WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:01.700 Welcome to the Behind the Shield podcast. As 00:00:01.700 --> 00:00:03.480 always, my name is James Geering, and this week 00:00:03.480 --> 00:00:05.599 it is my absolute honor to welcome on the show, 00:00:05.860 --> 00:00:08.640 tactical athlete strength conditioning coach, 00:00:08.939 --> 00:00:13.599 Vanessa Frost. So we discuss a host of topics 00:00:13.599 --> 00:00:16.219 from her own journey into the world of coaching, 00:00:16.440 --> 00:00:20.480 transitioning to training firefighters, hiring 00:00:20.480 --> 00:00:24.260 standards, ongoing fitness standards, training 00:00:24.260 --> 00:00:28.960 the youth athlete, prehab and rehab. and so much 00:00:28.960 --> 00:00:32.119 more. Now, before we get to this incredible conversation, 00:00:32.219 --> 00:00:34.920 as I say every week, please just take a moment, 00:00:35.039 --> 00:00:38.420 go to whichever app you listen to this on, subscribe 00:00:38.420 --> 00:00:42.100 to the show, leave feedback, and leave a rating. 00:00:42.560 --> 00:00:46.000 Every single five -star rating truly does elevate 00:00:46.000 --> 00:00:48.679 this podcast, therefore making it easier for 00:00:48.679 --> 00:00:52.420 others to find. And this is a free library of 00:00:52.420 --> 00:00:57.200 over 1100 episodes now. So all I ask in return 00:00:57.200 --> 00:01:00.479 is that you help share these incredible men and 00:01:00.479 --> 00:01:03.759 women's stories so I can get them to every single 00:01:03.759 --> 00:01:06.599 person on planet Earth who needs to hear them. 00:01:07.340 --> 00:01:10.920 So with that being said, I introduce to you... 00:01:11.849 --> 00:01:34.370 Vanessa Frost. Enjoy. Well, Vanessa, I want to 00:01:34.370 --> 00:01:36.790 start by saying two things. Firstly, thank you 00:01:36.790 --> 00:01:39.349 to our mutual friend Trevor for making this connection. 00:01:40.000 --> 00:01:42.040 And secondly, I want to welcome you on to the 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:44.719 Behind the Shield podcast today. Oh, thank you 00:01:44.719 --> 00:01:47.219 so much. I'm really excited to be here, and I'm 00:01:47.219 --> 00:01:50.099 glad that Trevor connected us. He's a good dude. 00:01:50.140 --> 00:01:53.099 He actually helped me rebuild a wall in my house 00:01:53.099 --> 00:01:55.900 at one point in my life. So I'm grateful to him 00:01:55.900 --> 00:01:58.620 for many reasons. Beautiful. Well, very first 00:01:58.620 --> 00:02:00.560 question then. Where on planet Earth are we finding 00:02:00.560 --> 00:02:04.379 you this afternoon? I am in Ding Dong, Texas, 00:02:04.500 --> 00:02:10.509 which sounds fake. I recognize that. It is. I'm 00:02:10.509 --> 00:02:14.349 essentially an hour outside of Austin. It's so 00:02:14.349 --> 00:02:17.250 small, we don't even have a post office here. 00:02:17.530 --> 00:02:22.409 So yeah, Ding Dong, Texas. Have you asked how 00:02:22.409 --> 00:02:24.229 they got their name? And if so, I'd love to hear 00:02:24.229 --> 00:02:27.110 it. So I've Googled it. I haven't asked. I should 00:02:27.110 --> 00:02:29.949 just like, I don't know, I guess to find the 00:02:29.949 --> 00:02:32.490 oldest resident of Ding Dong and ask them, but 00:02:32.490 --> 00:02:35.669 I've Googled it. And we live in Bell County. 00:02:36.680 --> 00:02:40.259 In Texas, and apparently, whoever Bell County 00:02:40.259 --> 00:02:44.879 was named after had two sons. And as I would 00:02:44.879 --> 00:02:47.360 imagine, like, I'm a mom of two sons, like, sometimes 00:02:47.360 --> 00:02:49.099 I just want to call them Ding and Dong sometimes. 00:02:49.240 --> 00:02:52.039 So I guess that is how Ding Dong got its name. 00:02:52.060 --> 00:02:54.699 And that, like, the image on the front is these 00:02:54.699 --> 00:02:58.460 two Bells. And so it's like named after the... 00:02:59.290 --> 00:03:02.030 hooligan sons of whoever they named bell county 00:03:02.030 --> 00:03:05.710 after so ding dong ditch was basically them putting 00:03:05.710 --> 00:03:09.229 them up for adoption probably probably yeah all 00:03:09.229 --> 00:03:11.669 right well i'd love to start the very beginning 00:03:11.669 --> 00:03:14.050 of your journey so tell me where you were born 00:03:14.050 --> 00:03:15.909 and tell me a little bit about your family dynamic 00:03:15.909 --> 00:03:19.039 what your parents did how many siblings Yeah, 00:03:19.039 --> 00:03:23.039 so I was born in Japan. My dad, he works for 00:03:23.039 --> 00:03:28.080 Boeing. And he has been contracted with different 00:03:28.080 --> 00:03:30.580 areas in the military, both for our military 00:03:30.580 --> 00:03:34.680 and militaries around the world. And so I was 00:03:34.680 --> 00:03:38.939 born in Japan. And then we moved around, not 00:03:38.939 --> 00:03:41.419 quite a bit, but we moved to the US for a little 00:03:41.419 --> 00:03:44.639 bit. And then I spent most of my growing up in 00:03:44.639 --> 00:03:49.400 Rota, Spain, at a joint american spanish navy 00:03:49.400 --> 00:03:54.039 base there and so um i was there for i think 00:03:54.039 --> 00:03:56.199 i moved moved there right before my fifth birthday 00:03:56.199 --> 00:03:58.419 and then all the way until the day i moved for 00:03:58.419 --> 00:04:03.819 college um my mom has done quite a few things 00:04:03.819 --> 00:04:05.460 throughout her life but we were there for my 00:04:05.460 --> 00:04:08.740 dad's job um and then i have one older brother 00:04:08.740 --> 00:04:14.930 when you reflect back now what were elements 00:04:14.930 --> 00:04:17.889 of growing up in Spain that you wish could be 00:04:17.889 --> 00:04:19.910 brought to the US, which could be paralleled? 00:04:19.910 --> 00:04:21.769 And then what were some of the pros, excuse me, 00:04:21.769 --> 00:04:26.470 some of the cons when you reflect? When I reflect 00:04:26.470 --> 00:04:29.089 on, and of course, like, at the time, it was 00:04:29.089 --> 00:04:31.370 just normal life. And so I didn't realize it. 00:04:31.449 --> 00:04:39.269 But the speed at which life was lived was much 00:04:39.269 --> 00:04:43.800 slower. I think even I live. quote unquote, out 00:04:43.800 --> 00:04:45.860 in the country. Not really because I work just 00:04:45.860 --> 00:04:50.259 outside of Austin and such, but even like Southern 00:04:50.259 --> 00:04:53.079 living here feels fast, comparatively speaking. 00:04:53.420 --> 00:04:57.899 Now, and also I lived on a beach town in Spain. 00:04:57.980 --> 00:05:00.339 And so that might also be another dynamic, but 00:05:00.339 --> 00:05:02.079 like I haven't lived in a beach town in the US. 00:05:02.139 --> 00:05:06.139 And so maybe there's that aspect to it, but it 00:05:06.139 --> 00:05:11.120 was a lot slower. You spent a lot more time enjoying. 00:05:12.329 --> 00:05:16.250 And that like dinners every night were like a 00:05:16.250 --> 00:05:19.529 two, three hour affair where, you know, you were 00:05:19.529 --> 00:05:21.949 getting together with people, whether or not 00:05:21.949 --> 00:05:25.149 that be your family in your house or going out 00:05:25.149 --> 00:05:29.230 to eat with friends and such. It was an all night 00:05:29.230 --> 00:05:31.069 thing. You weren't rushed out of your table by 00:05:31.069 --> 00:05:35.949 any means. And I do miss that. I try, I find 00:05:35.949 --> 00:05:38.649 myself trying to recreate portions of that for 00:05:38.649 --> 00:05:42.240 my kids now. And I think those are the biggest 00:05:42.240 --> 00:05:45.759 things, but also potentially a con because one 00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:49.439 of the, one of the phrases like we grew up with 00:05:49.439 --> 00:05:51.600 was like mañana por la mañana, which means like 00:05:51.600 --> 00:05:54.879 tomorrow morning, tomorrow morning. And so anytime 00:05:54.879 --> 00:05:58.720 you needed anything done back home, like if, 00:05:58.800 --> 00:06:01.220 you know, instead of a two day turnaround, you're 00:06:01.220 --> 00:06:03.220 talking about like a two month turnaround because 00:06:03.220 --> 00:06:04.959 it's like, oh yeah, they'll be back tomorrow. 00:06:05.160 --> 00:06:06.920 And then tomorrow is like three weeks later. 00:06:07.600 --> 00:06:10.699 Um, so definitely some pros there and like where 00:06:10.699 --> 00:06:15.220 the focus was of life, the idea of like working 00:06:15.220 --> 00:06:17.800 so that you could live versus living so that 00:06:17.800 --> 00:06:21.180 you could work, um, is something that, that I 00:06:21.180 --> 00:06:25.720 miss dearly. My mom and my brother both moved 00:06:25.720 --> 00:06:28.240 to Portugal down the Algarve. So the South coast, 00:06:28.420 --> 00:06:32.860 um, about 20, God, 25 years ago, I think it was 00:06:32.860 --> 00:06:35.500 now. And it's still there. Yeah. Still there. 00:06:35.540 --> 00:06:38.240 Still love it. But yeah, the pace, you know, 00:06:38.259 --> 00:06:40.399 there's so many upsides to the pace and the way 00:06:40.399 --> 00:06:43.240 they view the health of their nation, their view 00:06:43.240 --> 00:06:45.600 on decriminalization of addiction, for example, 00:06:45.600 --> 00:06:49.040 or, you know, decriminalization of drug use from 00:06:49.040 --> 00:06:51.339 a personal use to get these people in the hands 00:06:51.339 --> 00:06:52.980 of the medical community and get back on their 00:06:52.980 --> 00:06:55.620 feet is so progressive compared to the rest of 00:06:55.620 --> 00:06:58.800 the world. But as you alluded to, if you want 00:06:58.800 --> 00:07:00.920 something done quickly in Portugal, you're probably 00:07:00.920 --> 00:07:03.600 going to be disappointed. Yes, very much. So 00:07:03.600 --> 00:07:06.079 something that I think, I mean, I didn't know 00:07:06.079 --> 00:07:07.639 any better, because again, I grew up there. So 00:07:07.639 --> 00:07:10.699 that was kind of my way of living. But it caused 00:07:10.699 --> 00:07:14.000 a lot of frustrations in my parents when they 00:07:14.000 --> 00:07:15.480 were like trying to get things done around the 00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:17.279 house where they needed, you know, different 00:07:17.279 --> 00:07:21.339 vendors or such to come in. But yeah, that it 00:07:21.339 --> 00:07:24.060 was a stark contrast from when I moved to the 00:07:24.060 --> 00:07:25.980 US and like everything happened immediately. 00:07:28.009 --> 00:07:31.290 So yeah, both, which is amazing in some ways, 00:07:31.370 --> 00:07:35.529 and then also terrible in others. What about 00:07:35.529 --> 00:07:38.089 the food? A number of times I've heard Americans 00:07:38.089 --> 00:07:40.709 say that when they went to Italy, for example, 00:07:40.709 --> 00:07:42.769 they had all the pasta and all the breads and 00:07:42.769 --> 00:07:45.689 they didn't blow up their stomach and all the 00:07:45.689 --> 00:07:48.589 side effects that we get here. What was the diet 00:07:48.589 --> 00:07:51.050 like compared to what we see on average here 00:07:51.050 --> 00:07:57.000 in the US? Different in that... And granted, 00:07:57.000 --> 00:08:01.079 things also changed over the course of me living 00:08:01.079 --> 00:08:05.579 there. And so I haven't been back. I haven't 00:08:05.579 --> 00:08:10.180 been back in probably 12 years or so now. And 00:08:10.180 --> 00:08:13.360 so I'm sure it's changed, you know, even more 00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:18.759 so from when I left to now. Sweet things are 00:08:18.759 --> 00:08:21.100 not nearly as sweet. That's something that I 00:08:21.100 --> 00:08:22.899 remember doing a lot of like during Christmas 00:08:22.899 --> 00:08:26.500 or Easter, you know, whatever kind of holiday 00:08:26.500 --> 00:08:28.459 we would always bring our neighbors baked goods. 00:08:29.259 --> 00:08:31.860 And like, we are in a baking family. So that 00:08:31.860 --> 00:08:35.019 meant like Betty Crocker, like mixed from the 00:08:35.019 --> 00:08:37.940 commissary, like type brownies and brought them 00:08:37.940 --> 00:08:41.080 over. And they loved them. They would always 00:08:41.080 --> 00:08:44.799 ask for more because like things that were that 00:08:44.799 --> 00:08:47.419 sweet were not that common. Like even if you 00:08:47.419 --> 00:08:52.399 went to one of those, like, I don't even know 00:08:52.399 --> 00:08:54.620 what to call them. I don't want to call it like 00:08:54.620 --> 00:08:57.720 a bread stop, but like just this little kiosk 00:08:57.720 --> 00:08:59.559 that like sells all the pastries and things like 00:08:59.559 --> 00:09:02.019 that. And you'd get like, you know, chocolate 00:09:02.019 --> 00:09:03.620 covered croissants and things like that. They 00:09:03.620 --> 00:09:07.220 were chocolatey, but not overtly sweet compared 00:09:07.220 --> 00:09:12.399 to like what kind of we serve here. Like occasionally 00:09:12.399 --> 00:09:14.440 I'll find one like that and I'll be like, oh 00:09:14.440 --> 00:09:16.419 my gosh, this is so good. And I'll give it to 00:09:16.419 --> 00:09:18.879 my kids. And they're like, this is gross. Like 00:09:18.879 --> 00:09:21.960 it's not sweet enough for what their taste buds 00:09:21.960 --> 00:09:25.970 are accustomed to. Um, and then again, depending 00:09:25.970 --> 00:09:29.490 on where you like lived and went to school, I'm 00:09:29.490 --> 00:09:31.169 sure things changed. I grew up by the coast. 00:09:31.210 --> 00:09:34.190 So a ton of seafood, um, was very much the norm, 00:09:34.309 --> 00:09:37.230 which I was grateful for. And then I went to 00:09:37.230 --> 00:09:42.110 a school where, um, they hired, like, it wasn't 00:09:42.110 --> 00:09:45.389 just like a lunch lady kind of reheating food 00:09:45.389 --> 00:09:48.389 in the back or like doing what they could with 00:09:48.389 --> 00:09:52.370 what they had. They actually, they showed up 00:09:52.370 --> 00:09:54.529 when we showed up in the morning and you could 00:09:54.529 --> 00:09:57.190 see, you could smell the kitchen cooking throughout 00:09:57.190 --> 00:10:00.330 like the day. It was a separate building. And 00:10:00.330 --> 00:10:02.409 so like when we'd go out for recess, you could 00:10:02.409 --> 00:10:05.429 like kind of smell as lunch was coming. And they 00:10:05.429 --> 00:10:09.129 were like three course meal lunches. Like you'd 00:10:09.129 --> 00:10:12.090 have a soup and then salad and then the main 00:10:12.090 --> 00:10:16.889 course and then either fruit or on Fridays, like 00:10:16.889 --> 00:10:18.549 some kind of dessert or whatever at the end. 00:10:19.690 --> 00:10:21.629 It's amazing because that sounds like such a 00:10:21.629 --> 00:10:25.029 crazy concept to a lot of people. But if you 00:10:25.029 --> 00:10:27.450 look at what Jamie Oliver was able to do in the 00:10:27.450 --> 00:10:29.690 UK, I believe it still stands. And what he tried 00:10:29.690 --> 00:10:31.509 to do here in the US that lasted, I think, a 00:10:31.509 --> 00:10:34.210 few weeks. You know, it's what we did a long 00:10:34.210 --> 00:10:36.450 time ago, you know, until there was Cisco, which 00:10:36.450 --> 00:10:39.889 I just learned recently from Joel Salatin. The 00:10:39.889 --> 00:10:42.210 food that's served to our schools is actually 00:10:42.210 --> 00:10:45.220 expired food that they get at a discount. So 00:10:45.220 --> 00:10:47.200 not only is it processed shit, but it's also 00:10:47.200 --> 00:10:50.259 old processed shit that then we're fed to our 00:10:50.259 --> 00:10:52.100 kids. And then we wonder why we have, you know, 00:10:52.120 --> 00:10:54.639 70 % of our nation obese or overweight. Well, 00:10:54.720 --> 00:10:57.360 because we deviated from what we know as work 00:10:57.360 --> 00:11:00.000 for, you know, since the dawn of man, which is 00:11:00.000 --> 00:11:03.299 whole food. Yeah. And that's unfortunate. And 00:11:03.299 --> 00:11:05.720 I think something that like people often forget 00:11:05.720 --> 00:11:07.480 about when they bring up these conversations 00:11:07.480 --> 00:11:11.059 is, and granted, I don't know the end. like the 00:11:11.059 --> 00:11:13.360 entire budget that places are working with. But 00:11:13.360 --> 00:11:17.240 I do know that people always prefer their taxes 00:11:17.240 --> 00:11:20.600 to be lower and there's a cost to that. Well, 00:11:20.659 --> 00:11:22.559 I think with Jamie Oliver specifically, he took 00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:26.940 the same budget because. yeah there's a misnomer 00:11:26.940 --> 00:11:29.879 if you take you know local whole food and you 00:11:29.879 --> 00:11:32.600 remove the middleman then it is you know quite 00:11:32.600 --> 00:11:34.860 inexpensive to grow real food into yeah that 00:11:34.860 --> 00:11:37.600 would make sense on a more local basis versus 00:11:37.600 --> 00:11:42.259 like a regional state or even nationwide um yeah 00:11:42.259 --> 00:11:45.840 that i mean that would be awesome but absolutely 00:11:45.840 --> 00:11:49.100 we can well what about sport and exercise what 00:11:49.100 --> 00:11:52.960 were you playing and doing back in spain um when 00:11:54.200 --> 00:11:57.240 I didn't, I didn't start sports until I was about 00:11:57.240 --> 00:12:00.799 seven years old. Everything. Oh, I lied. I lied. 00:12:00.860 --> 00:12:05.100 I did gymnastics when I was in the US. So I was 00:12:05.100 --> 00:12:08.399 about four. And then when we moved to Spain. 00:12:09.799 --> 00:12:12.659 We couldn't find any like gymnastics gyms close 00:12:12.659 --> 00:12:17.500 to us. I tried ballet. And then the ballet instructor 00:12:17.500 --> 00:12:21.320 essentially told me that my body type does not 00:12:21.320 --> 00:12:23.820 match that of ballerinas. So I shouldn't be there. 00:12:24.659 --> 00:12:28.419 And then my brother played tennis. And so my 00:12:28.419 --> 00:12:30.200 friends were like, okay, like, let's try you 00:12:30.200 --> 00:12:34.779 in tennis. So I did. And then the coach told 00:12:34.779 --> 00:12:39.870 my mom, he walked up to her and he goes, uh, 00:12:40.029 --> 00:12:42.629 she is no good. You should stop wasting your 00:12:42.629 --> 00:12:47.590 money. And so, you know, at like six years old, 00:12:47.669 --> 00:12:50.129 just like tennis dreams straight, like gone, 00:12:50.269 --> 00:12:53.230 um, poor hand -eye coordination, which honestly 00:12:53.230 --> 00:12:55.649 continued throughout my life. But then at, um, 00:12:55.649 --> 00:13:00.529 at seven, I started swimming. And so I did that, 00:13:00.649 --> 00:13:05.269 um, up until I think I was 15 years old when 00:13:05.269 --> 00:13:08.220 I stopped swimming. And so that was most of my 00:13:08.220 --> 00:13:12.100 childhood there in terms of sport. I didn't develop 00:13:12.100 --> 00:13:16.840 on land very well. And so like running was super 00:13:16.840 --> 00:13:19.059 awkward for me. And it wasn't until I got into 00:13:19.059 --> 00:13:21.960 high school, which then I went to an American, 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:23.879 like I went to the school that was on base, an 00:13:23.879 --> 00:13:27.940 American type high school where I started doing 00:13:27.940 --> 00:13:31.980 other things in addition to my swimming. Mostly 00:13:31.980 --> 00:13:35.129 I was a cheerleader for. My high school career 00:13:35.129 --> 00:13:39.850 dabbled in volleyball and softball and then track 00:13:39.850 --> 00:13:43.710 and field for one very, very upsetting season 00:13:43.710 --> 00:13:49.490 because running often was not my forte. Was that 00:13:49.490 --> 00:13:51.450 short distance, middle? What were you running? 00:13:51.809 --> 00:13:54.710 OK, so all the things because we went I went 00:13:54.710 --> 00:13:56.149 to a school that was small enough that if you 00:13:56.149 --> 00:13:58.889 were mildly athletic, then you were doing all 00:13:58.889 --> 00:14:02.210 the things. And so mostly the four and the eight, 00:14:02.269 --> 00:14:06.230 which like. No, thank you. Yeah, my son was a 00:14:06.230 --> 00:14:09.210 miler. And yeah, he had this love -hate relationship 00:14:09.210 --> 00:14:11.870 with it the whole time. Yeah, like it's fun, 00:14:12.090 --> 00:14:14.029 but it's also not very fun. Like I would have 00:14:14.029 --> 00:14:17.009 much rather have been in the pool than running. 00:14:18.070 --> 00:14:20.110 What about career aspirations? When you were 00:14:20.110 --> 00:14:21.549 in the high school age, what were you dreaming 00:14:21.549 --> 00:14:25.779 of becoming? Um, I wanted to be a doctor for 00:14:25.779 --> 00:14:29.759 a really long time. Um, I remember when I was 00:14:29.759 --> 00:14:32.960 probably like seven or eight, I told my dad that 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:38.039 I wanted to be either a lawyer, a vet or a doctor. 00:14:39.039 --> 00:14:43.500 And that, um, I get, I think just cause I was 00:14:43.500 --> 00:14:46.320 very opinionated as a little girl. And so my 00:14:46.320 --> 00:14:47.700 parents always said like, oh, well you should 00:14:47.700 --> 00:14:49.879 be a lawyer, which is where I got that from. 00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:55.679 Um, but then I always, I. I loved science and 00:14:55.679 --> 00:14:59.740 I loved like bodies, whether they were like, 00:14:59.759 --> 00:15:02.159 it was interesting to me, like how bodies could 00:15:02.159 --> 00:15:03.720 do what they do, whether we're talking about 00:15:03.720 --> 00:15:06.559 like humans or animals. Right. And so I wanted 00:15:06.559 --> 00:15:09.039 to be one of those things. And as I got into 00:15:09.039 --> 00:15:11.940 high school, I really wanted to pursue a career 00:15:11.940 --> 00:15:15.480 in medicine. And initially it was kind of what 00:15:15.480 --> 00:15:17.620 I went to college for, not what I, not what I 00:15:17.620 --> 00:15:19.600 ended up with, but that's what I was shooting 00:15:19.600 --> 00:15:24.769 for at the time. So why did that deviate? When 00:15:24.769 --> 00:15:29.570 I was in college, kind of a couple of things 00:15:29.570 --> 00:15:36.690 all collided in that. First, I was on an Air 00:15:36.690 --> 00:15:40.669 Force ROTC scholarship that I realized I did 00:15:40.669 --> 00:15:42.970 not want, like I'd grown up around the military 00:15:42.970 --> 00:15:47.330 and I didn't want to actually join the military. 00:15:48.490 --> 00:15:50.029 I didn't want to be told where to live or how 00:15:50.029 --> 00:15:52.070 long to be there or go here, go there type thing. 00:15:53.049 --> 00:15:56.570 And that is who essentially was, I was slotted 00:15:56.570 --> 00:15:58.370 to the Air Force was going to pay for med school 00:15:58.370 --> 00:16:01.970 at that point. And so I knew I wanted to leave 00:16:01.970 --> 00:16:04.950 that. And then around at that same time, my sophomore 00:16:04.950 --> 00:16:10.960 year, I was starting to do shadowing hours. When 00:16:10.960 --> 00:16:12.519 we were talking about trying to get into med 00:16:12.519 --> 00:16:14.840 school, the recommendation to me was like, go 00:16:14.840 --> 00:16:17.899 and get shadowing hours as many as you can between 00:16:17.899 --> 00:16:20.279 now and graduation. And so I started doing that. 00:16:21.519 --> 00:16:26.019 And the more I shadowed, the more probably disillusioned 00:16:26.019 --> 00:16:29.120 is a good word. I became with the medical system 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:33.220 and that like my whole goal was like, hey, I 00:16:33.220 --> 00:16:36.139 want to help people. And I think science in the 00:16:36.139 --> 00:16:38.059 human body is cool. And so that's how I'm going 00:16:38.059 --> 00:16:43.720 to do it. But the more I shadowed, the more I 00:16:43.720 --> 00:16:48.919 saw people and providers seeing patients that 00:16:48.919 --> 00:16:54.340 had preventable diseases. Like we, granted, and 00:16:54.340 --> 00:16:56.159 we were in a, you know, just a college town, 00:16:56.279 --> 00:16:58.720 not like a huge town. And so we weren't having 00:16:58.720 --> 00:17:00.940 a ton of like acute traumas and things like this. 00:17:01.929 --> 00:17:06.069 mostly frequent flyer type patients who came 00:17:06.069 --> 00:17:08.109 in because, you know, they weren't adhering to 00:17:08.109 --> 00:17:13.630 their meds or, you know, X, Y, Z, but all things 00:17:13.630 --> 00:17:16.490 that seem relatively preventable based on life 00:17:16.490 --> 00:17:19.930 choices. And I was like, I don't want to, I don't 00:17:19.930 --> 00:17:23.390 want to do that. I don't want to try and convince 00:17:23.390 --> 00:17:28.369 somebody that they need to change, which is ironic. 00:17:29.039 --> 00:17:31.480 to a degree, that's what I do now. But at the 00:17:31.480 --> 00:17:32.940 time, I was like, I don't want to, I don't want 00:17:32.940 --> 00:17:35.140 to spend my career trying to convince people 00:17:35.140 --> 00:17:38.420 to change on the back half of things in a reactive 00:17:38.420 --> 00:17:43.240 sense. But I want to be proactive. And so I, 00:17:43.359 --> 00:17:47.500 you know, made every parent's like dream of like, 00:17:47.579 --> 00:17:49.759 my daughter's no longer going to try and go to 00:17:49.759 --> 00:17:51.440 medical school, but instead, she's going to be 00:17:51.440 --> 00:17:56.119 a strength coach. So did you do that in college 00:17:56.119 --> 00:17:57.880 as well, the strength and conditioning side? 00:17:58.539 --> 00:18:01.960 so i was always um i mean kind of through high 00:18:01.960 --> 00:18:03.900 school like it was towards the tail end of high 00:18:03.900 --> 00:18:05.880 school i started getting into like weight training 00:18:05.880 --> 00:18:10.839 and things like that um in college i was always 00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:13.960 active um i was an air force rotc so like i was 00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:16.819 having to train regularly for that anyways um 00:18:16.819 --> 00:18:21.839 and then even when that let off It was like personal 00:18:21.839 --> 00:18:24.740 training. And then I started teaching like group 00:18:24.740 --> 00:18:26.180 fitness classes, but it was just something I 00:18:26.180 --> 00:18:28.500 did for fun. It was never like a true career 00:18:28.500 --> 00:18:32.900 aspiration by any means. And then when I like 00:18:32.900 --> 00:18:35.680 knew I no longer wanted to like try and pursue 00:18:35.680 --> 00:18:37.740 going to medical school, I was like, okay, well, 00:18:37.799 --> 00:18:41.619 maybe I could do this instead. I still pursued 00:18:41.619 --> 00:18:44.240 my degree in biology, which is what my undergrad 00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:46.960 is in, because that could take me kind of anywhere, 00:18:47.079 --> 00:18:52.559 a multitude of ways. But I was teaching group 00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:54.859 fitness classes. I was actually coaching at a 00:18:54.859 --> 00:18:58.140 CrossFit gym at the time. And I had met one of 00:18:58.140 --> 00:19:01.220 my clients. She was the softball coach for the 00:19:01.220 --> 00:19:04.539 college that I was going to. And she was like, 00:19:04.599 --> 00:19:06.900 oh, you're great. You should meet our head strength 00:19:06.900 --> 00:19:10.940 conditioning coach. And so she introduced me 00:19:10.940 --> 00:19:13.279 to Clint McLeod, who was strength conditioning 00:19:13.279 --> 00:19:16.299 coach at the time, who I'm sure was like just. 00:19:16.910 --> 00:19:19.349 And not even mildly irritated, like just straight 00:19:19.349 --> 00:19:21.089 up irritated that this little CrossFit coach 00:19:21.089 --> 00:19:23.809 was trying to make her way into the weight room. 00:19:24.609 --> 00:19:28.410 But I stuck around as just, you know, try and 00:19:28.410 --> 00:19:29.950 get into rooms and get around people who are 00:19:29.950 --> 00:19:31.869 better than you. And so I did that. And then 00:19:31.869 --> 00:19:34.269 that's how I kind of like morphed into a career 00:19:34.269 --> 00:19:37.170 of strength conditioning. How did you find yourself 00:19:37.170 --> 00:19:43.589 coming across the NSCA CSCS? So I was in at the 00:19:43.589 --> 00:19:49.740 tail end of my grad school. It was going to become 00:19:49.740 --> 00:19:53.000 a requirement to have your CSCS in order to work 00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:54.480 in a collegiate weight room, which is what I 00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:58.680 was doing at the time. And so that is when I 00:19:58.680 --> 00:20:02.500 went and got that. So when you said grad school, 00:20:02.599 --> 00:20:04.559 was that kinesiology that you were doing? Oh, 00:20:04.559 --> 00:20:06.519 yes. Yeah. So I graduated from my undergrad in 00:20:06.519 --> 00:20:10.859 biology. I pursued a graduate degree in kinesiology. 00:20:11.119 --> 00:20:14.019 And then during that time, I was a graduate assistant 00:20:14.019 --> 00:20:19.500 coach, strength coach at the Southern Illinois 00:20:19.500 --> 00:20:23.160 University where I got my degrees. I went to 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:25.819 University of North London, did kind of sports 00:20:25.819 --> 00:20:29.140 science and then transitioned into two years 00:20:29.140 --> 00:20:31.640 at UF here to finish my bachelor's in ex -phys. 00:20:32.119 --> 00:20:35.569 And one of the semesters you actually did. prep 00:20:35.569 --> 00:20:38.450 for the cscs and i never actually took the certification 00:20:38.450 --> 00:20:41.390 in the end ironically but it was the one class 00:20:41.390 --> 00:20:43.009 where i was like wow this is amazing this is 00:20:43.009 --> 00:20:46.470 totally pertinent to training when i when i graduate 00:20:46.470 --> 00:20:49.869 but the other all the other ones i did were just 00:20:49.869 --> 00:20:53.150 extremely myopic and really prepared you to stay 00:20:53.150 --> 00:20:56.730 in higher education studying sports science as 00:20:56.730 --> 00:20:59.230 opposed to really setting you up for you know 00:20:59.230 --> 00:21:02.430 a career in coaching or be even being a better 00:21:02.430 --> 00:21:05.700 athlete yourself What was your experience as 00:21:05.700 --> 00:21:09.740 far as that track educationally? So I think where 00:21:09.740 --> 00:21:12.460 I lucked out was that I didn't get my undergrad 00:21:12.460 --> 00:21:16.259 in exercises. And so since I did get my undergrad 00:21:16.259 --> 00:21:21.180 in biology, I still use so much of that in the 00:21:21.180 --> 00:21:24.000 background in terms of the human body. But my 00:21:24.000 --> 00:21:26.980 graduate degree is technically a master's in 00:21:26.980 --> 00:21:32.190 education. And so I got my kinesiology has a 00:21:32.190 --> 00:21:36.450 focus on teaching. I focused on motor behavior 00:21:36.450 --> 00:21:41.630 and so how to teach people movement. And it was 00:21:41.630 --> 00:21:44.970 actually really applicable. So most of my classes 00:21:44.970 --> 00:21:47.230 were biomechanics. So the physics of the human 00:21:47.230 --> 00:21:51.710 body and how it moves a ton of motor learning, 00:21:51.789 --> 00:21:55.359 which is. where like i did my research project 00:21:55.359 --> 00:21:59.619 and things like that on and then um a couple 00:21:59.619 --> 00:22:03.240 other classes that at the time i was like this 00:22:03.240 --> 00:22:05.480 isn't that relevant to me because my world was 00:22:05.480 --> 00:22:08.519 performance and specifically like a collegiate 00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:11.400 competitive setting where it was more about like 00:22:11.400 --> 00:22:15.519 public health initiatives in terms of trying 00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:19.019 to get people into exercise what are the barriers 00:22:19.019 --> 00:22:22.930 to that and so on so forth But now in my career 00:22:22.930 --> 00:22:25.109 field, I'm like, oh, this was actually a lot 00:22:25.109 --> 00:22:27.170 more relevant for me now than it was for me back 00:22:27.170 --> 00:22:32.690 then. And so what was cool was everything that 00:22:32.690 --> 00:22:34.650 I got to learn, especially on biomechanics and 00:22:34.650 --> 00:22:37.529 motor learning, I got to apply the very next 00:22:37.529 --> 00:22:41.230 day because in graduate school, our classes were 00:22:41.230 --> 00:22:46.309 from 6 to 9 .30 p .m. And then by 5 .30, I'd 00:22:46.309 --> 00:22:50.599 be in a weight room for the next 12 hours. It 00:22:50.599 --> 00:22:54.279 was very much applicable. I consider myself very 00:22:54.279 --> 00:22:56.180 lucky for getting that because I do hear that 00:22:56.180 --> 00:22:57.900 a lot. And that people are like, okay, you're 00:22:57.900 --> 00:22:59.500 either going to work in a rehab setting. So they 00:22:59.500 --> 00:23:03.299 have you like running bike tests all day or, 00:23:03.400 --> 00:23:05.599 you know, focusing on the smallest thing that 00:23:05.599 --> 00:23:10.400 doesn't actually prepare you to be a coach. So 00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:13.400 I got. kind of the best of both worlds, focusing 00:23:13.400 --> 00:23:16.380 on the very small things in my undergrad of all 00:23:16.380 --> 00:23:18.799 the nitty gritty science, and then a little bit 00:23:18.799 --> 00:23:22.400 broader spectrum and how to work with people 00:23:22.400 --> 00:23:26.240 as a graduate student, and then got to put it 00:23:26.240 --> 00:23:29.859 into real life practice the very next day. You 00:23:29.859 --> 00:23:31.940 mentioned motor learning. I've had this conversation 00:23:31.940 --> 00:23:33.880 with a few people normally when I'm trying to 00:23:33.880 --> 00:23:36.759 illustrate the importance of sleep in the fire 00:23:36.759 --> 00:23:41.220 service. Talk to me about when you learn a skill 00:23:41.220 --> 00:23:44.079 the importance of sleep to process that skill 00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:47.000 and be a little bit better the next day yeah 00:23:47.000 --> 00:23:50.640 so i mean i tell people all the time and you 00:23:50.640 --> 00:23:52.720 know we just started a cadet class and i was 00:23:52.720 --> 00:23:55.200 actually talking to them we started on monday 00:23:55.200 --> 00:23:58.299 so what four days ago now um and when i spoke 00:23:58.299 --> 00:24:01.880 to them i'm like emt school isn't very physically 00:24:01.880 --> 00:24:07.140 demanding but it is very um like mentally demanding 00:24:07.140 --> 00:24:10.190 in the sense that you have a ton to learn And 00:24:10.190 --> 00:24:13.470 the learning you might think happens in the classroom, 00:24:13.750 --> 00:24:17.269 but it doesn't. The learning is how much did 00:24:17.269 --> 00:24:21.049 you remember the next day after your brain was 00:24:21.049 --> 00:24:24.170 able to rest and try and push all of that from, 00:24:24.230 --> 00:24:26.269 you know, your short -term memory into your long 00:24:26.269 --> 00:24:29.549 -term memory so you can recall it. And the same 00:24:29.549 --> 00:24:32.690 is true in terms of like motor learning and behavior 00:24:32.690 --> 00:24:36.549 patterns, motor behavior patterns, and that your 00:24:36.549 --> 00:24:40.640 body does need to rest. and recover so that way 00:24:40.640 --> 00:24:43.980 you can same thing it's all has to do with our 00:24:43.980 --> 00:24:46.279 brain and how we process things right and so 00:24:46.279 --> 00:24:49.180 so that way your your body can recall those same 00:24:49.180 --> 00:24:51.420 things what people call muscle memory is referred 00:24:51.420 --> 00:24:54.339 to as procedural memory and that it's not your 00:24:54.339 --> 00:24:56.039 muscles that remember how to do them it's your 00:24:56.039 --> 00:24:59.180 nervous system and your brain and kind of like 00:24:59.180 --> 00:25:02.180 what pathways are more active and they do that 00:25:02.180 --> 00:25:04.769 through sleep yeah i think this is what's important 00:25:04.769 --> 00:25:06.549 when i think about you know the shifts that i 00:25:06.549 --> 00:25:08.029 worked and there are people out there working 00:25:08.029 --> 00:25:10.789 even longer now you know if you are going to 00:25:10.789 --> 00:25:14.230 be doing rope rescue training or you know als 00:25:14.230 --> 00:25:16.970 training or whatever it is and then the next 00:25:16.970 --> 00:25:18.829 day i've had this like i can't remember how to 00:25:18.829 --> 00:25:21.049 tie that knot it's because if you haven't slept 00:25:21.049 --> 00:25:23.569 that night you haven't given the body the ability 00:25:23.569 --> 00:25:25.950 to actually take that and file it away and then 00:25:25.950 --> 00:25:27.630 be able to retrieve it the next day and then 00:25:27.630 --> 00:25:30.730 slightly better so if we really want to take 00:25:31.480 --> 00:25:33.819 the performance side of, you know, fire and EMS 00:25:33.819 --> 00:25:37.980 seriously, it's another, you know, another piece 00:25:37.980 --> 00:25:40.880 of evidence in the case for a healthy firefighter 00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:43.539 work week, because we just simply cannot advance 00:25:43.539 --> 00:25:45.880 our learning if we're not giving the brain time 00:25:45.880 --> 00:25:48.960 to process what we did the night before. Yeah, 00:25:49.000 --> 00:25:53.400 absolutely. I think, I mean, being able to sleep 00:25:53.400 --> 00:25:57.640 is, whenever I teach, there's like five pillars 00:25:57.640 --> 00:25:59.670 of health and performance that I teach on. And 00:25:59.670 --> 00:26:02.309 the first one is sleep. And my like one phrase 00:26:02.309 --> 00:26:05.230 is like sleep is the magic pill. And that if 00:26:05.230 --> 00:26:09.450 there's anything you want to improve, like whether 00:26:09.450 --> 00:26:11.470 we're talking about like your health in terms 00:26:11.470 --> 00:26:14.190 of like your, you know, your lab work and things 00:26:14.190 --> 00:26:16.450 like that, your performance on the fire ground 00:26:16.450 --> 00:26:19.849 or fitness, or if you want to improve your nutrition, 00:26:20.009 --> 00:26:21.990 sleeping better. If you want to improve your 00:26:21.990 --> 00:26:23.430 mental health, sleeping better. If you want to 00:26:23.430 --> 00:26:25.089 improve your relationships, sleeping better. 00:26:25.130 --> 00:26:26.849 So that way you're not a jerk or an asshole to 00:26:26.849 --> 00:26:29.759 people when you interact with them. Um, sleep 00:26:29.759 --> 00:26:32.299 is the magic pill that unfortunately for the 00:26:32.299 --> 00:26:34.380 majority of the fire service, they, they never 00:26:34.380 --> 00:26:38.049 get to take all that frequently. Yeah. Well, 00:26:38.190 --> 00:26:40.029 there's, there's a revolution happening and people 00:26:40.029 --> 00:26:42.089 listen to this podcast. A lot of heard me talking 00:26:42.089 --> 00:26:44.730 about the 24 72, but it's, it's happening in 00:26:44.730 --> 00:26:47.630 Florida. Now we've had, we're up to 10 fire departments 00:26:47.630 --> 00:26:50.109 in the last two years, go to a 42 hour work week, 00:26:50.170 --> 00:26:53.630 24 72. So I think this is what's so beautiful 00:26:53.630 --> 00:26:56.210 is initially it was really, you know, the deaths, 00:26:56.210 --> 00:26:59.130 the suicides, the cancers, the, you know, cardiac 00:26:59.130 --> 00:27:02.529 issues, but now. we can start switching into 00:27:02.529 --> 00:27:04.190 the performance and say well look this is how 00:27:04.190 --> 00:27:06.730 much better of a firefighter of a paramedic you 00:27:06.730 --> 00:27:09.670 will be if you were giving the same kind of environment 00:27:09.670 --> 00:27:12.250 that we would give a an athlete now yes you have 00:27:12.250 --> 00:27:15.650 to be awake every fourth day now but you've got 00:27:15.650 --> 00:27:18.609 this extra rest and recovery and you know now 00:27:18.609 --> 00:27:21.049 we've shown the the young candidates that we 00:27:21.049 --> 00:27:23.190 actually care enough about them now all of a 00:27:23.190 --> 00:27:25.309 sudden you've got a much higher uh recruitment 00:27:25.309 --> 00:27:27.809 and now you don't have these vacancies with this 00:27:27.809 --> 00:27:30.670 mandatory overtime either so it's like this this 00:27:30.670 --> 00:27:34.049 beautiful, you know, solution to it, but it's 00:27:34.049 --> 00:27:36.529 taken a long time to build this case to get people 00:27:36.529 --> 00:27:39.289 to understand the why that you just cannot just 00:27:39.289 --> 00:27:41.930 keep squeezing blood out of a stone because you're 00:27:41.930 --> 00:27:43.269 going to end up with what we've got, which is 00:27:43.269 --> 00:27:50.509 a nationwide recruitment crisis. Yeah. What's 00:27:50.509 --> 00:27:53.150 I've been at my department for almost 10 years 00:27:53.150 --> 00:27:58.210 now. And what is cool is to see people who have 00:27:58.210 --> 00:28:01.140 been there, like who got there. after i've gotten 00:28:01.140 --> 00:28:06.640 there um and so all they've known in the world 00:28:06.640 --> 00:28:11.339 of like health and fitness right is that we we 00:28:11.339 --> 00:28:14.859 teach on it from day one and now that's not to 00:28:14.859 --> 00:28:18.160 say like every single person is the epitome of 00:28:18.160 --> 00:28:21.119 all those behaviors we teach on right but that 00:28:21.119 --> 00:28:28.170 it is so normal of a conversation that it's almost, 00:28:28.250 --> 00:28:31.470 you know, just like talking about types of knots, 00:28:31.589 --> 00:28:35.930 um, you know, amongst a crew. And so I think 00:28:35.930 --> 00:28:38.809 with time that will happen too, in terms of, 00:28:38.829 --> 00:28:40.609 I mean, it's starting to happen, but it'll happen 00:28:40.609 --> 00:28:43.309 even more so, um, with, with hopefully the work 00:28:43.309 --> 00:28:47.809 week schedule and 24 72 sounds awesome. Yes. 00:28:47.930 --> 00:28:49.349 That's what I'm hearing so far. I don't get to 00:28:49.349 --> 00:28:51.029 enjoy it. I left the fire service a few years 00:28:51.029 --> 00:28:54.119 ago, but, uh, hopefully other people are. All 00:28:54.119 --> 00:28:56.079 right. So you now, you know, you're working in 00:28:56.079 --> 00:28:57.940 this collegiate setting at the moment. Did you 00:28:57.940 --> 00:29:00.519 stay working with athletes, sporting athletes 00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:03.599 before being introduced to the first responder 00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:06.099 professions? So I did for a little bit. So I 00:29:06.099 --> 00:29:09.220 was in grad school for two years where I was 00:29:09.220 --> 00:29:10.960 coaching there. And then I actually stayed at 00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:14.000 that same school post -grad school as an assistant. 00:29:14.579 --> 00:29:17.400 And so I was no longer a student working as a 00:29:17.400 --> 00:29:18.759 full -time assistant strength and conditioning 00:29:18.759 --> 00:29:22.420 coach there, which actually I loved. That was... 00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:28.299 so much fun. But I only got to do that tidbit 00:29:28.299 --> 00:29:31.940 for about half a year. And then at the back half 00:29:31.940 --> 00:29:35.579 of that year, I had to fill the role of interim 00:29:35.579 --> 00:29:39.319 head, my head coach left for another school. 00:29:40.099 --> 00:29:44.819 And so they didn't fill that position quickly, 00:29:45.019 --> 00:29:46.519 especially not in the middle of the year, you're 00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:48.019 not going to fill that position until summertime 00:29:48.019 --> 00:29:53.170 in between kind of school years. And so I was 00:29:53.170 --> 00:29:58.990 the interim head for six months. And I, there's 00:29:58.990 --> 00:30:01.230 a lot I look back on and I grew a lot from that, 00:30:01.269 --> 00:30:04.950 but I, it was not a time that I enjoyed. I was 00:30:04.950 --> 00:30:09.490 25. I wasn't ready for the like micro politics 00:30:09.490 --> 00:30:15.509 that is working in a collegiate setting and coaches 00:30:15.509 --> 00:30:17.549 and things like that. It was a very stressful 00:30:17.549 --> 00:30:22.059 position. I I didn't I did the best I could but 00:30:22.059 --> 00:30:24.960 definitely wasn't prepared for on a managerial 00:30:24.960 --> 00:30:29.339 level and so it was I was ready to leave the 00:30:29.339 --> 00:30:31.420 collegiate setting after that especially if it 00:30:31.420 --> 00:30:34.039 was like oh this is this is the top of the the 00:30:34.039 --> 00:30:37.700 pyramid right being ahead um somewhere is the 00:30:37.700 --> 00:30:39.819 top of the pyramid and granted it'll look a little 00:30:39.819 --> 00:30:41.259 different depending on what school you get to 00:30:41.259 --> 00:30:43.119 what sports you work with so on so forth but 00:30:43.119 --> 00:30:45.640 I was like this this isn't it the same for me 00:30:45.640 --> 00:30:52.680 um and so I wanted out of collegiates, and honestly, 00:30:52.759 --> 00:30:57.980 I didn't care what I was going to. I was competing 00:30:57.980 --> 00:31:00.259 in weightlifting at the time, and my main focus 00:31:00.259 --> 00:31:04.039 at that time was to make a world team. And so 00:31:04.039 --> 00:31:11.099 I was ready to move specifically closer to Texas, 00:31:11.140 --> 00:31:14.420 ideally in Texas, because my coach was here. 00:31:14.910 --> 00:31:17.069 At that time, and so I was like, cool, I would 00:31:17.069 --> 00:31:19.789 travel back and forth from from Illinois to Texas 00:31:19.789 --> 00:31:22.210 just to train. And so I was like, I'm going to 00:31:22.210 --> 00:31:24.750 move to Texas, I was applying for like, personal 00:31:24.750 --> 00:31:27.390 training jobs at your local gym, I was applying 00:31:27.390 --> 00:31:31.970 to be a bank teller, banks, just so that I was 00:31:31.970 --> 00:31:33.769 like, I just need, you know, something that can 00:31:33.769 --> 00:31:38.029 help sustain my training, essentially. And then 00:31:38.029 --> 00:31:42.410 as I'm looking for jobs, my position popped up 00:31:42.410 --> 00:31:45.880 as a health and fitness coordinator. in Pflugerville 00:31:45.880 --> 00:31:50.119 and it was very like I don't know I guess all 00:31:50.119 --> 00:31:52.500 the stars aligned and that it's like well I've 00:31:52.500 --> 00:31:54.859 never like I'd individually worked and coached 00:31:54.859 --> 00:31:56.900 with a few paramedics and firefighters in Illinois 00:31:56.900 --> 00:32:00.640 but never on like an entity level um but I was 00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:03.759 like I know how to coach people. I know how to 00:32:03.759 --> 00:32:05.859 teach people how to move. And I've worked with 00:32:05.859 --> 00:32:09.039 everybody from, you know, 70 year old grandmothers 00:32:09.039 --> 00:32:12.660 to six year old children at all aspects of life 00:32:12.660 --> 00:32:16.920 and ability levels. And so, um, yeah, it, it 00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:20.400 really, it popped up and kind of just all worked 00:32:20.400 --> 00:32:22.440 out and that I applied for it and thankfully 00:32:22.440 --> 00:32:25.079 got the job and, you know, here I am almost 10 00:32:25.079 --> 00:32:28.539 years later. When you said weightlifting, was 00:32:28.539 --> 00:32:31.920 that Olympic weightlifting? Yeah. I never made 00:32:31.920 --> 00:32:37.440 the world team. You got pretty high then. Yeah, 00:32:37.519 --> 00:32:44.079 I was a couple podium finishes in, I think like 00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:50.420 probably 15, 16, 17. God, I think a second place 00:32:50.420 --> 00:32:56.160 nationals was probably my best finish. And then 00:32:56.160 --> 00:33:01.670 in... late 17, I got pregnant with my first son. 00:33:01.789 --> 00:33:05.970 And so my truly competitive career kind of ended 00:33:05.970 --> 00:33:09.529 there. Well, the reason I asked is you'd mentioned 00:33:09.529 --> 00:33:11.329 about being told you didn't have the body for 00:33:11.329 --> 00:33:14.190 a ballerina, you know, and the hand -eye coordination 00:33:14.190 --> 00:33:17.470 for tennis. I think this is something that I 00:33:17.470 --> 00:33:20.880 think it needs to be discussed. people look at 00:33:20.880 --> 00:33:23.680 instagram now and they look at for example our 00:33:23.680 --> 00:33:27.019 world you know the roided out beard wearing alpha 00:33:27.019 --> 00:33:30.480 self -named alpha and then people like oh i want 00:33:30.480 --> 00:33:33.000 to be like that guy and there's very little discussion 00:33:33.000 --> 00:33:37.079 on um you know the body types you know mesomorph 00:33:37.079 --> 00:33:41.019 ectomorph etc um so talk to me about that because 00:33:41.019 --> 00:33:43.339 here you are being told you're the wrong body 00:33:43.339 --> 00:33:46.079 type for one thing which again had you said come 00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:47.980 hell or high water i'm gonna dance you'd still 00:33:47.980 --> 00:33:50.400 be able to do that and you still be able to be 00:33:50.400 --> 00:33:52.980 a performing ballet but would you be at the top 00:33:52.980 --> 00:33:56.980 level maybe not yeah but you know the the the 00:33:56.980 --> 00:34:00.259 uh what am i trying to say here um the disappointment 00:34:00.259 --> 00:34:02.660 of being told that you're the wrong fit for one 00:34:02.660 --> 00:34:05.059 thing usually means well okay well that means 00:34:05.059 --> 00:34:07.279 i'm the right fit for something else then so 00:34:07.279 --> 00:34:09.519 talk to me about that you know the the perception 00:34:09.519 --> 00:34:12.679 of this air quotes perfect body compared to the 00:34:12.679 --> 00:34:16.239 spectrum of body types that we all exist in yeah 00:34:16.239 --> 00:34:20.340 i think um I think thankfully, you know, you 00:34:20.340 --> 00:34:23.599 say like on social media, the like, self perpetuated 00:34:23.599 --> 00:34:26.760 alpha, like there are some definitely like negative 00:34:26.760 --> 00:34:28.619 things that are seen from social media. But I 00:34:28.619 --> 00:34:30.559 think something that's really cool that I've 00:34:30.559 --> 00:34:33.340 gotten to see over the years is, and maybe this 00:34:33.340 --> 00:34:35.739 is more in the female space, maybe not as much 00:34:35.739 --> 00:34:39.480 the male space, I'm not sure. But I get to see 00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:43.460 those different possibilities now, like, my friends 00:34:43.460 --> 00:34:45.380 who have daughters, their daughters get to grow 00:34:45.380 --> 00:34:47.980 up seeing different possibilities, whereas like, 00:34:48.429 --> 00:34:50.750 When I was a seven -year -old being told that 00:34:50.750 --> 00:34:52.690 I'm never going to be a good ballerina because 00:34:52.690 --> 00:34:56.369 I was too fat, I didn't know there was anything 00:34:56.369 --> 00:35:03.349 else. And so whether people like it or not, your 00:35:03.349 --> 00:35:05.230 genetics play a factor into how good you're going 00:35:05.230 --> 00:35:10.610 to be at something. Now, you can do amazingly 00:35:10.610 --> 00:35:14.630 almost in spite of them. Maybe I'm going to be 00:35:14.630 --> 00:35:19.719 5 '5 and still an amazing swimmer. But if an 00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:23.159 amazing swimmer is six, two up against an amazing 00:35:23.159 --> 00:35:28.460 swimmer, who's five, five, like the person who's 00:35:28.460 --> 00:35:32.280 six, two is going to win. Like you can still 00:35:32.280 --> 00:35:34.639 be amazing and you can work amazingly hard, but 00:35:34.639 --> 00:35:36.820 like when talent works hard, it's like the idea 00:35:36.820 --> 00:35:38.599 of like when talent works hard, like game over. 00:35:39.099 --> 00:35:42.980 And so your, you know, different body types are 00:35:42.980 --> 00:35:46.659 going to lead into different things. And like, 00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:49.199 that's your genetic component even down to like 00:35:49.199 --> 00:35:53.860 I remember getting my like genetic code done 00:35:53.860 --> 00:35:57.559 for some kind of like like health metric essentially 00:35:57.559 --> 00:36:00.940 and they were looking a little different snippets 00:36:00.940 --> 00:36:03.800 and the excuse me the doctor was talking to me 00:36:03.800 --> 00:36:05.820 he was like are you a strength athlete and I 00:36:05.820 --> 00:36:08.599 was like yeah he was like I can tell and that 00:36:08.599 --> 00:36:10.699 like that's probably what you would do better 00:36:10.699 --> 00:36:12.760 at and that your endurance, like traditionally 00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:15.940 speaking, women are better at endurance versus 00:36:15.940 --> 00:36:19.380 like true concentric strength and power. Whereas 00:36:19.380 --> 00:36:22.000 like, that's not where I lean towards. And so 00:36:22.000 --> 00:36:27.119 I think that's something also that needs to be 00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:29.360 talked about that maybe ties into this room going 00:36:29.360 --> 00:36:31.559 off in a completely different tangent is that 00:36:31.559 --> 00:36:35.920 when people are young, exposing them to a variety 00:36:35.920 --> 00:36:40.019 of things. One, for the reason that we talked 00:36:40.019 --> 00:36:42.460 about in that like they're going to discover 00:36:42.460 --> 00:36:45.739 something that maybe they're better at or like 00:36:45.739 --> 00:36:49.400 in comparison to others. And then the tangent 00:36:49.400 --> 00:36:51.280 would be in that it's also going to help them 00:36:51.280 --> 00:36:54.619 like developmentally be stronger, have more resilient 00:36:54.619 --> 00:36:57.780 bodies, be less prone to injury in the future 00:36:57.780 --> 00:37:01.079 and so on and so forth. But I mean, your body 00:37:01.079 --> 00:37:03.679 type is going to play a role into. quote unquote, 00:37:03.800 --> 00:37:05.260 what you're good at. And if we think about the 00:37:05.260 --> 00:37:06.780 fire ground, like I talk to people about this 00:37:06.780 --> 00:37:09.800 all the time, like firefighting is like a big 00:37:09.800 --> 00:37:11.719 person's game. And when I say big person, I mean 00:37:11.719 --> 00:37:15.079 like a large body, like a taller person has more, 00:37:15.139 --> 00:37:17.460 like it's a lot easier to throw a 24 foot ladder 00:37:17.460 --> 00:37:20.659 when you're 6 '2 versus when you're 5 '2. It's 00:37:20.659 --> 00:37:24.420 a lot easier to haul 70 pounds of gear when I 00:37:24.420 --> 00:37:28.880 weigh 200 pounds versus if I weigh 130. And so 00:37:28.880 --> 00:37:33.369 like you're... body type size, it plays a role. 00:37:33.510 --> 00:37:35.570 That's not to say it's going to limit you forever 00:37:35.570 --> 00:37:37.929 and ever. But it's something you need to take 00:37:37.929 --> 00:37:41.230 into consideration. There's something I ask a 00:37:41.230 --> 00:37:44.030 lot of the coaches and people that were high 00:37:44.030 --> 00:37:46.710 level athletes when they were younger. The backstory 00:37:46.710 --> 00:37:48.789 when I first came to the States, and I've said 00:37:48.789 --> 00:37:50.329 this many times on here, so people have probably 00:37:50.329 --> 00:37:54.969 heard it, you know, way too much. But I kept, 00:37:54.969 --> 00:37:56.829 you know, after being here a little while, I 00:37:56.829 --> 00:37:59.289 kept hearing the same what I call Uncle Rico 00:37:59.289 --> 00:38:01.340 story. Well, I would have, should have, could 00:38:01.340 --> 00:38:04.280 have if it wasn't for my ACL, my MCL, my labrum, 00:38:04.420 --> 00:38:06.179 et cetera, et cetera. And these are people that 00:38:06.179 --> 00:38:09.000 are, you know, late 20s, early 30s, and now they're 00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:12.159 very deconditioned. And so it was really when 00:38:12.159 --> 00:38:14.340 I started the podcast, I really started unpacking, 00:38:14.360 --> 00:38:17.079 like, what are we doing to our children, our 00:38:17.079 --> 00:38:20.440 youth athletes? Because you have this high level 00:38:20.440 --> 00:38:23.139 of performance in high school that you don't 00:38:23.139 --> 00:38:25.079 see in British schools, not when I was growing 00:38:25.079 --> 00:38:27.099 up, at least. The best footballers obviously 00:38:27.099 --> 00:38:29.300 would get groomed and, you know, sent through. 00:38:30.259 --> 00:38:33.139 you know, training routes that ended up at Liverpool, 00:38:33.260 --> 00:38:34.800 Manchester and everyone else. But the rest of 00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:37.440 us just played sports. That was it. But after 00:38:37.440 --> 00:38:39.820 you finish school, people kept playing sports, 00:38:39.940 --> 00:38:42.159 cricket and rugby and football, you know, pub 00:38:42.159 --> 00:38:45.099 leagues and local leagues. But here you saw this 00:38:45.099 --> 00:38:47.199 super high level, you know, the weight rooms 00:38:47.199 --> 00:38:48.800 and all this kind of things in high schools and 00:38:48.800 --> 00:38:51.940 colleges. But then this steep drop off, you know, 00:38:51.960 --> 00:38:53.940 when there was, you know, mental burnout, injuries, 00:38:54.119 --> 00:38:57.639 et cetera. And you didn't have this. environment 00:38:57.639 --> 00:39:01.920 for continued sports participation in 34 year 00:39:01.920 --> 00:39:04.260 olds that you do see in other places in Europe. 00:39:04.559 --> 00:39:09.760 So to me, what I realized is that in some areas, 00:39:10.079 --> 00:39:14.340 the performance, the result of a game is more 00:39:14.340 --> 00:39:16.320 important than the well -being and longevity 00:39:16.320 --> 00:39:19.199 of the youth athlete. So what's your thoughts 00:39:19.199 --> 00:39:23.579 on that? Yeah, I was actually talking to one 00:39:23.579 --> 00:39:27.349 of our assistant coaches this week. about kind 00:39:27.349 --> 00:39:32.170 of this idea in that similar to you and that 00:39:32.170 --> 00:39:36.409 like in spain when you're growing up like you 00:39:36.409 --> 00:39:39.630 play sports in school but it's as like part of 00:39:39.630 --> 00:39:42.190 pe class like at least in the school that i went 00:39:42.190 --> 00:39:44.750 to we like in like the neighboring schools we 00:39:44.750 --> 00:39:47.769 didn't have organized sport the way they do in 00:39:47.769 --> 00:39:49.369 like middle school and high school here that's 00:39:49.369 --> 00:39:54.090 all club um and so if you're participating in 00:39:54.090 --> 00:39:57.159 club like yes they do care about like Winning 00:39:57.159 --> 00:39:59.659 and such, but also because there's so many years 00:39:59.659 --> 00:40:02.420 prior to even reaching that point, unless you're 00:40:02.420 --> 00:40:05.079 like such high level, you're, you're being pulled 00:40:05.079 --> 00:40:07.260 out and essentially like groomed to participate 00:40:07.260 --> 00:40:13.360 in sport. You're playing for fun, like, like, 00:40:13.460 --> 00:40:16.199 I don't want to say strict fun, like they take 00:40:16.199 --> 00:40:20.840 it seriously, but it's still fun. And that here, 00:40:21.039 --> 00:40:27.119 I think we as a country. in the us we put so 00:40:27.119 --> 00:40:36.039 much um value in high level athletics that it 00:40:36.039 --> 00:40:41.219 becomes the thing and that like and this is again 00:40:41.219 --> 00:40:43.739 a bias that i recognize in myself too like we 00:40:43.739 --> 00:40:46.320 didn't grow up watching sports in my family like 00:40:46.320 --> 00:40:48.300 we didn't watch sports on tv or anything like 00:40:48.300 --> 00:40:51.940 that so i didn't grow up um putting a high value 00:40:51.940 --> 00:40:55.780 on professional athletes like Any more than any 00:40:55.780 --> 00:40:59.699 other profession. Right. And so like, I thought 00:40:59.699 --> 00:41:02.519 they were cool. Like, that's awesome. But they 00:41:02.519 --> 00:41:06.659 weren't like the ultimate. Whereas here now as 00:41:06.659 --> 00:41:08.960 an adult, like I look at what professions get 00:41:08.960 --> 00:41:11.980 put up, you know, on the billboards that every 00:41:11.980 --> 00:41:14.199 kid wants to be. It's a professional athlete, 00:41:14.300 --> 00:41:16.800 which like the performance coach in me loves. 00:41:16.900 --> 00:41:19.559 I'm like, yes, like this person wants to play 00:41:19.559 --> 00:41:21.159 sports for the rest of their life, which is so 00:41:21.159 --> 00:41:27.789 cool. think it's a disservice because then if 00:41:27.789 --> 00:41:32.170 if you're not that then what are you like if 00:41:32.170 --> 00:41:37.170 that's what I'm striving for which like the majority 00:41:37.170 --> 00:41:40.070 of football players I worked with in college 00:41:40.070 --> 00:41:43.449 like you're not going to the NFL like and most 00:41:43.449 --> 00:41:45.230 of the people aren't even making it to the collegiate 00:41:45.230 --> 00:41:47.349 level like percentage wise I don't know what 00:41:47.349 --> 00:41:48.829 those are off the top of my head but they are 00:41:48.829 --> 00:41:55.250 teeny tiny and so um like If not that, then what 00:41:55.250 --> 00:41:58.070 am I? And I think that's where like, I think 00:41:58.070 --> 00:41:59.769 I've heard you call them Uncle Rico stories, 00:41:59.929 --> 00:42:03.489 right? Here is, that's where that comes into 00:42:03.489 --> 00:42:06.050 because if I couldn't be that, then why even 00:42:06.050 --> 00:42:09.630 bother? Why even bother to continue participating 00:42:09.630 --> 00:42:15.449 if I couldn't level up? Well, first of all, hopefully 00:42:15.449 --> 00:42:16.989 because of the love of the game, if that's what 00:42:16.989 --> 00:42:20.219 you were playing, right? But even below that, 00:42:20.320 --> 00:42:23.280 because we're human bodies and we're, you know, 00:42:23.280 --> 00:42:25.579 we're meant to move our bodies. That's how they, 00:42:25.599 --> 00:42:28.699 like how they work the best. And so for like 00:42:28.699 --> 00:42:30.739 your health and your longevity purposes, that 00:42:30.739 --> 00:42:34.139 would be why. But if it wasn't, you know, I didn't 00:42:34.139 --> 00:42:36.599 do it just for the love of the game, then why 00:42:36.599 --> 00:42:40.119 do it at all? Which to a degree I get, because 00:42:40.119 --> 00:42:42.500 like when I couldn't compete the way I wanted 00:42:42.500 --> 00:42:44.820 to, I was like, screw it, I'm not going to compete. 00:42:46.599 --> 00:42:50.880 But doesn't mean I stopped. Like I still did 00:42:50.880 --> 00:42:53.699 just chose like, okay, I'm not going to be a 00:42:53.699 --> 00:42:57.440 recreational competition. I can do true club, 00:42:57.519 --> 00:43:02.900 but like I can still do. Yeah. I mean, it's really 00:43:02.900 --> 00:43:04.800 interesting unpacking it as well. Cause you have 00:43:04.800 --> 00:43:07.519 this, Oh God, what's that? I don't know why my 00:43:07.519 --> 00:43:11.940 brain's not working very well today. This. What 00:43:11.940 --> 00:43:16.400 is that term? Specificity. There we go. So you've 00:43:16.400 --> 00:43:18.539 got these kids now and let's say they're a baseball 00:43:18.539 --> 00:43:20.380 pitcher and they're pitching and they're doing 00:43:20.380 --> 00:43:21.960 these strength and conditioning camps and they're 00:43:21.960 --> 00:43:24.280 doing travel ball and then they blow their shoulder 00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:27.039 out when they're 15 years old. And you listen 00:43:27.039 --> 00:43:29.719 to, again, so many coaches like yourself and 00:43:29.719 --> 00:43:32.199 athletes as well. It's the multi -sport athletes 00:43:32.199 --> 00:43:34.599 that tend to do the best. And you think about 00:43:34.599 --> 00:43:36.739 it, mentally, they're not just doing this one 00:43:36.739 --> 00:43:39.460 sport over and over again. But also physically, 00:43:39.599 --> 00:43:41.340 all those different planes of motion, all the 00:43:41.340 --> 00:43:44.219 different team dynamics, it makes perfect sense. 00:43:44.539 --> 00:43:47.360 But there's so much money in this kind of training 00:43:47.360 --> 00:43:50.199 the youth athlete. And I've always said this. 00:43:50.239 --> 00:43:52.019 You're telling me, for example, if you live in 00:43:52.019 --> 00:43:54.300 Florida and your child is into baseball, that 00:43:54.300 --> 00:43:56.559 no one in the state of Florida can challenge 00:43:56.559 --> 00:43:58.860 your child, that your child is so good that you 00:43:58.860 --> 00:44:01.639 have to go to Georgia or North Carolina. It doesn't 00:44:01.639 --> 00:44:03.159 even make any sense when you think about it. 00:44:03.840 --> 00:44:10.519 It is. I have two boys, a seven -year -old and 00:44:10.519 --> 00:44:14.119 a four -year -old. The four -year -old does swim 00:44:14.119 --> 00:44:16.079 class to learn how to swim and things like that, 00:44:16.119 --> 00:44:18.420 but he's not really interested in sport right 00:44:18.420 --> 00:44:23.199 now. My seven -year -old, he does jujitsu. He's 00:44:23.199 --> 00:44:26.739 played soccer and things like that, but he's 00:44:26.739 --> 00:44:30.000 into jujitsu and that's his thing, which is cool 00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:34.400 because it's kind of a different... youth sport 00:44:34.400 --> 00:44:38.420 model than what I hear like you know my friends 00:44:38.420 --> 00:44:40.340 and my co -workers talk about when they're like 00:44:40.340 --> 00:44:43.440 doing baseball for like seven months out of the 00:44:43.440 --> 00:44:47.199 year or something like that um and you know traveling 00:44:47.199 --> 00:44:49.340 and all these sorts of things I've coached at 00:44:49.340 --> 00:44:52.380 the like I've done a couple hockey camps I've 00:44:52.380 --> 00:44:54.619 taught yoga at hockey camp which is like so funny 00:44:54.619 --> 00:44:58.760 but um teaching six -year -olds how to do yoga 00:44:58.760 --> 00:45:01.320 is a that is a challenge and a really fun endeavor 00:45:01.320 --> 00:45:07.420 but these kids are specific wow I cannot my brain 00:45:07.420 --> 00:45:09.719 won't work either specializing I was gonna say 00:45:09.719 --> 00:45:16.099 specifying specializing um really young and it's 00:45:16.099 --> 00:45:20.260 and I see how it happens because I too am a parent 00:45:20.260 --> 00:45:24.119 like I see how you participate in one thing you're 00:45:24.119 --> 00:45:27.630 like oh I just They're doing okay, but they love 00:45:27.630 --> 00:45:29.789 it. I want them to be able to do better and enjoy 00:45:29.789 --> 00:45:32.210 it because they like it when they win. And so 00:45:32.210 --> 00:45:34.269 we're going to do more of it because when I do 00:45:34.269 --> 00:45:38.449 more of it, then they get better at it. In motor 00:45:38.449 --> 00:45:42.570 behavior, there is an entire line of research 00:45:42.570 --> 00:45:48.050 around how you look at practice. And you could 00:45:48.050 --> 00:45:52.769 throw whatever like sport movement pattern, whatever 00:45:52.769 --> 00:45:57.289 into practice, right? And so when you're looking 00:45:57.289 --> 00:45:58.929 at practice, there's this thing called block 00:45:58.929 --> 00:46:01.650 practice where you do the exact same thing over 00:46:01.650 --> 00:46:04.789 and over again. And then there's sequential where 00:46:04.789 --> 00:46:06.409 it's like, I'm always going to do A followed 00:46:06.409 --> 00:46:09.010 by B followed by C followed by D. And then there's 00:46:09.010 --> 00:46:12.269 random where it's like, you know, I still have 00:46:12.269 --> 00:46:16.409 those same letters A through Z of drills or whatever. 00:46:16.789 --> 00:46:19.769 And I'm just going to at random do them. And 00:46:19.769 --> 00:46:21.869 what you find time and time again is that when 00:46:21.869 --> 00:46:25.070 people do block practice, they get better. at 00:46:25.070 --> 00:46:29.590 that exact scenario. And then when you do, you 00:46:29.590 --> 00:46:33.929 know, sequential, they don't look as good as 00:46:33.929 --> 00:46:36.710 they did for that exact scenario as the people 00:46:36.710 --> 00:46:39.550 who do block practice, but they do better in 00:46:39.550 --> 00:46:43.710 real life scenario. And then the same is true 00:46:43.710 --> 00:46:46.250 for people who do random things. So, you know, 00:46:46.269 --> 00:46:50.190 when you're testing them in like a confined setting, 00:46:50.289 --> 00:46:52.389 they don't do as well. But when you're putting 00:46:52.389 --> 00:46:54.329 them into the real world, they do well. I promise 00:46:54.329 --> 00:46:57.050 I'm going to bring this around. And that if we 00:46:57.050 --> 00:47:03.570 look at physical development as the entire of 00:47:03.570 --> 00:47:08.030 life, right? If life is the entire sequence of 00:47:08.030 --> 00:47:12.389 practice, if you are doing the same thing every 00:47:12.389 --> 00:47:17.519 single year over and over again, you are going 00:47:17.519 --> 00:47:20.019 to get really good at that one thing and have 00:47:20.019 --> 00:47:23.699 huge glaring holes in others, which is why we 00:47:23.699 --> 00:47:25.940 have kids throw out their shoulders and have 00:47:25.940 --> 00:47:28.900 multiple, you know, surgeries by the time they're 00:47:28.900 --> 00:47:32.880 17 years old. Versus if we took, again, looking 00:47:32.880 --> 00:47:34.960 at the big spectrum, if we took more of a random 00:47:34.960 --> 00:47:37.599 approach and if that approach is different sports 00:47:37.599 --> 00:47:40.599 that they can participate in, so that way they 00:47:40.599 --> 00:47:44.289 can develop, you know. different things because 00:47:44.289 --> 00:47:47.630 each sport has something to offer but also lacks 00:47:47.630 --> 00:47:50.409 something else so that way we can develop well 00:47:50.409 --> 00:47:56.010 -rounded you know robust bodies and minds by 00:47:56.010 --> 00:47:58.449 the time they're now entering the truly competitive 00:47:58.449 --> 00:48:02.690 phase of like high school to go into college 00:48:02.690 --> 00:48:06.289 to go on further if that's what they are but 00:48:06.289 --> 00:48:09.429 then also robust bodies that can just survive 00:48:09.429 --> 00:48:14.260 you know the the world and the fire service like 00:48:14.260 --> 00:48:16.639 i see it in the academies where people have played 00:48:16.639 --> 00:48:18.920 a single sport for a really really long time 00:48:18.920 --> 00:48:21.940 and we're constantly battling you know the same 00:48:21.940 --> 00:48:26.179 injury that is from that sport and we're not 00:48:26.179 --> 00:48:28.099 playing the sport anymore but we're still seeing 00:48:28.099 --> 00:48:31.739 like the the effects of it i guess is a good 00:48:31.739 --> 00:48:35.039 way of saying it i think one of the the areas 00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:36.739 that we've done a lot of damage as well is this 00:48:36.739 --> 00:48:40.789 whole participation trophy conversation Because, 00:48:40.789 --> 00:48:42.690 again, it's sending the message that if you didn't 00:48:42.690 --> 00:48:45.610 win, then, as you said, who are you? You didn't 00:48:45.610 --> 00:48:47.489 win. So what was the point? Why did you even 00:48:47.489 --> 00:48:50.309 show up? You didn't win. Rather than, and I point 00:48:50.309 --> 00:48:52.469 this out all the time, if you go to a tough mudder 00:48:52.469 --> 00:48:55.449 and you run a half marathon with all these obstacles 00:48:55.449 --> 00:48:57.550 and get electrocuted and climb under barbed wire, 00:48:57.670 --> 00:48:59.130 and at the end, what do they put around your 00:48:59.130 --> 00:49:01.730 neck? A participation trophy. Does it mean that 00:49:01.730 --> 00:49:03.670 you didn't put any effort in? No, you just ran 00:49:03.670 --> 00:49:05.750 half marathon through mud and barbed wire and 00:49:05.750 --> 00:49:08.719 electrical wires. There's a difference between, 00:49:08.800 --> 00:49:11.619 and I've never witnessed this to date, a team 00:49:11.619 --> 00:49:13.900 of kids that put zero effort in that they just 00:49:13.900 --> 00:49:16.179 gave a bunch of trophies to. But I've seen lots 00:49:16.179 --> 00:49:18.159 of children that showed up for practice week 00:49:18.159 --> 00:49:20.280 in, week out, in the rain, in the cold, in the 00:49:20.280 --> 00:49:23.099 heat, tried their hardest and just weren't the 00:49:23.099 --> 00:49:25.760 best kids on the field and didn't win. But they 00:49:25.760 --> 00:49:28.579 got a trophy to say, you showed up all season 00:49:28.579 --> 00:49:31.159 and you put the work in. So I think that kind 00:49:31.159 --> 00:49:33.440 of rhetoric, which again comes from the same 00:49:33.440 --> 00:49:35.880 roided out, beard wearing ding -dongs that we 00:49:35.880 --> 00:49:39.280 see on... Instagram or the ones that are in the, 00:49:39.280 --> 00:49:41.019 you know, the lazy boys that never even do any 00:49:41.019 --> 00:49:44.119 exercise themselves is that we should be encouraging 00:49:44.119 --> 00:49:46.900 kids to just play. Like you said, in Spain, you 00:49:46.900 --> 00:49:49.139 know, you have the elitism. Okay. That's great. 00:49:49.199 --> 00:49:50.840 You go, go be on the television and everyone 00:49:50.840 --> 00:49:53.539 else it's called playing sport. You're not supposed 00:49:53.539 --> 00:49:56.940 to win every single game. No, no sports team 00:49:56.940 --> 00:49:58.920 on the planet has ever won every, every single 00:49:58.920 --> 00:50:01.940 game. So I think that's a very damaging narrative 00:50:01.940 --> 00:50:05.179 as well as to dissuade children. by saying if 00:50:05.179 --> 00:50:08.380 you didn't win you don't deserve a trophy yeah 00:50:08.380 --> 00:50:12.480 i think what this also brings up for me is like 00:50:12.480 --> 00:50:19.739 this classification of athlete as well in that 00:50:19.739 --> 00:50:25.739 like every something that i see now that i feel 00:50:25.739 --> 00:50:29.480 like i didn't see 15 10 years ago is that now 00:50:29.480 --> 00:50:32.099 everybody is an athlete which like Don't get 00:50:32.099 --> 00:50:34.480 me wrong. I want everybody moving. I think there 00:50:34.480 --> 00:50:37.039 are things that every human being should be able 00:50:37.039 --> 00:50:40.619 to do. And I think they should have qualities 00:50:40.619 --> 00:50:43.780 that most people would consider athletic. But 00:50:43.780 --> 00:50:49.420 in my opinion, similar to how like you, if you 00:50:49.420 --> 00:50:52.460 go out in sport and playing the game is like 00:50:52.460 --> 00:50:55.719 cool. You like, if you go out and play soccer, 00:50:55.820 --> 00:50:58.900 you are a soccer player. That is like, there's 00:50:58.900 --> 00:51:02.000 the pride. And then if you win. awesome then 00:51:02.000 --> 00:51:05.159 you get a trophy or whatever it is but like you're 00:51:05.159 --> 00:51:08.659 out playing soccer I think and again this is 00:51:08.659 --> 00:51:11.320 a bias that I recognize I think having been a 00:51:11.320 --> 00:51:13.099 highly competitive athlete and having worked 00:51:13.099 --> 00:51:15.420 with highly competitive athletes who like put 00:51:15.420 --> 00:51:18.280 every like I was considering working at like 00:51:18.280 --> 00:51:20.519 a part -time at a bank just so that way I could 00:51:20.519 --> 00:51:24.860 train like the things that in my opinion athletes 00:51:24.860 --> 00:51:28.880 do because they compete now whether that be at 00:51:28.880 --> 00:51:31.440 a recreational level but like they have some 00:51:31.440 --> 00:51:34.039 skin in the game of like i'm actually going up 00:51:34.039 --> 00:51:38.340 against somebody to like measure quote -unquote 00:51:38.340 --> 00:51:41.699 who's best then i get to like make that claim 00:51:41.699 --> 00:51:46.159 versus like the participation trophy in my opinion 00:51:46.159 --> 00:51:48.179 for adults is like them getting to call themselves 00:51:48.179 --> 00:51:49.480 an athlete it's like cool if you're going to 00:51:49.480 --> 00:51:51.340 be an athlete like you got to prove it somewhere 00:51:53.210 --> 00:51:55.050 because people don't get to call themselves like 00:51:55.050 --> 00:51:58.989 an NBA player, not playing the NBA. Not that, 00:51:59.030 --> 00:52:01.010 you know, most people are playing in the NBA, 00:52:01.070 --> 00:52:03.650 but like, to me, that's the participation trophy. 00:52:03.730 --> 00:52:05.250 I'm an adult. It's like, I'm an athlete. I'm 00:52:05.250 --> 00:52:08.329 like, you should be in shape, but like athletes 00:52:08.329 --> 00:52:11.130 compete. Are you competing? Yes. Okay, great. 00:52:11.210 --> 00:52:14.909 And cool. Love that for you. But yeah, that's, 00:52:14.909 --> 00:52:18.650 that's my little, little soapbox of competition 00:52:18.650 --> 00:52:21.779 of like, you know, participation trophies. Yeah, 00:52:21.779 --> 00:52:25.480 I was an athlete, martial artist. So I did compete 00:52:25.480 --> 00:52:29.760 in taekwondo, won national tournaments. But again, 00:52:30.599 --> 00:52:33.000 you know, at my weight, at my belt, in my division. 00:52:33.019 --> 00:52:35.019 So when you kind of filter it down, it wasn't 00:52:35.019 --> 00:52:37.960 like I beat everyone in the UK, every fighter 00:52:37.960 --> 00:52:42.320 by any means. That's good. It's a great achievement. 00:52:42.400 --> 00:52:44.760 So and then when I went to university, my sports 00:52:44.760 --> 00:52:47.219 science lecturers were actually taekwondo coaches. 00:52:47.719 --> 00:52:50.579 So I fought for my college then as well. That's 00:52:50.579 --> 00:52:52.920 cool. So I got a taste of that. It's kind of 00:52:52.920 --> 00:52:55.519 a good segue though. But then I entered the fire 00:52:55.519 --> 00:52:58.679 service. All of a sudden I shift now to tactical 00:52:58.679 --> 00:53:01.159 athlete, which I think is far more important 00:53:01.159 --> 00:53:03.559 than, you know, little high kicking men on the 00:53:03.559 --> 00:53:07.139 top of a plastic trophy. So let's kind of transition 00:53:07.139 --> 00:53:08.679 then. And if you want to put your disclaimer 00:53:08.679 --> 00:53:11.519 in now, this would be a good time to do it. Talk 00:53:11.519 --> 00:53:13.980 to me about the front door when you first went 00:53:13.980 --> 00:53:18.690 into Pflugerville. Any kind of myths that you 00:53:18.690 --> 00:53:20.889 brought in that were busted? And then what was 00:53:20.889 --> 00:53:22.889 the kind of environment when you walked through 00:53:22.889 --> 00:53:26.650 the front? Yeah, so just quick disclaimer, anything 00:53:26.650 --> 00:53:29.650 that I share here is my personal opinion and 00:53:29.650 --> 00:53:32.070 my experience. It doesn't reflect the opinion 00:53:32.070 --> 00:53:35.690 of that of my employer, right? And so some really 00:53:35.690 --> 00:53:37.829 interesting things that I learned even just in 00:53:37.829 --> 00:53:40.989 the application process that I didn't know and 00:53:40.989 --> 00:53:42.730 that it's something that I share with coaches 00:53:42.730 --> 00:53:45.329 who say they want to come into tactical now is 00:53:45.329 --> 00:53:49.969 like, everybody thinks tactical and by nature, 00:53:50.010 --> 00:53:52.289 a lot of the things that apply to the military, 00:53:52.489 --> 00:53:54.809 they think apply overall. So like having grown 00:53:54.809 --> 00:53:58.150 up around the military, like I know that like 00:53:58.150 --> 00:54:00.929 people have to make specific like fitness standards 00:54:00.929 --> 00:54:02.710 and they're being tested on their fitness on 00:54:02.710 --> 00:54:05.590 minimally an annual basis and so on and so forth. 00:54:05.690 --> 00:54:08.610 I thought that like, that was true in the fire 00:54:08.610 --> 00:54:11.789 service. Not because I knew of anything, just 00:54:11.789 --> 00:54:14.630 because I made the assumption that like. oh, 00:54:14.809 --> 00:54:17.210 well, like it would make sense for them to be 00:54:17.210 --> 00:54:20.210 in shape. They're all over the country. And, 00:54:20.329 --> 00:54:23.590 you know, I knew that the NFPA existed, but I 00:54:23.590 --> 00:54:26.070 didn't know like recommendation versus requirement 00:54:26.070 --> 00:54:28.309 and all these things, right. Going in, I was 00:54:28.309 --> 00:54:31.949 like, oh, it would make sense that every firefighter 00:54:31.949 --> 00:54:34.389 on the planet, or at least in our country, like 00:54:34.389 --> 00:54:37.929 does that. And so that was a huge, like myth 00:54:37.929 --> 00:54:40.530 busted in itself. And that I was like, okay, 00:54:40.590 --> 00:54:44.989 learning that's not the case. And then what was 00:54:44.989 --> 00:54:48.250 even crazier to me was that like, we could be, 00:54:48.250 --> 00:54:51.449 you know, a single department can butt up to 00:54:51.449 --> 00:54:54.190 another department, and they can do things completely 00:54:54.190 --> 00:54:57.409 differently that they really were, you know, 00:54:57.409 --> 00:55:00.469 all these individual little islands that like, 00:55:00.469 --> 00:55:04.429 obviously work together, but do things completely 00:55:04.429 --> 00:55:06.949 differently, which is like, that was something 00:55:06.949 --> 00:55:09.610 that blew my mind coming into work with a fire 00:55:09.610 --> 00:55:15.210 service. And so When I came in to start working 00:55:15.210 --> 00:55:19.809 with Pflugerville, it was so much fun. We were 00:55:19.809 --> 00:55:22.070 small. I mean, we're still relatively small, 00:55:22.230 --> 00:55:24.650 a little over 200 people now, but there was only 00:55:24.650 --> 00:55:28.570 75 people there when I first started. And so 00:55:28.570 --> 00:55:34.269 I got to know every single person. Essentially, 00:55:34.309 --> 00:55:38.650 the way I was coaching just one football team. 00:55:39.420 --> 00:55:41.039 that's the amount of people, right? I was, I 00:55:41.039 --> 00:55:46.340 was dealing with. And so I wasn't the first attempt 00:55:46.340 --> 00:55:48.719 at health and fitness within our department. 00:55:48.860 --> 00:55:51.559 It actually, I was hired in 2016. They actually 00:55:51.559 --> 00:55:55.860 started some of that in 2011 with like some annual 00:55:55.860 --> 00:56:03.050 testing. And then they had hired a a contractor 00:56:03.050 --> 00:56:06.190 who came in he was a gentleman who owned a local 00:56:06.190 --> 00:56:09.570 gym to to train the firefighters and i think 00:56:09.570 --> 00:56:15.889 unfortunately um didn't know either a who he 00:56:15.889 --> 00:56:19.389 was working with in their needs or b the ability 00:56:19.389 --> 00:56:21.550 to do that was outside of his skill set and he 00:56:21.550 --> 00:56:25.150 just maybe wasn't aware of that but unfortunately 00:56:25.150 --> 00:56:29.679 he left a bad taste in their mouth for exercise 00:56:29.679 --> 00:56:35.300 people, quote unquote, coming in. But the good 00:56:35.300 --> 00:56:38.119 news is he was the complete opposite of me. And 00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:40.719 so from my understanding, he looked a little 00:56:40.719 --> 00:56:46.559 bit, you know, like the ding dong, bearded, alpha, 00:56:46.880 --> 00:56:50.739 macho, do this because it's hard. Not like, hey, 00:56:50.760 --> 00:56:52.420 we're going to do this, which is actually what's 00:56:52.420 --> 00:56:54.280 going to make you better at X, Y, and Z from 00:56:54.280 --> 00:56:58.469 like a progressive standpoint. It's like. eat 00:56:58.469 --> 00:57:01.010 dirt because then you're tough kind of thing. 00:57:01.389 --> 00:57:05.630 Um, and so he was like, I was the complete opposite 00:57:05.630 --> 00:57:09.409 of him. And so either a, I was welcomed with 00:57:09.409 --> 00:57:14.789 open arms or B I was met with skepticism because 00:57:14.789 --> 00:57:18.949 of their previous experience. But I think with 00:57:18.949 --> 00:57:21.429 time getting to know people, you know, effectively 00:57:21.429 --> 00:57:23.750 coaching people, so on and so forth, like that 00:57:23.750 --> 00:57:25.809 dissipated pretty quickly when they learned, 00:57:25.869 --> 00:57:30.889 Oh, this is not that. And so, yeah, that's kind 00:57:30.889 --> 00:57:33.449 of what I met up front. There was a little resistance 00:57:33.449 --> 00:57:36.670 up front as there is with anything, but I think 00:57:36.670 --> 00:57:39.750 I had a relatively, quote unquote, like easy 00:57:39.750 --> 00:57:42.630 going of it in comparison to other people who 00:57:42.630 --> 00:57:47.389 are starting programs at departments. What was 00:57:47.389 --> 00:57:50.170 your training philosophy when you first entered? 00:57:50.269 --> 00:57:52.670 Because there's so much evolution in this world 00:57:52.670 --> 00:57:55.710 the last 10 years. How did you kind of view the 00:57:55.710 --> 00:57:58.539 tactical athlete in training them? year one and 00:57:58.539 --> 00:58:05.360 how has that evolved to 2025 um i had a i still 00:58:05.360 --> 00:58:09.039 have it it's people won't might not like this 00:58:09.039 --> 00:58:12.000 but like the mindset i had going in was that 00:58:12.000 --> 00:58:17.159 firefighters are not athletes because my definition 00:58:17.159 --> 00:58:21.159 of an athlete was somebody who was putting their 00:58:21.159 --> 00:58:25.579 training above everything else so like A lot 00:58:25.579 --> 00:58:27.280 of times when I was working with student athletes, 00:58:27.500 --> 00:58:29.619 it wasn't hard to get them to train. It wasn't 00:58:29.619 --> 00:58:31.579 hard to get them to come to practice. It was 00:58:31.579 --> 00:58:35.039 hard to get them to like do their homework, you 00:58:35.039 --> 00:58:39.179 know, go to class. Like they were athlete students. 00:58:40.559 --> 00:58:47.659 And so what you could ask of them before they 00:58:47.659 --> 00:58:52.280 would gripe, what you could push them to before 00:58:52.280 --> 00:58:55.300 they would be like, yeah, I'm not doing that 00:58:55.300 --> 00:58:59.860 was pretty high because also like they're at 00:58:59.860 --> 00:59:02.000 a point where like, they've been doing this to 00:59:02.000 --> 00:59:05.019 some degree for so long. It is the status quo 00:59:05.019 --> 00:59:08.380 of training. And so they have relatively high 00:59:08.380 --> 00:59:11.300 training ages depending on, you know, whether 00:59:11.300 --> 00:59:13.300 they're freshmen or seniors that changes, but 00:59:13.300 --> 00:59:15.920 like, I know what their bodies are currently 00:59:15.920 --> 00:59:18.159 capable of so on and so forth based on the sport 00:59:18.159 --> 00:59:21.719 demand, all these things. And so going in. I 00:59:21.719 --> 00:59:24.079 brought the methodology of high -quality training. 00:59:24.199 --> 00:59:26.739 That applies to anybody, in my opinion, whether 00:59:26.739 --> 00:59:29.539 we're talking about the collegiate athlete, the 00:59:29.539 --> 00:59:35.699 firefighter, or my 70 -year -old grandma, or 00:59:35.699 --> 00:59:41.360 a desk jockey who does that. High -quality training 00:59:41.360 --> 00:59:44.280 is high -quality training. It looks at, hey, 00:59:44.300 --> 00:59:47.139 what are the demands? Where do they currently 00:59:47.139 --> 00:59:51.820 sit? So what are they lacking to reach those 00:59:51.820 --> 00:59:54.039 demands and how can we make them more robust? 00:59:55.320 --> 00:59:57.500 In my opinion, that's not training an athlete. 00:59:57.519 --> 00:59:59.039 That's just high quality training, regardless 00:59:59.039 --> 01:00:02.380 of who you're talking about. And so that was 01:00:02.380 --> 01:00:06.320 my approach in taking that. And what I did at 01:00:06.320 --> 01:00:09.099 the time, especially because we had so few people, 01:00:09.099 --> 01:00:14.050 is there were some... points of autonomy where 01:00:14.050 --> 01:00:16.170 you could choose what you were doing, but we 01:00:16.170 --> 01:00:17.730 were all going to do the same thing. So that 01:00:17.730 --> 01:00:22.170 way I knew that everybody could move sufficiently 01:00:22.170 --> 01:00:26.789 in overall movement patterns. Because once they 01:00:26.789 --> 01:00:30.489 know how to do that, then we can start doing, 01:00:30.550 --> 01:00:33.869 you know, some, some real fun things or those 01:00:33.869 --> 01:00:38.429 who want can push even further. But if you push 01:00:38.429 --> 01:00:44.619 far on, you know, unstable joints weak systems 01:00:44.619 --> 01:00:48.119 that's how people end up getting hurt and so 01:00:48.119 --> 01:00:50.739 it has always been my approach and still is my 01:00:50.739 --> 01:00:55.699 approach to like build a robust human body in 01:00:55.699 --> 01:01:01.420 a way that they enjoy it what has changed maybe 01:01:01.420 --> 01:01:03.820 not drastically but maybe has become more of 01:01:03.820 --> 01:01:07.719 an emphasis now you know in 2025 versus then 01:01:07.719 --> 01:01:13.300 is that I think the largest component of my job 01:01:13.300 --> 01:01:17.760 is for people to have a positive experience with 01:01:17.760 --> 01:01:21.280 health and fitness. And I make that clear to 01:01:21.280 --> 01:01:26.159 everybody who comes in and wants to work with 01:01:26.159 --> 01:01:29.280 us, whether or not like that. I have a few like 01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:31.880 contracted coaches that come in and work. I have 01:01:31.880 --> 01:01:36.989 an assistant coach. or like just you know anybody 01:01:36.989 --> 01:01:38.849 who wants to come in and speak on it and so on 01:01:38.849 --> 01:01:40.929 so forth or my my health and fitness work group 01:01:40.929 --> 01:01:42.769 which is like my pure fitness trainers essentially 01:01:42.769 --> 01:01:46.030 and that our job is to give people a positive 01:01:46.030 --> 01:01:48.570 experience with health and fitness and like if 01:01:48.570 --> 01:01:50.590 there is a time to like you know light a fire 01:01:50.590 --> 01:01:54.010 under their ass we will do that but whatever 01:01:54.010 --> 01:01:56.630 that positive but whatever they're looking for 01:01:56.630 --> 01:01:59.869 in terms of positive we provide that to the best 01:01:59.869 --> 01:02:02.230 of our ability for the reason we talked about 01:02:02.230 --> 01:02:08.150 with the uncle ricos I don't want people to stop 01:02:08.150 --> 01:02:12.730 training. And even if they don't like it, they 01:02:12.730 --> 01:02:16.090 at least understand the importance of it. So 01:02:16.090 --> 01:02:20.369 they'll do something in a way that carries them 01:02:20.369 --> 01:02:25.210 through their career and beyond. That is probably 01:02:25.210 --> 01:02:29.230 the biggest thing that has changed for me. Brilliant. 01:02:29.650 --> 01:02:32.530 Well, you mentioned about moving sufficiently. 01:02:33.920 --> 01:02:38.260 Talk to me about the kind of physical hiring 01:02:38.260 --> 01:02:40.980 standards and what is the spectrum of candidate 01:02:40.980 --> 01:02:43.800 that you're getting at the front door? Yeah, 01:02:43.820 --> 01:02:49.139 so our hiring standards now are, they seem relatively 01:02:49.139 --> 01:02:55.019 low. And I'll talk about why. In that we require 01:02:55.019 --> 01:02:58.380 people to do, we actually don't require CPET 01:02:58.380 --> 01:03:01.400 up front. And we can talk about why in a bit, 01:03:01.500 --> 01:03:06.079 but we require people to do a minimum of seven 01:03:06.079 --> 01:03:08.619 pushups to a five inch block and an 80 beats 01:03:08.619 --> 01:03:12.059 per minute metronome, a minute side plank on 01:03:12.059 --> 01:03:18.340 each side, and then a 5k bike test to an equivalent 01:03:18.340 --> 01:03:22.619 of an eight met estimated eight met VO two max. 01:03:23.739 --> 01:03:29.210 And so This has changed a lot. That's recent 01:03:29.210 --> 01:03:32.409 as of the last, what year is it? It's 2025, so 01:03:32.409 --> 01:03:39.130 I would say since 2021. And we've gone through 01:03:39.130 --> 01:03:40.969 a couple iterations. When I first started working 01:03:40.969 --> 01:03:44.309 there, passing the CPAT was a requirement up 01:03:44.309 --> 01:03:49.369 front. And then we did a mass hiring of paramedics 01:03:49.369 --> 01:03:52.110 and then got them their fire, like help. Obviously 01:03:52.110 --> 01:03:54.230 they got it, but like put them through a fire 01:03:54.230 --> 01:03:56.170 academy to get their fire cert so that they were 01:03:56.170 --> 01:04:00.570 firefighter paramedics. And they got like a year 01:04:00.570 --> 01:04:04.809 to pass the CPAT upon hiring. And then it was 01:04:04.809 --> 01:04:09.449 six months upon hiring. So that way we keep them 01:04:09.449 --> 01:04:12.969 because. And again, a lot of this is all above 01:04:12.969 --> 01:04:15.269 me. It's more of just like, how can we fill the 01:04:15.269 --> 01:04:18.110 need? And we needed paramedics at the time. So 01:04:18.110 --> 01:04:21.170 we hired a bunch of them and did that. And then 01:04:21.170 --> 01:04:25.349 as of 2021, I think the hiring started in 2022. 01:04:25.650 --> 01:04:27.409 Don't quote me on the exact year. They all kind 01:04:27.409 --> 01:04:33.489 of blend together. But we now do cadet academies. 01:04:33.489 --> 01:04:37.820 So people come in with or without their... their 01:04:37.820 --> 01:04:40.119 certs, and then go through a foreign academy. 01:04:40.300 --> 01:04:43.340 The first one we did, we actually had zero requirements. 01:04:44.059 --> 01:04:50.380 And so the zero requirements resulted in a higher 01:04:50.380 --> 01:04:52.719 failure rate for sure. But what they allowed 01:04:52.719 --> 01:04:56.780 us to do is to kind of see if people come in 01:04:56.780 --> 01:05:02.719 at this, you know, being this fit, then we can 01:05:02.719 --> 01:05:05.380 get them to where we need them to be. And so 01:05:05.380 --> 01:05:08.780 that's where we came with those standards that 01:05:08.780 --> 01:05:13.159 i just mentioned with the goal being get the 01:05:13.159 --> 01:05:17.119 best people and train them to be fit because 01:05:17.119 --> 01:05:20.699 like anybody with high quality training and the 01:05:20.699 --> 01:05:23.880 right mentality can can get in good shape they 01:05:23.880 --> 01:05:25.440 just maybe didn't have the opportunity and maybe 01:05:25.440 --> 01:05:26.980 they didn't have the knowledge so on so forth 01:05:26.980 --> 01:05:31.300 um and so I would say from a fitness perspective, 01:05:31.460 --> 01:05:34.059 we take an inclusive standpoint because we have 01:05:34.059 --> 01:05:36.940 the infrastructure to train them and get them 01:05:36.940 --> 01:05:40.719 where they need to be. If you could be queen 01:05:40.719 --> 01:05:45.460 for a day and write a test of where a tactical 01:05:45.460 --> 01:05:48.179 athlete, a firefighter should be, what would 01:05:48.179 --> 01:05:54.110 that look like? Like a singular test? Like if 01:05:54.110 --> 01:05:57.210 this person passes this test and they get a high 01:05:57.210 --> 01:05:59.369 rise fire and have to climb 20 stories with a 01:05:59.369 --> 01:06:01.670 hundred pounds of gear, that person will be able 01:06:01.670 --> 01:06:09.230 to smash it. That kind of test. And are, are 01:06:09.230 --> 01:06:13.309 they currently a firefighter or not? Yes. No. 01:06:13.389 --> 01:06:15.369 So someone who's in, because the thing is, and 01:06:15.369 --> 01:06:18.309 we'll get to this in a minute. there there's 01:06:18.309 --> 01:06:20.550 there's two paths to be in a firefight there's 01:06:20.550 --> 01:06:22.829 one a lot of us did where we put ourselves through 01:06:22.829 --> 01:06:25.869 the academy you know and then certainly 20 years 01:06:25.869 --> 01:06:28.130 ago when i was testing had to compete against 01:06:28.130 --> 01:06:30.530 thousands of people to get you know one of 20 01:06:30.530 --> 01:06:34.329 30 jobs yeah um and then absolutely needs a place 01:06:34.329 --> 01:06:36.369 as well there's a second as you said citizens 01:06:36.369 --> 01:06:39.460 one you know with mentorship that I would argue 01:06:39.460 --> 01:06:43.239 allows people in underserved communities who 01:06:43.239 --> 01:06:45.800 can't afford to put themselves through fire academy, 01:06:45.900 --> 01:06:48.179 maybe it never even came across their radar in 01:06:48.179 --> 01:06:51.639 their particular community, to also become a 01:06:51.639 --> 01:06:54.500 phenomenal firefighter as well. But those two 01:06:54.500 --> 01:06:57.820 intersect at someone who's truly ready to be 01:06:57.820 --> 01:07:01.679 on a rig now. So at that point, they're about 01:07:01.679 --> 01:07:03.480 to walk through the fire station. They could 01:07:03.480 --> 01:07:05.719 get who knows what come through as their first 01:07:05.719 --> 01:07:09.010 call. Fitness test for that person, male or female. 01:07:10.989 --> 01:07:14.190 Do I get to put them through a battery of tests 01:07:14.190 --> 01:07:17.570 or is it literally just one? Okay. Cause I think 01:07:17.570 --> 01:07:20.110 that's important as well. And that, first of 01:07:20.110 --> 01:07:22.510 all, any one test that you pick is never going 01:07:22.510 --> 01:07:26.449 to be perfect. Cause it's always going to miss 01:07:26.449 --> 01:07:33.010 the mark on something. Yeah. It's always going 01:07:33.010 --> 01:07:34.429 to miss the mark on something because even if 01:07:34.429 --> 01:07:36.650 you were like, Hey, I'm going to make it. like 01:07:36.650 --> 01:07:38.929 a structure fire well is it the structure fire 01:07:38.929 --> 01:07:41.650 where i'm climbing 20 stairs or is it you know 01:07:41.650 --> 01:07:45.750 a structure fire where instead of like i'm going 01:07:45.750 --> 01:07:48.969 up i'm now you know searching for an expansive 01:07:48.969 --> 01:07:51.110 amount in a commercial building and like those 01:07:51.110 --> 01:07:53.969 two similar but also different demands or am 01:07:53.969 --> 01:07:57.489 i on a you know like even though we're structural 01:07:57.489 --> 01:07:59.730 firefighters we still work grass fires where 01:07:59.730 --> 01:08:02.170 i'm out there walking for three miles or whatever 01:08:02.170 --> 01:08:12.699 so um There would be one. Maybe I tell you what 01:08:12.699 --> 01:08:14.880 we currently do now, which by no means do I think 01:08:14.880 --> 01:08:18.380 is perfect currently. And then we can go from 01:08:18.380 --> 01:08:25.199 there. And that one, they would do some kind 01:08:25.199 --> 01:08:32.659 of occupational type testing in gear. And so 01:08:32.659 --> 01:08:36.899 we kind of use it. We kill two birds with one 01:08:36.899 --> 01:08:40.380 stone and that in gear we run through, we call 01:08:40.380 --> 01:08:43.239 it the consumption drill because we do measure, 01:08:43.340 --> 01:08:45.380 you know, the amount of air you consume during 01:08:45.380 --> 01:08:49.100 that time. But also it's based off of an assessment 01:08:49.100 --> 01:08:51.300 that has a ton of research behind it, really 01:08:51.300 --> 01:08:54.159 out of Canada to say like, Hey, if you can do, 01:08:54.159 --> 01:08:57.800 you know, these, it's either eight or 10. And 01:08:57.800 --> 01:08:59.619 I remember off the top of my head, depending 01:08:59.619 --> 01:09:02.020 on how you count them events and they're, you 01:09:02.020 --> 01:09:04.500 know, in gear, they're climbing up and down ladders. 01:09:05.390 --> 01:09:08.510 excuse me they're they're throwing ladders so 01:09:08.510 --> 01:09:12.189 on so forth dragging dummies pulling sleds these 01:09:12.189 --> 01:09:14.250 sorts of things not that you actually pull a 01:09:14.250 --> 01:09:15.909 sled but just to mimic the strength required 01:09:15.909 --> 01:09:20.649 right um so some kind of like occupational type 01:09:20.649 --> 01:09:26.750 obstacle course in that setting um meeting those 01:09:26.750 --> 01:09:30.310 metrics. So again, ours is based off of the research 01:09:30.310 --> 01:09:32.390 that had been done over a couple decades, the 01:09:32.390 --> 01:09:34.949 course of a couple decades. And so it's finishing 01:09:34.949 --> 01:09:39.470 that within eight minutes. There would definitely 01:09:39.470 --> 01:09:44.149 be a, there would be a requirement of a VO2 max 01:09:44.149 --> 01:09:47.670 test and how you want to, you know, measure that, 01:09:47.829 --> 01:09:50.130 whether you're running or biking or, you know, 01:09:50.149 --> 01:09:52.210 whatever that might be. And what's good about 01:09:52.210 --> 01:09:54.590 that is you can estimate that even not perfect. 01:09:55.180 --> 01:09:58.340 but also like really cost effective when we're 01:09:58.340 --> 01:10:00.619 talking about departments that are like shoestringing 01:10:00.619 --> 01:10:04.380 some budgets together. And so there would be 01:10:04.380 --> 01:10:09.319 some way to measure their VO2 max, and it would 01:10:09.319 --> 01:10:12.140 not be stratified by age or by sex. It would 01:10:12.140 --> 01:10:15.220 be regardless of who you are at, we would be 01:10:15.220 --> 01:10:18.180 at a minimum of 10 mets. That would be a minimum. 01:10:18.699 --> 01:10:22.600 In my opinion, I do think like shooting for the 01:10:22.600 --> 01:10:27.199 12 is actually ideal. Um, and people can come 01:10:27.199 --> 01:10:29.899 at me for that, but I think a minimum of 10. 01:10:31.279 --> 01:10:35.340 And so we would have those two, we would have, 01:10:35.340 --> 01:10:39.399 depending on your, and I think this is where 01:10:39.399 --> 01:10:44.460 things change too, depending on the area you 01:10:44.460 --> 01:10:47.840 serve and kind of what that looks like, whether 01:10:47.840 --> 01:10:52.460 we're talking like Because like in your instance 01:10:52.460 --> 01:10:54.119 where you're saying like, hey, somebody has to 01:10:54.119 --> 01:10:56.239 make it up 20 flights of steps. We don't even 01:10:56.239 --> 01:11:00.560 have a building that's like half that tall. I 01:11:00.560 --> 01:11:04.460 think our highest is five. And so not to say 01:11:04.460 --> 01:11:08.079 that that isn't important, but your ability to 01:11:08.079 --> 01:11:11.579 cover. ground for a long period of time in our 01:11:11.579 --> 01:11:14.439 case could be more helpful because we do run 01:11:14.439 --> 01:11:17.039 some grass fires and things like that so it would 01:11:17.039 --> 01:11:19.880 be some kind of like a longer endurance event 01:11:19.880 --> 01:11:25.180 um whether or not you wanted that to be like 01:11:25.180 --> 01:11:27.640 i think the bare minimum of that what we use 01:11:27.640 --> 01:11:30.500 is the nwcg packwalk test which i by no means 01:11:30.500 --> 01:11:33.000 do i think is the highest standard in any way 01:11:33.000 --> 01:11:36.750 shape or form um but that could work or if you 01:11:36.750 --> 01:11:39.770 were doing some like a timed test on like a really 01:11:39.770 --> 01:11:44.189 high tower um but again i don't know what the 01:11:44.189 --> 01:11:47.189 like magic measurement for that would be you'd 01:11:47.189 --> 01:11:49.409 have to like run a few things look at some data 01:11:49.409 --> 01:11:57.050 to come up with that um and then we do one last 01:11:57.050 --> 01:12:01.300 one which i think isn't as crucial to saying 01:12:01.300 --> 01:12:05.100 hey you were clear to be a firefighter but i 01:12:05.100 --> 01:12:13.020 think is crucial from a personal fitness development 01:12:13.020 --> 01:12:17.399 type thing where you would put them through a 01:12:17.399 --> 01:12:21.420 battery of tests like vertical jump you know 01:12:21.420 --> 01:12:24.739 understanding their their weight body fat percentage 01:12:24.739 --> 01:12:28.439 skeletal muscle mass things like that Some kind 01:12:28.439 --> 01:12:31.159 of maximal strength lift, whether or not like 01:12:31.159 --> 01:12:35.220 that's a rep max, like type deadlift or squat, 01:12:35.300 --> 01:12:40.779 or we use an isometric mid five pool. Muscular 01:12:40.779 --> 01:12:43.060 endurance in terms of pushups, inverted rows, 01:12:43.239 --> 01:12:48.819 side planks for low back health. And some kind 01:12:48.819 --> 01:12:52.859 of like field test, which would qualify as your 01:12:52.859 --> 01:12:56.920 VO2 max like estimator. That was a ton of rambling. 01:12:56.939 --> 01:12:58.699 And I don't feel like I answered your question. 01:12:58.920 --> 01:13:01.000 No, you did. Because you're spitballing at this 01:13:01.000 --> 01:13:02.680 point. Firstly, it's funny. You mentioned the 01:13:02.680 --> 01:13:04.460 pack test. I've had a few, you know, quite a 01:13:04.460 --> 01:13:07.020 few wildland people on here. And I always ask 01:13:07.020 --> 01:13:09.600 them, you know, is that up a hill? And they're 01:13:09.600 --> 01:13:11.699 like, no, it's flat. No, it's totally flat. Let 01:13:11.699 --> 01:13:13.560 me get this straight. The test that you have 01:13:13.560 --> 01:13:15.979 to be a wildland firefighter that involves climbing 01:13:15.979 --> 01:13:18.819 up mountains is walking a mile and a half on 01:13:18.819 --> 01:13:23.960 a flat road. You know, I don't know. If you know 01:13:23.960 --> 01:13:28.520 who Austin Womack is, but he is a, I met him 01:13:28.520 --> 01:13:30.399 because he was a strength coach for the Austin 01:13:30.399 --> 01:13:33.899 Fire Department at the time. He now works for 01:13:33.899 --> 01:13:41.039 CAL FIRE. He is a, is, serves in the, not National 01:13:41.039 --> 01:13:44.100 Guard, but the Army Reserve National Guard. I 01:13:44.100 --> 01:13:48.399 hate me if I got that wrong. But he was a collegiate 01:13:48.399 --> 01:13:49.979 and a professional strength and conditioning 01:13:49.979 --> 01:13:52.279 coach. He's also been a wildland firefighter 01:13:52.279 --> 01:13:55.279 previous to his strength coach career, post his 01:13:55.279 --> 01:13:57.619 strength coach career. And he is one of the people 01:13:57.619 --> 01:13:59.340 trying to kind of revolutionize strength conditioning 01:13:59.340 --> 01:14:04.359 in the wildland firefighting world. And so, yeah, 01:14:04.399 --> 01:14:08.439 by no means is it the test. But if we're looking 01:14:08.439 --> 01:14:10.140 at something, hey, that's a little bit longer 01:14:10.140 --> 01:14:11.460 endurance phase. Because here's the thing, you 01:14:11.460 --> 01:14:13.970 can like. And almost every firefighter that I've 01:14:13.970 --> 01:14:17.250 encountered can like, you can suffer through 01:14:17.250 --> 01:14:20.710 the sock for 10 minutes, which like a lot of 01:14:20.710 --> 01:14:23.750 when we're talking about like even the operational 01:14:23.750 --> 01:14:27.710 type obstacle courses, like 10, 15 minutes, it 01:14:27.710 --> 01:14:30.869 takes something different to do something for 01:14:30.869 --> 01:14:35.189 45. Not only in terms of like energy systems 01:14:35.189 --> 01:14:37.250 and your robot capacity and these sorts of things, 01:14:37.310 --> 01:14:41.239 but like really just like. the mental aspect 01:14:41.239 --> 01:14:43.939 of it as well and so that's why i think doing 01:14:43.939 --> 01:14:47.640 something with a longer longer type time frame 01:14:47.640 --> 01:14:50.859 is important one of my guests said something 01:14:50.859 --> 01:14:53.260 quite a while ago now but it really stuck with 01:14:53.260 --> 01:14:57.199 me he said uh the people that are you know bucking 01:14:57.199 --> 01:15:00.619 fitness standards are basically saying that they're 01:15:00.619 --> 01:15:04.260 scared to be tired and i was like god that is 01:15:04.260 --> 01:15:06.979 so spot on and then if you really reframe that 01:15:06.979 --> 01:15:10.560 then do you want the person who is in that room 01:15:10.560 --> 01:15:13.840 with you to be scared, to be tired. That's the 01:15:13.840 --> 01:15:16.039 worst thing you could possibly have is someone 01:15:16.039 --> 01:15:18.180 who's going to tap out the moment they get uncomfortable. 01:15:18.739 --> 01:15:21.399 So this is where this importance of these high 01:15:21.399 --> 01:15:24.560 fitness standards really lies is, you know, when 01:15:24.560 --> 01:15:27.439 you do these incrementally and you work up to 01:15:27.439 --> 01:15:29.260 a high level of fitness, and then you have those 01:15:29.260 --> 01:15:32.159 red line workouts that really are horrible once 01:15:32.159 --> 01:15:34.680 a week, whatever it ends up being, you know, 01:15:34.680 --> 01:15:36.619 when you get into that life or death situation. 01:15:37.399 --> 01:15:39.739 you're okay being uncomfortable. You've got the 01:15:39.739 --> 01:15:44.340 muscular capacity, the aerobic endurance to see 01:15:44.340 --> 01:15:47.300 through whatever needs to be done. But if you've 01:15:47.300 --> 01:15:49.520 lowered the bar to where someone's worst day 01:15:49.520 --> 01:15:52.500 happens in the fire room, that is an absolute 01:15:52.500 --> 01:15:56.920 recipe for disaster. Yeah. I think whenever, 01:15:57.300 --> 01:16:00.979 like, I think most people would say, I'm not 01:16:00.979 --> 01:16:03.239 afraid to be tired. And I'm like, okay, you may 01:16:03.239 --> 01:16:06.039 not be afraid of it, but if your body can't take 01:16:06.039 --> 01:16:10.319 it. then you should be afraid of it. And that 01:16:10.319 --> 01:16:14.319 like some people approach it in that sense. They're 01:16:14.319 --> 01:16:16.479 like, well, I mean, I ain't scared. I just don't 01:16:16.479 --> 01:16:18.460 want to do it. And it's like, cool. And why is 01:16:18.460 --> 01:16:22.279 that? You know, and even like, I think the really 01:16:22.279 --> 01:16:24.500 important thing that you just kind of like, you 01:16:24.500 --> 01:16:27.640 know, barely touched on, but is the incremental 01:16:27.640 --> 01:16:31.460 process of it happening is so important. I think 01:16:31.460 --> 01:16:36.000 a lot of people. are, you know, understandably 01:16:36.000 --> 01:16:38.960 so either scared or their pushback comes from 01:16:38.960 --> 01:16:42.699 maybe not seeing that picture of it being gradual 01:16:42.699 --> 01:16:45.060 of being like, cool, well, I know I'm not there 01:16:45.060 --> 01:16:47.640 right now. So if you were to implement them as 01:16:47.640 --> 01:16:50.939 is right now, I'd be on the chopping block, or, 01:16:51.020 --> 01:16:53.899 you know, however you want to phrase it, I'd 01:16:53.899 --> 01:16:57.010 be in trouble. But, okay, you're not there now, 01:16:57.170 --> 01:17:00.670 but what if we gave you the tools to get there 01:17:00.670 --> 01:17:05.069 by X amount of time? I was on a panel a couple 01:17:05.069 --> 01:17:09.050 weeks ago, and there was a chief on it who I 01:17:09.050 --> 01:17:11.010 think said something so beautifully. He said, 01:17:11.229 --> 01:17:18.890 you love your people by holding them to high 01:17:18.890 --> 01:17:22.630 standards and supporting them to reach those 01:17:22.630 --> 01:17:28.770 high standards. And I don't care what we're talking 01:17:28.770 --> 01:17:35.189 about, whether it be fitness or, you know, EMS 01:17:35.189 --> 01:17:39.010 skills or fire skills or whatever it may be. 01:17:39.109 --> 01:17:42.590 Like people say they're the best, which like, 01:17:42.630 --> 01:17:45.930 I want people to be the best, right? Because 01:17:45.930 --> 01:17:49.710 when my family needs you, I want you to be the 01:17:49.710 --> 01:17:52.310 best. Like I don't live in Pflugerville, but. 01:17:52.699 --> 01:17:55.420 I would, the reason I want to live in Pflugerville 01:17:55.420 --> 01:17:57.840 is because I know that if anything happens to 01:17:57.840 --> 01:18:03.500 my family, they are a okay. And so you want them 01:18:03.500 --> 01:18:05.659 to be the best. And so cool. Hold them to those 01:18:05.659 --> 01:18:08.399 high standards. You have to say, here's what 01:18:08.399 --> 01:18:13.079 the best is, but also like, here's how we get 01:18:13.079 --> 01:18:17.859 there. And should you fall, we're going to say 01:18:17.859 --> 01:18:20.819 like, Hey, you probably shouldn't have fallen. 01:18:21.079 --> 01:18:23.909 However, Here's how we don't fall in the future. 01:18:24.529 --> 01:18:26.689 Let's recognize whatever happens so that way 01:18:26.689 --> 01:18:29.310 it doesn't happen again. And then let's get you 01:18:29.310 --> 01:18:32.569 back up to where now you don't have to fall or 01:18:32.569 --> 01:18:34.949 you are less likely. You have more options so 01:18:34.949 --> 01:18:37.050 that way you don't fall. Whether we're talking 01:18:37.050 --> 01:18:39.630 like, hey, somebody literally fell and rolled 01:18:39.630 --> 01:18:42.050 their ankle. Guess what? I'm going to build them, 01:18:42.149 --> 01:18:45.449 help them build a robust system to where now 01:18:45.449 --> 01:18:47.770 they can jump on one foot from left to right. 01:18:48.189 --> 01:18:49.970 guess what? They're more, they're less likely 01:18:49.970 --> 01:18:52.529 to roll an ankle at that point. So how do we 01:18:52.529 --> 01:18:56.489 give them whatever support they need in order 01:18:56.489 --> 01:19:00.810 to like, you know, figuratively jump from left 01:19:00.810 --> 01:19:03.710 to right on an ankle, whether that be in fitness 01:19:03.710 --> 01:19:07.510 in my realm or EMS skills, fire skills, leadership, 01:19:07.670 --> 01:19:11.569 so on and so forth. This is the pushback you 01:19:11.569 --> 01:19:13.510 get when you talk about fitness standards is, 01:19:13.569 --> 01:19:16.229 oh, you're just trying to take a jobs. And my 01:19:16.229 --> 01:19:19.149 thing is firstly, well, What kind of illusion 01:19:19.149 --> 01:19:20.930 did you have at the front door? Did you not go 01:19:20.930 --> 01:19:23.109 to a fire academy? Did they not make you wear 01:19:23.109 --> 01:19:25.529 your gear and carry hoes up flights and flights 01:19:25.529 --> 01:19:27.909 of stairs and drag dummies and chop wood and 01:19:27.909 --> 01:19:30.109 do all these things that are really hard? And 01:19:30.109 --> 01:19:32.170 you get hot and you get tired. That was the front 01:19:32.170 --> 01:19:34.149 door. So the fact that you're even having the 01:19:34.149 --> 01:19:36.090 audacity to say you're trying to take out jobs 01:19:36.090 --> 01:19:40.029 is the assumption that no one told you it was 01:19:40.029 --> 01:19:41.920 going to be hard. which is complete rubbish. 01:19:42.520 --> 01:19:45.239 So, you know, exactly like you said, the solution 01:19:45.239 --> 01:19:47.939 is to put these standards in place. But of course, 01:19:47.939 --> 01:19:50.800 that doesn't mean tomorrow you have to be, you 01:19:50.800 --> 01:19:54.739 know, doing 12 mets. If you've fallen behind, 01:19:54.979 --> 01:19:56.960 and I think the work week is a big part of this, 01:19:57.079 --> 01:19:58.960 because that doesn't give you an environment 01:19:58.960 --> 01:20:01.779 to stay in shape, to, you know, control your 01:20:01.779 --> 01:20:04.239 body composition, to keep your testosterone high. 01:20:04.460 --> 01:20:08.579 So once we fix that as a profession, now we have 01:20:08.579 --> 01:20:11.939 to go from this. you know, protecting people 01:20:11.939 --> 01:20:14.079 that are out of shape and look at it as the complete 01:20:14.079 --> 01:20:16.399 opposite, which is you are, if you want, if you 01:20:16.399 --> 01:20:18.319 really love your people, you will fight for fitness 01:20:18.319 --> 01:20:20.779 standards so they have longevity in their career 01:20:20.779 --> 01:20:23.380 and longevity in retirement. But then there has 01:20:23.380 --> 01:20:25.640 to be an on -ramp process, you know, a year, 01:20:25.680 --> 01:20:27.859 18 months. Okay, here's, you know, we're going 01:20:27.859 --> 01:20:29.500 to help you. We've got peer fitness trainers. 01:20:29.619 --> 01:20:31.819 We're going to do all the things we can. But 01:20:31.819 --> 01:20:33.720 then you're going to have two types of people. 01:20:33.840 --> 01:20:36.619 You're going to have the person who became incrementally 01:20:36.619 --> 01:20:40.189 deconditioned that works their way back up. huge 01:20:40.189 --> 01:20:42.149 success and you're going to have some of them 01:20:42.149 --> 01:20:44.270 that have no intention of putting the work in 01:20:44.270 --> 01:20:46.350 and you're going to have to have the conversation 01:20:46.350 --> 01:20:48.130 all right well then what else do you want to 01:20:48.130 --> 01:20:50.409 do we've got some openings in fire prevention 01:20:50.409 --> 01:20:53.189 but apart from that you know because you're not 01:20:53.189 --> 01:20:55.630 fitting the standards and you speak to special 01:20:55.630 --> 01:20:59.069 forces special operations ocean lifeguards and 01:20:59.069 --> 01:21:00.850 you say what if someone said i don't want to 01:21:00.850 --> 01:21:04.229 work out it's too hard how long would you last 01:21:04.229 --> 01:21:05.989 in those teams? You wouldn't, you'd be gone. 01:21:06.390 --> 01:21:08.869 So you have to also put your big girl and boy 01:21:08.869 --> 01:21:11.409 pants on and draw a line in the sand and say, 01:21:11.510 --> 01:21:15.930 look, for someone to be deemed ready to be on 01:21:15.930 --> 01:21:18.130 a truck company or an engine company or on a 01:21:18.130 --> 01:21:20.750 rescue, you have to be able to do the job. And 01:21:20.750 --> 01:21:23.909 we told you that in day one in Florida, our certification 01:21:23.909 --> 01:21:27.079 is named minimum standards. That's as shit as 01:21:27.079 --> 01:21:29.500 you should ever be your entire career. We labeled 01:21:29.500 --> 01:21:32.159 it for you. So don't turn around now and say 01:21:32.159 --> 01:21:34.560 it's not fair when we ask you to be held to a 01:21:34.560 --> 01:21:39.979 standard because it was always fair. Yeah. When 01:21:39.979 --> 01:21:44.720 like we get on these discussions, I think something 01:21:44.720 --> 01:21:47.100 that comes up for me often as well is when people 01:21:47.100 --> 01:21:53.899 are trying to support those people. That is where 01:21:53.899 --> 01:21:58.710 having. I will always argue to have a professional 01:21:58.710 --> 01:22:03.189 in place. And now that doesn't mean you have 01:22:03.189 --> 01:22:06.090 to have necessarily an entirely full -time position 01:22:06.090 --> 01:22:15.489 like I do. But how can you figure out how to 01:22:15.489 --> 01:22:21.109 work with somebody whose expertise is health 01:22:21.109 --> 01:22:24.189 and fitness? Because for the same reason that 01:22:24.189 --> 01:22:28.529 you have experienced people teaching your EMS 01:22:28.529 --> 01:22:33.489 skills, in my opinion, you should have an experienced 01:22:33.489 --> 01:22:37.850 person at least overseeing the teaching of this 01:22:37.850 --> 01:22:40.069 and being able to put the right methodology in 01:22:40.069 --> 01:22:42.329 place. Because I think what unfortunately does 01:22:42.329 --> 01:22:47.020 happen many times in that... We have the people 01:22:47.020 --> 01:22:50.020 who are sitting well below where they need to 01:22:50.020 --> 01:22:51.699 be, right? Well below those minimum standards 01:22:51.699 --> 01:22:56.079 that you speak of. And the message that is said 01:22:56.079 --> 01:22:58.960 to them is like, well, you fucking signed on 01:22:58.960 --> 01:23:01.239 the dotted line, get your shit together and go. 01:23:02.239 --> 01:23:04.359 Which also I probably should have checked if 01:23:04.359 --> 01:23:06.460 I could cuss in here, but - You can, you can. 01:23:06.560 --> 01:23:10.619 Okay, good. Cause I do a lot. Which like, I agree 01:23:10.619 --> 01:23:13.630 with, like you did. Sign on the dotted line. 01:23:13.750 --> 01:23:15.630 And so you do need to get your shit together 01:23:15.630 --> 01:23:19.609 and go. But if everybody is just telling them 01:23:19.609 --> 01:23:24.029 that, and they're the person who's like, I don't, 01:23:24.029 --> 01:23:28.170 like, that's not working for me. Because when 01:23:28.170 --> 01:23:30.710 I entered, when I did walk through that front 01:23:30.710 --> 01:23:34.050 door, those standards weren't implicitly said, 01:23:34.170 --> 01:23:38.569 like, or even implied. The implication was like, 01:23:38.649 --> 01:23:42.789 hey, you got in, attaboy, you did it. In all 01:23:42.789 --> 01:23:46.350 fairness, that's what they walked into. And so 01:23:46.350 --> 01:23:50.869 if we are trying to change that, we need to do 01:23:50.869 --> 01:23:54.369 it in a way where we can allow those people to 01:23:54.369 --> 01:24:00.210 give a shit. And so having somebody be there 01:24:00.210 --> 01:24:05.770 to truly support them in a way that makes sense 01:24:05.770 --> 01:24:09.930 is huge. And there was one gentleman, he was 01:24:09.930 --> 01:24:11.880 one of my favorite people on the planet. Um, 01:24:11.979 --> 01:24:15.180 when I first showed up, he made it very clear. 01:24:15.239 --> 01:24:17.279 And he says, I do not like exercise. I do not 01:24:17.279 --> 01:24:19.819 enjoy exercise. I will hate the entire time you 01:24:19.819 --> 01:24:23.800 come here. And I said, okay, he said, but you're 01:24:23.800 --> 01:24:25.859 going to do something. And he said, I have to. 01:24:26.000 --> 01:24:27.560 And so I was, I said, cool, you're going to walk 01:24:27.560 --> 01:24:30.119 on this treadmill. And he did. Every time I showed 01:24:30.119 --> 01:24:31.579 up, every time I came around the stations, we 01:24:31.579 --> 01:24:33.539 would run our workout. He would walk on the treadmill. 01:24:34.329 --> 01:24:36.710 he'd walk on the treadmill and you know, the 01:24:36.710 --> 01:24:38.649 more times I came, the more questions I would 01:24:38.649 --> 01:24:40.729 ask him, I would ask about his family. I would 01:24:40.729 --> 01:24:42.869 ask about like what his kids were into, what 01:24:42.869 --> 01:24:44.649 activities were they doing? So on and so forth. 01:24:44.689 --> 01:24:47.510 It took three months and finally said, Vanessa, 01:24:47.510 --> 01:24:50.609 I'm going to join y 'all today. And I said, cool. 01:24:51.329 --> 01:24:53.210 Like didn't make a big deal out of it. It's like 01:24:53.210 --> 01:24:55.489 when, when your kid finally eats the green vegetable, 01:24:55.529 --> 01:24:58.449 you're like, cool. And inside I'm like, yes, 01:24:58.890 --> 01:25:04.079 did it. Right. But I didn't show up and say like, 01:25:04.159 --> 01:25:05.960 well, you fucking signed on the dotted line. 01:25:06.039 --> 01:25:10.520 Get your shit together. Let's go. Because I'm 01:25:10.520 --> 01:25:13.840 working with grown ass adults who have made their 01:25:13.840 --> 01:25:16.279 own decisions up until this point. And again, 01:25:16.380 --> 01:25:19.340 when they walked through those front doors, the 01:25:19.340 --> 01:25:22.260 expectations that currently exist were not there. 01:25:24.500 --> 01:25:28.220 And you can say like, you know, I can beat the 01:25:28.220 --> 01:25:31.569 drum as loud as I can. And for some people beating 01:25:31.569 --> 01:25:34.050 the drum works, but for other people's union, 01:25:34.069 --> 01:25:37.029 for other people's, well, for other people, you 01:25:37.029 --> 01:25:39.689 just need to like have a bit of a quieter conversation 01:25:39.689 --> 01:25:44.449 with them and kind of like, you know, like the 01:25:44.449 --> 01:25:46.390 timid animal you're trying to feed, like let 01:25:46.390 --> 01:25:49.750 them come to you and simply be there. Now, obviously 01:25:49.750 --> 01:25:55.069 there's a timeframe for that, but you still have 01:25:55.069 --> 01:25:58.569 to, I think, keep in mind, like, approach this 01:25:58.569 --> 01:26:00.869 in a way and it's different if i'm you know you're 01:26:00.869 --> 01:26:04.149 a battalion chief coming from it or like if you're 01:26:04.149 --> 01:26:06.750 the peer fitness trainer or the coach in my perspective 01:26:06.750 --> 01:26:09.989 like coming to it you have you have different 01:26:09.989 --> 01:26:14.609 roles to play yeah no i mean i've saw that myself 01:26:14.609 --> 01:26:18.750 a couple of times in in departments like california 01:26:18.750 --> 01:26:20.670 and i was there there was a culture of fitness 01:26:20.670 --> 01:26:22.829 and again they had i worked out the other day 01:26:22.829 --> 01:26:26.300 i was one the top one percent of this list for 01:26:26.300 --> 01:26:28.760 the first class after attrition through probationary 01:26:28.760 --> 01:26:31.119 years that's how competitive it was one percent 01:26:31.119 --> 01:26:33.720 and so they had a culture of fitness so when 01:26:33.720 --> 01:26:35.520 i think about it you know the cruise that i was 01:26:35.520 --> 01:26:38.180 on we were always whether it was volleyball actual 01:26:38.180 --> 01:26:41.079 workouts um you know that's where i got introduced 01:26:41.079 --> 01:26:43.960 to crossfit back in 2006 my friend came back 01:26:43.960 --> 01:26:45.859 and was swinging this cannonball cannonball with 01:26:45.859 --> 01:26:48.579 a handle i'm like what are you doing um and so 01:26:48.579 --> 01:26:50.979 you know so that There was that culture at the 01:26:50.979 --> 01:26:52.619 front door. So even though they didn't have specific 01:26:52.619 --> 01:26:55.579 fitness standards, you know, you'd been through 01:26:55.579 --> 01:26:57.619 such a crucible that that's the kind of human 01:26:57.619 --> 01:26:59.560 being that you were. And anyone that even starts 01:26:59.560 --> 01:27:01.819 flipping, the rest of the crew just brought them 01:27:01.819 --> 01:27:05.479 back up and we got them back involved. But it's 01:27:05.479 --> 01:27:06.819 also the environment. Like I said, I'm always 01:27:06.819 --> 01:27:09.100 very careful to say, look, you know, if you're 01:27:09.100 --> 01:27:11.500 going to have mandatory overtime all the time 01:27:11.500 --> 01:27:14.170 and you're working people 80 hours a week. How 01:27:14.170 --> 01:27:15.729 can you then turn around and say you're going 01:27:15.729 --> 01:27:17.409 to hold them to a fitness standard when you haven't 01:27:17.409 --> 01:27:20.409 even given them the environment to thrive? But 01:27:20.409 --> 01:27:22.489 you've also got to walk the walk yourself. And 01:27:22.489 --> 01:27:26.550 I saw my social media blow up after Pete Hegseth, 01:27:26.590 --> 01:27:29.590 is that his name, speech to the military about, 01:27:29.649 --> 01:27:31.729 you know, they all need to be in shape now. And 01:27:31.729 --> 01:27:33.609 it's like, well, that's all well and good. But 01:27:33.609 --> 01:27:35.989 your same group that you're attached to, your 01:27:35.989 --> 01:27:37.869 political party, also said that they were going 01:27:37.869 --> 01:27:39.670 to make America healthy again. And we haven't 01:27:39.670 --> 01:27:41.649 heard a damn thing about that till almost a year. 01:27:42.010 --> 01:27:45.430 Well, who are you recruiting from? America. So 01:27:45.430 --> 01:27:48.050 you're telling the military members that they 01:27:48.050 --> 01:27:50.130 need to be in shape, but you're doing nothing 01:27:50.130 --> 01:27:53.010 to make Americans be in shape. You haven't fixed 01:27:53.010 --> 01:27:55.829 anything post -COVID. There's not organic farms 01:27:55.829 --> 01:27:58.329 being bolstered now. There's not PE programs 01:27:58.329 --> 01:28:00.550 being put back in schools. You know, all these 01:28:00.550 --> 01:28:03.350 things that have to be in place as well. So I 01:28:03.350 --> 01:28:05.569 agree with you completely. You know, build it, 01:28:05.569 --> 01:28:07.090 they will come. You've got to set a standard. 01:28:07.210 --> 01:28:08.350 And that's what I was going to say. But there 01:28:08.350 --> 01:28:10.210 was other stations where I would be out there 01:28:10.210 --> 01:28:12.550 on my own doing a CrossFit workout for weeks. 01:28:12.909 --> 01:28:14.890 And then one day someone would come. And then 01:28:14.890 --> 01:28:16.850 there'd be two of us and then three of us and 01:28:16.850 --> 01:28:18.970 four of us. Then I'd be on days off and visit 01:28:18.970 --> 01:28:20.649 the station and my crew would still be working 01:28:20.649 --> 01:28:23.510 out without me. That's exactly what you're talking 01:28:23.510 --> 01:28:26.399 about. But, you know, there's also... you know, 01:28:26.420 --> 01:28:28.359 that environmental ownership where we've got 01:28:28.359 --> 01:28:30.680 to fix the work. We've got to have the upper 01:28:30.680 --> 01:28:33.399 echelon that are also in shape. You can't just, 01:28:33.479 --> 01:28:36.960 you know, virtue signal fitness without walking 01:28:36.960 --> 01:28:38.619 the walk and then create an environment that 01:28:38.619 --> 01:28:42.260 allows it to happen in the first place. Yeah. 01:28:42.319 --> 01:28:47.720 And, you know, I think a lot of people struggle 01:28:47.720 --> 01:28:50.699 in the same sense that like, in my opinion, the 01:28:50.699 --> 01:28:53.300 fire service is just like a microscope on like 01:28:53.300 --> 01:28:56.439 the American public. And that like the same issues 01:28:56.439 --> 01:28:59.079 that the American public has in terms of like, 01:28:59.100 --> 01:29:02.539 you know, diabetes, sleep apnea, like all of 01:29:02.539 --> 01:29:04.560 their blood markers, so on and so forth. The 01:29:04.560 --> 01:29:07.279 struggle to exercise, all of the things. It all 01:29:07.279 --> 01:29:10.699 happens in the fire service as well. Now, the 01:29:10.699 --> 01:29:14.319 stakes are high in that the general population 01:29:14.319 --> 01:29:17.020 doesn't have the risk of dying as the fire service 01:29:17.020 --> 01:29:18.699 has because they don't do a job that can kill 01:29:18.699 --> 01:29:22.739 them on a daily basis. But the struggles are 01:29:22.739 --> 01:29:26.399 still there. Because even if the environment, 01:29:26.640 --> 01:29:30.579 like, at our department, we offer overtime for 01:29:30.579 --> 01:29:34.439 people to work out. Like, they can stay up to, 01:29:34.500 --> 01:29:37.659 like, it essentially comes out to, like, twice 01:29:37.659 --> 01:29:42.340 a week. You can work out for an hour and get 01:29:42.340 --> 01:29:45.739 paid to do that. Which is amazing. And honestly, 01:29:45.819 --> 01:29:47.800 I've never, like, I haven't, that wasn't my idea. 01:29:48.039 --> 01:29:51.689 That was... you know, the fire chief's idea. 01:29:51.789 --> 01:29:53.970 And thankfully we've been able to keep that the 01:29:53.970 --> 01:29:58.869 entire time that I'm there trying to provide 01:29:58.869 --> 01:30:01.869 like an answer to this barrier of like, well, 01:30:01.930 --> 01:30:04.069 it's important that you work out. And so here's 01:30:04.069 --> 01:30:07.350 an opportunity for that. But like life is still 01:30:07.350 --> 01:30:12.069 busy. Life is still hard. And so, and, and I 01:30:12.069 --> 01:30:15.250 understand that. Like I. I've worked for the 01:30:15.250 --> 01:30:17.109 fire service for almost 10 years now. And five 01:30:17.109 --> 01:30:19.649 years ago, I guess more than that now. Oh my 01:30:19.649 --> 01:30:22.689 goodness. Yeah, I guess seven years ago, my husband 01:30:22.689 --> 01:30:24.689 was like, cool, I want to be a firefighter. So 01:30:24.689 --> 01:30:28.729 like, I live that life as well. And he works 01:30:28.729 --> 01:30:32.090 24, 48. It's like, I understand the struggle. 01:30:32.550 --> 01:30:34.250 I'm a strength coach and I still struggle to 01:30:34.250 --> 01:30:37.470 fit all the things in all the time. And so I 01:30:37.470 --> 01:30:41.840 get that. And so I think an important. piece 01:30:41.840 --> 01:30:45.140 is like the educational component and almost 01:30:45.140 --> 01:30:47.880 like bring this back to what we talked about 01:30:47.880 --> 01:30:51.779 with like these kids right it should be like 01:30:51.779 --> 01:30:55.100 the joy of the game that keeps you playing whether 01:30:55.100 --> 01:30:59.520 or not like cool I get to you know play I get 01:30:59.520 --> 01:31:01.359 to practice five times a week and then compete 01:31:01.359 --> 01:31:03.479 at a high level on the weekend like that's that's 01:31:03.479 --> 01:31:07.560 that's the peak of the pyramid right but if I'm 01:31:07.560 --> 01:31:11.079 not there then okay, maybe I get to exercise 01:31:11.079 --> 01:31:15.000 three times a week and, you know, try and eat 01:31:15.000 --> 01:31:18.640 a vegetable, which it seems like silly, silly 01:31:18.640 --> 01:31:22.439 in quotation marks, conversations to have with 01:31:22.439 --> 01:31:26.840 grown people who are doing a job that can kill 01:31:26.840 --> 01:31:30.479 them. But it's the reality of where we are because 01:31:30.479 --> 01:31:33.920 life is really freaking hard. And everybody is 01:31:33.920 --> 01:31:36.500 busy and people, the majority of firefighters 01:31:36.500 --> 01:31:40.060 in the country are not working a 24 72. And so 01:31:40.060 --> 01:31:41.939 they're trying to fit in all the things and, 01:31:42.039 --> 01:31:44.439 you know, be the parents that they are, be the 01:31:44.439 --> 01:31:47.720 spouses they want to be and still like find time 01:31:47.720 --> 01:31:51.060 to rest. Like it's incredibly difficult. And 01:31:51.060 --> 01:31:53.739 so I get that. And so I think the, like the education 01:31:53.739 --> 01:31:57.119 always needs to be in the message needs to be 01:31:57.119 --> 01:32:00.850 like, Hey. You might not be, you know, at peak 01:32:00.850 --> 01:32:03.430 level 10 because life is stressful right now. 01:32:03.489 --> 01:32:05.970 Maybe you're dealing with X, Y, and Z, but can 01:32:05.970 --> 01:32:07.989 you be at like seven and a half? So that way 01:32:07.989 --> 01:32:10.189 when life slows down, great, I can now bump up 01:32:10.189 --> 01:32:11.829 to an eight. I can bump up to an eight and a 01:32:11.829 --> 01:32:14.090 half and so on and so forth and like ride the 01:32:14.090 --> 01:32:18.010 ebbs and flows that is life. I think so often 01:32:18.010 --> 01:32:21.550 the fire service, it's human nature in one, but 01:32:21.550 --> 01:32:23.689 I think especially too in the fire service, it 01:32:23.689 --> 01:32:30.590 is so all or nothing. And also like, Because 01:32:30.590 --> 01:32:35.210 firefighters' jobs are, like, problem presents, 01:32:35.810 --> 01:32:39.970 I solve. Because, like, you are called to a problem. 01:32:40.050 --> 01:32:42.329 Your job is literally to solve that problem well 01:32:42.329 --> 01:32:44.630 enough until you can hand it off to people who 01:32:44.630 --> 01:32:49.130 can solve it even further. Which, like, is great, 01:32:49.250 --> 01:32:51.350 but also is really difficult in the sense that 01:32:51.350 --> 01:32:54.390 if that is the pathway I am used to of, like... 01:32:54.720 --> 01:32:57.119 problem here problem solved problem here problem 01:32:57.119 --> 01:32:59.520 solved versus like I'm gonna have to constantly 01:32:59.520 --> 01:33:03.199 work on this it is an ever -evolving problem 01:33:03.199 --> 01:33:06.659 that actually can never be solved because we're 01:33:06.659 --> 01:33:10.220 constantly moving the goalposts to a degree is 01:33:10.220 --> 01:33:13.520 is hard and I get that and I just I think it 01:33:13.520 --> 01:33:17.159 needs to be said because like they get it life's 01:33:17.159 --> 01:33:20.380 hard but we gotta do it Well, I think this goes 01:33:20.380 --> 01:33:22.520 back as well, just to flog the horse one more 01:33:22.520 --> 01:33:25.260 time with the 2472. And it's great because we're 01:33:25.260 --> 01:33:27.779 talking, you're in Texas, Plano just became the 01:33:27.779 --> 01:33:30.199 first department. I just listened to that podcast 01:33:30.199 --> 01:33:32.659 you did with the city manager from there. Yeah. 01:33:32.859 --> 01:33:35.279 Yep. So there we go. He's broken the dam now. 01:33:35.340 --> 01:33:38.140 So we'll see who's next in Texas. But this is 01:33:38.140 --> 01:33:40.659 it. If we're going to ask people to be there 01:33:40.659 --> 01:33:43.840 on everyone's worst day. We've got to create 01:33:43.840 --> 01:33:46.619 space for training, for time with family, for 01:33:46.619 --> 01:33:49.340 rest and recovery and sleep, you know, mobility 01:33:49.340 --> 01:33:51.199 and hydration and all the other things that we 01:33:51.199 --> 01:33:53.279 talk about because these are, you know, I mean, 01:33:53.300 --> 01:33:55.199 they are athletes, tactical athletes, and they're 01:33:55.199 --> 01:33:57.680 using that for a reason because, you know, God 01:33:57.680 --> 01:34:00.300 forbid you have a, you know, 9 -11 or a Vega 01:34:00.300 --> 01:34:02.560 shooting, you are going to have to operate at 01:34:02.560 --> 01:34:05.199 an extremely high physical level and, you know, 01:34:05.220 --> 01:34:08.460 a mental acuity level as well. So, so imperative. 01:34:09.529 --> 01:34:11.069 I know we're kind of getting short of time now, 01:34:11.130 --> 01:34:13.289 so I want to hit firefighter strength coach. 01:34:13.449 --> 01:34:16.189 So outside of Plougaville, talk to me about the 01:34:16.189 --> 01:34:21.609 programming you offer everyone. Yeah, so it's 01:34:21.609 --> 01:34:25.569 funny. When my kid was one, I had a firefighter 01:34:25.569 --> 01:34:29.670 say like, hey, you should like kind of bottle 01:34:29.670 --> 01:34:31.649 this up and share this with the world, like what 01:34:31.649 --> 01:34:33.770 you've done here. I'd been at the fire department 01:34:33.770 --> 01:34:36.569 for, I guess, three years at that point. And 01:34:36.569 --> 01:34:37.909 I said, you should kind of bottle this up and 01:34:37.909 --> 01:34:40.829 share this with the world. And I was like, that 01:34:40.829 --> 01:34:44.229 sounds like a great idea. But I was in the throes 01:34:44.229 --> 01:34:47.050 of having a newborn. My husband was in EMT school. 01:34:47.310 --> 01:34:51.630 Like, I was like, absolutely not. No. And then 01:34:51.630 --> 01:34:53.630 a couple years ago, I was finally like, okay, 01:34:53.649 --> 01:34:56.810 it's time to like start kind of sharing what 01:34:56.810 --> 01:35:01.229 I've been lucky enough to, you know, do and help 01:35:01.229 --> 01:35:05.069 firefighters with. and things like that and so 01:35:05.069 --> 01:35:07.869 so when and I was also tired of people like coming 01:35:07.869 --> 01:35:09.409 up to me showing me their phone and be like hey 01:35:09.409 --> 01:35:12.409 have you seen this and it's like some guy online 01:35:12.409 --> 01:35:16.649 like spewing bullshit about you know getting 01:35:16.649 --> 01:35:20.149 sun for 92 minutes first thing in the morning 01:35:20.149 --> 01:35:22.729 and that's what he has to do and that's why he 01:35:22.729 --> 01:35:25.010 can't make the health gains because I don't see 01:35:25.010 --> 01:35:27.229 I don't get 92 minutes of sunlight in the morning 01:35:27.229 --> 01:35:30.229 and so I can't be healthier and it's like okay 01:35:30.859 --> 01:35:34.859 So that's when I made the, you know, constantly 01:35:34.859 --> 01:35:37.199 regrettable decision to start like putting things 01:35:37.199 --> 01:35:40.420 out online to share with the world and try and 01:35:40.420 --> 01:35:44.199 not only improve like, you know, the fire department 01:35:44.199 --> 01:35:47.140 that I work with full time, but also like the 01:35:47.140 --> 01:35:50.220 lives and fire departments of those around. And 01:35:50.220 --> 01:35:52.859 so I've gotten to do some really cool things. 01:35:52.939 --> 01:35:56.060 I've gotten to go out and... And speak at different 01:35:56.060 --> 01:35:59.600 symposiums, seminars. I've gotten to write articles, 01:35:59.680 --> 01:36:02.539 both for like individual departments to share 01:36:02.539 --> 01:36:05.319 with their departments or kind of with some bigger 01:36:05.319 --> 01:36:08.060 blogs and things like that. I've gone out and 01:36:08.060 --> 01:36:11.039 taught workshops at prior departments. I've worked 01:36:11.039 --> 01:36:14.199 with departments on policymaking, on how to. 01:36:15.049 --> 01:36:18.069 implement fitness standards and consulted on 01:36:18.069 --> 01:36:21.170 that. I've also worked with firefighters like 01:36:21.170 --> 01:36:24.949 on a one -on -one basis or also have a few programs 01:36:24.949 --> 01:36:29.109 that float around out there as well to help them 01:36:29.109 --> 01:36:32.229 kind of fill the gap that I see exists right 01:36:32.229 --> 01:36:36.260 now. in the fire like in the fire service on 01:36:36.260 --> 01:36:39.699 a national conversation like i have one program 01:36:39.699 --> 01:36:42.460 um it's called ignition and it's about like getting 01:36:42.460 --> 01:36:44.439 people into training like there's so much out 01:36:44.439 --> 01:36:47.420 there that's like hey here's the exercise plan 01:36:47.420 --> 01:36:49.159 that currently exists like here's your four to 01:36:49.159 --> 01:36:50.859 five times a week blah blah blah all these things 01:36:50.859 --> 01:36:54.520 and it's like cool i have people who and like 01:36:54.520 --> 01:36:57.079 knock on wood i don't i don't but there are firefighters 01:36:57.079 --> 01:36:58.939 out there that like currently don't exercise 01:36:58.939 --> 01:37:03.779 at all and so like how do we talk to them in 01:37:03.779 --> 01:37:08.100 a way that makes sense for the fire service? 01:37:08.180 --> 01:37:10.100 Like ties everything back to what they do, not 01:37:10.100 --> 01:37:12.979 only to like how important their job is and their 01:37:12.979 --> 01:37:15.659 purpose in that, but also like you are more than 01:37:15.659 --> 01:37:19.300 a firefighter. And my goal ultimately is for 01:37:19.300 --> 01:37:23.420 you to like live strong lives. That's my tagline, 01:37:23.439 --> 01:37:25.279 like strong work, strong minds, strong lives. 01:37:25.319 --> 01:37:29.460 And that like. outside of being a firefighter, 01:37:29.460 --> 01:37:31.439 I want you to be able to do the things that you 01:37:31.439 --> 01:37:35.100 want to do. Once you've decided your fire career 01:37:35.100 --> 01:37:38.180 is over, and I say you decided because you didn't 01:37:38.180 --> 01:37:40.239 have to medically retire because your back couldn't 01:37:40.239 --> 01:37:42.739 handle it anymore. Because your shoulder was 01:37:42.739 --> 01:37:46.359 like, you know, just couldn't do it. Like once 01:37:46.359 --> 01:37:49.079 you decide you are done with your career in the 01:37:49.079 --> 01:37:52.899 fire service, like you get to also do the amazing 01:37:52.899 --> 01:37:56.619 things that you would like to do. Um, and so 01:37:56.619 --> 01:37:58.819 kind of that is everything that is firefighter 01:37:58.819 --> 01:38:01.819 strength coach in one. Beautiful. And for people 01:38:01.819 --> 01:38:03.979 listening, where can they find that, um, the 01:38:03.979 --> 01:38:05.880 website and then you online as far as social 01:38:05.880 --> 01:38:10.279 media? Yeah. So I am mostly on Instagram firefighter 01:38:10.279 --> 01:38:13.270 strength coach, and then, um, just. firefighter 01:38:13.270 --> 01:38:16.109 strength coach .com the blog that's up there 01:38:16.109 --> 01:38:18.909 um and so there's there's a ton of free resources 01:38:18.909 --> 01:38:21.710 on there another ton there should be more but 01:38:21.710 --> 01:38:24.430 um there are free resources on there for people 01:38:24.430 --> 01:38:27.470 to um not only get started um but there's like 01:38:27.470 --> 01:38:29.489 you speak a lot about testosterone there's a 01:38:29.489 --> 01:38:33.390 testosterone guide um on my website as well and 01:38:33.390 --> 01:38:37.220 so yeah and find me online brilliant Well, I 01:38:37.220 --> 01:38:39.100 want to thank Trevor again. And I want to thank 01:38:39.100 --> 01:38:41.560 you so much. I think we need to do another interview 01:38:41.560 --> 01:38:42.819 down the road because you didn't even really 01:38:42.819 --> 01:38:45.800 dip into programming or any of that area. Yeah, 01:38:45.859 --> 01:38:48.520 I would love to. And I think it's important to 01:38:48.520 --> 01:38:50.840 like talk both, right? And that like, hey, we've 01:38:50.840 --> 01:38:53.079 got to talk, you know, the big things that kind 01:38:53.079 --> 01:38:55.800 of get us here. And then let's talk nitty gritty 01:38:55.800 --> 01:38:57.880 for the people who like, you know, want to hear 01:38:57.880 --> 01:39:00.270 us nerd out about all that stuff. Absolutely. 01:39:00.369 --> 01:39:02.890 So I want to thank you so much for being so generous 01:39:02.890 --> 01:39:04.689 with your time and coming on the Behind the Shield 01:39:04.689 --> 01:39:07.090 podcast today. Absolutely. Thanks so much for 01:39:07.090 --> 01:39:07.430 having me.