Ever get the feeling that some problems just keep coming back
no matter how hard we try to fix them?
Oh yeah.
Well, you're not alone.
Today, we're diving deep into wicked problems.
Okay.
Think climate change, poverty, or healthcare.
The kind of messy, tangled issues
that just make you wanna throw your hands up in defeat.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Absolutely.
What's so fascinating about these problems,
if they really turn our usual problem-solving strategies
on their head.
Right.
Like puzzles with pieces that constantly change shape.
Oh wow.
And where the solution in one corner
might just make things worse in another.
Oh, that's a good analogy.
Yeah.
Okay, so no easy fixes here.
No.
But before we get lost in the weeds,
let's get a handle on what makes these problems so wicked
in the first place.
Right.
We're using a great article from hackscience.education
as our guide.
Okay.
Actively titled, Solving Wicked Problems.
Catchy.
I know, right?
Yeah.
The article goes back to the work of Rital and Weber.
Who?
Back in the 70s.
Wow, that's a while ago.
Yeah.
They kind of laid out some key characteristics
of these wicked problems.
Hmm.
First off, they're incredibly difficult to define.
Okay.
Everyone sees them differently depending on their own
experiences and priorities.
Right.
It's like trying to herd cats.
Oh, I love that.
Everyone has a different idea of what the problem actually is.
Yeah, that makes sense.
Yeah.
So no simple checklist to work from.
Not a chance.
That definitely throws a wrench in the work.
Exactly.
And to make matters worse, wicked problems are all tangled up
with each other.
Oh, yeah.
You pull on one thread and suddenly you're unraveling
something completely different over there.
It's true.
Take traffic congestion.
Okay.
You build more roads to ease the flow.
Right.
But then more people start driving because it's easier.
And you end up right back where you started.
Yep.
Classic wicked problem.
Oh, that whack-a-mole effect is so frustrating.
I know.
It almost makes you wonder if there's any point in trying
to solve these problems at all.
Well, that's another tricky thing about wicked problems.
What's that?
There's no clear finish line.
Oh, no.
You never really know for sure if you've truly
solved the problem because things are constantly changing.
I see what you mean.
Yeah.
Like think about something like crime prevention.
OK.
You might reduce crime rates in one area.
Right.
But then new criminal activities emerge.
Or shift to another location.
Oh, wow.
It's a constant game of adaptation.
Oh, OK.
I'm starting to see why they're called wicked.
Yeah.
But this feels a bit abstract.
Sure.
Can you give me a real world example of how this plays out?
Let's see.
Like something people can really relate to.
OK.
Imagine you're trying to improve access to health care.
Right.
Seems pretty straightforward, right?
Yeah.
On the surface.
But then you realize that some people can't afford insurance.
Others live miles from the nearest hospital.
Yeah, that's a problem.
And some distrust the medical system entirely.
It's true.
It's not just about building more hospitals.
Right.
It's about tackling a whole web of social and economic issues.
Oh, wow.
That are deeply intertwined with health care access.
Yeah.
So instead of one right answer, there's
a whole spectrum of potential solutions.
Exactly.
Each with its own set of trade-offs
and unintended consequences.
For sure.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
And that's where our traditional linear approach
to problem solving kind of breaks down.
OK.
We're so used to tackling problems in a step-by-step way.
Right.
Identify the problem.
Find the solution.
Implement it.
Yep.
And move on.
I see.
But with wicked problems, it's more
like navigating a maze blindfolded.
Oh, that sounds tough.
It is.
OK.
I'm starting to understand why our old playbook doesn't
work here.
Right.
But what does a wicked approach to problem solving
actually look like?
Well, the article actually provides a great visual
representation of this difference.
OK.
They compare the linear approach to a neat flow
chart with a straight line from problem to solution.
Got it.
But when it comes to tackling a wicked problem,
the visual is more like a tangled web
with arrows going every which way.
Oh, that's a great image.
Yeah.
So it's less about finding the perfect solution
and more about adapting and navigating the complexity.
You got it.
OK.
And that brings us to one of the most important ingredients
in tackling wicked problems.
OK.
What's that?
Diversity of thought.
Diversity.
Yeah.
I can see how that's important for social issues.
But does it really apply to all wicked problems?
Absolutely.
You see different groups experience the problem
in completely different ways.
That's true.
What might seem like a great solution to one person.
Right.
Could be totally impractical or even harmful to another.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
The article highlights how the internet,
instead of creating a homogeneous global culture,
has actually led to a surge in niche communities.
That's true.
And that means that solutions need to be even more nuanced.
OK.
And tailored to specific contexts.
So it's not just about bringing a diverse group of people
to the table.
It's about actively seeking out those different viewpoints.
Yeah.
And really listening to what they have to say.
Exactly.
Yeah.
That's important.
It's about recognizing that there's
no single expert who has all the answers.
We need to be open to learning from people
with different backgrounds.
OK.
Experiences and perspectives.
I get it.
It's like that old saying.
What's that?
If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.
I love that.
We need a whole toolbox of approaches and perspectives
if we're going to tackle these wicked problems effectively.
Right.
Speaking of tools.
Yeah.
Are there any specific strategies or frameworks
that can help us navigate this messy terrain?
The article dives into a few fascinating concepts.
OK.
That's your.
One that stands out is the idea of generalists.
Generalists.
Interesting.
And before you think it's just about jack-of-all-trades types.
OK.
Hear me out.
OK.
I'm all ears.
Tell me more about these generalists.
Right.
So we've established that wicked problems demand
a whole new way of thinking.
Right.
We need to ditch the linear step-by-step approach.
Yeah.
And embrace the messy, iterative reality of these challenges.
Exactly.
And diversity of thought is key.
Yeah.
Right?
Absolutely.
We need those varied perspectives
to even begin to understand the problem, let alone solve it.
You got it.
OK.
But sometimes it feels like just gathering those perspectives
I ask the problem.
Oh, yeah.
Especially with something as big and complex as, say, climate
change.
I see.
Where do you even start when everyone
has a different opinion on what needs to be done?
Well, the article doesn't explicitly dive into this.
OK.
But I think the concept of systems thinking
is super relevant here.
Systems thinking.
I've heard that phrase.
OK.
But to be honest, it always sounded a bit jargon-y to me.
I hear you.
What does it actually mean in practical terms?
Well, it's all about recognizing the interconnectedness
of things.
OK.
Instead of focusing on isolated problems.
Right.
You look at the bigger picture, the whole system.
OK.
And try to understand how different parts interact
and influence each other.
So kind of like a spiderweb.
Yes.
Tug on one strand and the whole thing vibrates.
Exactly.
Oh, I like that.
Yeah.
And this is crucial when dealing with wicked problems.
OK.
Because they often stem from complex systemic issues.
That makes sense.
Like think about homelessness, for example.
OK.
It's not just about a lack of affordable housing.
Right.
It's connected to mental health services.
Yeah.
Addiction support, job opportunities, social safety
nets, a whole web of interconnected factors.
So you're saying that to tackle a wicked problem
effectively, you can't just treat the symptoms.
That's right.
You have to zoom out and address the root causes
within the system itself.
For sales.
OK.
I'm with you.
And this requires a real shift in mindset.
How so?
We're so used to looking for quick fixes
or pointing fingers at individuals.
Yeah.
That's human nature, right?
It is.
But with wicked problems, we need
to start thinking in terms of long-term systemic solutions.
Exactly.
OK.
I'm getting it.
Good.
But honestly, it's also a little overwhelming.
I hear you.
I mean, it's easy to feel paralyzed by the sheer complexity
of these problems.
Sure.
Where do you even begin to untangle that web?
Well, and that's the thing about wicked problems.
What is?
There is no easy answer.
Oh, no.
No one-size-fits-all solution.
So are we doomed?
No.
Not at all.
OK.
But the article provides some really valuable insights
that can guide our thinking and actions.
OK.
Give me something to hold onto here.
What are some key takeaways that our listeners
can apply to their own lives?
OK.
Even if they're not tackling global issues
like climate change or poverty?
Well, one of the biggest takeaways for me
is that we need to become more comfortable
with ambiguity and uncertainty.
Ambiguity and uncertainty.
Yeah.
Oh, that is tough.
I know.
I'm definitely someone who likes to have a plan
and know where I'm going.
I get it.
But you're saying we can't always
have that with these wicked problems.
Right.
We're conditioned to seek certainty and control.
Yeah.
But learning to embrace the unknown
and adapt to changing circumstances.
OK.
That's essential for navigating these complex challenges.
All right.
Deep breaths, embracing the unknown.
Yeah.
Anything else?
Another key takeaway.
OK.
Is the importance of collaboration and co-creation.
Collaboration and co-creation?
Yes.
How so?
Wicked problems are too big and complex for any one person
or organization to solve alone.
Oh, yeah.
I can see that.
We need to bring together diverse perspectives.
OK.
And work together to find solutions that benefit
everyone's involved.
That makes sense.
Right.
Goes back to that idea of diversity being essential.
Right?
Exactly.
We need all those different viewpoints and experiences
to come up with solutions that actually work.
Absolutely.
And it's not just about finding common ground
or compromising.
It's about actively seeking out and learning
from those who have different experiences and perspectives
than our own.
Yeah.
That can be hard sometimes.
I know.
So being open to having our assumptions challenged,
even if it makes us uncomfortable.
That's the key.
Yeah.
Because sometimes the most innovative and effective
solutions come from unexpected places.
OK.
This is all starting to click.
Yeah.
But is there anything specific in the article
that speaks to this idea of collaboration and co-creation?
Hmm.
Let me think.
Any tools or frameworks we can use?
Actually, the article highlights two fascinating approaches.
OK.
I'm listening.
Herminotic thinking.
Yes.
And naturalistic inquiry.
Wow.
This sounds a bit academic.
They do.
But I'm intrigued.
Bear with me.
OK.
They have some really powerful applications
for everyday problem solving.
All right.
Let's unpack these.
OK.
Herminotic thinking.
What's that all about?
It's about understanding the relationship
between the parts and the whole.
It's a constant back and forth cycle
of refining your interpretation as you learn more.
So you're constantly going deeper.
Yeah.
Think about reading a complex novel.
Right.
You start with one understanding of a character.
Right.
But as you read on.
Yeah.
Your interpretation changes based on new information
and context.
So it's about constantly revising your understanding
as you go.
Right.
Not being afraid to change your mind when
you encounter new information.
Exactly.
OK.
That's interesting.
And naturalistic inquiry takes this a step further.
OK.
I have so.
It acknowledges that reality is subjective
and influenced by our perspective.
Perspective reality.
Yeah.
It encourages us to consider multiple sources of data.
OK.
And to be aware of our own biases and assumptions
as we try to make sense of the world.
So recognizing that there's no single objective truth,
especially when it comes to wicked problems.
Precisely.
Hmm.
What we perceive as reality.
Yeah.
Is shaped by our own experiences, beliefs, and values.
Right.
And that means we need to actively seek out
different perspectives.
OK.
To get a more complete picture of the problem.
This is blowing my mind a little bit.
Really?
I'm starting to see how these concepts can apply even
outside of these big, wicked problems.
I know, right?
Like how often do we get stuck in our own ways of seeing things
and fail to consider other viewpoints?
All the time.
It's so true.
And naturalistic inquiry reminds us to step back and ask.
What's that?
What am I missing?
What are the perspectives might be out there?
OK.
I'm starting to feel a bit more equipped to tackle
these wicked problems.
Yeah.
But before we wrap up, I'm curious about something.
Who is that?
The article mentions that wicked problems don't have right
answers.
Yeah.
But does that mean there are NO general principles
or strategies that can help us address them?
Interesting question.
Or can we still learn from each other's experiences
and develop frameworks for tackling the wickedness
itself?
That is a fantastic question.
It's something I've been wondering about.
And it's one that we'll explore further in the final part
of this deep dive.
OK, I can't wait.
So stay tuned, folks, because we're
about to get really meta.
All right, so we've spent the last part of this deep dive
really getting into wicked problems.
Yeah.
Those messy, interconnected challenges
that just seem to defy all our usual problem
solving tactics.
And honestly, it's been a bit of a mind-bending journey
so far.
It definitely is not your typical problem solving workshop.
I'll say.
But I think it's important to get comfortable
with that discomfort.
Yeah, why is that?
Well, because these wicked problems are all around us.
That's true.
You know?
Yeah.
And at the end of the last part, you
posed a really thought-provoking question.
Oh, OK.
If wicked problems don't have right answers,
does that mean we're just flailing in the dark
every time we face one?
Can we really learn anything from past experiences?
Good question.
Or are we doomed to reinvent the wheel each time?
It's a question that's been debated for decades.
And to be honest, there's no easy answer.
OK.
You know, every wicked problem is unique
and deeply embedded in its context.
But that doesn't mean we're completely helpless.
Oh, OK.
I'm ready for some hope here.
All right.
What can we do?
Well, while there may not be a single universal solution
to wickedness, there are certain frameworks and approaches
that can help us navigate these complex challenges
more effectively.
Give me an example.
OK.
What kind of frameworks are we talking about?
One that comes to mind is design thinking.
Design thinking.
It's a human-centered approach.
All right.
That emphasizes empathy, experimentation, and iteration.
Empathy, experimentation, and iteration.
Yes.
I've heard of design thinking being used for things
like product development.
But how does that apply to solving something
as massive as, say, global poverty?
It's actually a surprisingly good fit.
Really?
Yeah.
Design thinking encourages us to start.
OK.
By deeply understanding the needs and perspectives
of the people affected by the problem.
So instead of coming up with solutions in a vacuum,
you're actually going out and talking to the people who
are experiencing the problem firsthand.
Exactly.
That's a good idea.
And it's not just about gathering data or conducting
surveys.
It's about truly empathizing with people's experiences,
understanding their motivations, and identifying
their unmet needs.
That sounds a lot like what we were talking about earlier
with naturalistic inquiry.
Yeah.
Acknowledging that everyone's reality
is shaped by their own experiences and perspectives.
You're right.
There's definitely some overlap there.
There is.
And just like naturalistic inquiry, design thinking
encourages us to embrace experimentation and iteration.
Exactly.
So it's about acknowledging that we're probably not
going to get it right on the first try.
Right.
But we can learn from our mistakes.
Yep.
And adjust our approach along the way.
That's the key.
I like that.
There's no expectation of finding the perfect solution
right out of the gate.
The magic is in the willingness to try things out.
OK.
See what works.
Yeah.
And continuously refine the approach.
Right.
Based on real world feedback.
This is starting to sound less intimidating
and more like something we can actually wrap our heads around.
That's the goal.
What other frameworks can help us untangle
these wicked problems.
Another one I find helpful is adaptive leadership.
Adaptive leadership.
Yeah.
OK.
It's a leadership style that recognizes
that complex challenges.
Right.
Often require adaptive change.
Not just technical solutions.
I think I need a bit more explanation on that one.
Sure.
What's the difference between adaptive change
and a technical solution.
Think of it this way.
OK.
Technical problems are those that can be solved
with existing knowledge and expertise.
OK.
Like fixing a broken engine or building a bridge.
All right.
I get it.
You have a clear set of steps.
Uh-huh.
And you know what the outcome should be.
Right.
Adaptive challenges on the other hand.
Yeah.
Require us to change our beliefs, values, or behaviors
to address the problem.
Oh wow.
So it's more about changing ourselves.
In a way.
Yeah.
So it's about challenging the status quo.
Being willing to rethink the way things are done.
Exactly.
And embracing new ways of working together.
You got it.
OK.
And adaptive leaders play a crucial role in this process.
Oh so.
They create space for dialogue.
Right.
Encourage experimentation.
Uh-huh.
And empower people to take ownership of the solution.
OK.
I'm seeing how these frameworks can be helpful.
Yeah.
But are there any limitations to them?
Hmm.
That's a good question.
Can they really make a dent in solving
the world's most pressing problems?
It's important to be realistic.
OK.
No framework is a magic bullet.
Right.
And there's no guarantee that any approach will completely
solve these incredibly complex problems.
So it's not about finding a silver bullet.
Right.
But about equipping ourselves with the right tools
and mindset.
Yeah.
To approach these problems in a more effective way.
Exactly.
And that's where these frameworks can be incredibly valuable.
I see.
They help us think more systematically,
collaborate more effectively.
Right.
And tap into our creativity to find
new and innovative approaches to these wicked problems.
This has been an incredibly insightful deep dive.
It has been.
We've learned so much about the nature of wicked problems.
Our traditional ways of thinking fall short.
Yeah.
And how we can equip ourselves with new approaches
to make a real difference.
It's been a pleasure diving up with you.
The feeling is mutual.
And remember, even though these problems
may feel overwhelming, we're not powerless in the face of them.
That's good to remember.
We all have the potential to be part of the solution.
Absolutely.
So to our listeners, I hope this deep dive has empowered you
to see wicked problems, not as insurmountable obstacles,
but as opportunities for creative problem solving
and collaborative action.
Well said.
Keep asking tough questions.
Yes.
Stay curious and never underestimate
the power of collective action.
Wise words.
And on that note, we'll wrap up this episode of the deep dive.
OK.
A huge thanks to our expert for joining us today.
Thank you for having me.
And to our listeners for taking this journey with us.
Yeah.
Thanks, everyone.
Until next time, keep diving deep.
All right, we're back for the final part of our deep dive
into wicked problems.
Those messy, interconnected challenges
that just love to keep us on our toes.
Right.
We've covered a lot of ground so far.
We have.
But I think it's time to circle back
to that thought-provoking question you left us with
at the end of the last part.
OK, shoot.
If wicked problems don't have right answers,
does that mean we're basically just throwing darts
in the dark every time we try to address one?
You can definitely feel that way sometimes.
Yeah, like, are we really able to learn anything
from past experiences with these problems?
Uh-huh.
Or are we just destined to start from scratch
with each new wicked problem that comes along?
That's a tough question.
Yeah, no kidding.
And honestly, there's no simple answer.
OK.
I mean, every wicked problem is so unique.
Right.
And so deeply rooted in its specific context.
Uh-huh.
So it's not like we can just pull out a cookie cutter solution.
Yeah, that would be nice, though, wouldn't it?
It would.
But that doesn't mean that we're completely helpless, right?
Definitely not.
OK.
I'm all ears.
So while there may not be a universal solution
to wicked problems, there are definitely
some helpful frameworks and approaches out there
that can help us navigate these complex challenges
more effectively.
I like the sound of that.
Yeah.
So what kind of frameworks are we talking about here?
Well, one that comes to mind is design thinking.
Design thinking?
Yeah, it's really cool, actually.
OK, tell me more.
So it's a human-centered approach.
You're right.
That really emphasizes empathy experimentation and iteration.
Empathy experimentation and iteration.
Yep, those are the key ingredients.
I've heard of design thinking being used in product
development and stuff.
But how does that apply to tackling something
as massive as global poverty?
It's a great question.
Yeah.
But design thinking can actually
be a surprisingly good fit for those kinds of wicked problems.
Really?
Yeah.
It encourages us to start by really deeply understanding
the needs and perspectives of the people who are actually
being affected by the problem.
OK, so instead of just sitting in a room brainstorming
solutions, you're actually going out
and talking to the people who are living with the problem
every day.
Exactly.
That makes a lot of sense.
Yeah, and it goes beyond just gathering data
or conducting surveys.
Oh, OK.
It's about truly empathizing with their experiences,
understanding their motivations, and then
figuring out what their unmet needs are.
That sounds a lot like what we were discussing earlier
with naturalistic inquiry.
It does, doesn't it?
Recognizing that everyone's reality
is shaped by their own unique experiences and perspectives?
Absolutely.
So there's definitely some overlap there.
There is, for sure.
So with design thinking, it's not
about coming up with the perfect solution right off the bat.
It's more about being willing to experiment and try things out,
learn from what works and what doesn't,
and then keep iterating and refining your approach based
on that real world feedback.
That's the beauty of it.
I'm starting to see how this could be a really powerful tool
for tackling wicked problems.
It is.
So what other frameworks can help us unravel
these messy challenges?
Another one that's really helpful is adaptive leadership.
Adaptive leadership.
Yeah.
Have you heard of it?
It rings a bell, but I think I need a little refresher.
Sure.
What is adaptive leadership all about?
It's a leadership style that recognizes that sometimes the
best way to tackle a complex challenge isn't
by finding a quick technical fix.
Oh, interesting.
It's about realizing that sometimes we
need to make deeper changes.
Like what kind of changes?
Sometimes we need to actually change our own beliefs, values,
or behaviors.
Wow.
So it's about more than just finding the right solution.
It is.
It's about being willing to change ourselves in the process.
You got it.
OK.
That's a powerful idea.
Yeah.
And adaptive leaders can play a really important role in this.
How so?
Well, they're the ones who create space for open dialogue
and honest conversations.
Right.
They encourage experimentation and taking risks.
OK.
And they really empower people to step up and take ownership
of finding solutions.
It sounds like adaptive leadership
is all about creating the right conditions for change
to happen.
It is.
Both within ourselves and within our systems.
Exactly.
So we've got design thinking and adaptive leadership.
Yep.
Two powerful frameworks.
They sound really promising.
They are.
But can they really make a difference
when it comes to solving these massive global challenges?
That's the million dollar question, isn't it?
Yeah.
And it's important to be realistic.
OK.
Like I said earlier, there's no magic bullet for wicked problems.
Right.
And no framework is going to single-handedly solve
climate change or world hunger.
So it's not about finding that one perfect solution.
Right.
It's more about equipping ourselves
with the right tools and the right mindset.
Exactly.
To approach these complex challenges in a more effective
and maybe a more hopeful way.
I think that's a great way to put it.
Well, this has been a truly fascinating deep dive.
And I think.
We've learned so much about what makes
wicked problems so wicked.
Yeah.
How our usual ways of thinking often fall short.
And most importantly, how we can start to shift our thinking.
Yeah.
And find new and more creative ways
to tackle these challenges together.
I've really enjoyed diving into this with you.
The feeling is mutual.
And I hope our listeners are walking away
with a sense of hope and maybe even a little bit of excitement.
Yeah, me too.
Because even though wicked problems can feel overwhelming.
They can.
And we're not powerless in the face of them.
Absolutely not.
We all have a role to play in finding solutions.
So to our listeners out there, I hope this deep dive has left
you feeling a little more empowered.
And a little less intimidated by the wicked problems
that we all face.
That's the goal.
Keep those questions coming.
Keep that curiosity alive.
And never underestimate the power of working together
to make a difference.
Well, I'll cut.
And on that note, we'll wrap up this episode of the deep dive.
It's been a pleasure.
A huge thanks to our expert for sharing your wisdom with us
today.
Thank you for having me.
And of course, to our amazing listeners
for joining us on this journey.
Yeah, thanks, everyone.
Until next time, keep diving deep.