1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:18,000 Vejay Anand graduated as a pharmacist but then went into doing an MBA. 2 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:21,260 Marriage, advertising and product marketing happened. 3 00:00:21,260 --> 00:00:26,620 He joined Cafe Coffee Day during its meteoric rise in India and put in systems and standard 4 00:00:26,620 --> 00:00:29,820 operating procedures to drive efficiencies. 5 00:00:29,820 --> 00:00:33,500 He blew hot and cold, moving from coffee to beer. 6 00:00:33,500 --> 00:00:38,640 His love for teaching and writing led him down the path to becoming a brand historian 7 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:43,220 and on his blog, he has several stories for those who are interested. 8 00:00:43,220 --> 00:00:50,400 This is episode 13 of My First Job, the podcast that covers engaging career journeys and every 9 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,080 single one is full of twists, turns and insights. 10 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:56,240 My name is Venu Gopal Nair. 11 00:00:56,240 --> 00:01:02,640 I'm the host of this podcast and CEO of Ideascape Communications, an advertising agency into 12 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:05,160 branding, creative and design. 13 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,440 So settle in, sit back and enjoy the conversation. 14 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:11,240 Hi Vejay and welcome to the show. 15 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:12,240 Thanks Venu. 16 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:13,240 Thank you so much. 17 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:14,240 I heard the introduction. 18 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:19,640 So each person is unique. 19 00:01:19,640 --> 00:01:22,320 You have an amazing following on LinkedIn. 20 00:01:22,320 --> 00:01:24,920 You have over 15,000 followers. 21 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,040 You have 45 recommendations, which is amazing. 22 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:34,120 Let's start off with the present from a hot beverage like coffee to cold microbrewery 23 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:37,400 like beer, which is your current assignment. 24 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:38,400 What is the difference? 25 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,000 Yeah, the hot and the cold, right? 26 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:46,160 The alcohol and the non-alcohol and very less of alcohol and the caffeine and less of caffeine. 27 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:53,360 But you know, if you really ask me, the kind of people who drink in a sense are different, 28 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:54,360 but they're not, you know. 29 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:58,000 At the end of the day, I think it boils down to the fact that you want to have a good time. 30 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:03,040 It's not like earlier when alcohol drinking alcohol was like, oh my God, it's like taboo. 31 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:04,720 I remember when I was a kid. 32 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:08,840 Is this something, it wasn't always very easy for you to make friends even back in school 33 00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:10,720 in Kolkata was it? 34 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:14,500 I'm what they call an extroverted introvert. 35 00:02:14,500 --> 00:02:19,240 So I get along with a lot of people, but in a sense, I'm an introvert. 36 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:23,460 I restrict myself to a certain number of people who I talk to regularly. 37 00:02:23,460 --> 00:02:26,040 So it's a very strange, it's kind of an oxymoron. 38 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,740 I believe it's the way I've been brought up. 39 00:02:28,740 --> 00:02:33,200 So for example, you know, my grandparents' house in Kerala, even strangers could come 40 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:34,680 and have food at home. 41 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:39,280 So you had that upbringing that you have to be social, you have to talk to people, respect 42 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:42,720 everyone and different parts of society walking in. 43 00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:46,600 And everyone was given that respect at home in Kerala. 44 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:50,420 And so was the case at home, you know, I mean, my father had a transferable job. 45 00:02:50,420 --> 00:02:55,980 So that kind of percolated throughout very comfortable talking to, you know, putting 46 00:02:55,980 --> 00:03:02,400 my arms around my office support or even the, you know, the senior management. 47 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,780 But that's, I mean, I owe a lot to it the way I've been brought up actually to my parents 48 00:03:05,780 --> 00:03:08,160 and my grandparents. 49 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:11,560 So what were the first glimmers of a career like? 50 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:13,080 Very, very good question. 51 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:15,200 I think I can go on and on and on. 52 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:16,200 I love science. 53 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:21,520 I wanted to be an architect or do something with biology, very, very differing points, 54 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:22,520 differing. 55 00:03:22,520 --> 00:03:25,880 But yeah, then I decided that I'll do something with biology, but I didn't want to be a doctor. 56 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:29,000 So the next next good thing was to be a pharmacist. 57 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:31,640 So I actually did my graduation in pharmacy. 58 00:03:31,640 --> 00:03:32,640 Okay. 59 00:03:32,640 --> 00:03:35,200 I graduated in pharmacy. 60 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,560 And strangely enough, I enjoyed pharmacy, let's be frank, I like science. 61 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:45,760 My goal was to do a post-graduation in pharmacy and then probably do a PhD. 62 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:51,680 So I had got admission in one of the universities in the US for my post-graduation. 63 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:53,520 I had a year or so to pass. 64 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,360 It might sound very strange, but I was bored. 65 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:00,240 So I wrote an entrance exam for the MBA / PGDM. 66 00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:01,280 I got through. 67 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:02,280 So I said, okay, fine. 68 00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:03,280 I have the time. 69 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:06,600 Secondly, there was another reason also, I had got married very early. 70 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:07,600 So I said, okay, fine. 71 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:09,280 Let me study and spend some time with my wife. 72 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:11,320 I mean, she was my girlfriend prior to that. 73 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:13,840 So we took up a place and it worked very well. 74 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:17,360 What really worked for me, what really interested me was marketing. 75 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:21,240 I was always interested in marketing even prior to joining an MBA. 76 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:25,320 There's a magazine called A&M and I used to devour that. 77 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,120 I used to read and read and read that. 78 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:32,840 And I had a cousin of mine who used to buy these every issue and I used to read every 79 00:04:32,840 --> 00:04:34,280 issue, borrow from him and read it. 80 00:04:34,280 --> 00:04:36,400 So that really interested me. 81 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:38,720 I never thought I'll have a career in marketing. 82 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:43,200 When I joined my MBA stroke PGDM, that's when I decided that, you know what, marketing is 83 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:45,280 my true calling and let me get into marketing. 84 00:04:45,280 --> 00:04:48,920 And even within marketing also, I decided I'll not get into pharmacy. 85 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:51,760 I will get into the consumer side of things. 86 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,360 I found that to be far more exciting. 87 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:55,360 It is a personal choice. 88 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:58,880 There are people who got into pharmaceutical marketing and love it. 89 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:02,880 I decided, no, I want to be in the non-pharmaceutical kind of thing. 90 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:09,520 And here I am, selling beer for a living now. 91 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:15,320 I had a maths tutor, Dr. Bharti Banerjee, who incidentally was my mom's professor. 92 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:20,560 And she was a lady who encouraged me to do a lot of things. 93 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:22,880 She says, no, be a natural self. 94 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:23,880 Don't worry. 95 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:24,880 You got the gift. 96 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:26,880 You know, do it. 97 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:33,360 And Dr. Banerjee really guided me, helped me to nurture those inner things, which I 98 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:34,360 didn't know. 99 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:36,520 See, I was a kid at the end of the day in my teens. 100 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,680 And Dr. Banerjee was, shall I say, the best in me. 101 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:44,160 Who could see that something was there in me and dramatics, etc. 102 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:47,200 All that work, music, I mean, I've learned classical music. 103 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:50,760 So all this latent things within me. 104 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:54,000 When people bring it out and there is actually resistance. 105 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:55,000 Yes. 106 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,360 I don't want to do it. 107 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:01,800 So then you said you decided that you didn't want to get into pharma. 108 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:04,280 So out of campus, I joined Balarpur industry. 109 00:06:04,280 --> 00:06:08,000 Thapar group at that time, I mean, you know, Kramping, Veer, Balarpur industries. 110 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:09,600 So Thapar group had posted me. 111 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:11,920 I mean, I joined in Delhi, but I got soon posted to Bhopal. 112 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:13,560 I wanted to start my career in states. 113 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:15,000 They had an edible oil division. 114 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:17,160 So they posted me in Bhopal. 115 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,680 You know, and you know, that time MP was MP in Chhattisgarh. 116 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:25,840 I mean, on one side you had Orissa, on the other side you had Gujarat and UP and places 117 00:06:25,840 --> 00:06:26,840 like that. 118 00:06:26,840 --> 00:06:31,280 So it was, it was like, shall I say, a baptism by fire. 119 00:06:31,280 --> 00:06:35,560 On one side you had Naxals, the other side you had the Chambal Valley. 120 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:36,560 Okay. 121 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:40,160 And it used to take, if you just to cross the state, it used to take you two days from 122 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:42,080 one end to the state to the other end. 123 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:46,960 So in place like Jagdarpur, which is in the eastern part of now Chhattisgarh, you actually 124 00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:52,960 had tribals and you go down to Mansour, you had people in rifles walking around. 125 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:59,360 So I'm talking about the nineties, you know, so it was a fantastic learning experience 126 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:05,440 and each region with an MP behaved differently, the kind of, I would sell edible oil. 127 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:10,960 You shared the driver's seat, you held on to the three wheeler and you said, and that's 128 00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:11,960 the way I started my career. 129 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:15,440 Though I was an area manager and a team of six, seven people. 130 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:16,440 What do you do? 131 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:22,080 All you sit in the back of the van, you get steamed alive in that tin kind of box. 132 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:23,640 And that's the way I started my career. 133 00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:27,920 And I used to, I mean, I used to travel three to four days a week and traveling by train, 134 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:28,920 you never flew. 135 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:33,920 How important, I think, yes, I learned and unlearned a lot of stuff. 136 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:39,120 Or I would rather put this way, not unlearned, I learned a lot more in my first job. 137 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:43,840 You know, the reality of talking to customers, understanding the realities of the market, 138 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:48,240 the reality, you know, realizing the realities of the market, realizing how the market was, 139 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:51,880 the dynamics, which some things which you cannot be taught, you have to experience it, 140 00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:56,720 you know, insight into how consumers behave, how retail behave, how shopkeepers behave, 141 00:07:56,720 --> 00:08:00,640 how distributors behave, what are those small things which will make a difference. 142 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:03,480 It really took me to the innards of the FMCG system. 143 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:04,880 It was a great learning experience. 144 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:09,440 I strongly even now, I tell a lot of people, start a career in sales and then move to marketing. 145 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,240 It tells you that you can't come up with strategies that are in the air. 146 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:15,300 You really have to know what the market is like. 147 00:08:15,300 --> 00:08:20,760 It gave me a perspective which was not in textbooks, beyond which you have to take up 148 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:21,760 work. 149 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:22,760 So what happened? 150 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:24,320 How did you go about making a shift? 151 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:26,880 They decided to shut the division down for various reasons. 152 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:29,960 And I also wanted to move back to the South Symposium because my wife was here. 153 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:31,280 So that's when I moved into advertising. 154 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:35,520 I joined an agency called Nexus Equity, famous for the Ericsson commercial, but then they're 155 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,200 famous for a lot of other things too. 156 00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:39,640 And Nexus became Enterprise Nexus. 157 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:43,120 In sales, it's, you know, very salesy guy, you know, you sell, sell, sell, sell, sell. 158 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:47,640 And then you have a very different perspective, how communication can influence purchase, 159 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:49,520 consumer behavior, so on and so forth. 160 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:50,800 I love advertising even now. 161 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:53,800 It just that the industry can do a lot more changes. 162 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,000 I don't think it moved that much. 163 00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:00,840 So then you moved from advertising to pantaloons? 164 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,760 I worked in a place called Anatasia. 165 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:06,640 That is the starting of the dot com era. 166 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:09,720 And I joined them for a year. 167 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:13,040 As soon as the dot com era happened, the bubble burst. 168 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:17,840 And then soon after I joined Weekender, it was one of the most happening youthwear brands 169 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:18,840 at that time. 170 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:21,480 I was there for four or five years, heading both marketing and retail. 171 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,400 That's when I kind of went, I marketing and retail. 172 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:26,600 Let me just interject here. 173 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:30,240 Weekender was one of the earliest young brands, right? 174 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,200 So young people. 175 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:37,840 So how is it different selling to young people today, a brand like Agio and a brand like 176 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:42,280 Weekender, because let's say it's 30 years, three generations apart. 177 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:46,200 See any audience for that matter, you know, what evolved over a period of time. 178 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,160 So the youth of 20, 25, 20 years back is different from the youth. 179 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:54,840 I mean, but likewise for any brand, you also have to evolve with time. 180 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:58,520 You cannot be that what worked 20 years back and work now. 181 00:09:58,520 --> 00:09:59,520 It cannot work. 182 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:02,160 I mean, you know, you're one of the doyens of the business. 183 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:06,240 So you'll understand what worked then will not necessarily work now. 184 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:11,080 You have to evolve as your customers evolve, their taste change, behavior changes. 185 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:12,080 So you have to evolve. 186 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:17,520 So yes, what probably worked at that time will not work now. 187 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:21,920 But as a marketing person, since you have to understand the customer, you also have 188 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:26,760 to work on a strategy and tactics, which will resonate with your customer. 189 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:27,760 You don't have social media. 190 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:30,160 I mean, you don't even know what internet is. 191 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:31,240 So what did you do? 192 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:35,720 What did you do to launch Weekender in the markets, which were there at that point? 193 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,200 Honestly, I didn't launch Weekender. 194 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:41,480 It was already there. 195 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:46,280 I had to just take the, should I say the torch and run with it as far as marketing goes, 196 00:10:46,280 --> 00:10:50,040 extending the concept of where your attitude, which was very popular at that time, being 197 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:53,080 relevant to them, being seen in the right places with them. 198 00:10:53,080 --> 00:10:56,200 I mean, coffee dates started in 96, cafes were in infancy. 199 00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:58,800 You used to catch them at different places. 200 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:03,200 And you obviously spoke to them in a manner relevant to where they are and what they wanted 201 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:04,200 to hear. 202 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:05,200 Logic holds good even now. 203 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:10,800 So you have social media, you have microbreweries, pubs, cafes, etc. 204 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:11,800 The basics don't change. 205 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:14,600 It's just that the way you execute your strategy and your tactics have changed. 206 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:15,600 Right. 207 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:18,760 So quickly after that was when you got into? 208 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:22,480 I became an operations guy, a retail operations guy and I quite enjoyed it. 209 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:23,840 So quickly moved to Future Group. 210 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:27,840 When I was in Future Group, I had no intention of changing when Coffee Day kept calling. 211 00:11:27,840 --> 00:11:29,720 And I wanted to meet Siddharth for a very long time. 212 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:35,480 So when the HR person called me and said that, you know, listen, we're looking for a marketing 213 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:36,480 person. 214 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:41,160 And I always had Coffee Day from, I mean, I was a customer, regular customer and I enjoyed, 215 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,160 I mean, I visited the cafes very often. 216 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:45,720 I liked the brand. 217 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:49,960 I saw a passion in it, which was coming from obviously, I never knew Siddharth personally. 218 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:53,400 So when I got a chance to get interviewed by him and I said, you know what, I have a 219 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:54,400 business idea. 220 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:55,400 Let me pitch to him for all you know. 221 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,280 And I knew that he had a VC fund and all that. 222 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:00,160 So I went, attended the interview and I said, you know what, sir, I have an idea. 223 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:01,160 So here's the idea. 224 00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:02,760 Would you fund me? 225 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:03,760 So very strange. 226 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:04,760 We're getting an entry. 227 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:05,760 Let me be very frank with you. 228 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:09,360 So that was his typical style, you know, boss, he calls everybody boss in his close circle. 229 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:12,240 He said, hey boss, you know what, boss, lot of money. 230 00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:13,240 You join me, boss. 231 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:14,920 We'll do something good together. 232 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:15,920 And you'd be surprised. 233 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,560 I joined him without even a role being defined. 234 00:12:18,560 --> 00:12:22,040 So we had around three, four meetings figuring out what I can do for him, what he can do 235 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:23,040 for me. 236 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:24,040 And so there's a final meeting. 237 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:25,920 I still remember he called me to his office. 238 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:31,000 I remember in museum road and at 10 30, I get a call from a secretary, Veena, that, 239 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:33,520 you know, what Mr. Siddharth is going to be delayed. 240 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:34,520 He asked me to take it. 241 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:37,140 He's going to be delayed by half an hour and he's very sorry about it. 242 00:12:37,140 --> 00:12:39,480 And I said, wow, man, this guy really cares. 243 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:41,700 I mean, he doesn't ever do it. 244 00:12:41,700 --> 00:12:42,700 So she asked me, do you want to reschedule? 245 00:12:42,700 --> 00:12:44,480 I said, no, anyway, I'm on my way there. 246 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:48,480 I might as well come and, you know, and I said, you know what, it'll be good fun to 247 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:52,840 work with a person like this who respects you as an individual, who respects you for 248 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:53,840 your time. 249 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:56,880 And, you know, I mean, I've rarely, even now, I rarely see people. 250 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:57,880 I joined him. 251 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:00,880 He says, boss, you know what, I think somewhere inside you, you're an entrepreneur. 252 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:03,480 So I'm not going to give you a marketing role. 253 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:07,480 I'll give you a marketing plus role, I mean, or a business plus marketing role. 254 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:08,480 So let you join me. 255 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:09,480 We'll figure out something. 256 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:14,200 And I actually joined without a role being defined, but you figured things out. 257 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:17,760 I joined more as a group resource in the sense that, okay. 258 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:19,360 I was a part of the cafe. 259 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:20,860 I was also not a part of the cafe. 260 00:13:20,860 --> 00:13:24,040 So he used to put me on projects, special projects. 261 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:27,720 So he wanted us to work on it, work on that project. 262 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:28,720 Did I contribute to Cafe Coffee Day? 263 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:29,720 Definitely did it. 264 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:34,160 I ran one of the most profitable businesses for them called airline catering, which contributed 265 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:39,520 to 150 crores of top line, which was catering to all the low-cost carriers, 266 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:41,640 like Air Deccan and Go Air. 267 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:43,720 And then soon, soon we added other airlines. 268 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:45,240 What is that business like? 269 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:49,600 To manage the onboard food service, food and beverage services for them. 270 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:52,040 A lot of work goes into planning at that stage. 271 00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:53,280 Nobody knew the business. 272 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:56,600 So when we got it and then I took it over, nobody had a clue. 273 00:13:56,600 --> 00:14:01,640 So we pretty much defined the SOPs, defined, and coffee, they define, you know, I do believe 274 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:04,320 and no credit to me, I give credit to my team and my predecessor. 275 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:09,120 We kind of define the SOPs and the standards to be followed at that time. 276 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,480 And everything it grew from there. 277 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:13,120 Coffee Day kind of started that whole thing technically. 278 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:16,520 Though Deccan started this buy onboard model, we were quickly brought in because we had 279 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:21,840 a retail understanding because Captain Gopi knew Siddharth and so Siddharth decided to 280 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:22,840 come in. 281 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:25,560 We learned as we both of us learned as we went along. 282 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:31,080 And obviously we became special in this business and became 150 crores a profitable business. 283 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:34,120 What was also very interesting is that while it contributed to the top line and the bottom 284 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:38,760 and, we also got exposure to the brand on, should I say in the sky. 285 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:43,240 Cafe Coffee Day was there across so many flights, across two, three airlines. 286 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:46,400 I mean, it's a great way to connect to the customers. 287 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:49,800 So in a sense, we were paid to advertise our own brand. 288 00:14:49,800 --> 00:14:54,240 There's a lot of work to mention, you know, a lot of work when sleepless nights, I used 289 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:57,200 to get calls at two o'clock at night, four o'clock in the morning, six o'clock in the 290 00:14:57,200 --> 00:14:58,200 morning. 291 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:01,360 Sometimes there are nights when I'm not slept, very high intensity operations. 292 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:05,920 So what were the calls about in the sense, was it delivery issues or was something else? 293 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:08,960 If I go, there's a whole list of things I can get into. 294 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:10,120 That is not there. 295 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:11,120 This is not happening. 296 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,960 You know, okay, there's a VIP coming in. 297 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:17,180 So Vejay, sorry to trouble you, but we couldn't get you upset. 298 00:15:17,180 --> 00:15:21,840 So can you organize things and let's say go hearty and, you know, I just got information 299 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:24,240 now and, you know, there's a problem. 300 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:25,240 So sometimes there'll be escalations. 301 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,520 There's a problem now where something's happened with the food. 302 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:29,600 What do we do? 303 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:31,640 So I'll have a call, quick con call in the night. 304 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:33,840 We can let them do this, all that. 305 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:36,000 So operation, typical operations, you know, what happens. 306 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:40,680 So certain promoters, I want to disarm my flight and then problem in Guwahati or some 307 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:42,040 problem in Jaipur. 308 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:46,160 I think airline catering, if you ask me, what was my key lesson there was the importance 309 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:47,160 of SOPs. 310 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:48,620 Everything is SOP driven there, you know. 311 00:15:48,620 --> 00:15:51,920 So if you see, if you really see the air hostess taking a cart, we call it a cart, taking 312 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:52,920 it through the aisle. 313 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:55,760 The way food is set, everything is an SOP to it. 314 00:15:55,760 --> 00:16:01,120 So the way it's set, the way the bottle of water is kept in the cart is an SOP to it. 315 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,080 In which drawer is this particular item, there's an SOP to it. 316 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:09,920 You may wonder, actually, why do we, you know, everything seems so processed in an airline. 317 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:13,300 Some people call it plasticky, but everything is processed. 318 00:16:13,300 --> 00:16:17,360 These SOPs again are based on efficiency, convenience. 319 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:18,960 I don't think there's any convenience. 320 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:23,720 I think you fall in line because see, it's very strange, right? 321 00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:29,960 Airlines probably has the least number of accidents, but people feel really scared going 322 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:31,680 in an airline. 323 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,360 Everything is SOP driven, everything. 324 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,960 Developing those SOPs among the most challenging assignments. 325 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:43,560 I think the most challenging assignment all across has been people and people's egos. 326 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:48,360 Designing SOPs and all that is, it's not easy, but it's not tough either. 327 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:51,000 But getting people to follow them is a challenge. 328 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:54,760 I keep saying this, the easiest thing for people is to not follow processes. 329 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:57,720 Because we always want to take shortcuts. 330 00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:01,840 Following a process is the most difficult thing for a person to do. 331 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:06,840 Directly I had some 20, 25 people, but indirectly we had around 600, 700 people working for 332 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:07,840 us. 333 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:12,160 So that was a lot of work, which they were all from outside contractors. 334 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,960 And honestly, I was a bit of a micromanager. 335 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:17,700 So it made it all the more difficult for me. 336 00:17:17,700 --> 00:17:20,880 I do believe to a certain extent you have to be that kind of business where every minute 337 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:21,880 counts. 338 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:23,520 So it kind of made me that way. 339 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:25,440 But that was the challenging bit of it. 340 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:28,840 That's when I started handling the packaged products of Coffee Day. 341 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:33,480 The coffee, the cookies, the later on we had tea. 342 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:35,680 See only contributing 2%. 343 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:39,960 And thanks to my, you know, my, and I think my biggest challenge there was when I took 344 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:43,760 it over, we had 220 skews of packaged products in the cafes. 345 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:45,000 I brought it down to 30. 346 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,800 Just don't waste your time on all these small, small ones. 347 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:49,120 Take your winners, run with it. 348 00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:51,520 I mean, in a sense, it's like a BCG matrix, right? 349 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:54,640 You have your cash cow stars, et cetera, et cetera. 350 00:17:54,640 --> 00:18:00,440 Take the big, good ones with potential, put your money on it, more resources, time, energy 351 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:01,440 and let it grow. 352 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:03,200 And that is what we did. 353 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,680 Then in parallel, what had happened is that we launched our resorts division called the 354 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:08,360 Sarai. 355 00:18:08,360 --> 00:18:11,600 And that I was involved from the time the foundation stone was laid. 356 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:14,920 I was involved in everything, you know, even the, you know, the, the, the, the, the, the, 357 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:23,360 the menu room, you know, what, everything, what cosmetics we put in there. 358 00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:29,800 I remember the few of us who were there were like involved deeply, you know, what the restaurant 359 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:33,200 we called, you know, what's a, what's a uniform. 360 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:35,000 How many resorts were there? 361 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:40,520 No, we started off in Chikmagalur and then we were two more in Kabini and Bandipur. 362 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:42,600 And then later on he added Andamans to it. 363 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:48,880 And this is where I learned the fine art of customer service, guest satisfaction, because 364 00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:51,920 each room that time it does was 10 to 12,000 bucks a night. 365 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:53,320 I'm talking about so many years back. 366 00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:55,000 It was frightfully expensive. 367 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,240 That was customer service to the next level actually. 368 00:18:57,240 --> 00:18:58,240 And it's a different ball game. 369 00:18:58,240 --> 00:18:59,680 It's in a remote place. 370 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:03,100 It's not very easy to maintain standards. 371 00:19:03,100 --> 00:19:05,680 It's not very easy to find people to staff. 372 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:06,680 Yes. 373 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:07,680 Yes. 374 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:08,680 Yes. 375 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:15,200 So, I had a very different perspective on what luxury extra ultra-premium, ultra luxury brand 376 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:17,320 and also customers who would cater to them. 377 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:19,160 I mean, who we would cater to. 378 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:21,400 What about the actual Coffee Day stores? 379 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:23,280 Yes, we had a kind of a template. 380 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:28,440 I think when you're reaching between Cafe Coffee Day and Express, you have to run 2000 381 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:30,480 stores, you had to follow a process and a template. 382 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:32,040 So there was a process of site selection. 383 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:37,440 There was a process of food, what food, where, how marketing, how marketing would happen. 384 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,160 L & D learning and development would happen. 385 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:45,040 So they had to be a process because otherwise without processes and systems, it would just 386 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:46,040 collapse. 387 00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:50,760 So retail in a sense is very, very process oriented, very excess heavy driven. 388 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,360 So you had to set it up there too. 389 00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:58,960 Vejay, what is the role of marketing once it's set at that particular place? 390 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:01,600 Your room for maneuver, is it limited? 391 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:02,600 The process is set. 392 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:06,000 I mean, the car will run by itself, but you need to drive it, right? 393 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:08,400 It's like driving by itself. 394 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,000 Unless it's a self-driving car, but there are problems with that. 395 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:16,240 I think marketing task is A, definitely from making sure that the right communication goes 396 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:17,240 out. 397 00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:19,400 I mean, primarily is to get customers to come in. 398 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:23,960 That's the job of marketing, to get a build on the brand and that you have to keep evolving. 399 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:25,960 You can't repeat the same promotion all the time. 400 00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:27,400 You can't keep discounting all the time. 401 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:31,480 You have to make it exciting with the customer to come back to you again and again. 402 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:37,880 You have to create that experience, that excitement, that's a never ending process of keeping the, 403 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,320 I can't use the word titillated, but keeping the customer excited. 404 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,160 So that process never stopped. 405 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:44,960 People will get go with certain foods. 406 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:46,800 So you're going to bring in new food. 407 00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:49,740 People go to certain beverages; you have to change the beverages. 408 00:20:49,740 --> 00:20:50,740 You have to keep evolving. 409 00:20:50,740 --> 00:20:53,280 You have to keep changing, taste change, people change. 410 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:55,200 And so you have to evolve with time. 411 00:20:55,200 --> 00:21:01,800 Do you buy into what the Starbucks CEO made famous, his statement about coffee place being 412 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:03,360 the third place. 413 00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:06,880 It's not house, it's not work, but it's supposed to be something. 414 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:07,880 Good question. 415 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:08,880 I mean, I often I had to Howard Schultz. 416 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,880 I mean, I think he's one of the, like Howard Schultz., I think changed the perspective of 417 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:13,880 coffee in India. 418 00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:14,880 And I need to interject here. 419 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:18,160 I think Siddharth changed the perspective of what people had about coffee. 420 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:23,260 I think if there's a coffee hall of fame in India and before I get into Howard Schultz. 421 00:21:23,260 --> 00:21:25,120 even now coffee is an emotion for me. 422 00:21:25,120 --> 00:21:29,800 A lot of us hats off to the gentleman that he is, Mr. Siddharth. 423 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,240 All of us took it very personally. 424 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,000 We were emotionally attached to the brand. 425 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:39,200 I was talking to my ex-colleagues last week and we still talk very fondly about coffee 426 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:40,200 day. 427 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:43,680 We've still have Coffee Days so many years back, but we still talk very emotional terms 428 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:44,680 about coffee. 429 00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:45,680 There's a sense of belonging. 430 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:49,960 And that's something which I don't think will ever go away from any of us. 431 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:50,960 Whatever has happened. 432 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,320 I think that something which will never go away from any of us. 433 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:55,920 That's the wonderful thing about brands. 434 00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:57,960 You're looking at it from an internal perspective. 435 00:21:57,960 --> 00:21:58,960 Absolutely. 436 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:00,280 I think a lot goes to Siddharth. 437 00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:01,800 Don't doubt about it. 438 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:04,560 I was lucky in that sense to work with Malvika too. 439 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:05,560 Both phenomenal people. 440 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:07,560 Very few people know about Malvika. 441 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:10,640 I think she's a fantastic lady. 442 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:13,240 Many people wonder what she's doing right now. 443 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:17,240 And I believe if there's somebody who can turn it around, it's her. 444 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:18,840 She's more than capable. 445 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:19,840 Great lady, humility. 446 00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:24,000 I mean, interacting with her has been one of the best things in my career. 447 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,720 She was my boss and I can tell you, I've had a great time. 448 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:28,160 I've learned a lot from her. 449 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,400 She doesn't have those fancy degrees and all that. 450 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,120 Very common sense in an approach. 451 00:22:32,120 --> 00:22:33,120 She taught me humility. 452 00:22:33,120 --> 00:22:34,120 I mean, you know her pedigree. 453 00:22:34,120 --> 00:22:37,600 But if you really look at it, coffee is a passion for me. 454 00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:40,600 So I can go on and on and bought coffee and I'll go to death. 455 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:45,040 If you really look at coffee in a sense, again, has been a social lubricant. 456 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:49,560 So if you know that the French Revolution started in a coffee shop, the Lloyd's insurance 457 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:51,720 brokers started in a coffee shop. 458 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:56,120 There are a lot of startups which started in coffee shops. 459 00:22:56,120 --> 00:22:57,920 And it seems to be largely in coffee shops. 460 00:22:57,920 --> 00:22:58,920 That's strange, right? 461 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,480 The tea parlors never took off. 462 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:03,020 It's always been coffee. 463 00:23:03,020 --> 00:23:06,200 It said that the Naxal movement started off in the India coffee house on College Street 464 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:07,200 in Calcutta. 465 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:08,200 It is so. 466 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:14,200 So, you know, in fact, I think coffee houses are banned if I'm not wrong, because coffee 467 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:15,480 is to form in trouble. 468 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:19,080 It's a place where a lot of conversations happen, place where a lot of friends meet 469 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:23,360 up, animated discussions, etc., etc. happens. 470 00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:26,640 Even now, I don't think the conversation stopped. 471 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:28,400 So in a sense, it is a third place. 472 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,960 I know there are a lot of other places which claim to be the third place. 473 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:36,760 But in that sense, I think as far as the US goes, Starbucks really did that very well. 474 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:41,840 You know, while the office is not a place where social conversations can happen and 475 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:47,480 people don't feel close enough to some people to invite them home, in which case this becomes 476 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:51,520 a nice neutral point at which you can continue conversation. 477 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:53,920 Well, observation, you know, exactly. 478 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,800 You know, you sometimes want to break down those barriers. 479 00:23:56,800 --> 00:24:00,880 You called yourself in the beginning an extroverted introvert. 480 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:01,880 Yeah. 481 00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:05,440 So did this forming a network come easily to you? 482 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:09,040 See talking to people is not really a problem for me. 483 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,960 I can strike a conversation most people, but what I strike a very deep conversation. 484 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:13,960 No, not so much. 485 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:18,120 I find it easy to have work discussions because there is a topic to be discussed. 486 00:24:18,120 --> 00:24:23,760 I find it far more easier to have talking to strangers on work matters rather than social 487 00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:24,760 matters. 488 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:25,760 So all that happens. 489 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:27,160 These days, politics is a minefield. 490 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:29,880 So you don't exactly, I was going to tell you that. 491 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:34,440 That could suddenly define the conversation and take it in a different direction. 492 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:40,480 Yeah, but I do find it a lot more comfortable having striking or conversations in a sense 493 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:41,680 I do teach. 494 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,520 What is it that students are most worried about? 495 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:48,560 One thing is that people expect MBA to be the solution for all their problems. 496 00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:49,560 Exactly. 497 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:50,680 You're starting out your career. 498 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:51,680 So you know, just chill. 499 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:52,680 You have to learn, use. 500 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:53,680 Yeah. 501 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:58,000 And a typical what will work in a corporate scenario, what will not. 502 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:02,640 I come in with the luxury of having worked in a, in, you know, corporate. 503 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:07,920 So I'm able to handle these questions far better than a typical academic does. 504 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,400 So since I read a fair amount, you're aware and I read a fair amount and I write a fair 505 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:12,400 amount. 506 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:17,120 Easy for me to bring examples from different businesses and, you know, make it easier for 507 00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:18,120 them to understand. 508 00:25:18,120 --> 00:25:21,080 And I can say, this is what I did. 509 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:22,520 This is what he did. 510 00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:24,920 This is what competition did to me. 511 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:26,920 I've had firsthand experience, you know. 512 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,000 How did you get around to writing about brands? 513 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:34,180 Because I noticed that on LinkedIn, you, you started picking up these brand stories first 514 00:25:34,180 --> 00:25:37,800 about campaigns and then you started writing about brands themselves, which I thought was 515 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:41,800 a wonderful way of establishing what really happens. 516 00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:42,800 So I'm, I love trivia. 517 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,120 I, and I love consumer behavior. 518 00:25:45,120 --> 00:25:46,520 So I actually started writing. 519 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:50,580 If you remember the first stages, I started writing on how customers behave as a part 520 00:25:50,580 --> 00:25:51,580 of consumer behavior. 521 00:25:51,580 --> 00:25:56,040 I wrote about something about how advertising influenced customer consumer behavior. 522 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:57,280 And I put a story to it. 523 00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,520 So then somebody asked me, I don't remember who said, why do you stop? 524 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:00,520 I mean, continue. 525 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:01,520 I said, okay. 526 00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:02,520 Then I wrote one more. 527 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:05,040 Then I took, I wrote about something and then why do you stop? 528 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,400 So then I realized that, you know what, people were expecting me to write more than I started 529 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:09,400 researching. 530 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:13,200 Then I started writing the stories, how the commercial was made or the advertising was 531 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:14,200 done. 532 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,960 Then I, you know, I covered it nationally, internationally. 533 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:18,240 I mean, a lot of it is available online. 534 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:19,240 Yes. 535 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:20,240 I just put it together. 536 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:21,240 Then I spoke to a lot of people. 537 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:22,240 It started off with that. 538 00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:27,880 I also believe that, you know what I learned on the way, I think 99.9% of the time I learned 539 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:29,240 something new every day. 540 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:33,160 It's amazing how you managed to catch so many creative directors. 541 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:34,160 Yes. 542 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:38,240 I mean, you know, some of them are extremely forthcoming, the US with UK. 543 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:39,240 I mean, it's strange. 544 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:44,480 It makes someone, you know, Honda paper ad, the great national creative director, Ken 545 00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,960 Papandros, I wrote to him. 546 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:47,960 He responded. 547 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:48,960 He said, I love to contribute. 548 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:53,520 Rajan Nair who created, you know, Complete Man, great. 549 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:58,680 There are a lot of, you know, Sumantro who contributed, who wrote about Maharashtra tourism, 550 00:26:58,680 --> 00:26:59,680 Uday. 551 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:06,560 There are a host of people who were more than happy to, so both of them, I mean, again, 552 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:08,440 a lot of people are willing to just contribute. 553 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:12,520 Pratap Suthan and contributed for Ajanta Clocks. 554 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:16,400 It makes my task of so much more fun, right? 555 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:17,880 Because they have encountered it. 556 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:18,880 They have seen it. 557 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:21,800 End of the day, what I put forward is what a research online and I put it. 558 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:26,680 But when you have a first hand opinion or impression with somebody saying it's so much 559 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:28,200 better and so much fun. 560 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:30,600 For example, she's become a dear friend. 561 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:35,880 So they have bought by the famous Pan Parag commercial, Pan Parag Pan Masala. 562 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:37,800 You become great friends. 563 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:43,840 I hunted her and then she not only did she do this, she gave a blog like Rajan, not only 564 00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:47,400 did he give me an article, he gave me a podcast. 565 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,160 So it's great fun. 566 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:50,160 It's been a thing. 567 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:51,160 Yes, yes, yes. 568 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:52,160 I do. 569 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,280 I mean, I wish I could interview marketing people, but I don't think I have the time 570 00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:56,280 for that. 571 00:27:56,280 --> 00:28:03,360 Wonderful, Vejay, because I think for a story that started way back in the classrooms and 572 00:28:03,360 --> 00:28:07,880 where teachers found your potential and then you found your own potential. 573 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:08,880 Absolutely. 574 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:14,160 And then you figured out how to make the changes as far as your own career went, which I think 575 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:22,080 is the other interesting part about how we arrive at our own destinations because you 576 00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:23,080 make the effort. 577 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:28,600 Your writing and your work that you put in into not just building your brand, but into 578 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:33,880 all the other brand stories, which are a collection adds to the tapestry of how marketing works 579 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:37,760 and how minds work and how all of these things come together. 580 00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:39,600 Great talking to you as always. 581 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:40,600 Thank you so much. 582 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:41,600 Thank you. 583 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:42,600 Thank you. 584 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:43,600 Thank you. 585 00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:49,360 My first job, the podcast is a production from Ideascape Communications. 586 00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:56,200 Host relations, promotions and creative is managed by Deepa Ravi with occasional support 587 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:58,280 by Venu Gopal Nair. 588 00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:26,800 Archiving and technical help is provided by LPS Jayachandran.