Welcome to Drumbeats. I'm Mark McNacca, and I'm
here with my co -host, Robert Brandt, for Drumbeats,
and we're both the co -chairs of the Canadian
Indigenous Investment Annual Summit. We've both
made our home in the UK, and we've lived here
for a number of years. Rob, welcome to our podcast.
Great to be doing this with you. Thanks, Mark.
And for everybody out there, I'm Rob Brandt,
the managing partner of McCarthy Tatro's London
office. McCarthy Teacher was a Canadian law firm,
full service across Canada and offices also here
in London and in New York as well. I'm also happen
to be a Mohawk, a member of the Bay Mohawks of
the Bay of Quinte, which is the territory between
Toronto and Montreal. Great. And, you know, I
believe all podcasts have their compelling backstory.
And drum beats is no different. So I remember
last year, June 23, I was over at Canada House
and there were two Indigenous leaders up on stage.
One of them said he was off to Buckingham Palace
and for most people probably thought he was on
a tour, but I'm sure he was to meet the Queen
or the King at that time. And the other was yourself,
Robin. I remember seeing that and I saw your
name up there and I thought, no way. So I got
an introduction. to you and said, you know, my
name is Mark McNack. And are you a descendant
of the famous Chief Joseph Brant? And you, of
course, said, yes, you are. And I said, wow,
my direct descendant fought with Chief Joseph
Brant in the American Revolutionary War as one
of Brant's loyalists. And so for me, that was
very special to think after all this time, and
here we are in London, of all places, we never
met each other. And we were now connected. So
I remember you looking at me, you know, saying
very clearly you were. So why don't you tell
your response to that and we can, you know, work
through that story. Yeah, I couldn't believe
we hadn't met before, Mark, because we've both
been in London for many decades. But it was an
event focused around Indigenous investment that
brought us together. And probably a sign of the
times because there's so many things happening
in Canada in this space right now. So it was
very fortuitous that the two of us should meet
at this moment in time, both with our contacts
in the City of London and our personal backgrounds
and interests in this space. I loved it. Yes.
And, you know, one of the interesting things
when we met, Rob, and you were telling me about
the challenges for Indigenous people. in Canada
and you know many have not heard what's happened
you know the traumatic experience that has passed
through generations for the Indigenous people
in Canada and the challenges and you're part
of that new generation of Indigenous leaders
who you know are of course defending the rights
of Indigenous people in Canada you're also working
with other Canadians for their own success and
trying to create the country that I think our
ancestors always dreamed that Canada would be.
Equal opportunity for all, very respectful of
our Indigenous people who actually are the guardians
of the land that some of us now call home. So,
you know, that was for me, I thought my ancestor
would have been very ashamed to think of. what
had happened to the relationship between the
Indigenous people and new Canadians, as they
were probably referred to then. So this podcast
comes out of that. And, you know, it's for anyone
who's considering investing in Canada. And Canada
is one of the top FDI destinations in the world.
It's certainly one of the most attractive. And
especially when we look at all the changes with
the supply chain that's happened, on -shoring,
friend -shoring. You know, Canada is bordered
by three oceans, the Pacific, the Atlantic and
the Arctic. And if people are looking at putting
their money, Canada always ranks around one of
the top spots. And for UK business, you know,
it accounts for 41 billion of the outward stock
of FDI resides in Canada. That's in pounds. And
that's 2 % of the total UK outward FDI stock
in the last year for records, 2023 over 22. 2022,
that was an increase of nearly 50%, which is
absolutely huge. And from that point of view,
it's important. And the UK's Department for Business
and Trade represents Canada's the 15th largest
trading partner. So it demonstrates there's a
huge opportunity and there's over 13 ,000 VAT
registered businesses in the UK that have investments
in Canada. so it becomes you know one of the
key places if you're looking as they are in the
city of london where to put the money canada
is always up there is one of the top spots and
of course the city of london is one of the great
financial centers of the world along with new
york and tokyo london's always benefit from trade
from pre -roman times to roman times to through
the british empire and post -world war ii of
course london remains this great cosmopolitan
hub where people come with ideas, innovations,
and to make money because the city is still where
deal -making takes place. It's where people connect
across countries and cultures to make things
happen. So with that ranking of the money that's
here looking for places to park it, that's where
Canada comes up. If you're going to invest in
Canada today, you have to understand about the
Indigenous investment opportunities and how it
affects any investment in Canada. Rob, how about
you talk a bit more about that for our listeners?
Yeah, it's a really interesting, exciting time
in Canada. Canada is so well positioned to provide
the world, really the world, with all the resources
and power that it needs. Abundant resources,
tradition. and history of knowing how to get
those resources out of the ground and to market,
stable democracy, and a jurisdiction that respects
the law, the rule of law. And when it comes to
Indigenous investment opportunities, it is said
that all roads to net zero and energy transition
lead through Indigenous territories. And so with
changes in Canadian law, adopting the UN Declaration
on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, that will
give Indigenous nations a veto over projects
in their territories. And our courts in Canada
have been citing... on the rights of Indigenous
peoples and advancing those rights gradually
through case law. And so it all adds up to a
really interesting time in Canada and some great
opportunities, some really unique projects where
Indigenous peoples are taking a real, say, an
equity stake, a meaningful equity stake. They
want a seat at the board table. It's not enough
to promise jobs or a royalty. They want a real
say in how these projects get developed and managed
and operated. So I think one of the interesting
things for, certainly, you know, everybody's
heard of, most people have heard of London as
a financial center. What I don't think they appreciate
is when we talk about the Indigenous peoples
of Canada, of course, there's, you know, the
First Nations. there's the Inuit, and there's
also the Métis. And those three groups of Indigenous
people cover close to 700 different tribes. So,
Rob, you're part of the Mohawks, right? But there's
all kinds of different tribes, but they all are
benefiting from this opportunity in front of
them in terms of... economic reconciliation,
which is part of an overall reconciliation with
Canadian society as a whole. But when groups
are dealing with, you know, from 700, it sounds
like it's a very complex effort to do that. But
this is just going to become a fact of life for
Canada and people investing in Canada in the
future, isn't it? Absolutely. Those communities,
Indigenous communities, are spread across the
country, east, west, north. I hope with this
podcast we'll dispel some myths that Indigenous
communities are against development. For the
most part, when they are approached in a respectful
way at an early stage and given a meaningful
say in these projects, they are on side. And
I hope through this podcast we'll get to interview
some of the people who are making these deals
happen. and really get into understanding their
rationale, their thinking, and some of the details
of how they're structuring these transactions,
because it is unique amongst the rest of the
world. We're getting calls from Australia, countries
in Africa, South America, Indigenous communities
who are noticing some of the things happening
in Canada, wondering how. what they could they
can learn from some of these deals and structures
yes and I've also been speaking to some individuals
who have assets in Africa in different places
and are dealing with Canadian firms and they're
saying you know this indigenous issue is not
just as you said in Canada it's elsewhere but
Canadian firms are now particularly sensitive
to it I don't think you know Canada's got a very
how do we say, consolidated banking sector. And,
you know, all six banks recognize the importance
of any investments in Canada, following the letter
of law and the spirit of the law. So, you know,
it's not something if you're investing in Canada,
you can avoid. More likely than not, if you're
investing in physical assets. you are going to
be coming across an Indigenous group that, as
you say, has a seat at the table, right? And
they want to participate in that growth. So it's
not, oh, just give us a few jobs or something.
They want to participate in that growth. And
there's more and more people of our generation
and the younger generations who are leading that
charge, who've grown up in the financial centers
or in the large enterprises. who now are saying
gee i want to bring my skills to help my my tribe
or my community or my nation to achieve all that
they can be so that is really exciting and it's
a it's a dynamic and changing environment that
there's a lot on the go for and i hope that by
talking to some of the people who are involved
in these deals that our listeners will get an
understanding of how to approach these transactions,
how to successfully pull them off. And I hope
we can highlight all of the new opportunities
that are available in Canada. And the deals seem
to be coming out every week, if not more frequently.
There was a couple in the past few weeks, maybe
you'd just like to talk on, just mentioned for
some of our listeners to appreciate the scale
of the opportunities and the type of deals that
are happening at this stage. Indigenous communities
take a more active involvement in the sectors
that affect their communities. And so a couple
of weeks ago, it was announced that Bell Canada
was selling its Northern Antarctic telecoms business
to a syndicate of First Nations and Inuit communities.
That's a billion -dollar transaction. And one
of just many sticking on the West Coast. It was
also just announced that the First Nations communities
on the West Coast were going to take a majority
ownership in an LNG export facility. In Saskatchewan,
it was announced the major wind power project
with Enbridge again. Syndicate of First Nations
are going to partner with Enbridge. In Ontario,
you've got Hydro One announcing that they are
not going to build any more transition lines
without the majority investment from local Indigenous
communities that are affected by those lines.
And on the East Coast, you've had First Nations
acquiring a majority stake in Clearwater Foods,
one of the largest seafood producers in the world.
So lots of great examples, and I hope we can
get some of the people who've been involved in
those and many other transactions on our podcast
to talk about the ins and outs. Yes, that's what
we're aspiring to do, and I'm sure we'll have
many of them. on the next few weeks and you just
mentioned about transmission lines and i think
everybody around the world knows that you know
the transmission lines that were built you know
50 100 years ago they're not really set up for
all the different new sources of energy and the
actual demand from computing power so we had
the deputy premier of labrador newfoundland over
and you know all the groups are up there all
the All the name, all the tech firms are up there
trying to talk, gee, we'd love to put something
up here because it's nice and cold so we don't
have to worry about heating. And, you know, Newfoundland
and Labrador, you've got, you know, the Atlantic
Ocean, you've got the Arctic Ocean nearby to
help cool things down. But, you know, all those
deals are going to happen. And over time, it's
not a question of some of these indigenous groups
needing money. Over time, these are going to
become very wealthy nations. in their own right
and going to be looking, well, where will we
be investing? And who will we be investing with?
So those are some of the issues that we want
to be talking about. And we'll be talking about
over the next few weeks. Somebody's going to
ask us, why is this called drumbeats? And it's
called drumbeats, because this is a podcast about
the investment opportunities with Indigenous
peoples. And of course, we're going to talk about
the broader reconciliation issues as well. But
we We chose drum beats for a particular reason.
Rob, would you like to give some insight into
that for some of our non -Indigenous listeners?
Sure, very briefly. The drum is an almost universal
symbol in Indigenous communities across Canada.
And in many communities, the drum represents
almost the heartbeat of the culture. And most
often, those drums are made of... animal hides
or trees. And it is believed that the spirits
of those animals and trees live within those
drums. And as I say, provide the heartbeat of
the culture used not just for musical instruments,
but an important part of prayer ceremonies. And
so I think a very apt name for our podcast. Great.
I think it's a great name. And you talk about
the heartbeat. So this is the heartbeat for news
and information about Indigenous investing in
Canada. And this is where we'll get the stories
out first. We'll talk to all the right people.
We'll amplify the investment opportunities. We'll
amplify the successful deals, the deals that
we can all learn from in the next weeks and months,
during the course of the next year and onwards.
Drumbeat's podcast, as we've mentioned, we've
been talking about, it's for people on both sides
of the pond, which many of us refer to as the
Atlantic Ocean and beyond. North America is a
huge destination market. Canada has access to
the American market as part of the North American
Free Trade Agreement that's been renamed over
the past few years, but it's still a gateway
into the... The U .S. market and Canada ranks
high as a reliable supplier of commodities for
countries around the world, whether it's for
European countries, for American countries or
countries in the Asia Pacific. So that terminal
you talked about, the LNG deal for the West Coast,
East Coast, we know post the invasion of Ukraine,
the Germans. government were coming looking to
do deals with canada so canada's a as as a reliable
supplier rule of law etc etc it's a great place
to invest and if you're going to succeed with
your investments you have to understand how to
work with the indigenous nations in canada canadian
government is very supportive as are all the
provincial governments and this is going to be
the place to find out first about what's happening
and what will happen in the future. Rob, is there
anything you'd like to talk about for our listeners
before we wrap up? Just to say, Mark, that I'm
really excited about this. It's a space that
has personal and professional interest for both
you and I. It's a really historic time in Canada.
And this will be a platform for Indigenous business
and political leaders to talk about the successes,
the failures, highlight some upcoming opportunities,
educate our listeners on how to approach these
types of transactions. And as I said before,
hopefully dispel the myth that Indigenous communities
in Canada are against all development. Super.
So thank you very much, Rob. We look forward
to those of you, please subscribe to our podcast.
We also have a newsletter on our website, canadianindigenousinvestmentsummit
.com. And we look forward to speaking with everyone
next week. Rob, look forward to catching up in
the city shortly. As I do, Mark. Cheers.