So I remember our first little adventure
in kind of remote management.
And it's definitely not the way we do it now,
but we had a woman that had been doing the laundry
for several weeks for her stay.
And we said, I won't mention her name,
but we said, hey, a few of the guests
wanna go do the snowshoeing thing.
Do you wanna come?
She said, no, I'll stay here.
And we said, well, if you're gonna stay here,
do you mind just running the hostel?
I mean, you know, it makes sense.
If you can do laundry,
you should be able to run a hostel, right?
Hello, friends and travelers.
Thanks for listening.
You are riding along on the Hostel Road Trip podcast.
Our mission is to spread awareness
of the true hostile experience in the Americas
and share stories from the fascinating hosts
who create those unique facilities.
I'm your host, Jimmy Black,
joined alongside co-founder
of International Travelers House, Bobby Dyer.
Each session, we sit down with hostile operators
or travel influencers to hear about their road success,
discuss trending hostile topics,
and close with tips for travelers
who are seeking to have the ultimate experience
when visiting each destination.
You can't afford to miss this trip.
Now fasten your seat belts and let's hit the road.
["The Hostel Road Trip"]
Welcome back to the Hostel Road Trip podcast,
episode two of the day.
We recorded with Dave Cook at the Barn Door Hostel
in New Hampshire earlier today.
And now we are with Jay Greggs,
co-founder of the Bunkin Brew Hostel up in Oregon.
And I'm with my business partner, Bobby Dyer,
and co-founder of IGH Hostels.
Thank you so much for joining us, gentlemen.
Awesome, yeah, thanks for coming on, Jay.
I'm gonna rock on.
So, wanna jump in more so, Jay,
to your personal experience.
I always love to start the episode
with how you first came in contact with hostels personally.
And I know that you've got a beautiful story
of how you and Frankie came together
in a chance meeting of sorts through a soccer league.
But yeah.
Oh, wow, you remember.
Yeah, I smoke a lot of weed,
but I got a memory like an elephant.
But I wanna hear about your personal,
like when was your first exposure to hostels?
Yeah, you know, Frankie, he can tell his story
and he's been in the game, not in the game,
but he's been aware of hostels much longer than me.
For me, it was very late in life.
He was traveling at a pretty young age.
I didn't really leave the country
until I was pretty much 30.
So I kind of already had a career.
I was a lawyer.
I was doing this and that, working in an IT company.
So what happened to me was I was in the Midwest.
I didn't really love it out there.
I'm more of a West Coast kid.
And I said, well, I need to do something different.
And I wasn't sure what.
I didn't find anything I liked on the West Coast.
So I said, well, I made some money out here.
Let's just try traveling, kind of get some exposure.
So it was about 2016, I think.
And I bought a truck down in LA,
like a big black, like oversized tires.
And I just drove south as far as I could go.
And so I made it through every country till Panama.
And I didn't really know what I would expect,
but one of the things I discovered there was hostels.
I just had no idea about this concept.
And so I made it that far,
ended up spending a few months in Cuba,
just to kind of finish things out
and then came back to the States.
And I just thought I'd go back to lawyering,
but instead I just decided,
let's try this hostile thing in the States.
There isn't a lot of them out there.
I had a good time.
Frankly, I was surprised there weren't more of them
in the States, considering the experience that I had.
When you're cruising through,
cruising south through Central America,
what were some of the iconic hostels
or most inspirational hostels that you found
that you were like, whoa, really opened your eyes?
Oh yeah, there were a few.
And let me tell you,
you couldn't do what I did there in the States.
So I knew my house would be somewhat limited,
at least not legally,
but and down there, who knows what was legal or not.
But God, I mean, I remember one morning waking up,
I didn't even wake up.
I was woken up by a couple of bros in furry suits
with a beer bong at like seven or eight in the morning,
basically commanding me to climb the roof of this hostel,
take a beer shot and jump into a pool from the roof.
And then I was like, whoa, this is, you know,
and I was saying yes to everything back then, you know,
I just wanted to experience.
So I'm lucky I made it like many of us.
But yeah, that was a great experience.
You know, there's some other cool ones too
that just had really inventive ideas.
There was this one that was just a bunch of trampolines
and you would just kind of on an island
and you just, you'd stay on this.
The whole hostel was a wooden dock,
kind of on the edge of the land.
And then you'd jump on trampolines into the water
and it was beautiful, you know,
and Central America has some great settings.
So yeah, yeah, there were some great ones.
There were tree house hostels, just all trees.
Yeah.
Awesome stuff.
So you come back from that trip
and find yourself in Bend, Oregon, right?
I actually came back to Portland first, you know,
that was kind of, Ben was on the radar to me
because everyone in Portland goes there.
It's like the outdoor adventure hub of Oregon, right?
But at the time I really didn't have an exposure.
I just had heard about it.
Okay.
So you met Frankie when you were in Portland.
That's right.
Okay.
So now, so that's where you two hook up
and tell a little bit about how like,
yeah, that's a very unique thing
that you both met through the soccer league,
through like a mutual friend that was like,
I got a buddy who's trying to open a hostel.
Well, that's the weird thing, you know?
It's not weird to meet interesting people
through the things that you have passions about
that are, you know, normal commonplace things.
But what's weird is when you find two people
in a country that isn't doing that thing at all
and you run into each other.
So when I first heard about it from our,
kind of the captain of the team, he just said,
hey, there's this guy on the team that's also running a,
wants to start a hostel.
You should talk to him.
And I didn't believe it at first.
They said he probably means a hotel or an Airbnb.
This guy doesn't know, you know?
Yeah.
But it turns out he did.
And so, yeah, so we decided we would do it together.
Wow. That's awesome.
Yeah.
And I know from experience with Bob,
it really is a much different experience.
And for me, a much more enjoyable experience
to have a partner in that process,
especially if you could find someone
that has a lot of the opposite strengths
and that can counteract your weaknesses.
Yeah. And I think that you
and Frankie have a similar relationship
and working relationship that Bobby and I have.
And I can see the same benefits
that you two have drawn off each other in that way.
So that's so cool.
Now, tell us a bit about, now you've met the person,
your business partner, Frankie,
you want to open up this hostel,
you both jump on board together.
Take us a little bit through the process
of how you found yourself in Bend, Oregon,
as opposed to Portland.
And of course we know Jim Kennett was a big part
of being a mentor for you.
So give us a little bit about how that all went down.
Yeah, that's right.
So Jim Kennett had the main hostel in Portland,
and we weren't going to compete against him
without talking to him.
So we just decided, hey,
frankly, we didn't even know what we were doing anyway.
I mean, we came from different backgrounds.
Frankie came from Washington in medical,
I came from California and doing law.
So we were a little bit clueless.
We just had this vision
and we were kind of tired of what we were doing.
So we just were kind of rolling the dice a bit.
But so we figured it'd be a good start
to just invite this old man to have a beer with us.
And it was, it was a great idea.
He was very generous with his time.
He basically said, I'll tell you boys,
anything you want to know,
as long as you don't compete with me in Portland.
And we said, okay, where do we go?
And actually a side story is
he didn't even tell us Bend at first.
He told us Seaside,
because he had owned a hostel in Seaside,
and he had left to consolidate his empire,
so to speak, in Portland.
And so we actually negotiated with the woman
that he sold the Seaside hostel to,
which is out on the beach about an hour from Portland,
kind of the quickest beach access from Portland.
And those negotiations fell through.
And that's when Frank and her saying,
well, okay, so what kind of hostel do we want?
Jim was just kind of teeing us up for that
because it was already a hostel.
But we knew we could just build
whatever we wanted anywhere we wanted.
So we did a search all over Oregon
and we determined that
because we were both into outdoor adventure,
and that's the reason people come to Oregon,
we would start it in the capital of outdoor adventure,
which was Bend.
Amazing.
And also like a big brewery town as well, right?
Most breweries per like whatever,
isn't that a fact there?
That's right.
So yeah, Bunkin Brew, that's our name.
And so we had to build into the beer scene.
So I know down in Sandy, pretty good scene too,
but in Bend has some of the, let's see, per capita,
more breweries than anywhere in the world.
Yeah.
That's, yeah.
And I always loved the name that you came up with there.
Thanks.
Yeah, super creative and inclusive.
There's actually a funny story to that too.
We were in- Go, go, give it.
And I thought this would be the hardest thing
because it's gonna go into everything, right?
And we're setting up,
this could take weeks and months, we don't really know.
We sat down, in fact, with the soccer coach
or captain of our team and his girlfriend
in a bar in Portland, and we asked them,
we said, well, help us out.
You got us together, now what do you,
we're gonna film this back wall.
It's where it's gonna be.
So we're like, you're off to a pretty good start.
He's like, well, tell me again, what are you gonna do?
Well, we're like, we're selling beds.
He's like, all right, all right.
Well, you can't just do bed, that's pretty plain.
So what's another, what kind of beds?
We like bunk beds, there is like bunk, got it.
All right, so what else are you gonna do?
We're gonna sell beer.
All right, well, it can't be bunk and beer.
Give me any, you know, whatever, brew, brew.
Okay, bunk and brew.
And we just never found a better name.
Oh, no, it is a great one.
It is a fantastic name.
Now we were there and had the opportunity
to go and stay at your hostel, which was so cool
after the last conference
for the North American Hostel Association,
which we'll ask you more about that
a bit later in the episode.
But as far as going to your hostel,
I thought it was so cool.
I love that it's out of a historical building.
We operate out of a lot of historical buildings.
I love the character that comes with it.
But obviously there's also the challenges of, you know,
oh, this walkway is gonna be changed
or this room upstairs you can't use
and different things like that.
You know, so I wanted to ask a bit about those challenges
you went through so people could hear them.
And then I also wanted to talk about the awesome
like shower house that you made, you know,
like the washout, which is so cool,
how you separated that and how I can see
how that can be so efficient,
not only like cleaning and things like that,
but if you have an historical place,
a lot of the things you can't touch or amend,
so the bathrooms are, you're kind of stuck
with what you got.
So I love that you built this bath house
that now that functions adjacently
to the historical building, which allows it to be.
Then you brought in all these vendors
with food trucks and bars and cars.
So give us the listeners a bit about that process
of going into an historical property
and then bringing in those outside vendors
and maximizing the property with your,
what do you call them, dirt bags?
Yeah. You're at campers.
Dirt bags, got the dirt bag deal for the dirt baggers.
Yeah, yeah, that's it.
Give us a little bit of insight into that
because I really think you guys hit it out of the park
as far as like maximizing opportunity
within the historical building.
Yeah, yeah, we have.
I'd like to think so.
And you're right, we had all the challenges you mentioned
and we were lucky because we were onto a good thing
from the beginning.
So Bend didn't have a hostel.
It's becoming unaffordable for many people,
inflation, all the things.
So the hostel was an opportunity
to basically serve this market that people didn't,
wasn't served, people just passed their Ben
or they do day trips or they camp outside of the city
because they didn't have any access.
So at first we just threw an Airbnb.
We just put in a bunch of thrift store furniture
and we just said, let's test the model, right?
It's a cool house, it's right downtown.
You can walk everywhere.
Let's see what happens.
And so we were already profitable in our second month
and that's when we knew we were onto something
and that it's worth investing more
because we bootstrapped from the beginning.
And so what we found is that a lot of people would come
and they would already have a rig
that they were sleeping in an RV, something like that.
So they didn't need a bed,
but they did need a place to like be close to the city,
reconnect, resupply, take a shower, get a beer,
that sort of stuff.
So we said, well, how do you, this is our market,
but we're not like, we don't have a product for them.
So how do we take advantage of this property to do that?
And so we already knew that in this historic house,
there weren't enough bathrooms.
When we tried to join HI originally, we couldn't do it
because we didn't meet the metrics that they had for
our bathroom and stuff.
And we made it work because again, a lot of these guys,
they're pretty easygoing,
their standards are pretty flexible.
And frankly, as long as they have a good time,
they don't really care.
And that was one thing we always delivered.
Maybe you know something.
We can, because of the experience we deliver,
people will overlook a lot of flaws.
So, and that was the first one in the early days.
So anyway, so we said, okay, what can we do?
We need more bathrooms.
Let's maybe keep the dirt outside and do something new
because something new, we don't have to deal with all
the intricacies of blowing out the house.
And we had this, as we built this bath house,
we said, why we're at it, what else can we do with it?
And we got a great designer.
She said, you can add a sauna.
I loved it.
You can add lockers, you can add laundry,
you know, all the things that these guys can just have
their own little space out there and kind of the people
who want to have the private rooms and kind of, you know,
they have, you know, their own kind of thing going,
can be a little separate from these guys.
And so, yeah, it's worked really well.
And we basically invented a new category of travel
for that area that didn't exist.
Awesome.
And the food trucks, how you tied in,
that was really fascinating too.
You guys really used the whole property.
Talk about how you guys did that.
Yeah, so the next step was, again, we have this land
and we're like, how do we use it?
And so, you know, everyone enjoys the restaurants
and the bars downtown, but we started having people
that were staying longer and longer periods of time.
And so they can't either, they either don't want it,
they get tired, they just, it's not affordable
to just eat it out every night.
So we said, well, we have this land
and we had other food cart pods in the city,
but none of them were right downtown.
So that's when we started building out that infrastructure.
And so now we have three food carts and one bar.
And the bar is an old 1970s bread truck
that we just bought. Yeah.
Very cool.
I loved it, I loved it.
Yeah, we just really focused on character
and finding interesting things.
And that was kind of a staple to the yard.
Yeah, I think it's, yeah, go ahead, go Bob.
I was gonna tie into kind of the next step
of the operations wise.
I'd love to hear like you were,
you know, you traveled these hostels,
you had some wild times in Central America,
became a fan of hostels, met up with a buddy,
got a hostel going, but you never,
you weren't like a hostel manager for years
before you took on this vision.
What was that, tell us about kind of opening the hostel
and kind of those first days, maybe opening day,
things you had there.
Well, yeah, that was as wild as my travels were.
I mean, that was my only experience anyway, you know?
So we were taking cash, we were exchanging services,
stay a night for doing the laundry, you know?
It was kind of a relief, gave us a break.
I mean, it was pretty wild.
I mean, after a couple of months of that,
we're just, you know, when Frank and I were up all night,
you know, just doing it all ourselves, you know,
going from being a lawyer back to scrubbing toilets,
so, and making beds, but it was a lot of fun
and we knew people really appreciate it
and that kept us going,
but we knew we couldn't do that forever.
So I remember our first little adventure
in kind of remote management
and it's definitely not the way we do it now,
but we had a woman that had been doing the laundry
for several weeks for her stay and we said,
I won't mention her name, but she, we said,
hey, a few of the guests wanna go do the snowshoeing thing.
Do you wanna come?
She said, no, I'll stay here.
And we said, well, if you're gonna stay here,
do you mind just running the hostel?
I mean, you know, it makes sense.
If you can do laundry,
you should be able to run a hostel, right?
So anyway, the sense or not, we did it.
We left for 24 hours.
We had a great time snowshoeing with our guests
who had also stayed for quite a while.
When we came back, everything seemed normal
and we were pretty happy about it.
We got the keys back.
We said, thanks, you can stay another week for free.
Well, it turns out one of the guests had left
her some stuff in her car and that stuff was gone.
So we traced it back to the same woman
who had basically taken the keys,
taken everything out of this woman's car,
stuffed her credit cards under her own mattress
and we had the police take her out in handcuffs.
And that was it.
Oh wow.
First lesson.
So we had to tighten up a little after that.
Not much though.
But it's a little.
No, that is something.
Now we've been doing, at the past couple of episodes,
some of the operators are in the mode of,
they live on site.
You know, every in the line one of them used was,
hostels is life and my life is the hostel.
And we've been talking with them about how that is a classic,
you know, genuine old school way to run a mom and pop hostel,
but could really burn you out over time
as you don't get off site or it really does consume your life.
And I think it was cool to hear from them
so that people that are going through that can, you know,
have some camaraderie or understand
that that is a possibility.
But I think you guys portray the exact opposite end
of the spectrum, which is great because it shows
that there are options and styles of running your hostel
and managing it.
And I was always very impressed with how you
and Frankie started the place.
You went in full bore, like you said.
Yeah.
You were doing the hostel is life, life is the hostel.
But then very successfully, you both pulled yourself out
and were able to explore and go travel
and as if you were still a backpacker.
And there was a few times where I was like,
these motherfuckers, how are they pulling that off?
Like, you know, like, I mean, I was trying to figure out
how I could replicate this.
So I'd love to hear a bit and I'm sure others would as well
about how you did that transition.
Like, you know, you mentioned your first gamut at it
was unsuccessful.
Yeah.
We've all been there.
Exactly, yeah.
But how did you then over time get yourselves to the point
where you guys are both now running this place
and doing different things?
That's right.
Yeah, we are.
Yeah, Frankie's in Portugal and I'm a bit of a nomad,
but I get to travel a lot.
And yeah, that's right.
So we put in a few years of hard work
and it was a bit of a transition.
So maybe a year and a half, two years,
we were there all the time.
And then one of us would leave for a month
and the other would stay.
We just kind of back each other up.
And then I think after, God, actually,
even after one year, we took a month off together
and the hostel didn't burn down.
So we said, OK, maybe we take two months next time.
And then, yeah, and eventually we have managers come in
and with sufficient training and systems, we could leave.
And so we've been doing this now, I think, seven or eight
years.
And I'll tell you this much, like, where the hostel is now
is not where I thought it would be.
At some point, we basically handed it over.
You know, we have our kind of, you know,
these are the limits on the far end of things
and they're pretty far.
And then everything within it can be organic
based on customer demand.
And as long as our managers are keeping their ears open
for what customers demand.
So although the exact shape of it has changed and morphed
and we've accepted that, one thing we knew for sure
is that we couldn't do it forever.
And so from the very beginning, I
told them we focus first on profitability
and second on sustainability because we needed something
that we could deliver to management
to be able to operate in their sleep with no training.
What I often tell people and my managers is,
I need to have a system where if you win the lottery
or get hit by a truck, this hostile will continue.
You know, just a real visual.
Like if you disappear, who's going to know what to do?
Every time you do something, manager,
please think if I didn't do this, would it get done?
What would happen?
How would that affect the business?
And so instilling kind of that from the beginning, I think.
And also, you know, people appreciate having you
put their trust in them.
Sure.
And so I won't say we're gone 100% of the time.
We do come back when we do big management changes.
But we had one recently where two left and nearly
the same time.
But as long as we just have one there and one transitioning
out, we can do most of it remote now.
That's awesome.
And again, a testament to show the wide range
that you can attack this hostile in game
and from the point of you're on site all the time,
you live there, you're raising your kids there,
to you're running it remotely with systems, with training.
But I do love that you're doing it in a way
that you're not micromanaging, which that is, again,
pat yourself on the back.
Because most people, when they try to remove themselves,
they're remotely micromanaging.
It's their baby.
It's hard.
I get it.
And you talked about you and Bobby
having kind of remote into the spectrums.
I'm more on that side.
And Frankie's more free will.
And I think the fact that we're both so far to the extreme
on this kind of forces this middle ground, you know?
So yeah, it's been good.
Magnets pulling.
I think that's awesome.
And again, a testament to you guys in the ability
to do that, because it shows it is possible.
But it does rely a lot on systems and policies,
procedures.
But love that you give the creative freedom
and the empowerment to that person.
Here are the boundaries.
But inside of that, be creative, be empowered, be trusted.
And it is funny.
Sometimes I do show up, and the hospital
can be littered with crystals and little flags of this and that.
I do have to do a little cleaning out.
But for the most part, the core of it
is built by the people who stay there.
Yeah, and that's a great way to do it organically, genuinely.
Now, just to jump over now, the Bunk and Brew, obviously,
an awesome place.
But a whole other venture that you have created,
which we're so grateful for, you, Jim, and Frankie really
pioneered and spearheaded this formation
of a legitimate hostile association in America,
for all of North America, actually,
called the North America Hostile Association.
And we plug it during every episode.
And we always ask the person that we're interviewing
if they're a member.
And then we scold them for a few minutes afterwards if they're
not.
Good.
Please do hear us.
Scolding.
It's one of our favorite methods.
So yeah, yeah.
It's short, short, short.
It's public shaming.
Public shaming live.
But if you could tell the people,
or we love it so much, and just to give an example,
we met at the American Hostile Conference years ago
before the pandemic.
And then we went to Dublin at the same time afterwards
to go to the Hostile World Conference.
And we had a great time together.
And I think that's one of the great things
that people are missing out on in these conferences.
Oh, I don't have the time to go.
But it's so worth it with the networking and the relationships
that you could create, especially in an industry
where there's just not that many people that
know what you're doing.
It's very common that the hostel owner and manager,
not even their parents know what they're doing
and don't understand it.
So it's so great to have that camaraderie, that network.
I love the WhatsApp chat that you have going on.
And it's really, as we've seen a few different people try
to pull off the association over the years,
I feel like this is the best effort in part because
of your legal skills in actually forming successfully it
to be, what is it, a 501C7?
Six, yeah.
Six.
And just the potential.
Hey, you had a one in seven chance.
It's not bad.
I got the numbers.
I mean, there's not an infinite number.
So to tell the listeners a bit about what Naha is all about,
why was it created, and a little bit about where it's going.
Well, I'll tell you this.
You give me some credit for being
able to do remote management.
I only have one hostel.
You guys have quite a few.
So I imagine it gets harder as you try to scale that model.
And maybe someday, Frank and I will do that.
But I think what I realized is being
that I started hostels a little later in the life,
I'm 40-something now.
I'm like, how much energy do I have to really build
a global hostel, whatever, at least in the States,
which was kind of one of the ideas we had in the beginning.
And I quickly realized I probably
don't have the energy for that.
And it's not going to be the easiest thing to do it
on my own.
And so one of the motivations behind Naha
is to basically say, well, to your point, a lot of guys,
even hostile people, they don't know what they're doing necessarily
because they're doing it on their own.
They're just figuring out maybe like I
did by going to another country and kind of learning it that way.
So the idea of Naha was, how do we expand this network faster?
And maybe we can do that by having a network.
So me, Jay, I can provide my skills to this organization.
And they can replicate it across many different individuals
who want to start a hostel.
So I don't have to create 100.
If I can teach in one room 100 other individuals
how to create theirs, if that makes sense.
True that.
I know that makes a lot of sense.
And then what about going forward for the Naha?
Now that we've got momentum, we got a great conference
this past April in Portland that we went up to Ben to visit your place.
What do you think are some upcoming exciting things going on with Naha
that you might be able to share with some of the existing members
and potential members out there?
Yeah, one of the things that's cool is we started with just kind of a ragtag
group of whoever was just willing to give it a chance
and just fly and meet us and have a good time.
And everyone did, but no one really knew if we'd take off or how realistic it was.
But after 100 plus attendees at the last one, we figured we're on to a big thing,
right?
People picked up attendees.
So we are trying to get the next one actually down in Mexico.
And so there's some debate about how often we should be doing this.
And as long as we have people that are willing, we're going to try.
So we're trying to do that.
It is good for our representation to kind of bring it between US, Mexico.
Maybe the next year we'll do one in Canada.
So right now we are adding new board members.
So the first board members had put a lot into it,
because it was the only ones doing it.
Now we're forming committees to kind of spread the burden and that sort of thing.
So as we prepare for next year, I think in filling the board.
The other thing we also did, by the way, at the last conference,
we tried to figure out what do members want?
Yeah.
How do you make an organization that's actually continuing to deliver what people want?
And what's it going to cost?
And what are people willing to contribute for those benefits?
So right now we're actually doing the math and figuring that out.
What is, you know, and you'll see some surveys coming out,
this and that about what you want and how to deliver it.
And so that's I guess that's the stage we're in now.
Hopefully we'll have something to share next year in Mexico.
Well, yeah, it's really exciting to hear about the the Mexico location.
I think that will be a lot of fun, although you guys smashed it out of the park in Portland.
So definitely some shoes to fill for the next person.
Because those things are so they're so hard to pull off and coordinate.
So I really always give so much credit to the people who even try, you know,
and then when you when you actually do it well, you know, that's a smashing out of the park.
And I'm so glad that you guys took on that task because the first one has to go well
or there won't be a second one.
We certainly felt that pressure.
I mean, you know, again, just overordering on booze was definitely an intentional element.
Maybe we can go a little lighter next year. I don't know.
No, you guys did a great job.
It was a lot of fun.
Yeah, it was amazing. Really well put together.
So next year, that'll be something.
We encourage all those hostels out there listening that haven't become a member
to join up and embrace the community and the movement as we're stronger together than apart.
So great things going on at the Naha.
Very excited for the upcoming conference.
We always love to go and tear it up and have a great time.
So you can count on us being there in depth and in numbers.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah. So but just great having you, man.
And so excited to see what you got coming with the Naha.
I'm excited to see the new board members and new blood.
There's rumors Bob Dyer might be a board member.
We're very proud of him there.
So we'll take him if he'll have us.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, very exciting.
He's hard to pin down, but I think you can get him.
But I think the future is very bright for the Naha and also the bunk and brew.
And thanks so much, Jay, for joining us.
And of course, Bob, for co-hosting with me.
And we'll be meeting with Frankie Medusa in our upcoming episodes to hear a bit
about his story alongside you.
Yeah, I'll be curious to hear that.
We'll see how many memories have faded.