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Podcasts. We post something new every week and
you're going to find it informative. We want
to welcome to Veterans Radio. A Marine, Trevor
Reed. Trevor, welcome to Veterans Radio. Hey,
thank you for having me. Well, you have a book
out detailing a portion of your life that kind
of reads like, I can't believe you lived to write
about this. And the book is called Retribution,
A U .S. Marine's Fight for Justice, From the
Russian Gulag to Ukraine's Frontlines, coming
out here in January of 2026. Let's do a little
bit about your marine time because it layers
back into some of the problems you had in Russia
Tell us how a nice kid like you ended up in the
Marines and some of your duty stations Sure,
I guess we could go Way back but You know whenever
I was a kid I think I wanted to be like a detective
with my pet dog And then September 11th happened.
And shortly thereafter, there was all of the
footage from Afghanistan and Iraq. And I really
started to want to go into the military. And
later I found out that my dad had been a Marine.
You know that was enough for me. I decided that's
what I was gonna do after high school I did Like
one semester at a community college After high
school and I decided okay now this wasn't for
me and so I enlisted I went into the Marine Corps
in 2011 And then in boot camp I got selected,
uh, to, to become part of the presidential support
program program. And, uh, went through that whole
process, went through infantry school. Um, then
they sent me to additional training at security
forces school. And then onto eighth and I, uh,
where are like pre pre -duty, um, you know, Selection
was to guard the commandant and the commandant's
house there at the Marine Corps Barracks, Washington
so after my clearance processed I got sent to
Camp David and I did that for about 18 months
Met the president there got a couple of photos
with the president. It was President Obama at
the time and Afterwards, after 18 months, you
get basically to choose your next duty station.
So I chose to go to the Fleet Marine Force at
3rd Battalion 1st Marines at Camp Pendleton,
which was my dad's old unit. Did one deployment
with the 15th MEU to Southeast Asia, the Middle
East, Africa. I think I only had a month remaining
on my contract whenever I got out. And then shortly
thereafter, I got hired by Academy, formerly
known as Blackwater, to be a contractor for the
Diplomatic Security Service in Afghanistan. You
ultimately got out of that aspect of your life
and went on to school. Tell us a little bit about
the international studies and the languages that
you were looking into, because this all leads
you to going to meet a woman you met online in
Russia. So you got to kind of get us, how did
we get from that phase of life over to the next?
Sure. So I actually met Lena when I was contracting,
when I was in Afghanistan. Lot of guys would
stay out of the US for most of the year because
you get a tax break if you stay out of the US
for so many days and A lot of these guys would
just go to Europe somewhere And you know meet
up with girls. They have met online so I met
Lena who was from Moscow. Well, actually she's
from Volgograd, but she lived in Moscow and We
started talking during that time and she wanted
me to come visit Russia but I was pretty nervous
about going to Russia. She was too nervous to
come to the United States so we ended up meeting
in Greece. I fell in love there immediately and
then after that we started Relationship which
lasted for ultimately for years, but You know
most of the time I was in the US and most the
time she was in Russia so we would just have
to kind of Come visit whenever our schedules
lined up I got hurt in Afghanistan. I had to
come back to the US for surgery for spinal fusion
and During that time I figured okay. Well, I
should you know get my studies out of the way
while I'm back home here in Texas, so I went
to the University of North Texas and Had planned
on transferring to the Bush School of Government
at Texas A &M but for that degree program they
wanted me to have two years of a foreign language
already completed and so You know my plan was
okay. I'll go to Moscow in the summer. I Will
study this all summer and then maybe I can test
out of a year and a half or so of Russian It
makes ultimate sense, right? I'm gonna go to
Russia. I'm gonna see you with Lena I'm gonna
pick up the Russian language. All of this is
well planned out. Isn't it Trevor? I mean it
it just makes sense. Nothing could go wrong Yeah,
I did have some reservations about going at the
very last minute. Because former US Marine or
US Marine veteran, I should say there's no former
US Marines, but Paul Whelan was wrongfully detained
shortly before I went there. But there wasn't
a lot of information about that yet. And Russia
hadn't started to practice hostage diplomacy
until Paul Wieland. And this is where you really
get caught up in this. You're in Moscow, you
get yourself at a going away party, get yourself
a little inebriated, the local police pick you
up, and now you're in this web of... a Russian
legal system that is nothing like you've ever
experienced, certainly nothing, and this was
the fascinating part of the book for me, was
this whole, really amounts to like three years
or four years of your life, where you're caught
up in this Russian web of legal system, sentencing,
time in prison, This is why you should read the
book folks Retribution a US Marines fight for
justice from the Russian Gulag to Ukraine's front
lines But I don't know how you even tell a little
bit of this story to our listeners Trevor, but
give it a try Sure, I guess I'll start off whenever
I was detained so it's not actually illegal to
be drunk in public in Russia. I think that's
more of like a national pastime. But exactly,
exactly. And I don't think the police wanted,
you know, the role that they would ultimately
play in this. I did actually get the opportunity
to talk to them later about this, but they took
me to the police station basically to sober up.
And in the morning I was free to leave. I didn't
think that I could get home to Lena's apartment.
So you understand, like my phone only had, I
could only use my phone with wifi. And I didn't
speak Russian well enough yet to be able to get
back, I thought. So I asked the police lieutenant
for wifi and she said, yeah, sure, you can use
our wifi, but I already called your girlfriend.
She's coming to get you. So foolishly, I stayed
there in the lobby. I wasn't like in a cell or
in handcuffs or arrested or anything. She said
I had slept on the floor in her office. But I
waited, I think it only took maybe like 10 minutes
for Lena to get there. But during that 10 minute
time, the shift changed. And when the new police
chief came in, he asked, why is there an American
lobby? And after he talked to them, he was like,
okay, you're detained. So they told me I couldn't
leave. And then he called to, I don't know what
this word would be in English, but they said
the chief of FSB, which I think is the director
of FSB in English. So after that FSB came, they
attempted to interrogate me about my service.
They didn't ask if I committed a crime or anything
like that. And then once they were finished,
I think that's when they decided, okay, we're
gonna use this guy. Somebody up the chain in
Russian intelligence said, oh, we've got another
Marine. Let's hang on to them. There's some value
there and this puts you into a crazy legal system
which is described in the book and how the trial
goes, how the lawyers, and it turns out Lena's
interested in the law, interning at a Russian
law firm, how they try to help, and I'm not sure
if it does, right? How your dad comes over to
try to help, and one of the things he tries to
help with is just proving up, you're a good guy,
you're just a solid, you know. you weren't a
spy, you weren't this or that, and he gives,
and ultimately makes its way to the court, a
picture of you in Marine dress at Camp David,
I assume, with President Obama, which then just
becomes, see, we knew he was a big deal, and
more than just a little humble Marine. You get
sentenced to what, five years, three years? How
long were you sentenced? Oh no, they, uh, they
sentenced me to nine years. Oh boy. Yeah. Um,
that was actually the longest sentence that they
had ever given out for, uh, assault on police
officers with serious bodily harm is basically
the made up charge. Yeah. But just so you know,
like obviously the police weren't injured because
I didn't assault them. Um, and they, you know,
they, they looked at all of this evidence and
it seemed like the trial was going pretty well.
I think the judge knew like, okay, this guy didn't
do anything. Um, but in the end, it didn't matter
on the very last day before I was sentenced,
I think. Somebody probably called him and told
him or he called somebody because the next day
he came into court and he read the sentence.
His hands were shaking and you could tell he
was not the same judge that had been presiding
over the case. Well, you really have to read
the book because as you go through it, you're
telling me about, you know, the book talks about
you relate how the cops can't. the police, if
you will, can't get their story straight. They
got to come up with this, you know, attack and
grievous bodily harm, but they can't even get
that story straight. So, yeah, you really end
up going, okay, this was somebody up the chain
said, hang on to this guy, and they send you
off to. Russian gulag and the story there is
again amazing insight into what goes on in Russian
prisons The words that this isn't the right word
you can fix it for me here, but like there's
a prison mafia I don't I don't know what the
Russian term for is I don't recall how does I
wouldn't know how to pronounce it but you you
have to get their respect because they really
run the place and You make a an amazing decision
to say I'm not cooperating and that leads to
a whole series of problems, doesn't it? Right
First I just wanted to be clear to the the picture
with the president, you know, initially I was
really angry with my My my parents my dad mostly
for giving the court that I'm more angry with
the state department because they ultimately,
you know, handed that to the court. I don't think
that actually played a role. I found out much
later that pretty much as soon as they had detained
me, they had sort of asked the United States,
you know, hey, would you like to make an exchange
for this guy? So. I don't think that ultimately
affected anything, but I was really concerned.
um about that at the time when i got to the when
i was convicted and sent to the forced labor
camp um you know i knew from talking to other
other prisoners that mardovia had especially
hard prisons and i told them you know hey i'm
not gonna i'm not gonna cooperate i'm not gonna
do um any of the stuff they want me to do i'm
not gonna work there um And they said, Oh, well,
we have some, some guys that do that, but, you
know, they're going to be, they're going to be
furious and they're going to try to break you
so that you will do all of this stuff. And I
told them that that wasn't going to matter. Um,
and when I got to the prison camp, you know,
the guy, the guy asked, you said, are we going
to have any problems with you? And he's standing
there. Um, kind of smirking and I'm very sure
that the response that he normally got was no,
of course not. That's what the old guy, uh, who
was there with me for the intake side. And I
said, yeah, you're going to have it. And he said,
what? And I said, yeah, I'm not going to do any
of your stuff. I'm not going to follow your regime
and I'm not going to work. And he said, okay,
well then we're going to punish you. Actually,
he threatened me. I'm not going to say exactly
what he said that's in the book, but I said,
okay, well, that's not going to make a difference.
And, you know, his response was kind of, we'll
see. So shortly after being there, they started
to put me into solitary confinement and Mean
the conditions there were not Not good, so it's
mostly a concrete floor There's like a little
sink like a steel sink I think Bench that's bolted
into the ground and then you have the Basically
your rock that kind of like folds out of the
wall and it has wooden planks And then at night
what they'll do is they'll bring in a foam pad
kind of thing, which is your bed. And then in
the morning they take that away and then they
fold the bed up into the wall and then they lock
it there with a padlock so you don't have anything
to lay on in the day. And the big issue there
was Is that in the winter they use the cold as
like a weapon against you to try to break you
so. It would be probably nearly freezing in there
if not freezing sometimes and they wouldn't allow
you to wear any warming layers or anything like
that so. You know my day mostly consisted of
just kind of snuggling with this hot water pipe.
to stay warm and then after about an hour, you
know, my back would start to freeze. So I would
rotate over to put my back against the hot water
pipe and then just do this for a while. Um, the
rest of the day, I kind of walk in circles and
then tie, uh, like a shirt that I had snuck in
there around my head is like a makeshift kind
of hood. It's really, it's really just as I read
the book, uh, Trevor, it's just like, Day -to
-day survival. How do I get through today? And
I guess when you're facing nine years, you have
to approach it that way. And because of the limitations
of time, I'm gonna move on to two other issues.
One is, and you mentioned it at the top, this
prisoner swap that Russia seems to use US citizens
as bargaining chips to get some of their guys
back or spies back, whatever it might be. People
will remember the name Brittany Greiner who was
a women's basketball player who got picked up
on a marijuana vaping or something and ultimately
was part of a swap. And Paul Whalen who was a
US Marine veteran, a businessman was over there
I think for a wedding and he gets picked up,
this is I think before you, and becomes part,
it takes a long time before he becomes part of
a prisoner swap. This goes on today. I just picked
up this week an article about a man by the name
of Charles Zimmerman who was handed a five -year
sentence at a Black Sea resort. They found a
rifle on his yacht. He had sailed into that port
to meet a woman he had met online. The rifle
was on the. the boat, the yacht. He wasn't bringing
it on shore. He was using it for self -defense.
And they said, oh, well, now you've violated
our laws. He's now tied up in that system for
five years. And five years from now, he'll probably
be in a prisoner swap. But this is sort of the
only way out early, isn't it, out of that nine
-year sentence? It was, yeah. There was basically
no way I was going to get out without that and
you know in addition to that my thought was that
they would probably just keep adding charges
on to me and basically keep me there forever.
I don't know what charges those would have been
but you know they made up the first set they
can make up some more. Now what year did you
get did they slap you out? Uh, that was in 2022
in April. And my parents, you know, they did
this massive campaign, um, you know, with the
news media, with our congressmen, um, with the
Senate. And eventually that led to a meeting
with President Biden at the White House. And,
you know, he made the decision of, okay, we were
going to I was in really bad health by that point.
I don't think I would have lived more than a
few more months after the point where I was exchanged.
I weighed about 120 pounds. When I came back,
I had lost nearly 50 pounds of mostly muscle.
And you come, you get back, and I've got to speed
this up again, because again, this is one of
these stories when each chapter's like, I can't
believe he lived through this. You gotta come
back, you gotta get healthy, you've got to put
on weight, put on muscle, mentally get back in
shape, emotionally. But at some point, you make
this decision that you're gonna go to Ukraine.
to fight with them to, if you will, kill Russian
soldiers as part of your retribution for what
you were put through? Tell us about that phase
of life. Yeah, I knew whenever I was in prison
at a certain point that my goal was no longer
to just survive there, but if I ever made it
out of there. I was going to make them pay for
stealing those years for me and my family. Not
just that, but also for doing that to the United
States, because they were doing this to other
Americans as well, especially friends. So when
Russia invaded Ukraine, I was in the forced labor
camp. And I actually Wasn't in solitary confinement
that day. So I saw that happen and I knew Okay,
if I ever get out of here, I'm gonna go help
the Ukrainians fight them It wasn't just solely
for revenge. It was also You know, I felt that
the Russian government needed to You know have
a cost imposed on them for hostage diplomacy
and then also the fact that I knew what the Ukrainians
were going through and I knew With my training
and experience I could help them And that's it
was not an easy road to get there because again
you have physically emotionally have to recover
Then you have to find your way into Ukraine and
a unit to fight with but that gets accomplished
and How long are you in Ukraine as a fighter?
I went to Ukraine on November 1st 2022 So I think
around six months after I was released My buddies
there in North Texas that I served us in the
Marine Corps They helped me to get back in shape
and then get back my combat abilities I went
November 1st. I Had a little bit of trouble at
first finding a unit to fight with because all
of the guys that i had planned to meet were wounded
in combat just before i arrived um so after that
i did a special operations training course which
was about 10 weeks i think might have been 12
um after that i had to get a security clearance
processed i ended up going to another unit during
that time because the security clearance was
taking too long, had to redo the security clearance
and then once I received that, I think the day
after I arrived at my unit we began combat operations
and we did that for months and months. And through
this process, internally, emotionally, You're
in fighting in Ukraine against Russians. I mean,
do you feel like, okay, I'm accomplishing what
I wanted to accomplish through these actions?
Where do you end up emotionally during this period?
You know, I thought it would be in combat. You
know directly engaging the Russians and I would
feel something like that, but it actually wasn't
so the first The first night that I was in Dunbass
At the safe house when I arrived at my unit there
to rogue team That was when I had that moment
where it was just this just complete calm and
serenity and I was like, okay, I made it here
and Like I'm gonna do what I came here to do
And you know live or die Like I took my life
back from the Russians. I didn't let them you
know when and I'm gonna I'm gonna be able to
to move on. So that was it just just finally
getting there I slept for nine hours after that
and you know before that I was only able to sleep
for three or four hours a day. You're in combat
for a period of months, but ultimately, there's
a landmine explosion, which you get injured in
and have to come back to the US. Tell us when
that was and kind of, again, emotionally. How
big of a letdown was it or it was like, okay,
I've done what I came to do. Uh, no. So on that,
on that mission, I actually should have already
left. I didn't go to Ukraine with the goal of
staying there until the war ended. I knew that
was going to take too long, but, um, I set a
date to come back because I had been accepted
into a university and We have already finished
our rotation and then we're cycling back on to
leave and training rotation and i figured i would
leave. During that period because there is no
reason for me to stay for training. But they
called us back last minute are. The the brigade
command of the air we're operating on and said
hey can we have you come back here and do this.
This last operation with us this final assault
And so we said okay, and we turned our trucks
back around From going back to kiev staged there
and then did one final assault And on that final
assault was whenever I was wounded. So I was
already almost You know halfway back to kiev
before we even did this this mission so it wasn't
like I felt like I missed out or anything like
that but um and what what uh what month what
month would that when that would that have been
I think that was very late July maybe like July
30th or 31st or something um and so of 23 of
23 yeah You'd you now find yourself back, you
know, I got to get back to the I got to get medical
care I got to get back and and the plans for
school kind of shift Throughout this process
you you get pretty limited or almost no help
from the US government They weren't keen on having
US citizens on the ground fighting in Ukraine
but Did you ever kind of get official word from
the government, like, kid, we didn't want you
to do this. We're not going to help you, or how
did that interaction? Because they did a prisoner
swap for you. They probably weren't thrilled
that this is where you were. Yeah, so I want
to be clear about that, too. I didn't ask the
US government for help. Again, that was my parents
who did that, even though I specifically asked
them not to do that. Yeah, except they love you.
So you know how that went. Yeah. So they, they
did that on their own, but you know, I for one
didn't think that, you know, the U S government
really was involved in that at all. Uh, didn't
think that that was their responsibility. And
the other thing was I also knew how the US government
worked and I didn't have like a year to be evacuated.
So I found I found an NGO on my own with. And
I want to thank everybody for listening to Veterans
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