All across America and around the world, this
is Veterans Radio. This is Veterans Radio. And
now, your host for today's program, Dale Throneberry.
Good afternoon, American. Welcome to Veterans
Radio. My name is Dale Throneberry, and I have
the privilege and honor of talking to you today
about veterans. Everything Veteran. We've got
a great program lined up. We're going to be talking
about a new organization that is in the Detroit
area that has to do with Major League Baseball.
And we've got some news for you. And then in
the second half of the program, we've got the
former Under Secretary of the VA who's going
to be talking about the changes that have occurred
at the VA over the last five years. If you'll
remember when we were, we've been covering this
story for. 12 years now already, is that the
backup at the VA was up to over 600 ,000 veterans
trying to get benefits and so on and so forth.
And because of our guest, I think a lot has to
do with our guest. And this is a retired brigadier
general, Allison Hickey, kind of streamlined
the VA and finally brought in some magic technology.
So you got to stay tuned for that. That's an
interview that I did with Jim Falzone and General
last week. So that's pretty exciting stuff. So
we're very excited to talk about that with you
and all the other things that are going on. We've
got some events that are happening in the local
area and we've got just many, many things to
talk about with you. So I'm anxious for that.
If you wanted to get in on the conversation,
you can always give us a call here at Veterans
Radio at 734 -822 -1600. We are coming to you
from the studios of WAAM. Chalk Radio, 1600 A
.M. in beautiful Ann Arbor, Michigan. The sun
is out, the snow is melting again. And so we're
going to be talking right now with the baseball
season coming up. And one of our favorite players
is Justin Berlandert. No, Justin couldn't make
it. He's got to play baseball starting this week.
But he did start an organization called Wins
for Warriors Foundation. And joining me right
now on the line is the CEO and Big cheese over
there at the Wins for Warriors and that's Sandy
Hudson. Sandy, welcome to Veterans Radio. Thanks
Dale. Glad to be with you. I'm very happy to
have you with us as well. Here in the Detroit
area, hope springs eternal as we always say for
all of our sports teams and we're hoping again
that this year the Tigers will finally get to
the World Series and win this one for us. We've
been very patient. They've got a real shot this
year, and from Justin's perspective, the team
is complete in terms of pitching and hitting,
and so I really look forward to the season as
well. I do too. I think it's going to be very
exciting, but almost as exciting as Justin Verlander's
wins for Warriors Foundation. Can you tell our
audience about that, please? Sure can. Justin
launched this initiative about two and a half
years ago. He wanted to give back and he has
two grandfathers that were veterans and did service
and he wanted to do something but he just didn't
want to do something just for veterans. So what
he did is he really focused his efforts around
the hidden killer of PTSD and traumatic brain
injuries. So when he launched it with a commitment
two years ago with a million dollars, he really
focused some giving around some top -notch national
organizations, such as Give an Hour, the Michigan
Continues, even some of our grant dollars went
to Ann Arbor, to the University of Michigan's
discretion center, where they have a MSPAN program
that supports veterans and the families on weekend
retreats, all in the effort to help to diminish
the effects of transition back into civilian
life and and the effects of PTSD and traumatic
brain injury. It wasn't until about last year
when we launched an event called the 9K, which
was a road race, that he realized that he really
wanted to raise some serious money from his efforts
as well as others that wanted to be a part of
it. And so that's when he decided to form a foundation.
that public charity 501c3 that could certainly
allow for him to continue his efforts but get
others engaged as well including other celebrity
athletes. So he is really set out to make a difference
with not only the issues of mental health in
veterans but also as the foundation's mission
states to really advocate for and invest in resources
that enable veterans and their families to live
resilient lives. And so it's very positive. It's
very, you know, leveraging all of the great things
that veterans have going for them, but also to
help to make those great things better. So go
ahead. No, I was just going to say it's a great
organization and we've talked with people from
Give an Hour here in the local area or in the
state of Michigan. And it looks like it's probably
the similar thing around the country where they
donate time. These are psychiatrists and psychologists
who donate an hour a week to talk with veterans
and to help them through their, I guess, their
recovery hopefully from their post -traumatic
stress or their traumatic brain injury and many
of the other things. And in fact, we just a couple
of months ago, I had a chance to meet Justin
up at the Ann Arbor VA Hospital where they They
donated a new waiting area up in the, I think
it was the physical rehabilitation wing. Yep.
And that was cool because it's got all kinds
of baseball pictures and memorabilia and so on
up there. He just seems like a genuinely nice
man. He's a very nice man. He's a very caring
man and he's a very smart man and he wants his
investments to go a long way. It's not just about
giving away dollars. And so the creation of the
foundation And the kind of things that we're
doing with veterans and their families is really
across the board, trying to not only get after
the clinical side, as you mentioned, with Give
an Hour. The mission continues with their programs,
but also doing things like the Thousand Christmas
Salutes, which is a dinner that we hosted last
December for a thousand veterans and their families
in a top -notch facility called the Gross Point
1 Memorial. and we served a fabulous dinner and
actually even gave away three all -expense pay
trips to Disney World to three deserving veterans
families that could not otherwise couldn't go
on their own. So, you know, it's really we look
expansively about what we can do for families
as well as the veterans themselves and we're
committed to getting the public involved in the
effort. We have a new program launching on our
winsforwarriors .org website. And it's going
to be where Tiger fans can play along with Justin
and basically pledge dollars to help veterans.
And the better that Justin does, the more that
folks get to see their pledge dollars go to work
for veterans. So that's going to be exciting.
I like that. How's that one going to work? Because
the season begins in two days. It's going to
be up and running for the first start on Tuesday.
It's called Pledge It, and you basically are
pledging for every strikeout that Justin has.
You're able to donate a certain dollar amount,
and that continues throughout the season. So
it adds a dynamic that, as our name says, you're
able to win for Warriors, as Justin is, and hopefully
the Tigers are, but we wanted to get fans involved
as well. I think that's a great idea. donated
a dollar a strike out, and if Justin is back
to his normal ratio there, that could generate
a lot of money. That's how we feel about it,
Dale, and we really wanted to make sure that
we were not just getting those that might be
able to give bigger gifts involved, but we really
wanted to get everybody involved. I have so many
people that come up to us. almost on a daily
basis and said, you know, this is great that
Justin's doing this. How do I get involved? And
so we really, we revamped the website, made it
much more user -friendly and allowed for folks
to really understand the issues because that's
important, but also then to have many call to
actions that allow for them to donate, to advocate,
you know, and to volunteer if that's their thing.
So we wanted to have many call to actions that
allow for folks to engage. Well, it's certainly
something that we here at Veterans Radio are
very excited about. We'd like to talk to you
off the air more to see how we can help promote
the Wins for Warriors Foundation. The other thing
I know, and I've been aware of this for quite
a while, is that every time that Justin Verlander
pitched a game at home, he would invite veterans
into a private suite there. Yes. It's a program
that we've been very proud about. It's in partnership
with the Detroit Tigers Foundation. It's called
Verlander's Victory for Veterans. And every Saturday,
home game, it's not just when Justin pitches,
it's every Saturday home game. We invite through
our relationship with the VA, it turns out to
be about 13 home games, but we invite veterans
and their families to join together up in Justin's
suite. So you'll see more of that this upcoming
season and we're proud of that. uh... that program
and and and really it's the detroit tigers foundation
that does a lot of the heavy lifting for that
so uh... weekly uh... we were going to be doing
a lot more around uh... tiger games uh... this
year and we're uh... we're going to keep our
eye out for a game in late late august where
we're going to be inviting all sorts of veterans
and uh... and uh... to a special game uh... at
the end of the at the end of august so lots to
come on on that whole front because they really
want to tie in with not only the veteran community
but also the fan community and see what great
things we can do for them. Well it's always very
exciting to go to a Tigers game when they have
a veteran who takes the ball out to the mound
before the game begins and everybody gets to
their feet and you can actually see tears in
their eyes. It's very emotional. And, you know,
people in Detroit, they're blue collar type of
people, very supportive of their military. And
this is something that can, I think they're going
to grab on to this Sandy and just really help
you guys raise a lot of funds for what you want
to do. And we certainly appreciate what you are
doing and what Justin is doing to get this whole
thing started. When I was talking to you earlier
in the week, I wanted to know if, are there other
organizations like this with other major league
teams? Because we broadcast across, actually
across the world, but I was wondering if there
were other organizations that people might be
interested in for their team. There certainly
is. I mean, many sports teams support veterans
in various ways. One that's similar to what we're
doing is a program that the Boston Red Sox have.
and a couple of their players have been involved
with. It's a program called Home Base and it's
a program that raises money for a freestanding
facility that specifically treats veterans with
PTSD in a clinical setting and it's a partnership
with Mass General whereby the veteran pays nothing.
It's outside of the VA system but it allows for
the access that the veteran needs and that program
is now expanding into some other markets. to
create some new facilities and we're taking a
look at it right now to see if that's something
that Detroit might want to move in that direction
with and explore some partnerships with some
health systems. So there are some exciting programs
out there that are doing great work and we at
the foundation certainly are active in our research
and trying to hook up and connect with as many
programs as possible. Well, again, it's a great
idea. We're talking with Sandy Hudson. He's the
CEO and executive director of the wins for warriors
and Sandy if somebody wants to get involved with
the wins for warriors in Detroit How do they
do that? The best way to do it is go to the website
at wins winf for For warriors org. Okay, that's
wins for warriors org support Justin Verlander
and his his foundation here and of course support
the Tigers and We'll always be happy to do that
and hope to see you down at the ballpark sometime.
Thank you very much, Sandy. Thank you, Dale.
All righty. There you go, folks. I am just constantly
amazed at what civilian organizations are doing
to help veterans. We're going to be talking about
this a little bit later in the program, but we
always seem to feel that the VA is the one that
has to do all of these things. And we know that
the VA just gets overwhelmed sometimes. with
just the pure number of veterans out there. There's
still 22 million living veterans in America today,
and we've got to take care of them. And if they
all went to the VA, it's going to get a little
crowded over there because the people in Washington,
for some reason, they don't seem like they want
to do all these things, but nobody ever wants
to pony up the money. And if they don't pony
up the money... We've got to go outside to civilian
organizations like the Winds for Warriors and
some of the other organizations that we've talked
to here on Veterans Radio. So we want to know
if you have an organization out there that is
helping veterans in any way possible, let us
know and we'll be glad to get you on the air
and give you a little promotion, give you a little
PR, a little advertising and so forth because
we know that this is the way. We always take
care of our own here in America and this is what
we have to do. Pay attention to that. We've got
some events coming up. We're going to take a
break right now, and I'll come back, give you
a list of upcoming events in the local area and
around the world. So stay tuned. You're listening
to Veterans Radio. And we're back on Veterans
Radio, and that sound effect that we just played
was kind of gives me a good lead into some of
the things that are going on in the local area.
And I don't know how many of you are aware of
this, probably all of you in the local Ann Arbor
area. We are very, very lucky to have an organization
called the Yankee Air Museum. And the Yankee
Air Museum is over in Ypsilanti, Willow Run,
and it's at the former bomber plant from World
War II. They've done all kinds of things, but
the main thing is they've got all these great
static displays over there of airplanes and jet
planes and B -52s and helicopters and simulators
and uniforms and libraries and all kinds of things.
And I just wanted to let you know about a couple
of events that are coming up with them. We've
been involved with the Yankee Air Museum since
we went on the air in November 2003, and it's
always a pleasure to give them a little boost
here. So number one is that periodically they
have these presentations that they give where
somebody will come in and give a lecture on some
sort of historical event or plane or something
along those lines, and coming up on this Wednesday,
August? Yeah, August, right? April 6th. April
6th. At 7 .30 p .m., there's a free presentation
night, and this one is talking about saving the
Willow Run bomber plant. And in 1942, the largest
factory in the world, the world, I want you to
know, was built in Washtenaw County, Michigan,
and they called it the Willow Run Bomber Plant.
And this is where they built airplanes for World
War II. And they were turning out 8 ,000, you
know, bombers and mostly bombers. and B -24s
and B -25s and so forth and I know that I'll
be corrected if I don't get the names of planes
right because I never seem to remember what plane
is which one. But, so anyway, so they've got
that coming up and then they've got another event
that's coming up next weekend that's at the April
9th and that is from 10 until 2 o 'clock and
this is what they call their annual bomber buffing.
And what you do is you go over there and you
get to mingle with all these great people in
the local area who just love flying and love
World War II aircraft and you're going to clean
up the airplanes and you get to buff them and
they end up looking just like they did in the
1940s during World War II. And they've got a
B -17 that they'll be cleaning up. And let me
give you a little bit of history here on that.
It says, this polishing party is especially meaningful
because in 2016 is the 30th anniversary of the
Yankee Air Museum's purchase of the B -17. The
Yankee lady is only one of 10 B -17s still flying
and one of only five on which people can take
a ride. That's right, folks. You can go over
to the Yankee Air Museum, go to their website.
And you can sign up to take a ride on a B -17.
How cool would that be? Some of you out there,
your grandfathers, and maybe even your grandmothers
probably flew some B -17s. And you can take a
ride in that. My partner Bob Gould did that.
I have not done that yet. I'm anxious to try
it at some point. But you can do that. So if
you don't want to go to the presentation on Wednesday,
you can go over to the Yankee Air Museum on Saturday
the 9th from 10 to 2. Buff up these. airplanes
and perhaps you can work your way into a ride
on one of them. I think it'd be kind of cool
really. And let's see the other event, oh another
big fundraiser, these guys are always trying
to raise money. These things are not cheap to
run. I mean you're talking about a couple of
thousand dollars an hour just to keep them in
the air. So if you want to find out more about
what's happening over there you go to yankeeairmuseum
.org and you can find all kinds of information
about how to get tickets if you want to get a
fly. One of the things that they've got that
I just got in a message this week was corporate.
How do you like to take your corporate team out
for a team building experience? And in the meantime,
you get to ride on a V -17 or a V -25. I think
that's pretty exciting stuff. You know, they
take you out to these fancy resorts and stuff
to do these, but you could just go down the road
here and instead of going swimming in a swimming
pool, you actually get to go for a ride in a
V -17, the Yankee Lady or the V -25, the Yankee
Warrior. It's a 30 minute flight. You need to
give the Yankee Air Museum a call. His name is
Dave Wright. And give Dave a call at 734 -483
-4030. And that's 734 -483 -4030. And ask for
extension 236. And he'll set you right up. The
other thing that's going on, finally. And this
is that. How many of you like to swing dance
out there? I know, I do. I'm such a great dancer
anyway. Nina's over there going, yeah, right.
This is what we try to do. But there's a 1940s
USO dinner and dance coming up at the Yankee
Air Museum called American Bistro Night. And
this is going to be on Saturday, April 30th,
2016. The door is open at 5 .30. Dinner's at
6 .30. It's going to be in hangar one. Tickets
are $40 in advance. For members, $45. For non
-members, $50 at the door. It's available at
the Yankee Air Museum. You can give them a call
at 734 -483 -4030 or go online at yankeeairmuseum
.org. Again, the Bistro Night, American Bistro
Night, a 1940s USO dinner and dance. Music is
going to be provided by the couriers, swing dancing,
and the ladies for liberty. Sounds like the Andrew
Sisters have come back. to entertain you on that
night. So put it on your calendar right now,
Saturday, April 30th. And that's at the Yankee
Air Museum. And again, all kinds of things over
there. So go to their website. You'll be able
to find out how much it would cost you if you
want to take a ride on a B -17 or a B -25. And
I think you're going to really enjoy that. All
right. I got about four minutes here. I had some
more stuff to give you information on. The second
half of the program, as I mentioned, is a pre
-recorded program that my partner and I, Jim
Falzone, did with retired brigadier general Allison
Hickian. Allison was the undersecretary for benefits
at the VA from 2011 up until last October, I
believe it was. And her job, she'll tell you,
but her job was to modernize the system. Remember
all the news we've been reading over the last
couple of years, about 600 ,000 veterans and
constantly waiting for appointments and so on
and so forth. So she's going to give you the
down and dirty on what was going on at the VA.
And one of the things was that their archaic
system of keeping records, everything was on
paper. They didn't utilize the computers enough.
They didn't have computer systems that could
talk to each other. Sounds like the government
in general. And she was given a short amount
of time to do this. I want you to imagine that
you're on like an aircraft carrier and that you
are supposed to make a 95 or 90 degree turn in
about a minute. And if you've ever seen the size
of an aircraft carrier, you can't turn that thing
in a day sometimes. And so this was her mission
was to modernize the VA's benefits system. And
she'll tell you what was involved with that.
It is pre -recorded. Jim sounds a little bit
like he's in a tunnel. We worked on that. I think
I got him pretty much fixed up. And about 10
minutes into this interview, there's a little
break up on her phone. But otherwise, I think
this is a really, really important interview
for you to listen to. So make sure that you stay
tuned after the news to listen to this interview
with Brigadier General Allison Hickey. And she
was one of the first female graduates of the
United States Air Force Academy. She was a pilot,
which to me is always cool. And so we talked
about that a little bit before, and you'll be
able to find out more about her interview if
you go to our website, click on our podcast.
We have a whole other half -hour interview that
we did with her about her military career. But
the reason that we wanted to talk about this
issue was that the VA is continually trying to
upgrade their systems. And what we need you to
do This is all of our listeners, is we need you
to contact your senators and your congressmen
and tell them to just do something. They all
keep saying, well, we're going to help the veterans.
We've got to do this for the veterans. We're
going to do that for veterans. And then suddenly
it gets lost in the committee somewhere and we
never hear anything about it. So I want you to
contact your congressman or congresswoman and
let them know that you're getting tired of all
of this waiting around. You can't wait for another
president to come in to donate or to give money
to the VA system itself. You can't wait for things
to change because right now the Vietnam era veterans
are going into their 70s and are going to be
utilizing the VA system more and more and more
and more. You've got these veterans today that
during World War II they wouldn't have even survived.
And today they are surviving but they have so
many different issues. not only mental, but so
many physical. I mean, we've got double, triple,
quadruple amputees that are alive today that
wouldn't be alive 60 years ago. And we have to
make sure that we take care of them for the rest
of their lives. This is the deal that you made.
If you want people to be in the military, you've
got to agree to take care of them. Otherwise,
you're not going to get any people in the military.
So I just want to remind you that. I'm not going
to come back and reintroduce the interview after
the news at the bottom of the hour, so I want
to make sure that you stay tuned for Jim Falzone,
me, and Brigadier General Allison Hickey right
here on Veterans Radio, and we will be back after
the news. Our guest today is the former Under
Secretary for Benefits for the Department of
Veterans Affairs, Allison Hickey. Allison, say
hello to the veterans radio listening audience.
Hello, and it's great to be talking with you
all today. Well, we're glad to have you and my
partner, Dale Throneberry, is in the council
room with me. Dale, say hello to everyone. Hi,
good afternoon, General. Hi, Dale, how are you
doing? I am terrific and we're anxious to learn,
we've already learned about your military background
and you know just to review kind of for our audience
is that she's a graduate of the Air Force Academy,
a pilot, which is always cool, did a lot of great
things with the Air Force, was in for 27 years.
and retired in November of 2007 and offered this
position, I'm guessing, as Under Secretary for
Benefits of the Department of Ventures Affairs
on 6 -6 -11, D -Day for Alison. And I'm claiming
the victory forward. There you go. So, Alison,
let's start with this. Our veterans who are listening
to... Veterans Radio may be very aware of what
the undersecretary for benefits is involved in,
but I suspect most people in the general public
don't know what an undersecretary is and don't
know what an undersecretary for benefits is at
the VA. Maybe you can give us a little background.
Yes, so there are, in VA, there are three major
areas that respond directly to the cabinet secretary
and then to the president on all the issues of
veterans. One of them is the health side. The
person that leads all the medical side or health
side is the Under Secretary for Health. Then
there is the Under Secretary for Benefit who
leads about eight different programs, many of
which some of your readers may have leveraged,
whether it's a disability claim, a pension, a
going to school on the GI Bill, a VA home loan
program, a book rehab and employment kind of
program, and insurance, so all the service group
life insurance. for our military members and
then veteran group life insurance and others
for our veterans after they separate or retire.
And then finally, while I was there, I stood
up the transition portion of VBA or the Veterans
Benefits Administration as well. And then the
last administration is Memorial Affairs that
handles all of the memorials, all the cemeteries
that VA has responsibility for and works in that
space. Well, and listeners, we're going to refer
to the general with her permission as Allison
during this podcast and interview. Please do.
I've actually asked everyone to do that even
while I was in VA, so I appreciate you're doing
that. Allison, give us some sense of how big
this benefits portion of VA is in terms of either
budget or people. It's amazing to me how big
it is, and I think a lot of folks don't understand
that, and it later on leads to why there are
some complexities. Yes. So if there are 22 million
veterans alive today, the Veterans Benefit Administration,
between the veterans and the actual service members
that they support as well in VA home loans or
GI bills, because they do that as well for currently
serving members, it's a 12 million population.
When I left, the budget was $95 billion of which
all but $3 billion of that goes directly into
the hands of veterans, their family members,
and survivors. So it's not $95 billion for VA,
it's $92 billion for veterans, their families,
and survivors. So basically it means there is
enough staff in this world for three cents on
the dollar it takes to distribute 92 billion
dollars to veterans every year. The size of the
organization was about 21 ,000 employees, of
which about 10 ,000 are doing what people are
most familiar with, at least it seems, but those
are disability compensation claims. And then
another couple thousand are doing the education
claims, the GI Bill claims. And then it spreads
out over the other portfolios of benefits that
are provided to veterans, including some 700
or 800 people answering phones every day for
call -ins and things of that nature. Well, and
again, geographically, division or department
that you were responsible for covered the entire
country. a lot of physical presence. So we had
56 regional offices. The one in Michigan is obviously
in Detroit, but they also touch other parts of
the state. We also, though, have an overseas
presence. Like I say, we have one. VA has one.
They're the large office in Manila that handles
a lot of the veterans who are stationed over
there and overseas, and they also now help take,
you know, surge work from stations who may be
a little swamped. There are also VBA employees
in all kinds of countries that are there for
separating service members. And there's not a
lot of veterans who live overseas. And so these
people support, you know, the questions they
might have, the filing concerns, the help they
might need from those kind of forward deployed
locations. There's also a footprint in Puerto
Rico. and they serve the Virgin Islands and some
of the other Caribbean areas as well. When you
first came to the job in June of 2011, what was
the status of the benefits group that you were
taking over, did you feel? So first I will tell
you that everybody probably well remembers in
2011. They had just started responding to the
new three presumptive conditions for our Vietnam
veterans exposed to Agent Orange. And that put
260 ,000 new claims overnight in their inventory
in October of 2010, just before I arrived. And
so they were trying to work through those and
sort through those and get staff trained on how
to do them and get them stood up and try to move
forward to start tackling those, which they were
required by law to do first. And so by the time
I got there, the... A backlog of claims, which
are claims older than 125 days, had grown to
nearly 550 ,000 claims. They were doing them
all by hand, in paper, with little rubber fingertips
on their hands, looking at claims files that
could be, you know, upwards of two feet tall,
you know, not unlike, you know, looking at a
little toddler. and memorizing 850 diagnostic
codes in their heads. And it was just, when you
looked at it, just not an efficient, not an effective
process that a lot of really hard working people
were trying to do to their very best. And about
52 % of them were veterans themselves, kind of
frustrated with the tools they had on hand. And
they were falling further and further and further
behind. And they didn't like it. Veterans didn't
like it. And everybody deserved a better answer.
There wasn't a technology system. There wasn't
a way to file claims online. There weren't standard
forms. There weren't rules -based calculators.
There was no enabling capability in the technology
realm. They weren't organized to do the work
in lanes with the work segmented at all. So everything
went through one filter. Whether you were the
best employee, the longest, most mature employee
who really knew the work, or whether you were
brand new in the door, you had the equal opportunity
to pull some of the hardest cases. And it just
wasn't very well organized under the people process
or technology realm. And that's what we set out
to do, was to create an integrated plan, deliver
that plan in 45 days, and execute it on the next
three years to get that backlog down 90 % from
where it peaked. in 2013 at 611 ,000 claims and
today it hovers between 70 ,000 and 80 ,000 claims
and some of those have very good reasons for
not getting done in 125 days which wouldn't help
a veteran if they did them fast. Well one of
the things that as somebody who's been a practitioner
in this area during that period of time we've
seen tremendous progress been made over those
last three or four years. And it was, I think,
surprising to everybody when they found that
it was all paper. When I tell a veteran, no,
it's all paper. It'll take them so many days
to get it from the mail room to the file room.
How did you drive change in an organization that
big, which in 2011 didn't have the information
technology systems? and other things that you
would have expected in a business or corporation
of similar size? So I had not only had that experience
in the Air Force where I had to fundamentally
change a big part of the Air Force portfolio
where nobody really wanted to change, but we
had to. We had a bias for action that said we
had to. I then went over to industry for three
years where I learned about some fundamental
things. that added to my understanding of how
to make those kinds of large transformations
in change management. And so when I arrived in
NVA, one, I had a mandate from the Senate SBAC
chair to deliver a plan in 45 days. And so what
we did was what I know that works, and it works
in industry, which is we pulled all the key stakeholders
together. People were a little surprised. We
had not only VBA people, but we had field people
and headquarters people, and we had VSOs, and
we had lawyers, and we had union reps, and we
had people with just industry people that had
great ideas, and we just pulled them all together
and locked ourselves in a room for three or four
days. and went through, siphoned through an entire
list of about 600 different good ideas that had
been submitted through an innovation effort,
and culled those down to about 45 of what we
thought to be the most promising, and integrated
them into whether or not they would be a people
initiative, something that would change the way
we're organized or trained to do the work, a
process initiative, something that could be leaned
up or re -engineered or had already started that
process, improved some metal. and what technology
would need to do to enable all of that. And we
literally put that on paper, put all those initiatives
into those categories, integrated it, and then
I asked every one of the regional offices to
identify a change management agent. So a new
position we stood up, who was a very well -respected,
a little more junior in the organization, but
employees could approach, VSOs could approach,
anybody could approach. And they became part
of the impetus to help us move through not just
the structure of change, but the culture of change.
And I think... I think, General, there's a good
example, again, of one of those pearls of wisdom
you're giving us that I want to make sure our
listeners focus on. It takes a culture of change.
You can't just say, do it, and here's the process.
You've got to change that whole culture of people
buying in. And were there special steps or activities
that you undertook to make sure folks throughout
the 56 regional offices were buying into the
cultural change? Yeah, so one of the things that
I believe that every senior leader needs to do,
and I personally did this, is when you're going
to do that kind of a large change, you've got
to get in it up to your, I say armpits. And I
really did that so in the first week or two I
was there I asked for the all -employee email
list and there was a little nervousness about
giving me that well they might respond to you
if you send something and I commented that's
kind of the point and So I started sending personal
emails from me. Nobody wrote them for me I wrote
them if they responded back I responded if it
got to a veteran which it typically did I responded
and I just got involved in a very open communication
strategy. Because I felt like if you don't let
people voice their concerns to you and you don't
listen and respond, then they don't keep talking
to you and you're going to walk off a cliff when
you're trying to lead that large of a change.
Part of this was demonstrating that leadership
cared and wanted to change. Yes, and what I found
too, I went out and immediately went to 12 different
regional offices and instead of going and letting
a leadership person give me a briefing sitting
in a room with nice chairs and everything. I
said, no, we're not doing that. You're going
to walk me around through the regional office,
and I'm going to start wherever the veteran stuff
starts. So if it comes in the mail room, I want
to have a full experience of that veteran's information
and communication to us from the get -go, and
then how that claim is handled. every step of
the way and I want you to make me a claim and
take me through the process. I only had to do
that about three different regional offices before
it became really clear to me where things were
broken. And you know who knew it all along were
the actual employees. They just didn't have before
a sort of the focused effort. They didn't have
the resources to make the change and they just
needed someone to say okay here we go and be
just absolutely dogged persistent on making that
transformation happen and improving the way they
could do the work, which they really wanted to
change. They just needed someone to help get
them there. And then all for the betterment of
the veteran themselves. So when I arrived, veterans
were waiting, as you well know, and many of your
readership knows, more than 300 some odd days
for their initial claim decision. And today it's
down to something like, you know, 70 to 90 days
they're waiting. In some cases, it's really light,
depending on how many issues are in the claim,
but substantial numbers of days taken off that
wait. So one of the things, General, you mentioned,
I'm sorry, Allison, you mentioned were that you
reached out to all the employees. Dale's reading,
I think, one of the things you're referring to.
Yeah, it's where your average claim went down.
I can't believe these numbers. My claim took
almost a year and a half. We now complete 99
% of the claims in less than 90... 92 days is
your average. That's pretty good. So the way
we did that was we increased the productivity
of our employees by 81%. You know, when you give
them a better way to organize around the effort,
so we segmented all the work so the really fast
planes could go down the express lane. You know,
unlike when you go to the grocery store, if you
only have one or two items, you don't want to
wait behind the person's got a cartload full.
And so we did that. We segmented the work according
to lanes, which is what industry does, too. So
we adopted an industry model. Then we also completely
changed our training program. Our poor employees
in many cases were showing up, basically sitting
next to someone well -intentioned and learning
how to do claims by looking over the shoulder.
And you just can't do that. Military people know
one of the best things about our military in
this country is how well we train people to do
this mission. We weren't doing that in VBA. We
fundamentally overhauled the complete training
program and now mandated a complete long training
program before you ever even got involved in
really touching veteran planes and really got
people up to speed faster with a much higher
level of quality. And then we built the technology
like crazy with things in it, job aids in it
that helped people to make better decisions.
They never had that before and it wasn't fair.
For them, you know, people weren't happy with
what we were doing in VA in those days before
all this. But it wasn't the employees' fault.
It was the lack of good people process and technology
capability that just didn't exist and now does.
Well, I was just reading your final love note
to all the employees of the VA. And one of your
comments was that I thought was very appropriate
was, You know, most of these people aren't going
to file a claim willy -nilly. And so you've sat
down, remember integrity, quality, grant if you
can, deny only if you must. And I thought that
that was very interesting because the reputation
of the VA among veterans up until the last couple
of years has been deny, deny, deny. Until you
die. Until you die and then they don't have to
worry about your claim because you don't qualify
by then. And that was one of the problems that
was going on. And that's the perception that
you have obviously had a great deal to do with
changing that perception. And now we just have
to continue that on with the people that replaced
you. Yeah. So I think we got a pretty good culture
of, you know, I'm not sure that everybody in
the organization felt like they had the permission
to do that somewhere way back when There were,
you know, processes I think even prior to the
2000 time frames where there was a lot of, that
was the sort of model operation. And so, you
know, I said to them, no, you know, you do what
you can to say yes. And believe it or not, our
employees really do want to come to work every
day and if possible say yes. Giving them permission
to do that, I told them to put a little sticky
note on the computer that had those three things
on it to remind them that that's the way we approach
this environment. We figure out how to say yes
unless we absolutely can't. By the way, I will
tell you there's a little bit of some misunderstanding
in that because even prior to my arriving there,
the grant rate was hovering around 60%. 65 to
70 percent, and that's where it still is in the
65 to 70 percent range. But for those who aren't
granted, I fully understand that sometimes that
feels, it's not even about the resources or anything
else, it's just about somebody acknowledging
something that you're dealing with, whether that's
a visible wound of war or an invisible wound
of war, this process for some reason really helps.
them to feel validated in what they deal with
every day. Yeah, absolutely. That's what we hear
from the veterans. They just want somebody at
the VA to hear the whole story and give a reasoned
approach, which they can accept or not, but they
want to feel like they were heard. In our final
five minutes, I'd like to cover three topics.
I know that in the four and a half years you
were the undersecretary of benefits at the VA,
you were in the hot seat. And I want you to talk
to us a little bit about that hot seat. I also
want to hear your view on certified case managers
and finally talking a little bit more about successful
transformation and change. But let's start with
the hot seat. You know, so I fully expected to
arrive, you know, and sit directly in the hot
seat and stay there for all four and a half years.
I would say when you're leading that kind of
a change and the process has been so broken that
people had some concerns that you have to do
something fast. For change, by the way, this
magnitude of change, I don't know anybody in
the federal government or even the civilian work
industry that has made such huge change with
such major positive outcomes. I've just never
run across it. You just don't bring on six enterprise
IT systems that are all customer facing that
all enable you to do better across all eight
areas that you have responsibility for that meet
the needs of a veteran or family member or survivor
in a three and a half year period of time. It's
just unheard of. But still, people are in pain
and there's these feelings that you've got to
go faster, faster, faster, well sometimes faster.
Too fast can be also the undoing of do it well.
You can spend too much time talking to the critics
or those who are taking resources away from what
needs to be done. You don't have to say anything
nasty about Congress, but I do wonder sometimes
whether or not all those committee meetings actually
move the ball forward or just take resources
from the top away from what they should be doing.
So I would say that they have an oversight responsibility.
But I do think sometimes it would have been better
to let us do that great change without taking
quite so much fire from the tree line. Because
it did, we were ending up writing lots of responses
that we could have instead have been moving another
new initiative forward. And I think that there's
a balancing that has to be done around the oversight.
and the work that people are trying to do to
make things better. And so I would encourage
good collaboration in those environments to watch
the balance there. And I know I'm sounding very
political right now, but I am. That's OK. That's
the world in which you live. I don't, and so
I get to be a little more blunt. Let me move
you to the concept of certified case managers.
You and I had some exchange on this, and I think
it's really important to get your views out.
Yeah. So one of the things I have seen a growing
requirement of in industry since I've been out,
and even while I was in, It's this idea that
patients, and I'll use the word patients, that
will convert, you'll see in a second, over to
veterans, that human beings have more than just
their medical care requirements in life. They
have the complete physical socioeconomic window
of a view of their life. You're not going to
get a patient or a veteran to pay attention to
their diabetes plan. When they don't have a job,
their family doesn't have food on the table,
they're worried about staying in their home,
and all the rest of those non -medical side of
things. Interestingly enough, we have in certain
places in VA case managers around some of our
most wounded, ill, and injured, where they are
coordinating the efforts of sort of the the physical
medical response, the non -medical benefits response,
and even the end of life palliative care and
memorial affairs response. And I think, you know,
growing that capacity, growing that capability
so a veteran has a case manager to work with
of some kind will take a lot of the confusion,
the navigation issues, the who do I talk to,
how do I talk to someone. that knows and understands
the integration of all these things, because
this is my life. I'm not a medical person, and
then I'm a benefits person, and then I'm a memorial
affairs survivor. All these things are part of
my life, and I need somebody to help me navigate
that in a broader way. Industry is moving this
way towards certified case managers who not only
have the responsibility to make sure all the
cross -medical communities are issues are addressed,
but they're also now calling on and looking for
benefits for homelessness or for employment services
or transportation needs or all those kind of
things that we do by our DNA and VA. They actually
look at us and go, man, you guys have actually
got a good mile for this. Why aren't we doing
more of this in industry? And there's now a growing
discussion around that. Well, I think it's a
great idea. It would also help be on the whole
customer service front where I had somebody I
could call and feel like they know me and they
care about me and they'll navigate me through
the system. I think it's a great concept. I hope
folks in Washington DC are listening to you on
this and we see it blossom a little bit. I do
have one thing in closing if I can share with
you, which is for all your women veterans out
there or even your male veterans or your non
-veterans who know of women who have served,
please, please, please have them go register
at the Women in Military Service Memorial. They
can do it online. That's one of my new other
advocacy perspectives is to get more women to
come forward and... and other family members
to bring women forward who haven't yet registered.
So we'd also leave you with that thought and
that passion as well. And that was General Allison
Hickey on Veterans Radio. Jim Calsone and I interviewed
her last week talking about some of the changes
that have been occurring at the VA, especially
the Veterans Benefits part of it. And I think
it's important. that you know about this, that
the VA is doing everything that they can. As
I mentioned earlier in the program, it's like
trying to turn an aircraft carrier, you know,
in a very small room. It doesn't work and it
takes a lot of time. People are very territorial
and so we want to make sure that we continue
this process of updating the VA. You know, one
of the things that we have been saying here at
Veterans Radio since the very beginning is that
We like to feel that we are an advocate for veterans
issues and politics has no place in determining
what is fair for American veterans. We just want
our politicians to keep their promises. We encourage
our listeners, all of you out there, civilian
and military alike, to get involved in the political
process and to make sure that our voices are
heard because these people were some of the ones
that Allison had to deal with. They started to
cut her budget. They want you to do these things,
but then they don't want to pay for it. So get
on the horn. Let these people know what's going
on. Next week on Veterans Radio, we're going
to have another great story for you. I want to
make sure everybody knows also that my partner
Bob Gould is doing well. He had some surgery
this week. If you want to send him an email,
send it to Bob at veteransradio .net. Until next
week, you are dismissed.