1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:17,900 Welcome to Veterans Radio. 2 00:00:17,900 --> 00:00:20,560 I am Jim Fossone. 3 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:22,880 I'm the officer of the deck today. 4 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:24,760 We've got some great programs for you. 5 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:29,560 We always want to remind you you can find more about Veterans Radio at its Facebook 6 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:35,280 site or at the web veteransradio.org where we're on the web 24-7. 7 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:38,400 You can find a lot of our podcasts there as well. 8 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:45,040 We post new ones every Tuesday so you can get a new story, a new interview, something 9 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:49,720 you didn't know before by going to veteransradio.org. 10 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:53,080 Before we get started we want to thank our sponsors. 11 00:00:53,080 --> 00:01:00,920 Next up we want to thank National Veteran Business Development Council, NVBDC.org. 12 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:06,600 It was established 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00:02:03,440 You're going to hear some interviews today on pretty diverse subjects. 24 00:02:03,440 --> 00:02:11,360 So the first is we're going to talk to a colonel who was in the Marines and led the 25 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:14,600 President's own band. 26 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:21,600 All history there, right, the Marine Corps band does all the ceremonial programs in Washington, 27 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:22,600 D.C. 28 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:24,320 Real interesting. 29 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:32,560 And then we're going to talk to a couple of Navy vets about their concerns on why the 30 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:40,440 Navy hasn't renamed the USS Stennis and its sorted history and the need for changing that 31 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:41,880 in today's world. 32 00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:45,080 So really interesting programs stick with us. 33 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:50,200 We want to welcome to Veterans Radio today Colonel Jason Feddick of the Marine Corps, 34 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:51,360 retired. 35 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:53,240 Colonel, welcome to Veterans Radio. 36 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:56,080 Jim, thanks so much for having me on. 37 00:02:56,080 --> 00:03:00,560 Well this is a really unique opportunity to tell some stories that I think people probably 38 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:02,600 have never heard about. 39 00:03:02,600 --> 00:03:08,560 Colonel Feddick was the 28th director of the President's own United States Marine Band. 40 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:14,560 That's quite a high honor and must have been really the pinnacle of your career, Colonel. 41 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:15,960 Oh, absolutely. 42 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:17,880 And honestly a complete surprise. 43 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:21,960 You know, this job of director of the Marine Band is the same job that John Philip Sousa 44 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:22,960 once held. 45 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:26,240 He was the 17th director of the band in the 1880s. 46 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:30,440 And when I joined the service to join the President's own, I could have never imagined 47 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:34,520 that someday they'd give me the honor of leading this distinguished unit. 48 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:36,480 Well let's kind of start at the beginning. 49 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:43,200 How did a nice New England kid like you from New Hampshire end up in the Marine Corps? 50 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:46,560 I would say completely by accident. 51 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:51,360 My grandfather served in World War II, so we had a little bit of service in the family, 52 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:52,360 but not a whole lot. 53 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:57,760 I was training to be a music educator actually at the University of Massachusetts, I should 54 00:03:57,760 --> 00:03:59,400 say. 55 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:01,480 And my idea was to be a band director. 56 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:06,520 So I was about to get my degree and I was traveling on a little bit of the tour over 57 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:10,560 summer, kind of an internship with a group called the American Wind Symphony. 58 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:13,520 And I saw an advertisement for the Marine Band. 59 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:15,120 They had an opening for Clarinet. 60 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:20,200 And the way that the President's own finds its Marines is we audition like civilian orchestras 61 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:24,800 because we are trying to find musicians who are fully trained out of the gate and educated 62 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:28,280 to jump right in and start doing their job on behalf of the President and the Marine 63 00:04:28,280 --> 00:04:29,520 Corps. 64 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:34,600 And so the auditions often have civilians who will come to audition and if they win the 65 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:39,520 audition and they are qualified to a list of the Marine Corps, healthy enough, they 66 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:41,800 enlist for service in the Marine Band. 67 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,200 And they stay there for their entire careers, which of course as you know is very unusual 68 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,920 in the service and certainly in the Marine Corps. 69 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:50,840 So I decided to take a chance and take this audition. 70 00:04:50,840 --> 00:04:52,040 I was 21 years old. 71 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:53,960 I didn't know much about the Marine Corps. 72 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:57,120 I certainly had heard of the President's own. 73 00:04:57,120 --> 00:04:59,320 But I thought I was completely unqualified. 74 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,760 I imagined just the musicians that are in the band being so good and I'm just a college 75 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:04,760 student. 76 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:08,680 Came down to Washington, took the audition, was shocked at the end of that audition that 77 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:10,120 I won the job. 78 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:13,640 And they offered me a position with the band and that set me on a path that would eventually 79 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,840 lead to becoming the director, which is unfathomable to me. 80 00:05:16,840 --> 00:05:22,840 Yeah, when you look back on it, you say, wait a minute, a chance seeing of a posting resulted 81 00:05:22,840 --> 00:05:25,760 in an incredible career. 82 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:32,520 Now you have two bachelor's degrees from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst. 83 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:37,640 And you also have a master's degree in orchestral conducting from the University of Maryland 84 00:05:37,640 --> 00:05:38,920 at College Park. 85 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:40,240 That's correct. 86 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:44,160 This was all, this was not all planned out, right? 87 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:48,320 This is just taking opportunities that presented themselves. 88 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:54,440 Yeah, and you could imagine for a young musician, student, you know, the prospect of joining 89 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:59,200 the Marines, even though we have a very specialized mission in the Marine Corps, a very important 90 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:00,200 mission, but very unique. 91 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:03,720 A lot of people don't know about music and the service and exactly what goes into it 92 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:06,200 and who these service members are. 93 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:10,040 It was nerve-wracking to think I'm going to join the Marine Corps and I'm going to be 94 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:14,000 expected to uphold those traditions and that discipline as well as be a musician. 95 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:19,080 But when I joined, you know, thinking maybe I'll do my one enlistment my four years and 96 00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:24,080 then I'll go back to school or I'll start teaching, within a couple of months I realized 97 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:27,160 just how incredibly special this opportunity was. 98 00:06:27,160 --> 00:06:31,800 And I had put on hold at that point my aspirations to conduct and to lead because I didn't think 99 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:35,640 that that was going to be an opportunity, that it would just be playing clarinet and 100 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:37,880 doing what I had gone to school to do. 101 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:41,560 And then three and a half years into my enlistment, I was going to re-enlist, was going to continue 102 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:42,560 to serve in the band. 103 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:43,680 I was very happy. 104 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:48,960 They had an opportunity to audition again to become one of the junior assistant directors, 105 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:52,000 one of the conductors, and to be commissioned. 106 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:56,960 And I took that audition also with no expectations and when I won that audition, it set me on 107 00:06:56,960 --> 00:07:02,160 the path as an officer and as a conductor that eventually would lead to my appointment 108 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:03,760 as a director in 2014. 109 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:06,280 But the whole thing was completely unplanned. 110 00:07:06,280 --> 00:07:09,280 If you had talked to me when, or anybody when you were a teenager and say, hey, what would 111 00:07:09,280 --> 00:07:10,280 you like to do? 112 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:12,280 And you say, you know what, I'd like to be the director of the president's own. 113 00:07:12,280 --> 00:07:15,760 I'd like to be music advisor of the White House and have the same job that John Phillips 114 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:16,960 and Susan once had. 115 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:17,960 How about that? 116 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:19,720 People would have laughed in your face. 117 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:23,200 There's no way to plan that kind of opportunity. 118 00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:26,640 So you just go where the opportunities lead and you just hope that you're the most qualified 119 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:27,640 person at that time. 120 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:31,680 And I was so fortunate that that's how it worked out in that chapter of my career. 121 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:35,560 Well, that's really one of the pearls of wisdom we get out of these interviews is for 122 00:07:35,560 --> 00:07:42,400 people to realize you have to prepare yourself and take the opportunity when it shows up. 123 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:46,400 These are two opportunities that you had prepared for and you said, I'm going to raise 124 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,160 my hand and give it a try. 125 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:52,960 But I have to imagine that when you went home and said to the folks in New Hampshire, hey, 126 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:55,320 I'm going to join the Marine Corps. 127 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,160 There may have been some raised eyebrows. 128 00:07:57,160 --> 00:07:58,840 A little bit. 129 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:02,520 You know, I think if you had known me when I was growing up, kind of a class clown, little 130 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:08,640 jokester, sarcastic, that that probably being a United States Marine was probably low on 131 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,800 the list of what people thought I might do. 132 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:17,080 And certainly a colonel in the United States Marine Corps would have been a shock to some 133 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:18,880 of the people who knew me. 134 00:08:18,880 --> 00:08:22,520 They knew music was very important in my life and that I would be dedicated to wherever 135 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:24,640 that service called me. 136 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:26,320 But the Marines is very special. 137 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:30,440 But I'll tell you, Jim, as you probably with so many of your guests, you know, in your 138 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:34,720 own family service that the service changes you. 139 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:40,240 And within a very short amount of time when I became a Marine, I was changed. 140 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:45,520 And that change fundamentally defined who I'd become as a professional, who I'd become 141 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:46,920 as a musician. 142 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:52,280 And I feel that to this day, I'm a retiree now and I'm teaching, but I still feel that 143 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:56,200 influence on my life, both in music and beyond music every day. 144 00:08:56,200 --> 00:09:00,880 And I'm so grateful that I ended up in a place that I never would have imagined that I would 145 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:01,880 have gone. 146 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:05,000 You know, sometimes you end up where you're supposed to be. 147 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:08,960 And I think the Marine Corps was where I was supposed to be and it really resonated deeply 148 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:09,960 with me. 149 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:13,160 And I'm glad that I took that chance those years ago because I do shudder to think, well, 150 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:17,240 what would have happened if I decided that I didn't have the courage to put myself out 151 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:20,040 there and would have ended up in a very different place than I am now. 152 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:27,120 Now, Colonel, there are a lot of listeners right now who have been through basic training 153 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:33,600 themselves in the different services and they are asking themselves, do the military musicians 154 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:37,440 go to a basic training camp? 155 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:39,480 And the answer is yes and no. 156 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:45,080 So the vast majority of military musicians in all the services do attend recruit training. 157 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:48,240 That's different in every service, of course, different locations, different lengths of 158 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:50,320 time. 159 00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:52,240 Almost every Marine does go through basic training. 160 00:09:52,240 --> 00:09:56,000 I will tell you that the members of the President's Zone have been exempted from basic training 161 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:58,600 since the 1950s. 162 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:05,440 And the reason for that is that are the expectation of Marine musicians at the level of the President's 163 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:11,160 Zone, which are the music, the house band for the White House, have an incredibly diverse 164 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:15,720 portfolio of expectations on behalf of our nation, on behalf of the Marine Corps. 165 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:20,640 The expectation is that they'd have the education and the experience to do that job in that very 166 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:22,960 specialized environment right out of the gate. 167 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:30,720 And so without risk of injury, without being off of the instrument for 14, 16 weeks, that 168 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:32,880 exemption was made in the 50s and it's held true. 169 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:38,200 So what we do is we bring our Marines, our new Marines enlisted to Washington, D.C. and 170 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:43,680 we try to indoctrinate them in all of the training that happens in basic training, save 171 00:10:43,680 --> 00:10:46,120 for the weapons training and some of the physical rigors. 172 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:52,480 So all of the history, customs, traditions, UCMJ, everything that is important about the 173 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:57,840 culture of the Marine Corps, the respect for the history for the traditions of the Marine 174 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,080 Corps is taught over about an eight week period. 175 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:05,320 And that is when people are preparing to make that transition before they then start playing 176 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:06,920 full time with the band. 177 00:11:06,920 --> 00:11:10,080 It is a little bit of a point of contention, as you might imagine, with some of my colleagues 178 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:11,080 in the Marine Corps. 179 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:15,760 A lot of Marines who don't have a chance to meet musicians of the present zone, they're 180 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:21,320 sometimes suspicious of how could we have Marines that don't go through that very important 181 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:23,680 gauntlet, that very important right of passage. 182 00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:27,880 But as soon as they meet our Marines and see how dedicated they are to telling the Marine 183 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:32,520 Corps story, to being out there and representing all of our brothers and sisters who are doing 184 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,720 the hardest work of the Corps, they change their minds. 185 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:40,400 I mean, time and time again, as I spoke to my brothers and sisters, and they had a chance 186 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:45,040 to really understand what the band is all about, what music plays for a role in our 187 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:48,400 Marine Corps in our country, they become transformed as well. 188 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:54,360 And I've loved having those relationships with those Marines and having those conversations. 189 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:55,360 It's been very important. 190 00:11:55,360 --> 00:12:01,600 Well, Colonel, I've had the chance to listen to a number of the service bands and choral 191 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:04,160 groups and singing groups. 192 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:08,720 It's always inspiring when they're out in the community talking and performing with 193 00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:09,720 folks. 194 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:18,200 If I understand it right, do all of the services have musicians in them on these kind of engagements? 195 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,800 Yeah, every service has musicians. 196 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:26,560 So different sizes of the programs, the Coast Guard, for instance, has one band that is 197 00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:29,800 stationed in New London, Connecticut, at the Academy. 198 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:34,040 They're a smaller service, Department of Homeland Security, so that's the only band. 199 00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:39,360 All the other services have about anywhere from eight to 20 bands stationed around the 200 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:41,520 country and in some cases around the world. 201 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:46,520 In the case of the Marine Corps, we have 12 total bands, 10 fleet bands that are stationed 202 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:53,040 on the coasts where the Marine Corps is, also one in Japan in Okinawa and one in Hawaii. 203 00:12:53,040 --> 00:12:55,040 And then there's the Marine Band in Washington. 204 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:59,480 We also have the Marine Drum and Bugle Corps, which is the only drum and bugle corps in 205 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:00,760 the entire armed services. 206 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:02,840 So they're very historic and very special unit. 207 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:04,560 And those are the two ensembles. 208 00:13:04,560 --> 00:13:08,560 If you go to the Friday evening parades at Marine Barracks Washington in the summers, 209 00:13:08,560 --> 00:13:11,840 you'll see both the President's Zone and the Commandant's Zone Marine Drum and Bugle 210 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:16,480 Corps performing together during that tattoo, during that ceremony, which is very impressive. 211 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:20,240 To see that level of musicianship illuminating that ceremony. 212 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:24,120 Well, Colonel Federer knew right where I was going with this question because he and I 213 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:29,320 talked about Athe and I in DC where the Marines are. 214 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:34,880 And if you ever get a chance to go to the Friday night silent tattoo under the lights, 215 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:40,200 it's an impressive moving affair every time. 216 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:48,200 And I suspect for the men and women in the band, it's equally moving and prideful. 217 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:49,200 But you've been there. 218 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:50,200 You've walked the ground. 219 00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:52,200 Tell us about it. 220 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:54,040 It's a sacred place. 221 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,920 Marine Barracks Washington is, we call it the oldest post of the Corps. 222 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:02,240 It was the first official post of the Marine Corps in Washington, DC. 223 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:06,280 It was founded by Thomas Jefferson of all people and William Ward Burroughs, who was 224 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:07,280 the Commandant at the time. 225 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:11,640 They picked out this piece of land within marching distance of the Capitol in the White House 226 00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:15,920 so that the Marines that were stationed there could defend our nation, international capital 227 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:16,920 if it came to that. 228 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:20,520 And of course it did come to that in the war of 1812. 229 00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:23,440 It's a very special place and it's special historically. 230 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:26,200 It's a special sacred place to Marines all over the world. 231 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:31,360 And it's also special because it is our primary connection to the American public. 232 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:36,400 What music does in the military is it connects our service members, our men and women in 233 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:42,840 uniform to the public, to our government officials, to our president in a very emotional and visceral 234 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:43,840 way. 235 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:47,720 So when we march on Friday evening in Carades and we have three or four thousand people 236 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:52,600 come every week, every day citizens, sometimes veterans of course, since active duty service 237 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,360 members, but the majority of the audience are people that have no affiliation with the 238 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:57,600 service. 239 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:02,760 And they see Marines performing with such precision and such dignity and such excellence 240 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:08,440 and they hear that music that stirs the soul and in perfect cadence with what's happening 241 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,600 with our Marines on the deck. 242 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:16,840 It's a very, very special and emotional experience and people leave that parade having a greater 243 00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:22,800 admiration for those who serve, a greater respect and desire to support those who wear 244 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:27,640 the uniform and who represent our country in that special way. 245 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:29,720 It's the same spirit that happens all over the country. 246 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:35,120 You asked about bands traveling to other communities, not only in Washington, D.C., but all of the 247 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:39,480 bands have units, including the president's own, that go out on tour and share a piece 248 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:45,160 of what happens in Washington and in our government with communities all over the country, playing 249 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:49,480 in major venues like Carnegie Hall and the next day playing in a middle school gymnasium 250 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:52,560 in New Jersey or a field house in Nebraska. 251 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:57,040 And thousands of people will come to these concerts and gather together in community 252 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:02,240 with no political overtones, with nothing other than the expectation of being together 253 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:06,120 as Americans and listening to this great music and these great bands that we're so proud 254 00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:11,680 of and frankly just feeling good about our country and about what we are represented. 255 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:15,960 Music is the most powerful tool to do that, which is why music has been a part of the 256 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,760 services since its inception. 257 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:23,640 The Marine Corps has had music almost since its birth and it's been one of the most important 258 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:29,040 things to preserving and illuminating that culture and I can speak obviously firsthand 259 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:30,040 about that. 260 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,160 I was deeply engaged in that for 26 years. 261 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:38,000 Well, one of the things that we could spend a whole other show on is the history of music 262 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:43,440 in the military all around the nations, all nations involved. 263 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:50,800 But one of the things that you got to do directing the president's own is sort of do those good 264 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:55,320 will ambassador tours not just out of the White House but internationally if I understand 265 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:56,320 it. 266 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:57,320 Yeah. 267 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:02,320 Yeah, we don't travel too much internationally and most of that is because we are needed at 268 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:03,320 the White House. 269 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:07,400 And so over 300 commitments a year for the president of the United States with the Marine 270 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:12,920 Band, over a thousand commitments a year total for the Marine Corps, whether that's playing 271 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,800 for full honors funerals at our LinkedIn National Cemetery, which is one of the most important 272 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:18,280 things we do. 273 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:23,800 Marine Corps ceremonies, tours, concerts, all of that happens in DC. 274 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:28,440 But every once in a while we get internationally and to bring the Marine Band, in my case when 275 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:34,160 I was director I took the band on two international tours, one to Japan, of course great allies 276 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:38,840 of the United States and of the Marine Corps, big Marine Corps presence in Japan since World 277 00:17:38,840 --> 00:17:40,000 War II. 278 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:44,760 That was an incredible tour to bring this famous ensemble to the Japanese people to have 279 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:50,880 cultural exchanges with their Armed Forces bands, very, very special to building those 280 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:56,040 bridges and preserving those ally, ally ships that are so important to our country. 281 00:17:56,040 --> 00:18:00,280 And then just last summer before I retired I took the band to Europe and we played concerts 282 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:05,520 in Prague and Austria and the Netherlands to standing remotely crowds. 283 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:11,680 And it's just such a privilege knowing how important music is in the American military 284 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:18,320 culture, to bring these ensembles abroad and to show that and show how that represents 285 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:21,800 the excellence in our Armed Services all across all of the services. 286 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:26,960 Really very, very special feelings and indelible memories that I just, I will never forget. 287 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:32,840 Well you also had the chance to put some of this music down on wax as they used to say, 288 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,360 but I'm sure it's digitally recorded. 289 00:18:35,360 --> 00:18:40,800 Now tell us about recording sessions with the President's own. 290 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:45,680 Yeah, I'll tell you a funny little story is John Philip Sousa was director from 1880 291 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:46,680 to 1892. 292 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:50,920 He left a little bit before the recording industry really kind of caught hold and Sousa 293 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:55,080 himself was a bit skeptical of recordings because he felt like live performance was 294 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,120 one of those new things that will never take off, right? 295 00:18:58,120 --> 00:19:03,280 Yeah, I think that's exactly how he felt and he wasn't wrong in the sense that live performance 296 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:05,200 is still the best. 297 00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:10,120 Getting out to the people, having live musicians interact with live audiences is the bread 298 00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:12,800 and butter of music performance. 299 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:18,240 But as we all know, recordings are so important to sharing this art across the entire globe 300 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:23,840 and so recording has been a huge part of the Marine Band's legacy, putting historic repertoire 301 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:29,560 down onto disc that we can share wax cylinder originally then records then eight tracks 302 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:32,520 and cassettes and now CDs and now digital. 303 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:38,480 And we do a lot of recording in the Marine Band, not only for sharing for educational 304 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:43,960 purposes for bands all over the world to use this great professional ensemble as a model 305 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:48,920 for how to play core music that's important to all of us, but also to help preserve the 306 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,080 legacy of historic music. 307 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:55,640 So for instance, in the Marine Band, we did an entire complete collection of the marches 308 00:19:55,640 --> 00:20:02,200 of John Philip Sousa new recordings, 125 marches that we recorded over seven years during my 309 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:07,880 directorship to share with music lovers and share with the schools all over the world so 310 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:12,520 that could gather an appreciation for a lot of this music that is so central to our American 311 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:17,080 artistic identity and a lot of music that people don't know by the great John Philip 312 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,920 Sousa, one of our great composers in America. 313 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:24,760 And we also made all of the music available in sheet music form so that schools could 314 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:29,200 download for free the marches of John Philip Sousa, hear the Marine Band perform them and 315 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:32,600 then perform them themselves off of the same parts. 316 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:39,240 So this was a great example of the band being a resource to citizens. 317 00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:41,160 We are paid for by the taxpayer dollar. 318 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:47,600 We consider a huge part of our mission to provide inspiration, provide educational resources, 319 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:51,840 provide a model for people who are aspiring to be musicians or simply people who love 320 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:56,080 band music and look to the president's own as the pinnacle of that. 321 00:20:56,080 --> 00:21:04,840 Now Colonel, you had an incredible military career that we could talk on for quite a while, 322 00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:09,000 but I wanted to spend a few minutes at least because you are now wearing the mantle of 323 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:13,000 professor of music and director of bands at the University of Michigan. 324 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,160 How did a nice Colonel like you get talked into that job? 325 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:19,160 A nice Colonel like me, Jim. 326 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:23,120 I've talked to some of my Marines and I'll say the group of them. 327 00:21:23,120 --> 00:21:24,640 Well here's the situation. 328 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:30,440 I told you earlier in our talk that I wanted to be a band director and my career as a teacher 329 00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:34,480 got, I like to joke, I got a little sidetracked by me winning a position with the president 330 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:38,400 so it turned out to be a beautiful opportunity for me. 331 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:42,760 But I always knew when I was finished with the Marines and I was young enough when I 332 00:21:42,760 --> 00:21:45,960 got in that I knew I didn't want to overstay my welcome. 333 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:50,040 You know people who are in command, you have the privilege of command, you're really in 334 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:55,360 control of so many aspects of your colleagues' life, those under your command and I felt 335 00:21:55,360 --> 00:22:00,080 it was important for me to pass that baton at a time when I felt like someone else could 336 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,520 continue to take the unit in a place where it deserved to go. 337 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:04,920 So I knew I'd always return to teaching. 338 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:07,360 I just didn't know where it was going to be. 339 00:22:07,360 --> 00:22:11,520 When the opportunity came up to apply to the University of Michigan it was almost like 340 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:18,280 a dream come true because Michigan I've always for decades had such respect for this school 341 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:22,680 of music, for the students who come out of it, for the culture of the university, the 342 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:27,560 tradition of the university which of course is so important to me coming from the Marine 343 00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:28,800 Corps. 344 00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:33,400 So I applied and without any expectation that I would be the best candidate, I went to the 345 00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:35,200 process and it turns out I was. 346 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:40,320 And he would ask me a decade ago if I could go anywhere after my career in the Marine 347 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:42,600 Corps where would I want to go to teach music. 348 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,120 I would have told you the University of Michigan for all the reasons I just said. 349 00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:53,360 So for me to land here is my only my second job in my entire professional career is unfathomable 350 00:22:53,360 --> 00:22:59,320 to me but I am so grateful to have been a part of this and to get involved in what happens 351 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:00,320 here at Michigan. 352 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:04,920 It is an exceptional institution and I'm having such a great time taking my experiences 353 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,400 from my professional career and sharing them with my students. 354 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:11,680 Well let's do one more thing before we run out of time and I want to build on the concept 355 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:18,400 of passing the baton because those of us in the military we've all been at change of command 356 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:24,880 ceremonies and you just recently retired and there was a change of command for the president's 357 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:26,160 own. 358 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:32,160 Talk to us about your change of command ceremony because you passed the baton literally. 359 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:36,560 We did yeah and the change of command as you well know and all of our listeners who have 360 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:38,480 served is such a sacred tradition. 361 00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:42,960 It is our version of the inauguration right it's our chance to have the peaceful transfer 362 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,440 of power for any military unit. 363 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:49,360 In the Marine Band we take the change of command incredibly seriously because there is only 364 00:23:49,360 --> 00:23:53,160 one director of the Marine Band and we wear a very special uniform. 365 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,080 We know that the uniform of the president's own is unique. 366 00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:01,720 It's the red with blue trim you know the opposite of a marine uniform because musicians wore 367 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:07,560 the opposite colors of battle marines because we needed to be found on the battlefield quickly 368 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:10,040 to signal to the troops. 369 00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:16,600 So the Marine Band uniform is red with braiding and gold buttons 21 buttons and a beautiful 370 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,000 oculette and epaulette signifying our presidential service. 371 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:24,560 The director of the Marine Band wears a solid blue black coat just like Marines but with 372 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:25,560 the same decoration. 373 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:28,880 There's only one of them in the entire Marine Corps because there's only one limited duty 374 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:33,040 officer colonel in the entire Marine Corps and that is the director of the Marine Band. 375 00:24:33,040 --> 00:24:38,720 So there's only one time Jim when two individuals are wearing that black coat and that is when 376 00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:40,080 we do our change of command. 377 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:44,800 So we decided that this year since I was leaving in December rather than in the summer which 378 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:50,680 is traditional that we would take the change of command to this huge gathering of music 379 00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:54,800 lovers and educators the largest gathering in the country happens in Chicago every year 380 00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:58,100 in December it's called the Midwest Band and Orchestra Clinic. 381 00:24:58,100 --> 00:25:04,200 We wanted to show these music lovers these teachers this sacred ceremony and so in front 382 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:09,320 of about 5,000 people we stopped the concert in the middle and we both came out on stage 383 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:13,480 with the command on the Marine Corps, assistant command on the Marine Corps at the time, 384 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:19,280 and we did the change of command ceremony in front of these folks and we literally passed 385 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:24,360 the baton as you said there is a baton that was given to John Phillips in 1892 when he 386 00:25:24,360 --> 00:25:28,400 left the Marine Band by the men of the band and their esteem for him. 387 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:32,160 It's this ceremonial baton with a beautiful eagle globe and anchor on the top and it's 388 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:33,880 inscribed to Suza. 389 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:38,200 It lives in a hermetically sealed case all the time because it's a priceless artifact 390 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:42,920 and we pull it out once every decade or so for our changes of command and I passed that 391 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:47,840 baton to my successor Lieutenant Colonel Ryan Allen and then I left the stage in Chicago 392 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,360 in front of all those educators and I took off my blouse and that was the last time that 393 00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:54,280 I'll ever wear that historic uniform. 394 00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:59,640 Well it's an amazing career that you've had, experiences that again most people can't 395 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:01,140 even fathom. 396 00:26:01,140 --> 00:26:07,600 You got on this road kind of accidentally and enjoyed it immensely and we are so happy 397 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:13,840 you could share this so that kids out there, men and women who are in the musical field 398 00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:18,880 and didn't even know you could have a musical career in the military, can maybe get a little 399 00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:25,880 glimpse at this and certainly we would encourage anybody listening to any time any of the military 400 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:33,000 bands of one form or shape or another come into town, go listen you will be amazed. 401 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:37,480 Colonel Fettig we really appreciate the time that you've given to us and the insights that 402 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:39,560 you shared. 403 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:43,800 It's been wonderful to talk to you Jim and to all the Marines out there, Semper Fidelis 404 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:49,400 and to all of my new University of Michigan colleagues go blues. 405 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:56,000 Okay you got to admit most of us have never really heard from or talked to anybody who's 406 00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:01,760 been a military musician let alone the head of the president's own band. 407 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:09,160 Kind of interesting how they do things, a lot of tradition, a lot of sacred reasons 408 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:17,800 behind it but those of us who've just maybe been on a ship or flying a helicopter or cranking 409 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:25,440 on a diesel engine in logistics somewhere, we just don't get exposed to those folks so 410 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:31,000 I thought this was an interesting interview, happened to be a local guy who moved to locally 411 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:37,000 I should say for his second job interview in his life so great to tell that veteran's 412 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,720 story and that's what we do here on Veterans Radio. 413 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:47,640 So if you've got a local hero, you've got a local veteran with an unusual story, reach 414 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:55,840 out to us at veteransradio.org either Dale at veteransradio.org or Jim at veteransradio.org 415 00:27:55,840 --> 00:28:01,600 send us your suggestions that's how we find these folks to talk to that you've otherwise 416 00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:06,360 you didn't know their story they may be your neighbor down the street who's never really 417 00:28:06,360 --> 00:28:12,640 had a lot of discussion about that weird thing that he did when he was in service so keep 418 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:14,720 us in mind but we hope you enjoyed that. 419 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:20,960 I'd like you to hear a few words from our sponsors and then we'll move into a maybe 420 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:27,400 a little more thought provoking and stirring interview about the USS Stennis. 421 00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,240 Military veterans touch everyone's life. 422 00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:33,840 I'm guessing right now you're thinking of a veteran, a close friend, relative, maybe 423 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:34,920 it's you. 424 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:39,080 Even the toughest of us sometimes need help but don't know where to turn for support. 425 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:41,760 You don't need special training to help a veteran in your life. 426 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,560 Even small actions can make a world of difference. 427 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:54,440 If you know a veteran in crisis, please call the Veterans Crisis Line 800-273-8255 800-273-8255 428 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:57,240 a message from the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. 429 00:28:57,240 --> 00:29:01,120 If you have a VA claim denied by the Board of Veterans Appeals, contact legal help for 430 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:05,320 veterans at 1-800-693-4800. 431 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,360 They're experts in handling cases before the U.S. Court of Appeals for Veterans Claims. 432 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:13,120 Their number again, 1-800-693-4800. 433 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:17,720 We want to welcome back to Veterans Radio a couple of Navy gentlemen. 434 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:23,800 I'll use that term loosely because they're officer types that have spoken to us on different 435 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:27,640 subjects in the past and are willing to talk to us again. 436 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:32,120 So right there, hey, first we've got Captain John B. Cordell. 437 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:34,520 John, welcome back to Veterans Radio. 438 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,160 Hey, thank you very much. 439 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:37,160 John, thanks for having me. 440 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:38,160 I really appreciate it. 441 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:44,160 And we also have Lieutenant Commander Ruben Keith Green, both gentlemen retired. 442 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,400 Keith, welcome back to Veterans Radio. 443 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:49,640 Jim, thank you for having us and it's a pleasure. 444 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:55,960 Well, as I say, officers and gentlemen here according to Congress. 445 00:29:55,960 --> 00:30:02,200 But we've got a very serious subject to talk about today and both of you have been thinking 446 00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:07,440 and writing and talking about this for a number of years. 447 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:15,560 But recently had a article, The Tragedy to the Lost Generation, in a US&I proceedings 448 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:17,560 in August of 2024. 449 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:33,240 That sort of focuses on the whole issue of renaming the Navy renaming ships and in particular 450 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,480 why it hasn't yet renamed the USS John Stennis. 451 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:39,720 Keith, why don't you start with this? 452 00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:41,840 Tell us what the Stennis is. 453 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:48,440 Well, the USS John Stennis is an aircraft carrier named for Mississippi Senator John 454 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:52,920 Stennis, who is an arch segregationist, racist. 455 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:58,480 He's considered the father of the modern Navy, but the Navy's biography leaves out all of 456 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:09,640 his anti-civil rights and racist behaviors that he perpetrated for his entire adult life. 457 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:16,560 And when did it get put into service? 458 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:18,720 I believe it was 92. 459 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,120 Don't quote me on that. 460 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:25,240 Reagan nominated Stennis as the, I think it was 95. 461 00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:31,240 But Reagan nominated the ship in 1989 just before he left office and shortly before Stennis 462 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:32,920 retired. 463 00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:39,040 And this is an aircraft carrier for those non-naval types who are listening in here 464 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:40,160 on Veterans Radio. 465 00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:45,880 We're talking to Lieutenant Commander Keith Green and Captain John Cordell. 466 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:51,560 Keith, explain to folks how big an aircraft carrier is and how many people are on it when 467 00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:52,560 it's active. 468 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:58,520 Well, I'm going to pass that to John, since he's actually a nuclear service engineer 469 00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:01,400 who has some time on that platform. 470 00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:05,520 Oh, thanks, Keith. 471 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,280 So I have a service nuke officer, so I've served on it, actually pre-commissioned two 472 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,040 carriers, the Harry Truman and the George Bush, and we'll come back to the names and 473 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:14,240 why they matter. 474 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:20,080 But an aircraft carrier, Jim, is basically the largest ship in the world. 475 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:23,880 It's 1,000 feet long, roughly like three football fields. 476 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:29,360 It carries about 75 aircraft of different types, from jets to helicopters to vertical 477 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:30,360 takeoff. 478 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:37,720 And it has a core crew of about 3,000, and it adds about 1,500 aviation folks and others. 479 00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:46,360 So it sails around on nuclear power with about 4,000 to 5,000 sailors on board. 480 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:51,320 Yeah, that's what I wanted to get across, is how big it is and how many men and women 481 00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:55,360 living on it when it's out cruising around the world. 482 00:32:55,360 --> 00:33:02,280 It is currently, as I understand it, being retrofitted, updated, and when it gets done 483 00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:06,640 with that, it'll have another life of what, 25 or 30 years in the fleet? 484 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:08,520 Yeah, that's exactly right. 485 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:13,480 The nuclear plants of those ships are good for about 25 years, and so typically, because 486 00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:19,640 refueling takes about three to five years, there's only time for one, and so they last 487 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:21,400 about 50 years total. 488 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:27,760 Yeah, so the issue of the name on this ship isn't something that's going to go away tomorrow. 489 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:35,360 It's going to be the name of the ship's going to continue to live on for another couple 490 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:45,880 of two to three decades, so it's worth talking about the names Dennis, who he was. 491 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:51,760 Now let's put this in a little context, too. 492 00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:59,120 The military DOD, the Navy has gone through in the last few years looking at its bases, 493 00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:09,240 its ships, its buildings, its monuments, all of those things that were named after Confederate 494 00:34:09,240 --> 00:34:14,760 generals primarily, and said, you know what, that's not right anymore, that's not the 495 00:34:14,760 --> 00:34:18,280 image we want anymore. 496 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:23,720 And the Navy did do some of that work over the last couple of years, didn't it, John? 497 00:34:23,720 --> 00:34:24,720 They did. 498 00:34:24,720 --> 00:34:28,080 Yes, the naming commission was put together with some retired admirals, and they looked 499 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:34,600 at that, and Keith may know better than I do, but a couple things about that commission, 500 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:42,400 they were very much focused on the Confederacy, so it was Adels, like Chancellor'sville, and 501 00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:50,120 memorializing the rebel forces of the Confederacy that they wanted to get at. 502 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:56,720 And so the Stennis was sort of at one level outside of that bubble, but when you start 503 00:34:56,720 --> 00:35:01,240 to look at it, we could talk more about this, but one of his legacies was that he was very 504 00:35:01,240 --> 00:35:07,120 much a supporter of many of the things that the Confederacy stood for, and I think the 505 00:35:07,120 --> 00:35:12,760 record will show that he was pretty dedicated to making sure that those types of things lived 506 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,720 on, segregation being the large one. 507 00:35:15,720 --> 00:35:20,640 Well that's why you sort of have to set this up to understand this discussion of the need 508 00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:26,000 to change the name, with, hey, we've just gone through this for this limited period 509 00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:33,000 of the Confederacy, and according to an article by Steve Walsh, the Navy renamed something 510 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:39,320 like 33 ships, buildings, and streets as a result of that commission work, and so that 511 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:45,880 does kind of set up like, okay, we recognize this is a problem and we're changing it. 512 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:52,440 So now let's talk about Stennis, which as you say is just outside the bubble, but really 513 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:54,200 pretty associated with it. 514 00:35:54,200 --> 00:36:01,720 I'll throw it to either of you to talk about who this senator was that, you know, died 515 00:36:01,720 --> 00:36:06,600 many years ago, and many of us won't even remember him when he was alive, but talk about 516 00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:07,600 his legacy. 517 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,920 Okay, I'll take that. 518 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:16,560 I first learned who John Stennis was when I read Admiral Zoomwalt's memoir on Watch 519 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:17,560 in 1976. 520 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:23,640 I was an 18-year-old, 19-year-old seaman, and he had three chapters, and one of the 521 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:29,880 chapters in his book was Sailing Second Class, and John C. Stennis is the man who ordered 522 00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:36,360 the Navy's subcommittee hearings on permissiveness in the Navy after the so-called race riots 523 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:45,520 in the 1970s, early 72, 73, and he stacked it with Louisiana Congressman Eddie Hebert, 524 00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:51,960 who was also a signer of the Southern Manifesto, and he was adamant that Zoomwalt was being 525 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:55,400 too permissive and not punishing those black sailors. 526 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:59,680 When the truth eventually came out 50 years later, those black solar sailors had been 527 00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:05,680 victims of racial discrimination for years, including during the court martial process. 528 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:09,440 So Stennis has been on my radar for a long time. 529 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:13,920 I was busy being a chief engineer when Reagan made the announcement at the ship, and I had 530 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,760 bigger problems to worry about than what the next aircraft carrier's name was going to 531 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:18,760 be. 532 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:23,040 But as I started working on writing my first memoir, Black Officer White Navy, I dug back 533 00:37:23,040 --> 00:37:28,320 into who Stennis was, and the more I learned, the more appalled I got. 534 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:34,120 And then when John read my first book, he picked up on that, and since then we've been 535 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:39,040 writing articles and trying to get the Navy to change the name of this ship, because John 536 00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:41,720 Stennis was born in 1901. 537 00:37:41,720 --> 00:37:46,960 He was 18 years old when the Navy banned the enlistment of black sailors. 538 00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:54,360 President Woodrow Wilson and Secretary of the Navy Josephus Daniels would have been in 539 00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:59,800 total agreement with their efforts to curtail any opportunities for black sailors, including 540 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:02,760 banning the first enlistment of black sailors. 541 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:07,680 So Stennis knew men, knew invinerated men who had served in the Confederacy. 542 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:11,800 He was young enough to have known grown men that actually fought in the Confederacy. 543 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:16,520 But he's the biggest booster of the Confederacy in modern time. 544 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:21,040 And to have a ship settling around, made for a man who did so much damage and continues 545 00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:22,600 to do so much damage. 546 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:28,160 It's really, to me, it's a moral injury, it's psychological abuse. 547 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:33,600 It's saying thousands and thousands of black and other diverse sailors to be a servile 548 00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:35,480 to ship name for somebody like that. 549 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,200 Well, let's be clear about this. 550 00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,200 The historical record is clear. 551 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:47,200 This isn't your opinion, Keith, about Stennis's views on race relations. 552 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:55,080 He's got all kinds of documents that he's put his name to that are in archives all over 553 00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:58,040 the place, which makes it clear. 554 00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:04,120 For example, I read in the tragedy of the lost generation that when President Harry 555 00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:10,080 Truman integrated the armed forces in 1948 by executive orders, Stennis, he didn't like 556 00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:11,080 it. 557 00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:13,680 He told everybody he didn't like it, didn't he, Captain? 558 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:20,640 Right, and going even further, to your point, a lot of times I start with Wikipedia. 559 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:24,760 And so I hit Wikipedia for Stennis, and the first thing that pops up is Senator, father, 560 00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:25,760 the modern Navy. 561 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:31,440 Then you kind of flip the page too, and that's where the article about his segregationist 562 00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:32,560 policies goes in. 563 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,800 He voted against the Civil Rights Act, he voted against Martin Luther King's birthday, 564 00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:38,240 he voted against the Voting Act. 565 00:39:38,240 --> 00:39:45,640 So his goal was to keep people separate based on race, which is the definition of segregation. 566 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:49,600 And then when you click on segregation, it leads you right to the definition of racism. 567 00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:54,440 And so in that Wikipedia, it talks about how in his young life as a prosecutor, he prosecuted, 568 00:39:54,440 --> 00:40:00,320 I believe it was four black men who had a confession to murder, or rape and murder, 569 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:01,320 basically beaten out of them. 570 00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:07,360 I mean, he even describes in pretty graphic detail, being simulated hangings, being thrashed 571 00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:12,760 with belts, and all this was on the record of the trial that he led the prostitution 572 00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:16,920 of these people that was eventually overturned by the Supreme Court. 573 00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:18,080 So that was pretty clear. 574 00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,640 And then you follow his political career. 575 00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:26,200 And then based on Keith's sort of clues, I went back to the University of Mississippi, 576 00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:28,640 has an entire dossier on him. 577 00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:34,640 And that's where I found the letter that was printed in the magazine of, hey, I agree, 578 00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:40,000 what the letter said was, I agree with you, the boys should serve in all white units. 579 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,280 Stenus was pretty savvy. 580 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:48,600 He didn't put the racial epithets and the controversial language in his replies to letters. 581 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,480 He let the letters stand and endorsed them. 582 00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:57,440 And so I couldn't print that letter because of the words used in it to describe black people, 583 00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:00,280 Jews, and Italians, and others. 584 00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:05,360 But suffice it to say that what he put in that letter addressed Truman's mongrelization 585 00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:08,880 of the armed forces. 586 00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:13,480 And the problem that he was fighting against was the problem of black soldiers and black 587 00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:14,760 sailors. 588 00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,480 And that's what Stenus was agreeing with in that letter. 589 00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:24,160 Yeah, he's responding to a constituent and saying, I agree with you 100%. 590 00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:28,480 And in my years of service here, I have constantly and continually stressed the very point you 591 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:32,560 mentioned that our boys should have the chance to serve in all white units. 592 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,960 And this is 1955 when he's writing to the constituents. 593 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:36,960 Right. 594 00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:37,960 Yeah. 595 00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,280 And then so the next, I'll start, too. 596 00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:42,880 No, go ahead, Jen. 597 00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:47,120 So the next thing that, and this was a complete coincidence, as Naval Academy graduate, I 598 00:41:47,120 --> 00:41:50,400 get this quarterly magazine called Shipmate. 599 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,080 And I happened to know Abel Stravaid as referred with him in the past. 600 00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:55,360 He was a distinguished graduate. 601 00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:59,320 And so they have a little biography, and then they had five of them. 602 00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:04,160 And one of them was Brigadier General retired Leo Williams, the third Marine. 603 00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:08,480 And Barry in his bio was a quote that said, everybody knew that a man of my color could 604 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:10,520 never get a nomination from a Southern state. 605 00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:14,440 So I had to move to get to the Naval Academy. 606 00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:19,800 And between him and Keith, I found a book called Blue, Gold, and Black talking about 607 00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:21,280 the integration of the Naval Academy. 608 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:26,120 And I reached out to the author, who was coolly in touch with the general, who pretty much 609 00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:33,720 confirmed what we had sort of inferred from that document, is that there was a movement, 610 00:42:33,720 --> 00:42:37,760 a handshake, amongst the Southern Congressmen and Senators. 611 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:42,160 And the nomination process to the Naval Academy is very, it's run by politicians. 612 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:46,360 And so without writing anything down, they were able to have a handshake to make sure 613 00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:52,360 that no black candidates got through that process for decades. 614 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:57,480 And so that really, to me, was like the next piece of, you know, the next layer to peel 615 00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:02,160 back of, wow, not only did he have beliefs, but as Keith talks about, my beliefs drive 616 00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:03,160 my actions. 617 00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:09,760 He had tangible actions that he took to prevent blacks Americans from serving their country. 618 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:14,440 So let's go to, you know, I said a minute ago, I don't think there's really any question 619 00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:18,440 about his segregationist and racist beliefs. 620 00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:23,760 So let's go to what's the impediment for the Navy to change the name? 621 00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:25,640 Who's got to make that decision? 622 00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:27,680 Why hasn't that decision been made? 623 00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:31,040 You guys have been talking and writing on this for years. 624 00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:34,560 What feedback do you get from the Naval community? 625 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:40,440 Okay, Keith, quit laughing, Keith, answer the question. 626 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:47,080 Well, that was John laughing, I was gritting my teeth so far, the Navy, when my first article 627 00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:52,240 came out, the case of renaming the USS John C. Stennis, there was a flurry of activity 628 00:43:52,240 --> 00:43:55,760 in the press, people, you know, questioning this and so forth. 629 00:43:55,760 --> 00:44:00,080 And when the Navy was asked about it, they said they had no comment at this time. 630 00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:07,200 And they forwarded that article to the Congress, the Congressional Research Service, the Navy 631 00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:11,240 forwarded that saying that people were talking about the need for renaming the ship. 632 00:44:11,240 --> 00:44:14,080 But from that day to this, there's been no official comment. 633 00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:20,040 The Secretary of the Navy can make that change with the stroke of a pen, as far as I understand. 634 00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:23,800 And they don't have to appropriate any money, they can get money out of the couch cushions 635 00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:24,880 to do that. 636 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:33,240 So, but it's a lot of pushback, I suspect, but there's been no public discussions about 637 00:44:33,240 --> 00:44:35,480 it. 638 00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:37,440 So I don't really know what's going to happen. 639 00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:42,400 So how in the world has there not been a Congressional hearing on this issue? 640 00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:50,440 John, did you get different pushback or different feedback from the Naval community on this? 641 00:44:50,440 --> 00:44:56,960 So I have a lot of retired and active duty friends that are pretty high up in the Navy. 642 00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:02,600 And the sort of feedback I get is, hey, there's bigger fish to fry, right? 643 00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,960 Like this is not that important. 644 00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:06,680 We have other things to worry about. 645 00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:08,800 Number two, most of them just don't know. 646 00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:10,240 Like that's what I get a lot of. 647 00:45:10,240 --> 00:45:15,840 And back to your point, we talked about that before we started recording, the moveon.org. 648 00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:19,880 When you ask a sailor about John C. Senus, most of them say, oh, he's the father of 649 00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:21,480 the Navy, there's a carrier named after him. 650 00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:24,480 They haven't turned to page two of Wikipedia to find out. 651 00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:28,600 And that applies to Seaman and it applies to flag officers. 652 00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:33,040 What prompted me to write this article with Keith, to collaborate with Keith and write 653 00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:38,560 this article, was two sailors that approached us on the John C. Senus who were stationed 654 00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:44,040 there after we spoke at one of the, I think it was Anzo, an American Naval Service Officer's 655 00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:45,040 symposium. 656 00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:53,240 It said, we talk about this a lot, but basically what we're told is it's not your issue. 657 00:45:53,240 --> 00:45:58,920 And then we put the article, we have black sailors who felt like it was a slap in the 658 00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:00,920 face when they walked across the border deck. 659 00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:04,600 A black pilot who said it was a gut punch to land on the carrier. 660 00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:07,640 And so there are activity sailors. 661 00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:13,880 But one of my favorite quotes in a different context was a young chief said, when the organization 662 00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:18,240 you work for is discriminating against you, it's not in your best interest to point that 663 00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:19,480 out. 664 00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:24,240 And one of the things I've learned in my 40 years, especially with the Navy, is when 665 00:46:24,240 --> 00:46:28,000 you're at the top of the Navy or the top of leadership positions, you have the option 666 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,040 to do nothing and say nothing. 667 00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:34,680 And eventually, most things will just go away. 668 00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:39,080 And so that, it seems to be the option that's being taken. 669 00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:46,040 Well, the problem I have with the do nothing is something like 17% of the Navy are African 670 00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:47,040 Americans. 671 00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:49,760 It is a slap in the face. 672 00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:54,360 And we as veterans want to be proud of our service, right? 673 00:46:54,360 --> 00:47:00,000 And you can go into any store, down any street, any parade, and you're going to see guys 674 00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:05,080 wearing gales wearing ball caps and T-shirts with the name of the vessel they served on 675 00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:08,520 or the airborne unit they were with, what have you. 676 00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:16,200 I mean, you're not wearing the John C. Stennis cap out in public, is it? 677 00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:18,760 We had sailors tell us they refused to wear it out in public. 678 00:47:18,760 --> 00:47:20,360 They won't wear the shirt home. 679 00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:22,280 But you mentioned the number, 17%. 680 00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:26,040 You know what the percent of Black Naval Academy of the Shipman is? 681 00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:27,720 I don't. 682 00:47:27,720 --> 00:47:28,720 Six. 683 00:47:28,720 --> 00:47:29,720 Six. 684 00:47:29,720 --> 00:47:32,400 So we're going to get to that issue in a minute. 685 00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,360 I want to talk about that. 686 00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:41,240 But I want to go back to how does the general public, you guys are busy educating the naval 687 00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:43,880 community that this isn't right. 688 00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:46,080 You got to know the history of this man. 689 00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:51,120 And when you do, you won't want the ship named for him or continue to be named for him. 690 00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:57,000 How do you get the general public involved telling the secretary of the Navy, hey, don't 691 00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:58,000 be silent. 692 00:47:58,000 --> 00:47:59,800 There's a time to do something. 693 00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:01,760 Well, I have an opinion on that. 694 00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:06,800 I don't think the Navy gives a hoot what the general public thinks about that. 695 00:48:06,800 --> 00:48:10,400 What they care about is what Congress is interested in. 696 00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:15,600 And if you can get Congress interested in this topic, they will, the Navy has ignored 697 00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:20,800 the general public in the press, but they will not ignore an inquiry from Congress on 698 00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:28,240 why you stepped over an alligator to kill two frogs by renaming ships of people that 699 00:48:28,240 --> 00:48:33,600 have been long dead when Stennis was alive when I was fighting discrimination, you know, 700 00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:35,520 as an officer in the Navy. 701 00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:41,160 And there are going to be many thousands of minority sailors and white sailors that will 702 00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:43,760 serve on that ship in the next 25 years. 703 00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:49,920 And the longer the Navy delays this, the longer the moral consensus issues going to be. 704 00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:54,560 And it's up to Congress to step in and protect the people that volunteer to serve in our 705 00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:57,680 military from this sort of moral abuse. 706 00:48:57,680 --> 00:49:04,200 Keith, is there a particular congressman or woman who is maybe near and dear to this 707 00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:05,200 issue? 708 00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:11,040 Is there somebody or some committee in general that needs to hear from people about this 709 00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:12,040 matters? 710 00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:24,320 Well, Mississippi Senator Benny Thompson would be the obvious choice to spearhead this thing. 711 00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:30,000 And not only that, the Congressional Black Caucus, there was a huge outcry when the young 712 00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:34,080 airman was killed in his apartment. 713 00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:38,120 There was a huge outcry and, you know, you had these prominent people attending his 714 00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:43,320 funeral, but not one word from these people about sailors that are experiencing this sort 715 00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:48,480 of, I call it, discrimination and psychological abuse on an everyday basis. 716 00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:57,480 So you need to get, I think, Benny Thompson, have the moral authority to address this issue. 717 00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:58,480 Well we want to... 718 00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:02,160 And Jeff, Keith and I are working on, now that these letters are out there and these 719 00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:08,920 articles is a bit of a letter writing campaign to some key congressmen and senators, other 720 00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:15,960 Navy leadership and things like that that might educate them because, like I said, the 721 00:50:15,960 --> 00:50:19,400 average person just doesn't know. 722 00:50:19,400 --> 00:50:22,520 And then when you confront them with it, you know, it's kind of like if you took a poll, 723 00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:29,200 there's a good chunk of the country that feels like that racism is not an issue. 724 00:50:29,200 --> 00:50:32,600 And so it's tough to even bring a topic like this up. 725 00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:37,000 And back to my point about the 6% of the naval academy, remember, you don't grow admirals, 726 00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:38,120 it weren't ensigns. 727 00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:43,600 And so if you start at 6%, look at the percentage of black flag officers. 728 00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:44,600 Sure. 729 00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:47,200 I think it's down in like the one or two. 730 00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:57,040 And, you know, I mean, one of our mentors had a comment that says, you know, for something 731 00:50:57,040 --> 00:51:00,920 to change, there has to be empathy from the unimpacted. 732 00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:08,080 And if I'm a white senior person, this doesn't impact me. 733 00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:14,160 And for me to feel compelled to make a change, I have to really inject empathy into that 734 00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:17,280 18-year-old black sailor. 735 00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:19,680 And I don't have a lot of evidence of that happening. 736 00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:25,240 Well, we had talked earlier too about whether or not there was a change.org petition that 737 00:51:25,240 --> 00:51:27,240 the general public could sign. 738 00:51:27,240 --> 00:51:28,240 I think you told me there is. 739 00:51:28,240 --> 00:51:32,800 You can go to change.org and look for a petition called Renaming the Stennis. 740 00:51:32,800 --> 00:51:37,760 It hasn't grabbed a lot of the general public yet, but maybe it will. 741 00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:44,600 Keith, do you think it has any prospect of having an impact on Congressmen or the Congressional 742 00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:48,280 Black Caucus, or does it need a whole different type of effort? 743 00:51:48,280 --> 00:51:51,520 I think you need a whole different type of effort. 744 00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:54,000 I signed the petition quite some time ago. 745 00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:59,320 The last time I checked, there weren't very many signatures on it, but the Navy does not 746 00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:00,920 respond to outside pressure. 747 00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:04,200 The military does not respond to outside pressure. 748 00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:09,640 All of these issues with sexual harassment, discrimination, etc., have been ongoing for 749 00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:10,640 decades. 750 00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:18,920 And the Navy only responds when the people that control the purse strings have a say. 751 00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:25,240 Well, let's hope that some more momentum from Congress builds on renaming the John C. 752 00:52:25,240 --> 00:52:32,760 Stennis before it serves another 25, 30 years and that this is just not the right name for 753 00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:34,320 this aircraft carrier. 754 00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:36,640 I certainly appreciate both of you. 755 00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:42,160 I would be Captain John Cordell and Lieutenant Commander Keith Green, both retired from the 756 00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,320 US Navy, talking about the Stennis issue. 757 00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:52,200 These are the sort of thought-provoking discussions, interviews that we can bring you here on Veterans 758 00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:58,800 Radio because we have this format that allows for it and we have very generous sponsors. 759 00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:04,360 So we can't do this work without the continuation of our sponsors. 760 00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:05,800 We talked about some of them earlier. 761 00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:13,360 But I want to also mention the Vietnam Veterans of America National Chapter and local VSOs 762 00:53:13,360 --> 00:53:19,880 who will help out Vietnam Veterans of America Charles S. Kells Chapter 310 in Ann Arbor, 763 00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:29,480 the VFW Graffo Hero Post 423 in the American Legionist, Prescorin Post 46 also in Ann Arbor. 764 00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:35,520 Dale and I have been doing this for 21 plus years and you get towards the end of the year 765 00:53:35,520 --> 00:53:38,800 and you think, well, I don't know if there's any more stories to tell. 766 00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:41,120 And there always are. 767 00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:45,920 Some of those stories we find in papers, some of those stories we can elaborate on from 768 00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:52,440 books that we get a chance to read, or just folks who contact us and say, hey, I'd like 769 00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:54,360 to hear about this. 770 00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:55,680 And that's what we do. 771 00:53:55,680 --> 00:54:00,000 We track folks down and have those kind of conversations. 772 00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:05,520 It's amazing how many people are really happy to finally tell their story. 773 00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:10,920 Maybe nobody's ever asked or asked in a format that they felt comfortable with. 774 00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:16,200 So if you've got somebody out there who's interested, who might want to tell a story, 775 00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:17,800 reach out to us. 776 00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:23,640 Jim at veteransradio.org or Dale at veteransradio.org. 777 00:54:23,640 --> 00:54:30,720 We're always really interested in those kinds of opportunities to talk to somebody who maybe 778 00:54:30,720 --> 00:54:37,600 has kept their military story quiet, but really it needs to be added to the whole history 779 00:54:37,600 --> 00:54:41,880 of military service here in the United States. 780 00:54:41,880 --> 00:54:48,640 If you'd like to help out financially, you can go to veteransradio.org. 781 00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:55,400 There's a button that says donate and shows you how to give to what we do here. 782 00:54:55,400 --> 00:54:59,080 It's a voluntary organization. 783 00:54:59,080 --> 00:55:05,680 Nobody's getting paid big bucks to host veterans radio, but we do have to pay for our radio 784 00:55:05,680 --> 00:55:16,000 sponsors and our time on air, so we do appreciate whether it's 200 bucks or 20 bucks or $10. 785 00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:17,560 Feel free to donate. 786 00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:23,840 We also have a way to do that on our Facebook site, VeteransRadio's Facebook site, so reach 787 00:55:23,840 --> 00:55:25,840 out. 788 00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:28,760 It's the holiday season. 789 00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:35,400 It's a good time of year to step back a little bit, be thoughtful, maybe make sure you're 790 00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:40,960 extra kind to all your friends, neighbors, and those who aren't your friends and neighbors. 791 00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:44,840 I think that's one of the things we're supposed to do at this time of year. 792 00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:50,400 I always like to keep in mind all of the armed forces scattered all over the world who are 793 00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:59,400 keeping us safe and protected and allowing us to enjoy a holiday season, a religious 794 00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:07,120 season because they've been out there protecting us, and I think, again, that less than 1% 795 00:56:07,120 --> 00:56:08,840 is doing that for the rest of us. 796 00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:15,960 The least we can do is be very supportive of them and go out of our way a little bit. 797 00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:20,680 Whether it's dropping some toys and toys for Tots or helping out military charities, 798 00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:24,960 we really encourage you all to think about doing that. 799 00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:26,200 We're coming to the end here. 800 00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:32,400 We want to appreciate all of you for being loyal listeners to Veterans Radio. 801 00:56:32,400 --> 00:56:33,800 Love to communicate with you. 802 00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:34,800 Reach out to us. 803 00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:36,920 It's a great thing to do. 804 00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:41,840 Next week, Dale Throneberry, my partner, will be back to bring you some more interesting 805 00:56:41,840 --> 00:56:47,760 discussions on topics that we think Veterans are always interested in. 806 00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:57,360 Until next time on Veterans Radio, you are dismissed.