WEBVTT 00:00:04.679 --> 00:00:07.900 This is Climate to Action, a CSUSM student podcast. 00:00:08.199 --> 00:00:11.099 We amplify voices, explore solutions to the climate 00:00:11.099 --> 00:00:13.480 crisis, and confront climate injustice for all 00:00:13.480 --> 00:00:16.460 living beings. Here at C2A, we are committed 00:00:16.460 --> 00:00:19.500 to providing a variety of perspectives for addressing 00:00:19.500 --> 00:00:22.359 the climate crisis in every episode. Stay tuned 00:00:22.359 --> 00:00:24.800 for the end of the episode where we provide simple 00:00:24.800 --> 00:00:28.359 ways you can take action yourself. First, we'd 00:00:28.359 --> 00:00:29.859 like to acknowledge that our recording studio 00:00:29.859 --> 00:00:32.500 is on the traditional territory of the Luceño 00:00:32.500 --> 00:00:35.340 -Payacuichum people. CSUSM and its surrounding 00:00:35.340 --> 00:00:37.880 areas are still home to six federally recognized 00:00:37.880 --> 00:00:41.479 bands of the La Jolla, Paula, Palma, Pechanga, 00:00:41.679 --> 00:00:44.179 Rincon, and Ceboba Luceño -Payacuichum people. 00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:47.320 This land is also a shared space among the Cupeño, 00:00:47.460 --> 00:00:50.780 Kumeyaay, and Epay peoples. For today's episode, 00:00:50.939 --> 00:00:53.179 we are thrilled to introduce a very special guest, 00:00:53.439 --> 00:00:57.619 CSUSM's own Dr. Elizabeth Ritter. Dr. Ritter 00:00:57.619 --> 00:00:59.840 has done a lot of fieldwork, especially in the 00:00:59.840 --> 00:01:02.119 Mediterranean Basin. She also teaches classes 00:01:02.119 --> 00:01:04.739 on campus from intro to geography to parks and 00:01:04.739 --> 00:01:08.239 protected areas. Dr. Ritter, welcome to the show. 00:01:08.579 --> 00:01:10.799 Could you start by telling our listeners a little 00:01:10.799 --> 00:01:12.819 bit about your background, your research, and 00:01:12.819 --> 00:01:14.799 how you became interested in your field of study? 00:01:15.400 --> 00:01:19.519 Yeah, so I did not come to studying what I do 00:01:19.519 --> 00:01:24.219 directly. I, as an undergraduate, was majoring 00:01:24.219 --> 00:01:27.739 in biology, and I was wildlife biology and conservation 00:01:27.739 --> 00:01:31.099 biology focused. So I had the opportunity through 00:01:31.099 --> 00:01:34.560 my courses to spend a lot of time outdoors, to 00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:38.319 learn a lot about landscapes, the vegetation, 00:01:38.540 --> 00:01:40.599 the animals, and we had a lot of very practical 00:01:40.599 --> 00:01:45.439 hands -on sort of learning. And then I went to 00:01:45.439 --> 00:01:47.459 work for a while. So I worked in environmental 00:01:47.459 --> 00:01:51.340 consulting that I ended up hating. Sorry, everyone. 00:01:53.659 --> 00:01:55.900 It just wasn't for me, but my colleagues were 00:01:55.900 --> 00:01:58.760 really, they loved their jobs. So it wasn't for 00:01:58.760 --> 00:02:01.620 me. And I decided that I needed to find a new 00:02:01.620 --> 00:02:04.420 job or go back to grad school, figure out my 00:02:04.420 --> 00:02:08.479 life a little bit. And when I was digging around 00:02:08.479 --> 00:02:11.080 through grad school programs, I mean, I was still 00:02:11.080 --> 00:02:14.680 very interested in ecology sort of things, but 00:02:14.680 --> 00:02:17.360 I didn't really want to go into a master's degree 00:02:17.360 --> 00:02:22.620 in ecology. So what drew me to geography is that 00:02:22.620 --> 00:02:24.719 they were doing all these really interesting 00:02:24.719 --> 00:02:28.139 things and using really cool technologies to 00:02:28.139 --> 00:02:32.560 study landscape change, to look at how, you know, 00:02:32.560 --> 00:02:34.659 the questions. Sorry that you have to hear from 00:02:34.659 --> 00:02:36.539 me all the time. Like, why is this thing here? 00:02:36.699 --> 00:02:38.479 Like, what are the conditions that led to this 00:02:38.479 --> 00:02:42.280 sort of thing? um looking for patterns and trying 00:02:42.280 --> 00:02:45.539 to understand like the evolution of the landscape 00:02:45.539 --> 00:02:48.819 or the things on it um better so that's how I 00:02:48.819 --> 00:02:52.759 got into geography specifically and I still really 00:02:52.759 --> 00:02:56.000 thought um I was a bit naive when I went to to 00:02:56.000 --> 00:02:59.759 grad school um I still thought I was going to 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:01.580 work with small mammals like that was still my 00:03:01.580 --> 00:03:05.960 thing um but it I mean it's very hard to do of 00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:07.639 course because there's lots of permitting there's 00:03:07.639 --> 00:03:12.360 all which makes total sense. So I was a little 00:03:12.360 --> 00:03:15.879 lost for a while, even after starting grad school. 00:03:16.360 --> 00:03:22.300 But my academic advisor, she and colleagues had 00:03:22.300 --> 00:03:24.860 been working in the Mediterranean for a long 00:03:24.860 --> 00:03:29.259 time. And so she just suggested like, you're 00:03:29.259 --> 00:03:31.319 already doing some of this like GIS stuff, some 00:03:31.319 --> 00:03:33.659 of this stuff with remote sensing. What if you 00:03:33.659 --> 00:03:36.479 just came and looked at our site in Cyprus? Maybe 00:03:36.479 --> 00:03:40.800 something will like... spark for you. And so 00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:42.939 I applied for a whole bunch of scholarships and 00:03:42.939 --> 00:03:45.319 I got told a lot, but thankfully I got told yes 00:03:45.319 --> 00:03:49.159 enough that I could pay for my airfare and transportation. 00:03:49.259 --> 00:03:51.020 And then while we were on site, since it was 00:03:51.020 --> 00:03:53.539 archaeology field school, like they housed us 00:03:53.539 --> 00:03:56.379 and did all that kind of thing. So while I was 00:03:56.379 --> 00:03:59.139 there, like just seeing what they were working 00:03:59.139 --> 00:04:02.020 on and looking at this landscape and trying to 00:04:02.020 --> 00:04:05.599 envision it when the people of the past were 00:04:05.599 --> 00:04:08.569 there. It did. I was like, how can I use the 00:04:08.569 --> 00:04:10.330 skills that I have, the knowledge I have already 00:04:10.330 --> 00:04:13.430 about vegetation and about GIS and remote sensing 00:04:13.430 --> 00:04:17.310 to try to piece parts of this back together? 00:04:17.370 --> 00:04:19.550 Right. Because it's always an incomplete bit 00:04:19.550 --> 00:04:24.149 of knowledge. And how can I contribute to the 00:04:24.149 --> 00:04:27.089 I don't know how we understand the world of the 00:04:27.089 --> 00:04:29.389 past in that way. And so it was it was a bit 00:04:29.389 --> 00:04:36.870 of a secured, secured, circular route. Awesome. 00:04:37.230 --> 00:04:39.709 That's really interesting. And I know that there's 00:04:39.709 --> 00:04:42.430 a lot of really cool like technology that's used 00:04:42.430 --> 00:04:45.449 in GIS. I know when I was in your class, we did 00:04:45.449 --> 00:04:49.329 Esri and that, you know, it's a love for me personally. 00:04:49.370 --> 00:04:51.490 It's a love hate relationship, but I know it's 00:04:51.490 --> 00:04:54.889 a really, really cool way to track like geographical 00:04:54.889 --> 00:04:59.449 geographical locations and stuff like that. I 00:04:59.449 --> 00:05:02.470 don't think you're alone in that. Most people 00:05:02.470 --> 00:05:04.050 have kind of a love hate relationship. There's 00:05:04.050 --> 00:05:06.050 funny memes out there about it. Yeah. Cause it's 00:05:06.050 --> 00:05:08.529 like one, one like piece of like almost, it's 00:05:08.529 --> 00:05:10.430 almost like coding, like one thing wrong and 00:05:10.430 --> 00:05:12.649 just the whole thing like explodes. It feels 00:05:12.649 --> 00:05:14.810 like, but it's really cool once it comes together. 00:05:14.850 --> 00:05:16.430 Cause then you feel really accomplished. I remember 00:05:16.430 --> 00:05:18.790 I was like, yes, I like actually. Yeah. And it 00:05:18.790 --> 00:05:21.230 can be, it's, it's a tool. It's not the only 00:05:21.230 --> 00:05:24.310 tool. to helping us like understand these things 00:05:24.310 --> 00:05:26.670 and at least start asking questions about them. 00:05:26.730 --> 00:05:28.829 Right. It can be a starting point. It doesn't 00:05:28.829 --> 00:05:31.769 have to be. The end all be all. Yeah, absolutely. 00:05:32.209 --> 00:05:34.589 You spoke a little bit about how you kind of 00:05:34.589 --> 00:05:36.149 started in the Mediterranean basin with your 00:05:36.149 --> 00:05:38.230 academic advisors. Can you talk a little bit 00:05:38.230 --> 00:05:40.610 more about it and the climate issues or like 00:05:40.610 --> 00:05:43.389 the geographical location and everything that 00:05:43.389 --> 00:05:47.629 surrounds it? Yeah. So we look at human environment 00:05:47.629 --> 00:05:52.439 interactions. Of the past, so about 4 ,500 years 00:05:52.439 --> 00:05:55.899 ago to 3 ,000 -ish years ago. So the eastern 00:05:55.899 --> 00:05:57.759 end of the Mediterranean, this is kind of the 00:05:57.759 --> 00:06:01.079 early Bronze Age. It's still the Copper Age if 00:06:01.079 --> 00:06:02.240 you're on the western end of the Mediterranean. 00:06:03.680 --> 00:06:07.459 But we're trying to understand through archaeological 00:06:07.459 --> 00:06:13.339 excavation the things that we can link. So things 00:06:13.339 --> 00:06:16.000 are left behind. And how can we relate those 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:19.379 to the climate or environment of the time, essentially? 00:06:20.240 --> 00:06:24.879 and learn more about that um and then what systems 00:06:24.879 --> 00:06:27.860 do people put in place to address any environmental 00:06:27.860 --> 00:06:34.000 or climatic sort of changes right um my dissertation 00:06:34.000 --> 00:06:36.180 was quite a bit different it looked at modern 00:06:36.180 --> 00:06:41.139 things um so we did a whole bunch of just observational 00:06:41.139 --> 00:06:45.379 vegetation study essentially driving all over 00:06:45.379 --> 00:06:49.610 the island of cyprus um and just making notes. 00:06:49.709 --> 00:06:54.889 So very, very old school way of studying vegetation 00:06:54.889 --> 00:06:58.629 and then going through some historical, recent 00:06:58.629 --> 00:07:01.050 but historical sort of accounts of vegetation 00:07:01.050 --> 00:07:03.970 as well to fill out places we couldn't go or 00:07:03.970 --> 00:07:08.529 that had changed quite a bit. And what I was 00:07:08.529 --> 00:07:12.930 doing then was using these projections of future 00:07:12.930 --> 00:07:18.300 climate changes that there's several. groups 00:07:18.300 --> 00:07:22.240 that put them out. So there's one in England. 00:07:22.399 --> 00:07:26.379 There's a large group in Japan. The U .S. has 00:07:26.379 --> 00:07:28.420 their own groups that put out these global kind 00:07:28.420 --> 00:07:33.139 of climate models. And part of what they do is 00:07:33.139 --> 00:07:36.160 project to the future. So under different scenarios, 00:07:36.600 --> 00:07:39.819 what do we anticipate the future temperature 00:07:39.819 --> 00:07:44.160 precipitation might look like? So I was using 00:07:44.160 --> 00:07:46.500 their projections to see what the impacts on 00:07:46.500 --> 00:07:51.600 vegetation might be. And so we had, I don't even 00:07:51.600 --> 00:07:57.360 remember now, several dozen species that we were 00:07:57.360 --> 00:08:00.899 really wondering, will this allow this particular 00:08:00.899 --> 00:08:03.480 species to kind of expand its geographic range 00:08:03.480 --> 00:08:06.259 or will it cause it to shrink in some way? And 00:08:06.259 --> 00:08:08.600 if, what are those kind of like, what does that 00:08:08.600 --> 00:08:10.180 look like? What are those patterns again look 00:08:10.180 --> 00:08:13.490 like? And there are some things that are unique 00:08:13.490 --> 00:08:17.970 to cypress. So there's endemic species and other 00:08:17.970 --> 00:08:21.189 species of special concern that we didn't look 00:08:21.189 --> 00:08:22.750 at them specifically. They just happened to be 00:08:22.750 --> 00:08:25.990 in our observations. And, you know, how are they 00:08:25.990 --> 00:08:29.149 going to respond? Assuming that the model, you 00:08:29.149 --> 00:08:32.610 know, the future scenarios are correct or potential 00:08:32.610 --> 00:08:38.070 scenarios are likely. And so some of the things 00:08:38.070 --> 00:08:40.600 were really kind of. surprising because we also 00:08:40.600 --> 00:08:42.919 looked at some agricultural things because cypress 00:08:42.919 --> 00:08:46.759 is olives are very important um almonds are very 00:08:46.759 --> 00:08:49.679 important pomegranate fig culturally and economically 00:08:49.679 --> 00:08:55.179 right um pistachio there's a few others um they 00:08:55.179 --> 00:08:57.059 don't do pistachio production but like we do 00:08:57.059 --> 00:08:59.700 here in california there's several kinds of pistachio 00:08:59.700 --> 00:09:03.539 that have other kind of cultural uses or historical 00:09:03.539 --> 00:09:07.370 uses and so like For almonds, like almonds are 00:09:07.370 --> 00:09:09.230 happy. So as long as there's water, they can 00:09:09.230 --> 00:09:12.210 be provided water under future scenarios. They're 00:09:12.210 --> 00:09:16.629 like, we'll go wherever you want us, right? Some 00:09:16.629 --> 00:09:20.450 of the oak that are there are kind of like our 00:09:20.450 --> 00:09:23.389 scrub oak. They can, again, go lots of places 00:09:23.389 --> 00:09:25.710 and be perfectly happy under multiple kind of 00:09:25.710 --> 00:09:29.929 situations of climate. But some things that are 00:09:29.929 --> 00:09:32.629 already kind of restricted to high elevation, 00:09:33.070 --> 00:09:35.669 there's several pines, there's several oaks. 00:09:35.980 --> 00:09:38.440 that are unique, they, of course, very much shrink. 00:09:39.279 --> 00:09:42.220 And it's not that we were surprised so much about 00:09:42.220 --> 00:09:44.940 those things, because that's kind of what a bunch 00:09:44.940 --> 00:09:47.100 of other studies were saying about how vegetation 00:09:47.100 --> 00:09:53.080 is going to shift under climate. More so looking 00:09:53.080 --> 00:09:55.899 at it from the perspective of what information 00:09:55.899 --> 00:09:58.740 can I provide, should anybody ever look at my 00:09:58.740 --> 00:10:02.799 dissertation, that might help them maybe look 00:10:02.799 --> 00:10:07.730 at climate refugia. Or how do they want to maintain 00:10:07.730 --> 00:10:11.210 populations? So for them to implement policy, 00:10:11.590 --> 00:10:15.049 I wasn't in policy, or for them to implement 00:10:15.049 --> 00:10:17.490 different conservation strategies themselves 00:10:17.490 --> 00:10:21.970 that align with other kind of management goals. 00:10:22.990 --> 00:10:28.370 And so I don't know if anybody's flown with any 00:10:28.370 --> 00:10:31.110 of that, to be honest. I hope some of it has 00:10:31.110 --> 00:10:34.740 been a takeaway that they can work from. And 00:10:34.740 --> 00:10:39.360 then from there, my colleagues and I have continued 00:10:39.360 --> 00:10:41.799 to work together. So I still work with, which 00:10:41.799 --> 00:10:44.419 is a little bit unusual for a lot of people. 00:10:45.320 --> 00:10:50.279 I still work with my academic advisor and we 00:10:50.279 --> 00:10:54.320 have a really nice interdisciplinary team. And 00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:57.580 so she's a paleobotanist. So studying the vegetation 00:10:57.580 --> 00:11:01.059 of the past. I work with a zooarchaeologist who 00:11:01.059 --> 00:11:06.429 studies animal bones. Of the past, an archaeologist 00:11:06.429 --> 00:11:10.730 and a geologist or geomorphologist. So she studies 00:11:10.730 --> 00:11:17.289 landscapes. So I didn't work. We've kind of cobbled 00:11:17.289 --> 00:11:21.309 together this really kind of dynamic group. But 00:11:21.309 --> 00:11:25.110 we all bring kind of a unique perspective to 00:11:25.110 --> 00:11:28.330 what we're trying to sort out about how humans 00:11:28.330 --> 00:11:32.019 and the environment work together. yeah or in 00:11:32.019 --> 00:11:35.019 opposition right yeah definitely there's definitely 00:11:35.019 --> 00:11:37.320 a together and opposition we definitely see that 00:11:37.320 --> 00:11:40.259 very commonly now unfortunately one thing that 00:11:40.259 --> 00:11:42.039 kind of stood out when you were speaking about 00:11:42.039 --> 00:11:44.700 your work is how you track like species and their 00:11:44.700 --> 00:11:46.580 patterns of where they're going to go and that 00:11:46.580 --> 00:11:47.940 kind of makes me think of like what i'm studying 00:11:47.940 --> 00:11:50.980 right now is mosquitoes and like infectious diseases 00:11:50.980 --> 00:11:53.539 and how they're with climate change the weather 00:11:53.539 --> 00:11:55.639 patterns are changing do you see things like 00:11:55.639 --> 00:11:57.379 that with the species in the mediterranean basin 00:11:57.379 --> 00:12:00.139 do you see them like kind of shifting like for 00:12:00.139 --> 00:12:02.820 example in cyprus do you see them like shifting 00:12:02.820 --> 00:12:05.980 to a new area and if so how could that like affect 00:12:05.980 --> 00:12:08.940 i guess the surrounding species because of course 00:12:08.940 --> 00:12:12.460 an ecosystem is a very interconnected web so 00:12:12.460 --> 00:12:14.779 do you see that like happening and like what 00:12:14.779 --> 00:12:18.399 do you predict might happen if it does i mean 00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:22.919 i don't unfortunately i haven't followed um how 00:12:22.919 --> 00:12:24.600 they're tracking that in cyprus we haven't like 00:12:24.600 --> 00:12:26.779 repeated the vegetation observations or anything 00:12:26.779 --> 00:12:29.059 like that to know like what's it look like right 00:12:29.059 --> 00:12:32.860 x number of years later um to see if any of that's 00:12:32.860 --> 00:12:35.799 panned out yet but we know globally there are 00:12:35.799 --> 00:12:38.019 examples of this where vegetation is moving up 00:12:38.019 --> 00:12:42.259 slope it's moving further north um even the in 00:12:42.259 --> 00:12:45.139 the united states the usda has revised its plant 00:12:45.139 --> 00:12:48.919 zones to reflect where for gardening purposes 00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:53.009 and vegetable growing purposes um optimal or 00:12:53.009 --> 00:12:54.789 climate conditions under which to grow different 00:12:54.789 --> 00:13:00.309 things. So it's a well -known condition, but 00:13:00.309 --> 00:13:04.029 it's very species dependent. So some things have 00:13:04.029 --> 00:13:07.950 kind of a wider range of characteristics that 00:13:07.950 --> 00:13:14.350 permit them to basically thrive under a bigger 00:13:14.350 --> 00:13:17.129 variety of climatic conditions. Like cockroaches. 00:13:17.649 --> 00:13:22.309 Like cockroaches. And other things are far more 00:13:22.309 --> 00:13:32.470 restrictive. And so it's hard to... What we know 00:13:32.470 --> 00:13:39.490 from the past is that there are novel ecosystems, 00:13:40.009 --> 00:13:44.330 assemblages of species, essentially, that existed 00:13:44.330 --> 00:13:46.970 that no longer exist today because the climate 00:13:46.970 --> 00:13:49.860 shifted in particular ways. We either have relatives 00:13:49.860 --> 00:13:54.519 or closely related things left or we have, you 00:13:54.519 --> 00:13:57.299 know, new kind of conglomerations of maybe things 00:13:57.299 --> 00:14:00.220 that used to not associate with one another. 00:14:00.340 --> 00:14:03.899 Right. And so we expect to see novel kind of 00:14:03.899 --> 00:14:08.759 ecosystems and these alliances form in the future. 00:14:08.960 --> 00:14:10.919 With plants, it's a little hard because a lot 00:14:10.919 --> 00:14:13.299 of them don't respond quickly, especially when 00:14:13.299 --> 00:14:16.279 we're talking about trees and long lived organisms. 00:14:18.350 --> 00:14:21.269 Right. Their generations extend kind of beyond 00:14:21.269 --> 00:14:24.809 the current pace of climate change. So things 00:14:24.809 --> 00:14:28.330 that can reproduce quickly and or relocate quickly, 00:14:28.470 --> 00:14:34.370 you know, we may see them kind of like adjust 00:14:34.370 --> 00:14:38.049 first. We were talking in class this week already 00:14:38.049 --> 00:14:40.529 about how we've been observing phenology changes. 00:14:40.669 --> 00:14:44.789 So the patterns of like when things leaf out, 00:14:44.830 --> 00:14:48.120 migration patterns. And some things that we've 00:14:48.120 --> 00:14:51.419 been like, oh, like this migratory bird. Sorry, 00:14:51.500 --> 00:14:52.600 I don't have an example right off the top of 00:14:52.600 --> 00:14:54.519 my head. It's okay. We would anticipate that 00:14:54.519 --> 00:14:56.639 it would start to migrate sooner because spring 00:14:56.639 --> 00:15:01.440 is coming sooner, but they haven't. Right. We 00:15:01.440 --> 00:15:07.299 are starting to see like misalignments of when 00:15:07.299 --> 00:15:12.500 things like maybe bloom or there's phytoplankton, 00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:15.080 like when they first start to really like reproduce. 00:15:16.509 --> 00:15:19.529 and timing of the organisms that eat them. There 00:15:19.529 --> 00:15:22.110 are cyclical things that we know that happen, 00:15:22.269 --> 00:15:25.950 right, or random events, but they're shifting. 00:15:26.470 --> 00:15:30.370 The random events and the cyclical things are 00:15:30.370 --> 00:15:32.809 becoming the more regular instead of it being 00:15:32.809 --> 00:15:38.830 kind of a rare occurrence. And so, yeah, pollinators 00:15:38.830 --> 00:15:42.389 are off migrating when the things they pollinate 00:15:42.389 --> 00:15:45.659 are blooming. So we do have some examples of 00:15:45.659 --> 00:15:49.779 those things. You'll have to fact check me, but 00:15:49.779 --> 00:15:52.620 I think one of them is with saguaro cacti blooms 00:15:52.620 --> 00:15:56.399 and there's a moth that pollinates them and they're 00:15:56.399 --> 00:15:58.840 a little bit out of sync. Currently coming out 00:15:58.840 --> 00:16:01.500 of sync. Yeah. And that's hard too for like plants 00:16:01.500 --> 00:16:04.100 to flourish because they, you know, rely so heavily 00:16:04.100 --> 00:16:06.159 on pollinators and the pollinator like cycle. 00:16:07.659 --> 00:16:10.759 But kind of to switch gears here, you talked 00:16:10.759 --> 00:16:13.100 a little bit about like continental U .S. issues 00:16:13.100 --> 00:16:15.899 with like the USDA. And I know you've taught 00:16:15.899 --> 00:16:17.879 a class on national parks and protected areas 00:16:17.879 --> 00:16:21.019 because I took it with you. And lately there's 00:16:21.019 --> 00:16:22.799 been a lot of political debate around funding 00:16:22.799 --> 00:16:25.220 for national parks. What do cuts like that mean 00:16:25.220 --> 00:16:27.899 for conservation, climate resilience, or even 00:16:27.899 --> 00:16:31.480 like with the plants, like how will the species 00:16:31.480 --> 00:16:38.649 respond, anything like that? staffing cuts that 00:16:38.649 --> 00:16:44.470 we've seen this year um directly influence we 00:16:44.470 --> 00:16:48.009 we usually tend to think about things like um 00:16:48.009 --> 00:16:50.909 will there be anybody at the visitor center can 00:16:50.909 --> 00:16:53.929 they still lead tours the trash and pick up the 00:16:53.929 --> 00:16:56.110 trail maintenance right the construction crews 00:16:56.110 --> 00:17:00.710 uh fire suppression um yeah so we we usually 00:17:00.710 --> 00:17:02.429 think of those things first which are very very 00:17:02.429 --> 00:17:05.269 important but along with those people who were 00:17:06.299 --> 00:17:11.640 fired or laid off we've lost um you know some 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:14.180 of the veg management people we've lost the scientists 00:17:14.180 --> 00:17:17.680 we've lost the funding to do the monitoring that's 00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:20.400 required under different um rules and regulations 00:17:20.400 --> 00:17:25.680 so some of it is is like we may not know about 00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:29.160 some things for a while um if the data collection 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:30.960 has kind of stopped or nobody's even there to 00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:37.630 analyze the data kind of thing The one thing 00:17:37.630 --> 00:17:40.369 that I was recently reading about, I think it 00:17:40.369 --> 00:17:46.130 was in the Tahoe Basin. They had massive staff 00:17:46.130 --> 00:17:50.410 cuts. The Tahoe Forest, so it's not a national 00:17:50.410 --> 00:17:53.470 park, but it's under the USDA, the Forest Service. 00:17:55.309 --> 00:18:02.740 They lost people who were working on... Oh, there 00:18:02.740 --> 00:18:04.819 was some kind of algal bloom and they had been 00:18:04.819 --> 00:18:09.000 working with deploying these mats that basically 00:18:09.000 --> 00:18:11.740 block the sunlight. And they're having really 00:18:11.740 --> 00:18:14.680 good results. But now there's nobody to do those 00:18:14.680 --> 00:18:19.099 things. Oh, no. That's so sad. It is a little 00:18:19.099 --> 00:18:23.200 sad. You know, they can't hire students coming 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:25.119 fresh out of college right now or having a harder 00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:28.539 time hiring students for temporary or internship 00:18:28.539 --> 00:18:38.119 or summer positions. Yeah. So that makes it, 00:18:38.140 --> 00:18:45.240 I don't know the right words. It basically affects 00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:48.160 the management into the future as well because 00:18:48.160 --> 00:18:50.460 we have people who are missing out on those training 00:18:50.460 --> 00:18:52.779 opportunities and those experiential opportunities 00:18:52.779 --> 00:18:58.819 that are really formative in helping launch those. 00:19:01.000 --> 00:19:04.380 kind of management conservation sorts of careers 00:19:04.380 --> 00:19:07.660 yeah so i didn't say anything about climate but 00:19:07.660 --> 00:19:11.920 um it's okay it's okay i mean we already know 00:19:11.920 --> 00:19:15.339 that there's impacts to our our parks um we know 00:19:15.339 --> 00:19:17.460 that visitors are adjusting like their visiting 00:19:17.460 --> 00:19:21.640 hours because it's hotter or whatever reasons 00:19:21.640 --> 00:19:26.279 um so the usda again they they put out a report 00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:29.319 not too long ago i didn't write down the date 00:19:31.579 --> 00:19:34.680 But they're changing the timing of their trips. 00:19:34.759 --> 00:19:36.420 They're changing the activities they participate 00:19:36.420 --> 00:19:39.359 in. They're changing how they even experience 00:19:39.359 --> 00:19:42.980 these open spaces, parks, the forests, all these 00:19:42.980 --> 00:19:47.960 kinds of things. So we're seeing that more people 00:19:47.960 --> 00:19:50.740 are starting to also come when the parks expect 00:19:50.740 --> 00:19:53.420 to be kind of quiet. So they're shifting into 00:19:53.420 --> 00:19:57.799 the off season or the shoulder seasons when parks 00:19:57.799 --> 00:20:02.099 aren't staffed as well. Yeah. Interesting. So 00:20:02.099 --> 00:20:07.279 lengthening kind of the park seasons. There's 00:20:07.279 --> 00:20:11.559 more heat related illness issues, which increase 00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:14.880 cost of parks for. Of course, we have to provide 00:20:14.880 --> 00:20:19.259 medical services rightfully. When we have extreme 00:20:19.259 --> 00:20:22.599 or more regular, no longer extreme events like 00:20:22.599 --> 00:20:25.319 flooding, drought. Again, it shuts down parks. 00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:28.980 It affects the infrastructure. changes the visitation 00:20:28.980 --> 00:20:33.579 patterns um i talk about visitation because those 00:20:33.579 --> 00:20:35.420 are the numbers that are easy to measure like 00:20:35.420 --> 00:20:37.740 at a park entrance they're counting you right 00:20:37.740 --> 00:20:39.359 you have to pay a fee you have to like check 00:20:39.359 --> 00:20:42.960 in somehow um the national forests and like the 00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:45.079 um other public lands in the u .s like the bureau 00:20:45.079 --> 00:20:48.539 of land management most of them are kind of like 00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:51.240 they don't have like a fee gate so it's harder 00:20:51.240 --> 00:20:53.200 to estimate their numbers and the impacts on 00:20:53.200 --> 00:20:56.849 the visitation but the tahoe forest for We know, 00:20:56.930 --> 00:20:58.730 even though they don't collect fees in the same 00:20:58.730 --> 00:21:05.190 way. With these cuts, they are small. Like this 00:21:05.190 --> 00:21:07.730 is a small region. They have more visitation 00:21:07.730 --> 00:21:10.630 than Yosemite. Wow. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. And so 00:21:10.630 --> 00:21:14.509 their staffing cuts affects like all their ways 00:21:14.509 --> 00:21:18.190 that they can help visitors when these events 00:21:18.190 --> 00:21:20.670 may be happening or not happening or respond 00:21:20.670 --> 00:21:23.509 to fire, respond to bark beetle outbreaks, respond 00:21:23.509 --> 00:21:27.359 to all this sort of stuff. Yeah. So it has long 00:21:27.359 --> 00:21:30.579 term kind of impacts to the ecosystems. Right. 00:21:30.700 --> 00:21:32.900 And that's what's crazy is that the funding doesn't 00:21:32.900 --> 00:21:35.339 even a lot of people think, oh, it's just kind 00:21:35.339 --> 00:21:37.619 of this like surface. But you kind of spoke on 00:21:37.619 --> 00:21:40.779 how it not only impacts like, of course, jobs 00:21:40.779 --> 00:21:43.140 and job security, but it impacts our research 00:21:43.140 --> 00:21:46.819 on parks, impacts our research on with the species, 00:21:46.960 --> 00:21:49.319 with plant and animal. It impacts human health 00:21:49.319 --> 00:21:51.440 almost in a way because they're, you know, people 00:21:51.440 --> 00:21:53.259 are going at different times. And if they're 00:21:53.259 --> 00:21:55.740 not staffed with medical professional. or the 00:21:55.740 --> 00:21:57.339 amount of medical professionals that they may 00:21:57.339 --> 00:21:59.500 need, then that can be an impact on human health. 00:21:59.599 --> 00:22:02.279 And so that's crazy that just what people think 00:22:02.279 --> 00:22:05.420 are just like some cuts here and there is actually, 00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:08.539 it almost seems detrimental to the park's like 00:22:08.539 --> 00:22:13.140 health and well -being. Yeah. And the proposed 00:22:13.140 --> 00:22:16.039 budget that currently has the government kind 00:22:16.039 --> 00:22:21.240 of shut down. Right. Yeah. One part of it is 00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:27.500 so. The parks represent very little of our national 00:22:27.500 --> 00:22:32.339 sort of budget. Just because I wanted to be accurate 00:22:32.339 --> 00:22:34.759 here, less than one -fifteenth of one percent. 00:22:34.920 --> 00:22:37.660 Oh, my gosh. Our entire federal budget goes to 00:22:37.660 --> 00:22:42.559 the National Park Service specifically. But there 00:22:42.559 --> 00:22:46.200 is approximately $15 of economic activity generated 00:22:46.200 --> 00:22:49.160 for every single dollar we invest in them. Oh, 00:22:49.180 --> 00:22:51.220 my God. So the return on the dollar is huge. 00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:55.940 Yeah. Huge investment. They were already experiencing 00:22:55.940 --> 00:22:58.640 kind of staffing issues. They've had hiring freezes 00:22:58.640 --> 00:23:00.680 over the years. So they've been understaffed 00:23:00.680 --> 00:23:06.819 kind of for a while and underfunded. So since 00:23:06.819 --> 00:23:10.420 2010, they've had a 20 percent reduction in staffing 00:23:10.420 --> 00:23:14.480 and then 24 percent on top of that just in January. 00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:17.680 Oh, my God. But the proposals on the table right 00:23:17.680 --> 00:23:20.240 now for the budget, like this is pretty severe. 00:23:20.720 --> 00:23:24.019 So even though it's tiny, it has a big effect 00:23:24.019 --> 00:23:29.059 on what the parks can and can't do. The administration's 00:23:29.059 --> 00:23:32.740 budget for 2026 is proposing cutting about $1 00:23:32.740 --> 00:23:36.779 billion. So $900 million in reduction to park 00:23:36.779 --> 00:23:41.200 operations, which is a 31 % cut. Kind of the 00:23:41.200 --> 00:23:44.029 biggest one we've seen. Part of the proposal 00:23:44.029 --> 00:23:45.690 is saying we should transfer some of these parks 00:23:45.690 --> 00:23:48.250 back to states or two states in the first place. 00:23:48.289 --> 00:23:50.230 They've never had necessarily controlled them 00:23:50.230 --> 00:23:53.769 in the first place. Right. States also have limited 00:23:53.769 --> 00:23:57.829 budgets, staff and capability to take proper 00:23:57.829 --> 00:24:01.309 care of such. I'm not saying the government always 00:24:01.309 --> 00:24:04.069 take proper care of the land, but the states 00:24:04.069 --> 00:24:06.970 may have even more limited capacity to do so. 00:24:09.369 --> 00:24:14.220 So. That doesn't sound like it's going to work 00:24:14.220 --> 00:24:21.339 out so great. They are also saying, in addition 00:24:21.339 --> 00:24:24.559 to that, $73 million in construction funding. 00:24:25.279 --> 00:24:28.519 So that's like maintenance projects. Right. As 00:24:28.519 --> 00:24:33.180 well as like future sort of needs. $77 million 00:24:33.180 --> 00:24:36.740 cut to recreation and preservation and $197 million 00:24:36.740 --> 00:24:40.259 to historic preservation. Oh, my gosh. That's 00:24:40.259 --> 00:24:46.289 crazy. The house is like slightly better, mildly 00:24:46.289 --> 00:24:50.529 better. Only $176 million they're looking to 00:24:50.529 --> 00:24:54.569 cut. So 6 % of the overall budget. But they're 00:24:54.569 --> 00:24:57.150 also saying $37 million cut to construction. 00:24:58.490 --> 00:25:02.470 Getting rid of the EPA budget by 23%, which again 00:25:02.470 --> 00:25:04.430 is critical to the science programs that go on 00:25:04.430 --> 00:25:07.289 in the parks. Right. The research, clean water, 00:25:07.450 --> 00:25:12.500 clean air, clean all these things. So that's 00:25:12.500 --> 00:25:17.140 not great. And less protection for national monuments, 00:25:17.400 --> 00:25:19.799 which are designated under all this is designated 00:25:19.799 --> 00:25:25.099 under the Antiquities Act. So if we have less 00:25:25.099 --> 00:25:27.740 protection for those areas, that again puts them 00:25:27.740 --> 00:25:31.839 back on the slate for being open to development, 00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:35.119 different kinds of development. Right. The Senate 00:25:35.119 --> 00:25:41.990 has a more balanced approach. They're at least 00:25:41.990 --> 00:25:43.769 not saying we should cut things, but they're 00:25:43.769 --> 00:25:46.150 not giving the parks any more money. It's a flat. 00:25:46.549 --> 00:25:50.369 It's just a flat. Yep. So they can at least do 00:25:50.369 --> 00:25:54.730 what they're currently doing. But they have some 00:25:54.730 --> 00:26:00.190 really important sort of add -ons, I guess. So 00:26:00.190 --> 00:26:03.009 requirements. They want the administration to 00:26:03.009 --> 00:26:06.970 hire and retain staff to perform its mission. 00:26:09.309 --> 00:26:10.869 They want the administration to give Congress 00:26:10.869 --> 00:26:14.529 notice of any reorganization efforts that could 00:26:14.529 --> 00:26:18.950 cause a reduction in park staffing. They want 00:26:18.950 --> 00:26:22.569 to basically block any attempt to deauthorize, 00:26:22.609 --> 00:26:25.230 sell off or transfer units out of the park system. 00:26:25.890 --> 00:26:29.910 They want to get rid of efforts to divert money 00:26:29.910 --> 00:26:33.009 from land and water conservation fund. And they 00:26:33.009 --> 00:26:35.690 want to require notification to Congress of any 00:26:35.690 --> 00:26:37.990 future efforts to cancel park service leases. 00:26:39.490 --> 00:26:42.990 And finally, they're saying that they need to 00:26:42.990 --> 00:26:46.809 double down on and force the timely delivery 00:26:46.809 --> 00:26:49.390 of grant funds for tribal and other community 00:26:49.390 --> 00:26:52.170 driven efforts that help protect and interpret 00:26:52.170 --> 00:26:56.109 these historic resources. So there's kind of 00:26:56.109 --> 00:27:02.069 three proposals out there right now. Right. None 00:27:02.069 --> 00:27:04.190 of it's moving anywhere right now. Yeah. Yeah. 00:27:04.269 --> 00:27:06.910 Everything's just kind of at like it's at a standstill 00:27:06.910 --> 00:27:10.119 right now. It's. crazy where we're at. Well, 00:27:10.299 --> 00:27:12.319 Dr. Ritter, thank you so much for taking the 00:27:12.319 --> 00:27:14.859 time to speak and educate us today. Now that 00:27:14.859 --> 00:27:16.680 we're nearing the end of our podcast, we'd like 00:27:16.680 --> 00:27:18.940 to introduce you to our tradition of offering 00:27:18.940 --> 00:27:21.000 our listeners a chance to implement something 00:27:21.000 --> 00:27:24.279 into their own lives that helps combat climate 00:27:24.279 --> 00:27:27.299 change in some small way. In other words, it's 00:27:27.299 --> 00:27:29.539 our Climate to Action podcast call to action. 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:32.160 Dr. Ritter, throughout your work, you've emphasized 00:27:32.160 --> 00:27:34.099 the importance of collaboration and justice. 00:27:34.779 --> 00:27:37.059 What is one thing our listeners can do to contribute 00:27:37.059 --> 00:27:40.759 to climate action in their own lives today? So 00:27:40.759 --> 00:27:43.960 I know I was asked for something fun, but because 00:27:43.960 --> 00:27:48.579 of where our current political environment is, 00:27:48.799 --> 00:27:53.740 I think it's really important that people continue 00:27:53.740 --> 00:28:03.700 to train yourselves to interpret data. To analyze 00:28:03.700 --> 00:28:09.460 and interpret data, to critically evaluate sources 00:28:09.460 --> 00:28:14.259 of information and even like critically evaluate 00:28:14.259 --> 00:28:16.839 the text that you read around data because we 00:28:16.839 --> 00:28:18.259 just look at it and we go, oh, numbers, that 00:28:18.259 --> 00:28:24.500 must be right. Right. So and the reason I emphasize 00:28:24.500 --> 00:28:30.980 this is your climate action is because it's really. 00:28:31.720 --> 00:28:34.839 sometimes easy for us to like look at a chart 00:28:34.839 --> 00:28:38.859 or a graph and again take it at face value um 00:28:38.859 --> 00:28:42.940 and not that they're using made up numbers or 00:28:42.940 --> 00:28:47.119 anything like this it's that data can be cherry 00:28:47.119 --> 00:28:49.440 picked and misrepresented and then the narrative 00:28:49.440 --> 00:28:52.960 around them is very convincing yeah so being 00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:56.339 able to critically evaluate that that narrative 00:28:56.339 --> 00:29:00.559 and come to your own conclusions Right. Use the 00:29:00.559 --> 00:29:02.720 skills you're developing to come to your own 00:29:02.720 --> 00:29:04.740 conclusions about that and formulate your own 00:29:04.740 --> 00:29:07.619 opinions that are based, that are data driven. 00:29:08.119 --> 00:29:11.720 Right. That's my call to action. I love that. 00:29:11.740 --> 00:29:14.900 That's really interesting. So basically just 00:29:14.900 --> 00:29:17.640 look at data and being able to interpret it and 00:29:17.640 --> 00:29:20.259 analyze it in your own words and kind of being 00:29:20.259 --> 00:29:22.119 able to use that as your driving factor into 00:29:22.119 --> 00:29:24.640 going out. I really like that. It's really, really 00:29:24.640 --> 00:29:27.380 good. Well, thank you so much for sharing your 00:29:27.380 --> 00:29:29.730 insights with us today. I feel that your insight 00:29:29.730 --> 00:29:32.009 on these pressing environmental topics have greatly 00:29:32.009 --> 00:29:34.910 expanded my views and hopefully our listeners' 00:29:35.009 --> 00:29:37.250 views as well and truly opened the minds and 00:29:37.250 --> 00:29:40.150 opened our eyes to a wide variety of topics from 00:29:40.150 --> 00:29:43.930 the Mediterranean basin and geographical locations 00:29:43.930 --> 00:29:46.529 to our national parks and what's happening on 00:29:46.529 --> 00:29:50.069 the political side of climate. It's been incredible 00:29:50.069 --> 00:29:51.970 hearing about the work you're doing, and we encourage 00:29:51.970 --> 00:29:54.009 everyone listening to check out the resources 00:29:54.009 --> 00:29:56.490 Dr. Ritter mentioned and take action in their 00:29:56.490 --> 00:29:59.230 own lives. Want to hear more from Climate to 00:29:59.230 --> 00:30:02.450 Action, a CSUSM student podcast? Be sure to check 00:30:02.450 --> 00:30:04.750 us out wherever you get your podcasts and follow 00:30:04.750 --> 00:30:07.730 us on our socials at Climate to Action. That's 00:30:07.730 --> 00:30:10.569 at Climate to Action on Instagram and at Climate, 00:30:10.670 --> 00:30:12.970 the number two action on TikTok. We'll be posting 00:30:12.970 --> 00:30:15.269 updates, behind the scenes content, and so much 00:30:15.269 --> 00:30:17.910 more. Remember, it's never too late to start 00:30:17.910 --> 00:30:20.190 making a difference in the climate crisis. Keep 00:30:20.190 --> 00:30:22.670 learning, keep acting, and keep pushing for change. 00:30:23.109 --> 00:30:25.710 Until next time, this is Climate to Action signing 00:30:25.710 --> 00:30:28.960 off. Climate to Action is recorded at Inspiration 00:30:28.960 --> 00:30:32.220 Studios on the CSUSM campus. 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