WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:01.780 Welcome to the Behind the Shield podcast. As 00:00:01.780 --> 00:00:03.580 always, my name is James Geering and this week 00:00:03.580 --> 00:00:05.660 it is my absolute honor to welcome on the show 00:00:05.660 --> 00:00:11.400 veteran firefighter and realtor Dan Lennon. Now 00:00:11.400 --> 00:00:14.000 in this conversation we discuss a host of topics 00:00:14.000 --> 00:00:17.359 from Dan's journey into the fire service, the 00:00:17.359 --> 00:00:20.230 importance of firefighter fitness, the brother 00:00:20.230 --> 00:00:23.809 and sisterhood at the 343 Hero Challenge, how 00:00:23.809 --> 00:00:26.149 a side profession can not only give financial 00:00:26.149 --> 00:00:29.489 security, but also help with the transition out 00:00:29.489 --> 00:00:34.170 of the fire service, the 2472, and so much more. 00:00:34.670 --> 00:00:36.969 Now, before we get to this incredible conversation, 00:00:37.189 --> 00:00:39.810 as I say every week, please just take a moment. 00:00:40.210 --> 00:00:43.210 Go to whichever app you listen to this on, subscribe 00:00:43.210 --> 00:00:47.009 to the show, leave feedback, and leave a rating. 00:00:47.579 --> 00:00:50.780 Every single five -star rating truly does elevate 00:00:50.780 --> 00:00:53.479 this podcast, therefore making it easier for 00:00:53.479 --> 00:00:56.899 others to find. And this is a free library of 00:00:56.899 --> 00:01:01.500 over 1 ,100 episodes now. So all I ask in return 00:01:01.500 --> 00:01:04.700 is that you help share these incredible men and 00:01:04.700 --> 00:01:07.980 women's stories so I can get them to every single 00:01:07.980 --> 00:01:10.900 person on planet Earth who needs to hear them. 00:01:11.500 --> 00:01:15.819 So with that being said, I introduce to you Dan 00:01:15.819 --> 00:01:38.620 Lennon. Enjoy. Well, Dan, I want to start by 00:01:38.620 --> 00:01:41.719 saying thank you so much for first of your patience, 00:01:41.840 --> 00:01:43.540 because we tried to do this yesterday and my 00:01:43.540 --> 00:01:46.140 computer basically took a shit. So we had to 00:01:46.140 --> 00:01:48.959 reschedule and do it today. So I want to thank 00:01:48.959 --> 00:01:51.000 you again for coming on the Behind the Shield 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:54.879 podcast. Yeah, man. Thanks for having me. Super 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:57.819 excited to do it. And, you know, my sons, my 00:01:57.819 --> 00:02:01.579 oldest son, he met you at the 343 and I told 00:02:01.579 --> 00:02:04.120 him I was doing a podcast and he was like, is 00:02:04.120 --> 00:02:06.769 that the guy that interviewed James Brolin? And 00:02:06.769 --> 00:02:09.150 I was like, yeah. So like, because of you, my 00:02:09.150 --> 00:02:11.370 kids think I'm like some type of famous person. 00:02:11.430 --> 00:02:13.389 But I told him, I'm like, nobody knows who I 00:02:13.389 --> 00:02:16.490 am. So it's okay. But I appreciate it. You're 00:02:16.490 --> 00:02:20.870 helping me already. Well, that was so cool. We'll 00:02:20.870 --> 00:02:23.590 circle around to it again. But this last year, 00:02:23.650 --> 00:02:26.069 I've done the 343. I think this was the 11th 00:02:26.069 --> 00:02:30.490 year, if I'm not mistaken. And you did it with 00:02:30.490 --> 00:02:33.620 your son. Uh, Dave Coughlin did it with his son. 00:02:33.740 --> 00:02:36.080 So, you know, 10 plus years ago we were doing 00:02:36.080 --> 00:02:37.780 it and then we were losing a lot of people. And 00:02:37.780 --> 00:02:39.919 obviously there was a very poignant backstory 00:02:39.919 --> 00:02:43.879 to, you know, the, the, um, bonus wads and all 00:02:43.879 --> 00:02:46.060 those kinds of things. But it was so cool this 00:02:46.060 --> 00:02:48.460 year to see these firefighters that kind of walk 00:02:48.460 --> 00:02:51.120 the walk with their own fitness. Now, especially 00:02:51.120 --> 00:02:54.219 Dave, my God, his fricking athletic phenom that 00:02:54.219 --> 00:02:57.780 he and his wife has spawned. It was just so great 00:02:57.780 --> 00:03:01.840 to see. No, it was fun, too, because it's like, 00:03:01.939 --> 00:03:04.599 you know, when we first started doing the event 00:03:04.599 --> 00:03:08.219 years ago, you know, Chief Seagrass and Tony 00:03:08.219 --> 00:03:10.300 Willis, you know, they were big, you know, as 00:03:10.300 --> 00:03:12.639 far as kind of getting the initial groundwork 00:03:12.639 --> 00:03:14.780 laid for us. And, you know, when both of them 00:03:14.780 --> 00:03:16.659 left, they kind of said the same thing. It's 00:03:16.659 --> 00:03:18.400 like, it's on you guys to keep it going. And 00:03:18.400 --> 00:03:21.099 so, you know, Dave and Doss and then now Belinda, 00:03:21.199 --> 00:03:22.939 you know, they've just taken the ball and ran 00:03:22.939 --> 00:03:26.189 with it. It is a lot of work behind the scenes. 00:03:26.310 --> 00:03:28.610 I mean, I don't think anybody that comes in just 00:03:28.610 --> 00:03:31.270 for the one day realizes like it's a buildup 00:03:31.270 --> 00:03:34.789 from like normally like in a perfect world, if 00:03:34.789 --> 00:03:38.169 they could start it in like April, that would 00:03:38.169 --> 00:03:39.689 be great. But I mean, you know, logistically 00:03:39.689 --> 00:03:41.930 speaking, it's like crazy trying to get all the 00:03:41.930 --> 00:03:45.229 things lined up and they got to go sponsors and 00:03:45.229 --> 00:03:47.469 then getting everything situated with equipment. 00:03:47.610 --> 00:03:51.840 And they've had so many good, so many good. sorry 00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:54.039 buddy oh yeah i've got my son walking in here 00:03:54.039 --> 00:03:56.020 no you're fine but they've had so they've had 00:03:56.020 --> 00:03:58.439 so many good like local crossfit gyms that have 00:03:58.439 --> 00:04:00.840 you know came out over the years and not only 00:04:00.840 --> 00:04:03.000 compete but also you know donate their equipment 00:04:03.000 --> 00:04:04.960 for the day so we're able to kind of have everything 00:04:04.960 --> 00:04:07.500 set up so it's just crazy to see how much it's 00:04:07.500 --> 00:04:10.050 grown over the years Well, this year we were 00:04:10.050 --> 00:04:12.490 at the brand new Orange County training facility. 00:04:12.669 --> 00:04:14.409 So we'll circle around with that. But that was 00:04:14.409 --> 00:04:17.209 really cool to actually do it in, you know, towers 00:04:17.209 --> 00:04:19.689 and all these places with burn buildings everywhere 00:04:19.689 --> 00:04:22.910 and you saw props. And yeah, so I'm excited to 00:04:22.910 --> 00:04:25.350 hear the kind of backstory of that. But without 00:04:25.350 --> 00:04:27.230 jumping ahead too much, just start at the very 00:04:27.230 --> 00:04:30.050 beginning of your story. So tell me where you 00:04:30.050 --> 00:04:31.930 were born and tell me a little bit about your 00:04:31.930 --> 00:04:34.310 family dynamic, what your parents did, how many 00:04:34.310 --> 00:04:40.639 siblings? Born in Fort Lauderdale. My dad and 00:04:40.639 --> 00:04:43.220 my mom were both originally from New England. 00:04:43.420 --> 00:04:46.439 My dad's from Boston, busy town. My mom's from 00:04:46.439 --> 00:04:50.199 a small town in Connecticut called Tolland. You 00:04:50.199 --> 00:04:51.959 probably don't even know where that is. Nobody 00:04:51.959 --> 00:04:56.439 really does, but funny how they met. So my dad 00:04:56.439 --> 00:04:59.420 grew up in Waltham, Massachusetts, and that is 00:04:59.420 --> 00:05:02.459 where the band Aerosmith kind of started. And 00:05:02.459 --> 00:05:04.699 so they used to play at a place called Mo Blacks. 00:05:05.199 --> 00:05:06.279 And, you know, he would go there and he would 00:05:06.279 --> 00:05:08.819 check them out. And then on a family vacation, 00:05:09.079 --> 00:05:11.699 my dad met a kid and they became pen pals. Now, 00:05:11.759 --> 00:05:14.519 for the younger people, pen pals is this actually 00:05:14.519 --> 00:05:16.939 a thing where you meet somebody, you exchange 00:05:16.939 --> 00:05:19.060 addresses, and then you would write letters to 00:05:19.060 --> 00:05:20.500 each other. You know, that's kind of how you 00:05:20.500 --> 00:05:23.920 kept in touch. So like Snapchat, he got a random 00:05:23.920 --> 00:05:28.199 letter. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Well, that's the 00:05:28.199 --> 00:05:29.920 thing, too, is like people are so used to getting 00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:31.800 like phone calls. And if you don't get an immediate 00:05:31.800 --> 00:05:33.800 response, people get, you know, kind of annoyed 00:05:33.800 --> 00:05:36.240 by it. But, you know, back then you could reach 00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:37.920 out to somebody and not hear from them for months. 00:05:38.540 --> 00:05:42.759 So my dad randomly got a letter in the mail from 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:46.339 a girl probably two years later from Tallinn. 00:05:46.379 --> 00:05:47.959 And that's where this kid was from. And he was 00:05:47.959 --> 00:05:53.839 and he had given the info to my dad. My mom, 00:05:53.920 --> 00:05:56.160 beautiful girl growing up and sent a picture. 00:05:56.259 --> 00:05:58.680 She's like, hey, this guy told me that, you know, 00:05:58.759 --> 00:06:01.060 Aerosmith and I'd really like to come out there 00:06:01.060 --> 00:06:04.160 and meet them and da, da, da. So they ended up 00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:06.339 striking up, you know, letters back and forth. 00:06:06.420 --> 00:06:09.800 And that's kind of how they met. And then she 00:06:09.800 --> 00:06:11.579 was a senior in high school. My dad was a little 00:06:11.579 --> 00:06:16.540 bit older. And 77, he decided to give Florida 00:06:16.540 --> 00:06:19.560 a try. So back then, you know, everybody in the 00:06:19.560 --> 00:06:22.199 Northeast, they all hate the winners. And Florida 00:06:22.199 --> 00:06:25.050 was like. back then like the a place to be it 00:06:25.050 --> 00:06:27.589 was kind of like you know to like go down there 00:06:27.589 --> 00:06:30.250 and be wild or whatever so my dad started off 00:06:30.250 --> 00:06:33.329 driving oil trucks in boston at 15 years old 00:06:33.329 --> 00:06:35.410 and they would go to like gas stations pick up 00:06:35.410 --> 00:06:37.930 waste oil and so he ended up buying his own truck 00:06:37.930 --> 00:06:39.889 and said i'm gonna give florida you know a year 00:06:39.889 --> 00:06:42.230 and see how i like it and if you know if it doesn't 00:06:42.230 --> 00:06:44.430 work out i'll come back and then he never came 00:06:44.430 --> 00:06:47.209 back and so he left and then uh shortly after 00:06:47.209 --> 00:06:49.370 my mom decided to drop out of high school like 00:06:49.370 --> 00:06:51.569 two months before graduation and followed him 00:06:51.569 --> 00:06:54.800 down there And he always says, he's like, I never 00:06:54.800 --> 00:06:56.899 invited her. She just came down and ruined the 00:06:56.899 --> 00:07:02.660 party. So they ended up settling in Fort Lauderdale, 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:07.060 Broward area. And I was born in 1983. And then 00:07:07.060 --> 00:07:10.220 a few years later, my sister was born in 86. 00:07:10.680 --> 00:07:16.399 And then by 89, 90, they got divorced. Coming 00:07:16.399 --> 00:07:18.120 from that background, obviously, it's a little 00:07:18.120 --> 00:07:21.079 different from having parents separated, living 00:07:21.079 --> 00:07:23.040 with my mom mostly, and then we'd bounce it back 00:07:23.040 --> 00:07:26.019 and forth. And at that point, my dad was probably 00:07:26.019 --> 00:07:28.920 working 60, 80 hours a week. But during that 00:07:28.920 --> 00:07:31.800 time, he actually had a plan of becoming a fireman. 00:07:31.899 --> 00:07:34.639 And so he went to state standards, went through 00:07:34.639 --> 00:07:37.939 everything. got first in his class um but during 00:07:37.939 --> 00:07:39.819 that time it was just competitive market to get 00:07:39.819 --> 00:07:41.899 hired right like you would put an application 00:07:41.899 --> 00:07:44.480 and sometimes you'd hear nothing and then about 00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:47.199 six years after he had applied you know an apartment 00:07:47.199 --> 00:07:49.060 called him but by that point he was making too 00:07:49.060 --> 00:07:51.579 much money in his current job that uh he ended 00:07:51.579 --> 00:07:53.860 up you know just sticking with what he was doing 00:07:53.860 --> 00:07:58.920 what year was that he was testing uh it was probably 00:07:58.920 --> 00:08:03.389 like 80 88 89 yeah This is what's crazy, because 00:08:03.389 --> 00:08:05.610 obviously people think that there was a big boom 00:08:05.610 --> 00:08:09.089 in the fire service post 9 -11. That's when I 00:08:09.089 --> 00:08:12.209 came into the fire service. But when you hear 00:08:12.209 --> 00:08:15.790 the 90s, the 80s, it was super, super competitive. 00:08:15.889 --> 00:08:19.370 And I'm sure we'll get to this. But then you 00:08:19.370 --> 00:08:22.649 look at recruitment today, and it's just an absolute 00:08:22.649 --> 00:08:24.589 shadow of what it was. Completely different. 00:08:24.990 --> 00:08:27.149 There's 100 % there are ways to bring it back. 00:08:27.209 --> 00:08:30.360 But people will say to me with the... 24 72 but 00:08:30.360 --> 00:08:32.159 yeah then you're just going to steal firefighting 00:08:32.159 --> 00:08:35.179 from other people and it's like no the the rising 00:08:35.179 --> 00:08:37.759 tide lifts all ships if we all start changing 00:08:37.759 --> 00:08:40.559 the way we work young people will want to do 00:08:40.559 --> 00:08:42.620 this job again and then you will go back to what 00:08:42.620 --> 00:08:46.960 we had for so many decades which was highly competitive 00:08:46.960 --> 00:08:50.279 lists that you took the top you know 10 15 20 00:08:50.279 --> 00:08:53.950 percent from Yeah, and it's funny because it's 00:08:53.950 --> 00:08:56.490 one of those things where I was a senior in high 00:08:56.490 --> 00:08:59.070 school, 9 -11, didn't really know what I was 00:08:59.070 --> 00:09:00.549 going to do with my life. I just knew I wasn't 00:09:00.549 --> 00:09:04.299 ready to go to college because I was a nut. I 00:09:04.299 --> 00:09:05.960 ended up joining the service, and my dad had 00:09:05.960 --> 00:09:07.600 told me, he goes, well, the good thing about 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:10.080 being in the military for public service jobs 00:09:10.080 --> 00:09:12.480 is you can get hired if you know somebody or 00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:14.539 if you have military service because you get 00:09:14.539 --> 00:09:17.299 veterans preference. So when I was active duty, 00:09:17.580 --> 00:09:21.080 my dad, unbeknownst to me, he didn't want me 00:09:21.080 --> 00:09:23.240 coming home when I got out and just doing nothing. 00:09:23.320 --> 00:09:25.299 So he went and signed me up for state standards 00:09:25.299 --> 00:09:27.360 at EMT school without me knowing. So as soon 00:09:27.360 --> 00:09:29.240 as I got home, he's like, you're going to do 00:09:29.240 --> 00:09:31.980 this. And I was like, all right. I did EMT school. 00:09:32.100 --> 00:09:34.460 It took me three times to pass it because I'm 00:09:34.460 --> 00:09:37.059 not very smart and I just didn't really like 00:09:37.059 --> 00:09:39.100 the medical side initially, even though that's 00:09:39.100 --> 00:09:41.799 like 90 % of what we do. But as soon as I went 00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:43.740 to standards, that's when I kind of fell in love 00:09:43.740 --> 00:09:45.740 with what the job was. And I was like, okay, 00:09:45.799 --> 00:09:48.039 this is, it's got the same structure, you know, 00:09:48.039 --> 00:09:50.919 military style, you know, rank structure and, 00:09:50.960 --> 00:09:53.419 and all that. So, and getting yelled at at that 00:09:53.419 --> 00:09:55.899 point was kind of common. So I wasn't, you know, 00:09:55.899 --> 00:09:59.769 shook by it, but same thing when I got. I was 00:09:59.769 --> 00:10:02.250 trying to get hired in South Florida. And obviously 00:10:02.250 --> 00:10:04.490 back then they were doing the transition where 00:10:04.490 --> 00:10:07.529 medic, you had to basically be a medic to get 00:10:07.529 --> 00:10:10.269 hired. And when I was at private fire Academy, 00:10:10.429 --> 00:10:12.870 they told me, look, go hire, go get hired up 00:10:12.870 --> 00:10:14.750 in orange County. They'll, they'll take you right 00:10:14.750 --> 00:10:16.769 away as an EMT, get your experience and then 00:10:16.769 --> 00:10:18.450 come back down here. So I was like, all right. 00:10:19.049 --> 00:10:21.960 So ended up. Coming up to Orange County and, 00:10:22.039 --> 00:10:23.600 you know, it was still a competitive process. 00:10:23.860 --> 00:10:26.500 There was 30 spots. This is like right around 00:10:26.500 --> 00:10:29.679 2007. So like we're on the wave of the economic 00:10:29.679 --> 00:10:31.940 collapse. Like it's getting ready to really get 00:10:31.940 --> 00:10:34.580 bad. And I ended up fortunately getting a job, 00:10:34.659 --> 00:10:37.379 which worked out well because I just had my son. 00:10:37.919 --> 00:10:40.460 He was six months old and I'm sitting here like 00:10:40.460 --> 00:10:42.740 feeling like a loser. You know, I'm like, I got 00:10:42.740 --> 00:10:45.860 to figure something out, you know. And I fell 00:10:45.860 --> 00:10:47.620 in love with the central Florida area. It was 00:10:47.620 --> 00:10:50.200 it was a lot cheaper to live. You know, the pay 00:10:50.200 --> 00:10:52.940 wasn't great. It was, I think when I got hired, 00:10:53.000 --> 00:10:56.399 I was started at like $13 .39 an hour, you know, 00:10:56.419 --> 00:10:59.000 which, I mean, if you look at inflation, it's 00:10:59.000 --> 00:11:01.480 definitely going way faster than the pay has 00:11:01.480 --> 00:11:03.919 ever gone. But, you know, I was happy with the 00:11:03.919 --> 00:11:07.840 career choice and I started out at station 63. 00:11:08.669 --> 00:11:10.590 and the guys there were all awesome i mean we 00:11:10.590 --> 00:11:13.210 stuck together for probably five years which 00:11:13.210 --> 00:11:16.289 nowadays is you know uncommon it seems like there's 00:11:16.289 --> 00:11:18.529 so much movement at least in our department which 00:11:18.529 --> 00:11:20.350 i'm sure it's it's like that in a lot of places 00:11:20.350 --> 00:11:22.879 where You know, you don't have crews that stick 00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:24.759 together that long and they're floating and everything 00:11:24.759 --> 00:11:27.240 else. But, you know, that time frame, it was 00:11:27.240 --> 00:11:29.779 different. I mean, it was all competitive. And 00:11:29.779 --> 00:11:32.200 you had a lot of the older generation, which 00:11:32.200 --> 00:11:34.700 when they got hired, this was a career. You know, 00:11:34.700 --> 00:11:37.360 people would stick around for 30 years. And it's 00:11:37.360 --> 00:11:40.279 like nowadays, I mean, you know, these kids and 00:11:40.279 --> 00:11:43.080 I say kids, I mean, I'm only 42. But, you know, 00:11:43.080 --> 00:11:44.919 there's so many other ways you can make money. 00:11:44.960 --> 00:11:47.750 I mean, shit, you can. sell feet pics you know 00:11:47.750 --> 00:11:50.870 it's like if you're riding a rescue in pine hills 00:11:50.870 --> 00:11:53.429 area up all night i'm sure they start thinking 00:11:53.429 --> 00:11:55.509 man maybe i'll do something else so it's like 00:11:55.509 --> 00:11:59.049 how do you navigate kind of the next generation 00:11:59.049 --> 00:12:02.129 and the the different opportunities that they 00:12:02.129 --> 00:12:05.049 have to to get them to stay here and i know you 00:12:05.049 --> 00:12:07.409 brought up the 24 72 and you're a big advocate 00:12:07.409 --> 00:12:09.990 for it and that's definitely going to be the 00:12:09.990 --> 00:12:11.909 big thing because the beauty of this job is that 00:12:11.909 --> 00:12:14.230 if you can have a schedule where you're working 00:12:14.230 --> 00:12:16.559 seven to ten days a month and you can still have 00:12:16.559 --> 00:12:18.940 some type of business on the outside then you 00:12:18.940 --> 00:12:21.399 have the best of both worlds but this job was 00:12:21.399 --> 00:12:25.799 never designed to be your primary like everyday 00:12:25.799 --> 00:12:28.360 thing where you're constantly exposing yourself 00:12:28.360 --> 00:12:33.000 to whether it's the fires or the the ptsd and 00:12:33.000 --> 00:12:34.679 the medical side of it i mean you're running 00:12:34.679 --> 00:12:37.120 just the volume of calls now that they weren't 00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:40.399 running back then When you were in the school 00:12:40.399 --> 00:12:44.740 ages, because when we do the 343, you're obviously 00:12:44.740 --> 00:12:47.559 usually on the podium. You're a phenomenal athlete. 00:12:47.759 --> 00:12:49.460 What were you playing and doing back then when 00:12:49.460 --> 00:12:54.480 you were a young man? Well, it's funny because 00:12:54.480 --> 00:12:56.720 the people that know me now, they never knew 00:12:56.720 --> 00:12:59.539 me when I was a kid. And thank God there was 00:12:59.539 --> 00:13:02.620 no social media. But I mean, back then, I was 00:13:02.620 --> 00:13:07.600 smoking cigarettes. I was being a knucklehead. 00:13:09.300 --> 00:13:11.840 After 9 -11 happened, at least for me, that's 00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:13.580 kind of when things changed where I was like, 00:13:13.659 --> 00:13:15.980 all right, I want to do something with my life. 00:13:16.100 --> 00:13:18.399 Like most of my family, both my grandfathers 00:13:18.399 --> 00:13:21.279 were in the military. My dad's father was a jump 00:13:21.279 --> 00:13:24.200 master during the Korean War. My aunt was a corpsman. 00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:27.960 My uncle was an avionics guy in the Air Force. 00:13:28.019 --> 00:13:30.179 My other uncle was in the Navy. And he's actually 00:13:30.179 --> 00:13:32.279 just retired from Waltham Fire Department up 00:13:32.279 --> 00:13:36.009 north. But I kind of... you know at 18 you never 00:13:36.009 --> 00:13:37.690 know what you want to do so it was just kind 00:13:37.690 --> 00:13:39.809 of like well maybe i'll go into kind of the same 00:13:39.809 --> 00:13:42.830 path as those people because all my family you 00:13:42.830 --> 00:13:48.529 know they're pretty successful um i lost my train 00:13:48.529 --> 00:13:50.149 of thought where was i going with that we talked 00:13:50.149 --> 00:13:51.750 we were talking about what sports and exercise 00:13:51.750 --> 00:13:54.750 you did oh yeah so i mean i grew up playing football 00:13:54.750 --> 00:13:57.850 all that stuff but baseball and then when i hit 00:13:57.850 --> 00:14:00.750 high school i wanted to chase girls so i the 00:14:00.750 --> 00:14:02.549 practice was getting in the way and then i just 00:14:02.549 --> 00:14:05.000 started doing that I mean, to this day, I regret 00:14:05.000 --> 00:14:07.440 it because I was pretty good at baseball. I never 00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:10.019 had the size for football. But, you know, I always 00:14:10.019 --> 00:14:11.799 had the kind of that background. And then once 00:14:11.799 --> 00:14:14.700 I went to basic training and that kind of and 00:14:14.700 --> 00:14:16.419 anybody that doesn't know what they want to do 00:14:16.419 --> 00:14:19.480 with their life or needs like when you're young, 00:14:19.580 --> 00:14:21.940 you got to kind of look at yourself and go, am 00:14:21.940 --> 00:14:23.879 I doing everything I can or do I need a push? 00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:26.960 And so basic training for me was the push. When 00:14:26.960 --> 00:14:28.960 I went in there, it was like they reprogram me 00:14:28.960 --> 00:14:32.159 just because of my background. Like, you know, 00:14:32.179 --> 00:14:34.789 my mom. i know we're kind of going all over the 00:14:34.789 --> 00:14:38.070 place but so my mom you know she's struggled 00:14:38.070 --> 00:14:40.370 with substance abuse most of her life my sister 00:14:40.370 --> 00:14:44.129 who actually passed away from an overdose 15 00:14:44.129 --> 00:14:46.730 years ago kind of same thing same family history 00:14:46.730 --> 00:14:49.269 with that and so growing up and watching that 00:14:49.269 --> 00:14:52.970 i knew like what that road looked like and i 00:14:52.970 --> 00:14:54.769 knew that some of the people i was hanging out 00:14:54.769 --> 00:14:57.049 with were going down that road and i knew i did 00:14:57.049 --> 00:14:59.370 not want to continue down that path and i saw 00:14:59.370 --> 00:15:02.110 where it went so that was kind of me looking 00:15:02.110 --> 00:15:03.750 at the military he's like let me get out of here 00:15:03.750 --> 00:15:06.350 for a few years and figure my own life out and 00:15:06.350 --> 00:15:08.830 and the good thing is like anytime you put yourself 00:15:08.830 --> 00:15:10.730 in the room with with people that are already 00:15:10.730 --> 00:15:13.730 doing what you want to do that's infectious you 00:15:13.730 --> 00:15:15.889 know like you get around good people then you 00:15:15.889 --> 00:15:18.490 start kind of going down that same path so i 00:15:18.490 --> 00:15:20.750 mean i wouldn't be here today if i didn't have 00:15:20.750 --> 00:15:23.409 a lot of the good mentors i had between the military 00:15:23.409 --> 00:15:25.409 and the fire service i mean most of the guys 00:15:25.409 --> 00:15:28.159 that that are looked at as like the legends in 00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:30.360 the fire service, I latched onto those guys as 00:15:30.360 --> 00:15:32.960 much as I could just to pull what I could. And 00:15:32.960 --> 00:15:35.000 then obviously now at the state of my career 00:15:35.000 --> 00:15:39.460 where now it's time for me to give it back. Both 00:15:39.460 --> 00:15:41.500 the books really, but certainly the most recent 00:15:41.500 --> 00:15:43.480 one I wrote, you know, the multi -generational 00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:46.299 trauma is a big part of it, you know, to really 00:15:46.299 --> 00:15:48.139 show, look, this is, you know, not just your 00:15:48.139 --> 00:15:50.120 childhood, your parents' childhood, your grandparents' 00:15:50.320 --> 00:15:52.779 childhood, but it's not doom and gloom. When 00:15:52.779 --> 00:15:55.279 you identify that these dominoes are falling, 00:15:55.850 --> 00:15:57.730 you know, you yourself can look in the mirror 00:15:57.730 --> 00:15:59.350 and go, okay, what do I need to do? And I think 00:15:59.350 --> 00:16:02.429 that mentorship is a big part with the ACEs score, 00:16:02.549 --> 00:16:07.330 the Adverse Childhood Experience score. We, on 00:16:07.330 --> 00:16:09.730 average, have kind of an ACEs of about six out 00:16:09.730 --> 00:16:13.289 of 10, as do incarcerated personnel, you know, 00:16:13.289 --> 00:16:16.320 men and women. If you think about that, we find 00:16:16.320 --> 00:16:18.879 ourselves at the same crossroads. One finds a 00:16:18.879 --> 00:16:21.419 drug dealer as a mentor, one finds a military 00:16:21.419 --> 00:16:23.440 member as a mentor, and then off we go on different 00:16:23.440 --> 00:16:26.399 paths. But it's the same thing. Unaddressed trauma 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:30.559 is unaddressed trauma. Oh, yeah. When I was a 00:16:30.559 --> 00:16:33.000 kid, I didn't realize it. I don't think anybody 00:16:33.000 --> 00:16:37.460 does at that age. By the time I was turning 18, 00:16:37.639 --> 00:16:40.960 I got a little bit of trouble. That's when I 00:16:40.960 --> 00:16:42.639 realized I was like, I got to get out of here. 00:16:42.799 --> 00:16:46.279 And yeah, I mean, it's funny because I never 00:16:46.279 --> 00:16:49.240 realized it until looking back. But my first 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:52.740 experience where I actually helped somebody, 00:16:52.799 --> 00:16:56.029 I was. 18 years old getting ready to graduate 00:16:56.029 --> 00:16:58.850 but a month before me and my friends were driving 00:16:58.850 --> 00:17:01.629 out of my neighborhood out of cooper city and 00:17:01.629 --> 00:17:04.369 they just started widening the griffin road canal 00:17:04.369 --> 00:17:08.690 and as we're pulling out our cars coming down 00:17:08.690 --> 00:17:10.650 they kind of changed the way the road went normally 00:17:10.650 --> 00:17:12.450 it was just kind of a straight shot but they 00:17:12.450 --> 00:17:14.250 started putting jersey barriers up and they were 00:17:14.250 --> 00:17:17.190 like changing the the path of the road so we're 00:17:17.190 --> 00:17:18.829 pulling in we're getting ready to turn left and 00:17:18.829 --> 00:17:22.359 we watch x5 bmw drive into the canal And nobody 00:17:22.359 --> 00:17:24.900 else is on the road. So my friends, I'm like, 00:17:24.940 --> 00:17:26.819 pull up to the shoreline. I stripped down to 00:17:26.819 --> 00:17:29.220 my underwear. I end up getting a glass punch 00:17:29.220 --> 00:17:31.400 from my friend. I jump in there. I pull the lady 00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:33.660 out of the car. And then I vomited all over the 00:17:33.660 --> 00:17:35.980 place afterwards from the adrenaline dump. But 00:17:35.980 --> 00:17:38.240 I remember that first experience being like, 00:17:38.440 --> 00:17:41.220 all right, that was kind of cool. I wonder if 00:17:41.220 --> 00:17:42.720 there's more that I could do with that. And that 00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:45.579 kind of pivoted me towards the military. And 00:17:45.579 --> 00:17:47.160 then two weeks after that, then I ended up getting 00:17:47.160 --> 00:17:50.029 arrested for. something at a prom where I drank 00:17:50.029 --> 00:17:52.150 and then, you know, the cops were going to say 00:17:52.150 --> 00:17:53.289 that they were going to arrest me. I ended up 00:17:53.289 --> 00:17:55.829 running from the cops and then I pooped my pants. 00:17:55.890 --> 00:17:58.910 So then I went to county for a night. It was 00:17:58.910 --> 00:18:01.769 a whole crazy story, but, but, you know, that 00:18:01.769 --> 00:18:03.970 was kind of the switch of like, all right, I 00:18:03.970 --> 00:18:05.869 did something really good. And then right after 00:18:05.869 --> 00:18:07.710 that, I did something really bad. And then it's 00:18:07.710 --> 00:18:10.049 like, do I really want my life to go down that 00:18:10.049 --> 00:18:12.190 path? And after going one night in jail, I was 00:18:12.190 --> 00:18:15.029 like, okay, I'm not, uh, I'm not going that path. 00:18:16.170 --> 00:18:17.910 That's the point. That's a human being, isn't 00:18:17.910 --> 00:18:20.150 it? This is what was so crazy. It's funny you 00:18:20.150 --> 00:18:22.849 talk about Griffin. My wife was at Nova Southeastern 00:18:22.849 --> 00:18:25.349 in med school for the last four years. So three 00:18:25.349 --> 00:18:27.190 and a half years, I was driving down Griffin 00:18:27.190 --> 00:18:29.069 to go see her. So I can see exactly the canal 00:18:29.069 --> 00:18:33.089 you're talking about. But when I did the fire 00:18:33.089 --> 00:18:35.569 team testing, it was called, where they do one 00:18:35.569 --> 00:18:37.730 test and they give it to all the different departments. 00:18:37.950 --> 00:18:40.410 Miami Beach. Oh yeah, it was a mesh test. Yes, 00:18:40.430 --> 00:18:43.869 that was it. Miami Beach was there. And so they 00:18:43.869 --> 00:18:46.650 did a pre -app. And I was on the first app I've 00:18:46.650 --> 00:18:49.170 ever done for a fire service. And I'm super honest. 00:18:49.269 --> 00:18:50.769 I'm like, yeah, a long time ago, I tried these 00:18:50.769 --> 00:18:53.230 things. And the dude just crumpled it up and 00:18:53.230 --> 00:18:56.230 threw it in my face. And I was like, oh, so you're 00:18:56.230 --> 00:18:58.269 supposed to lie to be a firefighter in America. 00:18:58.329 --> 00:19:00.509 Got it. And it worked. I mean, I lied every other 00:19:00.509 --> 00:19:02.170 time. Oh, never tried anything. No, I was too 00:19:02.170 --> 00:19:05.190 busy at church lighting candles and shit. But 00:19:05.190 --> 00:19:06.950 you actually think about that, though. And I'm 00:19:06.950 --> 00:19:09.809 being sarcastic for a reason. what the fire service 00:19:09.809 --> 00:19:11.630 needs are some people that have done some things 00:19:11.630 --> 00:19:13.829 doesn't have to be a criminal past but have been 00:19:13.829 --> 00:19:16.210 through some struggles been through some traumas 00:19:16.210 --> 00:19:19.089 ideally work through them that's really post 00:19:19.089 --> 00:19:21.970 -traumatic growth it's resilience but that's 00:19:21.970 --> 00:19:23.609 what gives you the empathy that's what allows 00:19:23.609 --> 00:19:26.390 you to work in pine hills and holden heights 00:19:26.390 --> 00:19:28.630 and all these areas where you know it is a very 00:19:28.630 --> 00:19:30.690 desperate area and you can relate to these people 00:19:30.690 --> 00:19:32.910 that are struggling because you didn't grow up 00:19:33.240 --> 00:19:35.880 not knowing any trauma, not knowing any struggles. 00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:38.880 So I think it's such a misnomer in, you know, 00:19:38.880 --> 00:19:40.960 fire service recruitment that they're, they're 00:19:40.960 --> 00:19:42.980 looking for choir boys and girls and that's absolute 00:19:42.980 --> 00:19:45.240 bullshit. You know, a lot of people have done 00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:47.180 some things and that's going to be an asset in 00:19:47.180 --> 00:19:52.079 uniform. Yeah, no, I agree. I mean, Like when 00:19:52.079 --> 00:19:54.480 I did my application process, you know, I was 00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:57.599 honest and I put some stuff down. And then obviously 00:19:57.599 --> 00:19:59.980 I knew that the arrest thing was going to come 00:19:59.980 --> 00:20:02.480 up and it had been expunged and I had the whole 00:20:02.480 --> 00:20:05.220 thing there. So I don't know if Orange County 00:20:05.220 --> 00:20:07.259 does it now. I'm pretty sure they still do. Back 00:20:07.259 --> 00:20:09.359 then there was the lie detector and then you 00:20:09.359 --> 00:20:11.440 also had to do that psychological. And I think 00:20:11.440 --> 00:20:14.210 they scrapped the psychological. for the lie 00:20:14.210 --> 00:20:16.190 detector portion, you know, I went in there and, 00:20:16.269 --> 00:20:18.130 uh, the guy that was doing it was a Navy vet. 00:20:18.210 --> 00:20:20.029 So, you know, they only, before they click everything 00:20:20.029 --> 00:20:22.950 on, he explains it to you. And then, um, me and 00:20:22.950 --> 00:20:24.890 him like talked a little bit, just kind of get 00:20:24.890 --> 00:20:26.569 to know each other. And then he's like, all right, 00:20:26.569 --> 00:20:27.829 you're ready to go. And then he flips the thing 00:20:27.829 --> 00:20:31.549 on. So we ended up talking about all that stuff. 00:20:31.589 --> 00:20:32.650 And it says, all right, you know, you said you 00:20:32.650 --> 00:20:34.609 use marijuana three times, you know, whatever, 00:20:34.630 --> 00:20:37.190 and then go through the whole thing. But it was 00:20:37.190 --> 00:20:39.319 the same thing. I'm thinking it's like, If you 00:20:39.319 --> 00:20:40.940 had somebody that used marijuana a hundred times, 00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:43.059 but they haven't used it since, I mean, everybody 00:20:43.059 --> 00:20:47.180 goes through these things in life where, like 00:20:47.180 --> 00:20:49.380 you're saying, it's experimentation, they make 00:20:49.380 --> 00:20:51.200 mistakes, they learn from it, and you're looking 00:20:51.200 --> 00:20:54.240 to see, are they still walking this narrow line 00:20:54.240 --> 00:20:56.200 or have they gone to the other side? So it's 00:20:56.200 --> 00:20:59.799 like, if you're taking nothing but the best of 00:20:59.799 --> 00:21:01.660 what you're saying it is, how many people are 00:21:01.660 --> 00:21:04.839 you truly excluding from the career? Do you end 00:21:04.839 --> 00:21:07.000 up with that kind of person flying up the career 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:09.759 ladder and being, an absolute nightmare wearing 00:21:09.759 --> 00:21:14.079 bugles yeah or do they even make it because they 00:21:14.079 --> 00:21:16.980 don't have that capacity to deal with stressful 00:21:16.980 --> 00:21:18.859 situations because the first one they've ever 00:21:18.859 --> 00:21:22.910 had is this job you know like for me With a mother 00:21:22.910 --> 00:21:25.430 who had substance abuse and alcoholism and mental 00:21:25.430 --> 00:21:28.710 disorders, when I was a kid, she locked me and 00:21:28.710 --> 00:21:30.170 my sister in a bathroom because she thought I 00:21:30.170 --> 00:21:32.710 was Jesus. She thought my stepdad was the devil 00:21:32.710 --> 00:21:34.630 and then they had to break the door down. She 00:21:34.630 --> 00:21:36.589 went away to somewhere and I didn't see her for 00:21:36.589 --> 00:21:40.089 six months. Granted, I'm not mentally affected 00:21:40.089 --> 00:21:42.549 by it anymore. I don't even know if necessarily 00:21:42.549 --> 00:21:44.750 I was. I think I used alcohol and stuff when 00:21:44.750 --> 00:21:48.220 I was a kid as a coping mechanism. i look at 00:21:48.220 --> 00:21:50.180 it now and it's like now when i have that call 00:21:50.180 --> 00:21:52.700 i'm able to sit down and talk to the kid that's 00:21:52.700 --> 00:21:55.460 dealing with that similar situation and and tell 00:21:55.460 --> 00:21:57.680 them my story and a little snippet of just like 00:21:57.680 --> 00:22:00.099 listen this doesn't have to be your life you 00:22:00.099 --> 00:22:02.099 know and try and give them as much coaching and 00:22:02.099 --> 00:22:04.079 guidance as you can in that short period of time 00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:05.980 but if you have somebody that's never dealt with 00:22:05.980 --> 00:22:08.400 that how do you talk to that patient how do you 00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:10.859 talk to that family you know and it's at least 00:22:10.859 --> 00:22:13.380 for me the experiences of everything i went through 00:22:13.380 --> 00:22:16.240 as a kid to now have definitely made me better 00:22:16.240 --> 00:22:18.980 equipped to deal with the stuff we see on a daily 00:22:18.980 --> 00:22:21.539 basis because nobody's calling you when things 00:22:21.539 --> 00:22:24.059 are good in this job it's always the bad the 00:22:24.059 --> 00:22:26.319 worst of the worst and then how do you respond 00:22:26.319 --> 00:22:29.519 to it you know well what was funny is the two 00:22:29.519 --> 00:22:32.380 things that i'd said i'd tried were because i 00:22:32.380 --> 00:22:34.119 hate marijuana just didn't didn't work for me 00:22:34.119 --> 00:22:37.380 at all we're um mdma basically when i was in 00:22:37.380 --> 00:22:40.559 japan going to rave clubs and mushrooms which 00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:43.200 were legal psilocybin the two compounds that 00:22:43.200 --> 00:22:46.240 we see are helping veterans and first responders 00:22:46.240 --> 00:22:51.720 with mental health issues i read a lot of that 00:22:51.720 --> 00:22:54.119 stuff too about the psilocybin where yeah it's 00:22:54.119 --> 00:22:56.480 supposed to help almost rewire the brain and 00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:59.779 it helps with ptsd and you know you look back 00:22:59.779 --> 00:23:03.200 at you know i read all the crazy conspiracy stuff 00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:05.779 mk ultra and all the other things you know i 00:23:05.779 --> 00:23:08.519 go down the rabbit holes but One of the things 00:23:08.519 --> 00:23:10.380 that, you know, one of the conspiracy theories 00:23:10.380 --> 00:23:12.079 is why they outlawed all that stuff in the beginning 00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:13.880 is people were getting so enlightened and they 00:23:13.880 --> 00:23:15.920 were starting to push back on things in like 00:23:15.920 --> 00:23:17.980 the 70s. They were like, ooh, we got to quiet 00:23:17.980 --> 00:23:20.460 this down. Let's get the SSRIs and all this other 00:23:20.460 --> 00:23:22.500 stuff on board so that way these people aren't 00:23:22.500 --> 00:23:25.500 thinking about, you know, how we're really rigging 00:23:25.500 --> 00:23:28.420 the system against them. Well, we did basically 00:23:28.420 --> 00:23:30.559 the same hiring process because I came on in 00:23:30.559 --> 00:23:32.839 08 after coming back from California. So I think 00:23:32.839 --> 00:23:35.519 my badge number was 16 something. I forget what 00:23:35.519 --> 00:23:39.019 it was. Yeah. And I actually wrote about this 00:23:39.019 --> 00:23:41.549 in one of my books. Firstly, the psych test. 00:23:41.769 --> 00:23:43.789 I don't know if you had the same lady. You do 00:23:43.789 --> 00:23:46.509 the MMPI, which I found out since with all these 00:23:46.509 --> 00:23:48.710 conversations with the psychology and psychiatry 00:23:48.710 --> 00:23:51.509 world, was never meant to be a standalone test 00:23:51.509 --> 00:23:54.710 in the first place to determine anyone is able 00:23:54.710 --> 00:23:56.650 to do a job, not to mention a first responder. 00:23:57.809 --> 00:24:00.930 But secondly, then you talk with the lady in 00:24:00.930 --> 00:24:03.849 her office where she looked like a pack rat and 00:24:03.849 --> 00:24:07.130 you had to move. Like literally file to file 00:24:07.130 --> 00:24:09.009 to file to even find somewhere to sit. And I'm 00:24:09.009 --> 00:24:10.390 like, this is the person that's going to determine 00:24:10.390 --> 00:24:13.950 if I'm crazy or not. But I think where we've 00:24:13.950 --> 00:24:16.130 done a massive disservice is these are basically 00:24:16.130 --> 00:24:18.430 box checking things. A polygraph is another one. 00:24:18.490 --> 00:24:19.869 You know, squeeze your butt when you answer the 00:24:19.869 --> 00:24:21.930 regular questions and then answer the other one. 00:24:22.049 --> 00:24:24.670 You should be fine. A little, you know, behind 00:24:24.670 --> 00:24:28.569 the curtain trick for you. But I say that because, 00:24:28.650 --> 00:24:30.130 you know, I ended up being, I would like to say, 00:24:30.170 --> 00:24:32.710 a good paramedic, a good firefighter. So these 00:24:32.710 --> 00:24:35.559 barriers were... circumnavigated for a reason, 00:24:35.619 --> 00:24:38.000 for a good reason. But if you have the conversation 00:24:38.000 --> 00:24:40.539 that at the front door, James Gearing was in 00:24:40.539 --> 00:24:43.259 a house fire when he was four, his horrible divorce, 00:24:43.359 --> 00:24:47.259 another near -death experience. Dan Lennon has 00:24:47.259 --> 00:24:51.099 addiction in his family and has his own trauma. 00:24:52.299 --> 00:24:54.440 So if you have that conversation like James and 00:24:54.440 --> 00:24:57.119 Dan, the fact that you are driven to serve, that 00:24:57.119 --> 00:24:59.299 you want to put a badge on your chest and wear 00:24:59.299 --> 00:25:01.420 a uniform tells us that you probably had some 00:25:01.420 --> 00:25:04.220 things happen. So as much as we're going to do 00:25:04.220 --> 00:25:07.920 PT, let's start doing the mental health side, 00:25:08.019 --> 00:25:09.759 too. We're going to give you in probation, you 00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:12.500 know, six, eight counseling sessions as well, 00:25:12.500 --> 00:25:15.299 because if you want to grow and be a great firefighter, 00:25:15.299 --> 00:25:18.019 a great paramedic, working through some of the 00:25:18.019 --> 00:25:19.559 things that you went through when you were younger 00:25:19.559 --> 00:25:22.559 is going to create an asset. And we don't do 00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:24.980 that. We check boxes so that if someone, for 00:25:24.980 --> 00:25:27.119 whatever reason, doesn't work out, well, we tested 00:25:27.119 --> 00:25:30.220 them. You know, that's not our problem. So I 00:25:30.220 --> 00:25:33.140 think it's so backwards because most of us that 00:25:33.140 --> 00:25:35.420 put the uniform on have had some things happen. 00:25:35.460 --> 00:25:38.160 And that's not a bad thing unless it is pushed 00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:41.779 down and locked away. And then, you know, fast 00:25:41.779 --> 00:25:44.380 forward 10, 15 years in your career. Some of 00:25:44.380 --> 00:25:45.960 our men and women are wondering why they're sitting 00:25:45.960 --> 00:25:47.460 there with a bottle of whiskey and a pistol. 00:25:48.619 --> 00:25:52.619 Yeah. You know, it's kind of so true just at 00:25:52.619 --> 00:25:54.380 the fire service in general, right? Like you 00:25:54.380 --> 00:25:57.079 respond to a call and you react to whatever you 00:25:57.079 --> 00:25:59.319 see, right? And it seems like no matter what, 00:25:59.359 --> 00:26:01.880 that bleeds into everything we do, whether it's 00:26:01.880 --> 00:26:05.359 pre -planning for certain things as far as the 00:26:05.359 --> 00:26:07.599 hiring stuff, but they're never really pre -planning. 00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:09.160 They're just waiting to say, oh shit, we have 00:26:09.160 --> 00:26:11.099 a problem with staffing now and all these people 00:26:11.099 --> 00:26:13.059 are leaving. So let's do a reactionary thing 00:26:13.059 --> 00:26:16.019 and do it, right? And that's why like, you know, 00:26:16.039 --> 00:26:19.180 when you talk about 24 -72s, I'm a huge advocate 00:26:19.180 --> 00:26:21.519 for it. Obviously, not just because of the schedule. 00:26:21.579 --> 00:26:23.880 I think it's a great schedule for mental and 00:26:23.880 --> 00:26:26.920 physical health, but honestly, recruitment. And 00:26:26.920 --> 00:26:29.400 if all of these departments locally start doing 00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:32.019 it first, then as always, we're going to be the 00:26:32.019 --> 00:26:35.039 last one to convert to it. And by that point, 00:26:35.059 --> 00:26:37.140 it's too late. Like, why not be the front runner 00:26:37.140 --> 00:26:39.720 for it and be the one that starts it? And yeah, 00:26:39.779 --> 00:26:41.140 you know, it's going to pull from other areas, 00:26:41.180 --> 00:26:43.140 but now it's going to force the local area to 00:26:43.140 --> 00:26:44.640 do it. And really, they're already doing it anyway. 00:26:44.900 --> 00:26:46.960 They're going to do it. Kissimmee's already done 00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:49.200 it. I've heard OFDs talking about it. You have 00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:51.339 Palm Beach County who's wanting to do it. And 00:26:51.339 --> 00:26:53.220 like, fortunately for me, like I was in the Air 00:26:53.220 --> 00:26:55.880 Force Reserves after I got active duty down in 00:26:55.880 --> 00:27:00.400 Miami and I was a fireman for the DOD. And I 00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:02.099 have a lot of good connections with a lot of 00:27:02.099 --> 00:27:04.460 guys that are on all these big departments. And 00:27:04.460 --> 00:27:05.980 they all tell me, they're like, yeah, we're doing 00:27:05.980 --> 00:27:08.880 it because we know it's coming. And they're like, 00:27:08.900 --> 00:27:10.680 we love when the Orange County guys come down 00:27:10.680 --> 00:27:12.519 here because you guys train them so good that 00:27:12.519 --> 00:27:13.880 we don't really have to do anything for them 00:27:13.880 --> 00:27:15.319 when they get here. And I'm like, oh, great. 00:27:15.460 --> 00:27:19.400 Here we go again. And it sucks because it's like 00:27:19.400 --> 00:27:22.880 for our department, we have some of the best 00:27:22.880 --> 00:27:25.559 trainers. We have some of the best special ops 00:27:25.559 --> 00:27:28.799 guys. I mean, best medics. I mean, like all of 00:27:28.799 --> 00:27:31.579 the people that do our training. And I was fortunate 00:27:31.579 --> 00:27:34.480 to be a part of that cadre where I did a lot 00:27:34.480 --> 00:27:37.319 of recruit training. It's awesome to see and 00:27:37.319 --> 00:27:39.720 it makes you better. But it's also after a while. 00:27:40.659 --> 00:27:43.299 bogs you down because when you're watching people 00:27:43.299 --> 00:27:46.599 that you've poured yourself into and you give 00:27:46.599 --> 00:27:48.200 them everything you got and then you look at 00:27:48.200 --> 00:27:50.500 this person and you think, all right, I just 00:27:50.500 --> 00:27:52.440 trained my replacement. And then they walk out 00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:55.059 the door to somebody else for more money, better 00:27:55.059 --> 00:27:58.339 benefits, or now a schedule change. After a while, 00:27:58.400 --> 00:28:00.200 you just start feeling like, man, I'm turning 00:28:00.200 --> 00:28:03.839 my wheels. And that comes at a cost. You're giving 00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:06.359 up time with your family. I live in Volusia County 00:28:06.359 --> 00:28:08.759 and I drive an hour to work and I was doing that 00:28:08.759 --> 00:28:12.289 every day. Monday through Friday for almost five 00:28:12.289 --> 00:28:15.990 years to make the department better. But it's 00:28:15.990 --> 00:28:17.970 like we got to get something from the other side 00:28:17.970 --> 00:28:19.390 of it to where it's like, hey, we're going to 00:28:19.390 --> 00:28:25.740 train them, but you got to retain them. Absolutely. 00:28:25.859 --> 00:28:27.640 Well, this is the problem I have. My frustrations 00:28:27.640 --> 00:28:30.559 in Marion County is we have the Florida State 00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:33.400 Fire College here. We have a baby making machine, 00:28:33.539 --> 00:28:36.480 a firefighter baby making machine in our county, 00:28:36.519 --> 00:28:39.359 and they all go places. And again, the Marion, 00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:42.299 kudos to Marion. They have some great people 00:28:42.299 --> 00:28:44.579 in that department, despite the way that they 00:28:44.579 --> 00:28:46.460 work, but they've worked into the ground. And 00:28:46.460 --> 00:28:48.220 it was the same, you know, I mean, you and I, 00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:49.880 when we entered Orange, I mean, mandatories were 00:28:49.880 --> 00:28:52.940 already a thing. And when I became a medic, especially. 00:28:53.529 --> 00:28:55.670 which I put myself through. They didn't even 00:28:55.670 --> 00:28:57.589 give me any tuition reimbursement. They're crying 00:28:57.589 --> 00:29:00.470 for medics. They gave me zero help. Went to medic, 00:29:00.589 --> 00:29:02.549 Robie, Marion County, you know, I went to medic 00:29:02.549 --> 00:29:04.970 school in Ocala. I come out the other end and 00:29:04.970 --> 00:29:06.829 then, you know, I'm just getting hit and hit 00:29:06.829 --> 00:29:09.549 and hit and hit. But, you know, you do, you basically 00:29:09.549 --> 00:29:12.809 become a department that, you know, either non 00:29:12.809 --> 00:29:15.349 -cert trains them from scratch or, you know, 00:29:15.349 --> 00:29:16.930 has people come in that have already got their 00:29:16.930 --> 00:29:19.279 stuff. But yeah, I mean, if you're in, you know, 00:29:19.299 --> 00:29:21.759 50 or 42 or whatever, your learning curve is 00:29:21.759 --> 00:29:24.779 so steep that you do end up forging some amazing 00:29:24.779 --> 00:29:28.420 firefighters. But then, yeah, you know, if you're 00:29:28.420 --> 00:29:30.299 here in Marion and you hear Gainesville is going 00:29:30.299 --> 00:29:33.200 to a 42 hour work week that also has, you know, 00:29:33.220 --> 00:29:35.519 great firefighters and great training, of course, 00:29:35.519 --> 00:29:37.319 you're going to go there. And I know Marion, 00:29:37.359 --> 00:29:41.140 basically, it was all but 20 grand per person 00:29:41.140 --> 00:29:43.759 that they lost. That's how much it costs. the 00:29:43.759 --> 00:29:45.680 department, which means the taxpayer. So you 00:29:45.680 --> 00:29:47.680 lose 100 people, which they do in a very short 00:29:47.680 --> 00:29:50.220 amount of time. That's $2 million that just walked 00:29:50.220 --> 00:29:53.099 out the back door. So not only, as you said, 00:29:53.240 --> 00:29:55.099 it's a very valid point. You've got these people 00:29:55.099 --> 00:29:58.779 like Jamal pouring their hearts into these training 00:29:58.779 --> 00:30:00.980 programs because the one I had was terrible. 00:30:01.660 --> 00:30:07.240 2008, whatever the SOPs were for new hire training, 00:30:07.519 --> 00:30:10.539 our instructors were so frustrated, so frustrated. 00:30:10.619 --> 00:30:12.880 But I know now that you've evolved to this incredible, 00:30:13.480 --> 00:30:15.779 training program that you have, but yeah. And 00:30:15.779 --> 00:30:17.980 then you put all that money, all that time, all 00:30:17.980 --> 00:30:20.680 that manpower in, and then they go and become 00:30:20.680 --> 00:30:22.400 an asset in a different department. And that's 00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:26.359 an insult to the taxpayer who's funded the recruitment 00:30:26.359 --> 00:30:30.779 and training of that first responder. Well, and 00:30:30.779 --> 00:30:33.119 I'm waiting for like the politicians and like, 00:30:33.140 --> 00:30:35.140 and everybody else to kind of step in because 00:30:35.140 --> 00:30:37.799 your job at the admin level and at the political 00:30:37.799 --> 00:30:40.059 level is that you're supposed to be good stewards 00:30:40.059 --> 00:30:43.509 of the taxpayer's dollar, right? Now, I mean, 00:30:43.529 --> 00:30:46.069 grant funding, like we've used the Safer Grant 00:30:46.069 --> 00:30:49.329 for years. And from my understanding, like the 00:30:49.329 --> 00:30:52.470 Safer Grant, so say if I hire James and James 00:30:52.470 --> 00:30:55.369 is here on Safer Grant for three years, James 00:30:55.369 --> 00:30:58.210 ends up leaving after year one. We still have 00:30:58.210 --> 00:31:00.950 two years left on that grant. Now they can apply 00:31:00.950 --> 00:31:04.509 that money towards a current employee who is 00:31:04.509 --> 00:31:07.329 in Safer Grant. So it's like, it's almost like 00:31:07.329 --> 00:31:10.769 a shell game now where you're almost financially. 00:31:12.559 --> 00:31:15.039 in getting people to leave because now you get 00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:17.759 to offset the cost for your payroll. You know, 00:31:17.799 --> 00:31:21.019 so it's like maybe there isn't really a benefit 00:31:21.019 --> 00:31:23.299 to fix it if you have all these safer grant employees. 00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:24.940 I don't know if we got the grant. I don't even, 00:31:25.000 --> 00:31:27.039 I don't really pay attention to too much of that 00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:29.480 stuff anymore. But while I was down there, that 00:31:29.480 --> 00:31:31.519 was kind of the recurring thing is like, why 00:31:31.519 --> 00:31:34.339 fix retention if it's actually helping reduce 00:31:34.339 --> 00:31:36.579 your payroll costs for existing employees and 00:31:36.579 --> 00:31:39.680 then you continue rolling it over. This is funny 00:31:39.680 --> 00:31:41.980 because the last person I spoke to about the 00:31:41.980 --> 00:31:44.900 safer grant was recently, and there was a smaller 00:31:44.900 --> 00:31:47.440 department that, again, one of the guys had reached 00:31:47.440 --> 00:31:50.339 out talking about the 2472, and he said, and 00:31:50.339 --> 00:31:53.660 we just secured a safer grant. So proactively, 00:31:53.720 --> 00:31:56.420 what they've done is they've got a safer grant 00:31:56.420 --> 00:31:59.359 that will then help fund the D -shift. Now that, 00:31:59.400 --> 00:32:01.559 I mean, you can't think of a better investment 00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:03.940 of taxpayers' money, national taxpayers' money, 00:32:04.119 --> 00:32:06.980 than to use a safer grant to create a fourth 00:32:06.980 --> 00:32:09.759 shift. now you've you know you've created this 00:32:09.759 --> 00:32:11.819 recruitment tool you've got longevity you're 00:32:11.819 --> 00:32:13.559 going to reduce you know workman's comp claims 00:32:13.559 --> 00:32:16.460 you know accidents i mean all the things with 00:32:16.460 --> 00:32:19.259 this one grant but like you said the the dark 00:32:19.259 --> 00:32:21.440 side of that the abuse of that is exactly what 00:32:21.440 --> 00:32:23.400 you're talking about you're not using it as a 00:32:23.400 --> 00:32:25.420 training and retention tool at all you're using 00:32:25.420 --> 00:32:29.759 it to just move money around yeah and i mean 00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:32.680 the other side of it too is is that announcing 00:32:32.680 --> 00:32:37.039 that you can do a 24 72 for an apartment of our 00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:42.059 scale is significant. Right. So by announcing 00:32:42.059 --> 00:32:44.559 it, you kick the timeframe out, say two or three 00:32:44.559 --> 00:32:47.339 years. And with us having a training center now 00:32:47.339 --> 00:32:50.000 recruit from the local area specifically. So 00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:51.559 a lot of these people will leave. Cause I know 00:32:51.559 --> 00:32:53.420 guys that are from central Florida that left 00:32:53.420 --> 00:32:55.160 to go to Palm beach County that left to go to 00:32:55.160 --> 00:32:57.700 Miami that have no family there because the money 00:32:57.700 --> 00:33:01.640 was better, you know? So it's like. Now, it's 00:33:01.640 --> 00:33:03.480 going to be a daunting task because I was reading 00:33:03.480 --> 00:33:05.180 something not too long ago where they said in 00:33:05.180 --> 00:33:07.920 the state of Florida, we're short like over 1 00:33:07.920 --> 00:33:11.000 ,200 firefighters statewide. I know when the 00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:13.900 consortium was open, they were pumping out roughly 00:33:13.900 --> 00:33:16.839 250 a year of certified personnel in the state 00:33:16.839 --> 00:33:20.059 of Florida. So now with the central Florida area. 00:33:20.259 --> 00:33:22.339 So with the consortium closed and now Orange 00:33:22.339 --> 00:33:24.720 County being now the training facility where 00:33:24.720 --> 00:33:27.039 we're going to host our own standards in kind 00:33:27.039 --> 00:33:30.730 of conjunction with Valencia. I don't really 00:33:30.730 --> 00:33:32.829 know if that number is going to grow as much. 00:33:33.049 --> 00:33:35.430 And then you also have like Jay Marquez, who's 00:33:35.430 --> 00:33:38.029 doing his standards classes out in St. Cloud. 00:33:38.509 --> 00:33:41.089 But, you know, a lot of these places, I mean, 00:33:41.109 --> 00:33:43.509 if you're getting 300 a year, but now you're 00:33:43.509 --> 00:33:46.390 going to increase to the 2472 on top of trying 00:33:46.390 --> 00:33:49.210 to hire for people that are leaving, people that, 00:33:49.289 --> 00:33:52.289 you know, retire or whatever. It's like, how 00:33:52.289 --> 00:33:54.349 are you going to make it? You know, I don't know. 00:33:54.450 --> 00:33:57.210 And I mean, I saw something that Jay posted and 00:33:57.210 --> 00:34:00.720 the state of Florida is, you know, posting how 00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:03.400 you can get reciprocal certifications if you're 00:34:03.400 --> 00:34:06.160 a dod firefighter but these guys like when you 00:34:06.160 --> 00:34:09.199 come out as a four -year dod firefighter you've 00:34:09.199 --> 00:34:12.019 got a seven level which would basically be you 00:34:12.019 --> 00:34:13.800 know you're basically a supervisor you've got 00:34:13.800 --> 00:34:16.219 advanced classes and you got four years experience 00:34:16.219 --> 00:34:18.619 plus you're arf certified which you know most 00:34:18.619 --> 00:34:21.219 people don't have unless they work at goa So 00:34:21.219 --> 00:34:23.800 why not just make it a lot easier to obtain that 00:34:23.800 --> 00:34:25.619 state certification instead of having to now 00:34:25.619 --> 00:34:28.800 come in, challenge these written tests? You know, 00:34:28.800 --> 00:34:30.360 like, why does this guy need to take a test on 00:34:30.360 --> 00:34:32.639 the fire tetrahedron and like all this garbage 00:34:32.639 --> 00:34:35.559 that's in these books that I mean, the standards 00:34:35.559 --> 00:34:38.179 books to me, it's like, yes, it's kind of a baseline. 00:34:38.280 --> 00:34:39.599 But it's like, well, my wife went to nursing 00:34:39.599 --> 00:34:41.989 school her first semester she had to do. Like 00:34:41.989 --> 00:34:45.150 the history lesson of Florence Nightingale, like 00:34:45.150 --> 00:34:46.650 that has nothing to do with what you're going 00:34:46.650 --> 00:34:48.349 to do on the floor. And I get it for like a, 00:34:48.349 --> 00:34:50.789 you know, a degree program, but we're talking 00:34:50.789 --> 00:34:52.570 about a certification program. Like I feel like 00:34:52.570 --> 00:34:54.710 you could do away with that book and just bring 00:34:54.710 --> 00:34:57.190 people to run calls and teach them the job on 00:34:57.190 --> 00:34:58.849 the job. I mean, that's where you're learning 00:34:58.849 --> 00:35:00.869 it, you know? So it's just one of those things 00:35:00.869 --> 00:35:02.650 where it's like, how do you speed that up? How 00:35:02.650 --> 00:35:05.230 do you streamline it where now you can get people 00:35:05.230 --> 00:35:07.670 ready to actually go into the field? without 00:35:07.670 --> 00:35:10.070 having this huge four -month thing. And then, 00:35:10.090 --> 00:35:11.829 you know, EMT school is what it is. You got to 00:35:11.829 --> 00:35:13.510 go through that part of it. But I feel like there's 00:35:13.510 --> 00:35:16.969 a way to maybe speed this process up, especially 00:35:16.969 --> 00:35:19.409 with people coming from out of state. I mean, 00:35:19.429 --> 00:35:22.289 why not start recruiting and giving hiring bonuses 00:35:22.289 --> 00:35:24.289 and saying, hey, come to the state of Florida, 00:35:24.429 --> 00:35:26.949 easy reciprocation process to get your cert, 00:35:27.010 --> 00:35:29.090 and boom, you can come into this department that's 00:35:29.090 --> 00:35:33.269 24 -72 and we're hiring 450 people. Well, this 00:35:33.269 --> 00:35:35.150 is what's come up. I think it was Gainesville 00:35:35.150 --> 00:35:38.510 was initially talking about, you know, laterals, 00:35:38.510 --> 00:35:40.670 because if you look at reciprocity, let's just 00:35:40.670 --> 00:35:43.150 remove the, oh, you're going to take, you know, 00:35:43.150 --> 00:35:45.949 California or Texas firefighters from their department. 00:35:46.190 --> 00:35:48.449 Let's just think about the organic nature of 00:35:48.449 --> 00:35:50.530 moving around the country. You know, your wife 00:35:50.530 --> 00:35:53.389 is in a medical program and she got into Stanford 00:35:53.389 --> 00:35:55.710 or wherever it is. How many firefighters just 00:35:55.710 --> 00:35:57.650 simply need to work in a different state because 00:35:57.650 --> 00:36:00.050 of the family dynamic? So it goes both ways. 00:36:00.809 --> 00:36:02.989 So I think making reciprocity exactly what you're 00:36:02.989 --> 00:36:04.550 talking about, whether it's out of the military, 00:36:04.710 --> 00:36:06.630 whether it's different states. And then, yes, 00:36:06.710 --> 00:36:09.269 of course, you have your own department specific 00:36:09.269 --> 00:36:11.889 orientation academy. And then you have a probation 00:36:11.889 --> 00:36:14.469 because just because you're in a DOD doesn't 00:36:14.469 --> 00:36:16.010 mean that you're not a turd. So you still have 00:36:16.010 --> 00:36:18.869 that ability to filter out the chaff, as it were. 00:36:19.409 --> 00:36:22.030 But the other thing someone told me that and 00:36:22.030 --> 00:36:23.730 this doesn't surprise me, actually, if it is 00:36:23.730 --> 00:36:26.710 this amount that 30 percent of certified Florida 00:36:26.710 --> 00:36:29.030 firefighters are not working in the fire service. 00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:32.760 So whether they were, you know, recently or, 00:36:32.780 --> 00:36:34.820 you know, further. So firstly, I mean, I've always 00:36:34.820 --> 00:36:37.400 said this, like mine's expired now. But do you 00:36:37.400 --> 00:36:39.159 think if I went to an engine now, I'd be like, 00:36:39.199 --> 00:36:40.760 well, I don't know how to pull a transverse. 00:36:41.260 --> 00:36:43.920 Right. You know what I mean? For that, the people 00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:45.960 that have been out for a bit again, you know, 00:36:45.960 --> 00:36:48.099 depending on specific orientation. I mean, I 00:36:48.099 --> 00:36:50.179 got hired in California after being trained in 00:36:50.179 --> 00:36:52.460 Florida. And you talk about, you know, throwing 00:36:52.460 --> 00:36:54.739 the deep end. And I got guys doing high shoulder 00:36:54.739 --> 00:36:57.099 throw sticks and then doing building construction 00:36:57.099 --> 00:36:59.539 and vertical ventilation cuts on panelized roof. 00:37:00.159 --> 00:37:02.119 And I'm like, well, they just showed us to push 00:37:02.119 --> 00:37:04.019 it against the wall and then walk it up. And 00:37:04.019 --> 00:37:06.699 then we cut on the pallet. I mean, I was so under 00:37:06.699 --> 00:37:09.719 trained for truck company operations in standards 00:37:09.719 --> 00:37:11.679 here. But you know what? You put your big boy 00:37:11.679 --> 00:37:12.900 pants on and you're like, all right, well, I 00:37:12.900 --> 00:37:14.639 better fucking hurry up and learn this shit then. 00:37:15.539 --> 00:37:17.940 There are so many different ways that we can 00:37:17.940 --> 00:37:20.079 start pulling people. And then once that demand 00:37:20.079 --> 00:37:22.840 grows, the academies will be full. And then, 00:37:22.860 --> 00:37:24.159 you know, what's going to happen if there's a 00:37:24.159 --> 00:37:27.460 huge demand for the fire service? other academies 00:37:27.460 --> 00:37:29.340 will probably start popping up as well whether 00:37:29.340 --> 00:37:31.760 like you said within a department or putting 00:37:31.760 --> 00:37:35.739 on an extra class so they managed to train so 00:37:35.739 --> 00:37:37.619 many of us that there were thousands testing 00:37:37.619 --> 00:37:40.780 for a few spots in the past then you know what's 00:37:40.780 --> 00:37:42.380 going to happen is we'll go back to that again 00:37:42.380 --> 00:37:44.940 whatever that dynamic looked like 10 15 20 years 00:37:44.940 --> 00:37:49.440 ago yeah i mean the other side of it too is just 00:37:49.440 --> 00:37:52.400 the volume of calls you know like orange county 00:37:53.230 --> 00:37:58.150 I think we ran last year 142 ,000. And in 2008, 00:37:58.409 --> 00:38:02.489 it was like 93 ,000. So it's like, that is a 00:38:02.489 --> 00:38:04.989 huge jump. And yeah, we've increased a little 00:38:04.989 --> 00:38:07.489 bit, but I mean, four -man engines, okay. And 00:38:07.489 --> 00:38:09.769 then we're 45 stations. And I think back when 00:38:09.769 --> 00:38:12.050 we got hired, it was like 42. So you're talking 00:38:12.050 --> 00:38:14.809 about, you know, a couple extra stations, 29 00:38:14.809 --> 00:38:18.219 closed, gave that to Apaka. But we're the largest 00:38:18.219 --> 00:38:20.539 department in Central Florida. Now we're also 00:38:20.539 --> 00:38:22.739 running mutual aid calls into the city of Orlando 00:38:22.739 --> 00:38:26.940 and Ocoee and Winter Garden. So we're supplementing 00:38:26.940 --> 00:38:31.099 their departments as well. It's like if you're 00:38:31.099 --> 00:38:33.519 on for a 24 -hour period and then you get mandatory 00:38:33.519 --> 00:38:36.260 for 48, you're talking about that much more exposure 00:38:36.260 --> 00:38:38.500 running your ass off. I mean, something's got 00:38:38.500 --> 00:38:40.579 to give at some point. And I have these talks 00:38:40.579 --> 00:38:43.219 sometimes. I have the deputy chief's son at my 00:38:43.219 --> 00:38:46.539 station. you know he's he's very open about talking 00:38:46.539 --> 00:38:49.500 all this stuff and you know he's like yeah it's 00:38:49.500 --> 00:38:52.260 just it's it's how it's always been but i don't 00:38:52.260 --> 00:38:53.860 know if it's not necessarily a disconnect but 00:38:53.860 --> 00:38:55.460 i mean you know as well as i do like after a 00:38:55.460 --> 00:38:57.219 while you get removed from something you forget 00:38:57.219 --> 00:39:00.139 certain things and and the way it was isn't the 00:39:00.139 --> 00:39:02.639 way it is now like recruiting back then you didn't 00:39:02.639 --> 00:39:06.239 have to do it you had 30 applicants and or you 00:39:06.239 --> 00:39:09.420 had 30 spots and 500 applicants now you're literally 00:39:09.420 --> 00:39:11.989 giving anybody and everybody walking through 00:39:11.989 --> 00:39:13.650 the door an opportunity to get this job like 00:39:13.650 --> 00:39:15.789 i wish i was getting hired now because i would 00:39:15.789 --> 00:39:17.530 have never paid for my own standards of my own 00:39:17.530 --> 00:39:19.769 emt i would have came on and had a guaranteed 00:39:19.769 --> 00:39:22.190 job and got paid for a year most of the people 00:39:22.190 --> 00:39:24.590 i know everybody paid their own way everybody 00:39:24.590 --> 00:39:27.050 had to figure it out like if you had to do the 00:39:27.050 --> 00:39:30.369 the longer version where it was a schedule that 00:39:30.940 --> 00:39:32.760 you know you can still work full -time and you 00:39:32.760 --> 00:39:35.300 have a family and then you know do your standards 00:39:35.300 --> 00:39:37.760 on the weekends like my dad did it take you like 00:39:37.760 --> 00:39:40.059 six months to do it like now it's they they've 00:39:40.059 --> 00:39:42.639 sped it up but it's not because they they're 00:39:42.639 --> 00:39:44.599 doing it because they want to you know help people 00:39:44.599 --> 00:39:47.559 out they're doing it because they have to yeah 00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:50.219 i was working full -time at a publishing company 00:39:50.219 --> 00:39:52.940 right outside seaworld and uh you know going 00:39:52.940 --> 00:39:55.239 working out on my lunch hour going to school 00:39:55.239 --> 00:39:57.619 three nights a week and then one weekend day 00:39:57.619 --> 00:40:00.360 as well So that was a nine month EMT and then 00:40:00.360 --> 00:40:02.900 fire. So, you know, and again, I'm all for non 00:40:02.900 --> 00:40:05.079 -serve, but again, it has to be competitive. 00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:07.360 And I think the mentorship programs are amazing, 00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:10.239 like actually going into the underserved communities 00:40:10.239 --> 00:40:12.940 and finding the great firefighters that aren't 00:40:12.940 --> 00:40:16.480 represented very well. But if you just drag net 00:40:16.480 --> 00:40:18.539 as they're doing now, like high school kids, 00:40:18.619 --> 00:40:21.179 I just, one of my sons, like childhood friends, 00:40:21.280 --> 00:40:23.460 mothers, we just bumped into her in the grocery 00:40:23.460 --> 00:40:26.449 store here. They started off with a program that 00:40:26.449 --> 00:40:28.190 they were just going to take. I forget what it 00:40:28.190 --> 00:40:30.349 was like the top 15 kids or something. They ended 00:40:30.349 --> 00:40:33.530 up taking all the kids. So, you know, these are 00:40:33.530 --> 00:40:35.809 18 year old kids, which I'm opposed to. I think 00:40:35.809 --> 00:40:38.590 that's too young to be going into Pine Hills, 00:40:38.670 --> 00:40:42.710 Holden, you know, like you said, 56, 80 hours 00:40:42.710 --> 00:40:44.769 a week, just getting absolutely destroyed with 00:40:44.769 --> 00:40:48.570 all the horrible shit that we see versus, you 00:40:48.570 --> 00:40:52.880 know. like like the the um fdmy does or they 00:40:52.880 --> 00:40:55.340 certainly used to like law enforcement does wait 00:40:55.340 --> 00:40:57.679 until you're 21 have an explorer programs and 00:40:57.679 --> 00:40:59.980 all that kind of stuff but being in the meat 00:40:59.980 --> 00:41:02.019 grinder waiting until the brain is developed 00:41:02.019 --> 00:41:04.760 so that you can start to actually deal with the 00:41:04.760 --> 00:41:06.960 sleep deprivation and the trauma and the exposures 00:41:06.960 --> 00:41:09.360 like you said but i think we're doing a massive 00:41:09.360 --> 00:41:11.619 disservice and then you put in hiring bonuses 00:41:11.619 --> 00:41:16.000 you tell us you know 15 20 years ago But in the 00:41:16.000 --> 00:41:17.920 future, they'll be so desperate for firefighters 00:41:17.920 --> 00:41:20.860 that they'll offer a $15 ,000, $20 ,000 hiring 00:41:20.860 --> 00:41:24.099 bonus. We would have laughed in your face. So 00:41:24.099 --> 00:41:26.099 my thing is I don't understand why the fire service 00:41:26.099 --> 00:41:28.719 isn't searching the ends of the earth to reverse 00:41:28.719 --> 00:41:31.980 this crisis, why our national union isn't acknowledging 00:41:31.980 --> 00:41:34.599 it, what actually needs to happen as far as the 00:41:34.599 --> 00:41:38.119 work week. So it is incredible, but it's so great 00:41:38.119 --> 00:41:40.820 to see that Florida is now really the nucleus 00:41:40.820 --> 00:41:44.170 of this kind of... you know, the solution, the 00:41:44.170 --> 00:41:46.389 first step. It's not the only thing, but to see 00:41:46.389 --> 00:41:48.909 10 departments and St. John's as we speak now 00:41:48.909 --> 00:41:51.210 and negotiate, and I hope to God that they are 00:41:51.210 --> 00:41:52.789 able to push the needle in their department. 00:41:53.210 --> 00:41:55.110 But yeah, as you mentioned, behind the curtain, 00:41:55.170 --> 00:41:56.429 there's a lot of departments that are going to 00:41:56.429 --> 00:41:58.869 be going to this because they see that this is 00:41:58.869 --> 00:42:01.929 a solution. And then if we can be a beacon as 00:42:01.929 --> 00:42:04.329 a state of Florida, what's the ripple effect 00:42:04.329 --> 00:42:05.849 going to be for the rest of the country then? 00:42:05.909 --> 00:42:08.090 We can help our entire profession of brothers 00:42:08.090 --> 00:42:11.269 and sisters and their families for decades and 00:42:11.269 --> 00:42:17.039 decades to come. Yeah, I mean, 24 -72 is really 00:42:17.039 --> 00:42:19.599 the only way I think that's going to get the 00:42:19.599 --> 00:42:22.559 recruitment up. And I think there's also things 00:42:22.559 --> 00:42:25.639 like, at least at the local level, like when 00:42:25.639 --> 00:42:27.000 I was in the military and I was getting out, 00:42:27.119 --> 00:42:29.059 they always had like, if you're going to transition 00:42:29.059 --> 00:42:32.239 back to civilian life, then why not have something 00:42:32.239 --> 00:42:34.579 that you have a partnership with like military? 00:42:35.190 --> 00:42:37.929 that, hey, okay, X amount of people are going 00:42:37.929 --> 00:42:39.969 to come to Central Florida. Hey, they want to 00:42:39.969 --> 00:42:42.369 become firefighters. How can we start that process 00:42:42.369 --> 00:42:44.170 now where they're six months before they get 00:42:44.170 --> 00:42:46.570 out? All right, perfect. Boom. Let them go. As 00:42:46.570 --> 00:42:48.090 soon as they're off their military orders and 00:42:48.090 --> 00:42:50.869 they're out, roll right into it. So it's like, 00:42:50.969 --> 00:42:52.909 there's got to be different ways that they can 00:42:52.909 --> 00:42:55.849 get creative to do it. Again, that's head and 00:42:55.849 --> 00:42:59.170 shoulders above of what I'm doing, but it's one 00:42:59.170 --> 00:43:03.599 of those things where when you take people and 00:43:03.599 --> 00:43:06.000 you give them something for free, they're not 00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:08.599 truly invested into it. You know, like when I 00:43:08.599 --> 00:43:11.139 paid for my own standards and I paid for my own 00:43:11.139 --> 00:43:13.559 classes, like I was financially invested into 00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:16.239 it and time invested into it. When you give somebody 00:43:16.239 --> 00:43:18.360 an opportunity and they've just got to pass this 00:43:18.360 --> 00:43:20.460 CPAT test, which, you know, all of us can just 00:43:20.460 --> 00:43:22.760 walk through it. It's kind of a joke and then 00:43:22.760 --> 00:43:24.940 take a written test. And basically they know 00:43:24.940 --> 00:43:27.059 that you guys are short. Like I remember one 00:43:27.059 --> 00:43:29.460 recruit said, you guys need me more than I need 00:43:29.460 --> 00:43:31.940 you. literally a guy that was trying to get a 00:43:31.940 --> 00:43:35.360 job for us told us that and and sure enough he's 00:43:35.360 --> 00:43:38.300 right you know like like we're bleeding people 00:43:38.300 --> 00:43:41.519 so when you give things away what's the quality 00:43:41.519 --> 00:43:43.699 of the applicant you're getting you know like 00:43:43.699 --> 00:43:46.480 how you make it more competitive and 100 right 00:43:46.480 --> 00:43:50.639 the best schedule 24 72 hiring bonuses and now 00:43:50.639 --> 00:43:52.179 you're going to start bringing those people in 00:43:52.179 --> 00:43:55.260 that are are going to be quality applicants like 00:43:55.839 --> 00:43:58.219 I'm not talking about anybody that we hire or 00:43:58.219 --> 00:44:00.260 anybody I know. I'm just saying in general because 00:44:00.260 --> 00:44:04.699 I would bet if we pulled the metrics on discipline 00:44:04.699 --> 00:44:07.860 in the last five years, it's probably gone up 00:44:07.860 --> 00:44:11.219 a little bit higher than what it was 25 years 00:44:11.219 --> 00:44:13.820 previously when you had people who were coming 00:44:13.820 --> 00:44:17.320 in because you had to pick and litter. OFD, I 00:44:17.320 --> 00:44:19.940 tested for them when I had a year on, and there 00:44:19.940 --> 00:44:22.139 was 350 people there, and they were higher on 00:44:22.139 --> 00:44:25.500 10 people. Imagine as an employer where you have 00:44:25.500 --> 00:44:27.460 this huge pool of people to pick from, you get 00:44:27.460 --> 00:44:29.940 to be selected. But now it's like, oh, we just 00:44:29.940 --> 00:44:32.880 got to put asses in the seats. Bring them all 00:44:32.880 --> 00:44:36.539 in. Let's go. You got a job. Well, it's crazy 00:44:36.539 --> 00:44:38.820 because, I mean, people talk about, oh, we don't 00:44:38.820 --> 00:44:40.320 have the money for this. As you mentioned, no 00:44:40.320 --> 00:44:42.639 one said you got to do it in a fiscal year either, 00:44:42.679 --> 00:44:46.699 make the transition. I know Marion, just their 00:44:46.699 --> 00:44:49.360 overtime alone is like 5 million at the moment. 00:44:49.420 --> 00:44:51.199 And then you add the lack of retention, which, 00:44:51.260 --> 00:44:52.579 of course, they're not going to declare. Add 00:44:52.579 --> 00:44:54.599 another couple of million there. So you're telling 00:44:54.599 --> 00:44:56.179 me, because we're a small county, really, if 00:44:56.179 --> 00:44:58.900 you look at the number of people, that over three 00:44:58.900 --> 00:45:02.599 years, you can't transition to... hiring a d 00:45:02.599 --> 00:45:05.320 -shift and making all that lack of um you know 00:45:05.320 --> 00:45:07.420 the wasted overtime and the retention costs go 00:45:07.420 --> 00:45:09.360 away not to mention a healthier department which 00:45:09.360 --> 00:45:11.219 will bring down you know workman's comp claims 00:45:11.219 --> 00:45:13.900 but orange i mean i would imagine it's multiple 00:45:13.900 --> 00:45:17.059 times that so you've got again the lack of retention 00:45:17.059 --> 00:45:19.099 especially if you're doing non -cert programs 00:45:19.099 --> 00:45:22.079 all the time you've got the overtime cost the 00:45:22.079 --> 00:45:24.340 money is already there and then to underline 00:45:24.340 --> 00:45:27.880 your point one of my guests recently said that 00:45:28.359 --> 00:45:30.159 On average, and this is on the law enforcement 00:45:30.159 --> 00:45:36.159 side, it costs half a million dollars to get 00:45:36.159 --> 00:45:38.599 rid of one bad employee. Because usually that's 00:45:38.599 --> 00:45:40.219 the one that's going to have the kind of fake 00:45:40.219 --> 00:45:42.760 workman's comp claim. They're in there for all 00:45:42.760 --> 00:45:45.199 the wrong reasons. So he said, think about that. 00:45:45.280 --> 00:45:48.059 For every time that you lower the bar, the probability 00:45:48.059 --> 00:45:49.940 that you're going to have an employee is going 00:45:49.940 --> 00:45:52.039 to cost you a lot of money, whether it's mistakes 00:45:52.039 --> 00:45:54.420 in a lawsuit, whether it's... Fake workman's 00:45:54.420 --> 00:45:56.739 comp claims. You've got to factor that in as 00:45:56.739 --> 00:45:59.059 well. So now we're talking about tens and tens 00:45:59.059 --> 00:46:02.059 of millions of dollars that you can proactively 00:46:02.059 --> 00:46:05.099 save by staffing your fire department properly. 00:46:05.239 --> 00:46:07.500 Not to mention, in my opinion, the most important 00:46:07.500 --> 00:46:09.780 thing that you have men and women that actually 00:46:09.780 --> 00:46:11.559 go home to their fucking families when they're 00:46:11.559 --> 00:46:14.280 supposed to not get a phone call at seven in 00:46:14.280 --> 00:46:16.840 the morning, say, hey, because we're so awful 00:46:16.840 --> 00:46:19.219 at running a fire department, you have to pay 00:46:19.219 --> 00:46:22.489 the price and stay another 24 hours. Yeah, and 00:46:22.489 --> 00:46:23.849 they don't even give you phone calls anymore. 00:46:23.889 --> 00:46:26.210 Now you just get a telestaff automated text that 00:46:26.210 --> 00:46:27.489 says, yeah, you've been popped for mandatory 00:46:27.489 --> 00:46:30.070 for the next 24 hours at this location. Really? 00:46:30.909 --> 00:46:34.489 Yeah, it's even gotten more impersonal than it 00:46:34.489 --> 00:46:38.309 used to be. But it's just one of those things 00:46:38.309 --> 00:46:40.550 too. I'm starting to look at it now. I've got 00:46:40.550 --> 00:46:44.409 going on 18 years and I've literally witnessed 00:46:44.409 --> 00:46:48.630 just this transition of where it was highly competitive 00:46:48.630 --> 00:46:52.510 and it was like, if you got hired like that meant 00:46:52.510 --> 00:46:54.829 you were the best of the best to where now it's 00:46:54.829 --> 00:46:58.510 kind of just watered down to exceptions are made 00:46:58.510 --> 00:47:00.409 for somebody because we just need to get them 00:47:00.409 --> 00:47:03.349 in i you know i've done recruit testing when 00:47:03.349 --> 00:47:06.789 they were testing out and you know prior to like 00:47:06.789 --> 00:47:08.969 when chief perigo was there chief perigo was 00:47:08.969 --> 00:47:11.250 one of those guys like this is the standard like 00:47:11.250 --> 00:47:13.469 we wrote all the tests and rewrote everything 00:47:13.469 --> 00:47:16.269 for when they tested that orientation and then 00:47:16.269 --> 00:47:18.610 you know it seemed like after they moved him 00:47:18.610 --> 00:47:21.739 out of there The standard that he kind of had 00:47:21.739 --> 00:47:24.760 set started to kind of backtrack a little bit. 00:47:24.880 --> 00:47:26.500 And, you know, when you have a training team 00:47:26.500 --> 00:47:29.579 telling you, hey, get them through, what do you 00:47:29.579 --> 00:47:31.940 do? You can't buck the system in that sense, 00:47:32.019 --> 00:47:34.500 you know. And it's just then once you set that, 00:47:34.780 --> 00:47:37.219 you know, once you continue to move that goalpost, 00:47:37.400 --> 00:47:39.219 all of a sudden within a couple of years, now 00:47:39.219 --> 00:47:41.500 if your standard line was here, now you're all 00:47:41.500 --> 00:47:44.719 the way over here. Now you get the emails about 00:47:44.719 --> 00:47:46.659 talk to your crews about their driving, talk 00:47:46.659 --> 00:47:49.039 to your crews about talking to patients, this 00:47:49.039 --> 00:47:51.239 person's got to go for an investigation, this 00:47:51.239 --> 00:47:53.940 person got popped on a drug test. You see the 00:47:53.940 --> 00:47:56.139 recurrence of all that stuff and it seems like 00:47:56.139 --> 00:47:59.900 it's gone up, but that's what you get. That's 00:47:59.900 --> 00:48:02.699 what you get when you've just made it your priority 00:48:02.699 --> 00:48:06.219 just to fill the seats. You mentioned about being 00:48:06.219 --> 00:48:08.340 a smoker and then getting into the military. 00:48:08.820 --> 00:48:12.590 What has been the evolution of your own strength 00:48:12.590 --> 00:48:14.429 and conditioning journey. And then what's your 00:48:14.429 --> 00:48:17.349 perspective on punitive fitness standards in 00:48:17.349 --> 00:48:22.809 the fire service? So when I was in the military, 00:48:22.849 --> 00:48:25.170 I was still smoking when I still had to do all 00:48:25.170 --> 00:48:27.710 my, my running and everything else. And, and, 00:48:27.809 --> 00:48:29.710 you know, shout out to Pete Hegseth for actually 00:48:29.710 --> 00:48:31.809 bringing the standards back to the military, 00:48:31.829 --> 00:48:34.570 because I got a lot of friends that are getting 00:48:34.570 --> 00:48:37.550 ready to retire. And like the last couple of 00:48:37.550 --> 00:48:40.179 years, they said it was unbelievable. like what 00:48:40.179 --> 00:48:42.800 they were allowing like normally you have what's 00:48:42.800 --> 00:48:44.599 called worldwide deployable and if you couldn't 00:48:44.599 --> 00:48:46.840 pass your standard fit test for the year you 00:48:46.840 --> 00:48:48.440 were not deployable and you would go on the fat 00:48:48.440 --> 00:48:50.980 boy program that's what they called it it wasn't 00:48:50.980 --> 00:48:53.480 a nice thing they wanted to shave you to to make 00:48:53.480 --> 00:48:54.960 sure that you would want to get off that thing 00:48:54.960 --> 00:48:56.860 and you would be on that program where you were 00:48:56.860 --> 00:48:59.619 mandated to work out every single day and until 00:48:59.619 --> 00:49:02.519 you can beat the standard um similar like with 00:49:02.519 --> 00:49:05.599 us we have that ipad that you have to do once 00:49:05.599 --> 00:49:08.380 every two years And, you know, I was heavily 00:49:08.380 --> 00:49:10.500 involved with pure fitness and I've seen plenty 00:49:10.500 --> 00:49:12.699 of people anywhere from the firefighter rank 00:49:12.699 --> 00:49:15.219 up to the lieutenant rank who sometimes didn't 00:49:15.219 --> 00:49:17.639 pass it. And then they would just go back on 00:49:17.639 --> 00:49:20.579 duty. It's like, if you're saying this test is 00:49:20.579 --> 00:49:23.659 contractual and you have to pass it to be combat 00:49:23.659 --> 00:49:26.980 ready, how is this person still on duty? And 00:49:26.980 --> 00:49:28.579 then how do you fix that? You know, and then 00:49:28.579 --> 00:49:30.880 obviously when you have the union involved and 00:49:30.880 --> 00:49:32.599 all this other stuff, it gets a little muddy 00:49:32.599 --> 00:49:35.340 with that. But, you know, at the end of the day, 00:49:35.340 --> 00:49:38.969 like. We talk about insurance costs for the department. 00:49:39.150 --> 00:49:41.230 You talk about really what we're supposed to 00:49:41.230 --> 00:49:43.150 be here for is to serve the public. If you're 00:49:43.150 --> 00:49:45.110 not able to pass a simple test and you can't 00:49:45.110 --> 00:49:47.409 get off the Stairmaster, then there's things 00:49:47.409 --> 00:49:49.010 that need to be addressed. And if you're not 00:49:49.010 --> 00:49:50.570 going to hold yourself accountable, then your 00:49:50.570 --> 00:49:53.769 organization should be. But again, it's one of 00:49:53.769 --> 00:49:55.929 those things where you need people in the seats 00:49:55.929 --> 00:49:58.449 and now it creates a hole in a vacancy. So how 00:49:58.449 --> 00:50:01.550 do you fix it? And I mean, honestly, it just 00:50:01.550 --> 00:50:03.860 has to be. It has to be one of those things where 00:50:03.860 --> 00:50:05.579 they develop something where you pull somebody 00:50:05.579 --> 00:50:07.840 off duty because once you're, once you've been 00:50:07.840 --> 00:50:11.139 on a schedule of 24 and 48 and you're used to 00:50:11.139 --> 00:50:12.599 having your days off and now all of a sudden 00:50:12.599 --> 00:50:14.159 you got to drive down there five days a week 00:50:14.159 --> 00:50:15.920 and they put you on days to be on the fat boy 00:50:15.920 --> 00:50:17.739 program. I'm pretty sure you're going to start 00:50:17.739 --> 00:50:20.019 to get motivated to be in shape and hopefully 00:50:20.019 --> 00:50:24.340 stay in shape after that. But again, that takes 00:50:24.340 --> 00:50:26.360 leadership to do it. I just don't know if they're 00:50:26.360 --> 00:50:30.400 willing to do it. I was 70 and John Byrne was 00:50:30.400 --> 00:50:33.380 my lieutenant. So he would go do the iPad in 00:50:33.380 --> 00:50:35.320 flip -flops and then light up a cigarette the 00:50:35.320 --> 00:50:39.880 moment he was done. So, yeah. My first fire, 00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:42.599 my first fire ever, John Byrne was working in 00:50:42.599 --> 00:50:47.039 overtime on Engine 63, were apartment fire. And 00:50:47.039 --> 00:50:48.989 then back then, you know, you do. they don't 00:50:48.989 --> 00:50:50.610 really do it that much now, but they'd set up 00:50:50.610 --> 00:50:53.389 the tents, you know, what's his name? Larry Dunn 00:50:53.389 --> 00:50:55.670 was the one riding rehab and he would set everything 00:50:55.670 --> 00:50:57.110 up for you. And then you have to get your blood 00:50:57.110 --> 00:51:00.170 pressure. And so John Burns sitting there, he's 00:51:00.170 --> 00:51:02.030 got a blood pressure cuff on, he's smoking a 00:51:02.030 --> 00:51:03.989 cigarette. And then he looks at me and he goes 00:51:03.989 --> 00:51:07.010 120 over 80 and sure as shit, the thing pops 00:51:07.010 --> 00:51:09.150 up on the monitor. And I'm like, damn, this guy's 00:51:09.150 --> 00:51:14.889 a badass. Again. Yeah. I mean, he was one of 00:51:14.889 --> 00:51:17.860 those guys, you know, but again, like. If you 00:51:17.860 --> 00:51:20.039 could do the job and you could pass at least 00:51:20.039 --> 00:51:21.780 the minimum standard, that's fine. But if there's 00:51:21.780 --> 00:51:23.980 no accountability for the minimum standard, then 00:51:23.980 --> 00:51:25.699 what are we doing here? Why are we even taking 00:51:25.699 --> 00:51:28.460 the test at this point? Well, what was cool is 00:51:28.460 --> 00:51:30.320 kind of one of those build it, they will come. 00:51:30.380 --> 00:51:33.099 When I first got to 70, I started doing CrossFit 00:51:33.099 --> 00:51:35.639 and I was just on my own. People would come out 00:51:35.639 --> 00:51:37.420 and laugh or whatever and then go back in the 00:51:37.420 --> 00:51:42.039 station. But slowly but surely, I'd get someone. 00:51:42.079 --> 00:51:44.699 I think it was Mike. was it ryan or chang one 00:51:44.699 --> 00:51:46.420 of those two were the first ones to join me this 00:51:46.420 --> 00:51:48.960 is ryan maybe but then by the end of it yeah 00:51:48.960 --> 00:51:51.960 the whole station were working out and john would 00:51:51.960 --> 00:51:54.000 he loved the rower he'd be on the rower all the 00:51:54.000 --> 00:51:56.239 time so he and then he switched he was a big 00:51:56.239 --> 00:51:58.340 mountain jew guy and he's a diet mountain jew 00:51:58.340 --> 00:52:01.219 so even then there's little changes to make him 00:52:01.219 --> 00:52:03.000 a little bit healthier you know i think he was 00:52:03.000 --> 00:52:04.880 even trying to taper off his cigarettes a bit 00:52:04.880 --> 00:52:07.840 but that's the point is you know it's not like 00:52:07.840 --> 00:52:09.780 oh this person can't do it just take our job 00:52:09.780 --> 00:52:11.920 take their job it's like you know right they've 00:52:11.920 --> 00:52:14.110 they've They've got away from where they should 00:52:14.110 --> 00:52:16.630 be. And again, the work week is absolutely a 00:52:16.630 --> 00:52:19.170 big part of that. How can we just get them back 00:52:19.170 --> 00:52:21.269 to where they need to be? But what drives me 00:52:21.269 --> 00:52:24.670 crazy is when unions oppose fitness standards 00:52:24.670 --> 00:52:27.170 because the fitness standards are going to work. 00:52:28.039 --> 00:52:30.460 The thing that's keeping our people healthy is 00:52:30.460 --> 00:52:33.500 going to create a healthy retirement longevity. 00:52:34.039 --> 00:52:36.440 So if you're opposing fitness standards, not 00:52:36.440 --> 00:52:38.179 only are you spitting in the face of the people 00:52:38.179 --> 00:52:40.039 that we're supposed to be serving, but you're 00:52:40.039 --> 00:52:41.679 also spitting in the face of the people that 00:52:41.679 --> 00:52:43.460 are wearing the uniform. Because at the front 00:52:43.460 --> 00:52:46.280 door, as I always say, it was called minimum 00:52:46.280 --> 00:52:48.639 standards. This is the shittiest you should ever 00:52:48.639 --> 00:52:52.079 be. And so then push against those standards 00:52:52.079 --> 00:52:54.920 that we had to be held to in the fire academy 00:52:54.920 --> 00:52:59.199 and say, it's not fair. is the biggest, like, 00:52:59.280 --> 00:53:02.940 you know, the most glaring aspect of cowardice, 00:53:02.940 --> 00:53:05.139 in my opinion. If you're a union and you're in 00:53:05.139 --> 00:53:07.159 charge of the people, you know, the well -being 00:53:07.159 --> 00:53:08.880 of the people that you serve that are paying 00:53:08.880 --> 00:53:11.599 the union dues, our fitness standards should 00:53:11.599 --> 00:53:14.260 be fucking front and center and so should a healthy 00:53:14.260 --> 00:53:16.420 work week. And those are the two things that 00:53:16.420 --> 00:53:18.860 I haven't seen anyone move towards until very, 00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:21.960 very, very recently. So what the fuck are we 00:53:21.960 --> 00:53:24.159 paying for? A dollar pay raise? You know, what 00:53:24.159 --> 00:53:26.590 is that? That's not helping anyone. It's the 00:53:26.590 --> 00:53:29.849 actual environment that creates performance and 00:53:29.849 --> 00:53:33.710 longevity that we need to focus on. Yeah. And 00:53:33.710 --> 00:53:35.909 when I was briefly the union secretary, that 00:53:35.909 --> 00:53:39.250 was something I had brought up. And when I brought 00:53:39.250 --> 00:53:41.130 it up, you know, I kind of got a little pushback 00:53:41.130 --> 00:53:43.050 and even one of the officers had said, well, 00:53:43.090 --> 00:53:44.769 Dan, not everybody's like you. And I'm like. 00:53:45.119 --> 00:53:47.119 Listen, I didn't roll out of bed like this. You 00:53:47.119 --> 00:53:50.880 know what I mean? Like, this is 20 years of consistency. 00:53:51.159 --> 00:53:53.519 And so it's like, how do you get somebody to 00:53:53.519 --> 00:53:55.420 turn that switch on? I mean, at least in the 00:53:55.420 --> 00:53:59.139 fire service, incentives work. So why not have 00:53:59.139 --> 00:54:02.280 it where, like, instead of this, and the thing 00:54:02.280 --> 00:54:04.119 that fucking drives me crazy about the fire department 00:54:04.119 --> 00:54:06.780 is that I can be a stellar employee with five 00:54:06.780 --> 00:54:08.719 years on, and then the other guy can be the biggest 00:54:08.719 --> 00:54:10.639 piece of shit with 15 years on, and he's always 00:54:10.639 --> 00:54:12.039 going to make more than me because he's just 00:54:12.039 --> 00:54:14.369 been here longer. It's like, why not make it 00:54:14.369 --> 00:54:17.510 competitive while you're here and create a system 00:54:17.510 --> 00:54:19.989 where you can make more than that guy because 00:54:19.989 --> 00:54:23.710 you're just doing all these extra other things, 00:54:23.909 --> 00:54:26.230 you know? Like, it just doesn't make any sense 00:54:26.230 --> 00:54:28.690 to me. You're not incentivizing the younger guy 00:54:28.690 --> 00:54:31.550 to try, and you're almost validating the laziness 00:54:31.550 --> 00:54:34.449 of the older guy who does nothing anyway. And 00:54:34.449 --> 00:54:36.570 now it's just, yeah, wait around. I've been here 00:54:36.570 --> 00:54:39.010 20 years, so I get mine, and I don't have to 00:54:39.010 --> 00:54:41.110 do nothing for it, you know? But back to your 00:54:41.110 --> 00:54:43.920 question with the... like where my fitness started 00:54:43.920 --> 00:54:46.659 so i brought up like you know i got arrested 00:54:46.659 --> 00:54:50.900 and so when i got the police report back i remember 00:54:50.900 --> 00:54:53.179 i was reading through it and it said body type 00:54:53.179 --> 00:54:57.679 and you know fat muscular skinny and i in my 00:54:57.679 --> 00:54:59.880 mind i was 130 pounds you know i never really 00:54:59.880 --> 00:55:02.119 worked out and i just kind of got lazy and i'm 00:55:02.119 --> 00:55:05.000 like you see my son like he's just you know like 00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:07.000 little little some guy he lists and everything 00:55:07.000 --> 00:55:10.059 but you know i didn't really know too much about 00:55:10.059 --> 00:55:11.980 fitness didn't really eat a whole lot other than 00:55:11.980 --> 00:55:13.900 like Marie calendars out of the refrigerator 00:55:13.900 --> 00:55:17.739 and they checked the box skinny and something 00:55:17.739 --> 00:55:20.400 went off in my head like it was like my image 00:55:20.400 --> 00:55:23.400 of myself isn't what is actually being put on 00:55:23.400 --> 00:55:25.440 here and I was like all right I'm going to the 00:55:25.440 --> 00:55:28.219 gym so I ended up meeting up with a kid that 00:55:28.219 --> 00:55:30.679 summer his name was Mike Bowden I went to high 00:55:30.679 --> 00:55:32.179 school with him and he used to work out at the 00:55:32.179 --> 00:55:34.380 ballets down the street and the kid's jack dude 00:55:34.380 --> 00:55:37.340 you know played hockey and he just took me under 00:55:37.340 --> 00:55:40.460 his wing and he told me Eat three peanut butter 00:55:40.460 --> 00:55:42.900 sandwiches a day and three glasses of milk on 00:55:42.900 --> 00:55:44.760 top of all your other meals. And then I started 00:55:44.760 --> 00:55:46.820 taking like animal pack, which is like a bunch 00:55:46.820 --> 00:55:48.460 of aminos and everything. And all I did was go 00:55:48.460 --> 00:55:50.579 in and I lifted with him the whole summer. That 00:55:50.579 --> 00:55:55.019 summer I went from 135 to like 165. And so really 00:55:55.019 --> 00:55:57.280 everybody's like, yeah, I mean, it was a quick 00:55:57.280 --> 00:55:59.860 jump. So obviously like my body needed nutrition 00:55:59.860 --> 00:56:02.039 and everything else. And everybody thought I 00:56:02.039 --> 00:56:03.579 was on juice and all this other stuff. Like, 00:56:03.639 --> 00:56:05.869 no, I'm actually just working out. Then I went 00:56:05.869 --> 00:56:08.050 to basic training and then like my cardio got 00:56:08.050 --> 00:56:09.710 real good with the running and I've always been 00:56:09.710 --> 00:56:11.969 able to run. And then, then it just picked up 00:56:11.969 --> 00:56:13.989 from there. And so for those few years when I 00:56:13.989 --> 00:56:16.289 was active, I was, I was kind of just doing the 00:56:16.289 --> 00:56:19.030 standard, you know, bench press on Monday, back 00:56:19.030 --> 00:56:21.849 on Tuesday, probably skip legs Wednesday, arms 00:56:21.849 --> 00:56:24.610 on Thursday, abs, you know, and then rinse and 00:56:24.610 --> 00:56:28.610 repeat. And then when I was deployed in 2007, 00:56:28.889 --> 00:56:32.409 a good friend of mine, Jason Lord, he was 10 00:56:32.409 --> 00:56:34.150 years older than me. He always used to call me 00:56:34.150 --> 00:56:37.909 his little brother. And he introduced me to CrossFit. 00:56:37.969 --> 00:56:41.429 And that's when I realized like how out of shape 00:56:41.429 --> 00:56:44.389 I think I really was. And when I, by the end 00:56:44.389 --> 00:56:47.489 of that deployment, I came back and I did the 00:56:47.489 --> 00:56:51.550 CPAT for Orange County and I blew it out of water. 00:56:51.650 --> 00:56:54.690 And I remember Kenny Flanders before I took the 00:56:54.690 --> 00:56:56.429 test, he's like, oh, I've never seen you at mentoring 00:56:56.429 --> 00:56:58.849 before. And I'm like. No, yeah, I live in South 00:56:58.849 --> 00:57:00.289 Florida. I'm not driving all the way up here 00:57:00.289 --> 00:57:02.469 for this. And he goes, oh, well, not many people 00:57:02.469 --> 00:57:04.309 can pass this test if they've never done it. 00:57:04.349 --> 00:57:07.329 And I was like, oh, okay. So back then, Chief 00:57:07.329 --> 00:57:10.409 Plogger, he used to sit in like a scissor lift 00:57:10.409 --> 00:57:13.489 above the curtain and watch the potential guys 00:57:13.489 --> 00:57:17.650 go. And I think I got like a six -minute CPAL. 00:57:17.670 --> 00:57:20.170 I was just blown through it. And afterwards, 00:57:20.329 --> 00:57:22.250 I handed Kenny Flanders my time, and he goes, 00:57:22.349 --> 00:57:24.639 huh. I'm like, yeah, I guess I did all right. 00:57:24.739 --> 00:57:27.000 And that was it. And then back then, I guess 00:57:27.000 --> 00:57:29.739 Chief Plogger, he wanted people who were physically 00:57:29.739 --> 00:57:33.139 fit. He was like a no, like not really big in 00:57:33.139 --> 00:57:35.780 EMS. He was like a straight fireman, fire chief. 00:57:35.960 --> 00:57:37.920 And he was also in the Air Force. So I think 00:57:37.920 --> 00:57:39.599 that like at least kind of helped move the needle 00:57:39.599 --> 00:57:41.559 with me getting hired. But it's like, how do 00:57:41.559 --> 00:57:43.300 we get back to that standard? You know, like 00:57:43.300 --> 00:57:45.239 we had Chief Seagrass running the wellness department 00:57:45.239 --> 00:57:48.300 for years. And we had John Sabat and then, you 00:57:48.300 --> 00:57:51.239 know, Tony Willis after him who really kept it 00:57:51.239 --> 00:57:53.619 going. And, you know, the guys that are that 00:57:53.619 --> 00:57:55.340 are there are doing great. But I think it's just 00:57:55.340 --> 00:57:58.619 you get a lot of the the political stuff in between 00:57:58.619 --> 00:58:01.559 that kind of bogs the system down. And it's like 00:58:01.559 --> 00:58:03.320 we need to get back to that. And the good thing 00:58:03.320 --> 00:58:05.500 is we've done a good job of mental health, like 00:58:05.500 --> 00:58:08.679 Claudia Fernandez and her team have done phenomenal 00:58:08.679 --> 00:58:11.679 with with the the mental health stuff that we 00:58:11.679 --> 00:58:13.679 do for training. You know, Dave Coughlin's a 00:58:13.679 --> 00:58:15.980 part of that. And we're definitely getting better 00:58:15.980 --> 00:58:18.039 on that aspect. But it's like, all right, now 00:58:18.039 --> 00:58:20.630 we've gone. you know head and shoulders you know 00:58:20.630 --> 00:58:22.530 further with that but now we got to get back 00:58:22.530 --> 00:58:24.710 to taking care of the body at the same time because 00:58:24.710 --> 00:58:27.710 again out of shape people a higher instance of 00:58:27.710 --> 00:58:29.530 getting hurt now they're out of the field they're 00:58:29.530 --> 00:58:31.309 on light duty and now you got to plug those holes 00:58:31.309 --> 00:58:33.989 in overtime and that just bombs down your workforce 00:58:33.989 --> 00:58:37.269 so it's a it's a collaboration but until you 00:58:37.269 --> 00:58:39.449 have people in all those positions willing to 00:58:39.449 --> 00:58:43.099 make it a priority it won't be Yeah. And even, 00:58:43.119 --> 00:58:44.699 I mean, again, healthy body, healthy mind, you 00:58:44.699 --> 00:58:46.800 know, if you listen to a lot of people that have 00:58:46.800 --> 00:58:48.800 been through the crucible, one of my closing 00:58:48.800 --> 00:58:51.059 questions is what do you do to decompress? You 00:58:51.059 --> 00:58:53.300 know, it's nearly always the gym, you know, walking 00:58:53.300 --> 00:58:55.440 my dog, it's exercise, it's staying healthy. 00:58:55.619 --> 00:58:57.880 So, you know, if you want to improve mental health, 00:58:57.960 --> 00:58:59.900 improve physical health too. And that's again, 00:58:59.980 --> 00:59:01.860 back to the standards, hiring standards, you 00:59:01.860 --> 00:59:06.150 know, maintaining standards. Before we go to 00:59:06.150 --> 00:59:08.010 because I really want to dive into kind of like 00:59:08.010 --> 00:59:10.829 the the entrepreneurial side, you know, the second 00:59:10.829 --> 00:59:14.190 career, as it were. When you look back over the 00:59:14.190 --> 00:59:16.670 18 years, what were some of the what you call 00:59:16.670 --> 00:59:18.630 career calls that you've had in Orange County? 00:59:20.590 --> 00:59:26.190 Well. EMS wise, I mean, there's always a few, 00:59:26.289 --> 00:59:29.329 but like I would say one that kind of there's 00:59:29.329 --> 00:59:31.550 two that kind of bothered me and that I still. 00:59:32.000 --> 00:59:33.599 think about it's not like i wake up or anything 00:59:33.599 --> 00:59:34.880 but it's always like you know when you start 00:59:34.880 --> 00:59:36.659 talking about stuff that's a story that's always 00:59:36.659 --> 00:59:40.840 at the front of my brain um one of them was thanksgiving 00:59:40.840 --> 00:59:43.920 time frame this lady she she used to tell us 00:59:43.920 --> 00:59:46.579 she was a frequent caller um she used to tell 00:59:46.579 --> 00:59:48.780 us she was a retired new york firefighter and 00:59:48.780 --> 00:59:50.159 she lived with like with her parents and everything 00:59:50.159 --> 00:59:54.559 else and um her and her mom got in a fight and 00:59:54.559 --> 00:59:58.059 uh we show up on scene and the mom is got ran 00:59:58.059 --> 01:00:00.320 over by the f -150 in the driveway and this is 01:00:00.320 --> 01:00:02.139 on thanksgiving morning like nine o 'clock in 01:00:02.139 --> 01:00:05.239 the morning so come to find out like her mom 01:00:05.239 --> 01:00:07.820 had an argument her mom went and just like sat 01:00:07.820 --> 01:00:10.380 out in the driveway and the daughter didn't see 01:00:10.380 --> 01:00:11.699 her and the daughter was like i'm just gonna 01:00:11.699 --> 01:00:14.039 go for a drive and cool off threw it in reverse 01:00:14.039 --> 01:00:16.320 and ran her mother over complete accident she 01:00:16.320 --> 01:00:18.699 was devastated and that was just always one of 01:00:18.699 --> 01:00:20.440 those things that i was like oh my god you know 01:00:20.440 --> 01:00:22.659 how would that make you feel like trying to console 01:00:22.659 --> 01:00:25.090 somebody like that it's like I wish I had the 01:00:25.090 --> 01:00:27.630 words. Now, if you ever talk to Diana Alexander, 01:00:27.889 --> 01:00:32.150 she's out doing a lot of great, great teaching 01:00:32.150 --> 01:00:35.389 on that as far as like how to, how to talk to 01:00:35.389 --> 01:00:37.150 somebody in those moments. Cause you know, you 01:00:37.150 --> 01:00:40.230 get like that first five minutes and you know, 01:00:40.250 --> 01:00:42.469 it's more so just being a good listener. And 01:00:42.469 --> 01:00:44.190 I think being a good listener to those people 01:00:44.190 --> 01:00:46.530 and, and not saying everything's going to be 01:00:46.530 --> 01:00:49.269 all right, or, you know, I'm sorry for your loss. 01:00:49.309 --> 01:00:51.369 Like those are the common things we always say 01:00:51.369 --> 01:00:54.039 to each other. you know it's having that tool 01:00:54.039 --> 01:00:56.780 to to actually converse with somebody in the 01:00:56.780 --> 01:00:59.719 worst possible moment um and another call me 01:00:59.719 --> 01:01:02.159 and nelson begum i met it had not too long ago 01:01:02.159 --> 01:01:06.500 went to a drug house walk in the walk into the 01:01:06.500 --> 01:01:11.179 house and it was for a it was for a lady who's 01:01:11.179 --> 01:01:14.699 having a baby so we walk in there's a bat turned 01:01:14.699 --> 01:01:17.320 towards me she's smoking a cigarette and we're 01:01:17.320 --> 01:01:19.800 like are we here for you and you know she looks 01:01:19.800 --> 01:01:22.389 over like like if I say crackhead, typical missing 01:01:22.389 --> 01:01:25.510 teeth, like, you know, skinny. And she's like, 01:01:25.570 --> 01:01:27.610 yeah, get this off of me. And I looked down and 01:01:27.610 --> 01:01:30.250 she's literally got a fetus attached to her still. 01:01:30.610 --> 01:01:33.750 And it's probably two, three months old. Like 01:01:33.750 --> 01:01:38.409 the body's still transparent and the baby's guppy 01:01:38.409 --> 01:01:40.809 breathing. And we're just like, oh my God. So 01:01:40.809 --> 01:01:43.769 we ended up loading up, transporting mom and 01:01:43.769 --> 01:01:45.909 her to Winter Park. And I've got a guy who's 01:01:45.909 --> 01:01:48.699 got like two shifts on. with us uh we get to 01:01:48.699 --> 01:01:51.079 the hospital because i give my guys i give them 01:01:51.079 --> 01:01:54.000 a rider we end up going to the hospital i walk 01:01:54.000 --> 01:01:58.460 in the probie is holding the infant and like 01:01:58.460 --> 01:02:01.239 just doing blow by the staff doesn't know what 01:02:01.239 --> 01:02:04.340 to do and we're literally all just standing there 01:02:04.340 --> 01:02:05.900 like are you guys gonna like make a decision 01:02:05.900 --> 01:02:08.500 and then they just said well we're just gonna 01:02:08.500 --> 01:02:11.119 let it let it die you know what i mean so now 01:02:11.119 --> 01:02:13.400 it's like i'm looking at this poor kid who's 01:02:13.400 --> 01:02:15.460 got two shifts on thinking how is he processing 01:02:15.460 --> 01:02:17.860 this you know like like for us like after a while 01:02:17.860 --> 01:02:20.199 you kind of just you know you get numb with it 01:02:20.199 --> 01:02:23.159 and you know between whatever your religion is 01:02:23.159 --> 01:02:25.320 or whatever like i've kind of just taken it as 01:02:25.320 --> 01:02:28.619 like you know god gives everybody free will and 01:02:28.619 --> 01:02:30.679 and things happen that are beyond explanation 01:02:30.679 --> 01:02:32.920 and there's sometimes no way to make sense of 01:02:32.920 --> 01:02:35.739 it you know so you just that's how i move on 01:02:35.739 --> 01:02:37.219 from it but for some of these kids that have 01:02:37.219 --> 01:02:38.460 never seen any of this stuff and that's your 01:02:38.460 --> 01:02:41.130 first call like How are you going to, how are 01:02:41.130 --> 01:02:42.389 you going to process that and deal with it? And 01:02:42.389 --> 01:02:44.489 what do we do afterwards? At least with our department, 01:02:44.530 --> 01:02:46.130 now they have the peer support team that can 01:02:46.130 --> 01:02:48.210 come out and talk to people and do all that where, 01:02:48.289 --> 01:02:50.110 you know, 15 years ago, they'd be like, I'll 01:02:50.110 --> 01:02:51.889 be a pussy, you know, whatever, like get over 01:02:51.889 --> 01:02:54.090 it. So it's at least, at least that's moving 01:02:54.090 --> 01:02:59.369 in that direction. Firewise, probably the call 01:02:59.369 --> 01:03:02.670 that stands out the most is I was a fireman on 01:03:02.670 --> 01:03:05.909 truck 30, Jimmy Berry, you know, definitely like 01:03:05.909 --> 01:03:09.679 living legend these days in our department. And 01:03:09.679 --> 01:03:11.739 he's a lot of reason why I stayed in the fire 01:03:11.739 --> 01:03:14.300 service because I transferred out of 63 and went 01:03:14.300 --> 01:03:16.940 to 30. And I was like this close to leaving just 01:03:16.940 --> 01:03:20.500 because I had my original crew kind of all started 01:03:20.500 --> 01:03:22.159 going their separate ways. And the crew that 01:03:22.159 --> 01:03:23.800 came in there was fine. But it was like I was 01:03:23.800 --> 01:03:25.760 stuck on the rescue every shift and, you know, 01:03:25.760 --> 01:03:28.239 running to the hospital 15 times. I was like, 01:03:28.280 --> 01:03:30.380 you know, I watch Backdraft. This isn't what 01:03:30.380 --> 01:03:32.119 I got into this for. Like, I want to be on a 01:03:32.119 --> 01:03:35.159 fire truck. You know, this is bullshit. So I 01:03:35.159 --> 01:03:39.679 ended up going over to 30. and i was going over 01:03:39.679 --> 01:03:42.780 there doing command tech for a while and i saw 01:03:42.780 --> 01:03:45.019 kind of the dynamic there and it was like like 01:03:45.019 --> 01:03:47.179 30 is one of those stations kind of like a 51 01:03:47.179 --> 01:03:50.219 or 42 big kitchen table you know everybody's 01:03:50.219 --> 01:03:53.280 sitting around and it just feels like a firehouse 01:03:53.280 --> 01:03:55.119 you know not every not every fire department 01:03:55.119 --> 01:03:57.380 or every fire station is like that but that station 01:03:57.380 --> 01:03:59.300 when i was there i was like all right this is 01:03:59.300 --> 01:04:01.239 what i signed up for so as soon as i got there 01:04:01.239 --> 01:04:03.659 i got my truck stuff i learned a ton of stuff 01:04:03.659 --> 01:04:06.599 from jimmy jeff hansen and trevor jones who was 01:04:06.599 --> 01:04:08.239 you know my lieutenant for a long time there 01:04:08.799 --> 01:04:10.699 And that's where I kind of fell back in love 01:04:10.699 --> 01:04:13.539 with the fire service. And we get an apartment 01:04:13.539 --> 01:04:16.519 fire call. En route, they're saying multiple 01:04:16.519 --> 01:04:18.860 callers, right? So, you know, like, we all know, 01:04:18.940 --> 01:04:22.119 like, if it's, you know, single caller, nothing 01:04:22.119 --> 01:04:24.039 showing, blah, blah, blah, it's bullshit. When 01:04:24.039 --> 01:04:25.980 you hear multiple callers, fire out the windows, 01:04:26.179 --> 01:04:27.300 you know, all that shit. You're like, all right, 01:04:27.320 --> 01:04:31.360 it's go time. So, we show up. Rescue 40, who's 01:04:31.360 --> 01:04:35.360 with Kyle Onkus and Rebel, they pull up. They 01:04:35.360 --> 01:04:36.860 give a good arrival report. They say there's 01:04:36.860 --> 01:04:39.489 a lady hanging out of a window. So by that point, 01:04:39.510 --> 01:04:42.210 we got Chief Morrow, who's coming behind us. 01:04:42.809 --> 01:04:45.510 Jimmy passes command to him, sees the lady hanging 01:04:45.510 --> 01:04:47.530 out of the window. And he's like, truck 30, pass 01:04:47.530 --> 01:04:51.190 command, deploy for a rescue. And so me and him 01:04:51.190 --> 01:04:53.590 go up. The fire was on the second story. The 01:04:53.590 --> 01:04:55.630 lady was on the third story. The front door was 01:04:55.630 --> 01:04:57.809 open. I guess some kids later on, we found out 01:04:57.809 --> 01:04:59.849 that he started a mattress fire playing with 01:04:59.849 --> 01:05:02.110 a lighter. And then they ran away and the mom 01:05:02.110 --> 01:05:05.230 took off with them. So from our vantage point, 01:05:05.289 --> 01:05:07.230 if we're on the A side, we didn't realize that 01:05:07.230 --> 01:05:09.349 on the C side, the window had already vented 01:05:09.349 --> 01:05:11.829 and it was crawling up the side of the building 01:05:11.829 --> 01:05:15.190 and it caught the decking on fire. So Jimmy and 01:05:15.190 --> 01:05:18.969 I go up. On the way up, I hit the second floor 01:05:18.969 --> 01:05:22.090 with a can real quick and closed the door. Jimmy's 01:05:22.090 --> 01:05:23.989 like, hey, I'm going to go after her. Go ahead 01:05:23.989 --> 01:05:25.610 and go to the other side and search. Because 01:05:25.610 --> 01:05:27.630 as we were pulling up, masking up, somebody said 01:05:27.630 --> 01:05:29.769 a lady and a baby were on the other apartment 01:05:29.769 --> 01:05:33.139 on the other side. So Jimmy forces that door. 01:05:33.179 --> 01:05:37.099 I force that door. Jimmy gets the lady. She runs 01:05:37.099 --> 01:05:39.340 down the stairs and then he comes to find me. 01:05:39.800 --> 01:05:41.800 We searched that apartment. The only thing we 01:05:41.800 --> 01:05:43.880 found there was a shit ton of weeds on the table. 01:05:43.920 --> 01:05:46.260 And then we, we ended up coming back out. And 01:05:46.260 --> 01:05:48.300 as soon as we walk out, that whole deck is on 01:05:48.300 --> 01:05:50.579 fire and we're like, Oh shit. And that Lenny 01:05:50.579 --> 01:05:56.639 has truck. 30s bucket at the decking. Jimmy's 01:05:56.639 --> 01:05:58.500 like, what do you got left in that can? I just 01:05:58.500 --> 01:06:00.420 shot it as much as I could and we just ran the 01:06:00.420 --> 01:06:03.280 hell out of there. That was the first call that 01:06:03.280 --> 01:06:05.639 I'd ever had where there was that much of an 01:06:05.639 --> 01:06:08.699 element of a person hanging out of a window, 01:06:09.099 --> 01:06:11.059 shit's getting serious, we don't have a bunch 01:06:11.059 --> 01:06:13.079 of units on scene, it was just the truck and 01:06:13.079 --> 01:06:16.239 a rescue and it was like, go. That's the time 01:06:16.239 --> 01:06:18.500 to be reactionaries when you have that stuff. 01:06:18.619 --> 01:06:20.820 You got 30 seconds or less to make a decision. 01:06:21.389 --> 01:06:23.710 But, you know, that one call, I always talk about 01:06:23.710 --> 01:06:26.690 it. But it's funny how, you know, like Greg Hubbard 01:06:26.690 --> 01:06:29.849 used to talk about and Ralph Asterita about the 01:06:29.849 --> 01:06:32.429 Rolodex that he builds in your mind over the 01:06:32.429 --> 01:06:34.769 course of your career. It's like every call I 01:06:34.769 --> 01:06:37.250 go on, I always pull from those experiences now 01:06:37.250 --> 01:06:40.030 where, you know, it just speeds the process up. 01:06:40.170 --> 01:06:42.570 So, but yeah, that was definitely one of my favorite 01:06:42.570 --> 01:06:45.309 calls was with Jimmy. And anytime I talk to him, 01:06:45.329 --> 01:06:47.030 he's always like, yeah, that was probably the 01:06:47.030 --> 01:06:49.789 one that, you know, I actually got the pucker 01:06:49.789 --> 01:06:52.869 effect a little bit. actually jimmy someone need 01:06:52.869 --> 01:06:56.010 to get on the show he was at one day you know 01:06:56.010 --> 01:06:58.329 they rotate rigs through one day in orientation 01:06:58.329 --> 01:07:01.389 we were at the actual academy and we were loading 01:07:01.389 --> 01:07:04.250 i think it was five inch and i forget what happened 01:07:04.250 --> 01:07:07.670 like i i passed me a coupling and it hadn't made 01:07:07.670 --> 01:07:09.489 it to my hands and fell back and he gave me shit 01:07:09.489 --> 01:07:12.969 so first impressions weren't so good but uh but 01:07:12.969 --> 01:07:16.550 yeah good guy definitely And then you talk about 01:07:16.550 --> 01:07:19.150 Di Alexandra as well. I actually had her on probably 01:07:19.150 --> 01:07:20.769 about six months ago now. And we talked about 01:07:20.769 --> 01:07:22.869 that very, you know, death notifications and. 01:07:23.269 --> 01:07:25.349 Oh, I'll have to look back at it. I didn't, I 01:07:25.349 --> 01:07:27.190 didn't catch it. Yeah. She does a great job with 01:07:27.190 --> 01:07:29.570 that. Yeah. Yeah. And this is a thing that I 01:07:29.570 --> 01:07:31.530 talked to her about and some other people, Alex 01:07:31.530 --> 01:07:35.010 Jaber. When you think about how we're trained. 01:07:35.610 --> 01:07:38.610 If you, for example, do a primary search, you 01:07:38.610 --> 01:07:40.349 find the person, you come out, congratulations, 01:07:40.750 --> 01:07:44.210 great job, you succeeded. Paramedic school, you 01:07:44.210 --> 01:07:46.630 do a mega code, okay, you've got Brady, now you've 01:07:46.630 --> 01:07:50.170 got VTAC, then you convert, okay, normal sinus, 01:07:50.329 --> 01:07:52.789 congratulations. But then you go in the real 01:07:52.789 --> 01:07:54.570 world, especially a black cloud like me that 01:07:54.570 --> 01:07:58.110 had zero code saves in 14 years, you realize 01:07:58.110 --> 01:08:00.309 that it kind of sets them up for failure because 01:08:00.309 --> 01:08:03.309 we don't save most cardiac arrests or any of 01:08:03.309 --> 01:08:06.320 them in my care. So if you're not throwing in 01:08:06.320 --> 01:08:08.460 sometimes in a mega code, like they didn't make 01:08:08.460 --> 01:08:10.360 it, but you did everything right. Congratulations. 01:08:11.280 --> 01:08:13.639 Then we're not setting them up for what happens. 01:08:13.760 --> 01:08:15.900 You know, we didn't get there in time. You know, 01:08:15.900 --> 01:08:17.600 the lady had already run over her mother by that 01:08:17.600 --> 01:08:19.140 point. You know, there's nothing you can do already 01:08:19.140 --> 01:08:21.060 dead in the fire. There's nothing you can do. 01:08:21.380 --> 01:08:23.659 And I think that's another discussion for the 01:08:23.659 --> 01:08:26.760 fire services. How can we tweak training so that 01:08:26.760 --> 01:08:29.550 you're training for success? but you you can 01:08:29.550 --> 01:08:31.890 be extremely successful and the outcome can still 01:08:31.890 --> 01:08:33.710 be tragic and i think that part we're missing 01:08:33.710 --> 01:08:36.750 a little bit that's a good point yeah yeah because 01:08:36.750 --> 01:08:38.770 it's like every training you go to it's it's 01:08:38.770 --> 01:08:41.689 always we win you know and that's that's unfortunately 01:08:41.689 --> 01:08:46.029 not life you know absolutely not all right well 01:08:46.029 --> 01:08:48.930 then as you're progressing through when was it 01:08:48.930 --> 01:08:51.989 that you decided to kind of look into the real 01:08:51.989 --> 01:08:54.390 estate world and let's talk about that side for 01:08:54.390 --> 01:08:57.890 a moment So I've always been interested in my 01:08:57.890 --> 01:09:02.350 dad back in 2011. You know, he he was getting 01:09:02.350 --> 01:09:04.949 kind of 10 years, 15 years out from retirement, 01:09:05.090 --> 01:09:06.750 you know, from the divorce. He never really started 01:09:06.750 --> 01:09:10.069 putting away. And the company had just sold and 01:09:10.069 --> 01:09:11.770 changed hands and he ended up getting a good 01:09:11.770 --> 01:09:14.689 chunk of change. So he decided to buy a rental 01:09:14.689 --> 01:09:18.170 cabin up in Tennessee. You know, now he's retired 01:09:18.170 --> 01:09:20.670 and he's he ended up having three at one point. 01:09:21.130 --> 01:09:23.810 And. you know you bought it for a hundred thousand 01:09:23.810 --> 01:09:26.789 and i think it's sold for 500 000 now you know 01:09:26.789 --> 01:09:29.510 so you start looking at retirement and obviously 01:09:29.510 --> 01:09:32.210 you know a job like this you get 30 years you 01:09:32.210 --> 01:09:33.989 get beat up and it's always that's how they keep 01:09:33.989 --> 01:09:36.430 you is that yeah we're gonna pay you okay now 01:09:36.430 --> 01:09:38.810 but the the pot of gold is at the end of the 01:09:38.810 --> 01:09:40.829 rainbow so you know just stick around long enough 01:09:40.829 --> 01:09:44.409 and you know you'll get it um but and i think 01:09:44.409 --> 01:09:46.010 that's why they've actually made the florida 01:09:46.010 --> 01:09:48.409 drop system eight years because now with the 01:09:48.409 --> 01:09:51.189 issues of retention and and getting more people 01:09:51.739 --> 01:09:55.020 that i think they're having to kind of entice 01:09:55.020 --> 01:09:58.119 people to stay a little bit longer to make them 01:09:58.119 --> 01:10:00.819 you know fill those seats and it's it's terrible 01:10:00.819 --> 01:10:03.119 in a way i didn't realize i'd gone to eight now 01:10:03.119 --> 01:10:06.079 because it was what five before yeah five -year 01:10:06.079 --> 01:10:08.020 drop now it's an eight -year drop right so i 01:10:08.020 --> 01:10:10.479 mean since when does the state want to give you 01:10:10.479 --> 01:10:15.359 more money but i think it's definitely a reaction 01:10:15.359 --> 01:10:20.630 to the The decrease in applicants, the increase 01:10:20.630 --> 01:10:24.670 in need for people, and then just trying to keep 01:10:24.670 --> 01:10:29.550 some experience. But yeah, so my dad's experience 01:10:29.550 --> 01:10:32.430 with real estate and seeing it. And then my uncle, 01:10:32.590 --> 01:10:36.949 who's a fireman up north, he has a duplex in 01:10:36.949 --> 01:10:39.510 Waltham where he lived at the bottom and he rented 01:10:39.510 --> 01:10:41.909 the top and then paid the thing off. And then 01:10:41.909 --> 01:10:46.350 now he's just cash flowing continuously. When 01:10:46.350 --> 01:10:48.449 I was super involved with the fire department, 01:10:48.630 --> 01:10:50.810 I'm the type of person where if I'm into something, 01:10:50.869 --> 01:10:54.130 I'm all in. I dive in and do all of it. With 01:10:54.130 --> 01:10:57.569 recruit training, I was all in and that's all 01:10:57.569 --> 01:11:01.649 I was doing for five years. After a while, it 01:11:01.649 --> 01:11:04.369 just felt like I was constantly living paycheck 01:11:04.369 --> 01:11:06.390 to paycheck. It wasn't like I was living some 01:11:06.390 --> 01:11:09.130 luxurious lifestyle. It was just between driving, 01:11:09.430 --> 01:11:13.550 car, things come up in life. I've got two kids, 01:11:13.609 --> 01:11:16.289 vacation here and there. you know and then obviously 01:11:16.289 --> 01:11:19.750 like orange county's only had one raise on time 01:11:19.750 --> 01:11:21.869 in 17 years that i've been here so i mean it's 01:11:21.869 --> 01:11:25.869 like you're constantly playing catch up um and 01:11:25.869 --> 01:11:28.609 so i started thinking back to when my dad told 01:11:28.609 --> 01:11:30.470 me he was he was wanting to get into the fire 01:11:30.470 --> 01:11:33.369 service so he could still do the the oil truck 01:11:33.369 --> 01:11:35.569 route because he'd have all those days off to 01:11:35.569 --> 01:11:37.989 do it but then he'd have the security of the 01:11:37.989 --> 01:11:40.020 fire department And that's where I started thinking 01:11:40.020 --> 01:11:42.020 to myself, you know, maybe, maybe I need to look 01:11:42.020 --> 01:11:44.899 into just doing something else because one, I'm 01:11:44.899 --> 01:11:47.380 not going to be exposing myself to all the extra 01:11:47.380 --> 01:11:50.119 calls, work in the field over time and, and doing 01:11:50.119 --> 01:11:51.819 all that stuff. And, you know, a lot of the older 01:11:51.819 --> 01:11:53.840 guys, like they always said, like, don't get 01:11:53.840 --> 01:11:56.359 another job. Just, just do this. Cause if you 01:11:56.359 --> 01:11:58.420 just do this, it all goes towards your retirement, 01:11:58.479 --> 01:12:02.239 you know? So I bought into that philosophy. After 01:12:02.239 --> 01:12:04.539 I stepped down from the union, I went back and 01:12:04.539 --> 01:12:07.760 I did a recruit class and it was weird. It was 01:12:07.760 --> 01:12:10.119 like that. that same thing that was driving me 01:12:10.119 --> 01:12:12.100 to do it for that previous five years it just 01:12:12.100 --> 01:12:14.460 wasn't there anymore you know i didn't have that 01:12:14.460 --> 01:12:19.239 same like passion for it and so after uh after 01:12:19.239 --> 01:12:21.859 that class it was december 2022 i told my wife 01:12:21.859 --> 01:12:24.979 i go i'm gonna make some changes and it's probably 01:12:24.979 --> 01:12:28.140 gonna be a little tight but i i need to do something 01:12:28.140 --> 01:12:30.810 completely different so Friend of mine, Tony 01:12:30.810 --> 01:12:32.770 Kibler, he actually left Orange County and he's 01:12:32.770 --> 01:12:34.550 doing real estate full time. You know, I'd seen 01:12:34.550 --> 01:12:37.109 him on social media and I gave him a call and 01:12:37.109 --> 01:12:38.210 I was like, hey, man, what are you going to do 01:12:38.210 --> 01:12:42.850 to get your license? So he sends me some info 01:12:42.850 --> 01:12:45.149 and I did some research and I'm like, you know 01:12:45.149 --> 01:12:47.989 what? Just take action and do it. So I bought 01:12:47.989 --> 01:12:50.409 the online course. I did everything. And within 01:12:50.409 --> 01:12:52.590 a month and a half, I was done. Got my certification. 01:12:53.090 --> 01:12:54.949 I called Tony back. I'm like, all right, now 01:12:54.949 --> 01:12:57.319 what? He's like, oh, shit. he's like you're already 01:12:57.319 --> 01:12:59.140 done i'm like yeah i got my state license and 01:12:59.140 --> 01:13:01.239 he's like you realize like i've talked to probably 01:13:01.239 --> 01:13:03.180 20 people over the last few years and you're 01:13:03.180 --> 01:13:04.880 the only one that's ever called me back saying 01:13:04.880 --> 01:13:07.220 you did it i'm like yeah man let's go and so 01:13:07.220 --> 01:13:10.539 i ended up getting with exp realty um they are 01:13:10.539 --> 01:13:13.140 like one of the largest uh real estate companies 01:13:13.140 --> 01:13:15.720 in the in the world it's an international brokerage 01:13:15.720 --> 01:13:19.260 and um from there it was just all right let's 01:13:19.260 --> 01:13:21.420 go let's figure it out so anybody that wants 01:13:21.420 --> 01:13:23.260 to get into real estate just realize like you 01:13:23.260 --> 01:13:25.039 don't just walk into anything and have instant 01:13:25.039 --> 01:13:27.560 success right it's completely different environment 01:13:27.560 --> 01:13:29.939 you are not guaranteed a paycheck and it's all 01:13:29.939 --> 01:13:31.939 based off of how much work you're willing to 01:13:31.939 --> 01:13:34.579 put into it so the the fortune thing is that 01:13:34.579 --> 01:13:37.300 i know how to work and i was putting all that 01:13:37.300 --> 01:13:39.460 work into the fire department for an hourly rate 01:13:39.460 --> 01:13:42.159 and now i get to put all that work into my own 01:13:42.159 --> 01:13:45.439 business but that first year you know Six months 01:13:45.439 --> 01:13:48.159 into it, I think I had about $10 ,000 on my credit 01:13:48.159 --> 01:13:50.859 card because between get my license, get my MLS 01:13:50.859 --> 01:13:53.859 and not having the overtime. Because I told my 01:13:53.859 --> 01:13:55.819 wife, I'm like, I am not working overtime. If 01:13:55.819 --> 01:13:57.539 I'm going to go do this thing, I got to be all 01:13:57.539 --> 01:14:00.020 in. Every single day I'm off, I'm making cold 01:14:00.020 --> 01:14:02.840 calls. I'm taking classes. I'm figuring this 01:14:02.840 --> 01:14:04.600 thing out because I want to be an expert on it. 01:14:05.220 --> 01:14:09.340 So roll into like November, December timeframe. 01:14:09.579 --> 01:14:12.119 I had a couple of closings to where I was able 01:14:12.119 --> 01:14:16.539 to pay off that debt. And then January of 2024, 01:14:17.439 --> 01:14:20.800 I closed six houses in a month and ended up walking 01:14:20.800 --> 01:14:24.739 away with almost 50 grand. And I've never had 01:14:24.739 --> 01:14:26.380 that much money in my bank account my entire 01:14:26.380 --> 01:14:28.600 life. So when that happened, that was like the 01:14:28.600 --> 01:14:30.859 proof of work where I was like, OK, I got to 01:14:30.859 --> 01:14:33.760 really dive into this. And then I just went even 01:14:33.760 --> 01:14:37.579 harder, you know, but I have a problem where. 01:14:38.090 --> 01:14:40.590 I get so hyper focused on things. Maybe it's 01:14:40.590 --> 01:14:42.729 ADD or something that when I'm doing it, I don't 01:14:42.729 --> 01:14:45.329 know how to do that balance of work life. I just 01:14:45.329 --> 01:14:48.409 either do a lot or I'm doing nothing. And so 01:14:48.409 --> 01:14:51.090 it's like over the last few years, it's given 01:14:51.090 --> 01:14:53.149 me the time to kind of find that balance where 01:14:53.149 --> 01:14:55.670 now, you know, between just doing traditional 01:14:55.670 --> 01:14:58.289 real estate transactions, Tony and I have bought 01:14:58.289 --> 01:15:00.489 an investment property that we're flipping that 01:15:00.489 --> 01:15:02.109 we're actually going to close on next month. 01:15:02.170 --> 01:15:05.109 And now I'm becoming an investor. So it's, it's 01:15:05.109 --> 01:15:08.909 funny how everything that like it's only happened 01:15:08.909 --> 01:15:11.449 in two and a half three years so it's like it's 01:15:11.449 --> 01:15:14.109 crazy how fast your life can change when you 01:15:14.109 --> 01:15:16.590 all of a sudden just go into something completely 01:15:16.590 --> 01:15:18.390 different but actually do it you know we all 01:15:18.390 --> 01:15:20.890 talk about making changes all the time but it's 01:15:20.890 --> 01:15:22.989 like with your podcast would you ever dreamed 01:15:22.989 --> 01:15:25.449 in in a million years that you'd have 80 000 01:15:25.449 --> 01:15:27.729 followers and you're interviewing josh brolin 01:15:27.729 --> 01:15:30.470 probably not but it's just every day you do those 01:15:30.470 --> 01:15:33.930 little actions you know yeah no exactly and this 01:15:33.930 --> 01:15:36.729 is what's so Such an important conversation that 01:15:36.729 --> 01:15:38.449 we're having right now because you've literally 01:15:38.449 --> 01:15:41.069 underlined a couple of the pushbacks really from 01:15:41.069 --> 01:15:43.109 the firefighter level when we're talking about 01:15:43.109 --> 01:15:46.909 the healthier work week. First thing is, again, 01:15:47.130 --> 01:15:50.430 let me put it from the chief's point first. I 01:15:50.430 --> 01:15:52.489 always used to hear, well, if we give them more 01:15:52.489 --> 01:15:54.270 time off, they'll just work more, which I thought 01:15:54.270 --> 01:15:56.750 was a fucking arrogant statement that you are 01:15:56.750 --> 01:15:58.609 now in charge of someone on their days off as 01:15:58.609 --> 01:16:03.149 well. But that's not the case. If you are understaffed 01:16:03.149 --> 01:16:05.210 and you're relying on overtime as your staffing 01:16:05.210 --> 01:16:07.850 model, then when they work more, you're saying 01:16:07.850 --> 01:16:11.409 another 24 hours at your fire department. What 01:16:11.409 --> 01:16:14.250 actually needs to happen is when you are fully 01:16:14.250 --> 01:16:16.270 staffed and recruitment is high again because 01:16:16.270 --> 01:16:17.989 you've got a healthy work week and people are 01:16:17.989 --> 01:16:21.069 testing for you and the overtime goes away, now 01:16:21.069 --> 01:16:23.529 that conversation becomes, well, you've got to 01:16:23.529 --> 01:16:25.409 educate them, and I'm all for even having this 01:16:25.409 --> 01:16:29.270 on paper. You are not allowed to take a job overnight 01:16:29.270 --> 01:16:31.609 in the ER, private ambulance company overnight, 01:16:31.930 --> 01:16:34.670 work for another fire department, because I think 01:16:34.670 --> 01:16:36.010 that's fair enough. If we're going to give you 01:16:36.010 --> 01:16:38.029 the rest and recovery that you need to be great 01:16:38.029 --> 01:16:40.210 on your shift, you can't screw that up on your 01:16:40.210 --> 01:16:42.710 days off. But that doesn't mean that you can't 01:16:42.710 --> 01:16:46.890 go into the realty industry or be a personal 01:16:46.890 --> 01:16:49.890 trainer or landscaping or construction or whatever 01:16:49.890 --> 01:16:52.569 the thing is, because at night, you're going 01:16:52.569 --> 01:16:54.569 to go home. And you're going to sleep in your 01:16:54.569 --> 01:16:56.250 bed and you're going to wake up and have breakfast 01:16:56.250 --> 01:16:59.909 with your kids. So the pushback at the firefighter 01:16:59.909 --> 01:17:01.770 level is, oh, well, if the overtime goes away, 01:17:01.909 --> 01:17:04.210 then I'm going to lose money. It's like, well, 01:17:04.270 --> 01:17:07.149 firstly, the most important currency is to go 01:17:07.149 --> 01:17:09.710 home to your family. Yeah, Newsflash, that's 01:17:09.710 --> 01:17:12.970 the most valuable currency. Secondly, we're so 01:17:12.970 --> 01:17:15.289 brainwashed that we think that the best money 01:17:15.289 --> 01:17:17.409 is in the fire service. And you speak to people 01:17:17.409 --> 01:17:19.890 outside the fire service, they're like, my God, 01:17:19.970 --> 01:17:24.149 your pay is shit. And like you said, of course, 01:17:24.170 --> 01:17:25.649 if you're building something at the beginning, 01:17:25.750 --> 01:17:27.770 you're not going to see a lot of money. But you 01:17:27.770 --> 01:17:29.909 speak to people like Chris Booth is another one. 01:17:29.930 --> 01:17:32.550 I worked with him on a fatal house fire where 01:17:32.550 --> 01:17:35.699 the dude came running out on fire. One of the 01:17:35.699 --> 01:17:37.880 most bizarre calls I've ever run on. I wrote 01:17:37.880 --> 01:17:40.340 about it in my book. Still, I know it bothers 01:17:40.340 --> 01:17:41.819 him. I think that's one of the reasons why he 01:17:41.819 --> 01:17:44.539 left. But he had, like yourself, built up this 01:17:44.539 --> 01:17:47.720 other career and he was able to transition into 01:17:47.720 --> 01:17:49.460 it. And this is very successful in that too. 01:17:49.859 --> 01:17:52.220 But I think this is what firefighters need to 01:17:52.220 --> 01:17:55.020 hear. If you're going to do a 42 -hour work week 01:17:55.020 --> 01:17:58.699 and leave your family for 24 hours, you should, 01:17:58.739 --> 01:18:00.659 in my opinion, unless you're able to just fund 01:18:00.659 --> 01:18:02.859 it on the firefighter's salary, you should think, 01:18:02.899 --> 01:18:05.630 what else would I love to do? Because God forbid, 01:18:05.689 --> 01:18:08.569 you get hurt, you get fired, you know, you need 01:18:08.569 --> 01:18:11.850 to move states, whatever it is, that gives you 01:18:11.850 --> 01:18:14.609 another entire tribe, another entire identity, 01:18:14.689 --> 01:18:18.590 and another entire income that you can lean into, 01:18:18.689 --> 01:18:22.930 God forbid, something goes wrong. 100%. And, 01:18:23.130 --> 01:18:26.890 you know, like, what also pushed me initially, 01:18:27.229 --> 01:18:31.289 and why I think I had such early success was 01:18:31.289 --> 01:18:34.329 because I planned on leaving. I had talked to 01:18:34.329 --> 01:18:37.250 Tony Renta, who left successfully and was running 01:18:37.250 --> 01:18:39.789 his own business, and some other guys. And one 01:18:39.789 --> 01:18:43.050 thing Tony told me is, set a date. Because if 01:18:43.050 --> 01:18:44.529 you never set a date, then you're never going 01:18:44.529 --> 01:18:47.789 to do it. And at the point where I was at when 01:18:47.789 --> 01:18:49.729 I first was looking at getting my license, I 01:18:49.729 --> 01:18:52.949 was burnt out from all the overtime, burnt out 01:18:52.949 --> 01:18:55.090 from doing the training, burnt out from doing 01:18:55.090 --> 01:18:57.909 the union, and just burnt out from everything 01:18:57.909 --> 01:19:02.409 in between. You know what I mean? I was planning 01:19:02.409 --> 01:19:05.789 on leaving. I set it for December of 2025, which 01:19:05.789 --> 01:19:09.130 is coming up right around the corner. And that 01:19:09.130 --> 01:19:12.109 was the driving motivation. But what I found 01:19:12.109 --> 01:19:16.029 as time went on, the less time I was at the department, 01:19:16.390 --> 01:19:18.949 the more I started actually enjoying the job 01:19:18.949 --> 01:19:21.729 again. Because, you know, like any fireman will 01:19:21.729 --> 01:19:24.789 tell you, like, if you are at the point mentally 01:19:24.789 --> 01:19:26.569 where you're like, I hate going to work or I'm 01:19:26.569 --> 01:19:28.689 miserable, then it's probably time for you to 01:19:28.689 --> 01:19:31.840 go. You know, and honestly, like the more exposure 01:19:31.840 --> 01:19:33.699 and the more time you're there, that's that's 01:19:33.699 --> 01:19:35.020 what it's going to do to you. It's going to make 01:19:35.020 --> 01:19:37.819 you like I remember joining the job and being 01:19:37.819 --> 01:19:41.619 so excited. And it's like I I got that back, 01:19:41.619 --> 01:19:43.960 you know, when I went to 30 and then I really 01:19:43.960 --> 01:19:46.880 got super involved. And then I lost that same 01:19:46.880 --> 01:19:49.800 passion for it for a little bit just from trying 01:19:49.800 --> 01:19:51.359 to be the helper. Right. Because all of us are 01:19:51.359 --> 01:19:53.300 wired to be the helper. So I'm like, let me do 01:19:53.300 --> 01:19:54.779 training. I'm going to do the union. I'm going 01:19:54.779 --> 01:19:56.640 to do this. I'm going to do that. Spread myself 01:19:56.640 --> 01:19:59.760 too thin. And then on top of that, going to shift. 01:19:59.899 --> 01:20:02.300 And that was just like, I'm done with this place. 01:20:02.399 --> 01:20:04.460 I'm done with the politics. I'm done with all 01:20:04.460 --> 01:20:06.760 this nonsense. But now that I'm away there 10 01:20:06.760 --> 01:20:10.760 days a month, I can do that. I still love riding 01:20:10.760 --> 01:20:12.420 on a fire truck. And that's all I want to do 01:20:12.420 --> 01:20:14.460 now. I just want to ride on a fire truck, go 01:20:14.460 --> 01:20:16.720 to the station, hang out with the guys and have 01:20:16.720 --> 01:20:18.619 a good time for 24 hours. And it almost gives 01:20:18.619 --> 01:20:21.420 me that mental break of if I'm doing a bunch 01:20:21.420 --> 01:20:23.260 of real estate transactions and I'm like, oh 01:20:23.260 --> 01:20:25.920 God, I'm like mentally drained. I make that my 01:20:25.920 --> 01:20:28.060 day off from all that. And now I go and I have 01:20:28.060 --> 01:20:29.640 fun with my friends at the fire department and 01:20:29.640 --> 01:20:32.340 run calls. And it's not saying it's always easy, 01:20:32.439 --> 01:20:35.880 but it's fun. And now I don't want to leave. 01:20:35.979 --> 01:20:38.899 Now I see myself like I can stay a lot longer. 01:20:38.979 --> 01:20:41.539 So to any of the guys that come in now that I 01:20:41.539 --> 01:20:44.119 talk to, I try and tell all of them, look, do 01:20:44.119 --> 01:20:46.600 whatever you can to find that second thing that 01:20:46.600 --> 01:20:49.279 you like doing outside of this job. Because now 01:20:49.279 --> 01:20:51.520 to me, the fire department is a hobby that I 01:20:51.520 --> 01:20:54.140 love doing. And I'm fortunate where if I wanted 01:20:54.140 --> 01:20:55.920 to leave tomorrow, I could, but I stay because 01:20:55.920 --> 01:20:58.039 I enjoy it. And because I know I'm good at it, 01:20:58.119 --> 01:21:00.020 you know, like I know I can do it. I know I can 01:21:00.020 --> 01:21:02.579 help people and I'm equipped to do it. But if 01:21:02.579 --> 01:21:04.880 you're not mentally equipped to do something 01:21:04.880 --> 01:21:06.819 and you're not healthy enough to do it, how are 01:21:06.819 --> 01:21:08.880 you going to do that on the fire ground? You're 01:21:08.880 --> 01:21:12.739 not going to be able to do it. And if everybody 01:21:12.739 --> 01:21:16.359 could find that one thing that they can do outside 01:21:16.359 --> 01:21:18.199 of the fire department, they're setting themselves 01:21:18.199 --> 01:21:21.000 up for later because there's so many guys that. 01:21:21.310 --> 01:21:23.890 made this job their identity that as soon as 01:21:23.890 --> 01:21:27.869 it's over they're lost they don't know what to 01:21:27.869 --> 01:21:30.289 do with themselves you know and i know plenty 01:21:30.289 --> 01:21:32.569 of them like now now they're working at universal 01:21:32.569 --> 01:21:35.590 you know like doing this or you know they're 01:21:35.590 --> 01:21:37.750 working at lowe's or something you know it's 01:21:37.750 --> 01:21:39.489 like find that next thing that you're passionate 01:21:39.489 --> 01:21:42.890 about before before retirement not all right 01:21:42.890 --> 01:21:44.750 i just did 30 years and now it's time to leave 01:21:44.750 --> 01:21:47.289 now what you know it's and then you wonder about 01:21:47.289 --> 01:21:49.109 suicide rates and all these other things like 01:21:49.109 --> 01:21:51.689 it i don't see myself ever not working just because 01:21:51.689 --> 01:21:54.729 i think it's it's it's important for all of us 01:21:54.729 --> 01:21:57.170 like when i was a kid i remember thinking man 01:21:57.170 --> 01:21:58.689 i can't wait till i'm retired and i could just 01:21:58.689 --> 01:22:00.609 do nothing and it's like now it's like if i don't 01:22:00.609 --> 01:22:02.430 have nothing to do i'm going stir crazy i got 01:22:02.430 --> 01:22:04.689 to do something you know so set yourself up doing 01:22:04.689 --> 01:22:06.930 something that even if it's not making a whole 01:22:06.930 --> 01:22:11.180 lot of money you love doing it I think the performance 01:22:11.180 --> 01:22:13.479 side is also really important. If we're talking 01:22:13.479 --> 01:22:16.399 about, again, a healthy work week, the whole 01:22:16.399 --> 01:22:19.779 point is in that 24 hours to be at your absolute 01:22:19.779 --> 01:22:22.359 peak. And it's really interesting that you were 01:22:22.359 --> 01:22:24.680 saying that. As you gave yourself more time off, 01:22:24.720 --> 01:22:26.979 you started loving being there when you were 01:22:26.979 --> 01:22:28.939 there. But there's this misnomer. I've even heard 01:22:28.939 --> 01:22:31.739 people say, oh, well, if we had a 24 -72, then 01:22:31.739 --> 01:22:33.699 I'd barely be at the station and I want to be 01:22:33.699 --> 01:22:37.210 in the trenches. Let me ask you this. How many 01:22:37.210 --> 01:22:40.149 of your favorite football, baseball, basketball, 01:22:40.270 --> 01:22:42.409 you know, stars are like, well, I'm going to 01:22:42.409 --> 01:22:44.829 go play for two teams because if I only play 01:22:44.829 --> 01:22:46.409 one game a week, it's not going to be enough. 01:22:46.489 --> 01:22:48.609 Fuck off. You know, if you want to be better 01:22:48.609 --> 01:22:51.689 at your job, go take classes, work out, eat well, 01:22:51.869 --> 01:22:55.130 you know, forge relationships at home. That way 01:22:55.130 --> 01:22:56.890 you're going to be when you as you said, when 01:22:56.890 --> 01:22:58.689 you go for your 24 hours, you're going to be 01:22:58.689 --> 01:23:02.210 all in for that 24 hours. But this fantasy that, 01:23:02.270 --> 01:23:03.750 you know, if you're there more, it makes you 01:23:03.750 --> 01:23:06.090 better. No, it makes you worse. Like, you know, 01:23:06.109 --> 01:23:08.510 24 hours without sleep is bad enough. If you're 01:23:08.510 --> 01:23:11.170 going into 48 hours, now we're going into danger 01:23:11.170 --> 01:23:13.649 area. And I always underline this with the sleep 01:23:13.649 --> 01:23:16.789 deprivation. Sleep deprivation is only ever used 01:23:16.789 --> 01:23:20.390 deliberately for special forces selection, interrogation 01:23:20.390 --> 01:23:24.409 and torture. So there is no performance side 01:23:24.409 --> 01:23:27.449 of sleep deprivation. It's degradation. You know, 01:23:27.470 --> 01:23:29.329 we are getting worse and worse with every 24 01:23:29.329 --> 01:23:32.350 hours. So if you really are the chess beater 01:23:32.350 --> 01:23:33.970 and you've grown out your mustache and you've 01:23:33.970 --> 01:23:35.710 got your leather helmet that you never wash, 01:23:35.869 --> 01:23:39.449 you know, and you're that guy and you really 01:23:39.449 --> 01:23:42.210 say it's for them, then you should be fighting. 01:23:42.329 --> 01:23:44.369 You should be front of the fucking line fighting 01:23:44.369 --> 01:23:49.050 for the 24 -72. So every 24 hours that you come 01:23:49.050 --> 01:23:51.689 back, you're as close to baseline. You've had 01:23:51.689 --> 01:23:53.829 rest and recovery. You've had ample time to do 01:23:53.829 --> 01:23:56.609 your kind of red line workouts. And now you come 01:23:56.609 --> 01:23:59.569 in and you're ready to be tip of the spear. But 01:23:59.569 --> 01:24:01.869 this misnomer that, you know, if I just work 01:24:01.869 --> 01:24:03.470 all these shifts, I'm going to be a better firefighter. 01:24:03.470 --> 01:24:05.449 No, you're not. You're going to be worse. And 01:24:05.449 --> 01:24:07.649 if you're fighting a healthier shift, you are 01:24:07.649 --> 01:24:09.909 literally saying to your community, I want to 01:24:09.909 --> 01:24:12.909 be a shitty firefighter. That's it. But if you 01:24:12.909 --> 01:24:14.810 actually go for the healthy work week and then 01:24:14.810 --> 01:24:19.079 you have another. you know, um, passion on the 01:24:19.079 --> 01:24:21.039 outside, whatever it is that you want to do, 01:24:21.100 --> 01:24:23.319 realtoring or, you know, the, the, um, you know, 01:24:23.340 --> 01:24:26.619 selling houses or whatever the thing is that 01:24:26.619 --> 01:24:28.699 then is, as you said, going to create a reset. 01:24:28.779 --> 01:24:31.680 So when you come back the next shift, you're, 01:24:31.680 --> 01:24:33.319 you're ready to go again. So I think that's such 01:24:33.319 --> 01:24:36.180 a beautiful perspective that kind of busts the 01:24:36.180 --> 01:24:39.380 myths that if a real passionate firefighter is 01:24:39.380 --> 01:24:41.060 there all the time, cause it couldn't be further 01:24:41.060 --> 01:24:44.680 from the truth. Well, and the good thing too, 01:24:44.779 --> 01:24:48.880 is like, I think we're all hardwired to want 01:24:48.880 --> 01:24:51.199 to also help our own community, like the fire 01:24:51.199 --> 01:24:53.119 department, first responders and everything else. 01:24:53.260 --> 01:24:56.039 And so it didn't start out when I got my license 01:24:56.039 --> 01:24:59.159 that I was going to be helping a majority of 01:24:59.159 --> 01:25:01.859 the people that I work with or in the industry. 01:25:02.020 --> 01:25:05.140 And so now it's like instead of showing up on 01:25:05.140 --> 01:25:07.560 somebody's worst day to help somebody, now I 01:25:07.560 --> 01:25:10.510 get to. Help somebody buy a house, give them 01:25:10.510 --> 01:25:12.470 the keys to them and their family, take care 01:25:12.470 --> 01:25:14.090 of them through the process and make sure they're 01:25:14.090 --> 01:25:16.210 good. If I need to take a lower commission, I 01:25:16.210 --> 01:25:19.350 could do that. And then on the flip side, with 01:25:19.350 --> 01:25:22.310 investing on houses like Tony and I, we started 01:25:22.310 --> 01:25:24.949 what's called fire flips. And if a house catches 01:25:24.949 --> 01:25:27.289 on fire and somebody is in trouble. We'll come 01:25:27.289 --> 01:25:29.649 in and give them, you know, a fair offer that 01:25:29.649 --> 01:25:31.869 we can afford to give them. And then our goal 01:25:31.869 --> 01:25:34.930 is to continue using firefighters or people who 01:25:34.930 --> 01:25:36.789 have side businesses that are in the fire department 01:25:36.789 --> 01:25:40.050 to help rehab the project. So now it's like it's 01:25:40.050 --> 01:25:41.949 becoming full circle. And it's this thing that, 01:25:41.970 --> 01:25:44.090 you know, you start off on a path and then all 01:25:44.090 --> 01:25:46.069 of a sudden you start kind of fine tuning it. 01:25:46.189 --> 01:25:48.829 And so now we're able to feed the tribe and kind 01:25:48.829 --> 01:25:51.149 of keep everything in our community. And that's 01:25:51.149 --> 01:25:53.170 the goal is that I want all all the people to 01:25:53.170 --> 01:25:55.369 kind of find what I found out through this process 01:25:55.369 --> 01:25:58.140 that wasn't planned. it's find that next thing 01:25:58.140 --> 01:26:00.560 you're passionate about because it will it will 01:26:00.560 --> 01:26:02.760 keep you mentally sharp for when you actually 01:26:02.760 --> 01:26:05.779 need to be there but i i mean i don't know how 01:26:05.779 --> 01:26:09.000 i did as many years as i did with all the overtime 01:26:09.000 --> 01:26:11.119 i was working i mean i'm sure the adderall that 01:26:11.119 --> 01:26:13.020 i was taking at the time probably helped a little 01:26:13.020 --> 01:26:15.579 bit which don't don't take too much of that kids 01:26:15.579 --> 01:26:18.949 like I was taking probably 50 milligrams at one 01:26:18.949 --> 01:26:21.069 point and then like your erections don't really 01:26:21.069 --> 01:26:23.529 last like they used to. And then I got off of 01:26:23.529 --> 01:26:26.050 it and then, and then now it's all good, you 01:26:26.050 --> 01:26:28.770 know, but, but, and that's the other thing, like 01:26:28.770 --> 01:26:31.689 the stimulants that people are using now in the 01:26:31.689 --> 01:26:35.090 fire department, caffeine. all these energy drinks 01:26:35.090 --> 01:26:37.130 that they all and i don't get me wrong i like 01:26:37.130 --> 01:26:39.890 i like energy drinks but the adderall usage has 01:26:39.890 --> 01:26:41.569 gone through the roof and it's it's not just 01:26:41.569 --> 01:26:44.670 usage it's abuse you know so now you're talking 01:26:44.670 --> 01:26:46.689 about adding to the sleep deprivation having 01:26:46.689 --> 01:26:48.670 a chemical substance in your body when you're 01:26:48.670 --> 01:26:50.289 getting off shift being physically dependent 01:26:50.289 --> 01:26:53.270 on it and you know being tired all the time and 01:26:53.270 --> 01:26:55.149 now you're supplementing that tiredness with 01:26:55.149 --> 01:26:58.149 a drug to keep you awake i don't know how like 01:26:58.149 --> 01:27:00.649 you're seeing why people's hormone levels are 01:27:00.649 --> 01:27:03.079 low like Five years ago, I had my testosterone 01:27:03.079 --> 01:27:06.479 tested and I was like 680. And that's like the 01:27:06.479 --> 01:27:08.319 peak of when I was working hard and everything 01:27:08.319 --> 01:27:09.819 else because I was feeling tired, but I was like, 01:27:09.840 --> 01:27:12.020 I'm probably overworked. This year, I got my 01:27:12.020 --> 01:27:15.479 test tested again and it was over a thousand 01:27:15.479 --> 01:27:17.600 and I'm not taking anything. It's literally from 01:27:17.600 --> 01:27:21.380 good proper sleep, good nutrition, working out 01:27:21.380 --> 01:27:23.699 and taking care of myself on my days off. And 01:27:23.699 --> 01:27:25.899 I don't work any overtime. I work my 10 days 01:27:25.899 --> 01:27:28.520 a month and that's all I do. So to me, that's 01:27:28.520 --> 01:27:31.899 proof enough that. you don't need to be there 01:27:31.899 --> 01:27:33.800 that long it's not it's not going to do anything 01:27:33.800 --> 01:27:35.560 good for you and the older you get the harder 01:27:35.560 --> 01:27:39.079 it is to maintain it yeah that's amazing i mean 01:27:39.079 --> 01:27:41.680 even when i when i retired out it was it was 01:27:41.680 --> 01:27:44.539 the creek was the last place um right when i 01:27:44.539 --> 01:27:49.539 did i think my t was at like 550 and then i think 01:27:49.539 --> 01:27:51.529 it was a couple years later up until recently 01:27:51.529 --> 01:27:54.630 it stayed the same it's still about 700 and like 01:27:54.630 --> 01:27:57.609 720 i think it was at 51 years old and the same 01:27:57.609 --> 01:28:00.109 thing like not taking anything but this is the 01:28:00.109 --> 01:28:02.449 point walking the walk like exercise you know 01:28:02.449 --> 01:28:04.670 taking control of my sleep to the point where 01:28:04.670 --> 01:28:07.149 i came off shift work because if i'm going to 01:28:07.149 --> 01:28:09.689 be out here yapping about it then you know at 01:28:09.689 --> 01:28:12.210 that point you know in that toxic environment 01:28:12.210 --> 01:28:14.289 that i chose to leave because of the organizational 01:28:14.289 --> 01:28:18.090 betrayal I got to use myself as a guinea pig. 01:28:18.189 --> 01:28:19.810 And it's like, look, you don't need to be taking 01:28:19.810 --> 01:28:23.170 TRT. You need sleep, which is again, flogging 01:28:23.170 --> 01:28:25.810 a dead horse. If we had a 24 -72 and you had 01:28:25.810 --> 01:28:28.670 a full 72 -hour recovery period between shifts, 01:28:28.930 --> 01:28:31.430 you wouldn't need to have any supplementation. 01:28:31.489 --> 01:28:33.310 That in itself will be enough to get you back 01:28:33.310 --> 01:28:35.630 to where you need to be. But a 24 -48 and now 01:28:35.630 --> 01:28:38.710 you've got a 48 -24 with mandatory, this is why 01:28:38.710 --> 01:28:41.050 we're falling apart physically, mentally, and 01:28:41.050 --> 01:28:44.069 even in our relationships. So there's such a 01:28:44.069 --> 01:28:47.029 beautiful opportunity. Take all these pieces 01:28:47.029 --> 01:28:48.930 like you're talking about, whether it's, you 01:28:48.930 --> 01:28:51.109 know, forging something beautiful on your days 01:28:51.109 --> 01:28:53.470 off, whether it's just simply being home in time. 01:28:53.529 --> 01:28:55.810 Not to mention, I think that the start time conversation, 01:28:56.090 --> 01:28:58.930 why are we getting there at 730 in the morning 01:28:58.930 --> 01:29:01.289 when we could get there at 11 a .m.? And that 01:29:01.289 --> 01:29:03.569 way you could sleep in if you got murdered all 01:29:03.569 --> 01:29:06.050 night running calls and I could have breakfast 01:29:06.050 --> 01:29:08.569 with my family before I go to the station. So 01:29:08.569 --> 01:29:10.930 there's so many, you know. proactive solutions 01:29:10.930 --> 01:29:13.789 911 integrated telehealth for the non -emergency 01:29:13.789 --> 01:29:15.470 calls so that you're not running them anymore 01:29:15.470 --> 01:29:19.010 but you know it's again it starts with this this 01:29:19.010 --> 01:29:21.869 a belief that we can and then b the the busting 01:29:21.869 --> 01:29:25.310 of the myths that you know you need to be there 01:29:25.310 --> 01:29:28.130 to work all this ot versus you could actually 01:29:28.130 --> 01:29:30.310 make more money and be a damn sight healthier 01:29:30.310 --> 01:29:33.069 if you just work the hours you're supposed to 01:29:33.069 --> 01:29:35.869 work of course all hands on a hurricane or something's 01:29:35.869 --> 01:29:38.180 coming in no one's questioning that And then 01:29:38.180 --> 01:29:41.140 saying, what would I like to do when I wasn't 01:29:41.140 --> 01:29:42.939 in the fire service? What's the other thing that 01:29:42.939 --> 01:29:45.039 I love to do? Why don't I start a business doing 01:29:45.039 --> 01:29:49.579 that? It's funny you bring up the hurricane because 01:29:49.579 --> 01:29:51.239 I was having this conversation the other day. 01:29:51.260 --> 01:29:53.659 Because I've heard chiefs say to people, this 01:29:53.659 --> 01:29:55.199 is what you signed up for. It's like, no, the 01:29:55.199 --> 01:30:00.039 fuck I didn't. I signed up to be here for 2920 01:30:00.039 --> 01:30:02.560 is what we're currently on. And then obviously, 01:30:02.619 --> 01:30:04.770 like you said. hurricanes i look at that as like 01:30:04.770 --> 01:30:06.729 that's a deployment that's the military right 01:30:06.729 --> 01:30:09.510 like you got to be deployed when there's an emergency 01:30:09.510 --> 01:30:13.090 in the area fine but to fix your staffing problem 01:30:13.090 --> 01:30:16.130 no that's not what i signed up for like you guys 01:30:16.130 --> 01:30:18.050 are supposed to maintain the staffing levels 01:30:18.050 --> 01:30:21.310 you know yeah and this is the point this is this 01:30:21.310 --> 01:30:24.789 is what angers me is the people that oppose changing 01:30:24.789 --> 01:30:27.210 the work week for the firefighters they themselves 01:30:27.210 --> 01:30:29.750 work 40 hours a week and go home at five o 'clock 01:30:29.750 --> 01:30:31.829 every night and i don't know how you can look 01:30:31.829 --> 01:30:34.289 yourself in the mirror And if you talk about 01:30:34.289 --> 01:30:37.449 mental health, we look at us, we look at the 01:30:37.449 --> 01:30:39.289 men and women that are running the calls, but 01:30:39.289 --> 01:30:41.449 we forget that the people in the government buildings 01:30:41.449 --> 01:30:44.829 that have no problem sleeping when their men 01:30:44.829 --> 01:30:48.270 and women are dying of all things because of 01:30:48.270 --> 01:30:50.210 their work week and the understaffing that they 01:30:50.210 --> 01:30:52.949 created. The firefighters and the paramedics 01:30:52.949 --> 01:30:54.510 and the engineers and lieutenants, they weren't 01:30:54.510 --> 01:30:57.210 in charge of recruitment and staffing. The ones 01:30:57.210 --> 01:31:00.050 wearing the bugles were at the top. So they sleep 01:31:00.050 --> 01:31:03.109 well knowing that like locally here, I mean, 01:31:03.130 --> 01:31:04.829 I've lost count of how many firefighters they've 01:31:04.829 --> 01:31:07.250 buried in the last few years and they still just 01:31:07.250 --> 01:31:10.949 sleep fine at night. That's a huge, huge problem 01:31:10.949 --> 01:31:13.310 to me. If you're working 40 hours and enjoying, 01:31:13.550 --> 01:31:15.869 you know, being at home every night, you should 01:31:15.869 --> 01:31:18.170 be bending over backwards for the men and women 01:31:18.170 --> 01:31:19.869 in the trenches. And I'm seeing the opposite, 01:31:19.970 --> 01:31:21.989 which is why, you know, I think that one of the 01:31:21.989 --> 01:31:23.949 most under -discussed things in the fire service 01:31:23.949 --> 01:31:26.510 is cowardice and not refusal to make entry on 01:31:26.510 --> 01:31:29.970 a fire. but true moral courage to fight for your 01:31:29.970 --> 01:31:33.890 men and women and their families. Yeah. And it's 01:31:33.890 --> 01:31:35.510 deflection because, you know, you can even have 01:31:35.510 --> 01:31:37.229 these conversations with them and they'll go, 01:31:37.390 --> 01:31:40.069 well, you know, if you guys don't, you know, 01:31:40.069 --> 01:31:41.689 don't tell people to leave, then we wouldn't 01:31:41.689 --> 01:31:44.789 have this problem. It's like, bro, come on. You 01:31:44.789 --> 01:31:47.949 think me saying that you should leave? No, they 01:31:47.949 --> 01:31:50.390 see the writing on the wall, you know? And honestly, 01:31:50.510 --> 01:31:52.750 like even in the beginning stages of some of 01:31:52.750 --> 01:31:54.310 these guys' career, like now they're required 01:31:54.310 --> 01:31:57.199 to be a medic in three years, but. They have 01:31:57.199 --> 01:31:59.119 to go to school the day they get off. They have 01:31:59.119 --> 01:32:01.140 to do all their rides and clinicals on their 01:32:01.140 --> 01:32:04.939 days off. And then they're overworked and then 01:32:04.939 --> 01:32:06.640 they got to come back to shift. Like, why can't 01:32:06.640 --> 01:32:09.359 you do these clinical rides on duty, hire another 01:32:09.359 --> 01:32:12.199 overtime person for 12 hours to drive the unit 01:32:12.199 --> 01:32:14.100 so they can get their clinical hours on duty. 01:32:14.380 --> 01:32:16.239 And then they can actually enjoy a day or two 01:32:16.239 --> 01:32:19.039 off. Like that, that period of time that they 01:32:19.039 --> 01:32:21.479 have to go to school. I can't imagine having 01:32:21.479 --> 01:32:23.220 to do that. If you've got a young family at home, 01:32:23.260 --> 01:32:25.380 like when I got hired. My son was six months 01:32:25.380 --> 01:32:27.220 old and my wife just started nursing school. 01:32:27.359 --> 01:32:29.159 There is no way I would have been able to make 01:32:29.159 --> 01:32:31.840 that commitment and have a work -life balance 01:32:31.840 --> 01:32:34.199 and be able to maintain bills and do all that 01:32:34.199 --> 01:32:36.300 other stuff if I had to go to medical school. 01:32:36.779 --> 01:32:39.579 And now it's like the economy, I mean, inflation's 01:32:39.579 --> 01:32:41.399 crazy. So it's like, how are these kids making 01:32:41.399 --> 01:32:45.840 it? When I went through Orange County, they were 01:32:45.840 --> 01:32:47.859 talking about an in -house program. I kept waiting 01:32:47.859 --> 01:32:49.600 and waiting and waiting and nothing was happening. 01:32:49.920 --> 01:32:52.779 So I put myself through CF. I was going through 01:32:52.779 --> 01:32:56.119 a divorce. I was a single dad. I get 24 hours 01:32:56.119 --> 01:32:58.960 being murdered in Battalion 4, drive straight 01:32:58.960 --> 01:33:01.800 to college, sit through nine hours of classroom. 01:33:02.670 --> 01:33:04.810 then you know get my son from daycare be a dad 01:33:04.810 --> 01:33:06.989 the rest of the time and then the next day drop 01:33:06.989 --> 01:33:09.409 him off and now go do a 12 -hour clinical with 01:33:09.409 --> 01:33:12.989 marion or you know the hospitals same thing get 01:33:12.989 --> 01:33:15.430 my son rinse and repeat for a year i honestly 01:33:15.430 --> 01:33:17.390 i don't even know how i did it when i look back 01:33:17.390 --> 01:33:20.130 like my mind can't comprehend the logistics of 01:33:20.130 --> 01:33:23.270 it but like i said and then you get no tuition 01:33:23.270 --> 01:33:26.090 reimbursement and then i like literally right 01:33:26.090 --> 01:33:28.189 after i graduated they announced the in -house 01:33:28.189 --> 01:33:30.140 program But this is the problem. I'm like, what 01:33:30.140 --> 01:33:32.020 kind of message does that send? They're screaming 01:33:32.020 --> 01:33:34.800 for paramedics. You know, one of your firefighters 01:33:34.800 --> 01:33:37.020 has to go through that. And then all I get in 01:33:37.020 --> 01:33:39.560 return is mandatory over and over and over again, 01:33:39.640 --> 01:33:41.760 which is why I ended up leaving because I was 01:33:41.760 --> 01:33:45.659 a single dad. And one day after that deadly shift 01:33:45.659 --> 01:33:47.579 with Chris where three people died that day, 01:33:47.659 --> 01:33:50.819 different incidents, and I'd already handed my 01:33:50.819 --> 01:33:53.199 notice in in the morning. Because they told me, 01:33:53.239 --> 01:33:54.479 hey, you're going to get hit again. I'm like, 01:33:54.579 --> 01:33:56.500 you know what? I was in Reedy Creek's process, 01:33:56.600 --> 01:33:58.340 but I hadn't done the medical yet. And I was 01:33:58.340 --> 01:34:00.439 like, fuck it, I'm done. You can't tell me I 01:34:00.439 --> 01:34:03.260 can't go home to my son as a single dad. I'm 01:34:03.260 --> 01:34:04.840 working the shifts I'm supposed to be working. 01:34:05.439 --> 01:34:07.760 But again, through your gross mismanagement, 01:34:07.800 --> 01:34:10.479 you're telling me that I can't go home to my, 01:34:10.560 --> 01:34:13.739 what was he then, a four -year -old? Nah. So 01:34:13.739 --> 01:34:16.220 just to let you know, you're going to need someone 01:34:16.220 --> 01:34:18.460 for Station 70 next shift because I won't fucking 01:34:18.460 --> 01:34:20.399 be there. And that's how I ended it. I was done. 01:34:20.890 --> 01:34:22.930 And it wasn't because I didn't love the job. 01:34:22.989 --> 01:34:25.930 I love the job. But the mismanagement and the 01:34:25.930 --> 01:34:28.869 lack of ownership on the way that they staffed 01:34:28.869 --> 01:34:32.090 was why they're bleeding people. It's not because 01:34:32.090 --> 01:34:34.390 Dan Lennon said, oh, James, you shouldn't stay 01:34:34.390 --> 01:34:36.750 here. It's shit. No, it's because it was shit. 01:34:36.890 --> 01:34:40.869 That was it. It wasn't the job. It was the working 01:34:40.869 --> 01:34:44.840 environment. Now, had it been a 24 -72. My medic 01:34:44.840 --> 01:34:46.680 school experience would have been completely 01:34:46.680 --> 01:34:49.619 different if I just worked, you know, 24 on, 01:34:49.680 --> 01:34:52.779 72 off, and we were fully staffed. Same job, 01:34:52.939 --> 01:34:56.500 different working environment. Yeah, 100%. I 01:34:56.500 --> 01:34:58.439 mean, at least in our organization, you know, 01:34:58.460 --> 01:35:02.260 the change to engineers having to be on the rescues 01:35:02.260 --> 01:35:06.920 has been a complete, you know, decimation of 01:35:06.920 --> 01:35:10.520 that rank. And now the overtime has shifted from 01:35:10.520 --> 01:35:12.579 what it used to be firefighter medics to now. 01:35:13.369 --> 01:35:15.470 Primarily engineer medics, you know, the engineer 01:35:15.470 --> 01:35:17.750 medics, like, so our staffing model, you'll have 01:35:17.750 --> 01:35:19.750 an engineer assigned to the rescue and then a 01:35:19.750 --> 01:35:22.310 rescue driver. But if you're an engineer medic 01:35:22.310 --> 01:35:25.289 filling two spots and all they got to hire is 01:35:25.289 --> 01:35:27.250 a plain old rescue driver. Now that overtime 01:35:27.250 --> 01:35:29.909 list comes up for mandatory, the engineer medics 01:35:29.909 --> 01:35:31.909 are getting slammed. And these are all the guys 01:35:31.909 --> 01:35:34.470 that came up in the system that you came up with 01:35:34.470 --> 01:35:37.510 that promoted to get off the box. And then they 01:35:37.510 --> 01:35:39.689 made, they created this whole position, which, 01:35:39.770 --> 01:35:42.050 you know, Chief Droz, I know what his intent 01:35:42.050 --> 01:35:45.399 was, but. Ultimately, like when he left before 01:35:45.399 --> 01:35:49.720 the whole program was kind of finished, you left 01:35:49.720 --> 01:35:53.020 the administration behind and they kind of just 01:35:53.020 --> 01:35:55.340 figured out what they could do. You know, they 01:35:55.340 --> 01:35:57.859 put all this money into it. It's not working. 01:35:57.920 --> 01:36:00.020 And now you can't go back to your commissioners 01:36:00.020 --> 01:36:01.619 and go, hey, this isn't working. I know you guys 01:36:01.619 --> 01:36:03.239 put all this money into it. So now we're just 01:36:03.239 --> 01:36:06.020 going to maintain this terrible situation. And 01:36:06.020 --> 01:36:08.000 then, you know, now these guys are getting slammed. 01:36:08.140 --> 01:36:09.979 And then you wonder why these guys are all disgruntled 01:36:09.979 --> 01:36:11.500 telling these people, get the hell out of here 01:36:11.500 --> 01:36:14.199 before it's too late. you know so it's like the 01:36:14.199 --> 01:36:16.260 good thing is is finally with the new fire chief 01:36:16.260 --> 01:36:19.119 we had it for dinner and we mentioned you know 01:36:19.119 --> 01:36:21.600 some things about how they could resolve it and 01:36:21.600 --> 01:36:22.680 one of the things they're going to do is going 01:36:22.680 --> 01:36:24.659 to make all the firefighters at least take a 01:36:24.659 --> 01:36:27.460 a supervisory class so they can ride as a supervisor 01:36:27.460 --> 01:36:30.340 on the rescue so now at least it'll give some 01:36:30.340 --> 01:36:33.140 relief but now where's the overtime and all that 01:36:33.140 --> 01:36:34.939 other stuff going to get shifted to either way 01:36:34.939 --> 01:36:37.659 you're not solving the ultimate problem you're 01:36:37.659 --> 01:36:44.340 just another band -aid another reaction Well, 01:36:44.380 --> 01:36:45.960 I hope the chief is different than when I was 01:36:45.960 --> 01:36:47.399 there because I remember him bringing a tick 01:36:47.399 --> 01:36:49.199 into the station to see if we've been using the 01:36:49.199 --> 01:36:56.199 TV. Yeah, yeah. I mean, again, I don't know. 01:36:56.260 --> 01:36:59.039 I remember it too. I was Battalion 5 back then. 01:36:59.880 --> 01:37:04.220 And I tell most people, I'm like, you know, we 01:37:04.220 --> 01:37:07.680 all change over time. So my optimistic hope is 01:37:07.680 --> 01:37:10.859 he changed and maybe he sees things differently. 01:37:12.329 --> 01:37:15.109 At the same time, I also don't get my hopes up 01:37:15.109 --> 01:37:18.069 because growing up in an environment where my 01:37:18.069 --> 01:37:19.930 mom, who still struggles with substance abuse, 01:37:20.069 --> 01:37:21.710 always said, this is the last time I'm doing 01:37:21.710 --> 01:37:23.510 this, I'm quitting forever, and then it never 01:37:23.510 --> 01:37:27.850 really happens. I've got that, like, okay, people 01:37:27.850 --> 01:37:30.130 say things all the time, but I'll see it when 01:37:30.130 --> 01:37:33.689 I see it. Exactly. Actions speak louder than 01:37:33.689 --> 01:37:36.010 words. Well, speaking of that, it's a good way 01:37:36.010 --> 01:37:37.470 to kind of round off the conversation before 01:37:37.470 --> 01:37:39.350 we go to some closing questions. Back to the 01:37:39.350 --> 01:37:43.399 343. The first year I did it, and I'm actually 01:37:43.399 --> 01:37:45.560 going to make a video because it was sad what 01:37:45.560 --> 01:37:48.119 I had to write on my back this last year, but 01:37:48.119 --> 01:37:51.479 I'd lost six friends. So I had their names on 01:37:51.479 --> 01:37:54.399 my back and I was at the Reedy Creek then. And 01:37:54.399 --> 01:37:56.399 that was actually really the six that really 01:37:56.399 --> 01:37:59.100 inspired the Behind the Shield podcast is what 01:37:59.100 --> 01:38:03.800 started it. 10 years later, well, I guess 11 01:38:03.800 --> 01:38:06.619 technically now, I had to write on my back, there's 01:38:06.619 --> 01:38:08.899 not enough space on my back for The Fallen this 01:38:08.899 --> 01:38:12.220 year. Because last year I had it on my back, 01:38:12.239 --> 01:38:14.520 on my chest, down my arm. So there was no space 01:38:14.520 --> 01:38:17.939 left to write the names anymore. So the memorial 01:38:17.939 --> 01:38:20.319 element and obviously Carl Andreano is a big 01:38:20.319 --> 01:38:23.899 part of that. And he was one of the six. You 01:38:23.899 --> 01:38:26.560 know, that's so important. But as we've gone 01:38:26.560 --> 01:38:28.420 on and watched this, there's two things for me 01:38:28.420 --> 01:38:30.600 specifically. Firstly, who is this English guy 01:38:30.600 --> 01:38:33.119 that yaps on this podcast the whole time? I've 01:38:33.119 --> 01:38:36.470 always... With my workout partner, Casey, we've 01:38:36.470 --> 01:38:38.750 always done the regular, not the master's division 01:38:38.750 --> 01:38:40.569 because I wanted to prove a point. We're not 01:38:40.569 --> 01:38:42.710 going to win it, but I want approval. If I'm 01:38:42.710 --> 01:38:46.409 51 years old, I can still hold my own with the 01:38:46.409 --> 01:38:49.050 air quotes young guys because this is what the 01:38:49.050 --> 01:38:51.270 fire service should be. I don't think you should 01:38:51.270 --> 01:38:53.789 have easier tests for gender or age or anything 01:38:53.789 --> 01:38:57.109 like that. But the other thing is, I don't think 01:38:57.109 --> 01:38:59.890 there are very many other places where you truly 01:38:59.890 --> 01:39:03.600 see. brotherhood and sisterhood, like the 343 01:39:03.600 --> 01:39:07.380 Hero Challenge in Orange County. So talk to me 01:39:07.380 --> 01:39:10.800 about, you know, your first experience with that. 01:39:10.859 --> 01:39:12.680 And then what have you seen as far as the last 01:39:12.680 --> 01:39:17.920 decade or so with that particular event? So the 01:39:17.920 --> 01:39:21.359 first time I did it, me and Dan Barnard, we got 01:39:21.359 --> 01:39:22.920 hired together. We actually got hired with Carl 01:39:22.920 --> 01:39:24.880 as well. And so, yeah, when he passed, it was 01:39:24.880 --> 01:39:28.250 definitely, it was definitely like that. You 01:39:28.250 --> 01:39:29.590 know, as a young guy, you always think you're 01:39:29.590 --> 01:39:30.989 unstoppable. And then when you see something 01:39:30.989 --> 01:39:32.989 like that happen to somebody so young, it kind 01:39:32.989 --> 01:39:34.649 of wakes you up and realize that, you know, we 01:39:34.649 --> 01:39:36.850 all only have a finite amount of time here. So, 01:39:36.850 --> 01:39:39.050 you know, the first time I did it, I just did 01:39:39.050 --> 01:39:41.909 it to compete. And, you know, then we didn't 01:39:41.909 --> 01:39:44.350 win. So me being competitive, there was always 01:39:44.350 --> 01:39:46.850 that like, all right, I got to win it, you know. 01:39:46.949 --> 01:39:50.930 So every year, just go out there and do the thing. 01:39:50.989 --> 01:39:55.220 And I wasn't necessarily doing it. as the memorial 01:39:55.220 --> 01:39:57.579 side of it. I don't think I was thinking that 01:39:57.579 --> 01:40:00.319 complexly when I was that young. And then as 01:40:00.319 --> 01:40:03.739 I've gotten older, the more you realize what 01:40:03.739 --> 01:40:05.899 the event truly means, the more you appreciate 01:40:05.899 --> 01:40:08.359 it. And that makes me appreciate the people who 01:40:08.359 --> 01:40:12.100 put it in place and started it because now every 01:40:12.100 --> 01:40:15.439 year it is an excuse for us to actually get together. 01:40:16.039 --> 01:40:18.119 And not just sit around and talk about the same 01:40:18.119 --> 01:40:20.520 stupid fire department conversations about calls 01:40:20.520 --> 01:40:22.699 we run and all this other stuff. But to actually 01:40:22.699 --> 01:40:24.899 catch up with this community that we've created 01:40:24.899 --> 01:40:27.220 of everybody that just likes to come out, compete 01:40:27.220 --> 01:40:29.300 and have a good time and cheer for everybody. 01:40:29.399 --> 01:40:32.079 There's never like this animosity or any of this 01:40:32.079 --> 01:40:34.079 other stuff. It's always just a day to come out 01:40:34.079 --> 01:40:37.060 and kind of be together. And so it's just watching 01:40:37.060 --> 01:40:40.239 it evolve and then also watching the same faces 01:40:40.239 --> 01:40:42.500 come back. That's how you know it has an impact 01:40:42.500 --> 01:40:44.300 on people and that they look forward to it every 01:40:44.300 --> 01:40:47.029 year. So I'm blown away. And I love the work 01:40:47.029 --> 01:40:49.310 Belinda did on it this year. I think she elevated 01:40:49.310 --> 01:40:51.850 it to the next level. I don't know if she's going 01:40:51.850 --> 01:40:54.470 to do, you know, the whole process again next 01:40:54.470 --> 01:40:55.949 year, because it is one of those things that's 01:40:55.949 --> 01:40:59.369 a labor of love. But I hope if she does do it, 01:40:59.390 --> 01:41:01.670 that she continues on doing it. And if not, I 01:41:01.670 --> 01:41:03.949 hope the next person, you know, continues to 01:41:03.949 --> 01:41:07.930 grow it the same way. Absolutely. Yeah, I've 01:41:07.930 --> 01:41:10.130 said this. I mean, when I went this time, you 01:41:10.130 --> 01:41:12.270 know, I was going from person to person, you 01:41:12.270 --> 01:41:15.420 know. hugging and talking to each other and you 01:41:15.420 --> 01:41:17.020 know a lot of them obviously orange county guys 01:41:17.020 --> 01:41:20.659 and girls and uh i was with some of my crossfit 01:41:20.659 --> 01:41:22.239 friends and i told them that just so you know 01:41:22.239 --> 01:41:26.020 i haven't worked here for like 15 years this 01:41:26.020 --> 01:41:28.279 is how this brotherhood sisterhood is you know 01:41:28.279 --> 01:41:30.420 it's been well not quite 15 but you know 12 whatever 01:41:30.420 --> 01:41:33.239 it's been so this is what happens when when you 01:41:33.239 --> 01:41:36.130 care like you don't Those relationships don't 01:41:36.130 --> 01:41:37.430 end. Obviously, you're not seeing each other 01:41:37.430 --> 01:41:39.670 for a while. But that truly is a brotherhood 01:41:39.670 --> 01:41:42.670 and sisterhood. My truck one crew in Anaheim 01:41:42.670 --> 01:41:44.649 were at my wedding 10 years later. And I was 01:41:44.649 --> 01:41:46.149 only at that department for three and a half 01:41:46.149 --> 01:41:48.869 years. So when people say the brotherhood is 01:41:48.869 --> 01:41:50.569 dead, I say, you're just looking in the wrong 01:41:50.569 --> 01:41:53.109 fucking place. And you're part of the problem. 01:41:53.210 --> 01:41:54.789 If you're even saying that, you're part of the 01:41:54.789 --> 01:41:57.010 problem because you need to be creating that. 01:41:57.090 --> 01:41:58.909 Now, don't get me wrong. They're like my last 01:41:58.909 --> 01:42:02.369 place. There are environments that are so damn... 01:42:03.079 --> 01:42:07.220 that is extremely hard to create that. But, you 01:42:07.220 --> 01:42:08.819 know, if you just give up on it, then what have 01:42:08.819 --> 01:42:11.439 we got left? So find those places where there 01:42:11.439 --> 01:42:13.420 is that, you know, the Orlando Fire Conference, 01:42:13.600 --> 01:42:16.000 you know, the 343, some of these other events 01:42:16.000 --> 01:42:18.619 that have got going on. Because I love every 01:42:18.619 --> 01:42:21.119 single year you'd see the same people, all different, 01:42:21.220 --> 01:42:24.180 like you said, different fire departments. But, 01:42:24.300 --> 01:42:26.520 you know, the ones that aren't buying into the, 01:42:26.579 --> 01:42:28.659 oh, city's better than county or all that other 01:42:28.659 --> 01:42:31.180 bullshit rhetoric, but just see each other as... 01:42:31.369 --> 01:42:33.109 firefighters we're not any better we're running 01:42:33.109 --> 01:42:36.170 the same damn calls all over this country we 01:42:36.170 --> 01:42:39.250 are the same person so i love the fact to me 01:42:39.250 --> 01:42:41.189 that's kind of like the flame you know in in 01:42:41.189 --> 01:42:44.090 the the gas burner that little pilot flame it's 01:42:44.090 --> 01:42:47.069 still going you know no one it's not going to 01:42:47.069 --> 01:42:49.029 go out and the more you know obviously we feed 01:42:49.029 --> 01:42:51.369 it and fuel it the bigger it's going to get again 01:42:51.369 --> 01:42:54.529 but that to me is a real kind of re -up on you 01:42:54.529 --> 01:42:56.890 know being reminded of what the fire service 01:42:56.890 --> 01:43:00.399 is truly about Well, the great thing about the 01:43:00.399 --> 01:43:02.979 fire service, too, is that there could be people 01:43:02.979 --> 01:43:05.359 you don't talk to for years, but you know that 01:43:05.359 --> 01:43:07.340 if you ever called somebody and said, hey, man, 01:43:07.439 --> 01:43:11.100 I need help, you'd have an army of people at 01:43:11.100 --> 01:43:13.300 your doorstep ready to help you. Doesn't matter 01:43:13.300 --> 01:43:15.239 what it is, you know, and that could be people 01:43:15.239 --> 01:43:16.880 you don't even necessarily get along with most 01:43:16.880 --> 01:43:19.340 of the time. You know, it's just we are the helpers, 01:43:19.340 --> 01:43:21.460 you know, and we will be there when somebody 01:43:21.460 --> 01:43:25.220 says help me. Absolutely. Well, I want to shift 01:43:25.220 --> 01:43:27.060 some closing questions so I can be mindful of 01:43:27.060 --> 01:43:29.840 your time. The first one I love to ask, is there 01:43:29.840 --> 01:43:32.380 a book or are there books that you love to recommend? 01:43:32.619 --> 01:43:35.260 It can be related to our discussion today or 01:43:35.260 --> 01:43:42.020 completely unrelated. So one of the books I read, 01:43:42.140 --> 01:43:48.239 and it's definitely a great book as far as, I 01:43:48.239 --> 01:43:50.159 guess I'm trying to think of the right way to 01:43:50.159 --> 01:43:53.500 say it, but, you know, Maybe how some people 01:43:53.500 --> 01:43:56.279 who are politically motivated and the way they 01:43:56.279 --> 01:43:58.100 maneuver and how to watch out for those people. 01:43:58.239 --> 01:44:02.739 There's a book called the 48 laws of power. I 01:44:02.739 --> 01:44:05.180 read that book and it blew my socks off because 01:44:05.180 --> 01:44:07.420 now it's like every, everything that I talked 01:44:07.420 --> 01:44:09.960 about, it's almost like a manual to how to be 01:44:09.960 --> 01:44:13.939 like a dictator in a way, or just like, you know, 01:44:13.939 --> 01:44:16.979 psychologically like maneuver people. And that's 01:44:16.979 --> 01:44:18.840 not what I was looking to get out of it. It's 01:44:18.840 --> 01:44:20.520 just, I kept hearing about this book and when 01:44:20.520 --> 01:44:22.560 I finished reading it. I remember I was talking 01:44:22.560 --> 01:44:24.680 to Jamal. I'm like, I feel like this is how I 01:44:24.680 --> 01:44:26.800 know how some of these chiefs think sometimes, 01:44:27.079 --> 01:44:29.460 you know. So if you ever want to read a book 01:44:29.460 --> 01:44:31.600 that will blow your socks off, definitely read 01:44:31.600 --> 01:44:33.979 that. And I started getting into audio books. 01:44:34.039 --> 01:44:35.920 But the one thing I noticed is that I definitely 01:44:35.920 --> 01:44:39.500 grasp more by actually seeing the print of paper, 01:44:39.640 --> 01:44:41.500 whereas, you know, you kind of start letting 01:44:41.500 --> 01:44:43.039 your mind wander when you're listening to an 01:44:43.039 --> 01:44:45.500 audio book. So so that was definitely a good 01:44:45.500 --> 01:44:51.899 one. And then I go down like 1984. I'm sure that's 01:44:51.899 --> 01:44:54.439 a book a lot of people have heard of. I love 01:44:54.439 --> 01:44:56.560 that book because there's a lot of parallels 01:44:56.560 --> 01:45:00.020 between what was going on in that book compared 01:45:00.020 --> 01:45:06.960 to what's kind of going on now. And then. Jocko's 01:45:06.960 --> 01:45:08.699 book, obviously, I think everybody has probably 01:45:08.699 --> 01:45:11.100 read at this point. That one, Extreme Ownership, 01:45:11.100 --> 01:45:15.739 is definitely one that applies to anybody who's 01:45:15.739 --> 01:45:18.380 looking to be a company officer, but also just 01:45:18.380 --> 01:45:21.939 being a person, right? Nobody wants to hear excuses. 01:45:22.520 --> 01:45:25.800 And if you're in any way involved with anything 01:45:25.800 --> 01:45:28.220 and it goes sideways, then it ain't on anybody 01:45:28.220 --> 01:45:30.800 else. It's on you because it's either you didn't 01:45:30.800 --> 01:45:32.800 speak up or you let it happen. But if you're 01:45:32.800 --> 01:45:35.479 there and you have the ability to use your voice 01:45:35.479 --> 01:45:37.439 to fix something and you don't, then it's on 01:45:37.439 --> 01:45:42.020 you. Yeah, moral courage again. It's funny you 01:45:42.020 --> 01:45:44.840 said with the 48 laws. It reminds me, I had Hoyce 01:45:44.840 --> 01:45:46.939 Gracie on years ago. I interviewed him in California. 01:45:47.579 --> 01:45:50.500 And he was talking about learning striking. And 01:45:50.500 --> 01:45:52.739 he didn't learn striking to use striking. He 01:45:52.739 --> 01:45:55.039 learned striking so he could then counter striking 01:45:55.039 --> 01:45:57.609 with jujitsu. And I feel it's the same with that 01:45:57.609 --> 01:46:02.649 book. The more you can be educated on the underhand 01:46:02.649 --> 01:46:05.210 maneuvers of some of these horrendous leaders 01:46:05.210 --> 01:46:08.109 and tyrants, the more you're going to have the 01:46:08.109 --> 01:46:10.090 reaction to it. You're going to be able to counter 01:46:10.090 --> 01:46:14.369 it. Yeah. And then, oh, here, I got this one. 01:46:14.430 --> 01:46:25.350 Hold on. This one, it's a man and his relationship 01:46:25.350 --> 01:46:28.409 with God. I got it at a garage sale years ago. 01:46:28.470 --> 01:46:30.590 I don't know why I picked it up, but I just saw 01:46:30.590 --> 01:46:34.170 the title. Definitely a good book that, you know, 01:46:34.170 --> 01:46:36.170 it kind of mixes some scripture, but there's 01:46:36.170 --> 01:46:39.310 just some good stuff in there. And then Benjamin 01:46:39.310 --> 01:46:43.529 Franklin's virtues is also one that it's, let 01:46:43.529 --> 01:46:46.390 me see if I got it. I was just looking at it 01:46:46.390 --> 01:46:48.810 the other day. Yeah. I was in Boston recently 01:46:48.810 --> 01:46:50.890 and I saw this in the gift shop and we went to 01:46:50.890 --> 01:46:55.470 go visit his house. And it's yeah, it's a very 01:46:55.470 --> 01:46:58.289 small, like quick read, but basically it's something 01:46:58.289 --> 01:47:01.569 that in there he talks about. Like if you do 01:47:01.569 --> 01:47:04.010 these every single day, it's basically the way 01:47:04.010 --> 01:47:05.550 you start and the way you'll finish and how you 01:47:05.550 --> 01:47:07.310 can incorporate these things into your life. 01:47:07.350 --> 01:47:09.329 So definitely a good one. If anybody's looking 01:47:09.329 --> 01:47:11.670 to kind of change the way you're doing things 01:47:11.670 --> 01:47:13.800 as you get older, I think it's. I think it's 01:47:13.800 --> 01:47:15.779 natural where you start reflecting on who you 01:47:15.779 --> 01:47:19.180 are as a person and how you can do better, you 01:47:19.180 --> 01:47:21.140 know? So it's like, as you're getting older, 01:47:21.380 --> 01:47:23.960 and I remember reading in a psychology class 01:47:23.960 --> 01:47:25.760 I took at college where, you know, when you're 01:47:25.760 --> 01:47:28.399 20s, you know, you're one way, but then you hit 01:47:28.399 --> 01:47:31.039 a certain age and then you go from student to 01:47:31.039 --> 01:47:33.520 mentor. And so now that I've kind of hit that 01:47:33.520 --> 01:47:35.100 different stage in my life, I don't know what 01:47:35.100 --> 01:47:37.539 happens. Maybe it's, you know, we're so late 01:47:37.539 --> 01:47:40.600 to mature mentally that. that's why that takes 01:47:40.600 --> 01:47:42.880 on. Whereas women, obviously they're, they're 01:47:42.880 --> 01:47:45.020 more mature in the earlier years of their life, 01:47:45.100 --> 01:47:47.920 but it's definitely a joy. I'm enjoying the process 01:47:47.920 --> 01:47:50.859 of kind of that evolution of, of that next phase 01:47:50.859 --> 01:47:53.420 of my life and, you know, raising kids, obviously 01:47:53.420 --> 01:47:56.039 it helps as well, but yeah, definitely these, 01:47:56.100 --> 01:47:59.079 these ones are good ones to pick up and just 01:47:59.079 --> 01:48:01.739 thumb through every once in a while. Beautiful. 01:48:01.939 --> 01:48:05.359 What about films, documentary TV that you love? 01:48:08.439 --> 01:48:10.920 Well, me and Dave Kaufman love a movie called 01:48:10.920 --> 01:48:15.079 Ted, but it's, it's not, it's, it's, it's a, 01:48:15.159 --> 01:48:17.659 yeah, well, it's a different one than probably 01:48:17.659 --> 01:48:21.000 the one you're thinking of, but the, let's see, 01:48:21.039 --> 01:48:25.560 what's the latest one I saw. Have you seen that 01:48:25.560 --> 01:48:28.779 movie weapons? It's a, it's kind of like a horror. 01:48:29.680 --> 01:48:32.420 Josh Brolin. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. He is in that. 01:48:32.439 --> 01:48:33.960 Yeah. I forgot about that. Yeah. That was a great 01:48:33.960 --> 01:48:35.840 movie. Like I like anything that's got original 01:48:35.840 --> 01:48:39.279 storytelling. Cause I feel like. the trend of, 01:48:39.279 --> 01:48:41.880 of like superhero movies and the flashiness and 01:48:41.880 --> 01:48:44.079 all that other stuff. And, you know, like I tried 01:48:44.079 --> 01:48:46.420 to watch a movie with my youngest son the other 01:48:46.420 --> 01:48:48.119 night, me and my wife turned it on phenomenon 01:48:48.119 --> 01:48:51.739 with John Travolta. Remember where he like sees 01:48:51.739 --> 01:48:54.779 a light and then he like, all of a sudden he's 01:48:54.779 --> 01:48:56.619 like super smart. And then he starts having like 01:48:56.619 --> 01:48:58.220 telepathy. And then at the end of the movie, 01:48:58.359 --> 01:49:02.140 spoiler alert, he ends up having a tumor, but 01:49:02.140 --> 01:49:04.720 it's just a, it's a written story. Just kind 01:49:04.720 --> 01:49:07.250 of, kind of that same thing where. this guy all 01:49:07.250 --> 01:49:10.109 of a sudden gets this gift out of nowhere and 01:49:10.109 --> 01:49:12.390 now he's just got this thirst for knowledge and 01:49:12.390 --> 01:49:14.789 and kind of how he navigates that whole story 01:49:14.789 --> 01:49:17.069 you ever seen that one or no i don't think i 01:49:17.069 --> 01:49:19.149 ever watched it i can see the the cover in my 01:49:19.149 --> 01:49:20.869 head but i don't think i ever watched it i'm 01:49:20.869 --> 01:49:24.489 gonna have to yeah but i mean nowadays like these 01:49:24.489 --> 01:49:27.170 kids they can't watch anything with like a story 01:49:27.170 --> 01:49:30.050 you know it's got to be all all flash pizzazz 01:49:30.050 --> 01:49:31.949 or whatever i'm like yeah you guys missed the 01:49:31.949 --> 01:49:34.420 missed the boat on the good movies like Shawshank 01:49:34.420 --> 01:49:36.539 Redemption was one of my all -time favorites 01:49:36.539 --> 01:49:39.380 when I was a kid. Yeah, it's amazing because 01:49:39.380 --> 01:49:41.680 I didn't realize Shawshank and Green Mile were 01:49:41.680 --> 01:49:45.600 both Stephen King stories. Really? Yeah, because 01:49:45.600 --> 01:49:48.600 I'm actually working with some guys with the 01:49:48.600 --> 01:49:50.800 show I'm developing at the moment and they're 01:49:50.800 --> 01:49:53.699 in the horror world. And there was another one 01:49:53.699 --> 01:49:56.140 recently. Oh my God, the name just fell out my 01:49:56.140 --> 01:49:58.619 head. But yeah, so that world, obviously they 01:49:58.619 --> 01:50:00.460 have their horror, but then there's also this 01:50:00.460 --> 01:50:03.619 really powerful kind of human. storytelling element 01:50:03.619 --> 01:50:06.699 to it as well so it's a pretty interesting kind 01:50:06.699 --> 01:50:09.619 of genre because yes you got your slasher but 01:50:09.619 --> 01:50:11.779 then every so often stephen king for example 01:50:11.779 --> 01:50:14.720 will put one of the most beautiful human stories 01:50:14.720 --> 01:50:19.960 ever ever written out on screen too yeah so speaking 01:50:19.960 --> 01:50:22.619 of like movies and stuff what's uh what's the 01:50:22.619 --> 01:50:25.359 latest with your project and how did that like 01:50:25.359 --> 01:50:27.140 whole thing come to fruition because i've been 01:50:27.140 --> 01:50:29.720 following it but you know i know i don't want 01:50:29.720 --> 01:50:32.329 you to have to put too much info out Yeah, I 01:50:32.329 --> 01:50:34.529 mean, basically, it's a television adaptation 01:50:34.529 --> 01:50:39.789 of Kinder, my book, my latest book, with the 01:50:39.789 --> 01:50:42.789 goal to, it's funny you mentioned 1984, because 01:50:42.789 --> 01:50:44.649 this is kind of what I've been saying, you know, 01:50:44.649 --> 01:50:47.369 that the way 1984 worked was obviously the screen 01:50:47.369 --> 01:50:49.750 was used to divide a nation, which, as you said, 01:50:49.890 --> 01:50:54.909 seems very 2025. What if you put hope and healing 01:50:54.909 --> 01:50:58.619 in every home, on every screen? So by using this 01:50:58.619 --> 01:51:00.239 story, and it'll be kind of like a standalone 01:51:00.239 --> 01:51:03.140 series, Band of Brothers type thing. There's 01:51:03.140 --> 01:51:05.699 another arm to it, which I'll talk more about 01:51:05.699 --> 01:51:08.000 as we get developed, but that's going to provide 01:51:08.000 --> 01:51:10.960 tools as well and kind of hopefully get rid of 01:51:10.960 --> 01:51:13.119 some shame and guilt so that people can actually 01:51:13.119 --> 01:51:16.680 literally start taking that first step. But yeah, 01:51:16.779 --> 01:51:18.659 I mean, it all came from that whole phrase, if 01:51:18.659 --> 01:51:20.239 you want to change the world, start at home. 01:51:20.520 --> 01:51:22.920 You know, the IFF isn't going to change the world. 01:51:23.340 --> 01:51:25.260 The president is going to change the world. I 01:51:25.260 --> 01:51:27.800 know that because I've seen it. President's plural. 01:51:28.520 --> 01:51:31.020 So what can we do is you can literally get to 01:51:31.020 --> 01:51:33.720 the person. What can I do? What can I do then 01:51:33.720 --> 01:51:37.079 within my home to my partner, my children? And 01:51:37.079 --> 01:51:39.380 then what can I do to step outside my front door 01:51:39.380 --> 01:51:41.600 and be a mentor in my community and take the 01:51:41.600 --> 01:51:44.920 Dan Lennon from the bad route and take him into 01:51:44.920 --> 01:51:48.060 the good route? So that's the kind of grand thing, 01:51:48.159 --> 01:51:50.640 but I'm doing it very differently than Hollywood 01:51:50.640 --> 01:51:53.789 normally does. Normally, there's this whole fundraising 01:51:53.789 --> 01:51:56.010 thing, and then you bring actors and people on. 01:51:56.069 --> 01:51:57.909 I've done the opposite. I'm like, who was the 01:51:57.909 --> 01:52:00.270 right kind of soul to be part of this project? 01:52:00.609 --> 01:52:02.649 If I get enough of those people that don't even 01:52:02.649 --> 01:52:06.489 know what role, the money or anything, and then 01:52:06.489 --> 01:52:09.229 we go to the studio, and then obviously the funding 01:52:09.229 --> 01:52:11.619 will have to come. I think that you're going 01:52:11.619 --> 01:52:13.300 to have the right group of people that truly 01:52:13.300 --> 01:52:15.359 want to tell it for the right reason rather than 01:52:15.359 --> 01:52:18.239 just to make a profit, like you said. So that's 01:52:18.239 --> 01:52:20.619 the goal. Super early, you know, pre -production 01:52:20.619 --> 01:52:24.539 at the moment. But, you know, I'm just, to me, 01:52:24.560 --> 01:52:26.600 it's the only way that you can really make a 01:52:26.600 --> 01:52:28.960 dent is, you know, through the screen. And this 01:52:28.960 --> 01:52:31.859 is what my book was originally written for. I 01:52:31.859 --> 01:52:34.659 always had that in mind. But now a year later, 01:52:34.720 --> 01:52:37.239 and I've seen how deeply the book has hit people. 01:52:37.460 --> 01:52:39.579 Now I'm like, okay, it's time to pull the trigger. 01:52:40.670 --> 01:52:42.510 You know, there's some people in Hollywood that 01:52:42.510 --> 01:52:45.189 I'm kind of hoping are going to attach themselves 01:52:45.189 --> 01:52:46.949 to the project that would definitely give it 01:52:46.949 --> 01:52:49.329 more momentum. But I don't want to presume either. 01:52:49.449 --> 01:52:53.210 So we shall see. But but yeah, so so far, I've 01:52:53.210 --> 01:52:56.310 got about seven people from, you know, makeup 01:52:56.310 --> 01:52:58.489 and special effects through to stunts through 01:52:58.489 --> 01:53:02.090 to some of the actors. So we're kind of compiling 01:53:02.090 --> 01:53:05.289 it and morphing it. And hopefully it'll be one 01:53:05.289 --> 01:53:07.090 of those shows where people don't just hit stop 01:53:07.090 --> 01:53:09.140 and then go, well, that was good. but the next 01:53:09.140 --> 01:53:11.199 day the next week the next month the next year 01:53:11.199 --> 01:53:16.720 they're still talking about it so Yeah, it's 01:53:16.720 --> 01:53:18.560 planting those seeds. And if you ever need a 01:53:18.560 --> 01:53:21.720 stuntman, I'd be happy to lend my services free 01:53:21.720 --> 01:53:24.720 of charge. I appreciate it. Well, this is one 01:53:24.720 --> 01:53:28.020 of my funny little things down the road is, you 01:53:28.020 --> 01:53:30.640 know, you get like Jack Carr and he had a cameo 01:53:30.640 --> 01:53:34.060 in his show, Terminal List, where he was a bad 01:53:34.060 --> 01:53:36.760 guy and got shot in the car. I want to do a stunt 01:53:36.760 --> 01:53:39.399 cameo because normally writers aren't stuntmen 01:53:39.399 --> 01:53:42.180 too. i want to actually be in one of those probably 01:53:42.180 --> 01:53:45.079 the fire scenes where like oh that's james yeah 01:53:45.079 --> 01:53:50.819 yeah yeah you got to yeah absolutely it's cool 01:53:50.819 --> 01:53:52.979 it's cool seeing people that i've known over 01:53:52.979 --> 01:53:56.800 the years like do do bigger things that i think 01:53:56.800 --> 01:53:58.819 like none of us would ever known like it was 01:53:58.819 --> 01:54:01.000 even possible you know what i mean like watching 01:54:01.000 --> 01:54:04.220 like your progression from where you started 01:54:04.220 --> 01:54:07.159 to where you're at now it's it's just i hope 01:54:07.159 --> 01:54:09.100 other people that watch these things realize 01:54:09.100 --> 01:54:12.239 like if he can do it, you can do it. Whatever 01:54:12.239 --> 01:54:15.239 that other thing is, like just put yourself in 01:54:15.239 --> 01:54:17.880 that room. And then like you brought it up earlier 01:54:17.880 --> 01:54:20.960 where it's like, if all you ever do is sit at 01:54:20.960 --> 01:54:22.819 that kitchen table at the fire department and 01:54:22.819 --> 01:54:24.939 you don't venture out and meet other people outside 01:54:24.939 --> 01:54:27.319 of that circle. And I'm not saying it's a bad 01:54:27.319 --> 01:54:28.979 thing, but that's all you're ever going to do. 01:54:29.119 --> 01:54:31.520 And I feel like there's so much life that we 01:54:31.520 --> 01:54:34.420 have, like try some different things. Don't have 01:54:34.420 --> 01:54:36.600 regrets later on and sitting around at the firehouse, 01:54:36.659 --> 01:54:38.899 watching the same bullshit on TV, like go out 01:54:38.899 --> 01:54:41.899 there and. and and chase it you know it doesn't 01:54:41.899 --> 01:54:43.739 it doesn't take much and in the beginning yeah 01:54:43.739 --> 01:54:45.939 you gotta you gotta get going but any boulder 01:54:45.939 --> 01:54:47.859 you're pushing up a mountain is gonna be rough 01:54:47.859 --> 01:54:50.060 at first but once you reach reach that top and 01:54:50.060 --> 01:54:52.659 you push it over and it starts rolling down everything 01:54:52.659 --> 01:54:55.180 changes and it changes fast you know that's what 01:54:55.180 --> 01:54:58.279 i want for everybody 100 yeah i was just talking 01:54:58.279 --> 01:55:00.800 to someone actually jeff cool um one of the survivors 01:55:00.800 --> 01:55:02.979 of the black sunday fire and fdmy and we were 01:55:02.979 --> 01:55:05.939 just talking he's coming on the show um but you 01:55:05.939 --> 01:55:09.250 know this podcast has taken me to meet so many 01:55:09.250 --> 01:55:11.670 people of all walks of life. I mean, firefighters 01:55:11.670 --> 01:55:13.630 from different departments all the way through 01:55:13.630 --> 01:55:17.810 to neuroscientists and Navy SEALs and prison 01:55:17.810 --> 01:55:20.350 governors from Norway and educators from Finland 01:55:20.350 --> 01:55:23.630 and you name it. But you're so far out the echo 01:55:23.630 --> 01:55:25.569 chamber that you realize like, oh my God, there 01:55:25.569 --> 01:55:28.149 are solutions to all these things. But if I just 01:55:28.149 --> 01:55:30.789 stayed in the firehouse table, maybe I'd be a 01:55:30.789 --> 01:55:32.529 little better with a halogen or tying knots, 01:55:32.630 --> 01:55:35.760 but I'm not looking at the macro. So this is 01:55:35.760 --> 01:55:37.979 what I would say for people is just get outside 01:55:37.979 --> 01:55:40.159 that echo chamber, whether it's political, whether 01:55:40.159 --> 01:55:43.579 it's the job, whatever it is, be proud, keep 01:55:43.579 --> 01:55:46.520 that as one of the notches in your belt. But 01:55:46.520 --> 01:55:48.359 the moment you start really kind of breaking 01:55:48.359 --> 01:55:51.380 down those walls, you realize there's an entire 01:55:51.380 --> 01:55:54.479 world out there that for us, and this is, I think, 01:55:54.500 --> 01:55:56.520 one of the problems with us critically thinking, 01:55:56.640 --> 01:55:59.220 which is why I literally get people, some people 01:55:59.220 --> 01:56:02.319 pushing back saying, I'd rather do a 4896 than 01:56:02.319 --> 01:56:05.449 a 2472. which is literally saying I'd rather 01:56:05.449 --> 01:56:08.590 work 56 hours away from my family than 42. But 01:56:08.590 --> 01:56:10.670 it's because they're so sleep deprived. They 01:56:10.670 --> 01:56:12.770 can't critically think. They can't even comprehend 01:56:12.770 --> 01:56:15.869 common sense anymore because it's dogma. It's 01:56:15.869 --> 01:56:18.930 just so ingrained. But like you said, by pushing 01:56:18.930 --> 01:56:22.369 those walls down and then hopefully this 24 -72 01:56:22.369 --> 01:56:25.550 revolution that's happened, really reframing 01:56:25.550 --> 01:56:28.810 that, when we have healthier, happier firefighters. 01:56:29.659 --> 01:56:32.000 then you're going to believe that you can do 01:56:32.000 --> 01:56:33.960 some of these other things. And then that's, 01:56:33.960 --> 01:56:38.060 like you said, it's a snowball effect then. And 01:56:38.060 --> 01:56:40.399 then you as a person are going to grow and your 01:56:40.399 --> 01:56:42.819 family and your kids are going to benefit from 01:56:42.819 --> 01:56:45.380 that too. And then so is the fire service, because 01:56:45.380 --> 01:56:47.220 now we're going to have the humility to actually 01:56:47.220 --> 01:56:50.979 be open to new ideas. And again, the rising tide 01:56:50.979 --> 01:56:54.840 lifts all ships. Yeah. And I mean, if I look 01:56:54.840 --> 01:56:57.720 back at my own career, one of my biggest regrets 01:56:57.720 --> 01:57:01.840 is, I put too much time in the department and 01:57:01.840 --> 01:57:04.880 miss some time with my family. Whereas now I 01:57:04.880 --> 01:57:06.720 look at my kids, especially with my son being 01:57:06.720 --> 01:57:10.420 18, I'm glad I caught myself when I did, you 01:57:10.420 --> 01:57:11.920 know what I mean? So if there's anybody out there 01:57:11.920 --> 01:57:14.159 who's crushing the overtime and chasing that 01:57:14.159 --> 01:57:17.479 bag and, you know, like just focused on the now, 01:57:17.560 --> 01:57:19.760 which, which I get it, man. Like it's, it's tough. 01:57:19.859 --> 01:57:21.600 Like when you're not making what you need to 01:57:21.600 --> 01:57:23.479 make to maintain, you know, what's going on, 01:57:23.500 --> 01:57:27.319 especially now, just remember that all that stuff's 01:57:27.319 --> 01:57:29.920 temporary. But so is your kid's childhood. You 01:57:29.920 --> 01:57:31.640 know what I mean? And I think that's why you 01:57:31.640 --> 01:57:34.159 see the divorce rates in our industry go up is 01:57:34.159 --> 01:57:37.300 if you're not home, then how are you maintaining 01:57:37.300 --> 01:57:39.699 that relationship at home? You know, like, how 01:57:39.699 --> 01:57:44.479 are you? I'll never in my life when I retire 01:57:44.479 --> 01:57:47.079 say, man, I'm so glad I worked all that overtime. 01:57:47.859 --> 01:57:51.439 Nope. Never, never. You know, but like now when 01:57:51.439 --> 01:57:53.140 I retire, I'm going to be like, I am so glad. 01:57:53.640 --> 01:57:56.659 that I spent as much time possible at home with 01:57:56.659 --> 01:57:58.560 my kids. And even though I had to go to work 01:57:58.560 --> 01:58:01.579 and honestly, my wife likes it because I'm only 01:58:01.579 --> 01:58:03.420 gone 10 days a month. It gives her her break. 01:58:03.539 --> 01:58:06.039 She likes her break when I'm gone for 24 hours, 01:58:06.079 --> 01:58:08.119 gives her a chance to miss me. But then I'm home, 01:58:08.220 --> 01:58:11.640 you know, whereas before I was always gone, you 01:58:11.640 --> 01:58:14.760 know, and that's that's a hard way to raise a 01:58:14.760 --> 01:58:17.180 family and not be around your loved ones, you 01:58:17.180 --> 01:58:19.949 know. Well, you think about as well, what's one 01:58:19.949 --> 01:58:22.289 of the things that you hear when we lose someone 01:58:22.289 --> 01:58:25.149 to suicide? Oh, they were going through a divorce. 01:58:25.470 --> 01:58:28.630 So they blame the relationship. Well, why were 01:58:28.630 --> 01:58:31.250 they going through a divorce? I know so many 01:58:31.250 --> 01:58:33.289 firefighters that were head over heels in love 01:58:33.289 --> 01:58:34.710 with their wives, because these are men that 01:58:34.710 --> 01:58:37.649 I'm thinking of, that I've watched it deteriorate 01:58:37.649 --> 01:58:40.329 and they're heartbroken about it. So, you know, 01:58:40.369 --> 01:58:42.989 the divorce isn't separate from the fire service. 01:58:43.010 --> 01:58:44.850 If you're mandoed all the time and you're working 01:58:44.850 --> 01:58:48.050 80 hours a week, that's destroying your family. 01:58:48.399 --> 01:58:50.140 Because you are literally not there. When you've 01:58:50.140 --> 01:58:53.319 got a kid waiting for you to come home, and I 01:58:53.319 --> 01:58:55.199 try and share those homecoming videos all the 01:58:55.199 --> 01:58:57.819 time to remind us, this is how excited our children 01:58:57.819 --> 01:59:00.500 are for us to walk through the door. And then 01:59:00.500 --> 01:59:02.699 mom or dad has to tell them, hey, they're not 01:59:02.699 --> 01:59:06.079 coming home now. I mean, that's devastating for 01:59:06.079 --> 01:59:09.300 a kid. So that's why it's so important that we 01:59:09.300 --> 01:59:11.760 get away from, again, the money, which you can, 01:59:11.840 --> 01:59:13.960 A, you get more of an hourly rate when you go 01:59:13.960 --> 01:59:16.579 to a 42 -hour workweek anyway, and B, If you 01:59:16.579 --> 01:59:19.279 do a side project, then you get home in your 01:59:19.279 --> 01:59:21.140 own bed every evening. So the money is there 01:59:21.140 --> 01:59:24.079 regardless. But I always say the currency is 01:59:24.079 --> 01:59:26.399 in the time with your children because you'll 01:59:26.399 --> 01:59:30.760 never, ever get that back. Yeah. And I mean, 01:59:30.779 --> 01:59:32.479 that's the beauty of when you actually own your 01:59:32.479 --> 01:59:35.579 own business is you get to set your schedule, 01:59:35.680 --> 01:59:39.899 right? I don't work every third day. Well, my 01:59:39.899 --> 01:59:42.340 business, I work on it when I can. And if I need 01:59:42.340 --> 01:59:43.899 to take a break and I need to go pick the kids 01:59:43.899 --> 01:59:46.100 up or I need to have breakfast or I want to go 01:59:46.100 --> 01:59:49.000 to the gym or whatever, it's my time. You know, 01:59:49.060 --> 01:59:53.439 I set my schedule how I want to. And it's I think 01:59:53.439 --> 01:59:55.159 it's hard for people who don't know that life 01:59:55.159 --> 01:59:58.680 yet, because if all you've ever known is the 01:59:58.680 --> 02:00:02.140 fire department schedule, that it's hard to it's 02:00:02.140 --> 02:00:05.500 hard to break free of that matrix, so to speak. 02:00:05.960 --> 02:00:08.359 But once you know it, then you're like, I'm never 02:00:08.359 --> 02:00:10.739 going back to that. Because I never will. I mean, 02:00:10.760 --> 02:00:13.039 obviously, I know I could get mandatory, you 02:00:13.039 --> 02:00:14.939 know, coming off shift. You got to work holidays 02:00:14.939 --> 02:00:18.819 sometimes. I knew that all going in. But it's 02:00:18.819 --> 02:00:22.060 not sustainable for a career to work that much 02:00:22.060 --> 02:00:26.619 overtime and walk out in a healthy fashion. Most 02:00:26.619 --> 02:00:28.399 of the guys I know that work like that, that 02:00:28.399 --> 02:00:30.850 leave. Now they're going to get healthy. Now 02:00:30.850 --> 02:00:32.289 they're going to get double knee replacement 02:00:32.289 --> 02:00:34.390 surgeries. Now they're going to start doing this 02:00:34.390 --> 02:00:36.369 other stuff. And it's like, why not prepare yourself 02:00:36.369 --> 02:00:38.770 so you can run out of this place when you retire? 02:00:39.069 --> 02:00:41.470 It's a great job. But I mean, like, you're not 02:00:41.470 --> 02:00:44.430 supposed to be doing field work in your late 02:00:44.430 --> 02:00:46.710 50s, you know, and there's guys that have done 02:00:46.710 --> 02:00:49.250 it and they and, you know, kudos to them. But 02:00:49.250 --> 02:00:52.869 the bulk of the population, no way. It's not 02:00:52.869 --> 02:00:55.390 sustainable. And I don't want to be one of those 02:00:55.390 --> 02:00:57.310 guys that retires and then five years later, 02:00:57.369 --> 02:01:00.250 I'm dead. Yeah, which is a universal observation. 02:01:00.369 --> 02:01:03.810 There's no like study because again, sadly, we 02:01:03.810 --> 02:01:06.529 don't count our retirees. So when we have these 02:01:06.529 --> 02:01:08.489 supposed, this is how many firefighters die, 02:01:08.569 --> 02:01:11.229 it's like bullshit. Think about all the retirees 02:01:11.229 --> 02:01:14.750 that we lose 5, 10, 15, 20 years too soon after 02:01:14.750 --> 02:01:17.789 they retire. There's no statistic whatsoever. 02:01:18.550 --> 02:01:20.590 But this is the thing that we have, no matter 02:01:20.590 --> 02:01:24.159 where you are in the country, they all say. five 02:01:24.159 --> 02:01:26.859 years after retirement. So clearly then if, you 02:01:26.859 --> 02:01:28.920 know, North, South, East, West, Central, they're 02:01:28.920 --> 02:01:31.439 all observing the same thing that that is a reality. 02:01:31.779 --> 02:01:34.619 And so you do your five, eight year drop and 02:01:34.619 --> 02:01:36.659 then you do drop right after. And what was the 02:01:36.659 --> 02:01:38.680 point of trying to get that, you know, highest 02:01:38.680 --> 02:01:40.319 three or whatever it was that you're doing all 02:01:40.319 --> 02:01:42.260 this extra work if you're just simply then going 02:01:42.260 --> 02:01:44.680 to pass away, you know, one, two, three, five 02:01:44.680 --> 02:01:47.239 years later. So it is an important part of the 02:01:47.239 --> 02:01:50.960 conversation. Yeah. And I got tired of this. 02:01:51.869 --> 02:01:55.149 this thing I created in my mind of one day I'll 02:01:55.149 --> 02:01:57.489 get to that one day I'll you know when I retire 02:01:57.489 --> 02:01:59.649 I can do all these things you know traveling 02:01:59.649 --> 02:02:01.449 and all this other shit you know and I'm like 02:02:01.449 --> 02:02:05.390 why why wait you know I could drop dead tomorrow 02:02:05.390 --> 02:02:07.890 you know I thought about guys like Carl and you 02:02:07.890 --> 02:02:09.430 know people that I've known that's passed away 02:02:09.430 --> 02:02:12.109 over the years and it's like you don't have forever 02:02:12.109 --> 02:02:14.189 you know we all think you know you know it's 02:02:14.189 --> 02:02:15.890 sad that happened to that guy but it won't happen 02:02:15.890 --> 02:02:18.359 to me the shit that won't, it could happen to 02:02:18.359 --> 02:02:20.760 any single one of us, you know? So that's why 02:02:20.760 --> 02:02:22.619 like taking care of yourself earlier in your 02:02:22.619 --> 02:02:24.359 career and maintaining that healthy lifestyle 02:02:24.359 --> 02:02:26.859 is important. But I mean, you could be on a call 02:02:26.859 --> 02:02:29.439 and on the highway and some assholes not paying 02:02:29.439 --> 02:02:31.319 attention goes around the engine and then smack, 02:02:31.579 --> 02:02:34.300 you know, happened to Chad Lowry. Thank God he 02:02:34.300 --> 02:02:36.439 didn't die. But you know, I mean, that could 02:02:36.439 --> 02:02:38.119 happen to any single one of us. So it's like, 02:02:38.119 --> 02:02:41.300 don't take those moments to, to be home, be present, 02:02:41.319 --> 02:02:43.689 be with your family. Don't wait till the end 02:02:43.689 --> 02:02:44.930 of your career thinking you're going to have 02:02:44.930 --> 02:02:46.869 all this time and then poof, something happens. 02:02:47.850 --> 02:02:50.630 Exactly. Well, a couple more closing questions. 02:02:50.729 --> 02:02:52.989 The first one, is there a person that you'd recommend 02:02:52.989 --> 02:02:56.350 to come on this podcast as a guest to speak to 02:02:56.350 --> 02:02:58.329 the first responders, military, and associated 02:02:58.329 --> 02:03:04.229 professions of the world? Ooh, let's see. Have 02:03:04.229 --> 02:03:06.909 you had Jamal on yet or no? I haven't actually, 02:03:07.010 --> 02:03:08.569 but he's another one I should. Yeah, I mean, 02:03:08.609 --> 02:03:12.840 he did so much even when I was there. Yeah, him. 02:03:14.539 --> 02:03:17.359 Honestly, my first lieutenant, Steve Kleiman. 02:03:17.500 --> 02:03:20.300 I don't know if you remember him. I do. Yeah, 02:03:20.420 --> 02:03:23.319 I actually had him. Oh, I think he was one of 02:03:23.319 --> 02:03:25.380 our instructors actually in the academy. Yeah, 02:03:25.439 --> 02:03:26.680 I think he's one of the lead boys. Yeah, he was 02:03:26.680 --> 02:03:30.979 mine. And then honestly, when I got hired, I 02:03:30.979 --> 02:03:34.699 was 24. He's probably a little closer to my dad's 02:03:34.699 --> 02:03:37.359 age. So it was kind of that. you know father 02:03:37.359 --> 02:03:39.600 figure but wasn't your father type thing and 02:03:39.600 --> 02:03:41.399 then also would kind of tell you the things you 02:03:41.399 --> 02:03:43.960 didn't need that you needed to hear but you know 02:03:43.960 --> 02:03:45.560 maybe your dad didn't have the heart to tell 02:03:45.560 --> 02:03:49.659 you um not a not a roughneck guy like very understanding 02:03:49.659 --> 02:03:52.579 like there was a kid that we had transferred 02:03:52.579 --> 02:03:54.479 to our station and he was known as a fucking 02:03:54.479 --> 02:03:58.060 turd right and climbing being the guy he was 02:03:58.060 --> 02:03:59.979 he's like i'm gonna give this guy an honest shot 02:03:59.979 --> 02:04:04.439 and so you know this guy like physically Couldn't 02:04:04.439 --> 02:04:06.460 force a door. Like, there's a lot of things this 02:04:06.460 --> 02:04:08.899 guy was lacking. Not a bad person, just, you 02:04:08.899 --> 02:04:10.220 know, one of the guys would say, I was a shitty 02:04:10.220 --> 02:04:14.279 fireman. But Kleinman gave this guy every opportunity, 02:04:14.560 --> 02:04:16.819 worked with him day and night, like, tried to 02:04:16.819 --> 02:04:19.960 do everything for him. And when Kleinman was 02:04:19.960 --> 02:04:21.560 getting ready to transfer out, it just happened 02:04:21.560 --> 02:04:23.720 that he had to actually write this guy up that 02:04:23.720 --> 02:04:25.560 same day, his last shift, he was working at the 02:04:25.560 --> 02:04:28.380 station. So Kleinman said, you know, he wrote 02:04:28.380 --> 02:04:30.920 him up, and the kid, you know, took the write 02:04:30.920 --> 02:04:33.319 -up, and he goes, hey, LT, I just want to tell 02:04:33.319 --> 02:04:35.720 you, I really appreciate you taking the time 02:04:35.720 --> 02:04:38.800 to coach me and mentor me because nobody else 02:04:38.800 --> 02:04:40.520 has ever done that for me since I've been here. 02:04:41.100 --> 02:04:43.960 So to me, it just kind of spoke volumes to the 02:04:43.960 --> 02:04:46.640 type of person he was. And there's some people 02:04:46.640 --> 02:04:48.800 like there's a few things that happened along 02:04:48.800 --> 02:04:52.479 the way, closer to his retirement with some other 02:04:52.479 --> 02:04:54.260 guys that I'm friends with here in the department. 02:04:54.899 --> 02:04:57.960 And the one thing that I know about him is that 02:04:57.960 --> 02:05:01.489 he is somebody that would. do the right thing 02:05:01.489 --> 02:05:03.890 if it didn't benefit him because it was the right 02:05:03.890 --> 02:05:06.930 thing to do and it's that's a very rare thing 02:05:06.930 --> 02:05:09.390 you know most of the time if somebody is going 02:05:09.390 --> 02:05:11.609 to lose something out of their own self -interest 02:05:11.609 --> 02:05:13.569 then normally they're not going to kind of you 02:05:13.569 --> 02:05:15.369 know put themselves on the cross so to speak 02:05:15.369 --> 02:05:18.069 but climate is that guy that he would no matter 02:05:18.069 --> 02:05:19.869 what do the right thing even if he wasn't going 02:05:19.869 --> 02:05:21.489 to benefit from it or if it was even going to 02:05:21.489 --> 02:05:25.250 hurt him yeah absolutely no i liked him a lot 02:05:25.250 --> 02:05:27.090 i've actually worked i forget the name of the 02:05:27.090 --> 02:05:30.840 station it's right It right against the turnpike 02:05:30.840 --> 02:05:32.859 as you go in South into Orlando, it's on the 02:05:32.859 --> 02:05:35.979 right there. And I remember floating there. I 02:05:35.979 --> 02:05:38.720 think it was. Yeah. I think he was there when 02:05:38.720 --> 02:05:42.159 I was there. So yeah. Brilliant. All right. Well 02:05:42.159 --> 02:05:43.880 then the last question before we make sure everyone 02:05:43.880 --> 02:05:46.100 knows where to find you. And of course the first 02:05:46.100 --> 02:05:48.979 responder realtor, what do you do to decompress? 02:05:51.520 --> 02:05:54.460 Uh, so definitely getting home and go to the 02:05:54.460 --> 02:05:56.819 gym first thing. Like that's even before I go 02:05:56.819 --> 02:05:59.899 to shift, like I start off, I wake up at my house 02:05:59.899 --> 02:06:02.600 and delay it about four 30, you know, kind of 02:06:02.600 --> 02:06:05.260 roll out of bed, get my thing going, get to the 02:06:05.260 --> 02:06:08.380 station by six, get my workout in. Cause for 02:06:08.380 --> 02:06:10.359 me, it's like, if that's hanging over my head, 02:06:10.439 --> 02:06:11.979 like middle of the day, and then we start getting 02:06:11.979 --> 02:06:14.600 busy, it like drives me nuts. Like I'm like, 02:06:14.640 --> 02:06:16.899 I got to get a workout in. And so that's always 02:06:16.899 --> 02:06:20.689 like, like number one. And then. I don't know, 02:06:20.710 --> 02:06:22.250 maybe it's because I'm getting older, but I like 02:06:22.250 --> 02:06:24.789 doing gardening. I don't know how that started, 02:06:24.930 --> 02:06:27.050 but like yard work, gardening, like I've got 02:06:27.050 --> 02:06:29.949 a whole thing on the side of my house and really 02:06:29.949 --> 02:06:32.489 just spending time with my family. I know it 02:06:32.489 --> 02:06:35.930 sounds like a cliche, you know, answer, but it's 02:06:35.930 --> 02:06:38.569 just doing things. Yeah, doing things that are 02:06:38.569 --> 02:06:40.510 not involved with the fire department that just 02:06:40.510 --> 02:06:43.149 make you happy. Like, I love the fact that I'm 02:06:43.149 --> 02:06:45.470 able to go pick my son up at school. you know 02:06:45.470 --> 02:06:48.770 and be home at for dinner time and do a family 02:06:48.770 --> 02:06:51.649 game night and play yahtzee or you know watch 02:06:51.649 --> 02:06:53.729 something with them you know just whatever but 02:06:53.729 --> 02:06:57.210 and like it's funny because my kids like i'm 02:06:57.210 --> 02:07:00.109 i'm pretty loose with the way i talk so it's 02:07:00.109 --> 02:07:02.850 like we have a lot of like jokes and we scare 02:07:02.850 --> 02:07:05.149 each other and we do all that stuff so it's just 02:07:05.149 --> 02:07:06.970 like our house is full of laughter all the time 02:07:06.970 --> 02:07:08.729 and that's that's the thing i enjoy the most 02:07:08.729 --> 02:07:11.550 is in a way it's almost like the firehouse where 02:07:11.550 --> 02:07:14.579 we goof around and we have a good time And without 02:07:14.579 --> 02:07:16.539 all the call volume. So it's like, I try and 02:07:16.539 --> 02:07:19.659 keep, try and keep the firehouse. Like I treat 02:07:19.659 --> 02:07:21.600 my own house, you know, I just have a good time 02:07:21.600 --> 02:07:25.819 and, and keep it light. Beautiful. Well, for 02:07:25.819 --> 02:07:27.739 people listening, if they want to reach out to 02:07:27.739 --> 02:07:30.159 you personally or find you on social media, and 02:07:30.159 --> 02:07:32.020 then the same with the realty side, where are 02:07:32.020 --> 02:07:35.680 the best places to find you? Yeah. So Facebook, 02:07:35.760 --> 02:07:38.359 you can find me on there. Daniel Lennon. Instagram 02:07:38.359 --> 02:07:40.680 is probably the best way. It's at Daniel Lennon 02:07:40.680 --> 02:07:45.970 realtor at underscore. At Dan underscore Lennon 02:07:45.970 --> 02:07:50.010 underscore realtor. And then TikTok. And I don't 02:07:50.010 --> 02:07:51.949 think my MySpace is active anymore, unfortunately. 02:07:52.109 --> 02:07:54.989 Sorry. And do you have a website? Or is it best 02:07:54.989 --> 02:07:57.989 placed just through social media? Social media 02:07:57.989 --> 02:08:00.149 has all the tags on there and stuff like that. 02:08:00.270 --> 02:08:02.029 Yeah, it's pretty easy. And if there's anybody 02:08:02.029 --> 02:08:04.689 interested in actually learning how to get your 02:08:04.689 --> 02:08:06.289 real estate license, because I'm starting to 02:08:06.289 --> 02:08:08.729 kind of step into a role of, you know, especially 02:08:08.729 --> 02:08:11.489 first responders. Help the community that you 02:08:11.489 --> 02:08:14.949 serve. If you go to partnerwithdanlennon .com, 02:08:15.170 --> 02:08:17.310 you can find me on there and there's some videos 02:08:17.310 --> 02:08:20.050 you can watch. And there's no charges or anything 02:08:20.050 --> 02:08:25.529 like that. My goal is to almost continue to build 02:08:25.529 --> 02:08:28.250 this real estate business that I'm starting on 02:08:28.250 --> 02:08:31.270 and build a team of people where our primary 02:08:31.270 --> 02:08:35.670 focus is first responders, veterans, teachers, 02:08:36.069 --> 02:08:38.289 nurses, like all the people, all the helpers 02:08:38.289 --> 02:08:40.779 that are in the community. let's be the ones 02:08:40.779 --> 02:08:43.380 that kind of help them and the goal is not through 02:08:43.380 --> 02:08:46.380 profit because you know you're gonna make money 02:08:46.380 --> 02:08:49.520 selling a house but i'm a big advocate of if 02:08:49.520 --> 02:08:52.609 i can i know what it takes to make you know $5 02:08:52.609 --> 02:08:54.489 ,000 in the fire department working overtime. 02:08:54.829 --> 02:08:56.930 So if I sell a house and I can give you a little 02:08:56.930 --> 02:08:59.189 extra money to close on it, I'm perfectly fine 02:08:59.189 --> 02:09:01.090 with that. I can't look at somebody in the face 02:09:01.090 --> 02:09:03.270 and go, hey man, sorry, you got to go to rescue 02:09:03.270 --> 02:09:06.470 42 so I can get my extra commission that this 02:09:06.470 --> 02:09:08.750 other person's not going to pay me. So it's nice 02:09:08.750 --> 02:09:12.149 that I have the insulation of having that ability 02:09:12.149 --> 02:09:14.569 to help people to where they're able to achieve 02:09:14.569 --> 02:09:17.970 the dream of home ownership and not have to pay 02:09:17.970 --> 02:09:20.289 an arm and a leg for it, especially in today's 02:09:20.289 --> 02:09:23.619 market. Beautiful. Well, speaking of that, I 02:09:23.619 --> 02:09:25.199 was going to close out one quick question because 02:09:25.199 --> 02:09:28.680 I'm here in Ocala, where again, Marion County 02:09:28.680 --> 02:09:30.539 supposedly don't have the money for extra firefighters, 02:09:30.619 --> 02:09:33.899 but our county has exploded and there are literally 02:09:33.899 --> 02:09:36.920 housing developments and apartment complex going 02:09:36.920 --> 02:09:40.340 up every single corner. So again, how we have 02:09:40.340 --> 02:09:42.640 no money, I'm no mathematician, but it doesn't 02:09:42.640 --> 02:09:45.079 make any fucking sense to me. That being said. 02:09:45.739 --> 02:09:48.039 What kind of market is it now? Because it seems 02:09:48.039 --> 02:09:50.380 like there's a danger of saturation with so many 02:09:50.380 --> 02:09:54.939 things being built at the moment. So there's 02:09:54.939 --> 02:09:56.960 two stats that you always look at or see on the 02:09:56.960 --> 02:09:59.460 internet, right? They'll say housing inventory 02:09:59.460 --> 02:10:02.140 is at this thing, but it's a nationwide thing. 02:10:02.220 --> 02:10:04.140 So you really have to get with the local realtor 02:10:04.140 --> 02:10:06.739 to look at all that. Now, with that said, inventory 02:10:06.739 --> 02:10:09.739 is higher because with the influx of people moving 02:10:09.739 --> 02:10:13.640 to Florida. the builders started building like 02:10:13.640 --> 02:10:16.039 crazy. And then obviously with the COVID stuff, 02:10:16.159 --> 02:10:18.699 it drove the prices up. So over the next couple 02:10:18.699 --> 02:10:21.380 of years, I wouldn't be surprised if prices stay 02:10:21.380 --> 02:10:24.659 kind of flat. You're getting a lot of people 02:10:24.659 --> 02:10:27.579 now who were waiting for interest rates to drop 02:10:27.579 --> 02:10:30.039 before they sell their house and move. Now they're 02:10:30.039 --> 02:10:31.880 just tired of waiting and realizing that the 02:10:31.880 --> 02:10:35.239 1 % interest rates are never coming back. And 02:10:35.239 --> 02:10:38.119 we're actually where we're supposed to be. Historically 02:10:38.119 --> 02:10:41.420 speaking, 6%. is pretty much what like the average 02:10:41.420 --> 02:10:43.659 has been over the course of you know since they've 02:10:43.659 --> 02:10:46.560 been tracking mortgage rates so you have people 02:10:46.560 --> 02:10:48.880 who are listing their house it's sitting on the 02:10:48.880 --> 02:10:50.920 market you know longer than they normally would 02:10:50.920 --> 02:10:52.560 now like volusia county i think we're at like 02:10:52.560 --> 02:10:55.699 70 days on market and what happens is is that 02:10:55.699 --> 02:10:57.899 they end up doing price reductions because if 02:10:57.899 --> 02:10:59.399 they've had this house for 10 years they've got 02:10:59.399 --> 02:11:01.729 equity So when you have price reductions now 02:11:01.729 --> 02:11:05.250 going below what the normal line is for what 02:11:05.250 --> 02:11:08.010 the property values are in that area, that comparable 02:11:08.010 --> 02:11:11.149 drags everybody else's value down. And so that's 02:11:11.149 --> 02:11:12.590 why you're kind of seeing this little bit of 02:11:12.590 --> 02:11:15.510 a correction. But with COVID, you kind of got 02:11:15.510 --> 02:11:18.109 a hyperinflation in a lot of ways because all 02:11:18.109 --> 02:11:20.170 of a sudden interest rates bottomed out. And 02:11:20.170 --> 02:11:21.970 then you had these investors picking these houses 02:11:21.970 --> 02:11:25.130 up left and right with 1%. A DSCR loan, which 02:11:25.130 --> 02:11:26.489 is an investor loan, you were getting them at 02:11:26.489 --> 02:11:29.970 3 % or 4%. So I think you'll see a correction, 02:11:30.109 --> 02:11:31.409 but I don't think you're going to see a real 02:11:31.409 --> 02:11:35.069 estate crash just because what led to the housing 02:11:35.069 --> 02:11:38.550 crisis and the crash back in 2008 is not what's 02:11:38.550 --> 02:11:40.710 going on today. What happened then was subprime 02:11:40.710 --> 02:11:43.430 lending. You had people who had no income verification 02:11:43.430 --> 02:11:46.010 that really should have never qualified for a 02:11:46.010 --> 02:11:48.449 loan, and they were getting... And they were 02:11:48.449 --> 02:11:51.130 incentivizing lenders to just pump loans out. 02:11:51.270 --> 02:11:53.270 And so what would you get is you'd have somebody 02:11:53.270 --> 02:11:55.550 who didn't have a job or, you know, a low paying 02:11:55.550 --> 02:11:58.710 job who are qualifying for a $400 ,000 house. 02:11:58.869 --> 02:12:01.810 But year one, their interest rate was 1%. And 02:12:01.810 --> 02:12:04.229 then by year five, it would balloon to, you know, 02:12:04.250 --> 02:12:08.270 10%. And when the economic crisis started picking 02:12:08.270 --> 02:12:10.329 up and everything started crashing, all these 02:12:10.329 --> 02:12:12.090 people couldn't offload these houses. And then 02:12:12.090 --> 02:12:14.189 you had this huge inventory dump and the banks 02:12:14.189 --> 02:12:17.220 failed. That's not what's going on now. Now you 02:12:17.220 --> 02:12:20.020 just have builders who are building and building 02:12:20.020 --> 02:12:22.279 and building. And with all the existing houses 02:12:22.279 --> 02:12:24.579 on the market as well, you're seeing a stall. 02:12:24.760 --> 02:12:26.460 So if you're a home buyer, this is actually a 02:12:26.460 --> 02:12:29.180 great time to buy because you can get all your 02:12:29.180 --> 02:12:31.920 closing costs covered. And in a lot of these 02:12:31.920 --> 02:12:33.899 new construction developments, I've been able 02:12:33.899 --> 02:12:36.319 to negotiate people getting 3 .99 % interest 02:12:36.319 --> 02:12:37.840 rates because the builders are going to Wall 02:12:37.840 --> 02:12:39.800 Street and they're buying the mortgage rates 02:12:39.800 --> 02:12:44.950 down for their houses. Interesting. beautiful 02:12:44.950 --> 02:12:48.149 let's make it very competitive yeah yeah because 02:12:48.149 --> 02:12:50.170 it is interesting i'm not it's not my world at 02:12:50.170 --> 02:12:53.489 all i actually bought a foreclosed home one before 02:12:53.489 --> 02:12:56.689 this one um and uh you know that was after the 02:12:56.689 --> 02:12:58.289 crash so i got it for a good amount and then 02:12:58.289 --> 02:13:01.109 when i before that i was in california and pre 02:13:01.109 --> 02:13:03.489 -crash like they were they were telling me i 02:13:03.489 --> 02:13:05.310 got to get on on the property ladder i'm like 02:13:05.310 --> 02:13:06.890 you've lost your mind like some of my friends 02:13:06.890 --> 02:13:10.229 had a 1950s 800 square foot house and they were 02:13:10.229 --> 02:13:12.470 paying seven hundred thousand dollars for it 02:13:12.829 --> 02:13:14.989 And I'm like, there's no way, no way. I'm going 02:13:14.989 --> 02:13:16.369 to, I'm going to rent. I'm going to wait. And 02:13:16.369 --> 02:13:18.930 then sadly, you know, obviously what happened, 02:13:18.970 --> 02:13:21.350 thank God I did. But, but yeah, but now you're 02:13:21.350 --> 02:13:24.729 seeing the, the amount of inventory that's going 02:13:24.729 --> 02:13:26.750 up in Marion County here. It just, it was, I 02:13:26.750 --> 02:13:28.850 was kind of wondering if it was going to saturate. 02:13:28.930 --> 02:13:30.569 So, but that's, that's encouraging to hear. Okay. 02:13:30.630 --> 02:13:32.289 If there's, there's more houses, but there's 02:13:32.289 --> 02:13:33.930 not going to be a crash. And hopefully that will 02:13:33.930 --> 02:13:38.130 put some of the fears at ease then. I mean, if 02:13:38.130 --> 02:13:39.930 there's a crash, it won't be because of what 02:13:39.930 --> 02:13:43.060 happened in 2008, but. I mean, depending on what 02:13:43.060 --> 02:13:44.600 happens in New York, I wouldn't be surprised 02:13:44.600 --> 02:13:46.779 if we continue to see a lot of people relocating 02:13:46.779 --> 02:13:49.680 down there. Just because with the cost of living 02:13:49.680 --> 02:13:51.560 there, the taxes. And I mean, I have friends 02:13:51.560 --> 02:13:54.199 that are up there that are retiring and their 02:13:54.199 --> 02:13:56.060 pensions are so good. They can come down here 02:13:56.060 --> 02:13:57.880 and like that area, you can get a brand new construction 02:13:57.880 --> 02:14:00.460 house where you are for like 300 grand. Nice 02:14:00.460 --> 02:14:03.079 brand new house. I mean, it's nice up there. 02:14:03.199 --> 02:14:05.859 So, you know, it's just one of those things where. 02:14:06.329 --> 02:14:07.909 If I had a crystal ball, I could give you all 02:14:07.909 --> 02:14:10.109 the answers. But just based off of at least what 02:14:10.109 --> 02:14:12.369 I'm seeing, it's not going to be a crash based 02:14:12.369 --> 02:14:15.810 off of the mortgage industry. Now, if something 02:14:15.810 --> 02:14:18.989 happens with the economy -wise where nobody has 02:14:18.989 --> 02:14:20.770 a job and they can't pay their mortgage, then 02:14:20.770 --> 02:14:22.430 that's going to lead to, obviously, foreclosures. 02:14:22.430 --> 02:14:26.189 But I don't really know if that's coming. It's 02:14:26.189 --> 02:14:29.729 hard to say. Absolutely. All right. Well, it's 02:14:29.729 --> 02:14:31.430 been such a great conversation. We've gone all 02:14:31.430 --> 02:14:34.789 over the place. Yeah, you're going to have to 02:14:34.789 --> 02:14:37.250 chop this thing up to make it make sense. No, 02:14:37.329 --> 02:14:38.890 no, no. They never make sense. That's why I do 02:14:38.890 --> 02:14:42.670 it this way. So I want to thank you so much for 02:14:42.670 --> 02:14:45.069 being so generous with your time today and coming 02:14:45.069 --> 02:14:47.810 on the Behind the Shield podcast. Yeah, man. 02:14:47.869 --> 02:14:49.449 Thanks for having me. Actually, one more thing 02:14:49.449 --> 02:14:51.109 I forgot to mention when it comes to the safety 02:14:51.109 --> 02:14:53.909 or health and wellness thing. So my buddy is 02:14:53.909 --> 02:14:56.130 a chiropractor here in Deland, Deland Chiropractic. 02:14:57.119 --> 02:15:00.500 He ordered these tests and he's doing it with 02:15:00.500 --> 02:15:02.739 his family. And then he wanted me to do one. 02:15:02.840 --> 02:15:04.539 So I bought it. I still haven't done it. I got 02:15:04.539 --> 02:15:07.140 to turn it in. But this is to test your PFAS 02:15:07.140 --> 02:15:09.979 levels in your blood. And so this will give you 02:15:09.979 --> 02:15:13.000 a baseline for what your PFAS levels are. So 02:15:13.000 --> 02:15:15.399 obviously with us, with our gear, it's something 02:15:15.399 --> 02:15:17.159 that they brought up, you know, with the gears 02:15:17.159 --> 02:15:19.539 inner lining and all that other stuff that's 02:15:19.539 --> 02:15:22.439 in there. So he has his stuff. So he has his 02:15:22.439 --> 02:15:24.439 numbers. I'm going to show him mine, but he's 02:15:24.439 --> 02:15:27.060 actually going to develop a protocol that will 02:15:27.060 --> 02:15:31.359 hopefully help. excrete and get the forever chemicals 02:15:31.359 --> 02:15:34.140 out of us so i'm in the process of kind of working 02:15:34.140 --> 02:15:35.920 with him and then i'm hoping that you know in 02:15:35.920 --> 02:15:37.720 the next year i can actually present it to our 02:15:37.720 --> 02:15:40.300 our safety and wellness department and just say 02:15:40.300 --> 02:15:42.060 hey is there any way that maybe we can do something 02:15:42.060 --> 02:15:44.439 with this either at the physicals or you know 02:15:44.439 --> 02:15:46.619 you use your hsa card and you buy it and then 02:15:46.619 --> 02:15:48.960 you follow this protocol and hopefully that'll 02:15:48.960 --> 02:15:51.039 that'll kind of get some of these uh forever 02:15:51.039 --> 02:15:54.319 chemicals out of our systems it's funny you say 02:15:54.319 --> 02:15:55.939 that i was just at the brothers helping brothers 02:15:55.939 --> 02:16:00.239 conference and um I had some guests on probably 02:16:00.239 --> 02:16:04.859 six months ago now from Denmark, and they developed 02:16:04.859 --> 02:16:07.840 a probiotic that pulls PFAS out, and they're 02:16:07.840 --> 02:16:10.840 just in the human trials now. So hopefully that's 02:16:10.840 --> 02:16:12.220 another thing that's going to be coming out. 02:16:12.420 --> 02:16:15.239 Hetheshi, one of their people, was at the conference, 02:16:15.300 --> 02:16:17.460 so we got to hang out for a few days. But yeah, 02:16:17.539 --> 02:16:19.180 there's some exciting things happening. There's 02:16:19.180 --> 02:16:21.520 obviously space for more than one thing, but 02:16:21.520 --> 02:16:23.760 giving blood is supposed to be one of the things 02:16:23.760 --> 02:16:26.510 that we can do. Hopefully this probiotic will 02:16:26.510 --> 02:16:30.050 pull more out. But there's so many of these different 02:16:30.050 --> 02:16:33.370 PFAS compounds out there that the more kind of 02:16:33.370 --> 02:16:36.030 layers that we can add to it, the better. Yeah, 02:16:36.049 --> 02:16:38.010 yeah. And then that's why I don't drink out of 02:16:38.010 --> 02:16:39.870 plastic bottles anymore. I don't do any of that 02:16:39.870 --> 02:16:41.930 shit. It's just like try and stay away from all 02:16:41.930 --> 02:16:46.010 of it if you can. No Teflon, no nothing. Absolutely. 02:16:46.229 --> 02:16:48.329 All right, mate. Well, again, thank you so much. 02:16:48.329 --> 02:16:50.709 It's been such a great conversation. Yeah, man. 02:16:50.870 --> 02:16:52.030 Yeah, let's do it again sometime.