One little act of kindness can go a long, long
way Two little acts of kindness can brighten
anyone's day Three little acts of kindness can
make a beautiful sound Many acts of kindness
Hi, and welcome back to Tell Me What Happened,
the podcast that features people from all walks
of life talking about experiences they had as
a child and how those events impacted them as
an adult. I'm your host, Jay Rehack, and like
you, I've had my share of childhood experiences
that have impacted who I am, all of them painful
or eventful or even pleasant. have helped make
me who I am today. Tell Me What Happened is sponsored
by Sidelining Publishing, publishers of quality
books including Susan Salador's One Little Act
of Kindness, a children's book that is perfect
for the holiday season. Tell Me What Happened
is also sponsored by LaughSaver .com. Visit LaughSaver
.com and record your laughter. We'll keep it
for you now and forever. It's free and your children
and your grandchildren and your great grandchildren
will appreciate it. That's LaughSaver .com. Visit
LaughSaver .com and record your laughter now.
All right, so today I have as my first guest
a good friend of mine, a man that I used to teach
with at Whitney Young a long time ago, a man
who is now the... Executive Director of K -12
Education Initiatives and my very own library
program at the University of Chicago. Welcome
Dwayne Davis. Dwayne, great to have you on the
show. Are you ready to tell your story? I'm ready.
I think I'm ready. All right. Well, this is how
it's going to work, Dwayne. I'm going to stop
talking. I'm going to get out of the way. I'm
going to mute my microphone. At the end of your
story, I'm going to ask you one question. How
do you think that? experience has impacted who
you are today. So take it away, Dwayne. All right.
So I believe the year was 1990. It might have
been 1989. As you get older, the years kind of
blur together. You're not sure which year is
the right year and which year this kind of seed
actually got planted. But I definitely was a
gainfully employed teenager. at like an office
job. And I heard about this program, and I'm
going to name the program. I was going to Google
to see if it still existed. But this is the integral
part of the story. The program was called InRose.
Excellent program at the time. It was a program
to try to get young African -American and Latinx
high school students into like internship programs
for business. So you get like a really good kind
of office job. And then It turns into like a
network of people. You can kind of keep that
job and internship through college. And it was
trying to be a pipeline program. And I believe,
having done the research on this and looked it
up, that it was a relatively successful program,
like the young people I know that participated
at the time are, I think, many of them in business
or doing something that had long careers, like
inside of companies in that way. So I, as a teenager
at the time, with my office job that I had, that
was a relatively minimal wage job. I might've
been making four or something an hour. I'm not
quite sure what the hourly rate was at the time.
It was a lot of money to me. I said, I'm going
to go to this enrolls program. You have to have
a certain GPA. Yeah, to have a certain, you know,
wasn't super high and I wasn't, I wasn't, I was,
I believe I was a talented student, but I wasn't
a good student. I didn't kind of know how to
navigate those waters or possibly didn't even
care how to navigate those waters in that way
of trying to adjust as a young person at the
time. So I apply this program and I get to go
do an interview. And I know, OK, I got to go
to an interview. I've never been in like a formal,
formal job interview for like a business situation.
And I'm a young person at the time that I mean,
I dressed. fairly okay and I say fairly okay
like I like to wear like slacks and t -shirts
and you know shirts like button -up shirts at
the time and then the late 80s 90s you know they
might be like a silk or rayon shirt with like
some kind of floral print on it or you know and
you had the high top phase and had a high top
fade and my ear was pierced and I go into this
interview with a respectable pair of pants, a
respectable pair of shoes. I think I like an
off -white, I can still see myself too, like
an off -white kind of button -up shirt. I even
put a tie on, but it wasn't the kind of shirt
that took a tie. So it wasn't like a dress dress
shirt, like a press, you know, dress shirt that
got like lightly starched in the dry cleaners.
And I go into this interview because I got to
the interview and at the time I'm trying to decide
what I want to major in and I legitimately were,
think on my application, I put business or English.
And if I believe correctly, this is my junior
year of high school. I think in the intro mentioned
that I taught at Whitney Young Magna High School,
but I'm also a graduate of Whitney Young Magna
High School and my English teachers at Whitney
Young really impacted me. That's getting ahead
of the stories, but they did. So I get to this
interview and I get to this office and it's a
downtown office and other young people are there.
And they're dressed up too. I'm dressed a little
differently. I'm a little more alternative. I
got the big high top fade and it was pretty tall.
It was kid and play tall. And I got my earring
in and I think people have one like, they have
on suits. There's some young ladies there. They're
dressed kind of business professional. And, you
know, my mother's a college graduate. Like, you
know, I've got teachers in my family, professionals
in my family, but, you know, it doesn't quite
round. I'm born in a job interview. Like I said,
internship. I will see what it is. So I get to
the interview. i don't know i can't remember
one thing they asked me i do remember the end
of the interview they say you did great i got
two three things i need to tell you three things
one on your application you put business or english
don't put english don't put english i'm 15 years
old okay all right second take the earring out
next time you come for an interview like remove
your earring third thing wear a suit to the next
interview. And I walk out of there with a little
miffed. Like, hey, and I had enough perspective,
I think at that time, to be like, I'm a kid.
Like, I don't know what I want to do right now.
Like, I'm about to lock in. I got to tell people
I'm not sure. It really kind of made that moment
like. So I go back and get the second interview.
There's another level to this, right? And I think
the idea of that there are gates, right? And
you've got to like get the right key to the right
gate. You know, I think about the movie The Matrix
and the guy that makes the keys to open the doors
in the back, you know, the back channels on the
Internet, that metaphor for that. And it's like
there's another key. Another key is another interview.
So I go to for the interview, literally like
I might have been outside of the building. I
remove my earring. I don't have a suit. I don't
have money like in two weeks to procure a suit.
To be honest, I don't even know where to get
a suit. Like I haven't had at that time in my
life, like an Easter suit since I was like in
the fifth grade. So we're not buying, I think
I had an eighth grade graduation suit that I
got at like a store on 71st street on the South
side of Chicago. And it's like, I don't know
where to go procure a suit at 15 years old as
a junior in high school. So I go to the next
interview, take the earring out, walk in. says,
I do well again. I'm going on to the next round.
Like, oh, you did great. And it was interesting
to get feedback there, like right there in the
moment. Like, I didn't find out I didn't make
it. Like, there was no email. You know, there
wasn't, you know, there wasn't any of that. I
got, I didn't get a phone call. They told me
right there, like, you did great. You made it
to the next round. Two things this time. Don't
put English on your, don't put English on your
application. And then two, you need a suit. and
I'm glad you didn't have an airing in your ear.
You know, it was like, it was like they were
all talking about candidates. And as a candidate,
I seem to be a good candidate. But I had these
kind of flags on me. And flag, you know, flag
number one is I wanted to I was thinking about
being an English major, not being a business
major. Flag number two is I got my ear pierced,
which at the time in the 90s could mean a lot
of different things. But for me, it was just
a fashion choice. And then the third thing was,
is that I needed a suit, you know, like that
somehow the covering of a suit, you know, made
me more legitimate candidate, which means maybe
they didn't really read my application, where
it's like, I don't have money for a suit. I do
have a job. I'm dressed as a young person. I'm
dressed appropriately for an interview. I'm dressed
as dressed up as I can possibly be. And they
didn't have a thing that said, oh, we need to
get this young person a suit. It was like, you
need to get a suit. so then you can kind of have
the proper identification, the next key to get
to the next level in this particular game that
I've decided to play at this particular point
in my life. And I walked out of that second interview
and was like, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm
gonna be an English major. Because clearly, if
they say that's the wrong thing to do, then it
must be the right thing to do for me. It legitimately
solidified the idea. that I should major in English.
And then the story continued, right? But at that
moment, that moment solidified what I was gonna
major. I didn't know what I was gonna do with
an English major, but I knew why I wanted to
major in English is because of the teachers that
I had throughout my life, including my family,
that impacted me as far as stories, narrative.
reading, talking, writing, all those things.
Right then, in that moment, I made the decision
when I walked out of that door that I was going
to be an English major and I figure out what
to do after that. But business was likely not
going to be for me. And that's my story. That's
a great story. So you definitely became an English
teacher. So I know the impact to some extent
is. I thank God you don't wear that suit because
you're a heck of an English teacher. But anyway,
I'm going to let you tell me how you think it's
impacted your life because obviously there was
two roads that diverged in the woods and one
of them was the business side and the other side
was becoming an educator in English with an English
degree. And like you said, it doesn't mean you
necessarily become a teacher if you're an English
teacher, if you're an English major. So tell
us how it impacted your life then, Dwayne. So
I think the I mean, I think of this in like four
different ways. So I think way number one was
that it is okay to not know, right? That the
uncertainty of life was important. The uncertainty
of this may have to take a risk in order to do
something. I have to do something that everybody
might not think is the most popular or the right
thing to do. Like definitely impacted my life.
both negative and positive ways, right? So, you
know, like, hey, I'm gonna take a stand. Like,
I'm gonna take a stand. I'm gonna take a principal
stand on something. And I've, you know, definitely
felt the consequences of standing on principles
in a lot of different ways in my life. But in
that moment, it's the idea of knowing and not
knowing, and then being aware of your knowing
and not knowing. Two, it's like... Follow your
passion like it's a bit of like if it's something
that you enjoy doing that you gain joy from You
can hopefully find a way to do that thing it
not become cumbersome You know that you can continue
that thing and maybe you could do it in some
way shape or form for a professional career but
that it always stays with you. And definitely
like my love of literature, my love of reading,
my love of story has transferred in some cases
to theater and the movies and the TV shows. But
it's rooted in this idea that stories matter
to me and that everybody's humanity and stories
matter to me. And we see people's humanity in
their stories and knowing their story, talking
to people. Getting to know them, getting to understand
them, building community with them. Like that's
how we build it. We build it through the telling
the story. We build it through sharing information
with each other in that way. I think the third
thing I ended up becoming an English teacher
and in becoming an English teacher, what I didn't
necessarily want to do was transfer my love of
certain texts. But what I wanted to transfer
was the skillset that I thought it gave me that
ultimately, interesting enough, people in business
find valuable, right? He's, oh, this person can
tell stories. Oh, this person can like very quickly
summarize, synthesize, and move us to a different
point in discussion and direction, like very
quickly, right? And that comes from lots of coffee
time discussions, classroom chats. things that
I learned from young people, things that young
people would learn from me being in the community
with other people and learning those things.
And so the idea that the skill set that I got
was kind of transferable in that way. I'm using
that terminology because what's interesting about
it in reflection and telling this story is that
the thing that I turned out to be good at, other
people think I'm good at too. And I just happened
to have this very circuitous route in order to
get there, in order to say in that moment, I'm
going to make this decision to do this thing
and not do this other thing. And I think, lastly,
it's what I try to transfer to young people as
an educator. And you say teacher educator, this
is my 26th year in education. And it's respecting
young people who don't know and trying to transmit
to them that it's OK to do what you don't know.
it's perfectly fine to not know that there's
a lot of things in your life that you're not
going to be sure of and that you need to think
about them and consider them. But if you're not
sure, that's okay. That you can kind of fight
against the tide of a group of people who are
very happy and wanting to chart out their life
in a way and have goals and set those goals.
And that's a great thing for them, but that's
not for everybody. And that some young people
are still trying to figure it out. And I say
young people mean anybody not in the ground,
not still in this earthly plane. We are still
trying to figure things out. And I joke with
people and that's my last two points. I joke
with people. I joke with people saying I still
don't know what I do when I grow up and I have
a grown person that goes to college that lives
in my house and that when I figure it out, I'll
let everybody know, right? I'll let everybody
know. And I always ended many of my classes probably
in the last 15 years that I've taught by saying,
thank you for participating in the grand experiment
of education. Because if you were here with me
and we tried to figure something out together
and I tried to teach something or we tried to
have a conversation to try to unlock something
in your brain, I want to thank people for being
there, but I also want to let them know. There's
not one way to do it. We're all experimenting
and trying things out. And I know that moment,
that inroads moment, that internship moment,
kind of impacts how I think about all those things
in that way. I love it. It's easy for me to say,
because I identify with everything you say. I'm
like, yes, I'm with you, yes. And I think you
really hit it where you say, you got to let these
young people. Feel it either way, you know if
a kid says I know what I want to be then you
say great Congratulations, you know, but as you've
articulated I mean I'm 65 and I still can't wait
to figure out what I want to be when I grow up
So you hit it. Thank you so much Dwayne. I Love
talking with you because again was sort of kindred
spirits and in the the love of the bigger picture
It's not really, you know, it's not English per
se. It's that's the storytelling. It's you know
that the world It actually needs us. The business
world needs us. They know it. Everybody uses
it. They say the number one major for CEOs is
English majors. They've done studies on it. So
it's not like the business community has a corner
on it. But anyway, I'm not trying to push for
our discipline. I just enjoy having you on the
show, hearing your story. Thank you very much.
Happy post -Thanksgiving. Thank you, Jay. Great
to be here with you. And you never know who you
meet along the way. who turns into a person that
you can always go back to and have these conversations
with. And I met you in a moment where I was trying
to make similar decisions, like, you know, and
the road diverged again and again and again.
And you look at my, you look at my resume, you
can tell like this guy moved around a lot. But
really I moved around because I wanted to always
try to do something interesting. I wanted to
always try to move to something that might be
more challenging to me and teaching. is always
challenging, and circumstances are always kind
of nuanced. But when we crossed paths many years
ago, it was brief, and then it was long, and
we're still connected. So I appreciate you and
all that you do as well. All right. Thanks, Dwight.
You're sort of my... alternative what might have
been because you definitely you know have done
an incredible amount of different things and
I appreciate having on the show hearing your
insights that it's a profound understanding of
people and I hope people really kind of get that
out of this is that a kid says I'm not sure it
doesn't make no it's like Badger him until he
figures it out. Let him have a lifetime of not
necessarily floating around, but searching, picking
things up, saying, do I want to do this? Do I
not? But anyway, it's wonder. It's wonder. It's
wonder. It's what school can do for you and to
you is it can open doors for you and it can give
you the idea of what's possible. Right. And what
we kind of. school out of young people is we
school them out of like wonder. We want them
to know what they want to do. We want them to
be secure in that. We want them to then seek
this, you know, kind of put the steps in order
in order to get to. some perceived end goal of
something. And we just don't live in a world
where that applies as much as it does anymore.
And that is probably better to encourage young
people to be curious, to be critical, and to
consider all the possibilities and all the possible
options. And to do that in what we hope the education
provides is a safe environment to do so, like
a risk. You can take some risks and still have
a safety net. You can take some risks, even with
some ideas and kind of work them out and think
them out and talk them out with people who are
willing to listen to you because you might get
into another circumstance where nobody wants
to hear what you got to say. But I want to hear
what you got to say. I want to hear what you
want to write. How do we do that in informal
education and in families and communities across,
across, you know, again. for all young people,
meaning all people still sentient beings alive.
Thank you so much. I want to thank Dwayne Davis
for coming on the show. I want to thank all of
you, all the sentient beings who are above ground
who are listening to us today. I want to thank
our sponsors, Sidelining Publishing. Publishers
of quality books, including Susan Salador's One
Little Act of Kindness, which is perfect for
the holiday season, encourages young people to
be kind to one another. And also, LaughSaver
.com. Visit LaughSaver .com and record your laughter.
We'll keep it for you, now and forever. It's
free, and your grandchildren, and your great
-grandchildren, and your great -great -grandchildren
will appreciate it. That's LaughSaver .com. Alright!
Well, I'm going to end this show, as I often
do, with Susan Salador's classic, One Little
Act of Kindness. This is Jay Reheck asking you
all to stay safe out there and try not to hurt
anybody. One little act of kindness can go a
long, long way. Two little acts of kindness can
brighten anyone's day Three little acts of kindness
can make a beautiful sound Many acts of kindness
help the world go round One little loving word
can go a long, long way Can brighten anyone's
day Three little loving words Can make a beautiful
sound Many loving words Help the world go round
One little seed sown Can go a long, long way
Two little seed sown Can brighten anyone's day
Three little seeds so Can make a beautiful sound
Many seeds so Help the world go around One little
child's laughter Can go a long, long way Two
little children's laughter Can brighten anyone's
day Three little children's laughter Can make
a beautiful sound Many children laughing Help
the world go round And many see its own Help
the world go round and many acts of kindness
help the