WEBVTT 00:00:00.010 --> 00:00:02.750 The Inspired Insights podcast is for informational 00:00:02.750 --> 00:00:05.089 and entertainment purposes only and should not 00:00:05.089 --> 00:00:07.570 be considered health advice. This podcast is 00:00:07.570 --> 00:00:09.630 not intended to replace professional medical 00:00:09.630 --> 00:00:12.529 advice. Please note that this podcast may contain 00:00:12.529 --> 00:00:14.970 discussions on sensitive topics such as mental 00:00:14.970 --> 00:00:17.550 illness, suicide, and substance use. If you are 00:00:17.550 --> 00:00:19.969 experiencing a behavior health crisis or need 00:00:19.969 --> 00:00:23.109 support, please contact the 988 Suicide and Crisis 00:00:23.109 --> 00:00:29.050 Lifeline by calling 988 or visiting www .988lifeline 00:00:29.050 --> 00:00:56.509 .org. Welcome back, Soren. Welcome, welcome. 00:00:56.710 --> 00:00:59.729 We're here. Another episode of the Inspired Insights 00:00:59.729 --> 00:01:02.789 Podcast. I know. This final season, all the feels 00:01:02.789 --> 00:01:05.709 are happening for me. As with every episode we 00:01:05.709 --> 00:01:09.790 get through, I'm just like, things are happening. 00:01:09.849 --> 00:01:13.689 It's real. Yeah. Things are coming to an end 00:01:13.689 --> 00:01:16.310 or a new beginning. Or a new beginning. For both. 00:01:16.450 --> 00:01:18.989 For both of us. Inspired Insight of the Week. 00:01:19.730 --> 00:01:24.310 Oh, my. I know. Right on the spot. Do you want 00:01:24.310 --> 00:01:29.219 me to go first? Go for it. So I've been reflecting 00:01:29.219 --> 00:01:34.980 a lot lately on this idea of legacy. And I've 00:01:34.980 --> 00:01:37.280 been doing some traveling and really doing a 00:01:37.280 --> 00:01:40.640 lot of social work stuff, conferences and guest 00:01:40.640 --> 00:01:44.480 speaking and presentations. And my inspired insight 00:01:44.480 --> 00:01:49.760 is a bit wobbly because I'm forming it in real 00:01:49.760 --> 00:01:53.659 time. But it has to do with this idea of how 00:01:53.659 --> 00:02:01.129 our... our human drive for evolution and our 00:02:01.129 --> 00:02:05.250 human drive to pass things on. And for somebody 00:02:05.250 --> 00:02:09.289 who has elected to not have children in my life, 00:02:09.449 --> 00:02:13.389 the role that my career has played over the last 00:02:13.389 --> 00:02:18.449 25 or so years to supplement itself as a child. 00:02:18.650 --> 00:02:24.819 And so as I watch your family go through these 00:02:24.819 --> 00:02:27.680 transitions with you and your brother and what's 00:02:27.680 --> 00:02:31.319 coming up and where developmentally my career 00:02:31.319 --> 00:02:34.960 might be if it were a living, breathing human. 00:02:35.780 --> 00:02:38.500 I don't know. There's just so many parallels 00:02:38.500 --> 00:02:42.060 I've been thinking about with this concept of 00:02:42.060 --> 00:02:46.659 this career as a child. And as I move this career 00:02:46.659 --> 00:02:51.259 out into the world. Hoping it will eventually 00:02:51.259 --> 00:02:56.780 take care of me and provide for me as well. I'm 00:02:56.780 --> 00:03:03.060 just struck by our drive as humans for legacy 00:03:03.060 --> 00:03:05.879 and for passing things forward and for leaving 00:03:05.879 --> 00:03:09.000 our mark on the world. And in the absence of 00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:15.120 genetics, what role does my social work career... 00:03:15.610 --> 00:03:18.689 And potential, what's the legacy that I'm driving 00:03:18.689 --> 00:03:22.949 for around that? And how do I leave my mark on 00:03:22.949 --> 00:03:26.789 this planet, making sure that I've left the planet 00:03:26.789 --> 00:03:30.469 better than I found it? Yeah, I think that's 00:03:30.469 --> 00:03:33.849 a super interesting thing to think about, legacy. 00:03:34.409 --> 00:03:38.050 Particularly because in my eyes... Obsessing 00:03:38.050 --> 00:03:40.550 over one's legacy is kind of inherently irrational 00:03:40.550 --> 00:03:44.969 as a result of our inability to view our own 00:03:44.969 --> 00:03:49.629 legacy posthumously, right? Yeah. So we're attempting 00:03:49.629 --> 00:03:52.650 to produce something that can exist externally 00:03:52.650 --> 00:03:55.689 from us. But when it exists externally from us, 00:03:55.729 --> 00:03:58.750 we are no longer capable of deriving value from 00:03:58.750 --> 00:04:01.849 it. Yeah. Which is very much like having kids. 00:04:01.909 --> 00:04:04.349 Child. Right, right, right. And to your point. 00:04:04.810 --> 00:04:09.409 And depending on one's belief systems, we may 00:04:09.409 --> 00:04:12.810 or may not ever know what that mark was. But 00:04:12.810 --> 00:04:16.189 I think about those developmental phases, that 00:04:16.189 --> 00:04:21.670 Erickson kind of stuff, and I'm solidly in or 00:04:21.670 --> 00:04:26.790 approaching this whole stagnation versus generativity 00:04:26.790 --> 00:04:32.870 around looking retrospectively backwards. Redundant, 00:04:32.870 --> 00:04:37.110 I think. On what's my mark? What's my mark then? 00:04:37.209 --> 00:04:41.709 Has my life been productive? As you look back 00:04:41.709 --> 00:04:45.110 upon your life, I'm just curious. Do you feel 00:04:45.110 --> 00:04:48.470 that you're feeling like it's sort of coming 00:04:48.470 --> 00:04:52.029 to an end? You're wrapping things up? And what 00:04:52.029 --> 00:04:55.110 does that feel like dealing with your own mortality? 00:04:55.269 --> 00:04:59.490 Right. As legacy is sort of an inherent thought 00:04:59.490 --> 00:05:04.220 about one's own mortality. Yeah. Yeah. That is 00:05:04.220 --> 00:05:09.899 a very interesting question. As somebody who 00:05:09.899 --> 00:05:13.139 turned 50 six months ago, so I'm 50 and a half, 00:05:13.579 --> 00:05:19.259 there is a whole lot still ahead. I fully believe 00:05:19.259 --> 00:05:23.259 our best days, including my own, are still ahead. 00:05:25.160 --> 00:05:32.480 And if I live to be 100, I'm at the halfway point. 00:05:32.750 --> 00:05:40.269 I have a strong family history genetically. All 00:05:40.269 --> 00:05:44.829 sets of grandparents lived in their 90s, and 00:05:44.829 --> 00:05:47.430 I still have a grandmother alive well in her 00:05:47.430 --> 00:05:52.470 90s. I still have both my birth parents alive. 00:05:52.930 --> 00:05:57.370 And so that idea of mortality probably hasn't 00:05:57.370 --> 00:06:03.550 crossed my mind yet. We have no way of knowing 00:06:03.550 --> 00:06:06.290 what the world is going to look like 50 years 00:06:06.290 --> 00:06:13.110 from now and how our human age is being preserved 00:06:13.110 --> 00:06:18.389 beyond a typical life. I don't even know what 00:06:18.389 --> 00:06:22.610 the current life expectancy is. I think for men 00:06:22.610 --> 00:06:25.430 in the United States, it's 78. Yeah. And for 00:06:25.430 --> 00:06:30.639 women... Higher or lower. Yeah, it's always higher 00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:33.800 for women. Yeah, so, I mean, that's 30 years 00:06:33.800 --> 00:06:37.620 from now. So, yeah, I guess I am starting. And 00:06:37.620 --> 00:06:40.720 I don't want to be working and grinding at the 00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:43.560 level I feel like I am currently or as your mom 00:06:43.560 --> 00:06:45.839 accuses me of all the time. I don't want to be 00:06:45.839 --> 00:06:48.920 doing that 20 or 30 years from now either. And 00:06:48.920 --> 00:06:52.339 so that building in time for rest and reflection 00:06:52.339 --> 00:06:56.120 later, yeah, I guess I am kind of facing down. 00:06:56.649 --> 00:07:01.410 I didn't mean to suggest that you were getting 00:07:01.410 --> 00:07:03.350 like old to the point where you're looking down 00:07:03.350 --> 00:07:08.129 the barrel of the gun. Yeah. So moving on to 00:07:08.129 --> 00:07:10.449 my inspired. Yeah, let's hear it. Also talking 00:07:10.449 --> 00:07:13.209 about like this idea of aging and development. 00:07:14.250 --> 00:07:16.230 Although I love all of my friends and I think 00:07:16.230 --> 00:07:18.810 I've managed to kindle really fantastic relationships 00:07:18.810 --> 00:07:22.670 with the people around me. I feel like I've sort 00:07:22.670 --> 00:07:26.100 of begun to. develop a little faster, a little 00:07:26.100 --> 00:07:29.600 past some of the people that I once surrounded 00:07:29.600 --> 00:07:33.240 myself with as individuals who are very much 00:07:33.240 --> 00:07:36.920 on the same wavelength as me. And I feel like 00:07:36.920 --> 00:07:39.180 at this point in my life, I've sort of started 00:07:39.180 --> 00:07:44.259 to depart from that sort of teenage outlook. 00:07:44.420 --> 00:07:48.480 And a lot of my friends are still in that teenage 00:07:48.480 --> 00:07:52.779 outlook. Internally, not really externally in 00:07:52.779 --> 00:07:54.839 my interactions, but internally creates a little 00:07:54.839 --> 00:07:58.899 bit of friction for me as I sort of start developing 00:07:58.899 --> 00:08:03.360 past my current relationships. And I think it's 00:08:03.360 --> 00:08:06.319 something that's very interesting to think about 00:08:06.319 --> 00:08:11.980 as I am ready to move on. I'm at a point where 00:08:11.980 --> 00:08:15.680 I'm just over high school. Yeah. Like it's not 00:08:15.680 --> 00:08:20.040 something that is. drawing my attention uh anymore 00:08:20.040 --> 00:08:23.519 and i i think a lot of the styles of relationships 00:08:23.519 --> 00:08:27.339 that i see in high school that i once uh looked 00:08:27.339 --> 00:08:31.300 up at thought were very cool chic whatever um 00:08:31.300 --> 00:08:35.620 i'm now beginning to feel a bit distasteful to 00:08:35.620 --> 00:08:39.440 me yeah um which is just i i think a very interesting 00:08:39.440 --> 00:08:43.340 uh transitionary perspective that i've uh sort 00:08:43.340 --> 00:08:48.659 of adopted as i'm starting to not I feel bad 00:08:48.659 --> 00:08:50.200 for saying this, but I feel like I'm, to some 00:08:50.200 --> 00:08:52.559 extent, internally delegitimizing my relationships. 00:08:53.600 --> 00:08:55.379 Can I ask you a question? Yeah, go for it. At 00:08:55.379 --> 00:08:58.340 the risk of transitioning this into, you gave 00:08:58.340 --> 00:09:01.200 me a therapy session a couple minutes ago. I'm 00:09:01.200 --> 00:09:03.860 going to give you one. How much of that process 00:09:03.860 --> 00:09:06.700 that you're going through has to do with the 00:09:06.700 --> 00:09:09.940 fact that you're leaving the country in a couple 00:09:09.940 --> 00:09:14.210 months and may not be back here? for several 00:09:14.210 --> 00:09:17.590 years. So how much of this is anticipating the 00:09:17.590 --> 00:09:21.049 separation that's coming? I think as I've moved 00:09:21.049 --> 00:09:24.090 through my high school career, I have started 00:09:24.090 --> 00:09:29.230 to view relationships and emotions and situations 00:09:29.230 --> 00:09:33.789 as increasingly transient. And I definitely think 00:09:33.789 --> 00:09:37.980 that my... soon to be living in another country 00:09:37.980 --> 00:09:40.879 is contributing to that as I'm starting to view 00:09:40.879 --> 00:09:42.919 the setting around me not as a permanent fixture 00:09:42.919 --> 00:09:45.600 but as something that is temporary and soon to 00:09:45.600 --> 00:09:48.100 be removed yeah so I think it's certainly contributing 00:09:48.100 --> 00:09:52.879 to it however I think the primary contributor 00:09:52.879 --> 00:09:56.679 is my own personal development external from 00:09:56.679 --> 00:09:59.159 where I may be geographically in the future yeah 00:09:59.740 --> 00:10:02.259 Well, that's I mean, I think back all the way 00:10:02.259 --> 00:10:05.980 to season one and we had that whole work in progress 00:10:05.980 --> 00:10:10.259 sign behind us, right, that we are all works 00:10:10.259 --> 00:10:13.179 in progress and we're all constantly evolving. 00:10:13.639 --> 00:10:17.440 And I can't remember the exact quote, but there's 00:10:17.440 --> 00:10:20.820 there's a kind of a well -ish known line that 00:10:20.820 --> 00:10:22.840 goes something like, you know, people come into 00:10:22.840 --> 00:10:28.070 our lives for a reason, a season. Or a lifetime, 00:10:28.330 --> 00:10:30.389 you know, and and and there are relationships 00:10:30.389 --> 00:10:33.610 I've made in my life, even as an adult, that 00:10:33.610 --> 00:10:36.509 there was a there's a there was a pretty specific 00:10:36.509 --> 00:10:40.149 reason why that connection happened. And when 00:10:40.149 --> 00:10:43.590 that reason transitioned, the connection kind 00:10:43.590 --> 00:10:46.470 of faded or fizzled away. Yeah. And that's not 00:10:46.470 --> 00:10:49.690 to minimize the relationships we've made across 00:10:49.690 --> 00:10:52.330 our life, because every one of those relationships 00:10:52.330 --> 00:10:58.139 is important and is valid. And you're growing. 00:10:58.220 --> 00:11:02.600 We're growing. And when I'm 80 -something years 00:11:02.600 --> 00:11:07.419 old, I may have very different needs. And the 00:11:07.419 --> 00:11:10.279 relationships I surround myself with at that 00:11:10.279 --> 00:11:12.259 point in my life are probably going to look really 00:11:12.259 --> 00:11:14.399 different than the relationships I have now. 00:11:14.620 --> 00:11:17.919 That doesn't mean I care any less about those 00:11:17.919 --> 00:11:21.460 people. It just means that we've transitioned. 00:11:21.580 --> 00:11:25.019 We've grown. We've evolved. And sometimes evolution 00:11:25.019 --> 00:11:28.519 isn't always looking for something better. Sometimes 00:11:28.519 --> 00:11:33.600 evolution is that season is changing and we need 00:11:33.600 --> 00:11:36.799 something different. I think actually a sort 00:11:36.799 --> 00:11:39.740 of spectrum that I've identified in relationships 00:11:39.740 --> 00:11:42.059 that I find very interesting and that you've 00:11:42.059 --> 00:11:44.820 identified regarding like the season to lifetime 00:11:44.820 --> 00:11:48.500 is like I feel that relationships or the basis 00:11:48.500 --> 00:11:51.980 for them exist on a continuum from context to 00:11:51.980 --> 00:11:56.059 compatibility. Lifelong relationships, I feel, 00:11:56.080 --> 00:11:59.659 are based upon like basal personality compatibility. 00:11:59.899 --> 00:12:02.600 Just a human being that you thoroughly enjoy. 00:12:02.940 --> 00:12:06.000 And then... a lot of our seasoned relationships 00:12:06.000 --> 00:12:10.000 are dependent upon context. It could be a social 00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:12.879 setting that you found yourself in due to school 00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:15.980 and you may not necessarily mesh on a compatibility 00:12:15.980 --> 00:12:18.039 level with a lot of individuals there. However, 00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:20.220 you may share similar interests and as a result 00:12:20.220 --> 00:12:22.659 of that, that becomes your friend group, right? 00:12:22.740 --> 00:12:25.620 And I think that a lot of my relationships earlier 00:12:25.620 --> 00:12:28.139 in my high school career were exclusively context 00:12:28.139 --> 00:12:31.059 -based rather than compatibility -based. I was 00:12:31.059 --> 00:12:34.299 seeking out individuals who were going to enable 00:12:34.299 --> 00:12:39.480 and engage with my mental illness. And now a 00:12:39.480 --> 00:12:42.279 lot of my relationships, I feel, are based far 00:12:42.279 --> 00:12:45.539 more heavily on compatibility as I've sought 00:12:45.539 --> 00:12:52.639 out what I see as more genuine, legitimate relationships. 00:12:53.120 --> 00:12:56.580 Yeah. Yeah. I think you're right where you're 00:12:56.580 --> 00:12:59.120 supposed to be, Soren. Really. As you reflect 00:12:59.120 --> 00:13:01.779 on this, it kind of ties back to this idea of 00:13:01.779 --> 00:13:04.019 legacy that... We were talking about just a bit 00:13:04.019 --> 00:13:08.720 ago and this retrospective look. When I think 00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:14.759 about who I hung around with in elementary school, 00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:16.799 in middle school, in high school, in college 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:21.019 and beyond, some of it was proximity. Some of 00:13:21.019 --> 00:13:25.159 it was the relationships my parents had with 00:13:25.159 --> 00:13:29.799 their parents. And as we grow, it might shift 00:13:29.799 --> 00:13:34.919 from geography. to interest and shared the compatibility 00:13:34.919 --> 00:13:39.200 between humans. And then it maybe moves to geography 00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:42.700 again, like school, work, who you're surrounded 00:13:42.700 --> 00:13:45.059 with. In your case, who's in your dormitory? 00:13:45.259 --> 00:13:48.220 Who's your roommate now? And you meet these different 00:13:48.220 --> 00:13:51.940 people and friends. And part of that retrospective 00:13:51.940 --> 00:13:56.620 look back for me is just pausing to just give 00:13:56.620 --> 00:14:01.899 thanks to... what I got from those relationships 00:14:01.899 --> 00:14:04.480 every step of the way, even though I may not 00:14:04.480 --> 00:14:06.620 have seen some of those people for 40 -something 00:14:06.620 --> 00:14:12.539 years now. Yeah. We get information and we learn 00:14:12.539 --> 00:14:15.480 about ourselves in the context of these other 00:14:15.480 --> 00:14:18.860 relationships we've made. I actually really like 00:14:18.860 --> 00:14:22.899 that comment in that it is sort of like I like 00:14:22.899 --> 00:14:25.960 this idea that it is impossible to discover oneself 00:14:25.960 --> 00:14:29.700 without examining the way oneself interacts with 00:14:29.700 --> 00:14:32.399 the world around them. Like self -discovery as 00:14:32.399 --> 00:14:36.899 an internally derived. thing i i feel is sort 00:14:36.899 --> 00:14:40.259 of non -existent i i cannot sit and think and 00:14:40.259 --> 00:14:43.340 truly gain an understanding of myself without 00:14:43.340 --> 00:14:47.139 uh having a canvas that being the world on which 00:14:47.139 --> 00:14:50.200 to paint my person right right right yeah right 00:14:50.200 --> 00:14:56.360 and humans have an innate need to belong for 00:14:56.360 --> 00:14:58.320 a community it's part of that whole you know 00:14:58.320 --> 00:15:02.480 maslow the scale the triangle i mean um Belonging 00:15:02.480 --> 00:15:05.159 and love is squarely in the middle of that triangle, 00:15:05.340 --> 00:15:08.240 which assumes that when our basic needs are met 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:11.720 and our safety needs are met, we then are open 00:15:11.720 --> 00:15:15.379 to forming relationships and being part of community 00:15:15.379 --> 00:15:20.019 and belongingness. As introverted as anyone is, 00:15:20.259 --> 00:15:22.940 they still have a need to belong. Maybe their 00:15:22.940 --> 00:15:26.720 circle is a bit smaller or more selective, but 00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:30.879 that need is still the same. And so as we all 00:15:30.879 --> 00:15:36.820 advance through our lives and as we learn to 00:15:36.820 --> 00:15:40.220 take care of some of those physiological and 00:15:40.220 --> 00:15:44.740 safety needs for ourselves, then we start exploring 00:15:44.740 --> 00:15:47.759 what community and belonging needs for ourselves. 00:15:48.299 --> 00:15:53.679 100%. Yeah. Whoa. Concluding our Inspired Insights 00:15:53.679 --> 00:15:56.440 portion of the podcast. But it's a nice transition, 00:15:56.559 --> 00:15:58.480 right? Because we were also kind of reflecting 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:02.860 before we started recording on the concept of 00:16:02.860 --> 00:16:06.039 personality and needs and navigating the world 00:16:06.039 --> 00:16:10.139 and a little bit of like, how do we as humans 00:16:10.139 --> 00:16:14.120 get so entrenched in our way being the right? 00:16:14.669 --> 00:16:16.570 way. And we had some laughs. Maybe we'll recreate 00:16:16.570 --> 00:16:19.750 some of those moments. But we were talking about 00:16:19.750 --> 00:16:22.669 Myers -Briggs. And so for our listeners who might 00:16:22.669 --> 00:16:25.870 not be aware, and we'll put some links and pieces 00:16:25.870 --> 00:16:28.870 for folks to learn more, the Myers -Briggs type 00:16:28.870 --> 00:16:35.730 indicator, MBTI, is a very well -known personality. 00:16:36.600 --> 00:16:40.179 test. You folks can find it on the interwebs. 00:16:40.179 --> 00:16:42.659 And it's a series of questions that evaluate 00:16:42.659 --> 00:16:46.740 your preferences on four dimensions. And so we 00:16:46.740 --> 00:16:52.019 have the dimension of our focus around the world. 00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:56.600 So introvert versus extrovert, I or E. We have 00:16:56.600 --> 00:16:59.139 the dimension of how we take in information. 00:16:59.179 --> 00:17:03.720 So sensing versus intuition. We have the dimension 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:08.339 of how we make decisions, thinking or feeling, 00:17:08.539 --> 00:17:14.000 and then how we live our outside world, judging 00:17:14.000 --> 00:17:17.740 versus perceiving. And that's probably the letters 00:17:17.740 --> 00:17:19.960 that are most confusing for folks. And we'll 00:17:19.960 --> 00:17:22.779 describe a little bit this way. And I just want 00:17:22.779 --> 00:17:26.680 to say I am no expert in Myers -Briggs. It's 00:17:26.680 --> 00:17:30.099 an inventory I've done dozens of times. It was 00:17:30.099 --> 00:17:34.809 very... It's often used in office settings and 00:17:34.809 --> 00:17:38.329 in res life, residential life, college settings 00:17:38.329 --> 00:17:44.130 to help develop some shared empathy, shared perspective 00:17:44.130 --> 00:17:47.569 taking on how other people around you are wired. 00:17:47.670 --> 00:17:51.390 And each of these personality types, of which 00:17:51.390 --> 00:17:54.269 there are 16, right, these four dimensions and 00:17:54.269 --> 00:17:57.529 every possible combination gets you 16 different. 00:17:59.740 --> 00:18:04.660 And each type has some strengths and each type 00:18:04.660 --> 00:18:07.099 has some maybe more Achilles heels, things to 00:18:07.099 --> 00:18:10.839 be watchful of. So we were having some fun. I've 00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:14.680 got we've got cheat sheets here. We were having 00:18:14.680 --> 00:18:17.440 some fun with your mom before we started just 00:18:17.440 --> 00:18:20.779 kind of assessing where we are on the Myers -Briggs. 00:18:20.900 --> 00:18:24.220 So, again, I've taken this test dozens of times. 00:18:24.539 --> 00:18:31.140 I am an E .S. F, J. So extrovert, sensing, feeling, 00:18:31.460 --> 00:18:35.559 judging. And again, I will talk about that JP 00:18:35.559 --> 00:18:37.579 because that's, I think, where it gets more confusing 00:18:37.579 --> 00:18:42.000 for folks. I, and when you take the inventory, 00:18:42.099 --> 00:18:44.299 depending on the ones you're taking, it's the 00:18:44.299 --> 00:18:47.579 level of strength, like the degree of which you 00:18:47.579 --> 00:18:51.240 rely on these four dimensions. Of my four letters, 00:18:51.500 --> 00:18:57.000 the J is the strongest. And that J really is 00:18:57.000 --> 00:19:02.299 more about organization, planfulness, consistency, 00:19:02.680 --> 00:19:10.759 calendars, post -it notes, alarm clocks. Those 00:19:10.759 --> 00:19:15.099 are all the images of the J that come up. You 00:19:15.099 --> 00:19:22.640 are an E -N -T -P. Extrovert, intuition, thinking, 00:19:22.920 --> 00:19:27.940 perceiving. Almost the total opposite. We're 00:19:27.940 --> 00:19:31.819 both extroverts. We're both extroverts. And even 00:19:31.819 --> 00:19:34.720 extroverts need time to just sit with ourselves, 00:19:34.880 --> 00:19:38.359 right? So we may get our energy from others in 00:19:38.359 --> 00:19:42.720 our space. And the Achilles heel of that is how 00:19:42.720 --> 00:19:44.440 do we bring ourselves down and just sit with 00:19:44.440 --> 00:19:48.349 our own thoughts? Yeah, regarding my... specific 00:19:48.349 --> 00:19:51.609 brand of extroversion i used to have a lot of 00:19:51.609 --> 00:19:55.009 difficulty um unwinding from so like positive 00:19:55.009 --> 00:19:57.910 social settings without emotionally crashing 00:19:57.910 --> 00:20:02.730 hard yeah um like for example one of my attempts 00:20:02.730 --> 00:20:06.750 was directly after having a lovely evening with 00:20:06.750 --> 00:20:09.670 my parents that was very positive uh and then 00:20:09.670 --> 00:20:12.369 i had a really fun phone call with one of my 00:20:12.369 --> 00:20:14.269 friends that was also extremely positive and 00:20:14.269 --> 00:20:17.569 i got a lot of energy from that and then When 00:20:17.569 --> 00:20:21.170 you feel the absence of that energy and the sensation 00:20:21.170 --> 00:20:23.349 of like aloneness starts draining you. That's 00:20:23.349 --> 00:20:26.450 what I had a lot of issues with. Yeah. And I 00:20:26.450 --> 00:20:29.549 think through my recovery, I have sort of not 00:20:29.549 --> 00:20:32.410 I've not become an introvert by any means, but 00:20:32.410 --> 00:20:35.269 I have become less of an extrovert. Certainly. 00:20:35.410 --> 00:20:38.750 Yeah. Maybe you appreciate more of those introverted 00:20:38.750 --> 00:20:41.930 moments. A hundred percent. Yeah. For me, I'm 00:20:41.930 --> 00:20:50.230 curious for you. theater, movies, amusement parks, 00:20:50.509 --> 00:20:53.250 those things that might happen in the evening, 00:20:53.430 --> 00:20:56.970 it takes me, because I'm just sitting in the 00:20:56.970 --> 00:21:02.109 buzz and the hum around me, if I get home from 00:21:02.109 --> 00:21:06.569 a really cool Broadway show or musical or concert 00:21:06.569 --> 00:21:11.390 that ends at, what, 10, 30, 11 plus at night, 00:21:11.509 --> 00:21:15.920 it will take me hours. to then come down from 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:20.220 that energy and sleep. My husband on the other 00:21:20.220 --> 00:21:23.140 end of things, and he will be the first to say, 00:21:23.220 --> 00:21:25.640 and I can hear him now as he's editing this episode, 00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:30.299 he's an extrovert and he's not. He's an introvert. 00:21:30.759 --> 00:21:35.900 And he can shut down and take a nap in the middle 00:21:35.900 --> 00:21:40.460 of Disneyland. In the middle of a show. I'd be 00:21:40.460 --> 00:21:43.549 incapable of that. Because we are soaking in 00:21:43.549 --> 00:21:46.990 that energy. And so I think sometimes the introvert 00:21:46.990 --> 00:21:50.630 extrovert discussion gets a little stigmatized 00:21:50.630 --> 00:21:55.869 that introverts are seen as not social and extroverts 00:21:55.869 --> 00:21:58.630 are seen as go, go, go, social, social. And it's 00:21:58.630 --> 00:22:00.490 really more about energy. A hundred percent. 00:22:00.569 --> 00:22:03.900 I think it's important to. differentiate that 00:22:03.900 --> 00:22:06.160 it is about energy too because like a lot of 00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:09.000 introverts are extremely socially outgoing individuals 00:22:09.000 --> 00:22:12.460 that are capable of carrying on an extremely 00:22:12.460 --> 00:22:15.119 energetic conversation for long periods of time 00:22:15.119 --> 00:22:17.240 interacting with others for long periods absolutely 00:22:17.240 --> 00:22:20.299 it just slowly becomes draining for them whereas 00:22:20.299 --> 00:22:23.319 that for us it recharges our battery 100 that's 00:22:23.319 --> 00:22:28.579 Derek is that Derek can um talk about a multitude 00:22:28.579 --> 00:22:33.210 of random topics and knows a lot about those 00:22:33.210 --> 00:22:36.710 topics and be energized and jazzed in that conversation, 00:22:37.069 --> 00:22:40.250 and then the crash comes. And I'm the opposite. 00:22:40.349 --> 00:22:43.029 I'm energized in those conversations, and the 00:22:43.029 --> 00:22:45.650 hum is still buzzing through my brain and body, 00:22:45.789 --> 00:22:48.829 and it takes a while to then come down. Like 00:22:48.829 --> 00:22:53.529 you, I'm learning to lean into my more introverted 00:22:53.529 --> 00:22:57.670 opportunities. And as extroverts, we need those 00:22:57.670 --> 00:23:02.589 reminders to... hit pause and and do some of 00:23:02.589 --> 00:23:06.910 that recharge time and then the other dimensions 00:23:06.910 --> 00:23:09.369 that i want to get to the j and the p because 00:23:09.369 --> 00:23:11.869 that's where you and i are i think most opposite 00:23:11.869 --> 00:23:16.890 and we'll get there um but the uh intuition versus 00:23:16.890 --> 00:23:20.490 the sensing for me i'm i'm almost on the on the 00:23:20.490 --> 00:23:24.349 line there feeling versus thinking i think is 00:23:24.349 --> 00:23:27.819 another big difference between you and I. And 00:23:27.819 --> 00:23:30.160 I'm thinking about the conversations we've had 00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:33.880 here in the studio about the role that trauma 00:23:33.880 --> 00:23:36.779 plays and how we intellectualize the world around 00:23:36.779 --> 00:23:43.759 us. And I'm wondering if, not for you, Soren, 00:23:43.799 --> 00:23:50.480 but for humans, how might trauma impact this 00:23:50.480 --> 00:23:53.980 Myers -Briggs? these different dimensions and 00:23:53.980 --> 00:23:56.680 our ability to sit with feelings or sit with 00:23:56.680 --> 00:24:01.400 thought. I think, putting aside me specifically 00:24:01.400 --> 00:24:04.319 for a moment, trauma, as we've discussed previously, 00:24:04.539 --> 00:24:09.640 can have an extremely pronounced impact on our 00:24:09.640 --> 00:24:12.880 personality and the way that we view the world 00:24:12.880 --> 00:24:15.400 and the means through which we process information. 00:24:16.299 --> 00:24:21.180 The way my trauma or my process of recovery I 00:24:21.180 --> 00:24:24.559 feel manifested within me is it made me sort 00:24:24.559 --> 00:24:28.079 of hyper logical I now conceptualize the world 00:24:28.079 --> 00:24:32.779 almost exclusively through thought and before 00:24:32.779 --> 00:24:36.079 I took the Myers -Briggs personality test before 00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:41.740 my trauma and I was a feeler rather than a thinker 00:24:41.740 --> 00:24:46.240 and now I'm very much a thinker and I think part 00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:49.420 of that is I've sort of dissociated my thought 00:24:49.420 --> 00:24:53.960 from my emotion and tend to disregard my emotion. 00:24:54.220 --> 00:24:57.980 Not disregard, rather, but view it as an entity 00:24:57.980 --> 00:25:00.619 which needs to be maintained rather than one 00:25:00.619 --> 00:25:03.099 that should be the basis for my action. Yeah. 00:25:03.119 --> 00:25:05.119 Well, in this dimension, it's all about decision 00:25:05.119 --> 00:25:08.259 making. Yeah. And so you come to decisions through 00:25:08.259 --> 00:25:15.059 the intellectual process. My preference for decision 00:25:15.059 --> 00:25:21.619 making is weighing in how it feels for me. And 00:25:21.619 --> 00:25:26.420 what's interesting is as I get more involved 00:25:26.420 --> 00:25:29.980 in my own student, being a student in my doctoral 00:25:29.980 --> 00:25:33.240 social work program and being a professor, I 00:25:33.240 --> 00:25:39.680 am finding I'm more driven to the facts, to the 00:25:39.680 --> 00:25:42.799 research. What does the research say? what's 00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:46.460 out there that's not just anecdotal, but really 00:25:46.460 --> 00:25:51.299 empirical, evidence -based. And so moving myself 00:25:51.299 --> 00:25:54.599 on that slide ruler a bit towards the T as well. 00:25:55.119 --> 00:25:58.819 I think I am very much similar to you in that 00:25:58.819 --> 00:26:01.400 aspect. I am highly skeptical of information. 00:26:01.640 --> 00:26:05.259 And actually, before this episode, when we decided 00:26:05.259 --> 00:26:08.299 to incorporate Myers -Briggs into it, I was quite 00:26:08.299 --> 00:26:10.539 skeptical of Myers -Briggs. And I think it's 00:26:10.539 --> 00:26:13.119 important to note that there is not a massive 00:26:13.119 --> 00:26:16.059 amount of legitimate research backing up the 00:26:16.059 --> 00:26:18.700 claims of Myers -Briggs personality tests or 00:26:18.700 --> 00:26:21.279 their utility or efficacy in given situations. 00:26:22.259 --> 00:26:25.259 So I was highly skeptical of featuring it heavily 00:26:25.259 --> 00:26:27.319 in this episode. However, I think it is a useful 00:26:27.319 --> 00:26:30.380 tool. Yeah. And for me, it's a great conversation 00:26:30.380 --> 00:26:34.660 starter. Yeah. And building just understanding. 00:26:34.900 --> 00:26:37.579 So again, with the introvert and the extrovert, 00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:41.500 if I'm in an office setting or a dorm setting 00:26:41.500 --> 00:26:45.700 and all of the people around me are introverts 00:26:45.700 --> 00:26:49.140 and I'm the only extrovert, I've... In order 00:26:49.140 --> 00:26:51.359 to be really successful in those relationships, 00:26:51.599 --> 00:26:55.380 I've got to respect their need for some just 00:26:55.380 --> 00:27:00.079 my energy might be big and loud at times and 00:27:00.079 --> 00:27:04.000 vice versa, right? An introvert might want to 00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:06.579 be thoughtful about how to engage successfully 00:27:06.579 --> 00:27:10.079 with extroverts being mindful of their own energy 00:27:10.079 --> 00:27:14.900 needs and how to adjust in the moment and ramp 00:27:14.900 --> 00:27:18.180 up. Yeah. It's certainly useful as a systematic 00:27:18.180 --> 00:27:22.000 tool for empathy. So let's talk about JP or PJ. 00:27:22.960 --> 00:27:27.660 So I am all the way J. I fully acknowledge, again, 00:27:27.779 --> 00:27:31.079 alarm clocks, post -its, to -do lists, schedules, 00:27:31.440 --> 00:27:44.200 order, labels on boxes, and books on my bookshelf 00:27:44.200 --> 00:27:49.710 that are... very ordered and all aligned in the 00:27:49.710 --> 00:27:54.549 same way. That's my preference for how I organize 00:27:54.549 --> 00:27:58.970 the world around me. When I talk to you about 00:27:58.970 --> 00:28:03.049 post -its, to -do lists, schedules, alarms, you 00:28:03.049 --> 00:28:06.670 almost have a visceral reaction to it. I can 00:28:06.670 --> 00:28:10.130 see it. You started cracking your knuckles. You 00:28:10.130 --> 00:28:14.950 started tensing up. Yeah, I feel like I react 00:28:14.950 --> 00:28:18.490 very negatively to constraints and very positively 00:28:18.490 --> 00:28:23.250 to chaos. I thoroughly enjoy chaos as something 00:28:23.250 --> 00:28:27.390 that brings me a lot of positive emotions. And 00:28:27.390 --> 00:28:32.720 I feel that plans... I despise plans and I feel 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:35.920 that they have a tendency to limit our agency 00:28:35.920 --> 00:28:40.319 as humans. We are deciding a course and then 00:28:40.319 --> 00:28:43.160 electing to continue on that course almost blindly 00:28:43.160 --> 00:28:47.460 without examining situations as we go. For me, 00:28:47.519 --> 00:28:49.480 planning is almost like making decisions without 00:28:49.480 --> 00:28:53.440 complete data. Oh, you are such your parents' 00:28:53.539 --> 00:28:58.029 child. We have... So why we started talking about 00:28:58.029 --> 00:29:01.390 this in full disclosure is you and your family, 00:29:01.549 --> 00:29:04.210 the four of you, have a giant trip coming up 00:29:04.210 --> 00:29:06.890 and you're going to be out of the country and 00:29:06.890 --> 00:29:11.630 exploring lots of cool stuff. And you, as a family, 00:29:11.829 --> 00:29:16.130 pride yourself on traveling as light as possible, 00:29:16.309 --> 00:29:20.190 traveling with as long as you know what time 00:29:20.190 --> 00:29:22.450 to be at the airport and where you're sleeping, 00:29:22.730 --> 00:29:27.259 you're going to have a great time. And that stresses 00:29:27.259 --> 00:29:30.480 me out. And I've been joking with your mom about 00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:34.099 this for literally months now. It stresses me 00:29:34.099 --> 00:29:36.920 out. And I'm not saying, although I am saying, 00:29:37.039 --> 00:29:39.339 there's a right way or a wrong way, although 00:29:39.339 --> 00:29:43.900 I am. It's fascinating to me from an understanding 00:29:43.900 --> 00:29:46.619 and empathy, which has inspired insights all 00:29:46.619 --> 00:29:53.259 the way. It's fascinating to me how what... Because 00:29:53.259 --> 00:29:55.779 it's not even a preference. What brings you joy 00:29:55.779 --> 00:30:01.519 and your outlook on life can be so opposite for 00:30:01.519 --> 00:30:06.119 me and folks like me who, I'm the guy, when Derek 00:30:06.119 --> 00:30:10.420 and I got married, I made an itinerary for every 00:30:10.420 --> 00:30:14.220 guest that told them when they could be on their 00:30:14.220 --> 00:30:16.279 own and when we needed their time and attention, 00:30:16.480 --> 00:30:19.440 of which your parents were at our wedding. And 00:30:19.440 --> 00:30:23.920 I know now that... totally killed your parents' 00:30:24.119 --> 00:30:27.319 experience in the country we were at for our 00:30:27.319 --> 00:30:29.119 wedding. I'm sure they still had a lovely time. 00:30:29.299 --> 00:30:32.880 But I do feel like for me, like my emotional 00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:37.740 response to plans, orders, like a set regimen 00:30:37.740 --> 00:30:41.279 of activities is quite visceral. I react very 00:30:41.279 --> 00:30:43.940 negatively to that. Yeah. And to some extent 00:30:43.940 --> 00:30:47.160 that is to my detriment as I'm largely incapable 00:30:47.160 --> 00:30:50.319 of completing the work that I have to. However. 00:30:51.000 --> 00:30:56.539 I do feel that like living a life that is planned 00:30:56.539 --> 00:31:01.319 out by you beforehand is sort of neglecting a 00:31:01.319 --> 00:31:04.140 core aspect of the human experience. And that 00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:08.519 is spontaneity, riding by the seat of one's pants, 00:31:08.700 --> 00:31:12.839 and like this joy that comes from the chaos factor 00:31:12.839 --> 00:31:15.859 of life. Okay, now take the reverse. So what 00:31:15.859 --> 00:31:18.480 I think is a useful exercise in this conversation. 00:31:19.259 --> 00:31:21.759 is when I think about the Achilles heel, we talked 00:31:21.759 --> 00:31:25.519 about introvert and extrovert. I will acknowledge, 00:31:25.599 --> 00:31:28.420 I can acknowledge that the Achilles heel for 00:31:28.420 --> 00:31:34.980 me as a J is that not taking the time to smell 00:31:34.980 --> 00:31:39.339 the roses and be spontaneous in the moment may 00:31:39.339 --> 00:31:44.039 result in me missing opportunities for joy. and 00:31:44.039 --> 00:31:48.160 pleasure and excitement. And if I'm focused on 00:31:48.160 --> 00:31:52.799 the to -do list on my vacation, what I also know 00:31:52.799 --> 00:31:56.599 is some of my favorite travel memories with my 00:31:56.599 --> 00:32:00.140 husband and loved ones are the moments we didn't 00:32:00.140 --> 00:32:04.319 plan for. So I can fully acknowledge that this 00:32:04.319 --> 00:32:08.619 well -thought -out, planful, checkmark to -do 00:32:08.619 --> 00:32:15.140 list exposes me to the potential of missing some 00:32:15.140 --> 00:32:18.559 of the best stuff. And yet it also mitigates 00:32:18.559 --> 00:32:22.880 risk far better than my approach to travel. And 00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:27.700 I am a very, and your mom will say this, I'm 00:32:27.700 --> 00:32:32.240 a very risk adverse human and professional. Now 00:32:32.240 --> 00:32:36.819 I want you to flip it. Your Achilles heel as 00:32:36.819 --> 00:32:45.009 a P might be... Um, as I said previously, I'm 00:32:45.009 --> 00:32:49.730 not planful. I'm bad at managing my time. There's 00:32:49.730 --> 00:32:52.730 a far higher likelihood that I will be in a pickle, 00:32:52.890 --> 00:32:58.130 a pinch, as it were, than someone who plans regularly. 00:32:58.329 --> 00:33:00.890 Like an example of this, and I think a lot of 00:33:00.890 --> 00:33:03.650 this is more related to my particular brand of 00:33:03.650 --> 00:33:06.650 neurodiversity, which additionally contributes 00:33:06.650 --> 00:33:10.980 to my desire for chaos. Like an example of this 00:33:10.980 --> 00:33:13.660 being to my detriment is A, my schoolwork, and 00:33:13.660 --> 00:33:16.660 B, the fact that I've run out of gas many times. 00:33:17.259 --> 00:33:19.420 In my short career of driving, I've ran out of 00:33:19.420 --> 00:33:21.779 gas three times. And who else in your family 00:33:21.779 --> 00:33:24.359 runs out of gas at least once a month? Not once 00:33:24.359 --> 00:33:27.059 a month. Maybe once or twice a year. My father. 00:33:27.259 --> 00:33:30.940 Absolutely. You are your parents' kid. And that 00:33:30.940 --> 00:33:34.200 stresses... So that's a great example. Yet last 00:33:34.200 --> 00:33:39.019 evening, I was flying down the... up the highway 00:33:39.019 --> 00:33:43.980 from our state Capitol, having been late, having 00:33:43.980 --> 00:33:46.400 had to reschedule my entire afternoon because 00:33:46.400 --> 00:33:49.500 I was at a legislative meeting that ran way, 00:33:49.599 --> 00:33:54.480 way, way late. And every half hour that my schedule 00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:57.319 is sometimes scheduled, with each passing moment, 00:33:57.500 --> 00:33:59.880 I was needing to reschedule the next person. 00:34:01.140 --> 00:34:05.160 On my way to Augusta, our state Capitol, I... 00:34:05.869 --> 00:34:08.869 I noticed that, oh, I'm not going to have enough 00:34:08.869 --> 00:34:12.489 gas to get all the way back home. I don't have 00:34:12.489 --> 00:34:14.630 time to stop now. That's going to have to be 00:34:14.630 --> 00:34:17.829 the first thing I do on the return trip back. 00:34:18.389 --> 00:34:21.269 Because running out of gas on the highway is 00:34:21.269 --> 00:34:26.389 98 % of the reason why I'm a AAA member. 100%. 00:34:26.389 --> 00:34:31.679 It's 99%. Why? On the way home after that. I 00:34:31.679 --> 00:34:34.719 had to jump on another meeting while I was commuting. 00:34:34.719 --> 00:34:38.659 It was pouring rain. The level of anxiety rising 00:34:38.659 --> 00:34:43.500 in me, as I realized, trying to do the math on 00:34:43.500 --> 00:34:48.340 the highway of what exit can I get to, I got 00:34:48.340 --> 00:34:51.940 down to, I think, 13 miles left. You know, it 00:34:51.940 --> 00:34:56.179 says like how many miles left to empty. Here's 00:34:56.179 --> 00:34:58.400 another difference between you and I. That display 00:34:58.400 --> 00:35:01.809 on my dashboard. is my default display. How many 00:35:01.809 --> 00:35:06.170 miles left on that tank of gas is 100 % of the 00:35:06.170 --> 00:35:09.550 time the display, not how fast I'm going, not 00:35:09.550 --> 00:35:11.909 my tire pressure, not whatever the other bells 00:35:11.909 --> 00:35:15.590 and whistles are. It's miles left. That's how 00:35:15.590 --> 00:35:18.429 Jay I am. I think an important differentiator 00:35:18.429 --> 00:35:23.530 here is the adverse reaction to being in a situation 00:35:23.530 --> 00:35:27.730 in which you need to rapidly respond to a crisis. 00:35:28.539 --> 00:35:31.039 Every time I've run out of gas, it has been amusing 00:35:31.039 --> 00:35:35.599 for me. The venture. Yeah. Like, I felt positive 00:35:35.599 --> 00:35:37.860 emotionally, which feels really odd to say, but, 00:35:37.900 --> 00:35:41.440 like, when I'm in a situation in which there's, 00:35:41.440 --> 00:35:44.099 like, very few ways out without a little bit 00:35:44.099 --> 00:35:50.250 of chaos, I find it... Whereas you have a really 00:35:50.250 --> 00:35:53.690 high degree of anxiety around situations in which 00:35:53.690 --> 00:35:57.269 you need to think fast. Yes. Whereas I sort of 00:35:57.269 --> 00:36:00.969 thrive on that sensation. It excites me to respond 00:36:00.969 --> 00:36:04.429 to issues. Whereas for you, you'd rather mitigate 00:36:04.429 --> 00:36:07.150 those issues before they need response. To that 00:36:07.150 --> 00:36:13.389 point, in my car, all the time, I have a bag 00:36:13.389 --> 00:36:18.420 that is... slippers, socks, hat, mitten, scarf, 00:36:18.699 --> 00:36:24.599 all the time. I have a bag that has some dollar 00:36:24.599 --> 00:36:30.000 bills and like change. Should I need change? 00:36:30.159 --> 00:36:32.119 Because I don't carry cash. Who carries cash? 00:36:32.860 --> 00:36:35.219 But I have a little bag of cash just in case. 00:36:35.699 --> 00:36:39.960 I have another bag that is all hygiene related 00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:43.340 stuff. Should I be somewhere and need to access? 00:36:44.059 --> 00:36:46.480 fingernail clippers or a nail file or or any 00:36:46.480 --> 00:36:51.000 number of other things what's my um oh and then 00:36:51.000 --> 00:36:53.820 i have the car bag that has the pump the tire 00:36:53.820 --> 00:36:58.480 pump the um uh what i don't even know the names 00:36:58.480 --> 00:37:00.619 of all these things the first aid you know the 00:37:00.619 --> 00:37:03.900 cpr mask it's got that in it it's got oh the 00:37:03.900 --> 00:37:05.739 tire pressure gate the little thing that you 00:37:05.739 --> 00:37:08.139 put it in the thing shoots out i don't even know 00:37:08.139 --> 00:37:12.300 the name of these things i have a bag for everything 00:37:13.039 --> 00:37:16.179 in my car at all times. As you say this, I... 00:37:16.179 --> 00:37:18.940 Are you freaking out? No, I'm a little... I think 00:37:18.940 --> 00:37:20.800 it's a little funny because I also have all of 00:37:20.800 --> 00:37:23.300 these things in my car, but how they ended up 00:37:23.300 --> 00:37:26.539 there is different. I have a lot of disorganized, 00:37:26.539 --> 00:37:28.719 dirty clothes that I took off my sweater at school 00:37:28.719 --> 00:37:30.260 maybe and then left it in the back of my car. 00:37:30.320 --> 00:37:32.699 Like, my car is a treasure trove of random shit. 00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:35.860 Yeah. And I have... I had, like... I just pulled 00:37:35.860 --> 00:37:37.159 the money out of my car because we were dropping 00:37:37.159 --> 00:37:39.280 it off to get fixed earlier today. I had like 00:37:39.280 --> 00:37:42.199 $45 in crumpled ones from tips from work. Yeah. 00:37:42.539 --> 00:37:44.179 But you didn't even know we were there. They 00:37:44.179 --> 00:37:47.019 were there though. I have all these things except 00:37:47.019 --> 00:37:49.079 I did not plan for them at all and all of it's 00:37:49.079 --> 00:37:50.840 chaos and a mess. And it's only in there because 00:37:50.840 --> 00:37:53.900 you forgot to take it out. Precisely, yeah. One 00:37:53.900 --> 00:37:58.739 of my favorite kill time activities is a trip 00:37:58.739 --> 00:38:04.289 to Staples. I love Staples. The idea of school 00:38:04.289 --> 00:38:07.630 supplies. I love the idea. That wall in the back 00:38:07.630 --> 00:38:10.570 of our staples that is all the different size 00:38:10.570 --> 00:38:15.710 containers and holders. Dream. I could just stare 00:38:15.710 --> 00:38:20.809 at that and envision, oh, I could use that to 00:38:20.809 --> 00:38:23.349 organize my friendship bracelets. I could use 00:38:23.349 --> 00:38:26.969 that size to organize all of the affirmation 00:38:26.969 --> 00:38:29.530 cards I've been collecting and never use because 00:38:29.530 --> 00:38:32.750 I want to plan more than I actually want to use 00:38:32.750 --> 00:38:36.289 them. Hmm. Regarding school supplies, I personally 00:38:36.289 --> 00:38:39.590 lost all of my school supplies that we bought 00:38:39.590 --> 00:38:41.250 for this year of school within a month and a 00:38:41.250 --> 00:38:44.349 half. And now the only pencils that I use are 00:38:44.349 --> 00:38:46.750 golf pencils that I get from an AP Calc class 00:38:46.750 --> 00:38:50.489 for free. And they're just stuck in my pocket 00:38:50.489 --> 00:38:52.130 still because I forget to take them out of my 00:38:52.130 --> 00:38:54.030 pants pockets. Yeah. And I walk to school with 00:38:54.030 --> 00:38:55.809 pants on and, oh, look, there's a golf pencil 00:38:55.809 --> 00:38:58.769 in there. I can use it. Soren. So here's my question 00:38:58.769 --> 00:39:04.460 as we think about what's ahead. How will you 00:39:04.460 --> 00:39:13.960 transition some of your current preferences for 00:39:13.960 --> 00:39:17.019 the world around you, knowing that in a couple 00:39:17.019 --> 00:39:20.440 months, you are going to be six or seven hours 00:39:20.440 --> 00:39:25.280 ahead of East Coast time zone with classes that 00:39:25.280 --> 00:39:29.440 may start at 8 a .m., with homework that needs 00:39:29.440 --> 00:39:35.599 to be done. And as an adult. Your parents can't 00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:40.340 call your professors and remind them that, yep, 00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:42.159 you're on it, you're getting work in, can soar 00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:45.639 and have an extra day. You know where I'm going 00:39:45.639 --> 00:39:49.119 with this. Yeah, yeah. What's the plan? You know 00:39:49.119 --> 00:39:52.780 me, I don't have one. On the plane ride to Scotland. 00:39:53.199 --> 00:39:57.659 I think I already have developed some strategies 00:39:57.659 --> 00:40:01.840 to sort of mitigate my inability to complete 00:40:01.840 --> 00:40:05.440 work efficiently. And I think this is really 00:40:05.440 --> 00:40:08.239 useful for a lot of kids nowadays because high 00:40:08.239 --> 00:40:10.719 school in the United States, or at least my experience 00:40:10.719 --> 00:40:14.360 in high school, is that passing in work late 00:40:14.360 --> 00:40:17.400 is kind of the norm. Like it's not that much 00:40:17.400 --> 00:40:20.980 of a detriment to pass everything in at the end 00:40:20.980 --> 00:40:22.440 of the course. Yeah, the expectations have got 00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:24.599 a little loosey -goosey. The guardrails are a 00:40:24.599 --> 00:40:27.719 little bit more like flubber on the high. So 00:40:27.719 --> 00:40:32.980 I think part of the strategy in... Getting yourself 00:40:32.980 --> 00:40:35.719 to do work is like sort of convincing yourself 00:40:35.719 --> 00:40:39.000 to be panicked. Oh, interesting. Right. Like 00:40:39.000 --> 00:40:42.320 I need to intentionally create anxiety for myself. 00:40:42.519 --> 00:40:44.400 Channel it. Yeah. In order to motivate myself 00:40:44.400 --> 00:40:46.860 to do anything. Sorry, that's fascinating. I 00:40:46.860 --> 00:40:49.639 innately have zero anxiety about anything ever, 00:40:49.719 --> 00:40:53.880 pretty much. So the deadline, the pressure, it's 00:40:53.880 --> 00:40:56.679 more than pressure, isn't it? The crisis. Yeah. 00:40:57.119 --> 00:41:00.340 is your fuel to perform. Yeah. I need to build 00:41:00.340 --> 00:41:03.000 up in my mind an idea of crisis as well. And 00:41:03.000 --> 00:41:05.420 then I think rationally, I'm like, this isn't 00:41:05.420 --> 00:41:07.619 a big deal. I'll just do it in school or something. 00:41:07.940 --> 00:41:10.820 But in order to convince myself to put any effort 00:41:10.820 --> 00:41:14.659 into anything that I don't enjoy as an activity 00:41:14.659 --> 00:41:18.940 is to produce an internal crisis about it. That's 00:41:18.940 --> 00:41:23.239 fascinating. And so this is your... It's a great 00:41:23.239 --> 00:41:26.219 plan. I'm not being sarcastic. It's a great plan. 00:41:26.340 --> 00:41:30.659 This is you knowing you and knowing what works 00:41:30.659 --> 00:41:33.920 for you as you transition to your next era of 00:41:33.920 --> 00:41:37.320 how to be motivated, how to drive and set yourself 00:41:37.320 --> 00:41:40.920 up for success. And for you, knowing that you 00:41:40.920 --> 00:41:43.860 thrive in this environment, it might be creating 00:41:43.860 --> 00:41:48.219 some of this environment to thrive. Yeah. My 00:41:48.219 --> 00:41:55.309 plan is... I will schedule time in my day, every 00:41:55.309 --> 00:42:01.010 day, to not be scheduled. I'll have a block on 00:42:01.010 --> 00:42:03.489 my schedule that is just, I'll have to, we'll 00:42:03.489 --> 00:42:05.630 come up with some acronym. It'll be this time. 00:42:05.849 --> 00:42:07.809 But it will truly be a time to just sit with 00:42:07.809 --> 00:42:10.449 thoughts and not think about productivity, not 00:42:10.449 --> 00:42:12.710 think about the wallet staples, not think about 00:42:12.710 --> 00:42:18.210 reorganizing my bookshelf. It will be planned 00:42:18.210 --> 00:42:26.530 spontaneity. I like that. Yeah? A little bit 00:42:26.530 --> 00:42:32.510 of an oxymoron. But, you know, the panic -inducing 00:42:32.510 --> 00:42:35.329 productivity is a little bit oxymoronic as well. 00:42:35.389 --> 00:42:40.369 It's panic planfulness. Wow. Beautiful. Sorin, 00:42:40.409 --> 00:42:43.489 I want you to know that I accept every ounce 00:42:43.489 --> 00:42:53.679 of your... spontaneity and lack of planned approaches 00:42:53.679 --> 00:42:58.760 to life, even though it drives me nuts. I see 00:42:58.760 --> 00:43:04.360 you, I respect you, and I accept you. Wow. I 00:43:04.360 --> 00:43:06.940 love your planfulness as it allows for this show 00:43:06.940 --> 00:43:11.199 to be produced. What I'd like to leave are... 00:43:11.440 --> 00:43:14.059 audience with as they sort of digest a little 00:43:14.059 --> 00:43:17.960 bit more about us is um what we've done here 00:43:17.960 --> 00:43:20.340 right we've identified certain personality traits 00:43:20.340 --> 00:43:23.599 about ourselves um and through that self -discovery 00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:27.920 we have enabled ourselves to sort of fabricate 00:43:27.920 --> 00:43:29.840 coping mechanisms that adapt for those things. 00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:33.599 It's essential that we discover ourselves in 00:43:33.599 --> 00:43:37.639 more categorical terms in order to create coping 00:43:37.639 --> 00:43:40.219 mechanisms that work for us. And I would encourage 00:43:40.219 --> 00:43:43.099 our audience to maybe take a personality test, 00:43:43.239 --> 00:43:46.079 maybe try to spend a little bit of time thinking 00:43:46.079 --> 00:43:48.159 about how you respond to the environment around 00:43:48.159 --> 00:43:51.380 you, categorizing your behaviors. in order to 00:43:51.380 --> 00:43:54.599 create coping mechanisms and tools for yourself 00:43:54.599 --> 00:43:57.500 to succeed better in the future. And seek feedback. 00:43:57.780 --> 00:44:00.719 Yeah, 100%. I think that's how we grow as humans 00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:04.780 is get beyond our own opinions and thoughts about 00:44:04.780 --> 00:44:07.500 ourself and ask trusted friends, family members, 00:44:07.639 --> 00:44:14.280 loved ones, and seek feedback and be just able 00:44:14.280 --> 00:44:18.440 to sit with it and grow with it. 100%. Well, 00:44:18.440 --> 00:44:20.820 Soren, until next time. Till next time. This 00:44:20.820 --> 00:44:23.280 was the Inspired Insights podcast. Thank you 00:44:23.280 --> 00:44:25.500 so much for listening. I've been Chris McGlone. 00:44:25.639 --> 00:44:27.519 This has been Soren Peterson. We'll see you next 00:44:27.519 --> 00:44:31.599 week. See you next time. Bye. The Inspired Insights 00:44:31.599 --> 00:44:34.320 podcast has been brought to you by Inspired Consulting 00:44:34.320 --> 00:44:37.599 Group, LLC. Edited and produced by Amanda Seidel 00:44:37.599 --> 00:44:40.559 and Derek Carter. Marketing support for the Inspired 00:44:40.559 --> 00:44:43.139 Insights podcast by Elizabeth Keenan. Music by 00:44:43.139 --> 00:44:47.960 Derek Herter. Please visit www .inspiredcg .com 00:44:47.960 --> 00:44:51.380 to learn more. Copyright 2025. All rights reserved.