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Welcome to another session of the My First Job podcast.

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We think of banking as a conventional job, but today we're going to meet a person who's

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far from convention.

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Jaya Janardhanan has headed major initiatives in modern banking to transform the banks that

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she's worked in.

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And it's part of people like her, professionals, who have brought about a huge change in the

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banking scenario in India.

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But that involves a huge amount of change internally, as well as in the skill set of

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bankers.

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So she's not part of the group of people that you see in a bank.

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Jaya's work, I think, at least as far as I understand, is to manage the operations of

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a bank.

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And we'll understand a lot more.

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I'll be asking her some very basic questions because I'd like to understand what she does

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as well and how her career has evolved.

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So let's bring Jaya on and talk to her about her journey in banking.

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Welcome, Jaya.

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Good to have you on the show.

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Thank you so much, Venu.

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Thank you.

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Looking forward for the show.

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Thank you.

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OK.

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So you started Crayon Tech Solutions about a year ago.

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You went from being a corporate person in the operations in a bank to starting your

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own company.

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So what is the thought behind it?

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So I think there's a question that everybody has asked me, saying that why and what made

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you move into this space?

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So when I was working in the corporate space, and especially in the space of ops, service,

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digital banking, technology, we always have somebody to help us strategize, consult, tell

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us what to do.

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The big question remains how to do.

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And that's where the entire strategy fails.

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And many at times, we struggle quite a bit with respect to how to do it.

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You can't pull out the business as usual people from their job and ask them to do the execution.

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So while strategy is in the front, but execution is way behind.

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And the space that suffers majorly in execution is operations, service, and the other projects

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that the management wants to execute.

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And I struggled myself quite a bit when I was holding those roles.

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And that led me to say that maybe that's a space where corporates need help.

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That's a space which needs support.

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And genuinely, I started this with the intention saying that why can't we work with corporates

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to help them work on their solutioning?

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It's not a lifelong requirement.

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For example, there are corporates with the BFSI segment, which I specialize in.

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Come back to say that, look, our manual of instructions, our standard operating processes

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are way behind what is happening today.

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What the manual of instructions written in 2012 has nothing to do with what is happening

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today.

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But they were not able to make it.

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And the regulators are quite strict about the kind of processes and the manuals that

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we have in place when they come for the audit.

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So work with them.

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And that's a short-term thing.

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To help them get them to place and make them be in line with what they require.

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That's one example I came up with.

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So there are a lot of other areas which corporates struggle.

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And I said, this is maybe a space that I have specialized for the last 27 years as a banker.

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So let me set it up.

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And obviously, the thrill of being an entrepreneur is something extremely different.

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After being in senior positions for the last 15 years in the CXO positions and in the senior

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leadership positions, I had a huge struggle managing the corporate politics and manipulations.

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So I said, I needed to do quality work.

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I needed to make a difference to the BFSI segment.

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And maybe that's where people will look at you as saying that you've made a difference

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to what you have experienced.

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You brought the experience to the table.

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And that's how I don't call it as consulting.

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I call it as Creotech solutions.

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That's where the whole journey came in.

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That's interesting.

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Do you remember when you opened your first bank account as a child when you walked into

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a bank?

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My bank account, I got it open when I started my job in ICC bank.

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And that's when I got my first backup.

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Because you had to open an account because you had to have your sandwich with you.

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But did you at some point say that I am going to be a banker?

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This is part of a set of things.

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I'll figure out things as I go along.

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What are the school, college, what happened?

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See, in the time that I had graduated, which is the 1988-91, that era of that particular

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period, you had no other great opportunities like today.

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You have those multifold opportunities that are there across.

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So all that you knew was banks or the government jobs.

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I was sure I did not want to go to the government jobs.

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And banks looked very interesting.

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And that's where I kind of decided that I wanted to be a banker.

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Not something that I had planned at the age of 8 or 10 or 12, like today's kids know what

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they want in life after 15 years.

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But yes, when I finished my graduation and I was more or less convinced that I wanted

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to be a banker, how to get into banking, what to get into banking, what to do in banking,

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I had no clue.

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But I knew that I had to get a job in a bank.

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And that's where I focused myself completely on.

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I had many failures.

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I couldn't get through to a few of the bank's exams and all that stuff.

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But finally, I made my way through to ICICI Bank as a corporate bank.

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And obviously, yeah, I was there for a year, a year and a half as a corporate banker.

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And then I realized that, and then somebody kind of came up with a great opportunity saying

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that we're setting up the retail business.

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We are doing, we are planning to go big way in ICICI Bank.

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So we had a very senior, respectable and respected officer called Emin Gopinath.

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So Emin Gopinath had put across a slip in his against his cabinet saying that we are

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setting up a retail business in the bank.

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Whoever is interested in joining the retail vertical, please put in your name here.

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And I was the first person who went and put my name there saying that I want to join.

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And that's how my journey in retail started.

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And then it's been all about.

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At the point when you wrote your name, were you fairly clear about what this was?

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Or it was an evolving sector.

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I just don't understand what happens in retail operations in banking.

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So if you could explain that in very simple terms.

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I think it's a very nice, interesting story that I can tell you about because, you know,

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when I wrote my name there and he said that, you know, Jaya, you are in corporate banking.

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Do you really want to get into retail banking?

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I said, you know, and I don't know why maybe it was an inherent quality in me that I started

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taking the risk at that time.

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So that was a risk taking feature.

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I mean, great I had.

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So I said, yes, I'll take it.

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I'll come into retail banking.

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So I had not worked in a branch.

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I did not know how to handle cash.

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I didn't.

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I had no idea about anything what happens in a branch.

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So what happened is I, you know, he said that, look, we have to set up the centralized operations

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for ICSEB Bank, which is going to be the future of the industry in the financial industry.

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And he was a visionary.

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Let me tell you, he was a visionary.

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So he, you know, so I said, I'll follow you.

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I'll learn what you tell me.

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I will learn what you say.

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He said, okay, fine.

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He said, go and sit in a week in the DMAT operations.

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And believe me, Venu, DMAT operations that time had just started.

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It was in a mess.

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People had no idea what a DMAT account is, everything.

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And I also went and sat in that mess completely.

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And it was learning from opening a DMAT account to dematerialization, to a TIF.

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All those learnings happened for almost six months.

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And I remember when I moved into this retail space, I had my colleagues coming and telling

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me, you know, Jaya, I have seen people falling into, you know, getting into trouble, not

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knowingly, but you're getting into trouble.

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I mean, people get into trouble unknowingly, but you're getting into trouble knowingly.

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I said, why?

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He says, who the hell would leave a corporate banking life and get into retail banking?

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You're going to make a mess of your career.

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I said, it's okay.

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I'll just try it out.

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And after DMAT happened, everything got streamlined.

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People also started understanding things started falling in place.

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Mr. Gopinath came and said, look, you know, we are setting up the centralized operations

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for the bank and clearing is the first activity we will take it up.

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I said, sir, I've never done clearing in my life.

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He says, no problem.

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Go sit at Nariman Point for a one week, understand how clearing is done and come back.

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So I go there and it's a manual, you know, in the 90s, the process was completely manual,

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physical checks, RBI, clearing processes and all that stuff.

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And I learned it for a week and I came back and I said, sir, I'm ready for the job.

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He says, okay, fine.

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So we had a place in Mahalakshmi office of ICSB Bank and maybe, you know, a small place

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and he said, yeah, this is where we start our operations.

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I said, sir, here?

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He said, yes.

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I said, there's a laptop, there is a desktop, those laptops are not a common one.

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So he said, where's the desktop?

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He said, see, there's a desktop there, take it, configure the tech team to configure it.

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By the branch clearing, you start managing centrally and that's the journey of centralized

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operations.

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Okay.

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So that is how we started the centralized operations, bringing transaction management

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from the branches, building a model of what is, what can need to be done then and there

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remains of the branch.

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What can be taken away and can be processed a little later, moves into operation.

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So that's the journey and that's the segregation of operations and that's how we started.

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Then came account opening, the team built and then weekend of, you know, the team built

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larger, ICSB Bank had opened up seven processing centers across the country and things had

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more or less streamlined and, you know, we started, we started, you know, making sure

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that processes were streamlined.

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And those days the word digitization was not, the word automation was there.

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So while it was equal to digitization, it was still automation.

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So we automated a lot of processes and everything started falling in place.

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And then came a time when, largely, almost all the branches across the country were brought

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into the centralized operations.

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So we, you know, started, everything started happening from the...

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Can I just interrupt here for a minute, which is, how did you figure out what to prioritize

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when your customers didn't know what DMAT was, when clearing had to move from offline to

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online, what was the decision process of saying, what is the priority?

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So the decision to operationalize which activity dependent upon what the customer's requirement

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was.

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If the customer needed something, then and there, it remained at the branch.

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If a process, if an activity can wait for a few hours, that was moved to the back office.

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So that was the decision point of what should remain at the branch and what should move

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to the centralized operations.

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And that still continues as a basic step for a bifurcation, even today.

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Even today when you do data centralized operations, you actually think what should be given to

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customers then and there and what can wait.

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So that's where the decision making actually happens.

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So that is the whole process.

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So after I finished the centralized operations and I was ready, I mean, I was like, okay,

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somewhere along I realized I was not a BAU person.

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Okay.

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I needed something always new to do.

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And Mr. Gopinath came back again and said, you know what, we should look at quality.

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And all of us looked at him and said, what do you mean by quality?

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He says, see, going forward, operations service will all be quality dependent.

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You will be weighed based on quality.

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So we said, okay.

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And we were all, we were all learners, right?

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So we were all listening to him and he was for us, he was a great teacher.

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He said we should do Six Sigma.

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Okay.

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So no one knew what Six Sigma was all about.

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So he said, Jaya, will you be, will you do this project?

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I said, sir, if you teach me, I'll do, but I don't know what is Six Sigma.

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He says, no problem.

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Next day I find a laptop and a mobile phone on my table.

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Okay.

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So we are, we are, we are tying up with a consultant, the easiest group, and we are

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going to launch, we're going to work on the Six Sigma processes for operations.

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Again people came back and said, Jaya, everything is so settled.

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You're heading this piece.

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Why do the hell do you want to get into a Six Sigma?

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But there's no, what is quality in operations?

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I said, he must be saying it because of some reason.

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There must be something to this.

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They said, you can have, are quite happy messing it up.

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But then to tell you the truth, by the time I had was doing a Six Sigma, I had already

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crossed two promotions, but my colleagues who were there in my, who were there with

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me in corporate banking had still not even crossed one promotion.

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So I had walked up the ladder already.

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Okay.

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So therefore I will say, I was thinking that, look, maybe I'm doing something correct.

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I will, I will, I will, I will listen to this senior boss of mine and walk up.

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00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,160
And then did, and then we did quality and then we did Six Sigma.

237
00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:32,120
Now Six Sigma was, none of us knew how an account was getting opened and how many days

238
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:34,080
it took to open an account.

239
00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:40,040
The Six Sigma taught us that our account opening processes took us almost 23 days to open an

240
00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:41,040
account.

241
00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:49,920
And the firm used to travel about some 4,000 meters across to get it open, which means

242
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:53,160
form comes in the ground floor, goes to the second floor, comes to the third floor, goes

243
00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:54,680
to the second floor, first floor.

244
00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:58,160
And by the time the account gets opened, we have crossed about 23 days the customer can

245
00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:00,200
use this account.

246
00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:03,720
And he said, and then I said, okay, fine, 23 days.

247
00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:05,480
So what is the market standards?

248
00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:08,680
No one knew what the market standards were all about.

249
00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:10,080
And we decided to do that.

250
00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:13,560
We said, we all gathered together and said, okay, we'll do it in 12 days.

251
00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:15,760
Decent enough, 23 days to 12 days.

252
00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:16,760
Yeah.

253
00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:18,320
That 12 days was okay.

254
00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:24,280
We all started working and the senior management team made a trip to the trip to the US or

255
00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:25,280
somewhere over there.

256
00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:31,080
And they went to a bank and then they got this nice pre-generated kit where they had

257
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,560
their checkbook, debit card and their thing.

258
00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:38,440
And they come down and they say, look, if we have to become the best, then we better

259
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:42,160
follow these standards, which means giving the kit across the counter and getting the

260
00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,920
account open on the same day.

261
00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:48,840
We all fell off the floor and said, how the hell can we do this?

262
00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:57,560
And then came, then as usual, seven of us were taken and put into one conference room

263
00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:02,840
and said, don't step out of this room till you find the solution for this.

264
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:03,840
Yes.

265
00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:07,640
And seven days, of course, we had a tech person with us.

266
00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:14,240
And that is how ICSF Bank first launched the pre-generated kit, which had the checkbook,

267
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:18,920
the debit card, and we were the first in the industry to actually come out with it.

268
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:22,080
And we came back to say that we'd opened the accounts in three days and we moved it to

269
00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,080
one day and 24 hours turnaround time.

270
00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,040
And of course, the digitization changed the life.

271
00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:32,800
But these were those days when innovations and technology and the baby made a difference

272
00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:34,880
apart from all the other banks.

273
00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:36,400
This is how it all happened.

274
00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:42,880
So therefore, you realize why I'm so attached to operations and therefore why I'm so passionate

275
00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,400
about operations.

276
00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:49,400
No, and I think the shows and I think you can see this.

277
00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:50,400
Yes.

278
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:51,400
Okay.

279
00:16:51,400 --> 00:17:00,400
There are a couple of other people who have said hi, so I'll just show them.

280
00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:02,240
So I think they're watching the show right now.

281
00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:03,280
And that's the good part.

282
00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:08,800
So here, you know, people who are interested can actually ask questions to you.

283
00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:13,880
And during a point when we think that, you know, without interrupting the flow, how do

284
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:14,880
we take it from there?

285
00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:15,880
Okay.

286
00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:16,880
So this is great.

287
00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:21,200
So you had clearing, you had demand, and then you figured out how to open.

288
00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:26,720
Now these look like, but it was strange that it took 23 days.

289
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:28,720
Today, we've forgotten that.

290
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:29,720
Absolutely.

291
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:35,160
From a point where we used to go to buying to withdraw money every week or so to a point

292
00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:39,760
when none of us probably remembers the time that we walked into a bank at all.

293
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:42,760
Or carrying cash in a pocket now.

294
00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:43,760
Exactly.

295
00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:50,040
I mean, it's been such a sea change and people say that, no, but nothing much has changed.

296
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,280
But of course, a lot of things have changed.

297
00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:53,280
Banking has changed.

298
00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,760
There's a huge change that's happened.

299
00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:03,200
And you were that perfect point where the literal changeover took place.

300
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,560
It's almost as if, you know, you got into it.

301
00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:09,960
The years you've spent in banking are the ones which are the most transformative because

302
00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,920
you could talk of certain other things which could have happened.

303
00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:18,440
But we've moved exactly like you said, from not having to go into a bank to having so

304
00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:20,240
many payments handled.

305
00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,520
Tell me what is the next stage?

306
00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:31,520
What happens after you sort of, what are the next stages in how your career progressed?

307
00:18:31,520 --> 00:18:39,320
So one more interesting project that we did, of course, we did a lot of interesting projects

308
00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:40,320
in ICSEB Bank.

309
00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:45,920
And ICSEB Bank has a huge knack of putting very attractive names to all the projects.

310
00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,640
So there was one project which was called Project 123.

311
00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:55,360
And if I tell you what is the full form of Project 123, you'll have it in splits.

312
00:18:55,360 --> 00:19:01,120
So it was a project that was launched to do the 8-8 banking.

313
00:19:01,120 --> 00:19:05,280
So ICSEB Bank was the first bank that came to do an 8-8 banking.

314
00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:09,480
So the branch opens at 8 in the morning and closes at 8 in the night because we realized

315
00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:13,320
that customers needed to have the banking facilities throughout the day.

316
00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,480
So earlier it was 24 by 7.

317
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:16,840
And then so we walked in.

318
00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:20,360
So I had never seen KVKamath in my life.

319
00:19:20,360 --> 00:19:24,600
So that day my boss said, Mr. KVK has called us for a quick meeting.

320
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:25,960
So we need to go and meet him.

321
00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,440
So there were seven of us or eight of us who were there in his room.

322
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,680
And we had only five minutes with him, Venu, five minutes.

323
00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:37,040
And he said, look, we need to change the way people do banking.

324
00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:39,960
We need to be more proactive to help customers.

325
00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:45,800
And I need to make sure that we as ICSEB Bank goes as 24 by 7.

326
00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:48,440
And I did not know what struck us.

327
00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:50,440
I didn't even understand what he said.

328
00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:56,360
We come down and our boss says, gives a message to us, says, all of you all gather in this

329
00:19:56,360 --> 00:19:57,960
room and you all gathered.

330
00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:03,560
He put up, you know, he has a famous way of putting it on the board.

331
00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:05,280
He said, these are the steps.

332
00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:08,560
These are the people who will work on this project and we get started.

333
00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:12,560
So that six months, okay, to get to 8 to 8 banking.

334
00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:13,560
Okay.

335
00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:15,120
I don't know when did I go home in the night?

336
00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:16,920
When did I come back in the morning?

337
00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:17,920
There was no night.

338
00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:18,920
There was no day.

339
00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:21,080
And we launched this project.

340
00:20:21,080 --> 00:20:23,800
I'll tell you what is 1, 2, 3.

341
00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:27,320
It is 1st of February 2003.

342
00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:31,520
That's when we launched 8 to 8 banking and we were the first in the industry to launch

343
00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:33,160
8 to 8 banking.

344
00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:38,200
But that look, I see you're trying to do something which no one has done before.

345
00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:39,920
So there is nothing to copy, right?

346
00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:41,800
So everything is innovation.

347
00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:44,900
Everything is right there on the base that you're doing.

348
00:20:44,900 --> 00:20:49,480
So there's a lot of things that keep, you know, you keep learning as you do these things.

349
00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,600
So that's one best thing of ICSEB Bank.

350
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:56,520
The other piece, which was very interesting in ICSEB, and I like to quote these because

351
00:20:56,520 --> 00:21:00,920
these are things that has taught us a lot.

352
00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,800
You know, Madhavi Puri, who is the chairman for SEBI now, right?

353
00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:11,520
She used to head the, she was the head of the, you know, she was the head of the retail

354
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,720
business vertical at that point of time.

355
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:20,280
She had called us into a room and she mentioned the fact that this is the, she showed us a

356
00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:24,920
photograph and she said, tell me which place is this?

357
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,400
And I looked at the photograph, all of us looked at the photograph and said, someone

358
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:29,760
said it's a marriage hall.

359
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,280
Someone said it's a function and all that.

360
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:33,360
And then she flipped the whole thing.

361
00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:36,840
And that was an ICSEB Bank branch of value.

362
00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:43,160
And the reason is the moment the branch opens at nine in the morning, it gets so packed

363
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:46,560
that the BM himself is not able to come out of his cabin.

364
00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,200
There is a huge rush for people to put in cash.

365
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:50,200
Okay.

366
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:51,240
So it's very difficult.

367
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:56,160
So she said, I can't keep increasing the square feet of the branch every year.

368
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,160
You need to find a solution to handle cash.

369
00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:04,120
As usual, boss comes into the room and says, and you know, he has, he has a solution.

370
00:22:04,120 --> 00:22:06,080
He has a model for everything.

371
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:07,080
Okay.

372
00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:11,640
Of course he's a mentor for me for life, but he, he, he came kind of came and said, this

373
00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:13,200
is how we should do it.

374
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:14,280
And you know what he said?

375
00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:22,320
He said, create a drop box, create pouches, let people put cash into it and people drop

376
00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:23,440
it into the box.

377
00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:27,080
You process it in the back office and make sure that the credit happens.

378
00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,280
It's so easy to say in four lines, right?

379
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:31,520
Imagine the challenge of implementing it.

380
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:32,520
Okay.

381
00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:36,840
So now what happened was he told me that we should do it in plastic packets.

382
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:39,840
And I was very sure that plastic packets won't work.

383
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:44,400
I told him we should go for, you know, the paper packets with the paying and slip written

384
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:45,400
on top of it.

385
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:46,400
He said, no, it'll not work.

386
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:47,400
It's, it's a bad idea.

387
00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:52,360
So when I went to value branch, I was, I went there and positioned myself for about, you

388
00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:56,920
know, for, for about one week before to understand how the whole thing works.

389
00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:01,040
It's good to say, you know, put cameras, put boxes, put processing, how to do this.

390
00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:02,640
Where is the infra?

391
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:07,280
So I went down to the branch and I kind of asked a few customers, if we do this, how

392
00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:08,280
will you do this?

393
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:10,160
They said, no, no, no, I think we'll do it and all that.

394
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:14,320
Then I said, I showed, I had without showing my boss had prepared a paper packet and they

395
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:15,320
prepared a plastic packet.

396
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:16,800
I said, which of this would you choose?

397
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:18,080
They said paper packet.

398
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:19,200
So I did not tell my boss.

399
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:24,040
I created the whole bunch of paper packets with the paying and slip written and on that.

400
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:27,120
And I, you know, of course, work with the team, put the camera behind, put some people

401
00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:28,920
crossing all that I did.

402
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:35,680
And 26th of Jan, I said we will launch the, and this was called as the, this was called

403
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,000
as project Chris.

404
00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:43,400
Now I can, I'm, I can tell you what is project Chris cash received in sealed packets.

405
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:44,400
Okay.

406
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:49,640
So it's project Chris.

407
00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:51,240
I go there.

408
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:56,480
I said, so project Chris was done and you know, we, we launched it on 26th of, I put

409
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:58,160
somebody on the front end.

410
00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:02,480
They talked to customers, customers nicely put the, take the, I, so I had kept even the

411
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:03,480
plastic packets.

412
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:04,920
I kept it with the paper packets.

413
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:09,480
We saw the customers pulled up the paper packets, put the cash, sealed it, put it in the box

414
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:10,480
and we started the process.

415
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:11,480
Everything worked fine.

416
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:14,160
So he, he lands after two days.

417
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:16,040
I said, you come and see how the process works.

418
00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:20,120
He lands up after two days and he's shocked to see that there is only paper packets and

419
00:24:20,120 --> 00:24:22,120
there is no plastic packets people.

420
00:24:22,120 --> 00:24:24,360
He said, but I told you it has to be plastic packet.

421
00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:26,920
I said, the answer is for you to see on the front end.

422
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:30,400
There's only paper, people are picking up the paper packets.

423
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:31,760
Then he said, okay, fine.

424
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:36,360
And that's the time he said, I agree with this, what you've done, but you won't believe

425
00:24:36,360 --> 00:24:41,320
while that changed the way how the whole process worked, the cash customers started believing

426
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:45,960
when I left to venue and I was traveling back to Coimbatore and I had to implement this,

427
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:50,560
I had got almost messages across the, from all the branches across the country saying

428
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:54,840
that when will you come to introduce Crispin over branches?

429
00:24:54,840 --> 00:25:00,920
And the hilarious part of this whole project is KVK, Mr. KVK goes to Mangalore branch.

430
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:01,920
Okay.

431
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:06,440
And he sees these customers picking up this paper packets, putting the cash into it and

432
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,040
putting it into the drop box.

433
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,000
So he goes and asks the counter, what is people doing?

434
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,040
And people very nicely say that's project Crisp.

435
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:22,080
So project Crisp has become so famous, it has solved a lot of the cash related issues

436
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,280
and process and problems, but it became very famous.

437
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:31,000
I think it's about, I think in the last maybe seven or eight years they have, they moved

438
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:35,080
it out because they found a lot of fraud happening with 500 notes.

439
00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,480
So that's when they kind of decided to change the problem.

440
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:43,680
Yeah, so the questions that I wanted to lead up to in the initial stages, you know, if

441
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:47,720
a person is handing over the money to the cashier, it's being counted and then it goes

442
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:52,120
into the, versus putting it into other thing, you're not sure.

443
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:53,440
So how did you build trust?

444
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:55,440
How did the customer trust?

445
00:25:55,440 --> 00:26:00,080
So first and foremost is the customer can, where the customer is dropping the cash in

446
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,240
the box is actually, there is a CCTV camera.

447
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:04,240
Okay.

448
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,480
Which shows which customers dropping the cash.

449
00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:11,400
When the box is taken behind, there are two cameras which actually focuses on the box

450
00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:12,840
in the entire process.

451
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:17,760
So that whole area from the time you remove the box, open the box, or if you take a packet,

452
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:18,960
it is kept in front of the camera.

453
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:22,600
So the details of the customer is captured on the camera.

454
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:25,000
So JNR knows JNR's packet and then they open it.

455
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:27,680
So the whole process is monitored under camera.

456
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,880
Tomorrow this customer comes and tries to dispute with me.

457
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:34,800
I'm able, I was given the, the branches were given the ownership and the responsibility

458
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:37,160
to show the CCTV camera to them.

459
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,900
So nobody could try to play around with the information.

460
00:26:40,900 --> 00:26:43,040
So that is how the trust was built.

461
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:47,640
And the credit happened, the only challenge was I'm standing in a cash counter, I'm getting

462
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:49,120
the credit then and there.

463
00:26:49,120 --> 00:26:52,340
If I'm getting the credit in the next 30 minutes, I'm okay.

464
00:26:52,340 --> 00:26:56,960
So therefore the moment the customer gets it SMS, it's a very validational, that trust

465
00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:57,960
started then building in.

466
00:26:57,960 --> 00:26:58,960
That's how the whole process happened.

467
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:00,960
So these are some of those.

468
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:08,000
It's amazing how such a small thing like having to deposit cash on a daily basis when you

469
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:09,000
scale it.

470
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:14,120
Like you said, it was like a marriage hall and most people don't even understand that

471
00:27:14,120 --> 00:27:17,960
in certain branches, because if you go to a bank and there are no people in the, the

472
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:22,520
thing, you assume that banks all of the country are exactly the same, whereas you had the

473
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:27,220
ability to see differences in the way people operated.

474
00:27:27,220 --> 00:27:30,440
And like you said, by the time you came out, people are already saying, when are you going

475
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:31,920
to come to our branch?

476
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:32,920
Okay.

477
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:38,240
Because I couldn't go to all the branches.

478
00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:42,840
We had created a CD of the processes and we couldn't, the CD to all the branches across

479
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:48,480
so they knew what steps had to be followed, just like a standard operating process.

480
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:52,920
It's amazing how for something like, and these are processes that you never think about in

481
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,680
the normal, what do you say, schedule of operations.

482
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:58,240
There is no manual.

483
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,760
It says, this is how you collect cash.

484
00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:05,880
But just one, why did he suggest that you put it in a plastic packet?

485
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:10,480
Because I would think that a person doesn't want to see the amount being put in.

486
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:16,320
So that was basically to give us the comfort that the customer has deposited cash.

487
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:20,200
That's what the, that was the, yeah, that was fair enough.

488
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:21,200
Okay.

489
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:26,000
So moving on from here, you've got one, two, three, you've got crisp under your belt.

490
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:27,640
You've been moving up the ladder.

491
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:28,720
Things have changed.

492
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,000
Your colleagues have told you, you're doing the wrong thing.

493
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:36,280
And now asking, what should I do with my career next?

494
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,600
So what happens from here on?

495
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:46,960
I took up a very challenging opportunity at ING, Vizier Bank, now at Kota.

496
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:54,360
And so I also got a very interesting and a very, very, very great boss as the chief operating

497
00:28:54,360 --> 00:29:02,960
officer, an Australian who taught me time management and of course, very, very constructive

498
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,120
way of how things have to happen.

499
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:11,080
So one of the challenges, so it was very important to, and there was a marriage of Vizier Bank

500
00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:15,760
and ING, which was still struggling to kind of stabilize.

501
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:19,360
And that's when we said that we had to do something at the branch level for customer

502
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,080
experience.

503
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:24,920
And he said, see, we have to do something with manage the process of the branch.

504
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:30,240
And that's when I, that's when this whole idea of customer first project came.

505
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:35,600
So we identified 10 processes at the branches and we decided to work on it.

506
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:41,360
One of the earth-shaking changes that happened in ING, Vizier project of customer first was

507
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:46,240
the, you know, the, it was like a chicken and egg situation.

508
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:49,880
When you tell the branch, why are customers not moving into net banking?

509
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:54,320
The answer that you get back is we send the passwords, but it comes back.

510
00:29:54,320 --> 00:29:57,920
So every time, then you have to keep sending it back and the customers keep saying they

511
00:29:57,920 --> 00:29:58,920
don't get it.

512
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:02,360
So, you know, every time you had these points coming up.

513
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:06,000
So one day when we were doing a brainstorming session among the various process, we were

514
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,720
trying to figure out the top 10 issues.

515
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:13,160
And of course, this was the top of the chart and we were sitting in, you know, doing a

516
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:14,720
brainstorming session.

517
00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:19,520
And suddenly the idea struck us that why don't we give a password across a counter?

518
00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,280
And you know, you, and you can imagine what compliance would have come up with, right?

519
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:23,280
They were like all over the place.

520
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:27,560
How the hell can you say that you can get the password across the counter and all that?

521
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:30,040
And then we kind of broke through, broke through, discussed, discussed, discussed.

522
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:31,600
And we said, okay, fine.

523
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:34,560
It's a very, it's a number that doesn't hold any value.

524
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:35,560
It's just one number.

525
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:40,240
Only when the customer walks into your branch and he submits your KYC documents, will you

526
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,200
link this number to his account.

527
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:46,000
But truly you become an Anywhere Banking and truly a customer can walk into any branch

528
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:51,380
and take, and then customers and banks, branches can also start pushing customers towards using

529
00:30:51,380 --> 00:30:52,380
their banking.

530
00:30:52,380 --> 00:30:54,120
And then it kind of flew with everybody.

531
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,720
They said, yeah, yeah, that's a great idea.

532
00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:00,240
And then suddenly they came back and said, but see, net banking is okay.

533
00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:02,520
But we have also customers walking in asking for checkbooks.

534
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:04,480
We said, okay, let's do one thing.

535
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,880
Let's set up an auto trigger of the system.

536
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,600
And whenever the check reaches a particular level, let's auto trigger.

537
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:10,600
Oh, wow.

538
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:11,600
That's a great idea.

539
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,520
Then we said, okay, then why don't we implement this, the PIN also.

540
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:19,080
So therefore net banking password, ATM PIN and check became a self-driven processes,

541
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:21,600
okay, as part of customer first project.

542
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:22,600
Okay.

543
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:27,720
It changed the way how industry then went on to do this because it then went to be replicated

544
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:29,680
in many other banks.

545
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:34,520
So those days, unlike today when you talk about a green password or whatever it is,

546
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:40,240
but those days physical password was required to manage your ATM PIN or your net banking

547
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:41,240
and stuff like that.

548
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,240
And for checkbook, you had to go to the branch counter.

549
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:47,560
For checkbook, you don't need to go to the branch counter, self-triggered process happened.

550
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:48,920
Net banking became a self-driven.

551
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:53,440
Well, these went to get CIA awards and other things.

552
00:31:53,440 --> 00:32:00,720
What benefited us was that the way many of these processes, which were bottlenecks as

553
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:06,400
part of the customer centric activity kind of lowered out.

554
00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:13,440
And then many of the banks then followed suit to say that this is the best way to manage

555
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,080
transition towards the channels, et cetera, and all that.

556
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:24,240
So while ING gave me that with my COO, it opened up a lot.

557
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:28,840
So while I always had a flavor for innovation, I was always someone who was always looking

558
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,080
forward for doing something very differently.

559
00:32:32,080 --> 00:32:35,120
You also need to have somebody to actually help you with it.

560
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:38,200
It has to be supplemented with somebody encouraging you.

561
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,840
And that was a very fortunate part in my life.

562
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:46,280
My bosses, my mentors, they were all there saying that, OK, yes, think through it.

563
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:47,280
This is the right decision to do.

564
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:54,480
Whether it's a career or whether it's a functional role that I do, that's where things happen.

565
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:58,600
And when you started off, one of the things that you said is we need to do something,

566
00:32:58,600 --> 00:32:59,680
but how?

567
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:04,000
That is often the question that a lot of these questions are never answered.

568
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:05,600
And I see it with banks even today.

569
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:13,280
There are banks for whom I have received the credit card and then the password comes via

570
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,240
an envelope several days later.

571
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:18,440
And these two things never coincide.

572
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:23,160
So you never get down to the friction that is created is still being followed today.

573
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:24,160
That's the strange part.

574
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:29,320
I'm saying you had a process which you worked so far back, but yet it doesn't seem to have

575
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:36,080
percolated across all banks because they're still struggling with some of these.

576
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:41,880
Yeah, it all depends upon how banks are open to innovation.

577
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:47,600
Let me tell you, ICSF Bank was way ahead as far as innovations were concerned, as far

578
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,560
as allowing people to generate ideas.

579
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,920
Their policy used to be if there's an idea, try it out.

580
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:56,280
If it fails, pull it back.

581
00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:57,960
If it works, go forward.

582
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:04,200
And that's how you see ICSF Bank, the net banking was way ahead of its time.

583
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:05,920
That way ahead of its time.

584
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:10,160
Who would ever think that an ATM like this across the country was set up and no other

585
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:12,800
banks had so many ATMs before?

586
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:17,160
That bank was a visionary, at least when we started off, of course, they're still doing

587
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:18,480
extremely well.

588
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:24,720
But in net banking, in terms of what I remember, I don't want to quote banks, but ICSF Bank

589
00:34:24,720 --> 00:34:30,720
had a process of adding a beneficiary and getting to pay the beneficiary within 30 minutes

590
00:34:30,720 --> 00:34:32,480
of registration that other banks had.

591
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:36,360
We had to go and give a physical paper to the branch to add a beneficiary.

592
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,280
We changed much, much later.

593
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,440
So the process, it all depends upon bank to bank as to see when you do a comparison.

594
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:47,320
Today, also, when I was working for the other banks, when you sit in the discussion table,

595
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:49,680
the point is, who should you follow?

596
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:52,200
Is it ICSF Bank or is it HTC Bank?

597
00:34:52,200 --> 00:34:53,200
These are the two banks.

598
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:55,240
Of course, KOTEC has also come into the picture.

599
00:34:55,240 --> 00:34:57,120
So which bank do you want to follow?

600
00:34:57,120 --> 00:35:02,200
When it is growth, when it is innovation, when it is expansion, the thought is always

601
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:03,200
ICSF Bank.

602
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:08,320
When it is compliance, when it is process driven, it is always HTC Bank.

603
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:09,800
There's always this debate.

604
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,120
So both can't work together.

605
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:14,080
You have to choose one over the other.

606
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:15,480
So that's how the point.

607
00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:22,440
Well, that's a very interesting conflict in terms of how do you want to establish what

608
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,800
systems do you want to establish?

609
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:27,240
Because it has to go with the thoughts of the bank.

610
00:35:27,240 --> 00:35:32,200
It can't go into something which is completely new because obviously there is a certain system

611
00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:35,320
in place and people believe this is how it's done.

612
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:38,440
So whether you want to say it or not, that's how it gets done.

613
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:44,360
Okay, but you mentioned another thing, your Dhanalakshmi Bank, where you went in for digital

614
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:45,360
transformation.

615
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,280
What happened there?

616
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:57,760
So Dhanalakshmi Bank was a regional bank which was in existence for over 80 years then.

617
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:05,600
And there was a change in management and the new team came in to take the bank, to make

618
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:11,320
it a very universal bank, make it as a large bank, focused bank.

619
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:15,640
And that's where I joined there to help the operations and service.

620
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:21,720
There it was like the story was the same.

621
00:36:21,720 --> 00:36:27,720
The account would get opened in 25 days time and so go back to the ground level.

622
00:36:27,720 --> 00:36:34,200
Now the challenge was the need to set up operations was there, but the decision was where to set

623
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:35,200
it up.

624
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:36,600
And the mandate was very clear.

625
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:41,840
It had to be set up in Trissur, Trissur being the heart of Kerala.

626
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:47,960
And every second day you had a red flag in the front as a strike.

627
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,320
I was like, how do we do it?

628
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,600
But okay, we said, fine, that's not a problem.

629
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,080
Let's go ahead and set it up in operations.

630
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:55,840
We had a very good team there.

631
00:36:55,840 --> 00:37:00,600
We had a very good set up of the people over there who cooperated fully about it.

632
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:05,360
And they're very excited to make this whole thing happen.

633
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:06,360
So what happened?

634
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:13,120
This bank used to open about a thousand accounts or less than 500 accounts in a month.

635
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:20,240
And suddenly the business plan was to open thousand accounts a day.

636
00:37:20,240 --> 00:37:25,040
Everybody was like, how the hell could you open thousand accounts a day?

637
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:27,840
And the CEO said nothing doing that.

638
00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:29,320
That's an object.

639
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:30,320
So we set up the operations.

640
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:35,520
I set the floor and there was a head of operations and I went back to Bombay.

641
00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:40,320
And suddenly I got a call one day and I said, what happened?

642
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:45,920
They said, look, we have 20,000 firms lying in the operations and we don't know what to

643
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:47,240
do.

644
00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:49,760
And by then I had already got distress call.

645
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,120
Everybody had started calling, accounts are not getting open, sales guy, sales head is

646
00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:56,920
shouting on top of his voice, CEO is fuming angry.

647
00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:02,480
So I take a flight and fly, go to Cochin and I hit to the operations shop.

648
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:05,480
And this was about eight o'clock in the night I reach.

649
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,480
I see form flying all over.

650
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:09,480
Nobody had an idea.

651
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:15,240
There are some four people sitting in the operations and it was a complete mess.

652
00:38:15,240 --> 00:38:18,360
So first was to bring in people.

653
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,760
Now where do I get people overnight?

654
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:21,760
That's one part of it.

655
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,040
Second is there's so much of backlog.

656
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:30,980
What we did not realize was whenever Kerala was shut, other states are open.

657
00:38:30,980 --> 00:38:36,080
So form came in, but no one opened the account.

658
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:38,020
That's where the whole issue happened.

659
00:38:38,020 --> 00:38:43,760
So eight o'clock in the night to 11 o'clock in the night, the plan was how to manage this

660
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:46,620
backlog and going forward, how to manage it.

661
00:38:46,620 --> 00:38:52,880
So what happened is next day we set out, we put up a piece of paper circular across all

662
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:57,840
the, you know, NITs and the Actics and all those people, saying that we're looking for

663
00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,000
data entry operators.

664
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:05,880
And that full morning to evening to night we were interviewing students and maybe got

665
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:06,880
a few of them.

666
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:07,880
Okay.

667
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:12,720
We took 10 of almost some seven, six hours to train them the data entry part of it.

668
00:39:12,720 --> 00:39:15,800
And then we finally, now the point was it's a big hall.

669
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:16,800
Okay.

670
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:17,900
There are people sitting on it.

671
00:39:17,900 --> 00:39:22,640
How do you make sure this form reaches the desk, according to them, instead of them having

672
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,000
to get up and come and go and go.

673
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:27,080
So I told them, do you have a hospital close by?

674
00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:29,360
They said, yeah, but why do you need a hospital?

675
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:31,200
I said, let's go to the hospital.

676
00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:33,200
I will tell you why I need a hospital.

677
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:38,720
So we went to the hospital and there's a staff of the Dan Lok Shi Bank who knew somebody

678
00:39:38,720 --> 00:39:39,720
there.

679
00:39:39,720 --> 00:39:43,560
I said, go and ask him to give us a tray, the tray that they carry for medicines and

680
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:46,000
all that, ask them to give one spare tray.

681
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:49,080
So this guy went inside, did some jugard and all that, came out with a tray.

682
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:50,440
I said, let's take it to the office.

683
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:56,400
So we took it to the office and then we told the office boy, your job is to take the forms

684
00:39:56,400 --> 00:40:02,320
on this and keep moving the tray aside and move the forms to each of the desks so that

685
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:03,600
these guys don't have to get up.

686
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:07,720
When they finished doing the data and we put the forms back and get it over here to give

687
00:40:07,720 --> 00:40:09,200
it to the supervisor.

688
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:10,200
So they said, okay, fine.

689
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:11,560
So then it happened.

690
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:16,600
Then I then see the point is that then I had to make sure that we had to move this working

691
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,800
hours to full 24 by seven.

692
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:24,000
Now imagine trying to create a night shift in Kerala.

693
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:25,000
Okay.

694
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:29,520
So I was in great trouble saying that, okay, these guys will all stand up and protest.

695
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:31,160
But fortunately I got the support.

696
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:36,440
And then what I did was the three of us, there was a CTO who was then there, John, and then

697
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:41,520
there was a head of association was Mohanan and I, we split our day.

698
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:45,440
So I would work from the normal office hours from morning to evening.

699
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,360
I would come to the back office operations.

700
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:50,720
I would sit till 12 o'clock in the night, work with the team to make sure that they

701
00:40:50,720 --> 00:40:52,160
streamline the process.

702
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:55,320
I would get dropped at home by somebody else.

703
00:40:55,320 --> 00:41:00,040
And then John would come in, sorry, Mohanan would come in the morning at four in the morning.

704
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,720
He would be there till nine and then he would go back and get ready to come to office.

705
00:41:03,720 --> 00:41:07,960
John would come from all the way to office at nine o'clock and he would be there for

706
00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:09,880
the whole day till I come back in the afternoon.

707
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:14,600
So this we did for almost a month till we realized that things are falling in place

708
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:19,320
and it has started becoming a, it's become a flown, it's become a VA and that's when

709
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:20,720
I went back.

710
00:41:20,720 --> 00:41:25,400
So for me getting these firefighting and challenges is a big thrill.

711
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:28,440
Because otherwise it is no fun.

712
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:29,440
Right?

713
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:37,240
So this is precisely the kind of thing that most people run from and you run towards it.

714
00:41:37,240 --> 00:41:42,720
I remember the hospital authorities asking me, why do you want this particular tray?

715
00:41:42,720 --> 00:41:43,720
How to explain to them?

716
00:41:43,720 --> 00:41:45,440
I wanted for account opening processes.

717
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:46,440
I told them I need it.

718
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:47,440
I need that experience later.

719
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,280
And I managed to get it.

720
00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:51,280
Okay.

721
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:57,160
Now you told me at some point during our early discussions, you said that risk was not something

722
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:04,000
it is banking risk was not something that you particularly liked early on, but then

723
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:09,760
in Bank of America you did ops plus Chris, how did that happen?

724
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:15,600
So it's very, it's very interesting because I always, I always found risk coming and telling

725
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,840
me what not to do and not how to manage risk.

726
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:19,840
Okay.

727
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:24,520
And I hated risk because every time I was an ops person, but I'm always a business at

728
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:25,520
heart.

729
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:26,520
Okay.

730
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:27,520
Because I think they bring the bread and butter.

731
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:28,520
Okay.

732
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:32,080
So they, we have to do everything that helps the business grow.

733
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:36,960
But this is, but a risk, I always felt that would tell you how not to do what not to do,

734
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:38,600
but not how to circumvent it.

735
00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:40,740
There was never an answer for that.

736
00:42:40,740 --> 00:42:47,080
So when I was called for an interview at Bank of America and I met the CEO, Kaku at that

737
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:50,200
point of time, she said, yeah, you have done ops all your life.

738
00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:51,200
Why don't you try this?

739
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:52,760
I said, no, I've never done risk.

740
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:53,760
I don't understand this.

741
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:56,600
She said that all the more reason you should understand this.

742
00:42:56,600 --> 00:43:01,640
And as, as a risk-taking person, I am, I said, no, let me find out what is the ops risk.

743
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:07,040
And that's how I took off this, but that three years in that organization changed my attitude

744
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:12,360
towards risk and change my, so today when I'm doing any project with anybody on my role,

745
00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:19,640
I post that my object, my, my view, my thought process is if I do this like this, is there

746
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,520
a risk associated and how do I circumvent it?

747
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:26,080
How do I build processes to make sure that I don't get into an operational risk?

748
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:31,200
It made me more mature as an individual in the area of operations.

749
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:36,720
And that's where I kind of, you know, thank Kaku because I kind of have a different, while

750
00:43:36,720 --> 00:43:40,800
I understand ops risk now, I mean, I can, I can make sure that with any processes we

751
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:45,000
do, we take that into account and, you know, work on that.

752
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:48,520
So that's the, that, that, that again, what the risk I took.

753
00:43:48,520 --> 00:43:49,520
Yeah.

754
00:43:49,520 --> 00:43:54,040
The other great part of what you just said is that having had all this experience in

755
00:43:54,040 --> 00:44:01,560
operations, you knew what was practical risk and what was risk, which is going beyond a

756
00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:03,260
certain level.

757
00:44:03,260 --> 00:44:09,720
So it's almost as if you were able to say that this is what is actually required because

758
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:14,760
I know that some of these systems can break when pushed beyond a certain point.

759
00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:20,480
And this I agree because yes, you, you can't have systems in place beyond a certain level

760
00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:25,080
because you have to safeguard your interests, which I think is not the way most of these

761
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:26,320
are silos.

762
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:28,740
People work either in this or in that.

763
00:44:28,740 --> 00:44:32,600
And they set up these things saying, I know risk, you don't know risk until you've actually

764
00:44:32,600 --> 00:44:33,600
gone through it.

765
00:44:33,600 --> 00:44:36,640
And some things like you said, you can't predict.

766
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:40,520
You said overnight that sentence, I think was very insightful.

767
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:45,760
Kerala closed down with the rest of the country didn't, which means that it's not something

768
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,160
you anticipate that work will go on.

769
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:52,520
Things will come and then you will have to figure out how to, you know, sort of you mentioned

770
00:44:52,520 --> 00:45:02,080
briefly that you were one of the earliest to get robotic process, automated RPO, RPA.

771
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:05,360
What exactly does RPA do?

772
00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:14,240
So see, wherever you find, you know, voluminous processes, wherever you find manual processes

773
00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:18,800
and wherever you find monotonous processes where the volume is large, the process is

774
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:19,800
the same.

775
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:20,800
Okay.

776
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:23,160
And you, and you need to deploy manpower.

777
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:26,960
You cannot deploy manpower because he, I'll tell you where it all started from.

778
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:32,800
So when I was in Ujjivan and I was there, Ops was one of my responsibilities.

779
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:36,240
The team came and told us that, you know, and I used to notice one girl when I used

780
00:45:36,240 --> 00:45:37,800
to go home in the evening.

781
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:38,800
Okay.

782
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:42,080
I see her sitting there next day morning when I come, she's still there.

783
00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:44,160
So one day I asked her, you don't go home.

784
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:47,040
She said, no, I go, but I go late and I come early.

785
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:48,040
I said, why?

786
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:54,360
So she said, see, I do the IMPS recon and because the transactions have grown so large,

787
00:45:54,360 --> 00:46:00,320
it is, it goes, it crosses the one lakh Excel limits.

788
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:04,520
So therefore I have to break the files and therefore, and because it's settlement has

789
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:09,680
to be done on P plus one, I have to make sure that I do this and I have to be there for

790
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:11,160
a long hours.

791
00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:17,600
So I had met up with one of the, you know, one of the vendors in some time back in my

792
00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:23,240
previous organization and they had said about the same thing, voluminous, manual and you

793
00:46:23,240 --> 00:46:25,400
know, RPA can help you and all that.

794
00:46:25,400 --> 00:46:26,400
So I called them.

795
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:30,280
I said, look, I have this problem and is there a way you can, he said, of course we can solve

796
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:31,280
it.

797
00:46:31,280 --> 00:46:32,280
I said, okay.

798
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:33,400
So I told the team, let's do a POC with the client.

799
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:35,360
So they said, why should we do POC with one client?

800
00:46:35,360 --> 00:46:36,840
Let's do POC with three clients.

801
00:46:36,840 --> 00:46:37,840
Okay, fine.

802
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:39,920
So they did it with three clients.

803
00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:42,800
So the three clients, the three partners, they did POC.

804
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:46,200
They said, okay, when we are comfortable with this guy, this guy is able to.

805
00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:47,360
So I said, okay, fine.

806
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:54,960
So the whole processes of the Excel recon, which was done, was moved into it.

807
00:46:54,960 --> 00:47:02,240
So the whole RPA, the product actually, what they do is they, it actually processes it

808
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:07,680
by itself, defined a logic that you put in the system and it gives you an output that

809
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:09,320
you need to just work on the exception.

810
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:14,880
So what happens is the RPA is set to work post your, post you have defined, I mean,

811
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:16,880
post you download all your files.

812
00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:21,560
It works after beyond a particular business after the hours, sets up the outcome and pushes

813
00:47:21,560 --> 00:47:22,560
it.

814
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:25,160
So after the morning, you have a file, which will give you the exception.

815
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:29,280
So what you used to do with lacks and lacks, you just have to manage some 10, 15 line items

816
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:30,280
and bet.

817
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:32,760
So she then, he couldn't believe it.

818
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:33,760
Okay.

819
00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:37,280
So she said, she was still very, after the whole thing happened, she said, no, I can't

820
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:38,280
believe it.

821
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:39,280
Maybe the data is wrong.

822
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:40,280
How could something happen like this?

823
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:43,960
Then she herself sat and reconciled the physical versus the RPA.

824
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:46,000
And she said, no, I'm happy now.

825
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:52,760
So the, the, the, we used to spend about eight crore rupees giving to multiple partners and

826
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:53,760
vendors for record.

827
00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:59,120
This whole process was done with just three laks with a studio license.

828
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:01,440
It was a phenomenal chain.

829
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:06,960
I mean, everybody appreciated it so well because they were, it was, and it was this early days,

830
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:11,280
today you can hear RPA and AI all across anything and everything you do.

831
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:14,160
People say, RPA, Karpo, AI and all that.

832
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:18,640
But that time it was just a new entrant in the market, trying to take that out and trying

833
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:23,240
to put that today, Ujjivan has applied that in all their banking operations, back office,

834
00:48:23,240 --> 00:48:27,440
wherever there's RTGS, NEFT, everything, because you can deploy it across.

835
00:48:27,440 --> 00:48:31,000
But that time it was taking a risk on putting it across.

836
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:32,000
Wonderful.

837
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:37,680
Jay, I wouldn't have believed that I could hold a conversation with you for 50 minutes

838
00:48:37,680 --> 00:48:43,460
on banking because my knowledge of banking is very rudimentary.

839
00:48:43,460 --> 00:48:51,160
But thank you for casting light on so many little processes, which when scaled to this

840
00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:54,880
level can suddenly pose new problems.

841
00:48:54,880 --> 00:49:01,360
So as we move towards closing this out, I just want to figure out what is it that you

842
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:06,080
see when young people get into banking today or they're looking at banking and saying,

843
00:49:06,080 --> 00:49:07,160
okay, it's a boring job.

844
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:08,240
It's not a boring job.

845
00:49:08,240 --> 00:49:09,740
What should I look at?

846
00:49:09,740 --> 00:49:11,160
What would your advice be?

847
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:16,880
See, according to me, no job is boring and no job is, and not to look at every job is

848
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:17,880
exciting.

849
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:23,320
So it's basically what you want to do in life is very important and that sets your standards

850
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:25,160
for anything else also.

851
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:28,760
So banking for me, somebody asked me, is banking boring?

852
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:30,100
Banking is not boring at all.

853
00:49:30,100 --> 00:49:33,520
Banking is very interesting and especially operations is very interesting.

854
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:38,020
It's a new day, a new thing to look at, new challenge to handle.

855
00:49:38,020 --> 00:49:39,020
Everything is new.

856
00:49:39,020 --> 00:49:43,800
So there's nothing that one should, I mean, you can't, you should not walk into something

857
00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:47,600
saying that this is something like, you know, it's a time pass for me or it's a, it's a

858
00:49:47,600 --> 00:49:51,600
retirement job for me or is it a, it's something that I'm taking it up because I'm not getting

859
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:52,600
anything.

860
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:53,600
Then you will not like anything in life.

861
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:57,680
Unless and until there is a, you create that excitement for yourself, you will never be

862
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:00,740
able to enjoy any job for that matter.

863
00:50:00,740 --> 00:50:08,960
And that is something I think today's youngsters should look at.

864
00:50:08,960 --> 00:50:15,260
But you know, one of the things you started early on is that you are willing to take risks.

865
00:50:15,260 --> 00:50:20,840
And that's one thing that I've seen in the people that I talk to that the, the willingness

866
00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:26,300
to take risks early on and not stay in the conventional path seems to be one of those

867
00:50:26,300 --> 00:50:30,760
things, which is it's almost like you're saying this is the formula, but I don't want to take

868
00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:33,880
that formula because I don't want to take risks.

869
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:38,680
Is there a safe way to get to the top without taking, there is a way.

870
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:44,720
Every time I've taken a change of job, my father always told me, I don't think you'll

871
00:50:44,720 --> 00:50:45,720
ever get to the gratuity.

872
00:50:45,720 --> 00:50:47,320
I said, I'm not interested in that.

873
00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:48,320
Okay.

874
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:51,600
He said, you will never ever be able to get that money.

875
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:56,480
I said, I am not interested in the gratitude money because it is giving me challenges.

876
00:50:56,480 --> 00:50:59,120
I'm able to do something very different.

877
00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:01,960
And he never agreed with the thought process of mine.

878
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:08,960
He was around so he for him, it was, I was, I was, you know, he thought that I was, I

879
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:09,960
was too bold and been dust.

880
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:10,960
Okay.

881
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:11,960
That's what he used to say.

882
00:51:11,960 --> 00:51:13,960
He said, you, you, how do you change job like this?

883
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:14,960
Why are you changing jobs?

884
00:51:14,960 --> 00:51:17,960
Why are you not worried about security?

885
00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:18,960
And I'm like, okay.

886
00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:19,960
Okay.

887
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:20,960
Yeah.

888
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:28,840
So somewhere down the line is that, is that one of the things that, you know, there's

889
00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:32,840
a fundamental, what do you say?

890
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:37,640
This is something that needs to be resolved because at one stage you need enough experience

891
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:39,640
to do a job.

892
00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:44,920
Well, at another level, you need to know exactly when you say, okay, I think it's time for

893
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:49,880
me to change because a, I'm not getting as many challenges as before.

894
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:54,400
Is that one of the things that defined how you made the move?

895
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:58,220
No, the move was made based on.

896
00:51:58,220 --> 00:52:03,840
So I never said, so, you know, whenever I was comfortable in a job, I never said, okay,

897
00:52:03,840 --> 00:52:04,840
no to an interview.

898
00:52:04,840 --> 00:52:08,880
When somebody approached me, I said, why not speak?

899
00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:10,480
Let's know what the market has.

900
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:14,160
And sometimes that has come out as something very, very different that I could approach.

901
00:52:14,160 --> 00:52:18,400
And that's something, and of course I've always gone back to my mentor and asked him, okay,

902
00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:19,400
is this a step right?

903
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:23,080
Sometimes he said, no, just keep quiet and sit back.

904
00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:26,840
Sometimes he said, yes, you should risk or something that he said, you should know this,

905
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:29,720
you should take that chance and do the office role.

906
00:52:29,720 --> 00:52:32,920
And sometimes when, whenever there has been an opportunity, he says, what's, why would

907
00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:34,520
you want to take that chance?

908
00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:35,520
Stay put.

909
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:41,700
So these, see, you always need to, you know, have someone to whom you should talk to because

910
00:52:41,700 --> 00:52:46,080
it's, it defines you, whether you are thinking right or whether you are, whether you are

911
00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:49,760
with all your decision that you want to take is going in the right direction.

912
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:55,160
I strongly feel that, you know, all of us should have a mentor who should be there with

913
00:52:55,160 --> 00:53:00,280
us, whom we should be talking to, who will help us channelize our thoughts in the right

914
00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:01,280
direction.

915
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:05,160
And looking back, I don't think any of my decision was wrong.

916
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:09,840
And I don't think what I'm doing right now is something I'm doing.

917
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:11,920
I mean, why am I doing this?

918
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:12,920
Is this the right thing to do?

919
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:16,960
No, I'm not, for once also, I'm not looking back and regretting any of the decision I've

920
00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:19,240
taken or that I'm taking.

921
00:53:19,240 --> 00:53:22,800
That's because there is always a validation done with a mentor.

922
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:27,360
There's a validation done with somebody who you can talk to, which is what I keep telling

923
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:29,680
in when talk to people.

924
00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:34,760
Have someone always don't be lost because all these things that you talk about mental

925
00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:39,760
health issues, that issues, that pressure, everything arises because you're not able

926
00:53:39,760 --> 00:53:43,920
to open up and talk what you want to do, how you want to do.

927
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:46,800
And these are some of the things that are very critical in life.

928
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:52,440
So I never regret a decision I've taken in my life as far as my career is concerned.

929
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:54,680
There has been goods and bads about my career.

930
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:56,680
I have had my own challenges.

931
00:53:56,680 --> 00:54:01,440
Being a single woman in a boardroom, in a management committee had its own challenges.

932
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:05,240
I had to fight my way to get my voice heard.

933
00:54:05,240 --> 00:54:12,240
There are some times that I've had really bad arguments and had gone back home thinking,

934
00:54:12,240 --> 00:54:14,800
why the hell am I doing this job?

935
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:20,440
But till the job excites you, till you love what you're doing and till you find that there

936
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:27,200
is people around you appreciating you and you have the support to do it, just do it.

937
00:54:27,200 --> 00:54:29,560
Do not think too much beyond what.

938
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:33,840
We create a lot of problems for ourselves because we just think too much.

939
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:39,120
I think that's the basic reason why all of us end in a lot of trouble.

940
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:43,680
So that's what I keep talking to people about.

941
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:44,680
It's so practical.

942
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:51,400
I mean, the wonderful part about what you've just said is that the wisdom that you've imparted

943
00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:52,400
is all practical.

944
00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:54,320
It's something that can be done.

945
00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:58,920
But a lot of people try and find shortcuts or they try and find ways which are not really

946
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,920
the best ways to do it.

947
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:03,760
Yes, you will stumble.

948
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:08,720
But at the end of the day, you will have learned something that would probably not have come

949
00:55:08,720 --> 00:55:10,760
to you from anything else.

950
00:55:10,760 --> 00:55:16,160
I think we got so caught up in the conversation, you wanted to talk about Aspire for Her, which

951
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:19,120
is something that you've been, which is very close to your heart.

952
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:22,360
So why don't we close on that for today?

953
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:28,800
Yeah, you know, something that I always wanted to give back to the society and give back

954
00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:35,120
to the women folks is something that I found in Aspire for Her.

955
00:55:35,120 --> 00:55:41,440
And that's how I got associated with AFH and started working on that space, building the

956
00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:46,120
diversity ratio in the country, working with various corporates, working with various killing

957
00:55:46,120 --> 00:55:51,680
agencies, working with various people to see how we can bring in, you know, build the diversity

958
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:53,400
ratio in the country.

959
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:58,320
The one piece that I'm working very closely and I am very proud to share that is I'm working

960
00:55:58,320 --> 00:56:02,320
very closely with the rural entrepreneurs in from AFH.

961
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:07,080
And that is, you know, building the financial literacy for that particular segment, because

962
00:56:07,080 --> 00:56:08,400
that's an expertise that we have.

963
00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:13,960
Okay, we understand financial space, we understand literacy, and we understand why financial

964
00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:16,680
independence is very important for women.

965
00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:22,360
And that's the reason why I said I will work on that space in by manage the office of the

966
00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:23,360
tech for AFH.

967
00:56:23,360 --> 00:56:29,640
But rural entrepreneurial is a very, very specific space I work with in the financial

968
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:30,640
literacy space.

969
00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:35,040
And today we have started off with Maharashtra and we plan to expand across the country.

970
00:56:35,040 --> 00:56:40,400
So I wanted to make a mention of this is because I want people to understand that it's very

971
00:56:40,400 --> 00:56:44,960
critical for us to give back to the society what we have gained.

972
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:50,880
And the only way to do this is to get associated with organizations that work on that space.

973
00:56:50,880 --> 00:56:55,920
And that's why I wanted to make a special mention of course, the network, the people,

974
00:56:55,920 --> 00:56:59,200
the association that has that AFH has given me is phenomenal.

975
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:00,880
And there's no comparison about it.

976
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:05,800
But I think all of us will need to kind of, you know, like in COVID, they said, you know,

977
00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:11,040
break the chain, I will say build the chain unless and until you start working with the

978
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:14,720
folks down the ground level and give them back what you have learned, you will never

979
00:57:14,720 --> 00:57:18,920
be able to bring them up the curve at any point of time.

980
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:19,920
So that's fabulous.

981
00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:26,240
Yeah, no, I think it's been I really enjoyed this conversation because thank you for being

982
00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:33,160
so open, so practical, and yet so insightful about so many of the things that we never

983
00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:36,800
understand our problems when seen at scale.

984
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:41,480
And your approach and the way you you solve problems and even the advice that you give

985
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:44,560
people is so eminently practical.

986
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:46,520
Thank you for being on the show, Jaya.

987
00:57:46,520 --> 00:57:49,520
And it was wonderful talking to you.

988
00:57:49,520 --> 00:57:50,520
Thank you so much, Venu.

989
00:57:50,520 --> 00:57:56,320
I think every time I talk about my journey, I get very carried away because all these

990
00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:57,840
things are very close to my heart.

991
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:02,480
And I think you only made it more and more maybe more and more happy today by having

992
00:58:02,480 --> 00:58:04,640
me to take walk through the whole journey.

993
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:05,640
Thank you so much.

994
00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:06,640
It's been great.

995
00:58:06,640 --> 00:58:07,640
Wonderful.

996
00:58:07,640 --> 00:58:08,640
Thank you.

997
00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:10,920
Thank you very much.

998
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:14,120
That was Jaya Janardhanan.

999
00:58:14,120 --> 00:58:21,560
And it was a wonderful journey through the practical aspects of actually finding what

1000
00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:26,320
it means to run banks at the national level.

1001
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:32,640
My first job, the podcast is a production from Ideascape Communications.

1002
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:39,480
Guest relations, promotions and creative is managed by Deepa Ravi with occasional support

1003
00:58:39,480 --> 00:58:41,680
by Venu Gopal Nair.

1004
00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:59,400
Archiving and technical help is provided by LPS Jaya Chandran.