1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,480 All across America and around the world. 2 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:13,120 This is veterans radio. 3 00:00:13,120 --> 00:00:15,680 This is veterans radio. 4 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:20,920 And now your host for today's program, Dale Throneberry. 5 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:24,200 And welcome to veterans radio. 6 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:30,640 My name is Dale Throneberry, a CW2 helicopter pilot in Vietnam 1969. 7 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:31,640 Welcome to veterans radio. 8 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,960 I think we've got a just a great program going today. 9 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:37,360 We've got a we've got authors. 10 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:42,160 We've got the the the subject of the book with us joining us. 11 00:00:42,160 --> 00:00:43,680 So I'm really excited. 12 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:50,360 The book is titled in the shadows of Vietnam, the Gallant Life of Father Philip Salwa. 13 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:56,960 And we've got their authors, Julian and a yacht and Paul currency with us. 14 00:00:56,960 --> 00:00:58,320 So stick around. 15 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,200 This story is amazing. 16 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:06,160 It's one of those stories where for those of you that were in in the service anywhere, 17 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:10,240 you know, where you get in rocketed and all this other stuff and you say, you know, God, 18 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:13,680 if you get me out of this, I'll do whatever you want. 19 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:15,560 This is a story about that. 20 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,800 So I want you to make sure you stick around for that. 21 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:22,240 We are going to be, as I say, talking with them. 22 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:26,280 If you have a question or maybe you know, you want to, you know, that you want to ask 23 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:27,840 our guests, you can do that. 24 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:28,840 Just give us a call. 25 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,840 The number is 734-822-1600. 26 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:36,400 That's 734-822-1600. 27 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:39,280 I've got two events that I need to promote a little bit here. 28 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:44,560 Number one coming up next week for those of you in southeastern Michigan. 29 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:46,400 And that's our vet fest. 30 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:49,600 And the vet fest is on Saturday, August 3rd. 31 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:53,480 And it's running, it's going to be at Washtenaw Community College. 32 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:55,920 And it runs from 10 until 3. 33 00:01:55,920 --> 00:02:01,800 And that's the Washtenaw County Vet Fest Saturday, August 3rd, 10 a.m. to 3 p.m. at Washtenaw 34 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:03,840 Community College. 35 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:06,520 All kinds of service organizations are going to be there. 36 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:07,520 The VA will be there. 37 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:13,400 There will be veteran service officers there to answer your questions about benefits, anything 38 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:17,600 that you want to know, and all kinds of activities for the family. 39 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,000 So come on out, live music, everything else. 40 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:22,080 And Veterans Radio will be there. 41 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:24,120 So hopefully you'll come out and join us. 42 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:27,920 Again, that's vet fest Saturday, August 3rd, 10 to 3. 43 00:02:27,920 --> 00:02:32,080 The other thing is that our annual fundraiser for Veterans Radio is coming up. 44 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:33,760 And that is Radio on the River. 45 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:41,480 And Radio on the River for the third time is going to be on Sunday, September 22nd. 46 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:43,880 And that's going to run from 2 until 5 p.m. 47 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:49,560 And then we're going to do a live program at 5 p.m. from our location, which is right 48 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:50,760 on the here on River. 49 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:51,960 So mark your calendar. 50 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:54,240 This is our annual fundraiser. 51 00:02:54,240 --> 00:03:01,400 Our annual fundraiser Sunday, September 22nd, from 2 until 5. 52 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:03,000 I believe in what the hours are going to be. 53 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:10,120 You can find out more information if you get our flyer or if it's on our website, VeteransRadio.org. 54 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:11,880 So check it out. 55 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:15,400 Before we get into the interview, I need to thank our sponsors because we cannot ever 56 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:18,640 do this program without their support. 57 00:03:18,640 --> 00:03:23,440 And so starting off with is Legal Help for Veterans and Legal Help for Veterans specializes 58 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:25,160 in Veterans Disability Claims. 59 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:35,000 You can give Legal Help for Veterans a call at 800-693-4800 or go to their website, LegalHelpforVeterns.com. 60 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:40,360 The National Veterans Business Development Council, better known as NVBDC, is the nation's 61 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:44,400 leading third party authority for certification of veteran-owned businesses. 62 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:48,840 If you want to do business with the federal government and you are a veteran-owned business, 63 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:53,320 you got to be certified so they can prove that you're actually a veteran-owned business. 64 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:55,520 These are the guys that can help you out with that. 65 00:03:55,520 --> 00:04:04,720 For more information, go to their website that's NVBDC.org or give them a call at 888-237-8433. 66 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:09,080 The Charles S. Kettles VA Medical Center here in Ann Arbor, Michigan. 67 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:14,120 For more information with them, go to va.gov.narborhealthcare. 68 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:19,920 The Vietnam Veterans of America never again will one generation of veterans abandon another. 69 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,840 For more information, go to their website, vva.org. 70 00:04:23,840 --> 00:04:28,640 The Irwin Prescor and American Post 46 and the Charles S. Kettles Vietnam Veterans of 71 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:33,200 America Chapter 310, both of Ann Arbor, Michigan. 72 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:37,760 We really do appreciate the support that they've given us over the last 20 years. 73 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:43,120 If you'd like to support Veterans Radio, please go to our website, veteransradio.org. 74 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:47,040 Click on the donate button and I'll thank you in advance for your support. 75 00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:49,960 Now, today's program, here we go. 76 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:51,800 All right. 77 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:56,040 As I mentioned, the book is titled In the Shadows of Vietnam and it's a story of Father 78 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:57,880 Philip Tsila. 79 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,480 And obviously I'm going to bring them all on here. 80 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,160 So we've got a Father Tsila. 81 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,000 Can I call you Father Phil? 82 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:07,000 Yes. 83 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:08,360 Okay, that will work. 84 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:13,720 So first of all, I want to introduce the hero of our story. 85 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:15,760 Here is a Father Philip Tsila. 86 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:18,960 So Father Phil, welcome to Veterans Radio. 87 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:20,200 Thank you. 88 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:26,240 And I've also got the other two authors of the book and that is Julian Alliat and Paul 89 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:31,760 Karansi, I'm getting these names correct as we go along here. 90 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:34,760 So Julian and Paul, welcome to the program. 91 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:35,760 Thank you. 92 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:36,760 All right. 93 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:40,600 So let's go back in time a little bit. 94 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:45,720 And Father Phil, I'm going to ask you this. 95 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:51,960 What happened on that day in 1970 where you had to answer to God? 96 00:05:51,960 --> 00:06:02,080 Well, we were on a mission to search out an NVA bunker complex and we were two platoons 97 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,600 and the command control with us. 98 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:18,800 And on February 28th of 1970, the day before that happened, we were the second platoon 99 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:20,280 was my platoon. 100 00:06:20,280 --> 00:06:25,240 We were in the rear and the first platoon was in the front. 101 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:32,680 So we found it was kind of late in the afternoon to lay a siege and it was triple canopy jungle. 102 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:38,600 And if anybody is familiar with that, it gets very dark early in triple canopy jungle. 103 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:42,160 It was maybe like 435, I was already getting dark. 104 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:47,640 So we decided we had to go about a click, a thousand meters in the opposite direction 105 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:54,240 to find a resting area for us to camp out for the night. 106 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:58,800 So we did it and the next morning, opportune was the one designated to go out. 107 00:06:58,800 --> 00:07:04,600 And meanwhile, no one slept that night because it was, you know, everybody was on edge because 108 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,480 we knew that the Vietnamese could smell us. 109 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:10,040 They knew that we were there. 110 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:12,400 But unfortunately, nothing happened that night. 111 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:17,280 The next morning we went up, got up and we were the ones leading out. 112 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:22,440 It was our turn to lead out the company, the two platoons. 113 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:28,240 So we went out there and in single file and make big mistake that the company commander 114 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:33,880 made was telling us to go back down the same trail so that we wouldn't waste any time blazing 115 00:07:33,880 --> 00:07:36,520 a new trail. 116 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:40,160 And going down the same trail is a death march. 117 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:46,040 So we went down and we obeyed and we went down the same trail and I was in the fourth 118 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:53,880 squad so I was in the rear of the platoon and we got maybe about 15 minutes in. 119 00:07:53,880 --> 00:08:00,680 We're getting close and all of a sudden I hear all hell breakers and we're receiving 120 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,080 fire from all sides. 121 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:04,400 And so we're looking for cover. 122 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:05,800 We're trying to get behind trees. 123 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:10,960 We're trying to get behind rocks or whatever we can hide behind until we can form a defensive 124 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:12,640 perimeter. 125 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:20,760 Then we were successful in performing that task and no one was injured at that. 126 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:27,640 Well we had injuries but we no one was, there were no KIA casualties at that point. 127 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:33,720 We also discovered that the first six people of our platoon were alienated. 128 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:41,840 They were separated from the rest of our platoon by a 40-year, 20-year yard clearance. 129 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:46,640 And they were the ones carrying the platoon radio. 130 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:52,520 So we had to bring the radio up for command or the first platoon to try to get a hold 131 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:53,520 of them. 132 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:56,820 But every time we tried to reach them they weren't responding. 133 00:08:56,820 --> 00:09:03,480 So we figured they were either all dead or they had killed the radio. 134 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:08,040 And we had formed a defensive perimeter at that point. 135 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:10,200 We were returning fire. 136 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:15,680 And it was about a half an hour it seems, maybe less, maybe more. 137 00:09:15,680 --> 00:09:18,840 Never know what time it is over there. 138 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:24,100 That nothing was being done to try to rescue our guys. 139 00:09:24,100 --> 00:09:29,880 So I got very angry about this whole thing and I said to God, I said, Lord I'm going 140 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:32,600 out there to rescue those guys. 141 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,680 I don't care, nobody else seems to be going, I'm going out there. 142 00:09:36,680 --> 00:09:40,200 If you get me back out safe and sound and when I was scratched I'll do anything you 143 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:41,200 want. 144 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,680 It was a crazy thing to do because I wasn't carrying an M16. 145 00:09:44,680 --> 00:09:47,720 I was carrying an M79 grenade launcher. 146 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:54,520 And grenade launchers in the jungles of Vietnam are almost totally useless in battle. 147 00:09:54,520 --> 00:10:00,400 You have to shoot them almost at a 45 degree angle up so they don't hit a tree in front 148 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:04,040 of you to come back and ricochet on you. 149 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:09,120 So one guy came up and said to me, well if you're going to do this crazy thing I'll go 150 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:10,120 with you. 151 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:13,640 And his name was Herbert Klug from Dayton, Ohio. 152 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:17,680 He was a sergeant and a spec 4 like me. 153 00:10:17,680 --> 00:10:18,760 And he carried an M16. 154 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,000 So I said, okay, we'll go out there. 155 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:27,120 We low crawled, we found this big boulder that we could hide behind to give us cover. 156 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:31,680 And we just blasted the whole right flank with all the firepower we had. 157 00:10:31,680 --> 00:10:35,040 I was lobbing those grenades as fast as I could. 158 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:40,080 And one by one, one guy came back. 159 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:41,080 Another guy came back. 160 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:44,280 I could see them running back to safety. 161 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:47,480 And so four of them run back. 162 00:10:47,480 --> 00:10:51,380 And we knew that there were six guys out there. 163 00:10:51,380 --> 00:10:54,440 So Herb said, well it doesn't look like the other two are moving. 164 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:57,440 We better make a move for ourselves to go back. 165 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:00,240 We'll go out and get them later. 166 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:06,640 So we low crawled back and I got back over to my line and I looked over my shoulder and 167 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:08,480 Herb wasn't there. 168 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:09,680 So I said, what's going on? 169 00:11:09,680 --> 00:11:11,560 I said, he's in come back. 170 00:11:11,560 --> 00:11:16,160 I looked over the berm and he was halfway out there on this stomach. 171 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:21,640 So without even thinking, I went back out there still receiving fire, tried to drag 172 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:24,960 him in but I couldn't even move him an inch. 173 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:31,800 And that was my first experience of what dead man, dead alive or whatever. 174 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:32,800 Dead weight. 175 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:33,800 Dead weight. 176 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:34,800 Yeah, dead weight. 177 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:35,800 I'm getting old. 178 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:36,800 I'm going to forget it. 179 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:40,600 Dead weight was all about. 180 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,840 And so a couple of guys went out there. 181 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:45,040 We helped drag him in. 182 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:49,880 We turned him over after we brought him in and he had received him around the chin and 183 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,360 went out the top of his head. 184 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:55,400 He was dead immediately and never knew who had hit him. 185 00:11:55,400 --> 00:12:01,320 So there was darting a dust off people and they asked me, the red merman, asked me to 186 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:04,000 go out there to try to locate the other two. 187 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,600 I said, I'll go but I can't go by myself. 188 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:09,920 I can't carry those guys by myself. 189 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:13,760 So a couple of guys came with me, three, four guys. 190 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:20,320 We went out there and found the one guy was very injured and found out later he had an 191 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:21,760 eye blown out. 192 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:25,440 So he was the point man. 193 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:29,400 So they brought him back and the other man was our lieutenant and he was killed. 194 00:12:29,400 --> 00:12:33,720 We carried his body back and they all dusted off. 195 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:42,560 At the beginning of that endeavor, we had 27 of platoon, 20 people were killed and the 196 00:12:42,560 --> 00:12:50,360 rest wounded in actual action and seven of us never received a scratch. 197 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:58,920 So I was one of seven people left in our second platoon and that's about the story. 198 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:04,760 And we went, it was pretty much all day we were there and by the time we were finished, 199 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:08,040 it was getting close to almost dark again. 200 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:12,000 So we had to go and find another place to camp out for the night. 201 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,560 And that was the night that was more frightful than the other night because I figured they 202 00:13:15,560 --> 00:13:18,520 were going to come back and finish us off. 203 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:25,680 And we were all, all of us were on guard all night and fortunately none of us, they didn't 204 00:13:25,680 --> 00:13:26,680 come back. 205 00:13:26,680 --> 00:13:32,640 Apparently we got them all and they, they, they chased, we chased them away. 206 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:38,800 And the next day we broke camp and we went out finding another LZ and they dropped off 207 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,320 12 new guys for us with a new lieutenant. 208 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:44,600 And we weren't finished our mission. 209 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:47,400 We had seven more days to go. 210 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:53,920 So I immediately became a squad leader at a private first class. 211 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:58,000 I was a squad leader because I was six months in. 212 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:03,000 I was the expert at war, at jungle warfare. 213 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:04,000 Talk about a joke. 214 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:08,000 Yeah, yeah, we, we, we were all talked about, we talked about that a little bit before we 215 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:09,000 went on the air. 216 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:13,760 And you know, it's that we, you know, we all went in early, you know, by ourselves. 217 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:18,080 And then, you know, you're, you're flying along, in my case, I'm flying along with these 218 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:21,560 guys who had been there for a whole three months. 219 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,880 And you know, they're the experts and you know, something happens to them. 220 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:31,640 And then you become, you know, the head of the platoon or squad or whatever it is. 221 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,160 And you just have to, you know, have to do what you can do. 222 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:35,680 And I, and I appreciate it. 223 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:40,480 You know, the thing for my audience to know is that you received a silver star for this 224 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:45,280 little action that you went into and carried the, 225 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:47,960 Herb Kled got this, this thing was service cross. 226 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:48,960 Right. 227 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:51,600 Which is number two on the list of awards. 228 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:56,960 And I think that the, I was going to read the award, but you've already told us what 229 00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:57,960 happened there. 230 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:07,920 And I think that, you know, I, I, my audience knows, you know, that, you know, I was a helicopter 231 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:08,920 pilot. 232 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,200 I was on his flu, you guys in and brought you back out. 233 00:15:12,200 --> 00:15:16,320 Never really appreciating what you all had to go through. 234 00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:25,400 And this mutual admiration society that has come about after the war has been very helpful. 235 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:30,320 And I'm going to go into what you did after the war in just a second. 236 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:37,000 But I want to bring on, I want to bring on Julian and Paul to find out how did you guys 237 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:38,480 get involved with this story? 238 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,480 And Julian, we talked about this earlier on. 239 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:47,160 This is a Julian, last name is pronounced a yacht and he is a writer as well. 240 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,680 He writes murder mysteries, historical novels. 241 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,200 I'm going to give you guys a little credit here. 242 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:58,520 So there's a couple of books that were titled one is the flowers of heaven, dangerous blood 243 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:03,080 lines a life before disappearance, code named Lily. 244 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,040 That's the historical novel about a woman in Belgium. 245 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:07,040 Wasn't it? 246 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:08,040 Yes, correct. 247 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:09,040 I see. 248 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:14,280 And then a couple of books by Paul is scoundrels, the hanging in redemption of John Gordon, 249 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:15,480 the promise of Fatima. 250 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:20,880 I am the immaculate conception and darkness at Dachau. 251 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:24,520 You guys are very prolific in what you've been writing about. 252 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:31,040 So let's now let's go in there and say, okay, how did you find out about Father Phil? 253 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:36,880 Well, I guess I'm the guy who's responsible for that. 254 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:45,840 I saw an article in the Providence Journal in April of last year, not this past year, 255 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,200 but in 2023. 256 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:55,080 And it was written by a guy named Frank Lennon who writes a column on veterans for the Providence 257 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:57,320 Journal once a week. 258 00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:02,960 And this particular column was about Father Phil and his exploits. 259 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:11,320 Now what is ironic about it is that Father Phil was born in Winsocket, Rhode Island. 260 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:16,320 My brother was the former mayor of Winsocket, Rhode Island. 261 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:18,200 I now live in Lincoln. 262 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:22,400 He lives in North Smithfield about 15 minutes away. 263 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,240 I never heard of him. 264 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:26,920 I said, who is this guy? 265 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:28,920 How come I never heard of him? 266 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:32,440 Which is typical of Father Phil. 267 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:38,600 He doesn't need for you to know who he is to do the work that he does. 268 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:45,880 But it was a story, as he mentioned, about his heroism in the jungles of Vietnam and 269 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:55,120 then how he later accepted the call that a lot of people make a promise about in combat, 270 00:17:55,120 --> 00:17:57,000 but they never follow it. 271 00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:59,000 And he did. 272 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:00,000 This touched me. 273 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:05,960 And I said, I'm going to try to find his email address, which took me about six hours. 274 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:09,800 And then I find this email address that's got one lock in it. 275 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:14,040 And I'm saying, what the heck is this guy talking about? 276 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:20,120 So I said, this is for real because that sounds like a Vietnam name to me. 277 00:18:20,120 --> 00:18:22,200 And so I sent him an email and address. 278 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:27,640 I introduced myself and said, I just read the article in the journal about you. 279 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:37,520 And I was wondering if you'd be interested in my writing your story in the book. 280 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:43,400 And I might get an historian to help me out in the form of Paul Carrancy, who has written 281 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:47,320 many historical books along the way. 282 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:55,600 So he answered that he had often thought about writing his autobiography, but he didn't 283 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:58,160 have the patience, is what he said. 284 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:04,520 I don't have the patience to spend that much time sitting there writing and proofreading. 285 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:08,280 And I said, well, that's what we do in our retirement years. 286 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:09,280 That's what we do. 287 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:10,280 We do. 288 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:12,480 We write and we rewrite and we do things like that. 289 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,600 So the long story short is he agreed. 290 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:22,080 And then we decided to meet to see how we were going to do this. 291 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:24,800 And that's where I got Paul involved. 292 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:26,640 So we can pick it up from here. 293 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,520 Paul, tell me about how you got involved in this project. 294 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:37,680 Well, I was just sitting at home, minding my own business, working on a different book 295 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,120 that I was writing at the time. 296 00:19:41,120 --> 00:19:47,280 And Julian called and asked me if I had ever heard about Father Phil. 297 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:51,960 And I said, no, when he said there's a story in the Providence Journal today, take a look 298 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:54,200 at it and give me a call back. 299 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:56,800 So I did that. 300 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,880 Incredibly impressed with the story. 301 00:19:59,880 --> 00:20:04,880 Paul, Julian back and he said, I want to write his biography. 302 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:06,560 I was in contact with him. 303 00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:09,240 He agreed that I could do that. 304 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:10,920 Would you work with me on it? 305 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:17,120 Because you write biographies and history and Julian is primarily a novelist. 306 00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:23,160 So there was an invitation and a story I just could not pass up. 307 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:30,800 So I put the book I was working on aside and I worked with Julian on this. 308 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:37,360 The interesting thing about it was I had just finished working on a biography of a cover 309 00:20:37,360 --> 00:20:43,800 band out of Georgia where there are eight band members all alive and well. 310 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:50,280 And usually I write history and the subjects that I write about have been dead for hundreds 311 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:52,280 of years. 312 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:57,120 That was my first experience writing a biography about living people. 313 00:20:57,120 --> 00:21:01,520 And it was the most difficult thing I've ever done because the story is conflicted and everybody 314 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:05,000 has a different understanding of the events. 315 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:08,560 So I swore when I finished it, it took over 18 months. 316 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:12,720 And I said, I'll never write about another living person again. 317 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:17,120 And it wasn't more than a month later that Julian called with this offer. 318 00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:21,520 But the story was just so good that even though Father Phil is alive and well, I couldn't 319 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:22,800 pass it up. 320 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,400 So I agreed and we went to work on it. 321 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:29,440 Can you tell me about the first time that you met Father Phil? 322 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,320 What was your impression? 323 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:32,320 Which one of us? 324 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:34,200 Paul, you'll go first. 325 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:35,200 Yeah. 326 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:39,880 Actually, it was quite interesting because Father Phil was a priest like none other than 327 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,520 I had met in the past. 328 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:46,720 And his language was a bit rough. 329 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:56,160 And he tells the story, he was very animated and fascinating at the same time. 330 00:21:56,160 --> 00:22:04,520 But I said to him at some point along the way, you don't speak like priests that I know. 331 00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:08,240 You swear occasionally and you throw in a rough word. 332 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:13,320 And he said, well, that's because to relate to the people that he was relating to, the 333 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:14,320 veterans. 334 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:18,360 He needed to be one of them and he needed to speak like one of them so they would trust 335 00:22:18,360 --> 00:22:19,920 him. 336 00:22:19,920 --> 00:22:25,720 And he apparently, he'll tell you the story about that in a little bit, but apparently 337 00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:33,000 was able to do that to perfection and had gained a trust of all of these veterans to 338 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:38,720 the point where they would open up to him and he was able to work on their problems with 339 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:40,840 them because of that. 340 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:47,320 I found Father Phil to be an absolutely fascinating person, an extraordinary priest. 341 00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:55,080 And just every story that he told us, every aspect of his life was absolutely astounding 342 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:57,080 and extraordinary. 343 00:22:57,080 --> 00:22:58,080 Yeah. 344 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:02,720 Julian, tell me how you finally hooked up with him. 345 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:10,840 Well, I actually contacted Father Phil by email and said that I think that we should 346 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:13,520 meet for breakfast. 347 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:20,160 That's always an icebreaker and we'll decide at breakfast exactly how we're going to proceed. 348 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:27,440 And when we did meet at an IHOP for breakfast, we found out that he has quite an appetite 349 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:34,520 and he enjoyed the breakfast meetings more than anything. 350 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:43,360 So we decided that because there were going to be so many events to discuss and the chronological 351 00:23:43,360 --> 00:23:48,720 order of these events was going to be complicated and we would have to go back and look at them 352 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:50,280 several times. 353 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:57,400 As Father Phil has indicated at 75 years old, sometimes the dates get a little confused 354 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:02,040 or mixed up and so we had to go back and make sure and verify all the dates. 355 00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:10,200 So what we did is we taped every single meeting for about an hour and a half and the extent 356 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:15,560 of the meetings was limited to about an hour and a half because that's a lot of relating 357 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:19,000 of skills and history and stuff like that. 358 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:25,320 And we did this, Paul, I think for about five or six times at least. 359 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:32,160 And then we had all the information we needed and we started drafting one chapter at a time. 360 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:39,080 I would do the initial draft and Paul would come in and he would edit it and then we'd 361 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:48,480 send it to Father Phil to look at and inevitably he'd have changes because it's his story. 362 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:55,280 So we had the prerogative of having changes and so we made the corrections and then moved 363 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,080 on. 364 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:04,240 And in the process we started to realize that he knew so many people out there, so many important 365 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,520 people, you know, congressmen. 366 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:14,880 I mean, he gave the opening prayer of the U.S. Congress one year at the invitation of 367 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:21,600 Representative David Cicillini here from Rhode Island and he did this in Washington, D.C. 368 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:30,960 And he spoke at the Vietnam Veterans Wall one year to promote his minister's organization. 369 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:37,600 He said to us very clearly, he says, you know, I'm entrusted with counseling people with 370 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:42,080 post-traumatic stress disorder, but who counsels the counselor? 371 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:46,400 Who do we pour our souls out to? 372 00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:53,480 And so it was very important for him to establish a group of people like him, counselors, you 373 00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:59,200 know, in the ministry who do the same kind of work he does with post-traumatic stress 374 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:00,360 disorder. 375 00:26:00,360 --> 00:26:08,800 And so he was invited, you know, by the founder of the Vietnam Wall to speak at their November 376 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:15,280 11th Veterans Day presentation, and boy, did he jump on that opportunity and I don't blame 377 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:16,280 him. 378 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:18,400 It was a captive audience. 379 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:25,480 And that really was the beginning of his mission for the next 30 or 40 years. 380 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:31,800 So it's an amazing story and there's so many stories that I wouldn't know where to begin. 381 00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:33,920 I know, it's very difficult. 382 00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:39,480 For our audience, we are talking with the authors and the subject of the book titled 383 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:46,920 In the Shadows of Vietnam, the Gallant Life of Father Philip So-Wa, and Father Phil, and 384 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:52,960 I, of course, I found this story just resonated with me and it's not that I'm religious or 385 00:26:52,960 --> 00:27:00,080 anything like that, but just the explanation of post-traumatic stress and the way that 386 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:05,760 you went through your own journey, you know, to come out the other side. 387 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:09,440 Could you tell us a little bit about that because I know that when you got back, you 388 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,280 were kind of lost like many of us were. 389 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:18,560 When I came back, actually, I got my job back from an insurance company I worked for before 390 00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:20,160 I got drafted. 391 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:21,160 So they were very good. 392 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:25,760 They had to take me back because it was the law, you know, which got drafted out of an 393 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,960 employment, you know, they had to take you back when you got out. 394 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:37,680 And it was the employers insurance of Warsaw had just opened up a branch in Los Angeles, 395 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:44,080 which they only were there about four years, and I was working for them and they were very 396 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:52,000 patriotic people and they were lovely, lovely, a lot of Polish background, a lot of Eastern 397 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,320 European background. 398 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:57,600 And so when I came back, they welcomed me with open arms. 399 00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:03,600 But when I started talking a little bit about Vietnam, they kept saying, oh, don't talk 400 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:04,600 about that. 401 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:05,600 That's painful. 402 00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:07,800 We don't need to hear that. 403 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:10,800 We just wish just glad that you're here. 404 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,720 So okay, so I swallowed it and I said, okay, I won't talk about it. 405 00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:23,240 And that was the beginning of going into my Vietnam closet because after that, nobody, 406 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:28,280 none of my friends in classmates wanted to hear about it. 407 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,360 Nobody, nobody wanted to talk about it. 408 00:28:30,360 --> 00:28:37,440 And we were in a generation where we were not very welcome back. 409 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:43,400 And it was not a good topic to talk about anyway, to get any respect. 410 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:45,880 So I just swallowed it up. 411 00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:52,080 And I stayed in my Vietnam closet for 13 years until it finally came out. 412 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,160 I was in the religious order. 413 00:28:55,160 --> 00:29:01,320 And how did you decide to go into the priesthood? 414 00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:03,240 Well it was not my choice. 415 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,840 God forbid. 416 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:09,360 It was about four years after I got back from Vietnam. 417 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:10,520 I was back at work. 418 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:15,280 I was very happy and I had my own apartment. 419 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:20,640 And all of a sudden an article in the newspaper was talking about the great shortage of priests 420 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:24,800 that were happening and the churches were being in big trouble and all that. 421 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:26,920 And I was raised a Roman Catholic. 422 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:28,680 I've always been very religious. 423 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,520 A Sunday, Sunday alone Catholic. 424 00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:36,480 So I said, Jesus, I kept going back to that article. 425 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:37,680 I kept going back to that article. 426 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:42,240 It was almost like saying God was trying to tell me something. 427 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:45,360 So one day I called the Archdiocese of Los Angeles. 428 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:47,840 I was living in LA at the time. 429 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:49,320 I grew up in Los Angeles. 430 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:52,880 So all that stuff happens out in the West Coast. 431 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:58,400 I called up the Archdiocese of Los Angeles and said, I think I may have a vocation. 432 00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:00,400 So they had me connected with the vocation director. 433 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:01,560 He said, this is his number. 434 00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:02,560 Give him a call. 435 00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:03,560 I called him. 436 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:06,080 He said, okay, come on down. 437 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:07,080 Such and such a date. 438 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:09,120 So I went down. 439 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,080 And I said, I think I have a vocation to the priesthood. 440 00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,440 He said, why? 441 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:17,840 He said, because I told him about the Vietnam story and all that and the promise I made. 442 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,880 He said, well, he said, how often do you go to Mass? 443 00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:23,240 I said, well, every week, Father. 444 00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:26,560 I said, how often do you pray outside of Mass? 445 00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:29,080 I said, well, not very often. 446 00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:30,520 How often do you go to confession? 447 00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,480 Oh, Jesus, it's been many years since I've been a confession. 448 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:35,080 I said, well, how about the rosary? 449 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:36,680 I said, no, I don't say the rosary. 450 00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:41,560 But he says, it doesn't sound like much of a vocation to me. 451 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:47,800 But if you want to go to the seminary, you know, the education won't be wasted on you. 452 00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:50,640 When you, you know, something might change. 453 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,520 So they got me enrolled. 454 00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,240 I passed the exam and all that. 455 00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:01,800 And I was, I started that following September and I was the oldest one in my class because 456 00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:03,640 most of them were coming out of high school. 457 00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:05,040 They were coming out. 458 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,880 They were first year right out of high school. 459 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:12,400 I was already 22, 23 years old. 460 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:16,360 So I was a slow learner. 461 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:26,840 So anyway, I, I, in my second, in my second year of seminary in the fall of 75, I think 462 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,440 it was, yeah, 75, I was saying my rosary. 463 00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:34,640 I was walking in the woods and I said, geez, God, I think, thank you for bringing me here 464 00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,400 because I really feel a lot of peace. 465 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,360 I really feel I belong here. 466 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:43,680 It's the first time in my life I really enjoyed studying. 467 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:47,360 And so I heard this inner voice say to me, he said, well, do you remember that promise 468 00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:49,960 you made to me four years ago? 469 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:51,440 I said, oh my God, yeah. 470 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:53,560 It was the first time I remembered it. 471 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:57,720 I said, if I, if I do, if you get me out of the safe and sound, I'll do anything you 472 00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:58,720 want. 473 00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:01,880 I said, they wouldn't become, I did say I'd become a priest. 474 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:03,480 I just said, do anything you want. 475 00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:05,520 I said, well, this is what I want for you. 476 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,320 We said, and then that was the end of it. 477 00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:10,320 There it is. 478 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,600 I knew that was where I was supposed to be. 479 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:14,840 I never heard from him again. 480 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:19,360 Not, not, I mean, I did, but not in that. 481 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:24,440 Oh, here I am. 482 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,800 Many years later, doing the work of Vietnam veterans, which I love. 483 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:34,400 I've been a national chapter for Vietnam as America for over 35 years. 484 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:37,680 I gotta, I gotta, I gotta take a break here. 485 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:43,200 But when we come back, I want to talk to Father Phil and the authors again about what you 486 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:45,240 have been doing since then. 487 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:50,160 And I know it's been very involved in how, what an advocate you have been for veterans' 488 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,960 healthcare, especially mental health care. 489 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,960 And so we're going to take a break here real quick. 490 00:32:55,960 --> 00:33:00,000 We've been, we're talking about the book in the shadows of Vietnam, The Gallant Life of 491 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:02,320 Father Philip Tsawah. 492 00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:03,920 And it's great story. 493 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:06,120 You gotta go buy it. 494 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:07,120 Go buy the book. 495 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,120 Anyway, you're listening to Veteran Radio. 496 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:10,120 We'll be right back. 497 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:15,320 The Medal of Honor is the highest award for valor in combat given a member of the armed 498 00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:17,120 forces of the United States. 499 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:21,960 There have been over 3,400 recipients of the nation's highest award. 500 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:23,120 This is one of them. 501 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:27,720 Born Osir Frederick Ferguson led a force ship helicopter formation into a South Vietnamese 502 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,720 army compound under heavy fire. 503 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,160 Details after this. 504 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:38,040 If you have a VA claim denied by the Board of Veterans' Appeals, contact Legal Help for 505 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:42,280 Veterans at 1-800-693-4800. 506 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:46,280 They're experts in handling cases before the U.S. Court of Appeals for Veterans' Claims. 507 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:50,680 Their number again, 1-800-693-4800. 508 00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:55,000 After completing a hitch on the Navy, Ferguson got his commercial pilot's license and then 509 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,800 joined the army to fly helicopters. 510 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:01,800 Two weeks after graduating from helicopter school, he was in Vietnam. 511 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:07,320 On January 31, 1968, Ferguson heard that a first cavalry helicopter had gone down in 512 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:12,200 way and another had been badly shot up trying to rescue them. 513 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:15,320 Ferguson and his crew agreed to go get them. 514 00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:19,480 While refueling, he asked three Huey gunships if they wanted to accompany him. 515 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:20,880 They did. 516 00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:24,960 The GIs and the compound reported they were under heavy fire. 517 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:29,160 Ferguson circled until the fire abated, then began a low-level high-speed run into the 518 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:30,600 compound. 519 00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,320 He descended blindly in a dust storm from his rotors. 520 00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:39,640 When he touched down, he saw there was only one-foot clearance on each side of his blades. 521 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,440 The GIs jumped aboard and Ferguson pulled up. 522 00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:47,360 A mortar shell exploded under his aircraft, spinning it 180 degrees. 523 00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:50,600 One of the Hueys was shot down and the crew rescued. 524 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:54,640 The other two were so badly shot up by the time they landed, they were no longer able 525 00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:56,480 to fly. 526 00:34:56,480 --> 00:35:02,480 Ferguson received his Medal of Honor from President Nixon on May 17, 1969. 527 00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:06,680 The Medal of Honor series is a production of Veterans Radio. 528 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:08,600 Military veterans touch everyone's life. 529 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:13,880 I'm guessing right now you're thinking of a veteran, a close friend, relative. 530 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:15,000 Maybe it's you. 531 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:19,760 Even the toughest of us sometimes need help, but don't know where to turn for support. 532 00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,320 You don't need special training to help a veteran in your life. 533 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,200 We can all help someone going through a difficult time. 534 00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:27,520 Learn how you can be there for veterans. 535 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:34,080 Visit VeteransCrisisLine.net VeteransCrisisLine.net, a message from the U.S. Department of Veterans 536 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:35,080 Affairs. 537 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:45,680 We're back here on Veterans Radio and our guest is Father Philip Sohoi. 538 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:51,760 The book is in the shadows of Vietnam and the authors are joining us are Julian Ayat 539 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:53,680 and Paul Carronsi. 540 00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:57,640 And so Father Philip, you know, you answered the call. 541 00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:04,280 It took you 13 years to finally get your own act together. 542 00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,240 It sounds like from what I read. 543 00:36:06,240 --> 00:36:09,040 And in 1984, you became a priest. 544 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,760 And from there, you went on your next mission. 545 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:16,240 And that next mission was to help veterans with their own problems with post-traumatic 546 00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:17,240 stress. 547 00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:19,800 How did that go? 548 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:30,040 That was a realization that I could not be the only priest or minister who served Vietnam 549 00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:34,320 as a soldier that could be suffering from this PTSD stuff. 550 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:39,040 There must be others in the country that did the same thing. 551 00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:45,360 So I said, and I had just finished reading the book Out of the Night by William P. Mahade, 552 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:52,760 who was an Augustinian chaplain in the army in Vietnam. 553 00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:58,720 And when he got out and he worked with veterans for a while and he wrote this book Out of 554 00:36:58,720 --> 00:37:01,440 the Night. 555 00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:05,040 It's a spiritual journey for Vietnam veterans. 556 00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:09,640 I read that and I said, oh my God, it really clicked with me. 557 00:37:09,640 --> 00:37:13,480 And I wanted to, and so I called him, followed up his number and I called him. 558 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:21,040 And I said, you know, Bill, I said, I think there must be other people like me and you 559 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:30,120 in the country who have taken the call to ministry after their experience in Vietnam, 560 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:35,800 who are maybe suffering internally, but have no way to talk to them about their problems 561 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:36,800 or their suffering. 562 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:45,480 I said, I think it'd be a great idea to start a conference and to reach out to them, all 563 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,280 denominations. 564 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:53,400 So he said, I was hoping he was going to take up the idea and do it. 565 00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:55,440 He says, Phil, I think that's a great idea. 566 00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:58,480 I'm glad, I hope you can, your success when doing that. 567 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:00,840 So he threw it right back at my lap. 568 00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,400 So I said, oh my God, how am I going to do this? 569 00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:11,720 So I ended up finding addresses and of all the different denominations, Protestant denominations, 570 00:38:11,720 --> 00:38:16,440 Catholic dioceses, and Archdiocese, and sent out a cover letter to everybody, introducing 571 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:22,080 myself, telling them who I was, and what I'd basically, I was a Vietnam combat veteran, 572 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:28,920 who had become a priest and was suffering from PTSD and was looking for other people 573 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:34,400 who might be also in that same district, we could get together for a conference. 574 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:44,040 That's when I went to Washington at November 11, 1969, no, 1979, excuse me, or is it 1989? 575 00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:45,040 I don't remember. 576 00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:49,720 It's one of those years anyway. 577 00:38:49,720 --> 00:38:55,960 And Jan Scruggs invited me to present my idea because he thought it was a great idea. 578 00:38:55,960 --> 00:39:00,920 And so he gave me five minutes to talk about it, and at the end of the program, some people 579 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:06,000 came up with pieces of paper with names of ministers that they knew and Vietnamese, 580 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:09,000 for me to contact them and all that. 581 00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:10,920 And that was my head start. 582 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:15,960 And then from then on, I started writing those letters and got a lot of responses. 583 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:23,680 So the following year, it was our first meeting in Washington at the Marian Retreat House, 584 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:28,920 and we had 23 ministers show up for this first conference. 585 00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:30,400 I was really surprised. 586 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:36,320 I didn't think anybody would show up, but we had 23, and two of them were priests, 587 00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:40,440 were chaplains over there, and one was a Protestant minister. 588 00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:43,680 Well, most of them were Protestant, and they were all Protestant ministers, 589 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:47,320 besides the two priests and myself. 590 00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:50,440 And so we were there for a week. 591 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:56,440 And we started this with everybody, one by one took turns telling their story. 592 00:39:56,440 --> 00:40:02,320 And some of us, many of us took about an hour, or maybe 30 minutes. 593 00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,880 And there was never a dry eye in the place. 594 00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:10,520 There was one person that said he was on the verge of suicide. 595 00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:15,280 And then when he got hold of my letter, he got a little bit of hope, decided to come 596 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:19,120 over, and we're still in touch. 597 00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:25,760 So it was a beautiful, we met every year for 25 years. 598 00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:32,760 And from that, we started retreats, and weekend retreats for veteran couples. 599 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,320 And we didn't want just the guys that come, we wanted the wives to come, 600 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:39,080 because the wives are the ones that suffer the most. 601 00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,320 The guys don't tell their wives anything. 602 00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:46,560 And so they feel it's their problem or it's their fault. 603 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:51,520 So we don't call it post-traumatic stress disorder. 604 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:57,400 One of our members, Alan Cutter, as he's in the book, referred to it as post-traumatic 605 00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:59,520 spiritual disorder. 606 00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:06,520 So that's how we refer to it from then on, which is really a wounding of the soul. 607 00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:08,560 And that's what we started. 608 00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:14,400 And it's been, we've retired the group now because we've gotten too old and nobody 609 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:16,600 wants to travel anymore. 610 00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:22,920 And it was a few, but because other organizations are doing similar things with a younger 611 00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:24,640 federation. 612 00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,840 So we thought there was time for us to quit. 613 00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:33,840 But the other thing that's important to me was the fact that I got very interested in 614 00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:42,120 going overseas and doing this study with foreign veterans of other wars in other countries. 615 00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:49,600 And so I was invited to go to the Republic of Georgia, to Tbilisi, for the Peaceful 616 00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:57,480 Caucuses Conference, which was a conference for veterans who served in the Soviet war 617 00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:05,000 in Afghanistan and in Vietnam before we got there. 618 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:11,920 And it was the Chechens were there, the Azerbaijanis were there, the Azeris, the 619 00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:14,200 Armenians were there. 620 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,120 And it was a group of veterans from all those countries. 621 00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:23,360 And I did my program and it was simultaneously translated to them. 622 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:28,200 And I invited them to come out the following year and went back the following year. 623 00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:35,400 I was supposed to go to Bosnia in 2001 to do the same thing for their veterans. 624 00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:43,560 But what happened was that 9-11 happened, I put a kibosh on all the travel and that 625 00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:47,760 kind of put a kibosh on my overseas ministry. 626 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:53,560 But that's my story. 627 00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:54,560 He's not done. 628 00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:58,920 There's a lot more to this story that, you know, and we only have, you know, what, another 629 00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:02,080 10 minutes or so to talk about this whole thing. 630 00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:03,720 I'm going to have to have you back on. 631 00:43:03,720 --> 00:43:05,720 There's no doubt about that. 632 00:43:05,720 --> 00:43:08,600 Excuse me. 633 00:43:08,600 --> 00:43:12,840 In that time, I know that you were the national chaplain of the Vietnam veterans of America 634 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,360 for 40 years. 635 00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:19,120 You've been the national chaplain of the American Legion. 636 00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:27,320 You worked for many, many years at the VA in Boston and in Northeastern New England for 637 00:43:27,320 --> 00:43:28,680 all that time period. 638 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,520 Are you still actively involved with any of that? 639 00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:37,920 I'm the department chaplain for Vietnam, but for BFW in Rhode Island. 640 00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:42,120 I'm the department chaplain for DAV in Rhode Island. 641 00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:51,040 And I'm the local chaplain to all the DAVs, VFW and VVA, which I'm still a president. 642 00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:55,920 I've been the president of my chapter for the last 20 years, which I can't get rid of 643 00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:58,080 that job because nobody wants it. 644 00:43:58,080 --> 00:44:00,880 I can relate to that. 645 00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:01,880 I understand that. 646 00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:05,880 So there's not any organization I'm not involved in. 647 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:12,520 No, but you're really, you know, your mission is ongoing. 648 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:17,480 And there are probably so many veterans out there that are still around because of what 649 00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:20,600 you've been able to accomplish with that mission. 650 00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:24,640 And I just want, personally, from, you know, from the veteran community, I want to thank 651 00:44:24,640 --> 00:44:30,640 you so much for everything that you've done because of people like you, people like me, 652 00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:39,920 who were able to open up and finally get this future stuff that was inside of us out and, 653 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,000 you know, then finally be able to deal with it. 654 00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:46,720 I wanted to ask our authors, again, the book is in the shadows of Vietnam. 655 00:44:46,720 --> 00:44:50,280 You can find it anywhere, folks, Amazon, wherever you want it to go. 656 00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:56,680 But giving them a little lead up, I would like each one of you to tell one story that 657 00:44:56,680 --> 00:45:02,120 you think kind of identifies Father Phil to you. 658 00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:05,840 So we've got, what do we got, 10 minutes? 659 00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,200 Less than 10 minutes, about eight minutes. 660 00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:10,000 So let's see. 661 00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:13,080 Julian, I'll start with you. 662 00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:24,280 Well, I wrote in the book in the preface that I had been introduced to Father Phil by an 663 00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:27,120 article in the province journal. 664 00:45:27,120 --> 00:45:38,120 And you know, I said to myself, I've, I'm disappointed in myself for not having known 665 00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:41,640 Father Phil until now. 666 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:46,880 And that it, I felt it was my obligation. 667 00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:50,240 And I think Paul feels the same way. 668 00:45:50,240 --> 00:45:52,560 I have to write this story. 669 00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:54,760 Because I can't let it sit. 670 00:45:54,760 --> 00:46:02,040 This is something that so many people need to hear about because it's going to help them. 671 00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:09,480 Father Phil has helped a number of people in his lifetime. 672 00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:15,240 And he can help more without even knowing it by people reading this book because they'll 673 00:46:15,240 --> 00:46:20,280 be enlightened by what he has to say and what he did. 674 00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:26,280 And he's, he's well worth knowing, trust me. 675 00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:37,200 I wrote in the book and I compared him to someone that St. John Henry Newman, a British 676 00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:45,520 cardinal in the 1800s, who was a theologian and a writer and a poet. 677 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:53,600 And he was canonized as a saint by Pope Francis in 2019, not that long ago. 678 00:46:53,600 --> 00:47:01,440 And he once said that it's almost the definition of a gentleman to say that he is one who never 679 00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:03,760 inflicts pain. 680 00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:08,800 And that's Father Phil. 681 00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:09,800 That's what he does. 682 00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:19,320 And so, you know, I have, I could talk always about him, but the summarizes what I think 683 00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:23,040 he has done in his lifetime, and he's not done. 684 00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:24,040 He's not done yet. 685 00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,640 There's still a lot of fight left in that guy. 686 00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:28,680 And so watch yourself. 687 00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:29,680 He's there. 688 00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,320 He doesn't think so, but there is. 689 00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:36,440 So he's a friend, and I'm happy to call him my friend. 690 00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:37,440 Thank you. 691 00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:39,280 Paul, how about you? 692 00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:46,960 Well, you know, awards are not just an eagle boos to something that's self-serving. 693 00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:54,800 Awards are given because other people recognize an amazing or extraordinary contribution that 694 00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:58,120 you've made in the lives of other people. 695 00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:06,560 Father Phil has gotten so many awards in his career that Julian and I struggled with 696 00:48:06,560 --> 00:48:09,200 how we would list them in the book. 697 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:14,600 And we finally ended up just having to have three appendices in the back of the book to 698 00:48:14,600 --> 00:48:17,440 list all of his awards and accomplishments. 699 00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:24,600 You know, we mentioned that he was a Silver Star recipient in Vietnam, but he also received 700 00:48:24,600 --> 00:48:27,880 several other awards from the military. 701 00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:34,600 He received so many awards from organizations, the Knights of Columbus, Golden Lantan Award, 702 00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,800 the highest award given by that organization. 703 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:45,240 And so many others, like I say, it took three appendices to list them and explain them. 704 00:48:45,240 --> 00:48:50,320 So that's one of the things that I find so amazing about Father Phil. 705 00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:58,080 But there is another story that I can relate to in a sense, and it's not about Father Phil. 706 00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:06,800 It's about his parents and the amazing love story that resulted in their wedding, their 707 00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:14,480 marriage that Julian so eloquently wrote about at the beginning of the book. 708 00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:20,640 And I think that just deserves a mention because it's extraordinary. 709 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:25,480 And I know that you, Father Phil, you're still living in New Rhode Island, aren't you? 710 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:26,480 Yeah. 711 00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:27,480 Yeah. 712 00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:28,800 All of you are from Rhode Island. 713 00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:32,280 I know you live 15 minutes from each other. 714 00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:33,280 Nice. 715 00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:34,280 Around the corner. 716 00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:39,840 We didn't have time to talk, but I just want to mention that one of the important parts 717 00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:44,920 of my life was going back to Vietnam and adopting that Vietnamese family. 718 00:49:44,920 --> 00:49:46,080 That'll be for another show. 719 00:49:46,080 --> 00:49:51,280 I did want to ask you if you had ever gone back because many of my friends have gone 720 00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:52,280 back. 721 00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:58,640 I don't know if I'm quite ready for that, but you adopted a Vietnamese family while 722 00:49:58,640 --> 00:49:59,640 you were there? 723 00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:00,640 Yeah. 724 00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:02,720 They're living in Santa Ana, California now. 725 00:50:02,720 --> 00:50:05,880 In fact, the mother just died. 726 00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:13,000 She was 86 and the father of the group is 97 years old. 727 00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:14,880 This is back in 1990. 728 00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:21,120 So they were young then, which teenaged kids and now the teenage kids are in their 60s. 729 00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:23,720 I know that goes all of us. 730 00:50:23,720 --> 00:50:25,520 They're all American citizens now. 731 00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:27,080 They all became citizens. 732 00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,600 And very hardworking, I'm sure. 733 00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:30,600 Yes. 734 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:37,200 I mean, these are the people that unfortunately, in today's world, they appreciate being in 735 00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:40,560 America more than we do sometimes. 736 00:50:40,560 --> 00:50:45,600 And I think that that's a message that I'm sure that you're going to continue delivering 737 00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:47,960 to everybody that you talk to. 738 00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:55,920 Yeah, I would like to have you back on again to just to talk about maybe some of the techniques 739 00:50:55,920 --> 00:51:02,040 and things that you used while you were working with VA with the patients that were there. 740 00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:05,720 I mean, I know it's really hard. 741 00:51:05,720 --> 00:51:10,560 It's hard for all veterans, but it seems especially hard for Vietnam veterans to open up. 742 00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:17,680 I mean, even now, 50 years later, we have people that come to our meetings and you go, 743 00:51:17,680 --> 00:51:18,880 hey, tell us what you did. 744 00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:20,720 Well, I don't talk about that. 745 00:51:20,720 --> 00:51:26,800 You know what was the icebreaker going into a patient's room, a veteran's patient's room, 746 00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:30,080 is the CIB I was wearing on my suit coat. 747 00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:31,440 Oh, that. 748 00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:33,480 That was the icebreaker. 749 00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:36,600 Otherwise, they would have kicked me out because a lot of them just didn't want anything 750 00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:37,960 to do with religion. 751 00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:39,840 Well, it wasn't just a religion. 752 00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:47,200 I can remember just a personal thing of the first therapist I talked to was about 12, I 753 00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:51,360 was in the hospital, and I had not been in the service. 754 00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:53,240 And I walked out of that. 755 00:51:53,240 --> 00:51:55,800 I didn't go back for 20 years. 756 00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:57,640 So it's unfortunate that happens. 757 00:51:57,640 --> 00:51:59,920 Anyhow, we're coming up to the end of the program. 758 00:51:59,920 --> 00:52:03,120 I want to thank all three of you for being on Veterans Radio. 759 00:52:03,120 --> 00:52:05,520 It's such a pleasure to meet all of you. 760 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:10,160 Father Phil, I really do want to have you back on again at some point in the future. 761 00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:13,280 So now that I've got your emails and everything like that, we will do. 762 00:52:13,280 --> 00:52:15,280 If you don't mind. 763 00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:22,520 And the other two guys, Julian and Paul, any books that you want me to talk about, let 764 00:52:22,520 --> 00:52:26,800 me know if you're talking about veterans in any way, especially that story about Lily, 765 00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:28,920 I thought was really interesting. 766 00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:30,960 And we'll get back to you all. 767 00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:34,840 So thank you very much for being on Veterans Radio. 768 00:52:34,840 --> 00:52:35,840 Pleasure. 769 00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:36,840 Thank you. 770 00:52:36,840 --> 00:52:37,840 Okay. 771 00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:41,320 All right, we're coming up to the end of the program. 772 00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:44,640 Next week is our monthly benefits program. 773 00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:49,960 So if you have any questions about benefits, whether it's hospitalization or disability 774 00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:55,320 benefits or anything like that, you can, you know, our staff will be on our experts will 775 00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,000 be on the air with us. 776 00:52:57,000 --> 00:53:02,680 And I want you to make sure that you contact us, send us an email at info at veterans radio 777 00:53:02,680 --> 00:53:08,320 dot org, or you can call the program next week when we're on the air. 778 00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:13,040 And I'll get out that number next Sunday when we're on the air so that you can do that. 779 00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:18,240 A couple of other things are also to remember is that the radio of the river is coming up 780 00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:20,120 on September 22nd. 781 00:53:20,120 --> 00:53:24,320 We really appreciate anybody that could come out and support that. 782 00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:26,280 This is our major fundraiser of the year. 783 00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:30,800 And this is where we make up enough money to pay for being on the stations and so forth 784 00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:31,800 that we're on. 785 00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:35,760 So we're hoping that you will do that again, go to veterans radio dot Oregon. 786 00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:37,720 There's much more information on there. 787 00:53:37,720 --> 00:53:39,160 Let me see what else. 788 00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:43,240 So the vet fest coming up next Saturday, hopefully you'll be there. 789 00:53:43,240 --> 00:53:47,960 This is for southeastern Michigan, Washington Community College from 10 to three. 790 00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:49,560 We will be there on veterans radio. 791 00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:52,440 I hope you'll join us there. 792 00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:57,240 So the book again today was in the shadows of Vietnam, the Gala Life of Father Philip 793 00:53:57,240 --> 00:53:59,120 Sywa. 794 00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:02,120 Great story, Silver Star, all those things. 795 00:54:02,120 --> 00:54:06,440 This guy went through everything that every one of you veterans out there has gone through. 796 00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:10,240 So until next week, this is Dale Throneberry for all of us here at veterans radio. 797 00:54:10,240 --> 00:54:40,040 You are dismissed.