1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,880 You know, it seems like schools are always trying to get better, 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,160 you know, like always rolling out some new thing, 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,000 trying to find that like magic solution, right? 4 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:09,840 Right? 5 00:00:09,840 --> 00:00:10,960 Like how do we boost test scores 6 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:12,760 or how do we get kids more engaged? 7 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:14,640 Yeah, that's a great point. 8 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,520 But what if instead of just like chasing the next trend, 9 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:18,740 Yeah. 10 00:00:18,740 --> 00:00:21,840 There was a better way to kind of plan for change, 11 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:24,320 you know, more thoughtfully. 12 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:26,480 Like an architect would like design a building. 13 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,320 Yeah, I think that's a really good analogy 14 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:29,160 because you're right. 15 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:30,000 Okay. 16 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:33,120 Schools a lot of times fall back on these same planning methods 17 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:35,480 that don't really work, right? 18 00:00:35,480 --> 00:00:36,880 For the complexity of a classroom. 19 00:00:36,880 --> 00:00:38,480 Yeah, they're not really designed for that, are they? 20 00:00:38,480 --> 00:00:40,760 And that's really where educational design research 21 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:41,920 or EDR comes in. 22 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:42,960 EDR. 23 00:00:42,960 --> 00:00:43,800 Okay. 24 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:44,640 I'm intrigued. 25 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:45,480 Tell me more. 26 00:00:45,480 --> 00:00:46,300 Sure. 27 00:00:46,300 --> 00:00:48,440 So for this deep dive, we're actually looking at an excerpt 28 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,800 from a blog called hackscience.education. 29 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:52,640 Okay. 30 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:53,600 There's an article there called 31 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:57,240 Educational Design Research, an Emerging Planning Tool. 32 00:00:57,240 --> 00:00:58,080 Okay. 33 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:00,720 It was posted on December 11th, 2017 34 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:04,040 and last updated on January 25th, 2025. 35 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:05,080 So it's pretty recent. 36 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:05,920 Brought you. 37 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,520 And they really dive into how school leaders 38 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:11,840 are looking for like a more sophisticated approach. 39 00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:12,680 Yeah. 40 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:13,880 Not just like a quick fix. 41 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:16,920 It's like the difference between putting a bandaid 42 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:20,880 on something and actually like treating the underlying cause. 43 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:22,080 Oh, that's a good way to put it. 44 00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:22,920 Yeah. 45 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:23,960 So traditional planning models, 46 00:01:23,960 --> 00:01:26,160 I think often miss that deeper level. 47 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:27,000 Okay. 48 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:27,840 So walk me through this. 49 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:31,960 What do those traditional planning models actually look like 50 00:01:31,960 --> 00:01:33,280 when you see them in a school? 51 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:34,120 Yeah. 52 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:35,720 And like where do they tend to go wrong? 53 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:37,440 Well, imagine a school that's struggling 54 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:40,360 with low student engagement in math. 55 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:41,200 Right. 56 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:43,040 A traditional approach might be to say, 57 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:45,200 okay, well we've identified the problem. 58 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,200 Let's implement a new curriculum. 59 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:48,040 Right. 60 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:49,520 Gather some data and see if it worked. 61 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:50,360 Right. 62 00:01:50,360 --> 00:01:52,640 If not, we just kind of tweak and repeat. 63 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:53,480 Yeah. 64 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:54,560 That makes sense on the surface. 65 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:55,400 Right. 66 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:58,000 Like the classic problem solution model. 67 00:01:58,000 --> 00:01:58,840 Yeah. 68 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:00,720 But I have a feeling you're gonna tell me there's a catch. 69 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:02,000 Yeah, there's a bit of a catch. 70 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:02,840 Oh no. 71 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:06,440 Because schools are not simple machines. 72 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:07,960 You can't just swap out a part 73 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:09,480 and expect it to work perfectly. 74 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:10,320 Right. 75 00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:11,640 There are so many different factors at play. 76 00:02:11,640 --> 00:02:12,480 Yeah. 77 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:13,640 Think about student backgrounds, 78 00:02:13,640 --> 00:02:16,800 teacher experience the culture of the school. 79 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,040 Even things happening outside of the school. 80 00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:19,880 Right. 81 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:23,120 Yeah, it's like that whole thing of like predicting the weather. 82 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:23,960 Yes. 83 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:26,160 There's so many factors influencing that outcome. 84 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:27,360 It's so complex. 85 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:28,200 Yeah. 86 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:29,040 Exactly. 87 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:32,160 And so that's why this really linear planning model 88 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:34,680 often falls short because it oversimplifies things 89 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:36,760 and doesn't really account for how all these factors 90 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:37,600 are connected. 91 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:38,440 Right. 92 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:39,280 So you just end up chasing symptoms 93 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:40,440 instead of really getting to that root cause. 94 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:41,280 Yeah. 95 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:42,120 Just putting band-aids on things. 96 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:42,960 Oh man. 97 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:43,800 Yeah. 98 00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:46,920 Okay, so EDR, this educational design research 99 00:02:46,920 --> 00:02:48,120 is about going deeper. 100 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:48,960 Yes. 101 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:51,360 They call it an emerging planning tool in this article. 102 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:52,200 Right. 103 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:53,040 What makes it so different? 104 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:56,120 Well, there are five key characteristics 105 00:02:56,120 --> 00:02:59,720 that really set EDR apart from those traditional models. 106 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:00,760 Five. 107 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:01,600 Okay. 108 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:02,440 Put it up late on me. 109 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:04,040 Okay, so first it's theoretically oriented. 110 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,880 And this means that it's grounded in existing research 111 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:09,600 and educational theory. 112 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:11,720 So you're not just like throwing things at the wall 113 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:12,800 and seeing what sticks? 114 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:14,000 No, you're not just guessing. 115 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:14,840 Okay, that's good. 116 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:16,920 There's a solid foundation of knowledge backing it up. 117 00:03:16,920 --> 00:03:17,760 Right. 118 00:03:17,760 --> 00:03:19,440 So there's a reason why you're doing what you're doing. 119 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:20,280 Exactly. 120 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:24,200 But EDR is also designed to help generate new knowledge. 121 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:25,040 Oh, okay. 122 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:26,280 It's about building on what we know 123 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:28,000 while also pushing the boundaries. 124 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:29,920 So you're not just taking existing solutions 125 00:03:29,920 --> 00:03:31,000 and applying them. 126 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:33,040 You're actually trying to discover new things too. 127 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:33,880 Exactly. 128 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:34,720 That's awesome. 129 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:37,120 Okay, so what else makes EDR stand out? 130 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:40,800 The second characteristic is that it's interventionist. 131 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:42,040 Interventionist, okay. 132 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:44,400 It's not just about coming up with theories. 133 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:48,800 It's about designing and implementing practical interventions. 134 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:49,640 Okay. 135 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:51,280 To improve teaching and learning. 136 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:52,880 So you're actually taking action. 137 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:55,200 You're making a difference in the real world. 138 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:57,560 Not just having these hypothetical conversations. 139 00:03:57,560 --> 00:03:59,440 Yeah, not just academic exercises. 140 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:00,280 Gotcha. 141 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:02,440 I can see how that would appeal to a lot of educators. 142 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:03,280 Right. 143 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:04,280 Because they want to see results. 144 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,760 Yeah, they want to see change in their classrooms. 145 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:07,720 Okay, number three. 146 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,560 So the third characteristic is that it's collaborative. 147 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:11,400 Okay. 148 00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:13,560 EDR recognizes that the best solutions come 149 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:15,800 from getting lots of different perspectives. 150 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:16,640 Makes sense. 151 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:19,000 So it involves teachers, administrators, 152 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:22,560 students, even parents sometimes in the process. 153 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:25,800 Oh wow, so it's really like getting everyone at the table. 154 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:26,640 Yeah. 155 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:27,680 To share their insights and experiences. 156 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:28,600 Like, exactly. 157 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:29,560 Cool, what about the last two? 158 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:31,320 Okay, so the fourth characteristic 159 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:33,040 is that it's naturalistic. 160 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:34,040 Naturalistic, okay. 161 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:37,120 This means that EDR takes place in real classrooms 162 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,480 with real students and teachers. 163 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:41,280 So it's not like you're doing it in a lab. 164 00:04:41,280 --> 00:04:42,120 Yeah. 165 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:44,480 You're actually observing and gathering information. 166 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:45,480 In the actual environment. 167 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:46,760 Right, where the learning is happening. 168 00:04:46,760 --> 00:04:47,600 That's right. 169 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:48,440 Okay, cool. 170 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:49,680 And the last one. 171 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:51,440 And finally, it's iterative. 172 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:52,280 Iterative. 173 00:04:52,280 --> 00:04:55,120 We don't just design a solution and say, okay, we're done. 174 00:04:55,120 --> 00:04:57,680 We test it, we refine it, we test it again, 175 00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,680 and we just keep going until we get it right. 176 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:01,840 So it's constantly being refined and improved. 177 00:05:01,840 --> 00:05:02,680 Yes. 178 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:04,440 There's no like set it and forget it solution. 179 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,320 Right, EDR acknowledges that learning 180 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,200 and teaching their dynamic, they're always changing. 181 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:11,040 Right. 182 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,480 And our approaches need to be flexible and adaptable too. 183 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:14,560 Okay, I like that. 184 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:15,400 Yeah. 185 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:16,880 It seems much more realistic. 186 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:17,720 Yeah. 187 00:05:17,720 --> 00:05:20,880 And responsive to how complex education is. 188 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:21,720 Right. 189 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,080 Now I'm curious about how all of this actually plays out 190 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:26,040 in a school. 191 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:26,880 Yeah. 192 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:28,960 The article mentions that these insights about EDR 193 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:30,840 were actually taken from a book called 194 00:05:30,840 --> 00:05:33,240 Efficacious Technology Management, 195 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:34,960 a guide for school leaders. 196 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:35,800 Oh, wow. 197 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:37,720 And it's available under Creative Commons. 198 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:38,560 Awesome. 199 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:40,760 I wonder if that book goes into some more specific examples. 200 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:41,600 I think it does. 201 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:42,440 Okay, cool, cool. 202 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:44,560 So we've talked about like the characteristics of EDR. 203 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:45,400 Yeah. 204 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:48,440 How does it actually work when you put it into practice 205 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:49,560 in a school setting? 206 00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:50,400 Yeah. 207 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:51,600 What are like the steps involved? 208 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:53,040 Well, you can kind of think of EDR 209 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:55,000 as like a three phase cycle. 210 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:55,840 Okay. 211 00:05:55,840 --> 00:05:58,600 The first phase is analysis or exploration. 212 00:05:58,600 --> 00:05:59,440 Okay. 213 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:00,600 Then there's design and construction 214 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,480 and then finally reflection and evaluation. 215 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:06,840 So each of those phases builds on the one before it. 216 00:06:06,840 --> 00:06:07,680 Right. 217 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:09,360 And that leads to like a deeper understanding 218 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:10,400 and better solutions. 219 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:11,240 Yeah. 220 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:12,640 I like to picture it as a spiral 221 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:14,280 that's constantly moving upwards. 222 00:06:14,280 --> 00:06:15,240 Oh, like that visual. 223 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:16,320 Okay, break it down for me. 224 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:17,160 Okay. 225 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:19,480 So let's say a school is having trouble getting teachers 226 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,640 to adopt a new learning platform. 227 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:22,480 Okay. 228 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:25,920 In that first phase analysis and exploration, 229 00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:28,280 they would really dig deep into the problem. 230 00:06:28,280 --> 00:06:29,120 Okay. 231 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:29,960 Not just looking at like, 232 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:30,840 oh, the adoption rate is low, 233 00:06:30,840 --> 00:06:34,120 but really trying to understand why are teachers hesitant? 234 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:34,960 Right. 235 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:35,800 So it's about understanding the why. 236 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:36,620 Yeah. 237 00:06:36,620 --> 00:06:37,460 What are their concerns? 238 00:06:37,460 --> 00:06:38,300 What are their needs? 239 00:06:38,300 --> 00:06:39,140 Not just the what? 240 00:06:39,140 --> 00:06:39,960 Exactly. 241 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,520 Once they have a good understanding of the why 242 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:44,040 behind the problem, 243 00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:46,840 then they can move on to that design and construction phase. 244 00:06:46,840 --> 00:06:47,680 Gotcha. 245 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:48,960 And here it's about brainstorming 246 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:50,440 and coming up with interventions 247 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:53,340 that address those specific challenges. 248 00:06:53,340 --> 00:06:54,600 So like if teachers are worried 249 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,400 about the platform being too time consuming, 250 00:06:57,400 --> 00:06:59,680 maybe the intervention would focus on 251 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:01,280 like making the workflows better. 252 00:07:01,280 --> 00:07:02,120 Yes. 253 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:02,960 Or giving them more support. 254 00:07:02,960 --> 00:07:03,800 Exactly. 255 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:06,560 And this is where that collaboration piece is so important. 256 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:07,400 Yeah. 257 00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:09,600 The design team might include teachers, 258 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:13,240 tech specialists, instructional coaches, even students. 259 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:14,000 Wow. 260 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:15,840 The goal is to create solutions 261 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:17,960 that are really practical and relevant 262 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:20,160 and tailored to the needs of that school. 263 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:22,000 This is where it starts to feel really different 264 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:24,120 from that like top down way of planning. 265 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:24,960 Yes. 266 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:25,800 Yeah. 267 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:26,640 Very different. 268 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:27,480 Okay. 269 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:29,080 And it's important to remember that EDR is iterative. 270 00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:29,920 Right. 271 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:32,800 So designing construction is not just like a one time thing. 272 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:33,640 Okay. 273 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:36,080 It's about ongoing experimentation 274 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:38,840 and refining based on what's working and what's not. 275 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,120 So it's not about finding that perfect solution right away. 276 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:41,960 Right. 277 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:42,920 It's more about creating something 278 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:44,800 that can change and adapt over time. 279 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:45,640 Exactly. 280 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:46,480 Okay. 281 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:47,720 And that brings us to that final phase, 282 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:49,760 that reflection and evaluation phase. 283 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:50,600 Okay. 284 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:51,480 This is where the school really looks 285 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:53,400 at the impact of those interventions. 286 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:56,000 So like did that adoption rate actually go up? 287 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:56,840 Yeah. 288 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,920 Did teachers feel more confident using the new platform? 289 00:07:59,920 --> 00:08:00,760 Did it work? 290 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:01,600 Yeah. 291 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:02,440 Why or why not? 292 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:03,280 Yeah. 293 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:04,120 And that's it. 294 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:04,940 So you can take all that data and use it 295 00:08:04,940 --> 00:08:05,780 to keep improving the design. 296 00:08:05,780 --> 00:08:06,800 Exactly. 297 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,080 But it sounds like it's also about understanding 298 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:11,600 the reasons behind the results. 299 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:12,440 It is. 300 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:13,280 It worked well. 301 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:14,720 What could be better? 302 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:17,360 What new things did we learn about our teachers, 303 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:19,960 our students and like our whole school 304 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:21,040 as a learning organization? 305 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:21,880 That's right. 306 00:08:21,880 --> 00:08:24,080 It's about getting that deeper understanding. 307 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:25,080 This is fascinating. 308 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:25,920 Yeah. 309 00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:29,240 We're really starting to see how much deeper EDR is 310 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:31,000 compared to traditional planning. 311 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:32,040 I think so. 312 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:33,520 It's like you're not just solving the problem. 313 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:36,120 You're actually learning more about the whole system. 314 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:38,400 You're becoming a learning organization. 315 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:39,240 Yes. 316 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:41,540 Is there anything about EDR 317 00:08:41,540 --> 00:08:43,720 that might surprise our listeners? 318 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:45,760 Something that might challenge their assumptions 319 00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:48,360 about how change happens in schools? 320 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,320 Well, one thing that I think often surprises people 321 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:53,600 is the role of emergence in EDR. 322 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:54,600 Emergence, okay. 323 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:56,320 Even though it's a structured approach, 324 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:58,200 it's also incredibly flexible. 325 00:08:58,200 --> 00:08:59,040 Okay. 326 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:00,520 Sometimes the best solutions are not the ones 327 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:01,560 that you plan for. 328 00:09:01,560 --> 00:09:04,200 They kind of emerge organically through that process 329 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:06,240 of experimenting and refining. 330 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:08,440 So you're saying that there's this element of discovery. 331 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:09,280 Yeah. 332 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:10,440 Of like letting go a little bit 333 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:11,360 and seeing what happens? 334 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:12,200 Yeah. 335 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:13,200 Embracing the unexpected. 336 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:14,040 Okay. 337 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:17,240 EDR is about acknowledging that complexity. 338 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:18,960 Not oversimplifying it. 339 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:21,080 And being open to that journey of discovery. 340 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:22,080 Exactly. 341 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:22,920 I love that. 342 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:23,760 Yeah. 343 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:26,000 It feels much more like how learning really happens. 344 00:09:26,000 --> 00:09:26,840 It does. 345 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:27,660 Okay. 346 00:09:27,660 --> 00:09:28,500 But I have to ask. 347 00:09:28,500 --> 00:09:29,480 Yeah. 348 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:32,520 All this sounds great for people who work in education. 349 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:33,400 Right. 350 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:35,640 But why should our listeners 351 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:38,360 who might not work in a school care about EDR? 352 00:09:38,360 --> 00:09:39,600 That's a great question. 353 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:40,800 What's the relevance for them? 354 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:42,840 And that's what I think is so exciting about EDR 355 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:45,360 because it's not just a tool for education. 356 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:46,200 Okay. 357 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:48,800 It's a way of thinking that can be applied to any field 358 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:50,440 where you're trying to create change 359 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:52,560 in a really complex system. 360 00:09:52,560 --> 00:09:53,400 Ooh. 361 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:54,240 Okay. 362 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:55,080 I'm all ears. 363 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:55,920 Okay. 364 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:58,400 So think about healthcare business, 365 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:00,320 even social justice movements. 366 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:01,160 Yeah. 367 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:03,400 You're dealing with complex human behavior 368 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:04,720 interconnected systems. 369 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:05,560 Great. 370 00:10:05,560 --> 00:10:07,320 And you need solutions that are actually 371 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:08,560 gonna work long term. 372 00:10:08,560 --> 00:10:09,400 Yeah. 373 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:11,120 And that provides a framework for approaching 374 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,360 these challenges that goes beyond those superficial fixes. 375 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,920 So instead of trying to force a solution, 376 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:20,120 you're really taking time to understand the system. 377 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:20,960 Yes. 378 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:22,880 Involve the people who are a part of it. 379 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:23,720 Yeah. 380 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:26,760 And design interventions that actually respond 381 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:28,400 to the needs of the situation. 382 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:29,320 That's exactly right. 383 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:30,160 Okay. 384 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:31,000 I'm starting to see the connections here. 385 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:31,840 Good. 386 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,440 And because EDR is iterative, 387 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,480 you're constantly learning and adapting. 388 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:37,320 It has to be. 389 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:38,160 Along the way. 390 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:39,000 That's right. 391 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,440 It's not about being right the first time. 392 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:43,680 It's about being willing to experiment. 393 00:10:43,680 --> 00:10:44,520 Yeah. 394 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:45,360 And maybe fail. 395 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:46,760 And learn from those failures. 396 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:47,960 And continuously get better. 397 00:10:47,960 --> 00:10:48,800 Yes. 398 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:50,160 This is making me think of all sorts of things 399 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:51,440 outside of education. 400 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:52,280 Me too. 401 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:54,680 So listener, as we kind of wrap up this part of our deep dive. 402 00:10:54,680 --> 00:10:55,520 Yeah. 403 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:56,720 We wanna leave you with a question. 404 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:57,600 Okay. 405 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:02,040 How could EDR apply to your field or your area of interest? 406 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:05,080 What complex challenges are you facing 407 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,400 that might benefit from a more nuanced and iterative approach? 408 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:09,480 I like it. 409 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:10,640 Take a moment to think about that 410 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:11,880 as we head into our next segment. 411 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:13,320 Sounds good. 412 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,760 You know what's really interesting about EDR? 413 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:18,920 It's not just about like figuring out what works. 414 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:19,760 Right. 415 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,360 But it's about understanding why something works. 416 00:11:22,360 --> 00:11:23,200 Right. 417 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:24,200 Like what's the reason behind it? 418 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:25,020 Exactly. 419 00:11:25,020 --> 00:11:27,320 And that's where you get those like real aha moments. 420 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:30,000 The ones that really change how you think about things. 421 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:30,840 Yeah. 422 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:31,680 I love those aha moments. 423 00:11:31,680 --> 00:11:32,520 Oh yeah. 424 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:33,360 Me too. 425 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:34,200 It's a little burst of insight. 426 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:35,040 Holy. 427 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:35,880 And it just like shifts your whole perspective. 428 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:39,840 And EDR is really all about encouraging those moments. 429 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:40,680 Okay. 430 00:11:40,680 --> 00:11:42,280 By like carefully looking at data, 431 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:44,120 observing things in the real world. 432 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:44,960 Right. 433 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:46,480 And then thinking about what we've learned. 434 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:47,320 Yeah. 435 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:48,760 We can get a much deeper understanding 436 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:50,840 of why things work or why they don't. 437 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,160 So it's not just about like finding that quick fix. 438 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:54,000 No. 439 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,080 But it's about finding those like fundamental principles. 440 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:56,920 Just check it. 441 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:59,040 That can lead to real lasting change. 442 00:11:59,040 --> 00:11:59,880 Yes. 443 00:11:59,880 --> 00:12:01,800 And it's about understanding the root causes. 444 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:02,640 Right. 445 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:03,760 How everything is connected. 446 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:04,600 Yeah. 447 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:06,920 And there's complex dynamics that like traditional planning 448 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:08,600 often misses. 449 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:12,840 And because EDR involves like lots of different people 450 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:13,880 throughout the process. 451 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:14,720 Yeah. 452 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:17,160 You're more likely to get people to actually buy 453 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:18,240 into the solution. 454 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:19,080 Absolutely. 455 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:19,920 And support them. 456 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:20,760 Yeah. 457 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:22,080 Because when people feel like they've been a part 458 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:24,160 of finding the solution. 459 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:25,000 Right. 460 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:27,440 They're much more invested in seeing it succeed. 461 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:29,160 They're not just being told what to do. 462 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:30,000 Exactly. 463 00:12:30,000 --> 00:12:31,520 They actually understand why they're doing it. 464 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:32,360 Yeah. 465 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:34,440 That shared understanding makes a huge difference. 466 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:35,280 Absolutely. 467 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,320 So collaboration is really key in EDR. 468 00:12:38,320 --> 00:12:39,240 It's essential. 469 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:42,360 It's not just about like one person dictating the answers. 470 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:43,200 Yeah. 471 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:45,360 It's about bringing all those different viewpoints together. 472 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:46,200 Right. 473 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:47,920 And working together to find the best solution. 474 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:49,280 I love that analogy. 475 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:52,400 It's like that saying if you want to go fast, go alone. 476 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,760 But if you want to go far, go together. 477 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:55,600 Yes. 478 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:56,440 Exactly. 479 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:58,040 EDR really embraces that philosophy. 480 00:12:58,040 --> 00:12:58,880 It does. 481 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:00,200 So to recap what we've talked about. 482 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:03,320 EDR is kind of like this powerful magnifying glass. 483 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:04,360 I like that. 484 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:06,960 That helps you zoom in on these complex problems. 485 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:07,800 Yeah. 486 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:10,080 Uncover the root causes and design interventions. 487 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:11,560 That are actually going to work in less. 488 00:13:11,560 --> 00:13:12,560 I like that analogy. 489 00:13:12,560 --> 00:13:14,040 It captures it perfectly. 490 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:17,320 EDR is not about making things seem simpler than they are. 491 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:18,160 No. 492 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:19,560 Or forcing solutions on people. 493 00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:21,560 It's about acknowledging that complexity. 494 00:13:21,560 --> 00:13:22,400 Right. 495 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:24,840 And using it to learn and come up with new ideas. 496 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:26,000 Okay, listener. 497 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:27,000 I have a question for you. 498 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:27,960 Yep. 499 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:30,800 Think about a challenge you're facing right now. 500 00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:32,200 Maybe at work in your community 501 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:33,640 or even in your personal life. 502 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:34,480 Yeah. 503 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:36,760 Something that feels stuck. 504 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:37,600 I like that. 505 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:39,000 You just can't find an easy answer. 506 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:40,040 I got it. 507 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:43,600 Now imagine approaching that challenge using EDR. 508 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:44,720 Okay. 509 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:47,000 How would that change your perspective? 510 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:47,880 Mm-hmm. 511 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:50,720 What new possibilities might you see? 512 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:52,320 That's a powerful question. 513 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:53,160 It is, isn't it? 514 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:54,680 It really makes you think differently 515 00:13:54,680 --> 00:13:56,440 about how change happens. 516 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:57,280 Yeah. 517 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:58,320 It's not about finding a quick fix 518 00:13:58,320 --> 00:13:59,960 or telling people what to do. 519 00:13:59,960 --> 00:14:02,040 It's about understanding the whole situation 520 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,560 involving the people who are affected by it 521 00:14:04,560 --> 00:14:07,520 and working together to create something better. 522 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:08,960 Now you mentioned that the book, 523 00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,080 Efficacious Technology Management. 524 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:12,320 Yes. 525 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:16,080 Has some specific examples of EDR in action. 526 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:16,920 It does. 527 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:19,040 Are there any cases that really stand out to you? 528 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:19,880 Yeah. 529 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:22,440 There's one case study that I always find really interesting. 530 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:23,440 Okay, tell me about it. 531 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:26,440 It's about a school district that was struggling 532 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:30,000 with students not being engaged in online learning. 533 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:30,840 Oh yeah. 534 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:32,640 That's a common problem these days. 535 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:33,480 It is. 536 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,200 They probably spent a lot of money on new technology. 537 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:36,040 They did. 538 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:37,400 But the teachers didn't really want to use it. 539 00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:39,760 Right, and the students weren't seeing the benefits. 540 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:40,680 So what do they do? 541 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:42,480 Did they just buy more technology? 542 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:43,320 Yeah, they was gonna ask, 543 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:45,760 did they just like throw more technology at the problem? 544 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:48,360 No, they actually took an EDR approach. 545 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:50,680 They formed a design team with teachers, 546 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:53,640 students, administrators, and technology experts. 547 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,160 Wow, so they got everyone involved. 548 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:56,120 They did. 549 00:14:56,120 --> 00:14:58,360 And they spent time observing classrooms, 550 00:14:58,360 --> 00:15:00,720 talking to people and analyzing data 551 00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:04,280 to really understand why things weren't working. 552 00:15:04,280 --> 00:15:07,560 So they did their research before jumping into solutions. 553 00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:08,400 Exactly. 554 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:09,560 What did they find? 555 00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:11,560 Well, they found that the teachers felt overwhelmed 556 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:13,040 by all the new technology. 557 00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:14,960 Yeah, that makes sense. 558 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,400 They didn't have enough training or support. 559 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:18,240 Okay. 560 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:19,400 And they were worried about 561 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:21,200 how it would affect their teaching. 562 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:22,040 Right. 563 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:24,000 The students, on the other hand, 564 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:27,120 felt like the online environment was isolating. 565 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:29,160 And they weren't getting enough interaction. 566 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,040 So it wasn't really a technology problem. 567 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:31,880 Right. 568 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:32,920 It was more of a people problem. 569 00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:35,520 It was about how people felt about the technology. 570 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:37,160 About the training and the support and all that. 571 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:38,000 Exactly. 572 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,120 And that's what EDR helps them to see. 573 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:40,960 Okay. 574 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:43,280 And once they understood the real issues, 575 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:45,320 they could start to design solutions 576 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:47,680 that actually addressed those needs. 577 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:49,280 So what did those solutions look like? 578 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:51,720 Well, they created a bunch of professional development 579 00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:53,160 workshops for teachers. 580 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:54,000 Okay. 581 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,240 To help them learn how to use the technology better. 582 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:57,080 Right. 583 00:15:57,080 --> 00:15:58,320 And how to make it part of their lesson. 584 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:00,640 They also changed the online learning platform 585 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:01,960 to make it more interactive. 586 00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:02,800 Oh, cool. 587 00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,320 So students could do things like video chat work 588 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:08,840 on projects together and get personalized feedback. 589 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:10,240 So they were tackling the problem 590 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:11,520 from lots of different angles. 591 00:16:11,520 --> 00:16:12,360 Did they? 592 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:14,640 Looking at both the technology side and the human side. 593 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:15,480 Yes. 594 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:16,320 And it worked. 595 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:17,160 It did. 596 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:19,280 They saw a big increase in both teachers 597 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:20,640 using the technology. 598 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:21,480 Wow. 599 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:22,840 And students being engaged. 600 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:23,680 That's amazing. 601 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,000 The teachers felt more confident and comfortable. 602 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:26,840 Okay. 603 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:29,160 And the students actually enjoyed being online. 604 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,480 That's a great example of how EDR can lead to real change. 605 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:33,320 It is. 606 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:34,320 It's not just a theory. 607 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,080 It's something that can actually make a difference. 608 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:37,480 And what's even more impressive 609 00:16:37,480 --> 00:16:39,120 is that the change has lasted. 610 00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:39,960 Oh, wow. 611 00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:42,600 The school district kept using EDR. 612 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:43,440 Okay. 613 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:44,600 And they kept making things better 614 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:46,240 based on what they were learning. 615 00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:49,400 So they created a system that was constantly evolving. 616 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:50,240 They did. 617 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:51,520 That's the power of EDR. 618 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:52,360 It is. 619 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,520 It's not just about solving one problem. 620 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:55,360 Right. 621 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:56,720 It's about creating a system 622 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,120 that can learn and adapt. 623 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:00,560 Exactly. 624 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:03,480 So, listener, as we move into our final segment, 625 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,200 I want you to keep that idea in mind. 626 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:06,040 Okay. 627 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:08,440 EDR is not just about fixing things. 628 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:09,280 Right. 629 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:10,960 It's a way of thinking a mindset 630 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:13,880 that can help us deal with the challenges of the world. 631 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:15,440 And make things better for everyone. 632 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:16,480 I agree. 633 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:17,320 Yeah. 634 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:19,000 That story is a great example 635 00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:22,080 of how EDR can really change your thinking. 636 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:22,920 Yeah. 637 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:24,680 Instead of just trying to fix a problem. 638 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:25,520 Yeah. 639 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,760 Like building a better system. 640 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:29,000 You're getting to the root of it. 641 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:29,840 Yeah. 642 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:31,400 It's not just about putting out fires. 643 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:32,240 No. 644 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:34,120 You're creating something that's more resilient. 645 00:17:34,120 --> 00:17:34,960 Right. 646 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:35,800 And adaptable. 647 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,320 And that really responds to the people involved. 648 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:40,960 And that's what I find so exciting about EDR. 649 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:41,800 Yeah. 650 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:43,400 It's not just a tool for education. 651 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:45,080 It's something that anyone can use 652 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:46,680 to make positive changes. 653 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:47,520 Exactly. 654 00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:49,040 In any complex situation. 655 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:50,960 So, listener, if you're feeling inspired 656 00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:51,960 by what you've heard today. 657 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:52,800 Yeah. 658 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:54,680 We encourage you to like take this conversation 659 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:55,800 beyond the podcast. 660 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:56,640 Yeah. 661 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:57,480 Think about it. 662 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,880 Think about the challenges you see in your own life, 663 00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:02,040 your work, your community. 664 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:02,880 Yeah. 665 00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:03,720 How could you make a difference? 666 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:05,440 But EDR help you make a difference. 667 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:06,280 Yeah. 668 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:08,720 Could those principles of collaboration. 669 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:09,560 Right. 670 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:10,800 Iteration deep understanding. 671 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:11,640 Help you. 672 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:12,480 Make a change. 673 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,440 It's about moving beyond those like quick fixes. 674 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:16,280 Yeah. 675 00:18:16,280 --> 00:18:17,120 The band-aid solutions. 676 00:18:17,120 --> 00:18:17,960 The band-aids, yeah. 677 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:19,840 It's about embracing the complexity. 678 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:20,680 Working together. 679 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:21,520 Yeah. 680 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:22,600 And always trying to get better. 681 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,240 And believing that even small changes 682 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:26,760 can make a big difference. 683 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:28,600 As long as they're thoughtful and intentional. 684 00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:29,440 Exactly. 685 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:31,480 So as we wrap up this deep dive 686 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:33,400 into educational design research. 687 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:34,080 OK. 688 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:35,920 We want to leave you with a final thought. 689 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:36,720 OK. 690 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:40,400 If EDR is a tool that helps us tackle those complex problems. 691 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:41,240 Right. 692 00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,680 What kind of world could we create if we all used it? 693 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:45,560 Think about it. 694 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:49,840 What if we applied EDR to things like health care business. 695 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:50,160 Yeah. 696 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:51,320 Even politics. 697 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:51,680 Yeah. 698 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,720 What if we stopped blaming each other. 699 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:53,960 Right. 700 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:55,880 And actually started working together. 701 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,880 And like really understood the systems we're working with. 702 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:00,880 To find solutions that help everyone. 703 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,080 What if we embraced a culture of always getting better. 704 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:04,600 Yeah. 705 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:06,200 Where we learn from our mistakes. 706 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:08,040 And adapt to new information. 707 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:09,240 It's a challenging vision. 708 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:10,000 It is. 709 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:12,640 But I think EDR gives us a way to get there. 710 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:13,680 A roadmap. 711 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:14,360 Mm-hmm. 712 00:19:14,360 --> 00:19:17,160 For dealing with the complexity of the world today. 713 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:19,000 And creating a better future for everyone. 714 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:19,560 Exactly. 715 00:19:19,560 --> 00:19:22,080 So listener go out there and be a change maker. 716 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:22,440 Yeah. 717 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,360 Embrace the power of EDR. 718 00:19:24,360 --> 00:19:24,920 I agree. 719 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:26,560 And let's build that world together. 720 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:27,640 One step at a time. 721 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:28,560 One thoughtful step at a time. 722 00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:28,880 Yeah. 723 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:50,400 yeah.