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So check those products out. So now, my conversation
with Dr. Sabine Hazen. My guest today is Dr.
Sabine Hazen, MD. Dr. Hazen is a gastroenterologist.
She currently is at ProgenaBiome, a genetic research
lab whose interest is to understand the clinical
implications of the microbiome. It is impossible
for me to sit here and summarize and introduce
Dr. Sabine Hazen. Dr. Hazen is one of the hardest
-working MDs out right now. She is very passionate
and serious about the oath and about humanity
and about finding cures and helping fight chronic
diseases. Surely you will see, if you listen
to the episode, Dr. Hazen's passion that she
puts forth into her work. I allow her to just
introduce herself in this manner. You can easily
see this passion that I'm talking about. Now,
my conversation with Dr. Sabine Hazen, MD. I'm
Dr. Sabine Hazen. I'm a gastroenterologist by
trade. I stumbled on the microbiome. when a case
of Alzheimer's improved with fecal transplant.
The fecal transplant was done. Fecal transplant
is the procedure where you take stools from a
healthy donor and put it in an unhealthy. This
was a patient who had C. diff, a bacteria that
people get from being immunosuppressed and in
the hospital using a lot of antibiotics, getting
diarrhea. And so this patient, we did fecal transplant
and he improved with Alzheimer's. From there,
I'm the girl that basically was bringing drugs
to market with pharmaceutical companies, clinical
trials, you know, done hundreds of clinical trials
for pharma, you know, worked for companies like
Pfizer and Merck and GSK and you name it. For
years, I was the girl that was basically bringing
these drugs to market. CDIF was my most recruiting
clinical trial, I would say, where basically
when the patients didn't succeed in the drug
from pharma, I would do fecal transplant. And
when fecal transplant opened up the world and
started showing me something in Alzheimer's,
I started paying attention. And then when Colleen
Kelly's work of alopecia areata, two patients
with alopecia areata, improved with fecal transplant,
I started paying attention. And you know, Sahil
Khanna with chronic urinary tract infections
improving, I started paying attention. So at
the beginning I started utilizing a lab that
was available about eight years ago. And that
lab was not really validated. I was getting the
same stool sample, I was getting different results.
So I basically created Progenobiont to understand
the microbiome. So one could say I went from
being a gastroenterologist to a clinical trial
doctor to a sponsor, where I'm now leading the
microbiome research, trying to develop microbiome
formulas to fix the disease. In other words,
we've been looking at all these diseases wrong
by looking at them with, you know, the brain
for Alzheimer's, when we should be focusing maybe
on the gut as well. And I say as well because
nothing is a one, you know, corporate ideology.
You know, it's either in the gut or it's in the
brain or it's in both and you got to fix both
or it's in the connection between the two. And
so this has been my path. It's a path of discovery.
It's a path of trying to understand it. It's
a path of survival. You know, COVID was definitely
the challenge that got me to pay attention. Pay
attention to the septic tanks. Pay attention
to the stools of patients. Pay attention to the
data that came out of the stool samples in severe
COVID patients and their microbiome. And then
pay attention to the different diseases and their
signature microbiome that we saw. So it's really
a vision that I have. And it was a path that
was kind of almost You know designed for me to
be in this position. You know as the girl who
does gastroenterology Who does fecal transplant
who did clinical trials for pharmaceutical companies?
You know is the natural progression I think you
know it's almost like the natural progression
of disease But this is the natural progression
of my life, so it's taken over my life It's I'm
obsessed by it, and I think it's the key to longevity
nothing can be more important than understanding
these microbes right now at this moment in time
for me, and it should be for everybody else.
So in nutshell, that's me. Was it the COVID era
that really grabbed your attention about, well,
the gastrointestinal tract? It happened before
COVID. You know, we were, as GI doctors, we were
doing fecal transplant with patients on C. diff.
You know, nobody was really watching us doing
fecal transplant on patients with C. diff. And
then, you know, when fecal transplant became
a pharmaceutical product and it went into clinical
trials, we were stopped as gastroenterologists
from doing fecal transplant in a way. Like, let's
say you want to use the microbiome of your wife
or your kid for C. diff, and you go to a GI doctor
right now, you cannot. mainly because there are
no testing, there are no labs that are testing
the stools of a donor adequately. And when you
call, you know, the lab cores of the world and
the, you know, the quest, it will tell you, well,
why are you testing the donors? There's a pharmaceutical
product available. So I think that it happened
before COVID. I think COVID, that was the beginning,
but COVID really, you know, opened my eyes to
to the narrative, to the power of lobbyists,
to the power of pharma, to the power of, you
know, influencers. And by influencers, I mean
politicians on both sides, right? And all that
interference that happened during COVID with
suppressing a treatment, early treatment. Now,
obviously, there's no early treatment that's
a magic bullet. We know that. Some people tried
early treatment and it didn't work. It probably
didn't work because just a single drug was given
to them and not that combination. When you're
making a pie, you don't make a pie with one ingredient.
You need multiple ingredients, right? We're trying
to heal people, and we're saying, well, here's
a shot, here's a drink, here's a pill, and you're
gonna be fixed. Your problems are gonna disappear.
No, it doesn't work like that. It's really the
art of medicine. It's really the art of understanding
the disease, being a detective. Right. When people
call me, I had a patient the other day call me
and their assistant wanted to give me the history.
And I said, I don't want the history from the
assistant. You don't know if the mom, you know,
had Alzheimer's, if the mom had, you know, had
was taking drugs, if the mom, you know, so, you
know, it's great that there's, you know, these
people that are taking care of, you know, kids
but ultimately we have to give the history we
have to get the history from the person right
like I would not ask your mom for your history
for a medical condition I would basically ask
you directly because there are some things that
you may not want to tell your mom and there are
some things that I as a physician need to get
from you And it's really the art of medicine.
It's the art of bonding with a patient to get
to know that they have been molested, that they
have used drugs, that they have anxiety problems,
that they're suicidal. It's not something that
people are just going to put on a piece of paper.
How many people do you know are going to confess
that they're alcoholics on a piece of paper?
No. You have to get it out of there. I really
got to see that art over 30 years of practice,
you know, where I had a patient with chronic
pancreatitis and I would try to understand what's
the cause of the pancreatitis and I would say,
are you sure you don't drink? And he would say,
no, no, I'm not drinking. I don't know what's
the cause. It's probably my cholesterol. It's
probably this, that, and come to think of, and
then after like six visits, He finally confessed
to me he was a heavy drinker. He would wake up
in the morning and crave alcohol. But it took
that relationship, right? It is really a patient
-doctor relationship to get that history. And,
you know, when we talk about autism, it's very
important to understand that it is really that
patient -doctor relationship that helps us understand
is the kid a microbiome problem? Is the kid...
a neurological problem. Is the kid's autism caused
by an environment? You know, he's living in an
environment full of mold and toxins, right? He's
living in a house and plants around him are creating
a toxicity that is causing him to have problems.
So it really is detective work. And the only
way to do that detective work is to really have
that patient -doctor relationship. Yeah, that's
lost, I think, because of that narrative about
maybe this prescription first and fast. Maybe.
I don't know. I'm just guessing. I think prescription
first and fast is always the go -to. You know,
people are, well, let me try this pill. you know,
maybe it'll work on my kid. But what they don't
realize is that you try the pill and you just
aggravated your kid's microbiome. And there is
a point where you cannot turn back, you know,
where it is irreversible, okay, where you cannot,
you've done so much damage that you cannot go
back and fix the kid because you've burned the
mucosa. You know, think about the, you know,
you have a mosquito in your house Using a machete
and you're basically trying to kill the machine
the the mosquito but you just destroyed the house
and You know, it's the same thing. I have to
think with kids with autism Sometimes they just
have a small thing that needs to just be tweaked
and The parents do and and that small thing needs
to be tweaked and then you have to like see it
grow Okay. So in other words, I see the microbiome
and needs to be tweaked I tweak it and I see
a little bit of improvement in the microbiome,
but I don't see the clinical picture yet, right?
Because the clinical picture is going to take,
you know, six months, nine months, a year to
see. But what happens is these parents are doing
a treatment and then they're going, ah, it's
not working. Let me go to the next person. So
they're shopping doctors because they themselves
are very anxious because they live in an environment
with a kid that's super anxious, that's running
around, that's not verbalizing, that is in pain,
but not telling them that they're in pain, right?
So when you see that, You see these parents are
very anxious. They want to fix their kids right
away. But they don't realize it's not a one pill
fix, and it's not a one pill fix in one day.
It is truly, truly, you know, continuous treatment,
observation, and Controlling all the factors,
controlling the environment, controlling the
foods, controlling the diet, it's not simple.
And the moms who have succeeded in treating their
kids on their own understand that, that it was
a challenge and they felt it with their gut feeling
that... this was the right way to do it let's
continue changing the diet let's continue changing
continuing the vitamins let's continue that and
then the persistence and then the kid improved
okay now the problem is that there's not a lot
of data on autism right now and a lot of these
moms are listening to one person who you know
was helped with leucovorin for example and or
one person that was helped with fecal transplant.
So they try things on their own, but they don't
have the modalities or the tools to really help
them see if their kid is really on the improvement
side or not. And because they don't have those
tools to see if their kid is improving, they're
continuing on the wrong path. So this is where
the science is really not defined yet, right?
finally, you know, are all awake onto the problem
that we have with autism. You know, this was,
to me, that was a bigger problem than COVID,
to be quite honest, because when you see one
in 12 kids and 12 boys in California, 12 .5 boys
in California have autism, we have a problem,
right? And so, you know, when you saw, and it's
not just autism, it's chronic diseases, it's
COVID. It's long COVID. Look how many people
were infected with COVID. Look how many people
died with COVID. That right there gives you an
idea of what's happening to humanity. And we're
not done with COVID, right? So, you know, the
problem is that until we start analyzing all
the factors that we're doing, that's destroying
the microbiome, we're never going to advance
medicine. And until we stop retraction of papers,
censorship of doctors that are trying to help
these kids were not advancing, right? And this
is what I've realized, right? So remember, I'm
the girl that started as a Malibu gastroenterologist,
right? There's no better place to be than Malibu,
you know, the physician to like the celebrities,
right? And what have I done to celebrities all
these years? My celebrity patients, they don't
want drugs. They don't want pharma. They want
innovations. They want to be done. They don't
want to go back to their doctors. They don't
want to have an injection every six weeks for
Crohn's disease or biologic. They want an innovation
that they can go back and say, you know what,
I'm back to normal and I'm healthy. So, and those
are the people that have the funds, those are
the celebrities. So I went from a gastroenterologist
in Malibu to a clinical trial doctor that does
clinical trials for pharmaceutical companies
to being on the front line trying to innovate
a product for COVID to basically opening the
door to the microbiome and understanding the
microbiome. Remember, I'm not the girl that's
an academician. you know, if I publish, I publish
for other doctors to see what I'm doing. I don't
need to publish. I'm a successful gastroenterologist
in Malibu, you know, so I don't need to share
what I'm doing on my patients. What happens,
unfortunately, is what I saw during COVID is
this censorship and this, you know, killing the
narrative, killing the narrative, killing the
possibilities that COVID could be treated in
early patients. When you see 26 patients that
are hypoxic and they are improving and you document
that, it's not to document, hey, this is the
only treatment. It is to give an idea that sometimes
cheap solutions can work for some people and
that's okay. That's the art of medicine. It's
not just about drugs that are approved by clinical
trials and by the FDA. When we look at primary
care physicians, primary care physicians are
dealing with complex patients, right? So they
give a cholesterol medication, then they give
a hypertension medication, then they give an
anti -reflex medication. What are they doing?
They're doing combination treatment right there.
They're taking the history of the patient and
they're basically saying, my patient needs A,
B, C, D because this is what I know that's going
to kill them and I'm going to try to give them
A, B, C, D of drug. Now the FDA doesn't come
to every family medicine doctor and says, oh,
I'm sorry, you just combine A, B, C, and D. You
need to now make it a drug into a clinical trial
and therefore it needs to be approved. No. The
FDA understands this is the art of medicine and
we need to let primary care doctors treat as
such. Now oncologists are trying to do the same
thing where they're combining, you know, treatment,
chemos and basic and immunotherapy. And, you
know, the FDA wants a protocol. But is that right?
I mean, they're oncologists. They're on the front
line. They're taking care of those patients with
with cancer that are dying. These patients don't
have time for the oncologist to write an IND,
to submit it to the FDA, to wait six months.
Look, my protocol for familial FMT, in all honesty,
should have never gone through the FDA. It should
have been, Dr. Hazen has analyzed enough stools
of kids with autism that she has a good idea
of what microbes to give these kids with autism,
what microbes should be present in the stools
of the donors, that she chooses a certain donor
and she saw an N of one, now she wants to see
an N of 30, it should be a slam dunk, it's not
a pharmaceutical product. It should be informed
consent to the parent, informed consent to the
kid, if the kid is able to communicate. or the
parents take on that job and basically it should
be done, right? With a strong informed consent
and lawyers watching, right? Because that's what
we are, we live in America where lawyers are
watching. So if there's a problem, guess what?
They're coming after me. So yes, the FDA got
involved, okay? Yes, they finally approved it,
but it took six years. You know or five and a
half five years I've stopped counting and it
took hundreds of thousands of dollars That we
had to raise that we had to figure out ways to
bring the money to bring these this trial and
by the way We start because it is a clinical
trial because everybody's calling me to treat
their kid for familial FMT They have donors,
but unfortunately because now it is a clinical
trial. We need funding now So it was one thing
to keep the trial To make it alive. It is another
thing that we need funding right now to get this
trial going and Here's where the funding goes
a CRO clinical research organization that overlooks
the trial Regulatory person that reminds me that
we need to file a report every year because I
got dinged by the FDA When I did my ivermectin
doxycycline trial because I was wearing all the
hats. I was the regulatory girl. I was the doctor.
I was the monitor. I was the coordinator. I did
it all. And I was the sponsor. I was sponsoring
that trial. So what happened was I forgot to
submit a form to the IRB on time and to the FDA
on time. I got dinged by the FDA. I don't want
to be dinged again. So that means we need a structure.
We need a CRO. We need a monitor. We need a coordinator.
We need a regulatory person. We need doctors
that are not Sabine Hazen, doctors that are basically
overlooking these kids. So these doctors can
say, yes, Dr. Hazen is right. These kids are
verbalizing, right? So all that takes money.
Pediatric neurologists are not cheap. Pediatric
gastroenterologists are not cheap. So literally,
we have till December to raise funds autism and
these kids to put we have the 30 kids and we
have more than 30 kids we'd love to do more than
30 kids but in order to do this trial with the
30 kids and then make it a 1000 kids which we
have all these lists of people that are waiting
we need to finish this 30 kids and then we need
to and for to start the 30 kids we need the funding
to get Everybody coordinated this is not Rome
was not built in a day and it wasn't built by
one person and this is the destruction of the
microbiome in these kids is the destruction of
Rome and We need a lot of people we need everyone
hands on deck, you know I'm speaking to you today
when I could be you know lounging somewhere because
it's to awaken people to say hey It's time to
support Dr. Hazen. You know, I've been at this
for too long. I've showed the data, two twins
speaking, verbalizing, their microbiome changing.
The research won a research award at the American
College of Gastro, was recognized by the judge
as proof of concept, right? So this is a gastroenterologist,
my peer, looked at the data and said, this is,
you know, proof of concept. It's time to move
on. It's time to advance the field. And by the
way, you know, it's not just about feces, right?
Because here's the thing, the beauty of this
clinical trial is that it's gonna tell us who
didn't succeed. I'm gonna pick the best donor
from the family, and if that donor didn't help,
we, you know, we look. regain the speech of the
kid with autism, then we have to ask the questions,
why did that happen? Did it happen because I
need to keep implanting? Did it happen because
the mucosa is damaged, and therefore we need
to bring another drug to the pipeline to say,
hey, these kids are not engrafting. I'm giving
them microbes of their sisters or brothers, and
it's not sticking. Why is it not sticking? Burning
it is the mucosa burnt think about again the
house that demolished after a machete right so
is the colonic mucosa destroyed and therefore
I need to heal the the mucosa first and there
are great drugs to heal the mucosa for that to
begin with and Then after I heal the mucosa then
engraftment is possible now. Here's another thing
it may not be a colonic mucosa problem it may
be that the microbes The brain is so damaged
that it's triggering the gut to be damaged. So
I'm fixing the mucosa, but I haven't fixed the
brain. And then here's another thing. It could
be at the genetic level, right? Where basically,
genetically, these kids have a problem. We need
to fix the genetics. So this is where, you know,
my goal, and I'm working with two people right
now that are trying to develop two centers, one
implantation and one... in Sarasota, where we're
trying to create a universe, in essence, a center
for these kids to come in because we need to
monitor their diet. We need to monitor the environment.
We need to make sure everything is perfect for
that clinical. And we need to have coordinators,
neurologists, everybody to be present to follow
these kids to see why isn't this kid not working.
Maybe. I need to hit them with something else.
And this center would have the ability to treat
at every level, not just Dr. Sabine Hazen, you
know, familial fecal transplant, but Dr. Adams,
you know, pill poop, you know, because he's developing
his own protocol. Because for those kids that
do not have a sibling, they need a solution,
right? They have a microbiome problem. That's
where the stool bank comes in. And that's where
the pharma product comes in. So I'm not here
to kill the pharma product just because familial
FMT might work. I'm here to say, look, there's
still a need for your product, your pharma product,
because guess what? Your pharma product, we're
seeing it right now with C. diff. The pharma
product that is in the market right now that
they stopped us from doing fecal transplant with.
is not working for everyone. So guess what? I'm
back to square one taking my families, my siblings,
my, you know, my spouses and giving them poop
because my patient still has C. diff even though
I gave him the pharma product. So at some point
we're gonna have to realize that and here's the
other thing, not everybody wants stools from
a stool bank. We should have the right if I have
C diff as a patient and I want my daughter's
poop I should have the right in America because
we are a free country To choose my daughter's
poop for my C diff, right? So I think we need
to be able to allow treatment and stop the censorship
of treatment because we believe that it stops
the bottom line and it stops the price of a stock.
The price of a stock can still go up when you
have a product that's going to be helping kids
with autism. But here's the thing, the price
of the stock is going to be demolished if you
don't help these moms with kids with autism.
Because right now, who's driving the force of
The politics and who's driving the force of humanity
are moms moms that's that have had enough moms
who are suffering with kids with autism and or
kids with diabetes or kids with lupus or morbidly
obese kids and Had enough and they're saying
what have you done to our kids? What has been
going on? We've been listening to you and you've
made our kids You know, mental health is through
the roof, right? We have a problem. Our kids
have a problem. And if we don't stop that right
now, and I'm speaking as a mom, you know, and
for millions of moms out there, if we don't stop
that, this is the end of humanity. The kids are
our future. Who's going to take care of us when
we're ill? when one in 12 and a half kids is
autistic and needs help themselves. I mean, do
we even think outside the box? You know? And
by the way, even billionaire Roe is gonna need
a good doctor. They're suffering, they have kids
that are on the spectrum themselves. So we can't
stop research, we can't interfere with science,
and we gotta let... the flow of research going
and unfortunately right now what I see is the
same you know cookie cutter medicine happening
you know funds are going to academic centers
foundations are sponsoring you know are sponsored
by pharma to recruit patients and therefore they're
not doing other things you know that are innovative
uh that needs to stop we need to be able to allow
every innovation Never know in my work and improve
and it doesn't mean that it's gonna stop the
next the price of the stock It doesn't mean that
it's gonna stop the product from coming to market
It just means that it needs it gives us one more
clue to the mystery of life and disease So I
tend to talk a lot. I'm passionate about this
as you very good stuff I can't help but notice
about I can't help but mention the censorship
And anytime the medical paradigm says, don't
take this, then, you know, there's no research
behind this. It's very telling. And I can't help
but mention Andy Wakefield either. Yeah. And
then poor Andy, poor Andy. I mean, like Dr. Wakefield
was a warrior, you know, spoke out of honesty
spoke out of the goodness of his heart to help
these kids. And he he asked questions. He didn't
even say the vaccines cause autism. He just said,
look, these moms are coming into my office and
they're saying my kid got the MMR and a day later
stopped speaking, right? And he just said, moms
are not crazy. So are we supposed to not listen
to moms anymore? Are we supposed to not listen
to patients? Why are we gaslighting these patients?
I mean, as a physician, my first... The first
thing I was taught in medical school is take
a history from a patient and develop that relationship
with the patient to get that history. We're back
to the art of medicine. So what happened to Dr.
Wakefield was a bunch of egocentric maniacs that
basically riled up against him and essentially,
you know, thought that their way was the only
way and were not open to something else. The
beauty of this is the microbiome now is telling
the story. And it's saying, hey, guess what?
These kids with autism, they have lost their
bifidobacteria. And guess what? The studies of
Dr. Hazen, which won a research award at the
American College of Gastro, showed that the messenger
RNA killed the bifidobacteria in patients that
before and after taking the vaccines. And restoring
the bifidobacteria improved the speech of these
kids. So that doesn't mean all the vaccines cause
Autism, you know cause kill the Bifidobacteria
that doesn't mean all the vaccine killed the
Bifidobacteria in everyone but in a small subset
of kids Something is happening and we need to
look at it. And here's why I say this I trained
at Jackson Memorial Hospital in Miami during
the times of HIV When HIV was you know, we I
admitted 11 patients with HIV full -blown AIDS
at Jackson Memorial Hospital every night that
I was on call And we practice then the art of
medicine combination drugs How do we get the
patient out of the hospital as fast as possible?
He comes in with a pneumonia etc. Okay During
those times, you know, it was really seeing what
was happening, you know how to be a doctor how
to practice medicine and You know when you look
and it was asking questions, you know, where
did this come from? Etc They gave me courage
to practice the art of medicine. But here we
are now in you know During kovat we were the
same And the reason I said Jackson Memorial Hospital
and HIV, the number one rule that we had at Jackson
Memorial Hospital is never give an MMR to a patient
that is HIV. Why? Because they're immunosuppressed.
Now we have a better tool with the microbiome
to kind of say, is immunosuppression linked to
the microbiome? I think it is. So are those kids
Born immunosuppressed and why are we giving them
an MMR? If they're immunosuppressed if they're
born, you know with loss of bifidobacteria Is
that the population that is getting autism? Shouldn't
we be looking at that? So this is where I want
us to go I want us to be more I want us to be
better at delineating the population that can
tolerate a vaccine can tolerate an antibiotic
and Because there are times you have to give
a vaccine and there are times you have to give
an antibiotic Right in my opinion, you know and
and I'm still you know with the mantra and the
training of medicine Where you know, I believe
in antibiotics and I still unfortunately do believe
in vaccination Because it is a piece of the microbe
that you're giving to create the immunity. Okay?
unfortunately what I don't believe in is an unnatural
spike protein given to patients that has never
been studied that basically and that's why I
went rogue and I and people are calling me an
anti -vaxxer I'm not an anti -vaxxer I mean I
vaccinated all my kids I got vaccinated and then
some you know I mean I got vaccinated with the
MMR twice and in fact in residency I got an allergic
reaction the second time because I was already
immunized and I already had measles, mumps and
rubella in Morocco. So why didn't someone check
my antibodies? You know what I mean? So there
is a population that we need to be better at
looking, hey, they're immunized. Why are we giving?
The question that Dr. Rand Paul said on hepatitis
B in a day one, in a patient, in a mom that is
negative, that has negative hepatitis, why are
we giving that newborn at day one? We don't even
know what their bifidobacteria is. What if that
hepatitis B piece of the virus goes into the
blood, travels the gut, and starts eating out
the bifidobacteria and creating a bifidophage?
What if that happens, right? Do we even think
about, do we think these vaccines stay in the
arm? No, like they try to make us believe during
COVID. Oh, it stays in your adulthood. It doesn't
go anywhere. No, everything travels. Everything
travels through the nervous system. Everything
travels through the blood. We have to pay attention
to the blood and the circulation going to the
gut. And then in the gut is the waste of everything
that we've put into our bodies. You know, from
the cream you put into your face to the injection
you've put into your arm. All goes to your gut.
To the stuff you inhaled, all goes to your gut.
So now what damage is it doing in the gut? Right?
And so this is where we need to be better at
focusing on the microbiome. And thank God now
the FDA and Dr. Marty McCary is doing a great
job at illustrating the microbiome and speaking
on the microbiome because frankly it needs and
realizing that There's only a few scientists
at NIH that know anything about the microbiome.
And I would even challenge those two scientists
to ask them, what is Blatia? Is Blatia a good
bug or a bad bug? You know? What's your bacterium?
Is that a good microbe or a bad microbe? So until
you start, here's how you understand the microbiome.
You have to attain a cure. Then you go back like
don't think about those two kids with autism
right the two twins I discovered two three microbes
that were Possibly the culprit of their autism
now that doesn't mean it's a culprit of autism
for everyone But I discovered the culprit in
those two twins now when we treated them after
treatment we improved their speech and They're
reading every single books those microbes disappeared
Then the good bacteria reappeared because guess
what you got rid of the bad bug How did I see
that it's the art of medicine right kill the
bugs restore the good microbes right by knowing
what I know about the microbiome so imagine if
you now how did I get there by being ballsy and
Saying you know what I'm gonna try this and I'm
gonna try that and I'm gonna try this formula
and that The mom is respecting me and and I had
an informed consent with the kids and I didn't
go crazy I just used certain things that I knew
would kill one bug and would improve another
and And then speech we occurred in these kids,
right? But here's the thing so to understand
now we can go back and say proof of concept improve
the bifidobacteria speech restores killed those
microbes Bifidobacteria goes up, speech restores,
right? Now we can go back and say, okay, well,
how do we do this in more kids? How do we continue
this art, this vision, right? This manipulation
of the microbiome. So, you know, science is always
kind of catching up, right? So people are listening
to my data. You know, when I was during COVID,
when I spoke out on COVID is in the stools, you
know, others listened. And then pretty soon we
were looking at the septic tanks and pretty soon
gastroenterologists started looking at the mucosa
of patients with COVID. They started looking
at spike protein. They started looking at, you
know, COVID in the stools. And there were a lot
of data that showed that COVID remained in the
stools for a long time. So science caught up
to now we can say with certainty, yeah, of course
COVID was in the stools. Yes, COVID is in the
stools. But what we don't know is how long does
it last in the stools in that individual? How
do we get rid of it in the stools when you find
it? Are long COVID patients caused because they
still have COVID in the stools? I can tell you
I have a patient that has had COVID in her stools
for about a year and a half. And I had to get
rid of COVID first before starting to regrow
the microbiome. Because think about it. It's
like you've got ticks. You're not tigs, but you've
got scabies. Until you get rid of every little
bug on your skin, it doesn't matter that you
put lotions to remove the rash. You've got to
get rid of the bug. You've got lice in your hair.
You've got to get rid of every single little
egg before you can start putting conditioner
in your hair, right? But everybody is on to long
COVID, and they're all looking at, well, at least
they're admitting what I've been saying from
day one, which is it's a microbiome dysbiosis,
right? Long COVID we showed is loss of bifidobacteria
to begin with, and vaccine injury is loss of
bifidobacteria to begin with. So science will
catch up and will realize. And when I talk about
a disappearing microbiome, and then there's a
study in LA that basically shows that 25 % of
kids born have adequate bifidobacteria, you know,
this is validating, again, what I've been saying,
that we need to pay attention to the loss of
bifidobacteria in kids. And maybe, just maybe,
the loss of bifidobacteria is the trigger that
starts autism. Maybe, I mean, I could be wrong,
right? I mean, this is all hypothetical work,
and I'm the first one to say it's all, I wrote
the book, let's talk SH .T. I could be full of
it, or I could know it. But at the end of it,
guess what? I'm ready to talk about it. And I'm
ready to talk about it with the people that are
so pushing one narrative. Yeah, yeah, that's
a bad thing. And that's the problem, right? Why
didn't anybody... I've done hundreds of clinical
trials for pharma. I'm equipped to kind of discuss
research. I've done all these trials, you know,
if I'm such a good doctor that I can bring drugs
to market for pharma, you know, I brought the
first postpartum depression drug to market, right?
I worked on numerous drugs, you know, for Amgen,
cholesterol pills, Pfizer, you know, cholesterol
trials, Merck, I mean, C. diff, galore, psoriasis.
So if I'm so... good in a way that drugs are
going out and I've never had a problem with the
FDA because we're a clean site doing good research
and we bring in the right patients for the right
study and our data is clean, great. Then why
aren't you listening to me when I'm showcasing
the microbiome and knowing what I know, having
done hundreds of clinical trials for pharma,
knowing all the intricacies of clinical trials,
knowing what drug combination worked for Crohn's.
I did a study for Red Ale Biopharma where we
gave a combination therapy for what we believed
was mycobacteria perituberculosis in these patients
as the cause of their Crohn's. And I saw this
trial. I saw some people improving and I saw
some people not improving. I've been very privileged
in my life that I've seen a lot of things in
clinical trials, that I've read a lot of investigators'
brochures to know all the combination that are
used for treatment of cancer, for treatment of
C. diff, for treatment of... cholesterol, Crohn's
disease, ulcerative colitis, you know, I mean,
I've done a lot of psoriasis, I've done a lot
of clinical trials to see the direction that
pharma is going. You know, there was a time,
everything was antibiotics for everything, right?
We went for antibiotic for an infection and then
it became antibiotics for acne, antibiotics for
psoriasis. And then the era of biologics, biologics
for Crohn's, biologics for all sort of colitis,
biologics for psoriasis. So I see the progression.
And now I know we're in the feces business, because
the first company that has a capsule of poop
is out there. So now everybody in pharma is going
to start developing. And I saw it. I saw it before
COVID. That's probably why I went rogue in a
way because I was seeing on my desk, you know,
clinical trials of China, Korea, poop from China
for C. diff, poop from Korea for C. diff. And
I'm like, wow, we're in the poop business and
we have no idea what we're doing. And there's
like trillions of microbes out there. And to
me, that was a way of globalizing too. And in
my mind, I was like, why would the poop from
China be good for America? We have completely
different diets. Why would the poop from Venezuela
be good for Americans? Different diets. Why would
the poop from Mexico be good for, and I'll give
you a better example, why would the poop from
the Amazon jungle be good for Americans? When
the Amazon jungle is the original microbiome,
people have... You know, a sterile person that
goes from New York to the Amazon jungle cannot
survive the Amazon jungle. They'll come back
with diarrhea, vomiting, et cetera, because they're
sterile. They've been sterile. They've never
seen these microbes. So are you going to seriously
give a microbiome of the Amazon jungle to a kid
that's living in New York? Absolutely not. So
this is but unfortunately. This is where people
start thinking, oh, I'm going to make money from
poop. And it's the gold rush. And I'm going to
start storing stools from the Amazon and the
Amish and all that. And it's going to work. No,
it's not going to work. So save your money. Save
your space. Save your time. Don't do it. Preserve.
We need to preserve the microbiome of every region.
That's it. Something that's worth highlighting
is that mother's instinct that you mentioned
earlier. Because so many autism moms, my mom's
even, I think some of them are calling themselves
or their instinct is so good. And they're they're
always right. They always know what's right for
the kid. But also, having the sticking with the
treatment because you mentioned Luke O 'Vourne.
Luke O 'Vourne takes time. Yes. Yes. Richard
Fry was on in the spring before HHS, but mentioned
it. And it just takes time and people bail out.
And I love Richard. Richard's brilliant. Yeah,
he's brilliant. So, you know, absolutely, it
takes time and evaluations need to be done, right?
Kids need to follow up with their doctor to test
a car's testing, an A -TECH score, to measure,
to have markers that can guide the doctor to
say, yeah, your kid is improving, not just mom
saying, my kid's not improving or my kid's improving.
So, there needs to be a follow up, right? So,
and, and Leucovorin may be for a percentage of
patients, but it may not be for all patients,
because obviously, otherwise I wouldn't be busy.
I see, you know, Dr. R refers patients to me.
So it's not a one pill solution, but hey, Leucovorin
is a safe enough drug or pill that basically
is, because I don't really consider it a drug.
It's a safe enough pill that you could say, hey,
Let's try it. And by the way, nutrition also
is safe enough that you could say, hey, let me
try nutrition on my kid. Let me educate myself
on the microbiome. And let's see if that can
help my kid. So there are first steps that moms
can do. And yes, you're right. Mom's instinct
is impeccable. And moms are there to protect
their kids. They see the danger before the kid
sees the danger. That's why the mom you know
when you have a mom like holding a kid from like
playing or eating something because they know
What's gonna happen to their kids? It's that
umbilical cord is not really cut so I think we
need to start listening to moms more and we need
to start trusting moms and we need to pay attention
to what they're doing and There I would not be
here speaking on the two cases of the twins,
if it wasn't for the mom, that was really vigilant
with paying attention to her kids, because I
wasn't there every day. And she saw something
from day one. And she said, doctor, he said,
you don't understand. I see them. I feel them
that they're speaking. I feel them that it's
coming. And I said, OK, I mean, you know, you're
the one, you know, the mom flew in from Tennessee
to see me with the two kids, you know, so. started
taking care of her and the two twins because
of that relationship that I had with her that
I knew she was gonna give me good data you know
she was gonna be compliant she was gonna do the
testing she was gonna do and she was amazing
she gave me the testing she did the cars the
ATEX scores she did the the stool testing on
time when we needed it that's the kind of relationship
that I want because Listen, it's great that I'm
helping a kid with autism, but more importantly
My job is to help the community understand autism
better And my job is to write the data The problem
is when we are you when there's interference
and even the write -ups of the papers when my
papers are being retracted for no good reason
completely harassment, I mean The journal did
a peer review on four of my papers, approved
it by my peers, okay? A bunch of investors and
PhDs are criticizing it on a website called PubPeer,
and basically, they go to the journal, and now
they have, they are better than the peer reviewers
that are my peers? And their voice is heard better
than the peer reviewers that are my peers? I
mean, there's a problem. We have a problem. That's
like a plumber coming to criticize my colonoscopy
skills. Just because the plumber deals with poop
does not make him a gastroenterologist to criticize
my colonoscopy skills, right? This is what we're
dealing with here. We are dealing with a bunch
of scientists and investors that have an incentive
in the stock market and trying to, you know...
mess up the stock price for others that are coming
in and censoring the data and harassing the journals.
And that's a problem. And they're all anonymous,
so you don't even know who they are. If I have
a person that's going to criticize my paper,
say it to my face. When I criticize a paper,
I say it to the physician's face. And guess what?
The majority of times, the physicians are like,
yeah, you're right. But these criticisms of,
hey, we're retracting a hypothesis because of
the fact that you quoted people whose work was
retracted after my paper was published. They
were retracted after my paper was published.
So that's not OK. retract a hypothesis, okay?
So, you know, it just, it was ridiculous, the
comments, and there was nothing wrong with these
four papers that were retracted. And I'm not
an academician. I'm not perfect. I shouldn't
even be writing my data. The fact that I wrote
my data to showcase my work to the world, okay?
Guess what? It was on my money. Nobody paid me.
I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on these
publications and this research. You don't want
to look at it? Hey, no problem. But guess what
it did? You know what it did? It put me on stage
because you're now talking to me. And those papers
that are retracted are read most than the papers
that are not retracted. Because the public is
aware now. Because of what happened to dr. Wakefield.
We're back to dr. Wakefield. That's exactly the
cookie -cutter You know formula that they used
for dr. Wakefield control the narrative Wakefield
was an academician. He was top of the game. He
was used as a he was used as kind of like the
picture of Hey, don't defy pharma. Look what's
going to happen to you. We're going to retract
your papers. We're going to retract, you know,
your name. You're not going to work for an academic
center anymore. Here's the problem with me. I'm
not Dr. Wakefield. I'm a girl with a chip on
her shoulder. I'm the girl that was told you
can't be a doctor. You can't be a gastroenterologist.
You can't be a mom and a GI doctor. You can't
look at the microbiome. And every time someone
says to me, you can't, they turn me into a hurricane.
And that's it, because I'm a woman and I'm a
Leo, so hear me roar. And if I'm that person,
there are a million women just like me. And in
a way, You know, it's it's it's hard to hear
from a woman, right? but ultimately we are the
mothers of humanity and we are birthing these
kids and We have to have a voice and this is
my voice Speaking out on the microbiome speaking
out for our children Representing millions of
moms out there. We're tired of being divided
as the mom who works and the mom who doesn't
work We're together on this. Okay Because we're
together with our kids. We realize it's a challenge
to do it all. And for a woman like me to be on
the front line, there were sacrifices that were
made. That I wasn't there for my kids. So it's
a problem. that but I'm there because I realized
that if I'm not speaking as a scientist, as a
gastroenterologist, as a clinical trial doctor,
as a woman who was on the front line of COVID,
as a woman who is treating kids with autism,
who is going to speak? We saw who spoke during
the pandemic. Very few, very few. Very few women
spoke during the pandemic or were put on stage,
by the way. Yeah, Mary Talley Bowden, maybe is
a good one. Yeah, Mary. Yeah, very few. Molly.
Yeah. Do you have time for some questions or
do you have to go? Go ahead. Okay. Well, I'm
interested whenever you said that 25 % with the
bifidobacteria, is that after or at what point
can they? I don't know because I didn't do that
study. Okay. So is Is getting the Bifidobacteria
checked something that you would recommend? And
how does that happen? The problem is that the
majority of tests out there are not validated.
So they're just not validated. So in other words,
you test with a lab and it tells you you have
zero Bifidobacteria. Can you really trust it?
Did they go deep enough to look at that? So parents
can test with us under a research protocol. We
test a lot of babies. We love babies' poop to
just get more data. But unfortunately, it is
expensive because of the fact that, you know,
it is deep sequencing. It's whole genome. In
other words, we see every single microbe and
it's deep. The foundation pays for a portion.
The microbiome research foundation pays for a
portion of those tool testing. We also put people
that cannot afford it on a... So whenever we
have a study or whenever we get funding, we get
grants. This is before Christmas, so I encourage
everyone to donate to the Microbiome Research
Foundation. This is how we advance research on
the microbiome. And essentially what we do is
when we get a grant, we start looking at our
database and say, okay, let's approve 100 kids
to be tested for free. And I'll usually put it
on Twitter, on X. Sorry, and I'll basically say
looking for 25 diabetic kids. That's because
we got a grant to test 25 kids with diabetes
or looking to test Manuka honey, which we did
a study. So we're looking for patients. We, by
the way, right now we have an amazing study,
which actually I'm very proud to say I was part
of this. This was a drug that actually increased
the Bifida bacteria that we discovered. But we
need to see more. We just discovered it in one
patient with ALS. And so the drug was actually
approved for pancreatic cancer. And this is a
great product. that is working on the microbiome
and working on the immunity of these patients.
We're looking to recruit for those studies at
some point. So I'm still working with people
that have innovative products that are righteous,
that want to see the data coming out. I'm still
doing clinical trials. for companies and for
pharmaceutical companies, because I'm not there
to destroy pharmaceutical companies, okay? I'm
there to, listen, if you have an innovation,
I understand more than anyone that research is
expensive. And so, you know, drugs are expensive
because they have to pay off the research, right?
But ultimately, we also have to give Opportunity
for drugs that are over the counter to see the
light for those people that cannot afford to
wait For the drugs to come to market. So, you
know, these are this is how I do research You
know, I'm I'm always looking at new innovations.
I'm always looking at what's best out there and
now I'm looking at all these protocols with the
eyes of what's good out there, but what would
not hurt the microbiome. So when I'm looking
at a drug that I'm gonna take on as a clinical
trial doctor and as a site or CRO, it has to
be a drug that I feel like would not hurt the
microbiome. So that's what I'm working on. Are
there alternative lab tests or any kind of? Test
well there it's coming. It's coming, but I think
we have to before we make a claim Unfortunately,
there aren't you know standards set up right?
There's you know steps that you have to you know
Standard operating procedures that you have to
kind of follow right when before you say a Test
this is the test for autism of course my goal
is to bring this technology that I've developed
to the market as a consumer product But in order
to do that, it needs regulatory. It needs somebody
to have discussions with the FDA. It needs another
CRO, not me, because now I cannot be the CRO
that's doing the research and talking to the
FDA and be the sponsor. It's kind of like biased.
I want other people to kind of say, yeah, you
know what? This test that Dr. Hazen developed
has a purpose, and it could be a consumer product,
or it could be a lab. developed test. We are
a CAP and CLIA lab. But before we develop a lab
developed test, we need to, you know, I have
a very, very harsh, very, very, not harsh, but
very strong minded pathologist who basically
And I have a team. I have a team of scientists,
and I have a team of pathologists that keep me
legit, where if I say, well, I want to bring
out this test, they're like, no, you haven't
done A, B, C, D. And so they keep me on my toes.
And that's a good thing, because you don't want
to have a test. We all saw what happened with
uBiome. The test came out. Doctors were using
it. They were billing Medicare. And then there
was a double billing and triple billing of that
test with no validation from the medical community,
right? In other words, we have to get the doctors
on board with this to say, yeah, there's a need
for this test, right? And yeah, this test is
useful. Kind of like when we started hepatitis
C, looking at hepatitis C, there was a genome,
a genotype of hepatitis C. that told us the patient
has hepatitis C in the blood, but then there
was also a quantitative hepatitis C test that
said, yes, there's a quantitative hepatitis C
test. So those are the tests that basically need
to come out for autism, but before that comes
out, I need to convince the authorities, I need
to convince the FDA that there's a purpose for
this. I need to convince the doctors that there's
a purpose for it because right now this is as
beautiful as this is and as hopeful as this is,
light at the end of the tunnel, it is still years
away because we have to do the right thing. And
luckily we have a government right now that is
a little bit. better at expediting. And we have
the Maha movement that is on this, that wants
to see success, that wants to see cures. So I
think we're better positioned to bring on the
technology and bring on all that. But there's
a lot of work that needs to be done. So for parents,
I would say join our clinical trials for autism.
And if at least put your name on the list, so
ginger at progenobiome .com is who basically
gets the names, contact her, put your name on
the list, and we will call you when we do get
funds. I'm working really hard to get funds for
all this. So this is a big undertaking. Right?
One in 12 and a half kids with autism in California,
boys in California with autism. This is a big
undertaking. And this is an undertaking that's
not here to just light up the problem of autism,
you know, like all the foundations and everything.
But it is here to try to push the treatment path,
to try to push the cure path, because that's
what we need. But before we say a cure, we need
to have agencies and other doctors validate all
that and say, yes, doctor, he's in this right
or wrong. Okay. I put all that information in
the show notes too. And thank you. Yeah, definitely.
So I have a kind of a random question because
I'm a big fan of Dr. Jack Cruz, the neurosurgeon
and quantum physicist. I heard him and you on
Alexa's podcast and You talked about maybe doing
bifidobacteria and red light. Yes, yes. We started
with a couple samples, nothing we can discuss.
Jonathan Otto actually sponsored us a big red
light panel, so I'm excited about that. I have
to get together with Jack. If you know anything
about Dr. Cruz, he's very hard to get hold of.
You almost have to fly where he is, right? And
so, and yes, so I, you know, he's a brilliant
physician. I'm not so sure I agree with his controversial
and getting involved in the politics. I try not
to blame anyone for anything. Actually, I blame
the microbiome. I try not to look at people as
my enemies. I just try to look at them as, hey,
they're missing microbes. Even the people, by
the way, even the people that retracted my papers,
I don't look at them as enemies. I look at them
as, okay, upset about the fact that their company
went under, upset about the fact that they Probably
wanted a probably have a lack of microbes, but
I also look at them as It's a shame because these
people are actually very intelligent So I just
wish they would cut instead of using their intelligence
on Destruction I would I wish they would use
their intelligence on construction right instead
of looking at the problem of the paper and Retracting
the paper, which is a waste of time and energy
for everybody Put your energy into looking at
the microbiome with me and give me the negative
that I'm not seeing because I'm seeing it with
one set of eyes. I would love to have the person
that is, you know, retracting my papers come
to the come to the lab and say, no, you forgot
to look at that because I know that she's going
to eventually bust me on not looking at that.
So why bust me stop the busting and let's work
together so we can both look at it And you know
we're both women so we can both look at it together
with the eyes of Scientists instead of looking
at it with oh my god I'm gonna retract her papers
because she's trying to do something that I should
have been doing you know There's no point that
there's enough business in reconstruction and
in construction then in demolition, okay? That
we've demolished enough. It's time to build and
there's business for everyone, you know when
a gastroenterologist calls me and he says to
me Where do you do this procedure? How do you
do it? I help them not because I need to compete
with them But because I want them to shine so
they can help their patients You know, I created
the biome squad to educate doctors on the microbiome
I could have just kept all this to myself and
just started the hazen centers around the world
But no, I want other doctors to shine. I want
them to go on stage to talk about what I'm talking
about. That's that's the biggest, you know, mission,
in my opinion. It's not like I said, Rome wasn't
built in one day and by one person. It needs
thousands of doctors. You know, we there was
a health care revolution that was created during
Covid. I didn't take Sabine Hazen or Peter McCalla
or Robert Malone or, you know, Pierre Corey or.
Jessica Rose, Kevin McKernan, you know, it took
everyone to support each other, right? We all
came together. And, you know, Jack says things
that I don't agree with, Dr. Cruz, and I say
things that he doesn't agree with, but we could
still come together to do an experiment, right?
And so I think that's how we need to come. The
autism is the uniter of the world. And right
now research is the uniter. COVID should have
been the uniter of the world, but unfortunately
COVID was not. So now autism should be what unites
the world. You know, kids have autism in Saudi
Arabia. I talked to a family from Saudi Arabia
the other day with a kid with autism. You know,
kids in Egypt have autism. Kids in Japan have
autism. Kids in America have autism. This is
not a one place population one race one gender
problem boys and girls have autism you know and
it's not a religion issue either muslim catholic
jews have kids with autism so we need to come
together because guess what the microbiome of
you might of these kids needs to be looked at
to see what is different in kid in china versus
kid in America that's Chinese that is autistic.
What is different in kid in China that's autistic
or similar in the kid in China that has autism
to the kid in America, okay? Different microbes
in China. You know, Bifidobacteria is a microbe
that's very prevalent in America and that's our
great microbe, right? But it's not necessarily
the microbe that you need to have in the Amazon
jungle or in the Amish population or in the Chinese
So therefore that's why we need to start looking
at the world and humanity and looking at it with
eyes of discovery and not eyes of We need to
make a buck on this. Okay, and that's that's
hard to do. You know, there's very few people
that will look at a project and say, I'm not
planning to make money on this. I'm planning
to push the narrative. I'm planning to push the
funding. I've not made a penny since I started
because of the fact that I'm constantly reinvesting
in the research. I'm constantly re -evaluating
myself, re -looking at it. And the other thing
is this is a huge undertaking. This is thousands
of kids that need to be treated, millions probably.
This is looking not only at autism, but Alzheimer's,
the same formula we did with autism. We want
to reproduce with Alzheimer's, Parkinson's. Are
there signature microbes in GIST tumors? You
know, the other day I had a patient with GIST
tumors and she said to me, how come you started
looking at GIST tumors? I said, because I had
a couple patients with GIST tumors. That needs
funding in itself to see a thousand stool samples
of gist tumors, you know? So I think, you know,
at the end of the day, I embarked on this. Somebody
offered me a hundred and ninety six million dollars
for progenitor biome, and I didn't take it because
this is bigger than money. This is understanding.
This helped me understanding how to survive covid.
This helped me understand. How to possibly live
longer that doesn't mean I'm right okay? That
does not mean I'm right, but this is an opening
a light that I need to follow and of course I'm
going to follow it because what does it matter
at the end of the day if I'm dead in a year?
You know and I didn't look at this so you know
hopefully I'm not dead in a year to you know
understand and to continue this path Uh, but
that's what it takes. It takes righteous people
that are basically, you know, not there all about
the money. The money will come. I always believe
that if you do things the right way, money comes.
Yeah. Uh, one thing that I do love about, uh,
uncle Jack, Jack Cruz is he always says incentives
dictate outcomes. And it's like, from what like
you described, it's like, um, centralized medicine
has become profits over humanity. But like doctors
like you take the oath serious. And that's why
I tell you how I took my oath serious. I did.
I was the patent of hydroxychloroquine Z pack
vitamin C, D and zinc. And most people don't
realize was my patent. OK, it was an idea that
I got from Didier Raoul because he looked at
hydroxy Z pack and and and and zinc. But what
happened to me was more I saw that it killed
the virus in the stools. Initially in a couple
patients and I was like, I wonder if that's the
answer and then what I did in them I was trying
to name it I put H a Azithromycin Z zinc H a
Z was the first three letters of my last name
and I said wow God is sending me a sign right
because I'm a huge believer of God and so when
I so I named the patent Hayes D pack Someone
offered me ten million dollars for that patent
And I said, no, I need to see the data clearly
and I need to make sure that it doesn't kill
the microbiome. And guess what? It did kill the
microbiome. OK, so it wasn't the solution. It
was the solution for some. Right. And in a way,
it's kind of funny because interference and research
happened, but it happened in a way that was a
good thing because that. Combination should not
have been given to everybody. It was a combination
That's only the people that have zero bifidobacteria
have to you know, and it's in the severe population
That's who really benefited from that drug. Okay
drug combination But here's a perfect example.
I didn't bring it to market. I could have like
pushed it I could have like brought in but I
didn't bring it to market because I felt This
is not the right answer now ivermectin doxycycline
you know we did the protocol we did the you know
there was again interference in research but
again was not for everybody so you know i kind
of like stepped back you know during the pandemic
and dr borodi took on who passed away he took
on the ivermectin doxycycline zinc protocol and
i didn't want to have anything to do with it
because i felt like i'm not so sure it's the
right thing to give. Now, if we make it certain
parameters, that it's the right thing for certain
people, possibly, but then that takes a lot of
work, I felt that those drugs needed to be left
more for the art of medicine. So, you know, this
is where knowing, you know, and I felt that really
my job and my role is not to bring out for COVID
was not to bring out a drug. combination, but
really to illustrate the microbiome. And I think,
if anything, this is my role in all this. You
know, in full transparency, would I love to see
a stool test in the future being developed by
progenitor biome? Sure. But, you know, I just
don't feel that right now we're there. And I'm
being very honest with it. I just feel that Right
now there's so much to learn and the reason that
I don't feel we're there is because Let's say
I send you a stool test. Okay, you do a stool
test and I tell you you have a bacteria called
blot here and you have a lot of that bacteria
You're gonna freak out and you're gonna say oh
my god. I need to kill this bacteria I'm gonna
do ozone therapy. I'm gonna do Ibu. I'm gonna
do all these things to kill that bacteria But
guess what that bacteria was good for you. It's
what was Helping you survive that doesn't mean
that bacteria is a good bug or a bad bug. I'm
just giving an example I should have called it
bacteria X because people just like take whatever
I say and kind of like destroy it so basically
Let's say you have bacteria X and you I'm giving
you a report that says you have 30 % of that
bacteria You're gonna freak out and you're basically
gonna say oh my god. I need to kill it, right?
So that's why as I have to be responsible in,
until we understand better the microbiome, I
have to be responsible. And you heard Dr. Marty
McCarrie yesterday, or in a video, he said, you
know, a few people at the NIH are dealing with
the microbiome. And I can assure you those few
people have no idea what's going on in the clinical,
because the NIH is, you know, still needs Doctors
on the front line that are innovating treatment,
right and that are courageous enough to use treatment
so it takes courage to practice medicine and
especially in 2025 approaching 2026 It's gonna
take a lot more courage. You know, we're entering
a world of AI Where AI can be your doctor? We're
entering a world where they're gonna try to Censor
as many papers that doesn't fit their narrative
We're entering a world where the price of the
stock matters more than the price of a life And
these are the fights and these are the battles.
So my only My only Hope in a way is that I realize
and what I see are the people that are driving
the forces that are driving the price of the
stock You know are becoming patients and those
patients at some point will stop the interference
of research because that's what it takes. So,
because we're all gonna be patients. You know,
you said to me, you know, it's doctors like you.
I had no choice. I was on the front line of COVID.
What was I gonna do? You know, sell a product
that was gonna kill my microbiome? No. You know,
then what am I doing? I'm killing everybody's
microbiome? Then, you know, Who's gonna be my
secretary? Who's gonna be my nurse? Who's gonna
be my coordinator? You know, a world without
humans is just, with one human or one race is
just not a world, okay? We need the diversity
of races. around the world to create humanity.
Think about what the Italians bring to the picture.
Think about what people from Mexico bring to
the picture. What people from India bring to
the picture. China, Japan, we're all beautiful
in our ability to do something because we all
have different microbes that are bringing on
to the puzzle of humanity. let's figure out the
puzzle of humanity instead of continuing of the
wars that are killing the planet and killing
the humanity and you know you can keep fighting
but guess what at some point you're going to
be left as the sole human and then pretty much
dead so you know uh hopefully the world will
shape up and come together and i hope so for
the sake of our kids and for the sake of humanity
The microbiome of humans is disappearing. Before
COVID, the majority of patients I was seeing
had six phyla. Now I see a lot of patients with
two phyla, groups of microbes that share one
thing in common. Bifidobacteria, out of 1 ,000
samples, less than 5 % have bifidobacteria. And
1 out of 1 ,000 has lactococcus, lactobacillus.
Good luck absorbing sugar and calcium when you
don't have those microbes. Good luck getting
out of bed when you don't have those microbes,
you know? So, you know, microbes are helping
us absorb sugar into our cells to make our mitochondria
work. The reason these kids are now verbalizing
and when you restore the bifidobacteria is because
now they're absorbing the sugar to go into the
cells to make the cells work, and now the brain
is functioning, the machine's working, you know?
So you cut the microbe that helps absorb that
sugar. You kill it completely, which is what
we're seeing. This is why my mission is save
the BIF. You kill that microbe. Good luck to
humanity. Okay, and this is not a dress rehearsal.
This is not a drama stage or a PR movement. This
is reality check. Okay, reality check is we have
a lot of diseases cancer is going up Parkinson's
Alzheimer's autism Wake up humanity wake up wake
up politicians wake up Because you may be on
your high throne right now But that high throne
is gonna come really down when you develop Parkinson's
or Alzheimer's And now you want a good donor
and they don't they just don't exist Okay, the
art of war, they just want to the art of war
is like, they just want to rule, they don't care
who they're rolling over, they just want to rule
humanity. Well, the art of war actually, also
quotes the, you know, for for businessmen to
be like surgeons, you know, I read that book,
by the way. And it says, you know, as a businessman,
you got to be like a surgeon, a surgeon goes
into a room with a thick face and a black heart
and he opens the heart and he fixes the kid's
heart and he doesn't and he doesn't say oh my
god that poor little heart you know i can't open
it he goes in as a warrior so guess what i read
the book i know the i know how to play the game
so It's time to play the game for humanity now.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, because the art of war is turning
against and it's a woman who does a colonoscopy
for living and plays with shit that's dealing
with this. So, you know, and, you know, if they
want. We got to understand life, we got to understand
disease because we're all going to be patients
and I don't know why God chose me for this, probably
because I have a chip on my shoulder, but I intend
to continue this. and this train is moving and
it takes on people people can come people can
leave it's still moving and you can mock me you
can retract my papers it's still moving yeah
i don't care just tell you why and make fun of
me i don't care your my brand is let's talk shit
talk shit about me go for it it sells books so
this is who i am take it or leave it It's a good
spot to end on, Dr. Hazen, I think. Thank you.
And thank you for speaking to me. Yeah, I just
admire how much work you do. Yesterday, I felt
like I was in a washing machine. And I felt like
I was taken out of that washing machine and I
was like this... You know piece of clothing that
was just stretched in every direction and I just
you know, I crumbled but you know, we keep going
and you know God help me and yeah, and that's
it. That's all we can you know, I think if anything,
you know, there's The big thing for me the big
light at the end of the tunnel is that there
is a God and I don't believe that We die necessarily.
I think we just you know microbes live on the
body Is decomposed by microbes in our guts and
so those microbes are still alive You know they
go back into the earth and they keep going back
and they come and they come back. You know and
they do their thing so you know Epigen I believe
in the whole world of epigenetics. I believe
in you know in I think There is bigger than this
reservoir of microbes that we are there is bigger.
When you see a patient that's bipolar and you
change their microbiome and they're no longer
bipolar, personality changes with the microbiome.
When you see anxiety, depression, et cetera,
change, personality changes, right? So this is
who we are, you know? When you see a kid with
autism who doesn't verbalize and now all of a
sudden verbalizes after all I did was put in
a bunch of microbes, you have to be looking at
the microbiome what's invisible and say, wow,
this is amazing. We're just a reservoir for these
microbes. And how amazing is the power of a divine
power that basically created all of us to be
different in our microbiome and all of us to
be different in our fingerprints. How amazing
is that? It's bigger than us. you know to the
man that believes he knows it all well show me
how you can live forever because until then you
don't know shit that's that's it and truly amazing
you don't know it so yeah yeah yeah so that's
it so thank you so much have a great day yeah
thank you let me know where it's on and keep
Let me keep us updated somehow on the red light
and Bifidobacteria because I love red light.
Of course, I will. It's a big problem. We're
not getting the full spectrum light anymore.
That's a big problem. That's a big problem. And
we're getting other lights. Yes. Yeah, I swayed
the blue light especially. Yes, absolutely. Yeah,
the blue light I think is a big problem. Oh,
yeah. So and I think that's... And the idea of
sun on your belly, that's brilliant and I do
that myself and I think that's amazing. I listened
to Dr. Cruz early on during the pandemic and
that's how I became a fan of his and that we
connected. I think he's brilliant and he just
sees what others don't see. Kind of like me,
I see the microbiome. He said to me, if you listen
to the podcast, he said, the microbiome is basically
the projector. In other words, microbes are secreting
light. They're showing, but we're not seeing
the screen. He's he's right. I mean, there's
so much we don't know, you know, are these microbes,
you know secreting lights Are they absorbing
light and then doing their own thing with the
light, right? Is that why the abdomen you know,
you have to put the sunlight on the abdomen.
Are we refueling? You know, I was watching Superman
the other day the new movie and Remember, I don't
know if you saw it, but there was a scene where
he basically is completely destroyed. And they
put him on a bed, and then they put sunlight
on his belly. And then all of a sudden, like
he started restoring it. It was like, huge, powerful
sunlight. And it was right on his belly. And
I'm like, wow, they must be listening to Jack
Kruse. Because that is like, that was such a
classic. You know, because a lot of these movies,
it's kind of funny because, you know, I saw a
Seinfeld episode one time and it was actually
a case of mine that, you know, that was basically
presented on Seinfeld. So it's kind of funny.
And then when you see, you know, comics and et
cetera, talking about fecal transplant, you know,
South Park doing the episode of fecal transplant,
you know, you kind of say, wow, it's, you know,
it's kind of fun to see that. Hollywood uses
some of the scientific stuff that is out there
that we've done, playing with poop. Now Neil
Stolman, who got me into this fecal business
by making me do fecal transplant early on on
a patient that had C. diff and failed a clinical
trial, he basically, he quotes that South Park
episode and then he quotes the ER episode. He
goes, wow, we became famous when ER started doing
fecal transplant. And so he does, for those who
are interested in Dr. Stolman, he does a great
microbiome 101. It's on the microbiomeresearchfoundation
.org. We have videos, so there is a video that
he did of Microbiome 101, so I encourage people
to listen to it. It's great. There's also a lot
of other videos out there of, you know, physicians
that have been on the front line of fecal transplant
and, you know, Scott Jackson, who worked at National
Institute of Standard, who basically, you know,
his job was validating the microbiome testing,
has a couple of podcasts, a couple of videos
in there, you know, so. Support the foundation
and go educate yourselves on the videos. That's
it