Welcome to closer to Christ through general conference
where two friends who love Jesus share our own
approach to studying the most recent general
conference talks. This is Abby and Amy. Let's
jump into it. Today we get to discuss the awesome
talk the eternal gift of testimony by elder Kevin
G Brown of the 70 I was gonna be like my favorite
talk and I know we shouldn't have those but Everybody
we've all been waiting was amazing. I've talked
about it to other people many times I think everybody
was equally excited about it So I've noticed
it's one that just got a lot of attention and
memes and stuff quickly after that the talk was
given So I think it's fair to say it was a favorite
for most people for sure top favorite He touched
on the fact that every son or daughter of God
can gain a deeper, firmer and sure knowledge
for themselves. And he testified with so much
passion and fervor that I think everyone within
the sound of his voice was touched and they believed
him. And I think, man, that's such a beautiful
gift to have. Agreed, Abby. He was on fire with
that talk, I feel like, and it came straight
from his heart. I love that every speaker has
their own specific, and we've talked about this
before, their own specific gifts. that are specific
to them. Spiritual gifts. Yes. And I feel like
he has a gift of testimony. And that's coupled
with speaking from the heart and a contagious
excitement. The trifecta. Seriously. Let's discuss
the three points that he shared. Abby, can you
take that first one? Yes. The first one was God
is our loving Heavenly Father. God is omniscient
and he's omnipotent. Through the light of Christ
and the ministrations of the Holy Ghost, his
influence is everywhere. It is his nature to
bless us. So some things we pull out. He sees
our past, he sees our present and our eternal
destiny. Nothing can be hidden from him. And
from President Russell M. Nelson's invitation
to think celestial, we're encouraged to emulate
our Heavenly Father's vision and nature. Because
of his divine attributes, our Heavenly Father
gives us every good gift, each with his eternal
perspective and vision in mind. That's the first
point. Let's move to the second point. You want
to take that one? Sure. Agency is the gift to
choose and act for ourselves. It's also the responsibility
to choose well. Jesus Christ paid the ultimate
price for that privilege with his precious blood.
And sometimes we might believe the agency means
that we get to do whatever we want to do. But
the fact that the price was paid means that agency
is a sacred gift. It's interesting because when
I grew up, we would always say free agency and
we don't say that anymore because it was, there's
a price for it. It wasn't our price. but there
was a price. We're agents and agents are responsible
for something. I love how he said that. In this
case, we're responsible for the choices that
we make based on the knowledge we have and also
the gifts that we are given. We cannot make a
choice without being responsible for the consequences.
And then he asked a really awesome question that
each of us could ask ourselves. Why do we have
agency? And then he gave his answers that are
so powerful and I felt them to be true in my
heart as he spoke them to choose good To choose
Christ and to choose eternal life and he said
again and again So that tells me that every day
the choices we make determines what we're choosing,
right? Do we want to? Um, live with heavenly
father forever. Do you want something else again?
His teaching style is something that I really
appreciate I love his clear teachings that are
very simple and like nephi aglory and plainness
And i'm referring to the definition the elder
bednar used for plainness, which is clear to
understand I feel like he has that gift as well.
Very good teacher Yeah What i'm glad for is that
I don't feel like I have to duplicate him for
sure to fire me and he's like like be firm Question
your testimony. What things am I passionate about
that I can testify of? But for me, it's totally
cool to just appreciate the way that he delivers
his testimony that he's gained by. difficult
situation that he was raised in. He really had
to refine that testimony. I'll go to the third
point here. Our testimony comes through the power
of the Holy Ghost. A witness from the Holy Ghost
is greater than sight. He is the preeminent witness
of the Father and the Son. President Nelson taught,
in coming days it will not be possible to survive
spiritually without the guiding, directing, comforting,
and constant influence of the Holy Ghost. Testimony
through the Holy Ghost can come in many ways.
Light bulb in a dark room can come on dramatically.
And suddenly, Like the sunrise gradually and
over time can come like rays and light, intermittent
exposure to pure intelligence. I like the fact
that he emphasizes that a testimony comes through
the Holy Ghost. His words were this, whatever
the way, it comes through the Holy Ghost. His
teaching is so clear and his points are pure
doctrine. And I don't think an individual always
has the sunrise moments or the light switch moments,
I think throughout our lives. It just kind of
changes. We got to sit with our daughter as she
received her patriarchal blessing today. There's
a discussion as the patriarch was kind of coming
to understand her and learn a little bit more
about her. And then he said, now I just want
to have a conversation with Lily. So we're in
the room and he's just kind of directing it.
And he just looks at her and he says, Lily, I
want you to know that your heavenly father would
like to communicate with you today. And she just...
Like, she felt that and she had that emotion.
I'm like, we need to follow up tonight and make
sure she knows that that feeling that she felt,
that's not us saying, you should have an emotion
about this. You should feel this way about this
thing. That she had her own personal witness
that the patriarchal blessing was going to be
coming from her heavenly father. And that's so
sweet, Abby. I love it. Like we've talked about
it with primary music. We've talked about it
in a lot of ways. It's important for us as adults
who know what that experience with the spirit
looks like to emphasize it to, you know, new
members of the church or our children or You
know, anybody within the opportunity, when we're
filling it, point it out and let them recognize,
oh, he is, I have felt that more often than I
thought. For sure. Start stacking those up so
that you recognize, you know, that isn't my parents'
testimony to carry on. I have that witness for
myself that this thing that I'm doing is true
and correct. That's great, Abby. I love that
you had that experience today. The gift and witness
of the Holy Ghost are available to everyone.
So he tells each of us that I love this, that
he says, Jamaica is to me like Palmyra was to
Joseph Smith. It is my sacred grove. He says,
I do not know the exact spot where Joseph knelt
to pray in the sacred grove, but I know exactly
where I was when my sacred grove became a reality.
And then he says this, it happened at four Grove
road. in my bathroom at 6 a .m. on a Wednesday,
three years after my baptism. And then he says,
this sacred experience happened because two weeks
earlier an inspired sister missionary invited
me to read the Book of Mormon. These are two
things I like about this. Number one, I want
to ask, what is my sacred grove? Do I have a
time, a place of something that the Holy Ghost
bore truth to my heart? Someone could say, well,
I've been in the church all my life and I don't
really have one, but there probably is a time
when he, the Holy Ghost, bore truth to your heart
on any part of the gospel of Jesus Christ. It
can be any aspect of it. Number two, I love that
he shared what happened before this experience.
He thought to let us in on the fact that he had
read the Book of Mormon, and it's interesting
because this could have gone a different way.
Someone telling the story could have said, I
prayed and nothing happened because they weren't
waiting the two weeks and had not put together
these two corresponding instances. It reminds
me of when someone said the gospel is best understood
looking backwards, meaning that after we followed
the spirit, and lived the principles of the gospel
and acted, used our agency to act upon these
things, then you later look back and you can
connect the dots where God touched our lives
and led us through. Do you think that this is
factual? He was already a member of the church
for three years, but two weeks from the invitation
to read the Book of Mormon is when he received
the witness, which means to me... something sparked
in him a desire to be baptized without knowing
everything and all the paths and all of the history.
Well, he was a teenager. Yeah, he was young.
I think that's what I want to point out to people
too. This is one of those situations where clearly,
you know, why do you do these things? I know
not say that the Lord's command of me. He must
have prayed and said, is this the right thing
for me to do without knowing all of the details?
He allowed the spirit to get him into the church.
And then probably he was doing, making some life
changes and doing things a little bit differently
than he'd done previous to that point. And maybe
age appropriate steps, right? Yeah, the Book
of Mormon is, you know, pretty hefty reading.
Like nowadays, it's like put, put, put on the
speaker and like listening to it or whatever.
Maybe, you know, maybe the cassettes weren't
available. I'm just saying it was maybe more
of a challenging thing. So when the invitation
came, he was totally prepared to use his agency
to say, yeah, I'll do that thing. And I love
that you brought up the point. It wasn't like
he reads and then all of a sudden it's like,
oh, it's done. But he has this experience for
whatever reason. I don't know what per was in
his heart, but that he's showing a time lapse
in between asking the question and receiving
the answer. And that happens a lot in our lives.
Right. He shares a few things why his testimony
is not, why his particular testimony is not temporary.
Well, a testimony doesn't have to be temporary.
He says, a testimony is not given for temporary
use. This gift from our loving Heavenly Father
is meant to be eternal because Heavenly Father
is eternal. A testimony does not, should not
have an expiration date. It should not weaken
or diminish because something in my life has
changed or something in the world has changed.
And I appreciate this. It's basically saying,
when you have a testimony of Jesus Christ, it
doesn't mean that things are going to be peaches
and cream. It doesn't mean that it's not going
to be challenged. It means that you're going
to be forced to treasure that, like the eternal
gift that it is, and always be working to adding
to it and studying what you need to, like if
something's trying to punch a hole at it, like
let that be an opportunity to strengthen it.
Yeah, recommit. I love that. Elder Brown talks
about gifts three times in his talk. But then
I went back and he said the word 16 times in
eternal five times. So the first is a gift of
testimony the second he He likens it unto the
parable and he says that where did I write this?
Okay, growing growing our testimony rather than
burying yeah rather than very exact words I'm
bringing that up because the parable of the talents,
I think it's come up so many times in this conference.
I didn't necessarily pick that out when I was
thinking of the conference weekend right after
it happened. Yeah, but testimony being that too.
I love that he refers to testimony as a gift
and a choice. You know what I mean? Well, my
experience, it was probably at four in the afternoon.
I can't say the address on the podcast, but blank,
blank, blank, blank, Idaho. Anyway, I know where
I was when I received my testimony. of the gospel
of Jesus Christ because I was wanting this aha
moment, but I'd been raised with it all of my
life. And so I know that I've already shared
this on the Pillars and Right Talk, but the second
you start talking about where you were when you
knew the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter -day
Saints was the true gospel, those emotions and
those feelings that I had, I was typing to a
person that was going through a hard time and
I was testifying with things that I needed to
be true. If I'm being honest, when I was typing
them, I was hoping that they were true. They
were things that brought me a lot of peace and
comfort. But as I'm typing it, I'm... Instead
of burying my talents or the testimony and just
like knowing these things for myself, it was
in the process of typing a letter to somebody
that I was hoping could benefit from my testimony
of those things that it was like kind of packaged
for me to say. I was just typing the letter and
I was just like emotional and just crying and
I was like, holy cow, these things are true.
Yeah. So isn't that cool? You took the effort.
Yeah. It wasn't like, just tell me that it's
true. 100%. It was me testifying that it was
true. Me saying, I know this to be true and him
being like, yeah, you know it to be true. How
can I tell you that it's true? You already know
it's true. Totally. It was this sort of... It
was the right way for me to get the answer that
I kind of had always wanted. I love that. And
it did take a little bit of effort. Yeah. And
it took you processing and actually writing it
down. And then, yeah, he said, you've got to
give me something to work with. Yeah. Maybe if
I'd been impressed to bear my testimony often
in sacrament meeting, I would have been accustomed
to getting up there. And one day I'd been like,
oh, these things that I'm saying at the pulpit,
they're mine. That's my truth. I probably wasn't
doing that. It was this moment, sharing it, putting
it out there, knowing that I was intending to
give that testimony to somebody in a hard time.
that he was like, yep, you know it for yourself.
Here's the spirit to confirm that. I won't ever
forget those emotions. Let me go here. Here's
a grand truth, he says, in whatever way a testimony
is given, whether it's distilled like a sunrise
or comes in a glorious vision, it still requires
a choice to receive this precious gift. Saying,
I choose to believe makes it easier to receive
a witness from God. This just pairs with right
exactly what he's saying if we find our testimony
weakening remember that it is the choice we make
that diminishes the power of the testimony Yeah,
I I totally know there are there are things that
have come my way in life that I've questioned
Question things about the gospel of Jesus Christ,
but I always Say I have a testimony of this thing.
That's unshakable How do I reconcile with that
if I'm ready to reconcile I do if I'm not I put
it on a shelf And I work on the things that I
have a testimony of. Oh, yeah. It's good to start
with the things you do know. Testimonies do not
have to go anywhere. We just need to choose to
reconnect with it. Because in that same token,
I can say, I don't understand this thing, and
I'm going to sit and fester on this and focus
all of my energy and effort to that thing that
I don't understand, rather than all the things
I do understand. Because as we focus on the things
we do have a testimony of, our faith increases
and our capacity to understand the thing that
we don't understand. Also, that's kind of like
watering the weeds, right? Where we put our intention,
that's what grows. So it's good to put your intention
in your, you know, water the flowers and the
grass. Some people probably hear that and they
think that you're kind of wiping away things
that should really bother you. They want you
to be equally bothered by the things that are
bothering them. I think everyone is bothered
at a different level with different things and
at different times of your life. You know what
I mean? Because that's how this life is. Sometimes
you're like, oh, I'm totally good right now.
And then maybe another season you're like, wow.
I don't want it to sound like I'm not willing
to address the things that bother me. I'm just
saying the way that I found to deal with them
is to double my efforts on the things that I
do understand. If I have to speculate to get
an answer to the thing that I'm eating, then
it's not the time. Like if the brethren speak
on it or I can find like a search in my gospel
library app, that's great. I go to a podcaster
that's written some... You know, they've stepped
away from the church. They've shown that's where
their agencies led them to step away from it.
They're not tied to this. They don't have to
be tied to it. They go on their way, but they
can never leave the church alone. They're trying
to pull you with them so they can have some company.
But I'm like, what are you here to offer me?
And that's always kept me wanting to make my
focus on the things I do know and understand.
It's magical how he helps. Something said and
you're like, oh. Well, that reconciled that thing
that I was bothered by. It could be like way
later and it's not like you wake up every day
like bothered by this thing, but you put it in
a place when the time when the answers around
for that or I come to it or we come on board
documents to support or teach something. That's
when the time is yeah, I love that he can make
it not something I lose sleep over until that
exactly well also What it feels like to me Abby
when you say quote you put it on a shelf. Yeah,
it's a mental thing It's a mental thing. But
also what that tells me is that you're putting
it you're saying I'm not dealing with this right
now meaning all my focus isn't here But it's
also telling Heavenly Father. This is something
I'm working on Send me things as I continue to
live the gospel of Jesus Christ. Holy send me
things that will help to resolve that That is,
if I were a parent and I was having, and I had
a child who was having an issue, I would say,
continue going on the path you know, and hopefully
something's gonna come along your way that's
gonna help you out with that thing. But sitting
and stewing in something, you're not gonna get
anywhere. Do you know what I mean? 100%. And
because he's perfect and omniscient and wonderful,
then he's going to channel those things your
way and help you. Like you said, whether it's
now or in 10 years or whatever, you will be able
to resolve that. Yeah. And the same token, I
have a mental bookshelf. That means I have every
intention of coming back to it until it can fit
into just the normal bookshelf. You didn't burn
it. You didn't bury it. Yeah. But there are other
things that like I hear and I'm just like, that
is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. And it's
not even going to, it's in a trash can. I mentally
put it, I carry it and put it in a trash bin.
I'm like, good try buddy. That was not worth
the time. Get a better argument for me to lose
this testimony that I've worked hard for. Yes.
So he says this, I invite you to think about
your path to assure witness of Jesus Christ and
his gospel. He's asking each one of us within
the sound of his voice to think about our path,
take charge of your testimony, use your agency
wisely and acknowledge the giver and all glory,
all of his glorious attributes. I bear witness
that the power is within you. No one can choose
for you. No one can take this gift away. you
can choose to believe. Abby, I think this is
one of the reasons you said, I listened to him
and he gave it in a certain way. He gave it with
his own gifts and in his own way. I think another
thing he, the reason you feel empowered is because
he talked, he spoke to each one of us and said,
yeah, you, you, you, you know, saying like, take
charge of it. Yes, this I'm sharing my testimony.
Find yours, use yours and bring it to life if
it's not right now. I love it. He makes us a
promise. He says, as you do this, your testimony
will be a well of living water springing up onto
everlasting life. It's great. It's like when
you have that moment and that connection and
you find that testimony for yourself in whatever
way that it comes, sometimes an aha, sometimes,
you know, just like the sunrise, sometimes a
light switch or whatever. That is not a singular
experience. It's meant to be eternal. So like
the refreshing of that should happen regularly.
So I love that he used well of living water on
that one. It will be an anchor and a motivator.
It'll sustain you through difficult times. It
will enable you to develop spiritual gifts. It
will help you in your personal ministry and service.
It will be a weapon against Satan and your adversaries.
Your testimony will be a joy as you see it replicated
in your children, grandchildren, great grandchildren,
and in those you love and serve. It will be powerful
when you share it and use it to test. justify.
So that promise makes it so obvious why a lot
of people struggle with grasping what their spiritual
gifts are. They're taught by Satan that they
don't have any, or that that gift isn't worth
anything. that are like less important, like
it's a stacking of gifts that aren't that great.
You can tell why he does that. He's afraid that
once you find out what your spiritual gifts are,
Oh, he's absolutely afraid of it. When you recognize
what they are, you will be a thorn in his side.
You will be a weapon against Satan with these
awesome spiritual gifts that we have, with a
body to utilize that spiritual gift, then paired
with a physical body to do something about it.
Very powerful. I'm getting like tingles in my
head thinking about what that looks like from
the mouth of elder Kevin G Brown when he I mean,
I'm sure he was one of those guys in heaven when
some of us were like, I don't know if this is
a good idea. He's like, let's do this. Send me
to the hardest place on earth. Make it difficult
to get that testimony. You can send me anywhere.
I believe in Jesus. I believe he's going to do
what he's going to do. I'll help you. For sure.
He was testifying then and he had that testimony.
So he found it when he got to earth. He's found
that voice and he has used it for such good.
Satan's afraid of him. I love that Abby. Um,
I also, okay, this is so fantastic. So this is
one last thing to think about. He says, if you
know, you know, which we, for our past three
testimony meetings, it has been brought up. And
they reference a person that re -brought it up.
So I love it. And I know it comes from this.
It was so powerful. When something's powerful,
it moves you to take action. We have seen that
in our own ward, in our own community. He says,
we need more sure witnesses of Jesus Christ in
his gospel. Get there. Seek it. It is urgent.
This is the final dispensation, the dispensation
of the fullness of times." Just saying those
words, I feel the strength of them. And I love
that he's calling, like you said, Abby, he's
testifying loudly and boldly and clearly with
very clear doctrine. And I love that he says,
we need more sure witnesses of Jesus Christ in
his gospel. I totally want to stand up with him
and say like, Yeah, I'm on the team. You know?
It's late in the game to be switching sides.
And if you've picked a side, do it more boldly.
Do it more. Do it more. Yeah. Love it. In closing,
I'll just end with his words. He says, Brothers
and sisters, a testimony of Jesus Christ was
never meant to be a temporary gift. Nothing about
it is temporary. Not the giver, not the gift
itself, not the deliverer of the gift. not who
the gift is about. Wow. May your testimony be
described in this way, though heaven and earth
shall pass away, your testimony and witness of
the gospel of Jesus Christ will not pass away.
Now is the time to lay hold on this precious
gift in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen. Amen.
Spend this week figuring out the weapon that
you've been blessed with to fight off Satan.
Thanks for being with us. We'll catch you next
time. See you next time.