WEBVTT

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This episode is sponsored by LifeAid. As you

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guys know, I made a promise to only bring companies

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I interviewed the founder of LifeAid, Aaron Hinde.

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Welcome guys to episode 237 of Behind the Shield

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podcast. As always, my name is James Geering,

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and I am so excited to bring to you an incredible

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woman this week, Olivia Jackson. Now, Olivia's

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life story is nothing short of incredible from

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being born in South Africa, finding herself in

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the world of modeling, then transitioning to

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the world of professional Muay Thai in Thailand,

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entering the stunt world, a horrific near -fatal

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accident during filming, and then her incredibly

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inspiring, powerful journey back from that injury

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to where she is now. So as I always say before

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we start the interview, please take a moment,

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go to your podcast app, subscribe to the show,

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and then leave feedback. But then the big thing

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is take your social media and share these incredible

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episodes. Every single week, I have one of these

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men or women whose story I know is going to inspire

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people worldwide, and you guys are the key to

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getting these episodes out. So with that being

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said, I introduce to you Olivia Jackson. Enjoy.

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So Olivia, I want to start by saying thank you

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so much for taking the time to come on the podcast.

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Thanks for having me. All right, so where are

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we finding you on planet Earth today? Today I'm

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in England, in the UK, where my home is, in a

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very small village outside of London, about an

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hour outside of London. Fantastic. Now, obviously

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from your accent, that is not where you were

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born. So first proper question, where were you

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born and what was your family unit like when

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you were young? Well, I was born in Johannesburg

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in South Africa, real shithole. But I left there

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when I was a baby and we moved to this area called

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Richmond in South Africa, in Natal in South Africa.

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on a small holding, which was like kids' paradise.

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There was trees to climb, fruit trees to take

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fruit off of, nut trees. We spent hours cracking

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nuts. Huge rockeries with things to hide in and

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pretend it's a school or your house or whatever,

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loads of tunnels. It was like streams with ponds.

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loads of things to swing on vines and swings

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my dad made at night time there's loads of fireflies

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around so we used to go around and catch fireflies

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and put the poor things in jars so that it lights

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up but in the morning they're always dead poor

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things that's a huge metaphor for many things

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in life huh yeah but yeah such a cool childhood

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then just playing on the farm on the weekends

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And there was loads of the staff on the farm

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who had their little kids living there. And so

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we used to play with them running around and

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playing, you know. We were swimming in the pool

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and jumping in mud all day and make slippery

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slides. My dad had a nursery. So he had loads

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and loads of very, very long pieces of thick

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plastic. So we would, on the hills, we'd make

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a long slippery slide and put some. a dishwashing

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liquid and a hose pipe on it and slide down.

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Really good fun. So how much do you attribute

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later on becoming a fighter and ultimately a

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stunt person to just that rugged life on the

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farm? Well, I love that lifestyle. I think I'm

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in my old age, well, 38. I'm going back to that

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now. All I want to do is live on a farm. And

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I think maybe it's from that I don't know, but

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I've always loved dirt. So, like, if it was motorbikes,

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I loved motocross. Road bikes, yeah, I liked,

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but I loved, you know, riding in the dirt. The

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same with cars. Like, rally driving is so much

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better for me than, you know, road racing or

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track racing. Yeah, so I think it's sort of stuck

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with me. Quite a – I don't know what the word

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is. I think I – yeah, well, I've always liked

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the outdoors and – what's the word? Like I'm

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not a kind of person who likes minds getting

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dirty or minds getting hurt, I guess. So, yeah,

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that plays a part. Brilliant. Yeah, I grew up

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on a farm myself too. It's funny you talk about

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riding through dirt. I think it's a lot more

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forgiving. You can get flung from a motorbike

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and actually just roll out of it and be okay,

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or a horse. But yeah, on the road, it's not so

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forgiving. Yeah, and it's also just so much more

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exciting on the dirt. It's more forgiving when

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you fall, but there's loads more going on. It's

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easy to stay in a straight line when you're riding

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on tar. really boring but on dirt you concentrate

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so much more and you know you're probably getting

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pain from side to side but the fun is if you

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stay on and keep going forward yeah absolutely

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actually i remember you know on the farm doing

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you know donuts and four -wheel skids and all

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that stuff and then when Not too long ago, embarrassingly

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recently, in my suburban house before this one,

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we had about a third of an acre. And if it was

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raining, I'd take my car in the back and do donuts

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in the backyard with my son. And then the neighbors

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every so often would call and be like, hey, there's

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some lunatic doing stunts in the car. I'm like,

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oh, yeah, I'll call the police. Thanks. A few

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years ago, before I had the accident, I went

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out two arms and I had a manual car. In South

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Africa, we called it a bucky. It's a pickup truck

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or a ute or whatever you want to call it. I could

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transport my motocross bike. I always used to

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get my mom in the car if I picked her up and

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went somewhere. Then I'd find a gravel bit. Every

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time I saw a gravel bit, I'd go and do handbrake

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turns around it. You mentioned about the people

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helping on the farm. When people from outside...

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the nation of Africa or the continent of Africa.

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Yeah, there's obviously racism is one of the

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first things that comes in or apartheid. What

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was your perspective as a young girl growing

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up? Did you see apartheid? Was there normal integration

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where you were on the farm? What was your experience

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with that specifically? Well, yeah, I grew up

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in like, you know, proper apartheid times. I

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think Mandela only became president in 94, which

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was, I was 13 years old. I actually remember

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when the first, non -white was allowed to come

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to our school. It was an Indian girl, poor girl.

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But anyway, that was like, I actually remember

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that and I was probably only about 10 years old.

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So that was quite a big change. On the farm,

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I mean, I didn't really notice because I was

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younger, but so I had this, one of the black

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staff on the farm, they had this daughter called

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Golay. I used to love playing with her. She was

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so cool. But she was absolutely petrified of

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my mom. We had a long driveway. And my mom used

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to come driving up the driveway. And you just

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used to see Gwole absolutely bolt. Just bolt

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and run for the bushes and hide in the bushes.

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My mom and my dad were really good to their staff.

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It didn't matter if you were black or white or

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purple or pink. But I guess the little kids were

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just really scared of white adults. Really funny.

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But that was a weird time because there was lots

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of, at that time, there was lots of fighting

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in between. In South Africa, you have, at the

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time, two different parties that the black people

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followed. They're called Nkarta and ANC. ANC

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is Mandela's party that Mandela was in. And there

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was loads of fighting between those parties,

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between the sort of African people. And there

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are lots. we had loads of them over the staff

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and move onto the farm because it was fighting

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in the sort of townships, which is quite sad.

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And actually in the end, we ended up moving away

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from there because it was just so much fighting,

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which is quite sad. Yeah, no, it is. And that's

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the problem with that, that hate. you know, that's

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behind all of that. I mean, obviously, there

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was horrendous things happening to, you know,

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so many of the black people there. And obviously,

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there was that reflects them to a lot of the,

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you know, the white people that have been growing

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up through generations on farms that way. And

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actually, my stepbrother -in -law was from there,

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and they were basically run off their farm. And,

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you know, again, it's insanity. It kind of reminds

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me, there was a picture recently on the internet.

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And it was so cute. And it was these two young

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boys. One was black, one was white. I think it

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was here in America. And I want to say they were

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about five, six, maybe. And they said they both

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got the same haircut so they could confuse their

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teacher as a practical joke. You know, so they

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weren't seeing themselves different at all. And

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that's what always just blows me away is that

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when we're all young, like you were when you

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were growing up on the farm. there isn't that

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hatred, there isn't that prejudice, that segregation.

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And then that poison starts creeping in as we

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grow up and then we're divided. So I'm always

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intrigued to hear people's perspectives from

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different parts of the world. Yeah. I mean, people

00:12:30.679 --> 00:12:33.279
are crazy. They'll always find something to fight

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about. It's not black and white, it's Indian

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and black or blacker. from one area versus black

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from another area like that. Now in South Africa,

00:12:43.470 --> 00:12:46.029
there's loads of problems with, you know, what

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happened in Zimbabwe, really, really fucking

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sad, you know, where they gave the land away

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and then loads of people, the country's completely

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bankrupt and everybody lost their jobs. So there

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was absolutely no money. There's still no money

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in that country. So most of the African people,

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Zimbabweans, had to try and find work out of

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it. So a lot of them have come to South Africa

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because it's close. And now there's lots of problems.

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Zimbabweans generally are very sweet people,

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and a lot of them don't drink alcohol, which

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is a big bonus because a lot of the African people

00:13:28.100 --> 00:13:31.700
in South Africa get really tanked on the weekend.

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They love a big bender, or every single night

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sometimes. So a lot of people in South Africa

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hire Zimbabweans because they're really just

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good workers, you know. And then there's always

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problems now with the black people in South Africa.

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They hate the black people from Zimbabwe because

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they come and take all their work. So they literally,

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if you're Zimbabwean, you can only live in certain

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areas and you have to travel in groups because

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they just chuck them off trains, stab them in

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the streets, you name it. Wow. Yeah, and again,

00:14:06.970 --> 00:14:09.509
it all comes back from that hate and that greed

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and power at the top. Same with the Syrians.

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I mean, you look at the footage of some of these,

00:14:13.970 --> 00:14:17.090
what used to be a city that these people are

00:14:17.090 --> 00:14:19.470
fleeing from, they don't have a choice. And then,

00:14:19.470 --> 00:14:22.049
obviously, then you get this kind of resistance

00:14:22.049 --> 00:14:25.429
to them sheltering in certain countries. And

00:14:25.429 --> 00:14:30.309
the underlying thing is that the few are making

00:14:30.309 --> 00:14:32.309
decisions that are getting themselves extremely

00:14:32.309 --> 00:14:35.659
powerful, extremely rich. But, you know, these

00:14:35.659 --> 00:14:38.240
are all victims and whether they end up becoming

00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:40.600
bad people because of their circumstances, you

00:14:40.600 --> 00:14:43.139
know, these decisions that some of these people

00:14:43.139 --> 00:14:46.159
in power make, there's a domino effect that lasts

00:14:46.159 --> 00:14:50.419
for generations after that. Yeah, that's a really

00:14:50.419 --> 00:14:53.539
sad bit. Yeah. All right. Well, then back to

00:14:53.539 --> 00:14:56.639
your early life. Obviously, you end up becoming...

00:14:56.919 --> 00:14:59.240
um in a couple of professions where you're using

00:14:59.240 --> 00:15:01.940
your body as a tool so aside from actually running

00:15:01.940 --> 00:15:04.740
around the the farm did were there any specific

00:15:04.740 --> 00:15:06.740
sports that you started playing when you were

00:15:06.740 --> 00:15:10.679
a child uh yeah i did do sports but i wasn't

00:15:10.679 --> 00:15:15.659
like so like completely into any i used to play

00:15:15.659 --> 00:15:21.019
tennis pretty gay but i did and then i used to

00:15:21.019 --> 00:15:23.539
swim i was a really strong swimmer but i never

00:15:23.539 --> 00:15:26.000
really had the focus where you know just like

00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:33.000
complete dedication and pushed my skills to further,

00:15:33.159 --> 00:15:36.179
you know, to higher levels. I just sort of played

00:15:36.179 --> 00:15:38.500
with whatever I enjoyed and left it at that.

00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:41.659
I played hockey, but I was always really shit

00:15:41.659 --> 00:15:45.059
at hockey. I was always on the B team. And then,

00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:48.700
you know, just in South Africa, you have to do

00:15:48.700 --> 00:15:51.549
quite a few sports when you're at school. I think

00:15:51.549 --> 00:15:54.350
you had to do two sports per season and then

00:15:54.350 --> 00:15:58.269
any additional ones you could do. You had to

00:15:58.269 --> 00:16:00.409
do sport pretty much every day after school,

00:16:00.570 --> 00:16:04.250
which is good, I think. I love sports now. But

00:16:04.250 --> 00:16:08.490
I mainly got, like, dedicatedly into sports when

00:16:08.490 --> 00:16:11.950
I left school. Right. Okay. Now, when you were

00:16:11.950 --> 00:16:14.070
leaving school, what was your original career

00:16:14.070 --> 00:16:18.429
aspiration? Well, when I was in high school,

00:16:18.529 --> 00:16:20.409
last three years of high school, I went to a

00:16:20.409 --> 00:16:24.970
really good forward -thinking school. And at

00:16:24.970 --> 00:16:27.350
that time, it was quite different. But the school

00:16:27.350 --> 00:16:29.950
was all about, I think their motto was making

00:16:29.950 --> 00:16:32.429
women. It was an all -girls school. Making women

00:16:32.429 --> 00:16:42.789
for the real world, I think. So they tried to

00:16:42.789 --> 00:16:45.919
get us to do a lot of work experience. things

00:16:45.919 --> 00:16:48.299
we wanted to do. And then we had to go through

00:16:48.299 --> 00:16:52.580
the whole interview process, obviously for 10,

00:16:52.759 --> 00:16:57.200
and a CV process and all that. And I was just

00:16:57.200 --> 00:16:59.639
trying to think of things I could do, work experience.

00:16:59.820 --> 00:17:02.519
And I think I did interior. First, I was like,

00:17:02.580 --> 00:17:04.359
I want to become a vet because I love animals.

00:17:05.160 --> 00:17:07.759
And then I don't think I did that. I did work

00:17:07.759 --> 00:17:10.380
experience in interior design, totally random.

00:17:11.420 --> 00:17:13.940
When I was only a teenager, I was just bashing

00:17:13.940 --> 00:17:18.660
out things that sounded cool. Yeah, so that was

00:17:18.660 --> 00:17:21.299
my idea at the time. Really did not think I'd

00:17:21.299 --> 00:17:23.960
become what I did become. Yeah. All right, well,

00:17:24.039 --> 00:17:25.519
then the first thing you became was a model,

00:17:25.559 --> 00:17:28.980
is that right? Yeah, which actually started in

00:17:28.980 --> 00:17:33.339
school because I was at an old girls' school

00:17:33.339 --> 00:17:39.200
and there's a boys' school, which is... like

00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:42.339
the joining school, the boys' school to ours.

00:17:43.740 --> 00:17:47.319
They're a very wealthy school, boys' school,

00:17:47.400 --> 00:17:50.920
and they have lots of, you know, posh people

00:17:50.920 --> 00:17:52.720
go to school there. So they have all sorts of

00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:56.559
– they do lots of fundraising for different charities.

00:17:56.819 --> 00:18:01.819
And once I had a modeling show for some charity,

00:18:01.859 --> 00:18:03.279
I don't remember what, but they had all these,

00:18:03.339 --> 00:18:07.319
you know, top designers and things come along.

00:18:08.259 --> 00:18:11.519
So they asked some of us girls and boys to do

00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:13.619
the modeling show. I was like, okay, I'll do

00:18:13.619 --> 00:18:16.500
that. And then they had one to show us how to

00:18:16.500 --> 00:18:18.779
model walk, probably to walk on the catwalk.

00:18:19.059 --> 00:18:22.420
They had this top South African model at the

00:18:22.420 --> 00:18:24.359
time. Her name was Jodie. I don't remember her

00:18:24.359 --> 00:18:28.720
surname. She had ginger hair, I remember. And

00:18:28.720 --> 00:18:31.619
she, yeah, she showed us how to model. And then

00:18:31.619 --> 00:18:34.220
she said to me, I would do well at modeling.

00:18:37.079 --> 00:18:39.019
She thinks I should start, so she gave me some

00:18:39.019 --> 00:18:41.420
context. My mother said, no, I can't start until

00:18:41.420 --> 00:18:44.599
I finish school. So, yeah, I finished school.

00:18:45.319 --> 00:18:47.420
By the time I finished school, I wasn't quite

00:18:47.420 --> 00:18:50.519
sure what exactly what I wanted to do. So I just

00:18:50.519 --> 00:18:52.119
thought, I'm just going to start modeling and

00:18:52.119 --> 00:18:55.740
see how that goes until I find out what I really

00:18:55.740 --> 00:19:00.059
want to do. So I started modeling and then just

00:19:00.059 --> 00:19:02.579
carried on with that, really moved to Cape Town

00:19:02.579 --> 00:19:05.779
on my own. um to because that's where the biggest

00:19:05.779 --> 00:19:09.579
industry is uh yeah and then started modeling

00:19:09.579 --> 00:19:12.980
there and then um started modeling in europe

00:19:12.980 --> 00:19:15.039
for half the year in cape town for half of the

00:19:15.039 --> 00:19:17.480
year models sort of follow seasons around the

00:19:17.480 --> 00:19:20.839
world it'll be like a season in milan for a few

00:19:20.839 --> 00:19:23.619
months and then paris for a few months or then

00:19:23.619 --> 00:19:27.240
london and then south africa or you know things

00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:29.799
like that yeah Well, I heard you talking about

00:19:29.799 --> 00:19:32.359
that and we'll get into the Nutella in a moment.

00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:36.339
But you made a comment about possibly being lonely.

00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:37.980
And it is an interesting thing because you hear

00:19:37.980 --> 00:19:39.680
some of these people when you actually talk to

00:19:39.680 --> 00:19:42.059
them that are at these pinnacle careers, whether

00:19:42.059 --> 00:19:46.019
it's movie star or successful model. And you

00:19:46.019 --> 00:19:48.119
would think the man or the woman that finds themselves

00:19:48.119 --> 00:19:50.920
there would be completely fulfilled. But what

00:19:50.920 --> 00:19:54.519
did you find about in the modeling specific?

00:19:54.759 --> 00:19:58.650
Was it fulfilling to you or did you feel? Like

00:19:58.650 --> 00:20:01.470
you hear, for example, with these members of

00:20:01.470 --> 00:20:03.930
these bands that when they go on tour, it seems

00:20:03.930 --> 00:20:05.490
incredibly glamorous, but actually they find

00:20:05.490 --> 00:20:08.390
themselves very lonely touring away from their

00:20:08.390 --> 00:20:10.809
family for months and months and months. Yeah.

00:20:12.890 --> 00:20:20.869
Well, when I first went to Milan for my first

00:20:20.869 --> 00:20:25.190
season in Europe, I did really well, a lot better

00:20:25.190 --> 00:20:30.779
than I expected. And the modeling side of it,

00:20:30.859 --> 00:20:33.500
like actually being there on the day and in front

00:20:33.500 --> 00:20:35.839
of camera and working with the team, I always

00:20:35.839 --> 00:20:39.619
loved. Sometimes it's really testing and really

00:20:39.619 --> 00:20:41.400
difficult and you just feel like crying because

00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:45.039
it's a lot of pressure as a model. But most of

00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:48.680
the time I really loved it. But the scene around

00:20:48.680 --> 00:20:52.299
it, I really just did not like. Especially in

00:20:52.299 --> 00:20:56.160
Milan, there's so many old, creepy perverts.

00:20:58.899 --> 00:21:01.640
They just get a whole lot of models to go out

00:21:01.640 --> 00:21:04.000
to dinner with them. It's so sad and so disgusting.

00:21:04.900 --> 00:21:09.700
And you just go out to dinner with these creepy

00:21:09.700 --> 00:21:12.480
old men. And then a lot of them go partying.

00:21:13.000 --> 00:21:16.900
They give you drugs. Nothing horrible ever happens.

00:21:17.000 --> 00:21:20.579
Nothing creepier than that. But I just wasn't

00:21:20.579 --> 00:21:22.380
interested in that whole lifestyle. And a lot

00:21:22.380 --> 00:21:24.660
of the time you have to stay in model houses.

00:21:26.059 --> 00:21:28.079
So the agency, if they know you'll do well in

00:21:28.079 --> 00:21:30.819
that specific market, they'll offer to fly you

00:21:30.819 --> 00:21:33.480
out. They'll fly you out and they'll put you

00:21:33.480 --> 00:21:37.039
in a – they probably own some apartments and

00:21:37.039 --> 00:21:39.400
they just stack the models in there. It's normally

00:21:39.400 --> 00:21:42.160
two to a room. And I like my own space. I don't

00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:45.299
like sharing. And a lot of the times the models

00:21:45.299 --> 00:21:48.880
are really dirty. I remember once staying in

00:21:48.880 --> 00:21:51.880
a model house and there was some girls there

00:21:51.880 --> 00:21:54.180
that left tampons – used tampons on the side

00:21:54.180 --> 00:21:57.799
of the bath. And I'm quite a really clean person,

00:21:57.900 --> 00:22:00.039
so I can't handle being around mess or anything.

00:22:00.460 --> 00:22:04.500
And a lot of those girls, a lot of them are young,

00:22:04.579 --> 00:22:08.480
but also a lot of them are very lonely. They're

00:22:08.480 --> 00:22:10.779
away from their boyfriends, away from their parents,

00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:16.019
so that feels quite sad. Sometimes you stay in

00:22:16.019 --> 00:22:17.980
a model house and it's really great and you all

00:22:17.980 --> 00:22:20.799
get on like really good mates and you sort of

00:22:20.799 --> 00:22:24.640
make friends for life. You go partying all the

00:22:24.640 --> 00:22:27.380
time. And it just depends. It's always different.

00:22:27.579 --> 00:22:32.200
But my favorite was to stay in Cape Town. Because

00:22:32.200 --> 00:22:34.460
half of the year, the muddling season was really

00:22:34.460 --> 00:22:36.700
busy in Cape Town. All the sort of northern hemisphere

00:22:36.700 --> 00:22:39.759
countries came to Cape Town to shoot in their

00:22:39.759 --> 00:22:43.359
summer. So it was perfect. It was really busy

00:22:43.359 --> 00:22:46.200
there. And it's such a good lifestyle. You could

00:22:46.200 --> 00:22:49.380
just chill at the beach, walk up the mountains.

00:22:49.900 --> 00:22:51.900
There's loads of sports to do there. It's always

00:22:51.900 --> 00:22:56.890
good weather. Really nice people around. And

00:22:56.890 --> 00:23:00.910
I suppose it was more my home. So, yeah, I felt

00:23:00.910 --> 00:23:04.109
better then. Right. Well, that, I guess, leads

00:23:04.109 --> 00:23:07.710
us then to Nutella and your entrance into the

00:23:07.710 --> 00:23:09.369
martial arts. So, I'd love to hear that story.

00:23:10.769 --> 00:23:12.890
That's a weird way to get into martial arts.

00:23:13.690 --> 00:23:18.690
Yeah, I was in Milan. And I was staying with

00:23:18.690 --> 00:23:23.559
this creepy old man that owned an agency. Oh,

00:23:23.660 --> 00:23:27.839
man. But anyway, so I guess I was a little bit

00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:32.500
depressed. And so then I was like, oh, Nutella,

00:23:32.720 --> 00:23:34.799
that looks nice. I kept going to the supermarket

00:23:34.799 --> 00:23:37.420
and buying little tubs of Nutella. I could not

00:23:37.420 --> 00:23:39.099
stop munching, probably because I was a little

00:23:39.099 --> 00:23:42.460
depressed. But, yeah, I couldn't stop munching

00:23:42.460 --> 00:23:45.240
it. And obviously I put on a little bit of weight.

00:23:46.240 --> 00:23:49.339
And then little jars turned to big jars and just

00:23:49.339 --> 00:23:51.680
munched away. And by the time I came home, I

00:23:51.680 --> 00:23:54.809
mean, I was. It wasn't fat, but at the time,

00:23:54.829 --> 00:23:59.190
you had to be very slim for modeling. So I put

00:23:59.190 --> 00:24:00.650
on a little bit of weight, and then when I got

00:24:00.650 --> 00:24:04.609
back, I was at a casting, and some models were

00:24:04.609 --> 00:24:06.650
talking about how to lose weight or some bullshit

00:24:06.650 --> 00:24:09.789
like that. One girl said to me, though, she started

00:24:09.789 --> 00:24:12.930
this thing called kickboxing. Down the road,

00:24:12.930 --> 00:24:19.390
it was quite like a grungy gym at the time. It

00:24:19.390 --> 00:24:21.789
was sort of behind a nightclub. She was like,

00:24:21.849 --> 00:24:23.670
hey, I'll just be on there. This little club

00:24:23.670 --> 00:24:26.750
does kickboxing. Really good exercise. I was

00:24:26.750 --> 00:24:29.670
like, oh, I'll go down and give that a try. Yeah,

00:24:29.690 --> 00:24:31.490
so I went down and gave that a try once, and

00:24:31.490 --> 00:24:34.009
I was like, oh, my God, this is fucking amazing.

00:24:34.769 --> 00:24:36.950
So I started going back like three times a week,

00:24:37.009 --> 00:24:40.329
and then started going back every day. And then,

00:24:40.349 --> 00:24:42.210
yeah, I started getting more and more into it.

00:24:42.230 --> 00:24:45.089
And then there's all these – you have like beginner's

00:24:45.089 --> 00:24:47.950
class and intermediate, and then you have advanced

00:24:47.950 --> 00:24:52.029
classes. And then I always used to watch, there

00:24:52.029 --> 00:24:55.529
was also a class called fighter's class, which

00:24:55.529 --> 00:24:57.609
were very separate. It was all, you know, the

00:24:57.609 --> 00:25:00.849
hobnobs, all the really good guys that used to

00:25:00.849 --> 00:25:03.630
fight. I always used to dream, I would love to

00:25:03.630 --> 00:25:06.809
be in the fighter's class. I was quite determined

00:25:06.809 --> 00:25:09.569
to get better and get in that class. So eventually

00:25:09.569 --> 00:25:12.170
I did get in that class. And eventually after

00:25:12.170 --> 00:25:16.980
two years, I wanted to start competing. See,

00:25:16.980 --> 00:25:19.880
that's amazing that you just went for fitness

00:25:19.880 --> 00:25:22.440
originally. And, you know, as I'm sure we're

00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:26.859
going to talk about more, you know, your method

00:25:26.859 --> 00:25:30.039
of earning a living was aesthetics and how you

00:25:30.039 --> 00:25:33.359
looked. And then you got drawn into this beautiful

00:25:33.359 --> 00:25:36.339
art of Muay Thai, which, you know, undoubtedly

00:25:36.339 --> 00:25:38.579
every single class you walk away with bruises

00:25:38.579 --> 00:25:41.970
somewhere. Yeah, there was loads of problems

00:25:41.970 --> 00:25:45.150
for some time because I always used to – I mean,

00:25:45.170 --> 00:25:47.230
not massive bruises, but you get a lot of – you

00:25:47.230 --> 00:25:51.009
block a lot in Muay Thai. So you get lots of

00:25:51.009 --> 00:25:54.369
bruises on your shins and lots of bruises on

00:25:54.369 --> 00:25:58.710
your hips or wherever where you get kicked. So

00:25:58.710 --> 00:26:01.890
sometimes my model agents used to get really

00:26:01.890 --> 00:26:04.890
pissed off. I actually got a message on Instagram

00:26:04.890 --> 00:26:07.529
the other day from a makeup artist that used

00:26:07.529 --> 00:26:10.799
to work with me. Jesus. I don't know, 18 years

00:26:10.799 --> 00:26:13.279
ago, 15 years ago or something. She said she

00:26:13.279 --> 00:26:16.299
always remembers working with me because she

00:26:16.299 --> 00:26:20.299
always had to cover up all the bruises. But it

00:26:20.299 --> 00:26:22.920
was always all right. It actually opened up quite

00:26:22.920 --> 00:26:27.319
an industry for me in modeling. Sorry, my cat's

00:26:27.319 --> 00:26:31.180
climbing all over me. No, you're fine. Yeah,

00:26:31.200 --> 00:26:35.119
it opened up an industry for me in modeling because...

00:26:35.710 --> 00:26:38.289
I became quite sporty. I completely changed my

00:26:38.289 --> 00:26:40.230
type of body, actually. I've always been a really

00:26:40.230 --> 00:26:43.910
skinny person. Before that, I was pretty much

00:26:43.910 --> 00:26:47.549
like I am now, which is some muscle but not,

00:26:47.549 --> 00:26:51.029
you know, stacked, just really thin. And from

00:26:51.029 --> 00:26:53.589
loads and loads of training in Muay Thai, I actually

00:26:53.589 --> 00:26:57.930
become pretty muscular but still slim, which

00:26:57.930 --> 00:26:59.430
you would have thought is not great for modeling.

00:26:59.509 --> 00:27:02.410
But actually, there's so many sports brands out

00:27:02.410 --> 00:27:04.670
there, you know. And they became loads of people

00:27:04.670 --> 00:27:06.730
that needed more sporty looking or healthier

00:27:06.730 --> 00:27:10.569
looking. Yeah. So that was actually ended up

00:27:10.569 --> 00:27:13.109
quite good for me. Right. Well, just to interject

00:27:13.109 --> 00:27:15.509
for a second. So you mentioned earlier in, you

00:27:15.509 --> 00:27:19.390
know, pre Nutella, how everyone was, you know,

00:27:19.390 --> 00:27:21.009
wanting to be very thin. I remember the waif

00:27:21.009 --> 00:27:23.029
models, you know, the Kate Mosses and all those.

00:27:23.349 --> 00:27:27.069
And, you know, how horrendous is that? Just as

00:27:27.069 --> 00:27:31.509
a woman in that industry specifically. What has

00:27:31.509 --> 00:27:33.569
been your observation of influences like martial

00:27:33.569 --> 00:27:37.170
arts, CrossFit, mud runs, all these things of

00:27:37.170 --> 00:27:40.230
really redefining how a woman should look and

00:27:40.230 --> 00:27:43.509
what she should be able to do? I mean, it definitely

00:27:43.509 --> 00:27:47.529
has changed. I remember those days, especially

00:27:47.529 --> 00:27:49.589
in the beginning when I was modeling. It was

00:27:49.589 --> 00:27:52.690
all sort of Kate Moss era where everybody needed

00:27:52.690 --> 00:27:55.069
to be super thin. And I guess it depends on the

00:27:55.069 --> 00:27:57.289
market where you're working. If you're working

00:27:57.289 --> 00:28:01.259
in Japan, you need it to be really tiny. If you're

00:28:01.259 --> 00:28:03.900
working in South Africa, it's more catalog industry,

00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:06.920
so it's more natural. So you could be a little

00:28:06.920 --> 00:28:11.660
bit healthier looking. It just depends. But it's

00:28:11.660 --> 00:28:13.660
definitely changed over time. So obviously you've

00:28:13.660 --> 00:28:17.539
got all those influences like CrossFit and just

00:28:17.539 --> 00:28:22.640
a healthier outlook on women's bodies. And, yeah,

00:28:22.779 --> 00:28:25.180
it's definitely changed. A lot of the models

00:28:25.180 --> 00:28:28.460
you see now, even the supermodels, They'll be

00:28:28.460 --> 00:28:31.160
really in shape, slim, but they'll be really

00:28:31.160 --> 00:28:34.019
fit. Like they don't just starve themselves and

00:28:34.019 --> 00:28:37.119
go walk on the catwalk. They're really trained.

00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:41.619
So that is quite good, I guess. Yeah, I think

00:28:41.619 --> 00:28:43.880
it is because they are role models for a lot

00:28:43.880 --> 00:28:46.859
of young men and women, depending on what the

00:28:46.859 --> 00:28:49.660
sex of the model is. And to have that role model

00:28:49.660 --> 00:28:52.279
be, as you're saying, someone who's healthy rather

00:28:52.279 --> 00:28:55.339
than someone who's just thin, really, I think,

00:28:55.339 --> 00:28:58.220
steers people down the right path. Unless I'm

00:28:58.220 --> 00:29:01.500
blind, it seems like the anemia, bulimia, anorexia,

00:29:01.500 --> 00:29:03.180
you know, I mean, not anemia, excuse me, the

00:29:03.180 --> 00:29:05.920
bulimia, the anorexia. I mean, they may have

00:29:05.920 --> 00:29:11.039
poor red blood cells as well. But that era that

00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:14.259
you and I saw when we were young, you don't really

00:29:14.259 --> 00:29:17.059
see anymore. Even as a paramedic, I rarely, rarely

00:29:17.059 --> 00:29:19.440
ever come across anyone who's got either of those

00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:23.740
diseases anymore. No, I think I do hear of a

00:29:23.740 --> 00:29:26.920
few teenagers that have it. But I mean, being

00:29:26.920 --> 00:29:31.920
a teenager is nuts anyway, I guess. There's a

00:29:31.920 --> 00:29:34.319
lot going on. But I think when it does happen,

00:29:34.359 --> 00:29:36.799
it's often just teenagers, like 16 -year -olds

00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:40.279
or something. Yeah, and that could be the exposure

00:29:40.279 --> 00:29:42.299
now on social media may have had another negative

00:29:42.299 --> 00:29:46.660
impact. So you didn't just train. You ended up

00:29:46.660 --> 00:29:48.539
actually becoming a fighter. So I'd love to hear

00:29:48.539 --> 00:29:51.740
about your fights in Cape Town and how that took

00:29:51.740 --> 00:29:55.890
you overseas as well. So when I started fighting,

00:29:55.990 --> 00:29:57.789
I obviously started fighting in the amateur league.

00:29:58.990 --> 00:30:02.250
In Muay Thai amateur league is when you, I think

00:30:02.250 --> 00:30:04.470
the women fight four rounds of two minutes. Sounds

00:30:04.470 --> 00:30:06.630
really short, but it feels like four hours a

00:30:06.630 --> 00:30:13.130
round. And you wear a headgear protection, a

00:30:13.130 --> 00:30:16.349
chest pad, I think, and shin pads, and then I

00:30:16.349 --> 00:30:18.029
can't remember what gloves, probably like 8 -ounce

00:30:18.029 --> 00:30:20.650
or 10 -ounce gloves. So you've got quite a lot

00:30:20.650 --> 00:30:25.880
of protection going on. So I started in that

00:30:25.880 --> 00:30:29.640
league, and I fought one. My first fight, and

00:30:29.640 --> 00:30:35.400
I won, very happy. Then the second fight, I fought

00:30:35.400 --> 00:30:38.119
someone who was a bit heavier than me, and it

00:30:38.119 --> 00:30:41.460
did not go well. I lost, and I got in a black

00:30:41.460 --> 00:30:43.900
eye, which wasn't too bad, but I went to the

00:30:43.900 --> 00:30:48.839
toilet afterwards, and I was a bit upset that

00:30:48.839 --> 00:30:52.829
I'd lost, obviously, emotional. So I was crying

00:30:52.829 --> 00:30:55.009
a little bit, and then I needed to blow my nose.

00:30:56.029 --> 00:30:58.269
I'll give you some advice. If you ever got a

00:30:58.269 --> 00:31:02.769
ding on the eye, do not blow your nose. Oh, my

00:31:02.769 --> 00:31:06.049
God. I literally blew my nose, and in one instant,

00:31:06.170 --> 00:31:10.849
my eye popped out like a goldfish eye. Like just

00:31:10.849 --> 00:31:13.710
boom, popped. My sister was watching, and her

00:31:13.710 --> 00:31:16.970
jaw just dropped. She was, oh, my God. So from

00:31:16.970 --> 00:31:20.009
that moment, I had big, like, bubble goldfish

00:31:20.009 --> 00:31:23.359
eye. I think it was the UFC recently. I think

00:31:23.359 --> 00:31:26.539
Donald Cerrone had exactly the same thing. He

00:31:26.539 --> 00:31:28.900
was hit and it looked like he fractured his orbit,

00:31:28.980 --> 00:31:30.539
but actually he said after, he's like, I literally

00:31:30.539 --> 00:31:32.480
just went to clear my nose and my eye bloomed

00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:34.319
up. So I know exactly what you're talking about.

00:31:34.740 --> 00:31:37.859
Yeah, it's mad. So that turned into a massive

00:31:37.859 --> 00:31:41.779
black eye. And yeah, I couldn't do any modeling

00:31:41.779 --> 00:31:44.200
for about two or three weeks. So that ended up

00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:48.079
in a bit of a fight between my model agency and

00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:53.069
my Muay Thai coach. And then so around that time

00:31:53.069 --> 00:31:56.390
you were also exploring Buddhism, is that right?

00:31:56.450 --> 00:32:01.710
And that's what took you to East Asia? Yeah,

00:32:01.769 --> 00:32:04.930
I guess it all just sort of happened. I didn't

00:32:04.930 --> 00:32:06.930
sort of start one thing and go into the other.

00:32:06.970 --> 00:32:11.390
It all sort of just happened intermingled, I

00:32:11.390 --> 00:32:15.269
guess. So when I came out of school, we didn't

00:32:15.269 --> 00:32:17.230
really have phones. I don't think we had cell

00:32:17.230 --> 00:32:19.460
phones at that time, maybe just... Those old

00:32:19.460 --> 00:32:23.019
school ones that messaged or called. So I started

00:32:23.019 --> 00:32:25.440
becoming interested in Buddhism. When I was in

00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:27.319
school, I watched the movie Seven Years in Tibet,

00:32:27.559 --> 00:32:32.720
which I love. I don't know what it is, but as

00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:36.119
soon as I saw the scene of Tibet and I heard

00:32:36.119 --> 00:32:39.700
those Tibetan, I forgot what they're called,

00:32:39.799 --> 00:32:43.039
the big trumpets. I heard that sound and the

00:32:43.039 --> 00:32:47.710
sound of the drums and everything. And something

00:32:47.710 --> 00:32:50.789
drew me, and I was like, fuck me, I have to go

00:32:50.789 --> 00:32:54.490
to that place. And since that day, it was my

00:32:54.490 --> 00:32:57.289
mission that I wanted to go to Tibet. I found

00:32:57.289 --> 00:32:58.950
out they were Buddhist, obviously, so I started

00:32:58.950 --> 00:33:03.509
studying Buddhism. So for years, through modeling,

00:33:03.630 --> 00:33:07.930
my goal was to take two years off of modeling

00:33:07.930 --> 00:33:12.009
and go to study Buddhism. I wanted to stay in

00:33:12.009 --> 00:33:14.509
a monastery. Well, originally, I wanted to go

00:33:14.509 --> 00:33:18.140
to Tibet, but then I found out. that China overtook

00:33:18.140 --> 00:33:21.599
Tibet and killed, raped, or kicked all of them

00:33:21.599 --> 00:33:27.759
out. So most of them live in India now. So, yeah,

00:33:27.940 --> 00:33:31.200
save enough money for modeling and get it out

00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:33.660
there. It's funny because I heard you mention

00:33:33.660 --> 00:33:36.960
that movie, you know, specifically in one of

00:33:36.960 --> 00:33:38.920
the other interviews that you did. When I was

00:33:38.920 --> 00:33:41.369
out living in Japan, I'll never forget. So the

00:33:41.369 --> 00:33:43.130
Japanese, obviously, a lot of the stuff they

00:33:43.130 --> 00:33:45.289
speak is their own tongue, but there are some

00:33:45.289 --> 00:33:48.430
words that cross over that are basically mimicking

00:33:48.430 --> 00:33:51.250
English. And right when I was over there, which

00:33:51.250 --> 00:33:55.809
was about 2000, 2001, it was on Japanese TV.

00:33:55.910 --> 00:33:57.789
And every time they were advertising it, it would

00:33:57.789 --> 00:34:01.549
always be, Brad Pittow, seven years in Chebetto.

00:34:02.670 --> 00:34:04.630
So it was exactly, they hadn't changed anything,

00:34:04.730 --> 00:34:06.430
just stuck a few O's on the end of the word.

00:34:06.490 --> 00:34:09.329
So yeah, that always makes me laugh when I hear

00:34:09.329 --> 00:34:14.530
that specific movie. That is funny. So while

00:34:14.530 --> 00:34:17.230
you were traveling, you found yourself in Thailand.

00:34:19.210 --> 00:34:24.269
So my main goal was India, obviously. So I traveled

00:34:24.269 --> 00:34:27.150
around quite a bit for three months, all around,

00:34:27.389 --> 00:34:31.190
mostly in the north of India. And then I spent

00:34:31.190 --> 00:34:32.969
another three or six months, I can't remember

00:34:32.969 --> 00:34:36.690
exactly. I'm just staying in this place called

00:34:36.690 --> 00:34:38.690
Dharamsala. It's in the foothills of the Himalaya.

00:34:38.949 --> 00:34:41.730
It's where the Dalai Lama lives. So it's a big

00:34:41.730 --> 00:34:47.530
Tibetan community there and a lot of – it's very

00:34:47.530 --> 00:34:50.570
open to Westerners coming to study Buddhism there.

00:34:51.130 --> 00:34:53.989
So I spent some time there. And then my sister

00:34:53.989 --> 00:34:56.909
and her boyfriend at the time were in – they

00:34:56.909 --> 00:34:59.599
were going on holiday in Thailand. It's pretty

00:34:59.599 --> 00:35:01.559
close. Why don't you just pop over and say hello?

00:35:02.619 --> 00:35:06.900
So I did that. I popped over and said hello.

00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:09.039
And then a friend of mine also was staying in

00:35:09.039 --> 00:35:16.300
this island in Thailand on the eastern coast

00:35:16.300 --> 00:35:21.219
of Thailand called Koh Tao. So we all went there

00:35:21.219 --> 00:35:25.380
for a little holiday. And then I thought, oh,

00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:26.780
while I was there, I was like, oh, I could do

00:35:26.780 --> 00:35:29.150
with some training. I hadn't trained in like

00:35:29.150 --> 00:35:32.030
a year, and I'd just been mostly meditating or

00:35:32.030 --> 00:35:34.989
just walking around. So I just wanted to move

00:35:34.989 --> 00:35:37.769
my body. So I thought, oh, I'll do some training.

00:35:37.809 --> 00:35:40.690
They must have a Muay Thai gym here. So I found

00:35:40.690 --> 00:35:44.409
the only Muay Thai gym on the island. It's up

00:35:44.409 --> 00:35:48.010
this dirt road, like quite a bit into the – it's

00:35:48.010 --> 00:35:51.989
like inset into the jungle. Really cool. It's

00:35:51.989 --> 00:35:56.269
called Island Muay Thai. Pretty original. And

00:35:56.269 --> 00:36:00.039
so I went down there. just to do some pads. And,

00:36:00.079 --> 00:36:02.139
oh, my God, I just loved the people. I did one

00:36:02.139 --> 00:36:05.199
session, and then the guy, the owner of the gym

00:36:05.199 --> 00:36:09.840
called Pitun, he said to me, hey, do you want

00:36:09.840 --> 00:36:14.179
to do a fight? But I think about two years had

00:36:14.179 --> 00:36:16.980
passed since I last fought, which is only amateur

00:36:16.980 --> 00:36:20.260
anyway. I'd only had three fights. So I was like,

00:36:20.340 --> 00:36:22.840
yeah, I'll do a fight. He said, well, there's

00:36:22.840 --> 00:36:26.119
a fight in 10 days' time. Can you stay and do

00:36:26.119 --> 00:36:28.739
that fight? So I said, yeah, I'll do that. So

00:36:28.739 --> 00:36:31.800
I stayed, trained for 10 days and did a fight,

00:36:31.940 --> 00:36:35.579
won. And then he said to me, do you want to have

00:36:35.579 --> 00:36:37.059
another fight? There's another fight in three

00:36:37.059 --> 00:36:39.280
weeks time. He's like, yeah, I'll stay and do

00:36:39.280 --> 00:36:41.880
that. So I ended up staying and doing that. And

00:36:41.880 --> 00:36:43.440
then I just absolutely fell in love with the

00:36:43.440 --> 00:36:46.519
people at the gym and ended up staying there

00:36:46.519 --> 00:36:50.820
for close on two years. Wow. And then you were

00:36:50.820 --> 00:36:52.440
fighting under Muay Thai rules by that point.

00:36:52.500 --> 00:36:56.880
So no pads. No, they don't have amateur in Thailand.

00:36:57.199 --> 00:37:01.099
Right. So just gloves, that was it? Yeah. Right.

00:37:01.139 --> 00:37:05.099
So did you fight the whole two years? I did.

00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:10.880
So you only fight about once a month, sometimes

00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:14.179
once every two months, sometimes you train for

00:37:14.179 --> 00:37:16.480
about six weeks ahead and then you get up to

00:37:16.480 --> 00:37:19.019
the day and well up to the week and the girl

00:37:19.019 --> 00:37:21.239
has to cancel and you can't find somebody else.

00:37:22.059 --> 00:37:26.920
So sometimes I'll end up a bit longer. But yeah,

00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:29.460
but in general, the normal sort of thinking is

00:37:29.460 --> 00:37:33.159
a fight a month or every six weeks. So I had

00:37:33.159 --> 00:37:38.900
25 fights in total. So that's been 22 fights

00:37:38.900 --> 00:37:45.019
out there. Yeah, I stayed in Kotao for a couple

00:37:45.019 --> 00:37:50.539
of years and then I moved up to... Because Bangkok

00:37:50.539 --> 00:37:53.599
is where all the main fighting is. It's the highest

00:37:53.599 --> 00:37:56.219
standard of fighting in Thailand. So I just wanted

00:37:56.219 --> 00:37:59.000
to up my game a bit. So I went to a gym in Bangkok.

00:38:00.099 --> 00:38:02.940
Right. And then how did that go? Because as you

00:38:02.940 --> 00:38:04.239
were saying, that's kind of like the top tier

00:38:04.239 --> 00:38:08.440
when it comes to Muay Thai. Yeah. Well, I actually

00:38:08.440 --> 00:38:11.159
can't remember all of my fights. I actually found

00:38:11.159 --> 00:38:14.380
a video the other day of a fight that I had in

00:38:14.380 --> 00:38:17.099
this place called Trang, which is... in the deep

00:38:17.099 --> 00:38:21.400
south of Thailand, almost in Malaysia. And I

00:38:21.400 --> 00:38:24.260
remember the manager of the gym asked me for

00:38:24.260 --> 00:38:26.139
ages to go to it because he's from there. So

00:38:26.139 --> 00:38:28.500
we went and visited there and I remember going

00:38:28.500 --> 00:38:31.039
there and seeing all the places and seeing they

00:38:31.039 --> 00:38:34.519
actually have a massive gym there which is full

00:38:34.519 --> 00:38:40.119
of multiple champions there. But I don't remember

00:38:40.119 --> 00:38:43.840
fighting there whatsoever. But I've got a video.

00:38:43.860 --> 00:38:46.039
It's just like fight and throng. And I looked

00:38:46.039 --> 00:38:48.059
at it and it's me fighting. I was like, my God,

00:38:48.139 --> 00:38:50.699
I do not remember that. Well, you did have some

00:38:50.699 --> 00:38:53.679
trauma though. So you're forgiven for not being

00:38:53.679 --> 00:38:56.960
able to remember everything. All right. So then,

00:38:57.039 --> 00:38:59.920
so I know there's going to be a transition where

00:38:59.920 --> 00:39:03.639
you got into stunts, but what made you stop fighting

00:39:03.639 --> 00:39:06.380
ultimately? Was it the stunt work was more lucrative

00:39:06.380 --> 00:39:09.280
in the end or did you have a specific moment

00:39:09.280 --> 00:39:12.559
where you'd had enough? Well, it kind of all

00:39:12.559 --> 00:39:18.179
happened at the right time because I was going

00:39:18.179 --> 00:39:22.579
out with this guy, like the main guy of the gym.

00:39:22.739 --> 00:39:26.099
His name was Anuak. He's quite a big superstar

00:39:26.099 --> 00:39:30.719
in Muay Thai world, especially in Thailand. So

00:39:30.719 --> 00:39:33.380
we were going out and things were getting a little

00:39:33.380 --> 00:39:37.460
fuzzy. So I just wasn't into the training that

00:39:37.460 --> 00:39:43.139
much. I started skipping a few sessions or not

00:39:43.139 --> 00:39:48.039
sleeping as well or whatever. So my fights got

00:39:48.039 --> 00:39:52.659
postponed. So I just wasn't in it at that time.

00:39:54.340 --> 00:39:56.460
One thing you should never do if you really want

00:39:56.460 --> 00:39:58.119
to do well in sports, you should never fucking

00:39:58.119 --> 00:40:00.000
get a girlfriend or boyfriend because it really

00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:05.519
fucks things up. But anyway, at that time, sometimes

00:40:05.519 --> 00:40:08.699
I used to still do modeling jobs. Fighting in

00:40:08.699 --> 00:40:10.480
Thailand is never massive money unless you're

00:40:10.480 --> 00:40:14.579
a massive superstar, which is mostly only men,

00:40:14.639 --> 00:40:18.440
not women. And then it can be quite lucrative.

00:40:18.699 --> 00:40:20.960
But otherwise, it's not very good money, which

00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:23.400
didn't bother me because you don't pay to live

00:40:23.400 --> 00:40:25.559
there. You live as a professional at the gym

00:40:25.559 --> 00:40:28.380
and they feed you and house you. So I didn't

00:40:28.380 --> 00:40:30.780
mind. I just loved it so much. But every now

00:40:30.780 --> 00:40:34.440
and again, I take a modeling job to get some

00:40:34.440 --> 00:40:39.449
extra bucks. I took a modeling job, and we were

00:40:39.449 --> 00:40:42.570
shooting in Cambodia. And the guy that I was

00:40:42.570 --> 00:40:45.610
shooting with, the other model for the shoot,

00:40:45.690 --> 00:40:49.329
was a guy called Peter. And he was actually working

00:40:49.329 --> 00:40:51.889
in Bangkok. He lived there. And he was working

00:40:51.889 --> 00:40:54.670
as a casting director, well, on the casting team

00:40:54.670 --> 00:40:57.250
for a film that was filming there. He found out

00:40:57.250 --> 00:40:58.789
what I did, and he said, oh, they've been looking

00:40:58.789 --> 00:41:02.289
for this French film called Lago Winch, the second

00:41:02.289 --> 00:41:05.679
one. They're looking for this. this actress for

00:41:05.679 --> 00:41:07.360
ages and they can't find somebody, they need

00:41:07.360 --> 00:41:10.019
somebody that can do their own fighting stunts

00:41:10.019 --> 00:41:12.840
and other stunts. And they obviously could act

00:41:12.840 --> 00:41:15.019
the part and have the look and everything. So

00:41:15.019 --> 00:41:17.139
we did a little interview, well, not interview,

00:41:17.239 --> 00:41:20.099
casting in his room. And I ended up getting a

00:41:20.099 --> 00:41:22.099
job. So that was at the time where everything

00:41:22.099 --> 00:41:23.900
started getting a little fuzzy at the gym. So

00:41:23.900 --> 00:41:28.820
I decided I think I'll sort of move on now. And

00:41:28.820 --> 00:41:31.500
first I was still staying, living at the gym

00:41:31.500 --> 00:41:34.980
and went in to do the days on the film. And then

00:41:34.980 --> 00:41:39.280
eventually my boyfriend and I broke up, so I

00:41:39.280 --> 00:41:42.639
moved out. I really just wanted my space and

00:41:42.639 --> 00:41:44.639
freedom then as well because living in the gym,

00:41:45.039 --> 00:41:49.320
like being a woman in Thailand, you really have

00:41:49.320 --> 00:41:51.940
to be a woman. You have to dress in pink, and

00:41:51.940 --> 00:41:55.179
you're not allowed to drink alcohol, and you

00:41:55.179 --> 00:41:57.179
have to really be girly. And I was just like

00:41:57.179 --> 00:41:59.340
over that bullshit by that time. So it was just

00:41:59.340 --> 00:42:01.800
like I just want to be a normal Westerner now.

00:42:02.199 --> 00:42:08.130
So I got my own. apartments in Bangkok and then

00:42:08.130 --> 00:42:11.090
just carried on filming, really. Wow. Now, you

00:42:11.090 --> 00:42:13.130
said Anna White. Am I right in thinking that's

00:42:13.130 --> 00:42:14.750
one of the people that John Wayne Parr fought?

00:42:16.670 --> 00:42:20.630
I don't know if they fought. Because I do recognize

00:42:20.630 --> 00:42:22.369
the name. I've got a few Muay Thai guys that

00:42:22.369 --> 00:42:24.090
I follow. But anyway, I know who you're talking

00:42:24.090 --> 00:42:25.789
about. Yeah, he's a huge star, isn't he? He's

00:42:25.789 --> 00:42:29.750
on social media. He's very Thai. Very. He's not

00:42:29.750 --> 00:42:34.269
in any way on social media. I know what Kelsen

00:42:34.269 --> 00:42:37.429
Ritt is his name. He's a really great fighter

00:42:37.429 --> 00:42:41.949
when he was in his prime. Yeah, definitely. I

00:42:41.949 --> 00:42:43.590
mean, I know we're not connected, but I know

00:42:43.590 --> 00:42:45.250
some of the people I follow or I've trained with

00:42:45.250 --> 00:42:47.670
have definitely trained with him as well or fought

00:42:47.670 --> 00:42:50.670
him. So, yeah, but that's interesting because

00:42:50.670 --> 00:42:53.889
when I travel, I went to drama school. I had

00:42:53.889 --> 00:42:56.489
a martial arts background as well. I did the

00:42:56.489 --> 00:43:01.320
sword training when I was in drama school. And

00:43:01.320 --> 00:43:03.380
then when I traveled the world, I got to Sydney

00:43:03.380 --> 00:43:07.579
and Universal Studios, the theme park, was looking

00:43:07.579 --> 00:43:11.219
for stunt performers. And I ended up, you know,

00:43:11.239 --> 00:43:13.059
just literally being in Sydney going, well, what

00:43:13.059 --> 00:43:15.099
have I got to lose? And I showed up and it just

00:43:15.099 --> 00:43:17.019
happened that I looked like the bad guy in the

00:43:17.019 --> 00:43:20.099
Terminator 2 movie. So the same kind of thing.

00:43:20.139 --> 00:43:21.980
It's funny how you said that. They were looking

00:43:21.980 --> 00:43:24.440
for certain... you know, looks as well with the

00:43:24.440 --> 00:43:26.860
skills as well. And I ended up falling in that

00:43:26.860 --> 00:43:29.579
role, which led me through, you know, not a long,

00:43:29.699 --> 00:43:32.119
long career in stunts, but definitely for about

00:43:32.119 --> 00:43:36.099
a decade. So, yeah. Oh, cool. Right. So then,

00:43:36.179 --> 00:43:40.219
so you did the French film. So where did the

00:43:40.219 --> 00:43:43.719
stunts take you from there? Well, obviously the

00:43:43.719 --> 00:43:45.719
French film was an acting role. I had to do my

00:43:45.719 --> 00:43:49.880
own stunts. So they had a really cool team of

00:43:49.880 --> 00:43:53.079
French guys out there. And they literally spent

00:43:53.079 --> 00:43:58.179
days, weeks on weeks just spending all day trying

00:43:58.179 --> 00:44:00.460
to – it's quite a shift, as you'll know, from

00:44:00.460 --> 00:44:05.739
real fighting to screen fighting. And I actually

00:44:05.739 --> 00:44:09.099
– and also on the team was a really good Thai

00:44:09.099 --> 00:44:12.800
stunt coordinator called Singh Stunt. And so

00:44:12.800 --> 00:44:15.579
the Thai team and the French team, both great

00:44:15.579 --> 00:44:18.800
people. And I remember having such arguments

00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:24.110
with the French guys. because I remember specifically

00:44:24.110 --> 00:44:26.469
once about a teep, you know, a push kick forward.

00:44:26.969 --> 00:44:29.769
I do a push kick, so I push kick part of the

00:44:29.769 --> 00:44:32.429
scene. No, you're going up. Don't go up on your

00:44:32.429 --> 00:44:34.090
toes. I was like, yeah, but that's how you push

00:44:34.090 --> 00:44:36.530
kick, how you teep. He's like, no, you don't

00:44:36.530 --> 00:44:37.989
teep like that. I was like, you do teep like

00:44:37.989 --> 00:44:40.329
that. I used to get so pissed off because I was

00:44:40.329 --> 00:44:43.889
like, no, it's not proper. I remember once saying,

00:44:44.050 --> 00:44:46.929
because I used to speak quite fluent Thai, so

00:44:46.929 --> 00:44:49.260
he said to me in Thai, he's like, just go. and

00:44:49.260 --> 00:44:51.679
cool down go wait around the corner then cool

00:44:51.679 --> 00:44:55.639
down um but yeah it obviously took a little bit

00:44:55.639 --> 00:44:58.139
of a shift to get the performance side of it

00:44:58.139 --> 00:45:03.059
and made things bigger you know and um put more

00:45:03.059 --> 00:45:06.059
performance into but i loved that part so much

00:45:06.059 --> 00:45:09.000
so i i just really just carried on doing that

00:45:09.000 --> 00:45:11.239
i made some good connections in thailand i still

00:45:11.239 --> 00:45:13.960
love living in thailand at the time so i did

00:45:13.960 --> 00:45:16.880
some more films with sing and then met some of

00:45:16.880 --> 00:45:20.030
the other stunt people as you go and then uh

00:45:20.030 --> 00:45:22.630
worked for the other stunt teams in thailand

00:45:22.630 --> 00:45:25.909
now yeah i just kept on making connections and

00:45:25.909 --> 00:45:28.590
kept filming really brilliant now you worked

00:45:28.590 --> 00:45:30.329
in bollywood too it's funny because i went around

00:45:30.329 --> 00:45:33.010
the world um after i came out of drama school

00:45:33.010 --> 00:45:34.929
i bought around the world ticket and my plan

00:45:34.929 --> 00:45:36.429
was all right i'm gonna go to new zealand i'm

00:45:36.429 --> 00:45:38.070
gonna work on lord of the rings and i'm gonna

00:45:38.070 --> 00:45:39.889
go to india and they're gonna pick me up as a

00:45:39.889 --> 00:45:41.690
bollywood actor none of that actually happened

00:45:41.690 --> 00:45:44.489
it was all in my head but you actually did so

00:45:44.489 --> 00:45:47.860
so what was working in bollywood like Well, I

00:45:47.860 --> 00:45:50.500
did a couple of Bollywood films that used to

00:45:50.500 --> 00:45:53.559
come to Thailand, and then I actually went to

00:45:53.559 --> 00:45:56.940
Mumbai because Bollywood's from Mumbai. So I

00:45:56.940 --> 00:45:58.860
went actually and did some films. And actually,

00:45:58.880 --> 00:46:01.099
you know, if you do like a good Bollywood production,

00:46:01.380 --> 00:46:04.440
not a cheap, shitty one, they're actually a really

00:46:04.440 --> 00:46:09.639
well -produced film. And they actually paid pretty

00:46:09.639 --> 00:46:12.760
well as well. So, yeah, I actually love doing

00:46:12.760 --> 00:46:14.880
Bollywood because it's so over the top. We know

00:46:14.880 --> 00:46:19.250
a lot in these modern films. everything has to

00:46:19.250 --> 00:46:21.889
be so realistic. Everything has to be toned down,

00:46:21.909 --> 00:46:25.550
like in pre -production rehearsal time. So the

00:46:25.550 --> 00:46:28.130
stunt team always want to make great, cool kicks

00:46:28.130 --> 00:46:31.090
and everything bigger because it's fun and it

00:46:31.090 --> 00:46:34.510
looks nice. But then it always gets toned down

00:46:34.510 --> 00:46:36.829
because now it has to be very realistic. Why

00:46:36.829 --> 00:46:38.809
would you do this fancy kick if you could just

00:46:38.809 --> 00:46:42.869
do a straightforward kick? But in India, it's

00:46:42.869 --> 00:46:46.469
the complete opposite. It's hilarious because

00:46:46.469 --> 00:46:48.670
you don't just – somebody hits you with the left

00:46:48.670 --> 00:46:50.349
hook. You don't just sort of take a reaction

00:46:50.349 --> 00:46:53.309
with your head. It's a massive reaction with

00:46:53.309 --> 00:46:56.389
the head into a complete spin around the whole

00:46:56.389 --> 00:46:58.449
body and then drop to the floor. It's so funny.

00:46:58.909 --> 00:47:01.889
And I love everything has to be massive and over

00:47:01.889 --> 00:47:04.369
the top. So the kicks, a lot of the stuff is

00:47:04.369 --> 00:47:06.789
even done on wire because you can't – not many

00:47:06.789 --> 00:47:10.329
people can do it in real life. Yeah. Well, speaking

00:47:10.329 --> 00:47:13.130
of that, did you ever have the yearning to go

00:47:13.130 --> 00:47:15.380
to Hong Kong? Because that was one of my – younger

00:47:15.380 --> 00:47:18.599
dreams too you know seeing um gary daniels some

00:47:18.599 --> 00:47:21.800
of these english you know performers end up being

00:47:21.800 --> 00:47:24.159
bad guys in jackie chan's films that one day

00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:27.320
that was my destiny too i was i was going to

00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:29.860
be doing while i work with uh you know the hong

00:47:29.860 --> 00:47:33.079
kong team so were you ever drawn to that side

00:47:33.079 --> 00:47:36.079
uh no i wasn't actually that that's a little

00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:38.780
different because it's well i think it's quite

00:47:38.780 --> 00:47:41.260
intense as well i do know quite a few people

00:47:41.260 --> 00:47:44.059
that have worked in the hong kong industry and

00:47:44.510 --> 00:47:48.650
when it was massive, like in the 90s. And that

00:47:48.650 --> 00:47:51.110
is, it's a lot more intense. I think you're really

00:47:51.110 --> 00:47:56.150
going to be on your game there. And really cool

00:47:56.150 --> 00:47:58.289
that it's time. I think it seems to be making

00:47:58.289 --> 00:48:03.110
a bit of a comeback recently, I think. But yeah,

00:48:03.130 --> 00:48:06.349
I never had a drawing towards there really. Right.

00:48:06.909 --> 00:48:09.230
So then a movie that kind of connects the two

00:48:09.230 --> 00:48:12.449
of us is Mad Max. So my friends, Pete Hill, Steve

00:48:12.449 --> 00:48:15.329
Dunleavy, I think Damian Bryson. So a lot of

00:48:15.329 --> 00:48:17.849
the guys I work with in Japan ended up working

00:48:17.849 --> 00:48:19.590
on that production in Namibia. So how did you

00:48:19.590 --> 00:48:21.469
find yourself back in Africa to work on that?

00:48:22.670 --> 00:48:26.550
Well, so I worked a couple of years in production,

00:48:26.710 --> 00:48:30.809
well, in films in Thailand and living in Bangkok.

00:48:30.889 --> 00:48:33.150
And then, you know, the city life just got too

00:48:33.150 --> 00:48:36.260
much for me. Bangkok is absolutely full on. I

00:48:36.260 --> 00:48:37.619
don't know if you've ever been there, but it's

00:48:37.619 --> 00:48:40.860
intense. You could live for weeks in Bangkok

00:48:40.860 --> 00:48:42.420
and never touch the ground because everything

00:48:42.420 --> 00:48:46.539
can be above ground. It's so hot there and you're

00:48:46.539 --> 00:48:50.039
always just trying to hang out in shopping centers

00:48:50.039 --> 00:48:53.519
and somewhere where there's air con. I just don't

00:48:53.519 --> 00:48:56.800
like city life and it's so intense after a while.

00:48:56.920 --> 00:48:59.860
Just people, millions and millions of people

00:48:59.860 --> 00:49:03.980
and cars and traffic wherever you go. So I just

00:49:03.980 --> 00:49:09.300
really craved going back to Cape Town and just,

00:49:09.380 --> 00:49:11.719
you know, living there. And I heard there was

00:49:11.719 --> 00:49:15.159
a film industry there. I knew a couple of guys

00:49:15.159 --> 00:49:18.000
that were stunt people there. So I just gave

00:49:18.000 --> 00:49:20.599
them a shout. And then, yeah, I thought, oh,

00:49:20.599 --> 00:49:22.760
let me go and try and see if I can work in South

00:49:22.760 --> 00:49:26.019
Africa and get a bit of, you know, more natural

00:49:26.019 --> 00:49:28.539
lifestyle there. So I went back there in 2011.

00:49:29.659 --> 00:49:34.139
I spent a year there. which didn't go that great

00:49:34.139 --> 00:49:36.559
because at the time females, it didn't have a

00:49:36.559 --> 00:49:38.519
lot of females that used to be in core teams.

00:49:38.900 --> 00:49:41.679
So there wasn't very stable sort of income. It

00:49:41.679 --> 00:49:44.500
was just every now and again. I ended up running,

00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:48.139
somebody asked me to run a boxing gym for them.

00:49:48.219 --> 00:49:52.920
So I used to run a boxing gym. And then in 2000

00:49:52.920 --> 00:49:58.260
and beginning of 2012 or end of 2011. After being

00:49:58.260 --> 00:49:59.960
there a year, I thought, oh, no, you know, the

00:49:59.960 --> 00:50:01.719
industry is so much better in Thailand. I think

00:50:01.719 --> 00:50:04.619
I'm just going to go back there. So I went back

00:50:04.619 --> 00:50:08.000
to Thailand. No, when I was in South Africa,

00:50:08.099 --> 00:50:13.039
sorry, I did a casting for Mad Max. And you know

00:50:13.039 --> 00:50:15.159
how they had so many postponements. I think they

00:50:15.159 --> 00:50:17.280
were postponing for like 13 years in the end.

00:50:18.380 --> 00:50:21.179
I just got loads of reasons. But they were supposed

00:50:21.179 --> 00:50:24.179
to start in 2011, so they had a casting in South

00:50:24.179 --> 00:50:28.860
Africa for some performers. I got the job, but

00:50:28.860 --> 00:50:30.500
they kept on delaying. So I thought, oh, no,

00:50:30.519 --> 00:50:32.440
this is never going to happen. So I went back

00:50:32.440 --> 00:50:36.440
to Thailand and spent about three or four months

00:50:36.440 --> 00:50:39.420
there working. And then I got a call and said,

00:50:39.500 --> 00:50:42.019
oh, Mad Max is starting in a few weeks or a couple

00:50:42.019 --> 00:50:44.719
of weeks or something. So let's get going. So

00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:47.400
they were shooting in Namibia, which is just

00:50:47.400 --> 00:50:50.079
north of South Africa. So, yeah, I went back

00:50:50.079 --> 00:50:52.760
there and stayed in Namibia for like six months.

00:50:53.650 --> 00:50:55.710
Brilliant. Now, when you were on the set, obviously

00:50:55.710 --> 00:50:58.170
up to this point, you'd been using your martial

00:50:58.170 --> 00:51:01.969
arts as your main stunt tool. How did you come

00:51:01.969 --> 00:51:04.710
across riding dirt bikes? Well, actually, before

00:51:04.710 --> 00:51:09.510
we... I guess I wasn't doing that much Muay Thai.

00:51:09.530 --> 00:51:12.329
I was training it, but I've always loved to have

00:51:12.329 --> 00:51:18.309
something that I'm so into. So I was so into

00:51:18.309 --> 00:51:20.250
Muay Thai, and I guess I craved being really

00:51:20.250 --> 00:51:23.119
into something. So in a way, I was looking for

00:51:23.119 --> 00:51:27.900
something to really get into. And then when I

00:51:27.900 --> 00:51:30.019
did the casting for Mad Max and got that, they

00:51:30.019 --> 00:51:33.599
actually said to us, there's not going to be

00:51:33.599 --> 00:51:40.199
any female roles in the story. So what they might

00:51:40.199 --> 00:51:43.579
do with females is use us as pillions on the

00:51:43.579 --> 00:51:47.849
back of motorbikes because we're lighter. So

00:51:47.849 --> 00:51:50.050
some girls went out and got motorcycle licenses.

00:51:50.150 --> 00:51:52.210
I was like, no, man, it's going to be in the

00:51:52.210 --> 00:51:54.309
desert. I was like, let's just stop motocross.

00:51:54.329 --> 00:51:56.210
And at the same time, I went and watched a stunt

00:51:56.210 --> 00:52:02.570
show, which is not really like human stunts,

00:52:02.570 --> 00:52:07.309
but like some performers, it was more sports.

00:52:07.429 --> 00:52:12.989
So there was FMX and BMX and jet ski stunts and

00:52:12.989 --> 00:52:15.369
all things like that. And I saw the FMX, guys,

00:52:15.429 --> 00:52:17.780
and I was like, oh, my God. That's fucking amazing.

00:52:18.000 --> 00:52:21.239
I want to do that. So thinking it's pretty much

00:52:21.239 --> 00:52:24.079
the same thing, I just started motocross. I said

00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:26.059
to my sister, I want to start motocross. She's

00:52:26.059 --> 00:52:28.960
like, oh, I know this guy. He rides motocross.

00:52:29.340 --> 00:52:31.679
His name's Babs. At the time, he was like 60

00:52:31.679 --> 00:52:35.159
years old. And he actually still rides to this

00:52:35.159 --> 00:52:37.980
day, and I think he's 66. He's a fucking amazing

00:52:37.980 --> 00:52:42.360
dude. So I gave him a shout, and I was like,

00:52:42.460 --> 00:52:44.400
I want to start motocross. He's like, oh, come

00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:50.860
down. He had this old... YZ125 from 1986. He's

00:52:50.860 --> 00:52:54.039
like, give that a go. It's an amazing little

00:52:54.039 --> 00:52:58.539
bike. Off I went up and down the dirt path for

00:52:58.539 --> 00:53:00.500
a while and then eventually went onto the track

00:53:00.500 --> 00:53:03.019
and then started getting into the kit and buying

00:53:03.019 --> 00:53:07.139
my own kit. Eventually I wanted my own bike.

00:53:08.039 --> 00:53:11.860
Then just got absolutely obsessed with motocross.

00:53:11.920 --> 00:53:14.739
I loved it so much. I think that's an area that

00:53:14.739 --> 00:53:17.190
people don't understand about the stunt world

00:53:17.190 --> 00:53:19.389
is you know when you first go in i know that

00:53:19.389 --> 00:53:21.449
the british one i remember having a book like

00:53:21.449 --> 00:53:23.550
how to be a british stunt performer and you had

00:53:23.550 --> 00:53:26.789
to be like gymnastics level 12 and you know all

00:53:26.789 --> 00:53:29.550
these things but now you know you see that the

00:53:29.550 --> 00:53:31.590
martial artists do the fight scenes and then

00:53:31.590 --> 00:53:34.949
the the x games guys do the guys and girls do

00:53:34.949 --> 00:53:37.710
the um you know the motorized stuff and the the

00:53:37.710 --> 00:53:40.050
high divers are great at the falls that there's

00:53:40.050 --> 00:53:43.280
all this um you know, this, this specialization.

00:53:43.619 --> 00:53:46.400
So to be able to be well -rounded is definitely

00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:48.400
a goal for all of us. But ultimately, if it comes

00:53:48.400 --> 00:53:51.619
to a top stunt, you know, you need to find, you

00:53:51.619 --> 00:53:53.679
find your lane because the guy next to you, or

00:53:53.679 --> 00:53:56.719
the woman next to you may easily be one of the

00:53:56.719 --> 00:53:58.679
top people in the world of that particular, you

00:53:58.679 --> 00:54:02.340
know, genre that they're in. Yeah. I mean, there

00:54:02.340 --> 00:54:04.360
are, there are quite a lot of specialists now

00:54:04.360 --> 00:54:07.900
and that you, that they use. It's great that

00:54:07.900 --> 00:54:10.889
coordinators. Normally, I prefer to use stunt

00:54:10.889 --> 00:54:12.710
performers because if there's a stunt involved,

00:54:13.230 --> 00:54:15.530
the stunt performer has the performance side

00:54:15.530 --> 00:54:19.510
of it or knows how to perform. But a lot of the

00:54:19.510 --> 00:54:23.070
time, they do use specialists, like specific

00:54:23.070 --> 00:54:26.250
motorbike stunts. Sometimes, especially females,

00:54:26.329 --> 00:54:28.409
there's not a lot of female stunt performers

00:54:28.409 --> 00:54:30.250
who can ride really well, so they might bring

00:54:30.250 --> 00:54:34.869
in a TT rider if it's specific road bike stuff

00:54:34.869 --> 00:54:37.690
or a lot of the horse stuff is done by specific

00:54:37.690 --> 00:54:41.889
horse teams. And they also, you know, some performers,

00:54:41.889 --> 00:54:44.710
they're really good trick riders on horses. So

00:54:44.710 --> 00:54:47.489
if they can use a stunt performer, but yeah,

00:54:47.530 --> 00:54:49.690
they do use a lot of specialists now, which is

00:54:49.690 --> 00:54:53.369
good. It's safer. Yeah, well, exactly. Now, speaking

00:54:53.369 --> 00:54:57.150
of stunt performer, and I saw the short video

00:54:57.150 --> 00:55:00.309
that you and some of the other fellow stunt performers

00:55:00.309 --> 00:55:04.230
made about recognition of stunt performers in

00:55:04.230 --> 00:55:06.150
the movie industry. And it's an interesting thing

00:55:06.150 --> 00:55:08.760
because I've always been very anti. accolade

00:55:08.760 --> 00:55:10.579
in anything and even even the oscars for the

00:55:10.579 --> 00:55:15.139
actors a perfect example um uh denzel washington

00:55:15.139 --> 00:55:18.619
name fell out my head he did cry freedom he did

00:55:18.619 --> 00:55:20.880
so many of these incredible performances that

00:55:20.880 --> 00:55:23.440
he never won an oscar for i think it was training

00:55:23.440 --> 00:55:25.059
day he got one which i don't think was one of

00:55:25.059 --> 00:55:27.320
his you know strongest performances by any means

00:55:27.320 --> 00:55:29.079
this wasn't a strong script compared to some

00:55:29.079 --> 00:55:30.960
of the other ones so it's kind of a you know

00:55:30.960 --> 00:55:34.780
a bullshit thing in the first place however You

00:55:34.780 --> 00:55:37.579
guys have a very good point where just pure recognition

00:55:37.579 --> 00:55:39.760
of the stunt performer. And we've seen a lot

00:55:39.760 --> 00:55:43.199
of these people who are the actors claiming they

00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:45.739
do their own stunts. And of course, if you're

00:55:45.739 --> 00:55:47.920
hanging from a wire three feet above the ground,

00:55:47.960 --> 00:55:50.559
then yeah, it's perfectly safe. But they're kind

00:55:50.559 --> 00:55:52.980
of negating all the things that you guys do.

00:55:53.139 --> 00:55:55.159
So what's your philosophy? Not so much on, oh,

00:55:55.199 --> 00:55:57.500
we need to get awards for it, but just being

00:55:57.500 --> 00:56:01.840
included in the overall production. I don't know.

00:56:01.880 --> 00:56:05.159
I've never been a big driver for it. revved up

00:56:05.159 --> 00:56:09.380
about being awarded Oscars. I think it would

00:56:09.380 --> 00:56:11.480
never be for stunt performers anyway. It would

00:56:11.480 --> 00:56:15.320
be for like an action, maybe stunt coordinator

00:56:15.320 --> 00:56:18.079
or maybe second unit director, probably stunt

00:56:18.079 --> 00:56:22.840
coordinator more. So it wouldn't ever take away

00:56:22.840 --> 00:56:25.639
from like, you know, some people were worried,

00:56:25.679 --> 00:56:29.599
would it take away or, you know, show the fact

00:56:29.599 --> 00:56:31.739
that the actors aren't doing their own stunts.

00:56:31.760 --> 00:56:34.860
I don't think it would do any of that. And although

00:56:34.860 --> 00:56:38.000
I'm not a big forceful driver for the Oscars

00:56:38.000 --> 00:56:41.280
thing, I just don't understand why we're not

00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:45.480
included. To me, all aspects of making a film

00:56:45.480 --> 00:56:49.440
should be included, from lighting to directing

00:56:49.440 --> 00:56:55.519
to makeup to stunts. All of those departments

00:56:55.519 --> 00:57:00.719
take making a film. To make a good film, you

00:57:00.719 --> 00:57:03.780
need all of those departments. to be in tip -top

00:57:03.780 --> 00:57:07.920
shape and you know stunts work uh with the director

00:57:07.920 --> 00:57:10.059
and the producers right from the beginning through

00:57:10.059 --> 00:57:12.900
the whole film and a lot of films nowadays you

00:57:12.900 --> 00:57:14.760
take away the stunts you don't even have a trailer

00:57:14.760 --> 00:57:18.739
so yeah they do need it so i don't understand

00:57:18.739 --> 00:57:23.000
why why it's not included but yeah well especially

00:57:23.000 --> 00:57:25.679
now because we have social media i mean uh you

00:57:25.679 --> 00:57:28.139
know i follow bobby holland who's chris hemsworth

00:57:28.139 --> 00:57:30.119
stunt double and they have you know they have

00:57:30.119 --> 00:57:32.280
a fitness app together they got all kinds of

00:57:32.280 --> 00:57:34.679
things but it's out that now you know that that

00:57:34.679 --> 00:57:38.039
fourth wall's kind of being removed so you know

00:57:38.039 --> 00:57:39.760
we get to see behind the scenes even the dvds

00:57:39.760 --> 00:57:42.139
have all that behind the scenes footage so it

00:57:42.139 --> 00:57:45.019
seems a little silly to not now acknowledge that

00:57:45.019 --> 00:57:49.119
community when we all are fully aware of who's

00:57:49.119 --> 00:57:51.340
truly doing the stunts and and then you know

00:57:51.340 --> 00:57:54.360
the the areas where, you know, some of these

00:57:54.360 --> 00:57:56.880
actors have got, you know, a great background

00:57:56.880 --> 00:57:59.300
in movement, but then it boils down to the insurance.

00:57:59.480 --> 00:58:01.860
They're not going to let them do it anyway. Yeah.

00:58:03.199 --> 00:58:05.300
But yeah, we've been just going to steer it back

00:58:05.300 --> 00:58:08.320
down. Just, just acknowledging it doesn't need

00:58:08.320 --> 00:58:09.840
to be an award. And I'm not about that, but,

00:58:09.880 --> 00:58:13.179
but yeah, it's a. You guys are a hugely important

00:58:13.179 --> 00:58:16.960
part of a cast, especially when it comes to an

00:58:16.960 --> 00:58:18.960
action movie. If it's a drama and someone trips

00:58:18.960 --> 00:58:22.840
over a cat for two seconds in the movie, obviously

00:58:22.840 --> 00:58:24.900
that's not pivotal around stunts. But you bring

00:58:24.900 --> 00:58:28.219
in the Marvel movies and all those. That's really

00:58:28.219 --> 00:58:31.159
a stunt movie with great actors involved as well.

00:58:31.719 --> 00:58:34.639
Yeah. Yeah, it definitely makes sense. I think

00:58:34.639 --> 00:58:38.820
it will get included one day. Yeah, I think it

00:58:38.820 --> 00:58:40.860
should. All right. Well, speaking of stunts,

00:58:40.860 --> 00:58:42.840
obviously with this, you know, we're going to

00:58:42.840 --> 00:58:45.539
have to discuss Resident Evil because that's

00:58:45.539 --> 00:58:49.000
a very pivotal point in your story, even though

00:58:49.000 --> 00:58:52.679
it's definitely not a defining point. So if you

00:58:52.679 --> 00:58:55.440
wouldn't mind kind of how you got onto that particular

00:58:55.440 --> 00:58:58.440
project and then, you know, that awful, awful

00:58:58.440 --> 00:59:00.960
day when you were riding the bike on the bridge.

00:59:01.900 --> 00:59:04.559
Well, that sort of happened. I was living and

00:59:04.559 --> 00:59:08.420
working in England since 2013. I came over here.

00:59:09.320 --> 00:59:12.079
to shoot uh guardians of the galaxy the first

00:59:12.079 --> 00:59:15.619
one um and then i met my husband my now husband

00:59:15.619 --> 00:59:20.039
um and then so i fell in love with him and just

00:59:20.039 --> 00:59:23.059
wanted to stay living here in england it's quite

00:59:23.059 --> 00:59:26.280
it's very big industry here in england so i thought

00:59:26.280 --> 00:59:28.340
it's a good place to live and you know obviously

00:59:28.340 --> 00:59:31.539
stay with dave so in we ended up getting married

00:59:31.539 --> 00:59:36.860
in 2015 in may and there was a long time which

00:59:36.860 --> 00:59:39.469
is a really shit time because i couldn't I couldn't

00:59:39.469 --> 00:59:41.289
work in the UK because I didn't have a working

00:59:41.289 --> 00:59:46.289
visa. And I went to South Africa to ride motocross

00:59:46.289 --> 00:59:48.550
for like a few months because it was their summer

00:59:48.550 --> 00:59:50.449
and it was cold in England. So I was like, I'm

00:59:50.449 --> 00:59:55.730
out of here. So I was riding in Cape Town for

00:59:55.730 --> 00:59:59.789
like four months from October, November, December

00:59:59.789 --> 01:00:02.550
and January. And then I was stuck there without

01:00:02.550 --> 01:00:04.949
a visa. I couldn't come back here to work because

01:00:04.949 --> 01:00:08.260
of my visa. But anyway, we were getting married

01:00:08.260 --> 01:00:11.400
in May, so we got married, and then I think I

01:00:11.400 --> 01:00:14.059
lost my passport or something, but there was

01:00:14.059 --> 01:00:17.579
a massive delay in my spousal visa, so I couldn't

01:00:17.579 --> 01:00:20.840
come back here. And it was a bit of a shitter

01:00:20.840 --> 01:00:23.639
because I had booked a job here on the first

01:00:23.639 --> 01:00:27.139
Wonder Woman, but I wasn't sure when I could

01:00:27.139 --> 01:00:29.679
come back because I wasn't sure when my passport

01:00:29.679 --> 01:00:32.480
would come through. So I wasn't actually working

01:00:32.480 --> 01:00:36.340
in South Africa. riding motocross there which

01:00:36.340 --> 01:00:38.840
I was a male elephant element so that was fine

01:00:38.840 --> 01:00:43.960
and then I was while I was waiting for my visa

01:00:43.960 --> 01:00:47.760
and waiting to come and do Wonder Woman there

01:00:47.760 --> 01:00:50.659
I obviously wasn't sure when the visa would come

01:00:50.659 --> 01:00:54.579
through so I was asked to do a Resident Evil

01:00:54.579 --> 01:00:58.659
to double for Mila Jovovich and it's not a great

01:00:58.659 --> 01:01:02.260
film a bit of a shitter cheap movie but there

01:01:02.260 --> 01:01:06.059
was some Really good, fun stunts too, doing a

01:01:06.059 --> 01:01:09.400
lot of fun fights and some fun motorbike stuff.

01:01:09.579 --> 01:01:11.699
But I love both, so I was like, yeah, that looks

01:01:11.699 --> 01:01:14.340
good. And then I talked to Dave, my husband,

01:01:14.400 --> 01:01:16.019
for a while, and I don't know what to do because,

01:01:16.139 --> 01:01:19.320
you know, I've got Wonder Woman, which is a nice

01:01:19.320 --> 01:01:22.340
big film, but I don't know when my V's are going

01:01:22.340 --> 01:01:24.500
to come through. Or there's this one I could

01:01:24.500 --> 01:01:27.820
just start now, a Resident Evil shit film, but

01:01:27.820 --> 01:01:32.010
some really fun stunts. So then I spoke to the

01:01:32.010 --> 01:01:35.230
coordinator at the time for Wonder Woman, and

01:01:35.230 --> 01:01:37.650
I said to him about my situation. He's like,

01:01:37.750 --> 01:01:39.929
no, just do that Resident Evil job, and when

01:01:39.929 --> 01:01:42.449
you come back here in December when that finishes,

01:01:42.690 --> 01:01:46.150
then I'll just hop on to Wonder Woman. I'll put

01:01:46.150 --> 01:01:49.050
somebody else in the place in the meantime. So

01:01:49.050 --> 01:01:52.489
I was like, sweet, this is perfect. So, yeah,

01:01:52.550 --> 01:01:54.889
I took on Resident Evil, which was not a great

01:01:54.889 --> 01:01:58.960
idea, obviously. Yeah, you wanted to know what

01:01:58.960 --> 01:02:01.559
was going to happen though. So with the actual

01:02:01.559 --> 01:02:04.800
day, originally you had a fight scene planned.

01:02:04.940 --> 01:02:08.059
Is that correct? I mean, on the day of the accident,

01:02:08.139 --> 01:02:11.579
we're doing this quite a cool fight scene on

01:02:11.579 --> 01:02:15.659
top of a moving vehicle, like a big, I don't

01:02:15.659 --> 01:02:17.019
know what you call it, kind of like a lorry,

01:02:17.199 --> 01:02:21.239
but not very long, like a one -section lorry.

01:02:22.639 --> 01:02:26.219
A fight scene on top of that. It was on the move,

01:02:26.300 --> 01:02:30.239
so we had to, and it was a very difficult space

01:02:30.239 --> 01:02:34.880
to move on. And actually the scene was being

01:02:34.880 --> 01:02:39.420
shot the whole of the next week, and the whole

01:02:39.420 --> 01:02:42.679
of the next week was very sunny and hot. And

01:02:42.679 --> 01:02:46.280
that day, which was a Saturday, which was originally

01:02:46.280 --> 01:02:48.400
supposed to be a rehearsal day, but at last minute

01:02:48.400 --> 01:02:50.679
they were like, oh no, let's make it a filming

01:02:50.679 --> 01:02:53.750
day. So that was the only day and then it was

01:02:53.750 --> 01:02:55.730
a break Sunday and then filmed the whole of the

01:02:55.730 --> 01:02:59.750
sunny week. On that Saturday, it was actually

01:02:59.750 --> 01:03:03.489
poured down with rain the whole of Friday night.

01:03:03.889 --> 01:03:06.489
So everything was sopping wet in the morning.

01:03:06.610 --> 01:03:09.369
And there was still drizzling and raining a little

01:03:09.369 --> 01:03:13.809
on the Saturday. So we were supposed to shoot

01:03:13.809 --> 01:03:18.449
the fight scene on top of the moving lorry. But

01:03:18.449 --> 01:03:19.909
we couldn't because it would be too slippery.

01:03:20.650 --> 01:03:22.710
So you know what producers are like. They don't

01:03:22.710 --> 01:03:24.389
want to waste any time because everyone's there

01:03:24.389 --> 01:03:26.210
on the payroll. So they're like, ah, what can

01:03:26.210 --> 01:03:29.090
we shoot? Obviously not a great production, so

01:03:29.090 --> 01:03:33.050
they don't have weather options organized. So

01:03:33.050 --> 01:03:35.190
they're just like, can we shoot some motorbike

01:03:35.190 --> 01:03:37.590
stuff? Which is pretty fucking stupid because

01:03:37.590 --> 01:03:41.949
the motorbike stuff is directly, it's pretty

01:03:41.949 --> 01:03:45.389
much, the fight scene happens, and then I jump

01:03:45.389 --> 01:03:48.070
onto this motorbike after I've killed the guy.

01:03:50.380 --> 01:03:52.880
wheelie the motorbike off the lorry and go onto

01:03:52.880 --> 01:03:55.440
the road so it's basically the scene directly

01:03:55.440 --> 01:03:58.880
after so it's not like it'll be different weather

01:03:58.880 --> 01:04:01.239
it's going to be the same weather so in my head

01:04:01.239 --> 01:04:03.400
I was like oh this is fucking stupid because

01:04:03.400 --> 01:04:07.059
you can't shoot that because it's the wrong weather

01:04:07.059 --> 01:04:10.159
and you're going to see which is why so the two

01:04:10.159 --> 01:04:12.719
scenes wouldn't match up when you edit them yeah

01:04:12.719 --> 01:04:14.900
but I think you know what they like they just

01:04:14.900 --> 01:04:16.800
want to do something because they don't want

01:04:16.800 --> 01:04:20.880
to waste their money so Yeah, so they asked me,

01:04:20.920 --> 01:04:23.820
is it okay if I do the motorbike stuff, which

01:04:23.820 --> 01:04:26.260
is fine. I don't mind riding in the rain. That's

01:04:26.260 --> 01:04:30.179
no problem. Yeah, so we decided to do some motorbike

01:04:30.179 --> 01:04:34.039
stuff. Right, so the scene that you had shot

01:04:34.039 --> 01:04:35.880
up, it was on a railway bridge. Is that right?

01:04:37.599 --> 01:04:41.179
There was that scene, the bike scene that we

01:04:41.179 --> 01:04:45.179
did. It was a very long road. I would say about

01:04:45.179 --> 01:04:49.550
800 meters maybe long. Two parallel roads, tar

01:04:49.550 --> 01:04:52.329
roads, a desolate road, so there's nothing on

01:04:52.329 --> 01:04:55.630
them. There was some car debris, you know, like

01:04:55.630 --> 01:04:58.369
they always do in films, broken down cars on

01:04:58.369 --> 01:05:03.530
the side of the roads. But it wasn't a used road.

01:05:04.190 --> 01:05:07.230
It was an old highway, I think. It was two parallel

01:05:07.230 --> 01:05:12.769
roads and a bridge on each end of it. So we rode

01:05:12.769 --> 01:05:14.530
underneath the bridge. It wasn't on top of the

01:05:14.530 --> 01:05:17.389
bridge. Oh, okay, gotcha. All right. So then

01:05:17.389 --> 01:05:22.670
as you are riding towards the film truck, there's

01:05:22.670 --> 01:05:27.210
a boom with a camera and it's supposed to basically

01:05:27.210 --> 01:05:31.230
go up and over as you go past. Yeah. All right.

01:05:31.250 --> 01:05:32.690
So my question, because I've heard, obviously,

01:05:32.789 --> 01:05:34.030
you know, I've seen the articles and everything,

01:05:34.150 --> 01:05:36.989
but I don't really have seen anything describing

01:05:36.989 --> 01:05:39.909
this. What the hell went wrong? Before we talk

01:05:39.909 --> 01:05:42.030
about what happened to you, why didn't that boom

01:05:42.030 --> 01:05:45.500
even raise up in the first place? Well, there's

01:05:45.500 --> 01:05:50.139
loads of things that happened on the day where

01:05:50.139 --> 01:05:54.719
production went wrong, you know, not organized

01:05:54.719 --> 01:05:58.239
and risk assessments and things like that. But

01:05:58.239 --> 01:06:00.559
besides all that, like what directly happened

01:06:00.559 --> 01:06:04.659
was basically, as you said, I was to ride in

01:06:04.659 --> 01:06:07.320
a straight line. I had no helmet on, riding a

01:06:07.320 --> 01:06:11.699
straight line along the road and in the opposite

01:06:11.699 --> 01:06:15.320
direction. came the action vehicles car with

01:06:15.320 --> 01:06:18.360
a crane to the side of it at the time and a camera

01:06:18.360 --> 01:06:20.500
on the end of that crane. The camera is supposed

01:06:20.500 --> 01:06:24.440
to start scooping along the floor. And then as

01:06:24.440 --> 01:06:29.059
it comes close to me, it's supposed to lift up

01:06:29.059 --> 01:06:36.039
and over the top of my head. But the guy who

01:06:36.039 --> 01:06:40.800
owns the action vehicles company and the guy...

01:06:41.309 --> 01:06:43.250
This is a guy that was responsible for lifting

01:06:43.250 --> 01:06:46.530
the crane. Him and the driver basically just

01:06:46.530 --> 01:06:51.110
fucked up. Went completely freestyle and just

01:06:51.110 --> 01:06:56.329
didn't lift the boom in time and lifted it too

01:06:56.329 --> 01:07:00.449
late and smashed it into my head and top of my

01:07:00.449 --> 01:07:05.710
shoulder. And this was a cumulative speed opposing

01:07:05.710 --> 01:07:09.599
of over 100 kilometers an hour? Yeah, which is

01:07:09.599 --> 01:07:11.480
quite scary if you think about it. I have no

01:07:11.480 --> 01:07:14.739
helmet on. I was riding at about 70 kilometers

01:07:14.739 --> 01:07:17.880
an hour, and they were opposing at 50 kilometers

01:07:17.880 --> 01:07:21.980
an hour. So that's like in conjunction 120 kilometers

01:07:21.980 --> 01:07:25.679
an hour with no helmet, just something going

01:07:25.679 --> 01:07:28.219
straight into my head. So it's fucking amazing

01:07:28.219 --> 01:07:30.539
that I'm still alive, really. Yeah, because as

01:07:30.539 --> 01:07:32.960
we know in basic physics, that would be the same

01:07:32.960 --> 01:07:36.159
as you driving into a bridge at 80 miles an hour,

01:07:36.260 --> 01:07:37.840
whatever it ends up being through our system.

01:07:38.539 --> 01:07:41.559
to a dead stop it's crazy if you think about

01:07:41.559 --> 01:07:46.059
it that way yeah no it is so um yeah if you wouldn't

01:07:46.059 --> 01:07:49.019
mind just kind of walk us through you know what

01:07:49.019 --> 01:07:51.079
you remember of that and then and then obviously

01:07:51.079 --> 01:07:53.599
the the resulting injuries from that horrendous

01:07:53.599 --> 01:08:00.500
impact i i don't remember apparently i was conscious

01:08:00.500 --> 01:08:03.110
and trying to get up But I must have just, you

01:08:03.110 --> 01:08:05.170
know, like my left -hand side of my face was

01:08:05.170 --> 01:08:07.809
totally degloved, which means pulled back so

01:08:07.809 --> 01:08:10.630
you could see my teeth, through my teeth, and

01:08:10.630 --> 01:08:14.329
loads and loads of injuries. I was apparently

01:08:14.329 --> 01:08:17.069
still trying to get up and a little bit conscious.

01:08:17.109 --> 01:08:22.170
I don't remember that. I do remember literally

01:08:22.170 --> 01:08:24.989
one second of being put into the ambulance and

01:08:24.989 --> 01:08:26.770
seeing the roof of the car. I didn't know what

01:08:26.770 --> 01:08:29.789
was happening, but I remember that. And then,

01:08:29.829 --> 01:08:32.180
yeah, I just. And then I had loads and loads

01:08:32.180 --> 01:08:37.539
of horrific nightmares in the coma, which is

01:08:37.539 --> 01:08:40.760
literally like going to hell. And then I woke

01:08:40.760 --> 01:08:44.699
up. And then to see my family's and my husband's

01:08:44.699 --> 01:08:47.159
face, which was about three weeks, almost three

01:08:47.159 --> 01:08:52.079
weeks later. That's crazy. Absolutely. It's amazing

01:08:52.079 --> 01:08:54.600
that you were even up and coming from the paramedic

01:08:54.600 --> 01:08:56.340
background, you know, the impact that you had,

01:08:56.479 --> 01:08:58.880
you know, like you said, it should have killed

01:08:58.880 --> 01:09:01.579
you. And obviously, you know, what you're left

01:09:01.579 --> 01:09:04.659
with physically is not, you know, a complete

01:09:04.659 --> 01:09:07.680
fully formed, you know, functional body again.

01:09:07.800 --> 01:09:11.699
But, you know, the fact that you didn't die right

01:09:11.699 --> 01:09:14.079
there on an impact is, I mean, really defies

01:09:14.079 --> 01:09:18.140
all... you know, biomechanics and physiology,

01:09:18.340 --> 01:09:23.060
really. Yeah. Well, the surgeons kept saying

01:09:23.060 --> 01:09:25.960
that if I wasn't, because I always had a very

01:09:25.960 --> 01:09:28.439
strong back and my shoulders, you know, the back

01:09:28.439 --> 01:09:30.680
part of it, obviously from loads and loads of

01:09:30.680 --> 01:09:34.560
Muay Thai over the years. And he said that if

01:09:34.560 --> 01:09:38.479
I didn't have such a strong back, my whole shoulder

01:09:38.479 --> 01:09:40.760
would have ripped off completely on the site.

01:09:41.520 --> 01:09:43.619
So I would have had no shoulder or anything.

01:09:44.329 --> 01:09:48.270
Because my shoulder blade was shattered. He said

01:09:48.270 --> 01:09:52.590
the pressure that is needed to shatter a shoulder

01:09:52.590 --> 01:09:54.609
blade when you get hit from the front of the

01:09:54.609 --> 01:09:58.430
shoulder is very, very rare because it's got

01:09:58.430 --> 01:10:02.170
that much. It's so strong. But basically all

01:10:02.170 --> 01:10:05.310
my shoulder muscles were strong enough to hold

01:10:05.310 --> 01:10:07.890
it all together. So although it shattered, it

01:10:07.890 --> 01:10:14.319
still was still held together. and in a completely

01:10:14.319 --> 01:10:22.319
wrong way, which we sorted out later. I've always

01:10:22.319 --> 01:10:25.500
been really into nutrition and peak shape, so

01:10:25.500 --> 01:10:30.180
I think that helped really a lot. yeah i'm sure

01:10:30.180 --> 01:10:32.100
i've had several people on here that have been

01:10:32.100 --> 01:10:34.600
through all kinds of stuff from you know a mountain

01:10:34.600 --> 01:10:36.699
bike accident where the saddle went right into

01:10:36.699 --> 01:10:39.560
their femoral artery branch and and all kinds

01:10:39.560 --> 01:10:41.779
of people and again each one of those they were

01:10:41.779 --> 01:10:44.140
told that they were saved because of that because

01:10:44.140 --> 01:10:46.420
of their physical condition if they'd been deconditioned

01:10:46.420 --> 01:10:47.680
they would have bled out right there and then

01:10:47.680 --> 01:10:53.039
yeah yeah all right so then um you know a big

01:10:53.039 --> 01:10:57.659
part of obviously your post incident injury was

01:10:57.659 --> 01:11:01.420
that one arm. So I know it was completely decimated.

01:11:01.420 --> 01:11:03.060
I know there were parts of your arm they didn't

01:11:03.060 --> 01:11:08.039
even find, but it was still intact. So what was

01:11:08.039 --> 01:11:11.000
that journey for you from hoping that you were

01:11:11.000 --> 01:11:13.119
going to be able to rehab that arm to ultimately

01:11:13.119 --> 01:11:16.239
losing it? Well, in the beginning, like when

01:11:16.239 --> 01:11:19.100
I was still in a coma, they said to my husband

01:11:19.100 --> 01:11:22.279
and family, like her arm, everything actually

01:11:22.279 --> 01:11:27.590
on my left hand side. including my neck, is paralyzed

01:11:27.590 --> 01:11:31.329
and there's no way it's impossible for it to

01:11:31.329 --> 01:11:35.149
ever get better. It will never get movements

01:11:35.149 --> 01:11:40.090
again. Because all the nerves that feed my left

01:11:40.090 --> 01:11:45.289
-hand side, besides my top left -hand side, all

01:11:45.289 --> 01:11:48.470
those nerves were pulled out of my spinal cord

01:11:48.470 --> 01:11:51.409
by the root. There's no way that they can put

01:11:51.409 --> 01:11:53.470
them back in or there's no way that they can

01:11:53.470 --> 01:11:57.729
grow back in. And so they were told still when

01:11:57.729 --> 01:12:00.470
I was in coma that it's not possible for it to

01:12:00.470 --> 01:12:03.289
get better. But they didn't, I guess nobody had

01:12:03.289 --> 01:12:05.970
the courage to tell me that. And my husband was

01:12:05.970 --> 01:12:09.470
so determined that we could find somebody somewhere

01:12:09.470 --> 01:12:12.829
in America or the UK or anywhere in the world.

01:12:12.890 --> 01:12:15.369
Like he was just looking and speaking to the

01:12:15.369 --> 01:12:21.369
top surgeons to hopefully do something. But eventually.

01:12:22.319 --> 01:12:24.279
So I guess there was little time where there

01:12:24.279 --> 01:12:27.939
was little hope, and eventually we figured out

01:12:27.939 --> 01:12:31.460
that there's literally nothing you can do. Because

01:12:31.460 --> 01:12:36.239
my injuries are so complex, there's so many injuries,

01:12:36.500 --> 01:12:41.399
and they're so extensive that there's just literally

01:12:41.399 --> 01:12:45.739
nothing you can do. And anyway, at the same time,

01:12:45.819 --> 01:12:50.159
when I came out of a coma and eventually moved

01:12:50.159 --> 01:12:52.960
into a normal ward, I had to learn to walk again,

01:12:53.220 --> 01:12:55.539
eventually learn to walk again, and I could just

01:12:55.539 --> 01:12:57.420
really feel the weight of my dead arm because

01:12:57.420 --> 01:13:00.260
you've got the whole of your top left -hand side

01:13:00.260 --> 01:13:05.319
completely, you know, dead weight. And my god,

01:13:05.359 --> 01:13:07.600
my arm, when I eventually chopped it off, it

01:13:07.600 --> 01:13:10.260
was like four kilograms if it took off. You took

01:13:10.260 --> 01:13:13.899
four kilograms of dead weight hanging on my neck,

01:13:13.960 --> 01:13:16.460
my shoulder and my neck, which is also paralyzed.

01:13:17.520 --> 01:13:20.560
I just could not take it. And that was really

01:13:20.560 --> 01:13:22.260
holding me back. And eventually when I could

01:13:22.260 --> 01:13:26.920
go home and try and sort of get more normal life

01:13:26.920 --> 01:13:29.899
back together, like the thing that was really

01:13:29.899 --> 01:13:33.140
holding me back was the weight of my arm. There

01:13:33.140 --> 01:13:35.899
was no way that my arm would ever work again.

01:13:36.119 --> 01:13:38.960
And the arm completely atrophies. There's nothing

01:13:38.960 --> 01:13:42.340
left. It was just literally bone and skin covering

01:13:42.340 --> 01:13:44.979
it. And then some parts of it, as you said, they

01:13:44.979 --> 01:13:48.300
were never found. So like missing fingers, which

01:13:48.300 --> 01:13:52.170
looked really weird. And some of them were so

01:13:52.170 --> 01:13:54.550
mutilated, they were curled over and they could

01:13:54.550 --> 01:13:57.550
never go straight. It just looked like a big

01:13:57.550 --> 01:14:01.069
claw. And then, yeah, parts of the forearm, like

01:14:01.069 --> 01:14:03.850
nine centimeters of the forearm bone was missing.

01:14:03.909 --> 01:14:06.529
So they had to replace that with a piece of cement.

01:14:08.189 --> 01:14:10.590
And they said, yeah, to replace it, they have

01:14:10.590 --> 01:14:15.789
to take one of your lower leg bones, entire bone,

01:14:15.850 --> 01:14:17.489
I don't know which one, the entire bone to replace

01:14:17.489 --> 01:14:20.460
that piece. I was like, no, man, this arm's never

01:14:20.460 --> 01:14:22.239
going to work. It's holding me back. I could

01:14:22.239 --> 01:14:25.039
not even stand up for like a minute because of

01:14:25.039 --> 01:14:28.600
the weight on my neck, hanging on my neck. So

01:14:28.600 --> 01:14:30.479
I was like, I just want to take the arm off.

01:14:30.579 --> 01:14:32.739
It's not going to do anything. It just looks

01:14:32.739 --> 01:14:37.239
like a big dead claw. So yeah, I insisted that

01:14:37.239 --> 01:14:39.760
I wanted to take the arm off and just move on

01:14:39.760 --> 01:14:41.779
with my life. But that actually took quite a

01:14:41.779 --> 01:14:44.819
while. It took about six months. I was back in

01:14:44.819 --> 01:14:47.670
the UK at the time. They really wanted to make

01:14:47.670 --> 01:14:50.470
sure that, obviously, you can't reverse it. If

01:14:50.470 --> 01:14:51.850
you take your arm off, they can't put it back

01:14:51.850 --> 01:14:53.729
on. They really wanted to make sure that that

01:14:53.729 --> 01:14:56.170
is the right decision that you're positive on.

01:14:56.850 --> 01:15:01.390
I had to go for psychological obsession with

01:15:01.390 --> 01:15:04.890
the specific amputation guy, make sure that I

01:15:04.890 --> 01:15:08.949
was in the right headspace to do it. Then about

01:15:08.949 --> 01:15:10.850
six months later, they were like, cool, let's

01:15:10.850 --> 01:15:16.010
do it. I went and got the chop. That was actually

01:15:16.010 --> 01:15:18.010
the best day since the accident when I took my

01:15:18.010 --> 01:15:21.609
arm off. It's so strange to hear that, but the

01:15:21.609 --> 01:15:23.909
way you describe it makes perfect sense. If that's

01:15:23.909 --> 01:15:25.810
not functioning as your arm anymore, then it

01:15:25.810 --> 01:15:29.890
is dead weight and it's now hindering you. But

01:15:29.890 --> 01:15:34.710
what a challenging decision to make to remove

01:15:34.710 --> 01:15:36.689
something that you've had obviously since you

01:15:36.689 --> 01:15:40.810
were born. And for that to ultimately be the

01:15:40.810 --> 01:15:43.350
beginning of moving forward is a very powerful

01:15:43.350 --> 01:15:47.720
moment. Yeah, I said what I was going to do and

01:15:47.720 --> 01:15:50.359
so many people were like, no, don't chop your

01:15:50.359 --> 01:15:56.420
arm off. They just don't understand. But for

01:15:56.420 --> 01:16:02.000
me, the biggest problem with the accident was

01:16:02.000 --> 01:16:05.899
the change of life that I had to have. From having

01:16:05.899 --> 01:16:11.399
a very active, outdoor, full life. to not hardly

01:16:11.399 --> 01:16:13.859
being able to stand up at the time or do anything.

01:16:14.159 --> 01:16:18.220
That was so difficult for me, more than the change

01:16:18.220 --> 01:16:22.619
of my body or a possible loss of an arm. So that's

01:16:22.619 --> 01:16:24.699
what I really wanted to give back was some kind

01:16:24.699 --> 01:16:28.539
of happiness and some kind of life where I could

01:16:28.539 --> 01:16:31.359
move or stand up and at least make myself something

01:16:31.359 --> 01:16:35.079
to eat or anything. I had to have people help

01:16:35.079 --> 01:16:37.159
me all the time. I could never be left alone.

01:16:37.880 --> 01:16:42.359
So I just said, oh, you know, I weighed it up

01:16:42.359 --> 01:16:44.659
and I definitely just wanted to get rid of it.

01:16:45.060 --> 01:16:47.319
Yeah. Well, what's interesting as well, looking

01:16:47.319 --> 01:16:50.659
at you from the outside, looking in is, oh, there's

01:16:50.659 --> 01:16:53.699
Olivia. She lost an arm in an accident. But then

01:16:53.699 --> 01:16:56.380
when you see the x -rays and you talk about the

01:16:56.380 --> 01:17:00.079
internal trauma on the spine and the nerves,

01:17:00.239 --> 01:17:04.340
I mean, your spine. looks like an s shape you

01:17:04.340 --> 01:17:06.680
know completely distorted so so there's so many

01:17:06.680 --> 01:17:09.920
injuries that are hidden by your body that you're

01:17:09.920 --> 01:17:11.300
dealing with as well is that something that you

01:17:11.300 --> 01:17:14.199
struggle with is you know people think oh you

01:17:14.199 --> 01:17:16.600
know that's your only limiting factor whereas

01:17:16.600 --> 01:17:18.579
your internal battle is obviously all these other

01:17:18.579 --> 01:17:21.399
things that are going on as well yeah you know

01:17:21.399 --> 01:17:24.180
they're like having one arm for me is seriously

01:17:24.180 --> 01:17:28.479
not a problem it doesn't it wouldn't if i had

01:17:28.909 --> 01:17:31.189
If I had a normal, strong body, there was no

01:17:31.189 --> 01:17:33.189
problems. I had one arm. It wouldn't bother me

01:17:33.189 --> 01:17:35.949
whatsoever. I'd still be doing stunts. I'd still

01:17:35.949 --> 01:17:38.029
be doing all the other things that I love to

01:17:38.029 --> 01:17:42.250
do. The thing that really holds me back and is

01:17:42.250 --> 01:17:46.909
the biggest, you know, pain in my life is the

01:17:46.909 --> 01:17:50.750
paralysis. And the paralysis on the core and

01:17:50.750 --> 01:17:54.350
the neck especially cause the spine to move in

01:17:54.350 --> 01:17:56.909
so many directions. So it's, you know, bent and

01:17:56.909 --> 01:18:01.329
all sort of uncomfortable. And paralysis itself

01:18:01.329 --> 01:18:05.109
is so painful. I always thought if you see somebody,

01:18:05.270 --> 01:18:08.090
you know, when I never knew anything about it,

01:18:08.090 --> 01:18:10.850
I'd see someone in a wheelchair and I would think

01:18:10.850 --> 01:18:14.149
that their whole body was numb and heavy. But

01:18:14.149 --> 01:18:17.789
it's so painful. It's constant, constant, without

01:18:17.789 --> 01:18:23.250
a second's break, pain. And that's hard to live

01:18:23.250 --> 01:18:26.670
with. And also, you know, the constant spasming.

01:18:27.600 --> 01:18:30.180
twisting of the of the body is also very hard

01:18:30.180 --> 01:18:34.119
to live with so as you said you you were this

01:18:34.119 --> 01:18:38.239
you know able -bodied stunt performer using their

01:18:38.239 --> 01:18:40.659
body for their profession you have this horrendous

01:18:40.659 --> 01:18:43.880
accident and you find yourself now what has been

01:18:43.880 --> 01:18:46.460
your self -talk how have you how have you been

01:18:46.460 --> 01:18:49.340
so resilient and and and fought your way back

01:18:49.340 --> 01:18:51.439
to where you know we're watching videos of you

01:18:51.439 --> 01:18:56.649
doing martial arts again well As I said, I love

01:18:56.649 --> 01:18:59.689
sports and I love digging my heels and really

01:18:59.689 --> 01:19:04.810
being like getting into something 100%. So obviously

01:19:04.810 --> 01:19:07.829
Muay Thai is not a great option for me now because

01:19:07.829 --> 01:19:13.869
it's quite a hard sport. Well, martial arts and

01:19:13.869 --> 01:19:16.270
in fighting I had to change stance because there's

01:19:16.270 --> 01:19:18.229
nothing on my left hand side to protect myself.

01:19:18.350 --> 01:19:22.029
So I had to change to right foot forward stance.

01:19:22.800 --> 01:19:25.180
to southpaw which is a massive change anyway

01:19:25.180 --> 01:19:29.180
um so there's a guy that i used to train with

01:19:29.180 --> 01:19:33.239
actually to to get better at just sort of different

01:19:33.239 --> 01:19:37.600
kicks when i was doing stunts and he he's got

01:19:37.600 --> 01:19:39.479
a gym just down the road which is perfect for

01:19:39.479 --> 01:19:43.140
me he's an amazing teacher um so yeah i spoke

01:19:43.140 --> 01:19:45.039
to him and he was like yeah let's do something

01:19:45.039 --> 01:19:48.359
so and he does kickboxing which is quite a very

01:19:48.359 --> 01:19:50.479
different style to muay thai but it's absolutely

01:19:50.479 --> 01:19:55.210
perfect for me now So I went down and did that

01:19:55.210 --> 01:19:57.750
and just got into it. And the good thing about

01:19:57.750 --> 01:20:01.810
kickboxing is it has a belt system. So Muay Thai,

01:20:01.869 --> 01:20:04.890
you don't have any belt system. You just get

01:20:04.890 --> 01:20:06.550
in the ring and you fight and you train for your

01:20:06.550 --> 01:20:10.850
fight. And then you can get championships. But

01:20:10.850 --> 01:20:13.590
in kickboxing, you have belts. You do have tournaments

01:20:13.590 --> 01:20:15.710
as well, but you can work on yourself on white

01:20:15.710 --> 01:20:18.350
belt. In our school, there's eight belts up until

01:20:18.350 --> 01:20:21.479
a black belt. And so that gives me nice little

01:20:21.479 --> 01:20:24.439
goals to work for, which is cool. So at the moment,

01:20:24.479 --> 01:20:26.520
I've worked myself up to purple belts. I've only

01:20:26.520 --> 01:20:30.279
got brown belts and then black belts. Very nice.

01:20:30.420 --> 01:20:32.939
You know, watching the footage of you training,

01:20:33.060 --> 01:20:34.600
it reminded me, have you ever heard of the guy

01:20:34.600 --> 01:20:36.960
Bill Superfoot Wallace from back in the day?

01:20:37.909 --> 01:20:40.630
no so i think he did a couple of uh you know

01:20:40.630 --> 01:20:42.670
like jack chan style movies as well i think he

01:20:42.670 --> 01:20:45.189
was in a couple of his but he i think he was

01:20:45.189 --> 01:20:48.989
a judo player before and got thrown and completely

01:20:48.989 --> 01:20:52.369
messed up one side of his body so he ended up

01:20:52.369 --> 01:20:54.170
i think it was right side forward he could only

01:20:54.170 --> 01:20:56.670
kick with his right leg and then would use his

01:20:56.670 --> 01:20:59.789
right arm And he ended up being a world champion

01:20:59.789 --> 01:21:01.890
kickboxer. And he just had, I think it was the

01:21:01.890 --> 01:21:04.569
side kick, the round kick, the hook kick, and

01:21:04.569 --> 01:21:06.989
then, you know, like jab, cross, uppercut with

01:21:06.989 --> 01:21:09.510
his hands as well. So it reminded me a lot of

01:21:09.510 --> 01:21:12.609
that watching you train. I mean, I don't know.

01:21:12.609 --> 01:21:14.569
I can't even remember his name, but I saw there's

01:21:14.569 --> 01:21:18.729
actually a documentary on Netflix. It's a black

01:21:18.729 --> 01:21:22.369
guy. I think he's from America, I think. And

01:21:22.369 --> 01:21:23.930
he does wrestling. Have you seen him? He's got

01:21:23.930 --> 01:21:28.659
no legs. Yes. Yeah. Big Z. Yeah. Yeah, that's

01:21:28.659 --> 01:21:31.260
his name. It's incredible. Yeah, actually, he's

01:21:31.260 --> 01:21:32.779
one of the people I'll probably try and get to

01:21:32.779 --> 01:21:34.600
one day on here. But yeah, I mean, it's not even

01:21:34.600 --> 01:21:37.560
like, you know, below groin. I mean, he stops

01:21:37.560 --> 01:21:39.199
kind of at the belly button almost, doesn't he?

01:21:39.779 --> 01:21:42.039
Yeah, I think he looks like he's got no hips,

01:21:42.039 --> 01:21:45.260
but he has hips and just literally no legs. Yeah,

01:21:45.279 --> 01:21:47.600
yeah, it's amazing. So that's it. So I just want

01:21:47.600 --> 01:21:49.920
to ask you as well, from the physical side specifically,

01:21:50.479 --> 01:21:53.819
you know, there's no good time for this to happen

01:21:53.819 --> 01:21:56.199
to you, to your own personal journey. However...

01:21:56.829 --> 01:22:01.470
In the sports exercise community, this is a great,

01:22:01.529 --> 01:22:04.310
great time for adaptive athletes. I think sadly,

01:22:04.369 --> 01:22:06.670
that's probably a lot to do with so many of the

01:22:06.670 --> 01:22:11.390
IED, you know, the patients that we've had come

01:22:11.390 --> 01:22:15.619
back from the Middle East. Did you... when you

01:22:15.619 --> 01:22:17.539
actually got hurt fine there was there were there

01:22:17.539 --> 01:22:20.239
were some great resources because of that to

01:22:20.239 --> 01:22:23.020
to work around for example i think i saw the

01:22:23.020 --> 01:22:25.560
the picture of you doing the one -armed um jump

01:22:25.560 --> 01:22:28.359
rope that you see a lot in the games now oh yeah

01:22:28.359 --> 01:22:32.899
that actually my husband found on social media

01:22:32.899 --> 01:22:35.960
on instagram so there's a few great one -armed

01:22:35.960 --> 01:22:38.060
people to follow on instagram that he followed

01:22:38.060 --> 01:22:40.239
and there's this one guy i don't actually know

01:22:40.239 --> 01:22:43.949
his name but um He's great in that rope. He does

01:22:43.949 --> 01:22:46.750
double jumps. He's just double jumping the whole

01:22:46.750 --> 01:22:51.189
time. It's incredible. My husband contacted him

01:22:51.189 --> 01:22:52.810
and said, where did you get that cool rope from?

01:22:53.250 --> 01:22:56.810
First, we made a DIY one, which was pretty sketchy.

01:22:57.689 --> 01:23:02.569
The pole that we got from the shop and then put

01:23:02.569 --> 01:23:08.310
a tie jump rope onto it. Then he got one from

01:23:08.310 --> 01:23:10.640
the guy in the States. And so there is a lot

01:23:10.640 --> 01:23:13.899
of that opening up. And actually, like the weird

01:23:13.899 --> 01:23:16.199
thing is I've started modeling again, believe

01:23:16.199 --> 01:23:19.319
it or not. No, that's brilliant. That whole industry

01:23:19.319 --> 01:23:21.979
has really opened up. A lot of the, you know,

01:23:22.000 --> 01:23:24.460
even I don't really go into shops that much,

01:23:24.539 --> 01:23:26.460
but I do a lot of online shopping, even clothes.

01:23:26.859 --> 01:23:29.260
So you look at a lot of these websites now, it's

01:23:29.260 --> 01:23:33.119
all like really trying to open themselves up.

01:23:33.199 --> 01:23:35.699
There's a lot of, you know, slim people and overweight

01:23:35.699 --> 01:23:41.729
people, people with skin problems. Oh, what do

01:23:41.729 --> 01:23:47.590
people when they've, is it albinism? Oh yeah,

01:23:47.670 --> 01:23:52.350
the albinos. Yes, albinos, sorry. Yeah, people

01:23:52.350 --> 01:23:55.229
and lots of people with, you know, limb differences.

01:23:55.670 --> 01:23:58.409
And we see a lot of that nowadays. So that's

01:23:58.409 --> 01:24:00.149
worked out pretty well for me. So I've done a

01:24:00.149 --> 01:24:02.810
little bit of modeling and the other day I did

01:24:02.810 --> 01:24:08.229
a bit of acting. And what was that in? That was

01:24:08.229 --> 01:24:12.010
just for a TV commercial for the UK, for the

01:24:12.010 --> 01:24:16.729
census for the UK. I had to do a one -armed pull

01:24:16.729 --> 01:24:20.529
-up. Brilliant. Like I said, I've had so many

01:24:20.529 --> 01:24:22.590
different people on here that have lost limbs

01:24:22.590 --> 01:24:26.810
from a variety of reasons. It reminded me of

01:24:26.810 --> 01:24:28.609
one guy, Mitch Dreyer, who was actually my very

01:24:28.609 --> 01:24:30.670
first guest on this podcast. He was a fireman

01:24:30.670 --> 01:24:34.220
where a building collapsed on him. and he got

01:24:34.220 --> 01:24:36.779
burnt so horrendously, he lost one arm. And I

01:24:36.779 --> 01:24:40.039
met him at an Ido Portal workshop, and he was

01:24:40.039 --> 01:24:41.260
one of the only people in the room that could

01:24:41.260 --> 01:24:43.420
do just what you said, a one -arm pull -up. So,

01:24:43.420 --> 01:24:45.899
you know, it's funny. People look at a person

01:24:45.899 --> 01:24:47.760
and be like, oh, they've got a disability. No,

01:24:47.819 --> 01:24:50.680
they've just found a way to get even stronger

01:24:50.680 --> 01:24:53.479
with what they've got left. Yeah, yeah, that's

01:24:53.479 --> 01:24:56.960
true. Right. Well, then, speaking of the healing,

01:24:57.060 --> 01:24:59.659
I know, I mean, obviously, this mental journey

01:24:59.659 --> 01:25:03.680
has been very tough for you. An area that I'm

01:25:03.680 --> 01:25:06.539
actually about to talk about even in more depth

01:25:06.539 --> 01:25:08.960
in a few weeks on this show is equine therapy.

01:25:09.479 --> 01:25:11.880
So you've kind of traded out the motorbike for

01:25:11.880 --> 01:25:13.779
the horse. So I'd love to hear about your journey

01:25:13.779 --> 01:25:16.880
into that. Well, actually, I work a little bit.

01:25:16.880 --> 01:25:20.380
I just literally help somebody out with some

01:25:20.380 --> 01:25:25.439
equine therapy. It's every Monday, but sometimes

01:25:25.439 --> 01:25:29.439
only once a month. I'm at the horse school, horse

01:25:29.439 --> 01:25:32.670
riding school that I ride at. And they do equine

01:25:32.670 --> 01:25:37.409
therapy with people with dementia and sometimes

01:25:37.409 --> 01:25:39.909
just old people and sometimes severely handicapped

01:25:39.909 --> 01:25:42.449
people. And we just get them to come over and

01:25:42.449 --> 01:25:45.529
we give them proper British stuff like tea and

01:25:45.529 --> 01:25:52.289
cake or cookies and sometimes scones. And, yeah,

01:25:52.409 --> 01:25:54.430
then we bring out some horses, you know, that

01:25:54.430 --> 01:25:59.449
are really good with people. And some of them

01:25:59.449 --> 01:26:01.840
are really... They just want to look them fast

01:26:01.840 --> 01:26:04.920
and really love to touch them and rub them on

01:26:04.920 --> 01:26:07.600
the noses. Some of them even that can walk, they'll

01:26:07.600 --> 01:26:10.380
sort of walk them around. It's just such a nice

01:26:10.380 --> 01:26:12.520
day for them to get out and do something different,

01:26:12.579 --> 01:26:15.079
be outside and see the horses. They all love

01:26:15.079 --> 01:26:18.680
telling the story of 1940 when they used to ride

01:26:18.680 --> 01:26:21.600
horses. And some of them bring these amazing

01:26:21.600 --> 01:26:24.000
photographs when they're still in side saddle

01:26:24.000 --> 01:26:27.460
and long dresses. So funny. Amazing. Yeah, when

01:26:27.460 --> 01:26:29.560
you see that, you know, the healing power of

01:26:29.560 --> 01:26:33.699
dogs, of horses, and even some people that dive,

01:26:33.739 --> 01:26:36.359
they're able to swim with mammals in the ocean.

01:26:36.380 --> 01:26:40.220
But there is such a powerful connection between,

01:26:40.279 --> 01:26:42.819
you know, a healing animal and a person who's

01:26:42.819 --> 01:26:46.439
looking to be healed. Yeah, I've always loved

01:26:46.439 --> 01:26:51.739
animals, animals of any type, except insects.

01:26:52.020 --> 01:26:55.460
I don't like insects. If you grew up in Africa,

01:26:55.600 --> 01:26:56.979
there's probably some pretty hateful insects

01:26:56.979 --> 01:27:03.239
there. They're really cool. I've got two Maine

01:27:03.239 --> 01:27:08.239
Coon cats and I love them so much. They give

01:27:08.239 --> 01:27:12.399
me so much joy in every day. It's not a day that

01:27:12.399 --> 01:27:14.899
don't make me really laugh out loud. It's cool.

01:27:15.819 --> 01:27:18.300
Well, with the horses, have you seen a documentary

01:27:18.300 --> 01:27:24.529
called Buck? B -U -C -K. I've either seen it

01:27:24.529 --> 01:27:28.109
or I've seen the trailer, but I've definitely

01:27:28.109 --> 01:27:31.470
seen something about it. Okay. Yeah, so it's

01:27:31.470 --> 01:27:34.289
about basically one of the, I mean, it's not

01:27:34.289 --> 01:27:37.170
just one guy, but one of the horse whisperers.

01:27:37.170 --> 01:27:42.050
And his name is Buck Branaman. And when he was

01:27:42.050 --> 01:27:45.270
very young, he was in a very abusive household.

01:27:45.369 --> 01:27:48.529
His father made him and his brother be like performing

01:27:48.529 --> 01:27:51.289
cowboys that were on TV doing trick lasso work.

01:27:52.659 --> 01:27:55.960
And, you know, he ended up getting away from

01:27:55.960 --> 01:27:58.899
his father and becoming this incredible horseman.

01:27:58.939 --> 01:28:01.439
And that horse, you know, relationship with the

01:28:01.439 --> 01:28:04.439
horse basically was his healing. And then now

01:28:04.439 --> 01:28:07.279
he's this incredible person that's showing these

01:28:07.279 --> 01:28:10.060
riders, these horse owners that, you know, a

01:28:10.060 --> 01:28:11.439
lot of the problems they're having with their

01:28:11.439 --> 01:28:13.949
horses because of the way they're... treating

01:28:13.949 --> 01:28:15.550
the horse or the way they're they're dealing

01:28:15.550 --> 01:28:18.850
with their own anger um and so he's i'm actually

01:28:18.850 --> 01:28:21.029
going to georgia next month to sit down with

01:28:21.029 --> 01:28:23.170
him so that's going to be a fascinating thing

01:28:23.170 --> 01:28:25.109
because i mean not only did he heal but he ended

01:28:25.109 --> 01:28:26.829
up being a teacher for all these other people

01:28:26.829 --> 01:28:31.109
as well that's cool yeah i'm actually going doing

01:28:31.109 --> 01:28:37.029
a i was supposed to do a course in um june but

01:28:37.029 --> 01:28:39.470
then i then i ended up having to have an operation

01:28:39.470 --> 01:28:43.819
which ended up postponing at last minute So I

01:28:43.819 --> 01:28:48.279
postponed the course as well, but the course

01:28:48.279 --> 01:28:50.859
is now opening in September. And that's a course

01:28:50.859 --> 01:28:53.220
on natural horsemanship, which I'm sure the guy

01:28:53.220 --> 01:28:56.760
knows or understands or does himself. And that's

01:28:56.760 --> 01:29:00.840
just a really natural way of either healing horses

01:29:00.840 --> 01:29:04.479
that have problems or just training horses. It's

01:29:04.479 --> 01:29:06.680
really beautiful. It's amazing. I love it. I'm

01:29:06.680 --> 01:29:09.010
looking forward to them. Yeah, that sounds exactly

01:29:09.010 --> 01:29:10.729
what it is. And are you able to ride yourself?

01:29:10.989 --> 01:29:12.689
Because it seems like it would be a lot easier

01:29:12.689 --> 01:29:16.569
to ride a well -trained horse than trying to

01:29:16.569 --> 01:29:21.329
navigate a dirt bike. Yeah, definitely. Because

01:29:21.329 --> 01:29:24.630
they have their own minds and their own moods.

01:29:24.630 --> 01:29:27.189
You know what horses are like. It's not just

01:29:27.189 --> 01:29:32.270
throttle on or throttle off. But I love it. Yeah,

01:29:32.270 --> 01:29:35.710
I definitely ride twice a week. And I love it

01:29:35.710 --> 01:29:39.319
every time. These 25 horses we ride, we pretty

01:29:39.319 --> 01:29:42.319
much ride a different horse every time. And every

01:29:42.319 --> 01:29:44.640
time you climb even on the same horse, it's different.

01:29:44.739 --> 01:29:46.460
You've got to feel how they are on that day,

01:29:46.500 --> 01:29:49.079
what mood they're on, depending on the weather,

01:29:49.140 --> 01:29:52.079
what's going on around them. So many things can

01:29:52.079 --> 01:29:55.979
make it different. But I absolutely love it.

01:29:56.000 --> 01:29:58.340
I love the personalities and the characters of

01:29:58.340 --> 01:30:01.000
each horse. Brilliant. All right, well, I want

01:30:01.000 --> 01:30:02.659
to transition to some closing questions to be

01:30:02.659 --> 01:30:05.640
mindful of your time. But the first thing that

01:30:05.640 --> 01:30:08.100
I normally ask about people, recommend a book,

01:30:08.159 --> 01:30:10.760
but I know that you're in the process of writing

01:30:10.760 --> 01:30:13.800
a biography. Is that right? Well, I'm not writing

01:30:13.800 --> 01:30:18.060
one because I couldn't write anything. There's

01:30:18.060 --> 01:30:20.279
a writer, she's from New York, her name is Shannon,

01:30:20.439 --> 01:30:23.779
Shannon Nixon. She approached me some while ago.

01:30:23.819 --> 01:30:26.060
She actually, I don't know where she was. about

01:30:26.060 --> 01:30:28.619
me from but she she actually trains Muay Thai

01:30:28.619 --> 01:30:31.960
she loves it she had one fight as well and she

01:30:31.960 --> 01:30:35.180
she asked me if she could she was interested

01:30:35.180 --> 01:30:38.359
in writing a biography on me so I was like yeah

01:30:38.359 --> 01:30:40.279
that sounds amazing so we've been working together

01:30:40.279 --> 01:30:43.039
I don't know how long now maybe two years I think

01:30:43.039 --> 01:30:46.640
or a year I don't know but uh we just been we

01:30:46.640 --> 01:30:51.539
just spent hours talking um over Skype and she's

01:30:51.539 --> 01:30:54.340
obviously learned pretty much my entire life

01:30:55.640 --> 01:30:57.760
in the last couple of years. So she's written

01:30:57.760 --> 01:31:00.699
the book. I don't know when it's coming out quite

01:31:00.699 --> 01:31:04.560
yet. It is almost ready. There's just a few things,

01:31:04.619 --> 01:31:08.779
legal stuff that we're waiting on because we

01:31:08.779 --> 01:31:11.060
want to obviously include all the details of

01:31:11.060 --> 01:31:14.020
the accidents and stuff. So it just depends on,

01:31:14.119 --> 01:31:16.500
we've got to wait for a few legal things so that

01:31:16.500 --> 01:31:19.260
we're allowed to incorporate all of the details.

01:31:21.070 --> 01:31:22.609
Brilliant. Well, yeah, let me know as soon as

01:31:22.609 --> 01:31:24.390
it does and I'll definitely post it about it

01:31:24.390 --> 01:31:25.710
here. And I'm sure people listening and wondering

01:31:25.710 --> 01:31:28.649
as well. I know after the accident, you know,

01:31:28.649 --> 01:31:32.390
there was the question of, you know, who made

01:31:32.390 --> 01:31:35.449
the mistakes and at least some sort of compensation.

01:31:36.050 --> 01:31:38.470
Have you able to secure that yet or is that still

01:31:38.470 --> 01:31:43.810
in the air? That's a really dark, dirty, disgraceful

01:31:43.810 --> 01:31:48.729
situation. All those details will be in the book.

01:31:49.770 --> 01:31:53.970
He'd be also busy shooting a documentary. Also

01:31:53.970 --> 01:31:55.810
another guy from the States, he approached me.

01:31:55.890 --> 01:31:58.010
I shot actually another documentary with him

01:31:58.010 --> 01:32:00.649
about stunts. And then he wanted to do a story

01:32:00.649 --> 01:32:03.090
on just myself. So we've been doing that. And

01:32:03.090 --> 01:32:05.390
he's also in post -production at the moment.

01:32:05.590 --> 01:32:07.829
So those will probably come out more or less

01:32:07.829 --> 01:32:09.989
the same time, I think. Brilliant. Well, yeah,

01:32:09.989 --> 01:32:11.869
let me know and I will definitely make sure that

01:32:11.869 --> 01:32:14.439
the audience knows about those as well. All right.

01:32:14.500 --> 01:32:17.319
So then, as I said, so is there a book that someone

01:32:17.319 --> 01:32:19.220
else has written that you love to recommend?

01:32:19.220 --> 01:32:21.279
It can be about what we talked about today or

01:32:21.279 --> 01:32:24.260
something completely different. Well, I read

01:32:24.260 --> 01:32:28.500
a lot of books, but I generally, pretty much

01:32:28.500 --> 01:32:33.720
all the time, I only read Buddhist books. So

01:32:33.720 --> 01:32:35.939
I don't know if that would, I recommend those

01:32:35.939 --> 01:32:38.260
to the general public. Yeah, no, absolutely.

01:32:38.720 --> 01:32:40.939
All right. And then what about a film? Do you

01:32:40.939 --> 01:32:44.899
have a favorite film? Well, I think one of my

01:32:44.899 --> 01:32:46.840
favorites is still Seven Years in Tibet because

01:32:46.840 --> 01:32:51.260
I love it, although it's old now. I don't know.

01:32:51.979 --> 01:32:54.779
I just love Game of Thrones. That's it for me.

01:32:54.800 --> 01:32:56.640
I absolutely love Game of Thrones. I recommend

01:32:56.640 --> 01:32:59.720
anybody to watch that. It's got nothing to do

01:32:59.720 --> 01:33:01.680
with what we talked about, but it is good. Yeah,

01:33:01.699 --> 01:33:03.659
no, it seems like most people have seen it. I'm

01:33:03.659 --> 01:33:04.880
one of the few that haven't, but we're going

01:33:04.880 --> 01:33:07.579
to binge on it at one point. Pay for the HBO.

01:33:08.520 --> 01:33:11.560
It's so good. All right, what about a documentary?

01:33:11.579 --> 01:33:14.779
Do you have a documentary that you love? Hmm.

01:33:18.800 --> 01:33:23.619
Don't know. I'm actually not, you know, it's

01:33:23.619 --> 01:33:25.760
a bit weird, but I'm not actually that into documentaries.

01:33:25.899 --> 01:33:28.279
Sometimes I do. My husband loves documentaries,

01:33:28.579 --> 01:33:31.840
but I don't like watch them that much because

01:33:31.840 --> 01:33:35.960
most documentaries that you watch are made to

01:33:35.960 --> 01:33:41.729
sort of, they're intended to. invokes some sort

01:33:41.729 --> 01:33:44.590
of feeling, you know, of you. And a lot of them

01:33:44.590 --> 01:33:47.630
is like about a sad situation or a crazy situation.

01:33:47.850 --> 01:33:52.729
So it invokes a lot of feelings of you thinking,

01:33:52.810 --> 01:33:55.470
oh, what the fuck? Well, that's crazy. You know?

01:33:55.670 --> 01:33:58.890
Yeah. I tend to stick away from that. I just

01:33:58.890 --> 01:34:01.550
like good old films where it's about a story

01:34:01.550 --> 01:34:03.630
that's nothing like real life and you feel good

01:34:03.630 --> 01:34:05.449
at the end. All right. Well, we did talk about

01:34:05.449 --> 01:34:08.210
Big Z's documentary, so I can pop that into the

01:34:08.210 --> 01:34:10.789
rest of it. Brilliant. All right, so the next

01:34:10.789 --> 01:34:12.989
question, is there a person that you would recommend

01:34:12.989 --> 01:34:16.250
to come on this podcast as a guest to speak to

01:34:16.250 --> 01:34:18.229
the first responders and military of the world?

01:34:19.050 --> 01:34:21.609
And again, it doesn't have to be specific to

01:34:21.609 --> 01:34:23.609
that community. It can be anyone, stunt world,

01:34:23.810 --> 01:34:30.029
anyone. No, don't know. Quite a cool stunt performer

01:34:30.029 --> 01:34:31.930
if you're interested in female stunt performers.

01:34:32.449 --> 01:34:34.409
There's a girl, she's from the States, Jessie

01:34:34.409 --> 01:34:37.399
Graff. Do you know her? No, I don't. She's a

01:34:37.399 --> 01:34:39.539
stunt performer, a good stunt performer, and

01:34:39.539 --> 01:34:44.380
she's also really well -known for being a ninja

01:34:44.380 --> 01:34:47.239
warrior. I think she won last year. Oh, okay.

01:34:47.500 --> 01:34:50.319
Brilliant. That's so cool, yeah. She looks like

01:34:50.319 --> 01:34:51.979
I've never met her. She looks like a really nice

01:34:51.979 --> 01:34:55.680
girl and super fit. I love watching your Instagram

01:34:55.680 --> 01:34:58.460
stuff because her fitness is just on another

01:34:58.460 --> 01:35:01.880
level. It's amazing. Yeah, that is. Absolutely.

01:35:02.060 --> 01:35:03.279
All right, well, I have to look her up. Thank

01:35:03.279 --> 01:35:05.859
you. All right, so the very last thing before

01:35:05.859 --> 01:35:07.640
we talk about where people can find you online,

01:35:07.939 --> 01:35:11.720
what do you do to decompress? Well, I normally

01:35:11.720 --> 01:35:15.479
meditate every morning for about half an hour,

01:35:15.520 --> 01:35:18.000
45 minutes, an hour, depending on how I'm feeling.

01:35:18.239 --> 01:35:20.579
And that sort of gives me a good start for the

01:35:20.579 --> 01:35:24.560
day and just sort of calm my mind down and focus

01:35:24.560 --> 01:35:28.399
on what's going on inside of me. I always love

01:35:28.399 --> 01:35:31.180
to do sports, especially horse riding, to decompress

01:35:31.180 --> 01:35:33.840
in any way. If ever I'm stressed and I know I've

01:35:33.840 --> 01:35:36.319
got a horse riding session, I relax because I

01:35:36.319 --> 01:35:41.260
know that I feel better afterwards. Yeah, and

01:35:41.260 --> 01:35:43.859
sometimes even watching films is good. If you've

01:35:43.859 --> 01:35:45.659
got something you can't stop thinking about or

01:35:45.659 --> 01:35:48.180
stressed about, sometimes it's just good to watch

01:35:48.180 --> 01:35:50.279
a film and you completely don't think about it.

01:35:50.680 --> 01:35:53.359
And by the end of it, you know, you're not so

01:35:53.359 --> 01:35:57.460
stressed about it. Yeah, absolutely. I agree.

01:35:58.119 --> 01:36:00.020
All right, so then the very last question then,

01:36:00.079 --> 01:36:02.270
if people want to... find out about you online

01:36:02.270 --> 01:36:04.270
or on social media, where are the best places

01:36:04.270 --> 01:36:08.270
to go? Well, I'm not on Facebook. I'm actually

01:36:08.270 --> 01:36:11.550
not a huge social media fan. I'm a little old

01:36:11.550 --> 01:36:13.289
school. I think I just want to move to a farm

01:36:13.289 --> 01:36:17.149
and completely go off the internet and raise

01:36:17.149 --> 01:36:21.510
some sheep and some horses. I'm still on Instagram.

01:36:21.930 --> 01:36:25.430
My name's Olivia the Bandit because I'm a one

01:36:25.430 --> 01:36:29.569
-armed bandit. Yeah, and that's about it really.

01:36:30.280 --> 01:36:33.520
It's just Instagram. And is it Olivia biography

01:36:33.520 --> 01:36:36.720
is the one that's attached to the book? Is that

01:36:36.720 --> 01:36:41.560
right? Yeah, that's it. Olivia biography. All

01:36:41.560 --> 01:36:43.000
right. Well, I just want to say thank you so

01:36:43.000 --> 01:36:44.619
much. You've been so generous with your time.

01:36:44.739 --> 01:36:46.739
And, you know, I know like a lot of people I

01:36:46.739 --> 01:36:49.340
have on here, I know it's not easy to relive

01:36:49.340 --> 01:36:51.920
and recount, you know, some of the more challenging

01:36:51.920 --> 01:36:55.689
parts of your story. But it's just so amazing

01:36:55.689 --> 01:36:58.670
to watch you grow every day physically, you know,

01:36:58.670 --> 01:37:01.470
and I'm sure mentally as well from an injury

01:37:01.470 --> 01:37:04.750
that, you know, I think would have killed many

01:37:04.750 --> 01:37:06.970
people. And then, you know, psychologically would

01:37:06.970 --> 01:37:09.670
have, you know, stopped them from growing as

01:37:09.670 --> 01:37:11.590
well. So I just really, really appreciate you

01:37:11.590 --> 01:37:13.170
taking the time. Thank you.