1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,640 This show is made possible by Apple Podcasts, Squarespace, SoundCloud, and available wherever 2 00:00:06,640 --> 00:00:12,160 you get your podcasts. And by the generous contributions of subscribers like you. 3 00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:16,080 Thank you for reviewing, sharing, and subscribing. 4 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:22,800 If you think you've experienced an unexplained event, maybe brushed against the paranormal 5 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:30,240 and would like to share your story, contact us at phenomenacasefiles.proton.me. Please 6 00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:36,640 add the keywords listener case file X to the subject line of your email to pass through the 7 00:00:36,640 --> 00:00:53,680 show's strict communication filters. And finally, enjoy tonight's show. 8 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:16,480 Let's get this started. Let me tell you something about Estes Park Colorado celebrates Bigfoot. 9 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:24,480 And we're back on the case. This is Robert Cavalier. Tonight's show is about my visit to 10 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:30,960 Estes Park. Joining the celebration they call Bigfoot Days. Held on April 19th and 20th, 11 00:01:30,960 --> 00:01:37,040 Bigfoot Days kicks off the festival season at Estes Park, Colorado and kicks off my own season 12 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:42,640 exploring this kind of cultural phenomenon. I hope to bring you back more of these each season 13 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:49,360 starting with Bigfoot Days. Then I got my hopes set on the Roswell UFO Festival. The season for 14 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:55,680 the festivals I'd like to visit and at which if I can also set up a booth to share this podcast, 15 00:01:55,680 --> 00:02:01,040 my books, meet like-minded fun people and maybe even one day get to meet and greet people who've 16 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:06,960 listened to the Phenomenon Case Files podcast. The festivals I'm interested after Estes Park, 17 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:13,280 Bigfoot Days and I'd encourage you to check out in 2024 are the Roswell UFO Festival, July 5th, 18 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:21,120 the Kecksburg UFO Festival, July 19th and 21 at Mount Pleasant, Pennsylvania, 19 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:30,960 July 9th, the Phenomenon Case Files podcast. This is a new festival in about time because I 20 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,280 know this area and if you know anything about this area, it's very close to the 21 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:41,440 Dinosaur National Monument at the Bar West corner of Colorado and about a 15-20 minute drive 22 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:48,960 from the Dinosaur Colorado. It's exciting for me because if you map these cryptid UFO 23 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:54,640 paranormal festivals, you'll find that they are mostly held in the Midwest and East Coast States 24 00:02:55,360 --> 00:03:00,480 and the name Phenomenon. Got to check that out, right? Maybe it's not too late for me to 25 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:06,800 reserve a vendor tent there, so we'll see. So for me it's nice to have festival options available 26 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:14,080 which are within five to six hours drive. That's pretty doable for me versus 19 hours to number four, 27 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:20,240 the Mothman Festival, September 21 and 22 in the famous Point Pleasant, West Virginia. 28 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:25,920 And I've got to go to the Mothman Festival this year. I've been wanting to go to this for many 29 00:03:25,920 --> 00:03:30,480 years. I'm very drawn to this festival ever since the Mothman prophecies and the Mothman 30 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:36,320 documentaries I've seen. This is something I really want to do and I just love the eeriness and the 31 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:42,000 lore. Those areas are wholly different from my own experience growing up in the Southwest 32 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:50,000 and Mountain West. It's a far more humid area, more gloomy, more moody, and I know people from 33 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:57,040 those areas probably sometimes long for sunny places like where I'm from, but I love those kind 34 00:03:57,040 --> 00:04:02,560 of rainy days and I look forward to going to the Mothman Festival. It's a goal of mine this year 35 00:04:02,560 --> 00:04:05,040 and I will do it. Probably going to have to fly out there. 36 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:12,800 By the way, if you head over to the calendar tab on the PhenomenaCaseFiles.com website, 37 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:17,360 you'll see that I'm covering that movie, the Mothman prophecies with my friend Dan over at 38 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:24,400 the Hack it podcast. So he'll come on the show to co-host with me. This will be a more fun type 39 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:29,520 of episode looking at this movie from different angles and bringing you our impressions, commentary, 40 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:35,840 and of course, high jinks and laughs. So save the date. That should be episode five on May 23rd. 41 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:41,520 There are many other festivals going around, but these are the most accessible to me. It made me 42 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:49,280 realize that besides the Vernautah Convention, there's a big swath of land surrounding these 43 00:04:49,280 --> 00:04:56,320 mountain states to include Arizona, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico, Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, 44 00:04:56,320 --> 00:05:02,720 and to name more than a few, where there really aren't any kind of festivals held like this. 45 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:09,200 I'd really like to see a convention or festival at Aztec, New Mexico. Boy, wouldn't it be a dream 46 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:14,640 to buy a little hotel set up a bookstore and a small convention venue there? Anyway, that's a 47 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:20,720 dream of mine. And there used to be a little haunted hotel there, actually, which we'll cover 48 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:25,920 later on. I'm headed there this coming Memorial weekend and I'll bring back some stories. 49 00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:31,760 That's a promise. So let me ask you this. What indie podcast do you know of that takes you places 50 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:37,680 like I'm doing? Just saying. Subscribe and share. We're going places together. The main vein of 51 00:05:37,680 --> 00:05:42,720 the Phenomena of Podcasts is delving into mysteries and lore, bringing on experts in the field to 52 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:46,720 share their findings and worldviews, as well as diving into the metaphysical dimension of the 53 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:52,800 philosophy of the paranormal. Look, I'm primarily a writer and not a podcaster. Along the way, 54 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:58,560 I've discovered that sharing with listeners and readers the words in the worlds I've discovered, 55 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:04,320 both imaginary, real, and maybe paranormal, is an immensely rewarding experience for me. 56 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:10,000 It's about dialogue, about sitting across a table in a poorly lit tavern and talking away the night 57 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:16,960 with old and new friends about all sorts of things. But I'm covering festivals as a special 58 00:06:16,960 --> 00:06:23,520 part of the podcast because these kinds of events bring a special group of people together. That's 59 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:30,160 a community, sharing laughs, perspectives, celebrating, and making great memories. And almost all of these 60 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:38,640 festivals have a grassroots origin. They came about as a town or an area came to terms with their 61 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:44,720 lore with great unexplained events, cryptid sightings, hauntings. Usually these towns just 62 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:50,800 organize the festivals and embrace their legends, sharing them with the world. That's the case with 63 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:56,240 the Mothman Festival. And I can tell you this, it's much the same with the Hexburg Incident. 64 00:06:57,280 --> 00:07:03,760 There are other places ripe with festival potential like Kingman, Arizona, St. Augustine, 65 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:11,680 Florida, Aztec, New Mexico, Tows, and Atchison, Kansas. So without further ado, let's get onto 66 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:16,640 the program I prepared for you. Enjoy the show. 67 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:24,640 If you've ever found yourself turning down the lights on a lazy Saturday to watch 68 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:31,840 Stanley Kubrick's The Shining might have gone down the horror fan rabbit hole about that eerie hotel. 69 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:37,840 Then found out the hotel was inspired by the Stanley Hotel at Estes Park, Colorado. 70 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:45,360 So it may come as a surprise this little mountain town has been running a festival dedicated to what 71 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:53,440 is perhaps America's favorite cryptid, the legendary Bigfoot. Making my way through 72 00:07:53,440 --> 00:08:00,080 a winding mountain road to Highway 36, I found myself drawn to what amounts to a homegrown 73 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:06,400 festival that at first glance resembles more a farmer's market than a cryptid festival, 74 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:11,920 until you get closer and spot a giant happy-faced inflatable Bigfoot effigy. 75 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:18,080 It's a light jovial atmosphere within the town's festival enclosure, 76 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:23,120 rock Irish fusion blasting from a stadium nearby and vendors tense, 77 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:26,080 peddling their wares that meets the senses. 78 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:35,200 All of this with a scenic mountain backdrop that, on a chilly spring, was sprinkled with the 79 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:43,920 lightest snowfall and a rocky mountain breeze. It's a familiar affair, a goofy, toothy, lightheaded, 80 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:49,600 especially if you happen to be on to the twisted Griffin's beer on tap. 81 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:57,920 Many romp in the park, yet for a state which is not readily known for strong Sasquatch 82 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:05,440 associations unlike, say, Oregon, the Eastern Board or even the Southwest, this is a welcome lean to, 83 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:10,800 a sweet, pillowy meetup with the farcical side of the paranormal. 84 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:27,680 Last time I told you I was headed up to S.S. Park and, boy, was it a, I don't want to say surprising, 85 00:09:27,680 --> 00:09:33,120 but a really cozy little thing and in fact I was a little surprised. I know us as Park, I grew up 86 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:40,080 visiting that little town and it's right at the mouth of the rocky mountain. One of the entrances, 87 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:47,920 one of the ones that is most visited, very touristy place, but at this time of the year and that was 88 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:56,160 around mid-April, festival was just a two-day thing, 19th and the 20th of April and I'd meant to 89 00:09:56,160 --> 00:10:04,160 bring my gear, which I did, record some ambient sounds, but really I was taken aback by just the 90 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:12,960 feeling of it all and by the festivity. It wasn't a huge thing, but it was, you know, well traffic. 91 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:20,000 You know, there was a sense of a little bit of a party, but nothing out of control in a way, 92 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:24,000 a little disappointing at first, but, you know, it felt pretty cozy. You know, it was a good kickoff 93 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:30,480 to the festival season. I wasn't disappointed. I hate to phrase it that way. I was just expecting 94 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:35,280 something bigger for some reason. I don't know why and when I got there, I actually took a friend 95 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:41,520 with me. I shied up a little bit about fang now to do an interview because it wasn't as available. 96 00:10:41,520 --> 00:10:51,760 It was really more about tents and little things to buy and big, you know, inflatable big foot 97 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:59,440 things and floating about and some policemen. In fact, I first, when I came right upon it, 98 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:05,680 I asked a lady cop. I asked her, you know, where's the big foot festival and she turned around and 99 00:11:05,680 --> 00:11:11,600 looked at me like, this is it. You're here. And I kind of looked a little bit, oh well, 100 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:16,800 of course it was, yes, of course. I knew that. I knew that. Well, there was just at the entrance, 101 00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:21,120 there were a lot of things, a lot of big goods and all kinds of little things. I just didn't take it 102 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:26,480 for that. I didn't really notice all the things around. But never mind that, it was still pretty 103 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:32,480 fun and got to be in an atmosphere in which people were celebrating something which is really not that 104 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:37,440 common in Colorado. In fact, I don't think there is any other place in Colorado that has something 105 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:42,080 similar. So I think Estes Park is unique in that. You might have heard of other festivals like 106 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:48,800 the frozen man, you know, dead man frozen man of Naderland, which got moved actually to Estes Park. 107 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:54,240 So that'll be something there too. That's a weird little and fun little thing, too quirky thing, 108 00:11:54,240 --> 00:12:01,520 just like a lot of Colorado things. I enjoyed it. I said I took a friend with me just to, 109 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:06,880 hey, we're going to check this out, see how it goes. I might fan out, try to peddle my own 110 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:16,080 wares and see what happens. I bumped into a lot of people that were, you know, there was a 111 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:21,680 mothman tent and I tried to talk to the people there, many of them, but they were really just 112 00:12:21,680 --> 00:12:28,080 interested in selling t-shirts and nothing against that at all. But I think wouldn't that be a really 113 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:33,920 good opportunity to just talk about why am I here? Well, how did I come here as a vendor, as a, you 114 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:41,280 know, as someone that's obviously into all this stuff? But that really wasn't the way it went. 115 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:47,360 And there was some guy, because the day before, there was some thing that you pay for and you get 116 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:55,520 to, you know, kind of mingle with the big experts, the big, the bigfoot hunters, the ones that go 117 00:12:55,520 --> 00:13:01,360 out there and get bigfoot. Although to my knowledge, nothing against them. I haven't seen really any 118 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:08,720 bigfoot head trophies or bigfoot cages caged in, like, you know, you know, something you could 119 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:14,000 pay a few coins and watch, nothing like that. You know, this is an elusive creature. So the very 120 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:20,400 notion of a bigfoot hunter is a bit strange. I like it. I like those people too. And they come 121 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:26,080 in quite a few varieties. So you can't pick them all as this or that. I was kind of curious that 122 00:13:26,080 --> 00:13:33,120 in order to talk to them, you'd have to pay $20 for, you know, a photograph of some rather normal 123 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:39,840 looking guy with a beard. But I'm new to this thing myself. And that's the way it is. I want to make 124 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:46,320 it enemies, probably did already. But that's the way I am. I went in there hoping to initiate 125 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:53,440 conversations and get into the lore of it. But the atmosphere was festive and it was enjoyable. 126 00:13:53,440 --> 00:14:00,640 And it brought it got me to thinking, you know, I got into it in the words went in Rome. And I 127 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:06,240 got into it and my friend too got into it. We're just, you know, roaming around having fun, chatting 128 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:15,440 up people, all kinds of things. But really, it's just a it's a very, it's a very new festival too. 129 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:21,600 And I liked it and missed my chance to buy a good t-shirt because I, I just meandered way too long 130 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:27,440 by the time I got back to the t-shirt one, all the sizes that would fit me were just gone. So 131 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:35,680 big tragedy there. However, that sort of bookends the experience really a couple of hours, hanging 132 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:43,760 out, music, you know, this kind of cool band was in there. It was a very windy day, not as windy as 133 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:52,080 I would have expected, or in this mountain town, which does get very windy. It was cold and it snowed 134 00:14:52,080 --> 00:15:00,960 in the in the front range. And I expected to find actually quite a lot fewer people if you could 135 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:06,960 say that, you know, so in the end, it was actually more people than I expected. That was a good surprise. 136 00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:16,400 Like I bumped into one tent of a of a writer, a fellow writer, and she was a really interesting 137 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:25,680 person. But her angle was a child, children's about Bigfoot in a comic way, which I've never seen 138 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:30,800 or even thought of as an angle. And so all of this is very interesting. I'm not taking anything 139 00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:39,600 down. I like it. I like the way we deal with this really iconic and mythic creature of the American 140 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:49,600 West, because it's we're talking about a creature that is said to be a minimum nine feet to as tall 141 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:57,600 as 13 feet. So to be is a grizzly bear of a thing may be bigger. And to look at something like that, 142 00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:02,640 to kind of digest something like that, maybe we have to make fun of it, just like we make fun of 143 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:10,400 of death and and scary things in Halloween. So this is kind of like that. It's just a way it made me 144 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:18,560 think that this is a way that we negotiate those feelings, you know, Bigfoot for me is a lot more 145 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:26,800 than that. And for many others, and this festival is is a good is a good approach, a fun approach, 146 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:32,720 a family thing. And it certainly has its place. I wish to that other people and maybe in the 147 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:38,720 future they will come would bring in a different dimensions. Definitely, the Native American 148 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:46,640 experiences is missing from from this and other angles, the anthropological aspect of it all, 149 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:53,680 the folkloric, the mythical, all of these things. But that's okay. That's what we're here to talk 150 00:16:53,680 --> 00:17:00,560 about. And it's fine. And I enjoyed it. Believe it or not, this was my first foray into the whole 151 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:06,000 festival atmosphere of this kind of thing. And I hope it's not the last and back it's not. I'm 152 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:14,560 planning to go to at least two, maybe three, maybe four other things. I really have Roswell on my, 153 00:17:14,560 --> 00:17:19,200 I want to say bucket list because I don't want to be it, you know, I want it to be the last time. 154 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:27,120 But certainly a great kickoff to this, the Mothman Festival happens later in the year. 155 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:32,880 There's the Kecksburg incident and a couple of other things and another thing in in Colorado to 156 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:41,760 very near a vernal Utah. So for those who might know, very near to the skinwalker ranch, and that 157 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:48,400 will be a theme that we'll, we'll talk about later. This was supposed to be and was in fact a great 158 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:56,320 experience for me because it got me out of out of the corner in which we sit all of us just watching 159 00:17:56,320 --> 00:18:03,120 things and instead into doing things and engaging people. I hope the next time it will be different. 160 00:18:03,120 --> 00:18:10,480 I think it will be different. By then I think I myself will probably have a tent and be displaying 161 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:17,040 some of the things that I that I'm working on and I'd like to bring to light and share. And so 162 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:20,160 that will be a great experience for me in a different angle. And maybe that'll give me a 163 00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:29,360 different sort of behind the scenes experience that I wanted. This little fair was great and it 164 00:18:29,360 --> 00:18:35,440 kind of it didn't kind of it actually led into after, you know, it was pretty much wrap wrapping up 165 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:40,960 went into the Stanley Hotel, which itself was a great experience. Stanley Hotel really is a unique 166 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:48,160 experience all on its own. I'll talk about that in another episode down the road when we when we 167 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:54,240 visit it again. I'll visit it again and plan to do it in a few weeks and just focus on its lore, 168 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:59,520 its mystique and some of the some of the misconceptions about the hotel itself, which was 169 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:07,520 not the filming location, but was what inspired and the writing of it and the the movie and 170 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:13,040 many of the things and some really scary lore in there and that place the last time I was there 171 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:18,240 was quite a few years ago. Boy, everything was upside down. One of my friends, a different set 172 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:24,480 of friends that I went with. I remember one of them telling us, you know, because he's kind of 173 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:30,000 the crazy ones, was like, I think in this place, things will be reversed. I will be the normal 174 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,920 way you'll be the crazy ones. And sure enough, that's what happened. I won't get a lot of the 175 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:40,160 details on that because that's sort of a, that was the sense of youth and it was a weird night. 176 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:45,120 It's always a weird time for me there. I don't know why and it wasn't any different this time either. 177 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:52,240 So Stanley Hotel was just a walking distance from where the festival happened and the Bigfoot 178 00:19:53,040 --> 00:20:01,280 Festival of 254 Estes days or Bigfoot days really rather. So I'm meant to bring this episode 179 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:09,120 right around, I think it was going to be the end of April and it was going to be preceded by a 180 00:20:09,120 --> 00:20:14,400 hunting story, which I will bring to you. I normally don't want to talk housekeeping during 181 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:19,120 the first part of the show. I'm going to usually bring that in the very last one. The whole show 182 00:20:19,120 --> 00:20:25,040 is actually wrapped up. So if you start listening to this podcast and sharing it with other people, 183 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:32,880 I'll start setting up the rhythm of it so that the last move, once the music plays and after that, 184 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:38,080 a little clip of what's coming up and housekeeping things because they take up a lot of time and 185 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:43,840 they're mundane. But I want to bring it up because it's relevant. You know, get wrapped up into a 186 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:50,080 lot of things and a lot of things that happened that I want to share with you. One of those obviously 187 00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:56,560 was going to the festival, getting all that stuff done. It was a great night and I really know that 188 00:20:56,560 --> 00:21:07,040 I'll be back there again and maybe in a different role. This leads me to the very, I think the very 189 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:14,160 few days later, I was actually the next Tuesday, I was flying to Denmark. I reached out before I 190 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:20,880 went to Denmark to Copenhagen, the capital of Denmark. I reached out to a paranormal group out there 191 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:29,360 of Danish, of Danes, Danish people that are really dwelling into the same things that I'm doing. 192 00:21:29,360 --> 00:21:36,080 And they've got a website. It's called hitdenmark.dk. Really interesting. I'll have this in the show 193 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:43,360 notes for the next episode that I'll do with them later on. I reached out for an interview and shared 194 00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:49,680 some thoughts, some ideas. It was an amazing experience. And I went there not drawn just 195 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:54,000 because of the paranormal stories. It just happens to be a dimension that I thought about. It was 196 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,360 just something prearranged with friends to meet out there and just a big reunion for friends that 197 00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:04,640 I know in Europe. And we just gathered there, just chose that location. An amazing experience 198 00:22:04,640 --> 00:22:11,680 itself. And yet everywhere I go now, I want to also explore their lore, what drives and what's 199 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:17,920 under the hood. And this is a new dimension of exploring as I travel. And I'll bring that to 200 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:22,560 you and I'll share that to you. But it all had its toll. I was incredibly tired more than I even 201 00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:30,080 thought I would be. Of course I would be. And the flights and the marathon of walking everywhere and 202 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:37,040 so forth. I've been avoiding flying for a long time for years. And I think this is actually, 203 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:44,480 I don't think this is my first time flying since the end of COVID. And it was a little bit stressful 204 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:49,920 for me just, I think psychologically, it's just not that I don't like traveling. I do, I just, 205 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:56,000 the whole process of getting from one place to another and crossing a notion is more frightful 206 00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:02,960 than Bigfoot. Let me tell you. At any rate, this is not going to be the last time that we'll be 207 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:13,360 talking about Bigfoot, the wild man, Sasquatch, the man in the woods. Because it's something that I 208 00:23:13,360 --> 00:23:20,080 actually never expected would loom so large in the background of my psyche or even the foreground 209 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:29,360 really, as for me, a spiritual entity, an entity that's itself encapsulates all the mystery of 210 00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:36,160 the other side, whatever that means to you. I love the fact that it exists. Even if it exists 211 00:23:36,800 --> 00:23:45,840 only as an imaginary figure, it's valuable to me. If it exists as a real thing, and let's define 212 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:50,240 real as something that interacts with our physical world and the way we understand the rules of this 213 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:56,640 world, then that's an amazing prospect. I think, I think it probably does, but you can, you can 214 00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:03,200 argue with me, I don't know. And the not knowing is actually incredible. It's beautiful. It's not 215 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:11,760 something that we can wrap our head around really quickly, really easily, because there is an ineffable 216 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:19,120 quality to this creature. And that's what drives me. Other people, it might actually not. It might 217 00:24:19,120 --> 00:24:27,280 actually be a bit repulsive, or as in the case of the festival, a bit of a slight-hearted thing to 218 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:32,320 enjoy. And there's nothing wrong with that. We should enjoy it like that as part of it. And kids 219 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:39,120 enjoy it and all of that and growing up with it. Growing up, I didn't really think too much of Bigfoot. 220 00:24:41,120 --> 00:24:46,640 I didn't really think of the Bigfoot or Yeti all that much other than as, I guess, how people 221 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:50,880 would go about their business, think about it. I wasn't really even that interested. And in fact, 222 00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:59,840 I kind of blew it off as just tall tales that were fun to tell. And as I delved into the subject 223 00:24:59,840 --> 00:25:08,000 a bit more and encountered certain figures, and I'll just share that I actually went into graduate 224 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:15,280 studies for ecology as part of my graduate studies. And in doing so, I discovered, not Bigfoot, so 225 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:25,440 no drumroll there, but I discovered a great many deal of mysteries. I'm really into the idea of 226 00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:34,400 the paranormal, which we label as paranormal, as being part of the ecology, as being part of what 227 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:43,760 we coexist with and yet not know so much about. So that's my idea. I think that it's part of the 228 00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:49,840 ecology. I think that if it isn't, then we should know. So if there is something out there interacting, 229 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:56,080 whatever it is, if it's cryptids or some forces that we can't understand interacting with our 230 00:25:56,080 --> 00:26:01,680 world in some way, then that's part of the ecology. That's part of our world. And we should try to 231 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:07,520 understand it. I should try to understand is what I told myself. Bigfoot existed to me as a kind of 232 00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:12,880 comical mythic figure much in the way it was treated at the festival. But we're going to look 233 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:17,840 later on, not in this episode, but later on we'll get more in depth into what literature exists. 234 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:25,120 And one of the most amazing books, which I'll give a hope I give a good justice to it, is by Dr. Taylor. 235 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:32,320 He's with Future Generation's University. You should look into that university and its programs, 236 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:43,360 an amazing look and an amazing angle into how we interact with conservation. A very different 237 00:26:43,360 --> 00:26:51,040 angle versus what we think of conservation in terms of well preserving parks. That's part of it. 238 00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:59,360 But Future Generation brings the wild into the urban areas and how people living in urban areas 239 00:26:59,360 --> 00:27:06,240 and towns and cities can really just not create manicured parks which are fine to exist. And I 240 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:14,800 think they're great. But also start to really intertwine those two things. And I'm not giving 241 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:20,240 it justice, but I'll get into that more later on. I think you would want to look into that if you're 242 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:26,560 interested in ecology, if you're interested in conservation of a different angle and one in which 243 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:33,040 as part of your graduate studies, if you're interested in that, you don't sit and just read 244 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,680 books, which you really do, but you also get out there and you're part of the community. You're 245 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:43,600 interacting, you're doing things, your feet are on the ground, you're not just in the clouds. 246 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:52,720 And that's interesting to me. So one of the leading, in that time he was the director of the school, 247 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:58,400 the dean of the school, and he still has a prominent position there and wrote an amazing book 248 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:04,000 about Bigfoot. And that's one of the things we'll cover later on. And as far as other literature 249 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:11,680 that exists, there's quite a few others. There is the American Indian angle and how it exists in 250 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:19,360 the American Indian psyche, the First Nations psyche. And that's itself is an amazing thing to 251 00:28:19,360 --> 00:28:29,600 get into because Bigfoot is a spiritual being, a being that itself represents the mystery of our 252 00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:39,680 existence, or the mystery that we just cannot uncover easily. And beyond that, it's what it is 253 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:45,520 at its surface. So you think about something like Bigfoot, whether it exists or doesn't exist, 254 00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:49,920 let's just forget about that. Let's think about it as a thought experiment. But let's just say a 255 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:54,640 real creature. So what is it? What is its nature? That's one of the first things that we should ask. 256 00:28:54,640 --> 00:29:02,160 And one of the things that I notice is that it's a visitor or is it? It's something marginal, something 257 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:12,400 that just quite is not within our society. But if we somehow delve into the woods, maybe deep into 258 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:19,440 the woods, we might come in contact with this creature. And that's an amazing thing. And that's 259 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:27,440 itself is just a mind shattering, paradigm shifting type of thing. When that happens, and there are 260 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:33,360 people who are highly credible, who have reported encounters, which they think are consistent with 261 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:43,520 something that is not just a cougar or a bear or some other animal, but a wild man, something resembling 262 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:54,400 a humanoid, an ape-like creature, and yet more intelligent and more savvy and elusive. And that's 263 00:29:54,400 --> 00:30:01,040 the key about Bigfoot. Something so large, so big, and yet we can't find it. We can't pinpoint 264 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:08,960 unless somehow we happen on it or it wants to be seen. And when I speak about Bigfoot as an 265 00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:13,920 ecological figure, as I tied it in, I'm not trying to recruit something that's not there. 266 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:21,040 To me, it's a different dimension of Bigfoot. Bigfoot, to me, exists as an ecological figure. 267 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:28,080 An ecological figure in the sense that he exists in a wilderness, in a place that is beyond the 268 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:38,560 grasp of civilization of mankind. By definition, a figure at the fringe, an outcast, and yet 269 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:46,880 something or someone, this entity chooses to be outside of our grasp, of our experience. 270 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:54,960 Though we don't know, we don't know its motivations. We don't know if it is actually choosing to be 271 00:30:54,960 --> 00:31:01,200 aside from us or we, we humanity, we humans, are choosing to be outside of that realm. 272 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:10,720 So when I speak about an ecological reality, I mean to recruit not your politics, not your views, 273 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:18,240 but your sense of the world as an ecological entity, as a oneness. And in that oneness, 274 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:26,000 in that environment that we share, that we live in, might there be simply a whole host of things 275 00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:32,000 that we know not of? We like to think of ourselves as the explorers, as the discoverers, 276 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:38,720 but what if there are other things who are discovering things, discovering us, 277 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:45,840 discovering our world? Maybe it's not Bigfoot who's at the fringe, but we. 278 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:54,720 Colorado used to be the mountain west frontier. And if you doubt it, you can come over here and 279 00:31:54,720 --> 00:32:01,120 look at the great rocky mountains, majestic, snow capped, even in the summer. And you'll see that 280 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:09,680 there's a whole wall of things that are going to impede your path west. So maybe some people choose 281 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:16,720 not to go that far west because it's just too hard. Yet somewhere along the line, we did go west. 282 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:25,520 We did overcome that big wall of mountain of rock of trees of animals of even, once upon a time, 283 00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:31,760 grizzlies. And whether you like it or not, once upon a time, the native people that live there 284 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:42,240 for 30,000 years or more, they spoke of the Bigfoot Sasquatch, the wild man. And now we, 285 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:51,760 the civilizers of the world, hold festivals and hold up pop-up dolls and all kinds of things that 286 00:32:51,760 --> 00:33:01,040 look like Bigfoot. Look into what I was saying about what Bigfoot is, just from an observational 287 00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:11,840 standpoint, a solitary figure, a figure, a creature that, not unlike a cougar, avoids humanity. And if 288 00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:19,440 so, to me, that speaks of a certain kind of wisdom, a wisdom of the woods, a wisdom of the wild. 289 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:26,880 So let that thought settle in for a little bit. And while you're doing that, let me just take a 290 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:33,440 minute of your time to share this brief message about some of the work I'm doing and something 291 00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:41,520 I'd like to share with you. And I appreciate very much your time. One man's solitary mission 292 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:49,520 into the mysteries becomes an obsession. Coming this fall, Phenomena, a new novel by Robert Cavalier, 293 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:54,960 puts you in the shoes of Julian Carr, a crime reporter turned paranormal investigator who 294 00:33:54,960 --> 00:34:01,520 almost loses everything that once mattered to him in his search for the truth, in what could be his 295 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:11,520 one last case. Published by the Wildman's Press, stay tuned for release news on PhenomenaCaseFiles.com 296 00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:17,520 and X @Phenomenaxfiles and for advanced copies at Amazon and Kindle. 297 00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:29,920 Think about the different aspects of this creature. Could this Wildman be something 298 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:40,720 which does exist in ecological reality? What did that tell us? I think a lot, and I talked a little 299 00:34:40,720 --> 00:34:48,640 bit before this about the terrifying aspect of the Bigfoot, of an animal. So people were terrified 300 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:56,480 by grizzlies, but imagine a Bigfoot thinking animal, an animal that is cunning. And again, 301 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:04,080 I would emphasize its illusiveness. And there are many other animals that are very illusive, 302 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:14,800 like the mountain lion. In fact, many have said that the cry of the mountain lion is really what 303 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:22,320 people confuse as the Bigfoot, and that may very well be the truth. But there may be quite a bit 304 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:35,040 more to that as well. I think that as a terrifying figure, it's interesting too its aspect, its huge 305 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:43,520 head, its definitely threatening potential to something as small as a human. But I think 306 00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:52,480 another thing that's very interesting about it is that if one were to gaze, and I would wager, 307 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:58,960 gaze at this animal or be caught in its gaze rather, I think that it would be a thing that knows you, 308 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:07,200 something from whose gaze you cannot escape, a knowing, thinking thing. And I wonder if that's 309 00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:15,360 something that lies beyond that fear barrier. In fact, I think it is. And it's something ineffable, 310 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:24,080 like the wind, a river, a cloud, things that stand tall, large, they're inescapable, they're all 311 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:31,120 around us, and yet we can't really quite grasp them. What does the lore tell us? The lore tells us, 312 00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:40,960 and it asks for a long time, this lore is not just something from modern man, or people that 313 00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:46,240 get stigmatized as rednecks, sorry, but that's what they're called, rustic people. 314 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:52,560 It's not really their story, it doesn't really belong to them. Not that it doesn't belong to them, 315 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:57,680 but I'm saying it's origins, the origins of Bigfoot go way deeper, and they go thousands and 316 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:03,920 thousands of years. And that lore tells a similar story to the people that encountered it, 317 00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:12,320 encountered this creature, or said to have encountered it way later. And it is at its surface 318 00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:21,680 a solitary creature, a creature that dwells in the woods, a creature that is at one with the woods, 319 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:30,640 and a creature that doesn't want to be found. Unaccompanied. We don't really hear about a 320 00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:38,480 Bigfoot tribe or a Bigfoot horde. In fact, the experience is usually described as 321 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:46,080 either those terrifying sounds or cries that sound a bit like a mountain lion, or even 322 00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:52,960 something quite a bit more terrifying. And then also people have described a stench infused in 323 00:37:52,960 --> 00:38:02,240 rot and sulfur. And that is also a bit strange to me, it's what it is in terms of descriptions, 324 00:38:02,240 --> 00:38:09,920 that's what we have. But I wonder what the psyche does. I wonder if the brain plays a trick, 325 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:17,520 in something unknown, so unknown and so alien that I wonder if our mind, our brain, 326 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:27,440 find a match to something comparable, something analogous, comes up with the closest thing, 327 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:31,520 and that would be something that's telling you, alerting you that it's dangerous, that it's 328 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:41,920 not to be interacted with, that you should avoid it. Well, we won't avoid it, we want to know it, 329 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:49,040 what it represents, both as a folkloric figure and possibly as something that exists in our world. 330 00:38:50,240 --> 00:38:56,480 I like to think too that this Bigfoot, this wild man, as I like to call it, it's one of its names 331 00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:08,960 after all, is something that dwells at the margins, and it's something that knows us and knows to 332 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:17,680 avoid us. Maybe it's waiting us out, maybe it's been there all along, waiting for civilization to 333 00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:26,240 fall for human, maybe the last human to fall and for it to thrive. Could it be the haven't 334 00:39:26,240 --> 00:39:37,920 guard of things that lie just beyond the veil? What if Bigfoot is something like the Vikings, 335 00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:50,400 things recognizable as human to the unknowing eye and yet, holy alien. These Northmen, of course, 336 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:58,160 were human, but what I'm talking about is that part of them was invaders, wanderers, explorers, 337 00:39:58,160 --> 00:40:02,640 would-be colonizers. Could Bigfoot be something like that? 338 00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:13,280 I'll tell you this, whatever it is, the wild man exists because we brought it to life, 339 00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:22,880 gave form to a dream, a primal fear, to wonder itself. Some things are not what they appear to be, 340 00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:44,160 and some appear exactly as they are. 341 00:40:53,600 --> 00:41:04,320 I hope that you've enjoyed the show this time around. It's been a few weeks and this is a podcast 342 00:41:04,320 --> 00:41:14,080 that is going to be coming in at you in bi-weekly frequency, and for the month of May, even more 343 00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:21,120 frequent than that because I want to get this kick started as I did, like March, and it's part of 344 00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:27,680 something bigger that I wanted to talk about too. This has to do with the creation of the 345 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:36,240 phenomena case files podcast with Yours Truly, Robert Cavaliere. What I want to do is create, 346 00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:40,800 and I did in fact create an infrastructure which will bring not only these stories through the 347 00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:46,720 medium of the podcast, which is now available through anywhere you get your podcasts, really 348 00:41:46,720 --> 00:41:57,120 any of the major sources, Spotify, the RSS feed, the Apple podcasts, and many others, any of the 349 00:41:57,120 --> 00:42:02,240 major carriers, any of the major streamers, any of those will have it, except for YouTube, and 350 00:42:02,240 --> 00:42:09,760 as I discussed in the last, in one of the episodes, not somewhere I want to get into because I don't 351 00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:15,600 like the domain, and I may still yet do it at some point later down the road. Anyway, 352 00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:20,640 the reason I created it was because I'm interested in this subject, and as I said in the episode, 353 00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:27,760 the ecology of the paranormal is interesting to me as a phenomenon itself, as something that is 354 00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:33,840 unexplained and maybe will always be unexplained, and yet it doesn't take away from me, and I don't 355 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:41,040 think from anyone that listens to this, it doesn't take away from the experience, it doesn't make 356 00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:47,520 a difference that we won't understand it all, because if you can glimpse at some part of it, 357 00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:56,160 we'll have understood quite a lot. The links to the show are also available through the website, 358 00:42:56,160 --> 00:43:04,400 which is PhenomenaCaseFiles.com, it's pretty easy, and it's linked in the, or referenced in the 359 00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:11,440 show notes, the music is by Leonel Cassio, by the way, check him out, wonderful creator, and 360 00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:20,640 the website brings a little bit more dimension to it, it showcases the blogs that I enter, which 361 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:25,440 are not exactly what's covered in the show, sometimes a little bit more, sometimes a little 362 00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:29,760 bit more, I would say cursory, but for the moment they're going to foreign to a lot of different 363 00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:35,360 subjects, which I'm interested in, I think people will find interesting as well. Then there are the 364 00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:39,920 books, and that's one of the biggest things that I wanted to discuss with anybody that's 365 00:43:40,640 --> 00:43:48,400 stayed long enough after the music, the long music play, and I did that on purpose, 366 00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:53,120 because I want people to enjoy the show for what it is, and then we can get into the more mundane 367 00:43:53,120 --> 00:44:01,600 things and talk about what's coming, and one of the things that's coming is more a greater ability 368 00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:08,480 to share with you the stories that are close to my heart and things that I've worked for many years 369 00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:14,800 on, and I have some of my titles, some of them are a little bit teaser titles at this point, 370 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:21,760 have the works finished, but I'm still in sort of pre-production for some of those things, 371 00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:31,920 but I want to explore the website's capability to share with you chapters and get a glimpse of 372 00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:38,880 what I've written, so that is fiction, and that's an aspect that I wanted to share with you, and one 373 00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:50,080 of the series that I'm kicking off is in I hope that it'll be ready, I had set out for the summer, 374 00:44:50,080 --> 00:44:59,040 but it may be closer to the fall, hopefully by October, by Halloween, it'll be available, 375 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:05,520 and that's Phenomena, which is a fictional story, a thriller, a suspense thriller, paranormal 376 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:12,240 thriller about an investigator named Julian Carr, or a paranormal investigator who sort of 377 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:18,800 delves into these mysteries and gets caught into way more than he had imagined, and that'll be 378 00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:25,280 something I'm going to enjoy sharing with you all, as well as some of my other stories, like Sage, 379 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:32,720 and that's a story, it's a post-apocalyptic story of hope and really about extinction, 380 00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:39,280 and what happens at the brink of extinction, what can happen, I talked about that on the show 381 00:45:39,280 --> 00:45:47,040 a little bit, about how we brought many animals to extinction, and at some point, ourselves, 382 00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:52,960 we may face that, we may face that even very soon, sooner than we thought, and I hope not, 383 00:45:52,960 --> 00:46:01,600 I'm not a harbinger for these kinds of news, and yet it's a potential, a great potential for 384 00:46:02,720 --> 00:46:10,800 happening, I think that we have weapons that can destroy what we call civilization, and out of 385 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:18,080 that, out of the rubble, may arise a different kind of human, maybe something more like Bigfoot, 386 00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:25,840 more akin to its mysteries, who knows, but I go into these, so it may be confusing, but I don't 387 00:46:25,840 --> 00:46:32,800 think it is that there exists within me a desire to not only share a lot of the research that I've 388 00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:40,240 done in a lot of the stories and the people that I've met and the experiences I've had in researching 389 00:46:40,240 --> 00:46:47,920 Phenomena, as well as sharing the story that was born out of it, so the two things sort of 390 00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:55,120 in tandem, or in tandem in fact, and then there are other stories like Borderlands, and like, 391 00:46:56,080 --> 00:47:06,400 which is a sort of sci-fi punk, cyberpunk genre noir, detective noir story, and I'm very, very 392 00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:16,320 happy about it too, and then I'll start to also share in that book section the books that I have 393 00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:22,960 based my research on, I very much am interested in people delving on their own, carrying on their 394 00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:31,120 own investigations, so think of me as a kind of a host for a great, you know, a host of a gallery, 395 00:47:31,120 --> 00:47:35,440 and you can walk into the gallery and discover for yourselves many other treasures, and I want 396 00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:41,280 you to do that, so that'll be part of it. I'm also sharing non-fiction things that I'm going to be 397 00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:49,280 producing, writing, and they'll be available through the website, and eventually through 398 00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:54,720 Amazon, that'll come in shortly, so it's an exciting time because it took me many years to get to 399 00:47:54,720 --> 00:48:01,280 this point where not only did I create these things and work very hard at them, but I'm at a point 400 00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:09,040 where I want to share my voice with a community, with people that are out there who are like-minded, 401 00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:13,280 who maybe have delved into these things and really didn't know that there was so much more, 402 00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:22,160 so if you're one of those people, do me a favor and continue to follow the show, follow the podcast, 403 00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:27,440 visit the website, share with other people, and let me know what you think, write to me, 404 00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:34,160 the emails in the website, or write to each other, share stories, share experiences, 405 00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:41,200 and I'll be out there much more, and so as I built on this year one, it'll be very interesting to see 406 00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:46,560 what comes after all this effort, and I think many great things will come, and I look forward to 407 00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:53,120 sharing with you and getting to know you, and I'll share with you my last thought, which has become 408 00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:59,760 the mantra of the show, and that is that you should brush up against the borderlands of your 409 00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:23,760 own experience, seek that veil, and see what's behind that veil, and realize that the fringe is closer than you think. 410 00:49:29,760 --> 00:49:39,760 I'll see you next time.