1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,000 Hello and welcome to another episode of Articulations. 2 00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:09,000 Tamara Chalabi, co-founder of Itterate, is joined by Iliadora Marghelos, 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:12,000 a multidisciplinary artist based in Athens, Greece, 4 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:19,000 whose vibrant depictions of Greek typography and mythology reflect her mixed heritage. 5 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:24,000 Exploring themes of feminine roleplay, nostalgia and contemporary vitality, 6 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:32,000 Marghelos often uses steel wire screens and floating islets of coloured threads to guide her visual language. 7 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:39,000 Marghelos earned a BA in Art from Yale University and has held solo exhibitions at Barth Gallery, Los Angeles, 8 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:44,000 and Deo Horia, Athens, as well as esteemed institutions worldwide, 9 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:51,000 including the Museum of Greek Modern Culture in Athens and Louise Bourgeois' Sunday Salons in New York. 10 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:59,000 Iliadora collaborated with Inash, an organisation which employs Palestinian women in refugee camps in Lebanon, 11 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:03,000 specialised in the tradition of cross-stitch embroidery or tatris, 12 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:08,000 to produce five embroidery editions of her work, named Stoking Embers, 13 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:14,000 as part of Itterate's Variation Project that featured in Itterate's booth 14 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:23,000 with the exhibition A Running Thread as editions of Art Design Fair in Dubai from 6-9 November 2024. 15 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:29,000 Thank you for joining us on a new episode of Articulations. 16 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,000 Thank you for having me. A pleasure being with you. 17 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:42,000 I wanted to start by asking you why were you drawn to taking part in the Itterate Variations Project and the remaking of your work? 18 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:50,000 The idea of working together with women and connecting through embroidery added a new layer of meaning to my work. 19 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:56,000 Being able to use the same techniques such as cross-stitching that you also mentioned, 20 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:07,000 and connect through a similar creative language from a distance, opens up a new way of communicating visually. 21 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:17,000 The initiative Variations shows Itterate's commitment to engaging with various communities, 22 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:24,000 raise awareness of how diverse the art world can become when introduced properly. 23 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:28,000 Was there anything in particular that worried you about such a thing? 24 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:34,000 Do you know in terms of imagining that your work was going to be reproduced by someone else by hand, 25 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:38,000 could have a different outcome to your original work? 26 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:41,000 I expected it to be so from the beginning. 27 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:47,000 I think it's part of the process of additioning my embroideries that you expect differences, 28 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:51,000 and it can be interesting and add to the addition works. 29 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:56,000 Did the act of collaboration itself influence the final pieces in ways you hadn't anticipated? 30 00:02:56,000 --> 00:03:06,000 Embroidery as a practice is a solitary meditative process that requires a lot of time alone with a needle and thread. 31 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:12,000 It's appealing to share this process with others and establish a dialogue. 32 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:16,000 What was the process involved in the making of the five editions? 33 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:23,000 When I was first approached by Itterate to produce embroideries for Inache, 34 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:28,000 the intention was to generate limited editions of five, 35 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:33,000 and I began to stitch a design that would be eloquent enough for additioning. 36 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:39,000 When the original embroidery was sent to Beirut at Inache Association, 37 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:47,000 the design was distributed to a group of five Palestinian refugee women employed by the association 38 00:03:47,000 --> 00:03:50,000 that had a lot of experience in cross-stitching, 39 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:54,000 and that's how the editions came to life. 40 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:56,000 What did this collaboration mean to you? 41 00:03:56,000 --> 00:04:03,000 How do you feel it added layers to your work, given your interest in both heritage and craft? 42 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:11,000 It is much more interesting and appealing to share this process with others to establish a visual dialogue. 43 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:16,000 The collaboration with Inache to create a series of editions 44 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:21,000 was a way of bridging cultural and geographic distance. 45 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:28,000 Yeah, it also creates a conversation across the borders in a way that's interesting through the work itself, 46 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,000 even though you haven't actually met the women directly. 47 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:37,000 I recall you mentioning that you built stories through titles and color compositions, 48 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:40,000 and wondered if you could share more about your creative process 49 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:44,000 and how this approach played out in the creation and labeling 50 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:50,000 of colors like orange sparks and red coals of the Stoking Embers series. 51 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:58,000 When I start to work on a new piece, I try to assemble various materials and create forms 52 00:04:58,000 --> 00:05:02,000 that will best convey the feeling I want to communicate. 53 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:06,000 The thought process at first can be quite instinctive 54 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:11,000 and then progressively obtain meaning that will result in a title. 55 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,000 How did the titles come to you? 56 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:18,000 I choose color based on the overall feeling I'm portraying. 57 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:24,000 With the threads, I draw inspiration from symbolic motifs I found in nature 58 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:32,000 that are put together in a landscape of abstracted elements such as water, the sky, 59 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,000 the light of the sun and the moon. 60 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:36,000 These are all part of the composition. 61 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:43,000 The titles, particularly in this series of editions, Stoking Embers, 62 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:52,000 have a direct reference to color and the variations of colors you can find in burnt wood. 63 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:56,000 I know you refer to nature, to the Greek islands in particular, 64 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,000 but also to mythology in a larger scale. 65 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:05,000 Embroidery and weaving are both ancient practices known since antiquity. 66 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:11,000 They're mostly known to us through references in mythology 67 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:16,000 and descriptions of society at the time. 68 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:21,000 It's a practice that's always been attributed to women. 69 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:27,000 I'm interested in working on this traditional attribution of women to weaving. 70 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:32,000 Do you relate to any particular character in Greek mythology in the Odyssey, Homer's Odyssey? 71 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:39,000 We've got Penelope, we've got Ariadne, we've got Artemis, and female figures connected to weaving. 72 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:44,000 The passage of time telling stories, even Freud refers to the symbolism of weaving. 73 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:46,000 Did you resonate with this? 74 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:52,000 Definitely. The first reference you made to the Odyssey and Penelope, 75 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:59,000 what's highlighted through her weaving in the story of the Odyssey, 76 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:07,000 is how she cultivates patience and devotion and her ability to sort of undo. 77 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:15,000 It's very inspiring to be living on the grounds of a country that has such richness of culture from antiquity 78 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:21,000 and references to weaving from such an early age as feminine qualities. 79 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:27,000 In many myths, like the ones you mentioned, the story of Penelope in the Odyssey 80 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:38,000 and Ariadne, the thread is a way of showing the passage of time and qualities that women cultivate as mothers. 81 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:42,000 You began teaching yourself embroidery during your first pregnancy, 82 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:45,000 and much of your work explores themes of feminine role play. 83 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:48,000 I know you have seen women in your family use it. 84 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:54,000 So how did the craft connection to women, often passed down through generations, shape your approach to it? 85 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:59,000 It's true that the experience of pregnancy led me to embroidery. 86 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:06,000 I began this new way of illustrating a visual language to use in my work. 87 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:12,000 I grew up witnessing members of my family use threads as a means of expression. 88 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:18,000 My grandmothers were always embroidering or knitting when I was a child. 89 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:23,000 These images played a role in this newly adopted language. 90 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:27,000 That I acquired when I was expecting my first child. 91 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:34,000 There is definitely magic in describing the passage of time through the length of the thread. 92 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:40,000 How do you think motherhood influenced your artistic practice beyond the initial learning of embroidery? 93 00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:49,000 I think becoming a mother has changed my life in many ways, mostly in the way I work as an artist. 94 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:54,000 Embroidery has a high tolerance to mistakes. 95 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:58,000 If you don't like it, you can cut the thread and start over. 96 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:07,000 Embroidery welcomes the evolution of time through this hand-making process and cultivates feelings. 97 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:18,000 Motherhood introduces in a woman's life, such as patience, longing, and watching growth in a physical way. 98 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:28,000 Do you find that you can replicate that in embroidery or is it another element of it that mirrors the process of mothering? 99 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:32,000 Definitely mirrors it, but also completes it. 100 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:39,000 One next to the other, they work together, able to coexist from this experience of being a mother. 101 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:43,000 With regards to the compositions of your embroidery, you have a unique language. 102 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:46,000 Visually speaking, you don't follow traditional embroidery techniques. 103 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:51,000 How do you develop this visual language, especially the floating eyelet, 104 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:55,000 that is repetitive in your embroidered cross-stitch work? 105 00:09:55,000 --> 00:10:00,000 My first embroidery works were traditional cross-stitching on canvas. 106 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:07,000 These initial works had a two-dimensional feel, like drawing on paper. 107 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:15,000 The evolution of my work towards what you described, the floating eyelets and drifting away from the traditional embroidery techniques, 108 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:21,000 led to a more sculptural approach to embroidery. 109 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:35,000 There is a more dynamic presence of negative space through light and alternative surfaces I work on, such as the iron mesh as a canvas. 110 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:45,000 Would you say that there is any specific inspiration of artists that you admire, such as Louise Bourgeois or Johannes Vermeer? 111 00:10:45,000 --> 00:10:52,000 Louise Bourgeois's work is very inspirational to me. 112 00:10:52,000 --> 00:11:00,000 I really like the juxtaposition she does with various materials, hard and soft. 113 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,000 Her works have always spoken to me. 114 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:12,000 Vermeer was the master of light, and he could really achieve a high level of mastery of light. 115 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,000 I grew up admiring his use of light. 116 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:21,000 How do you find yourself applying it in your work or processing it and the patterns? 117 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:27,000 I'd say experimenting with other surfaces and the embroidery canvas. 118 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:36,000 My way of trying to play with light as a medium, I find that with iron mesh, these metal screens I use, 119 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:46,000 you can achieve an interesting negative space next to positive by playing with the transparency of this material 120 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:52,000 and the reflections of light through the shattering of these eyelet sign border. 121 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:58,000 Can you speak to how you choose your materials and what they represent in your storytelling? 122 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:04,000 To me, this iron lash is a material with a lot of potential to experiment with light. 123 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:19,000 It introduces various effects of positive space next to the background of shadows that form through reflection and transparency. 124 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:27,000 I experimented recently with mirror together with this iron mesh, and this adds a new reading to it. 125 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:32,000 I haven't shown it yet, but it has interesting results. 126 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:47,000 The softness of the thread together with the structural quality of metal try to illustrate a harmony between the vulnerability of feelings and the resilience of spirit. 127 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:53,000 I guess that's the dynamic I try to balance out through my works. 128 00:12:53,000 --> 00:13:01,000 You explored culture at Yale for your undergraduate degree. Do you think it influences your process with your installation work? 129 00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:11,000 It certainly does. It became clear to me throughout college, I could more easily express myself in a three-dimensional way. 130 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:22,000 Yale as an experience played a critical role at helping me become more self-aware in relationship to my work, acknowledging strengths and weaknesses. 131 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:35,000 What do you think of the fact that textile art as a medium or works on textile or with thread are becoming more mainstream within contemporary art today in a way we're not before? 132 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:50,000 More and more artists employing textile and thread in their work shows a will to explore in a more sensitive way the evolution of craftsmanship, 133 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:56,000 the boundaries between fine art and craftsmanship are constantly challenged and blurred. 134 00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:03,000 I find that very interesting because one does not exclude the other. I like the direction this is taking. 135 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:12,000 It shows an acceptance of what used to be labeled as tradition in the context of a more patriarchal society. 136 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:18,000 Now there's more acceptance in ways of creating that were attributed to women. 137 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:30,000 I like the fact that this medium is used by men as well. So patriarchy as we knew it is definitely being challenged. 138 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:39,000 I know you've been very busy with exciting projects ahead. What's next for you? Can you tell us more about your current and future projects? 139 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:53,000 We'll see where the next few years take us. Playwork is going towards larger scales and involvement in projects that include other forms of craftsmanship. 140 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:57,000 I'm more interested in working with other artists on craftsmanship. 141 00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:06,000 So collaboration with Iterar-Tex, the production of editions and collaborations on large scale installations. 142 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:15,000 I'm excited to see where it's going to go. Thank you for joining us and we're looking forward to seeing your work soon. 143 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:31,000 Thank you Tamara.