Welcome to closer to Christ through conference.
We're two friends who love Jesus and his gospel sharing our own approach to conference.
So today we're going to do a dive into Jeffrey R. Holland's talk, Motions of a Hidden Fire.
Okay, so the part that I loved about it, it was interesting because I read through the
entire talk and my prayer was, help me to know what is the best part for me to talk
about.
And so that just means who knows what that means.
Does it mean for anyone who's listening?
Does it mean in my own process?
But whatever it was, it truly did jump out and it was awesome because it like there wasn't
even a question.
I read it.
It was like being I copied it was just a very fluid motion and I love that.
So this is what stuck out to me.
When we don't know how or exactly what to pray, we should begin and continue until the
Holy Spirit guides us into the prayer we should be offering.
I loved this part of what he said and actually the entire talk, I mean, how can you not love
it, right?
Loved every bit of it.
Especially after not hearing from him for a couple of conferences.
Yeah, I know we missed him.
We missed him.
So then my question was, you know, how can my prayers be guided by the Holy Spirit?
And truly there have been times when I just did, you know, kind of the basic prayers,
you know, I think every person evolves in their prayers and in their relationship with
Heavenly Father, the way they talk to him, the way they understand and receive answers
from him.
And I did have a priesthood blessing at one time that said that my said something to the
effect that I would talk to Heavenly Father for hours.
And I just thought to myself, number one, where am I going to find the time?
Number two, it's kind of hard for me to even keep my train of thought sometimes, you know,
like I might fall asleep while I'm praying or whatever it was at the time.
And so I just thought, huh, that's interesting.
So I shelved it, you know, went on with my life.
Well now, I think it was like it was last year, last January, I was prayer journaling.
And that's something for me, my attention span, I mean, my thoughts can go all over
the place, right?
So prayer journaling for me is when I write down on a piece of paper, some people type
it, I write it, dear Heavenly Father, and then I just start talking to him.
But I'm writing it down.
And so for me, it's very effective in keeping my focus on him.
I remember what I'm doing and I can keep my train of thought.
So that's just for me.
But I started doing that and I was truly going through, I had lots and lots of questions.
It was like a string of questions.
And once one was answered, it was like, okay, then I need this.
Okay, thank you.
Then I need this.
And it just kept went on and on and on.
And I remember I had a temple appointment at like 11 o'clock, maybe it's one o'clock
that afternoon.
And I somehow the time just passed so quickly.
And I all of a sudden everything stopped.
And it was like, you better get ready for the temple as a kind of a thought that I heard.
And I was like, okay, I mean, I guess I could do it that early.
Looked at my clock.
And I was like time to throw a dress on brush my teeth at the door.
So I was like, Oh my gosh, that actually is true even for someone like me, who I never
would have seen that happen.
Right.
And I love prayer journaling, that's something that I love to do.
I don't do it every time I pray.
But when I have very specific questions, they need to formulate, I need to write down and
I really would like to record the impressions that I hear or feel Heavenly Father speaking
to me.
I love those because I can always go back and revisit them.
And it kind of is like it feels like a personal scripture to me in that they're just very,
you know, mundane everyday things.
But to me, they mean everything, because it's the direction I get from Heavenly Father.
I'm going to interject here because you taught me about prayer journaling.
And I remember at the time when you were talking about I remember a couple of friends, like
they really grasp on that.
And that was like something they were wanting to do, needing to do.
I'm like, I don't really, there's nothing like that pressing in my life that I felt
like a need for it.
But I shelved it at that time.
And then like fast forward some time and there was that talk, President Nelson, he asked
us to like forgive somebody that we'd like been holding on to something before.
So something had happened in my life and I was like, it was like kind of stalling me.
I was like, I want to forgive them.
I'm like, I don't even know like what words to say.
Like I don't need to have them like have this communication back.
But it was like that whole experience.
And so I put that to per journal because I knew I was going to meet with a stake president
and kind of like put my emotions out there.
But I'm like, I don't even know what I'm going to say to him.
And so I opened it up.
I was like in preparation for that.
What do I want to say?
What do I want the end outcome to be?
Not maybe a resolve of the situation that had happened, but like for me to feel that
peace and be able to shut the door on this thing that had happened.
And so I opened that as a prayer journal thing.
And then I was able to kind of say, you know, at the end of that prayer that it was like,
and that this forgiveness would, I'd feel that in my heart for the situation.
I was like, that was the coolest experience because if I just were to sit down on my knees
and pray about that, I'm not sure how long I would have sat there or what I would have
thought.
But to think of, I don't know, like writing an English paper that was a prayer.
It was a unique thing because that's just not what prayer has been for me in the past.
And like I said, it's not like an everyday thing in your life opening this prayer.
But when there's stuff that's really having your mind and your thoughts are kind of jumbled,
for me, it was a really good way to say, what am I thinking?
What am I trying to process?
What the resolve that I'm looking for?
And also when the answers come, you kind of finish out that per journal with the response
to the prayer in that moment.
And then you've got that like documenting like, I was really going through this hard
time.
This was what was on my mind and this is what the Spirit impressed me to do.
So there's so much place for it.
So I'm hoping like for a listener that's like, that is weird or strange.
I've never heard of that before.
That if it might feel like, oh, that's how you pray all day and all night.
You open a prayer, but you don't really close it as you're waiting for those little pieces
of information to come and kind of trickle down on you.
And then have it to reflect on later when you're like, does he really answer my prayers?
And then you kind of have, oh, look at this prayer that I asked and this is how he answered
it.
There's multiple benefits to it.
So if it feels good now, great, use it.
And if it seems kind of strange to you now, put it on a shelf.
That's one of those things.
And maybe at some point in your life, it's just the thing that you're going to need.
Yes.
And it's funny.
Because you brought that up.
I have a friend who she drives her kids back and forth.
It seems like all day, you know, for different things.
And she was like, Amy, that's not the way prayer journaling to sit, actually sit down,
pick up a pen and start writing.
She's like, that's, I don't have time for that.
It sounds like the worst thing ever.
And she said, I was kind of mourning that fact.
And I was driving one of my kids to his, you know, his bike, whatever he had some lessons.
And she said, I just felt heavenly father say, Kirsten, I know where to find you.
You don't have to be writing down.
That's not the way your brain works.
And I loved it because she had a different way to do it.
And she heavenly father knew where to find her.
So really, it is it's just if you want clarity, if writing is your thing, that's great.
Other times, I'll open up my phone and I'll just do a voice memo.
Like if I'm driving, let's say back from the temple or wherever, and I need to clarify
my thoughts in that way, I record it in that way.
So just if you're a verbal processor, if you whatever way you process, get to know yourself,
because heavenly father will speak to you in that way.
Well, who doesn't feel like a chauffeur sometimes, but you know, you're using that time with
your kid in the car where you're getting him to the event.
But sometimes you have 15 or 20 minute wait in between and the car is pretty quiet and
the silent you found your found a quiet place in that carpool situation.
Truly.
And the Lord will find you there.
Yes.
So it was interesting because when I did read this, I'll just share this little bit and
then I would love to hear some things that you have to say, Abby.
It was interesting because I had just this was back in March.
I had just finished giving a guided visual visualization for a really large group.
And I literally had gotten back into the car, picked up my phone, kind of looked at, you
know, the messages that I'd missed while I was in that engagement.
And I see a text from my sister in law.
And she just said, Your name came to me.
Please pray for me right now.
My dad's in the hospital.
And he's in a coma.
And I was just like, Oh my gosh.
And so think of it like my mind had to switch gears really quick.
And it felt like a very heavy, no, I shouldn't say heavy.
It felt like a prayer that deserved respect and time and my best.
So I wasn't really sure what to pray.
Just like Elder Holland said.
And so I just started.
And what I did again, you already know why I do this is because it helps to clarify my
thoughts and to guide me.
But I started just texting in my phone.
I pray Heavenly Fathers that angels will attend my sister in law and her dad.
I pray that his family who have passed will attend the doctors and assistants and physicians.
You can tell I'm still just, I don't really know where I'm going, but I'm asking for all
the things who have charge over his care that heaven's best will assist heaven's, sorry,
let me say that again, that heaven's best will assist earth's best in his care, that
he will hear and feel that he's still here on earth.
And then this is a part where you can tell that I connected with the Holy Ghost and my,
he started directing the prayer because you can tell it changes that he remember this
is her dad who was in a coma, that he will make the decision for what is best for his
earthly body to stay or to finish up his earthly ministry and begin a heavenly ministry.
So essentially it was saying, you know, of course we enact agency and he gets to choose.
And then at the last one was we are so grateful for a heart that gave and gave and gave.
He's touched so many lives with his quiet service, always with a smile.
And you can kind of see it went into past tense.
He did end up passing away that night.
And my first thought was, Oh no, she asked, she reached out and asked me to help pray
for her.
And of course that means that her dad will live, right?
That's what we always want.
As I felt it take a turn, I was like, Oh no, I hope she doesn't feel like this was my will
and it just felt like your prayer became an intertwined knowledge of what his will was
for then you could kind of prepare because you're still here on this earthly life.
You're such good friends with the sister-in-law and you can then be there to help her with
whatever needs she has.
And that's exactly what has happened.
Yes.
And it adds as much pain and sadness and grief and loss as it was and shock that he was gone
so quickly.
There have been so many blessings of him being on the other side, like a list of them.
And who would have ever known that the heavenly father, you know what I mean?
So that was just something that was very interesting and definitely the Holy Ghost guided and directed
that because I had no idea what was going to happen.
Absolutely.
When you don't know, start somewhere.
Yep.
Which was the point.
I think I'm going to jump off with that.
You said so many things that just resonated with me when you said you opened a prayer
to say like, what should I bring up?
What should I talk about in the podcast?
What I wanted to say about that was that with 100% certainty when I opened that prayer,
I knew I've already listened to Elder Holland's talk for myself.
I got those spiritual impressions.
I wrote those down.
So that was my initial thing.
I am going to look at this talk multiple times later, but when I looked at the talk this
most recent time, it was definitely with the intention of this audience that I have no
idea who it is.
I don't know their faces and I don't know what they look like, but I said, heavenly
father, what message is pertinent to bring up?
So yes, it is for me in the way that I was like, oh, this is good.
This is good.
This is something that I want to focus on.
But I do think somebody's ears are meant to hear this.
That wasn't necessarily for me.
Just like when I prepare a primary lesson, I'm like, here's the information.
I'm digesting this information and then what the kids want to run with.
That's what we're going to run with.
So just making the point that when I bring stuff up in this podcast, it's because the
prayer has been for the audience members, not necessarily what I need to get out of
it.
So what stood out to me in this passing was, I mean, there's a million things.
We really, really could talk about any paragraph and go in any different tangent.
We could talk about his experience on the edge of eternities.
I could be a whole really sighted listener or discussion with friends, but that's not
where my mind went.
My mind went to him talking about his beloved wife passing and the emotion that was tied
to that.
You can just feel the deep love that he gained for her over there, what he said, 60 years
of marriage.
He said that she wrote a talk once and it was entitled, Fulfilling the Measure of Your
Creation.
So of course, that's what I want to talk about.
Fulfilling the Measure of Your Creation.
He said of her, it seems to me that she fulfilled the measure of her creation more successfully
than anyone could have ever dreamed possible.
She was a complete daughter of God, an exemplary woman of Christ.
And I thought that is the most tender words to associate to his wife.
I wouldn't say that I know Pat that well.
I've seen her in snippets of different things, but just the support and love she gave her
husband and I know that he couldn't be who he is without her.
And so I just say, okay, how much I love Elder Holland?
I'm confident that I would have loved Pat that much.
So what I wanted to talk about was what we sometimes do with ourselves.
We look at somebody like Pat Holland and we say, man, she is amazing and she's perfect
and she's an exemplary daughter of God.
And we look at who she became over years and with life experience.
Her current self.
Yeah, that really developed physical and spiritual person.
And we think that we have to be there so immediately.
That's her age, right?
Right.
Her age against, not against, but versus or we just compare that.
Exactly.
And I think it's a very apt summary of her.
I think it describes her perfectly in every way, but I just want the listener to look
at the process of refinement that happens over so many years when it relates to that
word filling the measure of your creation.
We're spiritual beings long before we came to earth.
We have the snippet here and then we still have a lot of life, eternities that we still
grow and develop.
And so I think it's wise advice to periodically check in with Heavenly Father and say, am
I filling the measure of my creation?
Because he knows our capacity probably better than us.
And if we ask the question, then he can say like, hey, you're ready for a little bit more.
You ask the question, daughter, like, let me give you a little bit more.
And then you do that thing and you fill that measure of your creation and then you do a
little bit more.
I think sometimes we know what the end goal is.
We know what the end goal is.
And so we just kind of want to race through that process and get there so quickly.
Quickly going to say, Amy mentioned doing a meditation.
There's some different things that she does, but like we'll do like a yoga class.
And she one time had us in this garden that we created for ourselves and we're sitting
on a bench and we're expecting this guest to arrive.
And we are just, we just know this emotion.
We are so excited to have that guest be joining us.
Well, lo and behold, it's yourself five years from now that you're so excited to see.
And you have this conversation and you share these things and it's like, you're just the
best of friends because it's you.
And I know it's such a strange thing, but I'm like, I was so emotional about it because
I think I was in a growth, like kind of a growth period right then and knew what I wanted
to be, but knew I wasn't where I wanted to be.
And you just kind of fast forwarded me forward like five years and I saw that person and
I thought, I am so excited.
I'm so excited about this person.
And I'm like, I'm going to say that's probably been a few years.
Like I'm, I'm only like two years away from being that person that I'm excited to see
five years from.
So the periodic check in, like what I, what I wanted to suggest was when you hear
that make sure to ask yourself a few questions.
Are you comparing yourself to someone's absolute best when you're, when you're trying to make
it the judgment or if you're filling the major recreation, can you give yourself the grace
that you need to grow into the major recreation?
Can you give yourself the time and the patience and allow opportunities and experiences to
happen in your life that are going to grow you into that person that you eventually want
to become?
And then just ask yourself, what can I do today that might be bring bright, bring me
a little closer to Jesus Christ than I was yesterday?
I love that.
So just to point, I'm kind of pointing this out because it's something I've done myself.
I'm looking at somebody's best and think, I'm never going to be that good.
That is not the way that the Savior ever intended us to become like him.
Look at him as the example.
Look at like associate yourself with others around you that are going to help you to want
to be that changed person, but then give yourself that time and allow those experiences to happen,
you know, through series of years, through a series of calling through whatever you're
doing raising your children or with your relationship with your spouse or whatever.
There's a million and one things.
And so of course it would be easy to say of Pat Holland that she certainly filled the
major recreation.
I could say that about her, but I think I could say that about each of you as a listener.
Give yourself the grace to know that as long as you're in the process of trying to fill
the major creation, even if you're not there in that moment, that it's definitely going
to come and that you are actively engaged in that process.
That's all we're asked to do in this life.
I love that.
100%.
Those are two snippets, guys.
I'm hoping that you did read through the talk or that you're like, Oh, I need to go back
to that talk and see, you know, what's there for me.
And you might be like, why, why did they pick those two things of all things?
Well, because we're two people.
Yeah, we're two people looking at a conference talk, but there could be so many more things
that you could delve into again, like with yourself, you could, you could say what stood
out to you and you know, relook at it or, you know, some friends, you could say, Hey,
this stood out to me.
What stood out to you?
So don't let this be the last bit that you've taken a look at elder Holland's words.
There's so much more to be gathered there.
If we wanted to talk for an hour, we could keep talking about the talks, but we're going
to wrap it up because I think we're, we're about there at the 15 minute mark, but we
hope that you maybe saw some things in the talk that you hadn't really saw, saw before
and that it sparks you to kind of look at the way that you're praying a little bit differently
and say, can I add that to my, can I add that to my list of ways to pray when I really need
to communicate this message, need to get something across.
And then as far as filling the measure of your creation, that you're excited of where
you're at, but if that you can see room for growth, that's, that's an action step that
you designed that's going to help fill that little last major.
And then just know some years are going to pass.
If you ask the question again, you have capacity for more.
It's filling the measure of your creation, you know, five years from now is going to
look different than what it looked like to be full five years ago.
Absolutely.
And that's the whole plan, right?
Right.
Line up online.
Thanks for joining us.
We'll see you next time.
Streets.
Thank you.