Ricardo Belmar: Welcome to our new Retail Razor show, Blade to Greatness,
our new standalone Retail Razor show, where we hear from a retail industry
leader who shares their sharp insights and cuts of wisdom on how to excel in
this dynamic and competitive field.
In this series, we learn about the essential must have skills and qualities
that every retail executive needs to lead their teams and their business to success.
Casey Golden: Whether we're talking about HQ or stores, we'll uncover valuable
tips and advice that every retail leader can apply to their own retail career
path, raising your Blade to Greatness.
Ricardo Belmar: I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.
Casey Golden: And I'm your co host Casey Golden.
Today we'll speak with Ron Thurston, co-founder of Ossy bestselling,
author of Retail Pride, podcast host, speaker, advisor, and board member.
Ron leverages his extensive experience leading retail operations for America's
most prominent brands, to bring attention to the issues facing frontline
workers and retail leaders today.
After releasing his book Retail Pride, and the Retail in America Tour and
Podcast, Ron has co-founded Ossy to disrupt how the retail industry hires,
engages and connects retail workers with retail brands and technology partners.
Ricardo Belmar: Today he's here to talk to us about an incredibly important
aspect of change and culture that every retail leader needs to foster.
Implementing a career development culture as the first step to change
your mindset and make change.
Let's listen to what Ron has to share with us.
Casey Golden: Welcome, Ron.
Ron Thurston: Great.
Thank you so much Casey.
I love a conversation about how to retain and have career
development within retail because.
It is by far the number one thing I hear and also shows up in surveys around
why I stay in retail or why I don't stay in retail, is about mentorship
and career development conversations.
There's no exception to that.
It's not compensation.
Um, certainly a lot of conversation about flexibility and work in part-time, but
the majority of anyone who's worked in brick and mortar retail, who has chosen
to stay in this role because they love it.
because we're having important career trajectory conversations, which may
or may not be within the organization.
They may be ones that take you to a different company, but someone has
really guided you in that journey.
And I wanted to just spend a couple of moments because I was recently doing
a webinar with Sucharita Kodali from Forrester and they just released some
statistics that I think are fascinating.
So if you miss webinar I wanted to share.
Part of turnover is that retail does have higher turnover than other industries.
so in April of 2022, a little more than a year ago, the average turnover in
all trades is three percent per month.
So it's a quit rates are the total number of quits during the entire
month as a percentage of employees.
So on average, in every industry in April, 2022, 3% of the
workforce turned over in a month.
In retail, it was 4.4% of the total workforce and here we, and today
as we sit, both have gone down.
So April in 2023, it's 2.5% in all industries.
And in retail it's gone down a full percentage point to 3.5 Which is
great news because there was a lot of conversation about not being able to hire
and therefore have high turnover rates.
So good news, it's going down, but there are still real pain points.
One around inconsistent and unpredictable scheduling.
around benefits, like limited employer sponsored benefits, little or no
career advancement and understaffing.
And the reason, you know, the understaffing becomes such an important
point in retention because you said in April, 2022, 63% of workers say that
staff shortages are contributing to their burnout, and led to lost work days and
to depression and anxiety and sick days.
All of this is because of staff shortages.
So as.
Quit rates have gone down.
There's still a staff shortage problem that there's certainly
very high cost to what that means.
Uh, this kind of idea of how of culture and brand and how you communicate that
in conjunction with career development is a critical component to retention.
So it's the good news again, just to summarize, quit rates going down.
Yet we still have significant amount of open and we have a significant amount
of people who are making decisions about staying in retail based on
career conversations that are may or may not be happening today, and that's
part of, that's part of Ossy is also let's assess where you are in your
career and let's suggest some other opportunities for career advancement
based on your current skill set
Ricardo Belmar: So Ron, one of the things that has always struck me in
this topic is that in, in the past we've always heard a lot of retailers
using phrases like, you know, our store teams, they're the frontline that
represents our brand to the consumer.
And when you hear that, you would always think, well then they must really highly
value those employees and our goal.
And because of that, if they really are the face of the brand to that customer,
then surely you're doing everything you can to develop their skills, their not
just sales skills, but other operational skills to make them better, serve those
customers and offer them a career path so that they stay with you in that brand.
But I think historically what we all know is that.
Even though we heard retailers say that it didn't really hold true, right?
It wasn't really, you didn't see that at the end.
And when you talk to those store teams, most store teams didn't feel like that.
What was coming?
I'd like to say that it's gotten better.
And I think just hearing you talk about it, it's pretty clear, what some of
the things that need to happen that's a mindset that does need to change and
to become more of a practical reality.
I mean, do, do you believe that's definitely where we're trending.
And do you think that, , maybe what we saw during the pandemic and what happened
with stores, that's been that final push that has gotten retailers at the
executive level to move in this direction?
Ron Thurston: I, you know, I wish Ricardo, I could say consistently, yes.
I think there there are great demonstrations where that has been
true, and there are things that I.
we have never learned some of the same bad habits exist, and so I,
I do um, have, you opportunity to speak to a lot of candidates that
are either currently in job search or thinking about making a change.
And so much of it is related to exactly what you say.
And that the frontline teams and every retail brand have so many of
the answers that you wanna learn about your customer, about the product,
about why they choose to shop with you, why they convert, why they don't.
People who engage with a live customer and that, and converts or doesn't,
understands exactly why, because you've had really thorough conversations and
it's data you will never be able to capture on a website, you never know why.
You know, 90 plus percent of the people on your site never convert.
You don't know why.
Sometimes you'll get a popup survey.
I'm sure the response rates on that are pretty low.
But in a store, where I think some of this falls down is if, someone
would just ask me, I would tell you exactly what needs to change.
and, And creating forums where I shouldn't say what needs to change,
what, where we could improve or where product can be better, or um,
inventory levels or store design.
All of this can actually be captured by people who are standing in
front of their customer every day.
And so creating forum to do that, whether it's store visits, it's coffee talks,
town halls, whatever works for you, then I think I retention and that conversation
are so inextricably linked, linked.
Just last weekend I was in Sawgrass Malls here in Florida.
Went into a store.
into someone who used to work for me and the first thing that he said was, I
remember when you visited the store and you sat down with us and like had coffee
in the morning before we opened, and you asked us all what we loved about working
here, what we didn't, what we could do better as a company, how we could improve.
Let's talk about product.
Tell me what your customer's saying today.
For me, it was an hour of time spent and, you know, $10 worth of Starbucks and this
person years later remembers that meeting.
Ricardo Belmar: Hmm.
Hmm
Hmm,
wow!
Ron Thurston: You can't underestimate the power of what that means to field teams.
To just sit and listen, and act and respond.
It's the greatest thing you can do to retain your teams.
Casey Golden: Yeah, I think you really set an example with your
Retail in America tour for.
everyone to get back into the stores even when it was the least convenient.
You really showed a way of doing this because if I worked on a retail floor and
I was looking for a job change, you'd be my number one dream phone call, right?
I would already be following you on LinkedIn.
You would already be like, the ideal, I've got to get a meeting with Ron.
I'm looking for a career change.
So I think that you've become this great ambassador and I think that
that bridge, it's hard for other people to say how to grow, like how
to develop these types of cultures.
And I just feel like it's so much of your d n a that you offer, that
you're just like a natural resource.
So I'm so grateful that you, join all these conversations and these
podcasts to really open that up to say there is a resource.
There is a way because I think on both sides, they both wanna come to you.
Ron Thurston: Thank you, Casey.
That's really kind.
I also, I would say it's, easier to do than you think it is.
And that engagement is nothing more than honest and thoughtful
and empathetic conversation.
And We all know how to do that.
And we all, but just doing it is the first step.
And you know how whatever that needs to look like.
And I just think sometimes we're afraid to take that first step
because you're also afraid of maybe what you're going to hear sometimes.
It's like you coach the team before the C E O arrives and he
said, well, make sure you don't talk about this and don't do that.
And I would come from the place of, tell me the worst thing.
What do you hate about working here?
Like, tell me.
And in a very like thoughtful and honest way, because they
want you to tell me the truth.
So sometimes they think we're afraid to ask the questions
because we're afraid of what we're gonna hear, and we can't improve.
If we don't know, we can't change retention.
Core of this conversation is retaining great people.
You can't retain them if you don't provide the opportunity to tell
the truth and then change it.
And That for me is the best thing you could do is to say, you know what?
I'm so glad we had that meeting.
I didn't actually know that.
And therefore, this is what we're going to do differently at our company today.
Maybe award that person, you know, next company town hall, say, well, great.
The best idea for the year came from Casey when I visited the store.
Like there, there are ways to create culture that is about
feedback and about recognition that is so powerful yet so easy
Ricardo Belmar: Yeah, I think that is a great way to summarize what those
specific key traits are that every retail leader should take away from this
conversation, and how to make that culture better and how to really work towards
retaining those important store teams that, that you have today and making
it more enticing for the new ones with the new folks that you have coming in.
So, Ron, thank you so much for sharing these thoughts and these
and words of wisdom with us today.
Ron Thurston: Thank you Ricardo and Casey.
It's a pleasure.
Casey Golden: if you've enjoyed our show, please consider giving
us a five star rating and review on Apple podcasts and Goodpods.
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I'm your cohost, Casey Golden.
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I'm your host, Ricardo Belmar.
Casey Golden: Thanks for joining us.
Ricardo Belmar: Until next time, keep cutting through
the clutter and stay sharp.
This is the Retail Razor Blade to Greatness.