WEBVTT

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Welcome to the Behind the Shield podcast. As

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always, my name is James Geering, and this week

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it is my absolute honor to welcome back onto

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the show former SpaceX engineer and founder of

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Levels, Josh Clemente. Now in this second conversation,

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we discuss a host of topics from the American

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obesity crisis, burnout in healthcare providers,

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the ripple effect of the pandemic. how AI is

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bringing exciting technology to the world of

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healthcare, finding autonomy in your own health

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journey through levels, and so much more. Now,

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before we get to this incredible conversation,

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as I say every week, please just take a moment.

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Go to whichever app you listen to this on, subscribe

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to the show, leave feedback, and leave a rating.

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Every single five -star rating truly does elevate

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this podcast, therefore making it easier for

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others to find. And this is a free library of

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well over 1 ,100 episodes now. So all I ask in

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return is that you help share these incredible

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men and women's stories so I can get them to

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every single person on planet Earth who needs

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to hear them. So with that being said, I welcome

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back onto the show... Josh Clemente. Enjoy. Well,

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Josh, I want to start by saying... Welcome back

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to the Behind the Shield podcast. You are my

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guest on episode 381, which I looked up. It looked

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like it was towards the end of 2020. So very

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different time when we were sitting down last

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time, I'm sure. So firstly, I just want to welcome

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you back onto the show. Well, thanks a ton, James.

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It's really awesome to be back on and looking

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forward to the conversation. So as an icebreaker,

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and I love revisiting COVID or the pandemic for

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the simple reason that no matter what... people's

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kind of perspective was at that time. It's pretty,

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you know, glaring that at the end of it, everyone

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was like, well, I don't want to talk about it

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anymore. And I think that's such a tragedy because

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there were so many lessons that we needed to

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learn from it. So firstly, just through your

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personal perspective, talk to me about, you know,

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going through that and then emerging on the other

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side. You know, there's some sort of like social

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amnesia that seems to have kicked in where it's

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almost hard for me to remember. that time period

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to be honest and uh it became well it was it

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was obviously tremendously difficult i the things

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that changed my life i moved cross country just

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prior to the to the covid pandemic and um i was

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had just started levels in 2019 late 2019 and

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so we were only a few months into this giant

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initiative and um and so the first you know i

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guess three four depending on how long you think

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the pandemic went uh the first few years of this

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was in the context of COVID. And it changed everything

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about business dynamics, the shift to remote

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work, which, you know, I don't naturally fit,

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I think, psychologically into a remote environment.

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It can be, I'll just say, I remember a huge sense

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of loneliness and kind of this sense that each

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day, despite feeling like I was working while

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my laptop was open. I would close it and I would

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look around and it would kind of be like I was

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just in virtual reality. And that's what life

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felt like. It felt like we were all in a virtual

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reality trying to emulate life, but actually

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it wasn't really happening. And I think that's

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why the time dilation happened. And it's hard

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to remember those years because everything was

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so the same. We were all. I don't know, hiding

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away and, or a lot of people were very difficult

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to have a life, especially in the Philadelphia

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area, which was quite aggressive about the, the,

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uh, protocols. Um, I got married during that

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time period, which, you know, in retrospect,

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we were able to, we were able to get a wedding

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in between these two spikes where we were allowed

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to have a pretty normal gathering without, you

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know, there weren't really limitations on the

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number of guests. So we got very lucky, um, in

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the timing, but I just think about the. there

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were many people who didn't join because they

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didn't want to be a part of that gathering because

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they were concerned. And so there's just a lot

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of loss and a lot of things that, although I'm

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very happy that I got to experience those things,

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certainly life was different in ways that I don't

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even think I can quantify. You know, it's just,

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it's, yeah. How do you quantify what was different

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about life when you can only live the experience

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that you had? Yeah. And, you know, a lot of time.

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away from family, unfortunately, because we were

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all spread out and traveling was difficult. And

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I think that was probably the worst part of all.

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Well, I've said this, you know, even right in

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the middle of it, the biggest tragedy to me is

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if you really wrote down on a piece of paper,

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how could you make people more likely to get

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COVID or have a bad experience? It's exactly

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what happened. Okay. So I want you to stay in

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your house. I don't want you to see any of your

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friends and family. Don't exercise. get fast

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food delivered to your house and binge watch

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Tiger King. It's pretty much, you know, if you

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want to make people vulnerable, it's what we

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did. So it's important that we then reflect and

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go, what was done well, what was done poorly,

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the demonizing. you know, flat demonizing of

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the vaccine also poorly because I've had people

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in ICUs that said, yeah, the vaccinated patients

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had a much better outcome usually. Now, these

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are people with pre -existing conditions. So

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that's a whole conversation in itself. But, you

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know, it was this kind of World War I trench

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mentality rather than stand in the middle and

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then what can we take away? So through your eyes,

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you know, what are the takeaways that we should

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be reflecting on now as we stand here in 2025?

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I love your perspective there, being nuanced

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about it, because there's a lot of nuance. I

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think the difficult thing for me was that, and

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this is actually a problem that I have with the

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healthcare system, generally speaking, is that

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we use a public health lens to make specific

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individual recommendations. What I mean by that

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is that we look at the whole population and we

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do a bunch of statistics and math on it. And

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we say, you know, given... the highest probability

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of transmission, which often, in this case, very

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often, was in people who had pre -existing conditions

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and comorbidities, given their likelihood of

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a high -risk infection, we need to address everyone

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as though they are that person. And we need to

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enforce protocols as though everyone is that

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person. And it's this lowest common denominator

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thinking. And I don't mean that to say that the

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people who have pre -existing conditions don't

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matter. It's that... We were compromising by

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telling everyone to act as though they had pre

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-existing conditions. We were compromising everyone

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who was not in that situation because we were

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effectively putting people on bed rest. You know,

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if you look at the studies on, there are some

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fascinating studies. There was one, I think it

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was in Sweden, and they took a rowing team, young

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collegiate athletes who were at their peak, and

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put them on forced bed rest for, I think it was

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only one to two weeks. And they followed the

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subset of that group who were on bed rest versus

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those that kept their normal routines had, for

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the rest of their lives, diminished health. And

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so they had a higher predisposition for long

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-term health disorders, including diabetes, heart

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disease, et cetera. And this has been seen for

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women who are pregnant, who have to go on bed

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rest, who have high -risk pregnancy. We see the

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same thing. Long -term, their health outcomes

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are completely affected. The point there is we

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were essentially doing something like that to

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very healthy people, which caused a reduction

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in your immune response. It caused like the reduction

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in emotional health and social health. And we

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were doing that as though because we took a public

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health lens and treated, we tried to like cram

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everyone into a single box and say, how should

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the highest risk person respond? And I think

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that is a huge failure. And when I extrapolate

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that out to how we treat healthcare generally.

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We use public health methodology, lowest common

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denominator methodology all the time. And we

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give one size fits all recommendations that do

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not help the individual decide what I should

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do given my own personal health state today,

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who I actually am, not who the average general

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person out there is. And we've got to get much

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more nuanced about these things. And that's kind

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of like what I care most about. There was plenty

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of research, plenty of evidence at the time when

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COVID was roaring. That people with metabolic

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conditions and the elderly were the ones who

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were most at risk. And the mandate for everyone

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else should have been improve your metabolic

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health, improve your immune response, improve

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your strength, add muscle, be resilient. That's

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what you should be doing right now. Not hiding

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in your room in the dark, eating fast food. Absolutely.

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I think that was what was a huge disservice when

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we reflect back now is that there were so many

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of us that would have been more than happy to

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go out there and keep the world moving and allow

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the ones that are vulnerable to shelter in place.

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And even our children, we realized it was actually

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not really detrimental to our children unless,

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again, there's something preexisting that's going

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to affect the immune system. And absolutely,

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let's keep them somewhere safe as well. You know,

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let the kids go back to school, let the people

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who, you know, are keeping the country running,

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keep the country running. But instead, we saw

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these vaccine mandates and terminations and,

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you know, of fit first responders. So, yeah,

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it was it was such a disservice. And I think

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one of the things I've talked about this, there

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was a really horrendous incident in my son's

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middle school. My son was the victim of it. And

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it just destroyed trust in. because it was multiple

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kids it was exposed to, in these children saying,

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I'm struggling. They just didn't even want to

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put their hand up anymore because of what was

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happening. It was basically a 72 -hour psych

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hold of any of these kids that were saying, hey,

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I need some help. Not I'm going to shoot up the

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school, not I'm going to take my own life, just

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I'm struggling. And I feel the same as we come

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out of COVID. I think it was kind of... The response

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to the murder of the UnitedHealthcare CEO really

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showed that underlying feeling of distrust. And

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I feel that the kind of cracks are showing now.

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So I think, you know, what you're talking about

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really is so pertinent, especially when you think

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70 % of the country is obese or overweight, over

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40 % is obese. If you're taking that median now,

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what does that mean if you're... you know, an

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active, you know, athletic man or woman, like

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your healthcare is now being projected by 70

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% sickness. So you're absolutely right. If you're

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taking median statistics, it's completely skewed

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from where we actually need to be. Absolutely.

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Yeah. We, we don't have, I think one of the most

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unfortunate aspects of modern healthcare is that

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we do not have any aspirational or optimistic

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view. It's It's all about preservation of a ticking

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heart in the face of inevitable disease. It's

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really like, let's wait and watch and look for

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symptoms and eventually you'll get them and then

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we'll eventually put you on some sort of last

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line defense. And what we should have done in

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the pandemic is a microcosm of what we have to

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do in regular life, which is to say, here's where

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you are, here is what optimal looks like, and

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here is how you get to optimal. And that is not

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going to be an injection. It's not going to be

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a pill. In most cases, it's going to be a lot

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of small behaviors that compound over long time

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periods that everyone is held accountable to

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at the individual level because your doctor can't

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keep you safe. You are the one, each of us individually

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should feel like we are responsible for maintaining

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our health. You know, I controversially say doctors

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should not, today, should not be treating chronic

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illness. Right now, 93 % of American adults have

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at least one symptom of metabolic disorder. That

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doesn't mean that they have some sort of disease

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just yet, but they are clearly trending in that

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direction. And that burden on the healthcare

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system is destroying the system. It cannot sustain

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it. And so doctors need to stop. They need to

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reflect back to individuals. Here is where you

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are. These are the actions you're taking each

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day that affect your health status. And here's

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how you can improve them. Here are the tools

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that you need. And we need an industry to step

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up and provide those tools. But at the end of

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the day, it's the individual's responsibility

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to know their health state, to know the factors

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involved, and to take action. And I think we

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just completely abstract that away for some reason.

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We don't want people to feel a sense of responsibility.

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I'm not exactly sure all the incentives. There's

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a bunch. But at the end of the day, it's very

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rare for people to feel like they're in. they

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are actually in control and empowered over their

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health. It seems like chronic disease just happens

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to you. There's nothing you can do about it.

00:12:59.990 --> 00:13:01.850
And when that does, get your doctor to give you

00:13:01.850 --> 00:13:04.149
the right prescriptions. And COVID was unfortunately

00:13:04.149 --> 00:13:06.809
an accelerated microcosm of that exact dynamic.

00:13:08.990 --> 00:13:13.889
What impact do you think the prescription drug

00:13:13.889 --> 00:13:16.490
television commercials has on this? Because we're

00:13:16.490 --> 00:13:18.889
one of only two countries in the world, us and

00:13:18.889 --> 00:13:21.190
New Zealand, that even allow advertising for

00:13:21.190 --> 00:13:25.600
pharmaceuticals on television. That is such a,

00:13:25.600 --> 00:13:28.000
it's such a deep question and one that I would

00:13:28.000 --> 00:13:30.139
absolutely love to have a control to look at

00:13:30.139 --> 00:13:34.220
because my instinct. So I've gone through phases

00:13:34.220 --> 00:13:37.320
in terms of how I think about advertising. There

00:13:37.320 --> 00:13:39.240
was a time in my life when I thought advertising

00:13:39.240 --> 00:13:40.940
doesn't work. You know, I actually, in fact,

00:13:41.059 --> 00:13:44.480
I get, I get, I tune out any sort of advertisement.

00:13:44.620 --> 00:13:46.440
When I see billboards, it just makes me mad.

00:13:46.539 --> 00:13:48.620
I don't have any desire to go purchase that thing.

00:13:48.679 --> 00:13:50.480
It's just like, it's, it's out there. It's garish.

00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:53.779
It's ugly. It's annoying. I want to fast forward

00:13:53.779 --> 00:13:55.639
through them. How can this possibly be actually

00:13:55.639 --> 00:13:58.860
converting people into customers? As I've gotten

00:13:58.860 --> 00:14:02.559
deeper into business and I've started to better

00:14:02.559 --> 00:14:06.759
understand the pervasive, repetitive messaging

00:14:06.759 --> 00:14:09.539
and the effect that it has on people's behavior,

00:14:09.840 --> 00:14:14.139
it is obvious that we are all a product in and

00:14:14.139 --> 00:14:17.799
of itself of the advertising system, what we

00:14:17.799 --> 00:14:21.480
buy, how we run our lives. It is a downstream

00:14:21.480 --> 00:14:24.179
consequence of what we're told matters and what

00:14:24.179 --> 00:14:26.840
our friends purchase and what we see. And whether

00:14:26.840 --> 00:14:30.000
it's you or somebody in your circle who is prone

00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:32.259
to advertising, it eventually makes it into your

00:14:32.259 --> 00:14:35.860
home, bottom line. And there's no possible way

00:14:35.860 --> 00:14:40.259
that pharmaceutical advertising is not mass affecting

00:14:40.259 --> 00:14:44.279
the psychology of healthcare. When you are watching

00:14:44.279 --> 00:14:46.220
TV, even if it's in the background subconsciously,

00:14:46.220 --> 00:14:49.720
when you're hearing that you know, chronic illness

00:14:49.720 --> 00:14:53.379
symptom X, Y, or Z is addressed by this pill.

00:14:53.500 --> 00:14:57.019
It starts to reinforce in your mind that, that

00:14:57.019 --> 00:15:00.679
disease happens to people and pills are the solution.

00:15:00.899 --> 00:15:03.720
And I think if nothing else, that is a, that

00:15:03.720 --> 00:15:06.700
is a cycle that we need to break because it's,

00:15:06.700 --> 00:15:08.980
it's fundamentally not true. Almost all. And

00:15:08.980 --> 00:15:10.220
I'm specifically talking about chronic illness

00:15:10.220 --> 00:15:12.899
over and over again, because again, the vast

00:15:12.899 --> 00:15:15.279
majority of the population, nine of the 10 causes

00:15:15.279 --> 00:15:17.139
leading causes of death in the United States.

00:15:17.470 --> 00:15:21.049
are directly chronic illnesses or are accelerated

00:15:21.049 --> 00:15:24.289
or caused by chronic illnesses and that's that

00:15:24.289 --> 00:15:26.850
stroke it's heart disease it's alzheimer's disease

00:15:26.850 --> 00:15:30.009
and dementia it's diabetes these are the things

00:15:30.009 --> 00:15:31.570
that are killing people every year infections

00:15:31.570 --> 00:15:35.929
like you know chronic pulmonary diseases of the

00:15:35.929 --> 00:15:37.870
lungs all of these are accelerated by chronic

00:15:37.870 --> 00:15:39.429
illness so the things that are killing people

00:15:39.429 --> 00:15:41.690
right and the things that are causing nine out

00:15:41.690 --> 00:15:43.950
of every ten dollars of spend in the healthcare

00:15:43.950 --> 00:15:46.590
system are these chronic illnesses And so the

00:15:46.590 --> 00:15:49.009
vast majority of products being developed and

00:15:49.009 --> 00:15:50.870
that are being advertised to us are addressing

00:15:50.870 --> 00:15:53.250
these. And it's creating this imprint in our

00:15:53.250 --> 00:15:56.649
minds as a society that that's the dynamic. You

00:15:56.649 --> 00:15:59.169
get it, you take a pill. And I think that's broken.

00:15:59.350 --> 00:16:04.409
And if for no other reason, we should at least

00:16:04.409 --> 00:16:06.250
run the experiment. What happens if we turn off

00:16:06.250 --> 00:16:08.509
the advertising? What happens if we just do it

00:16:08.509 --> 00:16:10.009
like every other country except for New Zealand

00:16:10.009 --> 00:16:13.159
and just run it for five years? Do people start

00:16:13.159 --> 00:16:15.620
to feel, do we replace those with an empowerment

00:16:15.620 --> 00:16:19.539
message where exercise and nutrition and sleep

00:16:19.539 --> 00:16:21.340
and stress management and emotional relationships,

00:16:21.480 --> 00:16:23.620
if we talk about those things in that same slot

00:16:23.620 --> 00:16:26.820
on primetime news, does it start to shift and

00:16:26.820 --> 00:16:28.159
move the needle? I don't know. I think it's worthwhile.

00:16:29.679 --> 00:16:31.539
Absolutely. We can change the news while we're

00:16:31.539 --> 00:16:33.340
at it too. Speaking of repetitive programming.

00:16:33.580 --> 00:16:38.080
No doubt. No doubt. All right, well, then let's

00:16:38.080 --> 00:16:39.799
just kind of circle around for a second again.

00:16:39.840 --> 00:16:42.159
I think it's worth revisiting. Talk to me about

00:16:42.159 --> 00:16:45.200
the industry that you came from, what made you

00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.700
make the jump, and where the AI and the kind

00:16:48.700 --> 00:16:50.639
of original platform that you developed back

00:16:50.639 --> 00:16:53.220
in 2019, and then we'll start walking through

00:16:53.220 --> 00:16:55.679
to where you are today. Yeah, so my background

00:16:55.679 --> 00:17:01.460
is aerospace engineering. I was never into biology

00:17:01.460 --> 00:17:06.210
or healthcare, really. it actually happened the

00:17:06.210 --> 00:17:08.990
way that this all came about was through a really

00:17:08.990 --> 00:17:12.349
interesting life experience so i was working

00:17:12.349 --> 00:17:14.970
at spacex i was relatively early there i started

00:17:14.970 --> 00:17:19.509
in 2010 which was a long time ago now but i had

00:17:19.509 --> 00:17:21.970
a very very awesome experience there i was fresh

00:17:21.970 --> 00:17:25.250
out of college and just loving this insanely

00:17:25.250 --> 00:17:28.029
intense competitive and fast -moving environment

00:17:28.029 --> 00:17:30.549
that we had at spacex and about halfway through

00:17:30.549 --> 00:17:33.000
my time there i was able to be I was kind of

00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:34.720
picked as one of the first employees to work

00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:37.880
on our astronaut flight program. So originally,

00:17:37.940 --> 00:17:41.059
SpaceX was just a rocket provider. We would launch

00:17:41.059 --> 00:17:44.619
payload satellites into space for other companies.

00:17:45.059 --> 00:17:47.599
And then we won a contract to launch astronauts

00:17:47.599 --> 00:17:49.940
into space after the space shuttle was retired.

00:17:50.299 --> 00:17:53.359
And so we needed to build now a capsule that

00:17:53.359 --> 00:17:55.680
could carry human beings, you know, alive and

00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:59.410
well into orbit. That, I was one of the first

00:17:59.410 --> 00:18:02.130
four on that program, and that was an insanely

00:18:02.130 --> 00:18:04.970
awesome opportunity because it connected me with

00:18:04.970 --> 00:18:09.130
what I think is now pretty clearly an example

00:18:09.130 --> 00:18:12.650
of how broken our health technology is. And so

00:18:12.650 --> 00:18:17.190
I'll try to tell this in brief, but when I was

00:18:17.190 --> 00:18:21.180
there, my job was to develop the oxygen breathing

00:18:21.180 --> 00:18:23.859
systems and the fire suppression systems actually

00:18:23.859 --> 00:18:26.539
for the space capsule so if a fire breaks out

00:18:26.539 --> 00:18:28.539
inside of this very enclosed space we needed

00:18:28.539 --> 00:18:30.299
to put that out we can quickly identify it put

00:18:30.299 --> 00:18:32.500
it out and we also needed to maintain inside

00:18:32.500 --> 00:18:34.000
of this small volume it's about the size of a

00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:39.160
small car a livable breathable safe non -toxic

00:18:39.160 --> 00:18:41.420
atmosphere so people could be breathing it right

00:18:41.420 --> 00:18:44.299
and so all the systems associated with that were

00:18:44.299 --> 00:18:47.890
on my plate and I found myself wondering, you

00:18:47.890 --> 00:18:49.589
know, how do I know if we have seven different

00:18:49.589 --> 00:18:51.930
people in this spacecraft and they're all, let's

00:18:51.930 --> 00:18:54.589
say you have a 95th percentile male and a fifth

00:18:54.589 --> 00:18:57.849
percentile, I'm exaggerating here, let's say

00:18:57.849 --> 00:19:00.349
50th percentile female in terms of body size

00:19:00.349 --> 00:19:03.390
in this capsule, they have totally different

00:19:03.390 --> 00:19:05.549
metabolic requirements. They're breathing at

00:19:05.549 --> 00:19:07.029
different rates. They have different body mass.

00:19:07.250 --> 00:19:09.950
They have different circulatory systems. How

00:19:09.950 --> 00:19:12.390
do I know that all of these people are healthy?

00:19:12.829 --> 00:19:15.650
like what what sort of what sort of uh data can

00:19:15.650 --> 00:19:18.829
we acquire from these people that we can measure

00:19:18.829 --> 00:19:21.769
um and then and then know as the people operating

00:19:21.769 --> 00:19:24.630
the spacecraft that they're all healthy and i

00:19:24.630 --> 00:19:26.369
got met with blank stares when i would ask this

00:19:26.369 --> 00:19:28.789
question i was totally uh naive i didn't know

00:19:28.789 --> 00:19:30.329
i thought that i thought there surely was some

00:19:30.329 --> 00:19:31.950
advanced technology where you could put a little

00:19:31.950 --> 00:19:33.809
patch on and it would be continuously monitoring

00:19:33.809 --> 00:19:36.410
you know health for this you know for a human

00:19:36.410 --> 00:19:39.009
being um it turns out that that does not exist

00:19:39.009 --> 00:19:41.130
and i didn't you know this is again i was learning

00:19:41.130 --> 00:19:43.450
this in real time i thought that was interesting

00:19:43.450 --> 00:19:46.630
because as the engineer developing these systems

00:19:46.630 --> 00:19:50.029
i had sensors on top of sensors on every single

00:19:50.029 --> 00:19:52.809
functional component of the system i was designing

00:19:52.809 --> 00:19:55.609
i had hundreds of data channels that all combined

00:19:55.609 --> 00:19:58.390
to tell me is my system functional is that system

00:19:58.390 --> 00:20:00.109
feeding into another system that's functional

00:20:00.109 --> 00:20:02.609
and is the spacecraft overall performing in a

00:20:02.609 --> 00:20:05.009
healthy way and that's just that's just the water

00:20:05.009 --> 00:20:07.109
you live in as a systems engineer you just you

00:20:07.109 --> 00:20:09.910
are measuring all the time the health state of

00:20:09.910 --> 00:20:12.539
whatever machine you're building And so when

00:20:12.539 --> 00:20:14.799
I found out that not only did I have to keep

00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:16.839
these astronauts healthy without having any way

00:20:16.839 --> 00:20:19.720
of measuring what that even means, but that the

00:20:19.720 --> 00:20:23.380
industry outside of this incredibly advanced

00:20:23.380 --> 00:20:26.279
astronaut program was clearly suffering from

00:20:26.279 --> 00:20:28.160
the same problem. We did not have the ability

00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:31.119
to measure human health. That was a mind blowing

00:20:31.119 --> 00:20:34.839
realization. And so that was part one. And then

00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:38.160
part two was five, six years into level or I'm

00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:40.829
sorry, five, six years into SpaceX. I was just

00:20:40.829 --> 00:20:43.450
totally burning out. You know, I was physically

00:20:43.450 --> 00:20:47.089
fit. I've always been fairly fit. I was a CrossFit

00:20:47.089 --> 00:20:48.670
trainer at the time. So, you know, working my

00:20:48.670 --> 00:20:51.509
job and then I'd go teach CrossFit classes and,

00:20:51.529 --> 00:20:53.849
you know, work really hard in the gym. And I

00:20:53.849 --> 00:20:55.809
kind of thought physical fitness was equivalent

00:20:55.809 --> 00:20:59.430
to health in most cases. And I started to get

00:20:59.430 --> 00:21:02.710
surprised by how terrible I felt every day. You

00:21:02.710 --> 00:21:04.430
know, I would have these episodes of just like

00:21:04.430 --> 00:21:07.430
shakiness and cold sweat and like a pit in my

00:21:07.430 --> 00:21:10.420
stomach and just extreme fatigue. And it got

00:21:10.420 --> 00:21:12.599
bad enough that I actually called my mom and

00:21:12.599 --> 00:21:15.240
was like, I think you're the first person I'm

00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:17.500
telling this, but I think I have a chronic illness,

00:21:17.599 --> 00:21:19.460
like a terminal illness potentially. There's

00:21:19.460 --> 00:21:21.859
something so bad happening that I don't even

00:21:21.859 --> 00:21:23.440
know how to describe it. It feels like a systemic

00:21:23.440 --> 00:21:25.720
shutdown. And she said, you need to get to a

00:21:25.720 --> 00:21:28.019
doctor and work with them to find out. I went

00:21:28.019 --> 00:21:29.660
to the doctor. The doctor ran a blood panel.

00:21:29.779 --> 00:21:31.400
He said, you're young, you're healthy, you're

00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:32.940
fit. Get out of my office. You're totally fine.

00:21:34.319 --> 00:21:37.000
That was unsatisfactory. And so I realized these

00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:39.660
two pieces of the puzzle came together. where

00:21:39.660 --> 00:21:44.039
I suddenly had this moment of what I'm experiencing

00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:46.119
at work where I can't measure human health is

00:21:46.119 --> 00:21:48.319
actually affecting me. I don't know my own health

00:21:48.319 --> 00:21:50.759
state. This is like such a huge problem. I'm

00:21:50.759 --> 00:21:53.579
trying to figure out, am I dying of a disease?

00:21:53.759 --> 00:21:55.319
And I can't even answer that question confidently

00:21:55.319 --> 00:21:58.059
other than getting sort of shooed out of a doctor's

00:21:58.059 --> 00:22:01.960
office. And to accelerate the story, I started

00:22:01.960 --> 00:22:04.859
reading just voraciously about health technology

00:22:04.859 --> 00:22:06.700
and trying to figure out, like, was anyone working

00:22:06.700 --> 00:22:09.410
on this problem? And I stumbled across a device

00:22:09.410 --> 00:22:11.390
called a continuous glucose monitor, which is

00:22:11.390 --> 00:22:13.269
mentioned in a book by Rob Wolf, who's kind of

00:22:13.269 --> 00:22:16.549
a paleo CrossFit guy. And this technology felt

00:22:16.549 --> 00:22:18.789
like an incredible breakthrough. It's a little

00:22:18.789 --> 00:22:21.390
device you can wear on your body that is continuously

00:22:21.390 --> 00:22:24.730
measuring blood sugar, which is one of the major

00:22:24.730 --> 00:22:27.630
energy molecules in the human body and is so

00:22:27.630 --> 00:22:30.069
closely associated with health state. And I thought,

00:22:30.170 --> 00:22:33.470
okay, amazing. And it streams those data directly

00:22:33.470 --> 00:22:35.079
to your phone. And I thought, all right. Amazing.

00:22:35.099 --> 00:22:36.920
This is the step towards the technology I was

00:22:36.920 --> 00:22:39.599
thinking we had already. And so I tried to get

00:22:39.599 --> 00:22:42.319
one. My doctor returned me down. And long story

00:22:42.319 --> 00:22:44.319
short, that kicked off a personal like sort of

00:22:44.319 --> 00:22:47.460
crusade to say, I deserve access to this technology.

00:22:47.799 --> 00:22:49.940
When I did get it, it was life changing. And

00:22:49.940 --> 00:22:53.279
now with Levels, I left SpaceX and decided I'm

00:22:53.279 --> 00:22:55.480
going to make the technology to help us understand

00:22:55.480 --> 00:22:57.759
our health available and actionable for as many

00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:02.309
people as possible. It's so funny that you have

00:23:02.309 --> 00:23:04.589
that kind of observation because the people listening,

00:23:04.730 --> 00:23:07.269
most people in police, fire, EMS, corrections,

00:23:07.470 --> 00:23:11.250
dispatch, etc. There's so much money poured into

00:23:11.250 --> 00:23:14.690
the technology around us and so little investment

00:23:14.690 --> 00:23:17.329
in the human being. But without the human being,

00:23:17.450 --> 00:23:20.210
a fire engine isn't going to move. 911 call is

00:23:20.210 --> 00:23:22.609
not going to be answered. But it's that complete

00:23:22.609 --> 00:23:26.140
disconnect. You know, people think that we work

00:23:26.140 --> 00:23:28.619
in the same realm as, you know, the tier one

00:23:28.619 --> 00:23:31.279
special operators and, you know, these elite

00:23:31.279 --> 00:23:34.099
performers on the planet because we really are

00:23:34.099 --> 00:23:36.720
asked at the drop of a hat in our worst calls

00:23:36.720 --> 00:23:39.519
to perform at an incredibly high level, mentally,

00:23:39.680 --> 00:23:43.059
physically, emotionally. But when I speak to,

00:23:43.119 --> 00:23:46.059
for example, the Delta and the SEAL Team 6 guys,

00:23:46.220 --> 00:23:47.960
you know, they have the psychologists and the

00:23:47.960 --> 00:23:50.359
physiologists and the, you know, all the people.

00:23:50.829 --> 00:23:53.130
They have this amazing group around to forge

00:23:53.130 --> 00:23:56.049
performance. When it comes to first responders,

00:23:56.289 --> 00:23:59.430
the conversation, as you I'm sure have come across

00:23:59.430 --> 00:24:01.470
now, is really, well, we keep dying. Can you

00:24:01.470 --> 00:24:03.369
get us to die a little bit less? It's not even

00:24:03.369 --> 00:24:05.549
close to performance. It should be. There's this

00:24:05.549 --> 00:24:08.450
massive gap, and I hope we're beginning to kind

00:24:08.450 --> 00:24:10.869
of lead the charge in fixing the work, which

00:24:10.869 --> 00:24:16.069
will then put the performance conversation front

00:24:16.069 --> 00:24:19.150
and center. People have this assumption that,

00:24:19.170 --> 00:24:21.329
yeah, we're all taken care of and we're all in

00:24:21.329 --> 00:24:23.150
this great shape and we have all these kind of

00:24:23.150 --> 00:24:26.250
health buffers around us, but we don't. We have

00:24:26.250 --> 00:24:29.269
expensive fire engines and equipment and the

00:24:29.269 --> 00:24:31.450
work week destroys the person inside the uniform.

00:24:32.930 --> 00:24:38.029
I think that this is probably the most acute

00:24:38.029 --> 00:24:41.549
example is in the first responder community where,

00:24:41.690 --> 00:24:44.190
like you said, the machines and the technology

00:24:44.190 --> 00:24:47.089
are where we invest all of our resources. And

00:24:47.089 --> 00:24:49.710
we treat the humans as kind of a fungible, necessary

00:24:49.710 --> 00:24:52.849
but fungible, kind of almost disposable. And

00:24:52.849 --> 00:24:56.430
that actually applies. But I would say that putting

00:24:56.430 --> 00:25:00.089
the machinery on the pedestal applies across

00:25:00.089 --> 00:25:02.690
every industry. One of my mantras right now is

00:25:02.690 --> 00:25:06.670
that we, as humans, need to be at least as measured

00:25:06.670 --> 00:25:10.369
as our machines. And that's like, I don't think

00:25:10.369 --> 00:25:11.990
it's an unreasonable ask. And I'll give you a

00:25:11.990 --> 00:25:16.200
couple examples that I know of. Whenever we engineer

00:25:16.200 --> 00:25:20.160
a complicated machine, we build in, just like

00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:21.880
we did at SpaceX, we build in the capability

00:25:21.880 --> 00:25:25.500
to measure that machine completely in its healthy

00:25:25.500 --> 00:25:27.680
state. And that's key. We don't bring the sensors

00:25:27.680 --> 00:25:30.019
to a broken machine and then try to figure out

00:25:30.019 --> 00:25:33.099
what's broken about it. We build them into the

00:25:33.099 --> 00:25:37.059
DNA of that machine. As an example, a modern

00:25:37.059 --> 00:25:41.279
car produces about 25 gigabytes per hour of sensor

00:25:41.279 --> 00:25:47.500
data. total data than a human being will get

00:25:47.500 --> 00:25:49.519
from the healthcare system in their entire life.

00:25:49.660 --> 00:25:52.880
So every hour your Toyota Camry is producing

00:25:52.880 --> 00:25:54.759
more data than you will get four times more data

00:25:54.759 --> 00:25:56.859
than you get in your entire life. And that's

00:25:56.859 --> 00:25:58.099
not to say, like, I want to be clear. It's not

00:25:58.099 --> 00:26:00.400
to say that every, every measurement coming off

00:26:00.400 --> 00:26:03.500
the Toyota's sensor system is some sort of incredible

00:26:03.500 --> 00:26:05.700
insight or breakthrough. It's actually the exact

00:26:05.700 --> 00:26:08.440
opposite. The vast majority of that data is totally

00:26:08.440 --> 00:26:10.839
mundane. It's not saying anything is bad. It's

00:26:10.839 --> 00:26:12.500
saying it's just reporting out that everything's

00:26:12.500 --> 00:26:14.869
healthy. But as soon as there's a blip, as soon

00:26:14.869 --> 00:26:16.710
as something changes, your check engine light

00:26:16.710 --> 00:26:18.849
comes on or your tire pressure gauge comes on.

00:26:19.049 --> 00:26:21.670
You can intervene before you have a blowout on

00:26:21.670 --> 00:26:23.390
the highway with your daughter in the backseat

00:26:23.390 --> 00:26:25.450
and your car rolls, right? We have these intervention

00:26:25.450 --> 00:26:28.049
mechanisms to avoid catastrophic failure. And

00:26:28.049 --> 00:26:31.509
it would be absolutely untenable to take those

00:26:31.509 --> 00:26:34.450
sensor systems out of our cars. The same goes

00:26:34.450 --> 00:26:37.930
for our jet engines, right? When you're flying...

00:26:39.350 --> 00:26:42.150
airline travel is by far the safest method of

00:26:42.150 --> 00:26:44.049
transportation. It's safer than walking. So like

00:26:44.049 --> 00:26:45.569
walking on the city street is more dangerous

00:26:45.569 --> 00:26:47.309
than flying in an airplane, which is hard to

00:26:47.309 --> 00:26:49.450
believe, but it's just it absolutely is the case.

00:26:49.490 --> 00:26:51.650
You can look at the statistics. And part of the

00:26:51.650 --> 00:26:53.430
reason for that is that we take safety incredibly

00:26:53.430 --> 00:26:57.099
as an incredibly high priority. Failure is not

00:26:57.099 --> 00:27:00.480
an option of a jet aircraft with 250 people flying

00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:03.460
across the Atlantic Ocean. And those machines

00:27:03.460 --> 00:27:05.940
are measured with tens of thousands of sensors

00:27:05.940 --> 00:27:08.559
continuously, again, to measure health state

00:27:08.559 --> 00:27:10.740
so that we know when something goes wrong. And

00:27:10.740 --> 00:27:15.299
the pilot flying that aircraft feels peace of

00:27:15.299 --> 00:27:18.220
mind knowing that as soon as something goes wrong

00:27:18.220 --> 00:27:20.460
with one of those engines or with the airframe,

00:27:20.619 --> 00:27:22.380
they're going to get an alert because the system

00:27:22.380 --> 00:27:27.059
is instrumented accordingly. Where is that analogous

00:27:27.059 --> 00:27:30.200
capability in our health care? All of us right

00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:32.299
now, if we're being honest, all of us are flying

00:27:32.299 --> 00:27:35.220
completely blind. We do not have any such system

00:27:35.220 --> 00:27:39.059
that is keeping track of where we are, how we're

00:27:39.059 --> 00:27:41.900
performing, and what is slowly but quietly failing

00:27:41.900 --> 00:27:44.339
in the background. And so unfortunately, most

00:27:44.339 --> 00:27:47.339
of us are. We are actually degrading unnecessarily.

00:27:47.660 --> 00:27:49.859
And that's just across the general population.

00:27:49.859 --> 00:27:53.640
Now put the first responder in. the environment

00:27:53.640 --> 00:27:56.539
that you all are in, in incredibly high stress,

00:27:56.819 --> 00:27:59.579
fast acting, and oftentimes toxic environments,

00:27:59.839 --> 00:28:02.819
over and over and over again, there is going

00:28:02.819 --> 00:28:06.299
to be an accumulation of stress and damage that

00:28:06.299 --> 00:28:08.180
is going to have an impact on human health. And

00:28:08.180 --> 00:28:10.660
the fact is that we just simply do not, we have

00:28:10.660 --> 00:28:13.059
not decided to invest the resources in being

00:28:13.059 --> 00:28:14.539
able to measure that. And I think that's an absolute

00:28:14.539 --> 00:28:18.750
travesty. And it's a complete... miscarriage

00:28:18.750 --> 00:28:20.650
of justice in a lot of cases because it will

00:28:20.650 --> 00:28:22.970
only show up decades down the line, maybe when

00:28:22.970 --> 00:28:25.950
that person's already retired, or it will happen

00:28:25.950 --> 00:28:28.329
on the job, you know, unfortunately and acutely.

00:28:28.410 --> 00:28:30.089
And I think that happens, you know, we see that

00:28:30.089 --> 00:28:33.789
way too often. It's avoidable. It requires a

00:28:33.789 --> 00:28:36.529
rethinking of what is important and where we

00:28:36.529 --> 00:28:38.990
should place our investments. And it also requires

00:28:38.990 --> 00:28:42.230
a completely new lens on health care in general,

00:28:42.250 --> 00:28:45.170
like what health care actually means. And, you

00:28:45.170 --> 00:28:47.819
know, I would just... I would just posit that,

00:28:47.900 --> 00:28:50.980
again, we should be at least as measured as our

00:28:50.980 --> 00:28:53.119
machines. That's my only ask. It's not that big

00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:57.000
of an ask. It's funny that you use aviation as

00:28:57.000 --> 00:28:59.680
an example, because if you look at pilots, they

00:28:59.680 --> 00:29:01.880
have crew rest. They can only fly for X amount

00:29:01.880 --> 00:29:03.619
of hours, and they've got to sleep for X amount

00:29:03.619 --> 00:29:06.220
of hours. And I think the 24 -hour shift, because

00:29:06.220 --> 00:29:08.359
we have fire stations, we have beds, we can at

00:29:08.359 --> 00:29:11.740
least get naps. It's still the best model. Otherwise,

00:29:11.819 --> 00:29:13.839
you start breaking up the day, and now the circadian

00:29:13.839 --> 00:29:16.119
rhythm is all over the place. But it's putting

00:29:16.119 --> 00:29:18.119
that rest and recovery between each of those

00:29:18.119 --> 00:29:20.460
sleepless nights. And, you know, where, like

00:29:20.460 --> 00:29:22.119
you said, there's so much emphasis on safety

00:29:22.119 --> 00:29:24.279
and aviation and they do have these stringent

00:29:24.279 --> 00:29:28.559
operating procedures in fire. I mean, you know,

00:29:28.559 --> 00:29:31.240
24 is the minimum that you will work. But, you

00:29:31.240 --> 00:29:34.960
know, we are seeing a staffing shortage because

00:29:34.960 --> 00:29:37.039
of mismanagement, because of refusing to change.

00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:40.119
But now we have first responders working 80.

00:29:40.440 --> 00:29:42.339
One of my California friends just told me he's

00:29:42.339 --> 00:29:45.460
on 120 hour shift at the moment. five days straight

00:29:45.460 --> 00:29:48.619
so put that guy in the plane would you get on

00:29:48.619 --> 00:29:51.980
i sure as hell wouldn't there's no way it's unbelievable

00:29:51.980 --> 00:29:56.460
yeah the you know the we do this in all of our

00:29:56.460 --> 00:29:59.079
tip of the spear industries i think you know

00:29:59.079 --> 00:30:01.180
i have a very close friend who's a cardiothoracic

00:30:01.180 --> 00:30:05.660
surgeon at uh you know in a very very well known

00:30:05.660 --> 00:30:10.440
and top -notch health system and he was describing

00:30:10.440 --> 00:30:14.910
a heart Um, you know, essentially an, an incredibly

00:30:14.910 --> 00:30:19.349
emergent heart surgery that he had to do. And

00:30:19.349 --> 00:30:21.589
it was a 16 hour surgery and he started at 30

00:30:21.589 --> 00:30:23.750
hours into his shift. So he had not closed his

00:30:23.750 --> 00:30:25.609
eyes for 30 hours and he was trying to lace up

00:30:25.609 --> 00:30:27.210
his shoes here. I remember this vividly. He was

00:30:27.210 --> 00:30:29.829
describing. i was tying my shoelaces because

00:30:29.829 --> 00:30:31.990
i had just you know i had just sat down and taken

00:30:31.990 --> 00:30:33.930
my shoes off to try to get some rest and then

00:30:33.930 --> 00:30:35.910
they came in you know the call came he's trying

00:30:35.910 --> 00:30:39.130
to tie his shoes and his he could not focus enough

00:30:39.130 --> 00:30:41.210
his hand his dexterity was so impacted that he

00:30:41.210 --> 00:30:42.849
was struggling to tie a knot in his shoelace

00:30:42.849 --> 00:30:45.890
so he could go to the or and i just you know

00:30:45.890 --> 00:30:48.829
i have to wonder like with the family it's nothing

00:30:48.829 --> 00:30:50.609
against him he's being forced into this situation

00:30:50.609 --> 00:30:52.349
he's going to go and try and perform the best

00:30:52.349 --> 00:30:54.750
that he possibly can but with the family have

00:30:54.750 --> 00:30:57.750
the confidence And knowing that that was the

00:30:57.750 --> 00:31:00.029
case, that his dexterity was so impacted. And,

00:31:00.049 --> 00:31:03.190
you know, it's like the actual skill and capability

00:31:03.190 --> 00:31:08.069
that our best bring to the table is completely

00:31:08.069 --> 00:31:10.069
diminished, probably lower than the average when

00:31:10.069 --> 00:31:13.650
we run dry. And we just know this about performance.

00:31:13.730 --> 00:31:17.230
We know the impacts of sleep, both in the acute

00:31:17.230 --> 00:31:19.809
and chronically. And, you know, I think what's

00:31:19.809 --> 00:31:22.210
even worse is that when you do this long term,

00:31:22.289 --> 00:31:23.930
when you make this the standard expectation.

00:31:25.390 --> 00:31:28.309
you start to experience systemic failure. Like

00:31:28.309 --> 00:31:30.329
it's not just that in the moment you're struggling

00:31:30.329 --> 00:31:32.950
to focus or that you're like a little sluggish.

00:31:33.029 --> 00:31:35.650
It's that over time, the systems break down.

00:31:36.089 --> 00:31:39.210
And the number one and two, I believe the number

00:31:39.210 --> 00:31:41.150
one and two causes of death for firefighters

00:31:41.150 --> 00:31:45.369
right now are heart attack and occupational cancers.

00:31:45.869 --> 00:31:51.150
And the correlations between sleep, inflammation,

00:31:51.369 --> 00:31:55.059
and chronic stress and heart disease are so well

00:31:55.059 --> 00:31:57.160
understood. It's almost like it's not even worth

00:31:57.160 --> 00:31:59.960
rehashing. Like everybody knows that these are

00:31:59.960 --> 00:32:02.160
so closely linked. In fact, they're so closely

00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:04.960
linked that this is a really interesting anecdote.

00:32:05.740 --> 00:32:09.539
Every year when daylight savings happens and

00:32:09.539 --> 00:32:12.799
we lose an hour of sleep, the number of heart

00:32:12.799 --> 00:32:16.480
attacks and strokes goes up by 26 % on that day.

00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:19.680
And perhaps it's over that week. But the loss

00:32:19.680 --> 00:32:21.759
of that sleep, just one hour in the general population,

00:32:21.920 --> 00:32:24.759
is so dramatic that we know, like clockwork,

00:32:24.940 --> 00:32:27.759
that we are going to lose an extra 25 % of people

00:32:27.759 --> 00:32:29.339
to heart attacks. They may have been lingering.

00:32:29.480 --> 00:32:31.140
Obviously, they already had heart disease. But

00:32:31.140 --> 00:32:33.819
it puts them over the edge. And when we're doing

00:32:33.819 --> 00:32:36.180
this in literally the occupation for our first

00:32:36.180 --> 00:32:38.640
responders, we are forcing some number to have

00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:41.460
an unnecessary heart attack death. And that is

00:32:41.460 --> 00:32:46.400
unacceptable. Why are we doing this? There are

00:32:46.400 --> 00:32:48.700
so many incidents where we've lost firefighters

00:32:48.700 --> 00:32:52.420
to a multitude of things, from falling off the

00:32:52.420 --> 00:32:55.559
ladder to getting lost in a search. And we always

00:32:55.559 --> 00:32:57.640
chalk that down to the job. And no one thinks,

00:32:57.700 --> 00:33:00.500
well, when did they last sleep? We just had a

00:33:00.500 --> 00:33:04.740
fire truck, for some reason, make a decision.

00:33:04.779 --> 00:33:06.799
The barriers were down on the train line. They

00:33:06.799 --> 00:33:08.500
were on their way to a call. And so they drove

00:33:08.500 --> 00:33:10.440
around the barriers and got nailed by a train.

00:33:11.279 --> 00:33:12.819
I don't think that would have been the decision

00:33:12.819 --> 00:33:14.740
that person would have normally made. I guarantee

00:33:14.740 --> 00:33:18.220
you sleep deprivation was included in that. And

00:33:18.220 --> 00:33:19.440
it's funny because when you were talking about

00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:23.039
the medical side, I've talked about this a few

00:33:23.039 --> 00:33:27.440
times on here. The guy that really kind of began

00:33:27.440 --> 00:33:30.559
the insane surgical residency, you know, we're

00:33:30.559 --> 00:33:33.720
doing these crazy hours, William Halstead. It

00:33:33.720 --> 00:33:35.700
was discovered, this was in the 1800s, that he

00:33:35.700 --> 00:33:38.740
was a cocaine and heroin addict. So even like

00:33:38.740 --> 00:33:41.440
the why do we do this, you look far enough back,

00:33:41.619 --> 00:33:45.079
there's no reason. But I was on a paramedic clinical

00:33:45.079 --> 00:33:50.980
once in the OB ward, and this clearly very, very

00:33:50.980 --> 00:33:56.359
veteran obstetrician was delivering this baby.

00:33:56.660 --> 00:33:58.200
And I was in the corner. It was kind of like

00:33:58.200 --> 00:34:00.559
I just had to observe. That was it. He clamped

00:34:00.559 --> 00:34:03.579
both sides of the cord, and then he cut. the

00:34:03.579 --> 00:34:05.579
you know the other side of the clamp the side

00:34:05.579 --> 00:34:08.199
of the patient and like a monty python sketch

00:34:08.199 --> 00:34:10.960
blood just started spurting everywhere and this

00:34:10.960 --> 00:34:14.239
man must have clamped and cut thousands thousands

00:34:14.239 --> 00:34:17.380
of umbilical cords but i'm sure because this

00:34:17.380 --> 00:34:18.780
was i think it was like early in the morning

00:34:18.780 --> 00:34:20.699
he'd probably been on call or being up all night

00:34:20.699 --> 00:34:23.340
that was obviously salvageable you get another

00:34:23.340 --> 00:34:25.199
clamp and you know she didn't lose too much blood

00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:27.760
and we were good but if that was an aorta during

00:34:27.760 --> 00:34:30.579
a cardiac surgery that patient probably would

00:34:30.579 --> 00:34:33.659
have died. So this is why, just to underline

00:34:33.659 --> 00:34:35.760
what you're talking about, it is so, so important.

00:34:36.179 --> 00:34:38.280
And then you look at the chronic effects of sleep

00:34:38.280 --> 00:34:40.880
deprivation. The biggest killer of firefighters

00:34:40.880 --> 00:34:44.159
and cops is actually suicide at the moment. So

00:34:44.159 --> 00:34:46.900
there's a direct correlation between sleep deprivation

00:34:46.900 --> 00:34:50.579
and all things mental health as well. So like

00:34:50.579 --> 00:34:53.380
you're talking about with the check engine light,

00:34:53.539 --> 00:34:56.019
that's the physiological side, but also that

00:34:56.019 --> 00:34:58.579
ties into the psychological side too. Absolutely.

00:34:58.969 --> 00:35:01.889
Yeah, there's a really fascinating and increasing

00:35:01.889 --> 00:35:05.250
body of evidence that's looking at the psychological

00:35:05.250 --> 00:35:08.070
health as it relates to physiological markers.

00:35:08.449 --> 00:35:11.369
And there are predictive models that can look

00:35:11.369 --> 00:35:15.070
at a combination of biomarkers and predict the

00:35:15.070 --> 00:35:18.210
likelihood of a depressive episode for people

00:35:18.210 --> 00:35:20.650
who are predisposed. And it's pretty clear that

00:35:20.650 --> 00:35:25.849
that is going to be a future area of study that

00:35:25.849 --> 00:35:28.070
is going to become... forefront and primary right

00:35:28.070 --> 00:35:29.849
we're going to be we're going to start being

00:35:29.849 --> 00:35:32.969
capable of predictive models on the individual

00:35:32.969 --> 00:35:35.309
level not not again at the population level i'm

00:35:35.309 --> 00:35:38.670
most interested in for me and for my loved ones

00:35:38.670 --> 00:35:40.869
how do we equip them with enough information

00:35:40.869 --> 00:35:43.909
that there can be that check engine light equivalent

00:35:43.909 --> 00:35:46.929
for whatever it is that they're most predisposed

00:35:46.929 --> 00:35:50.210
for or at risk of and and the fascinating thing

00:35:50.210 --> 00:35:53.489
is that many of these well most i would say most

00:35:53.489 --> 00:35:58.119
of these conditions And I'll say that separately

00:35:58.119 --> 00:35:59.519
potentially from depression because there are

00:35:59.519 --> 00:36:03.039
obviously multi -factors and I don't claim to

00:36:03.039 --> 00:36:05.619
have all the expertise. But in many, many cases,

00:36:05.659 --> 00:36:09.099
we're experiencing the compounding effect of

00:36:09.099 --> 00:36:12.760
lots and lots of lifestyle factors. That's what

00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:14.480
we're experiencing. It's very rare that some

00:36:14.480 --> 00:36:19.099
single event occurs that triggers in and of itself

00:36:19.099 --> 00:36:23.420
a disorder that is life -threatening. It's very

00:36:23.420 --> 00:36:25.340
often, I think, the compounding effect, and that's

00:36:25.340 --> 00:36:26.940
our sleep, our stress, what we're eating, the

00:36:26.940 --> 00:36:30.000
sunlight exposure, our activity levels, and of

00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:31.679
course, genetic predisposition and other factors.

00:36:32.039 --> 00:36:35.239
And so, you know, I just, I struggle with our

00:36:35.239 --> 00:36:37.099
current paradigm where we throw people into the

00:36:37.099 --> 00:36:41.840
fire, literally, and we do so without even the

00:36:41.840 --> 00:36:44.480
most cursory inspection to help them understand

00:36:44.480 --> 00:36:46.280
their own health state and to help us understand

00:36:46.280 --> 00:36:50.699
the predisposition of these people towards, you

00:36:50.699 --> 00:36:53.400
know. resilience, right? How resilient is that

00:36:53.400 --> 00:36:55.360
person to what we're asking of them? We just

00:36:55.360 --> 00:36:59.219
don't do it. And I really like my mission with

00:36:59.219 --> 00:37:02.900
levels is to change how we treat health health

00:37:02.900 --> 00:37:05.420
data, to put the power into the hands of the

00:37:05.420 --> 00:37:08.719
individual to access, own and take action on

00:37:08.719 --> 00:37:10.880
that information, and then to bring in experts

00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:13.880
to help validate or provide, you know, additional

00:37:13.880 --> 00:37:18.139
plans, expertise, validation, etc. But I think

00:37:18.139 --> 00:37:19.860
the most important thing is to change the paradigm.

00:37:20.329 --> 00:37:22.210
The healthcare system should not own my data

00:37:22.210 --> 00:37:24.050
or tell me what I can access. It should be me

00:37:24.050 --> 00:37:26.650
who makes that decision. Very comparable to financial

00:37:26.650 --> 00:37:29.329
data. If you went to a bank and you asked for

00:37:29.329 --> 00:37:32.130
some information about your accounts and some

00:37:32.130 --> 00:37:33.809
bank employee told you, no, you don't need that.

00:37:33.889 --> 00:37:37.630
You don't need access to that. You can imagine

00:37:37.630 --> 00:37:39.750
what would happen next. But for some reason,

00:37:39.809 --> 00:37:42.349
we're willing to accept that in healthcare. This

00:37:42.349 --> 00:37:44.349
is information about your individual body, your

00:37:44.349 --> 00:37:47.369
predisposition to death. And we allow... the

00:37:47.369 --> 00:37:49.570
system to stand between us and that information.

00:37:49.670 --> 00:37:51.750
That's got to entirely disappear before anything

00:37:51.750 --> 00:37:56.210
can change. Absolutely. Well, you mentioned about

00:37:56.210 --> 00:37:59.929
kind of the nucleus of levels being the continuous

00:37:59.929 --> 00:38:02.730
glucose monitoring and then the blood work and

00:38:02.730 --> 00:38:05.469
the app. What has been the evolution of that

00:38:05.469 --> 00:38:08.889
over the last five years? Yeah, it's been quite

00:38:08.889 --> 00:38:12.510
a journey. Step one was, you know, I mentioned

00:38:12.510 --> 00:38:14.250
that I had used the continuous glucose monitor.

00:38:15.050 --> 00:38:17.070
And I was absolutely blown away by the technology.

00:38:17.989 --> 00:38:20.750
Again, I thought physical fitness is essentially

00:38:20.750 --> 00:38:24.769
health. And the way that that played out is that

00:38:24.769 --> 00:38:27.309
I would look at the fittest person in the gym

00:38:27.309 --> 00:38:32.010
or online, the real pinnacle athlete, and I would

00:38:32.010 --> 00:38:33.349
look at what they were doing with their lives

00:38:33.349 --> 00:38:35.989
in terms of what they were eating, how they were

00:38:35.989 --> 00:38:38.769
training, and I would kind of replicate that

00:38:38.769 --> 00:38:40.489
to the best of my ability. And what that often

00:38:40.489 --> 00:38:43.550
meant was, well, I would eat a lot like they

00:38:43.550 --> 00:38:47.630
did. but I wasn't training like they did, right?

00:38:47.690 --> 00:38:49.510
So if you're a Tour de France athlete or you're

00:38:49.510 --> 00:38:51.889
a bodybuilder, you're putting in four to eight

00:38:51.889 --> 00:38:56.130
hours of work per day. I was putting in 45 minutes.

00:38:56.730 --> 00:39:01.090
And yet I was carb loading and glycogen replenishing

00:39:01.090 --> 00:39:02.809
and using all these terms that I thought I understood,

00:39:02.909 --> 00:39:04.989
just like that person eating hundreds of grams

00:39:04.989 --> 00:39:07.090
of carbohydrates and that sort of thing. And

00:39:07.090 --> 00:39:09.170
when I put a continuous glucose monitor on, I

00:39:09.170 --> 00:39:13.000
immediately saw that... All of those things were

00:39:13.000 --> 00:39:15.340
way overclocked for my system. They were the

00:39:15.340 --> 00:39:18.699
portion sizing, the content, the timing. It was

00:39:18.699 --> 00:39:21.139
all really, really bad. And what I was experiencing

00:39:21.139 --> 00:39:23.380
was essentially prediabetes. My blood sugar was

00:39:23.380 --> 00:39:26.480
really chaotic. I was experiencing a ton of what's

00:39:26.480 --> 00:39:28.440
called variability, huge spikes and huge crashes,

00:39:28.539 --> 00:39:31.400
which are inflammatory. They increase your likelihood

00:39:31.400 --> 00:39:34.139
of cardiovascular disease and diabetes. And straight

00:39:34.139 --> 00:39:36.420
up, they just affect your quality of life when

00:39:36.420 --> 00:39:38.480
your blood sugar is crashing from a really high

00:39:38.480 --> 00:39:42.059
point. you feel that or i felt that as extreme

00:39:42.059 --> 00:39:46.179
fatigue and really a mood change and so the cgm

00:39:46.179 --> 00:39:48.000
immediately that the power of it is that it's

00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:50.199
continuously measuring and you can see within

00:39:50.199 --> 00:39:52.800
minutes you eat a thing and you can see how that

00:39:52.800 --> 00:39:54.980
is affecting your blood sugar and i was able

00:39:54.980 --> 00:39:57.219
to do trial and error and really like dial in

00:39:57.219 --> 00:40:00.519
a dietary lifestyle or approach that dramatically

00:40:00.519 --> 00:40:04.960
improved those symptoms so levels was all now

00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:09.280
again At the time, I had tried to get a CGM from

00:40:09.280 --> 00:40:12.440
my doctor and he said flat out, no, you're not

00:40:12.440 --> 00:40:14.820
diabetic. You don't need this thing. So I actually

00:40:14.820 --> 00:40:16.400
got one from Australia where they were over the

00:40:16.400 --> 00:40:19.260
counter and used that. So that was how I had

00:40:19.260 --> 00:40:20.679
to get it. It was like this gray market thing.

00:40:21.659 --> 00:40:24.400
And so the first thing that I wanted to do with

00:40:24.400 --> 00:40:26.699
levels was break the barrier down to continuous

00:40:26.699 --> 00:40:29.079
glucose monitors. So in the very first era, it

00:40:29.079 --> 00:40:31.880
was all about get more people, regardless of

00:40:31.880 --> 00:40:35.139
their health state, access to this tool and just

00:40:35.139 --> 00:40:38.780
make that. step one once that barrier was overcome

00:40:38.780 --> 00:40:42.179
step two was okay now take that data that people

00:40:42.179 --> 00:40:44.039
are collecting and help them actually understand

00:40:44.039 --> 00:40:46.039
it because you know it turns out when you put

00:40:46.039 --> 00:40:48.320
put a device in someone's arm you know oftentimes

00:40:48.320 --> 00:40:50.840
they've never seen blood sugar data before and

00:40:50.840 --> 00:40:52.780
they have no idea what to make of it and it can

00:40:52.780 --> 00:40:56.260
be really confusing right so we built this this

00:40:56.260 --> 00:40:59.059
software ecosystem that through the levels app

00:40:59.059 --> 00:41:03.340
that pulls the data off of the cgm contextualize

00:41:03.340 --> 00:41:06.500
it so puts it directly alongside the lifestyle

00:41:06.500 --> 00:41:09.239
choices that are affecting blood sugar like sleep

00:41:09.239 --> 00:41:13.579
nutrition you know exercise stress and helps

00:41:13.579 --> 00:41:15.579
people interpret that so we're doing a lot of

00:41:15.579 --> 00:41:18.559
AI analysis on it and directly explaining the

00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:21.639
correlations between actions and reactions we're

00:41:21.639 --> 00:41:24.079
now entering phase three with levels and what

00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:26.500
we're doing with with three is removing past

00:41:26.500 --> 00:41:30.079
just measurement to measurable health improvement

00:41:30.599 --> 00:41:32.619
And so that means that we don't just want people

00:41:32.619 --> 00:41:35.980
to put a CGM on and measure their, you know,

00:41:35.980 --> 00:41:37.940
and just see correlations. We want to show them

00:41:37.940 --> 00:41:42.239
how to take a measurement and improve the most

00:41:42.239 --> 00:41:46.199
priority biomarkers that are directly affecting

00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:48.739
their health. And to do that, we've expanded

00:41:48.739 --> 00:41:51.519
beyond just continuous glucose. We've added comprehensive

00:41:51.519 --> 00:41:54.320
blood work in addition. So we have hundreds of

00:41:54.320 --> 00:41:56.480
biomarkers that we measure with these blood panels.

00:41:57.070 --> 00:41:59.349
We combine that with the lifestyle data and the

00:41:59.349 --> 00:42:00.969
CGM data that you're collecting through levels.

00:42:01.230 --> 00:42:03.510
And then we identify the highest health priorities

00:42:03.510 --> 00:42:05.630
and we help you actually improve those markers

00:42:05.630 --> 00:42:10.989
to reduce your long -term risk. One of the, I

00:42:10.989 --> 00:42:14.570
think the least observed markers, unless you're

00:42:14.570 --> 00:42:16.389
obviously in a certain group that's very aware

00:42:16.389 --> 00:42:18.349
of this in the first responder professions is

00:42:18.349 --> 00:42:20.750
actually testosterone. And again, you look at

00:42:20.750 --> 00:42:23.010
the impact of that from sleep deprivation, it

00:42:23.010 --> 00:42:26.510
just destroys it completely. Have you... become

00:42:26.510 --> 00:42:28.369
aware of that with the groups that you've worked

00:42:28.369 --> 00:42:31.510
with in this third tier yeah it's really fascinating

00:42:31.510 --> 00:42:35.489
the number of hormone irregularities um is really

00:42:35.489 --> 00:42:38.590
shocking there are there are many many many reasons

00:42:38.590 --> 00:42:40.789
i think why our hormones are being assaulted

00:42:40.789 --> 00:42:44.050
in our in our modern era but what we're seeing

00:42:44.050 --> 00:42:47.289
consistently is specifically in men testosterone

00:42:47.289 --> 00:42:52.449
is down so that the current modern 20 year old

00:42:52.449 --> 00:42:55.230
has the testosterone levels of a 60 year old

00:42:55.579 --> 00:42:57.820
20 years ago. That's the trend that we're on.

00:42:58.699 --> 00:43:01.219
This is an absolute disaster, obviously. And

00:43:01.219 --> 00:43:03.679
I think there are a lot of factors. As you said,

00:43:03.860 --> 00:43:07.119
chronic sleep deprivation destroys hormones.

00:43:07.719 --> 00:43:10.420
It breaks the circadian rhythms during which

00:43:10.420 --> 00:43:13.440
the body replenishes and synthesizes. There are

00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:15.840
rhythms to basically every molecule in our body,

00:43:15.900 --> 00:43:18.679
and they are synced with our sleep and wake cycles.

00:43:19.000 --> 00:43:21.360
And so when you blow those up, you are breaking

00:43:21.360 --> 00:43:24.300
the body's programmed hormone synthesis schedule.

00:43:25.349 --> 00:43:28.269
Another really fascinating thing is there are

00:43:28.269 --> 00:43:33.150
studies that show if you give a man 75 grams

00:43:33.150 --> 00:43:35.289
of sugar, this is called an oral glucose tolerance

00:43:35.289 --> 00:43:37.690
test. You drink this sugary drink and then you

00:43:37.690 --> 00:43:40.230
measure blood sugar for the two hours after that.

00:43:41.030 --> 00:43:44.210
So a study showed that during an oral glucose

00:43:44.210 --> 00:43:47.769
tolerance test, testosterone is also suppressed

00:43:47.769 --> 00:43:52.019
by about 40 to 50%. for the entire duration of

00:43:52.019 --> 00:43:53.800
that test. So as soon as you drink that sugary

00:43:53.800 --> 00:43:55.900
beverage for the next two hours, testosterone

00:43:55.900 --> 00:43:58.599
is cut almost in half. And, you know, the duration

00:43:58.599 --> 00:44:00.639
of the test is not super long. So I don't have

00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:04.159
like a ton of long -term data on this, but you

00:44:04.159 --> 00:44:06.139
can imagine if somebody is, is let's say that

00:44:06.139 --> 00:44:08.840
they're poorly slept, they're working a, like

00:44:08.840 --> 00:44:11.480
you said, a hundred hour shift, right. And they're

00:44:11.480 --> 00:44:14.039
having to get in calories quickly and whenever

00:44:14.039 --> 00:44:16.960
they can, like around work shifts, those calories

00:44:16.960 --> 00:44:19.179
are probably coming in the form of quick process

00:44:19.179 --> 00:44:22.849
snacks. uh you know granola bars and candy and

00:44:22.849 --> 00:44:24.650
uh you know and energy drinks with a lot of sugar

00:44:24.650 --> 00:44:27.090
in them to help us feel replenished so you can

00:44:27.090 --> 00:44:29.750
imagine you're both uh you're both poorly slept

00:44:29.750 --> 00:44:33.050
and you're spiking your blood sugar consistently

00:44:33.050 --> 00:44:35.929
and creating this testosterone suppression over

00:44:35.929 --> 00:44:38.469
and over and over again so if you let's say you

00:44:38.469 --> 00:44:40.230
you drink an energy drink it suppresses your

00:44:40.230 --> 00:44:42.389
testosterone 40 percent And then you drink another

00:44:42.389 --> 00:44:44.130
one two hours later. Your testosterone is already

00:44:44.130 --> 00:44:45.789
suppressed. Now are we suppressing it again,

00:44:45.929 --> 00:44:48.289
another 50 %? I mean, I don't have the answer

00:44:48.289 --> 00:44:50.590
to this question, but the data shows that there

00:44:50.590 --> 00:44:53.550
is obviously a direct connection between these

00:44:53.550 --> 00:44:56.329
crucial hormones that affect male health and

00:44:56.329 --> 00:44:59.210
female health and the actions we're taking every

00:44:59.210 --> 00:45:00.849
day. And we're compounding these things over

00:45:00.849 --> 00:45:05.010
decades during our work. And we just aren't measuring

00:45:05.010 --> 00:45:08.420
the impact. So it's no surprise that... hormone

00:45:08.420 --> 00:45:11.039
therapies like testosterone replacement are are

00:45:11.039 --> 00:45:13.639
through the roof right now we're sort of you

00:45:13.639 --> 00:45:15.659
know injecting replacements for this stuff which

00:45:15.659 --> 00:45:18.599
uh you know i'm sure it helps restore quality

00:45:18.599 --> 00:45:20.400
of life for a lot of people but i just wonder

00:45:20.400 --> 00:45:22.860
how much are we putting a band -aid on a problem

00:45:22.860 --> 00:45:25.219
that we could otherwise fix just through different

00:45:25.219 --> 00:45:28.920
different choices if we knew the data This is

00:45:28.920 --> 00:45:31.320
the argument, one of the arguments for the 42

00:45:31.320 --> 00:45:33.659
hour work week that I'm just, you know, the dead

00:45:33.659 --> 00:45:36.320
horse that I'm flogging with, with a whip in

00:45:36.320 --> 00:45:38.579
each hand at the moment, because that's just

00:45:38.579 --> 00:45:40.440
it. We've got literally, you know, go to any

00:45:40.440 --> 00:45:42.699
fire station you ask, you know, and this is obviously

00:45:42.699 --> 00:45:44.760
affecting women as well, but testosterone is

00:45:44.760 --> 00:45:48.139
more of an impact on men, this particular area.

00:45:48.619 --> 00:45:50.920
But you ask, you know, late 20s, early 30s, who

00:45:50.920 --> 00:45:53.440
should be just dripping with testosterone. I

00:45:53.440 --> 00:45:55.460
mean, they are the, you know, the protectors

00:45:55.460 --> 00:45:57.260
of the community. They have to be fit. So they

00:45:57.260 --> 00:46:00.539
should be arguably pretty athletic. And they're,

00:46:00.539 --> 00:46:03.679
you know, 200, you know, 250 maybe. And it's

00:46:03.679 --> 00:46:05.760
insane. And then, like you said, then they go

00:46:05.760 --> 00:46:08.019
to a men's clinic. And then the predatory actions

00:46:08.019 --> 00:46:10.780
of those, they're like, well, here's TRT. Now,

00:46:10.920 --> 00:46:13.519
you know, I'm a big fan if you. There's nothing

00:46:13.519 --> 00:46:15.659
you can do about lifestyle changes. In the middle,

00:46:15.679 --> 00:46:17.579
there are peptides. At least you're getting your

00:46:17.579 --> 00:46:20.340
body to make its own testosterone still. But

00:46:20.340 --> 00:46:22.679
just like you said, the first step should always

00:46:22.679 --> 00:46:25.380
be, well, can I sleep more? Can I get some strength

00:46:25.380 --> 00:46:27.940
training in? What am I eating? Now, I mean, that's

00:46:27.940 --> 00:46:30.360
the first time I've heard that correlation with

00:46:30.360 --> 00:46:34.239
glucose. So all these factors that we know can

00:46:34.239 --> 00:46:37.480
reverse this and get testosterone back up. You

00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:40.340
know, it's such a, just it breaks my heart because

00:46:40.340 --> 00:46:41.880
I've got friends that are on TRT and they're

00:46:41.880 --> 00:46:43.980
on it forever now. That's it. It's affecting

00:46:43.980 --> 00:46:45.820
their fertility. It's affecting their hair loss.

00:46:45.980 --> 00:46:48.880
You know, the for lack of a better term, the

00:46:48.880 --> 00:46:50.380
bitch tits. I mean, all the thing in the back

00:46:50.380 --> 00:46:52.820
knee. These are all real things that come along

00:46:52.820 --> 00:46:55.980
with TRT. So, you know, when when people really

00:46:55.980 --> 00:46:58.199
start understanding the impact that these shifts

00:46:58.199 --> 00:47:00.760
are having and that if they simply went to a

00:47:00.760 --> 00:47:02.920
healthier work week and got more sleep and were

00:47:02.920 --> 00:47:04.880
cognizant of their own sleep at home, of course,

00:47:04.920 --> 00:47:07.239
and his ownership to that, they could reverse

00:47:07.239 --> 00:47:10.659
this and get. close to normal again without any

00:47:10.659 --> 00:47:12.780
pharmaceuticals. I mean, that's the message that

00:47:12.780 --> 00:47:16.579
we're just not hearing. It's all TRT and optimization,

00:47:16.920 --> 00:47:19.059
but in the wrong way, chemical optimization,

00:47:19.139 --> 00:47:22.659
not lifestyle optimization. Yeah, 100%. And this

00:47:22.659 --> 00:47:25.679
is one example of so many, right? Across the

00:47:25.679 --> 00:47:29.780
board, there are important biomarkers that track

00:47:29.780 --> 00:47:34.519
and directly demonstrate changes in system health.

00:47:36.429 --> 00:47:39.150
we have this total, you know, what I believe

00:47:39.150 --> 00:47:42.329
to be the root cause is, well, what I believe

00:47:42.329 --> 00:47:45.309
to be the root cause of the ongoing issue, the

00:47:45.309 --> 00:47:47.329
reason we don't fix it is because we have a complete

00:47:47.329 --> 00:47:51.389
scarcity of data. We don't connect our actions

00:47:51.389 --> 00:47:54.489
to these reactions. And so it's much easier to

00:47:54.489 --> 00:47:56.789
take a single data point where testosterone comes

00:47:56.789 --> 00:47:59.110
back at 200 and say, oh, your testosterone is

00:47:59.110 --> 00:48:03.630
200, time for TRT. And I would say, well, if

00:48:03.630 --> 00:48:07.050
that, if we had increased the cadence of of measurement

00:48:07.050 --> 00:48:09.190
so that that person was measuring on a quarterly

00:48:09.190 --> 00:48:12.309
basis at least for the past five years, I think

00:48:12.309 --> 00:48:14.690
what we would see is a dramatic decline associated

00:48:14.690 --> 00:48:18.050
with a change in sleep or a change in nutrition

00:48:18.050 --> 00:48:21.050
or a combination of these factors that, again,

00:48:21.090 --> 00:48:23.389
if we increase, if we go to a data abundance

00:48:23.389 --> 00:48:26.550
approach to healthcare, we would take more measurements

00:48:26.550 --> 00:48:28.730
and we would say, okay, let's try X and Y and

00:48:28.730 --> 00:48:30.050
then we're going to remeasure in a month and

00:48:30.050 --> 00:48:32.329
we're going to try Z and A and we're going to

00:48:32.329 --> 00:48:34.030
remeasure a month after that. And you're going

00:48:34.030 --> 00:48:37.139
to turn the knobs and remove the low hanging

00:48:37.139 --> 00:48:40.079
fruit. And then we'll find out quite quickly

00:48:40.079 --> 00:48:42.760
over the course of a few months. And I actually,

00:48:42.820 --> 00:48:44.659
I know people who have done exactly this. They've

00:48:44.659 --> 00:48:46.900
had fertility issues, fertility issues correlated

00:48:46.900 --> 00:48:49.219
with very low testosterone. They went through

00:48:49.219 --> 00:48:52.079
a series of lifestyle changes with consistent

00:48:52.079 --> 00:48:54.960
measurement and completely restored testosterone

00:48:54.960 --> 00:48:57.179
to healthy levels. Like from, again, from sub

00:48:57.179 --> 00:49:00.840
200 to mid 600s without TRT. And so now you've

00:49:00.840 --> 00:49:02.920
restored your body's natural function. And from

00:49:02.920 --> 00:49:05.539
there, if 600 still isn't doing the trick, great

00:49:05.539 --> 00:49:08.239
now we're adding a smaller dose of trt that's

00:49:08.239 --> 00:49:09.880
going to have less of a complication for the

00:49:09.880 --> 00:49:12.019
body that will get you to wherever you need to

00:49:12.019 --> 00:49:14.980
be but i think we do this across every single

00:49:14.980 --> 00:49:19.139
category from heart disease markers to blood

00:49:19.139 --> 00:49:22.239
pressure to hormones we are we are measuring

00:49:22.239 --> 00:49:24.440
minimally we're taking action on too few data

00:49:24.440 --> 00:49:27.300
points and we're not in any way trying to address

00:49:27.300 --> 00:49:30.280
the root causes which in most cases are completely

00:49:30.280 --> 00:49:32.380
in our control and so that's that's the whole

00:49:32.380 --> 00:49:35.260
objective with levels is to give people the cadence

00:49:35.260 --> 00:49:37.440
of measurement that you need and the, and the

00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:40.079
types of measurement that you need to see across

00:49:40.079 --> 00:49:41.980
the spectrum, how your body's performing, and

00:49:41.980 --> 00:49:44.739
then to show cause and effect and provide lifestyle

00:49:44.739 --> 00:49:48.559
first programs to improve those things. And,

00:49:48.599 --> 00:49:50.500
uh, it's, you know, it's pretty amazing the things

00:49:50.500 --> 00:49:52.300
you can accomplish in just four weeks. I dropped

00:49:52.300 --> 00:49:55.719
my, so I have a, a predisposition to heart disease

00:49:55.719 --> 00:49:59.840
in my family. Apo -lipoprotein B is an LDL cholesterol

00:49:59.840 --> 00:50:03.400
particle that is directly associated. It is the

00:50:03.400 --> 00:50:05.500
particle that builds up plaques in the arteries.

00:50:06.119 --> 00:50:10.440
So my ApoB was high. It was at 100. And following

00:50:10.440 --> 00:50:12.840
our lifestyle program for cardiovascular disease,

00:50:13.119 --> 00:50:16.519
I brought that from 100 to 73, which is well

00:50:16.519 --> 00:50:20.019
within the optimal range, in four weeks. 30 %

00:50:20.019 --> 00:50:22.059
reduction using just lifestyle. If you look at

00:50:22.059 --> 00:50:25.360
standard healthcare data, they're going to tell

00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:27.809
you that that is not possible. Only a medication

00:50:27.809 --> 00:50:31.070
can cause that. And so this is possible across

00:50:31.070 --> 00:50:32.570
many, many different types of markers, but you

00:50:32.570 --> 00:50:34.090
got to measure and you got to connect the dots

00:50:34.090 --> 00:50:36.989
between action and reaction. So anyway, it's

00:50:36.989 --> 00:50:41.230
a paradigm shift. Yeah, absolutely. Well, it's

00:50:41.230 --> 00:50:43.489
funny. First thing that you just made me think

00:50:43.489 --> 00:50:45.869
of something that I've never thought of before

00:50:45.869 --> 00:50:47.889
and I was never being presented anywhere I've

00:50:47.889 --> 00:50:49.750
ever worked, but it's just simply doing a baseline

00:50:49.750 --> 00:50:53.400
full blood work. at the front door before, you

00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:55.199
know, when you start in the fire service, because

00:50:55.199 --> 00:50:57.800
unless you come from another department, you

00:50:57.800 --> 00:51:00.360
would have, I'm assuming be a nine to fiver.

00:51:00.420 --> 00:51:03.159
You went to school. So as you begin, you should

00:51:03.159 --> 00:51:05.099
be at a good baseline. You're still young, you're

00:51:05.099 --> 00:51:07.159
still healthy. And then, like you said, if you've

00:51:07.159 --> 00:51:09.519
got quarterly, you know, markers and you can

00:51:09.519 --> 00:51:11.280
start to see trending, it doesn't, you know,

00:51:11.280 --> 00:51:13.139
one time, like you said, doesn't mean you're

00:51:13.139 --> 00:51:15.099
going to die, but if there's a continuous downward

00:51:15.099 --> 00:51:17.619
line, then yeah, there's some, some issues that

00:51:17.619 --> 00:51:20.940
need to be done. With the lifestyle change, one

00:51:20.940 --> 00:51:23.420
of the things that I saw with my own eyes, and

00:51:23.420 --> 00:51:26.199
I always got blood work done from an annual firefighter

00:51:26.199 --> 00:51:28.960
physical point of view. And again, not always

00:51:28.960 --> 00:51:31.900
as in -depth as we're talking about. But I went

00:51:31.900 --> 00:51:36.159
plant -based for about six months. And about

00:51:36.159 --> 00:51:38.679
two or three months into that, I had the annual

00:51:38.679 --> 00:51:41.719
physical again. And the doctor literally said

00:51:41.719 --> 00:51:45.019
to me, can you tell me how you eat? I've never

00:51:45.019 --> 00:51:48.039
seen such good blood work in my life. And all

00:51:48.039 --> 00:51:49.719
I had done is gone plant -based and I didn't

00:51:49.719 --> 00:51:51.659
stay plant -based, you know, but I mean, if you

00:51:51.659 --> 00:51:53.420
certainly, like you said, if you've got some

00:51:53.420 --> 00:51:55.940
markers that are off, I think the plant -based

00:51:55.940 --> 00:51:59.219
diet, if nothing else is amazing for recalibrate

00:51:59.219 --> 00:52:01.519
and get everything down. And then you can start

00:52:01.519 --> 00:52:03.360
putting meat back if, if that's what you choose.

00:52:03.940 --> 00:52:06.780
Absolutely. It's, it's so, it's so, uh, it's

00:52:06.780 --> 00:52:08.559
so incredible how much, and it's not surprising.

00:52:08.940 --> 00:52:11.099
I think a lot of us, myself included early on

00:52:11.099 --> 00:52:13.340
kind of roll our eyes at the nutrition dogma

00:52:13.340 --> 00:52:15.849
because there's so many competing. concepts and

00:52:15.849 --> 00:52:17.349
over the time over time you just kind of think

00:52:17.349 --> 00:52:19.010
you know what it's just calories like what's

00:52:19.010 --> 00:52:22.050
the difference well it the question is not are

00:52:22.050 --> 00:52:25.530
calories calories because that's a that's a thermodynamics

00:52:25.530 --> 00:52:27.389
question it's like yes every calorie is the same

00:52:27.389 --> 00:52:31.309
unit of energy but what what matters is our macronutrients

00:52:31.309 --> 00:52:34.030
macronutrients are all macronutrients equal and

00:52:34.030 --> 00:52:36.190
different nutritional philosophies and makeups

00:52:36.190 --> 00:52:38.630
like plant -based versus carnivore have completely

00:52:38.630 --> 00:52:40.849
different macronutrient content and that has

00:52:40.849 --> 00:52:44.239
a major impact so the con the Quantity of fats

00:52:44.239 --> 00:52:46.019
and proteins and sugars is totally different

00:52:46.019 --> 00:52:49.300
between them and fiber. And these are bioactive

00:52:49.300 --> 00:52:52.559
molecules that change the chemistry in your body.

00:52:52.719 --> 00:52:58.039
And it's incredible how fast you can affect massive

00:52:58.039 --> 00:53:01.519
numbers of markers. The ApoB change that I was

00:53:01.519 --> 00:53:04.820
able to achieve, I did that with a lot of animal

00:53:04.820 --> 00:53:07.579
protein. Typically, you're going to be told that

00:53:07.579 --> 00:53:09.260
you have to do a plant -based diet, and I've

00:53:09.260 --> 00:53:11.300
done these before, to bring cardiovascular markers

00:53:11.300 --> 00:53:14.309
down. But I did lean protein, low saturated fat,

00:53:14.489 --> 00:53:18.789
and I massively increased fiber. And that directly

00:53:18.789 --> 00:53:22.170
crashed my ApoB down by 30%. There's a long -term

00:53:22.170 --> 00:53:24.389
cardiovascular risk reduction right there that

00:53:24.389 --> 00:53:26.989
is equivalent to taking a medication. People

00:53:26.989 --> 00:53:28.610
would be really surprised and I think really

00:53:28.610 --> 00:53:31.949
empowered if they knew, like you did, how in

00:53:31.949 --> 00:53:35.550
control you are of these sorts of things. And

00:53:35.550 --> 00:53:39.940
so, you know, once again, like... Exactly as

00:53:39.940 --> 00:53:42.739
you said, what I envision for the future of healthcare,

00:53:43.059 --> 00:53:45.880
but certainly for high risk jobs, like this should

00:53:45.880 --> 00:53:49.000
be the basis, is a baselining when you first

00:53:49.000 --> 00:53:51.280
start and then a continual tracking so that we

00:53:51.280 --> 00:53:53.719
know directly when something starts to go awry.

00:53:53.780 --> 00:53:55.699
And if overall we're seeing an entire workforce

00:53:55.699 --> 00:54:00.139
where... The, you know, the veterans are sitting

00:54:00.139 --> 00:54:02.099
at a very low health state and the new people

00:54:02.099 --> 00:54:04.500
are on a trajectory to the same spot. We know

00:54:04.500 --> 00:54:06.199
we're doing something wrong, right? And it's

00:54:06.199 --> 00:54:08.280
like, there's no covering that up. I think the

00:54:08.280 --> 00:54:11.260
individuals will want this change and the infrastructure,

00:54:11.320 --> 00:54:13.380
the organization will want the change. And we

00:54:13.380 --> 00:54:15.699
will know, you know, how to, how to address that

00:54:15.699 --> 00:54:18.460
because we can connect lifestyle, specific lifestyle

00:54:18.460 --> 00:54:22.989
changes to outcomes in the body. Absolutely.

00:54:22.989 --> 00:54:25.130
One of the byproducts of the plant -based was

00:54:25.130 --> 00:54:27.650
I've never had such clean poos in my life. It

00:54:27.650 --> 00:54:30.530
was like the ghost wipe, as they call it. So

00:54:30.530 --> 00:54:32.789
that was a plus for anyone that's got an upset

00:54:32.789 --> 00:54:34.789
stomach. But yeah, but I mean, I've had this

00:54:34.789 --> 00:54:37.650
conversation. I've had vegans on the show and

00:54:37.650 --> 00:54:40.849
you hear these carnivores and they're just dying

00:54:40.849 --> 00:54:42.969
on their sword. But again, the middle ground

00:54:42.969 --> 00:54:45.570
is they're both removing the processed foods.

00:54:46.030 --> 00:54:48.150
you know ultimately that's what it is so you

00:54:48.150 --> 00:54:50.550
know if you choose to go all carnivore you know

00:54:50.550 --> 00:54:52.010
good for you if that works for your body type

00:54:52.010 --> 00:54:54.869
i kind of feel like historically humans have

00:54:54.869 --> 00:54:57.909
eaten you know fruits and vegetables too so and

00:54:57.909 --> 00:55:00.670
then the the meat side was probably more of a

00:55:00.670 --> 00:55:02.889
scavenger than a hunter for a long long time

00:55:02.889 --> 00:55:05.469
but i think that's why bone broth does well in

00:55:05.469 --> 00:55:07.530
humans because we were probably sucking out bone

00:55:07.530 --> 00:55:10.289
marrow years and years and years ago so i 100

00:55:10.289 --> 00:55:13.739
believe we were omnivores but you remove that

00:55:13.739 --> 00:55:15.639
process crap. And in my case, it was learning

00:55:15.639 --> 00:55:18.639
I was lactose intolerant after, you know, literally

00:55:18.639 --> 00:55:22.559
almost 40 years, which is late adopter. That

00:55:22.559 --> 00:55:24.360
was it. That was armor. And it was literally

00:55:24.360 --> 00:55:27.280
overnight. The moment I took dairy out and I

00:55:27.280 --> 00:55:28.820
actually put it back in again now because of

00:55:28.820 --> 00:55:32.119
the gut biome is kind of, um, a lot better than

00:55:32.119 --> 00:55:36.250
it was, but the, the number of. diseases that

00:55:36.250 --> 00:55:38.730
absolutely are reversible. And I think Forks

00:55:38.730 --> 00:55:40.449
Over Knives does a great job, even though it

00:55:40.449 --> 00:55:42.670
is a plant -based kind of leaning documentary.

00:55:43.329 --> 00:55:46.349
There's all these testimonies of kind of patients

00:55:46.349 --> 00:55:48.469
that the other doctors have just given up on

00:55:48.469 --> 00:55:50.829
that went with this doctor that put them on the

00:55:50.829 --> 00:55:52.570
plant base. And, you know, they were like, that

00:55:52.570 --> 00:55:55.469
was 20 years ago and here I am. So, you know,

00:55:55.469 --> 00:55:57.989
I think it's so empowering, like you said, using

00:55:57.989 --> 00:56:00.590
the word hope for people to realize just how

00:56:00.590 --> 00:56:04.849
much they can control their own health. If sadly...

00:56:05.039 --> 00:56:07.159
In some cases, they ignore what their doctor

00:56:07.159 --> 00:56:12.239
tells them. I think that the trend has been,

00:56:12.280 --> 00:56:14.039
and it's interesting, it calls back all the way

00:56:14.039 --> 00:56:17.760
to the COVID conversation, where we've seen this

00:56:17.760 --> 00:56:23.940
massive reduction in trust. I think that the

00:56:23.940 --> 00:56:26.860
average response these days when I talk to people

00:56:26.860 --> 00:56:28.940
about their quote -unquote healthcare strategy

00:56:28.940 --> 00:56:33.159
is, oh, I don't go to the doctor. I don't need

00:56:33.159 --> 00:56:36.400
that in my life. And I think it's because we

00:56:36.400 --> 00:56:39.119
we've all caught on to the fact that there's

00:56:39.119 --> 00:56:45.400
a there's a pretty clear lack of of personalization.

00:56:45.820 --> 00:56:52.179
The the one size fits all knee knee jerk reflexive

00:56:52.179 --> 00:56:55.559
15 minute appointment is just not cutting it.

00:56:55.599 --> 00:56:57.800
It does not convince us that what is being said

00:56:57.800 --> 00:57:00.219
is right. And and I think that's just like our

00:57:00.219 --> 00:57:04.280
own. We instinctively. develop this intuition

00:57:04.280 --> 00:57:07.900
about about uh information like we're always

00:57:07.900 --> 00:57:09.500
developing filters for what's right and what's

00:57:09.500 --> 00:57:11.340
not and we just we don't buy it when we're told

00:57:11.340 --> 00:57:14.800
the same thing that we've done already or that

00:57:14.800 --> 00:57:17.500
um that you know personally just simply doesn't

00:57:17.500 --> 00:57:19.539
fit with your own experience and this is why

00:57:19.539 --> 00:57:23.119
again i think that our healthcare system doctors

00:57:23.119 --> 00:57:27.880
need to stop being the prevention and and treatment

00:57:27.880 --> 00:57:31.500
arm for chronic illness again chronic illnesses

00:57:31.500 --> 00:57:34.909
did not exist by and large, a few decades ago.

00:57:35.510 --> 00:57:38.530
And the reason for this is multifactorial. But

00:57:38.530 --> 00:57:41.010
environmental toxins, the nutrition composition,

00:57:41.389 --> 00:57:43.809
ultra -processed foods, the amount of activity

00:57:43.809 --> 00:57:46.929
versus sedentary lifestyle, quality of our sleep,

00:57:47.090 --> 00:57:48.949
light pollution, you name it. There's so many

00:57:48.949 --> 00:57:51.090
reasons why this is all happening. But the fact

00:57:51.090 --> 00:57:53.750
is that our chronic illness is related to an

00:57:53.750 --> 00:57:56.969
abundance of different factors than have ever

00:57:56.969 --> 00:58:00.050
existed in human history. And doctors, the healthcare

00:58:00.050 --> 00:58:03.599
system, is built for trauma. it's built for car

00:58:03.599 --> 00:58:06.559
accidents it's built for knees or leg splints

00:58:06.559 --> 00:58:08.360
when there's a compound fracture it's built for

00:58:08.360 --> 00:58:13.579
you know incising out a tumor or non -communicable

00:58:13.579 --> 00:58:15.280
disease treatment like all of these things are

00:58:15.280 --> 00:58:16.840
what every dollar that goes into the healthcare

00:58:16.840 --> 00:58:19.219
system should be associated with but instead

00:58:19.219 --> 00:58:21.960
nine out of every ten dollars is being spent

00:58:21.960 --> 00:58:24.340
on chronic illness these things like diabetes

00:58:24.340 --> 00:58:26.880
and stroke and and uh and dementia and heart

00:58:26.880 --> 00:58:30.360
disease and that paradigm's broken we have to

00:58:30.360 --> 00:58:33.110
stop having doctors be the first line and we

00:58:33.110 --> 00:58:34.949
have to start providing products and services

00:58:34.949 --> 00:58:38.070
directly to individual people so that they can

00:58:38.070 --> 00:58:40.369
understand that they are the ones turning the

00:58:40.369 --> 00:58:42.190
knobs and pulling the levers that are affecting

00:58:42.190 --> 00:58:44.929
their health state and it's so powerful once

00:58:44.929 --> 00:58:46.909
you know that and you know that just the composition

00:58:46.909 --> 00:58:49.409
of your plate actually does have an incredibly

00:58:49.409 --> 00:58:53.250
powerful effect on your current and future health

00:58:53.250 --> 00:58:55.969
it immediately i think it just suddenly shuts

00:58:55.969 --> 00:58:57.670
down a part of the brain that is always on and

00:58:57.670 --> 00:58:59.329
always freaked out that something is going to

00:58:59.329 --> 00:59:01.369
quietly sneak up on you And now all of a sudden,

00:59:01.429 --> 00:59:03.110
you know, I can measure and I can take action

00:59:03.110 --> 00:59:06.050
and I can improve these things. So, yeah, I mean,

00:59:06.070 --> 00:59:08.670
it's really exciting in some way. It's frustrating

00:59:08.670 --> 00:59:10.489
to look at the system as it exists. And I know

00:59:10.489 --> 00:59:12.329
you feel this way about, you know, the work week

00:59:12.329 --> 00:59:14.929
and about all of the things that are broken about

00:59:14.929 --> 00:59:18.190
our first responder industry. I feel this way

00:59:18.190 --> 00:59:20.030
about the health care system. But I also know

00:59:20.030 --> 00:59:22.650
that the first domino has already fallen and

00:59:22.650 --> 00:59:24.369
the other dominoes are going to start falling

00:59:24.369 --> 00:59:26.730
quickly thereafter. As people are starting to

00:59:26.730 --> 00:59:28.309
catch on to this, the tools are becoming readily

00:59:28.309 --> 00:59:31.250
accessible and more affordable. And it's just

00:59:31.250 --> 00:59:32.650
a matter of time until this groundswell turns

00:59:32.650 --> 00:59:38.650
into the status quo, the new status quo. An interesting

00:59:38.650 --> 00:59:40.829
innovation was kind of brought to me about three

00:59:40.829 --> 00:59:43.349
or four years ago now. And it was the red tape

00:59:43.349 --> 00:59:46.030
that was cut, I think, during and after COVID

00:59:46.030 --> 00:59:49.210
that allowed this to progress more. But the telehealth

00:59:49.210 --> 00:59:53.570
embedding in 911. So you call, you know, you

00:59:53.570 --> 00:59:55.570
are a new parent. So you've got, you know, a

00:59:55.570 --> 00:59:58.030
young child. First time they had a fever, they

00:59:58.030 --> 00:59:59.710
thrown up and you're like, oh my God, you're

00:59:59.710 --> 01:00:02.489
kind of freaking out and you call 911. As of

01:00:02.489 --> 01:00:05.469
now, they send us, they send two paramedics and

01:00:05.469 --> 01:00:07.670
we come and, you know, if we're parents, we'll

01:00:07.670 --> 01:00:10.030
be even more calm and tell them, hey, you know,

01:00:10.030 --> 01:00:11.510
the fever will be fine. You just got to take

01:00:11.510 --> 01:00:13.190
them down, just leave them in a diaper. Do you

01:00:13.190 --> 01:00:15.309
have Tylenol? Okay, give them the pediatric dose.

01:00:15.650 --> 01:00:17.469
You know, we can take you to the hospital, but,

01:00:17.469 --> 01:00:19.230
you know, in all honesty, they're going to be

01:00:19.230 --> 01:00:21.579
much more comfortable here. And then if that's

01:00:21.579 --> 01:00:23.280
okay with you, you sign a refusal and off we

01:00:23.280 --> 01:00:26.360
go. That same exact process can be done through

01:00:26.360 --> 01:00:29.659
telehealth. So you call 911. And the way this

01:00:29.659 --> 01:00:32.780
company, GMR, describes it, you've got ALS, which

01:00:32.780 --> 01:00:35.960
is the true emergency, BLS, which would be broken

01:00:35.960 --> 01:00:40.079
leg or something. And then you have non -emergent.

01:00:40.079 --> 01:00:42.059
So there's third tier. And that's the one that

01:00:42.059 --> 01:00:44.019
would then be siphoned off, if the caller was

01:00:44.019 --> 01:00:47.679
okay with that, to a nurse, to a physician if

01:00:47.679 --> 01:00:50.099
you needed it. And they can do everything from...

01:00:50.579 --> 01:00:53.760
Set up urgent care clinics, you know, send an

01:00:53.760 --> 01:00:57.519
Uber to that person, you know, prescribe prescriptions

01:00:57.519 --> 01:00:59.420
if they do the telehealth with a physician and

01:00:59.420 --> 01:01:01.500
get that sent from a pharmacy. I mean, so many

01:01:01.500 --> 01:01:04.059
things that you would historically, you know,

01:01:04.059 --> 01:01:06.519
call 911 for either correctly or incorrectly.

01:01:06.940 --> 01:01:09.739
So it's, again, using my point being using this

01:01:09.739 --> 01:01:12.440
more advanced technology to take the pressure

01:01:12.440 --> 01:01:14.780
off the first responder profession. And it's

01:01:14.780 --> 01:01:17.280
cheaper for the patient, a lot cheaper. And now

01:01:17.280 --> 01:01:20.039
you've freed up an ER bed for. as you said, the

01:01:20.039 --> 01:01:22.280
real emergencies, the car accidents and the strokes

01:01:22.280 --> 01:01:26.420
and all the things. So with that being said,

01:01:26.639 --> 01:01:29.639
we keep hearing about AI, and I'm sure that AI

01:01:29.639 --> 01:01:33.099
now, as we talk in 2025, five years later, is

01:01:33.099 --> 01:01:37.219
a completely different animal than 2020. So what

01:01:37.219 --> 01:01:41.679
exciting possibilities are there now for this

01:01:41.679 --> 01:01:45.019
AI technology to analyze these data points that

01:01:45.019 --> 01:01:47.280
you're getting from the monitoring and the blood

01:01:47.280 --> 01:01:51.280
work? It's unbelievable. The changes in the past

01:01:51.280 --> 01:01:53.539
five years. And I think that the bottom line,

01:01:53.559 --> 01:01:55.079
the most important thing for all of us to think

01:01:55.079 --> 01:02:01.260
about is that AI is a tool. And what I'm most

01:02:01.260 --> 01:02:06.280
impressed by is the ability for these models

01:02:06.280 --> 01:02:09.300
to take incredibly complicated, fragmented information

01:02:09.300 --> 01:02:12.900
and make a clear and consistent pattern recognition

01:02:12.900 --> 01:02:15.139
out of it. This is something that humans are

01:02:15.139 --> 01:02:18.650
okay at. But actually, we're very prone to biases.

01:02:18.809 --> 01:02:24.210
So like frequency or recency bias. So the more

01:02:24.210 --> 01:02:26.389
times you see a certain thing, if you're a doctor,

01:02:26.510 --> 01:02:29.070
the more likely you are to assume that a similar

01:02:29.070 --> 01:02:31.949
circumstance is that same thing. The more recently

01:02:31.949 --> 01:02:34.230
that you've seen a certain case, and this has

01:02:34.230 --> 01:02:36.429
all been studied, the more likely a doctor is

01:02:36.429 --> 01:02:39.489
to diagnose a new case as that thing they saw

01:02:39.489 --> 01:02:41.969
most recently. So we're prone to these things.

01:02:42.389 --> 01:02:44.809
AI, when properly trained with the right data

01:02:44.809 --> 01:02:47.000
sets, is not prone to those things it has other

01:02:47.000 --> 01:02:50.059
issues but the the models that we're going to

01:02:50.059 --> 01:02:52.420
see emerge in in the healthcare world and that

01:02:52.420 --> 01:02:55.780
levels is is already working with are unbelievably

01:02:55.780 --> 01:02:59.519
powerful at identifying subtle pattern changes

01:02:59.519 --> 01:03:02.760
that a human would completely miss and surfacing

01:03:02.760 --> 01:03:06.420
those as priorities to pay attention to and um

01:03:06.420 --> 01:03:11.849
and this can be you know, directly correlating

01:03:11.849 --> 01:03:14.369
like changes in insulin resistance with fertility,

01:03:14.570 --> 01:03:16.190
which, you know, a lot of people don't connect

01:03:16.190 --> 01:03:18.530
those dots, like systems level stuff that's very

01:03:18.530 --> 01:03:21.170
straightforward. It can also be like multiple

01:03:21.170 --> 01:03:25.550
steps removed where the data is out there in

01:03:25.550 --> 01:03:27.429
the ecosystem, the AI has been trained on it,

01:03:27.449 --> 01:03:29.409
but a doctor has never read that paper. And so

01:03:29.409 --> 01:03:32.650
it knows the correlation between a specific symptom

01:03:32.650 --> 01:03:36.250
or set of behaviors and the onset of, for example,

01:03:36.250 --> 01:03:40.630
a cancer. And so what we're able to do is just

01:03:40.630 --> 01:03:44.329
put a lot of, offload a lot of the raw analysis

01:03:44.329 --> 01:03:46.809
to these AI tools. So you could, you know, what

01:03:46.809 --> 01:03:49.190
Levels is building is the ability for, first

01:03:49.190 --> 01:03:51.929
of all, people who use Levels own and control

01:03:51.929 --> 01:03:54.510
their entire data set. It's yours. You can export

01:03:54.510 --> 01:03:56.670
it. You can delete it. It's yours. We never sell

01:03:56.670 --> 01:03:58.730
it. We never send it to any third parties without

01:03:58.730 --> 01:04:02.030
your permission. And then we think that that's

01:04:02.030 --> 01:04:03.710
super critical. Like I've said all through this

01:04:03.710 --> 01:04:06.780
conversation. People need to have control and

01:04:06.780 --> 01:04:08.900
empowerment over their data. And one of the most

01:04:08.900 --> 01:04:10.539
powerful things that we're building the capability

01:04:10.539 --> 01:04:13.119
for people to do is to add all of their health

01:04:13.119 --> 01:04:15.280
record data. So all of your labs, all of your

01:04:15.280 --> 01:04:19.079
body image scans, MRIs, DEXA scans, cardiovascular

01:04:19.079 --> 01:04:22.139
scans, anything that you've ever developed that

01:04:22.139 --> 01:04:25.280
is in combination your health record, to add

01:04:25.280 --> 01:04:28.340
that into the tool that Levels has built. And

01:04:28.340 --> 01:04:32.659
then to basically talk to an AI about it. And

01:04:32.659 --> 01:04:35.340
to get specifically a complete interpretation

01:04:35.340 --> 01:04:38.699
of that combined health record that tells you

01:04:38.699 --> 01:04:41.360
the most you'll ever know, in my experience,

01:04:41.500 --> 01:04:43.860
the most comprehensive look at my own health

01:04:43.860 --> 01:04:46.320
state that I've ever seen comes from these models.

01:04:46.500 --> 01:04:48.679
And they're infinitely patient. They can talk

01:04:48.679 --> 01:04:50.380
to anyone regardless of your education level

01:04:50.380 --> 01:04:53.000
and explain to you why you may be experiencing

01:04:53.000 --> 01:04:55.420
the symptoms you are experiencing, why you may

01:04:55.420 --> 01:04:59.090
be predisposed to X, Y, or Z. And then what to

01:04:59.090 --> 01:05:00.949
do about it. And so it's not that it's going

01:05:00.949 --> 01:05:03.349
to replace doctors. It's that it's going to be

01:05:03.349 --> 01:05:06.230
able to facilitate a much more informed conversation,

01:05:06.469 --> 01:05:09.250
both for the doctor and for the patient. And

01:05:09.250 --> 01:05:11.550
so we have with levels, like I said, we've got

01:05:11.550 --> 01:05:14.730
blood work, CGM. We have these AI tools that

01:05:14.730 --> 01:05:17.329
do a lot of really powerful interpretation. And

01:05:17.329 --> 01:05:19.329
then we have clinicians that review and validate

01:05:19.329 --> 01:05:23.909
the health state information, right? They provide

01:05:23.909 --> 01:05:28.750
a validated human. expert opinion on where your

01:05:28.750 --> 01:05:30.429
health priorities lie and what you can do about

01:05:30.429 --> 01:05:32.809
it. And a lot of this is very informed and facilitated

01:05:32.809 --> 01:05:35.409
by AI models. It's just like they're so seamlessly

01:05:35.409 --> 01:05:37.610
integrated now through the experience. They're

01:05:37.610 --> 01:05:40.210
providing leverage across the experience in this

01:05:40.210 --> 01:05:43.969
incredible way. And relative to 2019, there was

01:05:43.969 --> 01:05:45.389
nothing even close. You know, we were using them

01:05:45.389 --> 01:05:48.670
just to generate very small snippets and they

01:05:48.670 --> 01:05:50.710
were not intelligent. They were not, you know,

01:05:50.710 --> 01:05:53.530
cross -functional. It's really night and day

01:05:53.530 --> 01:05:55.289
changed. And we're only we have not yet seen

01:05:55.289 --> 01:05:57.190
the outcome. what it's going to do for human

01:05:57.190 --> 01:06:01.449
health well also for comedy because i've seen

01:06:01.449 --> 01:06:03.929
ai videos of the queen rapping in a jamaican

01:06:03.929 --> 01:06:06.170
accent which is my highlight of every day now

01:06:06.170 --> 01:06:09.510
so that too yeah they uh they have some creativity

01:06:09.510 --> 01:06:13.489
i guess going back on a serious point though

01:06:13.489 --> 01:06:15.429
with the doctors because i want to make sure

01:06:15.429 --> 01:06:17.010
that you know that we're underlying the fact

01:06:17.010 --> 01:06:19.349
that it's not demonizing doctors at all and that

01:06:19.349 --> 01:06:22.150
i really empathize with the fact that you know

01:06:22.150 --> 01:06:24.920
the good physicians don't get enough time with

01:06:24.920 --> 01:06:26.159
the patient and i was thinking when you were

01:06:26.159 --> 01:06:28.900
talking if you or i went to a hospital for a

01:06:28.900 --> 01:06:32.079
thing how many hours and days would we be there

01:06:32.079 --> 01:06:34.059
while they're running all these tests before

01:06:34.059 --> 01:06:36.800
you can actually say okay this is this is it

01:06:36.800 --> 01:06:38.239
and you're expecting someone to come up with

01:06:38.239 --> 01:06:40.559
that in 15 minutes someone that maybe walks through

01:06:40.559 --> 01:06:42.559
a door and is asking for a specific medication

01:06:42.559 --> 01:06:47.389
as well so The same way as when you change the

01:06:47.389 --> 01:06:49.409
work week, change the start time in the fire

01:06:49.409 --> 01:06:52.250
service, and then put in telehealth, you would

01:06:52.250 --> 01:06:55.730
free up so much more time for police, fire, EMS,

01:06:55.949 --> 01:06:59.590
or certainly fire and EMS, my world, to then

01:06:59.590 --> 01:07:01.909
work on their fitness, work on their training,

01:07:02.050 --> 01:07:05.710
and be a much better first responder. I think

01:07:05.710 --> 01:07:08.190
this is going to be an amazing tool to alleviate

01:07:08.190 --> 01:07:11.289
the pressure on our healthcare system. I think

01:07:11.289 --> 01:07:14.159
the NHS, which I talk about all the time, When

01:07:14.159 --> 01:07:17.340
I was young, the NHS was incredible before privatization,

01:07:17.400 --> 01:07:20.619
before the obesity epidemic hit the UK as well,

01:07:20.679 --> 01:07:23.219
which breaks my heart when I go home now. But

01:07:23.219 --> 01:07:25.679
it's no wonder that it's crumbling. It's a great

01:07:25.679 --> 01:07:27.940
system, but it was allowed to be picked apart

01:07:27.940 --> 01:07:31.280
financially. And then the Brits got fatter and

01:07:31.280 --> 01:07:33.880
sicker, to put it bluntly. So if you can reverse

01:07:33.880 --> 01:07:37.860
that and just reserve that taxpayer's money for

01:07:37.860 --> 01:07:41.159
childbirths, the elderly, car accidents, cancers,

01:07:41.360 --> 01:07:43.969
et cetera, just like you said. then there would

01:07:43.969 --> 01:07:47.289
be plenty of beds and doctors and nurses. So

01:07:47.289 --> 01:07:49.949
it sounds like AI, telehealth, I mean, all these

01:07:49.949 --> 01:07:52.690
tools that we're seeing coming up now would actually

01:07:52.690 --> 01:07:55.610
be a blessing for healthcare, a blessing for

01:07:55.610 --> 01:07:58.570
first responders, so that we actually then can

01:07:58.570 --> 01:08:01.090
have the rest and recovery to perform at the

01:08:01.090 --> 01:08:04.530
highest level. And that surgeon wouldn't be overwhelmed

01:08:04.530 --> 01:08:07.269
and could come in after a good night's sleep

01:08:07.269 --> 01:08:10.110
and then perform that surgery. No doubt in my

01:08:10.110 --> 01:08:15.079
mind. I think the AI tools will end up, you'll

01:08:15.079 --> 01:08:20.140
end up with something like a personal model that

01:08:20.140 --> 01:08:23.659
takes all of your data and does the absolute

01:08:23.659 --> 01:08:26.859
best job. It's almost like a digital twin. You

01:08:26.859 --> 01:08:29.819
might hear this term often, but does the best

01:08:29.819 --> 01:08:35.260
possible job of representing your personal health

01:08:35.260 --> 01:08:37.920
in real time. That will be an AI model of sorts

01:08:37.920 --> 01:08:41.370
that you'll constantly be interacting with. And

01:08:41.370 --> 01:08:43.050
providing it with updated information, whether

01:08:43.050 --> 01:08:46.829
it's new tests or describing by documenting what

01:08:46.829 --> 01:08:50.689
you're eating on a daily basis or the sleep quality

01:08:50.689 --> 01:08:52.430
coming off of your wristwatch, it'll constantly

01:08:52.430 --> 01:08:54.569
be evolving and really be the real -time representation

01:08:54.569 --> 01:08:56.770
of your health. So that will be in and of itself

01:08:56.770 --> 01:08:59.409
an AI tool. And the beauty is that it will be

01:08:59.409 --> 01:09:01.609
able to communicate with you. So what I love

01:09:01.609 --> 01:09:05.569
about the models, these LLMs that have exploded

01:09:05.569 --> 01:09:08.819
over the past few years, is that they're... such

01:09:08.819 --> 01:09:12.340
a simple interface to complex stuff, right? You're

01:09:12.340 --> 01:09:14.560
able to just talk to it in human language. And

01:09:14.560 --> 01:09:16.739
it's such an incredible, like miraculous, almost

01:09:16.739 --> 01:09:19.340
tech capability to be able to talk to a code

01:09:19.340 --> 01:09:21.640
base essentially about incredibly complex topics.

01:09:21.819 --> 01:09:23.359
But you'll be able to communicate with your own

01:09:23.359 --> 01:09:25.359
health, which is like kind of a weird concept,

01:09:25.479 --> 01:09:28.180
but very, very, very, very much coming soon.

01:09:29.180 --> 01:09:34.960
And then we will have at a larger scale the AI

01:09:34.960 --> 01:09:37.619
models that will be supporting the health system.

01:09:38.010 --> 01:09:40.649
doctors and nurses will will have their own i

01:09:40.649 --> 01:09:43.829
think their own assistant of sorts that really

01:09:43.829 --> 01:09:45.949
helps them with their own personal philosophy

01:09:45.949 --> 01:09:47.409
right everybody's got their own bedside manner

01:09:47.409 --> 01:09:48.829
they've got their own experiences they've got

01:09:48.829 --> 01:09:51.130
their own skill sets they'll be supplemented

01:09:51.130 --> 01:09:53.050
with these incredibly powerful models so that

01:09:53.050 --> 01:09:54.649
when somebody comes to them they'll be able to

01:09:54.649 --> 01:09:56.630
take the the digital twin information from that

01:09:56.630 --> 01:09:59.329
person's health interpret it through their own

01:09:59.329 --> 01:10:03.210
model and lens and then provide real humanized

01:10:03.210 --> 01:10:05.369
health care right the human element is what's

01:10:05.369 --> 01:10:07.289
going to be able to shine because that doctor

01:10:07.289 --> 01:10:10.489
isn't trying to cram interpretation analysis

01:10:10.489 --> 01:10:15.510
and diagnosis into a 15 -minute slot. They'll

01:10:15.510 --> 01:10:18.430
be able to, maybe even remotely, take all that

01:10:18.430 --> 01:10:22.090
data in, do all of the complicated work through

01:10:22.090 --> 01:10:24.350
the AI, and then spend most of the time working

01:10:24.350 --> 01:10:26.390
on a humanized plan to help this person improve

01:10:26.390 --> 01:10:29.270
as necessary. Or an intervention, right? Like

01:10:29.270 --> 01:10:31.789
going directly to fixing the problem. And so

01:10:31.789 --> 01:10:34.670
I think that I'm very bullish about this. It's

01:10:34.670 --> 01:10:38.279
really important that... people that people own

01:10:38.279 --> 01:10:43.319
the, the AI health wave. I think that's, that's

01:10:43.319 --> 01:10:45.380
really important that it doesn't just, you know,

01:10:45.380 --> 01:10:47.000
come through the healthcare system. There has

01:10:47.000 --> 01:10:50.119
to be the personal side of this in order for

01:10:50.119 --> 01:10:53.119
it to really be as good as it can be. And regulations

01:10:53.119 --> 01:10:56.119
have to have to play nice. You know, it's, I

01:10:56.119 --> 01:10:58.560
would really hate to see a bunch of fear mongering

01:10:58.560 --> 01:11:02.560
and, um, and like oppressive state by state regulation

01:11:02.560 --> 01:11:06.539
today, every state. has its own health care and

01:11:06.539 --> 01:11:08.739
medical regulations. So a doctor in New York

01:11:08.739 --> 01:11:11.960
cannot treat a patient in New Jersey who literally

01:11:11.960 --> 01:11:15.800
may live one mile away. And so that's silly.

01:11:16.079 --> 01:11:18.340
If we end up with something similar and we like

01:11:18.340 --> 01:11:21.859
fracture the regulatory environment in similar

01:11:21.859 --> 01:11:24.399
ways, it's for AI or for these health care tools.

01:11:24.560 --> 01:11:26.979
We're just going to like delay the capability

01:11:26.979 --> 01:11:30.159
for them to to improve our health by who knows,

01:11:30.279 --> 01:11:35.529
decades. We have the same thing in the fire service

01:11:35.529 --> 01:11:37.609
where there's not reciprocity in a lot of states.

01:11:37.949 --> 01:11:40.710
And literally, you have fire engines with hose

01:11:40.710 --> 01:11:44.090
and you have trucks with ladders. And yes, there

01:11:44.090 --> 01:11:46.130
are some idiosyncrasies depending on where you

01:11:46.130 --> 01:11:50.229
work in the country. But at its core, 90 % of

01:11:50.229 --> 01:11:52.529
what we do is identical. So that's the conversation

01:11:52.529 --> 01:11:55.310
now as we look at the recruitment crisis is how

01:11:55.310 --> 01:11:57.930
many people need to move state from family or

01:11:57.930 --> 01:11:59.350
whatever it is. They just want to get out the

01:11:59.350 --> 01:12:02.810
cold. um take those barriers down because they're

01:12:02.810 --> 01:12:05.689
literally pointless and of course do an orientation

01:12:05.689 --> 01:12:08.069
and academy for that department so you learn

01:12:08.069 --> 01:12:10.430
you know the florida way the buffalo way whatever

01:12:10.430 --> 01:12:13.569
it is and then uh yeah have a probation to make

01:12:13.569 --> 01:12:15.909
sure that person is is a good employee but i

01:12:15.909 --> 01:12:17.670
mean the fact that we have these these barriers

01:12:17.670 --> 01:12:20.890
up is is insane it really is absolutely yeah

01:12:20.890 --> 01:12:23.630
it's um there's a lot of things that have to

01:12:23.630 --> 01:12:25.810
change but the pace feels really high right now

01:12:25.810 --> 01:12:27.750
you know things are things are changing in the

01:12:27.750 --> 01:12:31.319
technology world really rapidly A lot of the

01:12:31.319 --> 01:12:33.260
technology, frustratingly, has existed for a

01:12:33.260 --> 01:12:37.479
very long time. Many of the tests and just raw

01:12:37.479 --> 01:12:40.680
technology to give people better control of their

01:12:40.680 --> 01:12:43.640
health care has been around for decades. And

01:12:43.640 --> 01:12:46.859
it's really difficult to comprehend the amount

01:12:46.859 --> 01:12:49.699
of unnecessary loss of life and quality of life

01:12:49.699 --> 01:12:53.460
that we've suffered just because those tools

01:12:53.460 --> 01:12:56.380
have been inaccessible or directly gatekept out

01:12:56.380 --> 01:13:00.720
of people's hands. I'm really working with my

01:13:00.720 --> 01:13:04.939
parents to help them get the tests that I know

01:13:04.939 --> 01:13:06.739
that they need to better understand their cardiovascular

01:13:06.739 --> 01:13:08.579
health and their metabolic health. Because as

01:13:08.579 --> 01:13:12.779
they get older, the risk goes up exponentially.

01:13:13.720 --> 01:13:17.579
And it's so difficult for them. They're just

01:13:17.579 --> 01:13:19.199
having to deal with all this coordination and

01:13:19.199 --> 01:13:21.500
these complicated demands and requirements. And

01:13:21.500 --> 01:13:23.659
there's faxes and there's emails. And it's just

01:13:23.659 --> 01:13:25.739
so broken. It's so bad. The product experience

01:13:25.739 --> 01:13:30.329
of healthcare is so terrible. i hope that people

01:13:30.329 --> 01:13:35.189
start demanding alternatives and and and uh you

01:13:35.189 --> 01:13:37.229
know whether that's at the political level or

01:13:37.229 --> 01:13:41.630
or at the um you know at the personal like at

01:13:41.630 --> 01:13:43.409
the healthcare system level where you walk in

01:13:43.409 --> 01:13:44.970
and you just get poor service i hope that we

01:13:44.970 --> 01:13:47.430
start finding ways to to provide feedback into

01:13:47.430 --> 01:13:50.810
that system because it's just you know it's so

01:13:50.810 --> 01:13:52.930
depressing And at the same time, I look on the

01:13:52.930 --> 01:13:54.609
other side, I look at the technology space and

01:13:54.609 --> 01:13:56.850
I look at the pace of AI models and at the next

01:13:56.850 --> 01:13:59.229
generation technologies that are around the corner.

01:13:59.310 --> 01:14:02.390
And I'm like, there's a space age future of incredible

01:14:02.390 --> 01:14:05.449
health around the corner. And I don't know how

01:14:05.449 --> 01:14:07.550
these things are going to, I really can't picture

01:14:07.550 --> 01:14:09.029
how they're going to merge because it's like,

01:14:09.029 --> 01:14:12.050
they're so different, but I'm optimistic. I'm

01:14:12.050 --> 01:14:17.380
staying optimistic. Well, going to the actual

01:14:17.380 --> 01:14:19.420
product, Ben, talk to me about the different

01:14:19.420 --> 01:14:21.739
levels that you offer as far as the tools that

01:14:21.739 --> 01:14:24.819
people get for that subscription. Yeah, so we

01:14:24.819 --> 01:14:28.260
offer three experiences, we call them. Levels

01:14:28.260 --> 01:14:31.680
Classic is for the person who wants to really

01:14:31.680 --> 01:14:35.859
have an open exploration of continuous glucose

01:14:35.859 --> 01:14:38.520
data. So it's really about getting a CGM sensor

01:14:38.520 --> 01:14:42.460
and using the Levels app to explore how different

01:14:42.460 --> 01:14:46.609
actions and reactions occur. self -exploration

01:14:46.609 --> 01:14:49.909
with a continuous glucose monitor. And this is

01:14:49.909 --> 01:14:54.649
prompted by and with feedback from our app, exploring

01:14:54.649 --> 01:14:57.069
nutrition, various food types, portion sizes,

01:14:57.350 --> 01:15:00.710
timing, all that stuff, exercise, impact, sleep,

01:15:00.989 --> 01:15:04.510
and even stress state. So it's a really nice

01:15:04.510 --> 01:15:06.069
way to get started and to try this incredible

01:15:06.069 --> 01:15:10.529
tool. The next is Levels Core, which is our most

01:15:10.529 --> 01:15:16.250
popular package right now. You get a 28 marker,

01:15:16.369 --> 01:15:19.430
a very high value 28 marker blood panel, along

01:15:19.430 --> 01:15:24.229
with a CGM twice per year. And you do these basically

01:15:24.229 --> 01:15:26.890
periods of analysis or measurement where you're

01:15:26.890 --> 01:15:28.989
wearing the CGM, you're logging nutrition, exercise,

01:15:29.090 --> 01:15:31.550
sleep. All of that gets combined with the blood

01:15:31.550 --> 01:15:34.649
biomarkers. And then you get one of our licensed

01:15:34.649 --> 01:15:37.609
clinicians in your state. reviews and analyzes

01:15:37.609 --> 01:15:39.470
all of that data and provides recommendations

01:15:39.470 --> 01:15:42.310
for how to improve specifically the biomarkers

01:15:42.310 --> 01:15:44.649
that are of highest priority for you. And so

01:15:44.649 --> 01:15:46.569
by doing that twice per year, you have a really

01:15:46.569 --> 01:15:49.550
nice cadence to check in and see the improvements

01:15:49.550 --> 01:15:51.649
as they've happened. And then Levels Complete

01:15:51.649 --> 01:15:55.189
goes even deeper. It's a 100 marker panel twice

01:15:55.189 --> 01:15:57.489
per year. It's the same clinician analysis. There's

01:15:57.489 --> 01:15:59.670
four CGMs instead of two, so people can wear

01:15:59.670 --> 01:16:03.409
one per quarter. And you're really getting an

01:16:03.409 --> 01:16:06.289
incredibly deep profile of your health consistently.

01:16:06.729 --> 01:16:09.810
And these in -app programs combined with Levels

01:16:09.810 --> 01:16:12.289
coaches. So our coaches are there with you continuously.

01:16:12.869 --> 01:16:15.310
You know, some people like lots of interaction

01:16:15.310 --> 01:16:17.109
with the coaches. Some people like very little.

01:16:17.210 --> 01:16:18.810
But bottom line, they're there to support your

01:16:18.810 --> 01:16:20.829
experience. And that's where, you know, through

01:16:20.829 --> 01:16:22.510
Levels Complete, we get some really incredible

01:16:22.510 --> 01:16:25.630
results across biomarker improvement because,

01:16:25.670 --> 01:16:28.109
you know, we've got that extra element of coaching

01:16:28.109 --> 01:16:31.619
there and the depth of the blood panels. So overall,

01:16:31.760 --> 01:16:34.899
the packages are, they're sort of replacing a

01:16:34.899 --> 01:16:38.039
metabolic health clinic. You would, you pay a

01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:39.800
lot more and go to one of these concierge clinics

01:16:39.800 --> 01:16:41.600
and they would give, you know, probably a comparable

01:16:41.600 --> 01:16:44.199
suite of services with levels. It's very convenient.

01:16:44.279 --> 01:16:46.399
It's all done e -commerce. You can just order

01:16:46.399 --> 01:16:48.460
online, interact with us all through the internet.

01:16:48.520 --> 01:16:51.340
And then you get, in addition, the sort of health

01:16:51.340 --> 01:16:53.239
record I was describing previously and all of

01:16:53.239 --> 01:16:55.520
the AI tools for interpretation and in -app programs

01:16:55.520 --> 01:17:00.250
are all built into all of the experiences. See,

01:17:00.289 --> 01:17:01.829
what I like about this, I was just actually on

01:17:01.829 --> 01:17:05.470
the phone to a company that one of the first

01:17:05.470 --> 01:17:08.189
departments in Florida went to the 42 hour work

01:17:08.189 --> 01:17:10.909
week. Their chief, Hugh Bruder, was telling me,

01:17:10.930 --> 01:17:13.289
and it's like a full body MRI. And apparently

01:17:13.289 --> 01:17:15.710
they're catching all kinds of things, which is

01:17:15.710 --> 01:17:19.109
phenomenal. But that's still things are already

01:17:19.109 --> 01:17:20.850
starting to go wrong. The engine light is on,

01:17:20.890 --> 01:17:24.449
as you said. But what I like about, especially

01:17:24.449 --> 01:17:26.270
if you're able to do it at the front door with

01:17:26.270 --> 01:17:28.939
this baseline testing is, you know, these. six

01:17:28.939 --> 01:17:32.159
monthly blood draws and like you said cgm and

01:17:32.159 --> 01:17:34.380
the analysis is that you can constantly keep

01:17:34.380 --> 01:17:37.840
tweaking it rather than waiting you know 15 20

01:17:37.840 --> 01:17:40.859
years and now there's a mass in your your skull

01:17:40.859 --> 01:17:42.560
or whatever it is that well i'm glad you caught

01:17:42.560 --> 01:17:44.819
it but it would have been great not to have got

01:17:44.819 --> 01:17:47.439
this in the first place so uh you know those

01:17:47.439 --> 01:17:49.159
two hand in hand i think would be phenomenal

01:17:49.159 --> 01:17:52.100
you get this full kind of um you know comprehensive

01:17:52.100 --> 01:17:57.180
internal um ongoing tracking, if you like, with

01:17:57.180 --> 01:17:59.300
blood work, but then you also get the, okay,

01:17:59.340 --> 01:18:01.460
let me just do a Xerox of my body and make sure,

01:18:01.520 --> 01:18:03.920
you know, we're not missing anything. So those

01:18:03.920 --> 01:18:06.159
two side by side, I think would be phenomenal.

01:18:06.319 --> 01:18:08.579
And I know the, you know, the investment per

01:18:08.579 --> 01:18:11.699
firefighter versus how much it would cost for,

01:18:11.699 --> 01:18:14.779
you know, chemotherapy for some sort of surgery

01:18:14.779 --> 01:18:17.619
or, you know, a lifetime of drugs. I mean, it

01:18:17.619 --> 01:18:20.640
would be, you know, so much more cost effective.

01:18:21.199 --> 01:18:24.239
Absolutely. Yeah. There's an initiative that

01:18:24.239 --> 01:18:27.640
we're taking on right now, which is to bring

01:18:27.640 --> 01:18:31.819
our packages, our comprehensive health tracking

01:18:31.819 --> 01:18:34.399
and improvement packages to first responder teams.

01:18:34.779 --> 01:18:36.939
Because I think that that, once again, you know,

01:18:36.939 --> 01:18:43.520
it's one of the most acute examples where when

01:18:43.520 --> 01:18:45.939
we don't pay close attention to the changes and

01:18:45.939 --> 01:18:48.039
to the current health state, there are dramatic

01:18:48.039 --> 01:18:51.039
consequences. And so we really want to equip

01:18:51.039 --> 01:18:53.960
teams to be able to baseline all of their members,

01:18:54.140 --> 01:18:56.720
especially as somebody new shows up, understanding

01:18:56.720 --> 01:18:59.579
where their starting point is, and then be that

01:18:59.579 --> 01:19:05.479
constant background health trend as life plays

01:19:05.479 --> 01:19:08.479
out and to identify ways to keep people healthier.

01:19:08.979 --> 01:19:13.300
I think that you mentioned MRI. And with the

01:19:13.300 --> 01:19:18.989
hazards of fire and first responding, cancer

01:19:18.989 --> 01:19:20.569
and heart disease are towards the top of the

01:19:20.569 --> 01:19:23.510
list. And there's some really powerful tools

01:19:23.510 --> 01:19:26.510
just to kind of rattle off the ones that I personally

01:19:26.510 --> 01:19:30.409
use or know are providing a ton of value. On

01:19:30.409 --> 01:19:33.369
the cancer side, there are two, I think, really

01:19:33.369 --> 01:19:35.569
phenomenal tools. There's full body MRI, like

01:19:35.569 --> 01:19:38.229
you mentioned, where you can get just like a

01:19:38.229 --> 01:19:39.850
complete Xerox, there's no radiation involved.

01:19:40.670 --> 01:19:43.229
And they can look for masses through all the

01:19:43.229 --> 01:19:44.810
soft tissues in your body and just generally

01:19:44.810 --> 01:19:47.489
look at even like joint health and some really

01:19:47.770 --> 01:19:51.270
really great like blueprinting but if you do

01:19:51.270 --> 01:19:55.029
see something in that scan the beauty is you

01:19:55.029 --> 01:19:58.229
can you can look do another one right these these

01:19:58.229 --> 01:19:59.890
are readily accessible tools and so you can see

01:19:59.890 --> 01:20:02.729
is that is that mass evolving or changing and

01:20:02.729 --> 01:20:05.489
so it's a it's a really awesome way of staying

01:20:05.489 --> 01:20:07.489
up to speed on the soft tissue health and then

01:20:07.489 --> 01:20:09.689
there's this tool called liquid biopsy which

01:20:09.689 --> 01:20:13.350
is a which is a grail gallery test which is a

01:20:13.350 --> 01:20:15.470
blood test but it looks for cancer dna it looks

01:20:15.470 --> 01:20:19.949
for for fragments of cancer that could be circulating

01:20:19.949 --> 01:20:22.890
in the bloodstream because tumors shed, right?

01:20:22.949 --> 01:20:24.949
And it doesn't necessarily tell you where cancer

01:20:24.949 --> 01:20:27.189
might be developing, but it's a really powerful

01:20:27.189 --> 01:20:28.989
tool to look, once again, through a blood test

01:20:28.989 --> 01:20:31.069
for, I think there's like over 50 types of cancer

01:20:31.069 --> 01:20:34.050
that are captured with this. So another really

01:20:34.050 --> 01:20:38.350
awesome early test. And then I could go on, like

01:20:38.350 --> 01:20:40.649
on the heart disease side, there's just no replacement

01:20:40.649 --> 01:20:42.689
for consistent blood work. Heart disease is such

01:20:42.689 --> 01:20:45.390
a major, it is the number one killer across the

01:20:45.390 --> 01:20:48.529
United States. Men and women die from heart disease

01:20:48.529 --> 01:20:51.850
above everything else. And it is a preventable

01:20:51.850 --> 01:20:56.510
disease for 99 % of people. The legs of the stool

01:20:56.510 --> 01:21:01.189
that most affect heart disease are blood lipids,

01:21:01.189 --> 01:21:03.390
so cholesterol particles, bad cholesterol particles

01:21:03.390 --> 01:21:06.609
in the bloodstream, and inflammation. And the

01:21:06.609 --> 01:21:09.989
combination of those two is an absolutely devastating

01:21:09.989 --> 01:21:12.569
impact on artery health, and that eventually

01:21:12.569 --> 01:21:15.069
leads to plaques that build up and then a heart

01:21:15.069 --> 01:21:17.850
attack. And the things that can drive inflammation,

01:21:18.090 --> 01:21:20.090
there's a lot of them, but environmental toxins

01:21:20.090 --> 01:21:25.289
in particular is a major driver. So we're working

01:21:25.289 --> 01:21:28.130
with this new company kind of in stealth right

01:21:28.130 --> 01:21:31.069
now that has developed this incredible 300 marker

01:21:31.069 --> 01:21:33.270
environmental toxin panel that's going to become

01:21:33.270 --> 01:21:35.869
available quite soon. And we will provide that

01:21:35.869 --> 01:21:37.989
through Levels Complete. And so that'll be looking

01:21:37.989 --> 01:21:41.270
at PFAS and glyphosate and all these environmental

01:21:41.270 --> 01:21:44.300
toxins that are coming through our systems. That

01:21:44.300 --> 01:21:46.619
combined with blood testing for cholesterol particles

01:21:46.619 --> 01:21:49.500
like ApoB, LP little a, there's another one,

01:21:49.520 --> 01:21:52.340
lipoprotein A, and inflammatory markers like

01:21:52.340 --> 01:21:55.039
HSC reactive protein. By looking at all of those

01:21:55.039 --> 01:21:58.100
consistently, we can see those cholesterol and

01:21:58.100 --> 01:22:00.520
inflammation markers directly, and we can track

01:22:00.520 --> 01:22:02.500
them. And then I would also recommend tracking

01:22:02.500 --> 01:22:04.539
cortisol consistently. And if you're watching

01:22:04.539 --> 01:22:07.899
these, if they're already high, there are some

01:22:07.899 --> 01:22:09.260
awesome interventions which we could talk about,

01:22:09.359 --> 01:22:11.979
but if they're nice and steady and in range,

01:22:12.119 --> 01:22:14.739
great. But let's keep watching because that does

01:22:14.739 --> 01:22:17.100
not stay the same through life. These things

01:22:17.100 --> 01:22:19.600
are very dynamic and they can change quite quickly.

01:22:21.779 --> 01:22:23.739
Well, you touched on that. So what are some of

01:22:23.739 --> 01:22:27.439
the interventions that you're most fond of? Yeah.

01:22:27.500 --> 01:22:29.460
So I think specifically on the cardiovascular

01:22:29.460 --> 01:22:35.439
front, this is my current top priority. so i

01:22:35.439 --> 01:22:38.079
was able to bring my apo b down like i said so

01:22:38.079 --> 01:22:40.180
apolipoprotein b again it's it's this particle

01:22:40.180 --> 01:22:42.359
it's a cholesterol particle that has this protein

01:22:42.359 --> 01:22:45.420
on it that makes it very sticky and it ends up

01:22:45.420 --> 01:22:48.840
getting lodged in the wall of our arteries so

01:22:48.840 --> 01:22:51.899
apo b is necessary for heart disease to happen

01:22:51.899 --> 01:22:54.619
period it's not maybe it's not the only reason

01:22:54.619 --> 01:22:56.619
inflammation has to also seemingly be present

01:22:56.619 --> 01:22:59.619
for for that plaque to start but without the

01:22:59.619 --> 01:23:02.439
lipoproteins there you can't build the plaque

01:23:03.239 --> 01:23:05.319
Um, so it's the raw material. So you want to

01:23:05.319 --> 01:23:07.659
get that as low as possible. And I was able to

01:23:07.659 --> 01:23:10.140
bring mine down again in just four to six weeks

01:23:10.140 --> 01:23:13.560
with lifestyle only by 30%. And the way, the

01:23:13.560 --> 01:23:17.039
way that I did that was I ate 40 grams per day

01:23:17.039 --> 01:23:21.359
of fiber. I ate one gram per pound of protein

01:23:21.359 --> 01:23:24.100
every day, which replaced a lot of other things

01:23:24.100 --> 01:23:27.300
like, uh, uh, dietary fats and carbohydrates,

01:23:27.600 --> 01:23:31.119
fast acting carbohydrates. So, so I avoided ultra

01:23:31.119 --> 01:23:34.119
processed foods. which are typically flours and

01:23:34.119 --> 01:23:37.899
sugars. And that reduces inflammation. So that

01:23:37.899 --> 01:23:40.819
was my sort of nutrition approach. Reduce processed

01:23:40.819 --> 01:23:44.460
sugars and flours, increase fiber to 40 grams,

01:23:44.680 --> 01:23:46.979
increase protein to one gram per pound of body

01:23:46.979 --> 01:23:49.899
weight. And then I reduced my saturated fat to

01:23:49.899 --> 01:23:52.859
10 % of my calories. And this is like, it's a

01:23:52.859 --> 01:23:55.479
lot easier to track in a tool. I use levels to

01:23:55.479 --> 01:23:58.500
track all my macros. But that was the main intervention

01:23:58.500 --> 01:24:01.619
was nutrition. Then I took some supplements.

01:24:01.739 --> 01:24:04.619
So I took fish oil. Every day I took a gram of

01:24:04.619 --> 01:24:07.159
EPA, DHA, fish oil, which you can get basically

01:24:07.159 --> 01:24:12.619
anywhere. And I took a supplement called natokinase.

01:24:12.920 --> 01:24:14.920
I don't know how much the supplements matter.

01:24:15.039 --> 01:24:17.920
Fish oil is well documented as being very effective.

01:24:18.399 --> 01:24:21.960
The natokinase is an enzyme that is found in,

01:24:22.159 --> 01:24:25.880
it's actually very common in Japan. So a lot

01:24:25.880 --> 01:24:29.680
of Japanese eat. a dish called natto which is

01:24:29.680 --> 01:24:32.220
like a fermented chickpea food and this enzyme

01:24:32.220 --> 01:24:34.520
develops in there and it is associated with cardiovascular

01:24:34.520 --> 01:24:37.220
health and it actually is shown at high doses

01:24:37.220 --> 01:24:40.340
to reduce existing plaques in the arteries so

01:24:40.340 --> 01:24:42.880
it can it can actually like reduce the volume

01:24:42.880 --> 01:24:44.920
of blockage in your heart if you already have

01:24:44.920 --> 01:24:47.460
this um so i started taking that as well i take

01:24:47.460 --> 01:24:49.920
that every day and bottom line in just six weeks

01:24:49.920 --> 01:24:51.720
and again i took no medications on top of this

01:24:51.720 --> 01:24:53.479
i didn't change my sleep patterns because i don't

01:24:53.479 --> 01:24:55.760
have control my baby does i didn't change my

01:24:55.760 --> 01:25:00.319
exercise Those changes directly dropped my ApoB

01:25:00.319 --> 01:25:03.420
by 30 % in six weeks. It's incredibly huge reduction

01:25:03.420 --> 01:25:05.859
in cardiovascular disease risk for me. And I

01:25:05.859 --> 01:25:07.859
would just absolutely recommend like such an

01:25:07.859 --> 01:25:09.560
easy starting point. Just a few modifications.

01:25:09.779 --> 01:25:13.319
I still eat foods I love. Very easy. And then

01:25:13.319 --> 01:25:15.699
sorry, just to like provide one other recommendation.

01:25:16.239 --> 01:25:19.979
There's a really powerful scan called an arterial

01:25:19.979 --> 01:25:23.699
calcium score. So it looks at coronary. It looks

01:25:23.699 --> 01:25:26.930
at your heart. And it looks for calcium in your

01:25:26.930 --> 01:25:30.069
arteries. And calcium in your arteries is part

01:25:30.069 --> 01:25:32.869
of the plaque that's growing. You can get this

01:25:32.869 --> 01:25:36.750
scan for like 150 bucks. Anyone can get it. I

01:25:36.750 --> 01:25:39.289
can't recommend enough going and getting that

01:25:39.289 --> 01:25:42.430
scan done because especially if you're in, you

01:25:42.430 --> 01:25:45.050
know, if you're in your 40s to 60s, you're in

01:25:45.050 --> 01:25:47.390
the highest risk category for the development

01:25:47.390 --> 01:25:50.630
of plaques. This is an easy, non -invasive scan.

01:25:50.850 --> 01:25:52.890
And it will tell you if you already have development

01:25:52.890 --> 01:25:55.300
here, which if you do, you should absolutely

01:25:55.300 --> 01:25:58.039
pay close attention to the lifestyle factors.

01:25:58.720 --> 01:26:01.060
It's interesting that you talk about the diet

01:26:01.060 --> 01:26:02.739
in Japan for a couple of reasons. I actually

01:26:02.739 --> 01:26:08.039
lived there for about 15 months in 2001 -ish,

01:26:08.060 --> 01:26:10.920
either side of that. But two things. Firstly,

01:26:11.100 --> 01:26:14.470
I didn't realize that... about, I think it was

01:26:14.470 --> 01:26:17.390
a few years before I was there, like in the 90s

01:26:17.390 --> 01:26:20.430
or maybe late 80s, they actually had seen, I'm

01:26:20.430 --> 01:26:22.609
sure it wasn't anywhere near an obesity crisis,

01:26:22.710 --> 01:26:24.750
but they'd seen the beginning of a trending in

01:26:24.750 --> 01:26:27.130
the wrong way when it came to their health. So

01:26:27.130 --> 01:26:29.810
they actually nationally changed portion size.

01:26:29.970 --> 01:26:32.310
And if you look at a Japanese meal, they are

01:26:32.310 --> 01:26:35.289
very small portions. And then the other thing

01:26:35.289 --> 01:26:38.739
is in the Japanese schools. All the food is made

01:26:38.739 --> 01:26:41.539
from scratch, like from scratch, scratch, not

01:26:41.539 --> 01:26:44.180
sauces or anything. Everything is made from scratch.

01:26:44.380 --> 01:26:47.460
And that is something that we do so poorly here.

01:26:47.560 --> 01:26:50.100
Not only is it processed food, but I just learned

01:26:50.100 --> 01:26:53.359
literally about two weeks ago that it's basically

01:26:53.359 --> 01:26:55.560
out of date processed food that they sell to

01:26:55.560 --> 01:26:59.420
prisons and schools. So you compare those two

01:26:59.420 --> 01:27:02.520
Japanese culture, making it from scratch in the

01:27:02.520 --> 01:27:05.159
school to the way that we feed our children and

01:27:05.159 --> 01:27:07.220
look at the health of the Japanese children and

01:27:07.220 --> 01:27:09.539
the American children. I mean, there's a huge

01:27:09.539 --> 01:27:13.739
room for conversation there as well. It's always

01:27:13.739 --> 01:27:19.340
infuriated me. But since having my son, I cannot

01:27:19.340 --> 01:27:23.180
imagine putting him in a situation at such a

01:27:23.180 --> 01:27:26.479
young age where... I know that the legs of the

01:27:26.479 --> 01:27:29.199
stool of health that I just addressed are deliberately

01:27:29.199 --> 01:27:32.279
being chopped off. I can't do that to him at

01:27:32.279 --> 01:27:34.640
a young age. I know that, again, health outcomes

01:27:34.640 --> 01:27:37.479
are the compounding effect over years and decades

01:27:37.479 --> 01:27:40.060
of the daily decisions we take. And if we're

01:27:40.060 --> 01:27:43.140
pushing our children to consume ultra -processed

01:27:43.140 --> 01:27:45.920
poisons, which is what they are, if you look

01:27:45.920 --> 01:27:47.800
at the impact, the inflammatory response, the

01:27:47.800 --> 01:27:49.880
blood sugar response to eating these foods, it's

01:27:49.880 --> 01:27:52.279
the same as what happens when you consume a toxin.

01:27:52.810 --> 01:27:54.890
And our bodies don't recognize them and are not

01:27:54.890 --> 01:27:57.850
able to process them effectively. It's a complete

01:27:57.850 --> 01:28:00.409
trap. I mean, it's just like, it's such a, we're,

01:28:00.470 --> 01:28:02.609
I think we're putting our heads in the sand to

01:28:02.609 --> 01:28:04.409
some extent. Some people are loudly complaining

01:28:04.409 --> 01:28:07.109
about this, but we've industrialized the production

01:28:07.109 --> 01:28:10.270
of a product that is not an industrial, it's

01:28:10.270 --> 01:28:15.189
not an industrial, it's not an industrial process.

01:28:15.369 --> 01:28:18.090
Agriculture is intentionally supposed to be a

01:28:18.090 --> 01:28:21.659
very natural, distributed, local. process food

01:28:21.659 --> 01:28:24.479
production should be nearby it should be in the

01:28:24.479 --> 01:28:26.600
quantities and from the environment that we live

01:28:26.600 --> 01:28:29.060
in and instead we have like centralized plants

01:28:29.060 --> 01:28:30.859
that are cranking this out like you know like

01:28:30.859 --> 01:28:33.520
furniture like car parts and distributing it

01:28:33.520 --> 01:28:35.239
all over the world and they're stripping out

01:28:35.239 --> 01:28:37.100
all the nutrients to be able to do that and i

01:28:37.100 --> 01:28:38.739
think there's something really beautiful and

01:28:38.739 --> 01:28:40.680
i think something really wise about the cultures

01:28:40.680 --> 01:28:43.960
like japan who know that that just instinctively

01:28:43.960 --> 01:28:46.239
they know that it's obvious that that is the

01:28:46.239 --> 01:28:48.760
wrong way to treat food um i think there's so

01:28:48.760 --> 01:28:51.210
much emotion and so much like heart that goes

01:28:51.210 --> 01:28:53.390
into food production in, in some of these other

01:28:53.390 --> 01:28:55.750
countries that are, you know, frankly more established

01:28:55.750 --> 01:28:57.430
than us. They've been around longer. They've

01:28:57.430 --> 01:28:59.829
for whatever reason, there's, there's this sort

01:28:59.829 --> 01:29:02.630
of social wisdom that I think has developed and

01:29:02.630 --> 01:29:06.949
they've decided not to, uh, ship, you know, the

01:29:06.949 --> 01:29:09.529
equivalent of shredded cardboard to their children,

01:29:09.689 --> 01:29:12.569
press into patties with sugar added. Um, they've

01:29:12.569 --> 01:29:14.489
decided to make it from scratch in the, in the

01:29:14.489 --> 01:29:15.970
building. I think that's just really amazing.

01:29:16.090 --> 01:29:18.270
And what we should all strive to see in our own

01:29:18.270 --> 01:29:23.039
culture. Um, There should be a total... I don't

01:29:23.039 --> 01:29:25.720
exactly understand why we rationalize this because

01:29:25.720 --> 01:29:29.979
the current adolescent prediabetes population

01:29:29.979 --> 01:29:34.680
is now at 28%. So 28 % of our children and adolescents

01:29:34.680 --> 01:29:38.260
are prediabetic. That was 0 % like 20 years ago.

01:29:40.760 --> 01:29:45.159
Diabetes, one of the fastest growing life -threatening

01:29:45.159 --> 01:29:47.399
conditions for children and even for babies in

01:29:47.399 --> 01:29:50.560
a lot of cases is... non -alcoholic fatty liver

01:29:50.560 --> 01:29:53.640
disease that term didn't exist they had to add

01:29:53.640 --> 01:29:55.779
the non -alcoholic to the front of fatty liver

01:29:55.779 --> 01:29:58.020
disease because it used to just be for alcoholics

01:29:58.020 --> 01:29:59.640
it's like it's the thing that happens to your

01:29:59.640 --> 01:30:01.479
liver when you are consuming a ton of alcohol

01:30:01.479 --> 01:30:04.119
and your body produces a byproduct that is that

01:30:04.119 --> 01:30:06.420
of triglycerides that just stick to your liver

01:30:06.420 --> 01:30:08.920
and destroy it well turns out you can generate

01:30:08.920 --> 01:30:10.920
this by eating processed food eating a ton of

01:30:10.920 --> 01:30:13.180
fructose drinking a bunch of sugary drinks and

01:30:13.180 --> 01:30:15.100
we are doing this to our children and they are

01:30:15.100 --> 01:30:17.140
developing the same thing that advanced multi

01:30:17.140 --> 01:30:19.989
-decade alcoholics have near end of life and

01:30:19.989 --> 01:30:21.829
it eventually develops into complete systemic

01:30:21.829 --> 01:30:23.510
breakdown and these these children are going

01:30:23.510 --> 01:30:25.590
to need liver transplants or they're going to

01:30:25.590 --> 01:30:27.829
die later in life you know if this doesn't change

01:30:27.829 --> 01:30:33.229
and i mean there i don't really have much more

01:30:33.229 --> 01:30:34.750
to say than that it's like this is completely

01:30:34.750 --> 01:30:37.710
outrageous and there are examples around the

01:30:37.710 --> 01:30:39.250
world of cultures that are doing this better

01:30:39.250 --> 01:30:43.029
who do not have a they have no measurable uh

01:30:43.029 --> 01:30:45.649
adolescent chronic illness just doesn't exist

01:30:45.649 --> 01:30:47.930
in their cultures And we could have the same

01:30:47.930 --> 01:30:50.050
thing. We just have to make a loud noise and

01:30:50.050 --> 01:30:53.329
demand a difference. I certainly intend to, you

01:30:53.329 --> 01:30:54.729
know, I hope that everybody else does, but it

01:30:54.729 --> 01:30:57.109
can start locally. And then I hope that it eventually

01:30:57.109 --> 01:31:02.770
grows nationally. I always made lunch for my

01:31:02.770 --> 01:31:04.489
son and don't get me wrong. Like sometimes I

01:31:04.489 --> 01:31:06.189
would come to the school with Chick -fil -A like

01:31:06.189 --> 01:31:08.550
as you know, every so often, but usually, you

01:31:08.550 --> 01:31:10.189
know, we're making him whatever it was, but there'll

01:31:10.189 --> 01:31:11.829
be fruit. And then again, it was, you know, some

01:31:11.829 --> 01:31:14.210
of the stuff was more processed. There might

01:31:14.210 --> 01:31:15.989
be chips or, you know, cookies or something,

01:31:16.010 --> 01:31:19.050
but you know, there was also fruit and fresh

01:31:19.050 --> 01:31:21.229
meat and all these kinds of things. And the same

01:31:21.229 --> 01:31:24.710
with the exercise, you know, he. Early on, when

01:31:24.710 --> 01:31:26.189
I was in elementary, there was a thing they did

01:31:26.189 --> 01:31:28.130
called Morning Mile, and I would volunteer as

01:31:28.130 --> 01:31:30.310
a parent. And the kids would just walk or run,

01:31:30.369 --> 01:31:32.050
whatever they felt like, before school started.

01:31:32.250 --> 01:31:35.329
And they had recess. And then, you know, as time

01:31:35.329 --> 01:31:37.170
went on, all that, you know, you get into middle

01:31:37.170 --> 01:31:39.770
school and high school, PE basically is non -existent.

01:31:40.300 --> 01:31:42.699
So then, you know, I was always not pushing him,

01:31:42.739 --> 01:31:45.020
but just encouraging him in jujitsu. And then

01:31:45.020 --> 01:31:47.220
he got into running and now volleyball is this

01:31:47.220 --> 01:31:49.619
thing, but just exposing him and then living

01:31:49.619 --> 01:31:52.359
it myself or being that fit dad and that gym

01:31:52.359 --> 01:31:54.359
full of other fit parents with other fit kids.

01:31:54.720 --> 01:31:57.119
But this is the problem is that I was very fortunate.

01:31:57.180 --> 01:31:59.140
I grew up on a farm. You know, my father was

01:31:59.140 --> 01:32:01.260
a vet. So I grew up around medicine as well,

01:32:01.279 --> 01:32:04.729
like traditional healing medicine. But a lot

01:32:04.729 --> 01:32:06.170
of parents don't have that because they grew

01:32:06.170 --> 01:32:08.130
up in this household where it was processed food

01:32:08.130 --> 01:32:11.850
and inactivity. So, you know, it really angers

01:32:11.850 --> 01:32:14.810
me because it's not even a left or a right issue.

01:32:14.909 --> 01:32:17.010
Like both of them are responsible over decades.

01:32:17.390 --> 01:32:19.890
And then you look at the news stations again,

01:32:19.989 --> 01:32:22.590
they had those tickers, the death tickers during

01:32:22.590 --> 01:32:25.390
COVID. Well, if they kept those going, we'd be

01:32:25.390 --> 01:32:28.470
at about, you know, 20 million by now because

01:32:28.470 --> 01:32:31.250
people are dying regardless of that virus of

01:32:31.250 --> 01:32:34.119
all these. preventable illnesses. And as you

01:32:34.119 --> 01:32:37.680
said, younger and younger and younger. So this

01:32:37.680 --> 01:32:39.840
is what really pisses me off is that was the

01:32:39.840 --> 01:32:41.579
conversation the whole time is like, well, we

01:32:41.579 --> 01:32:43.460
need to address the things that are killing us,

01:32:43.520 --> 01:32:46.659
virus or no virus. And the moment we rounded

01:32:46.659 --> 01:32:49.479
out kind of 2022, people are like, well, I don't

01:32:49.479 --> 01:32:51.579
want to talk about it anymore. And nothing changed.

01:32:51.779 --> 01:32:54.640
So circling around to the positive side, this

01:32:54.640 --> 01:32:57.060
is what's so great about this conversation is

01:32:57.060 --> 01:32:59.479
we're educating. The whole point of this podcast,

01:32:59.560 --> 01:33:02.220
I say, is to get people educated and angry. You've

01:33:02.220 --> 01:33:03.800
got to understand why you should be angry. Then

01:33:03.800 --> 01:33:05.460
you'll become angry. Then you'll force change.

01:33:05.680 --> 01:33:07.819
And this would be initially for your own health.

01:33:07.939 --> 01:33:10.260
And then once you kind of figure it out for yourself,

01:33:10.460 --> 01:33:13.560
then your partner and your children, now they

01:33:13.560 --> 01:33:15.479
start benefiting from it. Now the whole household

01:33:15.479 --> 01:33:18.380
understands it. And then it resonates outwards.

01:33:18.420 --> 01:33:22.039
So I think it's... It's really, really exciting.

01:33:22.340 --> 01:33:24.359
There should be hope. There should be solutions.

01:33:24.859 --> 01:33:27.180
So I'm sure people listening want to know where

01:33:27.180 --> 01:33:29.520
to find this. So where are the best places to

01:33:29.520 --> 01:33:31.579
find Levels? And then are there any other places

01:33:31.579 --> 01:33:35.199
to reach you on social media as well? Yeah, so

01:33:35.199 --> 01:33:38.199
levels .com is where you can find the company.

01:33:38.319 --> 01:33:42.119
I always try to tell people, check out what we

01:33:42.119 --> 01:33:44.819
do, but then also check out the information we

01:33:44.819 --> 01:33:46.720
produce because part of the mission of Levels

01:33:46.720 --> 01:33:48.619
from the very beginning was to inform people.

01:33:49.239 --> 01:33:51.300
independent of a product about metabolic health

01:33:51.300 --> 01:33:53.819
which is the foundation of how our cells are

01:33:53.819 --> 01:33:55.680
producing energy from our environment and our

01:33:55.680 --> 01:33:58.340
food and it's necessary metabolic health is necessary

01:33:58.340 --> 01:34:00.840
to have physical health or mental health so the

01:34:00.840 --> 01:34:03.060
blog is an incredible resource for this like

01:34:03.060 --> 01:34:05.739
you know go deep on it we also have a youtube

01:34:05.739 --> 01:34:07.979
channel and the whole new level is our podcast

01:34:07.979 --> 01:34:10.600
with some really fantastic conversations with

01:34:10.600 --> 01:34:12.960
people who from experts across the health spectrum

01:34:12.960 --> 01:34:15.060
so i would i would always recommend starting

01:34:15.060 --> 01:34:18.289
there and then you can find levels as at levels

01:34:18.289 --> 01:34:22.229
on Instagram, X, TikTok. And then myself, my

01:34:22.229 --> 01:34:25.449
handle is at Joshua's Forest. We could put maybe

01:34:25.449 --> 01:34:27.930
in the notes and I sometimes write about stuff

01:34:27.930 --> 01:34:30.630
on X, but I'm typically not on other social media

01:34:30.630 --> 01:34:33.149
platforms. And then lastly, I do a newsletter.

01:34:33.369 --> 01:34:35.050
You can sign up for the newsletter on our website.

01:34:35.829 --> 01:34:38.489
It goes out to our regular mailing list and just

01:34:38.489 --> 01:34:40.289
kind of talking about the things that I'm really

01:34:40.289 --> 01:34:42.810
excited about or thinking a lot about or frustrated

01:34:42.810 --> 01:34:45.409
by typically in the world of health and in my

01:34:45.409 --> 01:34:48.119
own health. So it's... Nice way to follow along

01:34:48.119 --> 01:34:51.460
with what I'm thinking about. Brilliant. Well,

01:34:51.579 --> 01:34:54.119
I want to thank you so much. It really is exciting.

01:34:54.279 --> 01:34:55.979
This is the whole point of this. I want to drag

01:34:55.979 --> 01:34:58.319
these problems out into the spotlight, but then

01:34:58.319 --> 01:35:01.020
also bring the solutions. Otherwise, it just

01:35:01.020 --> 01:35:03.060
becomes a bitching session, for lack of a better

01:35:03.060 --> 01:35:05.939
word. So I want to thank you for what you're

01:35:05.939 --> 01:35:08.500
doing with Levels and then also for coming back

01:35:08.500 --> 01:35:11.479
onto the Behind the Shield podcast today. Well,

01:35:11.479 --> 01:35:13.680
James, I always love these conversations because

01:35:13.680 --> 01:35:16.729
they're very... urgent and specific about a,

01:35:16.770 --> 01:35:18.529
you know, in particular population you care so

01:35:18.529 --> 01:35:20.729
much about. And I think that that we need more

01:35:20.729 --> 01:35:23.489
of exactly this energy, like get angry and then

01:35:23.489 --> 01:35:26.210
focus, focus that anger on a specific problem

01:35:26.210 --> 01:35:28.010
until you break it down and then focus on the

01:35:28.010 --> 01:35:29.409
next one. And it's just so clear that that's

01:35:29.409 --> 01:35:31.149
what you are doing. And I'm sure your audience

01:35:31.149 --> 01:35:33.550
appreciates it, appreciates it. And, and coming

01:35:33.550 --> 01:35:36.189
from a family of law enforcement, I also appreciate

01:35:36.189 --> 01:35:38.569
it. So, so thanks for what you do and for giving

01:35:38.569 --> 01:35:39.050
me an opportunity.