You're listening to the Footglish podcast. Love football, learn English.
What on earth is happening with West Ham and are they going to sack their manager?
What do West Ham fans appreciate about Tomáš Souček?
Is it all over at West Ham for Vladimir Tsofal?
And what does it mean if things go tits up?
What does it mean to be a football fan?
Hello everyone! Are you ready for your weekly dose of football and English?
Well, make yourself comfortable, sit back, strap in and enjoy this episode.
My name is Denek Lukas, I'm a professional English teacher and my guest today is a passionate football fan and I believe an ex-footballer as well.
Welcome to the podcast, Clive.
Thank you very much. Thank you.
Yeah, ex-amateur footballer. Let's put that in there.
Well, we have that in common.
I'm exactly the same. But it doesn't prevent us from talking about football and the Premier League.
Not at all. Not at all.
Okay. Well, you're brave because as a West Ham fan, I think you're going through some sort of crisis these days.
Looking at the table, you are in the 14th place, which is not what I think you guys, you fans of West Ham, wanted at the beginning of the season.
Indeed not. No. We were looking to improve on the season we had last season, which wasn't exactly great.
The season before, league-wise, wasn't great. Yes, we won the Conference League, but our league performances have been adequate and nothing better.
And this season, I think we've been below adequate. A lot. Yeah. A good distance below.
And yet, somehow, I think people expect West Ham to do way better.
It looks like you are punching below your weight in the last few years. Why is that? Why is that? What's going on?
Well, for the last couple of seasons, I think there's been quite a lot of disharmony in the squad.
Because I think it's been well documented that David Moyes, as a manager, was very regimented in the side that he wanted to put out every week.
He likes to work with a small squad and therefore a big squad is of no use to him.
Whereas with the manager we have now, it's quite the opposite. With Ulan Lopetegui, it's quite the opposite.
He likes to use a squad of players and he's been showing that quite often to the detriment of our results.
But I think there is a plan of action and I'm kind of sticking with it, if you like. I'm not calling for his head yet.
Ah, okay. Well, then you're one of those that trust the process.
I'm not quite that deep. I believe that there is a process and I'd like to see it.
Because I have high expectations of Mr Lopetegui because at Sevilla he maintained Europa League wins for three seasons.
He also coached the Spanish under-21 side very successfully.
He also wasn't in charge of the Spanish national team for a short time.
For a short time, but he agreed to go to Real Madrid, I believe it was.
There were some kind of wild circumstances.
I believe he agreed in principle to go to Real Madrid when his tenure at the national squad had finished.
Yeah, before it finished and maybe he was accused of basically not being exactly following the contract.
Not very professional.
No, that's right. That has been said. He wasn't very professional in that instance.
And also it's been said that he wasn't very professional in the way he left Wolframs and Wanderers.
But I believe that a man that has principles must stand by them.
And if your employer is blatantly lying to you, then you have to take action.
And I believe that that was the case.
That's all the reports that I've seen and heard.
So I'm quite happy to believe that that was the case.
And I think that's the case. He's struggling a lot at West Ham.
There is no doubt about that.
You guys are losing left, right and centre.
Somehow you managed to beat another team that has been underperforming heavily, Manchester United.
So that was a big win, right?
But the latest game we have to unfortunately mention here is your defeat to Nottingham Forest.
On paper, you wouldn't expect West Ham to lose.
But to be honest, if you look at the table and the table doesn't lie, sorry.
A lot of West Ham fans were saying that they would accept a draw against Nottingham Forest.
And that just goes to show you the level that we believe we're at.
Well, Clive, but they are currently in the third place in the table.
So I think this is a realistic reflection of where both teams are at the moment, I'm afraid.
Well, of course, yeah. But I mean, when you look at it from like a historical point of view,
then Nottingham Forest have always had that team that can get them there or thereabouts.
Yeah, that's true. West Ham rarely have had.
That's true. That's true.
I think what confuses everyone is that Nottingham Forest have been out of the Premier League for a long time.
Yes, they have. And they struggled to get back.
But that was poor management, poor ownership.
And obviously, you know, the players weren't of the standard that they could or should have been.
Yeah. But we should remind everyone, Clive, that Nottingham Forest are Champions League winners twice, right?
Whatever it was called before the Champions League, they won it twice.
They did. Two years running. They came up from what is now the championship,
which was the second division back then, into the first division, which is now the Premier League.
And within two years, they were winning the European trophy.
And then the following year, they backed it up with another one and a few domestic titles in between.
Yeah. Well, you know, historically, Nottingham Forest have always been a club to be cautious of.
Well, in this game, it seems like you stood no chance.
Although, obviously, there was sort of a moment in the game that made it easier for Nottingham Forest.
So you had one player sent off. It was Edison Alvarez at the end of the first half.
And it was while you were losing, you were losing 1-0. You were 1-0 down.
And then this happened. I think it was a real sucker punch.
And I don't think anyone believed from that moment that it would go.
I mean, from the moment Alvarez was red carded, we all knew that, you know, chips were down, if you like.
Chips were down, yeah.
Yeah. And that was it, really. I mean, we were fighting an uphill battle the whole second half.
And unfortunately, you know, Nottingham Forest had the momentum.
They've got some very good players and they've got a really good coach right now. Really good coach.
You know?
So, Clive, tell me what exactly is wrong with West Ham these days?
So there might be some injured players, right? That's one thing, but not many, not many.
So what's going on? So you, okay, of course, you've got one really good player, Mohammed Koudous,
who got sent off in the previous game, I believe, or something like that.
And it was for a really bad, really bad incident. And I think he got like three match, three match ban or something.
Yeah.
But that's not the only problematic player in your team right now.
Then you have got Lucas Paqueta, right? What's going on with him?
So he's got, he's got, he's got. Well, in Spanish, Lucas Paqueta, he has these charges levied against him.
The betting scandal.
Yes, that's correct. Yeah, the betting scandal.
Whether they are true or not is irrelevant at this point.
Because at this point, the effect of the investigation and everything that goes along with that is affecting the way he approaches his job.
You think so, yeah?
I believe so. I absolutely, 100% believe that.
And, you know, nobody can do their job effectively if they're only 30% invested in it.
Yeah. You know, he's obviously concerned about his playing career. He's obviously concerned about any money that he may have to return.
Basically, mentally he's not in the right place.
No, not at all.
And a classic example of that is a few years back when West Ham were playing against Manchester United, Mark Noble, our captain at the time, was on the bench and he was playing out the end of his career.
It was towards the end of his career. And we got a penalty in the last moments of the game.
I remember that, yeah.
Mark Noble was hastily brought on by David Moyes without any warm up, without any pep talks, get out there and score the penalty.
It was in the extra time, the final minute of the game.
At the same time, he was a really experienced player who had been known for being a great penalty taker.
His penalty record is incredible. I mean, for West Ham, he has the best penalty record out there.
But he stepped up and missed it. That was because of preparation, etc.
But it was also the fact that he was completely unprepared mentally.
His mind was on congratulating the players after the game on the draw.
And then he gets told, get out there and win us the game with the penalty.
A lot of pressure. Even on a really seasoned and experienced player, that's a lot of pressure.
And therefore, I believe that Lucas Piquet, we know he's an outstanding player at times.
He's been quoted as being one of the most technically gifted players at West Ham.
He's a Brazilian international as well.
He is indeed. And he's a regular starter for the national squad.
But we know that his performances of late have been amateur.
But it shouldn't be just him. It's a combination of factors.
Everything is going wrong at West Ham currently.
Lopetegui, I don't know, but I've been watching your games.
As you know, I have a soft spot for West Ham because of the Czech players.
So it seems like he's experimenting a bit too much.
It seems like he doesn't exactly know.
Even the lineup, you could have accused David Mois for always sticking to the same starting eleven.
He might have been overloading the players.
He may have not given enough chance to the players that deserve the chance.
Okay, fair enough. But as you said at the beginning, Lopetegui seems to be the polar opposite of that.
And for some reason, he doesn't play ever the same team.
And it looks more like he's searching for that perfect starting eleven.
And it feels like everyone is letting him down. That's how it feels to me.
Yeah, but it could also be looked upon in this way.
He adapts his starting eleven for the team that we're playing and believes that he gets it right.
And then his substitutions are as a result of, ah, that player's not performing, I'll replace him.
Or I need more up front, so I'll bring these two off and bring them two on.
Or whatever the case may be. That could be the case.
However, I don't believe it is. I really don't believe that you're right.
That he doesn't know his best eleven.
And even if he did, he probably wouldn't use them every week.
But Clive, doesn't that lead to players losing their confidence?
Because I don't know, if I'm looking at it from the point of view of Tomas Socek, someone, okay, maybe Jared Bowen will always play.
Okay, we can assume that. We can assume that Mohamed Kudus will always play.
But then there are a lot of players who might play or might not play.
And if you're Tomas Socek or someone like that, if you don't know if you're going to play that game,
what does it do with your confidence? Tomas Socek doesn't seem to be phased.
But okay, maybe someone else, like Summer Wheel.
The classic example would be actually the other guy.
Which one is that?
Well, he's completely out of team.
He only gets in if Wampusaka is injured or suspended or on international duty.
But to be honest, Clive, do you know I've always been defending the Czech players, like even on some channels,
because I didn't like the way they were treated.
But with Wladimir Tsofal, I don't have a leg to stand on because Bezaka has been really good.
So for me, this is a no-brainer that Bezaka plays over Tsofal.
Yes, I would like Tsofal to get a chance.
Maybe we could play him in a different position.
You could shuffle the team around.
That's one thing that annoys us about David Moyes.
He was playing players out of position, like Lucas Piquet around on the left wing, for example.
But doesn't Lopetegu do it even more now?
Because he's been shown the way.
But we've got a perfectly good left winger in Kresencio Somerville,
the lad we picked up from Leeds last season, at the end of the season.
Championship player of the year, no less.
And we got him because he wanted to come to West Ham, apparently.
And he's perfectly good at the job.
He's very forward-thinking and he can get back and defend if he has to.
But he has got Emerson behind him, Emerson Palmeiri, who is a seasoned, established Premier League player.
He used to play for Chelsea.
Every European title football can offer, he has.
Every single one of them.
Including the international.
The only one he lacks is the World Cup.
That's true, because Breslau have been underperforming.
All of them, including players like Wan Busaka.
Wan Busaka has been doing his best and he's probably been one of the better players for West Ham.
I think so. Because he's trying to establish himself in the team and in the club.
I watched most of the games, Clive, and I would say Busaka, Kilman.
These two guys have been the best players.
I think Max Kilman has earned his place.
And I think Jean-Claire Tizibo has also.
He's been on, right?
He's put his name down rather hard because he's been very good.
But have you noticed who we keep turning to though?
We keep turning to Tomas Socek.
Because he is Mr. Reliable.
Because we know that if we need a box-to-box player, pop him on.
You know my opinion on Tomas Socek.
I love this guy. He's a hero for me.
He's a hero for me.
We all do.
There are better players in the club.
Are there though?
It depends how you define a good player.
Allegedly.
Because the problem is these days, right?
People love all the technical skills and the flicks and the flair.
Everybody is obsessed with this.
It's the age of social media.
Everybody wants to see the beauty of everything.
Including the beauty of sports.
But I thought Wes Ham were about hard work, grit, determination, never give up attitude.
And that's why I was so surprised when the Wes Ham fans, and I've spoken about this with the other Wes Ham fans, kind of turned against Tomas Socek.
Someone who embodies these qualities.
I think a lot of fans have come to the conclusion in their minds that Tomas Socek's time at Wes Ham is done.
And therefore they're now finding minor faults and creating larger faults with that, if you understand what I mean.
I am not one of those.
I'm a firm believer that Tomas Socek is Mr. Reliable.
He might as well wear an edge on his blinking chest for all I care.
Because he is like Superman to us.
When we need a goal in the dying moments of a game, we can always rely on Tomas Socek to be there to provide it.
To score it or provide it.
It's the same for the Czech national team.
You kind of know what you're getting from him, right?
And you know he will give his all.
And I was really surprised that Jarob Bowen was given the arm band captaincy and not Tomas Socek.
I believe that Tomas Socek had earned it.
I'll tell you what, there is a group of people in the Czech Republic who claim that Socek, I think Socek is a great captain.
And I like him not only for his footballing qualities, but for the sort of aura. He exudes some sort of leadership aura.
But that's me.
But there are some people in the Czech Republic who think that he's too nice to be a captain.
So maybe for this reason he wasn't selected.
Because he's very nice, right? He's just this gentleman.
He is. He is.
He's also, he may be very nice, but he's also 99 times out of 100.
If a player in the Premier League is wearing a headbandage, it's going to be Tomas Socek.
Because he does tend to put his head where it's not needed at times.
Or where it's in danger.
So for me, he puts himself on the line.
But the counter argument is that these days you want to have some sort of, I don't know a better word than asshole.
You want someone who is going to use some dark arts and who is going to maybe provoke someone and who will fight.
And Tomas Socek, he will not fight. He's a diplomat.
Oh yeah, of course.
Maybe this is the reason.
He is a practical joker also.
He's someone I admire and I would follow a captain like that.
But that's me because I like this sort of attitude.
And when I played football, I didn't like to be shouted at.
I didn't like these captains who just shouted at you and that's how others followed them.
Not me. I'm different.
I prefer this kind of role model to Tomas Socek, but everyone is different.
Mark Noble, one of the greatest captains West Ham have ever had.
You mentioned the phrase dark arts.
Now to someone like Mark Noble, using the dark arts was things like, classic example.
We had Jesse Lingard on loan.
And the first day at the changing room, he sat down, he picked up his phone.
Mark Noble told him, if I see that phone in your hand again during training sessions, it's going down the toilet.
From that moment on...
Socek wouldn't have said that.
No, no. Tomas said to me, club rules do not allow over your phone now.
Exactly.
Mark Noble, a little bit of the dark arts, I'll put it down the toilet or something of that nature.
Exactly.
Also, if there was an argument to be had, Mark Noble was quite willing and capable of participating or even leading that argument and winning it most of the time.
You need that. It's important.
Yeah. But I think, as you said, Tomas Socek is a diplomat.
He's a diplomat, yeah.
And one of the most admired England captains of all time was Alan Shearer.
And he was a diplomat. He wasn't a fighter. He was a big, tough, tough lad, but you wouldn't catch him fighting.
When we say fighter, this is misleading.
Fighter, as in he's not going to punch someone in the face.
He's not going to retaliate when somebody stamps on him.
He's not going to get a red card even because he knows he's smart enough and he knows.
Yeah, yeah. That's how you mean.
He's not arrogant. He's humble enough to know where his limits are and what he can do.
But also, at the same time, he will give his all. He will fight, right?
In a sense of on the pitch, he will put in tackles, as you said, put his head into the area jewels and all that.
Sometimes even the first one in the children's ward at the hospital and the last one to leave.
You know, that is leadership quality.
For me, I would follow that, but I understand why some people say something else.
So I don't have a problem with Bowen. He has been great. No problem.
But I had a problem with Socek being out of the team.
And I'm glad that it seems like West Ham fans have realized now.
I'm watching the channels. They're not talking about Socek the way they talked about him before.
So I think they've realized that he's not the problem because it seemed like he was being the scapegoat.
Yes. Yeah, he was.
And like I said, some fans believe that his time at the club was up and therefore he's still here.
Why is he still here? Well, we must find fault in him because he's not supposed to be here.
That's the mentality of some people.
They always said this thing that it's because of Mois loves him, because of Mois wants him, because of Mois.
This just isn't right. Now we can see that Lopetegui likes him too.
He didn't play this game against Nottingham Forest, but he didn't play only because he was sick.
He was ill. He put the message on Twitter that he was sick.
So that's why you couldn't have him in the team.
Yeah. So I have to ask you, Clive, about the other Czech player, Vladimir Tsofal.
It seems like you are frozen currently. Are you back?
I was. It froze, but my Wi-Fi just blinks on and off. So that's probably why.
So when I spoke to the other West Ham fan on this podcast, on the Footgris podcast,
we sort of speculated over Vladimir Tsofal's future at West Ham.
It seemed that we agreed that Vladimir Tsofal's days are numbered at West Ham, which is a shame, but it looks like it, doesn't it?
Yeah, it does. As you've probably seen on a lot of the other channels,
the call now among the fans is, let's get another right back to back up Wambasaka.
They're kind of dismissing Tsofal now.
I think that's unfair because I still think he's got a role to play.
He's produced some of the greatest crosses to provide for goals and stuff in the last few years.
And like Thomas Socek, he will get stuck in. He will put his head into places.
It might not be best of her.
But what we call them is warriors. They're warriors like Billy Bond of old.
Ron Harris at Chelsea and there's so many of them, even more recently Roy Keane at Man United.
I know that's not recent, but it's more recent than the ones I mentioned.
He's a pundit now, a very famous pundit.
Yeah, so I have to ask you about this upcoming game against Everton because how many times has this happened?
It seems like it's one of those games that if the manager loses it, he could be out of the club, right?
It could be a game that he needs to win.
I think that is kind of the feeling amongst fans and stuff.
But I really don't believe that that's what the club are thinking.
The club have signed him up for two years.
And David Sullivan isn't the sort of person to go and waste money and buy him out of his contract.
There's a phrase for you. He isn't trigger happy.
There you go. He's not trigger happy.
Look, Lopetegui came in with a minimum fee and decent wages.
We didn't have to buy him out of a contract or anything like that.
Same with David Moyes, the same with Pellegrini, the same with David Moyes before that, the same with Slavin Billish before that, the same with Sam Allardyce before that.
The same. Well, need I go on? David Sullivan does not like spending money on the coach or the manager.
He'll pay him a decent wage and he'll give him bonuses, etc.
But he won't buy him out of contracts and he won't sack him when they still got 18 months of a contract left.
So it seems like it's both a curse and a blessing.
In some respects. So we've got him until at least next summer minimum and if not the summer after.
But if we get European football by any way, by miracle, we get European football in these two seasons, he gets another year.
Can I say something like, yeah, okay.
Well, it's interesting that you mentioned this because not a long time ago I watched a video on the West Ham Network channel, which I believe you are also part of.
I'm one of the guests.
You have a show there. You have a show, the old school hammers.
That's correct.
With your mate. So Wednesday evening. So if anyone wants to watch that, you appear on this show called Old School Hammers and it's on the West Ham Network YouTube channel.
And today I watched a video from them and the host said an interesting thing.
He said that West Ham are six points off the relegation zone and seven points off the Champions League places.
So that shows that the league is really, it's quite even this season.
Anything could happen, right?
Yeah. I mean, it also shows how early in the league we are.
Yeah.
Some people are saying, oh my God, we're a quarter of the way through already and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Doom and gloom. Woe is our fate.
No, I look at it like this. Oh, great. We're only a quarter of the way in.
We've still got three quarters of the season to pick this up.
I'm more the glass half full.
Full.
Half empty. There you go.
But, you know, look, don't get me wrong.
I do have a moan about our club and the manager, the coach, sorry, and his tactics, etc.
I do moan. Of course I do.
I have every right to, you know, especially if I'm buying a ticket to go and watch it at the stadium.
No, do you?
This season, yeah. Do you have a season ticket?
To go to West Ham games?
No, no, no. Until they re-employed Gianfranco Zola as the coach, I'm not going to.
Oh, okay. What about David Moyes? Would you take him back now?
No, I wouldn't actually.
And I was kind of indifferent when he left. I was like, oh, okay, yeah, they have decided this time.
Yeah. It was a joke.
I'm just teasing. It's not going to happen.
No, it's not going to happen. But if by any stretch it did happen, I would be highly disappointed with the club.
You know, it really would because it got a little toxic for David Moyes and the club and the supporters.
That's why I don't think they're going to do it.
Yeah, you wouldn't bring toxicity back to the club.
Or the instrument of that toxicity because that's really what it was.
All of that was aimed at David Moyes and his leadership.
Yeah.
All right, Clive, I think we have come to an end of this wonderful podcast.
Thank you very much. It's always great to talk to you because you're so eloquent and well spoken.
And I enjoy that as an English teacher who has a podcast about learning English and football.
This is exactly what we want to do.
I'm actually quite conscious of it. So I do make even more of an effort.
Are you saying that if you knew this wasn't about English, you would sound like a proper cockney from the street?
I'm never a proper cockney because I was never born in London.
I was born in Crawley, which is south of London.
But you've heard me talk casually.
I use phrases that you mentioned before when I've been on your channel.
When I said it goes tits up for us and things like that.
I've tried to be a little more eloquent than that.
What was it again? It goes tits up.
Well, let's hope it doesn't go tits up for you against Everton.
Fingers crossed. All the best to you, Clive.
And this is exactly the kind of phrase that I might explain in the language corner, which will follow this interview.
So thank you very much, Clive. All the best to you.
I hope to catch up with you soon on this podcast or another show. It doesn't matter.
Yeah, great. And thanks for the invitation.
Yeah, no worries.
It's always a pleasure chatting with you.
Keep doing what you're doing. Keep growing the channel as you are.
It's great. And all of your students, this is the man.
This is the man that will teach you. And if he can't teach you, nobody can.
I wouldn't go that far, but...
You know, you know, you know, you know, let's say, let's say I can do the job.
OK, let's put it that way.
You teach practical English.
I do.
You teach English to people that they can use in the street or in a shop or something.
You know what? You know what? I'm actually quite lucky because these days I teach one football manager from the first Czech League.
I teach three football journalists and one ex footballer, a female, which is interesting.
Fantastic.
So I hope to get more people from the football industry because I think I can do a good job because I'm passionate about football.
And we will always have something. And I can teach English through football. I know how to do it.
Yeah. Anyway, enough of this self promotion.
It's been too much. Thank you. Thank you, Clive.
Have a good one, man.
Take care. Bye bye.
Welcome back to the Language Corner. In this part of the show, as always, you're going to learn something.
Hopefully you will. And that's because I'm an English teacher and of course my job is to teach English and you are the learners, right?
I know some of you aren't. That's fine. For whatever reason you're watching, you can keep watching.
But if you are here to learn something, well, now comes the time for you to learn something.
And we're going to have a look at a slightly vulgar phrase.
So if you haven't been 18 yet, huh, you should ask your parents before you hear this because we are going to talk about the phrase to go tits up.
First of all, let's explain what tits are.
Tits are woman's breasts. It's a vulgar way of saying woman's breasts. It's a slang way of referring to, you know, breasts.
And imagine if the tits go up. I think because we have gravity, tits should be going down.
I'm not a doctor, but I think so. So that's a bad thing.
If things go tits up, it basically means things go wrong.
So at the end of the show, I said to Clive, I hope that things don't go tits up in your game against Everton, which means I hope you guys don't lose again.
All right. Tough stuff, tough stuff to deal with as a teacher.
Well, sometimes you have to teach these as well.
And I like challenges like these, but of course we are on a dangerous ground.
Anyway, if you guys enjoy this and if you like what I do and if you want me to grow this channel and to grow this podcast, why don't you become my hero hero subscriber?
That's a way you can really support me.
Check out the link in the description of this episode.
And that's all for today. Thank you very much for listening.
And until next time, bye bye.