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Hello everyone and welcome to the Within Range coaching podcast. I'm Ranger, a certified

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holistic success coach. And in this podcast, I break down the journey entrepreneurs face

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as they start their organizations, overcome roadblocks in their way, and create an impact

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that lasts. We talk with entrepreneurs, nonprofit leaders, and purpose driven community members

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just like you. Together, we learn how to grow our impact and develop ourselves as the people

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behind the mission. My intention is to help more people, help more people. And remember,

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if you're curious about expanding your impact, growing a community, or defining your mission,

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vision, or values, we can chat off the record. You can find my info in the show notes or at my

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website withinrangecoaching.com. We're also looking to build our sponsor community with

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organizations and individuals who align with our values of fearless innovation, social responsibility,

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and courageous candor. If you're interested in helping us highlight individuals doing great work

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in the world and share these values, reach out to me directly at ranger at withinrangecoaching.com.

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I know you're just as eager to get started as I am. So let's jump right in. Good morning,

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good afternoon and good evening, everybody. And welcome to today's episode of the Within

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Range Coaching podcast. We're continuing on with my Walk Across America series. And in today's

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episode, we are speaking with David Matthews of Bike Friendly ATL. Our discussion today dives in

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on David's background of being a high performing tennis player, a life changing accident, and,

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of course, why he decided to place white bikes all over the southeast. So sit back, relax,

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and let's dive into today's discussion. All right, everybody. And we are joined now by David

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Matthews of Bike Friendly ATL. David, thank you so much for joining us today. You're welcome. Enjoy.

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Yeah, I appreciate it. And the reason I wanted you on the podcast is because, again, this is part of

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my Walk Across America series where I'm interviewing nonprofit leaders, entrepreneurs, community

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members that I've met along the way or in some way have influenced my walk. And to be completely

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honest, this is the first time that we've talked, you know, with audio or video or met at all. And

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that's kind of unique to most of the other guests that I've had on the episode. You know, usually

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I've had a conversation or met with them in person. But really, the reason that I reached out to you

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and Bike Friendly ATL is because your mission and what you do, I guess, I don't know the right word

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to say, I guess impacted, I don't know, spooked me a little bit, I guess might be kind of a good way

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or. I don't know, it's just a really poignant message that you guys have with your ghost bikes.

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And I would really love to just kind of share the your mission, what you guys do with your I don't

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know if you would call them art installations or memorials or what you would do. But I just think

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that it's a very unique project that you guys have going on. So thank you for taking the time to hang

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out with me today.

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Absolutely. My pleasure. Anything I can do to spread awareness, create a safer, total and total

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safer environment for everybody to grow up and live life with is definitely what we're after.

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Perfect. Yeah. And then just to kind of jump it off, David, if you could just explain a little bit

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about your background kind of leading up to Bike Friendly ATL, and then we can really get into your

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mission with the ghost bikes and what they represent.

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Sure, I guess. I guess, you know, being a former athlete, I don't want to say world class tennis

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player because people think world class is like on TV. You know, there's no sub sub categories,

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which there are there are two or three other subcategories to being on the TV. But I played a lot

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of high level tennis around the around the United States around in Europe, represented the country a

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couple of times for all national teams. So, you know, I was a pretty good tennis player, whether

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that's good or bad or ugly. That's just the way it was. Started training a lot of my training early

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on for tennis mostly, but I was originally a basketball nut. I love basketball growing up. And

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I learned at about the age of 20, used to do a lot of long distance running, you know, for training

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and stamina work and things like that. And I have one of my when I walked on my fifth year of

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eligibility in college, I was going to walk on for the basketball team. I finally got in a growth

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spurt late later than most. My growth spurt came from about 19 to 20 years old. I grew seven inches

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in 18 months. And people were like, wait a minute, and I was still in the community that I grew up in.

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So all my friends were like, what are you eating? You know, what are you? What drug you on or

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something? And I was like, Oh, my gosh, I have nothing. But all of a sudden, I went from about 510

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out of high school to about 65 in about 18 months. And all of a sudden, basketball became actually I

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could actually maybe play a forward position or something. Whereas normally, 510, you ain't gonna

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play nothing. And so I was in my coach, assistant coach, then in college, the team that I walked on

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and made it my division two school. He came in one day to the dorm and he said, Hey, let's go down

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to the clinic. I got a friend, you know, in the clinic, let's go visit him and you know, kind of,

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you know, raise his spirits a little bit just had knee surgery. And I'm like, Oh, my gosh, yeah, you

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know, and I'm thinking what kind of clinic is this? You know, is this inpatient? Or is this

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inpatient outpatient? Is it for other other things? I don't know. And we get down there. And when we

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walked in his room, I looked to my left at the in the doorway, and I looked to my left and his

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crutches were as tall about head top of my head height. And I'm going Wait a minute. This is not a

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normal guy. This is a big guy. It well it was tree Rollins who played for the Atlanta Hawks. He was

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he was in Columbus, having knee surgery and at the Houston Clinic back then was very world renowned

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for all these athletes flying in for knee surgery. And I mean, like seconds after I was in the

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doorway, all of a sudden, this is this assistant came in, and she was followed by another assistant

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rolling an exercise bike. And Dr. Houston followed them all in and I just kind of scooted over either

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the way what they kind of scooted me out of the way. And Dr. Houston says, you know, look at tree

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Rollins and he says, Well, time for you to get to work. And he goes, Well, Doc, I just had surgery

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yesterday at four o'clock. What are you talking about? I need some pain meds. He goes, get your

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butt up and get on the bike. And let's get that knee ready to go. You need to get back in uniform

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soon. And I'm like, hmm, if you have knee surgery, and the first thing the doctor wants to do like 12

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14 hours later gets you on a exercise bike. My cogs in my head, my gears in my head started

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turning. And as soon as Dr. Houston got through a tree and got him on the bike, and it was kind of a

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painful experience, you know, Dr. Houston got over by me and I said, I gotta ask you one question,

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Dr. What if I had gotten on the bike before having knee surgery? What? Tell me about that when he

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goes, one of the best ways to build your knees is a bicycle. It has no pounding on it. It has, you

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know, total range of motion, you're building the quadriceps, which supports the knee more than

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anything. He goes, a lot of knee surgeries will not be will not be happening. If people get on

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bikes instead of running. And sure enough, through the years, I've watched some of my I've had one

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of my 10 students, he qualified for the Boston Marathon one year, loved running. But after about

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two or three years of really training and go to the Boston marathon, he, you know, basically got on

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a bike too, because your knees just take a brutal pounding by running. And it's not a bad thing. Some

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people can do it. But some people, a lot of people can't. That's why orthopedic surgeons are in big

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demand. And so since since college, I started cycling a lot. And then at the age of 52, still

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playing really high level tennis here in the Atlanta area. Got hit head on by a automobile on

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a training ride one day in Tucker, Georgia, and gentleman 86 year old came across the road hit me

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literally head on my face went right into his windshield. The bridge of mine, I had like, what

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you call cycling goggles, cycling glasses on, they were clear, it was middle of the day, 1.30 in

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the afternoon. And the bridge of the cycling goggles were embedded in my nose. They could they

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couldn't get them off. And so, five hours of surgery later, I lost three front teeth, split my

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upper lip, split my chin, you know, whatever else happened, basically, you went through a long, you

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know, long process. Now I'm single, lost everything that I had. Is it due to that? I'll tell you. I

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have put out now well, and so basically, a year later, after I got hit a gentleman indicator, I

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went down to repaint his ghost bike. I don't know if you saw one of my feeds yesterday, I was

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painting one on the west side of Atlanta. But I went down Friday morning to repaint this gentleman,

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Paul Taylor's, he was killed in 2012, about a mile and a half from my house, their indicator. And

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one of my group said, we need to get this guy ghost bike. Well, the frame that I was hit on was on my

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garage wall. I pulled it down, painted it white, put him a little placard on it, what happened. And

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it has been there ever since 2012 until I showed up Friday, and it's not there. Well, guess where

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I'll be going very soon to replace that bike because my, you know, I've learned that politicians

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don't really like me coming around because I do paint a picture of possibly your city is not safe

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for everybody to use the roads conjunctly, or together. I started doing that in 2012, about a

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little over a year after I got hit head on. I didn't know how it would affect me, or what it

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would affect me. I just thought the first thing was being a person that my mother was a driver's

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ed teacher, taught me how to drive and use the roads in my car, taught me probably better than

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most driver's ed courses. And I wish that we as society could get back to some of that mentality

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of how to drive, because we've lost a lot of it. And I saw a couple of your feeds talking about

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close passes and things and people don't understand the impact that maiming or killing

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someone does to that person. You know, I used to ride a bike. Was I careless? Absolutely not. I

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know when I go down, no matter if it's my fault or not, I'm going to be in serious trouble. And

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it's not okay for somebody else to do it and think that it's just an accident. And we can, you

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should just live your life and go on and they have no penalty for driving irresponsibly. You know,

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one of my t-shirts says, it's got a gun in a car and it says, why does one of these used improperly

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get jail time and the other doesn't? And I understand why people think, but driving is a

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privilege. It's not a right, a God given right. So if you don't want to do it correctly, don't get

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behind the wheel because the risk you put everybody else involved is not worth it. You know,

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it's not you. It's not you. It's everybody else on the road. And there are a lot of people on the

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road, not only just in cars, but bicycles, pedestrians, everybody. So I started doing,

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I did the first one and I think if any of your readers or followers go to my website, they'll

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see the first picture that Atlanta Journal of Constitution came out while I was building that

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ghost bike. And my next door neighbor, even he's a documentary filmmaker, he came over and it just

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coincidentally, I mean, I didn't know I was doing it. He came out of his house and he came over and

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asked me what I was doing. He thought I was working on my bike, my real bike. And as I know,

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I'm working on a ghost bike for a fallen friend right up the road here. He goes, hold on one

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second. He goes, I got to go get my camera. And I'm like, your camera, why would you go get your

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camera for this? And he came back. And later he told me that through his endeavors through

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documentary filmmaking, he can see passion in people when they start talking, he sees it. And

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he went and videoed the whole thing. I've got a little 11 minute video about that day. And my

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banner on my website is me from that picture of the AJC working on Paul Taylor's first ghost bike.

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Everything that I've done since then has a link. It links either me to something that has taken me

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on this journey. Like, I don't know if you've noticed, people ask me where I get the logo on

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my hat. You can't really see it. But anyway, the logo on my hat, it's now it's a bike that I ride

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on my trainer in the garage on, you know, whatever days I want to get on the road and ride. It's a

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silhouette of that bike called the bike of angels. It's a, it's got two wheels on it. If you notice

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the wheels on my logo, there are five spokes, which is not like a normal bicycle wheel, but no

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bicycle wheels have 18 to 32 spokes. Well, this one has five, they're all carbon fiber, they're

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really thick, like two inches. And that bike is all white, just like my ghost bikes. And on every

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spoke on those two wheels are names of fallen riders, you know, from the past years, I don't

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have all 129 on there. But I have a lot probably like 60 or 70 and big black bold letters. And

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that those two wheels actually live through my crash. So that they they're the company is out of

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Indiana and they, they tout or they promote their bicycle wheels as being bombproof. And I'm living

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testament that they live through a crash, a head on crash, and they still roll. And they're still

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rolling on my trainer. So I started doing the first one for Paul Taylor. And I initially thought

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about doing you know, mainly just like the nine or 10 counties around Atlanta, this is in this and

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then I set up a Google search. And I get my Google search engine, it searches, you know, in the

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evening, and I get it about 11pm every night. And I'm sitting in my office here. And literally, if

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I'm in bed, and I get that search engine, and it comes in with real reports, if I see an article

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of a surrounding seven state area of somebody getting hit and killed on a bicycle, automatically

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go to the top of the article hit print, and it prints right here in my office. And so when I come

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in the next day, I start mapping, I start mapping, when can I get over there and put out like, I just

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got through with one trip, I went to Savannah, one day, I got down, I left here at 4am, went down to

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Savannah, placed four ghost bikes around Savannah, and then drove up into South Carolina, near

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Gaston and Anderson. And I put three more out over there and got back here at 2am the next morning.

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So I basically drive all day, putting out ghost bikes. And I get most of the time, I get, you

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know, emails from a loved one, a family member of somebody of how it means so much to them that

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somebody they don't even know cares. And to me, you know, if there's nothing else I do for people

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in this life, it's to a, maybe we can all create a following, you know, with, you know, some of

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your followers and, and other people trying to do good things. Maybe we can turn this thing around

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because the cesspool is spinning. And it has a lot of tentacles out there, you know, you're talking

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money, you're talking, you know, I have people all the time to say, well, I got some investors, not

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investors, but like people that want to help nonprofits, this, this and this. I love that idea

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of people helping nonprofits. My problem with that is people that want to give you money, but yet

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tell you what you can't say. Because what I say goes against, that's not against. I mean, like I

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said, my mother was a driver's ed teacher. She did it because of the goodness of her heart. She was a

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special ed teacher. Most of her kids couldn't drive, so they couldn't really get a job. But the jobs

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that were offered around them in that age were jobs that a special needs kid could take. Something

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that they don't get tired of, a special, a special needs kid never gets tired of doing the same job.

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Me and you, after about three weeks of the same job, we're looking, okay, what else can I do?

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They weren't, they wouldn't, they would keep doing the same job perfectly every day. And the jobs

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that were there, they just couldn't get to because they couldn't drive. Well, she was normally a

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special ed teacher where she went back to Auburn, got her driver's education certificate, so that

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she could teach her kids how to pass the driver's test. When she first went into the driver, the DMV's

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office, the guy there says, well, you know, well, who are you bringing in? All my special needs kids.

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Oh, they can't drive. And she goes, why don't understand? Why can't they, if they pass the test

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and can drive with you in the car, can't they drive? Well, yeah, of course, but they can't pass

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the test, he said. She goes, I'll tell you what, how many people take the driver's test verbally?

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And he goes, oh, like maybe 5%. She goes, I'll tell you what, when you're giving somebody a verbal

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driver's ed test, if they don't answer the question that you ask them, can you, will you go back to it?

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He goes, yeah, we'll go back to it at the end of the test, you know, give them a second chance.

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She says, I'll tell you what, I will have my students come and take the test verbally.

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If they pass on a test, on a question that you, that they can't answer at the time, count it wrong.

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Don't go back to it. Count it wrong. And if they don't make, and she said, is the quota right

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now 80% you got to make to pass the test? He goes, yeah, it's 80%. She said, if they don't make 90 or higher,

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they fail. And he goes, oh, you'll never have anybody pass. She never had anybody score less

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than 98 on the test. And those kids went and got driver's license, could now go to the job in the

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mill that they would do every day to help support their family because they can't live out on their

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own. They're special needs kids, but they can help support the family that they belong to.

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And I was like, wow, that is heart on heart. You know, not only are you a special needs teacher,

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but now you see these kids can help their families, but you're going to go back to school

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to help them be able to drive to a job to help their family. Yeah, no, that's fantastic. And

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it sounds like your mother and her passion, just like you were seeing that with your friend,

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he can see passion and he can hear when somebody talks about it. Even just now hearing you talk

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about your mother's passion, that sounds like it really bleeds through. And again, like I kind of

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mentioned off air at the very beginning, the entire premise, the thing that I would love to

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get out with this podcast is that there is opportunity, that there are good people out there,

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that we can make a difference for others. And it sounds like your mother taking that extra step of

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saying, hey, there's this issue. These special needs kids are having problems getting their

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driver's license. And even the DMV people saying it's impossible, it's not going to happen. And

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her saying, let's try it though. So it sounds like that really bleeds into and carries on into what

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you're doing with your ghost bikes. And if we can just kind of go back for just a quick second,

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with the ghost bikes in particular, because you said you started in 2012, correct? Right. So what

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gave you the initial idea of the ghost bike in particular? Did you see that somewhere else? Or

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did you just kind of go? It's kind of like what you, I'm sure you've seen a ton of people ask me

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all the time, what keeps you going? And I go, there are things that I see that maybe one day I'll sit

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down and write in my memoirs or whatever, but they are nothing less than God sent signs to keep your

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butt going. And I had seen a documentary, I think it was on CNN. I mean, literally, this was like

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in the late 2000s, like 2007, eight, nine, somewhere in there. I just happened to see CNN

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one night, they were talking about this ghost bike thing. And I'm a cyclist, you know, I've been

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cycling quite a long time and I'm like, okay, got it. And I watched it, it's only like a minute and

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a half, two minutes. But originally ghost bikes started, what I heard from that was in St. Louis.

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And it really got big in New York, because that's where there's tons of couriers in New York. They

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not only deliver executive documents and things like that, they have to be signed and returned

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immediately for lawyers and all that kind of stuff. But you know, in New York, people don't

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drive because it costs so much to A, have a car, B, to park it. And so couriers, that's how they

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get things done in New York. The emails are great, but if it's got to be physically signed, the

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courier is a dude and he's on a bike and he gets down there back. And so that's where it really

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took off now is that, you know, these, these couriers and cyclists in New York are getting

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hit and killed. And what are we doing? Why, why do we feel you're going to get anywhere faster in a

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car, especially in a major metropolitan area when bicycles going to be within about five or 10

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minutes, even in a 10 or 12 mile commute. I got one of my friends I cycle with in Decatur when I

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lived there, we would ride from six to seven AM every morning, a group of whole big group, like

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15 people, about 15 mile ride, get back to the house about seven, seven 15, get your shower and

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the eight o'clock people can get to work with no problem. It was a great group. He worked for CNN

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downtown seven and a half mile commute. He would leave, he would leave our group, get home about

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seven 15, get on his commuter bike. He had a big backpack with extra clothes that he was going to

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change into when he got to work and they had a shower there. He would leave at seven, like seven

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27 30. He'd be downtown in a half hour. No problem. Buy a bike, buy a bike. And a lot of guys that he

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worked with bike with motor ride a car from there to CNN, same track. And they would get there like

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five till and he's looking at them going, and I don't have to go to the gym to work out now I'm

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done. And people were amazed. I mean, yeah, of course, you know, not everybody's going to be fast

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to start out with, but you get in better shape by doing it. But the mere fact that humanity in itself

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has manifested itself in such a way now that when the, when the word on the street is, if you want

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to commit a murder and get away with it, hit somebody in on a bicycle and with a car is tragic.

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It is absolutely appalling and tragic to me because what people don't understand is that

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you're devastating a family, not a person, a family for life a whole lifetime. Anytime somebody, and

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you know, I'm glad we're talking on zoom because I don't, and then you wouldn't say it, but anytime

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somebody comes up to me and says, oh, it's sad that they got hit and killed this is, but time will

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heal it. They need to step away from me because I'm about to hit you so hard that your next lifetime

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will come up fast because this one has, it has eluded you. It doesn't go away. It doesn't.

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That's something that I've kind of noticed whether it is a natural tragedy, a manmade issue,

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terrorism, all these things. It's, you know, this many killed, this many injured. And I feel like

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that has gotten to the point that any loss just kind of feels, I don't want to say normalized,

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but maybe that is the right, yeah. Like you're just kind of numb to it. So when you hear, you

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know, a biker, I was just going to say like, you know, a pedestrian hit, a biker hit, like it,

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it has like a level of separation. And that's like kind of what you were saying with, if you want to

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get away with it, cause I'm in very remote areas. I mean, I'm pushing my little buggy, my stroller,

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I have my backpack and I mean, I knock on all of the wood, but that's something that I've thought

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about. Like if I were to be hurt or injured, what would happen? Like these people could just leave.

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There's no cameras out here. There's no nothing. And that's the joke I've made before, you know,

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kind of tongue in cheap dark humor, but like, I don't want to piss anybody off while I'm on this

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walk. Cause I'm such an easy target. And I mean, that's kind of going to with what you're saying

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is that even in these populated areas, and I mean, I see even just in New Mexico, I've seen so many

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crosses on the side of the road. I mean, I've seen those in every single state, but it's just always

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such that strong reminder. And I think what's so unique about the ghost bike is one you have,

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I mean, just even on the one behind you in your zoom, every single one of them, from what I've

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seen has the name, RIP, location, your hashtag and a number. And I think it's, it's so unique in that

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fact that you're, you're not just putting a white bike out there to signify something that happened

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here. It's like something bad happened to in this case, Tom, like this was their name. Like I Googled

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somebody that was on one of the ghost bikes and I found them. And that's what's so unique in it from

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my perspective of what you do. It gives a name. And like you were saying earlier, gives that,

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like shows that family that somebody cares outside of their immediate circle.

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Absolutely. I had a, I had a one of my shirts, not this one. You know, the unique thing about

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and I laugh now, but you should have asked me to sponsor you on your walk, because this is the

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color shirt that I wear ever since I got hit head on. I teach tennis for a living and my kids,

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I have people will text me on a Facebook or Instagram some nights and then, Hey, I saw you

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today and I'm aware. And they go, Oh, I drove by the tennis courts. I could tell you were out there

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because you're wearing your optic yellow and your hat. Everybody I've done, when I play now,

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in my senior, in my senior group, not group, but a league we have here, they all know when I'm

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coming to play, the guy in yellow is coming and they, they laugh about it, but they're starting

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to learn now that there's a reason and a cause behind what I wear is because I got missed one

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time in 52 years and I don't ever want that to happen again. I don't want it to happen to

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anybody. And I was going to say, you need to be wearing optic yellow out there. So that if they

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come over that hill and they don't see you just on the other side of it, maybe that optic yellow,

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they pick up a little better. Yeah. Visibility. I mean, I, I hang a safety vest from one of my

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old jobs off the back of my backpack. I have the optic yellow flag, like when the clips on the,

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on my backpack, I wear the vest, I have the flag. So like, I, I mean, if you want to send me a hat,

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let me know. I mean, absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. You won't. Yes.

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Okay, so it sounds like the ghost bike movement was already an established thing and you just

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kind of said, oh, I could do that down here. Yeah, I didn't really know where it had,

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I didn't ever know. I knew where it started, basically what they said, and then I didn't know

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how big it was in New York. I know there are a lot of couriers in New York and I had heard of some

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around. I'm trying to think. I really have never seen one, you know, per se. And then when I started

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getting my news feeds from Google, my Google searches, it got to be, I was like, oh my God,

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this is not just happening. You know, Atlanta is a big, obviously a major metropolitan area

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with like seven to nine million in whatever eight or nine counties, but it's happening everywhere.

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I mean, it's crazy. And then, you know, then about, I had put out about maybe 10 or 15 and I've got,

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I've got an Excel spreadsheet over here that has all of my ghost bikes listed where they were,

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what numbers on the ghost bikes. But if I go back out, I could put that same number and information

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on there. I tell people all the time, I have a messenger group with about out of 129 ghost bikes.

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I have about, I think it's 74 or five members on this messenger list. And I am the only one on there

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that has not lost a family member to a bicycle crash. They all are fallen friends, immediate

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family members. And whenever I have something to ask them, like this shirt, you can't really see it,

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I heart BFA, which is one of that BFA is bike friendly, Atlanta. This idea was given to me.

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I asked one of my girls that I coach, she's only like 12. I said, what can I do? She was going to

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donate a scooter because I actually have not only ghost bikes, I have ghost scooters. I have a ghost

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wheelchair and I have a ghost chair. So I have literally the only thing I haven't gotten into,

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which I think that's what all the little crosses are for, or people that are killed in automobiles.

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And, you know, I raised a question the other day on my Instagram account.

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What would people say if all of a sudden, and I would not be able to do it, but what if I started

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putting like a pair of white shoes out every time somebody got killed in a car? I mean, it would,

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my news feed every night would just be obliterated. It would be probably 50 people a day

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from around the Southeast getting killed by car versus car crashes. And we think those are accidents.

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No, drunk driving, distracted driving, drug driving, and speeding are the four leading factors to

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crashes in cars. You take those four factors out and I guarantee you the roads and fatalities will

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go straight to the bottom. Yeah, no, the saying that I have for myself is don't attribute to

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malice what can be attributed to incompetence. And that's just so that I don't get, you know,

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when people, like I've had a few close calls very recently with, you know, whatever. And it's always

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kind of like, was that on purpose? Are you trying to be a jerk? Like, I've definitely had people

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where I kind of question, like, are you just trying to hit the homeless guy? Are you trying to scare

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the pedestrian because you're mad and upset? Like, there's no one coming from the other way. Why are

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you doing this? And to that, I've seen so many people swerve randomly and, you know, it kind of

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makes you question, are you sober? Right. See people, you know, with the phone in their face,

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like kind of have a little thing. And it's like, and I'll admit, like, I've, I've texted and driven

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before. It's, it's a bad habit. I've done it. And now with this experience, it's like, that is

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probably the stupidest thing because there's been times where, like you said, I'm coming up over a

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hill and I'm thinking to myself, oh, okay, like I'm going to go to the other side because that's not

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much time if they're screwing around, if they're distracted. Right. And I go, oh my God, how many

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times have I even just changing the radio been distracted? Have I been thinking about something

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else and been distracted and kind of swerve a little bit? So it's, I mean, this whole experience

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for me changed how I drive for sure. But I mean, what coming into New Mexico, there's so many signs

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of rapport, intoxicated driving. And I think I've seen more in New Mexico than I have in other states,

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or maybe it's just the areas I'm going through. But I don't know, I just, if I was just oblivious

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to it before, but how big a problem drunk and inebriated driving is when it comes to fatalities.

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Absolutely. And to me, to me, for us as a massive technology led, you know, led society,

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we have so many options to stop it. So many. I mean, I'm sitting there the other day, I just

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transferred over, I found me a better insurance rate and the insurance company, and I won't mention

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them, I think every one of them do it. They offer you to send you a little pod that will plug into

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your car. You know, there's a little plug up on it. I think from every, I think even I had one in

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my old car, which was a 2015, that's nine years old. If you've got a car around 2015 or so, or newer,

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they can give you a little pod that will plug in and it will see how you drive and your insurance

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rates will be adjusted for that. And I think that should be mandatory. People go, well, that's my

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privacy. No, it's our safe roads in the store. And I have a 2005 Honda and I had a 2006 Nissan,

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which was totaled in a car accident where the lady was distracted and hit me. But whatever,

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everybody was fine. I was just annoyed because it happened a month before I started the walk and I

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had to buy a new car. But with that, even with the older cars, I had a phone app that tracked my

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driving. And every once in a while I would say, hey, you're going a little faster. Oh, hey, you,

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I don't know, you've had some hard stops, you know? And I'm like, oh my God. And things like that,

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you kind of become blind to. So even just that accountability for yourself saying, oh, I didn't

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realize I was going so fast. I didn't realize I had so many hard stops. Like that's helped me correct

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my driving and get to be better and safer on the road. Cause like you said, driving isn't a right,

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it's a privilege. Now I will add that the infrastructure and the way that the cities are,

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are 100% designed for cars. I have been in cities where sidewalks randomly go off like a small cliff.

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They are not connected well. The sensors don't work or the button, the crosswalks,

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crosswalks don't work. So it's impossible. And I'm thinking to myself, what if I was a single mom

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pushing around the stroller with a kid in it? Like I have camping gear in this thing. If it gets hit,

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I'm going to be pissed for a few hours. I'll probably have to buy a new one. People will help

364
00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:20,400
out whatever. But if there's a living creature in here, like, oh, I don't want to say a kid as a

365
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:25,680
creature, but you understand what I mean. It's just, that's a whole other issue that I feel like has

366
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:33,360
kind of, we're built for these two ton vehicles, not the 200 pound dude walking to his job.

367
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:39,520
Here's my last, not last, I'm going to sign it off, but here any discussion I have about this topic,

368
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:45,920
about, you know, infrastructure is not built for it. I get it. I do. Like take Atlanta, which I,

369
00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:50,480
I know the back of downtown Atlanta, like the back of my hand, I've cycled every road in that place.

370
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:58,960
So yes, infrastructure, we are what we call land scrapped. We couldn't put a bike lane from one

371
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:03,920
side of the city to the other, if your life depended on it, because there ain't enough room

372
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:10,400
anymore. You have literally had houses, town homes, condos, whatever, up to the edge of the road.

373
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:16,000
You know, there's your fence, there's the back of your condo. There's nowhere to put a bike lane.

374
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:23,280
I get it. So I'm going down, let's say me and you are going down a bike path, eight foot wide

375
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:30,480
bike path. That's what I was on yesterday out in from Smyrna to Anniston, Alabama, 104 miles.

376
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:37,040
They converted an old railroad track, filled it in with concrete. It's eight feet wide and it's a

377
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:44,640
bike path. It goes 104 miles. Okay. So let's say me and you're biking on this bike path and we're

378
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:49,120
going, it's got a yellow line dotted line down the middle, four and four, four feet and four feet.

379
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:54,080
Me and you're going down this bike path on two bikes and we can easily fit in four feet. That's

380
00:39:54,080 --> 00:40:01,040
pretty comfortable. We're paying attention, talking, having a good time and we're coming up on three

381
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:11,760
people walking side by side by side. They're taking up five feet. So basically the left person is

382
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:19,360
over the yellow line and they're enjoying themselves. They're not going to move. I understand

383
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:28,240
it. I don't like it, but guess what? It's my job as the faster vehicle that can cause more damage

384
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:36,240
to avoid the situation at all costs. I get on the left, me and you go, we make sure nobody's coming

385
00:40:36,240 --> 00:40:41,680
at us in the other bike lane. If we're on a hill, we're on a curve, we're going to be on a hill.

386
00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:48,000
We're going to wait, we'll slow down and go behind the walkers at four miles an hour, whatever.

387
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:55,120
And when it's clear for us to go, we're going to say on your left. And even when we say on your left,

388
00:40:55,840 --> 00:41:02,560
I know that left person may be like a squirrel and jump to the left. And if they do,

389
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:11,200
I have to avoid that person. And so then we get around them, we go around and we carry on

390
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:17,840
and everybody gets home safer. Why do drivers not held to the same accountability?

391
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:23,520
There's a, what is it? There's a saying, I'm trying to develop it still. And it's a silly

392
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:29,120
kind of tongue in cheek rule that I have for myself, which is P every chance you get, right?

393
00:41:29,760 --> 00:41:36,240
And it's, it's, it's just do the basics, do the thing that takes the extra 10, 20, 30 seconds.

394
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:40,880
Otherwise you're going to, you're going to be in for a world of hurt later. And that was because

395
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:45,600
I didn't use the bathroom when I had a chance to, and then I couldn't for two hours and that hurt.

396
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:51,760
And that's one of those cases where it's like, sure, I'm trying to go faster. I'm in a hurry.

397
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:58,080
I'm trying to do these things. But if you just take the extra 30 seconds and you wait,

398
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:02,320
you give that warning in this case and you say, Hey, on your left, you know, there's a chance that

399
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:08,400
they could be silly and jump to the left. Because I, the first time that happened to me, I thought

400
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:15,440
that meant go to whatever you panic and you don't think, and you say left, left, you know? So you're

401
00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:19,600
right. Like, and I think that's another thing too, is I feel like a lot of people don't have that

402
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:26,800
accountability for themselves of like, what is it? Another example, I was with someone when like,

403
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:31,040
I don't know, a couple of years ago, and we're coming up on a roundabout in a car. And I,

404
00:42:31,040 --> 00:42:35,120
they were driving and I saw to our right that somebody else was coming pretty fast.

405
00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:38,960
And I was like, Hey, slow down a little bit. And they're like, why we're in, we're going to be in

406
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:44,240
the, we're going to be in the roundabout first. We have the right away. Yeah. Slow down. They slow

407
00:42:44,240 --> 00:42:48,320
down. They race through it. And I'm like, they're like, well, we would have had the right away. If

408
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:53,920
they hit us, it would have been their fault. I'm like, I don't, I hear you. You're correct.

409
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:58,720
But you're on the right side of the car. You're going to get hit. I would have been the one that

410
00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:03,600
got hit. And it's like, would you rather be right? Or would you rather be dead?

411
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:09,760
Like all that paperwork and all that paper, even if they like when the lady told my car,

412
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:15,280
which she hit the back door of my car, my car was a hunk of junk. Like if she had waited an extra

413
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:20,720
10 seconds, I would have gone to work. I wouldn't have had to go to the emergency room. I wasn't at

414
00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:26,640
fault for it. But then I had months of headache. And it's like, if people would just take that

415
00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:34,160
extra few seconds, all of that could be avoided. And that's, you know, do the thing that takes an

416
00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:39,920
extra 30 seconds. That's it. That's all it's going to take. Well, but one of my teachers says,

417
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:47,280
you may come up behind a cyclist, but what, what is 15 to 30 seconds when we can all get home safer

418
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:55,600
and kill somebody? It's not worth it. Your job is not worth killing somebody. And yep, I'm

419
00:43:55,600 --> 00:44:02,320
starting to see accountability. I'm starting, you know, it's sad that I, you have to see it.

420
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:08,000
And I don't believe in incarcerating everybody, but yet when people are so callous, they can hit

421
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:15,360
and run somebody, a human being on the side of the road to die. I'm sorry. You need about 10 years

422
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:21,120
in a cell by yourself to figure it out because you missed the boat somewhere. Yeah. And it's,

423
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:26,560
and again, it's just that level of, I don't want to get in trouble. And again, kind of that

424
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:34,400
normalization of tragedy in that way that says, if I leave, there's no consequences for me. And I

425
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:42,080
just feel like there's, it's, it's insane, but it's interesting. And I think, I think there's a

426
00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:48,320
couple more things I want to touch on before we hop off here. And with what you said about, so

427
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:55,360
NFOFF, that means never forget our fallen friends. Right. And how many bikes are currently out there

428
00:44:55,360 --> 00:45:02,000
and how many do you have in the works? Me? Yeah. Can't see it probably. It's yellow. Back on my

429
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:06,640
hat, I always put a number on it. And a lot of the hats that I wear, I'll put the number upside

430
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:10,800
down. So people go, Hey, your number's upside down. And then I get to go into a conversation about

431
00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:17,920
why I have 129 around the Southeast, anywhere from about an hour South of Orlando to about

432
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:25,280
an hour North of Orlando. My one farthest North is Asheville, North Carolina. Then you can go to

433
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:35,680
Chattanooga. Then you can go probably just Northwest of Birmingham down to Pensacola and all across

434
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:43,520
the Panhandle. Oh, I'm sorry. I do have one in Santa Ana, California. A young man came up to me

435
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:51,520
Josh was about number 10 or 15. And his, his one of the guys, Josh Alper was his name,

436
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:56,480
Molly Dawson Morton used to ride with me on that 6 a.m. ride came up to me and he goes,

437
00:45:56,480 --> 00:46:01,920
I need your services. Well, I thought he wanted a tennis lesson. And I said, okay, so when you want

438
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:05,760
to do your lesson, he goes, no, I need a ghost bike. My college roommate just got killed on the

439
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:11,200
Santa Ana freeway. I want you to send him a ghost bike. I'm like, oh my, and it was a landmark

440
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:19,680
case in California. The driver of a brand new Tesla was going South on the Santa Ana. Josh was

441
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:26,320
riding his bike on the shoulder of the northbound lane, which has a median in between them. The

442
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:33,920
driver went off the West side of the Santa Ana freeway up on the bank, got weed, tumbleweeds in

443
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:40,560
his car, came back across those two lanes, went across the median and then went over the road.

444
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:46,880
And onto the other median on the right side of where Josh was, and then came up and killed Josh.

445
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:53,840
You know what he pleaded in court? You ready with this? I'm glad you're sitting down. He pleaded that

446
00:46:53,840 --> 00:47:01,360
the new car smell of the Tesla put him to sleep. And I'm going, it would have woke me up when I

447
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:09,120
went off the first shoulder. That's insane. And that's just the excuse. Like I've, I've recently,

448
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:13,600
some of the podcasts I've been listening to, like sometimes they go over crazy court cases

449
00:47:14,240 --> 00:47:22,160
and the things that people say to get out of it. We allow it in court. We allow it. The judge is

450
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:31,040
listening, wasting time on this. Oh my God. So that's insane. Okay. So around 129, pretty much

451
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:37,920
all over the country at this point, but center mostly in, in your area. Yeah. And when it comes

452
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:44,400
to placing the bikes, do you just go exactly where it happened or nearby or how do you decide where

453
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:50,640
the bikes actually go? They, you know, I take into account, you know, I'm a little more thoughtful

454
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:57,600
than most of the people that listen to you or me. I mean, honestly, I know where the crash occurred.

455
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:02,080
I usually read three or four or five articles on it, you know, from the, from the newspapers and

456
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:07,760
stuff. If I can, if I need to, I might reach out to a reporter that did the article or something to

457
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:13,360
kind of get a little more insight as to where it happened. But normally I will put it as close to

458
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:20,800
the crash site as possible. I also take into account number one, utility, phone pole workers,

459
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:26,720
grass cutters, homeowners. I take all of them into account and put it as close as I can without

460
00:48:26,720 --> 00:48:33,920
affecting any of that. And so I know the DOT in every state, they will pick them up very quickly,

461
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:40,160
unless I get them enough off the highway to where they don't think they're on the highway.

462
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:46,400
I don't put them on the highway. I might put them off the shoulder a little bit, things like that.

463
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:51,440
I mean, you know, the one I just, one of them I just put in Savannah, I found as close to it,

464
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:56,480
intersections as I could. And it was a state highway, not like a divided highway, but you know,

465
00:48:56,480 --> 00:49:02,560
four lanes going each way, 45 mile an hour speed limit. But I actually went over and found a pine

466
00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:08,960
tree and put two of my bike locks together and wrapped it, a pretty thick pine tree. And I put

467
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:13,360
it around the pine tree and kind of cut some of the shrubs. Oh, I go out with a full utility,

468
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:20,000
a truck utility. I've got a machete. I got, you know, things that I can cut stuff down with and

469
00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:27,920
try to make it aware of maintenance of it is nothing that hard, you know. But yeah, 129 and

470
00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:34,480
I'm getting ready to plan a trip to North Carolina. I got a lady up there who her daughter was,

471
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:39,840
she gave me one of the, this isn't it, one of the sayings is, I mean, I've got it on t-shirt,

472
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:44,480
what am I? You can't see it. I'm going to turn this around so you can kind of, oh, there we go.

473
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:50,160
You might, no, you are not be able to see it. I should have did a regular background. I'm in

474
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:57,120
my BFA office. And the thing that bike friendly that I thought would be very unique would be that

475
00:49:57,120 --> 00:50:05,200
anything you or anybody gets from bike friendly Atlanta that could be done would be done with

476
00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:11,280
the same hands that build the ghost bikes. So you feel like you are actually a part, not a

477
00:50:12,480 --> 00:50:16,800
subsidized out. I don't make any money from what I do. People go, oh, you're a nonprofit. How much

478
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:24,000
do you pay yourself? And I go, I don't, I don't make a dime. I use every bit of any money coming

479
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:30,800
in to buy gas for my vehicle. My vehicle, I don't write off it. I use it for these ghost bike trips.

480
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:36,560
I've been lucky to be sponsored by a bike rack company called Sea Sucker out of Delray Beach,

481
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:42,800
Florida. Great guy. I emailed him and he said, whatever you want, you're doing exactly what we

482
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:48,720
need to have done. And that is make our roads safer. And I was like, okay. And literally he sent me a

483
00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:55,600
$600 and $700 bike rack that goes on my car. Really nice, free of charge, just the nicest guy. And

484
00:50:55,600 --> 00:51:03,280
he goes, you ever coming down? I said, Florida is one of the most crashed bicycle states, obviously

485
00:51:03,280 --> 00:51:08,720
cause it's warmer like California. And he goes, I know we have people getting killed down here all

486
00:51:08,720 --> 00:51:14,080
the time. And I've been an hour south of Orlando and one day I'm going to make a trip to the Miami

487
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:20,000
area, maybe even Naples and go across that end of the peninsula. And I'm going to wake some people

488
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:27,200
up because a lot of people in that area go to work by bicycle. And it's just not right that they may

489
00:51:27,200 --> 00:51:34,720
never come home. And that's what I do it for. But 129 so far, getting ready for a trip to North

490
00:51:34,720 --> 00:51:40,640
Carolina, probably with about six or seven on my car ready to go. And you know, that'll knock it up

491
00:51:40,640 --> 00:51:46,880
to 135. Don't know how many is out there, but sadly I'm adding. Yeah.

492
00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:55,840
Hey everyone, just a quick message. You know that my mission with this podcast is to share stories

493
00:51:55,840 --> 00:52:00,800
of influence and impact so that we can help more people help more people. But to do that,

494
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:06,560
I need your support. Please rate, review, and share this podcast. If I could ask for just one

495
00:52:06,560 --> 00:52:12,080
favor, it's to just leave a review. It takes about 10 seconds and a few clicks, but it means the world

496
00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:16,960
to me and could inspire someone else to make a difference. Thank you so much and now back to the

497
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:27,440
show. Another question. So I mean, 129 and that's the lowest the number will ever be moving forward

498
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:32,480
until I feel like we, and again, that's what I think is so unique about this is that it's such an

499
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:38,080
easy, you see that and I think for me, you know, it reminds me to pay attention and hopefully it

500
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:45,440
inspires drivers to see that and go again, that level of accountability, like, okay, I need that

501
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:52,080
reminder. So when it comes to placing the bikes, it sounds like you take a lot into consideration

502
00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:56,880
with the placement, you know, making sure it's on the right area, the rights away, making sure it's

503
00:52:56,880 --> 00:53:02,080
not going to affect mowing or private property, et cetera. And you mentioned at the very beginning

504
00:53:02,080 --> 00:53:07,360
that you've had some issues with, I don't want to get too political, I guess, about it, but like

505
00:53:07,360 --> 00:53:14,960
with local politicians or local things like that, how have you, I don't know, like, like worked with

506
00:53:14,960 --> 00:53:20,160
it to make it to where they don't just remove them immediately or that the message still stands? Like,

507
00:53:20,160 --> 00:53:26,720
how do you kind of navigate that? Because I'm sure we could be aggressive and, you know, fist fight

508
00:53:26,720 --> 00:53:31,840
them in the McDonald's parking lot, but we can't really do that anymore. This isn't the 1800s.

509
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:36,800
So like, how do you work amicable, amicable, whatever the word is, I'm just going to leave

510
00:53:36,800 --> 00:53:42,080
that in there for my own humbleness. But how do you kind of work with local decision makers,

511
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:50,960
I guess, or how, how does that work? Good luck. Good luck. Okay. Honestly, one of my, one of my,

512
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:58,160
I would say this person is a very good, we don't know each other necessarily personally,

513
00:53:58,160 --> 00:54:03,280
like we don't go hang out together and have some drinks together. We're not personal like that,

514
00:54:03,280 --> 00:54:09,920
but business wise, we know each other. One of the sponsors of the Ride of Silence that I put on here

515
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:18,000
in Decatur every year, which is in May, it's, it's an annual ride. It's a universal annual ride

516
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:26,640
around the world on the third Wednesday of May every year at seven o'clock local time that honors

517
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:32,800
all the following friends of the past year. And I've put it on in Decatur. I did it for about

518
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:38,320
four years prior to the pandemic. And then when the pandemic hit, obviously we didn't do it for

519
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:47,120
a year or two. And then this person who's a lawyer represents a lot of bike, you know, crash victims,

520
00:54:47,120 --> 00:54:54,640
but he's also a regular lawyer too, called me and said, I can't imagine doing this Ride of Silence

521
00:54:54,640 --> 00:55:03,040
in Decatur, because in Decatur, Georgia is the only silver city where they ranked it by, you know,

522
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:08,400
how many feet of bike paths you got, how bike friendly it is, things like that. It is, I think

523
00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:14,080
it's by Bicycle Magazine does it. Decatur is the only silver city in the state of Georgia

524
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:21,280
on their gold, silver or bronze status. There are four other cities that are bronze. Decatur was

525
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:27,200
bronze. They started putting in a lot of protected bike lanes and stuff, but there are a lot of

526
00:55:27,200 --> 00:55:32,160
cyclists even in the city that, and you can all, you know, they ride the Stone Mountain, they ride

527
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:39,920
out the east side of Atlanta a lot. It's a very unique little city, but it, you know, he said,

528
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:44,960
I want to do the Ride of Silence because it does do a good thing for our community. It raises

529
00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:50,720
awareness for safer streets and things like that. He goes, but I can't imagine doing it without you

530
00:55:50,720 --> 00:55:56,400
leading it because this is who you are. And I said, yeah, I know, sadly, that's what I've become.

531
00:55:57,280 --> 00:56:02,480
I'm the ghost bike guy that wears yellow when he plays tennis and it's okay. I'm okay with that.

532
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:10,560
But he, you know, we have a good relationship, but I totally understand kind of back to your question.

533
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:17,120
You know, he's a lawyer. I get it. I'm the time bomb that you want to keep at arm's length,

534
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:24,080
because when I speak, what I say is not going to be filtered. It's not going to be politically

535
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:31,040
correct. And you look at some of my Instagram and Facebook and it says, you know, I'm a world

536
00:56:31,040 --> 00:56:37,280
class tennis player, cyclist that is not politically correct. So be ready when you ask me, not you,

537
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:44,240
but anybody ask me something, I'm coming. I'm coming full force and I will, you know, I've been

538
00:56:44,240 --> 00:56:49,040
to Savannah. Let me think how many bikes I've got in, let's say Savannah, within about 20 miles of

539
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:58,000
downtown Savannah. I'll probably got, I bet I got 15 ghost bikes in 15 years. It might be more than

540
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:02,800
Atlanta's got a lot around, like you take the nine counties, but nine counties around Atlanta is a

541
00:57:02,800 --> 00:57:08,160
big area. It's huge. You got seven, eight, nine million people. You ain't got nine million people

542
00:57:08,160 --> 00:57:14,240
in Savannah. So, you know, I went down to Savannah, I don't know, three, four years ago, they had this

543
00:57:14,240 --> 00:57:21,120
big ride in December, no, not December, it's in June or July, it's called Bragg Bike Race Across

544
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:26,880
Georgia. It's not really a race, it's just a ride. And they ride a pretty good ways, you know, from

545
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:32,400
like Atlanta to Savannah. And they take like three or four days. And there's a lot of people that

546
00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:35,600
are going out there with their friends, just doing, well, they get down there the last day

547
00:57:35,600 --> 00:57:40,480
and they're all coming into downtown Savannah. I mean, literally the, what do they call it? Not

548
00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:47,840
the boardwalk, but it's like Main Street right by the Dagum Ocean. I mean, it's the Main Street

549
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:58,000
where old historic Savannah is and a lady, you know, Judy probably had to be 50, 45, 50 years old,

550
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:04,640
riding right down as a concrete road, got, you know, joints in the concrete. She gets around

551
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:09,440
she gets her wheels caught in the concrete, flips her over on the left and what's coming down the

552
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:15,360
left lane is didn't want to hear about it. And I put one down, I went down there to put a bike out

553
00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:20,640
and you know, here I go again, I'm thinking about how do I not disrupt number one,

554
00:58:20,640 --> 00:58:24,960
commercialization, you know, people walking, having dinners and everything, there's not much

555
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:29,520
room on that sidewalk to put a bike. So I'm thinking that's out, that's out, that's,

556
00:58:29,520 --> 00:58:34,320
that's off limits. That's just not, not gonna happen. So then there's a park across the street

557
00:58:34,320 --> 00:58:42,640
and over there, unbeknownst to me, was they actually have bicycle tourists that will carry

558
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:48,560
a couple of people around in a three-wheel bicycle, you know, and they're meeting right here. Well,

559
00:58:48,560 --> 00:58:55,840
right there is a concrete bench and I'm thinking perfect. Number one, she was on a bike. Number

560
00:58:55,840 --> 00:59:02,320
two, it's in a park, it's not near a street, it's not near a walkway, it's out of every, but I'll

561
00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:07,520
even move it up forward enough to where the handlebars are not even behind up the bench.

562
00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:12,320
So if somebody sits down, you know, the handlebar won't hit them in the back. I'll move that up so

563
00:59:12,320 --> 00:59:18,880
that it's out of everybody's way. That thing got picked up within about a week because

564
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:26,080
they don't want to see their tourism downplayed because somebody got killed on their street.

565
00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:31,440
Yeah. So it sounds like even with taking in all those considerations that sometimes

566
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:40,800
placement or, I don't know, the, yeah, it would affect it. Again, it affects the bottom line of

567
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:49,680
somebody else. Sure it does, but in the long run, it's gonna kill you, not you. It's going to kill

568
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:55,280
your infrastructure, your commercialization because it ain't gonna get, you can't hide it.

569
00:59:55,280 --> 01:00:03,680
It's there. And so here we go again, you know, she was a long time ago and I've had 13, 14 since then.

570
01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:11,680
What's the problem? You ain't fixed it yet. Yeah. So, you know, I understand. And here we go again,

571
01:00:11,680 --> 01:00:17,840
you know, back to the original thing, you know, the owner of the car has got to be accountable.

572
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:25,360
Right now you can put in all the asphalt, all the protected bike lanes, all the walk lanes you want,

573
01:00:25,360 --> 01:00:31,200
but we're going to cross the street somewhere and until you can hold the driver accountable

574
01:00:31,840 --> 01:00:40,080
on all efforts, nothing's going to happen. Yeah. Exactly. And that's my mom, the driver's

575
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:47,280
ed teacher. You know, she told me that if you can't drive a car safe enough, don't drive it.

576
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:52,800
If you're going to impede traffic flow, impede it by driving improperly. You know, one of the

577
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:58,080
biggest things I see now is you got a left turn lane and it's turning onto a road that has two

578
01:00:58,080 --> 01:01:03,520
lanes, you know, going the same direction. And that car will turn and go into the far lane every time.

579
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:08,560
And I go, what you've done is impede the right turning lane from the other way, from getting on

580
01:01:08,560 --> 01:01:16,880
that same road and getting traffic out of the fricking way. But it's my road. So I guess I need

581
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:23,440
to drive a tank to prove my point so that when I run you over, I'm sorry, it was my road first.

582
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:29,920
Yeah. It's just like, it's like those extremely, you have to be had those hyperbolic examples of

583
01:01:29,920 --> 01:01:33,600
like, okay, well, what if it was this? And it's like, well, that's impossible. It's like, great.

584
01:01:33,600 --> 01:01:40,400
You're right. Now let's pull this down to the current situation. Yeah. Okay. But, and then

585
01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:46,480
I, one more, one, one last question, because I think that this, I have a theory on your guys'

586
01:01:46,480 --> 01:01:52,960
setup, but how much roughly does it cost to place one ghost bike from sourcing the bike, painting it,

587
01:01:52,960 --> 01:01:57,520
getting it where it needs to go? Like how much does that cost? If you don't mind my asking.

588
01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:05,360
Oh, I don't mind. You know, sourcing the bike. I mean, I get bikes donated all the time. I just,

589
01:02:05,360 --> 01:02:10,640
when I was down in Decatur Friday, one of the guys they used to ride with, he had an old 1980 bike

590
01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:17,520
that, you know, like cars, once they get probably 15 bikes, bikes for sure, once they're more than

591
01:02:17,520 --> 01:02:22,320
about 15 years old, 20 years old, finding replacement parts gets harder and harder.

592
01:02:22,880 --> 01:02:27,360
They're vintage and they're fun to ride and they look unique when you ride them, but if they

593
01:02:27,360 --> 01:02:34,400
break down, you're fried. So, so, you know, normally like on my bike, when I ride, I've got a

594
01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:39,360
couple of spare tubes, maybe a spare tire, things like that. But anyway, so I'm getting them donated

595
01:02:39,360 --> 01:02:46,240
and my lawyer guy, they collect them all the time. He has a basement full of bikes that some of them

596
01:02:46,240 --> 01:02:51,360
can't be serviced. They're just old. And he goes, anytime you want five or six, come and get them.

597
01:02:51,360 --> 01:02:58,240
And I'm like, you're not going to have enough bikes. And the good, you know, there's not a good

598
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:04,720
part to that. The bad part is that there's more people dying on bikes than we can get on bikes.

599
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:09,040
And number, but number three, you're going to have a lot of business because you're an attorney for

600
01:03:09,040 --> 01:03:17,120
these people. And it's a good, bad situation all the way around, but is that the circle of life?

601
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:25,200
Oh my God, is that a scary song? Yeah. I mean, having a constant supply of people

602
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:32,160
injured for your attorney to represent is sad, but I do still think that, again, I'm very much

603
01:03:32,160 --> 01:03:37,040
a bright side cup half full. There's a silver lining somewhere. And it's like, there are people

604
01:03:37,040 --> 01:03:42,160
like you that bring awareness to the issue. There's people like him that represent those people so

605
01:03:42,160 --> 01:03:47,360
that they can get justice, that they can get, I guess, I don't want to even say the right,

606
01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:53,440
the wrong righted, because when you're injured like that, or if you're, something happens,

607
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:58,880
like you never go back to being the same, right? But again, it's good that there are people that

608
01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:05,280
are in, when the worst happens, there's that spark of light. But it sounds like the bikes get donated,

609
01:04:05,280 --> 01:04:12,640
but then paint can't cost that much or driving around doesn't. You ready for this? Here we go

610
01:04:12,640 --> 01:04:20,160
with inflation. So two years ago, a can, this is the scary part, two years ago, a can of spray

611
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:26,640
paint, it normally takes me about one and a half cans of spray paint to do one bike. Okay. A can

612
01:04:26,640 --> 01:04:40,160
of spray paint was $3 and 24 cents. It is now almost $7 a can. So when I know that's double,

613
01:04:40,160 --> 01:04:48,880
double, I bought six cans the other day, it was almost 60 bucks. I was like, damn. Yeah.

614
01:04:48,880 --> 01:04:56,160
So it's scary. So then I also buy, you know, the little bike log that you can buy with one little

615
01:04:56,160 --> 01:05:00,880
key on it. And that's usually what I chain them up with. And I got to buy, you know, I got to paint,

616
01:05:01,440 --> 01:05:07,120
you know, I don't charge anybody for warehousing bikes or whatever. You'd hate to see my garage,

617
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:13,680
it ain't nothing but bikes, but it's okay. It's okay. That's, that's what I give to hopefully know

618
01:05:13,680 --> 01:05:23,440
that one day my mom is going to welcome me home and go, you did good. You know, you did what nobody

619
01:05:23,440 --> 01:05:30,560
else would think about doing. And you challenged every political specter to get a place safer for

620
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:37,360
everybody, not the rich, not the poor, not the well-off, not the those without, not the homeless,

621
01:05:37,360 --> 01:05:45,200
everybody. And so, so basically, you know, I, I try to narrow it down with how many, obviously the

622
01:05:45,200 --> 01:05:50,400
biggest cost is me transporting it to wherever, you know, I've been to Pensacola, I've been to

623
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:57,440
South of Orlando, six and a half, seven hours one way. And with gasoline now, and I've got a good,

624
01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:03,440
a very economy car, like almost 30, 38 miles to the gallon. So I'm getting pretty good gas.

625
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:09,920
But when I go out, it's six or seven ghost bikes and it's efficient. I don't waste money. And I

626
01:06:09,920 --> 01:06:14,640
tell people a hundred percent of your donation goes to the calls and none of it coming to me.

627
01:06:14,640 --> 01:06:18,720
I mean, you can't see it, but I'll take some pictures and put them on Instagram and you can

628
01:06:18,720 --> 01:06:24,720
share them if you want to. But with the money people have donated, I bought a t-shirt printing

629
01:06:24,720 --> 01:06:32,160
machine, which is right here on the other side of my tablet. It has four stations. I have silk

630
01:06:32,160 --> 01:06:39,600
screens. I do all of the screens myself. I make them all. I do, I do mugs. I do, oh my God, hats.

631
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:47,520
You know, everything that I can is made with the same hands that make the ghost bikes. So you feel

632
01:06:47,520 --> 01:06:54,800
like you are getting a a hundred percent original piece of the ghost bike. Back to your question,

633
01:06:54,800 --> 01:07:00,080
probably I would say if you wanted to add in gasoline for like one bike to go to, let's say,

634
01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:06,240
let's say Pensacola, that's about six hour drive, six and a half hour drive. You're probably talking

635
01:07:06,880 --> 01:07:14,720
cost of the material is probably only about say gas and paint. You're probably talking $75 maybe.

636
01:07:15,600 --> 01:07:21,520
If you're talking time into painting the bike, that could probably take, that's probably about,

637
01:07:21,520 --> 01:07:25,760
I think one time I estimated it being about from the time of picking up a bike to getting it here,

638
01:07:25,760 --> 01:07:30,800
to dismantling it so that there's not extra stuff to paint, all that, taking off the chain,

639
01:07:30,800 --> 01:07:39,520
the cables, all that. It's probably about 10 to 15 hours a bike. So, you know, if I'm taking six

640
01:07:39,520 --> 01:07:47,840
bikes out, you're putting, I'm putting in probably a hundred, 120 hours per bike and cost of maybe,

641
01:07:47,840 --> 01:07:54,080
it'll only cost me about, well, you figure what I say, 60 bucks for six cans of paint, maybe,

642
01:07:54,080 --> 01:07:59,840
maybe, so you're talking about a hundred hours, maybe about a hundred dollars in paint total.

643
01:08:00,480 --> 01:08:07,200
I do have stickers that I put on the head tube, which is the bike friendly logo. I buy these,

644
01:08:07,200 --> 01:08:11,920
oh, you can't see it. I buy these little pla, oh, you can see it kind of, see it's white on the

645
01:08:11,920 --> 01:08:16,960
bike. Oh, I'm trying to flash this, you can see it in the thing, but anyway, there it is. That's

646
01:08:16,960 --> 01:08:21,600
got a line, but then I paint it black on the back. That's the sign you see on that bike right behind

647
01:08:21,600 --> 01:08:27,760
me. Then I have a Cree Cup machine that I print out all the letters on high adhesive vinyl that

648
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:32,640
goes on there. Hopefully it'll stay for a year or two and that would be a, that would be nice.

649
01:08:34,720 --> 01:08:39,120
Probably, you know, I would think around maybe a couple hundred dollars a bike. That's, that's a

650
01:08:39,120 --> 01:08:46,640
rough estimate, you know, but here we go again. I, I don't care. I care about where we're going

651
01:08:46,640 --> 01:08:52,800
and what we're doing, you know, and if people, if people want to read in, I've had some of my

652
01:08:52,800 --> 01:08:58,080
former students that are big internet sensations and things like that, when I'm dying on TikTok

653
01:08:58,080 --> 01:09:03,440
and all this, you know, they all tell me that if I could find a way to make more money, that I could

654
01:09:03,440 --> 01:09:08,640
help more people with more money. And I look at them and I go, I'm not going to compare myself

655
01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:15,760
to anybody because I don't, I don't. I live my life being me, I'm not going to compare myself

656
01:09:15,760 --> 01:09:21,920
to anybody. And that's when I'm the happiest and the most stress free that I can be. And I get more

657
01:09:21,920 --> 01:09:29,040
done doing that. And how many, how many people did Jesus have endorsing His product?

658
01:09:31,840 --> 01:09:36,080
And people look at me and go, well, you know, and I'm not, I'm not comparing, not at all.

659
01:09:36,080 --> 01:09:36,560
Yeah.

660
01:09:36,560 --> 01:09:41,920
But what I'm doing is along the same lines, I don't want money because money

661
01:09:41,920 --> 01:09:46,880
is what kind of the problem. If you want to really want to look at the whole system,

662
01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:52,560
it's not doing what's right. It's doing what you can get away with. And when you get caught,

663
01:09:52,560 --> 01:09:57,600
how do we get out of that being caught? Well, you shouldn't have done wrong in the first place.

664
01:10:00,000 --> 01:10:04,000
And I think that's what I really want to get across is that, you know, it costs, you know,

665
01:10:04,720 --> 01:10:09,520
200 bucks to put out this bike, right? Which sounds like a lot,

666
01:10:09,520 --> 01:10:16,400
a lot. But with the impact that it makes, I think even just having one person slow down,

667
01:10:16,400 --> 01:10:21,760
having them be a little bit more perceptive, having them be more like that's, that's worth

668
01:10:21,760 --> 01:10:28,080
the world. And, you know, with 200, almost 150 bikes, almost like that's such a small price to

669
01:10:28,080 --> 01:10:32,000
pay to save somebody else. And I think that that's what I want to kind of get across is

670
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:38,960
you don't need to make a million dollars to make an impact. You can do it with a $200 bike that you

671
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:44,720
place somewhere in remembrance of someone else to hopefully save one, two, however many people.

672
01:10:45,680 --> 01:10:55,680
Just think that if one bike makes somebody think that their loved ones, their father,

673
01:10:55,680 --> 01:11:02,800
their mother, their grandpa could be the next person to not come home, not only on a bike,

674
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:11,600
but walking in and out of a Walmart or being in a car. And you could have done something to just

675
01:11:11,600 --> 01:11:16,640
slow people down and make our roads safer. You know, this began as a bicycle mission,

676
01:11:16,640 --> 01:11:23,440
but it's not anymore. It's a safer road for everyone to use. And when people, one of my

677
01:11:23,440 --> 01:11:31,280
shirts says, if you don't think bicycles, pedestrians and cars can get along on our roads,

678
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:39,600
you are the problem. And it's as simple as that, you know, if anybody says, yeah, but

679
01:11:39,600 --> 01:11:44,080
then you need to stop them right there and tell them you're trying to find a reason for a,

680
01:11:44,080 --> 01:11:50,080
whatever, a car to be the only thing on the road. And even if you do, one of my other shirts says,

681
01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:54,480
I got a bunch of shirts. One of my other shirts says, what do you have if you take every

682
01:11:54,480 --> 01:12:01,360
pedestrian and bicyclist off the road in America? In Georgia alone, you'll still have 1500 deaths by

683
01:12:01,360 --> 01:12:10,160
car alone. So what's the problem? Yeah, exactly. It's, it's insane, but I'm glad that there are

684
01:12:10,160 --> 01:12:15,360
people that are again, bringing awareness to it that are so passionate about it, that are

685
01:12:15,360 --> 01:12:21,520
willing to, you know, put up with the BS with the, the, I don't know, the red tape that's needed in

686
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:28,800
order to make this happen. So as, as a guy that's walked across what at this point, 2000 miles of

687
01:12:28,800 --> 01:12:34,320
road in a year, thank you for what you do. And if people want to support you or learn more about

688
01:12:34,320 --> 01:12:37,680
your mission, David, how would be, what would be the best way for them to find you online?

689
01:12:38,240 --> 01:12:43,040
Well, they can go to, I've got Instagram and Facebook, which is bike friendly ATL.

690
01:12:43,040 --> 01:12:49,040
On either one that I've got quite a pretty good following on Instagram. I think I've got about

691
01:12:49,040 --> 01:12:57,280
seven or so thousand on Facebook. I do events on there all the time. Bike friendly atl.org is the

692
01:12:57,280 --> 01:13:05,280
website. I update, you know, as much as I can, but usually Facebook and Instagram are faster

693
01:13:05,280 --> 01:13:11,360
updates for me, cause I can do like live feeds from there. My website's a little bit, you know,

694
01:13:11,360 --> 01:13:16,080
my website's a little bit hung up on the live feed kind of stuff. So I do most of that through

695
01:13:16,080 --> 01:13:20,960
Instagram where more of my followers are. I've just started getting into a tick tock. I'm same,

696
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:28,160
same name there, bike friendly atl. And I'm going to start doing some tick tock videos on safer

697
01:13:28,160 --> 01:13:34,160
driving. You know, how do you landscape or how do you maneuver around cyclists and pedestrians

698
01:13:34,160 --> 01:13:38,880
when you're using our roads in a safe manner? So then hopefully people will just listen and go,

699
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:43,920
maybe this guy's not so wacko. Maybe we all can be safer in cars too, you know?

700
01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:49,360
Awesome. No, that's fantastic. I mean, that information is definitely what is needed. So

701
01:13:49,360 --> 01:13:54,160
again, David, I'll link all that down in the show notes, your Facebook, Instagram, tick tock website,

702
01:13:54,160 --> 01:13:59,760
as well as a direct donation link for you. And if anybody has any questions or would be interested

703
01:13:59,760 --> 01:14:03,600
in starting this or doing something similar where they are, would they be able to contact you to

704
01:14:03,600 --> 01:14:09,600
kind of ask for advice or some, some assistance with that? Yeah, they can always email me at

705
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:16,480
bike friendly atl at gmail.com. Perfect. All right, David, thank you again. And I'll be sure to chat

706
01:14:16,480 --> 01:14:21,600
with you later. You betcha. Be safe out there. Thank you. Thank you for listening to today's

707
01:14:21,600 --> 01:14:25,920
episode. I hope that you're able to take a nugget or two from our conversation today and apply it to

708
01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:31,920
your business, nonprofit or life in general. All of David's social media accounts are linked in the

709
01:14:31,920 --> 01:14:36,800
show notes below. If you'd like to support bike friendly atl or start something similar in your

710
01:14:36,800 --> 01:14:42,720
area, please reach out to David directly to see how you two can collaborate. And y'all, we've got

711
01:14:42,720 --> 01:14:47,920
plenty of more episodes on the horizon. And I'm so excited to share some magic with all of you. If

712
01:14:47,920 --> 01:14:52,400
you'd like to share some of that magic with your community, please write us a review and share this

713
01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:58,160
episode with a friend. Just like David said during our interview, if we can share messages with our

714
01:14:58,160 --> 01:15:04,400
community, we can really turn this whole thing around. I'll see you all next week. And as always,

715
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:27,840
have fun, stay safe and be yourself.