1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:15,660 All across America and around the world, this is Veterans Radio. 2 00:00:15,660 --> 00:00:22,560 And now, your host for today's program, Dale Throneberry. 3 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,100 And welcome to Veterans Radio. 4 00:00:24,100 --> 00:00:29,600 My name is Dale Throneberry, a CW-2 helicopter pilot in Vietnam. 5 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:31,160 Welcome to Veterans Radio. 6 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:37,200 Today we've got kind of a special best of Veterans Radio, one of our rotor head segments. 7 00:00:37,200 --> 00:00:39,400 We're going to be talking to two helicopter pilots. 8 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:46,280 We've got Kate Meltzer, who is an AH-64D Apache Longbow attack helicopter pilot, and Phil 9 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:49,560 Marshall, who was a Medevac pilot in Vietnam. 10 00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:52,000 So those are going to be the people that we're going to be listening to. 11 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:56,360 But what we need to talk to you about today is our upcoming fundraiser. 12 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:57,360 That's right. 13 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:00,280 We're going to be talking about the River Time again here at Veterans Radio. 14 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:07,200 And Radio in the River is coming up on Sunday, Sunday, Sunday, September 22nd. 15 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:14,800 And it's going to be at a really great personal private home on the Huron River here in Ann 16 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:15,800 Arbor. 17 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:18,040 It's going to be running from 2 to 5 p.m. 18 00:01:18,040 --> 00:01:20,640 And our guests are going to be Doug Bradley. 19 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:24,080 And Doug Bradley is an Army veteran. 20 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:28,880 He served as a combat correspondent in Vietnam in 1970. 21 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:35,520 Since then he returned home to Wisconsin and he helped establish the Vets House, a storefront 22 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:38,840 community-based service center for Vietnam era veterans. 23 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:43,480 But he is also just a fanatic on the music of Vietnam. 24 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:45,240 And he has written a couple of books. 25 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:49,920 One is called We Got to Get Out of This Place, you know, a theme song for everybody everywhere, 26 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:51,760 it seemed like. 27 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:56,660 And so he's written that book and he wrote another one that's called Who'll Stop the 28 00:01:56,660 --> 00:01:59,960 Rain about Creedence Clairrata Revival. 29 00:01:59,960 --> 00:02:04,480 He's lectures on the music of Vietnam and he talks about the culture of the music in 30 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:05,480 Vietnam. 31 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:07,320 So I think it's going to be a great guest. 32 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:12,040 I think you'll really enjoy him if you get to come out to our fundraiser. 33 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:13,840 Our other guest is John Bernstein. 34 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:18,760 And John is the curator of the Arms and Armor Collection at the National Museum of the 35 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,040 Marine Corps. 36 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,240 John is also a helicopter pilot. 37 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:26,880 He is a post 9-11 Army helicopter pilot. 38 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:30,880 And so we're going to be talking pilot type stuff. 39 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:34,760 And also the museum and the music and the storytelling, which is what we do here at 40 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:35,760 Veterans Radios. 41 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:40,440 We're trying to collect as many stories as we can from our veteran community. 42 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:44,760 And so we're asking for you to help us out, you know, to make a donation. 43 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:50,280 If you can't come to the fundraiser, donations are always accepted. 44 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:55,760 You can go to our website, veteransradio.org, and you can click on the picture of the radio 45 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:56,760 on the river. 46 00:02:56,760 --> 00:03:00,080 If you don't want to go through that process, you can click on the little donate button 47 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,080 at the top of the website. 48 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:03,440 So we encourage you to come on out. 49 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:05,440 I think it's going to be really fun. 50 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:10,360 We've got all kinds of auction gifts. 51 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:11,800 We've got giveaways. 52 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:17,480 We've got veterans radio swag, as they call sweatshirts, hats, all kinds of things that 53 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,160 you could purchase at the event. 54 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:21,840 And I think it's going to be a good time. 55 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:23,920 We're hoping for good weather. 56 00:03:23,920 --> 00:03:28,200 And yeah, so hopefully go to veteransradio.org. 57 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:30,720 I think that you'll really check it out. 58 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:35,400 I think you're going to find that there's many, many things that you could, the stories 59 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:39,520 that you would find very interesting, the characters and people that we have talked 60 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:41,520 to over the last 20 years. 61 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:43,000 We need your help. 62 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,800 So hopefully you can spare a dime, well more than a dime. 63 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,080 But anyway, so I'd like you to do that if you can. 64 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:55,040 So remember that Sunday, September 22nd, here in Ann Arbor, Michigan, radio on the river, 65 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:57,320 our third annual radio on the river. 66 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:01,520 So more about that a little bit later on too. 67 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaking of sponsors, we have been doing this program for 20 years now. 68 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,160 And we couldn't do it without our sponsors. 69 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:11,240 We've got some great ones. 70 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,240 So let me tell you who we've got out there. 71 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:15,280 So number one is legal help for veterans. 72 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:20,480 Legal help for veterans specializes in veteran disability claims, give legal help for veterans 73 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:28,840 a call at 800-69-3-4800 or go to their website, legalhelpforveterans.com. 74 00:04:28,840 --> 00:04:33,680 The National Veterans Business Development Council, better known as NVBDC, is the nation's 75 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:38,460 leading third party authority for certification of veteran-owned businesses. 76 00:04:38,460 --> 00:04:48,160 For more information, you can go to their website, NVBDC.org, or give them a call at 888-237-8433. 77 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:52,800 By the way, if you are a small veteran-owned business and you want to do business with 78 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:57,280 the federal government or with many corporations that want to do business with veteran-owned 79 00:04:57,280 --> 00:04:59,960 businesses, you need to get certified. 80 00:04:59,960 --> 00:05:02,240 And these are the folks that can help you do that. 81 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:06,400 So again, that's NVBDC.org. 82 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:10,440 Charles S. Kettles, VA Medical Center here in Ann Arbor, Michigan. 83 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:12,600 For more information, go to va.gov. 84 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:19,800 We like to think that we have one of the best, if not the best, VA Medical Center in the 85 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:20,800 country. 86 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:22,640 Vietnam Veterans of America. 87 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:26,120 Never again will one generation of veterans abandon another. 88 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,400 For more information, go to their website, vva.org. 89 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:36,400 Locally, it's the Irwin Prescor and American Legion Post-46 and the Charles S. Kettles, 90 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:40,680 Vietnam Veterans of America, Chapter 310, both of Ann Arbor, Michigan. 91 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:44,200 Both of them have been supporting us since 2003. 92 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,920 If you'd like to support Veterans Radio, as I mentioned before, please go to our website, 93 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:49,920 veteransradio.org. 94 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:52,360 Click on the donation button. 95 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:53,600 Thank you in advance. 96 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaking of NVBDC, each month we'd like to highlight one of their members. 97 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,600 And this month we're going to highlight Todd McCracken. 98 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:05,960 And Todd is the President and CEO of the National Small Business Association. 99 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:10,760 Jim Falsone, my partner, recorded his interview with Todd a couple of weeks ago. 100 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:12,440 So we're going to play that right now. 101 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:14,240 So Jim, here you go. 102 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:16,640 Hi, I'm Jim Falsone and welcome. 103 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:21,600 This is Veterans Radio's spotlight on the National Veteran Business Development Council. 104 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:26,640 Better down is NVBDC.org. 105 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:32,800 Veterans Radio America has a partnership with NVBDC where we talk and put some spotlight 106 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:37,040 on the value of being a certified veteran-owned business. 107 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:41,760 NVBDC is the nation's leading third-party authority for certification of veteran-owned 108 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:43,960 businesses of all sizes. 109 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,600 It's a 501c3 nonprofit established in 2013. 110 00:06:48,600 --> 00:06:54,120 It addresses the growing need to identify and certify both service-debilled and veteran-owned 111 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:58,360 businesses in the government and commercial marketplace. 112 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:03,920 It administers a rigorous certification process designed to withstand the scrutiny of governmental 113 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:08,280 and corporate entities seeking to utilize certified companies. 114 00:07:08,280 --> 00:07:12,360 We want to welcome to Veterans Radio Todd McCracken. 115 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:17,640 He is the President and CEO of the National Small Business Association. 116 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:24,640 He directs all their advocacy and program-orientated operations. 117 00:07:24,640 --> 00:07:28,400 He's been there for, as he just told me, about forever. 118 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:30,200 Todd, welcome. 119 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:32,200 Welcome to Veterans Radio. 120 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:33,640 Thank you, Jim. 121 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:34,640 It's great to be here. 122 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:39,000 Well, we're going to talk about the National Small Business Association and some of its 123 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,680 veterans activities, its network. 124 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:48,240 But before we start there, you were recently at an NVBDC program where you got to speak 125 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:49,760 last month. 126 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:54,880 Tell us a little bit about why you think it's important for veteran-owned businesses to 127 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:56,760 get certified. 128 00:07:56,760 --> 00:08:04,480 Well, we're lucky enough that we're at a period of time where big corporations really see 129 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:09,640 it as important to engage more deeply with, well, small businesses generally, but especially 130 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,880 with veteran-owned small companies. 131 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:17,400 And they're reaching out in a way they hadn't for a long time. 132 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:27,480 And NVBDC really is the place to go to get certified and to become one of those businesses 133 00:08:27,480 --> 00:08:30,640 that can do business with those much larger companies. 134 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:32,520 And they do just a great job. 135 00:08:32,520 --> 00:08:37,160 As you said, they have not been around that long, a little over a decade now. 136 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:41,200 But they've really developed a really strong network, great relationships with some of 137 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:47,840 the biggest companies in the country, and really run the only viable and really rigorous 138 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:49,440 certification program for veterans. 139 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:56,640 And it's something that opens all kinds of doors for the veterans who've gotten certified 140 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:57,640 through them. 141 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:00,960 And I just can't say enough good stuff about their work. 142 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:07,680 Well, certainly some of your members at the National Small Business Association are probably 143 00:09:07,680 --> 00:09:11,920 certified by NVBDC. 144 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:19,120 You got the opportunity to attend one of the kind of premier functions of NVBDC. 145 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:21,720 After you get certified, they don't leave you alone. 146 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:24,520 They help you in the business world. 147 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:29,720 And as you know, as a National Association, that networking is all important. 148 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:36,960 Tell us what you observed and your impressions out of the NVBDC networking event held in 149 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:40,160 Detroit in August of 2024. 150 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:42,760 Yeah, I was just there last month. 151 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:43,760 It was a great event. 152 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:47,480 I was able to speak to the folks that were going on in Washington, DC, that affect small 153 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:51,600 companies and about our veterans network. 154 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:58,280 But they were also able to hear from a number of big companies on how they do procurement, 155 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:03,080 how they work with small businesses, how they get involved with them from sort of an overview 156 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:05,080 perspective. 157 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:10,360 But then all the veterans that were there were then able to sort of sit down and at 158 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:14,080 the end of the network, not just for each other, but with representatives from all those 159 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:20,880 companies and figure out what they're looking for, how to get contracts, how to develop their 160 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:22,920 businesses. 161 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:27,320 And boy, the range of veteran businesses that were there was really impressive. 162 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:31,560 A lot of folks from all kinds of sectors of the economy doing all kinds of interesting 163 00:10:31,560 --> 00:10:35,600 things, super diverse crowd. 164 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:38,840 And I think they got a lot out of networking with each other as well and learning from 165 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:43,840 each other about what has worked, what hasn't worked, how they've been able to advance their 166 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:44,840 businesses. 167 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:52,800 And all of course, sharing this veteran service background that I think really brings them 168 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:56,480 together as well in this sort of atmosphere of trust and camaraderie. 169 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:58,080 It's really great of that. 170 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:03,600 Well, we certainly want to encourage people, business owners out there who are veteran-owned 171 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:09,320 to look into NVBDC.org, see if certification might be right for them. 172 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:11,800 And maybe it'll help boost their business. 173 00:11:11,800 --> 00:11:12,800 It's only a door opener. 174 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:14,680 You still have to be able to perform. 175 00:11:14,680 --> 00:11:17,280 All right, let's get into today's program. 176 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:21,800 As I mentioned, we're going to be talking about helicopter pilots and some of the training 177 00:11:21,800 --> 00:11:23,080 that we all went through. 178 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:29,680 So our guests are, as I mentioned, Kate Melcher, an AH-64 Apache longhorn attack pilot, and 179 00:11:29,680 --> 00:11:31,960 Phil Marshall is a Medevac pilot. 180 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:38,040 The other thing about Kate and Phil is that Kate is also the executive director of Fisher 181 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:39,880 House Michigan. 182 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:44,520 And for those of you not familiar with that, she'll talk about it a little bit in the program, 183 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:49,120 but Fisher House is sort of like a Ronald McDonald House for the VA hospitals. 184 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,520 And so if you're a patient at the VA hospital and you need some place for your family to 185 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:55,000 stay, Fisher House is what they do. 186 00:11:55,000 --> 00:11:57,920 So she's been doing that for a long time now. 187 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:03,360 And Phil Marshall is an author, speaker, and a member of American Huey 369 down in Indiana 188 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:07,240 where they refurbished Huey's and other aircraft. 189 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:09,160 I think they have a Cobra now too. 190 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:13,760 And they'll take those out to various functions and provide rides for people who want to ride 191 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:14,760 in those things. 192 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:20,520 And he's written a whole bunch of books called Helicopter Rescues in Vietnam. 193 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:24,720 The true stories of daring helicopter rescues is told by the men who flew them. 194 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:26,360 So I think this is going to be cool. 195 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:32,560 So I'm looking forward to talking with them and I get to go back in time here. 196 00:12:32,560 --> 00:12:36,440 So we're going back to April of 2021. 197 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:37,440 So stay tuned. 198 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:41,240 I'm going to have a little intro music and then we'll get right into our interview. 199 00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:42,240 Thanks for listening. 200 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:52,680 He blesses the boy as they stand in line, the smell of gun grease and their bayonets 201 00:12:52,680 --> 00:12:55,440 they shine. 202 00:12:55,440 --> 00:13:03,640 He's there to help them, all that he can, to make them feel wanted. 203 00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:09,640 He's a good holy man. 204 00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:14,640 Sky pilots. 205 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:19,640 Sky pilots. 206 00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:27,640 How high can you fly? 207 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:31,640 You never are. 208 00:13:31,640 --> 00:13:36,640 Reach the sky. 209 00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:41,640 He smiles at the young soldiers, tells them it's all right. 210 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:45,640 He knows of their fear in the forthcoming fight. 211 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:50,640 Soon there'll be blood and many will die. 212 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:56,640 Mothers and fathers back home, they will cry. 213 00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:02,640 Sky pilots. 214 00:14:02,640 --> 00:14:07,640 So welcome fellow rotor heads to veterans radio again. 215 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:08,640 Yes. 216 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:09,640 Hello again. 217 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:10,640 Great to be here. 218 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:12,640 It's always fun to talk about helicopters. 219 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:13,640 It is. 220 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:14,640 It is. 221 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:21,640 And so what I wanted to start off with was how did you get into flying helicopters? 222 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:24,140 That's the question of the day. 223 00:14:24,140 --> 00:14:28,640 So since Kate outranks all of us. 224 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:32,640 She is a real live officer. 225 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:33,640 Yeah. 226 00:14:33,640 --> 00:14:35,640 Okay. 227 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:40,640 Kate, how did you get involved in flying helicopters? 228 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,640 Believe it or not, it started when I was working in Washington. 229 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:49,640 I was not one of those kids that went to air shows and looked up and said, I want to do that one day. 230 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:56,640 You know, I, I hear a lot of my aviation colleagues came to aviation that way from a sheer fascination. 231 00:14:56,640 --> 00:14:59,640 And for me, it was different. 232 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:03,640 I was actually working in the US Senate when September 11th happened. 233 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:09,640 And when Afghanistan kicked off and then Iraq kicked off. 234 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:12,640 I was drafting letters to gold star mothers. 235 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:16,640 And that was a terrible way I thought for me to spend the war. 236 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:24,640 So I started talking with colleagues who had been in the service before and, you know, I had a mentor in the Senate. 237 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:28,640 He was a retired Army Lieutenant Colonel named Bill Suity. 238 00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:40,640 And he said, the best place to learn leadership, the best place to make a change in the lives of others and to have impact is to be a company commander in the Army or in the Marine Corps. 239 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:44,640 And at the time, women were not allowed in combat. 240 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:51,640 I know very well that women experience combat throughout the Afghanistan Iraq conflicts, but legally they weren't allowed in combat. 241 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:56,640 They weren't allowed in combat arms, MOS is, but we were allowed an aviation. 242 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:01,640 And I figured if, if I'm ever going to war, I want guns. 243 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:06,640 I want to be able to shoot back. I want to be able to defend our guys on the ground. 244 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:12,640 I'm actually wearing my regimental crest from when I was in the first of the 104th and it reads above the best. 245 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:21,640 That was our mission to fly above our nation's best and to provide close air support and to protect them on convoy ops. 246 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,640 That's what I wanted to do. 247 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:41,640 And so it was sort of a curvy path to get me into aviation, but you know, eventually I enlisted was a commissioned officer went to flight school at Fort Rucker and I became rated a H64 D longbow helicopter pilot. 248 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:49,640 Awesome. You could blow stuff up. 249 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:53,640 Phil, so, Phil Marshall, how'd you get involved? 250 00:16:53,640 --> 00:17:03,640 I went to college right out of high school and I was no more no more ready for college than the man on the moon. I was more interested where the parties were and I've been arrested enough where the library was. 251 00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:11,640 So, without having degrees to go back to Ohio State University, you know, they told me perhaps I should pursue another career. 252 00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:19,640 And in the late 60s, if you were not a full time four year student or if you weren't married with at least one child you were draft eligible. 253 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:25,640 So I decided to go to each branch of the service whoever offered me the best deal I was going to enlist. 254 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:34,640 And when the army said that I told him I was interested in in flying but as a crewman I didn't have my degree. 255 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:41,640 And the recruiter says well we got this here warned officer flight school will make a helicopter pilot and I said I don't have a degree. 256 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:54,640 He says you don't need one. So, at the time you could go into war and also flight school right out of high school and graduate high school at 18 a year later you graduate flight school at 19 you're flying helicopters in Vietnam. 257 00:17:54,640 --> 00:18:07,640 I was two years of college I was 21 when I got to Vietnam but like Kate I wanted to be a gunship pilot are you kidding me I'm going to go in guns blazing I'm going to defend myself and come home. 258 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:15,640 And the army had different ideas for me before I graduated from flight school they told 24 of us are going to Medivac school at Fort Sam Houston. 259 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:28,640 And I wound up flying dust off helicopters in Vietnam on arm Huey's. And I was devastated but as it turned out it was the best thing that happened to me it was incredibly rewarding. 260 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:37,640 As aircraft commander I've got one aircraft I've got a crew I've got a mission, and it's all up to me everything that happens once. 261 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:51,640 When we get the alarm that we've got wounded it's all on my shoulders and talk about command decision and authority. It was it was just absolutely incredible to be able to do that at 21. 262 00:18:51,640 --> 00:19:06,640 And some of my best friends in our unit again 19 years old aircraft commanders in complete charge of the mission and coordinating everything so it was. Yeah it was an amazing time and no regrets it was the best thing that happened to me. 263 00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:15,640 Well I can kind of I agree with you entirely Phil I was also not an exemplary college student myself. 264 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:19,640 So I did the same thing I went left school. 265 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:26,640 As Phil pointed out we were eligible for the draft almost immediately because I got mine. I got the letter six weeks later. 266 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:37,640 Yeah I did well. Yeah, come on down so I ran down to the recruiters and no offense to those in the infantry at the time I didn't know what your jobs was in the infantry. 267 00:19:37,640 --> 00:19:47,640 I just knew that it wasn't a good idea for me and talking to the Air Force and the Navy they each had six month waiting periods to get in and I said that's no good. 268 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:50,640 And the Marines that I could go that afternoon. 269 00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:52,640 And I could be a lieutenant. 270 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:56,640 Because they have those really cool uniforms. 271 00:19:56,640 --> 00:20:00,640 And I said well let me check I have a date tonight I'll go. 272 00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:02,640 You know it goes on. 273 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:11,640 And then I went down to the army recruiter and as Phil mentioned he says well you know I see you have some college. 274 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:13,640 And I like sort of. 275 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:19,640 And I said and he said, oh you know they look into the war and officer flight program. 276 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:26,640 And so I fly fly what and he said helicopters and I'm going I've seen a couple. 277 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:36,640 Obviously I was tuned out of whatever was going on in the war in the world even and so took the aptitude test past the aptitude test. 278 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:40,640 Next thing you know I'm off my on my way over to Fort Polk Louisiana. 279 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:49,640 And you know first everybody had to go through that. 280 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:53,640 And our advanced training was most of us ended up at Fort Walters, Texas. 281 00:20:53,640 --> 00:21:02,640 And so I did want to talk a little bit about our experiences of the first time that we actually got into a helicopter. 282 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:06,640 So I'm going to fill out start with you this time. 283 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:22,640 So tell me all right first time and tell the the aircraft that you flew and kind of describe it to our eyes because we do have a lot of army people, you know military people out there but we also have civilians that would that are not familiar with the different types of aircraft that we flew. 284 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:43,640 Well we had three types of training aircraft as our primary helicopters but I was fortunate or unfortunate enough to be chosen to buy the th 55 which was what we call the Mattel Messerschmitt a little two place aircraft piston engine manual throttle and it was a huge. 285 00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:52,640 Guys I forget to 269 was a civilian version, but very, very tiny, not very forgiving. 286 00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:59,640 And the first day I learned that the state of Texas was not big enough to learn to hover one of those things. 287 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:11,640 That was the first criteria was to learn to hover if you, if you couldn't hover or if you couldn't solo you were set back for two weeks and if you still couldn't do it you were, you were history. 288 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:19,640 You were a lot of pressure, but very challenging and and once you accomplished each stage. 289 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:31,640 It was just, you know you just got a little stronger morally and confidence and so on until they finally nine months later you're flying Huey so it was. 290 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:46,640 It was a great experience that's for sure and and of course the instructor pilots were very forgiving. My favorite phrase from my first instructor pilot was a wrap over the head on the helmet and you ain't got the guy the brains God gave a constipated eight. 291 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:52,640 So yeah they were very patient with this and very forgiving. 292 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:57,640 Yeah, every day you could get one of those terrible terrible pink slips. 293 00:22:57,640 --> 00:23:02,640 Oh yeah yeah two pink slips and you were in trouble. Big trouble. 294 00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:19,640 This was at Fort Walters, Texas, which is about what was that that was west of Fort Worth Dallas area, about an hour's drive west but got very very few passes and during that training never did make it to Fort Worth I think we made it to mineral wells 295 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:31,640 perhaps lovingly referred to as miserable Gulch, but the the the training and the aircraft. Well, let me let me put it this way. 296 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:48,640 Every two weeks the army started a new class and the classes consisted of about 250 worn officer candidates, about 150 officer students and about 50 Vietnamese students so every two weeks the army is training starting 297 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,640 on 450 new helicopter pilots. 298 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:57,640 Virtually all the Vietnamese graduated regardless of how good they were. Same thing for the officers. 299 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:04,640 But the warrant officers I think about 175 of the original 250 might a class graduated. 300 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:19,640 We had a rather high washout rate because we were getting officer development at the same time they're teaching us to fly and a lot of guys just were not cut out to be officers, not the right attitude or the right attitude or attitude whatever. 301 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:31,640 But yeah there was a rather high washout for the worn officer candidate class but even still the army was training 250 300 or more pilots every two weeks. 302 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:40,640 That's it was very busy time that's that's for darn sure because we had to go through that four weeks of snowbird training, where we learned how to become officers. 303 00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:42,640 He didn't even see an aircraft. 304 00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:51,640 No, no, and you did the square meals. You know you had to sell it to your chair and you know try to get food in your mouth without looking at a type of thing. 305 00:24:51,640 --> 00:25:00,640 And we had people wash out of that part is as Phil just mentioned because they just couldn't put up with the, the, the officer development also known as for 306 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:06,640 officer development because we many of us were not officer material in that case. 307 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:14,640 So, Kate what about what about you when did you, where did you start your training and what kind of aircraft were you in. 308 00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:19,640 I started and completed my training at Fort Rucker. 309 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:28,640 So, the interesting thing talking with Vietnam era pilots is that I hear all of the reasons that our flight training happened the way that it did. 310 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:38,640 So, for us, all of those requirements were front loaded. It was months and months and months before we were allowed to see a helicopter, let alone touch one. 311 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:56,640 So, you would not even report to Fort Rucker for flight training unless you had completed walk school war and officer candidate school, or West Point or ROTC or whatever your source of commission was you had to be a fully formed officer before you were allowed to even start the ground 312 00:25:56,640 --> 00:26:11,640 portion of flight school. Then we would go on and we would do aeromedical training, which was all book learning and PowerPoints and, you know, you, you learn all of the things that can happen to your body when you're in flight, all the medical issues that you can 313 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,640 have and how it affects your flight performance. 314 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:30,640 And then we all had to go through the dunker course, which was one of my favorite days in all of the entire army. You know, we don't often fly feet wet or over water, but they wanted to make sure that we could survive a situation in which not only were we flying over water, but we stopped 315 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:45,640 flying while over water. So, you know, they, they put us in our flight suits and they threw us in a pool and just kept dunking us throughout the day there's a, there's a mock helicopter cockpit down there that will actually spin underwater. 316 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:52,640 They'll turn out the lights and you'll have darked out goggles in case you had a nighttime catastrophic event. 317 00:26:52,640 --> 00:27:02,640 And a lot of guys even washed out at that part, you know, their spatial orientation was, was changed enough that they couldn't figure out how to egress from a downed helicopter underwater. 318 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:11,640 So the academics of aeromed guys washed out, dunker guys wash out, Sear school, survive evade resist escape. 319 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,640 Because of the environment that we're in now. 320 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:21,640 All army aviators have to go through the same level of Sear training that special forces soldiers do. 321 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,640 It's not just survivor school any longer. 322 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:34,640 There, there are actually portions of the school in which you learn resist and escape from a POW type environment. 323 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:48,640 And there's open source information that'll tell you a little bit more about that, but it is a classified school for obvious reasons, but we would have guys that that couldn't take the mental or physical stress of Sear school and they would wash out. 324 00:27:48,640 --> 00:28:01,640 And so the washouts that you were talking about that were happening during flight training, the army decided they didn't want to waste the money, you know, putting these guys in an aircraft and spending the flight hours which were so precious by the time I went through. 325 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:13,640 They did all of the washing out up front so by the time you actually got through your systems course and were allowed to go to Karen's army airfield and see a helicopter. 326 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,640 You saw a lot of guys on your right and left that weren't there anymore. 327 00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:18,640 I'm sorry. 328 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:20,640 Go ahead, Phil. 329 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:23,640 I was going to make a comment about your your dunking training. 330 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:25,640 We had none of that. 331 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:31,640 And when we got to Vietnam we were issued a pair of water wings that we draped over the back of our seat. 332 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:39,640 And as dust off we often took our wounded out to the hospital ship so we could fly miles out over the South China Sea. 333 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,640 I never even tried on my water rings. I don't even know if they worked. 334 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:49,640 But yeah, we had none of that training. They, you know, you guys learned the hard way, you know, from our mistakes. 335 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:58,640 But I just found it interesting that you know, here we are flying single engine aircraft single single aircraft period out over open water a day and night. 336 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:03,640 And yeah, it was, I guess we were taking a risk. 337 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:16,640 I know it's me. The only thing they taught me was that if you if you had to do an auto rotation or anything into water is that just before you got to the water you were supposed to flip the aircraft on its side. 338 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:20,640 Yeah. Otherwise the blades were going to beat you up. 339 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,640 And yeah, wait till the blade stop and then get out. 340 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:24,640 Yes. Yeah. 341 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:28,640 And that was the extent of my water training. 342 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,640 Kate, I want to come back to you. What type of aircraft did you learn to hover? 343 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:40,640 We started on the TH 67. It's called the creek in the army and it actually was just retired out of the army fleet a couple of months ago. 344 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:49,640 But for those who aren't familiar with what that aircraft is, it looks similar to say a news or traffic helicopter that you might see in the civilian world. 345 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:58,640 It's a small single engine aircraft with skins and it's a great agile aircraft to learn to hover. 346 00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:09,640 You know, we are the greatest pastime was watching other people hover because you oh my gosh they look like idiots I'm going to do so much better than that they look like they're at their wrestling school. 347 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:11,640 This is ridiculous. 348 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:18,640 You know, and the ITs are always right there just to make sure that you know you don't crash and burn hovering 10 feet off the ground. 349 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:29,640 But everybody thinks that they're going to do it better and they're like oh my gosh, well, this guy has two left feet, you know, there's of course he's, he's hovering hovering like that, you know, but I can do better. 350 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:44,640 And without fail, all of us go out there and we look the exact same way just complete idiots and it usually takes, I don't know, five to seven days of just scrambled eggs out there trying to figure out what in the world you're doing. 351 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:50,640 And one day you show up and you just know how to hover. We call that finding your hover button. 352 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,640 What was the feeling that that. 353 00:30:53,640 --> 00:31:03,640 Well, first of all, there was a little bit of surprise because it's days of frustration because you just can't quite get it and it's always because you're trying to over control the helicopter. 354 00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:13,640 Always. You know you don't realize, you know, the type of control touch it actually takes to fly into to hover. And so it takes a while for you to just calm all of that down. 355 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:26,640 And realize that you've got to figure out how to fly with the helicopter. And the day that you actually get it. It's, you know, surprise for about a split second, and then it's total confidence. 356 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:30,640 Oh, I got this. Look at me. 357 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:31,640 Yeah. 358 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:46,640 But once you find that hover button, it doesn't go away and I cannot tell you nobody can tell you the difference between wrestling squirrels and hovering. It just happens. It just clicks for whatever reason. Nobody can tell you why it just happened. 359 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:59,640 It does. It just happens. And we have described it as when you're watching all these other people out there trying to hover and they're spinning around and the aircraft is going way up high and it bounces off the ground and 360 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:09,640 and so forth and then suddenly it stops. And it's not a perfect cover. Now two things either happened. You found that hover button or the instructor took over. 361 00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:12,640 Usually the instructor took over. 362 00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:17,640 I have the controls. Get out. 363 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:19,640 Yeah. 364 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:36,640 And every day you were tested on something. You had to meet certain criteria. And if you didn't do that, you would get what we call a pink slip for that day. And if you've got more than one pink slip, you would get a test ride. 365 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:52,640 And that would be with a usually a senior instructor would take you out and say this is useless. Go on home to wherever you're from or okay, we're going to try it again or you are recycled, which was the kiss of death for many people because you didn't want to leave your classmates. 366 00:32:52,640 --> 00:33:07,640 And I was thinking when you were talking about that is how the people would be sitting in the latrine with two plungers and they'd have a plunger stuck to the wall behind them and they'd have one on the floor and they'd be doing people can't see me doing this but you know 367 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:09,640 practicing your practicing. 368 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:24,640 Yeah, of course you've got your two left, you know, your two left feet are out there also trying to control thing and maybe a real quick lesson to our to our audience of people that aren't familiar how a helicopter actually works is there are four main controls. 369 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:41,640 And you've got the cyclic which controls your sideward forward backward movement. And you got your collective what they call the collective which is your power, and that controls your up and down movement. And then they have two pedals that you would control because the main blade is 370 00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:58,640 going around the body of the aircraft has a tendency to want to go in the opposite direction. And so you would, you know the little tail rotor that you see on a helicopter is controlled by these two pedals and every time you made a change in any one of the controls, you had to make an adjustment for the 371 00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:12,640 tail rotor or you would spin around. And, you know, it's funny the guys who fly fixed wings, you know they they don't understand how a helicopter works and they say what do you just beat the air into submission. 372 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:29,640 Exactly. We went through a whole aerodynamics course so we we learned aerodynamically how the helicopter operates. You know it was all an important part of, you know, if you're in an emergency situation, you can more easily recover from an emergency situation if you understand the 373 00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:32,640 physics behind how your aircraft operates. 374 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:42,640 And Dale one thing looking back that I've always realized was that in flight school I learned to work the controls of a helicopter. In combat I learned to fly the aircraft. 375 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:56,640 Right. Yes, absolutely. We need to take another real quick break here. And so we're talking right now with Kate Meltzer and Phil Marshall, and we're talking about helicopters and what it was like to fly them and I think when we come back we might tell a couple of little 376 00:34:56,640 --> 00:35:08,640 stories to our audience and also we want to really want to pay tribute to our crews because without our crews we never would have gotten off the ground and stayed off the ground, which is always a good point there. 377 00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:32,640 So you're listening to Veterans Radio. We'll be right back. 378 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:48,640 If you have a VA claim denied by the Board of Veterans Appeals, contact Legal Help for Veterans at 1-800-693-4800. They're experts in handling cases before the U.S. Court of Appeals for Veterans Claims. Their number again, 1-800-693-4800. 379 00:35:48,640 --> 00:36:06,640 As a flight leader, Freeman supported a heavily engaged American infantry battalion in the Eitrang Valley in the Republic of Vietnam. The unit was almost out of ammunition after taking some of the heaviest casualties of the war, fighting off a relentless attack from a highly motivated, heavily armed enemy force. 380 00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:25,640 When the infantry commander closed the helicopter landing zone due to intense direct enemy fire, Freeman risked his own life by flying his unarmed helicopter through a gauntlet of enemy fire time after time, delivering critically needed ammunition, water, and medical supplies to the besieged battalion. 381 00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:52,640 His flights had a direct impact on the battle's outcome by providing the engaged units with timely supplies of ammunition critical to their survival. After medical evacuation helicopters refused to fly into the area due to intense enemy fire, Captain Freeman flew 14 separate rescue missions, providing life-saving evacuation of an estimated 30 seriously wounded soldiers, some of whom would not have survived had he not acted. 382 00:36:52,640 --> 00:37:03,640 All flights were made into a small emergency landing zone within 100 to 200 yards of the defensive perimeter, where heavily committed units were perilously holding off the attacking elements. 383 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:24,640 The Medal of Honor series is a production of Veterans Radio. 384 00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:45,640 8255, a message from the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs. 385 00:37:45,640 --> 00:38:05,640 We're back here on Veterans Radio and we're talking helicopters today. Our owner head radio is what we're trying to do. I guess I've included Kate Meltzer and Phil Marshall, both helicopter pilots and of course myself. 386 00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:19,640 I couldn't imagine that I would ever do anything like that. I can remember my instructor, and his name was Berger. We did our warm-ups, I guess you could say, for the day, and everything seemed to go really well. 387 00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:34,640 We went back to the stage field, he landed and he got out and I said, where are you going? He said, just take it around, take it around three times. I said, who? Oh, that's me. Okay, we can do this. 388 00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:43,640 So now you're talking to the tower and all this other stuff and off you go and you get up over a thing and you're going, holy moly, look at this. This is just awesome. 389 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:55,640 So how did you feel, Phil, about soloing? Yeah, the same thing as Kate. It was just a sense of accomplishment. And my first thought was, hey, maybe I really can do this. 390 00:38:55,640 --> 00:39:12,640 And, you know, it was testing your metal and your abilities and everything. And it was just one challenge after another. You know, you first you learn to hover and then you soloed and then you start doing cross-countries and then you're flying two students or whatever. 391 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:20,640 And it was just one challenge after another and after you passed each challenge, it's again, hey, maybe I really can do this. 392 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:35,640 And of course, everybody knew they were going to Vietnam. There was no question about that. And even though you were getting closer and closer to that fate and you knew that one out of ten pilots were probably going to be killed and two more out of ten were going to be wounded, 393 00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:45,640 you still couldn't wait to get there because you knew when you got there that you had proved that, yeah, you really were a combat helicopter pilot. 394 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:53,640 But like I say, you learn to fly the aircraft when you got in country with an experienced pilot, that's for sure. 395 00:39:53,640 --> 00:40:16,640 So our solo was a little different because at that point in time, the TH-67s were experiencing what is called a cyclic hard over, which is an uncommanded input, which means as a human, we didn't make that maneuver and the aircraft did it on its own and it would basically turn on its side in flight. 396 00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:26,640 Or on the ground. So this, it was an incredibly dangerous situation. And so we always had an instructor pilot with us. 397 00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:39,640 We actually, there was an aircrew that was lost because of this cyclic hard over phenomenon and Fort Rocker didn't want to risk any more flight crews. So there was a seasoned instructor pilot with us every single flight, no matter what. 398 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:52,640 On solo day, that instructor pilot turned off his ICS, which is the radio inside the cockpit and sat on his hands. 399 00:40:52,640 --> 00:41:04,640 So he was there in case there was an absolute emergency, but he wasn't talking to you. He wasn't talking to tower. He was just physically there in case of emergency. 400 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:16,640 But you still have that same or that similar sensation. Oh my God, I got to figure out. So I'm pretty good. I know how to fly at this point, but you want me to fly and talk on the radio and not sound like an idiot. 401 00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:19,640 I'm going to sound like an idiot. Okay. 402 00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:38,640 You know, just remembering that you, this is me and here I am. Here's where I want to go. You know, just the real basic stuff and you want to sound like John Wayne on the radio, you know, you want to sound like, yeah, you know, you just want to sound cool, and you don't. 403 00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:51,640 So, you know, trying to fumble through the radio calls takes you down a couple of pegs. But for me, my, you know, bigger than life day was the day that I finished the Apache course. 404 00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:58,640 And, you know, you may be getting to that deal but when you talked about how soloing was the best day. 405 00:41:58,640 --> 00:42:01,640 My best day came a little bit later. 406 00:42:01,640 --> 00:42:07,640 I think my best day was when I when I survived an auto rotation the first time. 407 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:10,640 You're turning off what? 408 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,640 Yeah. 409 00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:19,640 You may need to explain that to the to the non-rotor heads and to the civilians. Good. 410 00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:36,640 An auto rotation is a helicopter has some unusual aerodynamics. Let's put it that way. But when the engine stops, which is not a good thing, but when it does stop, you can land it safely. 411 00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:46,640 And so what what you do, as soon as the engine quits is that you lower the collective so you take all of the pressure off of the rotor blade so they keep spinning, sort of like a clutch on an old English bike. 412 00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:57,640 You know, you want to just keep that that rotor going. And as you fall to the earth at about 1500 feet per second, it turned the aircraft into the wind. 413 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:06,640 And as you get closer to the ground, you kind of pull back on the cyclic which raises the nose of the aircraft and you pull in the collective as fast as you can. 414 00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:16,640 We call it pop the collective. And so you pop it. The idea is that the aircraft will stop for a second and it will hopefully then lower itself onto the ground nice and smoothly. 415 00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:22,640 And so we had to practice these. I don't know how many hundreds and hundreds of these things we did. 416 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:30,640 Sometimes out of hover, sometimes during a turn, sometimes I take off all these different emergency procedures that we had to learn. 417 00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:41,640 And I just loves the ability that I finally developed after thinking I was just going to go plow right into the ground that I could do this pretty much anytime. 418 00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:51,640 There are cartoons and things up there of helicopter pilots that maybe we'll put up on the Veterans Radio website to give you an idea of some of these things of that helicopter pilot. 419 00:43:51,640 --> 00:44:05,640 Helicopter pilots seem to have two or three arms. Their head is on a swivel. It's like an owl. Their head can go all the way around because your head has to be on a swivel because you're constantly looking for places to land if something happens. 420 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:14,640 And even on a combat assault, when you're going into the LZ, you're looking off to the right or to the left to see if there's another open field somewhere if this thing quits on us. 421 00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:32,640 So actually my instructor pilot at Fort Walters when I soloed first in the 23, gave me a little card that says I was an official Army hover bug because I'd been able to stand motionless in flights somehow. 422 00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:35,640 I have to get that out for you. 423 00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:46,640 Yeah, so once we did all of us did this training, we were able to then go off and do whatever our missions were around the world. 424 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:55,640 And I think as Phil pointed out, I was ready to go. I felt confident. Of course, also I'm in my, you know, I'm 21, 22 years old. 425 00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:59,640 So, you know, my frontal lobe hasn't fully developed yet anyway. 426 00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:01,640 Mine still hasn't. 427 00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:07,640 Yeah, I know that's a problem with a lot of us. Yeah, is that I, you know, I thought that I could do this. 428 00:45:07,640 --> 00:45:15,640 So, I know, I know Kate that you never got to go down range, which was really frustrating to you. But where did you go after flight school? 429 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:24,640 I ended up going to the 185 tab, which the, which is the theater aviation brigade based in the Mississippi National Guard. 430 00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:38,640 And I ended up as a staff officer there. So I learned a tremendous amount about flight planning operations planning all those sorts of things. And it was a frustrating place for me to be because I was planning missions for other guys to fly. 431 00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:51,640 But one of the things that I learned throughout all of flight training and as a staff officer is that this is one of those missions, one of those jobs in the military that is high risk, regardless of environment. 432 00:45:51,640 --> 00:46:00,640 And the reason why I'm really flying combat flight is the highest risk, but every single time you pull pitch, even in a training environment, flying helicopters is risky business. 433 00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:12,640 And the guys who do it, you know, Dale was talking about having your head on a swivel and using all of your appendages to fly. You are truly task saturated every moment that you're in the helicopter, especially when you're flying gunships. 434 00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:20,640 If you're distracted in flight, that's a problem. If you've got stuff going on at home with your wife or with your kids, that's a problem. 435 00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:31,640 It's a dangerous mission that requires focus. And I just remind everybody about this because when I think about my instructor pilot, two of my four instructor pilots are no longer with because of a aviation accident. 436 00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:45,640 The month of April is a tough month for me because this is a month where we memorialize the anniversaries of two different air crews, one from one of my units and one was my instructor pilot and his student. 437 00:46:45,640 --> 00:47:01,640 And so in the middle month, there are anniversaries like that, some are from combat, some are from training, but what we do is serious business and we like to joke and give each other a hard time about my aircraft is better than yours, but it's a brotherhood like no other. 438 00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:04,640 And I think you hear that just the three of us talking today. 439 00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:07,640 Absolutely couldn't agree more. 440 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:23,640 That's true. And when I came back, I was an instructor pilot, which was a lot more heavier responsibility than I had anticipated being. But then of course, you know, you remember back instrument training when we were flying in those the trainer the link trainer and inside the link 441 00:47:23,640 --> 00:47:40,640 training, which is like a like a coffin almost near supposed to fly these timed routes and everything like that. And I got done with my mission that particular day got out and guy was in there. They traced your route on a piece of paper big giant like Joe these hopefully perfectly oblong circles that you're flying. 442 00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:45,640 And mine went right off the edge of the paper. 443 00:47:45,640 --> 00:48:01,640 You blew you blew off the edge of the earth. I did. I did. Wow. What was it like. Oh my gosh. Pretty awesome because I am there are many more stories that that were where we want to share with our audiences about helicopters and so forth. 444 00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:11,640 Many more missions. Let me have our guests tell you about what they're doing today. Let's do it that way. So Phil, what are you up to today. This is 50 years later for you. 445 00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:28,640 Yeah, lucked into. I wanted to honor the 15 men in my unit in Vietnam that didn't make a home to their families and I knew that we had some incredible rescue missions so in 2012 I put together a book describing 20 of those missions and honoring the men who didn't 446 00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:50,640 get back and it was so well received I did a second book and that was well received and just last week I finished my 16th book documenting the helicopter rescue missions that we flew in Vietnam it's called helicopter rescues Vietnam and it's available on Amazon and then even before that about 15 years ago I got involved with 447 00:48:50,640 --> 00:49:06,640 the American Huey 369 we're out of Peru, Indiana. We are doing the annual inspections we have three Vietnam Hueys that we have restored back to flight. Kate has had the pleasure of flying one of those, and proud to have been able to be part of that, but 448 00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:22,640 and then also we are building the only Huey Museum in the world here across the road from Grissom. We're a 501 C3 charitable organization. We're still soliciting funds to build the Huey Museum like I say we are starting on it. 449 00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:40,640 But we need help from veterans, civilians who want to honor veterans with a donation you get your name on a plaque and we have a brick walkway with with the names of the 58,000 men and women who died in Vietnam. 450 00:49:40,640 --> 00:50:02,640 And but it's just been an incredible experience for me to not only have been Huey pilot a helicopter pilot but here I am in my early 70s and I'm still flying Vietnam Huey helicopters and I'm getting to share that with people like Kate I'm getting to share it with people that go for a flight in the aircraft and 451 00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:22,640 become members of the organization and and I'm helping build this only Huey Museum in the world. So, in a nutshell that's that's what I've done since Vietnam other than having my own business the Army gave me the confidence to start my own business it was successful and sold it retired and here I am today. 452 00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:35,640 Good. Thanks so Kate I know tell us about Fisher House. So Fisher House I think for those of you that aren't familiar. The easiest analogy is people compare us to Ronald McDonald House. 453 00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:47,640 So while we're not affiliated with Ronald McDonald House our mission is really similar but instead of building houses near children's hospitals, Fisher houses are built near VA and military hospitals. 454 00:50:47,640 --> 00:50:53,640 So if you have a military or veteran loved one who needs to be hospitalized. 455 00:50:53,640 --> 00:50:56,640 You can go and stay next door. 456 00:50:56,640 --> 00:51:06,640 It's a Fisher houses have been built all over the world since 1990 and Michigan opened its very first Fisher House during the pandemic of all things. 457 00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:19,640 June 1, 2020 was the first night that we hosted a family and since then the house which has 16 private family suites has been as full as public health laws would will allow us. 458 00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:33,640 So we've served over 1000 families in Ann Arbor since June of 2020 and Fisher House Michigan, our 501 C3, we are raising funds to support that house, and we are raising capital funds to build a second Michigan House. 459 00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:36,640 This time to support the Detroit VA. 460 00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:46,640 To date, we've raised about 9 million of our $20 million goal, and we have match periods throughout the year where generous corporate donors will will double your donation. 461 00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:52,640 So stay tuned for the Memorial Day match at Fisher House Michigan.org where you can double your money. 462 00:51:52,640 --> 00:51:56,640 And it goes for a great cause supporting our military and veteran families. 463 00:51:56,640 --> 00:52:05,640 I hope you enjoy today's best of veterans radio program from April 2021. You can listen to the most of our programs from the last 20 years at veterans radio.org. 464 00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:16,640 All you got to go is go to the website, click on the archives are up a little search button at the top, you can just type in the topic of the subject, the person and they'll come up. 465 00:52:16,640 --> 00:52:18,640 So this is what we do. 466 00:52:18,640 --> 00:52:26,640 And we need your support. So please go to veterans radio.org click on the radio on the river picture. 467 00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:42,640 And we hope to see you there was on Sunday, the 22nd. If you're not in the local area and you can't make it out, please, you know, take that time, make a small donation, large donation, whatever you can spare to help keep us keep veterans radio on the on the air. 468 00:52:42,640 --> 00:52:52,640 I think it'd be great. So this week, we're going to be going out on David Bray's version of God bless America. As I mentioned before, I like playing God bless America. 469 00:52:52,640 --> 00:53:02,640 I think it's a very, not only a patriotic song, but it's very important for all of us to realize what a great, great place we are fortunate enough to live in. 470 00:53:02,640 --> 00:53:12,640 And even, you know, even including all of the hoopla and everything else that's going on out there, you know, everybody still wants to come here. 471 00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:21,640 And so I sometimes I play these songs to remind us what a great place that we live and the opportunities that we have and the freedoms that we have. 472 00:53:21,640 --> 00:53:31,640 So this is David Bray. I hope you enjoy it. So until next week, this is Dale Throneberry for all of us here at Veterans Radio. You are dismissed. 473 00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:59,640 Through the night with your life from above 474 00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:09,640 From the mountains to the prairies 475 00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:17,640 To the oceans, white and full 476 00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:24,640 God bless America 477 00:54:25,640 --> 00:54:30,640 My home, sweet home 478 00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:38,640 My home, sweet home 479 00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:44,640 Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh 480 00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:51,640 God bless America 481 00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:57,640 It's love that I love 482 00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:02,640 It's the messiah 483 00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:12,640 Please guide her through the night with your life from above 484 00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:23,640 From the mountains to the prairies 485 00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:30,640 To the oceans, white and full 486 00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:38,640 God bless America 487 00:55:39,640 --> 00:55:44,640 My home, sweet home 488 00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:51,640 My home, sweet home 489 00:55:54,640 --> 00:55:59,640 My home, sweet home 490 00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:07,640 My home, sweet home 491 00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:14,640 My home, sweet home 492 00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:29,640 My home, sweet home 493 00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:36,640 Sweet home. 494 00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:39,640 Sweet home. 495 00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:43,640 Sweet home. 496 00:56:43,640 --> 00:56:59,640 Sweet home.