WEBVTT 00:00:04.540 --> 00:00:07.820 This is Climate to Action, a CCUSM student podcast. 00:00:08.119 --> 00:00:10.919 We amplify voices, explore solutions to the climate 00:00:10.919 --> 00:00:13.599 crisis, and confront climate injustice for all 00:00:13.599 --> 00:00:16.719 living beings. I'm your host, Molly Saruwatari. 00:00:17.019 --> 00:00:20.219 Here at C2A, we are committed to providing a 00:00:20.219 --> 00:00:22.460 variety of perspectives for addressing the climate 00:00:22.460 --> 00:00:25.519 crisis in every episode. Stay tuned for the end 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:28.179 of the episode, where we provide you ways that 00:00:28.179 --> 00:00:31.000 you can take action yourself. First, we'd like 00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:32.939 to acknowledge that our recording studio is on 00:00:32.939 --> 00:00:35.780 the traditional territory of the Luceño -Payacuichum 00:00:35.780 --> 00:00:39.179 people. CSUSM and its surrounding areas are still 00:00:39.179 --> 00:00:42.000 home to the six federally recognized bands of 00:00:42.000 --> 00:00:45.179 the La Jolla, Paula, Palma, Pechanga, Rincon, 00:00:45.340 --> 00:00:48.719 and Ceboba Luceño -Payacuichum people. This land 00:00:48.719 --> 00:00:51.560 is also a shared space among the Cupeño, Kumeyaay, 00:00:51.640 --> 00:00:54.640 and Epay peoples. For today's episode, we are 00:00:54.640 --> 00:00:57.740 so excited to welcome a very special guest, Dr. 00:00:57.880 --> 00:01:00.750 Ronnie K. O'Dell. Dr. Odell is a professor here 00:01:00.750 --> 00:01:02.850 at CSUSM in the Political Science Department. 00:01:03.189 --> 00:01:05.510 She's also the advisor of multiple organizations 00:01:05.510 --> 00:01:09.269 and clubs on this campus. Dr. Odell, welcome. 00:01:09.810 --> 00:01:12.890 Thank you. I'm really excited to be here. Can 00:01:12.890 --> 00:01:14.810 you start by telling us a little bit about your 00:01:14.810 --> 00:01:17.489 role at CSUSM and how you became involved with 00:01:17.489 --> 00:01:19.569 the United Nations Sustainable Development Goals? 00:01:19.909 --> 00:01:23.370 I would love to. I am an assistant professor 00:01:23.370 --> 00:01:27.549 of environmental politics within the College 00:01:27.549 --> 00:01:31.760 of well, it's CHABS, the College of Humanities, 00:01:31.819 --> 00:01:34.640 Arts, Behavior, and Social Sciences, and then 00:01:34.640 --> 00:01:36.879 with the Political Science and Global Affairs 00:01:36.879 --> 00:01:40.859 Department. Lots of acronyms and all of that. 00:01:41.079 --> 00:01:45.480 But I teach and I research about environmental 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:49.719 governance. And I often tell people, a lot of 00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:53.319 my research is about how humans cannot destroy 00:01:53.319 --> 00:01:56.799 the earth. But there's also a lot in there about 00:01:56.799 --> 00:02:01.230 how we can thrive how we ourselves can protect 00:02:01.230 --> 00:02:04.209 our lives as well as protect the environment 00:02:04.209 --> 00:02:07.430 and how do we do that at the national and especially 00:02:07.430 --> 00:02:11.129 at the international level so that is what i'm 00:02:11.129 --> 00:02:16.930 doing here at csusm i got into the sustainable 00:02:16.930 --> 00:02:20.610 development goals because i've very for a long 00:02:20.610 --> 00:02:24.490 time i have been interested in understanding 00:02:25.449 --> 00:02:29.050 how human thriving and human development, which 00:02:29.050 --> 00:02:31.870 I've studied a lot in the past, is connected 00:02:31.870 --> 00:02:34.610 with environment and environmental development 00:02:34.610 --> 00:02:38.310 or environmental governance. Because there is 00:02:38.310 --> 00:02:42.250 a distinction between those two. You know, when 00:02:42.250 --> 00:02:46.439 we as humans... thrive or when we use resources 00:02:46.439 --> 00:02:49.539 that means that we need to use what's around 00:02:49.539 --> 00:02:52.560 us in the environment and what is that connection 00:02:52.560 --> 00:02:55.439 what is the disconnect what are the challenges 00:02:55.439 --> 00:02:58.680 so it's kind of like a merging of a lot of my 00:02:59.680 --> 00:03:02.259 different research interests. And I know we'll 00:03:02.259 --> 00:03:04.139 get into it more. So I guess I'll just leave 00:03:04.139 --> 00:03:05.680 it there. That's why I'm interested in sustainable 00:03:05.680 --> 00:03:08.900 development. All right. So I actually have had 00:03:08.900 --> 00:03:10.860 the privilege of taking Dr. Odell's classes. 00:03:11.319 --> 00:03:13.780 I'm in her class currently, and I took her last 00:03:13.780 --> 00:03:16.800 semester where I actually met Dr. Odell. And 00:03:16.800 --> 00:03:19.120 so I've had the privilege of understanding what 00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:21.199 this... the United Nations Sustainable Development 00:03:21.199 --> 00:03:23.680 Goals are. However, many of our listeners maybe 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:26.879 don't know what that is. So can you explain to 00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:29.639 them what they are, how they work, kind of that 00:03:29.639 --> 00:03:34.939 whole thing? Yes, absolutely. They are 17 very 00:03:34.939 --> 00:03:39.419 ambitious goals for how the world can come together 00:03:39.419 --> 00:03:43.129 to do what I was just talking about. Make sure 00:03:43.129 --> 00:03:46.090 that humans can thrive in their lives while at 00:03:46.090 --> 00:03:50.009 the same time we ensure that the earth can also 00:03:50.009 --> 00:03:52.150 thrive. And all of the things that that means, 00:03:52.409 --> 00:03:56.069 you know, different animal species and the water 00:03:56.069 --> 00:04:02.129 and the air and mountains and rivers and all 00:04:02.129 --> 00:04:05.710 those kinds of things. How do we use all those 00:04:05.710 --> 00:04:09.169 resources while ensuring that we don't abuse 00:04:09.169 --> 00:04:16.160 them? the United Nations General Assembly, which 00:04:16.160 --> 00:04:19.759 is the United Nations is an intergovernmental 00:04:19.759 --> 00:04:21.779 organization bringing all the countries of the 00:04:21.779 --> 00:04:24.879 world together to try to address shared problems. 00:04:25.079 --> 00:04:31.519 The UNGA passed or adopted this resolution that 00:04:31.519 --> 00:04:36.480 accepted these 17 goals. And the 17 goals are 00:04:36.480 --> 00:04:41.980 really ambitious ideas. about how we want to 00:04:41.980 --> 00:04:45.800 live in this world. So ending poverty in all 00:04:45.800 --> 00:04:49.379 its forms everywhere, ensuring gender equality, 00:04:49.779 --> 00:04:53.379 access to quality education. Those are some of 00:04:53.379 --> 00:04:56.420 the social development goals. And there's also 00:04:56.420 --> 00:04:59.540 environmental goals connected to climate, connected 00:04:59.540 --> 00:05:02.660 to protecting land, protecting water, protecting 00:05:02.660 --> 00:05:07.590 forests, reducing desertification. protecting 00:05:07.590 --> 00:05:09.790 biodiversity. You know, there's a whole bunch 00:05:09.790 --> 00:05:14.689 here. So there's 17 goals, 169 targets to measure 00:05:14.689 --> 00:05:19.410 the goals, and more than 250 indicators to measure 00:05:19.410 --> 00:05:21.589 the goals. We won't be able to talk about all 00:05:21.589 --> 00:05:23.689 of those today, but that's essentially what it 00:05:23.689 --> 00:05:28.670 is. And these 17 goals have just proliferated 00:05:28.670 --> 00:05:30.689 around the world, really. You know, since they 00:05:30.689 --> 00:05:33.680 were accepted, they were negotiated. at UNGA 00:05:33.680 --> 00:05:36.480 which is the general assembly and then they were 00:05:36.480 --> 00:05:41.949 accepted and adopted they have been adopted in 00:05:41.949 --> 00:05:45.250 local governments, in national governments, in 00:05:45.250 --> 00:05:50.149 universities, in corporations, local nonprofits. 00:05:50.709 --> 00:05:55.110 So much has been organized around these SDGs 00:05:55.110 --> 00:05:58.129 that now that your listeners have heard about 00:05:58.129 --> 00:06:01.670 them, they'll start seeing them everywhere. SDGs, 00:06:01.670 --> 00:06:04.069 what you're looking for. But there are these... 00:06:04.459 --> 00:06:09.620 17 blocks which represent the SDGs and each of 00:06:09.620 --> 00:06:12.000 them has a number that is associated and they 00:06:12.000 --> 00:06:14.339 have a different color so you'll start seeing 00:06:14.339 --> 00:06:17.060 these blocks everywhere and you know you know 00:06:17.060 --> 00:06:18.980 statements or policy documents or whatever you'll 00:06:18.980 --> 00:06:22.209 be like oh those are the SDGs yes Right. And 00:06:22.209 --> 00:06:25.230 one of my personal favorite SDGs surrounds human 00:06:25.230 --> 00:06:27.589 health and health quality and the quality of 00:06:27.589 --> 00:06:30.589 health. I love the SDGs. I remember doing my 00:06:30.589 --> 00:06:33.990 research last year with you or last fall with 00:06:33.990 --> 00:06:36.170 infectious diseases. And we were talking all 00:06:36.170 --> 00:06:38.709 about the SDGs and how that relates to climate 00:06:38.709 --> 00:06:44.269 change. But how does an intergovernmental organization 00:06:44.269 --> 00:06:47.560 like the United Nations. Pick up the sustainable 00:06:47.560 --> 00:06:52.060 development goals. Why did it come to the UN's 00:06:52.060 --> 00:06:57.910 attention? Where do I start? Because this is 00:06:57.910 --> 00:07:02.009 a long story, actually. And maybe this is a good 00:07:02.009 --> 00:07:04.310 time. I don't know if it is, but I'm writing 00:07:04.310 --> 00:07:08.930 a book about this and I'm in the final throes 00:07:08.930 --> 00:07:12.329 of writing this book. So I'm just now finishing 00:07:12.329 --> 00:07:14.350 up and I'm going to be submitting it to the publisher 00:07:14.350 --> 00:07:18.980 this week. And the book. goes into the history 00:07:18.980 --> 00:07:22.300 of where the Sustainable Development Goals came 00:07:22.300 --> 00:07:25.459 from. Mostly it's about the negotiation process, 00:07:25.579 --> 00:07:27.560 and I know you're probably going to ask me more 00:07:27.560 --> 00:07:29.920 about that in a moment, but where did it all 00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:33.279 start? How does this get onto the agenda? Well, 00:07:33.420 --> 00:07:36.959 in the 1960s and 70s, and it goes back further 00:07:36.959 --> 00:07:40.199 than this, but the 1960s and 70s... people started 00:07:40.199 --> 00:07:44.860 noticing that the impact of human activity was 00:07:44.860 --> 00:07:48.579 being felt everywhere. And some of the first 00:07:48.579 --> 00:07:55.579 research on the ocean that happened in the 60s 00:07:55.579 --> 00:08:00.240 and 70s found plastics in the depths of the ocean. 00:08:00.759 --> 00:08:03.279 where basically where humans had never been before 00:08:03.279 --> 00:08:06.000 because they were able to go down and they started 00:08:06.000 --> 00:08:08.399 finding these bits of things and then they assessed 00:08:08.399 --> 00:08:10.800 them and it was plastic from human production. 00:08:11.339 --> 00:08:15.379 And there were many other examples from the 1960s 00:08:15.379 --> 00:08:18.220 and 70s, Rachel Carson's Silent Spring in the 00:08:18.220 --> 00:08:21.220 United States. People started noticing and being 00:08:21.220 --> 00:08:26.220 concerned. And in Sweden, there was a very specific 00:08:26.220 --> 00:08:30.000 movement about the environment. And Swedish ambassadors 00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:33.200 said, we can't just do this at the local level. 00:08:33.259 --> 00:08:35.940 Local level is so important. National level is 00:08:35.940 --> 00:08:37.980 important. But we've got to get all of the world 00:08:37.980 --> 00:08:41.659 countries together to figure this out. So they 00:08:41.659 --> 00:08:45.100 became instrumental in creating what became known 00:08:45.100 --> 00:08:47.659 as the Stockholm Conference, which was the Conference 00:08:47.659 --> 00:08:52.389 on Human Environment. And this was in 1972. Okay, 00:08:52.450 --> 00:08:54.210 I'm going to fast forward a long time, you know, 00:08:54.230 --> 00:08:56.629 a lot, because I could talk about this forever, 00:08:56.730 --> 00:08:59.269 as you can tell. But that's where it started. 00:08:59.350 --> 00:09:02.350 You know, these people who were concerned about 00:09:02.350 --> 00:09:05.070 industrial and human activities and the impact 00:09:05.070 --> 00:09:07.610 it was having on our environment. And they said, 00:09:07.610 --> 00:09:09.509 we have to get that to the international level. 00:09:10.070 --> 00:09:14.610 Since then, there has been much done, many work 00:09:14.610 --> 00:09:17.389 streams in the United Nations to address environmental 00:09:17.389 --> 00:09:21.659 issues. And all of those work streams sort of 00:09:21.659 --> 00:09:27.919 coalesced in the early 2000s when there was a 00:09:27.919 --> 00:09:30.779 discussion about what to replace development 00:09:30.779 --> 00:09:35.059 goals that had been created in the millennium. 00:09:35.059 --> 00:09:38.220 So the millennium development goals were eight 00:09:38.220 --> 00:09:41.500 goals that were adopted by the UNGA, the General 00:09:41.500 --> 00:09:45.299 Assembly, in 2000. These goals were focused... 00:09:45.930 --> 00:09:47.929 mostly, there was a little bit about environment, 00:09:48.029 --> 00:09:50.289 but they were mostly focused on social and economic 00:09:50.289 --> 00:09:53.230 development issues. So these were things like 00:09:53.230 --> 00:09:54.610 that I had just mentioned, you know, and you 00:09:54.610 --> 00:09:58.450 mentioned health, poverty, education, and they 00:09:58.450 --> 00:10:02.149 had a deadline of 2015. So when that deadline 00:10:02.149 --> 00:10:05.490 was approaching, the environmental community 00:10:05.490 --> 00:10:08.750 and the development community started talking, 00:10:08.809 --> 00:10:12.149 which they hadn't. really done very much, a little 00:10:12.149 --> 00:10:13.909 bit, you know, I mean, it was about the, like 00:10:13.909 --> 00:10:16.590 the 1972 conference was human environment, you 00:10:16.590 --> 00:10:18.090 know, on the human environment, but they still 00:10:18.090 --> 00:10:20.470 had really been working in different work streams. 00:10:21.269 --> 00:10:25.450 So they said, is this an opportunity to combine 00:10:25.450 --> 00:10:29.610 development and development concerns with concerns 00:10:29.610 --> 00:10:32.690 about environment? And that's where the discussion 00:10:32.690 --> 00:10:36.809 got going. So to answer your question, people 00:10:36.809 --> 00:10:39.879 were concerned and they said, Unless we get all 00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:42.860 the countries together and all of the different 00:10:42.860 --> 00:10:44.480 actors, we call them actors in the international 00:10:44.480 --> 00:10:47.879 system, you know, countries and their governments, 00:10:48.059 --> 00:10:51.080 but also corporations, et cetera. Unless we get 00:10:51.080 --> 00:10:54.220 them all together to try to figure out how to 00:10:54.220 --> 00:10:57.059 work on agreements to address these problems, 00:10:57.299 --> 00:11:01.220 we won't make the progress we want to make. And 00:11:01.220 --> 00:11:03.879 there's a lot to talk about in there, but that's 00:11:03.879 --> 00:11:06.490 how it all began. Absolutely. Let's kind of unpack 00:11:06.490 --> 00:11:10.049 the, you talked about the 2015. How did the UN 00:11:10.049 --> 00:11:12.070 bring countries together during that time, so 00:11:12.070 --> 00:11:15.370 2015, to adopt the 2030 agenda for sustainable 00:11:15.370 --> 00:11:18.450 development? Because of this, why are the SDGs 00:11:18.450 --> 00:11:20.789 considered a global commitment rather than just 00:11:20.789 --> 00:11:25.470 another UN policy document? Why has it hit so 00:11:25.470 --> 00:11:29.429 hard in the global everything? It really has. 00:11:29.669 --> 00:11:34.080 Part of that, well, let's go back to your first 00:11:34.080 --> 00:11:35.480 part of the question, then I'll get to the second 00:11:35.480 --> 00:11:40.799 part. 2015. And 2015 was kind of the culmination 00:11:40.799 --> 00:11:44.179 of all of this. It really started five years 00:11:44.179 --> 00:11:49.139 earlier. But the main place that countries began 00:11:49.139 --> 00:11:53.190 to really think about... uniting these different 00:11:53.190 --> 00:11:54.950 communities that I was just talking about is 00:11:54.950 --> 00:12:01.590 the 2012 conference on environment and on sustainable 00:12:01.590 --> 00:12:03.929 development sorry the conference on a sustainable 00:12:03.929 --> 00:12:06.950 development this was called Rio plus 20. because 00:12:06.950 --> 00:12:09.649 that conference followed up 20 years from another 00:12:09.649 --> 00:12:12.669 conference that had happened in Rio in 1992 called 00:12:12.669 --> 00:12:15.870 the conference. It was usually called the Earth 00:12:15.870 --> 00:12:20.350 Summit. But the conference in 1992 was followed 00:12:20.350 --> 00:12:25.889 up in 2012. In 2012, there was a Colombian diplomat 00:12:25.889 --> 00:12:30.850 who her name was Paula Caballero. And she is 00:12:30.850 --> 00:12:33.649 still very much active and engaged. But in 2012, 00:12:33.789 --> 00:12:39.639 she had this. Very shocking idea to instead of 00:12:39.639 --> 00:12:43.539 or to use the opportunity with the end of the 00:12:43.539 --> 00:12:46.080 Millennium Development Goals to combine these 00:12:46.080 --> 00:12:50.639 two communities and to get more about the environment 00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:55.720 in it. So she brought that to the 2012 conference. 00:12:56.059 --> 00:13:01.519 And the conference approved and said. Okay, let's 00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:03.879 move forward. We need an intergovernmental negotiation 00:13:03.879 --> 00:13:10.600 to see what do we replace with what comes after 00:13:10.600 --> 00:13:13.840 the MDGs. That intergovernmental negotiation 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:17.059 took on a whole bunch of different forms. But 00:13:17.059 --> 00:13:20.659 one form was what happened from UNGA, the General 00:13:20.659 --> 00:13:23.399 Assembly. They created what's called an open 00:13:23.399 --> 00:13:27.019 working group. And the open working group met 00:13:27.019 --> 00:13:29.919 for 13 sessions over about a year and a half. 00:13:30.700 --> 00:13:33.519 There were a lot of different people engaged 00:13:33.519 --> 00:13:36.480 in the process, following in the process. There 00:13:36.480 --> 00:13:40.600 were 30 seats on the open working group, but 00:13:40.600 --> 00:13:42.779 the 30 seats were each shared by three different 00:13:42.779 --> 00:13:45.139 countries. So there were essentially 90 countries 00:13:45.139 --> 00:13:50.860 involved. And the negotiation began with all 00:13:50.860 --> 00:13:53.759 these themes that we sometimes have referenced 00:13:53.759 --> 00:13:57.379 here already. You know, health, education, poverty, 00:13:57.600 --> 00:14:04.340 climate change, finance. sustainable cities. 00:14:04.500 --> 00:14:05.799 I'm trying to think about, you know, there was 00:14:05.799 --> 00:14:09.960 so many. And each time they would come together, 00:14:10.019 --> 00:14:13.080 they met for a week for every month for 13 months. 00:14:13.240 --> 00:14:15.019 And each time they would come together, they 00:14:15.019 --> 00:14:17.940 would learn as much as possible about those particular 00:14:17.940 --> 00:14:23.659 topics. And after they did that, they negotiated 00:14:23.659 --> 00:14:27.399 on putting together these 17 development goals. 00:14:28.879 --> 00:14:32.519 and 169 targets to measure the goals. And then 00:14:32.519 --> 00:14:35.299 that was put forward to the General Assembly 00:14:35.299 --> 00:14:40.039 in 2015 and adopted in 2015. So that's an overview 00:14:40.039 --> 00:14:45.700 of the process. And you asked about how this 00:14:45.700 --> 00:14:50.580 became this ambitious global agreement. Is that 00:14:50.580 --> 00:14:53.039 what you said? Agreement? Yeah. Rather than sort 00:14:53.039 --> 00:14:55.960 of a boring policy document that nobody thinks 00:14:55.960 --> 00:15:00.539 about or looks at. Right. And there's a lot to 00:15:00.539 --> 00:15:04.259 unpack there, but one clearly is that every country 00:15:04.259 --> 00:15:08.440 in the world has agreed that these sustainable 00:15:08.440 --> 00:15:11.159 development goals are important, they need to 00:15:11.159 --> 00:15:13.919 be met, and they've been approved, and every 00:15:13.919 --> 00:15:16.059 country in the world has been working on adopting 00:15:16.059 --> 00:15:19.639 them. They even, through what's called the High 00:15:19.639 --> 00:15:23.019 -Level Political Forum, under ECOSOC, the Economic 00:15:23.019 --> 00:15:31.660 and Social Council, countries provide... these 00:15:31.660 --> 00:15:35.019 reports, but also commitments, nationally determined 00:15:35.019 --> 00:15:39.659 commitments to how they are going to achieve 00:15:39.659 --> 00:15:42.179 the sustainable development goals. And it's a 00:15:42.179 --> 00:15:44.440 lot, you know, so these reports are extensive 00:15:44.440 --> 00:15:48.980 and they typically, the reports cover only a 00:15:48.980 --> 00:15:51.419 couple of goals at a time or focus on a couple 00:15:51.419 --> 00:15:54.820 of goals, but all the countries in the world 00:15:54.820 --> 00:16:00.019 have been supporting. these and so like I mentioned 00:16:00.019 --> 00:16:04.539 earlier so many other organizations companies 00:16:04.539 --> 00:16:08.120 universities there has been so much momentum 00:16:08.120 --> 00:16:13.059 behind it and if I had to boil it down to one 00:16:13.059 --> 00:16:16.299 reason why it's become more than just a boring 00:16:16.299 --> 00:16:21.220 policy document it's because people find the 00:16:21.220 --> 00:16:26.789 goals to reflect the kind of world we want to 00:16:26.789 --> 00:16:32.450 live in. They are ambitious, but they are achievable. 00:16:33.190 --> 00:16:37.850 And they combine environment and human development 00:16:37.850 --> 00:16:43.289 goals to say, we want to live wonderful lives 00:16:43.289 --> 00:16:46.149 where we have access to goods and services and 00:16:46.149 --> 00:16:48.970 where we can thrive and where we can enjoy our 00:16:48.970 --> 00:16:57.490 world. The marketing behind the goals themselves 00:16:57.490 --> 00:17:00.330 has been pretty good too because they're pretty 00:17:00.330 --> 00:17:03.149 obvious when you see them. I brought show and 00:17:03.149 --> 00:17:05.369 tell, which I know your listeners can't see, 00:17:05.569 --> 00:17:10.329 but you can see the goals in their little boxes 00:17:10.329 --> 00:17:13.190 and they are inspiring when you look at them. 00:17:13.430 --> 00:17:17.869 So it has morphed into something bigger than 00:17:17.869 --> 00:17:20.500 just a policy document. Yeah, absolutely. And 00:17:20.500 --> 00:17:23.099 I remember looking, we had to look at the sustainable 00:17:23.099 --> 00:17:26.039 development goals and kind of where our country 00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:29.259 sat. last semester and I was representing the 00:17:29.259 --> 00:17:33.119 United States in our model United Nations discussion 00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:35.599 that we had and I remember seeing where the United 00:17:35.599 --> 00:17:37.680 States stood and I thought we were doing a lot 00:17:37.680 --> 00:17:40.940 better than according to the SDGs than what we 00:17:40.940 --> 00:17:43.480 were and that was like a huge wake -up call for 00:17:43.480 --> 00:17:45.660 me who I've been on this podcast for a while 00:17:45.660 --> 00:17:47.859 and I love sustainability and I was like wow 00:17:47.859 --> 00:17:52.000 like this is insane how we're not doing as well 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:53.480 as I originally thought we were I thought we 00:17:53.480 --> 00:17:55.200 were going to be in the top 10 and I think we 00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:59.460 were like 30 something, maybe 40? We're 44 out 00:17:59.460 --> 00:18:03.480 of 193 on the index of them all. So there's an 00:18:03.480 --> 00:18:08.380 index that particular organizations have put 00:18:08.380 --> 00:18:11.019 together where they take as many indicators as 00:18:11.019 --> 00:18:13.039 we have information on and they put them in an 00:18:13.039 --> 00:18:16.619 index and then they compare how well countries 00:18:16.619 --> 00:18:19.900 are doing. So out of 193 countries, we're doing... 00:18:20.269 --> 00:18:23.470 as well as the 44th right country and it's not 00:18:23.470 --> 00:18:25.970 awful but it's not as good as we should be doing 00:18:25.970 --> 00:18:28.730 i believe and it's cool if you look on the sustainable 00:18:28.730 --> 00:18:31.190 development goals website um 12 of our listeners 00:18:31.190 --> 00:18:33.170 it's very accessible just go on google you can 00:18:33.170 --> 00:18:36.210 look it up and you can see each individual country 00:18:36.210 --> 00:18:39.210 and each individual goal how they're doing for 00:18:39.210 --> 00:18:41.089 each individual goal and each individual goal 00:18:41.089 --> 00:18:44.230 has like subsections so it's really interesting 00:18:44.230 --> 00:18:47.069 so if you get a chance look it up But Dr. O'Dell, 00:18:47.130 --> 00:18:48.750 you talked a little bit about communities that 00:18:48.750 --> 00:18:53.170 came together to bring it to UNGA. What communities 00:18:53.170 --> 00:18:55.609 were a part of this discussion? Were some of 00:18:55.609 --> 00:18:58.309 their individual voices heard? Voices, we like 00:18:58.309 --> 00:18:59.910 to focus a lot on indigenous knowledge. Were 00:18:59.910 --> 00:19:03.490 indigenous populations, were their voices heard 00:19:03.490 --> 00:19:05.490 when it came to this discussion of the SDGs? 00:19:05.849 --> 00:19:08.630 And how were different stakeholders even included, 00:19:08.690 --> 00:19:12.619 different countries? I love this question because 00:19:12.619 --> 00:19:15.720 this is the focus of the book. So if you're interested 00:19:15.720 --> 00:19:18.779 in this topic and then if you want to know how 00:19:18.779 --> 00:19:22.460 non -state actors are involved in international 00:19:22.460 --> 00:19:26.960 negotiations, then the book that will come out 00:19:26.960 --> 00:19:29.680 this year from Springer Nature is going to be 00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:32.400 the book that I think that you'll want to read 00:19:32.400 --> 00:19:37.500 because it unpacks that whole process. It doesn't 00:19:37.500 --> 00:19:41.299 just... tell us how states interact through the 00:19:41.299 --> 00:19:44.960 UN and through the committees. But how are you 00:19:44.960 --> 00:19:48.740 and I, you know, how are the average people in 00:19:48.740 --> 00:19:50.759 the world? And you mentioned indigenous communities. 00:19:51.099 --> 00:19:54.880 How are all of these people able to be a part 00:19:54.880 --> 00:19:57.400 of the process? You know, when it's an intergovernmental 00:19:57.400 --> 00:20:01.240 negotiation, you don't usually think other actors 00:20:01.240 --> 00:20:04.359 that I or I or you could be involved. Right. 00:20:04.440 --> 00:20:08.940 How does that happen? Right. So. One thing that 00:20:08.940 --> 00:20:12.519 has been very important to the United Nations 00:20:12.519 --> 00:20:16.880 since its creation was including non -state actors. 00:20:17.220 --> 00:20:22.220 And there are several different modalities or 00:20:22.220 --> 00:20:25.940 mechanisms for that. One of the major ones is 00:20:25.940 --> 00:20:29.359 that NGOs, non -governmental organizations, can 00:20:29.359 --> 00:20:32.829 become... consult, they can get consultative 00:20:32.829 --> 00:20:35.970 status to the UN through ECOSOC, the one I mentioned 00:20:35.970 --> 00:20:39.029 earlier, Economic and Social Council. When they 00:20:39.029 --> 00:20:43.630 gain consultative status, that means that they 00:20:43.630 --> 00:20:47.390 can observe in meetings and even be invited to 00:20:47.390 --> 00:20:49.710 speak during meetings in what are called interventions. 00:20:50.410 --> 00:20:53.349 And then they have access to the UN, they have 00:20:53.349 --> 00:20:56.490 access to the buildings where the delegates are 00:20:56.490 --> 00:20:59.170 working and then of course they engage in all 00:20:59.170 --> 00:21:04.009 kinds of other ways to in to interact with delegates 00:21:04.009 --> 00:21:07.730 and interact with their go their own governments 00:21:07.730 --> 00:21:12.490 to try to have their voice heard and be a part 00:21:12.490 --> 00:21:16.849 of the process but in the negotiations that went 00:21:16.849 --> 00:21:18.710 into creating the sustainable development goals 00:21:18.710 --> 00:21:25.210 there were honestly so many opportunities for 00:21:25.210 --> 00:21:28.890 non -state actors to be involved that so I started 00:21:28.890 --> 00:21:32.369 out this this research a few years ago I wanting 00:21:32.369 --> 00:21:34.710 to identify the process and I became overwhelmed 00:21:34.710 --> 00:21:39.630 it was a lot I did some interviews and the people 00:21:39.630 --> 00:21:42.089 that I interviewed said yeah we almost were over 00:21:42.089 --> 00:21:46.789 consulted because Every organization, every UN 00:21:46.789 --> 00:21:50.230 entity was sending out a new survey each day 00:21:50.230 --> 00:21:53.309 saying, what do you want in the goals? What do 00:21:53.309 --> 00:21:56.130 you want to see in this process? So one of them 00:21:56.130 --> 00:21:59.230 was called the My World Survey. And I brought 00:21:59.230 --> 00:22:02.269 a little thing to show you. This is the My World 00:22:02.269 --> 00:22:06.430 Survey. The My World Survey was created by some 00:22:06.430 --> 00:22:11.519 really creative people, I'll say, in the... in 00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:14.039 some organizations that were working closely 00:22:14.039 --> 00:22:17.980 with the United Nations. And leading up to the 00:22:17.980 --> 00:22:21.359 negotiations in 2012, they said, we need to see 00:22:21.359 --> 00:22:25.119 what the average person thinks and what did they 00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:28.220 want from this new list of goals. So they put 00:22:28.220 --> 00:22:30.619 out this survey in all kinds of forms. They put 00:22:30.619 --> 00:22:32.640 it out on the internet. And on the internet, 00:22:32.700 --> 00:22:35.119 you could go on to the survey. And they also 00:22:35.119 --> 00:22:38.440 used organizations, nonprofit organizations, 00:22:38.799 --> 00:22:41.420 local civil society organizations, international 00:22:41.420 --> 00:22:44.440 organizations. They used them to share the survey 00:22:44.440 --> 00:22:48.779 with all of their people. So all that to say, 00:22:48.839 --> 00:22:55.079 the survey asked people to rank 16 items. And 00:22:55.079 --> 00:22:57.859 the ranking was the idea, which ones are more 00:22:57.859 --> 00:23:03.049 important for what might become the SDGs? And 00:23:03.049 --> 00:23:05.970 nine million people filled out this survey in 00:23:05.970 --> 00:23:10.789 the final tally. Oh, my gosh. On the top was 00:23:10.789 --> 00:23:15.369 good education, better health care. To your point, 00:23:15.490 --> 00:23:17.509 you're concerned about health care, better job 00:23:17.509 --> 00:23:21.029 opportunities, honest and responsive government. 00:23:21.630 --> 00:23:24.089 And then it starts getting into some of the things 00:23:24.089 --> 00:23:25.950 that we're maybe more interested in this podcast. 00:23:26.450 --> 00:23:32.579 Food, water, near the. The bottom part on the 00:23:32.579 --> 00:23:36.680 ranking list is protecting forests, rivers, oceans, 00:23:36.920 --> 00:23:41.660 taking action on climate change. But I bring 00:23:41.660 --> 00:23:44.799 that all up to say that's one example, one example 00:23:44.799 --> 00:23:48.000 of literally hundreds of surveys that went out 00:23:48.000 --> 00:23:51.980 from NGOs, from the UN, to try to figure out 00:23:51.980 --> 00:23:56.279 what people would want. Those people who put 00:23:56.279 --> 00:24:00.140 the survey together and those organizations who 00:24:00.140 --> 00:24:05.130 went out, to find out what the, to get the survey 00:24:05.130 --> 00:24:08.289 answered, they brought the survey information 00:24:08.289 --> 00:24:11.390 to the UN committees. So that open working group 00:24:11.390 --> 00:24:14.009 that I was talking about and then other processes 00:24:14.009 --> 00:24:16.609 that were happening, they consistently reported 00:24:16.609 --> 00:24:20.869 on the survey to those committees. So the committees, 00:24:20.910 --> 00:24:24.869 the delegates who were negotiating these topics 00:24:24.869 --> 00:24:28.309 would be consistently reminded, here's what the 00:24:28.309 --> 00:24:31.650 average people want. So that's one way, those 00:24:31.650 --> 00:24:36.450 surveys. Now, this survey, one of the organizations 00:24:36.450 --> 00:24:40.809 that I interviewed and that I did a little deep 00:24:40.809 --> 00:24:45.269 dive into, Watanatodo Abayan, which means Don't 00:24:45.269 --> 00:24:48.369 Break Your Promises. It's an Indian civil society 00:24:48.369 --> 00:24:54.390 organization. They sent out this survey to many 00:24:54.390 --> 00:24:59.230 locations in India to try to gain. input and 00:24:59.230 --> 00:25:04.150 they hosted conferences around India to gain 00:25:04.150 --> 00:25:06.710 input and they put it together in a report. Another, 00:25:06.930 --> 00:25:10.150 the World Association for Girl Scouts and Girl 00:25:10.150 --> 00:25:14.549 Guides, they identified what they called post 00:25:14.549 --> 00:25:18.650 -2015 ambassadors to go out to local villages, 00:25:19.049 --> 00:25:21.509 local people who didn't have internet access, 00:25:21.789 --> 00:25:25.869 who couldn't respond to the survey online and 00:25:25.869 --> 00:25:29.130 who wouldn't have found this survey or even interacted 00:25:29.130 --> 00:25:32.230 with it in any other way these post -2015 ambassadors 00:25:32.230 --> 00:25:37.589 went out had people in local rural villages without 00:25:37.589 --> 00:25:40.690 internet fill out the survey came back compiled 00:25:40.690 --> 00:25:46.150 them and submitted them and they got the the 00:25:46.150 --> 00:25:48.410 my world survey was giving awards at the time 00:25:48.410 --> 00:25:51.190 for the amount that they could pull in from the 00:25:51.190 --> 00:25:54.599 survey but That is one way. And then I'll finally 00:25:54.599 --> 00:25:59.019 mention another way, which goes back to my initial 00:25:59.019 --> 00:26:04.240 response to your question. Organizations, both 00:26:04.240 --> 00:26:09.460 nonprofit, nongovernmental, stakeholder, corporations 00:26:09.460 --> 00:26:13.059 to local governments, they were all really involved 00:26:13.059 --> 00:26:14.819 in this process because they knew it would be 00:26:14.819 --> 00:26:16.980 important and they knew it would have a big effect 00:26:16.980 --> 00:26:20.500 on their work. They were deeply following the 00:26:20.500 --> 00:26:23.059 open working group and some other processes that 00:26:23.059 --> 00:26:26.779 were happening at the time. But they made it 00:26:26.779 --> 00:26:32.079 possible to go to New York and or they tried 00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:33.599 to make it possible. They worked with organizations. 00:26:33.779 --> 00:26:35.500 They worked with amongst themselves to go to 00:26:35.500 --> 00:26:38.960 New York. And there was another civil society 00:26:38.960 --> 00:26:41.400 organization called the Beyond 2015 Campaign 00:26:41.400 --> 00:26:45.960 who supported. So many organizations, through 00:26:45.960 --> 00:26:48.559 their work, either sharing their work with the 00:26:48.559 --> 00:26:51.079 Open Working Group or helping them to get there. 00:26:51.559 --> 00:26:53.420 And people would come to the Open Working Group 00:26:53.420 --> 00:26:56.859 when they met. As I said, they met for one week 00:26:56.859 --> 00:27:02.640 out of each month for 13 months. Organizations 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:06.119 from all over the world would go to the meetings 00:27:06.119 --> 00:27:09.460 and try to get their voice heard. They would 00:27:09.460 --> 00:27:12.299 sign up to give interventions. And they were 00:27:12.299 --> 00:27:14.980 able to give interventions. informal session. 00:27:15.160 --> 00:27:18.339 And that means when other delegates were listening, 00:27:18.500 --> 00:27:20.380 the delegates from countries, and then they were 00:27:20.380 --> 00:27:23.500 able to do a lot of side events and lobbying 00:27:23.500 --> 00:27:27.980 and engagement. So it really was this amazing 00:27:27.980 --> 00:27:32.319 time where people were excited. They were also 00:27:32.319 --> 00:27:34.519 concerned, you know, because they wanted to make 00:27:34.519 --> 00:27:40.859 sure that their ideas were in this new agreement. 00:27:42.039 --> 00:27:45.319 And they found as many ways as possible to be 00:27:45.319 --> 00:27:49.140 involved. You asked about the indigenous population. 00:27:49.440 --> 00:27:51.420 And this is the final thing I'll say, which is 00:27:51.420 --> 00:27:54.599 that there was a mechanism through the United 00:27:54.599 --> 00:27:56.720 Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change 00:27:56.720 --> 00:28:00.559 and the work with UNEA, the United Nations Environmental 00:28:00.559 --> 00:28:04.220 Program, called the major groups. At the time, 00:28:04.220 --> 00:28:05.940 there were nine major groups. Now there are 22. 00:28:06.700 --> 00:28:10.190 These major groups are a way to organize. NGOs 00:28:10.190 --> 00:28:12.769 or other non -state actors around a particular 00:28:12.769 --> 00:28:15.950 issue. One of them was the Indigenous Peoples 00:28:15.950 --> 00:28:18.930 Major Group. And they came to these meetings, 00:28:19.190 --> 00:28:22.589 spoke often. Often they spoke about human rights 00:28:22.589 --> 00:28:25.269 and that they wanted to see that SDGs have a 00:28:25.269 --> 00:28:29.750 human rights framework. So I've sort of covered 00:28:29.750 --> 00:28:31.990 over and mentioned a lot of organizations and 00:28:31.990 --> 00:28:35.150 a lot of ways that this was happening. But you 00:28:35.150 --> 00:28:37.529 kind of see, connected to what I said earlier, 00:28:38.190 --> 00:28:40.769 So many people were involved in the process. 00:28:41.250 --> 00:28:44.369 And they wanted to see an ambitious agenda in 00:28:44.369 --> 00:28:47.630 the SDGs. And they wanted to see their idea in 00:28:47.630 --> 00:28:52.789 the SDGs. So they became embedded in it. They 00:28:52.789 --> 00:28:55.529 did as much as possible to be part of the process, 00:28:55.789 --> 00:28:58.230 both the intergovernmental part as well as all 00:28:58.230 --> 00:29:00.509 the other work streams that were happening. And 00:29:00.509 --> 00:29:04.069 they had a chance to give their voice. It didn't 00:29:04.069 --> 00:29:06.799 always mean that it... turned into, you know, 00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:10.680 what became the SDGs, but they were at least 00:29:10.680 --> 00:29:13.279 in conversation with each other in so many ways. 00:29:13.799 --> 00:29:16.220 Right. Yeah. And that's really cool. I mean, 00:29:16.240 --> 00:29:18.559 the SDGs are just fascinating how they came to 00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:21.119 be. Everybody all like the collaboration that 00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:23.980 went into it. It's amazing how you can see when 00:29:23.980 --> 00:29:28.539 there's something that we as a globe care about, 00:29:28.559 --> 00:29:31.279 you can see how quickly we can come to more. 00:29:31.839 --> 00:29:34.579 quickly -ish, we can come together and get something 00:29:34.579 --> 00:29:37.079 done, especially when it's about sustainability. 00:29:37.160 --> 00:29:40.420 And you mentioned a few times living a healthy 00:29:40.420 --> 00:29:43.619 and good life as well as having generations after 00:29:43.619 --> 00:29:46.900 us live that same healthy and good life. So this 00:29:46.900 --> 00:29:49.240 is a really good way to kind of transition into 00:29:49.240 --> 00:29:51.740 talking a little bit more about SDG 13, which 00:29:51.740 --> 00:29:55.119 is the climate action goal. How come the United 00:29:55.119 --> 00:29:58.039 Nations decided to identify climate change and 00:29:58.039 --> 00:30:00.599 climate action as one standalone global goal 00:30:00.599 --> 00:30:04.779 and not kind of put it into a subcategory? What 00:30:04.779 --> 00:30:07.640 makes climate change and climate action so important? 00:30:08.619 --> 00:30:12.660 Good question. And at the time, it was absolutely 00:30:12.660 --> 00:30:17.579 not certain that climate action would be a standalone 00:30:17.579 --> 00:30:22.279 goal. There was a recognition. that human development, 00:30:22.539 --> 00:30:24.900 all this social development, economic development, 00:30:24.980 --> 00:30:28.059 these different communities, needed to be in 00:30:28.059 --> 00:30:30.220 conversation with environment in sustainable 00:30:30.220 --> 00:30:34.640 development communities. But as these negotiations 00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:38.019 were happening, there were also other negotiations 00:30:38.019 --> 00:30:41.099 that were going on. And I won't get too much 00:30:41.099 --> 00:30:44.759 into the weeds into this, but the UN Framework 00:30:44.759 --> 00:30:47.960 Convention on Climate Change started in 1992. 00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:51.680 And this... Framework Convention. It's called 00:30:51.680 --> 00:30:58.299 the UNFCCC. The UNFCCC, one of the main streams 00:30:58.299 --> 00:31:01.680 of work that it is and was attempting to do was 00:31:01.680 --> 00:31:07.099 to reduce carbon emissions. It recognized, and 00:31:07.099 --> 00:31:09.420 when I say it, it's like this whole process and 00:31:09.420 --> 00:31:13.119 so many people, but they recognized that carbon 00:31:13.119 --> 00:31:16.140 emissions were on the rise and have been on the 00:31:16.140 --> 00:31:18.619 rise, you know, since the Industrial Revolution, 00:31:18.640 --> 00:31:22.579 and that Carbon emissions directly connect with 00:31:22.579 --> 00:31:24.799 the increase in average global temperatures. 00:31:24.900 --> 00:31:27.039 And the increase in average global temperatures 00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:29.680 is affecting climate change. And climate change 00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:33.200 is having some really detrimental impacts on 00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:35.599 human health as well as animal health and our 00:31:35.599 --> 00:31:38.099 whole environment. So one of the first things 00:31:38.099 --> 00:31:41.440 that in this, at least in this particular stream, 00:31:41.539 --> 00:31:44.359 the discussion was how do we get countries to 00:31:44.359 --> 00:31:48.559 agree on reducing carbon emissions? So the UNFCCC. 00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:52.799 has what are called Conference of Parties. Conference 00:31:52.799 --> 00:31:54.759 of Parties. They bring countries together every 00:31:54.759 --> 00:32:00.380 year to negotiate and discuss how do we reduce 00:32:00.380 --> 00:32:05.660 our carbon emissions. In 2015, when this was 00:32:05.660 --> 00:32:09.359 all being negotiated, another process, the Conference 00:32:09.359 --> 00:32:13.000 of Parties 21, that was to meet in Paris in July, 00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:17.119 they were preparing for their discussions. And 00:32:17.119 --> 00:32:21.109 there was a lot... of momentum behind getting 00:32:21.109 --> 00:32:24.750 another agreement going. The Kyoto Protocol from 00:32:24.750 --> 00:32:27.849 1997 was an agreement to reduce carbon emissions, 00:32:27.990 --> 00:32:31.190 but it didn't work very well. It didn't hold 00:32:31.190 --> 00:32:34.329 countries to account. So there was a lot of momentum. 00:32:34.490 --> 00:32:38.150 There was excitement. There was some nervousness 00:32:38.150 --> 00:32:42.349 because the most recent COP19 hadn't done well. 00:32:43.109 --> 00:32:46.849 And so there was a lot of nervousness. Now, They 00:32:46.849 --> 00:32:48.609 were meeting, they were negotiating, they were 00:32:48.609 --> 00:32:51.250 trying to figure out in this work stream over 00:32:51.250 --> 00:32:53.950 here, how do we get to Paris? How do we get all 00:32:53.950 --> 00:32:56.809 these countries to agree on carbon emissions? 00:32:57.509 --> 00:33:00.869 How do we get them to agree on what is the appropriate 00:33:00.869 --> 00:33:05.730 level of Celsius that we would allow our world 00:33:05.730 --> 00:33:09.230 to be above or beyond? Should it be 1 .5? Should 00:33:09.230 --> 00:33:13.529 it be 2? And so there was a lot of fear that 00:33:13.529 --> 00:33:17.440 the SDGs... would either contradict or undermine 00:33:17.440 --> 00:33:22.980 that. Because the SDGs were meant to be, the 00:33:22.980 --> 00:33:26.480 open working group would make its proposal before 00:33:26.480 --> 00:33:32.779 the climate meeting in Paris. So if the SDGs 00:33:32.779 --> 00:33:37.460 said something that was less ambitious, that 00:33:37.460 --> 00:33:40.579 could mean that the COP agreement, which we now 00:33:40.579 --> 00:33:43.529 know as the Paris Agreement, But at the time, 00:33:43.529 --> 00:33:45.589 the COP agreement maybe would be less ambitious. 00:33:45.910 --> 00:33:48.369 If it was more ambitious, then it would undermine. 00:33:48.609 --> 00:33:51.130 So there was all these questions. So many questions 00:33:51.130 --> 00:33:53.670 of, should we even have this standalone goal? 00:33:54.009 --> 00:33:57.250 Let's just subsume it and mainstream it, basically, 00:33:57.250 --> 00:34:03.970 across all of the SDGs. In the end, they said, 00:34:04.130 --> 00:34:08.389 and this gets to your question, they said, climate 00:34:08.389 --> 00:34:11.530 change is just too important not to include. 00:34:12.119 --> 00:34:14.280 as a standalone goal and that's the same with 00:34:14.280 --> 00:34:18.719 the so this is 13 14 and 15 14 and 15 on land 00:34:18.719 --> 00:34:22.260 issues associated and then 15 on oceans and rivers 00:34:22.260 --> 00:34:25.699 and they said we we have to include these as 00:34:25.699 --> 00:34:29.199 standalone goals but here i'll i'll let you read 00:34:29.199 --> 00:34:34.500 it because goal number 13 Take urgent action 00:34:34.500 --> 00:34:36.480 to combat climate change and all its impacts. 00:34:36.699 --> 00:34:39.980 It has an asterisk at the end. Read what's at 00:34:39.980 --> 00:34:42.280 the bottom of the asterisk, what it's referencing. 00:34:42.519 --> 00:34:45.639 Okay. Acknowledging that the United Nations Framework 00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:48.139 Convention on Climate Change, or the UNFCCC, 00:34:48.300 --> 00:34:51.079 is the primary international intergovernmental 00:34:51.079 --> 00:34:53.719 forum for negotiating the global response to 00:34:53.719 --> 00:34:58.260 climate change. Right? So they were able to get 00:34:58.260 --> 00:35:02.940 around. The challenges of this negotiation and 00:35:02.940 --> 00:35:05.559 include it as a standalone goal as they knew 00:35:05.559 --> 00:35:09.059 it should be. But the political issues, as you 00:35:09.059 --> 00:35:12.360 see, were so challenging. It was just a challenge. 00:35:12.440 --> 00:35:14.400 They were able to get around that by saying, 00:35:14.559 --> 00:35:17.719 you know, we agree to this ambition. We think 00:35:17.719 --> 00:35:20.460 climate change is so important, but we will. 00:35:22.400 --> 00:35:26.480 defer to the agreements and the negotiation that's 00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:29.619 happening within the UNFCCC. And that allowed 00:35:29.619 --> 00:35:33.719 for both of these to happen. And it was so good. 00:35:33.800 --> 00:35:36.460 It was sort of brilliant because then it allowed 00:35:36.460 --> 00:35:40.059 for these three goals to be specifically focused 00:35:40.059 --> 00:35:44.280 on these climate issues. Climate. land, and oceans, 00:35:44.539 --> 00:35:47.699 while at the same time as recognizing that these 00:35:47.699 --> 00:35:50.960 other work streams are so important. And those 00:35:50.960 --> 00:35:52.699 other work streams are incredibly important because 00:35:52.699 --> 00:35:56.480 then they allow the countries to continue this 00:35:56.480 --> 00:36:00.320 work. And the Paris Agreement was hugely important 00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:05.019 at the time. It brought countries together. They 00:36:05.019 --> 00:36:07.960 were able to pass it and agree to voluntary commitments 00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:11.530 on reducing their carbon emissions. Oh, I did 00:36:11.530 --> 00:36:13.510 that. Like, I didn't even know about that final 00:36:13.510 --> 00:36:16.829 little asterisk. Asterisk. It is a hard word 00:36:16.829 --> 00:36:20.530 to say. Asterisk. Asterisk. Thank you. That's 00:36:20.530 --> 00:36:24.590 like, wow. I, that's crazy. So, okay. To kind 00:36:24.590 --> 00:36:28.050 of start wrapping up this episode, you mentioned 00:36:28.050 --> 00:36:30.610 that climate change influences global stability, 00:36:30.969 --> 00:36:34.309 migration, public health, of course, and economic 00:36:34.309 --> 00:36:36.809 development and so many other global issues that 00:36:36.809 --> 00:36:40.369 we've seen here today. In your opinion, why can't 00:36:40.369 --> 00:36:42.690 climate action succeed without collaboration 00:36:42.690 --> 00:36:46.230 across nations, sectors, and even different disciplines, 00:36:46.469 --> 00:36:51.909 even different majors here at the school? Why 00:36:51.909 --> 00:36:57.369 can't it succeed without collaboration across 00:36:57.369 --> 00:37:06.739 countries, nations, people groups, etc.? You 00:37:06.739 --> 00:37:08.599 know, I mean, I think it says it in the goals, 00:37:08.679 --> 00:37:11.920 actually. You know, read some of these goals, 00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:14.260 by the way, your audience, you know, will want 00:37:14.260 --> 00:37:17.460 to read them because especially goal 13, 14 and 00:37:17.460 --> 00:37:21.420 15, they try to kind of include everything, you 00:37:21.420 --> 00:37:24.940 know, but when you look at them, you see how 00:37:24.940 --> 00:37:29.380 interconnected we are. Yeah. We think of ourselves 00:37:29.380 --> 00:37:32.699 as individual people, as individual countries, 00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:37.820 as individual groups. But really, we are interconnected 00:37:37.820 --> 00:37:41.219 and interdependent even if we don't think we 00:37:41.219 --> 00:37:45.539 are. And just looking at a map shows that interdependence 00:37:45.539 --> 00:37:51.079 when we see that borders are made up and that 00:37:51.079 --> 00:37:57.539 waters, rivers, oceans, air, the things that 00:37:57.539 --> 00:38:02.820 we need to live a decent, healthy, thriving life. 00:38:04.010 --> 00:38:06.889 don't stay within those borders. They cross those 00:38:06.889 --> 00:38:13.110 borders. And because of that, it's so important 00:38:13.110 --> 00:38:16.670 to be connected with each other and to make these 00:38:16.670 --> 00:38:20.289 decisions together. absolutely and you even see 00:38:20.289 --> 00:38:23.150 it a local example of these waters crossing borders 00:38:23.150 --> 00:38:26.710 look at the Tijuana River it starts down in Mexico 00:38:26.710 --> 00:38:28.829 and then it comes up here and we have the beautiful 00:38:28.829 --> 00:38:31.929 Tijuana River Valley and estuaries so that's 00:38:31.929 --> 00:38:35.809 just a local example of how water air even just 00:38:35.809 --> 00:38:38.289 land transcends boundaries there's no such thing 00:38:38.289 --> 00:38:41.800 as a border when it comes to air so Now that 00:38:41.800 --> 00:38:43.619 we've finished that, this is going to bring us 00:38:43.619 --> 00:38:45.960 to the very final part of our podcast, our call 00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:47.659 to action. I know you were very excited for this 00:38:47.659 --> 00:38:49.599 part, and I'm excited to hear your call to action. 00:38:50.079 --> 00:38:52.500 So for those of you who may be new with us here 00:38:52.500 --> 00:38:55.179 today, the call to action is something that you, 00:38:55.260 --> 00:38:58.019 our listeners, can do in your day -to -day lives. 00:38:58.579 --> 00:39:01.219 Okay, Dr. Odell, what is your call to action? 00:39:02.280 --> 00:39:04.619 At the beginning, before we started recording, 00:39:04.920 --> 00:39:06.960 I told Molly that she was going to be really 00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:10.019 surprised at my call to action. And maybe you 00:39:10.019 --> 00:39:14.340 won't be, but I'm kind of surprised at it. My 00:39:14.340 --> 00:39:19.679 call to action is to observe the world around 00:39:19.679 --> 00:39:23.519 you. My call to action is to watch a sunrise. 00:39:24.639 --> 00:39:30.320 Watch a sunset. Go find an ant, like village. 00:39:31.130 --> 00:39:35.989 And watch what the ants do for an hour. Look 00:39:35.989 --> 00:39:40.590 at this beauty that we have around us. Look at 00:39:40.590 --> 00:39:46.730 the amazing colors in the morning. The Japanese 00:39:46.730 --> 00:39:51.309 call it forest bathing. Go walk through a forest. 00:39:52.489 --> 00:39:56.690 I don't think we're connected enough to our environment 00:39:56.690 --> 00:40:01.510 on a regular basis to appreciate how important 00:40:01.510 --> 00:40:06.789 and how valuable it is. And then after you do 00:40:06.789 --> 00:40:10.449 that a lot, then go do the other things. Then 00:40:10.449 --> 00:40:13.829 go and write a letter to your senator or representative. 00:40:13.969 --> 00:40:18.530 Then go be involved. But before you do that, 00:40:18.690 --> 00:40:23.309 connecting to our world that we're so dependent 00:40:23.309 --> 00:40:26.989 on, that we live and breathe even if we don't 00:40:26.989 --> 00:40:33.000 know it. and recognizing its existence is so 00:40:33.000 --> 00:40:37.639 crucial so it's kind of like a call to stop before 00:40:37.639 --> 00:40:42.579 you start and think before you act I love that 00:40:42.579 --> 00:40:45.179 I think that's probably my favorite call to action 00:40:45.179 --> 00:40:48.179 I was expecting that second part to be your call 00:40:48.179 --> 00:40:50.619 to action so I love that you are encouraging 00:40:50.619 --> 00:40:52.960 our listeners to go out and just take a minute, 00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:55.820 especially like if you're a student here at CCUSM, 00:40:55.900 --> 00:40:58.179 we're so busy, midterms just finished. And so 00:40:58.179 --> 00:41:01.079 connecting and the San Diego sunsets lately have 00:41:01.079 --> 00:41:05.340 been gorgeous. So amazing. So go, yeah, I'm probably 00:41:05.340 --> 00:41:07.860 gonna go watch the sunset today now. Anyway, 00:41:08.059 --> 00:41:10.099 thank you so much for sharing your insights with 00:41:10.099 --> 00:41:13.719 us today, Dr. Odell. I really enjoyed your insights 00:41:13.719 --> 00:41:16.420 on policy and climate change and climate action 00:41:16.420 --> 00:41:19.739 and seeing how international organizations are 00:41:19.739 --> 00:41:22.179 making strides to combat climate change. But 00:41:22.179 --> 00:41:24.019 before we end, you mentioned you have your book 00:41:24.019 --> 00:41:26.159 coming out this year. Can you tell us when it's 00:41:26.159 --> 00:41:28.920 coming out and where we can find it? Yes. So 00:41:28.920 --> 00:41:31.760 it's coming out with Springer Nature, which once 00:41:31.760 --> 00:41:34.920 they publish it, it will be available on all 00:41:34.920 --> 00:41:38.219 the platforms. So you can look at Springer Nature, 00:41:38.340 --> 00:41:41.619 but you can look at Amazon. It will be on the 00:41:41.619 --> 00:41:45.320 Sustainable Development Goals. And my title right 00:41:45.320 --> 00:41:47.329 now. The publisher might change this. I don't 00:41:47.329 --> 00:41:49.389 know. But my title right now is Sustainable Development 00:41:49.389 --> 00:41:52.610 Goals, a Civil Society Perspective. And civil 00:41:52.610 --> 00:41:56.929 society references... those non -state, non -government, 00:41:56.929 --> 00:42:00.929 non -corporation actors who are involved in all 00:42:00.929 --> 00:42:02.570 this, some of those that I mentioned, you know. 00:42:02.630 --> 00:42:04.730 So just like people like you and me and organizations 00:42:04.730 --> 00:42:08.110 who are involved in these process, how can they 00:42:08.110 --> 00:42:11.690 be a part of local, national, and international 00:42:11.690 --> 00:42:14.829 action to address that? So that's why it's called 00:42:14.829 --> 00:42:17.630 that. But I also reference stakeholders too, 00:42:17.730 --> 00:42:20.050 you know, local governments, corporations, how 00:42:20.050 --> 00:42:23.139 can they be involved in all of this? um when 00:42:23.139 --> 00:42:26.719 is it coming out likely the near fall like so 00:42:26.719 --> 00:42:31.699 around fall 2026 okay look for it then all right 00:42:31.699 --> 00:42:34.960 I'm super excited you will catch me reading this 00:42:34.960 --> 00:42:37.539 book absolutely and if I'm you know in a different 00:42:37.539 --> 00:42:39.420 state I'll come back and you can sign up for 00:42:39.420 --> 00:42:41.739 me yes you have to I will definitely sign okay 00:42:41.739 --> 00:42:46.909 awesome Want to hear more from Climate to Action, 00:42:47.090 --> 00:42:49.889 a CSUSM student podcast? Be sure to check us 00:42:49.889 --> 00:42:52.170 out wherever you get your podcasts and follow 00:42:52.170 --> 00:42:54.889 us on our socials at Climate to Action. That's 00:42:54.889 --> 00:42:57.550 at Climate to Action on Instagram and at Climate 00:42:57.550 --> 00:43:00.630 the number two action on TikTok. We will be posting 00:43:00.630 --> 00:43:03.010 updates, behind the scenes content and so much 00:43:03.010 --> 00:43:05.710 more. Remember, it's never too late to start 00:43:05.710 --> 00:43:08.070 making a difference in the climate crisis. Keep 00:43:08.070 --> 00:43:10.869 learning, keep acting, and keep pushing for change. 00:43:11.389 --> 00:43:14.110 Until next time, this is Climate to Action signing 00:43:14.110 --> 00:43:16.849 off. Climate to Action is recorded at Inspiration 00:43:16.849 --> 00:43:18.489 Studios on the CCUSM campus.