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Today, we're diving into the fascinating world of technology with John Greenwood, a

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luminary in the tech industry and the Chief Technology Officer at Kronos Fusion Energy.

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With over two decades of experience, John's career is a testament to innovation and creativity,

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seamlessly blending IT, web, mobile and software application development.

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His career is a rich tapestry, woven with diverse experiences across sectors like consumer

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electronics, entertainment, graphics and many more, contributing to companies and working

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alongside notable names like Disney, IBM and a few other musicians currently in your playlist.

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Known for his dynamic approach and versatile skill set, John has been instrumental in spearheading,

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digital transformations, enhancing data analytics and pioneering new product designs and development.

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His extensive background encompasses innovation, solution and service development, digital

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transformation and much more.

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At Kronos Fusion Energy, John's visionary leadership and deep technological expertise

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are driving the development of the smart fusion energy generator, steering our company towards

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realizing a sustainable and clean future.

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His approach is not just about advancing technology, but about creating a positive impact on the

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world.

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It's personal too.

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I must know John was kind enough to give me a job at Live Nation Entertainment over a

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decade ago.

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Our team at Live Nation was an overarching team of superstars and John was our leader.

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We were charged with designing, building and launching complex, multifaceted technology

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that streamlined hundreds, if not tens of thousands of internal and external business

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processes.

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I have always known John to be a great leader, an exceptional technologist, an avid environmentalist

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and an all-around great human.

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And so when Kronos needed a CTO to build the first ever fusion energy ERP system, I knew

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John was our wild card that could make near impossible cutting edge technology a reality.

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It's not just his professional achievements that set John apart.

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His passion for music, art and innovation continues to drive him towards exploring and

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integrating new technologies in unique ways.

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Join us as we explore John Greenwood's fascinating journey, his insights on the future of technology

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and his relentless pursuit of innovation across various sectors.

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Here's John.

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You are like a heavy hitter in the technology industry.

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What got you interested?

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What got you interested in what you do?

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So I suppose that I was originally following in my father's footsteps.

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He was an artist and a musician by trade.

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And that's what I wanted to do.

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And I was a musician, pretty successful musician.

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We were able to open for some big bands, go on tour.

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But I got an opportunity to join a company called Micrographics.

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Micrographics had written the world's first vector based drawing program for the IBM computer.

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And I joined them a few years later in 86 and was able to work on a program called InnoVision,

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which was a CAD program, a drawing program.

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And we launched it before Windows 1.0 and we became the first commercially available

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Windows application ever.

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And so I was very interested in kind of incorporating the art side of my brain with this business.

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And we went on to develop Windows Draw and Windows Graph.

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We went on to go public.

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During my time there, I did start there as an artist.

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I didn't quite get the vector based drawing feel as an artist.

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I kind of wanted to do more freeform.

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So I started traversing different roles within the company.

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And I was in sales.

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I started their inside sales group and their dealer programs, visiting dealers, setting

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them up.

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I worked in tech support, program management, release management, quality assurance, and

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finally software development and R&D.

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I think I was there for six or seven years.

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And I think I discovered early on through that experience the intersection of creativity

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and tech.

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And I was able to identify how technology can make your life better, which directly

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translates into how it can make life better for coworkers and your clients and customers

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when working on whatever product or solution you're developing.

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So I think that was engrained in me early, and it facilitated that passion approach to

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wanting to work with technology, but still getting to have that creative side.

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That's awesome.

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Yeah.

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You've been in entertainment.

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You've been in manufacturing.

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You've been in gaming.

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How does one translate their work between all of the different industries?

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It requires a nuanced approach that takes into account the unique challenges and opportunities

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and requirements of each industry.

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I know that one thing that's always bothered me is from time to time, if I was looking

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to work with another company, some companies would be really hard headed.

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And say, well, you have to have mortgage industry experience, or you have to have FinTech experience.

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And what I've done is set out to disprove that, and then I've worked with graphics companies,

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entertainment companies.

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I worked for nearly five years at a big law firm, one of the biggest law firms in the

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world, office products, ticketing, toy company, retail, e-commerce.

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So in doing that, it's made it a lot easier for me to pick up gigs here and there with

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companies that otherwise would just kind of look at your experience and say, no, you don't

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have that.

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But you still need to have that passion.

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And I've always had it, regardless of what it was.

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And a good example is the law firm.

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That might sound a little dry for somebody that's worked in graphics and entertainment,

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but the role was chief digital and innovation officer.

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And that also really drives me.

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The whole digital transformation piece to me is creative.

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It's getting in there and figuring out how you can streamline operations, streamline

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business processes, using technology and tools to help facilitate making things better for

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folks.

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So I've been able to easily kind of translate that to different business types, and it hasn't

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been a problem for me.

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Wow.

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Yeah.

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How does...

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You must have seen quite a bit of an evolution within technology, just from the 1980s to

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where we are now talking about AI, machine learning, quantum computing.

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How do you stay on top of it?

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How do you consistently learn?

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Is it something you are built with or do you work hard on it?

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Yeah.

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To the point of the last question, it becomes easier for me because of traversing all these

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different companies and industries in these different spaces.

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So I'm able to more easily continuously monitor the industry trends, merging technologies

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and regulatory changes that impact technological strategies in each of these sectors.

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So if I see I'm constantly...

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If you follow on LinkedIn, for instance, I'm constantly posting stories that I find interesting

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in digital transformation and innovation, but a lot of those, again, traverse different

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industries like legal.

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Maybe some things I post is on GDPR and the changes to GDPR, or there's new EU laws that

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are passed this week.

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I don't know if you saw those.

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Those are very interesting to me, but those traverse all sorts of industries.

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They touch on legal, of course.

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They touch on compliance and regulatory, but they also touch on all these other industries

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I've worked on.

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So I stay connected with industries, associations.

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I attend conferences and engage in knowledge sharing forums to stay informed and adapt

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technologies.

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I'm part of a collective of folks that are continually reaching out and helping each

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other to understand the ever-changing landscape in technology.

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Yeah.

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So it's like you're naturally interested in it and you're good at it and your friends

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do it.

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Yeah, I get that.

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That's pretty cool.

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What is the most innovative project, do you think, in your lifetime?

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What has been the most fun, challenging?

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So after I left Minder Graphics, I actually left with the president and COO.

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And again, we'd gone public, very successful company.

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I've learned a lot of things there.

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I'm very lucky to have joined that company.

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But he wanted to leave and start a multimedia company.

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And this was right down my alley, of course.

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We actually even brought in some very famous musicians and producers.

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But I was the third employee in that company.

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And it was called Seventh Level.

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It was a startup.

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And at the time, companies like Broderbund and Disney were releasing interactive titles

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with a few hundred cells of animation and 8-bit mono audio, which is unheard of in today's

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day and time.

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But these were the big interactive gaming and title houses at the time.

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It was very rudimentary stuff.

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And our vision and mission was to create interactive titles, at least when we started for children.

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So educational interactive titles with much improved audio and visuals.

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And so we set out to develop an AV engine that would allow us to produce titles in 16-bit

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stereo for things like sound effects and maybe dialogue.

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And in the cases where we were going to use key songs in the title, we had people, John

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Anderson from Yes sang children's songs.

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We had David Gilmore from Pink Floyd playing in the title.

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Howie Mandel was our main character that took the children throughout the title.

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And in those cases, we used CD quality audio or 44.1 kilohertz 16-bit stereo, which again,

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unheard of at the time.

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And then moreover, again, these other titles had a few hundred cells of animation.

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And this is Disney we're talking about.

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Our first title contained 12,000 cells of animation.

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And this allowed us to launch titles that were what you call on 24 Hollywood Bollies.

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So it's like watching a Saturday morning cartoon.

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And then we were able also to localize that into 13 different country languages.

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And it was very popular.

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We also did things like reuse of cells and tweening.

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Tweening is when you create key cells, a key character cell, but then automatically

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create the cells in between, which speeds up the development process.

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And folks like Disney took attention immediately.

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They hired us to create games for them, including some of the Lion King games like Timon and

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Pumbaa's Jungle games.

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I was able to create the world's first mix mode or Orange Book CD-ROM for Windows.

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So I was interviewed by a CD Magazine for that.

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And then we just went on to use that AV engine and that experience and continue to improve

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on it to create other Little Howie, Little Howie Mandel titles for which we won a presidential

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award from George Bush for a lot of the children's stuff.

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But then we got into other things for older children and adults, a Virgil reality series,

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and then eventually produced all the Monty Python interactive titles.

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And much like micro graphics, I kind of traversed through different roles at that company.

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So when I started, I started out there QA and release management group, but then I got

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into some coding, actually doing some programming and scripting on the titles and eventually

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became a producer.

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And I was a producer for Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail.

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And we actually won at the Cannes Film Festival the first year they had an award for video

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games and we won for Quest for the Holy Grail.

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So super, super fun, very innovative, very challenging, a lot of hours put in on that

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company.

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And we did take that company public as well.

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We actually did a secondary public offering.

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Yeah, it's almost like you seek to be in the forefront of ideas and innovations technologically.

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It almost feels like you have some sort of instinctual insight that allows you to see

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the next move in the game, so to speak, technologically speaking, just kind of looking at your resume

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and the evolution of it.

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That's pretty cool.

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And it shows passion, like there are passion projects for you.

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Right.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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I always try to find some level of passion in whatever I do.

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And I've been lucky enough to find these organizations like Bicronos Fusion Energy that I'm passionate

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about.

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It shows, John, it definitely shows.

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So all of these, like you've seen so many full cycle management or full cycle build

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of a lot of technologies.

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I'm sure with the advent of AI and AI doing some of the programming now, helping with

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data scrubbing, all of the ETL processes that we used to hire people for is now almost autonomous

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and optimizes itself, et cetera.

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How does a software development lifecycle, how is it going to evolve over the next 20

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years?

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Well, yeah, that's a good question.

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I'm not entirely sure how it will evolve over the next 20 years.

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That's pretty far up.

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But for easily the first half of my career, a lot of our careers, Waterfall, SDLC was

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king.

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And to some extent, it still exists, especially in the realms of legal and government and

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manufacturing projects, which I've worked on all of those in the last few gigs I've

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been in.

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However, to your point with the advent of things like DevOps, low code, AI, we've embarked

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on cultural philosophies and practices and tools that increase our ability to deliver

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applications and services at high velocity.

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So evolving and improving products at a faster pace than organizations using traditional

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software development and infrastructure management processes can.

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Automated testing frameworks also factor into this.

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I used to manage, as you know, a large QA organizations that are a number of my roles.

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And these have all but gone away.

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It's tough to find like a VP of quality assurance or anything because the developers are building

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these automated testing harnesses into the code that they write.

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And to your point again now with AI actually generating code and doing code reviews and

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testing artificial intelligence is changing the programming landscape and the future of

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coding by making code generation and optimization much better.

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Code snippet generation and performance optimization are two tasks that developers can automate

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now with the help of AI powered coding tools.

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AI can analyze big data sets and find patterns to boost code quality and efficiency.

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And the tools can suggest better code structures and warn developers of possible cybersecurity

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risks.

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I was looking at one of these the other day.

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I think it's called Devon, if I remember correctly.

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But I was very surprised that it was not only generating the code, but also going in and

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debugging and looking at cyber security and endpoint protection.

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But it can also predict future issues using past data.

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So doing predictive analytics based on the data workload.

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And it can lead to a better final product or solution and a smoother, more efficient

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development process.

243
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That said, I still believe humans are the creative element that's missing in the chain.

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So AI at least currently doesn't have that creative element intact.

245
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I'm not seeing it at least and I've played around with it a fair amount.

246
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While AI is automating a lot of these tasks, the notion of AI replacing programmers is

247
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still more of a speculation than a reality due to the irreplaceable human creativity

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problem solving skills.

249
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:41,880
Right.

250
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:48,080
I think it'll make things faster and easier, but I don't think it's actually going to

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replace human beings.

252
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I think you have to know what you're doing to even communicate with it properly.

253
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Right.

254
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Yeah.

255
00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:01,720
Well, yeah, it's like I tell my wife, my wife's an artist and a poet.

256
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She made her a poet and I've tried but I haven't convinced her yet.

257
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She constantly wants to spawn new ideas.

258
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And I said, you really should use generative AI to at least get you kick started.

259
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You don't have to use the content that's generated, but it gives you ideas to press on and move

260
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forward.

261
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Right.

262
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Yeah.

263
00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:25,200
Yeah, that's interesting.

264
00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:41,440
I talk to gamers and a lot of people when they play video games, they think that the

265
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next step is somehow programmed in and the truth of it is the programming for the program

266
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is in there, but the actual visuals and everything is actually built as you play through the

267
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game.

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And I think a lot of people quite understand how well our sort of predictive modeling has

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gotten even when it comes to predicting not only your gaming moves, but the visuals that

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then show up, the characters that then show up.

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All of that is almost like a machine learning model.

272
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Right.

273
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Right.

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And that's interesting because you go from playing like Pac-Man, not just less than four

275
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decades ago and the constraints of video games then and now you see this whole other world.

276
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And I saw a demo of the Apple Apple Pro headset and it was mind blowing.

277
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It was mind blowing.

278
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It is.

279
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It's crazy.

280
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:43,520
Yeah.

281
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I was almost terrifyingly good.

282
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It was almost like, you know what?

283
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That's it.

284
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Like I don't think I'm going to leave my house during my retirement.

285
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Like it's getting over.

286
00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,320
Yeah, it's moving at an incredible pace right now.

287
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Right.

288
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Yeah.

289
00:21:57,320 --> 00:21:58,320
Yeah.

290
00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:03,200
I think as technology people, like we're all excited about it, but there are a lot of people

291
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:07,160
that see a lot of doom and gloom, which I don't get.

292
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:08,840
I only see the upside.

293
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,360
So maybe I'm the problem.

294
00:22:12,360 --> 00:22:19,560
So John, you've generated a lot of intellectual property out there with some of these ways

295
00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:28,720
where you've married technology and art and technology and music and things like that.

296
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,080
Do you have time for your music, by the way?

297
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:32,760
How do you make time?

298
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:38,680
I haven't as much as I want to.

299
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:45,280
I was a lead singer in the band back in the 80s, but it was after I stopped doing that

300
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:48,520
so much is that I started playing guitar more.

301
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:50,560
And so I've performed here and there.

302
00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:56,520
I did a gig at the, I was lucky enough to do a gig at the House of Blues on Sunset before

303
00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:01,120
they tore that down because that was kind of a landmark for House of Blues.

304
00:23:01,120 --> 00:23:04,840
And then some other clubs are around here, but I try.

305
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,760
I need to make more time for it.

306
00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:14,120
Have you had a chance to try the app where you train it with your voice and then you

307
00:23:14,120 --> 00:23:18,080
just tell it the song and it'll sing that song in your voice?

308
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:19,080
I have not.

309
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:20,080
It's called Dub AI.

310
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:26,840
I literally trained it with my voice and I made it sing like Whitney Houston's I Will

311
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,280
Always Love You and I was blown away.

312
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:33,640
There's no way I can do that in real life, but I sound so good.

313
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,040
That's super interesting.

314
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:43,680
Yeah, I have a ton of patents in my name and it was always frustrating to me that a lot

315
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:45,640
of them came under Gateway.

316
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:50,240
I think I've got one at Sony and some other places, but the vast majority was when I was

317
00:23:50,240 --> 00:24:00,840
with Gateway Computer and they had a brilliant way to go about generating IP.

318
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:06,160
They had an intellectual property program where you turned the IP in.

319
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:11,800
They also made it part of your bonus actually and they did bonuses quarterly, which I thought

320
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:17,440
was unique to them versus other companies, but they actually tried to get you to work

321
00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:25,320
with other people to help generate IP, which was very successful.

322
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:31,200
Sometimes I would come up with things that were outside maybe a little bit of what they

323
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:38,440
did and your remark about the voice AI piece reminded me.

324
00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:44,720
I came up with something where you could play guitar, but as you were playing guitar, whatever

325
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:49,560
notes you were playing were automatically registered on this tool, this solution.

326
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:56,200
It recorded everything, recorded the tempo, everything so that you can go back because

327
00:24:56,200 --> 00:25:03,960
as I grew up as a musician, a lot of times in our band, the guitar player may start playing

328
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:08,400
a solo for something that you guys have written and then you get done and you're like, oh

329
00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,320
my God, that was fantastic.

330
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:12,320
What was that?

331
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:17,720
They just shrugged their shoulders and go, I don't know, I just did it on the fly and

332
00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:18,720
that was great.

333
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:19,720
Can you do it again?

334
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:20,720
I don't know.

335
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:25,160
I don't think so.

336
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:30,360
This invention was to record the actual notes that you were playing, the tempo you were

337
00:25:30,360 --> 00:25:34,600
playing, the keys, everything and gateway passed on that.

338
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:40,840
Well, many years later, of course, other inventions came up where people were using that.

339
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:43,760
I've done the same thing with keyboards.

340
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:50,600
I actually have an invention I can show you where I turned into gateway for a foldable,

341
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:54,440
compactable phone, which I believe is the same.

342
00:25:54,440 --> 00:26:00,960
Yeah, that does that now, but this was back in 1996 or 1997 that I turned that in.

343
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,760
It was a phone that folded in three parts.

344
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:10,440
It was frustrating sometimes, but moreover, it was very rewarding because they actually

345
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:14,840
paid you for specific milestones as you created things.

346
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:18,040
You go to an invention board.

347
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:26,480
I eventually did so much and was privy to the process so much that I joined that intellectual

348
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,680
property board and was able to review other patents that other people were turning in.

349
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:39,040
As you go in, you've just got to make sure that you approach the creation and the protection

350
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,640
of the IP.

351
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:47,720
As much as possible, it's good to be in a collaborative environment.

352
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,520
Every so often, you'll hear a success story like Sony.

353
00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:51,520
They did the Walkman.

354
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:57,720
I don't know if you know that story, but I can't remember the guy's name, but it was

355
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:03,120
a guy and maybe a few other people, and they literally went and locked themselves in a

356
00:27:03,120 --> 00:27:05,800
room and worked on this in a vacuum.

357
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:11,760
Sony was obviously a great success for Sony so many years ago, but it's hard to replicate

358
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:12,760
that sort of thing.

359
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:21,440
Apple's done it at times as well, but I find that a more collaborative environment is helpful,

360
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:23,720
especially because I wasn't a hardcore programmer.

361
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:29,320
If I came up with stuff, I would go and work with my counterparts, my friends at Gateway

362
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,680
as an example, and say, is this possible?

363
00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:37,640
I know it's unique because I don't see things out there, and I know it's novel, but is this

364
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:42,800
possible to generate this piece of hardware or this software process?

365
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:50,280
At times, then you can sign them on, and then they become co-inventors with you.

366
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:56,760
You just need to be cognizant to register your copyrights, trademarks, and your patents.

367
00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:03,480
Your business product or domain names, create confidentially non-disclosure licensing contracts

368
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:05,360
for employees and partners.

369
00:28:05,360 --> 00:28:14,400
It's important, and a lot of companies have gotten away from it, but IP is very important.

370
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:21,640
We definitely think so.

371
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:27,160
We spoke to a company, I want to say about two to three weeks ago, and they were making

372
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:32,400
... They call it sapphire screens, but they were making these ultra-strong screens that

373
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:37,800
could go on your phone and would also be foldable.

374
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:44,160
Producing these screens requires... Producing that material requires industrial heat of

375
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,840
almost 200 degrees centigrade.

376
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:52,080
We were having conversations with them about potentially using fusion energy, like an industrial

377
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:57,880
generator, to help them process those things.

378
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:04,080
It's interesting to hear about the origins of that technology.

379
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:07,920
Wow.

380
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:13,120
What do you think about what's happening in terms of our superconducting capability in

381
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:14,120
America?

382
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:20,600
I know that politically, there's a lot of worry about South Korea basically controlling

383
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:21,600
our computing.

384
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:26,480
I know that a lot of people talk about this.

385
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:31,400
How do you feel about that?

386
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:38,240
As it relates to... Just the future of the availability of these

387
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:48,000
superconductors in order to have computing follow Moore's Law in the future.

388
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:57,200
If we're talking about things like quantum computing and AI, all of these things require

389
00:29:57,200 --> 00:30:05,640
not only huge amounts of energy, but they require computing that we don't have the capacity

390
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:06,920
to produce right now.

391
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:13,120
I know a lot of startups are working on it.

392
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:20,620
If you're talking about the internet, I don't have a strong opinion on some of these countries

393
00:30:20,620 --> 00:30:26,080
that you brought up and that there's always a danger there and that comes into the regulatory

394
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,480
and the compliance and moreover the security piece.

395
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:38,000
But if you're talking about the intersection of technology and these energy pieces evolving,

396
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:45,200
to your point, high performance computing is one to look at and advanced simulation

397
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:51,120
techniques being essential for modeling and optimizing these fusion reactors and their

398
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:55,680
designs and the plasma behaviors.

399
00:30:55,680 --> 00:31:02,400
Chemical modeling, which enables the scientists and engineers to simulate complex dynamics

400
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:11,200
and optimize the reactor performances, that's all going to be crucial to predict the behavior

401
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,880
of fusion reactions under different operating conditions.

402
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:21,000
We've seen things like... What was it?

403
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:27,640
The Japanese reactor that had an issue when it flooded, things of this nature.

404
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:32,400
High performance computing models in that respect are going to be helpful.

405
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,560
The development of advanced materials and engineering techniques.

406
00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:44,160
I know that I shared something with everyone at Kremes on AI being used to help find new

407
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:49,120
materials not too long ago.

408
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:53,080
Because materials and engineering techniques are going to be critical for building and

409
00:31:53,080 --> 00:32:00,840
operating fusion reactors, innovations in material sciences like high temperature superconductors

410
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,480
and in-based ceramics and all these sorts of things.

411
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,480
We're all in that article that I shared.

412
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:11,200
But AI is going to factor into it heavily.

413
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:15,400
It's going to be very interesting to watch this space and how AI and machine learning

414
00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:17,160
can be impactful to it.

415
00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:24,600
But as far as the other part of that question, I think it's all about security.

416
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:30,680
It's going to be crucial that we secure all of this.

417
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:31,680
It's tough.

418
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:41,200
A lot of these companies, I'm sorry, countries are way ahead of us in terms of the hacking

419
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:47,600
and the breaches that they're performing on a lot of these companies and it's tough to

420
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:49,200
stay ahead of the curve on that.

421
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:53,440
I really haven't seen anybody that's been able to stay ahead of the curve.

422
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,640
It's been more reactionary.

423
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:57,640
That's true.

424
00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:58,640
That's true.

425
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:07,800
I think the fear is that we rely a lot on Taiwan for our computer chips and things like

426
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,080
that.

427
00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,840
Everyone wonders that.

428
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:20,080
For example, for us at Kronos, when we use our D-Wave quantum computing infrastructure,

429
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,800
we pay about $10,000 for 10 hours.

430
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,560
That's the quantum computing usage going.

431
00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:34,200
I fear that if we cannot scale up a larger infrastructure to build on some of these things,

432
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:39,120
we would end up paying maybe $30,000 for 10 hours.

433
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:48,960
That's my fear going forward, just from a computing economics perspective.

434
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:51,280
I understand the concern.

435
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:58,040
In Gateway, for instance, we got a fair amount of our chips from Taiwan as well.

436
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:07,920
There's always that danger of that market closing up to you based on geographical concerns

437
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:11,200
and politics as well.

438
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:14,720
Cyber security is a big thing for us.

439
00:34:14,720 --> 00:34:17,920
We're heavily relying on you for all that, John.

440
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:19,080
What do you think?

441
00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:27,000
Not only do we, as a nuclear energy company, have regulatory things that we need to worry

442
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,720
about.

443
00:34:29,720 --> 00:34:34,880
There's a lot of compliance around that, but you hear about cyber attacks all the time.

444
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:40,640
You hear about the inevitability of it.

445
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:45,840
My accounts have, at least three or four times in the last decade, I've had a couple of my

446
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:51,140
accounts get hacked.

447
00:34:51,140 --> 00:35:00,520
We are, in terms of an energy asset, I worry about cyber security.

448
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:01,800
What do you think?

449
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:06,120
How can we really ensure that we're protected?

450
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,520
Is there a way?

451
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:15,120
What I've really fallen back on, in regards to compliance in general, compliance first,

452
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:23,280
I need to say, I've had a lot of experience with ADA and GDPR, CCPA, HIPAA, PCI, FedBrand,

453
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:31,360
all these, especially in roles they've served in within legal, finance, retail arenas.

454
00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:34,400
Same thing goes with security.

455
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,600
The compliance and security pieces are hand in hand.

456
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:43,160
You've got to do a full assessment of solutions and the infrastructure coupled with continued

457
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:49,120
audits to evaluate the adherence to regulatory requirements and endpoints in the security

458
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:50,120
piece.

459
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:58,000
Everything, as far as compliance and regulatory, is constantly changing.

460
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:03,240
On the flip side of the coin, on the security piece, the threats are constantly changing.

461
00:36:03,240 --> 00:36:13,320
As soon as we figure out a way to shut an organization down or plug up an area that

462
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:19,200
could be breached, they find a new way in.

463
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:26,320
You have to really work on a regular basis to ensure that all these things have been

464
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:27,320
plugged up.

465
00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:36,000
I've had very good luck with certain tools that protect both externally but internally

466
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:37,000
as well.

467
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:41,400
Tools like Verona's and Big ID and things like that.

468
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:47,680
They help you protect your data from both external threats and internal threats.

469
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:52,680
You want to make sure what are employees doing with data?

470
00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:54,960
Why is this guy touching that data?

471
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,680
Why is he moving it from here to here?

472
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:02,200
He shouldn't be doing that sort of thing and protecting the endpoints.

473
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:10,800
Tools like that coupled with third party organizations that do this for a living, and that's all

474
00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:11,800
they do.

475
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:20,480
I've worked successfully recently with Rapid7 and a number of SolarWinds and a number of

476
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:24,400
other, CrowdStrike is another one.

477
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:31,400
A lot of the organizations that I've worked in recently are very concerned over breaches

478
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:32,400
and hacking.

479
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:36,360
I know everyone is, but when you're working in one of the biggest law firms in the world

480
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:40,320
where they're handling, they have tens of thousands of clients and they're handling

481
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:46,600
their matters, they obviously don't want to be breached because it's not just their data,

482
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:50,000
it's all their clients' data.

483
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:52,720
It's critical and it's very private data.

484
00:37:52,720 --> 00:37:55,400
It just can't be out there.

485
00:37:55,400 --> 00:38:02,520
Constantly having to keep up with protecting those endpoints.

486
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:06,000
It's going to be an interesting decade for computing.

487
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:16,480
It always is an interesting decade for computing, I guess, but I feel like now especially so.

488
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:21,280
About five years ago, I used to talk about using five, maybe six years ago, I used to

489
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:27,520
talk about using AI machine learning and even quantum computing for fusion energy.

490
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:33,520
I spoke at an event at Harvard and I heard snickering in the back of the room.

491
00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:40,160
People thought that this was an impossibility and now it's in the ethos of fusion energy

492
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:45,920
as how are we going to use a quantum computing lab and they're opening a quantum computing

493
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:50,720
lab in Princeton dedicated to fusion energy.

494
00:38:50,720 --> 00:38:57,360
This happened just a week ago and it made me so happy to see this because it was proof

495
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,280
that I'm not crazy.

496
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,160
That's always good.

497
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:11,000
That's always good, but it was cool to see that I've always seen quantum computing being

498
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,560
applied in a financial sense like algorithmic trading.

499
00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:16,120
That's really what I've seen.

500
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:27,640
I've seen friends use it for drug manufacturing and basically health research, like cancer

501
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:28,640
research.

502
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,560
I've seen that.

503
00:39:31,560 --> 00:39:37,440
These are the two areas where quantum computing has really taken off and excelled, I think.

504
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:42,560
I've heard a lot of talk about quantum encryption and how they're going to be quantum encryption

505
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:47,920
programs that are going to be for banking and hospital use in the future because we're

506
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,640
going to need it.

507
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:56,400
I really want fusion energy to be like that fourth leg for this.

508
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,440
I feel like there's a lot of room.

509
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:08,200
Like you said, that supercomputer at Google that synthesized material compositions of

510
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:13,320
380,000 materials using the right AI, that's phenomenal.

511
00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:19,000
Now I think, hey, what happens if we stick that into a quantum computer and speed up

512
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:27,360
that process and give it 200 more variables as to creating the perfect material?

513
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,320
Wow, that blows my mind.

514
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,320
I want to do that badly.

515
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:36,080
It's super interesting to watch this space.

516
00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:41,120
It's all kind of coming together in the best ways.

517
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:44,440
What do you think about fusion energy, John?

518
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,400
What makes you interested in fusion?

519
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:54,880
Well, I mean, that's kind of been the holy grail, right?

520
00:40:54,880 --> 00:41:02,320
Again, it kind of drives into the passion parts of it.

521
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:07,200
I'm very interested in energy in general.

522
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:13,360
I'm striving personally to get off the grid if I can.

523
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:17,480
I live on a very large property, kind of on a little mountain top.

524
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:24,680
The only thing we have here right now still is our Southern California Edison is supplying

525
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:25,680
electricity.

526
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:29,080
I'd like to get out of that business too.

527
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:30,080
We're on propane.

528
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:34,600
I've got Starlink for my internet.

529
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:39,720
I'd like to install solar and battery backups and all that sort of thing.

530
00:41:39,720 --> 00:41:51,040
I'm very interested in an energy future where we can create unlimited energy and as clean

531
00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:57,520
as possible to drive a lot of these clean energy and help everybody get to the point

532
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:00,600
where they can jettison that technology.

533
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:01,600
Yeah.

534
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:05,640
I think it'll be super cool.

535
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:14,640
I think 10 years from now we'll circle back and have a conversation about how we use computing

536
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:17,760
to crack fusion energy for humanity.

537
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:22,040
I think as a team, we're all environmentalists.

538
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:26,880
I think it's that basic passion that drives us.

539
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:32,440
I think it's going to be super interesting to see what the emerging technologies and

540
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:33,440
trends are.

541
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:39,480
To your point, I don't have a crystal ball, so I don't know 20 years out.

542
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:40,480
Right?

543
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:41,480
Right.

544
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:48,760
Right now, in the here and now, I have to say digitalization and internet of things

545
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:51,400
is going to factor heavily into this.

546
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:59,240
I go out to Palm Springs a lot too and Joshua Tree, I'm actually on the board of the Joshua

547
00:42:59,240 --> 00:43:01,240
Tree National Park Association.

548
00:43:01,240 --> 00:43:05,760
If you go out there, which I think you've gone out there, Priyanka, you see all the

549
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:07,760
That's my favorite place on earth, man.

550
00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:10,000
That's a good place to get away.

551
00:43:10,000 --> 00:43:11,000
It's ours too.

552
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,600
As you know, when you're driving out there, you can't miss them.

553
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:18,920
You see all the windmills, the wind turbines.

554
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:22,200
Those have become more and more internet of things pieces.

555
00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:27,160
If you look at them, you see all kinds of devices on that are measuring things.

556
00:43:27,160 --> 00:43:32,360
If something fails, those things can catch fire through friction and they'll shut them

557
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:36,600
down beforehand, so AI is being used.

558
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:40,800
Just the digitalization of that in the energy sector for things like internet of things

559
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:45,880
and artificial intelligence, they're really going to enable more efficient and intelligent

560
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:46,880
energy management.

561
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:53,320
You've got things like smart meters and sensors and internet of things, devices that provide

562
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:59,400
real-time data on energy consumption, enabling predictive maintenance, as I mentioned a moment

563
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:04,720
ago, demand response, energy optimization strategies.

564
00:44:04,720 --> 00:44:11,640
Another one is the integration of AI and predictive analytics into energy management systems.

565
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:16,960
It's going to enable more efficient operation and optimization of energy assets.

566
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:22,600
AI algorithms to analyze vast amounts of data in real-time to predict energy demand and

567
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:29,320
optimize energy production and improve reliability and contribute to overall energy efficiency

568
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,000
and sustainability.

569
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:41,000
Another one that I was into this a lot, I need to make more time for it, is blockchain.

570
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:47,680
I got pretty heavily into it when I was at the Big Wall firm and I actually became the

571
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:49,160
blockchain expert there.

572
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:56,480
When people hear blockchain, a lot of people hear NFTs and Bitcoin and things of that

573
00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:57,480
nature.

574
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:01,560
But blockchain, as you know, is so much more than that.

575
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:06,040
It's the underlying technology that drives all those things, which may or may not be

576
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:10,880
a success, those things, I mean, NFTs and Bitcoin.

577
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:17,480
Blockchain technology offers new opportunities for peer-to-peer energy trading, decentralized

578
00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:23,520
energy systems and transparent energy transactions.

579
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:28,080
Blockchain enabled platforms would enable consumers to buy and sell renewable energy

580
00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:30,400
directly with each other.

581
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:36,160
They could foster greater energy independence to our point that we were talking about earlier,

582
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:42,040
resilience and really democratization of energy markets.

583
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:47,280
I think that blockchain is going to factor into a lot of different industries, but I

584
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:51,800
think that for Kronos, it's going to be another key element.

585
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:56,720
Definitely like contracts management, things like that at a large scale.

586
00:45:56,720 --> 00:45:57,720
Yeah, exactly.

587
00:45:57,720 --> 00:46:03,400
Having that sort of permanence and record keeping and source of truth, that's amazing.

588
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:07,680
On the flip side of it, I'm in the process.

589
00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:13,520
I kind of have it about 70% done, but I'm in the process of writing an article about

590
00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:21,320
the future of cryptocurrency and how you need fusion energy for such a thing to take off,

591
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:26,680
because there are huge energy constraints when it comes to crypto mining.

592
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:27,680
Great, great.

593
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:34,160
There's been a huge drain on the grid in small cities and people have done all kinds of shady

594
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:38,680
things to leverage energy prices in different locations.

595
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:44,520
I was reading something yesterday and I wish I had the exact numbers, but the water that

596
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:48,280
you use to pool a lot of these systems.

597
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:54,560
I'm pretty sure I read that there was as much water was consumed by the state of Idaho.

598
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:56,560
Oh my God.

599
00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:59,480
Yeah, in a year.

600
00:46:59,480 --> 00:47:00,480
It's tough.

601
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:01,480
You're absolutely right.

602
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:02,480
That's a great point.

603
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:03,480
I'm hopeful for the future.

604
00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:11,200
I think we can make it happen.

605
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:17,360
I have friends that are very curious about the field.

606
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:24,160
What would a young person trying to get into computing and AI and maybe even fusion energy,

607
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:26,160
what should they know?

608
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:32,280
Yeah, on the fusion energy part, I think you'd know better than I would at this stage at

609
00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:33,280
least.

610
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:43,600
But just in technology in general, there's so many unique solutions out there.

611
00:47:43,600 --> 00:47:50,080
When the whole AI and generative AI thing started, there was only one or two solutions

612
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:52,160
out there that you can play with.

613
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:56,120
As you know now, they're popping up almost daily.

614
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:59,720
You can now generate text-based videos.

615
00:47:59,720 --> 00:48:05,520
You type in some prompt text and get a full video out of it with the...

616
00:48:05,520 --> 00:48:06,520
Sora AI.

617
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:07,520
Yeah, Sora.

618
00:48:07,520 --> 00:48:11,640
Chat GPT, there's a new version.

619
00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:14,520
Like I said, it's almost daily.

620
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:19,240
Google, Musk is doing his thing as well.

621
00:48:19,240 --> 00:48:22,400
I would really encourage people to...

622
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:26,080
A lot of these solutions are free, at least the base models.

623
00:48:26,080 --> 00:48:32,880
To get them and play with them and to my point earlier, with my wife, even if you've got

624
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:41,600
an aversion to generating things and then using that as your own work, that's not necessarily

625
00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:42,960
how you have to use it.

626
00:48:42,960 --> 00:48:45,880
You can use it to spawn new ideas.

627
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:53,760
To spawn a spring point, to spring off of it and create something new.

628
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:54,760
Artists, same thing.

629
00:48:54,760 --> 00:49:02,320
I know a lot of artists are scared right now of the generative AI replacing them.

630
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:14,480
I think as with bank ATMs and everything else in our past and PCs even, it's a tool and

631
00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:17,520
it's up to us how we use that tool.

632
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:23,680
I think people are going to start to realize this, that it's actually something that I

633
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:28,800
would encourage people to use to make things, make their lives easier.

634
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:35,560
Circling full back to where we started this conversation, how do you make your life easier?

635
00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:39,800
How do you streamline things so that you have time to do other things?

636
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:45,560
How do you help yourself generate new ideas by using these new technologies?

637
00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:51,160
So I would encourage people to start there and play around with some of these tools and

638
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:57,280
learn these tools because they're not going away.

639
00:49:57,280 --> 00:50:00,760
They're going to continue to grow and scale.

640
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,680
Yeah, that's awesome.

641
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:04,680
Thank you so much, John.

642
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:05,680
Of course.

643
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:06,680
Thank you guys.

644
00:50:06,680 --> 00:50:10,040
Okay.