --> 00:03:53.930 You're just sitting there listening to some great 00:03:53.930 --> 00:03:58.870 business leaders and great community leaders. 00:04:00.550 --> 00:04:03.930 When I hear the discussions, two things. First 00:04:03.930 --> 00:04:05.409 of all, those are the people you want to be doing 00:04:05.409 --> 00:04:08.530 business with. They're hungry. They're competitive. 00:04:09.330 --> 00:04:11.849 They know how to succeed. And that comes back 00:04:11.849 --> 00:04:15.169 to partly all the challenges they faced. You 00:04:15.169 --> 00:04:16.750 know, everybody thinks about the Ukrainians at 00:04:16.750 --> 00:04:19.600 the moment. And everybody's supporting and saying, 00:04:19.699 --> 00:04:22.139 look at them fight for their country. And in 00:04:22.139 --> 00:04:24.519 all honesty, it's different, but it's similar. 00:04:24.639 --> 00:04:26.420 Because when I look at the Indigenous peoples 00:04:26.420 --> 00:04:29.560 of Canada, look at how they've been fighting 00:04:29.560 --> 00:04:34.620 to regain their voice, to regain their land, 00:04:34.699 --> 00:04:38.480 sea, and water. But they're also seeing the contribution 00:04:38.480 --> 00:04:41.220 of how do we make Canada a better place for all. 00:04:42.019 --> 00:04:46.100 So that was really, really, really powerful. 00:04:46.680 --> 00:04:50.199 for that message to come through. And then for 00:04:50.199 --> 00:04:54.939 the chiefs we had around the table and former 00:04:54.939 --> 00:04:59.480 chiefs and just that leadership, they're providing 00:04:59.480 --> 00:05:02.600 their communities what anybody wants. When I 00:05:02.600 --> 00:05:05.519 hear them talking, it's like, I want my leader 00:05:05.519 --> 00:05:10.019 where I live to be thinking about me and my community 00:05:10.019 --> 00:05:15.459 in that manner. And because they have this deep 00:05:15.970 --> 00:05:18.250 spiritual connection that many of us have lost 00:05:18.250 --> 00:05:23.069 with the environment around them. Those are the 00:05:23.069 --> 00:05:24.829 places you want to be because they're going to 00:05:24.829 --> 00:05:26.529 be looking after the water. They're going to 00:05:26.529 --> 00:05:29.670 be looking after the land and the air. And I 00:05:29.670 --> 00:05:31.410 think one of the other things I was reflecting 00:05:31.410 --> 00:05:34.589 on yesterday, you might remember this because 00:05:34.589 --> 00:05:36.209 we came about the same time. I mean, everybody 00:05:36.209 --> 00:05:39.310 today has a digital map. And I remember the A 00:05:39.310 --> 00:05:42.579 to Z. here in the uk used to carry around your 00:05:42.579 --> 00:05:44.699 map so you could figure around and postcodes 00:05:44.699 --> 00:05:46.980 really work in this country right i don't think 00:05:46.980 --> 00:05:48.560 they work the same way in canada because somebody 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:53.180 gives you oh where am i sw1 xx you know why you 00:05:53.180 --> 00:05:55.139 know exactly where you are in canada i never 00:05:55.139 --> 00:05:58.319 figured out that it got it to the general area 00:05:58.319 --> 00:06:02.300 but here you live by the postal codes but when 00:06:02.300 --> 00:06:06.040 you had the a to z i thought when we moved from 00:06:06.040 --> 00:06:08.829 the a to z that you carried in your hand, digital 00:06:08.829 --> 00:06:11.709 maps, you were lost. So then you go back to the 00:06:11.709 --> 00:06:17.449 first maps of Canada. And then you go back to 00:06:17.449 --> 00:06:20.230 some of the stories we heard earlier today. You 00:06:20.230 --> 00:06:22.569 know, there were no maps. The maps were told 00:06:22.569 --> 00:06:27.050 and were lived as some of them were telling us 00:06:27.050 --> 00:06:28.870 that we went on this journey that our ancestors 00:06:28.870 --> 00:06:32.370 do, have always followed that. How much knowledge 00:06:32.370 --> 00:06:38.509 has been lost? over time the indigenous people 00:06:38.509 --> 00:06:42.970 retain that so when you're looking at building 00:06:42.970 --> 00:06:45.649 a new mine or doing a development you've got 00:06:45.649 --> 00:06:47.649 your topographical map and your engineers have 00:06:47.649 --> 00:06:49.329 looked in oh here's where we're going drill and 00:06:49.329 --> 00:06:52.670 here's what we're going to do you miss so much 00:06:52.670 --> 00:06:58.129 of what is really on that land and how it works 00:06:58.129 --> 00:07:03.920 and how the the vegetation and animals cross 00:07:03.920 --> 00:07:07.540 and use that. And there's that richness that 00:07:07.540 --> 00:07:10.199 that's what being a human is all about, right? 00:07:10.300 --> 00:07:15.360 We are so alienated from what's really there. 00:07:15.560 --> 00:07:18.100 It's absolutely amazing. And that came through. 00:07:18.240 --> 00:07:20.819 And that's part of the richness why I think anybody 00:07:20.819 --> 00:07:22.839 speaking with the indigenous people, they know 00:07:22.839 --> 00:07:25.480 what they're talking about. Absolutely. And I 00:07:25.480 --> 00:07:28.579 think for the investors who are here from London 00:07:28.579 --> 00:07:32.370 thinking about... In some cases, for the first 00:07:32.370 --> 00:07:35.149 time, hearing about what's happening in Canada 00:07:35.149 --> 00:07:39.689 directly from Indigenous people. And some of 00:07:39.689 --> 00:07:42.550 them would have seen court cases, media coverage 00:07:42.550 --> 00:07:44.829 of protests and those sorts of things and got 00:07:44.829 --> 00:07:48.370 the impression before today that Indigenous people 00:07:48.370 --> 00:07:51.069 are against all development. But I think the 00:07:51.069 --> 00:07:55.339 messages were pretty clear. Generally speaking, 00:07:55.639 --> 00:07:58.360 Indigenous people in Canada are supportive of 00:07:58.360 --> 00:08:01.639 all kinds of development when it's done in the 00:08:01.639 --> 00:08:03.680 right way, when they're involved in a meaningful 00:08:03.680 --> 00:08:06.519 way, and when they're consulted and respected. 00:08:08.920 --> 00:08:13.439 Secondly, I think investors were surprised at 00:08:13.439 --> 00:08:16.040 the number of really exciting... opportunities 00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:19.259 there are right now at this moment in time in 00:08:19.259 --> 00:08:22.579 Canada within the Indigenous economy. It's not 00:08:22.579 --> 00:08:27.579 the same Canada of 10 years ago even. Investors 00:08:27.579 --> 00:08:30.220 who may have been disappointed at not getting 00:08:30.220 --> 00:08:34.840 some things done in the past, I think were surprised 00:08:34.840 --> 00:08:38.679 to learn that one, the law has changed in Canada. 00:08:39.159 --> 00:08:41.779 The courts have been very supportive of Indigenous 00:08:41.779 --> 00:08:45.440 rights. Business people have come to understand 00:08:45.440 --> 00:08:48.639 that involving the local Indigenous communities 00:08:48.639 --> 00:08:53.519 in their projects, in their businesses, is good 00:08:53.519 --> 00:08:55.879 business. And that's the way you're going to 00:08:55.879 --> 00:08:58.679 get things done in Canada from now on. We're 00:08:58.679 --> 00:09:01.580 not going back to the days when you could literally 00:09:01.580 --> 00:09:04.740 build a mine in an Indigenous territory, on a 00:09:04.740 --> 00:09:07.019 reserve even, and not consult the Indigenous 00:09:07.019 --> 00:09:11.700 people. And that happened time after time. But 00:09:11.700 --> 00:09:14.190 those days are gone. Way gone. I think that's 00:09:14.190 --> 00:09:17.169 now with the environment that we're in, with 00:09:17.169 --> 00:09:20.370 what's going on again south of the border, that 00:09:20.370 --> 00:09:23.289 you have to take another look at Canada because 00:09:23.289 --> 00:09:26.470 probably if you're in the UK, investor or corporate, 00:09:26.909 --> 00:09:29.429 and maybe you have a subsidiary over there at 00:09:29.429 --> 00:09:31.970 the moment as some of the delegates had. They 00:09:31.970 --> 00:09:34.149 were here from the head office seeing what's 00:09:34.149 --> 00:09:37.029 going on in one of their key markets. I think 00:09:37.029 --> 00:09:39.389 many of them and some of them said they were 00:09:39.389 --> 00:09:44.000 surprised. They really didn't know how far this 00:09:44.000 --> 00:09:47.179 has gone. So it's a completely new, it's a new 00:09:47.179 --> 00:09:49.220 opportunity to have to look at the Canadian market 00:09:49.220 --> 00:09:51.539 in a different way because the returns are actually 00:09:51.539 --> 00:09:54.240 greater now, as you said, because in the past 00:09:54.240 --> 00:09:56.799 where things were not done, taking into account 00:09:56.799 --> 00:10:00.100 the Indigenous people, things didn't happen as 00:10:00.100 --> 00:10:02.559 quickly because somebody was just saying, listen 00:10:02.559 --> 00:10:05.600 to our voice. Now that there's that process, 00:10:05.720 --> 00:10:09.039 it's in the constitution, free power and informed 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:12.000 consent, that's the way things are done. Things 00:10:12.000 --> 00:10:15.320 will actually get done in a much quicker manner. 00:10:15.419 --> 00:10:18.159 Some of the deals that were done with non -Indigenous 00:10:18.159 --> 00:10:19.940 companies, the non -Indigenous companies were 00:10:19.940 --> 00:10:21.860 saying, we could not have made this happen so 00:10:21.860 --> 00:10:25.340 quickly, but because you as our Indigenous partner 00:10:25.340 --> 00:10:28.519 know how to achieve things. And that's not about 00:10:28.519 --> 00:10:31.539 working with around the bureaucracy. It's understand 00:10:31.539 --> 00:10:33.620 what the regulations are trying to achieve. So 00:10:33.620 --> 00:10:37.019 to make sure the submissions are on target and 00:10:37.019 --> 00:10:40.039 deliver what's required makes that whole process. 00:10:40.789 --> 00:10:43.190 process easier and i'm sure some people will 00:10:43.190 --> 00:10:46.169 be surprised to to learn as they were done around 00:10:46.169 --> 00:10:48.909 the world but there's the some of the indigenous 00:10:48.909 --> 00:10:53.250 chiefs they were doing deals on zoom from start 00:10:53.250 --> 00:10:56.669 to completion right with no physical interaction 00:10:56.669 --> 00:11:01.570 on some very large transactions you know that 00:11:01.570 --> 00:11:04.450 qualifies large anywhere in the world and they 00:11:04.450 --> 00:11:07.940 were done so yeah i think it was mark But lastly, 00:11:08.059 --> 00:11:10.220 you said this morning in one of the sessions 00:11:10.220 --> 00:11:12.980 that there's no clearer form of consent than 00:11:12.980 --> 00:11:16.399 to involve and take an equity stake in a project. 00:11:16.679 --> 00:11:20.639 And so you're seeing that movement in Canada 00:11:20.639 --> 00:11:23.659 where it's not enough to offer a royalty payment, 00:11:23.700 --> 00:11:28.200 say, to the indigenous nation. It's not enough 00:11:28.200 --> 00:11:32.899 to promise jobs. We want an equity stake and 00:11:32.899 --> 00:11:36.070 a seat at the board table. And if you involve 00:11:36.070 --> 00:11:38.970 Indigenous people in that way, then, as Mark 00:11:38.970 --> 00:11:42.490 said, what clearer form of consent could you 00:11:42.490 --> 00:11:45.710 get? Correct. And so if we move from the chiefs 00:11:45.710 --> 00:11:47.629 and think about the organizations we had, like 00:11:47.629 --> 00:11:53.330 FNPC and FNFA and the others, you know, Ernie 00:11:53.330 --> 00:11:55.090 Daniels, for example, he's on the board of the 00:11:55.090 --> 00:11:57.750 Bank of Canada. Yeah, and these are all part 00:11:57.750 --> 00:12:01.409 of, again, a relatively new breed of Indigenous 00:12:01.409 --> 00:12:06.830 institution. that is helping and built to facilitate 00:12:06.830 --> 00:12:09.190 and foster the growth in the Indigenous economy. 00:12:09.570 --> 00:12:14.009 And we had the top people, top executives from 00:12:14.009 --> 00:12:16.269 every one of those organizations here speaking 00:12:16.269 --> 00:12:20.269 articulately and passionately about how they've 00:12:20.269 --> 00:12:22.350 helped in the last, and again, it's relatively 00:12:22.350 --> 00:12:27.419 new phenomena in the last 10 years. and what 00:12:27.419 --> 00:12:29.860 they plan to do the next 10 years. And they've 00:12:29.860 --> 00:12:33.360 got big, big plans. Yes. You mentioned FNMPC, 00:12:33.440 --> 00:12:38.220 the First Nations Major Projects Coalition. They 00:12:38.220 --> 00:12:41.340 started with their conference only 10 years ago. 00:12:41.379 --> 00:12:43.000 I think that was when they were established, 00:12:43.240 --> 00:12:45.840 and they had 80, Mark. But lastly, the CEO who 00:12:45.840 --> 00:12:50.379 was here said they had 80 delegates in a small 00:12:50.379 --> 00:12:54.990 motel. booked room for their first conference. 00:12:55.210 --> 00:12:57.529 And in a couple of weeks, they'll have their 00:12:57.529 --> 00:12:59.669 conference again, their annual conference in 00:12:59.669 --> 00:13:02.690 Toronto, and they'll have 2 ,000 delegates. That's 00:13:02.690 --> 00:13:05.970 great. And with our delegation came from the 00:13:05.970 --> 00:13:08.909 Yukon. That was very interesting for everybody 00:13:08.909 --> 00:13:12.070 too. And you're off to the Arctic in the near 00:13:12.070 --> 00:13:14.289 future, aren't you? Yeah, it's the Arctic Indigenous 00:13:14.289 --> 00:13:19.340 Investment Conference in early May. And so I'll 00:13:19.340 --> 00:13:21.679 be a keynote speaker and again talking about 00:13:21.679 --> 00:13:26.320 international themes. It's that time when Canadians 00:13:26.320 --> 00:13:30.860 are thinking about beyond the U .S. as a source 00:13:30.860 --> 00:13:35.039 of capital and investment and partnership. Yes, 00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:37.500 and as one of the speakers said, before the Europeans 00:13:37.500 --> 00:13:40.740 arrived, the Indigenous were trading with other 00:13:40.740 --> 00:13:44.039 Indigenous nations. What happened is that stopped. 00:13:45.159 --> 00:13:47.700 And they were prevented from doing so as their 00:13:47.700 --> 00:13:51.019 communities and nations were divided up or restricted 00:13:51.019 --> 00:13:52.840 in terms of what they're doing. So they're going 00:13:52.840 --> 00:13:54.840 back to what they've always done. They've always 00:13:54.840 --> 00:13:58.000 been successful traders. And now they have full 00:13:58.000 --> 00:14:01.919 participation in the country and economy today. 00:14:02.679 --> 00:14:06.559 And coming back to some of the frameworks they 00:14:06.559 --> 00:14:10.879 have, First Nations Financial Authority and the 00:14:10.879 --> 00:14:12.779 others, there's the frameworks and then there's 00:14:12.779 --> 00:14:16.779 the... lending capacity and the financial instruments 00:14:16.779 --> 00:14:19.159 that now the Indigenous peoples have to tap into, 00:14:19.279 --> 00:14:21.779 apart from the revenue streams that they already 00:14:21.779 --> 00:14:27.120 receive. But I think a good example is in terms 00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:30.779 of Chief Ted, Chief Ted Williams. Yeah, Chief 00:14:30.779 --> 00:14:35.299 Ted Williams, the chief of the Ramah Nation in 00:14:35.299 --> 00:14:39.360 Ontario. And they started with a casino. which 00:14:39.360 --> 00:14:42.379 is really well known in Ontario. And they have 00:14:42.379 --> 00:14:45.399 now leveraged that to be a shareholder of Cedar 00:14:45.399 --> 00:14:50.559 Leaf Capital, which is amazing, along with the 00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:54.440 Desnehi Group and the third group. Enshikai Hind 00:14:54.440 --> 00:14:59.559 from BC, the Squamish Vancouver. Right, the Squamish 00:14:59.559 --> 00:15:02.860 Nation. Yeah. three different groups across the 00:15:02.860 --> 00:15:04.840 country, so the Indigenous people are also working 00:15:04.840 --> 00:15:07.940 together. Working with our platinum sponsor, 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:12.259 Scotiabank. Yes, yes. And full credit to Scotiabank, 00:15:12.259 --> 00:15:15.419 who helped set up Cedar Leaf with the three First 00:15:15.419 --> 00:15:20.159 Nations. And Scotiabank said earlier today their 00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:24.299 goal is to sell out, but they have helped set 00:15:24.299 --> 00:15:27.620 it up. They are help training people. They're 00:15:27.620 --> 00:15:30.539 helping build capacity so that Cedar Leaf, who 00:15:30.539 --> 00:15:34.039 are a brand new securities dealer, like a brokerage 00:15:34.039 --> 00:15:38.480 house here in London, and Scotiabank have helped 00:15:38.480 --> 00:15:41.519 set it up. They may eventually become a competitor 00:15:41.519 --> 00:15:43.899 of Scotiabank because Scotiabank is already in 00:15:43.899 --> 00:15:48.440 that business. But Scotiabank have said it's 00:15:48.440 --> 00:15:50.419 the right thing to do to build capacity with 00:15:50.419 --> 00:15:55.769 the Indigenous economy. And so full credit to 00:15:55.769 --> 00:15:58.269 them. They've also said that they don't believe 00:15:58.269 --> 00:16:01.029 it's a zero -sum game, that just because cedar 00:16:01.029 --> 00:16:02.950 leaf is in the market, coming into the market, 00:16:03.009 --> 00:16:07.629 that that means there will be less revenue for 00:16:07.629 --> 00:16:10.230 securities dealers to share and that'll lead 00:16:10.230 --> 00:16:12.490 into Scotia's income. They think it'll grow the 00:16:12.490 --> 00:16:14.909 pie because the indigenous economy is growing. 00:16:15.289 --> 00:16:17.649 Correct. And it is growing. And I think you're 00:16:17.649 --> 00:16:19.789 right. More and more of them want to access the 00:16:19.789 --> 00:16:22.559 capital markets. And Cedar Leaf Capital will 00:16:22.559 --> 00:16:26.059 be part of that solution. But talking with Clint 00:16:26.059 --> 00:16:28.779 Davis earlier today and the CEO, he was watching 00:16:28.779 --> 00:16:30.639 his phone because I think there were some deals 00:16:30.639 --> 00:16:35.000 coming through. And I'm sure by the time our 00:16:35.000 --> 00:16:37.039 podcast goes live next week, they'll be announced. 00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:41.679 But when we first spoke to him prior to the summit, 00:16:41.860 --> 00:16:44.960 they had one or two that they were hoping to 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:48.759 sign. And then since we spoke to him up to today, 00:16:48.980 --> 00:16:54.049 the deals is bust. just been closing for them, 00:16:54.110 --> 00:16:57.769 which shows they're getting traction. Yeah. And 00:16:57.769 --> 00:17:01.230 they had some of their younger talent with them. 00:17:01.370 --> 00:17:04.789 That's right. At the summit earlier today and 00:17:04.789 --> 00:17:07.750 highlighting what they're doing to invest in 00:17:07.750 --> 00:17:11.890 Indigenous talent and help grow the pool of people 00:17:11.890 --> 00:17:14.369 that they can access and that other people will 00:17:14.369 --> 00:17:16.630 be interested in accessing as well. You know, 00:17:16.630 --> 00:17:20.299 Mark Palasi is now on the... The board of CIBC, 00:17:20.519 --> 00:17:23.279 which just shows the opportunities in front of 00:17:23.279 --> 00:17:26.420 the indigenous people, which again, as they also 00:17:26.420 --> 00:17:28.579 get into non -indigenous people and McCarthy 00:17:28.579 --> 00:17:32.279 Tetrell, you're now co -head of your indigenous 00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:35.640 - The projects and transactions group. Projects 00:17:35.640 --> 00:17:37.539 and transactions group. You have a strong team. 00:17:37.900 --> 00:17:41.559 And that just shows the non -indigenous companies, 00:17:41.839 --> 00:17:43.839 the banks, the law firms, and the enterprises 00:17:43.839 --> 00:17:49.700 realize we need a team so we can engage. as equals 00:17:49.700 --> 00:17:52.599 and understand to make things happen quicker 00:17:52.599 --> 00:17:57.019 and those just it's an emerging market economy 00:17:57.019 --> 00:18:01.420 within canada that has a very stable reputation 00:18:01.420 --> 00:18:04.480 without a doubt so many so many exciting stories 00:18:04.480 --> 00:18:07.640 and we had the honorable greg rickford ontario's 00:18:07.640 --> 00:18:10.890 minister of indigenous affairs and First Nations 00:18:10.890 --> 00:18:15.450 Economic Reconciliation with us, spoke later 00:18:15.450 --> 00:18:18.690 in the day. I'm used to seeing ministers or government 00:18:18.690 --> 00:18:22.349 officials who are involved in conferences like 00:18:22.349 --> 00:18:26.539 ours come in. do their speech and then leave 00:18:26.539 --> 00:18:29.779 immediately with their team. But give the minister 00:18:29.779 --> 00:18:32.880 his dues. He stayed with us the entire day. Yes, 00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:36.420 which is great. And he sat taking notes and he 00:18:36.420 --> 00:18:38.500 spoke at the end of the day about his reflections 00:18:38.500 --> 00:18:43.059 on the day. Yes. But I think it was due to the 00:18:43.059 --> 00:18:45.720 high quality of the content throughout the day 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:47.799 and the type of people who were on the other 00:18:47.799 --> 00:18:51.430 panels that... Yeah, he doesn't get a chance 00:18:51.430 --> 00:18:53.930 to hear these individuals in that same manner. 00:18:54.049 --> 00:18:56.589 And he's also, I think now in his title, it's 00:18:56.589 --> 00:18:59.730 also Ring of Fire responsibility, right? He's 00:18:59.730 --> 00:19:02.230 got a very long title. That's right. And what 00:19:02.230 --> 00:19:04.490 did he have to say about that, Rob? You were 00:19:04.490 --> 00:19:06.990 in that session with him, I think. Yeah, he actually, 00:19:07.089 --> 00:19:09.289 in that session, he was supposed to talk more 00:19:09.289 --> 00:19:13.079 about the Ring of Fire. He ended up... tossing 00:19:13.079 --> 00:19:14.880 out his notes and speaking off the cuff about 00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:17.460 his reflections on other panels that he had seen 00:19:17.460 --> 00:19:20.759 and the things that he had learned over the day. 00:19:21.140 --> 00:19:25.559 On the Ring of Fire, he is committed to trying 00:19:25.559 --> 00:19:29.700 to speed up the approvals process. We've got 00:19:29.700 --> 00:19:37.299 an area of richness, critical minerals in northern 00:19:37.299 --> 00:19:41.059 Ontario, but very inaccessible. at the moment. 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:44.680 So very little infrastructure, talking very remote 00:19:44.680 --> 00:19:51.180 areas of the province. And so his government 00:19:51.180 --> 00:19:53.740 is committed to trying to build some infrastructure 00:19:53.740 --> 00:19:56.640 because you need that infrastructure around at 00:19:56.640 --> 00:20:00.740 first before you can then really exploit the 00:20:00.740 --> 00:20:06.140 riches that are there. And just building that 00:20:06.140 --> 00:20:09.759 infrastructure, you need to involve the local 00:20:10.140 --> 00:20:13.420 Indigenous communities who are affected by anything 00:20:13.420 --> 00:20:17.240 that's going to go up there. Right. So they are 00:20:17.240 --> 00:20:20.299 committed to trying to develop that. One of the 00:20:20.299 --> 00:20:24.039 sessions that I was in was the team from Saskatchewan. 00:20:24.119 --> 00:20:26.180 We had strong turnout from Saskatchewan, the 00:20:26.180 --> 00:20:28.380 heart of the country, right? So it makes sense. 00:20:28.539 --> 00:20:32.859 And the CEO of Denison Mines. David Cates. David 00:20:32.859 --> 00:20:37.250 Cates was... And talking about his journey, which 00:20:37.250 --> 00:20:39.609 has been very similar to mine, because he grew 00:20:39.609 --> 00:20:41.269 up with a different understanding of the history 00:20:41.269 --> 00:20:46.049 of Canada. And he's, I think, now been CEO for 00:20:46.049 --> 00:20:49.609 10 years. And Denison Mines has one of the richest 00:20:49.609 --> 00:20:52.369 uranium deposits. If I recall correctly, it's 00:20:52.369 --> 00:20:58.890 about 40%. And they've worked very closely with 00:20:58.890 --> 00:21:05.220 the nations to access that in a way that... does 00:21:05.220 --> 00:21:08.160 not destroy the environment, that they can maintain 00:21:08.160 --> 00:21:13.259 their hunting and fishing and care and connection 00:21:13.259 --> 00:21:18.299 with the land. And I think for some of the UK 00:21:18.299 --> 00:21:21.480 delegates, they had a deep appreciation that 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:27.420 this is not, this is very deep and emotive for 00:21:27.420 --> 00:21:29.619 them in their understanding themselves as a people 00:21:29.619 --> 00:21:33.339 because they still continue these traditions. 00:21:33.869 --> 00:21:35.789 As we have great traditions in the city of London, 00:21:36.549 --> 00:21:38.250 right? There's some things that money is not 00:21:38.250 --> 00:21:41.029 replaceable. And the theme of the discussions, 00:21:41.349 --> 00:21:45.690 and I think when David heard it and said it at 00:21:45.690 --> 00:21:51.609 the time, it's how to move us from no, was the 00:21:51.609 --> 00:21:54.650 conversation with the indigenous nation. How 00:21:54.650 --> 00:21:57.009 to move us from no, because they don't need to 00:21:57.009 --> 00:21:59.539 develop it. There's already uranium mines on 00:21:59.539 --> 00:22:01.700 their territory. They didn't have to have another 00:22:01.700 --> 00:22:05.220 one. So they weren't going to do it unless the 00:22:05.220 --> 00:22:07.759 community saw some benefit. And it's not just 00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:11.460 financial benefit. It's what will this do for 00:22:11.460 --> 00:22:14.140 our community? Because we've got uranium mines. 00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:16.980 Why do we need another one? And Dennis and mine 00:22:16.980 --> 00:22:20.819 spent a lot of time working with them and through 00:22:20.819 --> 00:22:23.200 a whole process. And one of the key learnings 00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:25.869 was... They were then told, okay, we'll work 00:22:25.869 --> 00:22:28.049 with you, let's put together, and then we'll 00:22:28.049 --> 00:22:33.529 put it to a vote in our community. And most CEOs 00:22:33.529 --> 00:22:36.529 of companies are not used to working on a transaction 00:22:36.529 --> 00:22:40.309 that is then going to a vote with a community. 00:22:40.769 --> 00:22:44.730 And Denison did not, they left it with their 00:22:44.730 --> 00:22:48.670 partner, Indigenous partner, to talk to the community 00:22:48.670 --> 00:22:50.710 and then put it forward to them. There was no... 00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:53.579 Let's push this through. Here's what we can do. 00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:57.279 And the chiefs in that group change every year. 00:22:57.880 --> 00:23:03.880 So it's not like on the East Coast where some 00:23:03.880 --> 00:23:05.559 of the chiefs have been there for a very long 00:23:05.559 --> 00:23:08.799 time and they know who they're working with. 00:23:08.839 --> 00:23:12.859 In this group, they change every year. So I think 00:23:12.859 --> 00:23:15.339 they've spoken with five different chiefs. But 00:23:15.339 --> 00:23:17.279 when the indigenous peoples commit to something. 00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:21.980 It's the community or the nation that's committing 00:23:21.980 --> 00:23:24.380 to it. So it's not going to change down the road. 00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:28.440 because it's passed on. Yeah, that sure sharpens 00:23:28.440 --> 00:23:30.200 the mind when you're negotiating something and 00:23:30.200 --> 00:23:32.279 you know it's going to be subject to that kind 00:23:32.279 --> 00:23:34.819 of approval. It's a bit like having to go to 00:23:34.819 --> 00:23:37.299 shareholders for approval of a transaction, but 00:23:37.299 --> 00:23:40.140 shareholders have a really, really meaningful 00:23:40.140 --> 00:23:43.319 interest in what you're doing. It's not a delegated 00:23:43.319 --> 00:23:45.299 responsibility to management. It comes back to 00:23:45.299 --> 00:23:47.220 the shareholders. Some people might think that 00:23:47.220 --> 00:23:49.299 slows it down, but actually it doesn't. What 00:23:49.299 --> 00:23:52.839 you get is great commitment. to what's going 00:23:52.839 --> 00:23:55.019 on because when you're having a mine it's going 00:23:55.019 --> 00:23:58.700 to last for decades so there's so many great 00:23:58.700 --> 00:24:00.900 stories from coast to coast we said we had chief 00:24:00.900 --> 00:24:04.119 terry paul from the east coast does not travel 00:24:04.119 --> 00:24:07.220 very often uh anymore he's a bit of a legend 00:24:07.220 --> 00:24:10.539 um and he's been chief of the member two nation 00:24:10.539 --> 00:24:15.299 for 40 years now uh and done so much uh in the 00:24:15.299 --> 00:24:18.079 way of business development to the one of the 00:24:18.349 --> 00:24:21.089 highlights of the day for me i think was something 00:24:21.089 --> 00:24:23.390 we only decided that the last minute which was 00:24:23.390 --> 00:24:27.509 to ask the chiefs uh who were with us to come 00:24:27.509 --> 00:24:31.609 up and just yes we we asked them for two minutes 00:24:31.609 --> 00:24:37.130 of their reflections on the day and uh it and 00:24:37.130 --> 00:24:41.430 in chief terry's case he talked about how what 00:24:41.430 --> 00:24:43.869 a humbling experience it was and how grateful 00:24:43.869 --> 00:24:46.960 he was to be at a place like the London Stock 00:24:46.960 --> 00:24:51.460 Exchange, and that he had learned a lot over 00:24:51.460 --> 00:24:54.920 the day, and that he had loved the whole experience. 00:24:55.180 --> 00:24:57.700 That meant a lot for somebody like that to be 00:24:57.700 --> 00:25:01.339 impacted. And then we had Chief Tammy Cook -Searson 00:25:01.339 --> 00:25:06.559 talking about her residential school experience, 00:25:06.700 --> 00:25:10.299 and her family's residential school experience, 00:25:10.400 --> 00:25:14.380 and for her again. It was emotional for her to 00:25:14.380 --> 00:25:17.119 think of her background and her family's background 00:25:17.119 --> 00:25:20.039 and histories. And then to be able to come to 00:25:20.039 --> 00:25:23.319 the heart of one of the world's great financial 00:25:23.319 --> 00:25:27.299 centers in the London Stock Exchange was very 00:25:27.299 --> 00:25:32.519 moving. Absolutely. And all of the chiefs we've 00:25:32.519 --> 00:25:37.599 had were like that. And they emphasized, we're 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:40.339 the chiefs. Decisions are made at that level. 00:25:42.519 --> 00:25:44.460 structures around them, supporting them with 00:25:44.460 --> 00:25:47.779 the framework. And Harold Callow is also here 00:25:47.779 --> 00:25:50.099 and provide great insight into what's happened 00:25:50.099 --> 00:25:53.160 over time and where things are going. And none 00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:55.859 of them really are looking forward to leaving 00:25:55.859 --> 00:25:59.140 because the Indigenous economy is just taking 00:25:59.140 --> 00:26:01.599 off. And it's so exciting for them all to see 00:26:01.599 --> 00:26:04.779 we're growing, new opportunities are coming. 00:26:04.859 --> 00:26:07.079 How do we get the best for the Indigenous people 00:26:07.079 --> 00:26:10.480 that will also benefit Canada? as a whole so 00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:12.819 we had chief crystal smith talking about cedar 00:26:12.819 --> 00:26:17.559 lng right absolutely the lowest carbon footprint 00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:22.019 in the world for an lng plant and that is really 00:26:22.019 --> 00:26:24.539 something they've achieved that through use of 00:26:24.539 --> 00:26:28.579 renewables to drive the conversion of the gas 00:26:28.579 --> 00:26:31.680 to liquid natural gas so it can be shipped over 00:26:31.680 --> 00:26:34.960 to asia and i'm sure some people are thinking 00:26:34.960 --> 00:26:36.720 okay how are we going to do that on the east 00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:41.420 coast but They talked about the hydrogen opportunity 00:26:41.420 --> 00:26:45.359 on the East Coast. And there was a question from 00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:47.619 the audience, from the UK audience, about what 00:26:47.619 --> 00:26:49.579 sort of funding requirements are you looking 00:26:49.579 --> 00:26:52.740 at? And he said hundreds of millions. And I think 00:26:52.740 --> 00:26:56.160 the audience was a bit taken aback at that moment 00:26:56.160 --> 00:27:01.480 because they knew that he wasn't joking. There's 00:27:01.480 --> 00:27:06.660 a huge requirement for capital, and they've succeeded. 00:27:07.559 --> 00:27:10.480 in the past. So they will be able to access those 00:27:10.480 --> 00:27:12.720 funds. So people are going to have to compete 00:27:12.720 --> 00:27:16.519 to be part of those deals now. So I think that's 00:27:16.519 --> 00:27:19.819 really exciting across the board. And Tabitha 00:27:19.819 --> 00:27:23.039 Pohl joining us, and she is another one of our 00:27:23.039 --> 00:27:26.900 speakers who's in such high demand. And as I 00:27:26.900 --> 00:27:28.680 said this morning, she's probably done three 00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:31.559 other conferences this week in Canada. She was 00:27:31.559 --> 00:27:35.750 in Halifax yesterday. Yeah, I was with the Prime 00:27:35.750 --> 00:27:38.829 Minister earlier this week, but found the time, 00:27:38.950 --> 00:27:43.890 took a red eye and joined us this morning. And 00:27:43.890 --> 00:27:49.269 really grateful for her perspectives. She's the 00:27:49.269 --> 00:27:52.029 CEO of the Canadian Council of Indigenous Business. 00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:56.460 And a group, as I said, is near and dear to my 00:27:56.460 --> 00:27:59.599 heart because I had my first office summer job 00:27:59.599 --> 00:28:02.599 40 years ago working with that organization. 00:28:03.240 --> 00:28:06.660 And when it was first established and to see 00:28:06.660 --> 00:28:09.819 where they are today with 2 ,500 members, McCarthy 00:28:09.819 --> 00:28:12.319 Tater was a member. You've got many non -Indigenous 00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:17.579 members of the group. And it's all about partnerships 00:28:17.579 --> 00:28:22.559 and helping grow the Indigenous economy in Canada. 00:28:22.880 --> 00:28:24.440 Yes, because they are the voice of Indigenous 00:28:24.440 --> 00:28:28.200 business in Canada. So it was great to have Tabitha. 00:28:28.380 --> 00:28:30.740 I think in terms of what we're talking about, 00:28:30.779 --> 00:28:32.599 and we spoke about Denison Mines and working 00:28:32.599 --> 00:28:36.119 with English River First Nation, I think that 00:28:36.119 --> 00:28:40.539 was really powerful, and the work that the Saskatchewan 00:28:40.539 --> 00:28:43.500 Investment... Oh, the Saskatchewan Indigenous 00:28:43.500 --> 00:28:47.400 Investment Finance Corporation. Okay, SIFSI. 00:28:47.710 --> 00:28:50.930 I remember it now. I remember it as the acronym. 00:28:51.049 --> 00:28:54.809 But, you know, there's a new body, again, bringing 00:28:54.809 --> 00:28:58.329 lending capacity to the Indigenous peoples. And 00:28:58.329 --> 00:29:03.750 the Desnetti Group, Sean. We'll talk to him on 00:29:03.750 --> 00:29:05.930 an upcoming podcast, won't we? Yes, which will 00:29:05.930 --> 00:29:09.130 be great. And they've built a huge business. 00:29:09.650 --> 00:29:11.829 And what they're doing is when the opportunities 00:29:11.829 --> 00:29:15.640 are coming. You know, if, for example, we'll 00:29:15.640 --> 00:29:17.079 be talking to him and he mentioned, you know, 00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:20.099 the uranium mine with the prices dropped, you 00:29:20.099 --> 00:29:23.460 know, during COVID. And so they redeployed their 00:29:23.460 --> 00:29:26.960 human resources to think, how do we keep people 00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:30.900 employed gainfully to learn new skills? So when 00:29:30.900 --> 00:29:33.880 the market opens up again, we can take on some 00:29:33.880 --> 00:29:36.420 of the infrastructure projects that happen in 00:29:36.420 --> 00:29:38.599 Saskatchewan. So it'll be really exciting to 00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:43.400 speak to Sean Whelan. We've had a long day, Rob. 00:29:44.859 --> 00:29:50.720 I need a drink, Mark. So do I. So do I. So let's 00:29:50.720 --> 00:29:55.259 go have that. But it's been a fantastic end of 00:29:55.259 --> 00:29:58.200 the second annual summit. I'm really excited 00:29:58.200 --> 00:30:00.279 about what we're achieving for the Indigenous 00:30:00.279 --> 00:30:04.559 Peoples of Canada in the city, in the UK, and 00:30:04.559 --> 00:30:07.240 Europe. The audience grows from year to year. 00:30:07.839 --> 00:30:12.940 People are saying, when is it next year? and 00:30:12.940 --> 00:30:15.460 want to book. That's from speakers and delegates, 00:30:15.539 --> 00:30:17.539 and our sponsors have been absolutely great. 00:30:17.640 --> 00:30:19.980 Those have been with us. Some people have already 00:30:19.980 --> 00:30:22.400 booked flights for next year, haven't they? Yes, 00:30:22.440 --> 00:30:25.740 yes. And that's down to the efforts of you and 00:30:25.740 --> 00:30:29.319 Siwa Ren, who have just done a fantastic job 00:30:29.319 --> 00:30:32.880 producing an event that's first class. So thank 00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:35.039 you for that. Well, thank you, because this is 00:30:35.039 --> 00:30:36.900 like the Indigenous people. We all have roles 00:30:36.900 --> 00:30:39.720 and work together for the success of the community. 00:30:40.220 --> 00:30:42.859 And I think we are building a community with 00:30:42.859 --> 00:30:45.720 the summit. And, you know, we have different, 00:30:45.759 --> 00:30:47.960 all our sponsors have been there with us, you 00:30:47.960 --> 00:30:51.259 know, including Anglo American as well, you know, 00:30:51.259 --> 00:30:53.079 giving us support, helping to bring the right 00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:56.240 people into the audience. So it remains a compelling 00:30:56.240 --> 00:30:59.720 summit and very relevant for everyone. CIBC have 00:30:59.720 --> 00:31:02.460 been with us from day one. They were a big supporter 00:31:02.460 --> 00:31:06.599 again this year. Yes. National Bank. Yeah, National 00:31:06.599 --> 00:31:09.990 Bank, Steve Berna. Absolutely. Who had transitioned 00:31:09.990 --> 00:31:13.750 from FNFA and brought National Bank in and led 00:31:13.750 --> 00:31:16.130 a great conversation and gave due respect to 00:31:16.130 --> 00:31:20.109 FNFA and everything he learned with working with 00:31:20.109 --> 00:31:24.670 Ernie and with Ernie Daniels. So it's been a 00:31:24.670 --> 00:31:27.430 great day. But yes, let's go have that drink. 00:31:27.569 --> 00:31:29.349 Are you going to have champagne, beer or wine? 00:31:30.329 --> 00:31:34.390 I think I need a pint. Yeah, exactly. A pint 00:31:34.390 --> 00:31:37.190 of Guinness would be great. So let's go get that. 00:31:37.349 --> 00:31:40.950 Thank you very much, everyone. And we'll speak 00:31:40.950 --> 00:31:46.369 to everyone soon. No one. Thank you. Thank you 00:31:46.369 --> 00:31:49.410 for tuning in. We hope you found our discussion 00:31:49.410 --> 00:31:52.450 of today's 2025 Canadian Indigenous Investment 00:31:52.450 --> 00:31:55.250 Summit that was held at the London Stock Exchange 00:31:55.250 --> 00:31:59.289 as engaging as we did. Be sure to share, subscribe 00:31:59.289 --> 00:32:01.809 and leave a review on your favorite podcast channel. 00:32:02.009 --> 00:32:04.490 Thanks for listening to Drumbeats. Until next 00:32:04.490 --> 00:32:06.000 time. Thank you.