WEBVTT 00:00:46.539 --> 00:00:50.960 Welcome to over educating under employed I Am 00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:53.060 really excited to bring you this episode this 00:00:53.060 --> 00:00:56.740 week. We've got Sam Lipkin from flagpole magazine 00:00:56.740 --> 00:01:02.579 and volumes hip -hop and We had a really great 00:01:02.579 --> 00:01:06.180 conversation She has a really cool story. I can't 00:01:06.180 --> 00:01:08.900 wait for you to hear it I hope everybody has 00:01:08.900 --> 00:01:11.579 a wonderful Thanksgiving is spending time with 00:01:11.579 --> 00:01:14.260 people that mean something to them I'm really 00:01:14.260 --> 00:01:17.719 thankful for a lot this year. And I really just 00:01:17.719 --> 00:01:21.200 want here to thank everybody that's been a part 00:01:21.200 --> 00:01:24.939 of this podcast this year. I have gotten to talk 00:01:24.939 --> 00:01:28.019 to some people that I never would have imagined. 00:01:29.280 --> 00:01:32.560 And I've gotten some amazing stories and I'm 00:01:32.560 --> 00:01:35.700 really thankful that I've been able to share 00:01:35.700 --> 00:01:38.959 those with y 'all. We got a lot more coming. 00:01:39.420 --> 00:01:43.599 Next week we've got John Neff from Japan cakes 00:01:43.599 --> 00:01:47.280 and of course the drive -by truckers and Then 00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:50.719 in two weeks, we've got Jim chemo West who was 00:01:50.719 --> 00:01:55.180 just nominated for more Grammy Awards. He's Got 00:01:55.180 --> 00:01:59.099 a Grammy already For his slack key guitar work, 00:01:59.180 --> 00:02:03.159 but as he is most famous for being the guitar 00:02:03.159 --> 00:02:05.260 player for weird Al Yankovic for the last 40 00:02:05.260 --> 00:02:09.669 years We had a really great conversation His 00:02:09.669 --> 00:02:13.150 story is really amazing. Thanks for listening 00:02:13.150 --> 00:02:15.150 y 'all. I really appreciate y 'all being a part 00:02:15.150 --> 00:02:17.590 of this. Hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving. 00:02:18.289 --> 00:02:20.949 Here's my interview with Sam Lipkin. Travel safe. 00:02:21.750 --> 00:02:26.090 I'm here with Sam Lipkin. She is the editing 00:02:26.090 --> 00:02:29.830 coordinator at Flagpole magazine as well as a 00:02:29.830 --> 00:02:32.229 creator with Volumes Hip Hop. Are you still with 00:02:32.229 --> 00:02:36.379 them? Yeah, I own... That's yours. Okay. Awesome. 00:02:36.740 --> 00:02:40.039 Okay. So 90 % of volumes is me. Awesome. Awesome. 00:02:40.439 --> 00:02:44.199 I have used y 'all as a resource before like 00:02:44.199 --> 00:02:48.039 at a fest. Your hip hop calendar was like very 00:02:48.039 --> 00:02:51.319 useful. But I didn't realize like how closely 00:02:51.319 --> 00:02:53.000 tied to that, which is why I have you here to 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:56.620 find out all the things that you do. And I'm 00:02:56.620 --> 00:02:58.060 going to start with the first question I ask 00:02:58.060 --> 00:03:01.319 everybody, which is what's the first song that 00:03:01.319 --> 00:03:05.199 you remember loving as a kid? Interesting. The 00:03:05.199 --> 00:03:08.680 first song I remember loving, I would definitely 00:03:08.680 --> 00:03:11.539 say it would have to have been a Pink Floyd song. 00:03:11.599 --> 00:03:17.860 Yeah. So I actually very young. I had as a toddler, 00:03:18.419 --> 00:03:21.020 I was at my aunt and uncle's house and accidentally 00:03:21.020 --> 00:03:24.199 came in while they were watching the wall. Oh, 00:03:24.219 --> 00:03:28.300 wow. And I was like. fascinated. I was enthralled 00:03:28.300 --> 00:03:30.979 by this. And then I would beg to watch whatever 00:03:30.979 --> 00:03:35.560 that movie was. And I just had a really, obviously 00:03:35.560 --> 00:03:38.659 inappropriate for such a young child, but whatever 00:03:38.659 --> 00:03:42.680 it was about it. Kind of a unique way. Yeah, 00:03:42.900 --> 00:03:45.060 you know what I mean? Like, it's just like really 00:03:45.060 --> 00:03:48.280 heavy and intense. It's not like it's inappropriate 00:03:48.280 --> 00:03:51.659 in the way that like the South Park movie is 00:03:51.659 --> 00:03:55.159 or something like that. Most of what is inappropriate 00:03:55.159 --> 00:03:57.699 is going to go over your head. Yeah. But because 00:03:57.699 --> 00:04:00.360 of that, I feel like it probably was the wall 00:04:00.360 --> 00:04:02.659 part two or something like that was probably 00:04:02.659 --> 00:04:05.259 my first favorite song just because it played 00:04:05.259 --> 00:04:08.199 on the radio all the time. And I definitely had 00:04:08.199 --> 00:04:11.259 a paint Floyd connection. What's so interesting 00:04:11.259 --> 00:04:14.780 is I wouldn't say it's universal, but it's super 00:04:14.780 --> 00:04:18.970 common for that memory. to be tied to a movie 00:04:18.970 --> 00:04:24.589 for people. That is interesting. Yeah. Like Mary 00:04:24.589 --> 00:04:27.069 was talking about the Big Chill soundtrack. I 00:04:27.069 --> 00:04:29.050 don't think she's, she wasn't the movie, but 00:04:29.050 --> 00:04:32.870 the soundtrack was something that J. Roddy Walston 00:04:32.870 --> 00:04:36.290 was on here and he told me that it was Twist 00:04:36.290 --> 00:04:39.670 and Shout watching Ferris Bueller. Okay. So it's 00:04:39.670 --> 00:04:43.649 just, it's really interesting how that seems 00:04:43.649 --> 00:04:47.699 to be a very common thing. Yeah, so tied to the 00:04:47.699 --> 00:04:50.399 visual. It's got to be something with just how 00:04:50.399 --> 00:04:53.899 young we are and how memories form. Yeah, but 00:04:53.899 --> 00:04:58.420 I do like think of movies a lot when I hear certain 00:04:58.420 --> 00:05:00.879 songs, right? There's certain songs that get 00:05:00.879 --> 00:05:04.199 like very tied to scenes. I think like Twist 00:05:04.199 --> 00:05:07.620 and Shout's a great example of that. And then 00:05:07.620 --> 00:05:10.100 Pink Floyd's like a whole other level. That's 00:05:10.100 --> 00:05:12.319 it. Because they're like intentionally making 00:05:12.319 --> 00:05:16.060 this visual experience. One of my favorite soundtracks 00:05:16.060 --> 00:05:18.740 when I was a kid was the Armageddon soundtrack. 00:05:19.360 --> 00:05:21.779 And my parents had that CD and we would listen 00:05:21.779 --> 00:05:24.699 to it all the time in the car. And I still just 00:05:24.699 --> 00:05:28.980 think of that as a great example of great movie, 00:05:29.519 --> 00:05:34.339 amazing soundtrack. So where did it go from there? 00:05:34.379 --> 00:05:38.759 What did you grow up listening to? A lot of classic 00:05:38.759 --> 00:05:42.300 rock for sure. I would say up till middle school. 00:05:42.519 --> 00:05:46.500 Very into classic rock. A lot of times through 00:05:46.500 --> 00:05:51.120 video games I found like Nine Inch Nails and 00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:53.680 Ozzy and it was so funny because when I would 00:05:53.680 --> 00:05:57.959 and Rob Zombie and Eight years old telling my 00:05:57.959 --> 00:06:01.879 dad like oh this song and my game is so cool 00:06:01.879 --> 00:06:04.579 And my dad would be like I guess it's time. Here's 00:06:04.579 --> 00:06:12.160 my CD So my parents weren't really too concerned 00:06:12.160 --> 00:06:14.319 with what I was listening to and things like 00:06:14.319 --> 00:06:18.019 that. So a lot of that and then, and you grew 00:06:18.019 --> 00:06:20.300 up in the age of like parental advisory stickers 00:06:20.300 --> 00:06:23.579 and all that. So they probably knew when you 00:06:23.579 --> 00:06:26.639 were listening to stuff that yeah, I will say 00:06:26.639 --> 00:06:29.980 in sixth grade is when I started riding the bus. 00:06:29.980 --> 00:06:32.420 So I would get up early in the morning and watch 00:06:32.420 --> 00:06:35.699 all the MTV music videos. And that was my first 00:06:35.699 --> 00:06:39.040 exposure to things other than what my parents 00:06:39.040 --> 00:06:43.100 listened to. And my dad got upset with my grandmother 00:06:43.100 --> 00:06:47.319 because I got my grandmother to take me to music 00:06:47.319 --> 00:06:50.040 store, Sam Goodies, actually. I worked at a Sam 00:06:50.040 --> 00:06:52.100 Goodies for several years. Yeah. My grandmother 00:06:52.100 --> 00:06:56.240 took me to the Sam Goodies and I bought the first 00:06:56.240 --> 00:06:59.579 Gorillaz CD and it had a parental advisory sticker 00:06:59.579 --> 00:07:01.759 on it. And I got it home. And just because my 00:07:01.759 --> 00:07:05.120 dad had no idea what it was, he was like, upset 00:07:05.120 --> 00:07:07.480 with her. Do you know what this means? And he's 00:07:07.480 --> 00:07:10.949 like, what are you listening to? Was that kind 00:07:10.949 --> 00:07:13.050 of like was that one of your first like forays 00:07:13.050 --> 00:07:15.089 into hip -hop cuz then the automators all over 00:07:15.089 --> 00:07:18.970 that and yes I think like girl like early grill 00:07:18.970 --> 00:07:25.290 is especially like very Yeah, yeah Yeah, it really 00:07:25.290 --> 00:07:29.189 is. I would say that was my first exposure to 00:07:29.189 --> 00:07:31.889 There's all these things on the radio and nothing 00:07:31.889 --> 00:07:35.470 really clicked with me and I was really into 00:07:35.470 --> 00:07:37.910 gorillas. I still am. Yeah. Yeah, and that was 00:07:37.910 --> 00:07:41.930 definitely my First exposure to some of the more 00:07:41.930 --> 00:07:46.449 lyrical hip -hop. Yeah, but I I grew up in North, 00:07:46.449 --> 00:07:51.649 Georgia Extremely predominantly white very conservative. 00:07:51.750 --> 00:07:54.769 I just didn't have a lot of exposure like a smaller 00:07:54.769 --> 00:07:58.110 town very small town I didn't have exposure to 00:07:58.110 --> 00:08:00.329 hip -hop that wasn't just what was on the radio. 00:08:00.689 --> 00:08:04.750 Yeah Me neither. No, I got really known the more 00:08:04.750 --> 00:08:07.589 underground stuff in the early 2000s and mid 00:08:07.589 --> 00:08:11.529 -2000s A lot of that stuff was like even side 00:08:11.529 --> 00:08:13.689 projects of people that were affiliated like 00:08:13.689 --> 00:08:15.649 working with the gorillas and stuff like that 00:08:15.649 --> 00:08:20.889 like Tron 30 30 comes to mind or Like black star 00:08:20.889 --> 00:08:24.350 like most definitely which was like mainstream, 00:08:24.389 --> 00:08:27.629 but even that record was not I also can really 00:08:27.629 --> 00:08:30.170 relate to the video game thing I actually had 00:08:30.170 --> 00:08:34.409 an early episode of this episode where this podcast 00:08:34.409 --> 00:08:36.929 where I just rambled about video games and music 00:08:36.929 --> 00:08:41.129 for 20 minutes because I really think and maybe 00:08:41.129 --> 00:08:43.129 ties back to the thing with movies too is like 00:08:43.129 --> 00:08:45.629 there's something about music being tied to an 00:08:45.629 --> 00:08:49.870 experience and when you're watching a movie that's 00:08:49.870 --> 00:08:51.529 an experience but when you're playing a game 00:08:51.529 --> 00:08:56.470 like that's like very interactive and very I 00:08:56.470 --> 00:09:00.210 never got into club music really but then I started 00:09:00.210 --> 00:09:03.070 playing like Beat Saber and now I'm like into 00:09:03.070 --> 00:09:06.090 some of that stuff because of the experience 00:09:06.090 --> 00:09:09.159 I had listening to it like What are some of the 00:09:09.159 --> 00:09:10.940 examples of like video game music that you were 00:09:10.940 --> 00:09:13.279 getting into as a kid or that really? Called 00:09:13.279 --> 00:09:15.580 to you because I think that's such an interesting 00:09:15.580 --> 00:09:18.399 kind of Yeah, and it's the ones I already named 00:09:18.399 --> 00:09:21.340 a little like there. My dad had this PlayStation 00:09:21.340 --> 00:09:25.500 1 game called sled storm. Okay, and That's where 00:09:25.500 --> 00:09:28.799 I first heard Rob zombies Dracula and I yeah 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:31.500 I found in the settings where you could pick 00:09:31.500 --> 00:09:33.960 the songs that were playing and I would just 00:09:33.960 --> 00:09:38.309 play that over and over again playing Midnight 00:09:38.309 --> 00:09:43.990 clubs three on the ps2 was where I heard The 00:09:43.990 --> 00:09:46.350 hand that feeds by nine -inch nails. Yeah. Yeah, 00:09:46.350 --> 00:09:48.850 so that got me really in the nine -inch nails 00:09:48.850 --> 00:09:52.230 That net record was like they're they're like 00:09:52.230 --> 00:09:55.210 big comeback after a while like I thought Was 00:09:55.210 --> 00:09:58.809 that with teeth? Yes. Yeah, and yeah that record 00:09:58.809 --> 00:10:03.649 Was is one of my favorite nine -inch nails Good 00:10:03.649 --> 00:10:06.450 a good entry point to nine -inch nails for people 00:10:06.450 --> 00:10:08.990 like that are a little younger for sure because 00:10:08.990 --> 00:10:10.929 I get the impression I think we're about the 00:10:10.929 --> 00:10:13.590 same age. I'm 39. I think you're probably Yeah, 00:10:14.049 --> 00:10:16.070 I was like I think you're younger than me, but 00:10:16.070 --> 00:10:18.149 a lot of the people I've interviewed are older 00:10:18.149 --> 00:10:24.009 than me It's interesting and I think like an 00:10:24.009 --> 00:10:29.710 older millennial like me relates to both like 00:10:30.029 --> 00:10:36.110 Gen X in some aspects and then also like solidly 00:10:36.110 --> 00:10:40.250 millennial people like yourself Because I still 00:10:40.250 --> 00:10:43.169 remember a time without the internet, but I also 00:10:43.169 --> 00:10:46.090 had it young enough to where it was never like 00:10:46.090 --> 00:10:49.809 This is foreign to me and video games I think 00:10:49.809 --> 00:10:52.330 is something like that's the dividing thing where 00:10:52.330 --> 00:10:55.389 like a lot of people that are older than me They 00:10:55.389 --> 00:10:57.529 might have played games or whatever, but it's 00:10:57.529 --> 00:11:00.980 oh, yeah, I really liked Pac -Man or Yeah, or 00:11:00.980 --> 00:11:04.600 it's one or two games And they didn't really 00:11:04.600 --> 00:11:06.940 carry over into it. I'm like Millennials like 00:11:06.940 --> 00:11:11.879 we stay gamers I just happen to grow up in a 00:11:11.879 --> 00:11:15.720 gamer household parents are very young and Both 00:11:15.720 --> 00:11:18.519 of my parents play video games. Yeah, and so 00:11:18.519 --> 00:11:21.720 it wasn't a It wasn't like video games are bad 00:11:21.720 --> 00:11:24.259 for you or why are you playing? There's a communal 00:11:24.259 --> 00:11:27.179 thing in my house and I also played a lot of 00:11:27.159 --> 00:11:31.539 Strategy and RPG games that were my parents saw 00:11:31.539 --> 00:11:34.659 as a little bit more Good for your brain. Yeah 00:11:34.659 --> 00:11:36.759 using your brain in logical ways. You're coming 00:11:36.759 --> 00:11:38.759 up with strategy You're having to think through 00:11:38.759 --> 00:11:42.200 things. I wasn't into the shooters and not me 00:11:42.200 --> 00:11:43.980 either really I was really into like games like 00:11:43.980 --> 00:11:46.980 civilization was a big one for me and the music 00:11:46.980 --> 00:11:50.059 that's that game Introduces you into a lot of 00:11:50.059 --> 00:11:53.179 like really amazing like world -class classical 00:11:53.179 --> 00:11:57.500 music and things like that too. Yeah, and Think 00:11:57.500 --> 00:12:00.360 Rob Zombie's Dragula for me. I heard that with 00:12:00.360 --> 00:12:04.039 in the Matrix soundtrack, but similar like just 00:12:04.039 --> 00:12:08.279 like it was tied to This thing that was bigger 00:12:08.279 --> 00:12:11.980 than just the song. Yeah. So at what point did 00:12:11.980 --> 00:12:15.340 you Are you a music do you play music at all? 00:12:15.639 --> 00:12:19.940 No me neither I've tried. Yeah, I'm a comedian 00:12:19.940 --> 00:12:26.200 and historian philosopher, but I sing in a choir, 00:12:26.379 --> 00:12:30.480 that's about it, like community choir. I think 00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:34.019 that all comedians are usually like failed rock 00:12:34.019 --> 00:12:37.600 stars. That's so funny. And then also a lot of 00:12:37.600 --> 00:12:40.399 rock stars want to be comedians. Comedians, yeah. 00:12:40.480 --> 00:12:43.440 It's like the grass is always, we're all miserable 00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:47.080 and the grass is always greener. It's a creative 00:12:47.080 --> 00:12:51.960 outlet and it's... Tends to stem from a same 00:12:51.960 --> 00:12:58.340 source a lot of I think so too. Yeah Yeah So 00:12:58.340 --> 00:13:02.980 you're a writer But are you also would you consider 00:13:02.980 --> 00:13:05.899 yourself? Okay. Have you ever done any comedy 00:13:05.899 --> 00:13:08.899 or anything you've ever done? I've thought about 00:13:08.899 --> 00:13:12.500 it. So I've always been a writer. That's always 00:13:12.500 --> 00:13:16.159 been my thing I was like, as soon as I could 00:13:16.159 --> 00:13:18.580 form sentences, I would write stories about me 00:13:18.580 --> 00:13:20.960 and my cat. And I will talk about that a little 00:13:20.960 --> 00:13:23.440 bit. OK. What are some of the earliest things 00:13:23.440 --> 00:13:26.480 you remember writing about you and your cat story? 00:13:26.600 --> 00:13:30.200 Was it fiction? Typically, it's so I definitely 00:13:30.200 --> 00:13:33.600 was probably in first grade writing my own little 00:13:33.600 --> 00:13:36.480 mystery stories where me and my cat were solving 00:13:36.480 --> 00:13:38.940 mysteries in the neighborhood, because that's 00:13:38.940 --> 00:13:42.860 what I was the sidekick. The cat. The cat, okay. 00:13:43.039 --> 00:13:44.779 You were the lead character, okay. I was running 00:13:44.779 --> 00:13:48.700 things. That's good. I feel like if like in first 00:13:48.700 --> 00:13:50.500 grade you're writing and you're not even the 00:13:50.500 --> 00:13:52.820 lead character, you're... There's more going 00:13:52.820 --> 00:13:55.220 on here. I'm like, I'm a little worried about 00:13:55.220 --> 00:13:57.700 you. On the topic of being worried about me, 00:13:57.840 --> 00:14:00.100 it was in third grade that I found Ed Grail and 00:14:00.100 --> 00:14:04.320 Poe, and that's where I decided that's what I 00:14:04.320 --> 00:14:04.860 wanted. That's a terrible time to start reading. 00:14:04.899 --> 00:14:07.860 Yeah. That's where I started writing poetry. 00:14:10.090 --> 00:14:12.929 I was just fascinated with him. I loved him very 00:14:12.929 --> 00:14:16.110 much. I still do. Well, what was it at such a 00:14:16.110 --> 00:14:18.710 young age though? I don't think that... I think 00:14:18.710 --> 00:14:20.809 there's a million reasons to love a girl. Yeah. 00:14:21.409 --> 00:14:23.330 And that's not what I'm at. But what do you think 00:14:23.330 --> 00:14:26.389 was appealing to you at such a young age? Because 00:14:26.389 --> 00:14:30.730 that's not typical. No. I feel like middle school 00:14:30.730 --> 00:14:33.129 is when people get into the... Drama dump. People 00:14:33.129 --> 00:14:36.700 get into the goth phase. Middle school. Oh, it's 00:14:36.700 --> 00:14:39.519 been, since I came out of the womb, I've been 00:14:39.519 --> 00:14:43.919 angsty and bad and all of those things, but I 00:14:43.919 --> 00:14:49.379 don't know. My family was very transparent with 00:14:49.379 --> 00:14:52.419 a lot of things that happened and there's a lot 00:14:52.419 --> 00:14:54.960 of things that I was probably aware of very young. 00:14:55.480 --> 00:15:00.480 And I don't know how to say this without tooting 00:15:00.480 --> 00:15:03.320 my own horn, but I was a very intellectual child. 00:15:03.870 --> 00:15:05.710 And I read a lot. You were reading and writing 00:15:05.710 --> 00:15:08.070 a lot. Yeah, I was reading and writing a lot. 00:15:08.269 --> 00:15:11.210 I was really into watching documentaries even 00:15:11.210 --> 00:15:14.149 at a very young age. Nonfiction, I was super 00:15:14.149 --> 00:15:18.350 into it. I loved 10 Burns as a kid too. It was 00:15:18.350 --> 00:15:21.710 weird. The baseball documentary series like I 00:15:21.710 --> 00:15:24.669 was really into. And the jazz one too. Anyway, 00:15:25.149 --> 00:15:29.129 I just had this interest in Don't know. I just 00:15:29.129 --> 00:15:32.370 had always had this interest in the unexplained 00:15:32.370 --> 00:15:38.309 but also diving deeper into Humanity knowing 00:15:38.309 --> 00:15:40.769 quite young that there were a lot of dark things 00:15:40.769 --> 00:15:42.490 that happen I think that was always interesting 00:15:42.490 --> 00:15:46.090 to me and my parents are both huge horror fans. 00:15:46.090 --> 00:15:50.269 I am too a Lifelong horror. Yeah, I always watch 00:15:50.269 --> 00:15:53.070 those things. So I think just very young I was 00:15:53.070 --> 00:15:56.549 just trying to process I had a lot of emotions 00:15:56.549 --> 00:15:59.269 that I didn't know how to communicate. I've always 00:15:59.269 --> 00:16:02.950 been a little socially awkward, a little odd. 00:16:03.309 --> 00:16:05.870 And growing up, I had a very hard time relating 00:16:05.870 --> 00:16:10.250 to others. And so reading and writing made sense 00:16:10.250 --> 00:16:12.889 to me. Reading someone's feelings and writing 00:16:12.889 --> 00:16:16.309 my own, that made sense to me much more than 00:16:16.309 --> 00:16:20.110 being like, weirdly having the verbal words for 00:16:20.110 --> 00:16:23.399 it. So Edgar Allan Poe was super appealing at 00:16:23.399 --> 00:16:26.320 that time that I don't think that I knew that 00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:28.879 Opened that door for me. Have you ever heard 00:16:28.879 --> 00:16:33.480 MC Lars rap about Edgar Allan Poe? No, I will 00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:36.000 send I'll send to you later. It's fantastic Your 00:16:36.000 --> 00:16:38.580 world's colliding right there. Yeah. Yeah, it's 00:16:38.580 --> 00:16:44.620 and he's calls it laptop rap. Okay, and I actually 00:16:44.620 --> 00:16:46.840 oddly enough because we're in Athens right now. 00:16:46.840 --> 00:16:51.309 I saw him open for Cindy Wilson from B -52s one 00:16:51.309 --> 00:16:54.649 time. Okay, cool. Yeah, interesting. Yeah, yeah. 00:16:55.230 --> 00:16:57.929 Anyway, yeah, MC Lars, shout out. He's awesome. 00:16:58.830 --> 00:17:01.009 But yeah, I think he's actually working on an 00:17:01.009 --> 00:17:03.889 entire album about Edgar Allan Poe now. Oh, he 00:17:03.889 --> 00:17:07.150 has one song back in the day, but like something 00:17:07.150 --> 00:17:11.150 in the back. Yeah, I think that's right up your 00:17:11.150 --> 00:17:13.549 alley. Yeah. And what you're talking about, I 00:17:13.549 --> 00:17:15.849 think it goes back to what we were talking about 00:17:15.849 --> 00:17:19.319 earlier, where that kind of Think you put it 00:17:19.319 --> 00:17:22.640 really well like this kind of struggle to relate 00:17:22.640 --> 00:17:26.099 with others. So we Instead of more traditional 00:17:26.099 --> 00:17:29.480 forms of communication People write songs people 00:17:29.480 --> 00:17:33.000 write stories people write jokes. I realized 00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:37.500 that For a long time like that that if I didn't 00:17:37.500 --> 00:17:40.140 put like a funny spin on what I was saying it 00:17:40.140 --> 00:17:43.319 came across It's just like rude Because I and 00:17:43.319 --> 00:17:45.160 then I've heard of urgent and things like that. 00:17:45.160 --> 00:17:49.440 So it's like I'm just straightforward and matter 00:17:49.440 --> 00:17:51.960 -of -fact about a lot of things. I think that 00:17:51.960 --> 00:17:55.140 I do that as well. And then also like having 00:17:55.140 --> 00:17:57.640 that outlet though, and I think you maybe you 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:01.839 can talk about this. Having that outlet made 00:18:01.839 --> 00:18:05.519 a lot of that other stuff better. So have there 00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:08.079 been periods in your life where you stopped writing? 00:18:09.099 --> 00:18:11.339 Absolutely. What happens? It's a struggle, yeah. 00:18:11.859 --> 00:18:16.500 It's a struggle and it's something that I think 00:18:16.539 --> 00:18:19.799 there's a lot of people that come to these creative 00:18:19.799 --> 00:18:23.539 outlets to deal with mental health in some way, 00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:26.420 whether whatever it is that you deal with that. 00:18:27.160 --> 00:18:29.259 It's not always the case, but it has been for 00:18:29.259 --> 00:18:31.960 me and I have people close to me that it's the 00:18:31.960 --> 00:18:35.140 case for where when your mental health gets better. 00:18:36.019 --> 00:18:39.420 That outlet struggles like you don't know you 00:18:39.420 --> 00:18:42.980 don't need it or you're just not in that mindset 00:18:42.980 --> 00:18:45.460 and that happened for me off and on so it's. 00:18:45.500 --> 00:18:50.420 when I'm in a better place, I don't feel that 00:18:50.420 --> 00:18:53.000 need to write. And I tend to not think about 00:18:53.000 --> 00:18:57.180 it on a personal creative writing level. Yeah. 00:18:57.839 --> 00:19:01.039 No, that makes sense to me. I think I experienced 00:19:01.039 --> 00:19:04.059 something, it's not the opposite, but it's almost 00:19:04.059 --> 00:19:07.240 like the flip side of that, where the more I'm 00:19:07.240 --> 00:19:10.700 writing comedy or the more I'm doing these types 00:19:10.700 --> 00:19:15.230 of things, the better I'm feeling. Okay, so if 00:19:15.230 --> 00:19:18.049 I don't do these things that's when I start to 00:19:18.049 --> 00:19:22.650 feel like shit I know a lot of people like that, 00:19:22.650 --> 00:19:25.490 too So that's why I'm wondering is like when 00:19:25.490 --> 00:19:27.630 you go through these periods where things are 00:19:27.630 --> 00:19:29.609 you're feeling better? Maybe you're creative 00:19:29.609 --> 00:19:31.710 outlets are struggling does it kind of start 00:19:31.710 --> 00:19:34.269 to catch up to you eventually where if you're 00:19:34.269 --> 00:19:37.430 not putting some of that angst or whatever into 00:19:37.430 --> 00:19:43.039 that I definitely and in some way it almost feels 00:19:43.039 --> 00:19:45.740 like there's a piece of you that you've left 00:19:45.740 --> 00:19:50.039 behind or you're not nurturing or Writing has 00:19:50.039 --> 00:19:53.079 been such a strong part of my identity I think 00:19:53.079 --> 00:19:57.640 my whole life and I will say for me I think all 00:19:57.640 --> 00:20:00.339 of it's gotten a little better since I have reached 00:20:00.339 --> 00:20:03.180 a point in my career where writing is my career 00:20:03.180 --> 00:20:09.380 so Again, when I set aside my personal writing 00:20:09.380 --> 00:20:12.039 for too long, that doesn't feel good, because 00:20:12.039 --> 00:20:15.000 again, it feels like I'm not in touch with a 00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:20.160 piece of myself, not taking care of myself, because 00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:24.660 that's my outlet, but I'm always writing, which 00:20:24.660 --> 00:20:27.279 feels good. So I don't know if that makes sense. 00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:30.079 No, that makes a lot of sense, actually. And 00:20:30.079 --> 00:20:32.440 it leads really nicely into the next question 00:20:32.440 --> 00:20:35.130 I wanted to ask you, which is like, How did you 00:20:35.130 --> 00:20:38.410 start to, you're young, you're writing a lot 00:20:38.410 --> 00:20:41.569 that deal with your emotions and angst and you 00:20:41.569 --> 00:20:46.009 get into Edgar Allen Poe. And at what point did 00:20:46.009 --> 00:20:49.089 you decide that you wanted to make writing your 00:20:49.089 --> 00:20:54.630 profession? Yeah, I think all through grade school, 00:20:54.910 --> 00:20:57.849 trying to decide what to go to college for. It 00:20:57.849 --> 00:21:01.509 was a big conflict because that question of if 00:21:01.509 --> 00:21:04.029 you could do anything and not worry about money. 00:21:04.160 --> 00:21:07.220 What do you want to do? I would love to be a 00:21:07.220 --> 00:21:11.420 novelist just right full time, but There's parental 00:21:11.420 --> 00:21:15.059 pressures. There's societal pressures like oh 00:21:15.059 --> 00:21:20.279 I like food. I like to travel and go to concerts. 00:21:20.279 --> 00:21:24.779 So how do I what do I do? and Capitalism is a 00:21:24.779 --> 00:21:30.519 bitch. Yeah, and so I struggled my pathway back 00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:35.190 I guess I always knew that writing and specifically 00:21:35.190 --> 00:21:38.029 journalism was what I was supposed to do. And 00:21:38.029 --> 00:21:42.869 I fought it and I took a very circular route 00:21:42.869 --> 00:21:45.529 to get back to it. I tried to do other things. 00:21:45.529 --> 00:21:47.450 Did you have like backup plans or something like 00:21:47.450 --> 00:21:51.910 that or? I don't know. I feel like I always had 00:21:51.910 --> 00:21:55.670 these ideas that just, I don't know. I don't 00:21:55.670 --> 00:21:59.990 know that I had a concrete backup plan. I had 00:21:59.990 --> 00:22:03.319 things that I was okay with doing. Gotcha, and 00:22:03.319 --> 00:22:05.839 I just don't know that they ever round it out 00:22:05.839 --> 00:22:09.180 and I guess the easiest way to make sense of 00:22:09.180 --> 00:22:13.799 it is in high school I was the Co -editor -in 00:22:13.799 --> 00:22:17.200 -chief of my school newspaper. Okay. I was really 00:22:17.200 --> 00:22:20.319 into journalism Everyone was telling me journalism 00:22:20.319 --> 00:22:24.940 was gonna die so going into college I went for 00:22:24.940 --> 00:22:28.059 English because I was like there's a lot of things 00:22:28.059 --> 00:22:31.190 I could do under that and it's still I'm very 00:22:31.190 --> 00:22:34.789 good at this. I'll do English. And in college, 00:22:34.950 --> 00:22:38.529 I thought I was gonna get my doctorate and teach 00:22:38.529 --> 00:22:41.869 college. So I actually double majored in English 00:22:41.869 --> 00:22:46.630 and classical culture. And towards the end of 00:22:46.630 --> 00:22:49.650 college, I was almost there and my advisor was 00:22:49.650 --> 00:22:52.849 like, it is a long shot that you're ever gonna 00:22:52.849 --> 00:22:56.450 be able to make enough money as a college professor 00:22:56.450 --> 00:22:59.670 to pay back all these student loans. to get there 00:22:59.670 --> 00:23:02.289 in the first place. So I was like, this is what 00:23:02.289 --> 00:23:05.190 I was trying to avoid the whole time. So I get 00:23:05.190 --> 00:23:07.849 out of college not knowing what I'm going to 00:23:07.849 --> 00:23:13.009 do, but knowing that digital marketing is a hot 00:23:13.009 --> 00:23:15.990 topic and a lot of people want digital marketers 00:23:15.990 --> 00:23:19.869 and they need people that can write. So eventually 00:23:19.869 --> 00:23:24.210 I found my way into that position and I worked 00:23:24.210 --> 00:23:27.599 for a big company. Doing digital marketing? Doing 00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:31.740 digital marketing. And, oh, I wasn't there very 00:23:31.740 --> 00:23:34.500 long before. I did extremely well there. I got 00:23:34.500 --> 00:23:38.180 a promotion and a year and everything. And I 00:23:38.180 --> 00:23:41.960 just, the company was a really bad fit for me. 00:23:42.180 --> 00:23:45.440 My mental health suffered a lot. But your writing 00:23:45.440 --> 00:23:50.519 was great. Writing never better. Writing never 00:23:50.519 --> 00:23:55.839 better. Mental health tanks. And so I just Saved 00:23:55.839 --> 00:23:59.980 up enough money to quit and take care of myself 00:23:59.980 --> 00:24:03.099 for a little while because it was really bad 00:24:03.099 --> 00:24:06.819 Yeah, I was in a really bad place and that you 00:24:06.819 --> 00:24:09.119 walked away with a lot of skills from that job 00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:12.579 that you Ended up like using in doing things 00:24:12.579 --> 00:24:16.279 like volumes hip -hop. Absolutely. Yeah Absolutely. 00:24:16.779 --> 00:24:20.660 So it's that's the roundabout pathway to I did 00:24:20.660 --> 00:24:22.579 some digital marketing for a while. Yeah, so 00:24:22.579 --> 00:24:26.400 I'm yeah, it's hard not Yeah, if you've got those 00:24:26.400 --> 00:24:30.039 kind of skill sets everyone's hiring for it and 00:24:30.039 --> 00:24:33.039 you can make some decent money. So Yeah, yeah, 00:24:33.039 --> 00:24:36.460 I was with a startup for a while as there and 00:24:36.460 --> 00:24:40.460 I was an archivist for a marketing firm state 00:24:40.460 --> 00:24:43.039 -run marketing firm at one point so I wasn't 00:24:43.039 --> 00:24:45.619 really doing the marketing but I was surrounded 00:24:45.619 --> 00:24:49.700 by it and absorbed it all and then started working 00:24:49.700 --> 00:24:52.880 for a startup and and did digital marketing with 00:24:52.880 --> 00:24:56.420 them. And I definitely use a lot of those skills 00:24:56.420 --> 00:25:02.880 now in promoting the podcast or the people that 00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:06.640 I have on it promoting their stuff when it comes 00:25:06.640 --> 00:25:09.799 out. It was definitely an invaluable experience 00:25:09.799 --> 00:25:12.339 where those marketing skills are so important. 00:25:12.640 --> 00:25:16.339 I have absolutely used them. I guess the reason 00:25:16.339 --> 00:25:19.559 I'm mentioning that is because I feel like even 00:25:19.559 --> 00:25:23.450 though that it was a bad fit for you, the experience 00:25:23.450 --> 00:25:27.650 ended up being something that probably led to 00:25:27.650 --> 00:25:29.809 you starting Volumes Hip Hop and things like 00:25:29.809 --> 00:25:32.910 that. Volumes actually started before this. Okay, 00:25:33.250 --> 00:25:35.250 so give me a little bit about the history of 00:25:35.250 --> 00:25:36.609 Volumes Hip Hop then. Yeah, I was gonna say, 00:25:36.750 --> 00:25:41.829 I'm sorry, it's hard to keep my paths in line. 00:25:41.890 --> 00:25:44.170 That is literally the format of this podcast, 00:25:44.430 --> 00:25:47.170 is we like follow a thread for a little while 00:25:47.170 --> 00:25:50.079 and then we go back and then we follow it. Maybe 00:25:50.079 --> 00:25:52.220 we get a little too far down. Yeah, exactly. 00:25:52.420 --> 00:25:54.619 So let's talk about volumes hip -hop and then 00:25:54.619 --> 00:25:57.140 maybe that'll fill in the gaps. I think it will 00:25:57.140 --> 00:26:01.640 fill in the gaps. So I have always loved music 00:26:01.640 --> 00:26:05.579 so much and found a way into my friend circles 00:26:05.579 --> 00:26:08.099 being musicians and things like that. When I 00:26:08.099 --> 00:26:10.200 just realized you started that in like 2013? 00:26:10.819 --> 00:26:14.440 2017. 2017. It was 2017. Okay. Not quite that 00:26:14.440 --> 00:26:17.740 long ago. Eight years is still. Oh yeah, at this 00:26:17.740 --> 00:26:22.839 point it has been. I went to UGA. I said I went 00:26:22.839 --> 00:26:25.259 to college, but I guess I never clarified that 00:26:25.259 --> 00:26:30.940 I went to UGA. I graduated in 2015 and yeah, 00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:33.480 didn't know what I was doing. That's the point 00:26:33.480 --> 00:26:35.900 where I graduated college and I was like, now 00:26:35.900 --> 00:26:39.819 what? Having a very hard time getting a job in 00:26:39.819 --> 00:26:43.359 any kind of field I thought I fit. So I was just 00:26:43.359 --> 00:26:48.900 working. to pay the bills. My best friend is 00:26:48.900 --> 00:26:52.400 Trevi of Trevi and the Enemy, a hip hop artist. 00:26:53.160 --> 00:26:56.220 So Trevor and I found a group of friends to move 00:26:56.220 --> 00:27:00.740 in with and they were, Trevor is a hip hop artist 00:27:00.740 --> 00:27:04.660 and we just found this cool collective of hip 00:27:04.660 --> 00:27:09.500 hop musicians and fans and engineers and stuff 00:27:09.500 --> 00:27:12.980 in the community. So we moved in with them. I 00:27:12.980 --> 00:27:15.859 was doing my thing very depressed that I was 00:27:15.859 --> 00:27:17.740 not working any kind of job I went to school 00:27:17.740 --> 00:27:21.720 for. And I was already going to all the hip hop 00:27:21.720 --> 00:27:26.380 shows. We had studios in our house. I already 00:27:26.380 --> 00:27:29.619 was getting to know everybody. And one of our 00:27:29.619 --> 00:27:33.420 good friends said what the hip hop scene really 00:27:33.420 --> 00:27:38.019 needed was its own zine or coverage because Red 00:27:38.019 --> 00:27:42.720 and Black, Banner Herald, Flagpole. No one was 00:27:42.720 --> 00:27:45.200 really covering the scene. They maybe had some 00:27:45.200 --> 00:27:48.220 cherry -picked palatable hip -hop artists Yeah, 00:27:48.220 --> 00:27:50.460 I remember that being the kid like I came to 00:27:50.460 --> 00:27:53.660 a fest in like 2016 and I remember that being 00:27:53.660 --> 00:27:57.819 Okay, like it was yeah, very there was some representation 00:27:57.819 --> 00:28:01.220 there, but it wasn't Not nearly as much as there 00:28:01.220 --> 00:28:04.180 is now and and it was a lot more difficult than 00:28:04.180 --> 00:28:06.779 navigate Especially as somebody who come in from 00:28:06.779 --> 00:28:09.059 out of town. Yeah, not knowing the scene like 00:28:09.059 --> 00:28:14.740 I have no idea Yeah, it's it and it's complicated 00:28:14.740 --> 00:28:17.019 there there's so much with the culture because 00:28:17.019 --> 00:28:20.579 hip -hop is a culture and there's so much where 00:28:20.579 --> 00:28:23.680 from my perspective a lot of what was happening 00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:28.859 was the hip -hop culture in the scene has a distrust 00:28:28.859 --> 00:28:34.579 a understandable distrust so They're not necessarily 00:28:34.579 --> 00:28:39.519 reaching out to flagpole or whatever so and flagpoles 00:28:39.519 --> 00:28:43.289 only covering Them in a way that they feel is 00:28:43.289 --> 00:28:46.269 inauthentic to the movement, but flagpole doesn't 00:28:46.269 --> 00:28:50.289 know what's actually going on either a little 00:28:50.289 --> 00:28:53.269 bit of a How does someone know if you don't tell 00:28:53.269 --> 00:28:56.250 them? But if you don't trust them, do you really 00:28:56.250 --> 00:28:59.829 trust them with your story? Because then they 00:28:59.829 --> 00:29:02.349 might treat it like they're a tourist or not. 00:29:02.509 --> 00:29:04.970 Yeah, so it's understandable It's entirely understand. 00:29:04.970 --> 00:29:06.690 Yeah. No, I understand what you're saying. Yeah, 00:29:07.109 --> 00:29:11.670 but at that point I was like I like to get active. 00:29:11.690 --> 00:29:14.950 I like to be involved. Like, you need fans, right, 00:29:14.950 --> 00:29:18.250 to make things work and to sell out venues and 00:29:18.250 --> 00:29:22.289 stuff like that. But I just wanted to be a little 00:29:22.289 --> 00:29:25.049 bit more hands -on, and I was like, a zine is 00:29:25.049 --> 00:29:29.490 something I can do. So I was just really burnt 00:29:29.490 --> 00:29:32.890 out and distressed from working jobs to pay the 00:29:32.890 --> 00:29:35.289 bills that weren't doing anything for my career. 00:29:35.529 --> 00:29:38.890 I kept being told by companies, you don't have 00:29:38.890 --> 00:29:42.369 any... experience you just have degrees so I 00:29:42.369 --> 00:29:45.430 was like I'm just gonna make volumes hip -hop 00:29:45.430 --> 00:29:48.829 and start a monthly hip -hop zine covering the 00:29:48.829 --> 00:29:51.410 hip -hop scene was it in print it was in print 00:29:51.410 --> 00:29:56.390 so the January 2017 was the first zine that was 00:29:56.390 --> 00:30:00.329 printed so for a year volumes hip -hop was a 00:30:00.329 --> 00:30:03.690 monthly printed zine that I walked around Athens 00:30:03.690 --> 00:30:07.289 and put out everywhere with a calendar of events 00:30:07.289 --> 00:30:12.289 it had list of a list of people like if you need 00:30:12.289 --> 00:30:15.390 a videographer photographers engineers that had 00:30:15.390 --> 00:30:18.349 contact information it had stories in it things 00:30:18.349 --> 00:30:22.569 like that and I was just getting to know everybody 00:30:22.569 --> 00:30:25.789 in the scene and I was at everything that it 00:30:25.789 --> 00:30:28.869 naturally progressed into putting together shows 00:30:28.869 --> 00:30:33.029 yeah so after the first year volumes the zine 00:30:33.029 --> 00:30:35.650 was just honestly too expensive to keep printing 00:30:35.650 --> 00:30:41.039 yeah very hard for me to secure advertising or 00:30:41.039 --> 00:30:43.539 sponsors or things like that. So it went to being 00:30:43.539 --> 00:30:47.059 online only. So for a long time, I still covered 00:30:47.059 --> 00:30:52.119 the hip hop scene in a media and a press capacity 00:30:52.119 --> 00:30:55.420 online, but I got way more into doing shows. 00:30:55.759 --> 00:30:58.779 And so I did shows, I've put together multiple 00:30:58.779 --> 00:31:03.099 festivals, and that's really what volumes developed 00:31:03.099 --> 00:31:08.180 into. So I was a... Few years into volumes before 00:31:08.180 --> 00:31:11.000 I got like that digital marketing job gotcha 00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:15.859 and it Helped my resume I was a that was the 00:31:15.859 --> 00:31:18.480 point of volumes at first was I wanted to be 00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:22.839 involved in the scene with my friends and I wanted 00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:26.319 I Didn't have I couldn't get a job to show people 00:31:26.319 --> 00:31:29.539 I had the experience to get a better job So I 00:31:29.539 --> 00:31:31.720 was like I'm gonna create what I want to do and 00:31:31.720 --> 00:31:34.420 show people that I'm able to do it and volumes 00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:37.759 Got me the digital marketing job and from all 00:31:37.759 --> 00:31:40.799 of that experience Eventually, I that's how I 00:31:40.799 --> 00:31:44.480 came to flagpole I already knew who I was because 00:31:44.480 --> 00:31:46.779 I had been doing my thing with my zine around 00:31:46.779 --> 00:31:49.500 town They were like we already know who you are 00:31:49.500 --> 00:31:51.859 and what you're doing and that leads me to this 00:31:51.859 --> 00:31:54.779 interesting dynamic that you touched on earlier 00:31:54.779 --> 00:31:58.660 where There used to be this distrust between 00:31:58.660 --> 00:32:01.119 the hip -hop community and some of the more at 00:32:01.119 --> 00:32:05.039 the time me not mainstream in the traditional 00:32:05.039 --> 00:32:09.440 sense, but established, the established independent 00:32:09.440 --> 00:32:13.519 media in Athens. What were some of the things 00:32:13.519 --> 00:32:17.680 that you did to repair that, bridge that gap, 00:32:17.900 --> 00:32:20.480 repair that, and did it happen after you came 00:32:20.480 --> 00:32:22.480 to Flagpole, or was that something you were actively 00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:25.440 doing as part of Volumes Hip Hop? Yeah, I think 00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:28.279 it's something I was actively doing as part of 00:32:28.279 --> 00:32:33.119 Volumes is... It's hard for me to speak with 00:32:33.119 --> 00:32:35.380 full confidence that I know this is exactly what 00:32:35.380 --> 00:32:38.720 happened I think introducing all you can do is 00:32:38.720 --> 00:32:42.619 give you right from my perspective. Yeah introducing 00:32:42.619 --> 00:32:46.079 the Z Introduces a little bit of competition 00:32:46.079 --> 00:32:49.500 into the market naturally, of course and I think 00:32:49.500 --> 00:32:51.859 that there's just a lot that people didn't know 00:32:51.859 --> 00:32:56.240 and my personal mission was Everyone's stories 00:32:56.240 --> 00:32:59.440 that I was sharing just proving to them that 00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:02.500 they could trust me and through word of mouth 00:33:02.500 --> 00:33:04.980 and yeah other people reading what I wrote they 00:33:04.980 --> 00:33:09.559 were like I want you to write about me and Things 00:33:09.559 --> 00:33:13.660 just changing. I think things changing after 00:33:13.660 --> 00:33:16.599 Kind of everything we went through in 2020 and 00:33:16.599 --> 00:33:20.359 Black Lives Matter. I think that the local publications 00:33:20.359 --> 00:33:24.920 started taking hip -hop culture as something 00:33:24.920 --> 00:33:28.279 that needed to be represented and represented 00:33:28.279 --> 00:33:30.579 with care and maybe not just how it had been 00:33:30.579 --> 00:33:33.220 represented previously. And there's new people 00:33:33.220 --> 00:33:37.180 that were put into place. After the pandemic, 00:33:37.799 --> 00:33:42.579 Andrew Scheer at Banner Herald became like the 00:33:42.579 --> 00:33:47.460 culture editor and writer. And he goes back in 00:33:47.460 --> 00:33:51.660 Athens to having hip hop ties. He... Had done 00:33:51.660 --> 00:33:54.279 he'd been in punk bands and stuff and he has 00:33:54.279 --> 00:33:58.420 hip -hop ties to a lot of the ogs so andrew brought 00:33:58.420 --> 00:34:01.480 a lot of that organically to the banner herald 00:34:01.480 --> 00:34:05.380 and As soon as I came to flagpole. It was just 00:34:05.380 --> 00:34:07.920 like we know you're the hip -hop girl. If there's 00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:10.179 anything hip -hop related first of all, you tell 00:34:10.179 --> 00:34:13.940 us What is relevant to be covered and if a story 00:34:13.940 --> 00:34:16.880 comes through you write it? That's what I was 00:34:16.880 --> 00:34:21.070 thinking about too was like Not only was were 00:34:21.070 --> 00:34:23.170 you introducing some competition, but you were 00:34:23.170 --> 00:34:26.409 introducing a like legitimate source of information 00:34:26.409 --> 00:34:30.349 Yeah for the scene that that I think like it 00:34:30.349 --> 00:34:32.690 just inherently repaired some of the mistrust 00:34:32.690 --> 00:34:36.550 because all of a sudden flagpole Doesn't have 00:34:36.550 --> 00:34:41.230 to rely on The community trusting them. They 00:34:41.230 --> 00:34:44.349 just have to read your scene Yeah, and then they 00:34:44.349 --> 00:34:47.150 have a source of information to be able to cover 00:34:47.150 --> 00:34:51.960 that stuff with some credibility, you know, even 00:34:51.960 --> 00:34:53.639 if it's just like adding things to their show 00:34:53.639 --> 00:34:57.500 calendars. And I think like that just opening 00:34:57.500 --> 00:35:00.480 the doors of communication in a very public way. 00:35:00.960 --> 00:35:06.940 Yeah. And I have always and still open to meeting 00:35:06.940 --> 00:35:09.659 up with people and stuff and just telling them 00:35:09.659 --> 00:35:12.659 how to get press and what to do. Because there's 00:35:12.659 --> 00:35:15.300 just a lot of people that had no idea. So that's 00:35:15.300 --> 00:35:19.780 been along the way. showing people that their 00:35:19.780 --> 00:35:23.840 stories can be told in a genuine and safe way, 00:35:24.239 --> 00:35:26.159 built trust there to where other people were 00:35:26.159 --> 00:35:28.659 interested in having their stories told, but 00:35:28.659 --> 00:35:32.360 then people are like, so how do I get in touch 00:35:32.360 --> 00:35:35.480 with these? Kind of sparking that interest and 00:35:35.480 --> 00:35:39.400 showing that there's value in them reaching out. 00:35:39.719 --> 00:35:44.840 Which is so, from the other side, as like someone 00:35:44.840 --> 00:35:47.809 in the press, There are so many people reaching 00:35:47.809 --> 00:35:50.090 out and there's so much going on all the time. 00:35:50.489 --> 00:35:53.429 We don't just know what's happening every year. 00:35:53.809 --> 00:35:56.050 Like the number one way for us to know what you're 00:35:56.050 --> 00:35:59.369 doing is to tell us. And the reverse of that 00:35:59.369 --> 00:36:02.469 is for me, people will be like, how did you get, 00:36:02.469 --> 00:36:05.030 how did you get X or Y on your podcast? And I'm 00:36:05.030 --> 00:36:07.469 like, I just asked them. The worst they're going 00:36:07.469 --> 00:36:11.030 to do is ignore me. That's worse than saying 00:36:11.030 --> 00:36:15.210 no, personally. Saying no is fine. But at least 00:36:15.210 --> 00:36:20.230 you tried. IndieCon at the beginning of the month 00:36:20.230 --> 00:36:26.650 is something that F Factor and Game Gang in town 00:36:26.650 --> 00:36:31.010 brought back. They used to do like a indie indie 00:36:31.010 --> 00:36:33.150 conference and they just brought it back at the 00:36:33.150 --> 00:36:35.650 beginning of this month. And I did a I saw some 00:36:35.650 --> 00:36:39.159 stuff about it. Yeah. Yeah. Did a little talk 00:36:39.159 --> 00:36:43.380 on how to get press and Honestly, my number one 00:36:43.380 --> 00:36:46.820 thing is being easy to work with I actually saw 00:36:46.820 --> 00:36:50.039 that and was like I Really wish I could have 00:36:50.039 --> 00:36:52.539 been so we should we should talk a little maybe 00:36:52.539 --> 00:36:54.900 you need me though though like cliff notes after 00:36:54.900 --> 00:37:01.280 this So I in fact, I would say so flagpole magazine 00:37:01.280 --> 00:37:04.739 is probably my number one source of FOMO I just 00:37:04.739 --> 00:37:07.719 read it from Florida. I'm like All this great 00:37:07.719 --> 00:37:10.960 stuff. Yeah. What are some of the things that 00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:13.579 you found really challenging about that position 00:37:13.579 --> 00:37:17.460 when you first came on board? I felt I think 00:37:17.460 --> 00:37:21.300 coming on board, I felt very comfortable. I will 00:37:21.300 --> 00:37:23.559 say that I felt very comfortable. It's an extremely 00:37:23.559 --> 00:37:27.619 small staff. Yeah. If anything, the most challenging 00:37:27.619 --> 00:37:31.480 part was at the point that I came on, everyone 00:37:31.480 --> 00:37:34.840 had been there for I think that our front desk 00:37:34.840 --> 00:37:37.440 had been there for three or four years. Everyone 00:37:37.440 --> 00:37:41.320 else had been there for eight, 10, 15, 20. So 00:37:41.320 --> 00:37:46.179 it was a very established staff. So coming in 00:37:46.179 --> 00:37:51.280 new, everyone was open to, everyone was open 00:37:51.280 --> 00:37:55.980 to hearing like new ideas or everyone else had 00:37:55.980 --> 00:37:58.840 been there for so long. But at the same time, 00:37:59.420 --> 00:38:03.599 trying to integrate myself into Finding those 00:38:03.599 --> 00:38:07.739 lines of bringing a breath of fresh air but not 00:38:07.739 --> 00:38:11.659 tipping the boat Yeah, and the things that are 00:38:11.659 --> 00:38:14.940 being done because they work and they have reasons 00:38:14.940 --> 00:38:18.079 that you might not be aware of There's so many 00:38:18.079 --> 00:38:21.000 reasons and you find out why things have been 00:38:21.000 --> 00:38:23.280 done a certain way when you try to do it different 00:38:23.280 --> 00:38:29.239 Fall on your face. It's That's why. And the readers, 00:38:29.739 --> 00:38:33.719 the flagpole has such a long -term readership 00:38:33.719 --> 00:38:37.119 with a lot of people that there's things that 00:38:37.119 --> 00:38:39.219 of course they want to know what's going on in 00:38:39.219 --> 00:38:43.960 town and new things are fun, but then you go 00:38:43.960 --> 00:38:47.519 too far from the established paper and people 00:38:47.519 --> 00:38:49.300 are going to be upset because it's not what they 00:38:49.300 --> 00:38:53.010 used to read or things like that. It's a balance. 00:38:53.250 --> 00:38:55.489 Anything that's been established for a long time, 00:38:55.489 --> 00:39:00.269 I think, is a balance of keeping it fresh and 00:39:00.269 --> 00:39:05.710 new, not upsetting the foundation. Yeah, that 00:39:05.710 --> 00:39:08.550 makes a lot of sense. So I want to ask you about 00:39:08.550 --> 00:39:12.809 something that you mentioned early on, and that 00:39:12.809 --> 00:39:16.730 was when you were in college, so many people 00:39:16.730 --> 00:39:18.849 were talking about how journalism was dying. 00:39:19.250 --> 00:39:23.929 Yeah. Has it? Were they right? Man, I don't think 00:39:23.929 --> 00:39:26.869 so. So I think that I think it's complicated 00:39:26.869 --> 00:39:31.150 because of course the reason the recent kind 00:39:31.150 --> 00:39:35.750 of Shaking news was that the AJC is not Printing 00:39:35.750 --> 00:39:39.349 a physical paper anymore. So you hear that and 00:39:39.349 --> 00:39:44.170 it's oh Traditional journalism media, I think 00:39:44.170 --> 00:39:47.510 is a different thing than journalism I think 00:39:47.510 --> 00:39:51.659 print media is dying and Journalism, I'm not 00:39:51.659 --> 00:39:57.639 sure. Yeah. So print media, in some ways, you 00:39:57.639 --> 00:39:59.679 see where a lot of people are cutting that, because 00:39:59.679 --> 00:40:02.139 it's just not making sense for the budget. And 00:40:02.139 --> 00:40:06.940 you could say that. But we distribute papers. 00:40:07.420 --> 00:40:10.159 Yeah. Like a flagpole? No, I've got copies of 00:40:10.159 --> 00:40:13.780 flagpole in my room. Yeah. People want the physicals. 00:40:13.780 --> 00:40:16.380 People pick them up. I meant to ask you to bring 00:40:16.380 --> 00:40:18.039 a couple of the latest ones to show, but it's 00:40:18.039 --> 00:40:20.440 fine. Oh, yeah, I should have. I'll put pictures 00:40:20.440 --> 00:40:24.039 of them on the video. Yeah, yeah. People call 00:40:24.039 --> 00:40:28.300 and come pick up papers. We have papers that 00:40:28.300 --> 00:40:32.699 we distribute that we'd like people that are 00:40:32.699 --> 00:40:35.500 on our list where we send them out all over the 00:40:35.500 --> 00:40:38.480 country. People that are still want to know about 00:40:38.480 --> 00:40:41.719 home. I know you said you look from Florida, 00:40:42.119 --> 00:40:45.320 you look at what's going on and have FOMO. So 00:40:45.320 --> 00:40:48.380 that could be your new tagline, by the way. That's 00:40:48.380 --> 00:40:52.340 serving FOMO nationwide. I love that. Yeah, exactly. 00:40:52.619 --> 00:40:56.039 Exactly. Rumpus will be the biggest FOMO for 00:40:56.039 --> 00:41:00.460 a little while. I didn't miss out on that. You 00:41:00.460 --> 00:41:04.159 came to that one. So that that's where I think 00:41:04.159 --> 00:41:08.139 that print media is complicated. And that's if 00:41:08.139 --> 00:41:10.159 I was anywhere but flagpole, I might be able 00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:13.099 to say differently. Journalism in general, though. 00:41:14.200 --> 00:41:17.699 Oh, also feels complicated because there's always 00:41:17.699 --> 00:41:23.179 a need to know what's going on. Well, and then 00:41:23.179 --> 00:41:26.320 like the truth, too. Right. Yeah. In this age 00:41:26.320 --> 00:41:29.219 of misinformation. Yes. Do you think that print 00:41:29.219 --> 00:41:34.039 media can like help set apart certain? I don't 00:41:34.039 --> 00:41:37.079 know. I don't want authority. Maybe like things 00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:39.480 that have print that are printed, maybe have 00:41:39.480 --> 00:41:43.340 some somewhat more. Maybe not like actual but 00:41:43.340 --> 00:41:46.760 just perceived authority things that are printed 00:41:46.760 --> 00:41:51.480 Can't be edited and changed so I think that's 00:41:51.480 --> 00:41:55.639 what makes it interesting because Everything 00:41:55.639 --> 00:42:00.500 online can be adapted. Yeah, it can be altered. 00:42:00.519 --> 00:42:04.579 It can be updated redacted whatever on one hand 00:42:04.579 --> 00:42:08.800 the Updating is nice because you would like to 00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:11.619 assume that you're getting the most up -to -date 00:42:11.619 --> 00:42:14.400 recent information that you're on top of the 00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:19.320 news, but things can be removed. You can read 00:42:19.320 --> 00:42:21.239 something and go back later and it's not the 00:42:21.239 --> 00:42:24.940 same story. And as a historian, like one of our 00:42:24.940 --> 00:42:30.260 primary sources is not what people are saying 00:42:30.260 --> 00:42:34.090 about it in an updated format, but the newspaper 00:42:34.090 --> 00:42:37.849 said about it that day. Yes, I think that is 00:42:37.849 --> 00:42:42.329 very important. For archival reasons and just 00:42:42.329 --> 00:42:46.889 being able to go back and yeah follow the story 00:42:46.889 --> 00:42:49.530 and how people were reacting because that tells 00:42:49.530 --> 00:42:54.110 us a lot culturally. And obviously we're in a 00:42:54.110 --> 00:42:58.230 lot of cultural upheaval. And the fact that there's 00:42:58.230 --> 00:43:02.159 not really a line to follow there's. Don't know 00:43:02.159 --> 00:43:04.079 it's very complicated. I don't know if what I'm 00:43:04.079 --> 00:43:08.380 trying to say. No, I think the first thing fascism 00:43:08.380 --> 00:43:13.400 kills is the truth. Yeah Yeah, absolutely and 00:43:13.400 --> 00:43:18.380 that there's just Media so it's just hard to 00:43:18.380 --> 00:43:23.119 find It's just hard to find The straight facts 00:43:23.119 --> 00:43:27.619 in a lot of ways. Yeah, I know that there are 00:43:27.960 --> 00:43:31.340 it's subscription based, but there are some news 00:43:31.340 --> 00:43:35.059 filtering applications and things that you can 00:43:35.059 --> 00:43:38.559 put in your browser that when you're looking 00:43:38.559 --> 00:43:41.380 at stories and Googling things that it will actually 00:43:41.380 --> 00:43:44.059 break down for you. Grounded is a really good 00:43:44.059 --> 00:43:47.920 source for that. That's one of them. They break 00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:54.159 down what publications are covering certain stories. 00:43:55.260 --> 00:43:58.400 who's covering it more or like Republican versus 00:43:58.400 --> 00:44:02.440 Democrat and how it's being covered exactly and 00:44:02.440 --> 00:44:06.360 I yeah it's hard to tell people to go spend money 00:44:06.360 --> 00:44:08.960 on that when people are struggling to buy groceries 00:44:08.960 --> 00:44:12.599 right now but we're getting into I don't know 00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:14.699 we're getting into a point when it comes to news 00:44:14.699 --> 00:44:19.219 and media that I don't know what to believe without 00:44:19.219 --> 00:44:22.079 tools like that. What are some of the things 00:44:22.079 --> 00:44:26.130 that because Flagpole doesn't just cover art 00:44:26.130 --> 00:44:29.769 and culture. So what are some of the ways that 00:44:29.769 --> 00:44:34.530 you work to maintain your own journalistic integrity? 00:44:35.090 --> 00:44:39.030 And I will say the news side is something that 00:44:39.030 --> 00:44:41.510 I personally am not. You don't really mess with 00:44:41.510 --> 00:44:44.090 that. I don't really mess with too much. It's 00:44:44.090 --> 00:44:46.969 a conversation. It has to be a conversation. 00:44:47.789 --> 00:44:52.210 And sometimes it's a conversation with the entire 00:44:52.210 --> 00:44:55.460 staff. what we're covering, how we're covering 00:44:55.460 --> 00:44:59.139 it, and trying to make sure that it's the facts. 00:44:59.239 --> 00:45:02.320 And we are a small team. And it's also not a 00:45:02.320 --> 00:45:06.599 secret that Flagpole, we are independent. We're 00:45:06.599 --> 00:45:10.059 one of the very few independent alt -weeklies 00:45:10.059 --> 00:45:12.739 left in the nation. We own ourselves. We can 00:45:12.739 --> 00:45:15.840 do whatever we want, which I love. I appreciate 00:45:15.840 --> 00:45:20.480 that. But we're also liberal leaning. So sometimes 00:45:20.480 --> 00:45:23.219 you can read that slant in things, but I think 00:45:23.219 --> 00:45:28.199 that, I think we do strive to put out the facts, 00:45:28.579 --> 00:45:32.199 not jump on things based on hearsay, things like 00:45:32.199 --> 00:45:34.780 that. The best thing you can do is always refer 00:45:34.780 --> 00:45:38.780 to sources. And I know our news editor, Blake, 00:45:39.699 --> 00:45:42.880 does a good job of identifying where all the 00:45:42.880 --> 00:45:45.199 information comes from. So you can go back and 00:45:45.199 --> 00:45:47.599 do your own research. Because I always encourage 00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:50.599 everyone Go do your own research too. The problem 00:45:50.599 --> 00:45:52.860 is we didn't teach a lot of these people how 00:45:52.860 --> 00:45:56.119 to do research. That's the problem that we're 00:45:56.119 --> 00:45:59.380 running into now, I think. So where do you see 00:45:59.380 --> 00:46:03.739 all of this going for you personally? Do you 00:46:03.739 --> 00:46:07.760 have goals or do you just do what you have the 00:46:07.760 --> 00:46:10.000 tools for in front of you at the moment? Because 00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:13.360 I don't really unnecessarily operate with goals. 00:46:15.210 --> 00:46:17.670 here's what I got, I'm gonna do something with 00:46:17.670 --> 00:46:24.530 it. Yeah, that has changed entirely for me. So 00:46:24.530 --> 00:46:28.110 I'm a very anxious person and I'm a planner. 00:46:28.289 --> 00:46:32.150 Everything in my life, I'm very, I like plans, 00:46:32.289 --> 00:46:35.190 I like routines, things like that. Those are 00:46:35.190 --> 00:46:38.269 like coping, those are very strong coping skills 00:46:38.269 --> 00:46:44.170 for you. Absolutely. And growing up, everything 00:46:44.400 --> 00:46:47.380 especially with my parents, everything was goals. 00:46:49.199 --> 00:46:52.199 And growing up, going through college, everything 00:46:52.199 --> 00:46:55.460 was, here's my plan, here's my goals. Getting 00:46:55.460 --> 00:46:58.400 out of college was like, here's my plans, here's 00:46:58.400 --> 00:47:02.099 my goals. And obviously through my story, it 00:47:02.099 --> 00:47:05.019 just never really panned out the way that I planned. 00:47:05.800 --> 00:47:11.619 And I was a very strong goal setter. And I think... 00:47:11.789 --> 00:47:15.710 Honestly that period that I talked about where 00:47:15.710 --> 00:47:19.409 I quit my digital marketing job and was struggling 00:47:19.409 --> 00:47:23.250 a lot mentally It was at that point that I realized 00:47:23.250 --> 00:47:28.050 for me personally Focusing too much on the future. 00:47:28.050 --> 00:47:30.869 I was not taking care of myself in the present 00:47:30.869 --> 00:47:37.469 and it was almost excusing my anxiety by being 00:47:37.469 --> 00:47:40.530 like We don't have to worry about the steps we're 00:47:40.530 --> 00:47:43.130 taking if we don't have a goal in the first place 00:47:43.130 --> 00:47:45.690 and what we're trying to get there. And I started 00:47:45.690 --> 00:47:49.530 looking at it differently. And right now, currently, 00:47:50.329 --> 00:47:56.030 I think having that experience and how wild the 00:47:56.030 --> 00:47:59.369 news is every day and the current situation, 00:47:59.710 --> 00:48:02.550 I don't know how to set goals for myself anymore. 00:48:03.070 --> 00:48:05.670 I don't know what's going to happen. Like you 00:48:05.670 --> 00:48:11.159 said, that making the best of the present with 00:48:11.159 --> 00:48:13.719 the tools I have available and just knowing that 00:48:13.719 --> 00:48:17.000 if I'm making the best of every day, I gotta 00:48:17.000 --> 00:48:21.260 be on the right path. I think that's, yeah. That's 00:48:21.260 --> 00:48:23.559 what it is for me. The cure to FOMO is YOLO. 00:48:24.039 --> 00:48:26.599 Yeah, that's fair. And it's hard for me. I'm 00:48:26.599 --> 00:48:30.860 a big FOMO person. FOMO hits me hard. YOLO is 00:48:30.860 --> 00:48:33.960 hard sometimes to live by. But yeah, I think 00:48:33.960 --> 00:48:37.460 that's the place I'm at. Yeah, Sam. Thank you 00:48:37.460 --> 00:48:39.539 so much for being here Is there anything that 00:48:39.539 --> 00:48:42.579 that we didn't talk about that you feel like 00:48:42.579 --> 00:48:45.639 you you want to you? Want to make sure that we 00:48:45.639 --> 00:48:48.860 know about yeah This has been a really great 00:48:48.860 --> 00:48:51.840 conversation. Yeah, I think that we've really 00:48:51.840 --> 00:48:56.420 covered things I will clarify that I've been 00:48:56.420 --> 00:49:00.179 the editorial coordinator at flagpole for a little 00:49:00.179 --> 00:49:03.460 over four years now. And since January, I'm actually 00:49:03.460 --> 00:49:08.440 the music editor as well. Oh, okay. Cool. Can 00:49:08.440 --> 00:49:13.300 we talk a little bit about how your role changed 00:49:13.300 --> 00:49:15.480 and your duties expanded when that happened this 00:49:15.480 --> 00:49:19.239 year? Yeah, sure. So when I came into Flagpole, 00:49:22.360 --> 00:49:26.460 the editorial team had changed because of COVID, 00:49:26.920 --> 00:49:30.659 where really through COVID it was Blake Odd holding 00:49:30.659 --> 00:49:34.119 down news and it was Jessica Smith holding down 00:49:34.119 --> 00:49:37.579 arts and culture and music. And so I came in 00:49:37.579 --> 00:49:40.139 as the editorial coordinator is like a bridge 00:49:40.139 --> 00:49:44.139 between the two to help take on a lot of the 00:49:44.139 --> 00:49:47.079 planning, special projects like the guide to 00:49:47.079 --> 00:49:51.280 Athens, coming in as an extra set of editor eyes, 00:49:51.960 --> 00:49:55.000 helping put the paper together, knowing that 00:49:55.230 --> 00:49:58.250 Music was my writing strong suit, but I feel 00:49:58.250 --> 00:50:02.730 like I can write anything just about But with 00:50:02.730 --> 00:50:05.250 my connection to volumes hip -hop it was known 00:50:05.250 --> 00:50:08.750 when I came in we wanted to be very careful that 00:50:08.750 --> 00:50:14.150 Jessica was the music editor so no one felt There 00:50:14.150 --> 00:50:18.510 was any Bias happening or I was changing things 00:50:18.510 --> 00:50:23.210 stepping on toes on toes but I did a lot of the 00:50:23.210 --> 00:50:25.869 music writing. I did a lot of the culture writing, 00:50:26.269 --> 00:50:30.710 too, since being editorial coordinator. Over 00:50:30.710 --> 00:50:33.929 time, I worked very closely with Jessica Smith 00:50:33.929 --> 00:50:36.809 on the arts and culture and music side of things. 00:50:37.289 --> 00:50:40.110 And that's a huge chunk of the paper that used 00:50:40.110 --> 00:50:44.110 to be two separate editors. So I would help her 00:50:44.110 --> 00:50:46.820 a lot. And at the beginning of the year, She 00:50:46.820 --> 00:50:49.840 moved on to a new position that's super great 00:50:49.840 --> 00:50:54.099 for her. And so we were like, we don't have to 00:50:54.099 --> 00:50:57.400 keep the paper structure like this. It was something 00:50:57.400 --> 00:51:00.320 that was left over from COVID. So we restructured 00:51:00.320 --> 00:51:02.440 a little bit. And you restructured it based on 00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:05.280 the skill set that the team had. Exactly. It 00:51:05.280 --> 00:51:09.139 was exactly that. At that point, everyone decided. 00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:13.519 Volumes, my connection to volumes was not a concern 00:51:13.519 --> 00:51:15.800 anymore. I'd been with the paper long enough 00:51:15.800 --> 00:51:19.460 to prove in myself. Kept a lot of my editorial 00:51:19.460 --> 00:51:22.119 coordinator duties because I'm really good at 00:51:22.119 --> 00:51:25.880 organizing things and picked up music editor 00:51:25.880 --> 00:51:29.179 as well. And then now we do have an arts and 00:51:29.179 --> 00:51:31.500 culture coordinator position. So we were able 00:51:31.500 --> 00:51:34.760 to pull all the pieces of the paper back out 00:51:34.760 --> 00:51:37.079 again a little bit. little do they know it's 00:51:37.079 --> 00:51:39.659 all part of your master plan master plan right 00:51:39.659 --> 00:51:43.679 volumes hip hop into flagpole oh man that's i'll 00:51:43.679 --> 00:51:46.260 cut that i don't want to start it's all good 00:51:46.260 --> 00:51:51.500 i will say with all the changes my place at flagpole 00:51:51.500 --> 00:51:55.719 better serves what i'm writing about in the music 00:51:55.719 --> 00:51:59.559 community than volumes does it's it's organic 00:51:59.559 --> 00:52:04.360 and i make choices that fit flagpole yeah so 00:52:04.360 --> 00:52:09.300 volumes is become much more of just my event 00:52:09.300 --> 00:52:13.079 production business. So at this point, I will 00:52:13.079 --> 00:52:19.239 say it's really moved away from the zine press 00:52:19.239 --> 00:52:23.349 media aspect since I am now at Flagpole. Will 00:52:23.349 --> 00:52:25.690 say that that calendar that you put out for a 00:52:25.690 --> 00:52:31.670 fest was still very helpful Like super plugged 00:52:31.670 --> 00:52:34.150 into every aspect of the music scene here. It's 00:52:34.150 --> 00:52:38.250 it was really nice to like Under I wish I wish 00:52:38.250 --> 00:52:41.110 porch fest like the calendar for that could be 00:52:41.110 --> 00:52:44.130 a little bit easier to read because wow, but 00:52:44.130 --> 00:52:48.469 And I will so Just as a product of all the things 00:52:48.469 --> 00:52:49.989 that I do and I don't even know who does that. 00:52:49.989 --> 00:52:53.630 I'm not trying to call anybody It's something 00:52:53.630 --> 00:52:56.690 that's talked about a lot 260 artists this year. 00:52:56.710 --> 00:53:00.469 Yeah, it's crazy So I will say the last two years 00:53:00.469 --> 00:53:04.409 I have been on the FS booking committee Which 00:53:04.409 --> 00:53:07.090 I have loved being a part of that and a big part 00:53:07.090 --> 00:53:10.389 of that is Booking the hip -hop acts. This is 00:53:10.389 --> 00:53:12.690 actually great because I like Mary told me about 00:53:12.690 --> 00:53:14.989 the booking committee yesterday So now I get 00:53:14.989 --> 00:53:16.929 to talk to one of you without even realizing 00:53:16.929 --> 00:53:20.010 I'm sorry. I'm not trying to drag No, no, you're 00:53:20.010 --> 00:53:22.030 great. I've got my hands on all kinds of things. 00:53:22.150 --> 00:53:25.309 No, this is perfect. This is perfect Beats nicely. 00:53:25.369 --> 00:53:28.210 So how what is the process like with booking 00:53:28.210 --> 00:53:30.130 Brass Fest? I was actually really curious and 00:53:30.130 --> 00:53:33.650 she was like there's a booking committee totally 00:53:33.650 --> 00:53:38.460 there's AFS is a huge undertaking, so Mary does 00:53:38.460 --> 00:53:41.139 a great job, but everyone's gotta be in their 00:53:41.139 --> 00:53:45.500 lane to make it work. And delegate. Delegate. 00:53:46.000 --> 00:53:50.079 So with the Booking Committee, everyone submits, 00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:52.940 artists submit, and they submit links and all 00:53:52.940 --> 00:53:56.380 their info, and then there's a period during 00:53:56.380 --> 00:53:59.400 which the members of the Booking Committee go 00:53:59.400 --> 00:54:02.659 through the spreadsheet and check everyone out. 00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:10.340 make your own list of priorities, maybes, and 00:54:10.340 --> 00:54:14.000 then you just have your nose or your backup, 00:54:14.079 --> 00:54:16.840 backups, or things like that. Nobody really campaigns 00:54:16.840 --> 00:54:19.079 against people being on. They just have their 00:54:19.079 --> 00:54:23.880 picks for it. Yeah. Basically, yeah, we have 00:54:23.880 --> 00:54:27.300 our picks for it. The only thing I can think 00:54:27.300 --> 00:54:31.570 of is if someone is... I know that this act is 00:54:31.570 --> 00:54:34.710 very problematic in some way. It doesn't represent 00:54:34.710 --> 00:54:38.250 Athfest or I don't know. It would have to be 00:54:38.250 --> 00:54:40.829 pretty extreme to be like, I have to let you 00:54:40.829 --> 00:54:44.510 guys know about this person or band. Otherwise, 00:54:45.250 --> 00:54:48.269 after we go through looking at the list, we come 00:54:48.269 --> 00:54:52.730 together as a group with kind of our picks and 00:54:52.730 --> 00:54:56.610 Troy Aubrey is the head of it. and Troy already 00:54:56.610 --> 00:55:00.969 always comes with who he's picked for headliners 00:55:00.969 --> 00:55:03.789 and who he has offers out for and we fill in 00:55:03.789 --> 00:55:07.570 the blanks is essentially how the booking committee 00:55:07.570 --> 00:55:10.510 works. And this year, it was really lovely because 00:55:10.510 --> 00:55:14.210 we had an intern who was able to facilitate sending 00:55:14.210 --> 00:55:19.949 out the contracts. In the past, we've split it 00:55:19.949 --> 00:55:23.489 up, gotten the contracts back from people, but 00:55:23.489 --> 00:55:26.820 we do Split it up as far as who's contacting 00:55:26.820 --> 00:55:29.239 who about the initial offers and getting things 00:55:29.239 --> 00:55:33.179 set. How do you make sure that the bands that 00:55:33.179 --> 00:55:35.300 share members don't play at the same time? Because 00:55:35.300 --> 00:55:37.480 that's got to be like that's got to be like a 00:55:37.480 --> 00:55:40.820 real concern. It definitely is. And that's Troy. 00:55:40.900 --> 00:55:44.539 That's Troy Aubrey. That's wild. Because John 00:55:44.539 --> 00:55:46.320 Neff, who I'm actually going to go talk to this 00:55:46.320 --> 00:55:48.900 afternoon, he played in three different bands 00:55:48.900 --> 00:55:50.699 at this year's AFFest. And I was just joking 00:55:50.699 --> 00:55:53.570 with him. We should just call it NeffFest. But 00:55:53.570 --> 00:55:56.650 that's a real concern. I can think of several 00:55:56.650 --> 00:56:00.429 other examples where people are in multiple bands 00:56:00.429 --> 00:56:05.349 and it's a lot to keep track of. It's not just 00:56:05.349 --> 00:56:08.889 the hundred or so artists that play. It's way 00:56:08.889 --> 00:56:12.809 more than that. Yeah, which is you talking about 00:56:12.809 --> 00:56:16.630 PorchFest makes PorchFest and they're scheduling... 00:56:16.940 --> 00:56:19.320 Really intense this year. I can't believe they 00:56:19.320 --> 00:56:23.639 let people play in more than one porch fest So 00:56:23.639 --> 00:56:25.900 this year was my first year being on the porch 00:56:25.900 --> 00:56:31.059 fest committee and I can't speak to a Lot of 00:56:31.059 --> 00:56:33.780 the decisions. We definitely came together many 00:56:33.780 --> 00:56:38.159 times to talk through improvements concerns and 00:56:38.159 --> 00:56:41.280 they've done a really great job of Adding things 00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:46.340 like the food truck park and yeah the Indy market 00:56:46.340 --> 00:56:49.059 and Indy South market and things like that. They're 00:56:49.059 --> 00:56:53.360 really cool the ever -expanding number of acts 00:56:53.360 --> 00:56:57.400 is a thing that is widely talked about and I 00:56:57.400 --> 00:57:00.579 think that there are Certain point you spread 00:57:00.579 --> 00:57:03.539 the people so thin You know, and I haven't been 00:57:03.539 --> 00:57:06.539 to a porch fest. I just yeah just think Lee that's 00:57:06.539 --> 00:57:09.059 just what happened. It's right the more acts 00:57:09.059 --> 00:57:11.539 there are the more people who are going to end 00:57:11.539 --> 00:57:14.260 up playing to two or three people in the lawn. 00:57:14.719 --> 00:57:17.840 And there's those some acts that are always going 00:57:17.840 --> 00:57:21.599 to draw a crowd of 80 people or more or whatever 00:57:21.599 --> 00:57:25.039 and spill out into the street. I cannot speak 00:57:25.039 --> 00:57:27.559 for historic Athens as far as what the future 00:57:27.559 --> 00:57:30.940 holds. I can't speak. But they're aware of some 00:57:30.940 --> 00:57:34.519 of these things that are aware. And I think that 00:57:34.519 --> 00:57:37.099 sometimes talking to a group of people, you can 00:57:37.099 --> 00:57:40.010 bring up criticisms. But when you have all of 00:57:40.010 --> 00:57:42.869 these people still willing to sign up, it's hard 00:57:42.869 --> 00:57:47.070 to justify. Like sometimes it's hard to justify 00:57:47.070 --> 00:57:50.750 your changing. Yeah. Although they're valid, 00:57:51.050 --> 00:57:53.369 I think they're valid criticisms. But if people 00:57:53.369 --> 00:57:56.210 are still signing up, it's it's on them. They 00:57:56.210 --> 00:57:58.329 know what they're signing up for. It's kind of 00:57:58.329 --> 00:58:01.710 like Disney raises their prices. People are still 00:58:01.710 --> 00:58:06.829 going people. We might think it's it might be. 00:58:07.039 --> 00:58:10.679 Tough on the whatever but but and for the people 00:58:10.679 --> 00:58:13.320 that they're not wrong anymore. There's others 00:58:13.320 --> 00:58:16.739 that are still coming in So that's where I think 00:58:16.739 --> 00:58:19.480 it's at Sam. Thank you so much for being here. 00:58:19.920 --> 00:58:22.659 Yeah I really appreciate it. Yeah, absolutely. 00:58:23.159 --> 00:58:25.780 Thanks. Make sure you check out flagpole magazine. 00:58:25.860 --> 00:58:30.880 In fact You have a chance right now to be part 00:58:30.880 --> 00:58:34.309 of flagpole magazine Their last issue of the 00:58:34.309 --> 00:58:38.570 year, they take user submitted, reader submitted 00:58:38.570 --> 00:58:42.789 stories and articles and poems and all that kind 00:58:42.789 --> 00:58:47.429 of thing. You can make a submission right now. 00:58:48.110 --> 00:58:50.489 That's open for a little bit longer. There's 00:58:50.489 --> 00:58:53.510 links in the description to the magazine. There's 00:58:53.510 --> 00:58:56.900 links to Volumes Hip Hop. Stick around hit that 00:58:56.900 --> 00:58:58.920 subscribe button a lot of people are listening 00:58:58.920 --> 00:59:01.880 without subscribing and I appreciate it But we 00:59:01.880 --> 00:59:05.019 got a lot of cool stuff coming your way We got 00:59:05.019 --> 00:59:08.780 John Neff and Jim chemo West as I mentioned earlier 00:59:08.780 --> 00:59:11.480 and then starting in January we're gonna take 00:59:11.480 --> 00:59:13.840 a couple weeks off and then starting in January 00:59:13.840 --> 00:59:16.719 we got season 3 kicking off with Tommy Simbaz 00:59:16.719 --> 00:59:21.159 who's a comedian and a friend of mine and Brian 00:59:21.159 --> 00:59:23.760 Howard from cracker and he's played with Kevin 00:59:23.760 --> 00:59:27.440 Kenny and Just countless people. Stick around. 00:59:27.639 --> 00:59:29.760 We've got a lot coming and we're just getting 00:59:29.760 --> 00:59:32.579 started here on overeducated and underemployed. 00:59:33.039 --> 00:59:34.219 Happy Thanksgiving, y 'all.