WEBVTT 00:00:04.969 --> 00:00:08.789 All across America and around the world, this 00:00:08.789 --> 00:00:17.609 is Veterans Radio. And now, your host for today's 00:00:17.609 --> 00:00:24.079 program, Dale Throneberry. And good afternoon 00:00:24.079 --> 00:00:26.280 and welcome to Veterans Radio. My name is Dale 00:00:26.280 --> 00:00:28.559 Throneberry and I get to be the aircraft commander 00:00:28.559 --> 00:00:31.579 today and be your host here on Veterans Radio 00:00:31.579 --> 00:00:35.119 and for I guess about the 650th time I'm not 00:00:35.119 --> 00:00:38.750 sure who's counting, right? But we are very excited 00:00:38.750 --> 00:00:40.750 to have you joining us today. We're going to 00:00:40.750 --> 00:00:43.590 be talking about a book entitled Battle Rattle. 00:00:43.670 --> 00:00:45.369 How many of you out there know what Battle Rattle 00:00:45.369 --> 00:00:47.609 is? Well, you've got to stay tuned to find out 00:00:47.609 --> 00:00:50.409 what it is. It's a book by Roger Boas, and it's 00:00:50.409 --> 00:00:52.469 about his experiences during World War II. That's 00:00:52.469 --> 00:00:54.590 right, ladies and gentlemen, we have a genuine 00:00:54.590 --> 00:00:57.109 World War II veteran who's going to be on our 00:00:57.109 --> 00:01:00.390 program today. Roger is 94 years old, and I think 00:01:00.390 --> 00:01:02.229 that you're going to find him a fascinating guest, 00:01:02.270 --> 00:01:05.030 and he's got all kinds of stories. that he can 00:01:05.030 --> 00:01:07.010 tell about his experiences while he was with 00:01:07.010 --> 00:01:11.269 the artillery and with Patton's third army crossing 00:01:11.269 --> 00:01:14.310 through France and Belgium and into Germany and 00:01:14.310 --> 00:01:16.370 so on. And so I really want to make sure that 00:01:16.370 --> 00:01:19.329 you stay tuned for that. I'm very excited to 00:01:19.329 --> 00:01:21.530 interview Roger today. I think it'll be a really 00:01:21.530 --> 00:01:24.430 great opportunity for all of us. And a matter 00:01:24.430 --> 00:01:27.560 of fact, You can get in on a conversation if 00:01:27.560 --> 00:01:30.959 you'd like to. Just give us a call here at WAAM, 00:01:31.120 --> 00:01:35.099 talk radio 1600. The local number is 734 -822 00:01:35.099 --> 00:01:40.459 -1600. That's 734 -822 -1600. Or you can call 00:01:40.459 --> 00:01:47.280 us toll free at 844 -838 -1600. That's 844 -838 00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:50.000 -1600 for toll free. For those of you who are 00:01:50.000 --> 00:01:52.299 way out of the southeast Michigan area, feel 00:01:52.299 --> 00:01:54.379 free to give us a call on that toll free number. 00:01:54.780 --> 00:01:58.079 You can also follow us on Facebook. You can follow 00:01:58.079 --> 00:02:01.540 us on Twitter. You can hear our podcasts by going 00:02:01.540 --> 00:02:04.420 to our website, veteransradio .net, and click 00:02:04.420 --> 00:02:07.739 on podcasts. And you can also listen to about, 00:02:07.739 --> 00:02:10.780 I'm guessing about 300 of our archived programs. 00:02:10.860 --> 00:02:13.319 We're still trying to upload all of them to you. 00:02:13.520 --> 00:02:15.520 As soon as we get them up, we'll let you know. 00:02:15.599 --> 00:02:18.879 It takes a little while for us to do it, especially 00:02:18.879 --> 00:02:22.840 with the technologically challenged people that 00:02:22.840 --> 00:02:26.530 work for us. That's Bob and me, or Bob and I, 00:02:26.590 --> 00:02:30.129 I guess I should say. Speaking of Bob, I just 00:02:30.129 --> 00:02:31.770 want to let you know that he came through his 00:02:31.770 --> 00:02:34.610 surgery with flying colors and that I'm hoping 00:02:34.610 --> 00:02:37.250 he will be back behind the microphone in the 00:02:37.250 --> 00:02:39.169 next couple of weeks. He's doing really well 00:02:39.169 --> 00:02:41.810 and he's got a lot of his energy back and his 00:02:41.810 --> 00:02:44.250 spiciness back and so he's ready to go. So we're 00:02:44.250 --> 00:02:47.389 excited to have the opportunity to get Bob back 00:02:47.389 --> 00:02:49.710 on the air. I've got a couple of announcements 00:02:49.710 --> 00:02:54.060 to give you today. We go and talk with Roger. 00:02:54.680 --> 00:02:56.840 So first of all, joining me on the line right 00:02:56.840 --> 00:03:01.219 now from the Ann Arbor VA Healthcare System. 00:03:01.879 --> 00:03:05.000 How's that for a number, right? And that is April 00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:08.439 LaRocque. April, welcome to Veterans Radio. Hi. 00:03:08.580 --> 00:03:10.800 Thanks for having me on. Thank you, April. Thank 00:03:10.800 --> 00:03:13.080 you for joining us. And I know you've got a big 00:03:13.080 --> 00:03:15.879 event coming up here pretty soon. So tell me 00:03:15.879 --> 00:03:17.780 all about what's happening at the Ann Arbor VA. 00:03:18.800 --> 00:03:21.439 I will, too. Yeah. So just wanted to mention 00:03:21.439 --> 00:03:24.259 that The VA Ann Arbor Health Care System's mission 00:03:24.259 --> 00:03:27.560 is to honor America's veterans by providing exceptional 00:03:27.560 --> 00:03:29.719 health care that improves their health and well 00:03:29.719 --> 00:03:32.479 -being. And we are hosting a special program 00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:35.979 next month to honor, in a particular way, Vietnam 00:03:35.979 --> 00:03:39.039 -era veterans. So we're going to be hosting a 00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:42.819 Vietnam -era veterans commemoration event on 00:03:42.819 --> 00:03:46.180 Friday, May the 6th, from 9 a .m. to 12 p .m. 00:03:46.219 --> 00:03:49.460 in our auditorium. And we really... You know, 00:03:49.580 --> 00:03:51.800 our plan is to take this opportunity to honor 00:03:51.800 --> 00:03:54.219 all Vietnam -era veterans and their families 00:03:54.219 --> 00:03:57.719 and to provide an opportunity for them to reunite 00:03:57.719 --> 00:03:59.840 and share their experiences with each other. 00:04:00.699 --> 00:04:02.860 We're going to start off by having a formal opening 00:04:02.860 --> 00:04:06.439 ceremony around 9 .30 a .m. that will include 00:04:06.439 --> 00:04:09.759 guest speaker Lieutenant Colonel Charles S. Kettles, 00:04:10.080 --> 00:04:12.860 who is a decorated Vietnam veteran and current 00:04:12.860 --> 00:04:16.459 Medal of Honor nominee. And that will be followed 00:04:16.459 --> 00:04:20.720 by some live music and refreshments. And we will 00:04:20.720 --> 00:04:23.480 also offer the Vietnam Era veterans in attendance 00:04:23.480 --> 00:04:26.740 a commemorative lapel pin, which will be pinned 00:04:26.740 --> 00:04:29.379 on by representatives from their respective branch 00:04:29.379 --> 00:04:31.600 of service who will be there with us. Oh, wow. 00:04:31.600 --> 00:04:34.560 That sounds cool. So this is going to be on Friday, 00:04:34.740 --> 00:04:40.639 May 6th, from 9 in the morning till noon. Any 00:04:40.639 --> 00:04:43.139 refreshments for these fine men and women of 00:04:43.139 --> 00:04:46.639 the Vietnam Era? Yes, absolutely. And also just 00:04:46.639 --> 00:04:48.079 wanted to mention too, we're going to have a 00:04:48.079 --> 00:04:51.259 military memorabilia exhibit that's being provided 00:04:51.259 --> 00:04:56.060 by a local VSW post 423 in Ann Arbor. We'll have 00:04:56.060 --> 00:04:57.899 information about the history of the Vietnam 00:04:57.899 --> 00:05:01.420 War as well as resource information about various 00:05:01.420 --> 00:05:04.560 VA programs and services including VA healthcare. 00:05:05.439 --> 00:05:06.980 We'll have representatives from the Veterans 00:05:06.980 --> 00:05:10.920 Benefits Administration, National Cemetery Administration. 00:05:11.950 --> 00:05:15.490 and then local resource information from veteran 00:05:15.490 --> 00:05:18.610 service organizations, the Washtenaw County Department 00:05:18.610 --> 00:05:21.209 of Veterans Affairs, and the Buddy to Buddy Veteran 00:05:21.209 --> 00:05:23.550 Volunteer Program. Oh, that sounds like it's 00:05:23.550 --> 00:05:26.350 going to be a great event, a great event. Reminding 00:05:26.350 --> 00:05:29.029 our audience that this is on Friday, May 6th 00:05:29.029 --> 00:05:31.449 from 9 in the morning until noon, and it's going 00:05:31.449 --> 00:05:35.509 to be in the auditorium at the Ann Arbor Veterans 00:05:35.509 --> 00:05:38.740 Healthcare Systems. main hospital and is this 00:05:38.740 --> 00:05:41.319 just a local event or are VA hospitals around 00:05:41.319 --> 00:05:44.279 the country doing similar programs? Yeah, there's 00:05:44.279 --> 00:05:47.680 a number of VAs who are participating in this 00:05:47.680 --> 00:05:53.120 Vietnam War commemoration time period which was 00:05:53.120 --> 00:05:55.620 marked by a presidential proclamation on May 00:05:55.620 --> 00:05:58.360 12th to have this commemoration period to extend 00:05:58.360 --> 00:06:01.540 from Memorial Day of 2012 through Veterans Day 00:06:01.540 --> 00:06:04.980 of 2025. And so I know you've got a lot of listeners 00:06:04.980 --> 00:06:08.100 out there who aren't in the Michigan area. So 00:06:08.100 --> 00:06:10.560 if you'd like to find out where a Vietnam War 00:06:10.560 --> 00:06:12.800 commemoration event may be taking place in your 00:06:12.800 --> 00:06:20.120 area, just visit their website, www .VietnamWar50th 00:06:20.120 --> 00:06:25.220 .com. Okay, so we've got to go to VietnamWar50th 00:06:25.220 --> 00:06:28.060 .com to find out if there's a celebration there 00:06:28.060 --> 00:06:31.720 where everybody lives. Absolutely. There's a 00:06:31.720 --> 00:06:34.019 map of the US and around the world, actually, 00:06:34.100 --> 00:06:36.120 where you can see where these events may be taking 00:06:36.120 --> 00:06:38.800 place during this commemoration time period. 00:06:38.959 --> 00:06:42.379 OK. A lot of opportunities for people to go. 00:06:42.839 --> 00:06:45.199 That is terrific. April, I wanted the people 00:06:45.199 --> 00:06:47.360 to know who you are over at the VA. So what is 00:06:47.360 --> 00:06:51.240 it that you do at the Ann Arbor VA? Sure. I am 00:06:51.240 --> 00:06:53.660 currently the outreach coordinator for the hospital. 00:06:53.740 --> 00:06:56.800 I work in public affairs. I'm also a social worker 00:06:56.800 --> 00:07:00.639 by trade. And I am also the former prisoner of 00:07:00.639 --> 00:07:04.879 war advocate for our facility. So we host a monthly 00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:08.800 support group for former POWs. So I've been involved 00:07:08.800 --> 00:07:10.819 in that program for a number of years as well. 00:07:11.079 --> 00:07:13.319 That's what I thought. I wanted to get your cred 00:07:13.319 --> 00:07:16.939 out there for our audience. Thank you. So anyways, 00:07:17.259 --> 00:07:20.120 we've been talking with April the Rock. And again, 00:07:20.120 --> 00:07:22.720 to remind you, the Vietnam Era Veterans Commemorative 00:07:22.720 --> 00:07:25.259 Event for the Ann Arbor area is going to be on 00:07:25.259 --> 00:07:28.389 Friday, May 6th. 2016 from 9 o 'clock in the 00:07:28.389 --> 00:07:31.910 morning until noon. Be there. And we'll see you. 00:07:32.209 --> 00:07:33.810 And April, I look forward to meeting you there. 00:07:34.610 --> 00:07:36.910 Sounds great. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank 00:07:36.910 --> 00:07:39.209 you. All right. Other things coming up, and this 00:07:39.209 --> 00:07:41.790 is another announcement for our Yankee Air Museum. 00:07:41.850 --> 00:07:43.410 For those of you who live in southeast Michigan, 00:07:43.490 --> 00:07:46.350 this is a place to go for airplanes. All kinds 00:07:46.350 --> 00:07:50.029 of airplanes, helicopters, simulators, uniforms, 00:07:50.949 --> 00:07:53.110 you name it, they've got it. And then they're 00:07:53.110 --> 00:07:54.750 trying to raise a little money. So they're having 00:07:54.750 --> 00:07:58.269 their 12th annual American Bistro night, and 00:07:58.269 --> 00:08:01.889 that's going to be on Saturday, April 30th. And 00:08:01.889 --> 00:08:05.430 the doors open at 530, dinners at 630, and just 00:08:05.430 --> 00:08:07.810 need to go to yankeeairmuseum .org to find out 00:08:07.810 --> 00:08:10.410 more information about it. Looks like a lot of 00:08:10.410 --> 00:08:13.129 fun, and I hope to see you there. And then finally, 00:08:13.230 --> 00:08:15.629 I've got kind of an unusual request. We've never 00:08:15.629 --> 00:08:18.649 done one of these on Veterans Radio before. but 00:08:18.649 --> 00:08:20.990 we got an email from one of our long -time listeners 00:08:20.990 --> 00:08:24.269 that asked if we would announce a wedding. So 00:08:24.269 --> 00:08:29.649 here we go. We're going to congratulate Maria 00:08:29.649 --> 00:08:34.639 Valdez and Nathan. Nathan Kerpel on their wedding 00:08:34.639 --> 00:08:39.620 yesterday, Saturday, April 16, 2016. So we want 00:08:39.620 --> 00:08:42.620 to give you a very big Veterans Radio congratulations. 00:08:42.980 --> 00:08:45.440 That's to Maria and Nathan. And thank you very 00:08:45.440 --> 00:08:47.419 much for being a supporter of Veterans Radio. 00:08:47.700 --> 00:08:50.659 And we hope you had a great time yesterday and 00:08:50.659 --> 00:08:52.779 in the future. Remember, part of our slogan is 00:08:52.779 --> 00:08:55.559 always, always remember, never forget. And I 00:08:55.559 --> 00:08:58.360 know you'll never forget yesterday. So thanks 00:08:58.360 --> 00:09:00.340 for letting us announce this to our audience. 00:09:00.850 --> 00:09:02.409 All right, everybody, we're going to take a real 00:09:02.409 --> 00:09:04.070 quick break. And when we come back, we're going 00:09:04.070 --> 00:09:06.570 to be talking to Roger Boas. And his book is 00:09:06.570 --> 00:09:09.710 entitled Battle Rattle, a Last Memoir of World 00:09:09.710 --> 00:09:12.730 War II. You're listening to Veterans... Well, 00:09:12.809 --> 00:09:14.750 the song may be This is the Army, Mr. Jones. 00:09:14.809 --> 00:09:16.250 But actually, we're going to be talking with 00:09:16.250 --> 00:09:19.350 This is the Army, Mr. Boas. And joining me on 00:09:19.350 --> 00:09:21.590 the air right now is our guest for the day, and 00:09:21.590 --> 00:09:24.789 it's Roger Boas. And his book is entitled Battle 00:09:24.789 --> 00:09:27.490 Rattle, a Last Memoir of World War II. And let 00:09:27.490 --> 00:09:30.509 me just give you a quick little background. on 00:09:30.509 --> 00:09:34.850 Roger. Roger is 94 years old. And so for all 00:09:34.850 --> 00:09:36.970 of you Vietnam era veterans out there that do 00:09:36.970 --> 00:09:39.070 listen, this is an opportunity for you to talk 00:09:39.070 --> 00:09:41.509 to somebody from your dad's generation. This 00:09:41.509 --> 00:09:44.450 is the way I'm looking at it. Because as our 00:09:44.450 --> 00:09:46.710 listeners know, my dad was in the Coast Guard 00:09:46.710 --> 00:09:50.330 during World War II and was on an LST, which 00:09:50.330 --> 00:09:52.070 we'll talk about in a little bit, with Roger. 00:09:52.529 --> 00:09:54.570 And so this is our opportunity. So if you want 00:09:54.570 --> 00:09:57.669 to ask Roger a question, Later on during the 00:09:57.669 --> 00:10:00.169 interview, please give us a call here at 734 00:10:00.169 --> 00:10:06.870 -822 -1600 or 844 -838 -1600. Right now, I want 00:10:06.870 --> 00:10:12.009 to welcome Roger Boas to Veterans Radio. Glad 00:10:12.009 --> 00:10:14.570 to be with you, and thanks for calling. It was 00:10:14.570 --> 00:10:16.450 my pleasure, sir, and I want to thank you, and 00:10:16.450 --> 00:10:19.389 I thank your publicist, Tricia, for sending me 00:10:19.389 --> 00:10:21.830 your book. I found it to be a really excellent 00:10:21.830 --> 00:10:25.490 read. Oh, thank you very much. So, okay, let's 00:10:25.490 --> 00:10:29.750 get started. What motivated you to write this 00:10:29.750 --> 00:10:34.009 book entitled Battle Rattle? Well, I'd written 00:10:34.009 --> 00:10:37.929 a lot of letters home during the war. And then 00:10:37.929 --> 00:10:40.710 I forgot about it. I did other things, other 00:10:40.710 --> 00:10:44.629 jobs I had in San Francisco. But as time went 00:10:44.629 --> 00:10:48.350 on, I thought I should read back those letters. 00:10:48.350 --> 00:10:51.250 And as I read them, I thought that they were 00:10:51.250 --> 00:10:53.509 something that my grandchildren should know about. 00:10:53.789 --> 00:10:57.169 Because it talked about the war and about my 00:10:57.169 --> 00:11:00.169 feelings about the war. And so I really wrote 00:11:00.169 --> 00:11:03.789 it for my grandkids and for their friends. And 00:11:03.789 --> 00:11:07.049 that's how it got started. Well, it's probably 00:11:07.049 --> 00:11:09.789 something that many of us wish our parents had 00:11:09.789 --> 00:11:11.830 written because a lot of our parents, it sounds 00:11:11.830 --> 00:11:14.330 like you were the same way. You didn't talk much 00:11:14.330 --> 00:11:16.610 about your military experience for a long time. 00:11:17.710 --> 00:11:21.070 No. In fact, it's so interesting. When I came 00:11:21.070 --> 00:11:24.100 back from the war, my And I'd been in combat 00:11:24.100 --> 00:11:30.360 straight for 39 months. My parents never discussed 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:33.320 it. And I had other friends who had come back 00:11:33.320 --> 00:11:36.379 and we were bewildered. Why was this subject 00:11:36.379 --> 00:11:41.580 not to be discussed? It was off limits and it 00:11:41.580 --> 00:11:44.639 was a strange, odd feeling that I never did appreciate. 00:11:45.440 --> 00:11:47.879 I can kind of relate to that and probably from 00:11:47.879 --> 00:11:50.360 my own generation is that many of us when we 00:11:50.360 --> 00:11:53.200 did come home Nobody wanted to talk about it. 00:11:53.559 --> 00:11:55.860 And it's not that, you know, not that we the 00:11:55.860 --> 00:11:57.559 veterans didn't want to talk about it. It's just 00:11:57.559 --> 00:12:00.019 that nobody wanted to hear us talk about it. 00:12:00.299 --> 00:12:02.659 Maybe that's what it was. I don't know. I'm sure 00:12:02.659 --> 00:12:04.200 we're going to get into that a little bit later 00:12:04.200 --> 00:12:07.240 on because you do mention, you know, your experiences 00:12:07.240 --> 00:12:10.759 when you came back finally. So let's talk about 00:12:10.759 --> 00:12:14.080 life before World War II. This is kind of a history 00:12:14.080 --> 00:12:16.279 lesson for all of us. How would you describe 00:12:16.279 --> 00:12:21.639 America pre -World War II? Well, it was a very 00:12:21.639 --> 00:12:27.740 neutral sort of a country. Definitely not wanting 00:12:27.740 --> 00:12:30.200 to get involved in war from a congressional point 00:12:30.200 --> 00:12:34.059 of view and from many of the most important people. 00:12:35.039 --> 00:12:38.940 I happened to have been a debater at college 00:12:38.940 --> 00:12:42.559 and we would debate whether or not the United 00:12:42.559 --> 00:12:45.519 States should support Great Britain in its battle 00:12:45.519 --> 00:12:50.970 against Germany that started in 1939. And we 00:12:50.970 --> 00:12:55.350 were almost alone in the feeling that the U .S. 00:12:55.809 --> 00:12:59.110 should go in and help England. The great feeling 00:12:59.110 --> 00:13:02.629 was, let's stay the heck out of it. Really? That's 00:13:02.629 --> 00:13:04.070 something that we never really learned in our 00:13:04.070 --> 00:13:05.789 history classes, that there was such a debate 00:13:05.789 --> 00:13:09.710 over whether we should get involved or not. Say 00:13:09.710 --> 00:13:12.389 that again, please. I said that that was not 00:13:12.389 --> 00:13:14.309 something that was covered in our history classes 00:13:14.309 --> 00:13:16.529 in high school, that there was such a big debate. 00:13:16.809 --> 00:13:19.210 over whether we should have gotten involved in 00:13:19.210 --> 00:13:24.750 World War II or not? No, that's right. The political 00:13:24.750 --> 00:13:29.129 leadership was very much against getting involved. 00:13:30.110 --> 00:13:33.049 Congress was against getting involved, many of 00:13:33.049 --> 00:13:36.870 it. We were a country that wanted to stay away 00:13:36.870 --> 00:13:39.169 from war. We'd had enough apparently in World 00:13:39.169 --> 00:13:43.769 War I. And so we delayed for a long time going 00:13:43.769 --> 00:13:47.279 to help England. And in fact, it was a strange 00:13:47.279 --> 00:13:50.299 thing. We were just sitting in our fanny when 00:13:50.299 --> 00:13:54.759 all of a sudden, the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor 00:13:54.759 --> 00:14:01.019 on December 7th, 1941. And so the ones that were 00:14:01.019 --> 00:14:03.860 incurring our wrath and we declared war against 00:14:03.860 --> 00:14:10.179 were the Japanese. And strangely enough, and 00:14:10.179 --> 00:14:14.929 very oddly, Adolf Hitler, the head of Germany, 00:14:15.710 --> 00:14:20.149 nine days later declared war on the United States. 00:14:20.990 --> 00:14:24.389 And so we immediately then were at war not only 00:14:24.389 --> 00:14:27.110 with Japan, but also with Germany. If Hitler 00:14:27.110 --> 00:14:29.330 had kept his mouth shut, that might have been 00:14:29.330 --> 00:14:32.210 a very different situation. That's for sure. 00:14:32.750 --> 00:14:34.470 I had never really thought of it that way. I 00:14:34.470 --> 00:14:36.409 just thought, you know, one just naturally followed 00:14:36.409 --> 00:14:41.340 the other. I guess not. Roger, I hope you don't 00:14:41.340 --> 00:14:43.500 mind if I call you Roger. No, that's just fine. 00:14:43.779 --> 00:14:50.360 Okay. You had the ability to travel to Europe 00:14:50.360 --> 00:14:53.720 prior to World War II. Your mother and your grandmother 00:14:53.720 --> 00:14:57.799 and you all went to Europe in 1935. Can you tell 00:14:57.799 --> 00:15:01.059 me what did you notice as a 14 -year -old seeing 00:15:01.059 --> 00:15:08.009 Europe just before World War II? Yes. I didn't 00:15:08.009 --> 00:15:12.490 notice much in England, strangely enough. I was 00:15:12.490 --> 00:15:15.590 guided around England by a major who'd been in 00:15:15.590 --> 00:15:17.610 World War I and we saw the sights, but there 00:15:17.610 --> 00:15:20.710 was no feeling that England would be soon shortly 00:15:20.710 --> 00:15:27.250 at war. I picked up concern about war when we 00:15:27.250 --> 00:15:31.049 got to Vienna, my mother and I, and had dinner 00:15:31.049 --> 00:15:34.789 with a very nice couple who were Jewish. And 00:15:34.789 --> 00:15:38.990 they said they were scared. Yes, that Hitler 00:15:38.990 --> 00:15:41.090 might come into Austria and if he did, they didn't 00:15:41.090 --> 00:15:44.149 know what would happen to them. And that's exactly 00:15:44.149 --> 00:15:47.269 what happened. And they disappeared and I've 00:15:47.269 --> 00:15:50.110 never heard, they just disappeared. I don't know 00:15:50.110 --> 00:15:54.429 what happened to that poor couple. So what I 00:15:54.429 --> 00:15:59.850 picked up in Europe in 1935 was a concern in 00:15:59.850 --> 00:16:03.970 a couple of places. One, Austria from the Jewish 00:16:03.970 --> 00:16:06.669 people that we had letters of introduction to. 00:16:07.899 --> 00:16:13.700 another in we went to Russia and Poland and in 00:16:13.700 --> 00:16:17.600 both Warsaw Poland and in the cities we visited 00:16:17.600 --> 00:16:22.379 in in Russia there was much talk that war would 00:16:22.379 --> 00:16:26.059 be that war would come about with Germany and 00:16:26.059 --> 00:16:29.019 this was well before the war started but they 00:16:29.019 --> 00:16:32.789 were right I think that's interesting. We're 00:16:32.789 --> 00:16:35.870 talking with Roger Boas, whose book is entitled 00:16:35.870 --> 00:16:40.190 Battle Rattle, Last Memoir of World War II. I 00:16:40.190 --> 00:16:42.350 want our audience to kind of understand where, 00:16:42.669 --> 00:16:47.269 in your background, is that your family originally 00:16:47.269 --> 00:16:50.809 was Jewish, but then you've converted, you didn't 00:16:50.809 --> 00:16:53.049 convert, but your relatives converted to Christian 00:16:53.049 --> 00:16:58.809 science, correct? Yes. My family was Jewish. 00:16:58.830 --> 00:17:06.839 I'm Jewish. However, in the late 1800s, my great 00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:11.640 -grandmother, who lived in Texas, Texarkana, 00:17:12.039 --> 00:17:17.039 Texas, became a friend of Mary Baker Eddy, the 00:17:17.039 --> 00:17:20.980 founder of Christian Science. And so she, my 00:17:20.980 --> 00:17:24.380 great -grandmother, became one of the first Christian 00:17:24.380 --> 00:17:28.579 Science practitioners in Texas. And then she 00:17:28.579 --> 00:17:33.019 had two children, two ladies, one of whom was 00:17:33.019 --> 00:17:35.700 my grandmother. They were Christian scientists. 00:17:36.660 --> 00:17:39.200 And then my grandmother had a daughter, my mother, 00:17:39.339 --> 00:17:43.720 Larry, and she was a Christian scientist. And 00:17:43.720 --> 00:17:50.160 then my dad went to the Jewish temple. When he 00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:52.599 married my mother, he became a Christian scientist. 00:17:53.619 --> 00:17:56.900 And I also then went to Christian science Sunday 00:17:56.900 --> 00:18:02.599 school. What kept my dad from being a more recognized 00:18:02.599 --> 00:18:04.599 Christian scientist was the fact that he liked 00:18:04.599 --> 00:18:08.180 to smoke cigars and have a highball every once 00:18:08.180 --> 00:18:10.880 a week, and that was not allowed in Christian 00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:13.940 science. He was a kind of an outrigger Christian 00:18:13.940 --> 00:18:16.980 scientist, but we all followed the religion. 00:18:17.599 --> 00:18:20.039 That's very interesting because you had mentioned 00:18:20.039 --> 00:18:23.259 in your book that you had some experiences with 00:18:23.259 --> 00:18:28.170 anti -Semitism when you went to Stanford. Yes, 00:18:28.309 --> 00:18:31.289 the experiences were what you would call oblique 00:18:31.289 --> 00:18:36.809 or not bold. That is, I was Jewish and as a result 00:18:36.809 --> 00:18:41.089 I was not invited to any of the Stanford fraternities. 00:18:41.109 --> 00:18:44.089 They didn't have a Jewish fraternity there and 00:18:44.089 --> 00:18:46.450 the non -Jewish ones didn't want people like 00:18:46.450 --> 00:18:51.430 me. And so that was the first time I really felt 00:18:51.430 --> 00:18:55.450 the effect of anti -Semitism. Not that I didn't 00:18:55.450 --> 00:19:02.509 have a nice life at Stanford, but being not allowed 00:19:02.509 --> 00:19:06.410 on fraternity rows, so to speak, bothered me 00:19:06.410 --> 00:19:10.230 then as it still bothers me. It was a pure prejudice. 00:19:12.069 --> 00:19:14.630 Many of us can't understand that looking back 00:19:14.630 --> 00:19:17.410 70 years and seeing that some of these things 00:19:17.410 --> 00:19:21.150 were occurring that long ago. You mentioned that 00:19:21.150 --> 00:19:23.670 on December 7th that the Japanese attacked Pearl 00:19:23.670 --> 00:19:28.769 Harbor. What do you remember of that day? I was 00:19:28.769 --> 00:19:37.529 picking up a colleague from school and we were 00:19:37.529 --> 00:19:43.849 driving from San Francisco to a seminar on literature 00:19:43.849 --> 00:19:47.549 being held by one of our professors at Stanford. 00:19:48.220 --> 00:19:52.019 And we picked it up on the radio. And all of 00:19:52.019 --> 00:19:56.799 a sudden, it dawned on both of us that life as 00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:01.519 it had been for us was over. That basically we 00:20:01.519 --> 00:20:05.700 were at war. The Japanese had attacked us. And 00:20:05.700 --> 00:20:09.000 I appreciated the fact that very shortly, and 00:20:09.000 --> 00:20:12.599 it happened the next day, that President Roosevelt 00:20:12.599 --> 00:20:18.170 would declare we were at war with Japan. What 00:20:18.170 --> 00:20:21.789 we did not anticipate was that we would be at 00:20:21.789 --> 00:20:25.710 war with Germany almost simultaneously. All right, 00:20:25.829 --> 00:20:29.849 and part of your experience at Stanford, excuse 00:20:29.849 --> 00:20:34.049 me, was that you were joined ROTC. Is that correct? 00:20:34.750 --> 00:20:38.009 Yes, I like I have always liked riding horses 00:20:38.009 --> 00:20:41.970 and rode horses ever since I was about seven 00:20:41.970 --> 00:20:47.960 until recently and Stanford's I had a field ROTC, 00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:51.460 Reserve Officers Training Corps, was based on 00:20:51.460 --> 00:20:55.559 horse drawn field artillery guns, 75 millimeter 00:20:55.559 --> 00:20:59.779 guns, drawn by horses. And so everyone rode a 00:20:59.779 --> 00:21:02.319 horse. Officers enlisted men, all the cadets. 00:21:03.279 --> 00:21:06.519 And I found that perfectly wonderful. We roamed 00:21:06.519 --> 00:21:10.579 the backwoods of the campus on those horses days 00:21:10.579 --> 00:21:13.940 at a time and went to camp on horses. And I found 00:21:13.940 --> 00:21:17.140 it a very pleasurable existence. But as a result, 00:21:18.059 --> 00:21:22.500 on graduation day, I graduated as a second lieutenant 00:21:22.500 --> 00:21:26.220 in the field artillery. Field artillery. This 00:21:26.220 --> 00:21:28.000 is where it's going to get interesting, folks. 00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:33.039 So here we go. So Roger is now in the field artillery 00:21:33.039 --> 00:21:36.180 unit, and he's going to start his training. And 00:21:36.180 --> 00:21:38.119 so where did you begin your training, and can 00:21:38.119 --> 00:21:40.039 you kind of describe a little bit about what 00:21:40.039 --> 00:21:44.839 it was like? I had 30 days at a place called 00:21:44.839 --> 00:21:51.240 Camp Roberts, which was an army station in California 00:21:51.240 --> 00:21:54.380 midway between San Francisco and Los Angeles. 00:21:56.759 --> 00:21:59.480 That's the first time I began to meet people 00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:05.200 with very different attitudes, especially the 00:22:05.200 --> 00:22:09.400 Southerners. They wanted to go in and kill those 00:22:09.400 --> 00:22:14.500 Germans. uh... so you might say bloody -minded 00:22:14.500 --> 00:22:18.059 went from there to uh... the artillery school 00:22:18.059 --> 00:22:23.819 at port still and there they warned us that and 00:22:23.819 --> 00:22:25.619 there have been uh... they warned us that the 00:22:25.619 --> 00:22:27.960 british were not holding up there at the end 00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:32.119 of their responsibilities militarily i couldn't 00:22:32.119 --> 00:22:35.720 believe it i was a great man of the british but 00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:37.980 they were right the british were screwing up 00:22:37.980 --> 00:22:42.829 apparently and on the battlefield of those days. 00:22:43.730 --> 00:22:50.990 And then from Fort Sill, I was sent to the Mojave 00:22:50.990 --> 00:22:56.250 Desert, which had been made into a military area 00:22:56.250 --> 00:23:01.289 by General Patton as a major general, and I joined 00:23:01.289 --> 00:23:08.029 an outfit called the 4th Armored Division, which 00:23:08.029 --> 00:23:11.000 consisted of tanks and self -propelled guns. 00:23:11.940 --> 00:23:15.240 And I became a forward observer, a field forward 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:20.279 observer in the Fourth Armored and stayed there 00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:23.019 with them in the Mojave Desert. Then we went 00:23:23.019 --> 00:23:26.880 to Texas and then we went to England. And after 00:23:26.880 --> 00:23:30.680 kind of a glorious vacation -like time in England, 00:23:31.420 --> 00:23:33.480 we crossed the channel and everything changed. 00:23:33.690 --> 00:23:35.970 Well, we're going to talk about that in a minute. 00:23:36.009 --> 00:23:38.450 We've got about two minutes to go until we have 00:23:38.450 --> 00:23:42.450 to take a break. You mentioned all this desert 00:23:42.450 --> 00:23:45.849 training in the Mojave Desert in California because 00:23:45.849 --> 00:23:47.529 you thought you were going to be going to North 00:23:47.529 --> 00:23:51.230 Africa, correct? Yes, we were definitely destined 00:23:51.230 --> 00:23:58.809 for North Africa. And then Rommel, whoever it 00:23:58.809 --> 00:24:02.779 was, was running the German side. was ordered 00:24:02.779 --> 00:24:06.259 by Hitler to stop. And so we didn't, we were 00:24:06.259 --> 00:24:09.279 not sent to North Africa after all. Right, because 00:24:09.279 --> 00:24:11.420 evidently the English finally decided that they 00:24:11.420 --> 00:24:13.599 were going to turn around and really fight, as 00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:16.019 you mentioned earlier. They weren't following 00:24:16.019 --> 00:24:18.680 through, although, you know, that's all hearsay 00:24:18.680 --> 00:24:22.660 for a lot of us. But yeah, the English had stopped 00:24:22.660 --> 00:24:26.700 the German approach to Egypt, and then Rommel 00:24:26.700 --> 00:24:29.930 was... forced to surrender. I mean, he didn't 00:24:29.930 --> 00:24:32.049 surrender, but he was forced to surrender after 00:24:32.049 --> 00:24:34.569 Hitler told him not to. And I guess that kind 00:24:34.569 --> 00:24:36.250 of put him in Hitler's doghouse for a little 00:24:36.250 --> 00:24:41.549 while. Right. So you went from there to... In 00:24:41.549 --> 00:24:43.170 about a minute, do you think you can describe 00:24:43.170 --> 00:24:46.789 your journey across the Atlantic to England the 00:24:46.789 --> 00:24:52.029 second time? Yes, when I went in 1935, it was 00:24:52.029 --> 00:24:55.430 a luxurious trip with my mother and grandmother. 00:24:56.960 --> 00:25:00.819 everything, lovely meals and dance music and 00:25:00.819 --> 00:25:05.000 all that sort of stuff. Going there on a troop 00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:07.660 ship was a very different story. There were ten 00:25:07.660 --> 00:25:09.799 of us in a room, ten second lieutenants in the 00:25:09.799 --> 00:25:12.400 room in bunk. It was even worse for the enlisted 00:25:12.400 --> 00:25:16.700 men. And all of us to get away from the crowded 00:25:16.700 --> 00:25:20.779 depth went up on deck day and night to get the 00:25:20.779 --> 00:25:24.140 fresh air. But the crossing, other than the fact 00:25:24.140 --> 00:25:26.019 that I met some people that were important to 00:25:26.019 --> 00:25:31.940 me, was uneventful. And we landed in England 00:25:31.940 --> 00:25:39.819 and were sent to the old town of Devisas. And 00:25:39.819 --> 00:25:43.140 we occupied the British barracks there until 00:25:43.140 --> 00:25:46.299 we went into France. Okay. We're going to take 00:25:46.299 --> 00:25:48.420 a break right now. Roger, stay tuned. Don't go 00:25:48.420 --> 00:25:53.029 away. And we're going to take a quick break, 00:25:53.250 --> 00:25:55.029 folks. We're talking with Roger Boas, the author 00:25:55.029 --> 00:25:56.710 of Battle Rattled, and we're getting ready to 00:25:56.710 --> 00:26:00.410 go into France right after D -Day. You're listening 00:26:00.410 --> 00:26:04.910 to Veterans Radio. Stay tuned. And we're back 00:26:04.910 --> 00:26:07.829 on Veterans Radio and my guest today is Roger 00:26:07.829 --> 00:26:10.069 Boas. He's the author of a book entitled Battle 00:26:10.069 --> 00:26:13.329 Rattled, Last Memoir of World War II. Just to 00:26:13.329 --> 00:26:16.349 remind you that Roger is 94 years old so he is 00:26:16.349 --> 00:26:19.910 truly one of the unfortunately few remaining 00:26:19.910 --> 00:26:22.710 World War II veterans out there. And he was in 00:26:22.710 --> 00:26:26.849 artillery and he was part of Patton's Third Army. 00:26:27.670 --> 00:26:30.670 And so now we've arrived in England from all 00:26:30.670 --> 00:26:34.119 of his training in the States. So forth. So Roger, 00:26:34.160 --> 00:26:36.160 tell me a little bit about what England was like 00:26:36.160 --> 00:26:41.039 for the Yanks coming over. It was like a, it 00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:45.079 was like a fairy land. I mean, it was the English 00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:47.359 and certainly in London, they welcomed us with 00:26:47.359 --> 00:26:51.299 open arms. There were, there were quite a few 00:26:51.299 --> 00:26:58.019 Americans, but not too many. Everyone was very, 00:26:58.019 --> 00:27:03.380 very receptive to us. There was a joke going 00:27:03.380 --> 00:27:07.200 around that, as I recall, said there were three 00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:11.279 things wrong. Overpaid, over sex, and over here. 00:27:11.779 --> 00:27:14.960 That was the way some were describing it, perhaps 00:27:14.960 --> 00:27:19.920 quite correctly. But in my own experience, everyone 00:27:19.920 --> 00:27:24.160 I met in England was polite and receptive and 00:27:24.160 --> 00:27:29.319 very glad to see it. And so being in England 00:27:29.319 --> 00:27:36.279 was like a Like a vacation, a theater, museums, 00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:40.220 going up to the Shakespearean country of Stratford 00:27:40.220 --> 00:27:44.880 -on -Avon. Everything was just great fun. That 00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:47.799 changed when we crossed the Channel, but England 00:27:47.799 --> 00:27:51.339 was just a delight. Well, you were there for, 00:27:51.339 --> 00:27:53.740 what, eight months before the land? Yes, around 00:27:53.740 --> 00:27:58.759 six months. Right before, what am I talking about, 00:27:58.920 --> 00:28:03.430 D -Day. Right, before D -Day. and uh... we were 00:28:03.430 --> 00:28:09.009 you part of our patents magic show for the germans 00:28:09.009 --> 00:28:12.029 with the fake can't have a look at the work this 00:28:12.029 --> 00:28:15.829 way we met patten uh... and uh... we being the 00:28:15.829 --> 00:28:17.990 officers in my division there are five hundred 00:28:17.990 --> 00:28:23.009 of us uh... met him in the uh... auditorium of 00:28:23.009 --> 00:28:25.869 of of the facility we had uh... borrowed from 00:28:25.869 --> 00:28:29.589 the from the british uh... and that he was introduced 00:28:29.589 --> 00:28:33.880 to us by our division commander the new commander 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:37.079 of the third United States Army which had not 00:28:37.079 --> 00:28:43.940 yet gone into action and we went down to the 00:28:43.940 --> 00:28:47.839 English Channel and camp and then then crossed 00:28:47.839 --> 00:28:54.180 the channel a couple of weeks later and went 00:28:54.180 --> 00:28:58.400 into Normandy and couldn't really move we were 00:28:58.619 --> 00:29:01.200 I was in an armored division, but it couldn't 00:29:01.200 --> 00:29:04.220 move. It was kind of locked in those orchards 00:29:04.220 --> 00:29:08.079 of Normandy. And finally we broke through, broke 00:29:08.079 --> 00:29:11.700 through the German lines that were opposing us 00:29:11.700 --> 00:29:16.880 and came to the French town of Avroche. And it 00:29:16.880 --> 00:29:20.200 had taken a terrible beating from the air, including 00:29:20.200 --> 00:29:22.920 the fact that it killed American general, Lieutenant 00:29:22.920 --> 00:29:26.900 General McNair. But as we started driving through 00:29:26.900 --> 00:29:34.450 Avroche, There, standing on a rather large army 00:29:34.450 --> 00:29:38.470 jeep, you can call it that, with twisting boots, 00:29:39.289 --> 00:29:44.230 two pistols, a beautiful helmet, medals, looking 00:29:44.230 --> 00:29:47.309 like a million bucks, and saluting everybody 00:29:47.309 --> 00:29:53.190 as we went by, was General Patton. And he took 00:29:53.190 --> 00:29:57.420 us through Europe, and we all... greatly respected 00:29:57.420 --> 00:30:02.460 him, almost loved him. He became our leader for 00:30:02.460 --> 00:30:05.119 life. It certainly sounds like that when you 00:30:05.119 --> 00:30:07.720 describe him in your book, you talk about that 00:30:07.720 --> 00:30:09.900 where he's saluting everybody as you're driving 00:30:09.900 --> 00:30:13.880 by on your way into France. I wanted to kind 00:30:13.880 --> 00:30:15.599 of back up just a little bit because I think 00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:18.920 it was a really important part of the story is 00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:20.980 that when you landed on the beaches of, I think 00:30:20.980 --> 00:30:24.859 it was Utah Beach, how difficult it was to get 00:30:24.940 --> 00:30:27.440 off the beach because of all the wounded that 00:30:27.440 --> 00:30:33.339 were coming back through to England. Yes, I had 00:30:33.339 --> 00:30:36.180 been trained and as I mentioned in the Malawi 00:30:36.180 --> 00:30:43.799 desert and in Texas and then in England and one 00:30:43.799 --> 00:30:47.119 thing I was never felt or even thought about 00:30:47.119 --> 00:30:54.630 was fear and once we landed once we crossed the 00:30:54.630 --> 00:30:58.210 channel and saw all those bodies lying on their 00:30:58.210 --> 00:31:01.069 stretchers either dying or going to a hospital 00:31:01.069 --> 00:31:07.990 a fear hit me and that fear never ever left me 00:31:07.990 --> 00:31:14.130 I can't say it never left me because like when 00:31:14.130 --> 00:31:16.069 I would play poker at night I wouldn't think 00:31:16.069 --> 00:31:22.309 about it and when I actually went into some Forward 00:31:22.309 --> 00:31:25.849 observer action it left me but by and large I 00:31:25.849 --> 00:31:28.329 found myself fearful for the rest of the war 00:31:28.329 --> 00:31:33.670 and It was combating that fear that was difficult 00:31:33.670 --> 00:31:38.490 and One way to combat it was to start shooting 00:31:38.490 --> 00:31:42.049 at people So that's what I did. I started shooting 00:31:42.049 --> 00:31:46.150 at people And unfortunately, it sounds like shortly 00:31:46.150 --> 00:31:50.819 after you arrived in France you and another buddy 00:31:50.819 --> 00:31:53.619 of yours ran across two Germans and luckily you 00:31:53.619 --> 00:31:59.299 shot first. Yes, that to me has always been a 00:31:59.299 --> 00:32:03.140 very unfortunate incident. When I say unfortunate, 00:32:03.240 --> 00:32:06.680 I don't think it should have happened. Or another 00:32:06.680 --> 00:32:11.539 way of putting it is I'm not proud of it. But 00:32:11.539 --> 00:32:14.980 the other soldier, Sergeant Plaza, his name and 00:32:14.980 --> 00:32:22.440 I were reconnoitering in the Normandy area, Orchard 00:32:22.440 --> 00:32:26.980 area and so forth, and down the road toward us 00:32:26.980 --> 00:32:30.880 come two German soldiers about our age, and we 00:32:30.880 --> 00:32:34.940 were in our early 20s. They were fully armed, 00:32:35.880 --> 00:32:39.839 but they weren't carrying their arms as if they 00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:41.740 were going to attack or shoot. They had them 00:32:41.740 --> 00:32:44.819 just shoulder them over their shoulders, so to 00:32:44.819 --> 00:32:49.950 speak. And they were talking. And my sergeant 00:32:49.950 --> 00:32:52.990 and I really didn't know what to do as these 00:32:52.990 --> 00:32:57.029 two Germans approached us. And so we cried halt. 00:32:58.690 --> 00:33:02.569 And they did not halt. But they didn't aim their 00:33:02.569 --> 00:33:05.569 guns at us. It didn't even look as if they saw 00:33:05.569 --> 00:33:09.289 us. And they came walking and we yelled at them 00:33:09.289 --> 00:33:14.869 again halt. And when they did not, we shot them. 00:33:15.630 --> 00:33:18.390 And they both dropped. dead i believe that what 00:33:18.390 --> 00:33:23.789 i didn't examine the bodies and i often wondered 00:33:23.789 --> 00:33:28.029 if that was that that was a necessary action 00:33:28.029 --> 00:33:32.750 if these two young germans would have gone on 00:33:32.750 --> 00:33:36.970 and uh... been people members of the community 00:33:36.970 --> 00:33:40.490 of course look at their germans were pretty bad 00:33:40.490 --> 00:33:44.869 and they were pretty rough but that it left a 00:33:44.869 --> 00:33:48.009 big question in my mind I think it would leave 00:33:48.009 --> 00:33:49.769 a big question in your mind because you know 00:33:49.769 --> 00:33:52.529 even though we are and you were you know we're 00:33:52.529 --> 00:33:55.430 taught to kill the enemy it's it's it's one thing 00:33:55.430 --> 00:33:57.670 to talk about doing it and then it's another 00:33:57.670 --> 00:34:00.029 thing actually doing it because with artillery 00:34:00.029 --> 00:34:02.390 you're using you know you're blasting people 00:34:02.390 --> 00:34:08.530 from far away. Yes the artillery was as a forward 00:34:08.530 --> 00:34:12.630 observer I would see the the shells hit but I 00:34:12.630 --> 00:34:14.750 couldn't really tell what kind of damage was 00:34:14.750 --> 00:34:18.019 going on. Once in a while something blew up and 00:34:18.019 --> 00:34:22.059 I could tell we'd hit a vehicle or a gas truck 00:34:22.059 --> 00:34:24.800 or something like that But when you're shooting 00:34:24.800 --> 00:34:30.980 at close range It's a very eerie feeling if you 00:34:30.980 --> 00:34:33.659 were the other guy that the other guy is shooting 00:34:33.659 --> 00:34:37.519 at you it's legit But when he's just walking 00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:40.800 down the road and if got something with the other 00:34:40.800 --> 00:34:44.519 fellow It's legitimacy begins to be questionable 00:34:45.110 --> 00:34:48.090 I think that's something that many people, especially 00:34:48.090 --> 00:34:52.329 infantry guys, have to deal with when they're 00:34:52.329 --> 00:34:55.309 in battle. You never know. It's like you said, 00:34:55.349 --> 00:34:57.070 you don't know. If these guys had finally noticed 00:34:57.070 --> 00:34:58.530 you, if they had pulled their guns out, then 00:34:58.530 --> 00:35:00.929 you would have been okay with it. This is kind 00:35:00.929 --> 00:35:05.030 of a different situation. Let's try to move on. 00:35:05.630 --> 00:35:07.710 As you go across France, you ran into a couple 00:35:07.710 --> 00:35:11.829 of other interesting experiences. Could you talk 00:35:11.829 --> 00:35:13.349 about the one where you ended up in the church 00:35:13.349 --> 00:35:18.760 tower? When I ended up where in a church steeple. 00:35:19.860 --> 00:35:25.940 Oh Yes We had left Normandy and had been ordered 00:35:25.940 --> 00:35:31.920 to Brittany by our army commander and told to 00:35:31.920 --> 00:35:37.739 try and destroy a German U -boat pins Which were 00:35:37.739 --> 00:35:41.760 based at the port of Loria, France Which is on 00:35:41.760 --> 00:35:46.199 the coastline in Brittany So I, as a forward 00:35:46.199 --> 00:35:48.860 observer, a field artillery forward observer, 00:35:50.260 --> 00:35:55.420 was ordered by my battalion commander to find 00:35:55.420 --> 00:35:59.960 an observation post where I could bring down 00:35:59.960 --> 00:36:05.320 our guns. We had 18 105 millimeter howitzer guns 00:36:05.320 --> 00:36:13.920 on the German, those German elements. protecting 00:36:13.920 --> 00:36:21.619 the German sub -pins. And so in the town in Brittany 00:36:21.619 --> 00:36:26.440 of Kodas, C -A -U -D -A -N, there was a church 00:36:26.440 --> 00:36:33.179 with a tall steeple. And I went up in it with 00:36:33.179 --> 00:36:36.840 my crew and I could see from the steeple, which 00:36:36.840 --> 00:36:41.460 was about 20 feet high, The German guns firing 00:36:41.460 --> 00:36:46.139 here and there See them clearly and so I brought 00:36:46.139 --> 00:36:52.360 down counter fire on and Got pretty close I could 00:36:52.360 --> 00:36:54.719 see some of them exploding we were getting it 00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:58.500 and I can see them moving the guns and Then darkness 00:36:58.500 --> 00:37:01.480 came and we came down from the steeple when I 00:37:01.480 --> 00:37:05.500 say we me and my crew And then the next morning 00:37:05.500 --> 00:37:10.570 early I went back up, this time accompanied by 00:37:10.570 --> 00:37:15.010 Colonel Alex Graham, who was my battalion commander, 00:37:15.590 --> 00:37:19.230 and who wanted to see what was going on. And 00:37:19.230 --> 00:37:21.170 we hadn't been up there for the half an hour 00:37:21.170 --> 00:37:25.650 or so. Then all of a sudden, something we were 00:37:25.650 --> 00:37:29.929 doing gave us away. Maybe a flash from our binoculars 00:37:29.929 --> 00:37:34.650 or our battery commander's scope. But they started 00:37:34.650 --> 00:37:41.510 firing at the church steeple. and Graham and 00:37:41.510 --> 00:37:44.489 I and the plaza and the other guys, the radio, 00:37:44.630 --> 00:37:49.369 etc. just raced down the stairs to the main floor 00:37:49.369 --> 00:37:54.510 not too soon because they found the church people 00:37:54.510 --> 00:37:58.429 and they blew the top off maybe 25 minutes, 25 00:37:58.429 --> 00:38:04.809 seconds after we'd gotten down to the floor and 00:38:04.809 --> 00:38:09.510 we were very lucky No one hurt no one killed 00:38:09.510 --> 00:38:13.869 and they'd blown the top off the steeple and 00:38:13.869 --> 00:38:18.949 We then the next day pulled out and went across 00:38:18.949 --> 00:38:26.170 France to the town of Troy Many many years later 00:38:26.170 --> 00:38:30.309 40 or 50 years later With my brother -in -law. 00:38:30.309 --> 00:38:34.869 I went and his son -in -law We got in the car 00:38:34.869 --> 00:38:42.570 and drove back Dakota and Couldn't find the church 00:38:42.570 --> 00:38:47.309 That's one and I went up to an ATM machine where 00:38:47.309 --> 00:38:51.989 there was a older couple of man and woman I Spoke 00:38:51.989 --> 00:38:54.429 rather rotten French, but I asked him in my poor 00:38:54.429 --> 00:38:59.429 French Where's the where's the church? All they 00:38:59.429 --> 00:39:03.630 said no church And I said look I was here in 00:39:03.630 --> 00:39:09.170 1944 and there was a church Ah, they said. And 00:39:09.170 --> 00:39:13.429 they took me and my companions by the arms and 00:39:13.429 --> 00:39:18.710 walked us up the block to where there was sort 00:39:18.710 --> 00:39:21.710 of like a county office building with men and 00:39:21.710 --> 00:39:25.610 women working behind desks. And they took us 00:39:25.610 --> 00:39:31.369 upstairs to the room where the regional council 00:39:31.369 --> 00:39:34.780 would meet. It was empty at the time. And behind 00:39:34.780 --> 00:39:39.599 the chairman's chair was a photograph of the 00:39:39.599 --> 00:39:43.960 church. And it appears that the day after we 00:39:43.960 --> 00:39:48.679 left this town and crossed France to Troyes, 00:39:49.400 --> 00:39:52.820 the Germans came in and blew that church up from 00:39:52.820 --> 00:39:57.179 top to bottom. And it never was replaced. But 00:39:57.179 --> 00:40:00.940 there, looking at it in the council room, was 00:40:00.940 --> 00:40:04.860 the exact church. very much revered by the citizens 00:40:04.860 --> 00:40:08.659 even to this day. That's a cool story. I like 00:40:08.659 --> 00:40:12.840 that one. I want to make sure people read the 00:40:12.840 --> 00:40:14.980 book, so I'm not going to ask you to describe 00:40:14.980 --> 00:40:18.079 all of the adventures that you had crossing France 00:40:18.079 --> 00:40:20.059 and so forth. We're talking with Roger Boas. 00:40:20.440 --> 00:40:22.579 His book is Battle Rattle. It's the last memoir 00:40:22.579 --> 00:40:27.119 of World War II. I do want to get into though, 00:40:27.579 --> 00:40:33.349 when you came upon the discovery of... Ordruff? 00:40:34.690 --> 00:40:37.010 Ordruff, yes. The concentration camp. Can you 00:40:37.010 --> 00:40:46.230 tell us about that? Yes. We, my battalion and 00:40:46.230 --> 00:40:53.489 regiment were going down the Autobahn in combat 00:40:53.489 --> 00:41:00.650 formation and we see a very nice building, a 00:41:00.650 --> 00:41:04.559 residential building, but Quite different from 00:41:04.559 --> 00:41:08.320 the others much more modern designed by a modern 00:41:08.320 --> 00:41:11.340 German architect obviously and looking quite 00:41:11.340 --> 00:41:15.940 posh and So Bob Parker my battalion commander 00:41:15.940 --> 00:41:19.579 and I and I was the adjutant I Just pulled out 00:41:19.579 --> 00:41:22.579 of the column for a minute and went into this 00:41:22.579 --> 00:41:27.360 building and went up looking around The occupants 00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:29.380 weren't there, but there were servants there 00:41:29.900 --> 00:41:32.500 And we learned that it was the residence of the 00:41:32.500 --> 00:41:36.599 IG Farben head. IG Farben being the company that 00:41:36.599 --> 00:41:39.900 made all kinds of stuff, including the chemicals 00:41:39.900 --> 00:41:45.239 used to gas Jews in concentration camps. And 00:41:45.239 --> 00:41:47.360 we looked out from the window, I think of the 00:41:47.360 --> 00:41:51.000 second or third floor, and across the street 00:41:51.000 --> 00:41:57.780 we see a pile of bodies, dead bodies. We raced 00:41:57.780 --> 00:42:02.099 down the steps and across the street and enter 00:42:02.099 --> 00:42:09.639 what was an auxiliary concentration camp, auxiliary 00:42:09.639 --> 00:42:13.219 to a much bigger one 40 some odd miles away called 00:42:13.219 --> 00:42:20.139 Buchenwald. And this was at Ordres. And there 00:42:20.139 --> 00:42:22.500 were a whole bunch of bodies right in the middle. 00:42:23.500 --> 00:42:27.539 And they'd recently been shot. And the guards 00:42:27.539 --> 00:42:33.059 had left and some were still bleeding. And many 00:42:33.059 --> 00:42:36.860 had starved Davids. They were Jewish. And they 00:42:36.860 --> 00:42:41.000 were in striped uniforms, shot through the head 00:42:41.000 --> 00:42:46.000 and made into sort of a pyramidal pile. I'd never 00:42:46.000 --> 00:42:49.579 seen anything like that before. And in fact, 00:42:49.619 --> 00:42:53.079 a couple of days later, three of the high generals 00:42:53.079 --> 00:42:58.219 Eisenhower, Bradley, And Patton came to look 00:42:58.219 --> 00:43:02.420 at this place. And Patton threw up. It was so 00:43:02.420 --> 00:43:08.539 awful. Terrible sight. I can only imagine. I 00:43:08.539 --> 00:43:13.360 want to transition though to an experience that 00:43:13.360 --> 00:43:18.500 you had after you came back. You were in your 00:43:18.500 --> 00:43:23.239 granddaughter's class in San Francisco. Can you 00:43:23.239 --> 00:43:25.000 hear that story with the person that you met 00:43:25.000 --> 00:43:36.420 there? Yes I Saw that camp in on April 4th 1945 00:43:36.420 --> 00:43:45.719 and It was a site that never left my mind and 00:43:45.719 --> 00:43:51.440 Many years later in the 2000 like 2012 or something 00:43:51.440 --> 00:43:55.730 like that I went to the graduation, eighth grade 00:43:55.730 --> 00:44:01.150 graduation, of my grandson at a school in Northern 00:44:01.150 --> 00:44:06.070 California's East Bay area, Prospect Sierra School, 00:44:07.210 --> 00:44:13.250 and they had invited various people, old timers, 00:44:13.849 --> 00:44:18.570 wives, widows, sons, grandsons, etc., to talk 00:44:18.570 --> 00:44:21.289 about World War II and personal experiences. 00:44:21.920 --> 00:44:25.019 or experiences that have been handled down. So 00:44:25.019 --> 00:44:29.000 I was there talking as were others. And then 00:44:29.000 --> 00:44:34.340 they had lunch. And I sat at a table with a bunch 00:44:34.340 --> 00:44:38.019 of old timers, being one of the old timers myself. 00:44:40.599 --> 00:44:47.860 And there was a fellow sitting on my left. And 00:44:47.860 --> 00:44:52.440 he had been speaking at the and saying he'd been 00:44:52.440 --> 00:44:56.179 a concentration camp survivor. And I said, what 00:44:56.179 --> 00:45:00.239 camp were you in? This is at lunch. And he said, 00:45:00.400 --> 00:45:04.480 Ordruff. I said, hell, my battalion commander 00:45:04.480 --> 00:45:08.599 and I opened up Ordruff ourselves. We were the 00:45:08.599 --> 00:45:13.219 two first Americans in it in April 4th, 1945. 00:45:14.599 --> 00:45:17.340 He just drops his food and puts his arms around 00:45:17.340 --> 00:45:20.699 me and says, you're my savior, you're my savior. 00:45:21.050 --> 00:45:25.469 They just kept repeating it. But the war, it's 00:45:25.469 --> 00:45:29.489 so strange. Here we had probably met in April 00:45:29.489 --> 00:45:34.349 of 45, and now we're having lunch together in 00:45:34.349 --> 00:45:41.250 2000 and something at a private school. It is 00:45:41.250 --> 00:45:43.489 amazing that coincidences, it's like everything 00:45:43.489 --> 00:45:47.010 is destiny in some sort. We're running up against 00:45:47.010 --> 00:45:49.869 the clock, Roger, so I want to talk about... 00:45:50.619 --> 00:45:54.860 when you came home and you kind of did, you know, 00:45:55.000 --> 00:45:56.599 you were suffering, you felt you were suffering 00:45:56.599 --> 00:45:59.179 from battle rattle, which was the term that was 00:45:59.179 --> 00:46:01.099 used during World War II for post -traumatic 00:46:01.099 --> 00:46:03.940 stress. So what was it like when you got home? 00:46:06.280 --> 00:46:08.619 I couldn't wait to get home and when I got home 00:46:08.619 --> 00:46:12.260 I found it to be perfectly dreadful. My parents 00:46:12.260 --> 00:46:16.900 were lovely to me, but I couldn't relate to them 00:46:16.900 --> 00:46:22.280 or to anyone. I found I couldn't focus on anything 00:46:22.280 --> 00:46:28.139 or that I couldn't make decisions. I knew something 00:46:28.139 --> 00:46:33.119 was wrong with me, but I didn't know what. I 00:46:33.119 --> 00:46:36.219 was a practicing Christian scientist in those 00:46:36.219 --> 00:46:40.159 days, so I went to a Christian science practitioner 00:46:40.159 --> 00:46:45.780 who tried to help, but it was no success. I felt 00:46:45.780 --> 00:46:49.639 lost. couldn't focus, couldn't make decisions. 00:46:50.900 --> 00:46:53.679 And that sort of aura hung around me for seven 00:46:53.679 --> 00:46:58.260 or eight years. What I didn't know then that 00:46:58.260 --> 00:47:02.219 I know now was that I was suffering from what 00:47:02.219 --> 00:47:07.780 in World War I they called shell shock. In World 00:47:07.780 --> 00:47:11.559 War II, we sort of loosely called battle rattle. 00:47:12.280 --> 00:47:15.260 My division psychiatrist was the battle rattle 00:47:15.260 --> 00:47:19.840 doctor. And what I had was a good case of post 00:47:19.840 --> 00:47:22.880 -traumatic stress disorder, which no one knew 00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:28.239 anything about at this particular time. You mentioned 00:47:28.239 --> 00:47:31.139 in the book, and again the book is Battle Rattled 00:47:31.139 --> 00:47:34.719 by Roger Boas, B -O -A -S, and I encourage all 00:47:34.719 --> 00:47:37.619 of you out there, whether you're in the military 00:47:37.619 --> 00:47:39.699 or civilian, or you had somebody that was in 00:47:39.699 --> 00:47:41.340 the military, to get a chance to go and read 00:47:41.340 --> 00:47:45.559 this. It really filled in a lot of blanks for 00:47:45.559 --> 00:47:48.559 myself. And I think it would help us understand, 00:47:48.619 --> 00:47:50.980 because you mentioned in the book that they trained 00:47:50.980 --> 00:47:54.079 you for a year and a half, but nobody trained 00:47:54.079 --> 00:47:57.360 you how to come back. And that was kind of your 00:47:57.360 --> 00:47:59.860 mission. Your message at the end of the book 00:47:59.860 --> 00:48:03.900 is, how do you bring these people back? Yes, 00:48:04.500 --> 00:48:07.500 all the training was go get them, shoot them 00:48:07.500 --> 00:48:11.260 down. And almost no attention to, here's how 00:48:11.260 --> 00:48:14.099 you react psychologically if you get shot at. 00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:17.360 or if something bad happens to you or your friends. 00:48:18.199 --> 00:48:22.119 So all of us were exposed. Some handled it better 00:48:22.119 --> 00:48:27.039 than others. My colleagues seemed to handle it 00:48:27.039 --> 00:48:30.539 best if they stayed in the service. It was a 00:48:30.539 --> 00:48:33.800 framework of protection. But for those of us 00:48:33.800 --> 00:48:38.239 who got out like me, it was up to you. And in 00:48:38.239 --> 00:48:42.019 my case, I had a very bad time handling myself. 00:48:42.320 --> 00:48:45.119 I think if I hadn't come back. If I'd stayed 00:48:45.119 --> 00:48:48.739 in Europe either as a serviceman or as a civilian 00:48:48.739 --> 00:48:52.099 and gone to say Oxford or Cambridge or a school 00:48:52.099 --> 00:48:56.179 in France, I'd have been a lot better off. But 00:48:56.179 --> 00:48:59.599 coming home where parents and friends did not 00:48:59.599 --> 00:49:01.900 want to talk about the war, didn't talk about 00:49:01.900 --> 00:49:04.719 the war, and you yourself were wondering what 00:49:04.719 --> 00:49:07.820 the heck is happening to me, it was a bad scene. 00:49:09.519 --> 00:49:12.659 Well, I want to remind everybody, it's not that 00:49:12.659 --> 00:49:16.320 Roger was not successful after World War II. 00:49:16.460 --> 00:49:19.199 I mean, he was very big in public television 00:49:19.199 --> 00:49:22.300 and you were trying to explain these things to 00:49:22.300 --> 00:49:24.679 people through, it sounds like a really great 00:49:24.679 --> 00:49:28.119 television program for over 13 years. You ran 00:49:28.119 --> 00:49:31.000 a successful dealership and you got involved 00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:32.900 in a lot of different things. I want to, you 00:49:32.900 --> 00:49:36.000 know, people with post -traumatic stress, you 00:49:36.000 --> 00:49:38.579 know, they just... deal with it the best way 00:49:38.579 --> 00:49:40.099 that they can. They still have to go on with 00:49:40.099 --> 00:49:45.659 their lives. I got lucky. I was not dealing with 00:49:45.659 --> 00:49:51.579 it well at all. And having trouble making decisions, 00:49:51.820 --> 00:49:56.159 etc. And one day I'd been home five or six years, 00:49:56.719 --> 00:49:59.780 out of the blue, a friend of mine, actually an 00:49:59.780 --> 00:50:02.719 Austrian refugee, a very charming, bright chap, 00:50:03.880 --> 00:50:07.699 a professor of economics. I said to me, Boas, 00:50:07.900 --> 00:50:11.260 in his German accent, Austrian accent, why don't 00:50:11.260 --> 00:50:14.300 you try public television? And public television 00:50:14.300 --> 00:50:18.119 was just getting started. And here in San Francisco, 00:50:18.420 --> 00:50:23.480 it was called as it is today, KQED television. 00:50:25.199 --> 00:50:30.659 And I went down. The only show they had right 00:50:30.659 --> 00:50:35.170 then was a cooking show out of popover and stuff 00:50:35.170 --> 00:50:39.030 like that. I talked to the head of the station 00:50:39.030 --> 00:50:42.530 and he said, let's give it a try. And so I started 00:50:42.530 --> 00:50:47.130 helping, being a co -producer and on the mainstream 00:50:47.130 --> 00:50:50.909 of a show we called Profile Bay Area. And it 00:50:50.909 --> 00:50:54.309 helped pull me out of the slump. My mind got 00:50:54.309 --> 00:51:01.889 better, the PTSD started to slow down, and I 00:51:01.889 --> 00:51:04.699 loved public television. So that was a change 00:51:04.699 --> 00:51:08.280 in my life for the better. It's a great way to 00:51:08.280 --> 00:51:10.239 end our interview, too, I think. Unfortunately, 00:51:10.400 --> 00:51:12.519 we have to stop this now. We've run out of time. 00:51:13.599 --> 00:51:15.880 Thank you so much, Roger, for being on our program. 00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:17.900 This is Roger Boas. His book is Battle Rattled. 00:51:18.599 --> 00:51:20.380 Please go out and buy this book. Tell everybody 00:51:20.380 --> 00:51:22.420 you know about it. I think you're going to enjoy 00:51:22.420 --> 00:51:24.980 the stories. Some of them are very humorous. 00:51:25.059 --> 00:51:27.000 Some of them, of course, as anybody who's been 00:51:27.000 --> 00:51:29.079 in the silvers knows, that, you know, you've 00:51:29.079 --> 00:51:31.119 got some funny stuff goes on and then some terrible 00:51:31.119 --> 00:51:32.739 things that go on. So I want to thank you very 00:51:32.739 --> 00:51:34.860 much for being on our program. Great pleasure. 00:51:34.940 --> 00:51:37.360 And thank you for the invitation. I much appreciate 00:51:37.360 --> 00:51:40.179 it. Thank you, Roger. All right. That's it for 00:51:40.179 --> 00:51:43.340 today, folks. That's Veterans Radio. And we'll 00:51:43.340 --> 00:51:45.360 be coming back next week. And we're going to 00:51:45.360 --> 00:51:47.849 be talking about benefits and services. such 00:51:47.849 --> 00:51:49.829 as Roger was talking about, where we're trying 00:51:49.829 --> 00:51:51.989 to help these veterans that are coming back today. 00:51:52.829 --> 00:51:55.269 And so I encourage you to tune in next week. 00:51:55.630 --> 00:51:57.989 Until then, you are dismissed.