This is Climate to Action, a CSUSM student podcast.
Climate to Action is an initiative of the Climate
Action and Sustainability Center at California
State University San Marcos. My name is Molly
Sarwatari. I am a third year political science
major with a sustainability minor. I am interested
in climate action because I want to be able to
speak up for the voiceless as I work toward my
future career in environmental law. And I'm Alex
Sandoval. I'm a third year student and I'm majoring
in psychology. Being a part of a Climate to Action
podcast has given me more knowledge about the
climate crisis while also learning the ropes
and being part of a podcast. We're here to amplify
voices and explore solutions in the fight against
climate change and to address climate injustice
for all living things. We are committed to incorporating
discussions on Indigenous knowledge in addressing
the climate crisis and to provide a call to action
in every episode. But first, we'd like to acknowledge
that our recording studio is located on the traditional
territory of the Luiseno -Payamcoicham people.
CSUSM and its surrounding areas are still home
to the six federally recognized bands of the
La Jolla, Paula, Palma, Pechanga, Rincon, and
Sabobo -Luiseno -Payamcoicham people. It's also
important to acknowledge that this land remains
the shared space among the Kupenyo, Kumeyaay,
and Ipai peoples. Today's episode is focused
on citizen science and climate action. We are
delighted to introduce a special guest, Rebecca
Lewis, the Scotland and Northern Ireland Manager
for Bug Life in the UK. Thank you for being here
with us today. Welcome, Rebecca. Thanks for having
me. So Rebecca, why don't you tell us a little
bit about yourself, kind of what got you into
citizen science, what kind of made you want to
go into like bug life, anything like that? I
think I've got really strong memories of my dad
in the garden building solar panels on our lawn.
You know, that's that curiosity. He was always,
you know, I grew up and I'd be in the shower
and he'd come and he had to switch on the outside
and turn it off and say, you know, we've got
to save energy. So I kind of grew up like that,
understanding the importance of how much we use
and our impact on the natural environment. Having
a garden full of multiple... animals and learning
how to look after and care for them and learning
what their needs were. So, you know, it was learning
how to nurture and care from an early age. Since
this is a podcast about climate action, we'd
love if you could tell us and our listeners how
and when you first became aware of the climate
crisis. I think you have daily reminders of the
climate crisis. I think there's no one point
in time, as I mentioned, you know, my dad and
also my mum who used to to cook and make things
and saying well you know that you have to be
taking care of our resources so that link to
resource of the link to resilience within our
system and i think in my job on a daily basis
you know i had a recent uh events through one
of our programs of like a remote community and
we were out looking at sites to monitor uh the
rivers And we went to the site and I dipped my
hand in the water and it was just uncomfortably
warm. You know, and it's these continual reminders
of the impact it's having. You know, that again,
just kind of inspires you to do something as
well as has that little bit of kind of fear around
it. So I would say it's a regular thing. Watching
the bees come out in the garden and noticing
that the flowers aren't ready yet. You know,
it's these kind of things. It's disrupting our
system. Yeah, absolutely. There's definitely
daily reminders. Like I feel like I can't even
walk to class without telling that there's a
little pond at CCUSM and it like dries up so
fast or like this tree is like not blooming at
the same time it used to be three years ago,
anything like that. And you also mentioned the
bees, how like the pollen is not ready for them
and they can't actually like do their job, I
guess, in our ecosystem. What are some other
ways that climate change is affecting the invertebrate
species and habits that Bug Life works to protect?
Well, Bug Life protects all invertebrates. So
we've got multiple people within the organisation.
We're looking at our species -rich grasslands
and wildflower meadow areas that you might be
familiar with, but also our peatlands and our
freshwater, but also our protected species as
well. So we're looking at it on different levels,
which climate change impacts across them all.
So you're looking at your peatland areas. as
climate change increases, the flow of water is
going to change. But you also get something called
brownification coming in. So if water is sort
of running through these areas, it's collecting
these particulate matter, it's darkening the
water. And as the climate change, of course,
you know, it's darker, it's absorbing more of
the heat. So there's many different layers about
it. I mean, it's changing the order in which
things happen and shifting the temperature dependent
processes in which invertebrates depend. So a
lot of our work is about making our habitats
resilient to it as well. So creating more space
for invertebrates. With our river systems, we're
looking at increasing the coverage and planting
up and repairing areas. So areas that aren't
impacted by other things, for example, just need
that shade for our rivers. But climate change
is also exacerbating impacts we currently have
as well. So we're kind of fighting against all
these multiple layers, but it's just building
up the system. But importantly, also making people
aware. A lot of the work we do within our organisation,
across all of our programmes, is about bringing
people into the picture, about educating, about
talking about what we do. A classic example,
I guess, is Wither Freshwater, one of our projects,
Guardians of Our Rivers, working with the Riverfly
Partnership, bringing people to the water. And
a lot of the invertebrates... are ones that they've
never seen and actually don't even know exist.
So it's about bringing invertebrates alive for
everybody. And so they're no longer hidden. If
something's hidden, then you can't care about
it. Why should you? You don't even know it's
there. So a lot of it's conversational pieces,
getting people involved. Yeah, absolutely. Is
there a particular species or ecosystem that
you believe to be especially vulnerable to climate
-related changes? Or is it pretty much just the
whole... ecosystem as a whole. Well, I think
we have to keep the conversation as an ecosystem
at whole. I mean, you can go in to look at particular
environments. The freshwater environment, for
example, is particularly vulnerable. Our climate
change is having a profound effect on river ecosystems.
Freshwater vertebrates being particularly vulnerable
to these changes, you know, they're trapped within
the system. And these are small but crucial organisms
and they play a vital role on the aquatic food
webs. ecosystem functioning as a whole so with
invertebrates because they are that trophic layer
they're supporting everything else above so when
you're looking at protecting them across the
system and looking at protecting across the impacts
of things like climate change it's the advantage
to everything else above so I think if you want
a particular story we've got this little chap
the upland summer mayfly So people think about
the wintertime, they think about snow, especially
in Scotland, we get lots of snow. But this is
no longer the case. We're getting less and less
snow and that snow line is moving north. So this
little mayfly was using the snow to insulate.
Well, the snow insulates its habitat, covers
over these streams and it's helping it to survive.
But now the snow is no longer there. It's having
to shift its range. So you can talk about climate
change in general, which I think we always should,
how it affects our day -to -day lives. But also
if you want to look at these individual stories
to help people follow them, what's happening
to demonstrate. Yeah, there's lots of examples
of that as well. Yeah, that gives like a really
specific example that somebody could, you know,
understand better. In what ways do invertebrates
contribute to ecosystem resilience against climate
change? There's lots of ways. I think in, you
know, sort of a larger umbrella, they are storage.
They help the carbon sequestration and storage.
Their activity increasing soil carbon storage
within the marine system. They're the carbon
cyclers as well. Little super powered carbon
capture superheroes, I guess. With ecosystem
adaptation, they provide seed dispersal, help
with the kind of regulation, improving infiltration
and retention with an environment. If you think
about the worms in our garden, for example, it's
good to have... you know examples that people
can think about so they're burrowing into the
soil they're creating these wee tunnels so when
it rains the water isn't just flowing off it's
actually infiltrating into the soil it's the
same mimicked in our freshwater environment where
we've got mayfly that do the same kind of burrowing
technique into the bed of the rivers so they
help retain the the water on the land rather
than it running straight off um but also there's
a the feedback mechanisms and disturbance recovery
they can help to accelerate ecosystem recovery
following things like wild farms and storms for
example but they're also a can be a pioneer species
so often facilitate that succession after extreme
events so they perform lots of really important
functions and helping build a resilience you
kind of touched based on how ecosystems and how
like invertebrates in general can kind of um
adapt to the conservation but how does bug life
in itself adapt to the conservation strategies
in response to the effects of climate change
yeah i think as an organization we contribute
across many layers and equally um they're all
equally important in our eyes i guess from contributing
to um policy legislation changes right down to
community level, where we're talking to people
on the ground. I think it's highlighting the
importance of things. We've got campaigns like
our light pollution campaign, which people generally
don't think about, working with the planning
systems, both local and governmental. So when
they're designing these systems, how can we make
sure that there's space for nature and nature
is protected within that? But I think we value...
We do value these conversations on all levels.
It's not just talking to those looking at policy
and legislation. It's talking to everyday people
who can make changes within their lives and help
to connect the dots to understand. Yeah, absolutely.
I think it's important to... to talk about that
how it's not just a legislation and you know
the power holders because people at least in
my opinion I feel like personally I wouldn't
know the first thing to do so it's good to have
something like an organization like this to to
have that to get information on can you tell
us more about citizen science yeah um it's a
particular area close to my heart I guess um
I think years ago when I was studying at university,
you know, the thought of citizen science was
just a side thought, I guess. You know, the data's
not really important. It's not going to tell
us enough. It's not real science. And over the
years, I worked with lots of species recovery
programs. And, you know, when you're trying to
recover vast areas over short spaces of time,
you need people. And that's where citizen science
comes in. And that's, you know, that's what provides
the magic. I guess you're joining it together.
But citizen science. can provide data a lot of
the techniques that we use now are driven by
science have been tried and tested we have one
particular project with our guardians of a river
it's been going for over 10 years through the
river fly partnership we we know um we have faith
in the data we're working with our environment
agencies as well that are using the data but
i think the big question we've got to ask ourselves
of where does responsibility lie So with climate
change, we are all responsible. We all contribute.
We all take from the environment and we all give
to the environment as well. So everybody has
that role to play. So with our Gardens Over Rivers
project, for example, we're going out to communities
across Scotland and we're delivering training
on how to monitor their local watercourses. So
understanding what is in their doorstep. how
it's impacted what is currently being done and
what you can do about it how you can be involved
it's also making it simple not taking too much
of their time making it sustainable within itself
people think about you know you have to make
everything you do sustainable including citizen
science um but yeah i think the biggest thing
about that particular project is what comes back
you know we have our training program we have
our scientific knowledge but also going into
communities there's so much learning and understanding
to gain that can help us in the fight against
climate change to to bring both these knowledge
bases together Yeah, absolutely. I know so many
people who go to the school who actually don't
even know what citizen science is or have never
even heard of it. I'm fortunate enough to be
that sustainability minor. And I took Professor
Dabb's course and we talked a lot about citizen
science and what it was. So I was able to kind
of understand what citizen science is for. And
like you said, it's truly like a magic because
it brings communities together to help like combat
climate change. You kind of talked about the
Guardians of the River project. However, is there
a project of citizen science that's your favorite
or a project of yours, your own organization,
that's your favorite to work on or that you've
produced? Yeah, I think. the guardians of a river
was project that i i um worked on within bug
life but there is other citizen science project
that i've been lucky to be involved in um and
we if you go on to our our website um there's
a project looking at it's called bee lines and
what it has is it's mapped out the the whole
of the uk with this kind of insect super highway
so it's a way of and personally at home i've
got a patch in my garden that i've let go wild
um i can actually go in and register that on
the super highway and what it is is trying to
build the connectivity across the country but
it collects um all projects including the ones
that we are delivering as an organization But
yeah, all over citizen science across the country.
There's also another one where you can download
an app on your phone. I don't know if you remember
as kids going out driving and having to clean
off the windscreen because of all these little
tiny little corpses all over. But what we notice
is that's not happening so much anymore. So what
Bug Life has is they've come up with this citizen
science project where you can clean off your
registration plate, you can take a photograph,
download the app. and then before you go on your
journey and when you come back from your journey
you take another photograph and it counts the
little carcasses so there's lots of kind of fun
ways of getting involved but they're what they're
showing is is really big declines in invertebrates
so it also helps that general understanding I've
never thought about that. I was just wiping my
windshield yesterday and I was thinking the same
thing. Like, I don't see it as much. Or usually
when you travel, I feel like it's when you notice
it the most. Right. I feel like I used to have
to scrape it off like like once a week. And now
it's like, oh, I can go like two months without
scraping it off. It just gets dirty. But I didn't
realize that's like a negative thing. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I think the last result, I mean, I don't
want to misquote here, but I think the slide
I was talking about in the lecture earlier, they
noted about 62 % declines. But if you look into
some of our individual species as well, there
was a particular spider I was looking at, you
know, it's seeing 79 % decline of this. I mean,
the numbers are extraordinarily high. The State
of Nature report think the more recent one is
talking about an overall 33 % decline. So we're
talking about really big numbers. And if you
were thinking about that trophic layer, again,
going back to that and what our invertebrates
are supporting, it has impacts, kind of a bit
of a cascade. So get involved. Yes. How can citizen
science make climate change more visible and
climate action more accessible to everyone? Yeah,
I guess it is what it says on the tin. Design
is for citizens. it's it's enabling people to
have the conversations and there's lots of opportunities
to be able to do that um with our projects you
know there's there's some examples there and
and you know there's other organizations of course
if if you don't happen to to enjoy invertebrates
that i'll never fully understand of course because
they're so awesome but yeah it just enables you
in your day -to -day life to to be thinking um
about climate change and the variety of of ways
that you can contribute in a variety of programs
that allow you to connect to actually collect
data and to make some change but yeah just keep
talking and having these conversations yeah absolutely
and you mentioned earlier that you just said
like get involved that's most important is there
a way that our listeners can specifically get
involved in citizen science Absolutely. There's
loads and loads of options. But I think what
I would start with is go out for a walk locally,
go and explore your local area and think about
things that you enjoy, where your heart is, what
you enjoy doing and the areas of nature where
you would want to contribute to. Because the
thing about any science or any data collection
is you want that long term connection for the
long term data. Okay, so that's the first thing.
And I think there's lots of organisations, lots
of ourselves, you would then kind of look up
or you can contact them to say, I'm really interested
in my part of the world. I'm interested in, say,
my lake or the river running into my land. I'm
interested in looking at this. green park that's
that's mowed on a regular basis that could quite
easily be a welfare meadow what can i do there's
loads and loads of online resources and i think
the other thing as well is is to get more people
involved you know so you can build up your own
community group or often you can join the groups
that are already um established but yeah start
start with what matters to you first and and
explore locally and then take it from there I
think that's important too, especially in San
Diego County. We have so many places that we
could take a deeper look into. In every episode
of our podcast, we have a call to action. We
like to ask our guests their thoughts about what
our listeners can do to positively impact our
community. What are some simple things people
can do to help address the climate crisis? I
think that depends on your time. As a mother
of three, working full -time doing a phd i know
that time is of the essence yeah so you want
to start and look at your household you want
to start and look at your garden you know think
of simple simple actions let no more let it grow
no more me there's all these sort of slogans
out there that's really easy um so just just
choose a patch let it let it go wild see the
flowers coming through you know you can then
go and do something that's called a timed insect
count or a fit count where you get a a meter
square i use duct tape because duct tape's good
for everything right right yeah you can make
a square and put it on your lawn put it on before
and and count sit there for 10 minutes all the
instructions are online um count for 10 minutes
and you're looking at the number of invertebrates
that visit that area you then let it grow and
then do the same thing and you can see the difference
and you can enter the data You know, think about
wet wipes. So you flushing down the toilet. Think
about the flea treatment you might lose in your
dog, the dishwashing liquid powder you're using.
There's loads of little things on a day to day.
And then you can get step to the bigger things
that are happening. Collecting data from the
environment around you, like projects like Guardians
of our Rivers. But yeah, try not to overwhelm
yourself. Because we need to conserve our conservationists,
the conservationists in all of us. You cannot
do everything yourself and you can't do everything
at once. But make these small things happen on
a daily basis. Yeah, that's truly amazing. I
know as college students, time is really of the
essence, especially right now we're recording
this. It's about to be finals week. And I know
I'm stressed out. I can't even imagine how like
our senior class is feeling with figuring out
what the next steps in their life are. And so.
You're so right about not letting it overwhelm
because even I have to remind myself, too. I
can't like, yes, I can start the change, but
I as one person am not going to 360 climate change
or 180, I guess, not 360. I as one human being
can't completely 180 climate change. However,
I can be the voice that stands up and kind of
start that or I can be the person in my household
with my roommates who's like, hey, let's not
leave the light on overnight or. Why is the AC
at 50 degrees? Turn the water off when you brush
your teeth. Exactly. Like we don't need to be
taking an hour long shower or anything like that.
There's such easy ways that you can kind of add
to combating climate change. And I think that's
something that's really overlooked. I also think
it's something you can do together. Like, obviously,
now that we talked with you, we could take it
back to our peers, our friends. And even like
that thing with the duct tape, I think that would
be something fun to do with your friends, your
family. I mean, anybody really. Thank you all
for tuning in to this episode of Climate to Action.
Remember, whether it's through learning more,
making sustainable choices or advocating for
change, every step counts. Keep taking action
and we'll see you next time. Want to hear more
from Climate to Action, a CSUSM student podcast?
Listen wherever you get your podcasts and follow
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it's at climate2action. Visit for updates, behind
-the -scenes content, and more. Finally, Climate2Action
wants to remind you to take climate action. We
challenge you to take the first steps in your
own climate journey. Like Rebecca suggested,
let's make sure that we take time for ourselves
and really can take into consideration each individual
impact that we have. Let's transform our climate
curiosity and climate action together. Remember,
every small change can create a big impact when
working collectively. Climate to Action is produced
at Inspiration Studios on the CCUSM campus and
is funded through a generous donation from the
Rosemary Kramer Raitt Foundation. Until next
time, this is Alex and Molly from Climate to
Action signing off.