Hello everyone and welcome to the Untitled Trick Show.
How are you doing?
Remote edition.
Remote edition, yeah.
I'm very tired.
It's very hot.
I've just finished recording and I'm going to bed.
As much as I didn't have as traumatic an evening as you did, I didn't get to sleep until 2 o'clock
because my room didn't drop in temperature from 26 last night.
So it's been, unless they're listening to the variety show, a month since they've heard
us talking, actually talking to us.
Because obviously the episode before this one, four nights ago, was the compilation
episode of the USS Shit Show stuff.
It was.
So I hope everyone enjoyed that.
And I've got a little, I know I say on the variety show, I don't do corrections, but
I'm breaking my own rules because I'm pretty sure I pronounced Reid's name wrong last time.
Oh, we know you did.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I did.
Reid Rimer is the chap who made the intro for us for the USS Shit Show.
Thank you very much, Reid.
Holy moly, it's a good intro because we've not discussed it, have we?
No.
Because you put it on USS Shit Show, which would have been the first time anyone had
heard it.
Yep.
And this will be the first time that we've done it in a talking episode.
And I've got to say, when I heard it the first time, shivers down the spine.
Absolute quality work.
It's straight out of Star Trek.
It was perfect.
Yeah.
When he asked exactly what I was looking for, I just said, next gen, DS9 Voyager.
I think we're the three.
I might have said low decks as well, just like that.
And then kind of short.
And I think it's like 55 seconds, I think, something like that.
Yeah.
And it was, he sent us the first draft.
It's like, oh, this is the first draft we've got.
It took him a couple of days as well.
It was so fast.
And I was like, this is fantastic.
And then, yeah, he went off and did even more magic with it and come back even better.
I was like, oh, fucking hell.
We're super impressed.
I had it.
So you, me and Carrie know a chat together, aren't we?
And I put it in there and all three of us were like, this is incredible.
We're so impressed.
It really, really is.
It's just, just everything about it.
It hits all the TNG notes.
It hits the Deep Space Nine notes with the French horn or flugelhorn or whatever you want to call it.
It was just magical.
Really, really was magical.
So find him on Twitter at fabel underscore org, on TikTok at fabelfactory org, Instagram at fabelfactory org or on Facebook at fabelfactory org.
And when I say org, that's O-R-G org as an organisation, I suppose.
Yeah.
Reid, if you're listening, thank you very, very much.
Yeah, thank you very much.
Right, TJ, as always, have you done and watched or absorbed or listened or whatevered any sci-fi for the last month?
Yeah, we've already talked about it, though, and that was Rebel Moon.
So if they head over to the Variety Show, they can hear all about it.
And Gentlemen Broncos, which technically falls under sci-fi.
I guess it does.
But that's it, really.
Nothing else.
I've not caught up on Doctor Who.
I've watched a little bit of Star Trek.
Obviously, I've watched the episode that we were going to be talking about today, but watched a couple of episodes of TNG just because I could, but couldn't tell you what they were.
But that's it, really.
Yeah, nothing exciting at all.
How about you?
So, yeah, we finished Doctor Who, which I don't go into spoilers because you haven't watched it, but very happy with it.
Look forward to having a conversation.
I think when we talk about it, we should probably do like a spoiler cast thing because it would be really a shame to accidentally ruin it for anybody.
Well, I was thinking what we should do is a little walk with the remote microphones and we'll talk about it while we walk.
Yeah.
And it'll just be a bonus episode.
We'll put it out on whatever we put it out on.
But yeah, I've heard mixed reviews.
I've heard a lot of people saying it felt rushed and that ruined it for them.
And I've heard other people say it was absolutely phenomenal.
Really, really satisfying ending to this first series.
So I'm looking forward to it.
I just need to get myself the time to sit down and watch it.
That's my issue.
I would not at all say that it was rushed.
I don't think it was rushed at all.
I know I definitely didn't get that feeling from it.
I would, my real only critique is one that you've already said, and it's kind of just how the doctor is and that you don't feel that kind of fire inside him.
He has moments of it that you like, you feel like, oh yeah, you're just getting to a crescendo of it and it just dies just before.
You never get that, you know, oh God, I'm forgetting what the name is, David Tennant or Matt Smith, moments of definite anger.
Or even Peter Capaldi.
He had some, he had some brilliant Capaldi, Capaldi, whichever way he's pronounced.
He had some fantastic anger scenes.
Fix this, fix it now.
It's not possible, I can't.
Yes it is, you can, and you will, or this street will be over.
I'll show you and all your fun little friends to the whole laughing world.
I'll bring you in it, I'll bring the Zygons, give me a minute, I'll bring the Daleks and the Cybermen.
You will save Clara and you will do it now or I will rain hail on you for the rest of time.
Doctor, stop talking like that.
You can't.
I can do whatever the hell I like.
You've read the stories, you know who I am.
And in all of that time, did you ever hear anything about anyone who stopped me?
I know the Doctor.
The Doctor is no longer here, you are stuck with me.
And I will end you and everything you love.
Up to the point I've watched, I've just still not seen it with this new Doctor and that's not necessarily a bad thing.
It's a new Doctor, so it's a new portrayal of him, but part of me does miss that fire.
Yeah, as I say, you get a little bit of it, but I feel like it's not quite there.
But I think it leaves itself like that's kind of opening the door to kind of something else, you know, that I keep coming out more.
It's also just, I don't get the whole thing of it being season one again.
That kind of is a bit weird.
Yeah, that threw me.
I think it should have just carried on from where it was.
Yeah, just keep going. What difference does it make?
If you're going to call it season one, then don't do any throwbacks.
Don't have this lady who has been with a previous Doctor.
Don't do these scenes where you're seeing all the other Doctors floating around you.
All these things, just like, OK, if you're going to quit season one, then ignore the rest of it.
You know, they're pulling all of the, you can't pick and choose.
I know essentially it doesn't really matter.
It's just, you know, it's still Doctor Who.
Just keep the series running.
Was that a spoiler?
I don't think so.
Well, up to the point I've seen, there's been no one that's been with David Tennant, Matt Smith or any of the previous Doctors.
You would have seen one of his helpers at.
So what's that group on Earth? The SHIELD, or whatever they're called.
Oh, SHIELD. Sorry, right. Yeah, OK.
Yeah, there's a woman in SHIELD.
Yeah, sorry, I know what you mean now. Yeah, OK, fine. Yeah, I understand.
No, fair enough. I thought you were going down the route of later on another.
No, it's just the people in SHIELD.
Ah, fine. OK.
You know, that's from other Doctors.
So, well, you know, don't use all these other things from the other Doctor series then.
That's just my point.
Or use SHIELD, but don't use it with characters that we've already met in the other iterations of it.
Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough. I agree with that.
That's not a real critique though, is it? That's just...
No.
I think you might have said it, Disney now are involved and they probably just want to make it their own thing, don't they?
Well, that's it. I think it's purely Disney wants to make their own thing.
And they're saying we're starting it from scratch with our own Doctor, our own ideas behind it.
And we're just going to say this is the new generation.
Exactly. Right. Shall we go on with it?
I think that's a very good idea.
Enter authorisation code.
Trials and Tribulations.
What an episode. That's all I've got to say about it.
Isn't it brilliant? I was so happy with this episode, honestly.
I would almost go out to say it is one of the best Star Trek episodes ever made.
I haven't seen every single Star Trek ever, but certainly it's definitely one of the better ones.
I'm just so impressed with it. What year did this come out?
1994.
November 4th, 1996, according to Wikipedia. Original air date.
Oh, yeah, you're right. 1994.
Season 5, episode 6.
I must be looking at a different Wikipedia to you then, because I'm looking at it here and it's November 4th, 1996.
Which is what you said. Sorry, I'm saying 1994.
Why am I... Sorry, yeah, 1996. Ignore me. You're absolutely right. I'm going crackers here.
Yeah, 1996 and everything about it, excluding the CGI remaster of the Enterprise and the Space Station.
Everything else is just mind-blowingly good.
I was so impressed with the blue-screening stuff that imposing them into the old footage,
there's only one bit that's a little bit ropey near the end with...
We'll get to, obviously, where Cisco is...
They're sat in the mess room and Kirk and Spot come in and they go over to the replicator.
There's a bit where they pan past Cisco and he's sat at a desk.
Just there, if I'm going to really pick holes, that moment I'm like, Cisco's not there.
But every other one, I'm just like, how did they do this? How did they do this in 1996? This is amazing.
It's genuinely hard to tell which of the scenes they re-recorded with completely new actors and everything.
I'm guessing that's going to be the majority of the crowd and the corridor scenes where they're walking backwards and forwards.
Yeah, definitely.
And the original scenes from the original series. It's mind-blowingly good.
I would assume every scene is re-done unless in the camera shot it has one of the original bridge crew.
I think every other scene is probably just...
No, because I've gone back and re-watched some of it. And the fight scene.
Large amounts of the fight scene are the original footage.
When there's the barman back on the scenes when all the tribbles are everywhere, you've got the barman sat behind the bar, just covered in tribbles.
That's the original scene. So much of it is the original scene. It's phenomenal.
It blew my mind when I first saw it. And even watching it back now, it's just so good.
Yeah, I was really impressed. And also I was surprised at how funny it was.
The whole episode is written like it's almost a comedy.
Because everyone's doing little quips and jokes. Maybe that's a Deep Space Nine thing, but the whole thing I was kind of chuckling along at little stuff.
100%. It's like the two temporal investigators. They're just facing me. Someone's just said, well, let's do that whole comedy thing of the FBI with FBI.
We don't make jokes here, sir. And they've just done that exact kind of thing that you get in all the films.
And they've done it into Deep Space Nine. And you're right. There's a lot of comedy to be had.
Like the whole thing. Tell Worf he smells of a lilac. That really tickled me.
Yeah, that was funny. It's loads of little quips like that all the way through.
I'm just one of those temporal guys. I'm just just now IMDb-ing him. I took a screenshot I'm supposed to do this early because he's in so much stuff.
Is that the taller of the two? Jim Jensen or Jensen. His name is. Yeah, he's in loads of things.
So basically, let's get on what the episode is. So it's space timey wimey stuff happens and they end up back in original Star Trek time with Kirk.
And it's the episode of the original series where the ship gets overrun with triples.
Yeah, so 105 years ago by the temporal investigation team, they've been gone back 105 years.
And yeah, you're right. It's the time of the Enterprise 1701 and I love that as well when the temporal agents at the beginning.
Well, which Enterprise was it? There's been five. No, there's been six. Yeah.
It's all of this. Yeah, it's just a really good episode in general.
Yes, they go back and, you know, time stuff happens and they have to prevent a particular character from affecting the timeline.
Spoilers, I'm sure you can imagine they do. And yeah, that's it. Really.
It's quite a simple little story, really. But I think the draw of it is the fact that they've intertwined it with the original footage and put them in with the original actors.
And how they did it is magic to me. Well, number one, Darwin and modern Darwin were the same actor.
So they did use the same actor from. Yeah, that's Charlie Brill.
So they used the original actor from the original series episode for the Deep Space Nine episode, which I thought was a brilliant idea.
Yeah, that was such a brilliant addition. But the two things that really surprised me.
Number one, this links and I can't believe I'm saying this. This links discovery with Deep Space Nine.
It does. And that took me a little while to figure out. As I'll get to later on, I had to actually ask Miranda.
I was like, because Miranda just kept talking about it's Dax, kept talking about Dax. And she's like, it's a Dax.
I'm like, what do you mean it's a Dax? Like, she is called Dax, as I'm not understanding. And how did she live?
How is she saying that she had sex with McCoy? How is she saying that she knew all this thing?
And like, she doesn't look like she's a hundred years old. No, I'm not. I'm not even talking about Dax.
Oh, OK. Well, there's two things. I'm talking about the fact that, well, possibly three.
So the link I'm talking about is that Darwin is an undercover Klingon who's been of course changed
to look human. Of course. Yeah. And we see that in Discovery Season 2, don't we? Yeah, too.
We find out that actually he's not human and he's Klingon. So we get that link.
And then I was really intrigued to know if you said about in the latest season of Discovery,
they find a time orb or something that does the whole time thing. Is it the time orb from the Deep Space Nine episode?
Is it Bajoran or not? Yeah, I don't. I don't think it is that. It's some other thing.
But yeah, so that so Dax is one of those symbiotic. Yeah, she's a trill. So she has a trill.
That's the race. Yeah, she has a slug inside her basically that when her body dies, they move it.
And you later on in Deep Space Nine. So I think it's in about a series time.
The Dax we know and love, who is a brilliant Dax. She is so good as that character dies.
And then we get a much younger new Dax. Yeah. And I think it's Ezra Dax is the new one.
I can't remember what. Oh, Jadzia Dax. That's it. So yeah, Jadzia dies and then Ezra appears.
And not wanting to spoil it, Jadzia marries someone on the station.
And it's not who has been a sex pest for that the entire series of Deep Space Nine.
But then the new Dax is just like, yeah, no, sorry, that's the old Dax. See you later. Yeah.
It's a really horrible kind of situation. They're kind of they're basically the Stargate gold, gold, aren't they?
Yeah, they're gold. Yeah, no, you're you're you're bang on.
That's exactly where that kind of comes around. And funny enough, the episode of the TNG I watched is the first true that I come across in TNG.
And what's funny is in the TNG, the slug is this giant half American football sized thing.
But when we see it in Deep Space Nine, it's a much smaller, daintier thing. Yeah.
They've got the trill in Discovery and I didn't even clock that they were the same because then because I don't say the word trill in this episode at all.
And the kind of facial stuff is exactly the same, obviously, but I didn't clock at any point.
Is that future discovery or future?
Future, so it's not not old timey discovery. So I was just going to say because if that was the case, obviously, then we kind of get that hold.
Oh, because if they are in the old Discovery, so when they're back in the original series era, as it were, then it's a bit of a weird one because Dax obviously is covering up her trill marks to be on the Enterprise when they travel back in time.
But if trills are existing as part of the Federation, why did she cover them up?
There's a character in it. I don't know if they're actually part of the Federation or if they're just on the ship.
Oh, fair enough. That I'm not sure.
That could just be all it is. But I'll just say just little things like that.
If you've got, you're going to go back to pre all of this generation, you've got to kind of make sure you're up, you stick with the law of it if you're planning on staying within the same storylines as it were.
But otherwise, no, I'm going back to Deep Space Nine. Yeah, the only it really did tickle me that holy shit. Yeah, we've got this discovery link of a human Klingon sort of thing.
So that did make me laugh.
But yeah, you find out about Jadzia way more if you go back and watch series one of Deep Space Nine, you'll find out all about it.
Yeah, I'll have to watch a lot of Deep Space Nine. I've barely seen any of it.
Like I said in my rant that was released last week, it is some of the best storytelling you'll get from Star Trek in Deep Space Nine.
I mean, I know that's an opinion thing, but I do think the stories in Deep Space Nine are better than almost all of the other treks. Yeah.
So what it lacks in some ways, it makes up in that way.
So, shall we talk about the episode as it runs through? I think that's a very good idea.
Accessing library computer data.
So we start off and they're in Kardashian space collecting an orb.
Yeah, collecting an orb.
And that is where it starts on the actual shuttle when the temporal agents come first, isn't it?
Because it's Cisco talking about Cisco kind of reliving it and explaining it to the temporal agents who are like this great little comedy duo, aren't they?
They're proper like straight out of X-Files or something, aren't they? The guys in the black suits, men in black or something.
That was exactly I was trying to think of what it was. It's men in black where you get that typical trope of we don't tell jokes here.
Yeah, they say they don't tell jokes, but clearly they're deadpanning all the jokes. They're clearly two funny guys.
Very much so.
So yeah, they go and meet Cisco and he starts explaining to them exactly what happened.
And I'd like to point out immediately I noticed he has a proper mug. He has a big solid mug with a handle.
Cisco Deep Space Nine is the first Star Trek where they're using proper drinking utensils.
It's like we're on Deep Space Nine. We can't have nice things here. We can't have little fine bone china teacups.
We have to have mugs.
It's a big, heavy, almost tankard-esque mug. Green. It was beautiful. And he plonked it down.
It went down with a thud and I was like, yes, Cisco, at last. It's normal. This dude is normal.
So you could just imagine it would be like, oh no, the Cardassians are invading. Grab the mug. Smashing it around their heads as they invade the bridge.
Knock everyone out with Cisco's mug. Yeah.
Yeah. And my little note here is something, something Orb of Time. Yeah. They go on.
He starts talking about collecting the Orb of Time. And I was so surprised. We see Worf. I had no idea Worf was in Deep Space Nine.
I've literally seen so little of Deep Space Nine. They didn't know Worf was in it.
To give you a really quick rundown of how that happens. So Next Generation finished.
We then get the Next Generation film Generations. Deanna Troi crashes the Enterprise, destroying it.
No one should have let her drive, but there you go. Enterprise is destroyed and they all are out of job, basically.
And Worf then ends up going to Deep Space Nine. Right.
And that's why in First Contact, if you remember the beginning of First Contact, they're having to do nebular crap while the Borg are being confronted.
And then Picard's just like, screw this and takes the Enterprise E in to go and destroy the Borg cube.
Report. Main power's offline. We've lost shields. Our weapons are gone.
Perhaps today is a good day to die. Prepare for ramming speed.
Sir, there's another starship coming in. It's the Enterprise.
And they save the Defiant from being blown up and they beam Worf back.
Riker makes the whole quip about, let's say a strong little ship and Worf goes, what do you mean little?
And Picard says, well, while you're here, you're back.
And that's because he's on the Defiant, which is part of Deep Space Nine. And that's where he's been.
And is he any survivor of it?
No, there's a few people on the Defiant, I think, but they basically just take him off Defiant and just leave the others.
Oh, we're just nicking.
No, I'm sure they do probably rescue all the other Defiant crew.
But yeah, it's the idea is that that's why he's back into the Enterprise at that point, because yeah, they killed him.
Well, they didn't kill him. They killed off the Enterprise in Generations and they used Worf into Deep Space Nine instead.
Yeah. And they are flying around in Defiant at the moment and it can cloak.
It can. So yeah, the Defiant is so many things you've missed by not watching Deep Space Nine.
It's an experimental ship that Cisco has helped build. It's got a stolen cloak, which is illegal because it breaks all sort of treaties.
And it gets used quite heavily. But it's basically a gunship.
It's a ship that's probably got more weapons than it does actual anything else.
I was going to say, I'm pretty sure I've watched a video about all the different starships and someone wrote how many cannons and stuff it's got.
And it is literally like a flying tank with millions of turrets and could just wipe anything out.
And they just don't use it in that way.
It's a full on gunship, which is why you've got Worf in first contact saying, right, fire everything.
Right, fuck it. Prepare for ramming speed, because honestly, it'd probably survive.
Yeah. Insane.
And then, yeah, they go through a particular kind of radiation. Would you like to know what the kind of radiation it is?
Oh, go on then.
It is a chronotron radiation.
Right. So, yeah, so they get chronotron radiation being picked up.
And that's the radiation you always get around time travel in Star Trek. It's always the chronotons.
That's it. So they hit some chronotron radiation.
And I thought this was like foreshadowing for something that happened later, but it's actually just what happens.
They say, oh, our shields have been dropped. The teleporter has been activated. And he's like, oh, raise the shields.
And then they kind of don't really say anything about it at all. It doesn't really get mentioned again.
But I think that must be the moment that the baddie teleports himself off of their ship and on to the Enterprise.
That's exactly it. So the chronotron radiation appears because the bad guy has activated the time sphere, the time orb.
They then end up going back and you can't buy Star Trek rules and law and whatever else you want to go.
Except for in the final film of the original series Star Trek films, you can't beam under cloak and you can't fire under cloak.
So to get off the ship, you've got to drop out of cloak and then do what you want to do.
So, yeah, that's why then. So, yeah, the bad guy activates the time sphere and then turns off the cloak and escapes the ship.
And do we go back very quickly to Cisco again?
Because we have a sexy Deep Space Nine intro. Well, we see the Enterprise. It gives you a shot of the Enterprise.
Excuse me. And then we have the really cool deep space nine intro and then Cisco is explaining to them that the temporal guys about it.
Now, one of the temporal guys makes a little quip. He's like, oh, no, it's Kirk.
Now, they know about him because he's had a few temporal violations himself.
Fourteen, wasn't it? Seventeen, they say. Seventeen. So he's had 17 temporal violations himself.
It'd be interesting to find out if that's if any of those are actually an episode, like if all 17 are episodes that you could count.
They will be. I bet they will be. They haven't just made a number up.
And I bet one of them includes generations. Yeah. Seeing that's a whole temporal thing as well.
But yeah, I thought that was very good. I like the fact they've got kind of this history going on with everything that they're discussing.
And it's just ongoing. Yeah. Because then you realise it's a little bit redundant
because if someone fucks up the timeline, all their data is wrong anyway. Yeah. Because it all changes.
Well, wait, wait, wait. Again, computer program. Right.
Strap yourselves in, everybody.
These idiots are going to start talking about time travel like they don't literally share a single brain cell between the two of them.
Feel free to fast forward three minutes and 50 seconds if you don't want to hear all this timey wimey bollocks.
They wouldn't know. I think he might say this later is like, say the timelines change and they will.
We wouldn't know the time they could have changed. So their data would always be right because it would have changed.
So nothing would have changed for them. They wouldn't know it's changed.
So it's almost like the temporal police are kind of pointless because what are they policing?
Because it's always going to change if he goes back in time and kills. So, you know, Kirk had died, for example,
then they could just go, you can't go back in time to save Kirk in our timeline. Kirk died. You have to let him die.
Well, not just that. Let's say they went back and killed Kirk.
Then you wouldn't get the all the origins of the films that they go through, which are huge for kind of like the Federation and Klingon piece.
And actually, when they came back, they wouldn't be meeting with the temporal police because they probably wouldn't be on Deep Space Nine at that point.
In fact, most of them probably wouldn't exist.
Well, that's it. Well, that's the thing. You would they can't go back. I don't think.
It opens so many holes and so many issues with going backwards and forwards with time.
That's why I try and I know we've said a few points about it, but I always try and gloss over the potentially inaccuracies or things that happen in it,
because what are you going to do? You can't make it perfect because there's always a hole.
There's always a loophole somewhere that's going to screw something up.
You either can go back if you haven't changed a single thing or if what you go back to do is meant to happen as part of a loop, then that's all good.
But if you went back and actually did something, it's like one of those other theory that if you could go back in time, you cut it's actually impossible to change the past
because for you to have got that position, you were you have to do that.
Everything you do in the past is already happened. So you can't go back in time to kill Hitler because if you went back in time to try and kill Hitler,
something happens that stops you from killing Hitler because it doesn't happen. It just straight up doesn't happen.
And that's kind of implying that there aren't multi dimensions and stuff.
But that's why I like the whole string universe theory, because if you're going to go down the route of time travel, the string universe theory is the one that makes the most sense.
You go back and you change something, it's not going to affect your current future because otherwise you would never have transported back in the first place.
And then you get that whole infinite loop of, well, if I change something and I don't exist, how did I come back in time in the first place to do this?
Whereas with the whole string theory idea is you go back and change and that's now just a new string and it's going to go off in its own historical route of whatever you've changed.
You're still exists, but in their dimension or their timeline is now different to yours.
Well, doesn't Doctor Who explain it by being like you're inside the TARDIS's time kind of window.
So by you going back in time, you're now outside of time.
So you can't back to the future yourself because now you are pulled out of any timeline that exists until you go back again.
I'm not sure because don't forget we get that whole episode with Christopher Eccleston and Billy when she tries to save her dad from being run over and we get the weird devil angel things flying out the sky trying to kill them because she's screwed with the timeline.
Yes, you're right. Those weird things. I think we need to do.
We're going to have to do a time travel episode at some point. Oh, definitely.
Definitely. Anyway, right. Blimey.
Thank fuck. That's over. Now let's get on with it.
I've got a nail appointment at 3pm. Yeah, we finished with the agents and they were back on the define and we're getting a mission briefing with O'Brien and Wharf
basically saying we've worked out where we are. We know when we are. This is what we think Darwin is doing. By the way, he's clean on. Yeah.
And they all start getting their costumes on. Yeah, which proves a point from four weeks ago. Obviously the replicators make uniforms. Yeah.
Because you wouldn't just carry around some original sick. I mean, oh, right. Quickly check the defiance fancy dress cupboard. I'm sure we've got some old stuff in there.
Yeah, it makes sense for Holodeck stuff, though, doesn't it? If you think about it, it's not like the Holodeck's going to have a matrix esque kind of thing of all the weapons coming out of all different clothes from any kind of possible scenario you could think of.
It's not going to happen. It probably does do that, but then replicates it for you rather than actually having it physically there.
Exactly. It was a little bit weird and it felt a little bit. This was actually if I have a criticism, I'd say this is a little tiny, tiny, tiny one.
It was really weird that they did the whole filming of the putting on the uniform and it felt like it was a beginning of a 90s music video.
So you've got them pulling on the top, pulling up the boots. It's like this. This is a little weird.
I feel like maybe this is directed here by Jonathan West. I'm looking at the Wikipedia. It makes you wonder if this guy kind of he was like a special guy to come in and do a director of one episode.
You know how like Jonathan Frakes did a few. Maybe this is a similar scenario where you get these cool random episodes because they get like these random directors or random writers come in to do special episodes.
Maybe that's why it feels a little bit different. But there's a good joke. Kind of the first time I really noticed that actually this is a funny episode and that is when Dax, they're saying about different clothes and she's like, and women wore less.
And she's got this really skimpy skirt.
I'm just going to say 12 year old me and even 40 year old me. Holy fuck. She is hot.
I mean, I always, oh mate, she was definitely would have been a pin up girl for me throughout my teenage years watching Deep Space Nine.
But her and the original series outfits, which were disgustingly skimpy, even if you look at the original series, they were tiny.
But man, she looks good in it.
It looks like Dax is going to be the poster on Ensign Tom's.
That is a good idea. You've got the female Vulcan from Enterprise.
T'Pol.
Whatever her name. T'Pol.
And I'm going to have Jadzia Dax.
Yeah.
Oh yeah, I like that.
And this is when we get a really good look at the set too. They're walking through the corridor of the Enterprise. But it's such a good job recreating the sets.
Oh, so much, so much just care and attention was put into it. I know this was around the 30th anniversary of Star Trek Full Stop, which again, I think that's another 30 years ago at this point.
Well, nearly 30 years ago. So I know they would have put more money into this, especially as it was the original series they were working with.
But it's just so well done. Everything about it, the uniforms, the style. I can't place anything wrong with it.
Yeah.
It was just it. It's perfect.
Next we get O'Brien and the really young looking Doctor stuck in the lift because they can't figure out how the lifts work.
Which is again a brilliant moment. And then they have that bit, I won't tell if you don't.
Yeah, because really you actually have to hold the handle and speak, which is an odd thing.
But that's a joke lifted from Star Trek for the Voyage Home, the film. I don't know if you remember. That's the one where they go back in time to save the whales.
One of the 17 times Kirk broke the Temple Lord.
We've got two we've mentioned already.
And Scotty picks up the mouse to the Mac and goes, hello computer.
And it's like he gets given the keyboard. It's like, oh, how quaint.
And that's exactly the same joke, isn't it? They're on the original Enterprise and they're expecting everything to be voice command. And it's not.
Well, that's like I saw some great videos of this guy. What's his name? Pirate Software is his kind of username.
I know who you mean. Yeah. His name's Thor, I think.
And he did a Minecraft kind of convention thing and they had loads of computers set up for kids.
And he said he made a point that half of the kids went to touch the screen because they thought it was touchscreen, even though the keyboard and mouse were in front of them.
And then they had to give them all controllers because none of them could use the keyboard and mouse.
So it's that kind of happening in real life. You can imagine Scotty never using a mouse before. It's the same as our kids. Don't know how to use a mouse and keyboard.
Oh, dear. But yeah, so that's Dr. Julian Bashir again, as you don't know, Deep Space Nine.
He is the Geordie of Deep Space Nine.
He basically every opportunity he gets for the first four seasons is trying to lay Jadzia every episode.
Oh, gross. And it is pretty great. It's actually uncomfortable.
Yeah, I don't like that stuff. But it's kind of of the era. Not saying that that's right, but like Geordie always trying to get laid, it's just a little bit more constant with Bashir.
But do you feel sorry for Bashir's actor for it?
Yes, because his character, excluding that, is phenomenal. He's got a really good character arc and the actor himself is brilliant.
Yeah. It's just really disappointing that they felt the need to do that. And it is. But anyway, you will find out about that when we watch more Deep Space Nine.
Then we see the first bit now of really good blue screening, because it's when Odo is in the background where the in the mess room after he spoke to that lady about getting Klingon coffee.
You see the trader at the bar talking to the barman and he gets a treble out and you see Odo in the background.
And that's the first time I was like, oh, oh, well, that's cool. And he looks like he's meant to be there. He looks like there's no I couldn't spot in the short time that you see it.
Any kind of normal blue screen artifacts you can see around stuff. It probably looked even better before it got HD-ified.
Well, that's the thing. So Deep Space Nine, I'm pretty sure like Voyager has never been remastered. Hundreds of thousands of people want it remastered, but they stopped at TNG.
Don't ask why. Don't know. But you're right. Watching Deep Space Nine now on the bigger screen in the original format is a risk because obviously it was designed for CRT TVs or small SD ones.
And yeah, now we've got them on this big HD screen. You'd expect to maybe see the rough edges of things. But in this episode, that doesn't exist.
Didn't see it. It looked brilliant. Thought I'd always been there. Miranda said to me that when it originally aired, they actually aired the original episode first before the Deep Space Nine one.
That I couldn't tell you, but I would not be surprised if they did, because that sounds a very good idea.
Yeah. So you remember watching that and then watching that one straight after. I've just made a comment. This episode's funny. It is. And Worf's here now and he's saying the Tribbles are the mortal enemies of the Klingon Empire.
Oh, got the whole story of like the Klingons sending out Klingons across the galaxy to exterminate them. It's like, wow, you've taken that too far. I love it.
And even Odo's there going, really? And he's there being really cute, isn't he? He's like doing a little boobie talk like this to the Tribble like it's a little pussycat.
He told me Tribbles like everyone, but this one doesn't seem to like you. The feelings. Feelings mutual. They are detestable creatures.
Interesting. It's been my observation that most humanoids love soft furry animals, especially if they make pleasing sounds.
They do nothing but consume food and breed. If you feed that thing more than the smallest morsel in a few hours, you'll have 10 Tribbles, then 100, then a thousand.
Calm down.
They were once considered mortal enemies of the Klingon Empire.
As a character that I historically don't like, Odo, I think I'm going to have to watch them all again.
Well, just watch them. But whichever ones I've seen, I've always not liked his character and I can't place what it is because I like the actor.
I just don't know why I don't like the character.
You're designed not to meant to like him.
Really?
You're meant to be an antagonist rather than a protagonist for a lot of them.
It's a weird flip actually.
So Quark, as much as he should probably be in Federation jail for the majority of Deep Space Nine for the things he does, and trust me, you will get there.
We will get there.
The number of times Quark is involved in making Deep Space Nine nearly fall to an enemy because he's invited them on board for illegal trading or invited people to come on knowing that they're there to kill someone from the Federation.
He'd be in jail by this point.
He should be the protagonist, the antagonist, sorry, the bad guy. But instead you tend to find Quark is more the protagonist and Odo, who should be the protagonist, often ends up feeling like the antagonist because he's stopping the fun.
And that's the reason. He is the person there to kind of keep everything moving forward and in a straight, narrow kind of line and legal. And he does it so well that it comes across on TV like, God, he's a party pooper. I don't like him.
But there are some good episodes where you actually get his whole background and again the character art for him and you start to not just feel sorry for him, but you will develop an emotional attachment to him.
Yeah. I think you said to me before he gets better by the end.
Oh, 100%.
One episode I've seen loads and we've talked about before is the one where he gets stuck in the lift with that woman.
With Troy's mum.
Yeah, because I didn't know that was Troy's mum. Yeah, I remember you telling me it was Troy's mum.
Is he the same race as what they're scared of in Picard?
Yeah, he's a changeling. So Deep Space Nine, basically, he is the first changeling that anyone has ever come across. The Cardassians used him as kind of a pet and then eventually let him be the security officer.
And then the Federation came along and said, no, we want you to stay as the Federal as the security officer here. But then in Deep Space Nine, we come across more of the changelings.
And then it's those changelings that start, I think it's the Dominion War or help with the Dominion War and they turn out to be utter shits. And obviously they hold the grudge all the way through to Picard.
And I don't need to go back to a big lake of liquid or something.
Yeah, he goes to the big Jizz Pool in the sky.
Right. So that's where they all go eventually, is that they all have to return when their time is up.
They don't have to. I can't remember, if I'll be honest. They can go back and they can merge into it and then it's like swimming around with millions of your own family.
And you can come out of it though.
Yeah, you can come out of it or you can just start. His rule that is set up in Deep Space Nine is whereas we go to sleep, he has to not have form. He needs to be a puddle in a bucket.
Right. Yeah, that was the thing. Yeah, because he goes in a dress or something. Yeah.
Yeah. And what they kind of say is the Great Lake where all the other changelings are, they've chosen just to stay in the Great Lake rather than take form most of the time.
Right. Okay.
Where were we? Yeah, red alarms go off.
Yeah, and the Klingons turn up.
Yeah, we see this great bit where we see a ship full of people. There's people everywhere.
We're walking around. Even I think Dax mentioned it earlier. It's like, oh, they really pack them in.
It's really busy.
Yeah.
Yes, they really pack them in.
She toes on about a guy called Ike. I've written down Iks Groth.
Oh, I thought she meant Gout.
Was it? She says Groth, I thought, whatever it is. Somebody seems to know. I don't know who that is.
Yeah. So basically that's an old Klingon friend of hers from when she used to be a man.
Right. So when Sisko first knew, so Sisko is best friends with Dax and Sisko is best friends with the Dax that became Jadzia Dax.
So he's having to get to know this new Dax all over again in Deep Space Nine, basically. Although she's got all the memories of all the lifetimes the Triller's been through, when you become a new host, you start your own life with their memories and their teachings and everything like that.
Yeah.
So you can choose to do what, so you might not be friends with the people that you were friends with previously.
It just so happens that they do become friends and they stay friends. But yeah, she was also friends with Klingons previously.
Yeah. So really this episode does a lot of chopping and changing, doesn't it? It goes around with Dax and Sisko, then it chops between O'Brien and Dr. Man. What's his name again? Sorry.
Dr. Bashir.
There's a lot of flip-flopping between the two of them throughout. And we go back to another lift scene and we get a little bit of I'm my own grandpa.
Many, many years ago when I was 23, I was married to a widow.
Stop. You'll really get us in trouble with this one. We don't need Ray Stevens on our arse.
Yeah, we get back to the future.
Back to the future where this lady is flirting with Bashir and turns out he has a feeling that that might be his great grandmother.
Yeah.
And I just love that. I instantly just said to her, I'm my own grandpa. And luckily O'Brien gets them out of there and they teleport, I think.
And I kind of thought, what a shame they didn't use the original teleporting image.
That would have been nice.
Just in case they got caught teleporting, you know, I'm sure that all the sparkles and stuff, they could have just had a little bit of fun with it and be like, oh, we have to make the teleporter look like the old teleporter.
Hang on, O'Brien. What we're going to do, we've got a whole canister of glitter here.
We're going to transport the glitter above your head and then we're going to transport you back. So just stand there in the glitter and it will be fine.
Yeah. I kind of, I got this fun of vague memory of one of the visual effects guys for the original series saying it's actually just a torch shining on tin foil of how they did the graphic.
That I can't remember, but that does sound very familiar. It would have been something similar to that. And then it would have been overlaid over the original.
Yeah. When we kind of shoot forward a little bit, Dax proclaims that she actually fancies Spock and not Kirk when she sees them both talking on the machine.
This is another great scene where we see Spock and Kirk go up to like a communicating to what even now is actually probably out of date, really a phone or a wall, essentially.
It's like a house phone. Like, I don't think they'd really be doing that.
Well, don't forget. So the original series, I believe Gene Roddenberry aimed for it to feel very like the Navy.
Yeah.
And if you look at naval ships or 50s, 60s and even you didn't have radios and stuff. You had wall panels that you ran up to to speak to the bridge or so. Yeah, actually it kind of fits with where Gene Roddenberry originally.
Yeah. But we said that all the time that they kind of look almost like submarines or naval vessels. We keep saying that, don't we? It feels like that's the kind of feel they're going for. Yeah, you're right. That does suit it.
But at the same time, you're thinking they're so far in the future. He would just flip out his little communicator, wouldn't he?
Yes, basically.
Yeah. And then we have another really funny bit where they're like, they're all in the mess hall and there's a Klingons there. And then the staff goes, oh, yeah, the Klingons over there.
And they're like, there's Klingons in here. And obviously they don't look anything like what Klingons are. And then they all just slowly turn to wharf.
It's a long story. That three heads converge into that kind of little loats, that central bit on the screen. And then so, yeah, I don't we don't talk about it. And we don't talk about it with outsiders.
Yeah, it's really is a really funny little little bit because I don't know if they really have said why. If it was like.
I don't think they do. And I think it's an ongoing joke because like in Picard season three, wharf basically gets exactly the same line when it's joked that it was wharf's fault about the Enterprise E.
And wharf said we don't talk about that. It's almost exactly the same thing again. So it's like, wharf, are you holding secrets from us here?
And then we have the fight scene that we alluded to earlier. Who is it? We've got Scotty. Does it Chekov?
You've got Scotty, Chekov and the guy they mistake for Kirk, some other guy.
Yeah, no idea who that's meant to be. And then a guy, crew member number three.
Even that, that was incredible. The swapping between the real TOS episode and then characters that have been made up to look like the ones that we see.
And the interchanging of it, just all of it, unbelievably clever. Yeah, they have a big ruck.
And obviously wharf is probably one of the least adept fighting characters there. He has a bit of a fight, but you'll notice, I think, I think Bashir has some really good little fighty bits.
And like he looks like he walloped somebody actually hurts them. And you see Chekov fighting the Klingon, does no damage. He's like punching the Klingon in the chest.
Nothing happens. And then you just kind of see wharf kind of grappling with someone who's like, come on, you're meant to be this, we say it all the time, you're meant to be this super duper tactical Klingon dude.
Beat the crap out of everyone. Like he does in Picard, they fixed him in Picard.
Yes they did. They finally fixed him in Picard. It only took him being in his third generation of Star Trek series to get fixed.
I kind of get the idea that that's because he's finally accepted who he is. And he's finally accepted everything that's happened with all the meditation, the stuff we see in Picard that he's doing.
Whereas Deep Space Nine and TNG, he's still deeply troubled by the fact that he's Klingon, but he's not been brought up Klingon. And that he's this kind of, he's the black sheep of the Klingon race.
And all of the TNG and Deep Space Nine is him coming to terms with that. Whereas I like to think Picard, he's finally come to terms with that, which allows him to actually use his full potential.
I agree with that I think. And then the two idiots get arrested.
Yes they all get arrested.
I think we have my favourite scene now in the entire show where they have the line up and they've got Bashir and O'Brien in the line up and Kirk addresses them directly.
I want to see this scene from the original one. They must have just overlaid them onto two other people.
They did.
Okay, that must be what they did. And they must have, he must interact with a random crew member who is now being voice replaced by O'Brien, I'm assuming.
Yes.
Because I haven't seen the original episode. And it is, in my opinion, it's flawless.
It looks exactly like they're there.
Again, for something that happened in 1996, this is so good. I think if it happened now and it was a Marvel film it would look shit.
It would all be done by CGI and it would have the uncanny valley side thing so something wouldn't look right.
I tell you actually, the best way to describe it, it would be like Disney and the second Tron film, which I can't remember its name.
I haven't seen them.
Oh, really? Okay, well, I will very quickly send you a picture of what I'm talking about.
So in the second Tron film, they had a, just called Tron Legacy. Sorry, that's it.
And basically they carry on the story from the original Tron film. Now the original Tron film you have to watch and actually I've got a really big soft spot for Tron.
I've seen the original Tron film.
Oh, good.
I thought you were saying there's two new ones.
I don't know. So that continued. So Tron Legacy carries on and there was another Tron film coming.
But they basically CGI'd Jeff Bridges to look young. So they had old Jeff Bridges and they had new Jeff Bridges.
And I am sending you the image via WhatsApp now so we can do this live.
Okay. I was looking at the riverside.
You will see what I mean. It looks amazing, but there's something not right.
Oh, yeah, that's weird. Well, you think you can tell it's him but tell it's not.
Yeah, it's something is unsettling about it and it's almost always the eyes or the skin texture.
It's the skin texture. That is the skin texture on him. It's too...
In that it's particularly the skin texture, but in other things...
It's too smooth.
Yeah. And in fact, there's another one. I'm just trying to find a decent quality of it.
When you're watching it, it's pretty good when you watch it because he's obviously moving.
And I'll send you this smaller version of it because obviously you see what I mean.
It looks good when it's small, but you can still see there's something not right.
And for me, it's always the eyes. You look at the eyes and either they're not quite looking in the right direction or the right location.
That looks better.
It does look better, but it's still not right. And you can't put your finger on what it is.
And if we were talking about trials and tribulations now, this is what they would do.
They wouldn't necessarily use all the old footage. What they would do is they recreate the footage and they'd use CGI.
Face mapping.
They've done that with a Star Wars. I don't want to spoil for anybody that hasn't seen it.
They literally do that. They bring someone...
Rogue One. They did that in there as well. Peter Cushing's face, wasn't it?
Yeah. No, you're right. And they do that quite well, I'd actually say. That's very good.
That is a good one.
They do it in... What's the Bounty Hunter guy?
Oh, Boba Fett.
The other one. Mandalorian. They do it in Mandalorian Season 2. They bring Luke Skywalker into it at one point.
And I bet it doesn't look very good.
It looks very good. But they used somebody who looked like him a bit.
And then they did obviously a face thing onto his face.
And it's convincing enough. I wasn't there going, oh, that looks weird. It's convincing enough.
But that's fine. But Disney are involved and Disney has the moolah.
Whereas if this was modern day Star Trek, even with the budget that Paramount puts into it, I don't think they'd put enough into it.
Disney have the moolah, but they don't pay their guys enough or give them enough time.
I mean, you've seen some of the recent Marvel ones like the Doctor Strange with the eye.
The third eye is awful in that film.
And I haven't seen the Ant-Man film, but that stretched out guy. I've not seen that film yet.
Yeah, Modoc is awful. It's just a joke. I wouldn't actually watch it. It will break Marvel for you more than it already is.
But look, we're getting away from it. So they're at the line up. Yep. O'Brien gets to speak to Kirk, albeit saying, I don't know who started it.
And then it comes to Chekov. And the transition is beautiful. It's not faulted.
And then they're all sent off to their quarters and told, right, stay in your quarters until this is dealt with.
Yeah. And then the kind of story just a bit, a bit of a progressive bit, they realized that baddie, they capture the baddie guy, don't they? Because they spot him at the end of the fights at Odo and Worf bringing back.
They discover that there's a bomb inside one of the tribbles. So they have to start scanning the ship.
So Cisco and Dax go to the bridge to try and use the bridge computers to quickly scan everywhere.
We get another beautiful bit of blue screening where Kirk looks straight at Dax and Dax kind of grins back at him and smiles back at him.
Oh, it's because he sits on a triple, doesn't he? When he sits on his chair, he sits on one.
Yeah, she's kind of oopsie.
Yeah, oops. And then it kind of is the next bit where we then are in the mess hall and this is the bit where Cisco's kind of sat front facing on the table.
Not quite. So basically they're scanning and then it goes to Odo, Worf and Bashir scanning all the tribbles.
They say, right, we've done two decks, but there's no way we're going to find it. We get the joke that Jed Sears said, well, yes, there's 1,577,000 and whatever the number is.
Yeah.
Yeah. And this is because they populate at this speed, blah, blah, blah. So we get all of that and Cisco's like, oh, sorry, no.
Yeah, Cisco then said, well, we'll go to the bridge and we'll scan from there. No, sorry. I'm all about.
Right. So, yeah, they've come off the bridge to message them. They give their update and then they say, well, we'll go to the mess hall and we'll stay close to Kirk and find out where he's going.
And maybe that will give us an idea where the bomb is, which is fine because that's what they do.
And they find out that they're going to the grain silo basically, which is where the bomb triple must be.
But he goes to get himself a chicken sandwich and I think coffee.
Now, he doesn't call it a food replicator. Well, it's not replicated.
So, again, original series. It's so old that it's set up in a way that in the 50s, 60s and 70s, when you used to go to a lower cost restaurant, what you did is they would have a wall full of serving hatches.
And what you do is you go on, lift it up and take your food out of the hatch. And basically, you know what was in each hatch roughly.
And you take it and then you go and pay for it. And then what would happen is there'd be cooks in the kitchen behind the hatches.
And any time there's a slot empty, another dish would then be pushed in. And that's exactly what's happening on the Enterprise.
And that's what we saw in the Enterprise episode we watched where the alien race, the quarks race.
Oh, the Ferengi. And he goes and nicks all those pies and stuff.
Yeah. But what's interesting is in original series and also in Enterprise, you get the idea that actually, well, not the idea, you know that the cook cooks specifically for the captain of the ship.
And the food is bought to them normally. But I like the fact that in the original series, they don't just have food bought to them all the time.
It's just like, I found you a sandwich. I'll just quickly nip in the metal and I'll grab one.
Yeah. And his is covered in tribbles.
Yes. And there's just tribbles everywhere. And they call it a food processor is actually what he calls it. They're in the food processor is what Scotty says.
That's the actual wording he uses.
Yes, they're in the machinery. He comes in, the tribbles are everywhere, Captain. They're in the machinery.
And then Spock says they're in the vents. Oh, there's other vents on the space station like these vents at the grain.
Yeah. And that's where they know, oh, right. That's where we're going. Yeah. And then it clips to them coming down the ladder into the grain and they start scanning the thousands of tribbles in there.
Yeah. And then we have it's kind of they're in the hatch. I think, aren't they? Where Kirk is underneath and he opens the hatch and all the tribbles start falling on him.
And they're in that one where they're all falling out. So obviously they're trying to find it while the tribbles are landing on Kirk's head.
Obviously they find it. Two classic comedy moments there because basically they cut between.
So Cisco throws a triple. Yeah. And then it goes to Kirk and you see a triple drop out the hatch and hit him in the head. Yeah. And it's like, oh, so Cisco threw that, didn't it? Yeah.
And then Zia does it again in a bit and you get to see it again. I did notice that they're quite happy to just throw the tribbles around after they've scanned them.
These are actual creatures. Yeah. OK. You might not like them, but they're just being themselves. They're living their best lives just eating and fucking.
You know, and you're just chucking them around just because they're upsetting you. You know.
So the funny thing is, is again, they follow on from the original series properly. So in the original series, they check the grain and the grain is poisoned.
And that's why the tribbles are dead. Yeah. And that's why they go down. Well, they're gorged on poisoned grain.
So they knew it was poisoned without scanning the grain because it's already happened in their history.
So they know at this point that grain is poisoned and Kirk will find that out. Yeah.
And then Spock says the exact same number of tribbles that Jack said.
And then carries on with the description as well with their replication rate over three days it would be.
Yeah. That was a very funny little bit.
Let me see if I can remember. It was like the 10 tribbles every 12 hours across 24 hours.
Yeah. Then across three days, I think it then cuts out. But it's just very, very funny that they have that moment revisited.
I'm just saying it's the comedy moment again, isn't it? It's been done purely as the comedy thing, because again, Dax shrugs her shoulders while looking at Cisco going, I did say.
So 10 every 12 hours. So through asexual reproduction, tribbles can produce with liters of 10 every 12 hours, all of whom will then go on to do the same.
A single triple could therefore have over 1.7 million descendants over the course of three days.
And even McCoy even comes on to screen at one point, doesn't he? He says, well, Jim, as far as I can tell, they're born pregnant.
Yeah, they're born pregnant. Yeah.
They find the triple. They beam it off into space where it blows up.