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Welcome 00:04:33.019 --> 00:04:35.519 to episode 404 of Behind the Shield podcast. 00:04:35.660 --> 00:04:37.579 As always, my name is James Gearing, and this 00:04:37.579 --> 00:04:39.680 week it is my absolute honor to welcome on the 00:04:39.680 --> 00:04:42.860 show the two French brothers behind the 9 -11 00:04:42.860 --> 00:04:46.379 documentary, November 13th, and their most recent 00:04:46.379 --> 00:04:51.279 one, Notre Dame, Jules and Gédion Naudé. Now, 00:04:51.300 --> 00:04:54.379 I have literally been waiting four years to talk 00:04:54.379 --> 00:04:57.480 to these two incredible men after being moved 00:04:57.480 --> 00:05:00.339 so powerfully by their documentaries and understanding 00:05:00.339 --> 00:05:02.920 their passion for the first responder community, 00:05:03.259 --> 00:05:06.939 specifically the fire service. So I was humbled. 00:05:07.019 --> 00:05:09.699 I was honored to sit down with them and had so 00:05:09.699 --> 00:05:12.120 many questions that this conversation went on 00:05:12.120 --> 00:05:14.939 for two and a half hours. As you will hear, Jedion 00:05:14.939 --> 00:05:16.839 had to actually leave and go and get his children 00:05:16.839 --> 00:05:20.629 from school because I kept him so long. But they 00:05:20.629 --> 00:05:24.329 witnessed firsthand the tragedy in New York City, 00:05:24.430 --> 00:05:27.629 and then they documented the tragedy in Paris, 00:05:27.649 --> 00:05:30.310 and then obviously the Notre Dame fire as well, 00:05:30.410 --> 00:05:32.370 amongst other documentaries that they've done 00:05:32.370 --> 00:05:35.269 on top of that. So I can't recommend strongly 00:05:35.269 --> 00:05:37.750 enough to listen to this from beginning to end. 00:05:38.230 --> 00:05:40.930 In the midst of what we have been through this 00:05:40.930 --> 00:05:42.649 last year, and some of the things that we've 00:05:42.649 --> 00:05:46.100 already been exposed to in 2021, This restores 00:05:46.100 --> 00:05:48.600 the faith in humanity. You hear the beautiful 00:05:48.600 --> 00:05:51.579 stories that came out of some of these horrendous 00:05:51.579 --> 00:05:54.259 terrorist attacks. Now, before we get to that 00:05:54.259 --> 00:05:56.639 conversation, as I say every single time, please 00:05:56.639 --> 00:05:58.660 just take a moment, go to whichever app you listen 00:05:58.660 --> 00:06:01.920 to this on, subscribe to the show, leave feedback. 00:06:01.980 --> 00:06:04.560 I truly do love reading your feedback. And leave 00:06:04.560 --> 00:06:06.980 a rating. Every five -star rating makes this 00:06:06.980 --> 00:06:09.980 podcast more visible for others to find it. And 00:06:09.980 --> 00:06:13.040 this is a free library for you, planet Earth. 00:06:13.480 --> 00:06:15.980 So all I ask in return is that you help share 00:06:15.980 --> 00:06:18.620 these incredible men and women's stories so I 00:06:18.620 --> 00:06:20.839 can get them to everyone else who needs to hear 00:06:20.839 --> 00:06:23.959 them. So with that being said, I introduce to 00:06:23.959 --> 00:06:47.550 you Jules and Gédéon Naudet. Enjoy. So, Jules 00:06:47.550 --> 00:06:50.529 and Gideon, thank you so much for taking the 00:06:50.529 --> 00:06:53.709 time to come on the podcast today. Pleasure to 00:06:53.709 --> 00:06:55.949 be here. Thank you for having us. Most welcome. 00:06:56.029 --> 00:06:58.230 Thank you. Now, despite the accidents, where 00:06:58.230 --> 00:07:00.670 are we actually finding you on planet Earth today? 00:07:02.709 --> 00:07:08.250 I'm in Connecticut. I'm in New York City. And 00:07:08.250 --> 00:07:12.110 for the record, I wish I could be talking like 00:07:12.110 --> 00:07:16.060 Sylvester Stallone. I took classes. you know 00:07:16.060 --> 00:07:19.620 growing up in paris france i guess uh yeah it 00:07:19.620 --> 00:07:23.540 was too late i was asked the other day if i was 00:07:23.540 --> 00:07:26.420 popular with the girls when i was younger because 00:07:26.420 --> 00:07:28.420 of the english accent i told her no because everyone 00:07:28.420 --> 00:07:31.040 was english so no one cared but now i don't know 00:07:31.040 --> 00:07:32.439 if you have the same thing but when you move 00:07:32.439 --> 00:07:34.060 to a different country people find your accent 00:07:34.060 --> 00:07:38.319 intriguing the the french uh did did go a long 00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:41.480 way that's true beautiful all right well i love 00:07:41.480 --> 00:07:44.459 to start at the very beginning so Where were 00:07:44.459 --> 00:07:46.420 you born? And then tell me about your family 00:07:46.420 --> 00:07:48.339 dynamic, what your parents did, and if you had 00:07:48.339 --> 00:07:53.360 any other siblings. Michel, do you want to start? 00:07:54.180 --> 00:07:58.600 Okay, okay, okay. I don't get much credit being 00:07:58.600 --> 00:08:03.720 the first one, of course, because the second 00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:07.459 one, Jules got all the brain and the rest. But 00:08:07.459 --> 00:08:12.980 yeah, we were born in both in Paris. parents 00:08:12.980 --> 00:08:18.879 are Parisian and crazy enough they decided when 00:08:18.879 --> 00:08:23.560 we were respectively 18 and 16 years old that 00:08:23.560 --> 00:08:28.259 they wanted to change their life and move to 00:08:28.259 --> 00:08:32.899 New York City. And at that time, New York was 00:08:32.899 --> 00:08:36.299 like in the movies. It was Starkey and Hutch 00:08:36.299 --> 00:08:39.759 and everything that you could possibly imagine 00:08:39.759 --> 00:08:42.720 when you're growing up watching a series on TV. 00:08:43.200 --> 00:08:49.509 And we arrive in New York and... And right away, 00:08:49.649 --> 00:08:53.909 we knew we wanted to continue to make documentaries 00:08:53.909 --> 00:08:58.490 and films. That was something that we had started 00:08:58.490 --> 00:09:01.450 years before. Maybe you can talk about that, 00:09:01.529 --> 00:09:05.970 Jules. So I think to go back before, so we were... 00:09:07.159 --> 00:09:10.379 family environment. Our father was the editor 00:09:10.379 --> 00:09:13.340 -in -chief of a magazine called Photo, which 00:09:13.340 --> 00:09:16.340 was all about photojournalism and photography 00:09:16.340 --> 00:09:18.759 in general. So we were raised very early on with 00:09:18.759 --> 00:09:21.740 these great masters of photojournalism between 00:09:21.740 --> 00:09:27.480 Cartier -Bresson and all of the others who were, 00:09:27.659 --> 00:09:31.799 you know... Coming for lunch with our parents 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:34.419 and our father in particular and so as little 00:09:34.419 --> 00:09:36.600 kids We would listen to these incredible stories 00:09:36.600 --> 00:09:39.539 of how to capture a moment with them. It was 00:09:39.539 --> 00:09:43.090 with one click with one image But we were struck 00:09:43.090 --> 00:09:46.649 by that. And our parents were absolute cinephiles 00:09:46.649 --> 00:09:48.850 and we were watching movies every single night. 00:09:49.570 --> 00:09:52.409 On Sunday night, where in France, we normally 00:09:52.409 --> 00:09:54.889 around midnight, you have classics that air, 00:09:55.090 --> 00:09:58.509 whether it is a Kurosawa or a Renoir or whatever 00:09:58.509 --> 00:10:01.870 it was, or someone else. And actually, they would 00:10:01.870 --> 00:10:03.970 force us to watch it. They thought it was important 00:10:03.970 --> 00:10:05.690 for our general culture. And the next day, they 00:10:05.690 --> 00:10:07.529 would write us a note that we would give to our 00:10:07.529 --> 00:10:09.690 teachers saying, oh, I'm terribly sorry. But 00:10:09.690 --> 00:10:11.889 yesterday, you know, the rules of the game. by 00:10:11.889 --> 00:10:14.789 Renoir was on TV and we thought it was very important 00:10:14.789 --> 00:10:16.570 so of course all the teachers were convinced 00:10:16.570 --> 00:10:19.889 we were writing our notes ourselves and we called 00:10:19.889 --> 00:10:21.750 our parents and our parents would invite them 00:10:21.750 --> 00:10:25.490 to lunch because we were honestly very bad in 00:10:25.490 --> 00:10:27.309 school and so they needed to do some kind of 00:10:28.230 --> 00:10:30.409 work around that and so they would invite our 00:10:30.409 --> 00:10:31.710 teachers to school and said you know but this 00:10:31.710 --> 00:10:34.470 is the importance of cinema and what it teaches 00:10:34.470 --> 00:10:37.289 you and etc etc so very early on where we were 00:10:37.289 --> 00:10:40.409 raised with you know moving images and uh photography 00:10:40.409 --> 00:10:43.149 as as examples on how to tell a story for us 00:10:43.149 --> 00:10:46.250 it morphed a little bit into uh documentaries 00:10:46.250 --> 00:10:48.850 instead of photography and i think we got uh 00:10:48.850 --> 00:10:53.299 our Father lent us our first camera when Gédéon 00:10:53.299 --> 00:10:56.360 was 12. I was nine. We're still in the same dynamic. 00:10:56.580 --> 00:10:58.940 He was kind of the director. I was the actor 00:10:58.940 --> 00:11:01.519 at that time. And that's where we started and 00:11:01.519 --> 00:11:04.960 continuing into continuing being. interested 00:11:04.960 --> 00:11:08.500 in documentary filmmaking in particular. And 00:11:08.500 --> 00:11:11.200 I think the first program we made was at Gédéon's 00:11:11.200 --> 00:11:16.759 high school, where we did a kind of a profile 00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:20.580 of the students and the teachers, which ended 00:11:20.580 --> 00:11:22.659 up being banned by the school. But we set up 00:11:22.659 --> 00:11:26.759 secret screenings inside the school during the 00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:28.820 high school time, where, of course, you would 00:11:28.820 --> 00:11:32.159 see all the teachers screaming in vain while 00:11:32.159 --> 00:11:35.519 the students are playing dungeon and dragon in 00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:37.120 the back of the class or whatever it was but 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:39.379 so that's where we got our first taste for you 00:11:39.379 --> 00:11:42.419 know uh kind of the fly on the wall kind of documentary 00:11:42.419 --> 00:11:45.159 style that we really like but also to show the 00:11:45.159 --> 00:11:48.080 the humanity of things in our you know own uh 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:51.659 immature way at that time and but when we arrived 00:11:51.659 --> 00:11:54.399 to the united states and and in new york which 00:11:54.399 --> 00:11:56.740 was always the the biggest dream of our parents 00:11:56.740 --> 00:11:59.299 who always told us you know one day kids we will 00:11:59.299 --> 00:12:02.769 go there And and so being raised with American 00:12:02.769 --> 00:12:05.090 cinema and series and all that, you know, when 00:12:05.090 --> 00:12:08.830 we arrived, I was 19, I was 16. It was almost 00:12:08.830 --> 00:12:10.850 like it felt like coming home. You know, everything 00:12:10.850 --> 00:12:13.210 was bigger. Everything was was was wilder, was 00:12:13.210 --> 00:12:15.669 more extreme. And we felt right at home because 00:12:15.669 --> 00:12:17.870 that the electricity that we would have and would 00:12:17.870 --> 00:12:20.210 walk this, you know, just on you walk one block 00:12:20.210 --> 00:12:22.009 in New York and you've met you've crossed paths 00:12:22.009 --> 00:12:24.230 with people from 20 different countries with 00:12:24.230 --> 00:12:26.730 different crazy adventures, probably that happened 00:12:26.730 --> 00:12:29.710 to them. And so that energy, you know, the system. 00:12:29.740 --> 00:12:31.740 sustained us and fed us very early on. And then 00:12:31.740 --> 00:12:36.940 we went to NYU and tried to learn, at least professionally, 00:12:37.100 --> 00:12:42.940 how to do documentaries and film in general. 00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:46.179 But it was really that awakening moment of coming 00:12:46.179 --> 00:12:49.120 to New York and feeling of that electricity that 00:12:49.120 --> 00:12:52.019 you can feel and that possibility that there 00:12:52.019 --> 00:12:55.059 is no, everything is possible. That, you know, 00:12:55.080 --> 00:12:58.139 cliche that, you know, the American dream. uh 00:12:58.139 --> 00:13:01.759 is really was a reality for us of course yeah 00:13:01.759 --> 00:13:04.799 so it's interesting how you as you mentioned 00:13:04.799 --> 00:13:07.120 your observation was immediately how diverse 00:13:07.120 --> 00:13:09.740 new york was and i had the same thing even even 00:13:09.740 --> 00:13:11.919 in england i grew up in the farm in a very rural 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:14.220 part of england so when i would go to heathrow 00:13:14.220 --> 00:13:16.720 airport on ski trips or whatever i'd always have 00:13:16.720 --> 00:13:18.860 the same thing like what a beautiful tapestry 00:13:19.470 --> 00:13:21.529 the airport was of the world and then london 00:13:21.529 --> 00:13:25.210 was the same thing so it's it's then crazy and 00:13:25.210 --> 00:13:27.049 obviously as we're recording this there's some 00:13:27.049 --> 00:13:29.309 lunacy going on in this country at the moment 00:13:29.309 --> 00:13:33.850 um that sometimes people in this country don't 00:13:33.850 --> 00:13:35.970 see just how diverse and beautiful their own 00:13:35.970 --> 00:13:39.690 country actually is no and we're lucky i think 00:13:39.690 --> 00:13:42.649 it's particular for us from a european descent 00:13:42.649 --> 00:13:45.330 like this where You know, Europe, we're small 00:13:45.330 --> 00:13:46.970 and we're big at the same time. You know, you 00:13:46.970 --> 00:13:49.830 can take the car or the train and in two hours 00:13:49.830 --> 00:13:51.830 you can be in a different country. And then an 00:13:51.830 --> 00:13:53.769 hour, two hours later, another country after 00:13:53.769 --> 00:13:55.950 that. So I think it's really, I've always found 00:13:55.950 --> 00:13:59.789 it a strength to be able to be in the middle 00:13:59.789 --> 00:14:01.470 of all these different cultures. And I think 00:14:01.470 --> 00:14:03.450 it's a plus to realize that we're not alone. 00:14:03.669 --> 00:14:07.190 And it's an incredible and beautiful and crazy 00:14:07.190 --> 00:14:10.289 world out there. And we're enriched by the people 00:14:10.289 --> 00:14:14.509 in it. Absolutely. Back to your childhood in 00:14:14.509 --> 00:14:16.750 France or in Paris specifically, obviously, we're 00:14:16.750 --> 00:14:19.450 going to talk about the Bataclan and that horrendous 00:14:19.450 --> 00:14:23.029 day a little bit later. But being younger, I 00:14:23.029 --> 00:14:24.570 talk about this a lot. When I grew up in England, 00:14:24.610 --> 00:14:26.789 we had the IRA bombing. So we were exposed to 00:14:26.789 --> 00:14:28.190 terrorism when I was young. I remember a lot 00:14:28.190 --> 00:14:30.970 of the hijackings and plane bombings. Through 00:14:30.970 --> 00:14:33.070 your lens, obviously, you had no intention of 00:14:33.070 --> 00:14:35.450 documenting terrorist attacks when you were becoming 00:14:35.450 --> 00:14:40.789 filmmakers. Were there any... tragedies in France 00:14:40.789 --> 00:14:44.590 during your childhood, prior to obviously moving 00:14:44.590 --> 00:14:51.009 to the US? Indeed, France and Paris in particular, 00:14:51.169 --> 00:14:56.330 where we grew up, experienced the terror, the 00:14:56.330 --> 00:15:00.850 horror of terrorism in the 80s. It was the first 00:15:00.850 --> 00:15:09.259 bombs attack. And we remember quite well, you 00:15:09.259 --> 00:15:14.279 know, sometimes our parents asking us just to 00:15:14.279 --> 00:15:19.179 give them a call right coming out from school 00:15:19.179 --> 00:15:23.200 to make sure it was safe to go home, walking 00:15:23.200 --> 00:15:28.600 back home by ourselves. We remember bombing exploding 00:15:28.600 --> 00:15:35.279 near a father's office. and that was yes that 00:15:35.279 --> 00:15:39.500 was quite scary it was it was very much an environment 00:15:39.500 --> 00:15:44.899 then Yeah, terrorism was something that we all 00:15:44.899 --> 00:15:48.159 knew about. It continues after we arrived in 00:15:48.159 --> 00:15:51.500 the U .S. You had the big wave in the mid and 00:15:51.500 --> 00:15:56.879 early 90s of bombings in the RER, the subway 00:15:56.879 --> 00:16:00.419 in Paris, where almost every three days a bomb, 00:16:00.659 --> 00:16:04.080 a pipe bomb with nails and all that would explode 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:09.639 in a busy subway train. So France has always... 00:16:10.159 --> 00:16:12.580 Just like you, you were born with it. You would 00:16:12.580 --> 00:16:15.200 listen to it on the radio and on the news at 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:17.399 night with your parents, most probably. It was 00:16:17.399 --> 00:16:22.399 permanent. Terrorism was something we were aware 00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:25.220 of. And even though we had not seen it firsthand, 00:16:25.440 --> 00:16:28.500 it was never very far away. Yeah. And who was 00:16:28.500 --> 00:16:31.120 behind the attacks that you were seeing in Paris? 00:16:31.299 --> 00:16:34.820 Was that, again, fundamentalist Islam? Yeah, 00:16:34.899 --> 00:16:39.000 I think it was the PLO, the Palestinian Liberation 00:16:39.000 --> 00:16:42.440 Front. And I think you had also a wave of Corsican 00:16:42.440 --> 00:16:47.139 extremists. So there was a bit of both. But these 00:16:47.139 --> 00:16:49.919 were at that time, I would say, were not more 00:16:49.919 --> 00:16:56.320 religious based, more politically. It was more 00:16:56.320 --> 00:17:00.360 a political struggle. The result is the same. 00:17:00.419 --> 00:17:02.980 Terrorism is terrorism and the trauma and the 00:17:02.980 --> 00:17:06.140 death is the same. I think it was not on a religious 00:17:06.140 --> 00:17:11.359 basis as we've seen later after that. Yeah. All 00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:14.400 right. So now you're in New York. So lead me 00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:17.119 through your education and then how you found 00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:22.460 yourself approaching FDNY. Should you pick up 00:17:22.460 --> 00:17:29.099 this one? Yeah, well, it's always been a shameful 00:17:29.099 --> 00:17:36.640 tale, basically, because here we are arriving 00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:39.700 in New York in the luggages of our parents. And 00:17:39.700 --> 00:17:44.279 I'm 19, Jules is 16, and we are incredibly lucky. 00:17:45.109 --> 00:17:50.190 that one of us is accepted to teach NYU film 00:17:50.190 --> 00:17:54.509 school, the famous one. Still have no idea how 00:17:54.509 --> 00:18:02.670 they got us in, but so only one of us is there 00:18:02.670 --> 00:18:05.890 and because our parents simply cannot afford 00:18:05.890 --> 00:18:12.430 to pay tuition. And so Jules and I have this 00:18:12.430 --> 00:18:18.089 crazy idea to pretend that, as I'm officially 00:18:18.089 --> 00:18:21.829 registered, to pretend that Jules also is officially 00:18:21.829 --> 00:18:26.329 registered. And I'm going to take twice as many 00:18:26.329 --> 00:18:30.349 credits and I'm going to give half of the classes 00:18:30.349 --> 00:18:32.950 to Jules. I'm going to take the directing classes 00:18:32.950 --> 00:18:35.430 and he's going to take the producing classes. 00:18:36.170 --> 00:18:41.710 And to this day, it's insane to think that they 00:18:41.710 --> 00:18:45.799 never realized what happened. And for four years 00:18:45.799 --> 00:18:55.960 Jules got to NYU completely illegally. So I'm 00:18:55.960 --> 00:18:59.579 the only one who officially graduated. We will 00:18:59.579 --> 00:19:03.880 be forever grateful to NYU and whenever we can 00:19:03.880 --> 00:19:09.980 we thank them because it was an amazing school. 00:19:10.220 --> 00:19:13.950 It's one of those schools where You don't have 00:19:13.950 --> 00:19:17.269 to do so much theory. You can just take the camera 00:19:17.269 --> 00:19:20.690 and go out and experiment. And that's the only 00:19:20.690 --> 00:19:23.529 way you're really going to learn. And that's 00:19:23.529 --> 00:19:28.369 what NYU would let us do. But yeah, that was 00:19:28.369 --> 00:19:32.250 the only way to learn. I mean, yeah, we had to 00:19:32.250 --> 00:19:37.549 beg and cheat. Beautiful. And this led us to... 00:19:38.079 --> 00:19:42.599 As we were finishing NYU, we reconnected with 00:19:42.599 --> 00:19:45.539 a friend from Paris who had been at Gédéon's 00:19:45.539 --> 00:19:48.420 high school and who had moved to New York and 00:19:48.420 --> 00:19:53.900 who had married an amazing guy who was an actor 00:19:53.900 --> 00:19:56.170 but was also a firefighter, James Hanlon. And 00:19:56.170 --> 00:20:00.309 after numerous French dinners, which would go 00:20:00.309 --> 00:20:04.789 very, very late into the night, James would tell 00:20:04.789 --> 00:20:08.470 us these incredible tales of life of a New York 00:20:08.470 --> 00:20:11.990 City firefighter and especially life in a firehouse, 00:20:12.069 --> 00:20:14.910 that kind of amazing, mysterious and fascinating 00:20:14.910 --> 00:20:18.509 brotherhood. And so we came up with the ideas 00:20:18.509 --> 00:20:22.740 altogether to what if we do. a documentary on 00:20:22.740 --> 00:20:26.299 a firehouse and especially on a young firefighter. 00:20:26.299 --> 00:20:29.559 And what better way to do it than to use a young 00:20:29.559 --> 00:20:31.940 probie, a rookie firefighter in his probation 00:20:31.940 --> 00:20:36.099 period, which lasts nine months. And we thought 00:20:36.099 --> 00:20:38.220 it was great. We kind of knew it was a very long 00:20:38.220 --> 00:20:40.500 shot because I think the last time that cameras 00:20:40.500 --> 00:20:44.519 had been allowed by the FDNY in a firehouse was 00:20:44.519 --> 00:20:48.299 actually from the BBC in 1975, a documentary 00:20:48.299 --> 00:20:51.900 called The Bronx is Burning. came out. Fascinating. 00:20:52.500 --> 00:20:55.079 You should appreciate that. But it's really at 00:20:55.079 --> 00:20:57.319 the heyday where, you know, you would when they 00:20:57.319 --> 00:21:02.059 would you would look at a baseball game at Yankee 00:21:02.059 --> 00:21:03.740 Stadium, they would pan in the back and you had 00:21:03.740 --> 00:21:06.079 plume of smoke and like five different parts 00:21:06.079 --> 00:21:10.420 of the Bronx were burning. So and so since 1975, 00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:12.500 no one had been allowed to film in the firehouse. 00:21:12.559 --> 00:21:15.940 And so coming to the fire department. with James, 00:21:16.039 --> 00:21:19.599 who was a firefighter, with, I think, our thesis 00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:22.799 film at NYU, which was about amateur boxer in 00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:25.200 Spanish Harlem, which is a very human and very, 00:21:25.279 --> 00:21:29.440 you know, good way to look at things. I think 00:21:29.440 --> 00:21:31.400 they appreciated that and they decided to give 00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:36.200 us a chance. We knew the parameter was we wanted 00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:41.799 to follow every single time that the probie would 00:21:41.799 --> 00:21:44.880 be, whether he was doing a 24 -hour shift or 00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:47.140 a 12 -hour shift, would be there. And so the 00:21:47.140 --> 00:21:48.819 idea was, well, we're going to follow for nine 00:21:48.819 --> 00:21:50.619 months and we'll see what happens. The problem 00:21:50.619 --> 00:21:53.980 is that no one was interested in that. We had 00:21:53.980 --> 00:21:57.019 sent letters to every broadcaster in the U .S. 00:21:57.019 --> 00:21:59.019 and France, and everyone kept telling us. Oh, 00:21:59.059 --> 00:22:00.779 it's very nice. But honestly, you know, firefighters 00:22:00.779 --> 00:22:03.799 don't really interest anyone. And so, as usual, 00:22:03.940 --> 00:22:05.819 you know, the beg, steal and borrow. We didn't 00:22:05.819 --> 00:22:08.000 steal, but we borrowed from friends and best 00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:12.220 friends. And we took day jobs to be able to pay 00:22:12.220 --> 00:22:16.440 for the tapes. I was a Xerox copy person, which, 00:22:16.480 --> 00:22:18.720 of course, now sounds antiquated. But, you know, 00:22:18.799 --> 00:22:21.160 I was in a production company just making Xeroxes. 00:22:21.220 --> 00:22:24.079 And Gideon, what were you doing for that? I was 00:22:24.079 --> 00:22:30.000 a buzz boy and a very bad one at it. So the idea 00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:34.359 was to find ways. And once we had at least the 00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:36.920 budget, which was not much to buy the cameras 00:22:36.920 --> 00:22:40.380 and buy the tapes at that time, we worked with 00:22:40.380 --> 00:22:43.019 the fire department to try to kind of do a casting 00:22:43.019 --> 00:22:45.539 in a way, select the probing. So for this, we 00:22:45.539 --> 00:22:52.079 went to the... the fire academy the rock and 00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:54.559 uh talk to the new class and introduce ourselves 00:22:54.559 --> 00:22:56.380 and said this is who we are this is what we've 00:22:56.380 --> 00:22:58.200 done and this is what we'd like the project we 00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:01.000 would like to do and so out of i don't know a 00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:04.180 class of 200 there was about 50 that were interested 00:23:04.180 --> 00:23:07.440 in at least talking to us we you see in the documentary 00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:10.700 the kind of the interviews we do at first And 00:23:10.700 --> 00:23:13.960 as soon as we met Tony Benetatos, it literally, 00:23:14.119 --> 00:23:16.700 as we said, he was the one. You know, he had 00:23:16.700 --> 00:23:21.109 that naivete and that enthusiasm of youth. And 00:23:21.109 --> 00:23:24.589 especially he had no link to the fire department, 00:23:24.769 --> 00:23:28.430 contrary to a lot of others who were sons, grandsons, 00:23:28.430 --> 00:23:33.490 cousins or nephews of a firefighter themselves. 00:23:33.609 --> 00:23:36.349 Here was a blank slate. And what better way for 00:23:36.349 --> 00:23:38.190 the audience to identify with them? Because as 00:23:38.190 --> 00:23:41.390 Tony would come to the to the firehouse and discover 00:23:41.390 --> 00:23:43.930 this world, through his eyes, the audience will 00:23:43.930 --> 00:23:45.890 have the same way, discovering everything, being 00:23:45.890 --> 00:23:49.839 a virgin to that world. And so we got the okay. 00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:54.460 He agreed to participate. He finished the training 00:23:54.460 --> 00:23:57.720 of the rock and was assigned on, I think, July 00:23:57.720 --> 00:24:00.920 2nd or something like that, June 3rd, I think, 00:24:00.960 --> 00:24:05.720 to come to the firehouse. Beautiful. And just 00:24:05.720 --> 00:24:07.920 prior to that, it just occurred to me, had you 00:24:07.920 --> 00:24:11.220 had any exposure with the Sapo Pompier in Paris 00:24:11.220 --> 00:24:15.480 itself? No. No, no, never. Well, just I guess 00:24:15.480 --> 00:24:19.359 like every young boy, you know, fascination with 00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:21.900 the big rig trucks and the French one in particular, 00:24:22.059 --> 00:24:23.880 who looks like they're coming out from a Star 00:24:23.880 --> 00:24:26.700 Wars movie when they put their C -3PO helmet 00:24:26.700 --> 00:24:29.759 down. And, you know, it was always kind of. The 00:24:29.759 --> 00:24:32.099 normal fascination, but actually, you know, never 00:24:32.099 --> 00:24:35.559 been to a fire, never met any of them socially 00:24:35.559 --> 00:24:39.059 or any other way. So that was a dream come true. 00:24:39.140 --> 00:24:43.099 All this was kind of a lifelong little boy's 00:24:43.099 --> 00:24:47.119 dream coming true. Beautiful. Well, I know he 00:24:47.119 --> 00:24:49.019 refers to himself. I think you talk about him 00:24:49.019 --> 00:24:51.980 as black clouds and white clouds. And he was 00:24:51.980 --> 00:24:53.500 definitely a white cloud. It's funny because 00:24:53.500 --> 00:24:56.599 outside FDNY, a lot of people revere. the city 00:24:56.599 --> 00:24:58.579 and i think it's based more on the war years 00:24:58.579 --> 00:25:00.460 that you know every station is just burning you 00:25:00.460 --> 00:25:02.420 know every shift and the reality is most of the 00:25:02.420 --> 00:25:05.519 the busy departments even more inner city we 00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:09.119 don't get as much fire in you know 2021 as as 00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:12.180 those guys did in the 70s and 80s so kind of 00:25:12.180 --> 00:25:15.160 walk me through your experts expectation of what 00:25:15.160 --> 00:25:16.500 these shifts are going to look like and what 00:25:16.500 --> 00:25:21.579 his first few weeks actually look like so um 00:25:22.589 --> 00:25:27.710 So we start, of course, you know, in our imagination, 00:25:28.009 --> 00:25:29.609 we'll be going to a fire every day. It's going 00:25:29.609 --> 00:25:33.690 to be amazing. Babies will be saved and all that. 00:25:34.170 --> 00:25:38.740 But the reality is... actually what was complicated 00:25:38.740 --> 00:25:42.519 is as you can imagine two little frogs as they 00:25:42.519 --> 00:25:44.480 would call us coming with cameras in a place 00:25:44.480 --> 00:25:47.019 where normally what stays in the firehouse you 00:25:47.019 --> 00:25:48.400 know what happens in the firehouse stays in the 00:25:48.400 --> 00:25:50.740 firehouse and here you have two strange french 00:25:50.740 --> 00:25:54.119 creatures with incredible accents who were filming 00:25:54.119 --> 00:25:57.019 them every move. So their first go to, even though, 00:25:57.039 --> 00:25:59.819 you know, the captain of the engine had agreed 00:25:59.819 --> 00:26:01.880 and the captain of the engine in a house where 00:26:01.880 --> 00:26:04.400 you have the engine and the truck, the captain 00:26:04.400 --> 00:26:06.380 of the engine is the captain of the house. And 00:26:06.380 --> 00:26:09.630 so they had agreed, but... As soon as we came 00:26:09.630 --> 00:26:12.150 in, every time we would film them, they would 00:26:12.150 --> 00:26:15.450 come up with the most incredible curse words 00:26:15.450 --> 00:26:18.750 I had ever seen and still to this day ever heard. 00:26:19.009 --> 00:26:21.190 And so, of course, we couldn't use anything at 00:26:21.190 --> 00:26:23.509 all. And so whenever we would be there, they 00:26:23.509 --> 00:26:25.750 would do that. So we decided, OK, it's going 00:26:25.750 --> 00:26:27.910 to be a little bit more complicated than we thought. 00:26:28.279 --> 00:26:30.940 And also by the fact that whenever Tony would 00:26:30.940 --> 00:26:34.640 work, there was no job whatsoever. It was just, 00:26:34.759 --> 00:26:37.819 you know, as you said, it was a fantastic cooking 00:26:37.819 --> 00:26:40.680 show, which is in itself is something else, which 00:26:40.680 --> 00:26:44.460 is actually, I think, is the way we kind of got 00:26:44.460 --> 00:26:48.160 to there to to to for them to trust us with. 00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:51.420 James had told us very early on. don't worry 00:26:51.420 --> 00:26:55.259 they're going to you know make fun of you mercifully 00:26:55.259 --> 00:26:57.880 until you know they accept you and you will see 00:26:57.880 --> 00:26:59.859 the change almost overnight there is the moment 00:26:59.859 --> 00:27:03.279 where you know they start from making fun of 00:27:03.279 --> 00:27:05.200 you to you know actually from not talking to 00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:06.740 you to making fun of you making fun of you that's 00:27:06.740 --> 00:27:09.140 a good that's a good uh that's a good sign and 00:27:09.140 --> 00:27:11.700 the more they really ride right the more you're 00:27:11.700 --> 00:27:14.579 accepted and so we kind of knew of that but i 00:27:14.579 --> 00:27:17.019 remembered when they would um Not really talk 00:27:17.019 --> 00:27:19.940 to us or that to look at us was a kind of a strange 00:27:19.940 --> 00:27:23.660 look. I remember that our grandmother told us, 00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:25.700 you know, if you want to for certain people, 00:27:25.799 --> 00:27:27.180 if you want to get to them, go through their 00:27:27.180 --> 00:27:29.700 stomach. So I started cooking quite a lot. And 00:27:29.700 --> 00:27:33.660 we did lasagnas. We did French fries that didn't 00:27:33.660 --> 00:27:36.680 come out from a bag and frozen. And, you know, 00:27:36.680 --> 00:27:38.779 all of these things. And I think that really 00:27:38.779 --> 00:27:40.539 was one of the big parts that they said, oh, 00:27:40.740 --> 00:27:42.460 they're maybe not that bad. You know, they cook 00:27:42.460 --> 00:27:45.740 OK. So so that was the start of at least of it. 00:27:46.170 --> 00:27:48.029 Yeah, well, it's funny because there's that one 00:27:48.029 --> 00:27:52.690 scene where you make lamb. And I'm sure to, again, 00:27:52.890 --> 00:27:54.630 European eyes, you're like, this is going to 00:27:54.630 --> 00:27:56.730 be enough. American portions are very different. 00:27:56.829 --> 00:28:00.829 So what was that day like for you? It's strange 00:28:00.829 --> 00:28:06.269 enough for me. It was the best day of that entire 00:28:06.269 --> 00:28:12.039 project. cooking this amazing meal, which I was 00:28:12.039 --> 00:28:15.420 very proud. And it was, you know, it was a leg 00:28:15.420 --> 00:28:19.640 of lamb, flageolet beans, and mashed potatoes. 00:28:19.680 --> 00:28:21.920 You cannot go more French than this with the 00:28:21.920 --> 00:28:23.519 little sauce that goes with it and all that. 00:28:23.960 --> 00:28:26.420 Except that like a moron, you know, yes, I forgot 00:28:26.420 --> 00:28:29.880 to realize that instead of doing one leg of lamb, 00:28:30.019 --> 00:28:31.759 you know, I should have had at least 12 of them. 00:28:33.049 --> 00:28:35.329 You know, so we cook and we set the meal and 00:28:35.329 --> 00:28:38.930 everyone is in a fantastic mood and everyone 00:28:38.930 --> 00:28:42.990 is really making fun of us and everyone is laughing 00:28:42.990 --> 00:28:45.970 and you can feel that fantastic energy. And I 00:28:45.970 --> 00:28:48.089 remember the moment, you know, being in the kind 00:28:48.089 --> 00:28:50.750 of in the doorway, looking at everyone and everyone 00:28:50.750 --> 00:28:53.069 is having a great time. And you know, and James, 00:28:53.130 --> 00:28:55.809 you know, telling stories and all that. And you 00:28:55.809 --> 00:28:58.710 see and I remember reflecting, this is the moment. 00:28:58.789 --> 00:29:01.650 Finally, we're accepted. This is amazing. And, 00:29:01.670 --> 00:29:05.369 you know. the craziness and reality being stranger 00:29:05.369 --> 00:29:08.130 than fiction, it is the night of September 10. 00:29:08.309 --> 00:29:11.069 And that we would not know that the next day 00:29:11.069 --> 00:29:13.069 everything would change. But that night was a 00:29:13.069 --> 00:29:15.490 fantastic night. Even though then later on during 00:29:15.490 --> 00:29:18.450 the night we had like five false alarms and we 00:29:18.450 --> 00:29:20.950 barely slept. And since we were still, you know, 00:29:20.970 --> 00:29:25.509 completely terrorized of missing a fire, we would 00:29:25.509 --> 00:29:28.390 sleep. completely dressed, shoes on, cameras 00:29:28.390 --> 00:29:31.430 on the shoulder, like this, on the couch, ready 00:29:31.430 --> 00:29:34.029 to pounce at any movement and terrorize that 00:29:34.029 --> 00:29:35.849 we would miss it or we'd be in the bathroom when 00:29:35.849 --> 00:29:38.589 the bell runs out. You know, the normal firefighter's 00:29:38.589 --> 00:29:45.849 probie kind of worries. And then the next day 00:29:45.849 --> 00:29:48.829 was completely different. Absolutely. Well, and 00:29:48.829 --> 00:29:50.930 that's what's so heartbreaking. I think with 00:29:50.930 --> 00:29:54.569 9 -11, with November 13th, even with the Notre 00:29:54.569 --> 00:29:57.109 Dame documentary, especially with those two where 00:29:57.109 --> 00:30:00.809 lives were lost, is you take a moment to paint 00:30:00.809 --> 00:30:04.329 the picture of what the morning was like. And 00:30:04.329 --> 00:30:06.309 so obviously, we'll talk about in a second, the 00:30:06.309 --> 00:30:08.269 calls that they ran right before it happened. 00:30:08.450 --> 00:30:10.670 And then in November 13th, the people setting 00:30:10.670 --> 00:30:14.470 up for the day in the cafes. And so let's talk 00:30:14.470 --> 00:30:17.009 about that. So kind of... What was the morning 00:30:17.009 --> 00:30:19.890 like prior to, you know, when the world changed, 00:30:19.990 --> 00:30:24.569 as it were? Changed a day only one. Well, it's 00:30:24.569 --> 00:30:32.130 a regular morning. I mean, right away we wake 00:30:32.130 --> 00:30:38.230 up and we know that around seven, eight o 'clock 00:30:38.230 --> 00:30:41.089 in the morning, there's going to be a shift. 00:30:41.150 --> 00:30:50.099 And so Tony Beletatos will just go home. But 00:30:50.099 --> 00:30:53.960 right away, we call her parents, like we often 00:30:53.960 --> 00:30:57.660 do, and they live in Paris. And we tell them, 00:30:57.660 --> 00:31:02.420 look, it was another night with no fire, but 00:31:02.420 --> 00:31:06.019 we really believe we're connecting with the guys. 00:31:06.099 --> 00:31:09.279 They're finally accepting us, and they're very 00:31:09.279 --> 00:31:11.579 happy for us. And we hang up with our parents, 00:31:11.619 --> 00:31:14.680 and we say, well, I'll speak to you later. Have 00:31:14.680 --> 00:31:18.640 a great day. And right when we hang up, I think 00:31:18.640 --> 00:31:24.680 the alarm ring. And it's an order of gas on VZ 00:31:24.680 --> 00:31:26.839 and Church, something like that. Jules, if I'm 00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:33.039 not mistaken. Lispenard. Lispenard. And so Jules, 00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:38.440 who has a camera that follows the chief, the 00:31:38.440 --> 00:31:41.839 chief car. And at that time, it's Chief Pfeiffer, 00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:45.480 Battalion Chief. Joseph Pfeiffer, who's on duty. 00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:51.119 So Jules jumps with the chief in his car, and 00:31:51.119 --> 00:31:57.740 the truck follows. And I'm with the second camera, 00:31:57.779 --> 00:32:01.599 and my job is to follow the rookie, Tony, at 00:32:01.599 --> 00:32:05.960 all times. Except that Tony had just barely been 00:32:05.960 --> 00:32:11.299 relieved. And so he is relieved. The other rookie 00:32:11.299 --> 00:32:16.490 who gets... on the engine and follows the chief 00:32:16.490 --> 00:32:19.750 and Jules and the truck. I stay in the firehouse 00:32:19.750 --> 00:32:29.779 with Tony and basically minutes pass and... And 00:32:29.779 --> 00:32:32.099 I guess you should tell the story because this 00:32:32.099 --> 00:32:35.420 is... This is unbeknownst to me. When I take 00:32:35.420 --> 00:32:39.319 the call and I go in the chief's car, you have 00:32:39.319 --> 00:32:41.880 to understand we had set up our responsibilities. 00:32:42.220 --> 00:32:45.039 Gédéon, which is the oldest and the accomplished 00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:48.400 cameraman, was the one filming Tony at all times. 00:32:48.519 --> 00:32:52.559 And so me being kind of the newbie and filming 00:32:52.559 --> 00:32:55.440 for the first time, we had thought, but it would 00:32:55.440 --> 00:32:57.119 be an interesting point of view to have the chief 00:32:57.119 --> 00:32:58.960 also, the battalion chief. So we have two... 00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:03.819 different insights into the job, the men who 00:33:03.819 --> 00:33:06.900 go inside the fire and the strategy part of the 00:33:06.900 --> 00:33:09.660 chief itself. And so, you know, I've been doing 00:33:09.660 --> 00:33:12.079 that all summer. Most of the chiefs know me pretty 00:33:12.079 --> 00:33:14.880 well. Chief Pfeiffer, we've seen each other. 00:33:14.940 --> 00:33:16.480 He's kind of used to the old French guy in the 00:33:16.480 --> 00:33:19.319 back of his SUV with a camera. So it's nothing, 00:33:19.400 --> 00:33:26.579 you know. And so when I arrive at Les Bernard 00:33:26.579 --> 00:33:30.460 and Church, Honestly, it's a pretty normal day. 00:33:30.519 --> 00:33:34.279 It's gorgeous. I remember it's a blue sky. I 00:33:34.279 --> 00:33:36.200 think I'm thinking about, you know, going voting 00:33:36.200 --> 00:33:38.259 later on because it was the mayoral election 00:33:38.259 --> 00:33:41.259 of New York at that time, right on that day. 00:33:43.460 --> 00:33:46.980 So I I arrive and just film and I'm sure she 00:33:46.980 --> 00:33:48.660 was there. But, you know, at the fire scene, 00:33:48.759 --> 00:33:51.099 there's a lot of people. There's a lot of them. 00:33:51.160 --> 00:33:53.119 So I don't see him. But for me, you know, with 00:33:53.119 --> 00:33:55.440 Tony somewhere, I don't I concentrate on what 00:33:55.440 --> 00:33:57.559 I'm supposed to do. And since I'm, you know, 00:33:57.599 --> 00:33:59.859 I'm new at this, I always kind of do the cliche. 00:33:59.920 --> 00:34:02.079 I'm going to film kind of the landmark that is 00:34:02.079 --> 00:34:04.819 right in front of me so I can kind of get a good 00:34:04.819 --> 00:34:07.380 point of to find myself. So it's always. the 00:34:07.380 --> 00:34:08.840 World Trade Center is there. So I always kind 00:34:08.840 --> 00:34:11.440 of do the pans from the World Trade Center, moving 00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:14.300 back to the guys. You know, I'm thinking in my 00:34:14.300 --> 00:34:16.460 head how I'm not going to mess this up and no 00:34:16.460 --> 00:34:18.460 one's going to scream at me if I don't take the 00:34:18.460 --> 00:34:20.340 message. So, you know, it's still the little 00:34:20.340 --> 00:34:22.619 brother, older brother kind of thing. So, you 00:34:22.619 --> 00:34:25.960 know, just practicing, filming. I see Chief Pfeiffer, 00:34:26.059 --> 00:34:28.800 who sees that there is a slight odor of gas, 00:34:28.880 --> 00:34:31.139 but, you know, Con Edison, which is the gas company's 00:34:31.139 --> 00:34:33.519 call, standard procedures, there's nothing, you 00:34:33.519 --> 00:34:35.940 know, we don't smell a lot of gas, so we're not... 00:34:36.119 --> 00:34:38.900 concerned at all. But we stay around, as is what 00:34:38.900 --> 00:34:41.480 you're supposed to do until the kind of lesson 00:34:41.480 --> 00:34:44.980 arrives. And as we're milling around and I'm 00:34:44.980 --> 00:34:48.969 filming Chief Pfeiffer, I. carry a very small 00:34:48.969 --> 00:34:50.809 camera. It's about like this. I carry it normally 00:34:50.809 --> 00:34:53.429 at my hip so I can look around and see what's 00:34:53.429 --> 00:34:56.349 happening. And I look on the little LCD screen 00:34:56.349 --> 00:34:59.929 to kind of see what is in frame. And as I'm filming 00:34:59.929 --> 00:35:03.869 the chief, I remember we hear this kind of loud 00:35:03.869 --> 00:35:06.389 roar, like getting a bit louder. You know, we're 00:35:06.389 --> 00:35:08.550 used to planes in New York City, but this one 00:35:08.550 --> 00:35:11.630 was different. So I remember looking up and seeing 00:35:11.630 --> 00:35:14.250 in between two buildings, behind two buildings, 00:35:14.469 --> 00:35:18.530 a plane that goes in the back of it. pretty large 00:35:18.530 --> 00:35:21.090 it's pretty fast it's pretty low i can read american 00:35:21.090 --> 00:35:23.829 online um american airline on the on the back 00:35:23.829 --> 00:35:26.550 of it and then you know it kind of disappears 00:35:26.550 --> 00:35:28.929 behind a building and i'm saying okay reflex 00:35:28.929 --> 00:35:31.469 my camera is already on so i you know turn to 00:35:31.469 --> 00:35:33.650 follow its trajectory it's what what's going 00:35:33.650 --> 00:35:36.489 to happen and it is it reappears behind the building 00:35:36.489 --> 00:35:40.389 it crashes into one world trade it's the moment 00:35:40.389 --> 00:35:45.380 where uh which is But time completely kind of 00:35:45.380 --> 00:35:49.880 dilates. It's, you know, seconds seem to take 00:35:49.880 --> 00:35:53.440 minutes. And it's very strange. I think you have 00:35:53.440 --> 00:35:57.699 such a sensory overload that being able to process 00:35:57.699 --> 00:36:00.260 that kind of slows down everything. So between 00:36:00.260 --> 00:36:02.559 what I'm seeing and what I'm thinking, I cannot 00:36:02.559 --> 00:36:05.539 make sense of the two together. And I'm brought 00:36:05.539 --> 00:36:08.119 back kind of to reality by the sound. There is 00:36:08.119 --> 00:36:11.039 a delay in the explosion, which I hear and see 00:36:11.039 --> 00:36:13.900 the... The firefighters all around kind of being 00:36:13.900 --> 00:36:17.980 removed from that microsecond of shock. And then 00:36:17.980 --> 00:36:21.119 everyone jumps into their trucks and the chief 00:36:21.119 --> 00:36:23.139 jumps into his car. I follow him immediately. 00:36:23.219 --> 00:36:27.039 And then we dash to the World Trade Center where 00:36:27.039 --> 00:36:29.679 we're there in about a minute and a half flat 00:36:29.679 --> 00:36:33.019 since it's early on. It's 846. There's not much 00:36:33.019 --> 00:36:36.679 people that time. But we're cruising. And what 00:36:36.679 --> 00:36:39.800 I don't... I remember at that time, even though 00:36:39.800 --> 00:36:42.780 I'm filming continuously, is the chief actually 00:36:42.780 --> 00:36:45.539 says, and I will find that later when I rewatch 00:36:45.539 --> 00:36:47.639 the tape, Chief Pfeiffer saying, you know, it 00:36:47.639 --> 00:36:51.780 looked like a direct attack. One was the World 00:36:51.780 --> 00:36:54.880 Trade Center was hit and then gives where they 00:36:54.880 --> 00:36:57.840 should meet. The first one inside one World Trade 00:36:57.840 --> 00:37:00.480 Center and the other one as a secondary staging 00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:04.000 post a little bit further. But, you know, it's 00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:07.829 hard to really think concrete. I'm just concentrating 00:37:07.829 --> 00:37:10.730 on what I'm seeing, trying to film the chief 00:37:10.730 --> 00:37:14.090 and his driver, and all that. But it's kind of 00:37:14.090 --> 00:37:18.329 chaos in my mind at that point. So you want to 00:37:18.329 --> 00:37:20.369 jump back and forth? We can do back and forth 00:37:20.369 --> 00:37:22.309 between Gédéon's perspective and mine, maybe. 00:37:22.429 --> 00:37:27.630 Please, please. Okay. So I'm in the firehouse. 00:37:27.650 --> 00:37:31.389 It's a completely empty firehouse with just Tony, 00:37:31.510 --> 00:37:36.849 the probie firefighter. And he's about to leave 00:37:36.849 --> 00:37:42.469 to go home when suddenly there's a large frantic 00:37:42.469 --> 00:37:46.969 knock at the firehouse front door. And he opened 00:37:46.969 --> 00:37:50.909 the door and there is this guy who says, you 00:37:50.909 --> 00:37:54.590 guys have to come. There is an explosion. There 00:37:54.590 --> 00:37:58.889 is a plane that hit the wall at center. Come 00:37:58.889 --> 00:38:05.869 right away. And it makes no sense. Tony looks 00:38:05.869 --> 00:38:09.329 at me. I look at Tony. The firehouse is completely 00:38:09.329 --> 00:38:14.349 empty. I just pick up the camera and I go around 00:38:14.349 --> 00:38:18.289 the corner on Church Street. And I see a gigantic 00:38:18.289 --> 00:38:23.309 hole in One World Trade Center with smoke coming 00:38:23.309 --> 00:38:26.909 out of it. And it's this moment where suddenly 00:38:26.909 --> 00:38:32.250 I feel terribly guilty for the entire summer. 00:38:32.730 --> 00:38:36.809 I wished that something would go on, that we 00:38:36.809 --> 00:38:43.210 would see a fire. And suddenly, here it is, a 00:38:43.210 --> 00:38:46.309 plane. I just crashed into the World Trade Center. 00:38:46.429 --> 00:38:51.110 This is just too big. And, you know, it's a stupid 00:38:51.110 --> 00:38:53.710 reaction. Why should I feel guilty? I didn't 00:38:53.710 --> 00:38:59.219 make it happen, but I did. I'm thinking, damn, 00:38:59.440 --> 00:39:02.659 where is Jules? And he must be with everyone. 00:39:02.840 --> 00:39:05.400 And he must be heading toward the World Trade 00:39:05.400 --> 00:39:11.300 Center. So I go back. I tell Tony that there 00:39:11.300 --> 00:39:14.579 is indeed a gigantic hole in the World Trade 00:39:14.579 --> 00:39:17.880 Center. And I pick up all the equipment and I 00:39:17.880 --> 00:39:21.800 start walking down to Church Street, to the World 00:39:21.800 --> 00:39:27.170 Trade Center. Same with Jules, you know, it's 00:39:27.170 --> 00:39:31.349 very hard to comprehend filming the reaction 00:39:31.349 --> 00:39:35.289 of the people. It's like the entire planet was 00:39:35.289 --> 00:39:42.329 there looking up. And quickly, just arriving 00:39:42.329 --> 00:39:48.730 down the World Trade Center, this gigantic boom, 00:39:48.809 --> 00:39:53.099 explosion, and it was the second plane. just 00:39:53.099 --> 00:39:58.019 hitting the the south tower um and and yeah that 00:39:58.019 --> 00:40:01.420 that's that's those twilight zone moment where 00:40:01.420 --> 00:40:06.059 you it's just too much uh you this is no accident 00:40:06.059 --> 00:40:11.679 anymore but you have no idea what to do uh the 00:40:11.679 --> 00:40:14.380 only thing i knew was jules was at the world 00:40:14.380 --> 00:40:22.030 trade center Those two towers were burning and 00:40:22.030 --> 00:40:25.010 now cops were telling everybody to evacuate. 00:40:25.550 --> 00:40:30.190 So I just walked back to the firehouse. I think 00:40:30.190 --> 00:40:33.300 the crazy part... where it becomes you know it 00:40:33.300 --> 00:40:35.440 kind of goes on the of the rail which is already 00:40:35.440 --> 00:40:37.820 when we see the first plane i remember for me 00:40:37.820 --> 00:40:40.599 was a series of just getting things from from 00:40:40.599 --> 00:40:43.880 from from bad to worse you know arriving at the 00:40:43.880 --> 00:40:46.679 uh finally at the world trade center by parking 00:40:46.679 --> 00:40:48.739 right under the awning of one world trade the 00:40:48.739 --> 00:40:51.699 north tower and seeing the chief uh gets out 00:40:51.699 --> 00:40:53.940 to start to put his bunker gear and of course 00:40:53.940 --> 00:40:56.179 i asked him you know can i come in with you and 00:40:56.179 --> 00:40:59.159 he tells me yes you know please don't um don't 00:40:59.159 --> 00:41:01.300 leave my site and i think in him we talked to 00:41:01.360 --> 00:41:03.579 after about it he didn't want me to start uh 00:41:03.579 --> 00:41:06.320 being around he didn't want me if he if he he 00:41:06.320 --> 00:41:08.380 thought that if he told me not to to go in i 00:41:08.380 --> 00:41:10.159 would be around it and he knew it was dangerous 00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:13.980 and so we went in and i think what as soon as 00:41:13.980 --> 00:41:18.599 we go in I see these two people who are burning 00:41:18.599 --> 00:41:22.639 alive. And it made me almost remember these pictures 00:41:22.639 --> 00:41:26.880 that we had seen when we were young people. The 00:41:26.880 --> 00:41:30.780 Vietnam, the war photographers were taken in 00:41:30.780 --> 00:41:35.000 the Vietnam War with, you know, a little girl 00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:37.480 burning and all that. All these images came back 00:41:37.480 --> 00:41:40.679 flooding into me because here, you know, having... 00:41:41.019 --> 00:41:43.579 My brother and I have lived very sheltered life 00:41:43.579 --> 00:41:46.019 up to that point. You know, I think the death, 00:41:46.139 --> 00:41:49.000 the closest we had seen was a relative in a suit, 00:41:49.159 --> 00:41:51.960 you know, in a coffin that you pay your respects 00:41:51.960 --> 00:41:54.980 to. But here, the immediacy and the horror of 00:41:54.980 --> 00:41:59.039 it and the sight, the sound, the smell, everything 00:41:59.039 --> 00:42:02.360 was so horrible that I think that gauge, at least 00:42:02.360 --> 00:42:04.679 in my part, and I think Gideon did the same. 00:42:06.269 --> 00:42:09.389 I censored myself from that moment on, which 00:42:09.389 --> 00:42:11.690 was a defense mechanism. I don't think there's 00:42:11.690 --> 00:42:13.690 anything noble about what I wanted to do and 00:42:13.690 --> 00:42:16.030 all that. I think I was at first trying to protect 00:42:16.030 --> 00:42:18.630 myself from the horror of the image that is still 00:42:18.630 --> 00:42:23.210 seared into my brain until today, that no one 00:42:23.210 --> 00:42:24.949 should see this, that there is a certain respect 00:42:24.949 --> 00:42:28.090 of... uh in life but in death also and so from 00:42:28.090 --> 00:42:31.449 that moment on uh i would not actually also uh 00:42:31.449 --> 00:42:33.449 separately had made that same decision filming 00:42:33.449 --> 00:42:36.230 the dead or the or the wooden in a way that was 00:42:36.230 --> 00:42:39.570 gratuitous we didn't want that and so as i come 00:42:39.570 --> 00:42:42.869 in the the the world trade center First, I see 00:42:42.869 --> 00:42:44.409 that all the windows outside have been blown 00:42:44.409 --> 00:42:46.610 out. It looks very strange. You have that smell 00:42:46.610 --> 00:42:48.650 of kerosene downstairs. You don't know what happened. 00:42:48.909 --> 00:42:51.670 We would learn later on that it was the jet fuel 00:42:51.670 --> 00:42:55.030 that went down a broken elevator shaft that created 00:42:55.030 --> 00:42:57.590 that fireball in the lobby. And that burned these 00:42:57.590 --> 00:43:02.329 people right there that I was seeing. As I'm 00:43:02.329 --> 00:43:04.690 going to the left, following the chief still, 00:43:04.869 --> 00:43:08.670 we hear one of our guys from, I think, the truck, 00:43:08.889 --> 00:43:13.070 Jamal, who actually used the extinguisher and 00:43:13.070 --> 00:43:14.789 puts down the person. And that person is then 00:43:14.789 --> 00:43:16.730 taken outside. I think that person lived, actually. 00:43:17.429 --> 00:43:20.889 And then I follow the chief and we go to the 00:43:20.889 --> 00:43:24.349 fire control area, which is right to the left 00:43:24.349 --> 00:43:27.869 when you come in. And then, you know, firefighters 00:43:27.869 --> 00:43:31.880 start streaming in. It's a nonstop. sirens, guys 00:43:31.880 --> 00:43:35.820 coming in, checking in, going up. And here I 00:43:35.820 --> 00:43:38.539 don't feel worried in a way. I feel, you know, 00:43:38.579 --> 00:43:41.360 I'm surrounded by these amazing, you know, kind 00:43:41.360 --> 00:43:44.579 of superhero who don't wear maybe uniforms or 00:43:44.579 --> 00:43:48.400 capes, but, you know, their bunker gear, for 00:43:48.400 --> 00:43:50.719 me, it's a giant S in a way. It's kind of a Superman. 00:43:51.659 --> 00:43:54.639 And also I feel that, you know, I've seen that 00:43:54.639 --> 00:43:56.619 the fire is very high above me, so I don't... 00:43:56.750 --> 00:43:59.949 feel concerned i there's not a million year that 00:43:59.949 --> 00:44:02.190 in my i have any thought that these towers can 00:44:02.190 --> 00:44:04.170 ever come down i think that's not something you 00:44:04.170 --> 00:44:09.050 even realize can happen and as um i'm filming 00:44:09.050 --> 00:44:12.250 around filming the uh everyone we hear a loud 00:44:12.250 --> 00:44:15.510 explosion and i remember looking up and filming 00:44:15.510 --> 00:44:18.960 and we see flaming debris uh falling on the other 00:44:18.960 --> 00:44:21.719 side of the courtyard. And someone comes in and 00:44:21.719 --> 00:44:24.179 said, another plane has just hit the other tower. 00:44:24.320 --> 00:44:26.059 And that's where, for me, I realized that it's 00:44:26.059 --> 00:44:27.860 not an accident. Up to that point, I was sure 00:44:27.860 --> 00:44:29.940 it was an accident, or at least I didn't question 00:44:29.940 --> 00:44:32.900 what was happening. And here it seems to be, 00:44:32.920 --> 00:44:34.639 you know, we're under attack and that seems to 00:44:34.639 --> 00:44:37.500 be what is happening. And everything changes 00:44:37.500 --> 00:44:41.099 again. You know, the stress level comes in because 00:44:41.099 --> 00:44:45.920 it's now you're hunted in a way. You feel like 00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:52.260 a target. and and and so the stress for me I 00:44:52.260 --> 00:44:55.539 keep it inside but I think it manifests as being 00:44:55.539 --> 00:44:59.820 frantically filming and as a way you know our 00:44:59.820 --> 00:45:01.800 brain protects us in the most strangest way so 00:45:01.800 --> 00:45:04.179 for me it was making sure I keep filming because 00:45:04.179 --> 00:45:07.199 it gave me something to do made sure I had to 00:45:07.199 --> 00:45:10.159 clean the lens so I would them you know, the 00:45:10.159 --> 00:45:12.059 image will be good. And once again, you know, 00:45:12.079 --> 00:45:14.980 my brother will not be disappointed with me and 00:45:14.980 --> 00:45:17.679 will be proud of the work I do. And so it was 00:45:17.679 --> 00:45:21.480 always trying to, it was almost like, I don't 00:45:21.480 --> 00:45:23.539 know, something I would repeat almost like a 00:45:23.539 --> 00:45:26.360 Zen kind of thing. You know, I would count when 00:45:26.360 --> 00:45:28.500 I would film people to make sure I would keep 00:45:28.500 --> 00:45:30.800 them in frame for about five to 10 seconds. So 00:45:30.800 --> 00:45:33.099 I would count out loud or in my head. And so 00:45:33.099 --> 00:45:34.880 it was a way to kind of calm my nerves and give 00:45:34.880 --> 00:45:38.260 me something to do. Seeing everything happening 00:45:38.260 --> 00:45:41.960 through that little LCD screen in a way was a 00:45:41.960 --> 00:45:45.619 way to looking at it through a window. And then, 00:45:45.699 --> 00:45:49.840 unfortunately, started the loud bangs and explosion 00:45:49.840 --> 00:45:52.000 that we would hear that we would very soon realize 00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:54.340 it was actually people who were jumping from 00:45:54.340 --> 00:45:58.980 the higher floors. And that was one of the hardest 00:45:58.980 --> 00:46:01.219 part, you know, because it's absolutely surreal. 00:46:01.340 --> 00:46:05.400 You don't see it. But you hear it, and the sound 00:46:05.400 --> 00:46:10.420 represents the death of a person. And intellectually, 00:46:10.579 --> 00:46:12.719 to realize that every time you hear that, and 00:46:12.719 --> 00:46:16.320 I would hear it over 20 times, if not more, you 00:46:16.320 --> 00:46:18.960 know what that sound represents, and with that 00:46:18.960 --> 00:46:21.519 sound is a life, and what a life represents. 00:46:21.719 --> 00:46:27.159 And it's kind of traumatic to try to understand 00:46:27.159 --> 00:46:32.300 that. But then, Jadid, if you want to pick up 00:46:32.300 --> 00:46:40.489 on your end. So, meanwhile, I walk my way back 00:46:40.489 --> 00:46:44.570 to the firehouse, and it's still empty. It's 00:46:44.570 --> 00:46:50.349 only the probie, Tony, there, manning the firehouse 00:46:50.349 --> 00:46:57.570 by himself. And there is this monitor, and he's 00:46:57.570 --> 00:47:02.760 watching TV, and he's completely helpless. like 00:47:02.760 --> 00:47:08.139 i am there is nothing you can do we uh except 00:47:08.139 --> 00:47:14.079 uh except soon um uh one then two then three 00:47:14.079 --> 00:47:18.400 firefighters uh arrive uh directly from their 00:47:18.400 --> 00:47:21.159 home the lucky one who managed to cross the bridge 00:47:21.159 --> 00:47:27.840 or the tunnel uh fast enough um uh to uh to arrive 00:47:27.840 --> 00:47:34.030 at the firehouse and um And I'm thinking there 00:47:34.030 --> 00:47:37.929 is no way I'm going to walk back by myself to 00:47:37.929 --> 00:47:41.949 the World Trade Center. I'm not a firefighter 00:47:41.949 --> 00:47:45.449 and I'm going to be pushed away again by cops 00:47:45.449 --> 00:47:52.130 and FBI agents who are now all around. And so 00:47:52.130 --> 00:48:00.199 I waited until... Steve Rogers arrived, the veteran 00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:04.860 firefighter in the house, who right away said, 00:48:05.019 --> 00:48:07.900 I'm going to pick up my, I'm going to go there 00:48:07.900 --> 00:48:11.920 on my pickup truck. And he assembled three of 00:48:11.920 --> 00:48:19.179 his guys. And I said, can I come? uh i i need 00:48:19.179 --> 00:48:21.420 to find out what's going on and jules is over 00:48:21.420 --> 00:48:24.599 there and uh i cannot stay here by myself doing 00:48:24.599 --> 00:48:27.340 nothing and he said yes and i was so grateful 00:48:27.340 --> 00:48:30.860 that he said yes and um so i jumped with him 00:48:30.860 --> 00:48:34.800 and then and three other guys and he he drive 00:48:34.800 --> 00:48:38.519 his pickup truck like a madman down church street 00:48:38.519 --> 00:48:42.400 uh we arrived we parked kind of a block or two 00:48:42.400 --> 00:48:47.030 from the world trade center uh The vision of 00:48:47.030 --> 00:48:50.309 downtown... It's collapsed already. The South 00:48:50.309 --> 00:48:53.030 Tower is collapsed. Yes, so sorry, so sorry. 00:48:53.389 --> 00:49:00.510 While we are at the firehouse, the South Tower, 00:49:00.610 --> 00:49:05.289 the second one to be hit, collapsed. It happened 00:49:05.289 --> 00:49:09.289 at the same time that I lose Tony Benenatos, 00:49:09.590 --> 00:49:15.289 the probie, who basically... rush outside with 00:49:15.289 --> 00:49:24.329 an old retired fire chief, Chief Burns, an incredible 00:49:24.329 --> 00:49:27.550 character who also managed to come home, even 00:49:27.550 --> 00:49:32.329 though he was a retired chief. He just saw Tony 00:49:32.329 --> 00:49:36.630 in the firehouse. He just picked up some gear 00:49:36.630 --> 00:49:40.150 and he said, Tony, let's go. Let's go help people. 00:49:40.699 --> 00:49:43.400 And that was insane to see, except that I lost 00:49:43.400 --> 00:49:46.139 them in the crowd, so I came back. Anyway, so 00:49:46.139 --> 00:49:52.099 here I am in the pickup truck with Steve, the 00:49:52.099 --> 00:49:57.659 veteran of the house, three other guys, and driving 00:49:57.659 --> 00:50:03.619 like a madman. And the street is completely white. 00:50:03.840 --> 00:50:06.619 People are white. Everybody is covered by this 00:50:06.619 --> 00:50:12.460 dust. We start to walk. toward the North Tower, 00:50:12.619 --> 00:50:17.119 the only one left standing. And when we arrive 00:50:17.119 --> 00:50:21.039 on Visey Street, the street adjacent to the tower, 00:50:21.400 --> 00:50:26.039 I take a bit more time. I don't walk as fast 00:50:26.039 --> 00:50:29.760 as they do. I don't know. There's something just 00:50:29.760 --> 00:50:33.300 at that point so terrifying that I don't know 00:50:33.300 --> 00:50:36.320 why, but my legs are not really walking me anymore. 00:50:36.420 --> 00:50:41.659 And I'm kind of do... stand up, just stupidly 00:50:41.659 --> 00:50:50.019 filming. And that's when this gigantic war happened. 00:50:50.639 --> 00:50:55.639 And it was like in those catastrophe movie, you 00:50:55.639 --> 00:50:58.280 know, you just look up and you see in slow motion 00:50:58.280 --> 00:51:02.559 the top of this skyscraper falling on you. And 00:51:02.559 --> 00:51:09.349 the next thing I know, I'm running a few feet 00:51:09.349 --> 00:51:16.349 away to an empty fire engine. And I go up. I 00:51:16.349 --> 00:51:20.889 open the door and I crawl myself. I hear someone 00:51:20.889 --> 00:51:24.730 behind me getting in just a few seconds after 00:51:24.730 --> 00:51:29.909 me. And that's it. I'm just waiting to die because 00:51:29.909 --> 00:51:34.969 the debris I can hear and feel are falling. all 00:51:34.969 --> 00:51:38.429 around the the fire engine some are falling on 00:51:38.429 --> 00:51:41.570 it i i can i can hear the the windows exploding 00:51:41.570 --> 00:51:44.690 and i'm just waiting for the moment of the big 00:51:44.690 --> 00:51:48.690 one crashing us and uh remembering uh you know 00:51:48.690 --> 00:51:52.210 as seconds as drew said second would would feel 00:51:52.210 --> 00:51:56.250 like minutes uh feeling quite um angry pissed 00:51:56.250 --> 00:51:59.369 off that uh i was not dead already you know the 00:51:59.369 --> 00:52:02.730 the waiting for for your death was so annoying 00:52:02.730 --> 00:52:06.619 so so So horrible. So you just wanted it to be 00:52:06.619 --> 00:52:12.380 over. Anyways, your turn, I guess. Yeah. James, 00:52:12.420 --> 00:52:16.579 is that what you're interested in? I don't know 00:52:16.579 --> 00:52:19.400 if you want us to skip. No, no, no. As long as 00:52:19.400 --> 00:52:22.719 you have time, I've set aside as much time as 00:52:22.719 --> 00:52:24.500 it takes to tell your story today. So please 00:52:24.500 --> 00:52:27.119 take your time. I'm honored that I'm sitting 00:52:27.119 --> 00:52:29.480 here listening to this. So thank you. No problem. 00:52:29.599 --> 00:52:36.889 So to go back a little bit. After the second 00:52:36.889 --> 00:52:40.050 plane has hit, you know, it's a chaotic time 00:52:40.050 --> 00:52:42.909 in the lobby. There's more and more people coming, 00:52:43.090 --> 00:52:46.789 more and more people going up, including Chief 00:52:46.789 --> 00:52:49.670 Pfeiffer's brother, Kevin, from Engine 33, a 00:52:49.670 --> 00:52:53.690 lieutenant who goes to see his brother and his 00:52:53.690 --> 00:52:57.269 brother gives him the assignment to go up. And 00:52:57.269 --> 00:52:59.010 unfortunately, it will be the last time they 00:52:59.010 --> 00:53:00.489 will see each other because Chief Pfeiffer's 00:53:00.489 --> 00:53:04.699 brother would die in the North Tower. As people 00:53:04.699 --> 00:53:12.980 are coming in, I see the preacher of the firehouse. 00:53:15.360 --> 00:53:19.559 fire chaplain, sorry, the chaplain, father judge, 00:53:19.780 --> 00:53:23.980 which I had seen before at other events and things 00:53:23.980 --> 00:53:26.199 like that. But here, normally, you know, he's 00:53:26.199 --> 00:53:29.099 always kind of a blusterous guy, always a smile 00:53:29.099 --> 00:53:31.539 on his face, always a quick word, a quick, quick 00:53:31.539 --> 00:53:34.079 smile. And here it's absolutely the opposite. 00:53:34.480 --> 00:53:37.320 He has an incredibly serious demeanor. He looks 00:53:37.320 --> 00:53:39.679 like he's mumbling. Some people would say he 00:53:39.679 --> 00:53:43.679 was. praying and, you know, not making eye contact 00:53:43.679 --> 00:53:45.780 with people. And it was very striking. I remember 00:53:45.780 --> 00:53:47.739 filming him because he was, you know, he's really 00:53:47.739 --> 00:53:52.460 a beloved figure in the fire department and was 00:53:52.460 --> 00:53:55.860 always there for people. And I see a lot of people 00:53:55.860 --> 00:53:59.059 and what strikes me is really the look on their 00:53:59.059 --> 00:54:02.860 faces. It's not fear because they're not afraid, 00:54:02.980 --> 00:54:07.159 but the level of concern, the level of realization 00:54:07.159 --> 00:54:11.530 of... the the the how big is the job how dangerous 00:54:11.530 --> 00:54:14.409 it's going to be the realization of the loss 00:54:14.409 --> 00:54:16.449 of life that has already taken place that will 00:54:16.449 --> 00:54:19.230 continue to take place and the most probable 00:54:19.230 --> 00:54:22.110 uh injuries to firefighters as they're going 00:54:22.110 --> 00:54:27.050 up 80 floors of uh 80 floors uh using the stairs 00:54:27.050 --> 00:54:29.889 with 50 pounds on the minimum on their on their 00:54:29.889 --> 00:54:33.670 shoulders you can feel that that that that determination 00:54:33.670 --> 00:54:39.000 and i'm always You know, we're giant groupies 00:54:39.000 --> 00:54:42.280 of firefighters, all first responders, firefighters 00:54:42.280 --> 00:54:47.000 in particular. And to see that determination, 00:54:47.099 --> 00:54:51.389 that courage, that... you know, what for us makes 00:54:51.389 --> 00:54:54.789 them kind of the best of all of us is this determination 00:54:54.789 --> 00:54:58.510 to regardless of danger to themselves, they will 00:54:58.510 --> 00:55:01.869 be there and they will jump into a building on 00:55:01.869 --> 00:55:06.829 fire willingly, eagerly to be able to save people's 00:55:06.829 --> 00:55:09.829 lives. And here I could see it firsthand. Even 00:55:09.829 --> 00:55:11.550 though they knew it was going to be bad, they 00:55:11.550 --> 00:55:15.090 knew that some of them or themselves would lose 00:55:15.090 --> 00:55:17.389 their lives. There was no hesitation. On the 00:55:17.389 --> 00:55:19.610 contrary, the frustration was that they couldn't 00:55:19.610 --> 00:55:26.289 get up there fast enough. And as things are trying 00:55:26.289 --> 00:55:29.610 to... quite done in a way even though we're getting 00:55:29.610 --> 00:55:32.949 you know you at that point you have uh rumors 00:55:32.949 --> 00:55:36.230 that you know uh everything has been hit that 00:55:36.230 --> 00:55:39.150 the sears tower that chicago that los angeles 00:55:39.150 --> 00:55:41.230 that pretty much everything you know world war 00:55:41.230 --> 00:55:42.989 three has just started because you don't know 00:55:42.989 --> 00:55:45.510 anything you're in the middle of the the eye 00:55:45.510 --> 00:55:48.190 of the storm you're cut off from everything i 00:55:48.190 --> 00:55:50.510 think people in watching it on television anywhere 00:55:50.510 --> 00:55:52.289 else in the world knew much more than we did 00:55:52.289 --> 00:55:57.639 and so when um Things have quiet down in the 00:55:57.639 --> 00:56:01.320 lobby. Most firefighters have gone up. The chief 00:56:01.320 --> 00:56:03.360 are mingling around, trying to find their strategy. 00:56:03.780 --> 00:56:07.099 And I remember I'm filming Chief Pfeiffer. He's 00:56:07.099 --> 00:56:10.400 the first chief on site, and so pretty consequent. 00:56:10.519 --> 00:56:14.369 And as I'm filming him... We hear a very loud 00:56:14.369 --> 00:56:17.250 roar once again coming from above us. And I remember 00:56:17.250 --> 00:56:21.070 all of us are looking up and suddenly everyone 00:56:21.070 --> 00:56:23.829 scatters. And so I follow them and I see that 00:56:23.829 --> 00:56:26.690 they run into a little entrance that would lead 00:56:26.690 --> 00:56:29.590 to another, I think, five world trade. And it's 00:56:29.590 --> 00:56:31.909 because that sound is almost like the sound of 00:56:31.909 --> 00:56:33.590 death. You know, it's kind of that freight train 00:56:33.590 --> 00:56:35.650 of death coming towards you. You know it's coming. 00:56:35.730 --> 00:56:37.170 You have no idea what's happening, but you know 00:56:37.170 --> 00:56:39.710 this is bad. And so as I follow everyone, we 00:56:39.710 --> 00:56:43.809 start going up an escalator. I remember just 00:56:43.809 --> 00:56:46.670 stopping and saying, OK, what am I running? You 00:56:46.670 --> 00:56:48.250 know, I don't know what this is, but this is 00:56:48.250 --> 00:56:50.590 death and I'm going to die. And unfortunately, 00:56:50.710 --> 00:56:52.630 it's the sad reality of it. And I remember being 00:56:52.630 --> 00:56:56.610 surprised as the kind of the. zen like um uh 00:56:56.610 --> 00:57:01.130 a calm that i had in my mind uh again time is 00:57:01.130 --> 00:57:03.090 completely distended i have the impression this 00:57:03.090 --> 00:57:05.329 lasts for half an hour even though it's only 00:57:05.329 --> 00:57:08.550 a few a few seconds but i remember that long 00:57:08.550 --> 00:57:11.690 conversation in my head of okay i'm about to 00:57:11.690 --> 00:57:14.889 die i'm kind of pissed off at that and sad because 00:57:14.889 --> 00:57:17.010 you know i have so many people i i love that 00:57:17.010 --> 00:57:20.050 uh i'll be missing and all that but in my mind 00:57:20.050 --> 00:57:23.019 it's almost like that's you know that um I know 00:57:23.019 --> 00:57:25.760 a door opens and kind of, OK, I'm going to walk 00:57:25.760 --> 00:57:27.880 through that and we'll see what happens after. 00:57:27.940 --> 00:57:30.199 I remember having a prayer saying, you know, 00:57:30.219 --> 00:57:32.340 now is the time. I'm not a believer. So I think, 00:57:32.340 --> 00:57:35.079 you know, I could use a sign, you know, edging 00:57:35.079 --> 00:57:38.920 my bets, I guess. And, you know, no, no atheist 00:57:38.920 --> 00:57:42.139 in a foxhole, as they say. Yes, it happens. But 00:57:42.139 --> 00:57:46.320 you. And as that roar is coming and the darkness 00:57:46.320 --> 00:57:51.320 engulfs us and that dust or fog, I don't know 00:57:51.320 --> 00:57:53.679 what it is, is covering us. It's really kind 00:57:53.679 --> 00:57:55.900 of, you know, we're suddenly crossing into the 00:57:55.900 --> 00:57:59.179 underworld, the abyss, the dentist's inferno. 00:57:59.179 --> 00:58:02.699 It's what it looks like. And then that incredible 00:58:02.699 --> 00:58:07.010 quietness. Almost like during the first heavy 00:58:07.010 --> 00:58:10.630 snow in a city where all the sounds of the streets 00:58:10.630 --> 00:58:13.829 disappear. It's exactly that. Everything is muffled. 00:58:14.429 --> 00:58:18.730 And then a sound suddenly comes in and you hear 00:58:18.730 --> 00:58:22.309 a little sound. You see someone saying, is everybody 00:58:22.309 --> 00:58:24.909 okay? And of course I'm the first one to pipe 00:58:24.909 --> 00:58:26.269 up because I'm afraid they're going to leave 00:58:26.269 --> 00:58:29.449 me behind. I say, I'm okay! Kind of desperately 00:58:29.449 --> 00:58:32.849 crying in a way. And, you know, I turn on the 00:58:32.849 --> 00:58:35.650 big floodlight I have on my camera, which ends 00:58:35.650 --> 00:58:37.429 up being good because the chiefs normally don't 00:58:37.429 --> 00:58:39.690 have a lot of equipment on them, but they're 00:58:39.690 --> 00:58:42.570 downstairs. And so someone sees the light and 00:58:42.570 --> 00:58:44.550 says, you with the light, come downstairs, come 00:58:44.550 --> 00:58:47.309 help us. And what I would discover is that they 00:58:47.309 --> 00:58:50.449 had just found the body of Father Judge and they 00:58:50.449 --> 00:58:54.230 were trying to see if he had a pulse. And unfortunately... 00:58:54.750 --> 00:58:58.730 He had died, probably being hit by a piece of 00:58:58.730 --> 00:59:01.929 debris that broke his neck. And so I think he 00:59:01.929 --> 00:59:05.210 died very quickly there. But unfortunately, there 00:59:05.210 --> 00:59:07.409 was nothing we could do. And so very quickly, 00:59:07.429 --> 00:59:09.929 we have no idea what's happening. We have no 00:59:09.929 --> 00:59:13.610 idea. The South Tower has collapsed. As far as 00:59:13.610 --> 00:59:15.210 we're concerned, it's probably a partial collapse 00:59:15.210 --> 00:59:18.920 in the North Tower. And that's why... chief pfeiffer 00:59:18.920 --> 00:59:22.800 immediately doesn't hesitate doesn't uh in about 00:59:22.800 --> 00:59:25.860 uh five seconds after that um that huge explosion 00:59:25.860 --> 00:59:30.250 or roar or whatever it was says okay uh Battalion 00:59:30.250 --> 00:59:34.989 1 to all units in Tower 1, evacuate the building 00:59:34.989 --> 00:59:37.190 and make sure it's repeated, make sure it's understood. 00:59:37.610 --> 00:59:40.309 And once he's repeated it about two or three 00:59:40.309 --> 00:59:41.949 times and make sure it's been repeated, then 00:59:41.949 --> 00:59:44.869 he says, OK, we need to get out of here. It's 00:59:44.869 --> 00:59:48.469 dangerous. Some of the chiefs start to carry 00:59:48.469 --> 00:59:52.090 the body of our father judge. And we go up that 00:59:52.090 --> 00:59:54.969 escalator that would lead to the right to the 00:59:54.969 --> 00:59:59.710 West Street right there. We still see debris 00:59:59.710 --> 01:00:03.429 is falling. People are still jumping and it's 01:00:03.429 --> 01:00:05.070 still very dangerous. So Chief Pfeiffer says, 01:00:05.190 --> 01:00:08.369 OK, we're going to go to use the footbridge that 01:00:08.369 --> 01:00:12.250 links the World Trade Center to the financial 01:00:12.250 --> 01:00:15.090 center and we'll be safer because we'll be protected 01:00:15.090 --> 01:00:18.269 from whatever falls. And the other chief says, 01:00:18.369 --> 01:00:20.030 OK, we'll stay here. We'll wait for you to make 01:00:20.030 --> 01:00:22.929 sure it's safe. So here comes that kind of very 01:00:22.929 --> 01:00:26.519 frustrating moment where we. We do go back and 01:00:26.519 --> 01:00:28.260 forth where now I watch it. I want to scream 01:00:28.260 --> 01:00:29.960 at the television knowing that there is a hidden 01:00:29.960 --> 01:00:32.840 clock, you know, that is that is running there. 01:00:33.179 --> 01:00:36.780 And as I go there with the chief, with his chauffeur, 01:00:36.780 --> 01:00:39.480 Ed Fahey and someone else, you know, we arrive 01:00:39.480 --> 01:00:43.000 on the other side. It seems to be OK. And we 01:00:43.000 --> 01:00:44.699 try to radio the guys back and say, OK, it's 01:00:44.699 --> 01:00:47.800 safe. Come there. We know no news, no nothing. 01:00:47.880 --> 01:00:50.139 We go back over there once again and again and 01:00:50.139 --> 01:00:52.059 frustrating. But, you know, we don't know anything 01:00:52.059 --> 01:00:54.420 at that point. They're not here. We go back again, 01:00:54.559 --> 01:00:57.159 go down. And here we come out on the other side 01:00:57.159 --> 01:00:59.539 of the World Trade Center to a scene which is 01:00:59.539 --> 01:01:01.940 completely, as Gédéon said, is completely different. 01:01:02.000 --> 01:01:05.079 It's like kind of a nuclear winter. You have 01:01:05.079 --> 01:01:07.920 ash on the floor. You have pieces of debris, 01:01:08.139 --> 01:01:11.659 papers everywhere. And even though I film what 01:01:11.659 --> 01:01:15.900 looks like the pieces and debris of the South 01:01:15.900 --> 01:01:19.380 Tower, in my head, I refuse to recognize that. 01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:22.000 We've had no information that said the towers 01:01:22.000 --> 01:01:24.199 come down. All they were on the radios are May 01:01:24.199 --> 01:01:26.139 Day, May Day, May Day. That's it. And when I 01:01:26.139 --> 01:01:28.480 look at it, again, I'm lying to myself saying, 01:01:28.519 --> 01:01:31.900 oh, no, the second tower is probably here. It's 01:01:31.900 --> 01:01:33.820 behind the smoke or from where I am, I cannot 01:01:33.820 --> 01:01:37.539 see it. That's fine. And then the chief goes 01:01:37.539 --> 01:01:42.000 back to the secondary position he had given at 01:01:42.000 --> 01:01:44.300 the beginning and to regroup with the chief. 01:01:44.400 --> 01:01:48.190 We're in the shadow of one World Trade. I'm still 01:01:48.190 --> 01:01:50.889 cleaning my camera. I'm still doing things and 01:01:50.889 --> 01:01:53.090 kind of disoriented, not knowing what's happening, 01:01:53.170 --> 01:01:56.550 but still following the chief. And as the chief 01:01:56.550 --> 01:02:00.530 is called by other firefighters there, we're 01:02:00.530 --> 01:02:02.949 about to go back into World Trade Center. There's 01:02:02.949 --> 01:02:07.389 more people up there, more people we need to 01:02:07.389 --> 01:02:10.289 save. And as we do, I think, about two or three 01:02:10.289 --> 01:02:13.530 paces, we hear that roar again. Except this time 01:02:13.530 --> 01:02:15.690 I can look up and I see that kind of mushroom 01:02:15.690 --> 01:02:21.130 of the tower falling on us. Once again, I think 01:02:21.130 --> 01:02:26.869 first reflex, running like crazy. I think I broke 01:02:26.869 --> 01:02:30.469 an Olympic record how fast I was running. But 01:02:30.469 --> 01:02:34.090 I realized that I was trying to run a 120 -story 01:02:34.090 --> 01:02:35.570 building in the middle of the street. It was 01:02:35.570 --> 01:02:39.579 stupid. As I'm running, I see two trucks there. 01:02:39.699 --> 01:02:41.699 And I remember a conversation we had over the 01:02:41.699 --> 01:02:43.400 summer with the firefighter that said, you know, 01:02:43.400 --> 01:02:46.219 sometime when you have collapses. pockets will 01:02:46.219 --> 01:02:48.260 be created and you have to look for certain things 01:02:48.260 --> 01:02:51.500 you know that could maybe sustain a pocket when 01:02:51.500 --> 01:02:53.420 you have a collapse so it's crazy the kind of 01:02:53.420 --> 01:02:55.500 things you remember in the heat of moment and 01:02:55.500 --> 01:02:57.179 so i see these two trucks and i said well that 01:02:57.179 --> 01:02:59.599 seems like a good idea so i put myself on the 01:02:59.599 --> 01:03:01.659 floor my camera is on the side it's still running 01:03:01.659 --> 01:03:03.679 our lights is still on because i forgot about 01:03:03.679 --> 01:03:06.599 it and that's where you see these images of that 01:03:06.599 --> 01:03:10.400 giant cloud that comes and then it's sucked back 01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:12.800 in and the papers And in the middle of all that, 01:03:12.900 --> 01:03:17.219 I hear someone who jumps on top of me. And as 01:03:17.219 --> 01:03:20.480 debris is falling all around and I hear the debris 01:03:20.480 --> 01:03:25.219 hit, I feel it a little bit, the person on top 01:03:25.219 --> 01:03:29.670 of me being hit also. And once again. Here, I'm 01:03:29.670 --> 01:03:32.409 absolutely not zen. I'll have to admit, I'm exactly 01:03:32.409 --> 01:03:34.650 like my brother. I'm pissed off. Like, okay, 01:03:34.730 --> 01:03:37.250 what the hell happened? I survived. I'm supposed 01:03:37.250 --> 01:03:39.150 to have survived. I cannot have another one now. 01:03:39.250 --> 01:03:41.469 First one, I'm okay. You know, I could deal with 01:03:41.469 --> 01:03:43.449 it. This is unfair. I'm out of the building. 01:03:43.710 --> 01:03:45.690 How is this happening to me? Well, you asked 01:03:45.690 --> 01:03:49.289 for a sign, so. Yeah, that was, yeah, that was 01:03:49.289 --> 01:03:53.409 charming in my plea to hire you after that. But, 01:03:53.409 --> 01:03:56.789 you know, but here I am. And again, the strange 01:03:56.789 --> 01:04:00.760 thing is, Sound completely disappears again after 01:04:00.760 --> 01:04:02.980 that. In that moment, which again, my head is 01:04:02.980 --> 01:04:04.820 probably seven minutes long, even though it's, 01:04:04.820 --> 01:04:07.599 you know, 12 seconds or something. It's, you 01:04:07.599 --> 01:04:10.239 know, it's very, no sound or nothing. The person 01:04:10.239 --> 01:04:14.260 on top of me gets up and I hear a voice and okay, 01:04:14.300 --> 01:04:16.059 get up. And I recognize it's Chief Pfeiffer. 01:04:17.459 --> 01:04:19.820 We get up because the question he had seen me. 01:04:19.840 --> 01:04:22.000 I'm in a T -shirt and a pair of jeans. He needs 01:04:22.000 --> 01:04:24.139 a bunker gear. And he sees it. He said, OK, what 01:04:24.139 --> 01:04:25.800 is that moron doing in the middle of the street? 01:04:25.940 --> 01:04:28.239 And, you know, it looks like beachwear. So come 01:04:28.239 --> 01:04:31.280 on. So he decided to because he felt that I was 01:04:31.280 --> 01:04:33.920 his probie in a way. And we have a very strong 01:04:33.920 --> 01:04:36.059 link, Chief Pfeiffer and I, which we still see 01:04:36.059 --> 01:04:39.079 to this day each other very often. We spoke every 01:04:39.079 --> 01:04:41.619 week. You know, he's the man who saved my life. 01:04:42.199 --> 01:04:46.769 But I remember going when he gets up. We don't 01:04:46.769 --> 01:04:48.409 see anything. There was clouds everywhere. We 01:04:48.409 --> 01:04:52.070 hear gunshots, which was very frightening because 01:04:52.070 --> 01:04:54.230 here we hear pops all over the place. And it's 01:04:54.230 --> 01:04:56.969 like, oh, OK, that's it. Now they're in terrorist 01:04:56.969 --> 01:04:59.090 or whatever it is are in the streets with AK 01:04:59.090 --> 01:05:01.170 -47s. It's the end of the world where we'll be 01:05:01.170 --> 01:05:03.710 shot like rabbits. And what we would discover 01:05:03.710 --> 01:05:08.050 after it was actually a munition inside of a 01:05:08.050 --> 01:05:11.309 police truck that had caught fire. And so the 01:05:11.309 --> 01:05:13.369 munition was popping all over the place. And 01:05:13.369 --> 01:05:15.849 so. But when you don't know that, then, you know, 01:05:15.869 --> 01:05:21.010 it's kind of. And so after that, I found a little 01:05:21.010 --> 01:05:24.789 deli right off where I go with Chief Pfeiffer. 01:05:25.369 --> 01:05:29.090 And I'm no longer in any, you know, shape to 01:05:29.090 --> 01:05:31.630 to film anything. I give a call, I think, to 01:05:31.630 --> 01:05:35.789 my fiance and tell her that we're OK, that I 01:05:35.789 --> 01:05:37.469 don't know where Gideon is, but I'm sure he'll 01:05:37.469 --> 01:05:39.130 be fine. And, you know, I'm a little shook up. 01:05:39.150 --> 01:05:42.530 We're OK. And after that, I think I filmed sporadically, 01:05:42.650 --> 01:05:46.989 but I'm in no way shape able to do that. All 01:05:46.989 --> 01:05:50.409 I do is look for Gideon, which. funnily enough, 01:05:50.449 --> 01:05:52.769 or strangely enough, was actually probably 50 01:05:52.769 --> 01:05:55.389 feet away from me when the second tower collapsed, 01:05:55.429 --> 01:05:58.170 except we went in different directions, and fortunately 01:05:58.170 --> 01:06:07.469 both survived. Yeah. So I've just jumped into 01:06:07.469 --> 01:06:13.409 this fire engine when hearing the tower collapsing 01:06:13.409 --> 01:06:20.349 right on top of me, and I heard and I saw, someone 01:06:20.349 --> 01:06:25.530 else, a guy jumping into the engine truck right 01:06:25.530 --> 01:06:30.210 behind me. And I guess we just waited for a moment 01:06:30.210 --> 01:06:33.969 to come, for a big piece of the tower to crash 01:06:33.969 --> 01:06:38.809 us. And this moment, crazy enough, never happened. 01:06:40.989 --> 01:06:45.130 Unfortunately, some people who had found refuge 01:06:45.130 --> 01:06:51.159 behind the truck, the engine where we were in 01:06:51.159 --> 01:06:55.139 the back didn't got so lucky because a big piece 01:06:55.139 --> 01:07:00.260 fell on them but we we got okay uh and i would 01:07:00.260 --> 01:07:03.179 later discovered that the guy who jumped behind 01:07:03.179 --> 01:07:10.559 me was an fbi special agent who had previously 01:07:10.559 --> 01:07:16.860 already saved 20 people from one world trade 01:07:16.860 --> 01:07:19.300 center and five world trade center I mean, the 01:07:19.300 --> 01:07:23.039 guy had been already risking his life saving 01:07:23.039 --> 01:07:29.539 20 people, burned and injured, found himself 01:07:29.539 --> 01:07:35.699 outside when the second tower collapsed. So this 01:07:35.699 --> 01:07:40.179 guy, me, with a camera, jumping into an engine 01:07:40.179 --> 01:07:45.760 truck and just decided to follow me. And so the 01:07:45.760 --> 01:07:49.610 noise stopped. The tower... has collapsed. We're 01:07:49.610 --> 01:07:54.769 still alive. And this guy, I don't know who he 01:07:54.769 --> 01:07:57.190 is, I will later discover again that he's a special 01:07:57.190 --> 01:08:00.829 agent, an FBI, tells me, all right, let's get 01:08:00.829 --> 01:08:03.369 out. And we get out, except we don't get out 01:08:03.369 --> 01:08:05.489 on the sidewalk. It's not the sidewalk anymore. 01:08:05.829 --> 01:08:11.530 It's trucks, I mean, it's cars on fire. There 01:08:11.530 --> 01:08:16.430 is nothing flat on which you walk. It's just 01:08:16.840 --> 01:08:20.359 pieces of stones and whatever pieces of the building 01:08:20.359 --> 01:08:26.760 so it's um and uh and as jules i have a light 01:08:26.760 --> 01:08:30.020 on my camera and we managed to make a few steps 01:08:30.020 --> 01:08:35.000 and and suddenly i hear these guys screaming 01:08:35.000 --> 01:08:38.159 at me saying come back come back you have the 01:08:38.159 --> 01:08:41.880 light uh i found someone help me and i turned 01:08:41.880 --> 01:08:44.699 i turned the light to the camera i did not realize 01:08:44.699 --> 01:08:49.289 it was not with me anymore and this guy again 01:08:49.289 --> 01:08:52.670 saved someone else on those few steps that we 01:08:52.670 --> 01:08:57.649 that when we got out of the engine he had found 01:08:57.649 --> 01:09:00.789 someone else that he was carrying by himself 01:09:00.789 --> 01:09:04.550 except this guy that he found that was hurt was 01:09:04.550 --> 01:09:07.430 quite heavy and he definitely needed help so 01:09:08.239 --> 01:09:11.579 So, of course, we each had one arm of this hurt 01:09:11.579 --> 01:09:16.000 guy, you know, with us. And with the light of 01:09:16.000 --> 01:09:20.319 the camera, we were able to navigate. And it 01:09:20.319 --> 01:09:25.260 took us a block or two to find help. And I just 01:09:25.260 --> 01:09:29.739 then just walked back to the firehouse. And each 01:09:29.739 --> 01:09:34.199 step to the firehouse was this kind of shock. 01:09:37.340 --> 01:09:39.739 this question, you know, like, like, like, like, 01:09:39.739 --> 01:09:43.199 you know, where is Jules? How could he possibly 01:09:43.199 --> 01:09:46.239 survive that? Where are the guys of the firehouse? 01:09:46.859 --> 01:09:51.420 What's going on? And, and unfortunately, I arrived 01:09:51.420 --> 01:09:54.100 at the firehouse and the firehouse is almost 01:09:54.100 --> 01:09:57.640 empty. And there is suddenly no word from Jules. 01:09:57.680 --> 01:10:03.770 In fact, guys from uh guys would arrive almost 01:10:03.770 --> 01:10:06.949 one by one like driplet of water here and there 01:10:06.949 --> 01:10:10.369 and i would ask them if they had seen jules i 01:10:10.369 --> 01:10:13.569 mean he was with them uh they must have seen 01:10:13.569 --> 01:10:18.090 him and uh and they were not you know uh they 01:10:18.090 --> 01:10:21.170 said no no sorry uh no no no jules we don't know 01:10:21.170 --> 01:10:24.609 where he is and uh anyway it took uh it took 01:10:24.609 --> 01:10:28.130 uh almost uh almost over two hours for jules 01:10:28.130 --> 01:10:34.369 to uh to to come back and that was, yeah, that 01:10:34.369 --> 01:10:38.649 was the best reunion. Yeah, because what happened 01:10:38.649 --> 01:10:42.550 is that after I stopped filming, I would kind 01:10:42.550 --> 01:10:45.829 of go back and forth to all the streets I could 01:10:45.829 --> 01:10:48.210 find and ask every firefighter, you know, have 01:10:48.210 --> 01:10:51.310 you seen the guys from Engine 7 and Ladder 1? 01:10:51.430 --> 01:10:53.550 And, you know, a little French guy with a camera. 01:10:53.949 --> 01:10:57.010 And what was infuriating is that none of them 01:10:57.010 --> 01:11:00.050 would meet my eyes. And so I thought that was 01:11:00.050 --> 01:11:03.710 a bad sign. None of them would sustain looking 01:11:03.710 --> 01:11:06.710 into my eyes and said, no, no, sorry. And, you 01:11:06.710 --> 01:11:09.750 know, so I had a bad feeling that this was going 01:11:09.750 --> 01:11:13.090 to be that I unfortunately knew the answer, that 01:11:13.090 --> 01:11:15.670 they were all dead. And so I dragged my feet. 01:11:15.729 --> 01:11:17.310 It took me a long time. It took me two hours 01:11:17.310 --> 01:11:19.939 to come back to the to the firehouse. On the 01:11:19.939 --> 01:11:23.920 way, I found guys from the engine. I was asking, 01:11:23.960 --> 01:11:25.640 but did you see Gideon? He said, no, no, he was 01:11:25.640 --> 01:11:28.060 not with us. I didn't see him. And we finally 01:11:28.060 --> 01:11:30.579 arrived back at the firehouse. And you have this 01:11:30.579 --> 01:11:34.560 scene that is in the film because what you have 01:11:34.560 --> 01:11:36.739 to understand is that one of our best friends 01:11:36.739 --> 01:11:39.079 was working not too far. And as soon as this 01:11:39.079 --> 01:11:42.000 happened, knew we were there, came to see us, 01:11:42.060 --> 01:11:46.760 Dory, and was with Gideon in the kitchen. And 01:11:46.760 --> 01:11:49.300 when I arrived, I put my camera down. And he 01:11:49.300 --> 01:11:51.439 picks it up and he films the moment where we 01:11:51.439 --> 01:11:54.100 see each other and we fall into each other's 01:11:54.100 --> 01:11:56.720 arms. And I think, you know, yes, we're probably 01:11:56.720 --> 01:12:00.159 28 and 31 at that time. But when I see these 01:12:00.159 --> 01:12:02.199 images, we're six and nine years old, I think. 01:12:02.239 --> 01:12:06.569 And I think there is that moment. Still, I remember 01:12:06.569 --> 01:12:09.069 when I listened to it in French, I said, you 01:12:09.069 --> 01:12:11.229 know, I filmed everything. Don't worry. And I 01:12:11.229 --> 01:12:14.590 have all the tapes again. It's you go through 01:12:14.590 --> 01:12:16.890 crazy things when, you know, you're you're you're 01:12:16.890 --> 01:12:19.350 you're you're in a traumatic experience, I think. 01:12:19.770 --> 01:12:23.930 But what was amazing and was what we had survived 01:12:23.930 --> 01:12:27.739 and that was unbelievable. But the entire firehouse, 01:12:27.800 --> 01:12:30.119 one by one, all these firefighters, all these 01:12:30.119 --> 01:12:35.000 friends that we had made, suddenly all came back, 01:12:35.060 --> 01:12:38.260 one after the other, as improbable as it was, 01:12:38.319 --> 01:12:41.390 and the last one being the probie. Talk about 01:12:41.390 --> 01:12:43.829 reality being stranger than fiction. You know, 01:12:43.869 --> 01:12:46.069 it would have been a movie. It would have thought 01:12:46.069 --> 01:12:48.109 to be a very bad script. But, you know, here 01:12:48.109 --> 01:12:50.829 was that the last guy that we're missing was 01:12:50.829 --> 01:12:53.810 Tony. And he came back last. And everyone was 01:12:53.810 --> 01:12:57.569 OK in the firehouse, which was, you know, complicated 01:12:57.569 --> 01:13:01.590 because then that the search part, you know, 01:13:01.590 --> 01:13:05.750 started. And which was the most difficult thing 01:13:05.750 --> 01:13:08.029 of all, because, you know, people were fine the 01:13:08.029 --> 01:13:09.930 first day. But that was it. And you kept hoping. 01:13:10.800 --> 01:13:12.920 It has to be hundreds, if not thousands of people 01:13:12.920 --> 01:13:16.500 alive. It has to. And the more we dug, because 01:13:16.500 --> 01:13:19.960 we then went back with the guys and filmed as 01:13:19.960 --> 01:13:22.460 they were digging, sometimes digging ourselves, 01:13:23.140 --> 01:13:26.239 they were no one to be found. And then, unfortunately, 01:13:26.340 --> 01:13:29.300 it became not a rescue, but a recovery effort, 01:13:29.539 --> 01:13:33.739 which personally, I think, was more complicated 01:13:33.739 --> 01:13:38.239 psychologically, because I think on September 01:13:38.239 --> 01:13:41.390 11, and that's just a personal... way i feel 01:13:41.390 --> 01:13:44.029 but then on september 11 i was you know i was 01:13:44.029 --> 01:13:46.930 more reacting i was not uh i was reacting to 01:13:46.930 --> 01:13:49.649 what's happening uh no time to think no time 01:13:49.649 --> 01:13:53.789 to really uh go through psychologically what's 01:13:53.789 --> 01:13:56.470 happening but the recovery effort as you're digging 01:13:56.470 --> 01:13:59.170 and as you're you know you're looking for the 01:13:59.170 --> 01:14:02.189 remains of people you have too much time on your 01:14:02.189 --> 01:14:04.170 hand and you have too much time to process what 01:14:04.170 --> 01:14:06.289 you're seeing and what's your what you're feeling 01:14:06.289 --> 01:14:09.100 when you're smelling And that's a complicated 01:14:09.100 --> 01:14:13.319 thing, at least personally for me it was. But 01:14:13.319 --> 01:14:17.359 I think what sustained us was the of individuals 01:14:17.359 --> 01:14:21.500 who are willing to risk their life for each other 01:14:21.500 --> 01:14:25.159 and for us. And here, even though, you know, 01:14:25.159 --> 01:14:27.899 the place, even though we know the time, you 01:14:27.899 --> 01:14:30.760 know, was full of dangerous gases and horrible 01:14:30.760 --> 01:14:34.239 things that we all breezed in. All they wanted 01:14:34.239 --> 01:14:37.659 to do is dig further, is dig longer. We would 01:14:37.659 --> 01:14:41.060 have to pull guys out from the piles and the 01:14:41.060 --> 01:14:42.920 chief saying, no, no, you have to take a break. 01:14:43.039 --> 01:14:45.539 You've been digging for 12 hours nonstop. Go 01:14:45.539 --> 01:14:47.840 back to the firehouse. Take a two hour rest. 01:14:47.899 --> 01:14:49.819 Then you can come back. And people were almost 01:14:49.819 --> 01:14:52.079 fighting. They didn't want to leave. It was really 01:14:52.079 --> 01:14:55.729 impressive to see how. You know, New Yorkers, 01:14:55.729 --> 01:14:57.869 you know, you were not the nicest people in the 01:14:57.869 --> 01:14:59.789 world, you know, trying to take a steal a cab 01:14:59.789 --> 01:15:01.510 from another New Yorker. You know, I think, you 01:15:01.510 --> 01:15:03.329 know, Crowbar will come out to brass knuckles. 01:15:03.449 --> 01:15:07.369 But here at that moment, that spirit of we're 01:15:07.369 --> 01:15:10.930 all in this together to see all New Yorkers caring 01:15:10.930 --> 01:15:13.930 for each other, to see everyone. We were all 01:15:13.930 --> 01:15:15.829 in the same boat and to see the entire world 01:15:15.829 --> 01:15:19.409 was like that. But that. I think that drove what 01:15:19.409 --> 01:15:22.449 we wanted to do and what we I think we succeeded 01:15:22.449 --> 01:15:25.829 in doing in the end is to show that what we had 01:15:25.829 --> 01:15:28.050 seen at the moment where the worst of humanity 01:15:28.050 --> 01:15:31.590 is revealed. That's terrorism, which is, I think, 01:15:31.590 --> 01:15:34.850 you know, the basest human instinct of just instilling 01:15:34.850 --> 01:15:38.409 terror to other. The best of all of us is there. 01:15:38.590 --> 01:15:42.010 That kindness, that courage, that that willingness 01:15:42.010 --> 01:15:44.489 to say no and to put your life on the line to 01:15:44.489 --> 01:15:48.119 help others is. was present everywhere you looked. 01:15:48.220 --> 01:15:51.020 It was present in the firefighters selflessly 01:15:51.020 --> 01:15:55.260 going up and risking their lives. It was in the 01:15:55.260 --> 01:15:57.939 people coming down the stairs and carrying each 01:15:57.939 --> 01:16:00.420 other, sometimes 80 flights carrying other people. 01:16:00.600 --> 01:16:03.439 It was every normal New Yorker coming to their 01:16:03.439 --> 01:16:05.819 firehouse, coming to everyone. It was the steel 01:16:05.819 --> 01:16:09.220 workers who all came and worked on the site. 01:16:09.340 --> 01:16:13.239 It was that sense of humanity, that wave of saying 01:16:13.239 --> 01:16:16.680 no to the horror. And that was, I think, what 01:16:16.680 --> 01:16:20.180 I keep from all that is a giant lesson of humanity 01:16:20.180 --> 01:16:24.899 that this has taught me. Jed, you want anything 01:16:24.899 --> 01:16:29.579 to add to that? No, no, no. Jules has said it 01:16:29.579 --> 01:16:39.619 perfectly. Yes, no, at the end of the day, 20 01:16:39.619 --> 01:16:48.050 years later, You cannot help but be eternally 01:16:48.050 --> 01:16:57.130 grateful to this spirit that for Jules and I 01:16:57.130 --> 01:17:03.050 is embedded in the first responders and the firefighters. 01:17:03.170 --> 01:17:11.279 Because whoever you have in the firehouse, It's 01:17:11.279 --> 01:17:17.079 like a club. It's like a class with your schoolmates. 01:17:17.220 --> 01:17:27.220 It's like an insane mix of people. But there 01:17:27.220 --> 01:17:34.579 is something very special about us because despite 01:17:34.579 --> 01:17:38.739 all their differences and their fights sometimes, 01:17:39.420 --> 01:17:51.960 they have a higher calling. To witness this higher 01:17:51.960 --> 01:18:00.500 calling, to actually see people ready to be better, 01:18:00.659 --> 01:18:08.300 to go beyond what normal people you know, ask 01:18:08.300 --> 01:18:13.399 of themselves on a daily basis. To see such courage, 01:18:13.659 --> 01:18:20.579 there is nothing more inspiring. And it's true, 01:18:20.720 --> 01:18:29.890 this is what basically cures a trauma. uh or 01:18:29.890 --> 01:18:35.329 cure uh feeling down uh or cure any any moment 01:18:35.329 --> 01:18:37.689 where we we're thinking the the world is too 01:18:37.689 --> 01:18:42.590 insane and too crazy it's just to just for jules 01:18:42.590 --> 01:18:46.350 and i or if i measured it's just to go back to 01:18:46.350 --> 01:18:50.670 this day and the days that followed uh to be 01:18:50.670 --> 01:18:54.239 able to To have witnessed the best in humanity, 01:18:54.460 --> 01:18:57.939 as Drew said. And it is embodied in those crazy, 01:18:57.979 --> 01:19:01.840 insane guys and women who live in a firehouse. 01:19:03.239 --> 01:19:06.720 Yeah, if you are an alien and you arrive on planet 01:19:06.720 --> 01:19:09.159 Earth and you want to see the best of humanity, 01:19:09.640 --> 01:19:13.899 yeah, go to the places of work of first responders. 01:19:15.500 --> 01:19:20.539 Maybe not go to see where politicians live. Go 01:19:20.539 --> 01:19:23.899 to a firehouse. You know what we're about to 01:19:23.899 --> 01:19:30.020 do. You'll see the best of us. And so this, yeah, 01:19:30.159 --> 01:19:33.619 you have the trauma on one hand and the effect 01:19:33.619 --> 01:19:37.720 and the damages. But if you have seen what we've 01:19:37.720 --> 01:19:43.659 seen, then this will heal or will at least help 01:19:43.659 --> 01:19:48.600 me. deal with the trauma in the best way. And 01:19:48.600 --> 01:19:52.739 so 20 years later, so grateful to have seen it. 01:19:54.439 --> 01:19:57.579 Yeah, well, I mean, the thing coming from a first 01:19:57.579 --> 01:19:59.640 responders lens, so being a fireman and being 01:19:59.640 --> 01:20:02.000 so proud, because I see that what you're talking 01:20:02.000 --> 01:20:03.420 about and everyone else, you don't see it in 01:20:03.420 --> 01:20:05.340 yourself, of course, because that would be narcissism. 01:20:06.600 --> 01:20:08.720 But, you know, you recognize it in the men and 01:20:08.720 --> 01:20:10.760 women that you work alongside. But one of the 01:20:10.760 --> 01:20:13.260 things that I've always said about this, about 01:20:13.260 --> 01:20:15.800 the Paris attacks, you know, is, you know, all 01:20:15.800 --> 01:20:18.279 the obviously similar events, the London attacks, 01:20:18.460 --> 01:20:22.180 is the heroism of the civilians. Just like you 01:20:22.180 --> 01:20:25.260 said, just the exact, there's no perfect analogy 01:20:25.260 --> 01:20:27.819 than Chief Pfeiffer jumping on your back because 01:20:27.819 --> 01:20:31.439 you're there in your beach wear, still, you know, 01:20:31.479 --> 01:20:35.739 up front being prepared. to assist, to document, 01:20:35.760 --> 01:20:38.300 to all these things. And the stories of heroism 01:20:38.300 --> 01:20:41.000 of regular people that worked in the world trade. 01:20:41.279 --> 01:20:44.239 Just now, this invasion of the government building, 01:20:44.399 --> 01:20:46.520 I see stories of heroism coming out of that. 01:20:46.600 --> 01:20:49.399 They weren't expecting a group of people to invade 01:20:49.399 --> 01:20:53.000 their office. So I think that, I don't know if 01:20:53.000 --> 01:20:54.880 you had the same, but one of the most powerful 01:20:54.880 --> 01:20:59.039 things I saw around September last year, 2020, 01:20:59.239 --> 01:21:03.539 as strange a year as it was, was the phrase, 01:21:04.029 --> 01:21:07.930 I miss 9 -12. And I think people identify that 01:21:07.930 --> 01:21:11.430 day, just like you said, as the best of the humanity. 01:21:11.850 --> 01:21:14.869 All colors, creeds, races, religions, sexual 01:21:14.869 --> 01:21:19.130 orientations came together to fight evil and 01:21:19.130 --> 01:21:23.130 to do good. And unfortunately, it's sad, but 01:21:23.130 --> 01:21:26.529 it's always how it happens. We saw it after the 01:21:26.529 --> 01:21:29.710 attacks of November 13. We saw it even when Notre 01:21:29.710 --> 01:21:33.289 Dame was burning. Unfortunately, you know, we're 01:21:33.289 --> 01:21:36.250 complicated human beings. It takes, unfortunately, 01:21:36.350 --> 01:21:39.390 a tragedy to remind of us the best of us. So 01:21:39.390 --> 01:21:42.390 hopefully it can happen without something traumatic 01:21:42.390 --> 01:21:45.090 happening. But at least the good part, it's in 01:21:45.090 --> 01:21:47.489 us. So really, that's the first part is there. 01:21:47.590 --> 01:21:51.970 It's our ability to love and to. to to to to 01:21:51.970 --> 01:21:54.829 to be better and to and to sacrifice ourself 01:21:54.829 --> 01:21:57.369 is in all of us and uh and i think at least that's 01:21:57.369 --> 01:22:00.529 a that's pretty good silver lining absolutely 01:22:00.529 --> 01:22:03.310 well you you mentioned paris before we move on 01:22:03.310 --> 01:22:06.810 to there um i do want to talk about the mental 01:22:06.810 --> 01:22:10.050 domino effect and the physical domino effect 01:22:10.050 --> 01:22:11.470 because as we were talking before we started 01:22:11.470 --> 01:22:13.850 recording and it's it's a topic that i've talked 01:22:13.850 --> 01:22:16.810 about already on the show we're losing hundreds 01:22:16.810 --> 01:22:22.369 more men and women post 9 -11. We lost 343 firefighters 01:22:22.369 --> 01:22:24.090 specifically, and I know we're getting close 01:22:24.090 --> 01:22:27.649 to that number now in post 9 -11 illness. That's 01:22:27.649 --> 01:22:29.289 not including law enforcement, as you mentioned, 01:22:29.369 --> 01:22:32.409 steel workers, civilians. So what have you seen 01:22:32.409 --> 01:22:34.510 being literally, you couldn't have gotten any 01:22:34.510 --> 01:22:37.949 closer to that event and being so close to the 01:22:37.949 --> 01:22:42.289 city of New York and FDNY, NYPD, the last 20 01:22:42.289 --> 01:22:44.430 years, the ripple effect of that horrendous day? 01:22:46.520 --> 01:22:48.579 I think everything goes back to that day. And 01:22:48.579 --> 01:22:51.680 as I said it, you know, that day you could have 01:22:51.680 --> 01:22:54.140 told everyone who was there that was between 01:22:54.140 --> 01:22:57.319 the police officers, the fire department, everyone 01:22:57.319 --> 01:22:58.899 who was working on the recovery. You could have 01:22:58.899 --> 01:23:01.359 told them, you know, this is what we're breathing 01:23:01.359 --> 01:23:04.079 in is deadly. It's going to be bad. They would 01:23:04.079 --> 01:23:05.800 have said, I don't care. I need to save people. 01:23:06.239 --> 01:23:10.659 The problem I have is that, unfortunately, politicians 01:23:10.659 --> 01:23:13.340 abandoned. Everyone who was there that day all 01:23:13.340 --> 01:23:16.180 the first responders when they refused to take 01:23:16.180 --> 01:23:19.260 care of their of ensure that their health would 01:23:19.260 --> 01:23:23.399 be Would be will be taking care of their their 01:23:23.399 --> 01:23:26.829 medical bills all that and to think that civilians 01:23:26.829 --> 01:23:30.869 needed to kind of rise up and and go and speak 01:23:30.869 --> 01:23:34.050 at the congress and the senate to plead and to 01:23:34.050 --> 01:23:37.109 beg for firefighters and and first responders 01:23:37.109 --> 01:23:39.569 all together to have the medical coverage they 01:23:39.569 --> 01:23:41.729 needed i think is a shame and it needed to be 01:23:41.729 --> 01:23:44.109 done it was done several times john stewart in 01:23:44.109 --> 01:23:47.029 particular was a great proponent of that and 01:23:47.029 --> 01:23:50.060 and helped a lot with that But, you know, I've 01:23:50.060 --> 01:23:53.279 always been and I'm speaking personally, I've 01:23:53.279 --> 01:23:56.359 always had a problem with politicians using. 01:24:00.600 --> 01:24:02.880 Tragedies to their own advantage. And the fact 01:24:02.880 --> 01:24:04.880 of everyone saying, oh, we will never forget, 01:24:05.119 --> 01:24:07.000 we'll celebrate them forever. And then, you know, 01:24:07.020 --> 01:24:09.760 a month later or a year later when they need 01:24:09.760 --> 01:24:12.100 to actually pay a little bit because our friends 01:24:12.100 --> 01:24:15.199 are dying and because they were there and saving 01:24:15.199 --> 01:24:17.920 people. And now it's like, well, really, are 01:24:17.920 --> 01:24:19.819 they really that sick? And do they really need 01:24:19.819 --> 01:24:21.979 to go there? I think it's an absolute shame and 01:24:21.979 --> 01:24:24.260 it's quite disgusting. So every time we can point 01:24:24.260 --> 01:24:26.760 it out. That let's you know, it's one thing to 01:24:26.760 --> 01:24:28.680 say, let's never forget. It's another to actually 01:24:28.680 --> 01:24:30.840 doing it and putting your mouth where you're 01:24:30.840 --> 01:24:33.420 putting your words, where your mouth is, is, 01:24:33.420 --> 01:24:35.060 you know, take care of these people. These people 01:24:35.060 --> 01:24:37.460 are here for us every single day throughout the 01:24:37.460 --> 01:24:41.460 world. Right now, thousands of firefighters are 01:24:41.460 --> 01:24:43.539 saving people around the world and in the US 01:24:43.539 --> 01:24:48.140 also. So let's remember that, you know, it doesn't 01:24:48.140 --> 01:24:51.359 need a tragedy like 9 -11. Unfortunately, that's 01:24:51.359 --> 01:24:53.380 what highlighted the amazing work that these 01:24:53.380 --> 01:24:55.800 people do every single day. But these people 01:24:55.800 --> 01:24:58.460 had to be cherished and had to be protected. 01:24:58.659 --> 01:25:02.060 And everyone who gave, you know, a little bit 01:25:02.060 --> 01:25:06.100 of themselves on that day needs to be taken care 01:25:06.100 --> 01:25:08.819 of and all that. And I think it's shameful that 01:25:08.819 --> 01:25:10.640 it takes so long and that we have a fight every 01:25:10.640 --> 01:25:16.140 five years to re -up the Zagoroda bill. And I 01:25:16.140 --> 01:25:19.000 think it's, you know, it's enough. You know, 01:25:19.039 --> 01:25:22.989 we're better than this. if you want to talk about 01:25:22.989 --> 01:25:26.850 the trauma and you know of course of course um 01:25:26.850 --> 01:25:33.050 it was interesting to to see the the i we understand 01:25:33.050 --> 01:25:36.750 your show is about of course all first responders 01:25:36.750 --> 01:25:41.670 and and so please uh uh allow us to apologize 01:25:41.670 --> 01:25:45.310 as as we are firefighters groupies and and our 01:25:45.310 --> 01:25:48.090 experiences with firefighters only we wish we 01:25:48.090 --> 01:25:52.180 could talk about police and and construction 01:25:52.180 --> 01:25:57.140 workers and everybody else who came. But our 01:25:57.140 --> 01:26:02.600 experience is with firefighters. And with firefighters, 01:26:02.699 --> 01:26:06.619 we saw a tremendous change in their culture. 01:26:08.760 --> 01:26:12.119 When we arrived at the firehouse, when we started 01:26:12.119 --> 01:26:15.680 filming in the summer of 2001, we quickly realized 01:26:15.680 --> 01:26:20.899 that... The culture in the far house is the culture 01:26:20.899 --> 01:26:25.699 of being the biggest macho on the planet. I mean, 01:26:25.739 --> 01:26:30.260 you might discover at the end of the day that 01:26:30.260 --> 01:26:33.659 they're big teddy bears, but, you know, the way 01:26:33.659 --> 01:26:38.920 they talk, it's like, oh my gosh. And so that's 01:26:38.920 --> 01:26:44.510 the way it was, you know. You don't ask for help. 01:26:44.649 --> 01:26:47.770 Whatever happened stays in the firehouse. If 01:26:47.770 --> 01:26:50.409 you have a problem, you talk about it among yourself. 01:26:50.649 --> 01:26:55.430 You never, never, never ask for help. Except 01:26:55.430 --> 01:26:59.329 when something as big as 9 -11 happened, you 01:26:59.329 --> 01:27:03.130 need to ask for help. And those guys didn't. 01:27:03.590 --> 01:27:07.729 And we saw first. Yeah, they didn't at first. 01:27:07.810 --> 01:27:12.239 And we saw psychologically how damaging. It was 01:27:12.239 --> 01:27:15.180 not just in the firehouse, but in every single 01:27:15.180 --> 01:27:22.960 firehouse. And people were ringing the alarm, 01:27:23.140 --> 01:27:28.060 saying, you know, if you don't talk about it, 01:27:28.100 --> 01:27:32.460 if you don't go through the normal, if you don't 01:27:32.460 --> 01:27:36.479 recognize it as true trauma, which has some serious 01:27:36.479 --> 01:27:41.500 mental and physical... In fact, you're going 01:27:41.500 --> 01:27:45.899 to pay a heavy price. And at first, yeah, many 01:27:45.899 --> 01:27:50.899 did. But as years passed, we saw the culture 01:27:50.899 --> 01:27:55.159 in the FDNY change for the better. And we saw 01:27:55.159 --> 01:28:00.439 those guys starting to understand and talk to 01:28:00.439 --> 01:28:06.340 professionals, help each other. I mean, there's 01:28:06.340 --> 01:28:09.899 still the, you know, the basement firehouse therapy 01:28:09.899 --> 01:28:13.819 that is the most amazing one, of course. You 01:28:13.819 --> 01:28:16.960 know, you have an issue, you talk to the guys. 01:28:17.720 --> 01:28:21.479 No one else understands better than... But it's 01:28:21.479 --> 01:28:27.380 not enough. And this was huge to see this change 01:28:27.380 --> 01:28:32.100 over the years. And I think 20 years later, the 01:28:32.100 --> 01:28:35.800 culture is now... very much understanding of 01:28:35.800 --> 01:28:41.239 what trauma is and means and the horrible effect 01:28:41.239 --> 01:28:45.020 of post -traumatic disorder. So they're now taking 01:28:45.020 --> 01:28:48.239 that very seriously. So that's a good thing that 01:28:48.239 --> 01:28:52.000 came out. Yeah, I think that as we described 01:28:52.000 --> 01:28:55.279 it before 9 -11, you had kind of that Superman 01:28:55.279 --> 01:28:58.560 complex. You know, nothing can hit can can get 01:28:58.560 --> 01:29:02.020 me. I'm stronger than anything. And I think through 01:29:02.020 --> 01:29:03.939 that and through the department realizing that 01:29:03.939 --> 01:29:07.840 and having, you know, these people are now tested 01:29:07.840 --> 01:29:11.079 physically, just like all survivors of 9 -11, 01:29:11.199 --> 01:29:13.920 not only physically for the cancers and all the 01:29:13.920 --> 01:29:17.159 horrible things we diseases. Unfortunately, a 01:29:17.159 --> 01:29:20.119 lot of us are suffering from. but also mentally 01:29:20.119 --> 01:29:22.779 to make sure that everyone is okay, that everyone 01:29:22.779 --> 01:29:24.859 who needs to talk to a professional therapist, 01:29:25.279 --> 01:29:28.380 psychiatrist, whatever it is, is there. And it 01:29:28.380 --> 01:29:31.300 took, Jadon is right, it took some time, but 01:29:31.300 --> 01:29:33.560 I think it's a better department because of it 01:29:33.560 --> 01:29:36.520 now. Yeah, absolutely. And I had Nancy Carbone 01:29:36.520 --> 01:29:38.319 on the show from Friends of Firefighters and 01:29:38.319 --> 01:29:39.800 what they're doing, I think is another great 01:29:39.800 --> 01:29:45.039 asset to the FDNY. Exactly, exactly. All right, 01:29:45.039 --> 01:29:47.640 well then. I know we're already an hour and a 01:29:47.640 --> 01:29:49.560 half in and we're still in New York in 2001. 01:29:49.920 --> 01:29:52.100 And there's no rush on my end at all. I mean, 01:29:52.119 --> 01:29:55.300 it's such a powerful story and I want to give 01:29:55.300 --> 01:29:58.300 you the time to tell it properly. For you personally, 01:29:58.520 --> 01:30:01.600 firstly, what was that journey from that event 01:30:01.600 --> 01:30:05.819 yourself like? And then the next time I really 01:30:05.819 --> 01:30:09.539 saw your work come up was obviously after the 01:30:09.539 --> 01:30:11.659 Paris attacks and that beautiful documentary 01:30:11.659 --> 01:30:14.960 that you made, which I think is one of my favorite. 01:30:15.719 --> 01:30:18.880 documentary pieces ever and it's just I mean 01:30:18.880 --> 01:30:20.539 obviously it's the people it's the way you shot 01:30:20.539 --> 01:30:24.579 it it's again the the fact that you didn't sensationalize 01:30:24.579 --> 01:30:27.300 any of the deaths or anything like that but lead 01:30:27.300 --> 01:30:30.199 me through that period between the two and your 01:30:30.199 --> 01:30:33.819 own first exposure to that attack as you know 01:30:33.819 --> 01:30:38.199 a Frenchman well that's you know after uh doing 01:30:38.199 --> 01:30:41.680 9 11 which we you know in a way we we kept doing 01:30:41.680 --> 01:30:45.100 over and over because we we did many versions 01:30:45.100 --> 01:30:47.560 of it and every year every five years then we 01:30:47.560 --> 01:30:49.859 wanted to to to add to it to follow these guys 01:30:49.859 --> 01:30:57.100 we did a few documentaries um um We did one on 01:30:57.100 --> 01:30:59.680 the four hour on the White House chief of staff, 01:30:59.779 --> 01:31:01.380 which was kind of a departure of our traditional 01:31:01.380 --> 01:31:03.239 kind of fly on the wall. But we wanted to try 01:31:03.239 --> 01:31:05.859 different things. And same thing always. The 01:31:05.859 --> 01:31:10.479 way is finding, you know, kind of the person 01:31:10.479 --> 01:31:13.359 behind the uniform or behind the title, what 01:31:13.359 --> 01:31:15.050 it's like to be. you know, White House chief 01:31:15.050 --> 01:31:16.729 of staff, the closest person to a president, 01:31:16.869 --> 01:31:20.670 even than the first lady. Then we did one on 01:31:20.670 --> 01:31:24.170 the directors of the CIA, which is kind of linked 01:31:24.170 --> 01:31:27.109 a little bit, you know, towards terrorism. But 01:31:27.109 --> 01:31:31.409 then as we were finishing the one on the CIA, 01:31:31.569 --> 01:31:33.369 we were editing, we were in New York, we received 01:31:33.369 --> 01:31:36.050 a phone call of friends saying, you know, do 01:31:36.050 --> 01:31:37.970 you know what is happening in Paris right now? 01:31:38.210 --> 01:31:43.210 It was Friday, November 13, 2015. And as the 01:31:43.210 --> 01:31:47.680 first, news was trying to trickling in. They 01:31:47.680 --> 01:31:50.399 were talking about bombs at the stadium and then 01:31:50.399 --> 01:31:55.939 shootings at cafes. Immediately, we called our 01:31:55.939 --> 01:32:01.020 parents who live in Paris, who we knew were in 01:32:01.020 --> 01:32:04.100 the neighborhood around the 10th and 11th arrondissement. 01:32:04.359 --> 01:32:07.590 And so here we had a very strange... reverse 01:32:07.590 --> 01:32:09.970 of what had happened on September 11. On September 01:32:09.970 --> 01:32:13.350 11, they were the ones in Paris agonizing at 01:32:13.350 --> 01:32:16.189 home and watching on television live as the towers 01:32:16.189 --> 01:32:18.909 collapsed and being sure that their sons had 01:32:18.909 --> 01:32:21.130 just died in front of them. And to answer your 01:32:21.130 --> 01:32:22.869 question from before, it's only the two of us. 01:32:23.369 --> 01:32:28.609 We're the only siblings. And here, it was us 01:32:28.609 --> 01:32:30.470 watching television, not being able to reach 01:32:30.470 --> 01:32:32.069 our parents, knowing they were in the neighborhood 01:32:32.069 --> 01:32:36.470 and freaking out like they had before. You know, 01:32:36.489 --> 01:32:38.750 we were born and raised in Paris. We spent, you 01:32:38.750 --> 01:32:41.430 know, 16 and 19 years there. So and we go back 01:32:41.430 --> 01:32:43.949 there often. So it's still, you know, it's it's 01:32:43.949 --> 01:32:45.890 it feels very close to home. And to see that 01:32:45.890 --> 01:32:49.189 you see on television, that helplessness that 01:32:49.189 --> 01:32:51.430 you feel of watching on television, not being 01:32:51.430 --> 01:32:54.829 able to do anything, not knowing anything. We 01:32:54.829 --> 01:32:58.470 were devastated like everyone. And we then started, 01:32:58.649 --> 01:33:01.069 of course, in the coming days after that, hearing 01:33:01.069 --> 01:33:07.479 the stories of heroism. It took a turn is that 01:33:07.479 --> 01:33:09.619 actually Chief Pfeiffer, so the chief who saved 01:33:09.619 --> 01:33:12.579 my my life on 9 -11, who I'm incredibly close 01:33:12.579 --> 01:33:18.399 with, became after 9 -11, the chief of the counterterrorism 01:33:18.399 --> 01:33:21.800 for the fire department of New York, gave me 01:33:21.800 --> 01:33:24.560 a call a few weeks later and said, can you, Jules, 01:33:24.579 --> 01:33:29.539 can you arrange a trip that I could go to Paris? 01:33:30.119 --> 01:33:32.979 in a few months with heads of counterterrorism 01:33:32.979 --> 01:33:36.220 from different fire departments in the US and 01:33:36.220 --> 01:33:39.079 a couple of FBI people. And we'd like to meet 01:33:39.079 --> 01:33:44.279 everyone in the French government, first responders, 01:33:44.600 --> 01:33:47.579 hospitals, fire, police, SWAT teams, et cetera, 01:33:47.640 --> 01:33:52.000 to see the lessons we could take from that attack. 01:33:52.180 --> 01:33:54.960 What worked, what didn't work. And when, unfortunately, 01:33:55.079 --> 01:33:58.000 not if, but when it happens, we can be ready 01:33:58.000 --> 01:34:00.859 and put things in place. that will help us. And 01:34:00.859 --> 01:34:04.199 so we found ourselves in March of 2016 going 01:34:04.199 --> 01:34:06.920 to Paris. I think we had a delegation of about 01:34:06.920 --> 01:34:11.279 12 people. And we went to, I had organized to 01:34:11.279 --> 01:34:13.899 meet with, from the Ministry of the Interior, 01:34:14.079 --> 01:34:16.260 the Prime Minister, the heads of the police, 01:34:16.560 --> 01:34:19.460 of the SWAT teams, of the fire department, of 01:34:19.460 --> 01:34:24.819 the EMS, et cetera, et cetera. As all these professionals 01:34:24.819 --> 01:34:28.079 together were talking and describing what had 01:34:28.079 --> 01:34:31.800 happened, we were kind of, I was kind of the 01:34:31.800 --> 01:34:39.079 unofficial translator. Here we go. And so we 01:34:39.079 --> 01:34:43.180 discovered all of these stories reminded me of 01:34:43.180 --> 01:34:46.180 what we had lived through on 9 -11, the heroism 01:34:46.180 --> 01:34:50.779 of the first responders, the heroism of the civilians. 01:34:52.780 --> 01:34:55.100 After a couple of months thinking about it, saying, 01:34:55.260 --> 01:34:57.819 but, you know, we have to tell that story, but 01:34:57.819 --> 01:35:00.579 it's a very complicated story. And again, we 01:35:00.579 --> 01:35:02.579 know that, you know, telling a story like this 01:35:02.579 --> 01:35:05.720 is full of kind of pitfalls of, you know, we 01:35:05.720 --> 01:35:07.819 have to do it in the right way and be respectful 01:35:07.819 --> 01:35:10.680 and not be gratuitous, just like we had done 01:35:10.680 --> 01:35:14.020 with 9 -11. And so we started first to talk to 01:35:14.020 --> 01:35:17.939 the... the big organization, the French government, 01:35:18.159 --> 01:35:20.300 the head of the fire department and the head 01:35:20.300 --> 01:35:21.979 of the police, which I had met through these 01:35:21.979 --> 01:35:27.060 trips that I had taken. And they all said, okay, 01:35:27.159 --> 01:35:28.760 they all understood where we were coming from. 01:35:28.859 --> 01:35:31.399 They had all seen our 9 -11 projects and the 01:35:31.399 --> 01:35:34.560 others that we had done and decided to do this. 01:35:35.359 --> 01:35:39.039 And started about a long eight -month process 01:35:39.039 --> 01:35:42.140 of starting to get to the civilians in particular 01:35:42.140 --> 01:35:44.539 and the local firefighters that had participated 01:35:44.539 --> 01:35:47.880 that night and been there. And it took a while. 01:35:48.060 --> 01:35:53.220 It was made easier by the fact that Judeo and 01:35:53.220 --> 01:35:56.140 I were survivors. And so in ourselves, we were 01:35:56.140 --> 01:35:59.829 all part of this very strange... a club where 01:35:59.829 --> 01:36:02.229 nobody nobody wants to be a member of but we 01:36:02.229 --> 01:36:04.270 are you know they're the survivors of terrorism 01:36:04.270 --> 01:36:08.310 and i think in the way that we when we met them 01:36:08.310 --> 01:36:12.550 we mostly didn't talk about we wanted uh what 01:36:12.550 --> 01:36:14.670 we wanted to do or their stories we talked about 01:36:14.670 --> 01:36:17.359 our story where we came from, what we had lived 01:36:17.359 --> 01:36:22.840 through, the trauma, how that trauma had changed 01:36:22.840 --> 01:36:25.399 over the years. Because for them, they were watching 01:36:25.399 --> 01:36:27.600 it with very young eyes in a way. Their trauma 01:36:27.600 --> 01:36:30.119 was still a year old, which is nothing. And so 01:36:30.119 --> 01:36:31.939 we're looking at us with about, at that time, 01:36:31.960 --> 01:36:35.920 16 years on a traumatic experience, were really 01:36:35.920 --> 01:36:39.119 enabled them to trust us and understand and speak 01:36:39.119 --> 01:36:41.970 to them in a way that others could not. And so 01:36:41.970 --> 01:36:45.489 we then decided, OK, but, you know, all these 01:36:45.489 --> 01:36:47.750 people have agreed for us to do it. But where 01:36:47.750 --> 01:36:49.850 how do we do it? And that's why we came up to 01:36:49.850 --> 01:36:52.369 do it with Netflix, because it was kind of the 01:36:52.369 --> 01:36:55.949 safest place that will do it justice. We didn't 01:36:55.949 --> 01:36:58.029 see the documentary knowing that it was already 01:36:58.029 --> 01:37:00.630 to be at least three hours long to do it on a 01:37:00.630 --> 01:37:03.350 normal network that would then, you know, would 01:37:03.350 --> 01:37:05.409 have to cut for commercials or for all that. 01:37:05.979 --> 01:37:08.899 That was not the forum for that. The platform 01:37:08.899 --> 01:37:11.140 that we thought we needed was that for people 01:37:11.140 --> 01:37:13.920 to watch it when they wanted, to stop when they 01:37:13.920 --> 01:37:17.460 wanted, to be able to watch the second parts 01:37:17.460 --> 01:37:19.819 of it three months later, six months later, two 01:37:19.819 --> 01:37:22.500 years later, and not to be rushed to watch it 01:37:22.500 --> 01:37:26.159 and to maybe a broadcaster who kind of wanted 01:37:26.159 --> 01:37:28.600 to do the best rating numbers. That was not what 01:37:28.600 --> 01:37:34.029 it was all about. We managed to, and we're very 01:37:34.029 --> 01:37:36.210 grateful that Netflix gave us the freedom to 01:37:36.210 --> 01:37:39.090 do that, kind of almost a talking head documentary 01:37:39.090 --> 01:37:42.069 with very little images, and trust us to say 01:37:42.069 --> 01:37:46.359 a compelling story. That film is kind of the 01:37:46.359 --> 01:37:50.760 other end of the spectrum from our original 9 01:37:50.760 --> 01:37:53.579 -11, you know, which we started. This is 16 years 01:37:53.579 --> 01:37:56.239 later. We're much more mature. But in a way, 01:37:56.279 --> 01:37:58.359 we're treating the exact same subject in two 01:37:58.359 --> 01:38:00.239 different ways. The first one is with the images 01:38:00.239 --> 01:38:02.399 that we film as we were protagonists ourselves 01:38:02.399 --> 01:38:06.000 and inside. The other is more a duty of memory. 01:38:08.760 --> 01:38:12.619 And so which relies more on the words of these 01:38:12.619 --> 01:38:16.960 people. And once again, the courage of the people 01:38:16.960 --> 01:38:22.579 that gave us their testimony and were candid 01:38:22.579 --> 01:38:24.479 enough to talk about what they lived through, 01:38:24.520 --> 01:38:27.680 the civilians, the firefighters, the SWAT members, 01:38:27.819 --> 01:38:31.960 to see that humanity, that same best of us that 01:38:31.960 --> 01:38:37.720 comes out, was so touching that we knew we needed 01:38:37.720 --> 01:38:39.659 to tell that story. But it's very complementary 01:38:39.659 --> 01:38:43.720 to our 9 -11 documentary in a way. Yeah, I mean, 01:38:43.739 --> 01:38:46.020 it was so incredibly powerful. And like you said, 01:38:46.119 --> 01:38:47.920 the courage, because I mean, I have this on the 01:38:47.920 --> 01:38:50.720 show today with the courage that you have to 01:38:50.720 --> 01:38:53.460 relive that horrific moment to tell the story, 01:38:53.500 --> 01:38:55.239 knowing that it's going to help so many people 01:38:55.239 --> 01:38:57.619 out there. It was the same thing. And I obviously 01:38:57.619 --> 01:38:59.920 want to get you guys to lead us through that 01:38:59.920 --> 01:39:02.920 day, at least an overview of it. But the courage 01:39:02.920 --> 01:39:06.920 that it took to lose a wife, you know, to see 01:39:06.920 --> 01:39:09.739 a friend that didn't make it, you know, and then 01:39:09.739 --> 01:39:13.359 to sit there and tell the story. And then also, 01:39:13.520 --> 01:39:15.949 and we'll get into it as well, but... But some 01:39:15.949 --> 01:39:18.810 of the humor in it, amongst all that death and 01:39:18.810 --> 01:39:20.750 destruction, you know, and we'll talk about that 01:39:20.750 --> 01:39:22.689 when we get to that point. But, I mean, it was 01:39:22.689 --> 01:39:25.369 just, again, completely parallel what I saw in 01:39:25.369 --> 01:39:27.810 9 -11, what I saw in 7 -7, you know, with the 01:39:27.810 --> 01:39:29.750 reports of that and the kind of stiff, you know, 01:39:29.750 --> 01:39:32.770 British upper lip, which I love, stiff upper 01:39:32.770 --> 01:39:34.350 lip, like, screw you, terrorists, we're going 01:39:34.350 --> 01:39:36.390 back to work. Made me very proud to be British. 01:39:37.390 --> 01:39:40.289 But, yeah, I mean, again, but you saw that community, 01:39:40.449 --> 01:39:42.750 you saw people banding together, you saw, as 01:39:42.750 --> 01:39:46.779 with 9 -11, The firefighter in a station waiting 01:39:46.779 --> 01:39:49.640 for possibly another bullshit call to come in 01:39:49.640 --> 01:39:52.420 and all of a sudden the worst case scenario. 01:39:52.439 --> 01:39:56.800 And clearly, as with the men and women in FDNY 01:39:56.800 --> 01:39:59.979 and the surrounding agencies and then the same 01:39:59.979 --> 01:40:02.899 in Paris, they clearly were prepared. They'd 01:40:02.899 --> 01:40:04.819 done the training. They kept themselves fit. 01:40:04.920 --> 01:40:08.520 So as a responder, it was amazing that when they 01:40:08.520 --> 01:40:10.539 were dropped right in the middle of it, that 01:40:10.539 --> 01:40:13.810 they... had to collect themselves, but then they 01:40:13.810 --> 01:40:17.449 went to work. And through that lens, to me, they 01:40:17.449 --> 01:40:19.109 walked the walk. There's no better description 01:40:19.109 --> 01:40:23.069 than that. No, it's true. And so to go maybe 01:40:23.069 --> 01:40:25.590 through for the people who don't really know 01:40:25.590 --> 01:40:30.310 what happened, it's quite crazy. So it's a Friday 01:40:30.310 --> 01:40:34.090 night, mid -November, and it's a night where 01:40:34.090 --> 01:40:38.189 it's actually exceptionally warm and wonderful 01:40:38.189 --> 01:40:42.119 outside. Parisian as Parisians are are most of 01:40:42.119 --> 01:40:45.159 them are at the cafe drinking a beer having a 01:40:45.159 --> 01:40:47.500 cigarette all the terraces are full it's nice 01:40:47.500 --> 01:40:49.100 you know full of life we're probably arguing 01:40:49.100 --> 01:40:52.399 about politics or whatever it is but and you 01:40:52.399 --> 01:40:57.000 have a exhibition match a soccer match playing 01:40:57.000 --> 01:41:03.260 the the biggest stadium in Paris and 70 ,000 01:41:03.260 --> 01:41:07.909 players And the match is going great. And suddenly 01:41:07.909 --> 01:41:13.189 a suicide bomber detonates his explosive vest 01:41:13.189 --> 01:41:16.390 in the middle of the in front of the stadium 01:41:16.390 --> 01:41:20.510 outside. No one knows exactly at that point what 01:41:20.510 --> 01:41:22.329 is happening. They don't even believe they don't 01:41:22.329 --> 01:41:23.989 know if it's a terrorist attack, if it's just, 01:41:23.989 --> 01:41:26.029 you know, an accident or, you know, whatever. 01:41:26.350 --> 01:41:30.159 And the president is there. The president is 01:41:30.159 --> 01:41:35.100 in the stadium with his German counterpart. And 01:41:35.100 --> 01:41:41.079 over the next, I think, 33 minutes, three groups 01:41:41.079 --> 01:41:44.899 of terrorists would attack. Three would detonate 01:41:44.899 --> 01:41:49.619 their suicide bombs, suicide vests outside the 01:41:49.619 --> 01:41:55.840 stadium. Six different cafes would be shot by 01:41:55.840 --> 01:42:00.079 machine guns by a team of roaming terrorists 01:42:00.079 --> 01:42:03.180 that would drop them off from their car, spray 01:42:03.180 --> 01:42:05.239 an entire terrace, go back in the car, go to 01:42:05.239 --> 01:42:08.489 the next one. At the end of that, three more 01:42:08.489 --> 01:42:13.069 terrorists arriving at a very busy music hall 01:42:13.069 --> 01:42:17.430 where a concert of an American rock band is taking 01:42:17.430 --> 01:42:20.909 place. And we'll start shooting in a theater 01:42:20.909 --> 01:42:25.229 where there is about 3 ,000 people. All that 01:42:25.229 --> 01:42:29.029 within 33 seconds of each other. So imagine on 01:42:29.029 --> 01:42:32.880 the perspective of first responders. where you 01:42:32.880 --> 01:42:35.760 first have reports of bombs in one location, 01:42:36.000 --> 01:42:40.600 then you're getting shootings at another, then 01:42:40.600 --> 01:42:42.920 at another, then at another, then another, then 01:42:42.920 --> 01:42:46.220 another, then another. And you had that sense 01:42:46.220 --> 01:42:49.880 that it's never going to stop. Every time a code 01:42:49.880 --> 01:42:52.600 would come in, a different area was under attack 01:42:52.600 --> 01:42:57.899 by a different terrorist group, commando. And 01:42:57.899 --> 01:43:01.350 it was that... that craziness that on the part 01:43:01.350 --> 01:43:03.569 of the first responders, police and fire department, 01:43:03.670 --> 01:43:07.710 was incredibly complicated. And yet, as usual, 01:43:07.970 --> 01:43:13.029 would rush to the scene. And you see in the documentary, 01:43:13.170 --> 01:43:17.050 the incredible work of the firefighters who are 01:43:17.050 --> 01:43:18.869 the first responders, the first one who arrived. 01:43:19.289 --> 01:43:22.710 And even a shooting is happening, risking their 01:43:22.710 --> 01:43:25.949 lives to tourniquet and to try to stanch the 01:43:25.949 --> 01:43:32.380 bleeding and all that. And then... The accumulation 01:43:32.380 --> 01:43:36.010 of all of that is that... a music concert where, 01:43:36.130 --> 01:43:38.630 you know, you have 3 ,000 people in there, three 01:43:38.630 --> 01:43:42.930 guys come in with machine guns and shoot indiscriminately 01:43:42.930 --> 01:43:46.310 at the crowd. And again, you see these civilians, 01:43:46.550 --> 01:43:49.470 the stories of them protecting themselves, protecting 01:43:49.470 --> 01:43:54.670 someone weaker than them, protecting complete 01:43:54.670 --> 01:43:58.069 strangers, either by escaping, either by playing 01:43:58.069 --> 01:44:02.329 dead and covering them with your body as people 01:44:02.329 --> 01:44:06.449 are dying all around. And the terrorists will 01:44:06.449 --> 01:44:10.649 then proceed to take 11 hostages and wait for 01:44:10.649 --> 01:44:17.050 the police to lock themselves in a long but very 01:44:17.050 --> 01:44:22.369 narrow hallway with these 11 hostages. And that 01:44:22.369 --> 01:44:25.329 hostage negotiation will then take place. And 01:44:25.329 --> 01:44:27.470 when you talk about the humor, what we wanted 01:44:27.470 --> 01:44:31.130 to show is that humor is a very important part, 01:44:31.229 --> 01:44:34.460 I think, of healing. But it's also a way that, 01:44:34.460 --> 01:44:38.979 you know, our brain kind of enables us to protect 01:44:38.979 --> 01:44:41.260 ourselves. Humor sometimes comes out when you're 01:44:41.260 --> 01:44:43.340 stressed, you know, you laugh and all that. And 01:44:43.340 --> 01:44:46.180 these moments where you can think that, you know, 01:44:46.199 --> 01:44:48.380 how can you even think about laughing when two 01:44:48.380 --> 01:44:51.180 terrorists are pointing AK -47s at your heads, 01:44:51.220 --> 01:44:52.960 that they're playing with the detonator where 01:44:52.960 --> 01:44:55.140 you can see on their vest full of explosives 01:44:55.140 --> 01:44:57.520 and they're holding your feet away from them. 01:44:58.170 --> 01:45:01.869 It's in these moments that the crazy, surreal 01:45:01.869 --> 01:45:05.829 reality happens. And here it happens when the 01:45:05.829 --> 01:45:09.569 SWAT team, amazing. people, whether it is in 01:45:09.569 --> 01:45:11.689 the US or in France, but here in Paris, these 01:45:11.689 --> 01:45:14.850 sweat team members who know it's going to be 01:45:14.850 --> 01:45:16.770 complicated. It's a narrow hallway. You have 01:45:16.770 --> 01:45:19.470 11 hostages. You have two terrorists armed to 01:45:19.470 --> 01:45:21.750 the teeth, AK -47 explosives. We're going to 01:45:21.750 --> 01:45:23.590 have to breach at some point, which is, you know, 01:45:23.609 --> 01:45:25.989 it's going to be bad for you and for the hostages. 01:45:26.489 --> 01:45:29.869 And yet, as they try to negotiate to buy some 01:45:29.869 --> 01:45:33.810 time, the negotiator has the thickest southern 01:45:33.810 --> 01:45:38.130 accent you can imagine. And so. Comes that surreal 01:45:38.130 --> 01:45:41.710 moment where he tries to give the number to call 01:45:41.710 --> 01:45:43.630 on the cell phone to negotiate and all that, 01:45:43.670 --> 01:45:46.189 except no one understands him. And the hostages 01:45:46.189 --> 01:45:49.390 have to repeat for about 15 times the number. 01:45:49.449 --> 01:45:51.470 And it becomes kind of a sketch that you think 01:45:51.470 --> 01:45:53.409 comes out of Saturday Night Live if it was not 01:45:53.409 --> 01:45:56.489 so terrible. All this is to say that you find 01:45:56.489 --> 01:45:58.609 these moments where you look at the documentary 01:45:58.609 --> 01:46:00.590 and laugh and almost be all ashamed. No, no, 01:46:00.609 --> 01:46:03.649 I should not laugh. The hostages themselves and 01:46:03.649 --> 01:46:06.819 the people there that will tell that. crazy moment 01:46:06.819 --> 01:46:12.199 when you think life is going to be over in an 01:46:12.199 --> 01:46:16.579 instant. A moment of laughter, a smile, a twinkle 01:46:16.579 --> 01:46:20.420 in the eye, holding someone's hand or just a 01:46:20.420 --> 01:46:25.199 square inch of flesh in yours can mean the difference 01:46:25.199 --> 01:46:27.359 between life and death, mentally and physically. 01:46:27.619 --> 01:46:32.380 And so what we wanted to see in the candidness. 01:46:32.699 --> 01:46:38.199 of these incredible testimonies of not only because 01:46:38.199 --> 01:46:39.699 they're talking about their courage, but for 01:46:39.699 --> 01:46:42.439 some, because they're talking about that, yes, 01:46:42.479 --> 01:46:45.239 the terrorist pointed a machine gun at his head 01:46:45.239 --> 01:46:49.720 and said, go get my bag full of charges. If not, 01:46:49.760 --> 01:46:51.420 I'll kill you and I'll kill your friend. And 01:46:51.420 --> 01:46:54.819 he says, but I go there and I pick up the bag 01:46:54.819 --> 01:46:57.420 and I feel guilty because I'm giving them more 01:46:57.420 --> 01:47:00.060 ammo. but I don't want to die. And I think to 01:47:00.060 --> 01:47:03.539 have the honesty to say that is incredibly courageous, 01:47:03.560 --> 01:47:06.279 but also very human. And I think it's to be applauded. 01:47:06.340 --> 01:47:10.060 All of them that participated, the act of telling 01:47:10.060 --> 01:47:13.819 your story is an act of courage because it is 01:47:13.819 --> 01:47:18.479 not easy. It is not fun for the most part. It 01:47:18.479 --> 01:47:25.399 was difficult. It was long. It was heavy, but 01:47:25.399 --> 01:47:28.029 it's... it helps you, it heals you to be able 01:47:28.029 --> 01:47:30.229 to tell your story. And here, these people in 01:47:30.229 --> 01:47:32.890 particular, who, for the ones in the Bataclan, 01:47:33.029 --> 01:47:36.029 the one in the council venue, who had been taken 01:47:36.029 --> 01:47:38.390 hostage for two hours, that this moment of their 01:47:38.390 --> 01:47:40.409 lives had been taken away from them, these two 01:47:40.409 --> 01:47:45.689 hours of their life was taken hostage by the 01:47:45.689 --> 01:47:48.470 terrorists, to be able to tell their story minute 01:47:48.470 --> 01:47:50.989 by minute, what they saw, what they felt, what 01:47:50.989 --> 01:47:54.310 they smelled, was a way to reclaim what had been 01:47:54.310 --> 01:47:57.029 stolen from them. And so it was very important. 01:47:57.069 --> 01:47:59.930 It was an act of courage, of resilience and healing 01:47:59.930 --> 01:48:03.109 on their part. Yeah. You got anything to add 01:48:03.109 --> 01:48:06.649 before I kind of throw some things at you, Gideon? 01:48:07.649 --> 01:48:10.989 Go ahead. Go ahead. Okay. So, I mean, like I 01:48:10.989 --> 01:48:13.949 said, anyone listening, this is an absolute must 01:48:13.949 --> 01:48:15.970 listen as a human being, as a first responder. 01:48:16.189 --> 01:48:19.250 I mean, excuse me, as a must watch. I mean, it 01:48:19.250 --> 01:48:22.270 was such a... Absolutely one of the most powerful 01:48:22.270 --> 01:48:23.750 things I've ever seen. And being a responder 01:48:23.750 --> 01:48:26.729 myself, you know, I can invest in that even further. 01:48:27.090 --> 01:48:29.670 But a few of the takeaways, and obviously I don't 01:48:29.670 --> 01:48:31.550 want to go over the whole entire thing, but a 01:48:31.550 --> 01:48:33.590 few things I think that were very powerful to 01:48:33.590 --> 01:48:36.170 me. The first one was you mentioned the French 01:48:36.170 --> 01:48:38.850 prime minister was there. Is it prime minister 01:48:38.850 --> 01:48:41.949 or president? You get the president and the interior, 01:48:42.109 --> 01:48:44.149 the minister of the interior. Okay, president. 01:48:44.189 --> 01:48:46.130 The president of the stadium, yeah. Okay, we'll 01:48:46.130 --> 01:48:48.689 make sure I get the right title. So it's a Germany 01:48:48.689 --> 01:48:52.529 versus France game. And so when the initial explosions 01:48:52.529 --> 01:48:54.869 go off, it's outside the stadium, even though 01:48:54.869 --> 01:48:56.250 it sounds like one of the terrorists tried to 01:48:56.250 --> 01:48:58.770 make their way into the stadium. And what I was 01:48:58.770 --> 01:49:01.989 very impressed with was the fact that he chose 01:49:01.989 --> 01:49:05.369 to... tell them to keep playing to try not to 01:49:05.369 --> 01:49:07.310 arouse suspicion at first you're like oh well 01:49:07.310 --> 01:49:09.550 that's easier said than done but then in the 01:49:09.550 --> 01:49:12.489 next breath they say that his own son is in the 01:49:12.489 --> 01:49:14.850 stadium so i thought that was very powerful because 01:49:14.850 --> 01:49:16.989 he's not making it now for strangers he's including 01:49:16.989 --> 01:49:20.050 his own family member and that decision undoubtedly 01:49:20.050 --> 01:49:24.750 saves lives But the amazing part is he has very 01:49:24.750 --> 01:49:27.369 little information. It's actually the fire commander 01:49:27.369 --> 01:49:30.510 in the stadium that the president goes towards 01:49:30.510 --> 01:49:33.510 and said, what do you think? And the fire department 01:49:33.510 --> 01:49:36.270 official there says, we don't know what's happening. 01:49:36.430 --> 01:49:39.850 We have two choices. If we don't if we stop and 01:49:39.850 --> 01:49:42.149 panic people, we might have a frenzy. There's 01:49:42.149 --> 01:49:46.029 70 ,000 people there. If we tell if we stop the 01:49:46.029 --> 01:49:48.770 game and say, OK, let's evacuate. We don't know 01:49:48.770 --> 01:49:52.630 what's outside. And so. He makes a very difficult 01:49:52.630 --> 01:49:55.229 decision to keep everyone inside, including his 01:49:55.229 --> 01:49:58.090 son. It is a very personal one. And fortunately, 01:49:58.270 --> 01:50:00.510 it was the best, because if if they would have 01:50:00.510 --> 01:50:02.510 panicked people, they would have been a stampede 01:50:02.510 --> 01:50:04.229 and people would have died from that. If they 01:50:04.229 --> 01:50:06.550 would have let them outside. You had two more 01:50:06.550 --> 01:50:08.689 suicide bombers, unbeknownst to them, that were 01:50:08.689 --> 01:50:11.090 waiting, that exploded themselves a bit later 01:50:11.090 --> 01:50:14.449 on. So but again, you know, making the right 01:50:14.449 --> 01:50:18.060 decision sometime, it's it's. Inches and seconds 01:50:18.060 --> 01:50:20.659 is the difference between life and death. And 01:50:20.659 --> 01:50:23.939 these decisions are hard to take, but fortunately, 01:50:24.100 --> 01:50:26.880 they were the right ones. Absolutely. Well, another 01:50:26.880 --> 01:50:30.720 thing that I thought was very powerful is as 01:50:30.720 --> 01:50:33.920 it unfolds, and again, you said about the heroism, 01:50:33.960 --> 01:50:37.579 the way that the first responders, a lot of them 01:50:37.579 --> 01:50:40.560 obviously were the firefighters initially, segregated 01:50:40.560 --> 01:50:42.800 off, sectioned off. They had the group leader 01:50:42.800 --> 01:50:47.220 and the person assisting. And they started triaging 01:50:47.220 --> 01:50:50.079 and they, you know, the innovation, like using 01:50:50.079 --> 01:50:52.760 the barriers as stretchers, you know, some of 01:50:52.760 --> 01:50:55.960 those things. But you saw people banding together. 01:50:56.000 --> 01:50:58.159 You saw these responders acting just like you 01:50:58.159 --> 01:51:00.880 said. There was no what we call warm zone. They 01:51:00.880 --> 01:51:03.359 had no idea if one of those people in the crowd 01:51:03.359 --> 01:51:05.300 was another one with a gun or a bomb that was 01:51:05.300 --> 01:51:08.140 going to kill himself. So initially, knowing, 01:51:08.300 --> 01:51:10.960 like you said, there's chaos and ultimately what 01:51:10.960 --> 01:51:13.520 seemed to be a journey south to the Bataclan. 01:51:15.500 --> 01:51:18.840 It was just the heroism of these men and women, 01:51:18.899 --> 01:51:21.279 like you said, sheltering people, the actual 01:51:21.279 --> 01:51:23.739 responders themselves. And I think a very powerful 01:51:23.739 --> 01:51:26.720 moment to me that's kind of summed up from the 01:51:26.720 --> 01:51:29.800 responder's lens was the doctor, medicine, I 01:51:29.800 --> 01:51:33.920 think it was, who had been on scene. He was kind 01:51:33.920 --> 01:51:37.319 of orchestrating the response. He had a chest 01:51:37.319 --> 01:51:40.560 wound patient. He told him the whole pressure. 01:51:41.159 --> 01:51:43.119 obviously got caught up with all the other triage 01:51:43.119 --> 01:51:44.939 that was going on. And then when he came back, 01:51:45.119 --> 01:51:48.600 that person had passed away in that same seated 01:51:48.600 --> 01:51:50.880 position. And even though he was trying to maintain 01:51:50.880 --> 01:51:53.399 his composure, you could see in his eyes, knowing 01:51:53.399 --> 01:51:57.159 responders, that that moment has definitely stayed 01:51:57.159 --> 01:52:00.779 with him. And what's, if I may, what's incredible. 01:52:00.939 --> 01:52:04.020 So he's a fire department doctor, which means 01:52:04.020 --> 01:52:07.659 he's military. He was deployed. He's done Afghanistan. 01:52:08.060 --> 01:52:11.130 He's done Mali. So he's been on theaters of war. 01:52:11.229 --> 01:52:14.069 He's treated war wounds and all that. And here 01:52:14.069 --> 01:52:17.590 to see it and you see it in his eyes in the cafe 01:52:17.590 --> 01:52:19.789 that he knows that he's been to that restaurant. 01:52:20.289 --> 01:52:23.189 And then he talks about that. And just because 01:52:23.189 --> 01:52:25.649 he's doing triage and there's 30 other people 01:52:25.649 --> 01:52:28.250 and for 30 other people, it's at least, you know, 01:52:28.270 --> 01:52:30.689 20 seconds per person. And by the time he comes 01:52:30.689 --> 01:52:33.970 back, that that person has died. And to see almost 01:52:33.970 --> 01:52:37.689 a tear in his eye and holding that emotion. You 01:52:37.689 --> 01:52:39.789 see that humanity that rises to the surface, 01:52:39.949 --> 01:52:42.930 that all of them, even though they did an incredible 01:52:42.930 --> 01:52:45.510 job. Can you imagine you arrive at a terrace 01:52:45.510 --> 01:52:49.569 where you have 28 seats, 24 people are dead on 01:52:49.569 --> 01:52:53.159 that terrace or dying? And you are at first two 01:52:53.159 --> 01:52:57.619 trucks and everyone has to do everything. It 01:52:57.619 --> 01:53:01.020 is unbelievable the work they've done, the people 01:53:01.020 --> 01:53:04.399 they managed to save with an air courier effort, 01:53:05.119 --> 01:53:07.720 coordinating with the civilians themselves who 01:53:07.720 --> 01:53:10.380 were helping. But they all talk about one thing. 01:53:10.479 --> 01:53:12.699 They all talk about when they would treat people. 01:53:13.310 --> 01:53:15.289 The people themselves, the victim would say, 01:53:15.350 --> 01:53:17.750 don't take care of me. Take care of the next 01:53:17.750 --> 01:53:20.869 person. They're much worse off. I'll be OK. Take 01:53:20.869 --> 01:53:22.829 care of my neighbor. Take care of people that 01:53:22.829 --> 01:53:25.930 they don't know. And that was really what what 01:53:25.930 --> 01:53:28.569 struck them is, again, that sense of protection 01:53:28.569 --> 01:53:31.550 for for for the other for caring for the other 01:53:31.550 --> 01:53:35.369 above themselves. Yeah, I think another powerful 01:53:35.369 --> 01:53:38.800 moment for me. You had the one lady, and I meant 01:53:38.800 --> 01:53:40.220 to write the names of all these people, but I 01:53:40.220 --> 01:53:41.579 forgot. But I guess it's probably a good thing 01:53:41.579 --> 01:53:43.439 I didn't because people listening probably don't 01:53:43.439 --> 01:53:45.760 know which person it was anyway. But there was 01:53:45.760 --> 01:53:47.939 a couple in the Bataclan. So now those three 01:53:47.939 --> 01:53:49.939 terrorists have come in. You've got 1 ,500 people 01:53:49.939 --> 01:53:52.659 at this rock concert. They are literally executing 01:53:52.659 --> 01:53:55.720 to the point where there are piles, mountains 01:53:55.720 --> 01:53:59.500 of bodies. And this couple finds their way into, 01:53:59.760 --> 01:54:02.560 was it a bathroom where they got into the ceiling 01:54:02.560 --> 01:54:05.939 space? And this one lady is heavier. She's, you 01:54:05.939 --> 01:54:10.100 know, she's obese. And she's trying to get in. 01:54:10.140 --> 01:54:12.000 And obviously, as you're recounting it, you know, 01:54:12.020 --> 01:54:13.479 you can imagine, especially she's probably wearing 01:54:13.479 --> 01:54:15.760 heels or something as well. And she's trying 01:54:15.760 --> 01:54:17.979 to climb up into this section that they found 01:54:17.979 --> 01:54:21.239 in the ceiling. And she keeps falling. And she 01:54:21.239 --> 01:54:23.079 says, and you can almost see this, all these 01:54:23.079 --> 01:54:26.109 people waiting. to get up into this safe haven 01:54:26.109 --> 01:54:29.149 away from these murderers. And this one woman 01:54:29.149 --> 01:54:31.189 is big and she can't get up there. So immediately 01:54:31.189 --> 01:54:33.149 you think she's going to say, and then everyone 01:54:33.149 --> 01:54:34.609 pushed her out of the way and they went up themselves. 01:54:35.329 --> 01:54:38.189 But she said that the complete opposite, that 01:54:38.189 --> 01:54:40.149 the people were cheering her on and helping her 01:54:40.149 --> 01:54:42.010 get up there. And she got up there. And I thought 01:54:42.010 --> 01:54:44.569 that was an incredible moment of humanity because 01:54:44.569 --> 01:54:47.409 you would think the stampede selfishness effect 01:54:47.409 --> 01:54:49.510 would kick in, but it was the polar opposite. 01:54:50.970 --> 01:54:52.810 basically helped her emotionally and physically 01:54:52.810 --> 01:54:54.909 get in that hole before they got in themselves. 01:54:58.670 --> 01:55:04.149 I'm talking too much. You're the one who took 01:55:04.149 --> 01:55:11.170 the best. As you said, it's one of those moments 01:55:11.170 --> 01:55:15.949 where you expect the worst, but the best happened. 01:55:17.340 --> 01:55:21.340 Yeah, this lady who's here with her husband and 01:55:21.340 --> 01:55:26.930 they've drove on the same day hours. on their 01:55:26.930 --> 01:55:30.590 their small cars coming from the north of france 01:55:30.590 --> 01:55:35.810 to listen to one of their best uh rock band and 01:55:35.810 --> 01:55:39.569 uh here they are finally and uh they they the 01:55:39.569 --> 01:55:44.489 two the two kids are at home uh the babysitter 01:55:44.489 --> 01:55:47.069 is is taking care they finally have the evening 01:55:47.069 --> 01:55:50.750 for themselves that they go to to paris and and 01:55:50.750 --> 01:55:52.630 they know they're going to have a great time 01:55:54.760 --> 01:55:57.140 And the next thing they know, yeah, you have 01:55:57.140 --> 01:56:01.239 three terrorists shooting at each other, at everybody 01:56:01.239 --> 01:56:07.680 around them. And the wound of an AK -47 is horrible. 01:56:08.760 --> 01:56:15.079 So they arrive along with maybe 20, 30 people 01:56:15.079 --> 01:56:18.960 in a tiny little room. They try to lock the door, 01:56:18.979 --> 01:56:22.520 but it doesn't really lock. They are in this 01:56:23.050 --> 01:56:26.170 room where they don't know what to do. There 01:56:26.170 --> 01:56:31.930 is no windows, no escape route. Behind the doors, 01:56:31.930 --> 01:56:36.970 they still hear the gunfires. And suddenly someone 01:56:36.970 --> 01:56:42.729 says, there is a hole through the toilet ceiling, 01:56:42.909 --> 01:56:48.250 which is a small area in the back. And so little 01:56:48.250 --> 01:56:51.500 by little, people are... are getting up there. 01:56:51.699 --> 01:56:54.279 And to get up there, you have to put one foot 01:56:54.279 --> 01:56:57.779 on the toilet, then the second foot on maybe 01:56:57.779 --> 01:57:02.640 the area where you put the toilet paper. Anyway, 01:57:02.859 --> 01:57:06.560 it's not that easy. But come the turn of this 01:57:06.560 --> 01:57:10.520 woman, and as you said, she's... She's kind of, 01:57:10.520 --> 01:57:13.939 yeah, she's obese and it's very hard for her. 01:57:14.020 --> 01:57:17.739 The first time a foot goes through the toilet, 01:57:17.840 --> 01:57:22.810 the second time she falls on her husband. And 01:57:22.810 --> 01:57:25.989 and yet at that time, they're looking at each 01:57:25.989 --> 01:57:29.409 other. She's she's feeling so guilty that every 01:57:29.409 --> 01:57:34.510 second she she's wasting, you know, the terrorists 01:57:34.510 --> 01:57:37.810 are going to open the door and kill everybody 01:57:37.810 --> 01:57:41.020 and it will be her fault. But no, the people 01:57:41.020 --> 01:57:44.600 behind her who's making a line are cheering her 01:57:44.600 --> 01:57:49.100 and saying, you can do it. And finally, she managed 01:57:49.100 --> 01:57:52.460 to do it with maybe, I think, a foot on her husband's 01:57:52.460 --> 01:57:56.479 head and her other foot. Someone is helping her 01:57:56.479 --> 01:57:59.779 with their hands. And the next thing they know, 01:57:59.859 --> 01:58:03.260 all those people are in this kind of strange 01:58:03.260 --> 01:58:08.319 place between the roof and this. and the ceiling 01:58:08.319 --> 01:58:12.600 and they are safe or at least they think and 01:58:12.600 --> 01:58:17.260 they hear the sound of the guns all over and 01:58:17.260 --> 01:58:22.739 they don't know that for the next two hours they 01:58:22.739 --> 01:58:27.600 are finding refuge exactly on the ceiling above 01:58:27.600 --> 01:58:37.279 where the venue is, where the stage is. pretending 01:58:37.279 --> 01:58:42.300 to be dead among tens who are actually dead. 01:58:42.920 --> 01:58:49.500 Everybody is lying down. And that's the scene 01:58:49.500 --> 01:58:58.399 of hell that was the Bataclan. And it was such 01:58:58.399 --> 01:59:00.300 a powerful moment. I think the other one, there's 01:59:00.300 --> 01:59:01.380 one more thing I want to talk about and then 01:59:01.380 --> 01:59:03.960 we'll go to Notre Dame because I know we're almost 01:59:03.960 --> 01:59:09.130 at two hours now. The other thing I think was 01:59:09.130 --> 01:59:12.810 very haunting was one of the women had the realization 01:59:12.810 --> 01:59:17.750 that three terrorists commanded the action of 01:59:17.750 --> 01:59:22.149 1 ,500 men and women. And there was that realization 01:59:22.149 --> 01:59:26.350 of, you know, I think, but ultimately, what if 01:59:26.350 --> 01:59:28.529 we had rushed them? What if we had gone? Then, 01:59:28.649 --> 01:59:30.130 you know, some of us would have been killed, 01:59:30.149 --> 01:59:32.529 but the rest would have been saved. But I think 01:59:32.529 --> 01:59:35.210 it was a very... powerful lens into the fact 01:59:35.210 --> 01:59:37.770 that fear can paralyze us you know and obviously 01:59:37.770 --> 01:59:39.750 i'm sure they seemed like there was more than 01:59:39.750 --> 01:59:42.250 three of them too with all the you know the horrendous 01:59:42.250 --> 01:59:46.130 executions that were going on but i'm sure that's 01:59:46.130 --> 01:59:47.609 something that's going to haunt her to the day 01:59:47.609 --> 01:59:50.949 again you could see it in her face that so many 01:59:50.949 --> 01:59:52.970 people were killed is it 130 i think that day 01:59:52.970 --> 01:59:56.229 in the end wasn't it in paris altogether it was 01:59:56.229 --> 02:00:02.220 190 190 oh i got that wrong okay 139 90 at the 02:00:02.220 --> 02:00:06.239 beta clone and but it's 130 I apologize okay 02:00:06.239 --> 02:00:10.420 yeah so I mean you know a huge amount but I mean 02:00:10.420 --> 02:00:13.779 again easier said than done any one of us would 02:00:13.779 --> 02:00:16.479 probably would have been trying to find our void 02:00:16.479 --> 02:00:18.399 space in the ceiling somewhere to get away as 02:00:18.399 --> 02:00:21.020 well but that was a powerful moment that how 02:00:21.020 --> 02:00:24.920 you know again how a weapon can completely offset 02:00:24.920 --> 02:00:29.000 the quote -unquote fair fight and put you know, 02:00:29.020 --> 02:00:31.539 innocent civilians and make them so vulnerable. 02:00:31.640 --> 02:00:33.220 I mean, I just had people from the pulse attacks 02:00:33.220 --> 02:00:36.399 on a few weeks ago, same exact thing. So just 02:00:36.399 --> 02:00:38.039 to kind of put it out, I thought that was a very 02:00:38.039 --> 02:00:41.300 powerful moment as well. Yeah, because I think 02:00:41.300 --> 02:00:43.720 that's where you see really the, it talks to 02:00:43.720 --> 02:00:47.340 the helplessness of it. And when she says in 02:00:47.340 --> 02:00:49.899 her interview, it's really, I can't believe that 02:00:49.899 --> 02:00:51.920 three jackass, because I think that's what she 02:00:51.920 --> 02:00:56.350 is, are... You know, we're 1500 and we're at 02:00:56.350 --> 02:00:59.310 the mercy of three jackasses with guns. And it's 02:00:59.310 --> 02:01:01.649 yes, it's the power of fear and terror, because 02:01:01.649 --> 02:01:04.130 this is the point of terrorism is terrorizing 02:01:04.130 --> 02:01:07.949 people and making them flee and making them full 02:01:07.949 --> 02:01:11.350 of fear and paralyzing them. But yet, as we see 02:01:11.350 --> 02:01:15.630 that, we see the country is, you know, I think 02:01:15.630 --> 02:01:21.319 this documentary is in a way a perfect. a few 02:01:21.319 --> 02:01:24.659 to terrorism because I think the contrary happened. 02:01:24.840 --> 02:01:27.500 At the moment where they wanted to terrorize 02:01:27.500 --> 02:01:30.500 us and paralyze us, that's where you saw the 02:01:30.500 --> 02:01:37.100 most incredible moments of courage, of compassion, 02:01:37.619 --> 02:01:40.149 of love. in the middle of that horror and hate. 02:01:40.289 --> 02:01:45.729 And that's, I think, is really what really prevailed. 02:01:45.890 --> 02:01:48.210 And that's what we should hang on to. I think 02:01:48.210 --> 02:01:50.010 we've always, and Julien was talking about that 02:01:50.010 --> 02:01:52.069 at the beginning, the way these people behave, 02:01:52.170 --> 02:01:55.569 I think, is really for us kind of a vaccine against 02:01:55.569 --> 02:02:01.739 depression, against that. you know, that thinking 02:02:01.739 --> 02:02:04.399 of, of, of everything, the world is such a horrible 02:02:04.399 --> 02:02:06.899 place because when you hear the, the, the radio 02:02:06.899 --> 02:02:09.359 or the television, you know, it's not very, but 02:02:09.359 --> 02:02:12.920 when you see that at moments like this, you know, 02:02:12.939 --> 02:02:15.739 people can be so beautiful, so amazing. I think 02:02:15.739 --> 02:02:18.300 that's, you need that, you need that, that kind 02:02:18.300 --> 02:02:20.319 of little shot in the arm that says, okay, you 02:02:20.319 --> 02:02:22.460 know, if they could do it, of course I can, or 02:02:22.460 --> 02:02:25.920 I need to try. Absolutely. Well, just one more 02:02:25.920 --> 02:02:27.340 element of that, and then I want to move on to 02:02:27.340 --> 02:02:29.159 Notre Dame. I'm going to be mindful of your time. 02:02:29.420 --> 02:02:31.760 I think the other very powerful thing, and again, 02:02:31.859 --> 02:02:35.460 for the responders listening, I mean, I did my 02:02:35.460 --> 02:02:37.680 best to become the best version of me. Was I 02:02:37.680 --> 02:02:40.659 perfect? No. Was I the best firefighter, paramedic? 02:02:40.659 --> 02:02:42.560 No. But I mean, I think that's something we all 02:02:42.560 --> 02:02:45.479 push towards. But I think it's very important 02:02:45.479 --> 02:02:48.159 to highlight that when the SWAT team actually 02:02:48.159 --> 02:02:51.800 made entry, Two terrorists with semi -automatic 02:02:51.800 --> 02:02:55.279 weapons that had bomb vests around them. It took 02:02:55.279 --> 02:02:58.859 them one minute and six seconds to neutralize 02:02:58.859 --> 02:03:02.439 the threat in a narrow hallway with hostages. 02:03:02.560 --> 02:03:05.619 So I don't think there's any better illustration 02:03:05.619 --> 02:03:08.479 of you are the sum of all your training up to 02:03:08.479 --> 02:03:10.800 that point, whether it's an organization with 02:03:10.800 --> 02:03:13.720 this individual, that that could have ended with 02:03:13.720 --> 02:03:17.069 a failure. Lots of dead hostages and police officers 02:03:17.069 --> 02:03:19.489 and maybe a further rampage because they just 02:03:19.489 --> 02:03:21.270 killed all the cops that came and so they could 02:03:21.270 --> 02:03:24.090 go back in and do some more. So what was your 02:03:24.090 --> 02:03:28.189 perspective on that? I think the SWAT team commander, 02:03:28.409 --> 02:03:31.430 which is a fantastic human being, who had the 02:03:31.430 --> 02:03:34.029 words that, you know, at the kosher supermarket 02:03:34.029 --> 02:03:37.090 earlier in January, who had been with his SWAT 02:03:37.090 --> 02:03:40.329 team there after the Charlie Hebdo attacks. And 02:03:40.329 --> 02:03:42.369 here he's faced with an impossible situation, 02:03:42.569 --> 02:03:45.569 which he says actually to the chief of police 02:03:45.569 --> 02:03:48.689 who asked him, are we going to be OK when you 02:03:48.689 --> 02:03:52.449 breach? And the commander of the SWAT says, you 02:03:52.449 --> 02:03:54.350 know, stupidly, I told him the truth. I said, 02:03:54.390 --> 02:03:56.710 no, it's not going to be OK because we're in 02:03:56.710 --> 02:03:59.329 a narrow hallway. We have 11 hostages. We have 02:03:59.329 --> 02:04:02.850 two guys with AK -47s and suicide vests. And 02:04:02.850 --> 02:04:05.229 I'm going to lose probably half of my guys and 02:04:05.229 --> 02:04:09.189 half of the hostages. But we have no other choice. 02:04:09.270 --> 02:04:11.630 We have to do it. And we're willing to take this. 02:04:11.829 --> 02:04:15.449 And when the commander is about to breach, he 02:04:15.449 --> 02:04:17.470 actually does something that he never does before. 02:04:17.689 --> 02:04:20.310 He checks in with his men and said, are you guys 02:04:20.310 --> 02:04:23.710 OK with it? He's their superior. He doesn't have 02:04:23.710 --> 02:04:25.689 to ask them whether they feel OK about the mission 02:04:25.689 --> 02:04:28.189 or not. But he wanted to make sure they realized 02:04:28.189 --> 02:04:30.090 what they were about to do. And all of them to 02:04:30.090 --> 02:04:33.189 a T were saying, of course, let's go in. We know 02:04:33.189 --> 02:04:36.270 we know the risk. Let's do it. And to see that. 02:04:36.840 --> 02:04:39.960 Again, that time distortion, when the hostages 02:04:39.960 --> 02:04:42.899 talk about that breach, for them it lasts half 02:04:42.899 --> 02:04:47.399 an hour. But we found the tape of it, and it's 02:04:47.399 --> 02:04:52.140 a minute and six seconds where the guys are emptying 02:04:52.140 --> 02:04:58.460 clips of AK -47s into a giant shield that protects 02:04:58.460 --> 02:05:03.039 the SWAT teams. And as a result of that, after 02:05:03.039 --> 02:05:05.880 that one minute and six seconds, the two terrorists 02:05:05.880 --> 02:05:10.279 will be dead. One, by detonating, is a suicide 02:05:10.279 --> 02:05:13.659 vest. The other will be shot before he could 02:05:13.659 --> 02:05:19.800 do so. There's not a single cop who's... There 02:05:19.800 --> 02:05:22.460 is one cop who's hurt with a bullet to the hand, 02:05:22.560 --> 02:05:26.119 but that's it. And none of the hostages are hit. 02:05:26.680 --> 02:05:29.960 So it is almost like a miracle operation because 02:05:29.960 --> 02:05:32.819 technically half of them should have died. So 02:05:32.819 --> 02:05:39.079 the courage of these incredible SWAT members, 02:05:39.239 --> 02:05:43.199 which I'm close to some of them and I really 02:05:43.199 --> 02:05:45.859 admire them the same way I admire the firefighters. 02:05:46.159 --> 02:05:48.560 They were incredible that night. And it's people 02:05:48.560 --> 02:05:50.720 who are willing to put their lives on the line 02:05:50.720 --> 02:05:58.739 for all of us. that command our respect and for 02:05:58.739 --> 02:06:01.760 us to be grateful. Beautiful. Well, Jedion, I 02:06:01.760 --> 02:06:03.619 know you've got to go soon. So before you do, 02:06:03.659 --> 02:06:05.180 I want to get you in one more time. And I'm sorry 02:06:05.180 --> 02:06:06.659 that we've gone so far. I know you've got to 02:06:06.659 --> 02:06:09.960 pick up your kid. Just quickly, so tell me about 02:06:09.960 --> 02:06:14.180 Notre Dame. I was actually in Paris in 2016, 02:06:14.399 --> 02:06:17.319 so a year after the attacks, but before the fire. 02:06:17.439 --> 02:06:19.079 So we've literally got pictures outside Notre 02:06:19.079 --> 02:06:24.100 Dame. So again, as Parisians, tell me about that 02:06:24.100 --> 02:06:27.000 event and what made you want to do another documentary 02:06:27.000 --> 02:06:34.479 on them. Like many people around the world, we 02:06:34.479 --> 02:06:45.020 watch on TV or on a computer screen this monument, 02:06:45.260 --> 02:06:48.859 you know, slightly, I mean, completely disappearing 02:06:48.859 --> 02:06:53.840 before our eyes. And it was not just any monument. 02:06:54.000 --> 02:06:58.000 It was Notre Dame de Paris. It was the cathedral 02:06:58.000 --> 02:07:02.920 of... of Notre Dame. It was this place where 02:07:02.920 --> 02:07:05.560 everybody who has been lucky enough to travel 02:07:05.560 --> 02:07:10.380 to Paris had seen it and maybe visited inside. 02:07:10.939 --> 02:07:17.260 It was this homage to what human being can do 02:07:17.260 --> 02:07:24.020 that is so beautiful that is, whether you're 02:07:24.020 --> 02:07:27.359 a believer or not, it didn't matter. It was It 02:07:27.359 --> 02:07:30.899 was a beautiful piece of culture, of architecture. 02:07:31.140 --> 02:07:35.899 It represented so much. It was built over 800 02:07:35.899 --> 02:07:42.100 years ago at a time where it was just insane 02:07:42.100 --> 02:07:47.319 to conceptualize how to build something so monumental 02:07:47.319 --> 02:07:52.539 that would stand time. There was revolutions. 02:07:52.640 --> 02:07:58.619 There was... kings and emperors and government 02:07:58.619 --> 02:08:07.359 that tried to destroy it. Time alone was not, 02:08:07.420 --> 02:08:15.539 you know, nice to this beautiful place. somehow 02:08:15.539 --> 02:08:23.180 it's with all the crisis of time. And so it's 02:08:23.180 --> 02:08:28.260 one of those monuments where you're alive and 02:08:28.260 --> 02:08:30.619 wherever you are in the world, you're thinking, 02:08:30.760 --> 02:08:34.739 okay, everything is going bad. You switch on 02:08:34.739 --> 02:08:40.220 TV, you listen to your podcast, your radio, the 02:08:40.220 --> 02:08:43.680 world is going mad. But at least... You can be 02:08:43.680 --> 02:08:45.819 pretty sure there are some monuments in the world, 02:08:45.939 --> 02:08:49.319 some things that are really standing and that 02:08:49.319 --> 02:08:53.960 will be standing for the rest of time. And Notre 02:08:53.960 --> 02:08:56.260 Dame de Paris, for everything that it represented, 02:08:56.720 --> 02:09:00.939 was one of those monuments. You know, the Pyramid 02:09:00.939 --> 02:09:05.640 of Egypt, anything you can think of that just 02:09:05.640 --> 02:09:10.670 huge, the seven beauties of the world. But here 02:09:10.670 --> 02:09:14.449 it was being destroyed in front of you. I mean, 02:09:14.489 --> 02:09:20.090 this thing that was making your life more grounded 02:09:20.090 --> 02:09:26.569 suddenly was disappearing in smoke. And so Jules 02:09:26.569 --> 02:09:29.409 and I, yeah, we lived it live like most people 02:09:29.409 --> 02:09:32.970 and we're so relieved when we discovered that. 02:09:33.710 --> 02:09:37.670 the fire department of paris had managed to to 02:09:37.670 --> 02:09:42.850 save the notre dame and uh and of course we thought 02:09:42.850 --> 02:09:46.550 you know uh there gotta be more to it than just 02:09:46.550 --> 02:09:51.090 guys and and girls coming in and and putting 02:09:51.090 --> 02:09:54.869 water on on it and and and that's when we discovered 02:09:54.869 --> 02:10:01.279 uh again thanks to chief pfeiffer that um and 02:10:01.279 --> 02:10:07.640 Jules' relations with the French fire department, 02:10:07.800 --> 02:10:12.899 that the rescue of Notre Dame was nothing but 02:10:12.899 --> 02:10:16.760 easy. That Notre Dame should have been destroyed 02:10:16.760 --> 02:10:21.539 ten times that evening. And if it was not for 02:10:21.539 --> 02:10:27.319 the absolute abnegation and sacrifice of the 02:10:27.319 --> 02:10:32.949 firefighters, stories that were not told, stories 02:10:32.949 --> 02:10:37.630 that people of Paris and France didn't know about. 02:10:38.649 --> 02:10:41.890 Yeah, it would be Paris without Notre Dame, which 02:10:41.890 --> 02:10:43.949 is something insane to think about. It's like 02:10:43.949 --> 02:10:54.029 Egypt without the pyramids. And so we started 02:10:54.029 --> 02:10:58.789 to... to talk to the firefighters and and discovered 02:10:58.789 --> 02:11:02.310 that what they had gone through what they were 02:11:02.310 --> 02:11:06.390 what they thought was was just insane and um 02:11:06.390 --> 02:11:10.710 and juju so please uh please go i think i'm so 02:11:10.710 --> 02:11:13.449 sorry i i have to run no please thank you so 02:11:13.449 --> 02:11:16.029 much you've been so generous with your time it 02:11:16.029 --> 02:11:19.350 was a great honor to uh to to to be on your show 02:11:19.350 --> 02:11:24.840 uh your show is amazing thank you so much Jules, 02:11:24.840 --> 02:11:29.520 forgive me, I have to talk to the kids. Merci 02:11:29.520 --> 02:11:32.640 beaucoup. I'll panel your answers. I'll have 02:11:32.640 --> 02:11:34.340 to do a thicker French accent, but I think I 02:11:34.340 --> 02:11:40.600 can. We'll just pretend to be both. No, but it 02:11:40.600 --> 02:11:45.380 was really that, as Julien said. The relationship 02:11:45.380 --> 02:11:50.239 we had already created with the head of the fire 02:11:50.239 --> 02:11:52.649 department, which I changed. it was not the same 02:11:52.649 --> 02:11:56.170 from um november 13 but it was his deputy which 02:11:56.170 --> 02:11:59.750 i had got to know a lot of Paris firefighters 02:11:59.750 --> 02:12:03.010 and SWAT teams from Paris did a lot of trips 02:12:03.010 --> 02:12:08.189 coming to New York and that I would greet them 02:12:08.189 --> 02:12:10.029 when they would arrive with Chief Pfeiffer and 02:12:10.029 --> 02:12:11.609 there were lots of exchanges that we've done 02:12:11.609 --> 02:12:13.710 over the years and so we have a great relationship 02:12:13.710 --> 02:12:18.770 with these people and I called the chief of the 02:12:18.770 --> 02:12:24.329 fire department in Paris a couple of weeks after 02:12:24.329 --> 02:12:26.949 to tell him that we're We're all so proud. We're 02:12:26.949 --> 02:12:28.989 all watching and in awe of what you guys did. 02:12:29.109 --> 02:12:31.109 And he said, you know, you have so many incredible 02:12:31.109 --> 02:12:33.050 stories. You know, I think you should maybe do 02:12:33.050 --> 02:12:36.189 a documentary about it. So I went to Paris to 02:12:36.189 --> 02:12:40.090 meet with him and discovered. Once again, you 02:12:40.090 --> 02:12:44.649 know, this incredible courage, not only of the 02:12:44.649 --> 02:12:47.449 firefighters, but of the civilians that came 02:12:47.449 --> 02:12:49.470 to help, the people who work in the church who 02:12:49.470 --> 02:12:51.829 came to work, the people who were working on 02:12:51.829 --> 02:12:56.939 the scaffolding that came to help also. Also, 02:12:57.039 --> 02:12:59.340 that comedy of error, that humor that we were 02:12:59.340 --> 02:13:01.600 talking about on November 13, that is almost 02:13:01.600 --> 02:13:04.640 there. That kind of, another kind of, you have 02:13:04.640 --> 02:13:06.979 the impression, a cyanide -like sketch of when 02:13:06.979 --> 02:13:10.880 they go to try to retrieve the Crown of Thorn, 02:13:10.979 --> 02:13:12.500 because the Crown of Thorn is supposed to be 02:13:12.500 --> 02:13:18.039 in a safe at Notre Dame. Except that, you know, 02:13:18.060 --> 02:13:20.859 so you have to imagine, this building, the entire 02:13:20.859 --> 02:13:24.500 roof is on fire, and firefighters are on teams 02:13:24.500 --> 02:13:27.789 working on all the facade. up down on the right 02:13:27.789 --> 02:13:29.970 on the left in the north in the south and one 02:13:29.970 --> 02:13:33.970 team in particular is in is in charge of saving 02:13:33.970 --> 02:13:37.829 the artwork and and all of the relics because 02:13:37.829 --> 02:13:41.909 there is actually a department in a special department 02:13:41.909 --> 02:13:44.270 in the fire department that takes firefighters 02:13:44.270 --> 02:13:48.869 in charge of saving um works of arts who operate 02:13:48.869 --> 02:13:51.109 in museums and all that because it is something 02:13:51.109 --> 02:13:52.829 that you have to think about you know Don't go 02:13:52.829 --> 02:13:56.590 put water on a Leonardo da Vinci or something 02:13:56.590 --> 02:14:00.170 like that on a painting. And so, you know, here 02:14:00.170 --> 02:14:02.189 are these firefighters who at first, you know, 02:14:02.229 --> 02:14:04.210 were so excited. Oh, great. I'm going to go fight 02:14:04.210 --> 02:14:06.710 the fire on Notre Dame because it's firefighters 02:14:06.710 --> 02:14:09.189 and firefighters. You have that amazing duality 02:14:09.189 --> 02:14:11.810 where you don't want bad things to happen. But 02:14:11.810 --> 02:14:13.630 if there is a big fire, you want to be the one 02:14:13.630 --> 02:14:18.909 who is the first due and we'll get to it. He 02:14:18.909 --> 02:14:21.069 arrives. Oh, great. I'm going to be able to go 02:14:21.069 --> 02:14:23.010 up there, go close to the fire. I'll be with 02:14:23.010 --> 02:14:24.810 the nozzle. It'll be amazing and all that. And 02:14:24.810 --> 02:14:26.409 the chief said, well, I'm sorry, but you need 02:14:26.409 --> 02:14:28.710 to go and find the crown of thorn and all that. 02:14:28.729 --> 02:14:31.090 OK, I'm not very religious, but OK, let's go 02:14:31.090 --> 02:14:33.949 find it. And comes that committee of error where 02:14:33.949 --> 02:14:35.810 they have to look for a safe. They look everywhere. 02:14:35.930 --> 02:14:37.770 As he says, he looks behind paintings. He looks 02:14:37.770 --> 02:14:39.649 on the floors. He moves everything while the 02:14:39.649 --> 02:14:43.590 roof is on fire and lead is melting and is falling 02:14:43.590 --> 02:14:47.210 like a cascade of lava in the middle. And so 02:14:47.210 --> 02:14:48.649 they have to be careful that it doesn't fall 02:14:48.649 --> 02:14:52.630 on them. They finally found the safe, break the 02:14:52.630 --> 02:14:56.250 safe, come out triumphantly with the crown of 02:14:56.250 --> 02:14:57.689 thorns. And as he says, you know, I'm carrying 02:14:57.689 --> 02:15:00.409 really the top like this because I don't want 02:15:00.409 --> 02:15:02.390 to break it. I don't want to break the thorns 02:15:02.390 --> 02:15:03.850 because, you know, a crown of thorns without 02:15:03.850 --> 02:15:06.930 thorns, I'll get into trouble. So he comes in 02:15:06.930 --> 02:15:09.529 and out. And here comes the curator of Notre 02:15:09.529 --> 02:15:13.510 Dame who said. And here we see this amazing firefighter 02:15:13.510 --> 02:15:15.710 so proud to come. And unfortunately, we have 02:15:15.710 --> 02:15:17.189 to tell him it's not the right one. That's the 02:15:17.189 --> 02:15:19.689 display one. And they go back into another treasure 02:15:19.689 --> 02:15:23.430 hunt to try to find it. So it's what we wanted 02:15:23.430 --> 02:15:27.350 to show in most of our program. Reality is messy, 02:15:27.550 --> 02:15:31.899 is beautiful, is funny, is dramatic. That's the 02:15:31.899 --> 02:15:34.659 beauty of human nature. You can overcome everything 02:15:34.659 --> 02:15:38.000 with humor and with love. And so here, to see 02:15:38.000 --> 02:15:40.859 these incredible firefighters who, what we didn't 02:15:40.859 --> 02:15:43.899 realize at the time, you know, a few of them 02:15:43.899 --> 02:15:47.800 decide to go up and are sent in a suicide mission, 02:15:47.899 --> 02:15:52.199 in a way. There is no one, no civilians anymore 02:15:52.199 --> 02:15:55.100 in Notre Dame. The church has been, the cathedral 02:15:55.100 --> 02:15:59.500 has been evacuated. the two towers, which holds 02:15:59.500 --> 02:16:02.600 the bells, the bells are weights about eight 02:16:02.600 --> 02:16:05.119 to 10 tons each, and there's about 10 of them. 02:16:05.640 --> 02:16:08.460 And they realized that inside of these towers, 02:16:08.640 --> 02:16:11.220 the frame that holds the bell is all made out 02:16:11.220 --> 02:16:14.979 of wood, and it's starting to catch fire, which 02:16:14.979 --> 02:16:17.140 means that at some point, the beams are going 02:16:17.140 --> 02:16:20.380 to collapse, the bells are going to come crashing 02:16:20.380 --> 02:16:23.000 down, and you'll have a domino effect and the 02:16:23.000 --> 02:16:25.140 entire cathedral is going to implode into itself. 02:16:25.699 --> 02:16:29.600 And here is the Head of the fire department who 02:16:29.600 --> 02:16:32.700 is faced with two choices. One, he does nothing, 02:16:32.780 --> 02:16:36.239 pulls everybody out, let the building collapse. 02:16:36.459 --> 02:16:39.479 The world will lose one of these most beautiful 02:16:39.479 --> 02:16:44.299 icons of architecture and faith and art. But, 02:16:44.399 --> 02:16:47.299 you know, no one will take place. Or you send 02:16:47.299 --> 02:16:50.639 a commando that. knowing that you have about 02:16:50.639 --> 02:16:53.120 half an hour before the collapse, who have to 02:16:53.120 --> 02:16:57.899 try to put water on the beams that are holding 02:16:57.899 --> 02:17:01.379 the bells and save the entire edifice at the 02:17:01.379 --> 02:17:06.799 cost of their lives. And the chief of the fire 02:17:06.799 --> 02:17:08.940 department goes and talks to the French president, 02:17:09.219 --> 02:17:13.360 explained to him the choices, and the president 02:17:13.360 --> 02:17:17.590 said, go for it. You have a commando of about 02:17:17.590 --> 02:17:20.430 10 firefighters who go up and will fight their 02:17:20.430 --> 02:17:22.909 way inside of the tower, fight their way up the 02:17:22.909 --> 02:17:27.149 stairs, and will actually extinguish the fire 02:17:27.149 --> 02:17:29.350 probably five minutes, service five minutes to 02:17:29.350 --> 02:17:31.610 spare. But within these five minutes, it could 02:17:31.610 --> 02:17:33.549 have been the end of all these firefighters and 02:17:33.549 --> 02:17:37.590 that amazing monument. So you have all of these 02:17:37.590 --> 02:17:41.610 incredible. And what I love is these firefighters, 02:17:41.850 --> 02:17:45.799 like all firefighters, took. in such beautiful 02:17:45.799 --> 02:17:49.020 terms. It's not fancy. It's not, you know, they 02:17:49.020 --> 02:17:54.139 don't have degrees in artistic writing and all 02:17:54.139 --> 02:17:56.590 that. But it comes from the heart and it's quite 02:17:56.590 --> 02:17:59.469 profound and it's quite moving when they talk 02:17:59.469 --> 02:18:03.690 about their love for their fellow firefighters, 02:18:04.030 --> 02:18:05.469 for their love for their job, their love for 02:18:05.469 --> 02:18:08.950 Paris, their love for what they are going to 02:18:08.950 --> 02:18:12.829 do. And it's simple and it's touching. And once 02:18:12.829 --> 02:18:15.989 again, inspires us because that's what we always 02:18:15.989 --> 02:18:18.670 want. We're a group of firefighters, so every 02:18:18.670 --> 02:18:21.979 time we can praise them, we'll do it. But these 02:18:21.979 --> 02:18:25.059 are, you know, these amazing heroes and reminds 02:18:25.059 --> 02:18:28.219 us of a moment where we think everything can 02:18:28.219 --> 02:18:32.440 be over. Well, not always. You still have that 02:18:32.440 --> 02:18:36.239 glimmer, that spark of hope is in all of us. 02:18:36.280 --> 02:18:39.120 And that's what we have to remind people, especially 02:18:39.120 --> 02:18:41.520 this year, or at least this year, I should say. 02:18:42.399 --> 02:18:44.520 Yeah, well, I mean, absolutely. And I think that's 02:18:44.520 --> 02:18:47.600 what I saw, again, as a fireman. So understanding. 02:18:48.329 --> 02:18:50.649 the logistics the actual dangers of what they 02:18:50.649 --> 02:18:52.649 did and even just the fact they even had water 02:18:52.649 --> 02:18:55.090 so far up you know having to go through all these 02:18:55.090 --> 02:18:57.290 like ancient stairwells i'm amazed they even 02:18:57.290 --> 02:18:58.930 managed to get a water supply in the first place 02:18:58.930 --> 02:19:04.370 but to to have to be standing under wooden structures 02:19:04.370 --> 02:19:07.209 that are holding bells of that size they knew 02:19:07.209 --> 02:19:10.270 if if if one of those broke that was it they 02:19:10.270 --> 02:19:12.170 were all going to get you know taken down with 02:19:12.170 --> 02:19:14.870 the bell and obviously killed immediately but 02:19:14.870 --> 02:19:17.930 but again and you you know that firsthand When 02:19:17.930 --> 02:19:19.389 you're a firefighter, you don't think about that. 02:19:19.450 --> 02:19:20.809 You think about it. It's in the back of your 02:19:20.809 --> 02:19:22.709 head because that's what makes you a good firefighter. 02:19:22.750 --> 02:19:24.569 You're not oblivious to the danger. You are aware 02:19:24.569 --> 02:19:26.309 of the danger and you take into consideration. 02:19:27.209 --> 02:19:29.649 But you know why you're here. And at the same 02:19:29.649 --> 02:19:32.770 time, you know, it's the best feeling in the 02:19:32.770 --> 02:19:35.290 world as you go into a firehouse after a good 02:19:35.290 --> 02:19:38.409 job. There's smiles all around and it smells 02:19:38.409 --> 02:19:42.209 like a fireplace on their bunker gear and everyone 02:19:42.209 --> 02:19:43.969 is happy because they've done a good job or they 02:19:43.969 --> 02:19:47.969 save people. That's the best reward. is helping 02:19:47.969 --> 02:19:49.989 out someone at the end of the day absolutely 02:19:49.989 --> 02:19:52.149 well a couple things i want to touch on that 02:19:52.149 --> 02:19:56.790 one um so firstly just like tony you had a rookie 02:19:56.790 --> 02:19:59.569 but this time it was a female firefighter who 02:19:59.569 --> 02:20:02.489 had not seen fire until this point. She's been 02:20:02.489 --> 02:20:04.950 on for two weeks. She's on, you have to think, 02:20:05.149 --> 02:20:09.870 a woman firefighter, young, fantastic, lots of 02:20:09.870 --> 02:20:12.090 courage, lots of heart. She's been on the job 02:20:12.090 --> 02:20:13.729 for, I think, two weeks or two months, I don't 02:20:13.729 --> 02:20:17.290 remember. And her first job is actually at Notre 02:20:17.290 --> 02:20:19.010 Dame. She's first due, which means she's the 02:20:19.010 --> 02:20:22.069 first truck to arrive. They go up all the way 02:20:22.069 --> 02:20:25.670 to the inside of the roof. And there is a little 02:20:25.670 --> 02:20:28.370 door that comes into the roof. It's full of smoke. 02:20:28.629 --> 02:20:31.090 The fire has started probably half an hour ago. 02:20:31.489 --> 02:20:33.670 They go in, doesn't see anything. She goes with 02:20:33.670 --> 02:20:39.090 her officer. They're attached to a rope and they 02:20:39.090 --> 02:20:41.010 go up. They don't see anything. And it's getting 02:20:41.010 --> 02:20:43.790 warmer and warmer and warmer. And she's never 02:20:43.790 --> 02:20:45.549 been to a fire. So she says, OK, it's getting 02:20:45.549 --> 02:20:47.489 hot, but I don't want to say anything because, 02:20:47.590 --> 02:20:50.350 you know, I don't know if I'm supposed to say 02:20:50.350 --> 02:20:52.110 anything. And, you know, I want to do a good 02:20:52.110 --> 02:20:55.829 job. And at some point, her officer turns around 02:20:55.829 --> 02:20:58.229 and says, let's go out. It's too hot. And indeed, 02:20:58.270 --> 02:21:01.010 when they come out, they start to see that all 02:21:01.010 --> 02:21:04.129 of their bunker gear is almost like shining in 02:21:04.129 --> 02:21:09.610 a metallic way. It's because the lead, the outside 02:21:09.610 --> 02:21:13.829 of the roof is all lead sheets, was melting and 02:21:13.829 --> 02:21:18.510 was melting on them in pools of molten lava, 02:21:18.670 --> 02:21:20.709 in a way, and was starting to burn them. And 02:21:20.709 --> 02:21:23.860 their helmets started to melt. it was so hot 02:21:23.860 --> 02:21:27.239 and here she is that's her first fire and she 02:21:27.239 --> 02:21:30.020 incredibly bravely goes in the middle of the 02:21:30.020 --> 02:21:33.120 fire itself and then would fight all night uh 02:21:33.120 --> 02:21:37.350 on this you know you always have And it's, you 02:21:37.350 --> 02:21:39.610 know, these little things of having another rookie 02:21:39.610 --> 02:21:43.049 there. I think for November 13, it ended up that 02:21:43.049 --> 02:21:45.489 there was a cameraman in one of the fire trucks 02:21:45.489 --> 02:21:48.430 and that was first due to one of the cafes. So 02:21:48.430 --> 02:21:50.889 you always have little, life is very strange 02:21:50.889 --> 02:21:53.569 and repeats itself. Yeah. Well, with the molten 02:21:53.569 --> 02:21:55.610 lead, I think one of the most powerful images 02:21:55.610 --> 02:21:58.969 was the gargoyle with the lead spilling out of 02:21:58.969 --> 02:22:01.610 his mouth. where normally it would be water. 02:22:01.809 --> 02:22:05.590 And here you have this, yes, molten lead being 02:22:05.590 --> 02:22:12.350 spitted out of the statues like this. It's quite 02:22:12.350 --> 02:22:15.170 an incredible sight. Very, very eerie. They all 02:22:15.170 --> 02:22:17.450 describe it as that eeriness, especially because, 02:22:17.590 --> 02:22:21.370 you know, it's whether you've seen Notre Dame 02:22:21.370 --> 02:22:24.750 in the Hunchback of Notre Dame on Disney with 02:22:24.750 --> 02:22:28.329 the Hunchback, you know, or you've seen the different 02:22:28.329 --> 02:22:31.129 movies. It represents, it's more than just a 02:22:31.129 --> 02:22:34.809 church. It evokes something, whether you're French, 02:22:34.850 --> 02:22:36.870 you're American, you're wherever, that it was 02:22:36.870 --> 02:22:38.909 more than a building. It is more than a building. 02:22:38.950 --> 02:22:42.850 Each stone has a little bit of part of our common 02:22:42.850 --> 02:22:45.510 humanity in all of us, because it belongs to 02:22:45.510 --> 02:22:47.430 the world, these kind of places. Yeah, and I'm 02:22:47.430 --> 02:22:50.590 assuming that the bells rang following Bastille. 02:22:50.590 --> 02:22:52.649 I mean, some very powerful moments in French 02:22:52.649 --> 02:22:58.610 history. Yes, they did. And they were after each 02:22:58.610 --> 02:23:02.870 world war. And it was an amazing moment when 02:23:02.870 --> 02:23:06.370 we discovered, you know, that part of Paris, 02:23:06.549 --> 02:23:09.010 it's on Ile de la Cité, which is one of the two 02:23:09.010 --> 02:23:11.969 islands right smack in the middle of Paris itself 02:23:11.969 --> 02:23:17.780 on the Seine River that traversed the town. And 02:23:17.780 --> 02:23:20.360 that little island is a little bit like it's 02:23:20.360 --> 02:23:22.659 a small village into itself. You know, they have 02:23:22.659 --> 02:23:25.360 their own kind of little culture. They kind of 02:23:25.360 --> 02:23:27.959 look at outsiders strangely and all that. And 02:23:27.959 --> 02:23:32.340 here they would talk about, you know, Notre Dame 02:23:32.340 --> 02:23:35.819 is almost the breathing, beating heart of that 02:23:35.819 --> 02:23:40.680 little village. They hear its sounds when the 02:23:40.680 --> 02:23:43.020 bells ring, when the – all that. And suddenly 02:23:43.020 --> 02:23:47.090 after the fire, the – that beautiful monument 02:23:47.090 --> 02:23:50.430 had gone silent, had gone mute. And they would 02:23:50.430 --> 02:23:53.790 describe it almost like a patient that had gone 02:23:53.790 --> 02:23:57.649 into a coma. And we're waiting for it to speak 02:23:57.649 --> 02:24:01.229 and wake up and breathe again. And a few months 02:24:01.229 --> 02:24:06.149 after the fire, the former French president died, 02:24:06.309 --> 02:24:08.489 Jacques Chirac, and it's customary to normally 02:24:08.489 --> 02:24:10.209 ring the bells. Except the bells, there's no 02:24:10.209 --> 02:24:12.370 more electricity. There's no more of that. Except 02:24:12.370 --> 02:24:16.350 that the people at Notre Dame decides to go up 02:24:16.350 --> 02:24:19.409 and ring the bell by hand, by attaching a rope 02:24:19.409 --> 02:24:23.809 to the knocker. All of us, because they invited 02:24:23.809 --> 02:24:26.889 me to come with them, were rolling for 45 minutes, 02:24:27.110 --> 02:24:30.069 rang the bells of Notre Dame, the biggest one, 02:24:30.149 --> 02:24:33.010 which is 13 tons, by hand, which was a surreal 02:24:33.010 --> 02:24:35.729 experience. And when we came back down, people 02:24:35.729 --> 02:24:39.270 stopped, the people that went up and said, you 02:24:39.270 --> 02:24:43.409 finally gave us back our beating heart. To hear 02:24:43.409 --> 02:24:46.610 her, it was like that comatose patient that woke 02:24:46.610 --> 02:24:49.319 up and said. I'm still alive. I'm still here. 02:24:49.579 --> 02:24:52.319 So it really represents, you have so many things 02:24:52.319 --> 02:24:55.579 that place represents for people of Paris, for 02:24:55.579 --> 02:24:58.299 people of the world, for people of France. Beautiful. 02:24:58.520 --> 02:25:00.620 Well, I think that's a perfect place to kind 02:25:00.620 --> 02:25:04.059 of end the conversation there. Some few closing 02:25:04.059 --> 02:25:05.680 questions I'd love to ask people. I'd love to 02:25:05.680 --> 02:25:09.520 get your mind as well. The first one is, is there 02:25:09.520 --> 02:25:12.540 a book that you love to recommend to people that 02:25:12.540 --> 02:25:14.280 can be related to what we've discussed today 02:25:14.280 --> 02:25:19.719 or something completely different? OK, I'll have 02:25:19.719 --> 02:25:22.440 to find it again. I remember one of the things 02:25:22.440 --> 02:25:25.059 and I think that corresponds to that. There was 02:25:25.059 --> 02:25:27.319 an amazing book that I had read extracts when 02:25:27.319 --> 02:25:30.459 I was in high school in France growing up that 02:25:30.459 --> 02:25:34.139 they they made you read. And it was I think it 02:25:34.139 --> 02:25:40.260 was the letters that were sent by the people 02:25:40.260 --> 02:25:46.760 that were put to before it. takes place during 02:25:46.760 --> 02:25:48.920 the Second World War in France, and it was the 02:25:48.920 --> 02:25:51.780 resistance fighters and their last letters before 02:25:51.780 --> 02:25:55.840 they were executed by the Germans. And in these, 02:25:56.059 --> 02:25:58.479 you found this incredibly touching letter, and 02:25:58.479 --> 02:26:00.579 I remember reading one in particular of a young 02:26:00.579 --> 02:26:04.840 16 -year -old boy who was about to be executed 02:26:04.840 --> 02:26:07.280 for being part of the resistance, and he was 02:26:07.280 --> 02:26:09.620 executed by the Nazis, writing a last letter 02:26:09.620 --> 02:26:12.719 to his mother, asking her not to cry because 02:26:12.719 --> 02:26:15.590 of what he had done, he had lived. And he had 02:26:15.590 --> 02:26:19.250 done it in a way to save people, to save life 02:26:19.250 --> 02:26:23.549 and to preserve freedom. And in these moments 02:26:23.549 --> 02:26:26.549 of selflessness, I've always been touched by 02:26:26.549 --> 02:26:29.129 that, by these people like firefighters, like 02:26:29.129 --> 02:26:31.770 police officers, like first responders who are 02:26:31.770 --> 02:26:35.190 willing to put their lives on the line. for the 02:26:35.190 --> 02:26:37.629 rest of us. And I always find that and that book 02:26:37.629 --> 02:26:40.010 that always struck me, I'll have to find it again 02:26:40.010 --> 02:26:42.450 and give it to you. But you put me on the spot. 02:26:42.670 --> 02:26:46.129 Sorry. Beautiful. Thank you. That's a great, 02:26:46.170 --> 02:26:50.010 great answer. What about movies? Is there a movie, 02:26:50.030 --> 02:26:52.729 not a documentary, but a regular, like, you know, 02:26:52.729 --> 02:26:57.100 fictional film that you like? But that's a problem. 02:26:57.180 --> 02:26:59.440 I watch, you know, a whole lot of television 02:26:59.440 --> 02:27:03.379 and film and series and all that. So I'll go 02:27:03.379 --> 02:27:05.780 in first and see documentaries. And again, it's 02:27:05.780 --> 02:27:08.440 maybe on the same subject, but you have an incredible 02:27:08.440 --> 02:27:11.440 documentary on World War Two in France and the 02:27:11.440 --> 02:27:14.219 resistance called The Sorrow and the Pity by 02:27:14.219 --> 02:27:17.100 Max Ophuls. It's just about four hours long. 02:27:17.280 --> 02:27:20.920 It's it was filmed, I think, 15 years after the 02:27:20.920 --> 02:27:25.350 war. And it's a fascinating look into. normal 02:27:25.350 --> 02:27:28.309 human beings who suddenly find themselves you 02:27:28.309 --> 02:27:30.909 know their world put upside down and that's the 02:27:30.909 --> 02:27:33.309 occupation at that time and having to fight even 02:27:33.309 --> 02:27:35.450 though they're not you know they're not trained 02:27:35.450 --> 02:27:37.309 they're not all that and how you know you you 02:27:37.309 --> 02:27:40.170 face evil so it always kind of relates to the 02:27:40.170 --> 02:27:43.170 things in terms of movies oh there's too many 02:27:43.170 --> 02:27:46.030 of them it's it's hard to uh to think in them 02:27:46.030 --> 02:27:48.969 i'll have to think by by genre and all that but 02:27:48.969 --> 02:27:51.360 uh that's too hard there's too many of them Beautiful. 02:27:51.420 --> 02:27:53.040 That was great. I've never heard of the sorrow 02:27:53.040 --> 02:27:54.940 and the pity before, but it's funny. I meant 02:27:54.940 --> 02:27:57.059 to say as well, when we started, the very first 02:27:57.059 --> 02:28:02.819 explosion on November 13th was in a stadium where 02:28:02.819 --> 02:28:05.840 France and Germany were playing a friendly match. 02:28:06.059 --> 02:28:09.059 And again, that goes to show that people, you 02:28:09.059 --> 02:28:12.139 know... innately are good and sometimes some 02:28:12.139 --> 02:28:14.860 bad people get put in positions of power or you 02:28:14.860 --> 02:28:16.399 know whether it's power governmentally whether 02:28:16.399 --> 02:28:19.040 it's power because of a weapon they hold but 02:28:19.040 --> 02:28:21.200 ultimately we're just men and women who want 02:28:21.200 --> 02:28:23.340 to feed our children put a roof over our heads 02:28:23.340 --> 02:28:26.940 you know and watch them grow up but and that's 02:28:26.940 --> 02:28:29.700 why you see in every conflict you never you know 02:28:30.030 --> 02:28:33.489 People of all sorts, you know, are stepping up 02:28:33.489 --> 02:28:37.250 against tyranny, no matter where they're from, 02:28:37.290 --> 02:28:40.350 no matter what country they're part of, their 02:28:40.350 --> 02:28:44.329 religion and all that. That spark of hope and 02:28:44.329 --> 02:28:46.290 humanity is in all of us. And we see it time 02:28:46.290 --> 02:28:48.690 and time and time and time again. Absolutely. 02:28:48.909 --> 02:28:50.709 All right. Well, the next question. Is there 02:28:50.709 --> 02:28:52.829 a person you'd recommend to come on this podcast 02:28:52.829 --> 02:28:56.149 as a guest to talk to the first responders, military 02:28:56.149 --> 02:29:01.180 and associates? Yes. Piper. And yes, I'll talk 02:29:01.180 --> 02:29:05.620 to him. I'll see if he's interested and I'll 02:29:05.620 --> 02:29:07.719 ask him to reach out to you if he is. Beautiful. 02:29:07.739 --> 02:29:11.209 Thank you. And actually on that same token. Because, 02:29:11.409 --> 02:29:13.290 for example, you mentioned the helmet. It's one 02:29:13.290 --> 02:29:15.649 of the things that drives me crazy is people 02:29:15.649 --> 02:29:18.690 looking down their nose at firefighters from 02:29:18.690 --> 02:29:20.549 other countries because they don't wear what 02:29:20.549 --> 02:29:22.409 I call the leather sombrero that we have here, 02:29:22.569 --> 02:29:25.670 the antiquated helmet. And people in the fire 02:29:25.670 --> 02:29:27.950 service love it and they hate pistol grips. But 02:29:27.950 --> 02:29:30.170 the reality is the men and women of the fire 02:29:30.170 --> 02:29:33.190 service around the world do the same job. So 02:29:33.190 --> 02:29:35.469 that's the kind of message that I want. But I 02:29:35.469 --> 02:29:39.709 would love to get a member of Sapo -Pompier. 02:29:40.090 --> 02:29:42.329 the paris french firefighter but obviously they 02:29:42.329 --> 02:29:44.270 have to speak english if there was one that had 02:29:44.270 --> 02:29:47.569 been at both events or in one or the other i 02:29:47.569 --> 02:29:52.469 can talk uh let me see what i can do i let me 02:29:52.469 --> 02:29:54.629 think of a couple of heads i can think of a couple 02:29:54.629 --> 02:29:57.829 of them One would be great is the one who was 02:29:57.829 --> 02:30:00.430 chief of the fire department on November 13, 02:30:00.569 --> 02:30:02.950 but he's a very, very, very busy man still. So 02:30:02.950 --> 02:30:04.709 I don't know. But if not, I can try to think 02:30:04.709 --> 02:30:07.069 of firefighters that were at both, either Charlie 02:30:07.069 --> 02:30:10.290 Hebdo on November 13 and Notre Dame. I have a 02:30:10.290 --> 02:30:12.969 couple of friends. I'll reach out to them. I'll 02:30:12.969 --> 02:30:14.709 see which one has the better English. Beautiful. 02:30:14.829 --> 02:30:16.829 Thank you so much. All right. So then the very 02:30:16.829 --> 02:30:18.829 last question before I let you go, before we 02:30:18.829 --> 02:30:21.110 make sure everyone knows how to find the films 02:30:21.110 --> 02:30:22.469 you've done, if there's anything that you do 02:30:22.469 --> 02:30:24.649 want to say as far as future projects that won't 02:30:24.649 --> 02:30:27.920 be back. Bad luck. What do you do to decompress? 02:30:30.219 --> 02:30:35.559 Being very French, I cook. To decompress, it's 02:30:35.559 --> 02:30:38.579 basic, simple pleasures in life. I will cook. 02:30:38.659 --> 02:30:41.719 I will garden. I will have amazing meals with 02:30:41.719 --> 02:30:44.899 my friends and drink a nice bottle of wine with 02:30:44.899 --> 02:30:48.100 my family. Right now, it's around the fireplace. 02:30:49.139 --> 02:30:53.550 Just normal things. Really normal things. Enjoy 02:30:53.550 --> 02:30:57.290 the people who are around me. That's what I take 02:30:57.290 --> 02:31:02.149 from all that. Every single happy moment is to 02:31:02.149 --> 02:31:04.770 be treasured like it's the last one. And it doesn't 02:31:04.770 --> 02:31:06.889 have to be a big thing. It could be this amazing 02:31:06.889 --> 02:31:09.930 moment where you have a dinner party. Well, nowadays, 02:31:10.069 --> 02:31:13.010 this past year, we didn't have a few. But where 02:31:13.010 --> 02:31:15.250 everyone is having a great time and laughter 02:31:15.250 --> 02:31:19.690 is echoing through the apartment. That's all 02:31:19.690 --> 02:31:22.049 it takes. That's happiness for me. Beautiful. 02:31:22.569 --> 02:31:24.290 Yeah, I think that's something that's been the 02:31:24.290 --> 02:31:26.250 negative this last year, even though this last 02:31:26.250 --> 02:31:28.489 year is what you make of it. And in comparison 02:31:28.489 --> 02:31:31.590 to some of the events we discussed, it was a 02:31:31.590 --> 02:31:33.750 very good year for most people. But yeah, that 02:31:33.750 --> 02:31:37.270 tribal element, that community, I think is so 02:31:37.270 --> 02:31:39.850 important. We're a social animal. We need our 02:31:39.850 --> 02:31:42.569 social contact. It defines who we are as a species. 02:31:43.190 --> 02:31:48.540 Absolutely. But it will be good. Again, we've 02:31:48.540 --> 02:31:52.559 lived on this earth through much, much worse. 02:31:52.739 --> 02:31:55.239 It will pass. It will be horrible. And we have 02:31:55.239 --> 02:31:57.940 to remember the loss and the people who we've 02:31:57.940 --> 02:32:00.040 lost along the way and celebrate their life and 02:32:00.040 --> 02:32:03.579 their courage. But this too shall pass. Yes. 02:32:03.659 --> 02:32:05.680 Yeah. And I think just like what we've discussed 02:32:05.680 --> 02:32:08.620 as well, we've been taught some lessons. We've 02:32:08.620 --> 02:32:10.940 been taught some lessons on our country's wellness. 02:32:11.180 --> 02:32:12.879 We've been taught some lessons on the environment. 02:32:13.200 --> 02:32:16.139 So I hope. We will take those lessons with us 02:32:16.139 --> 02:32:19.500 and improve in the future. But we all have to, 02:32:19.600 --> 02:32:21.500 I think it's Chief Pfeiffer who always talks, 02:32:21.559 --> 02:32:23.260 when he talks about the trauma we've all lived, 02:32:23.360 --> 02:32:25.600 he said the most, you know, when you live a trauma 02:32:25.600 --> 02:32:27.879 like that, you have two choices. One, you don't 02:32:27.879 --> 02:32:30.520 learn anything from it. You don't gain anything 02:32:30.520 --> 02:32:33.059 from it. And all this is for nothing. Or two 02:32:33.059 --> 02:32:37.780 is you try to find something positive in all 02:32:37.780 --> 02:32:41.219 of this. You remember it always, but you don't 02:32:41.219 --> 02:32:44.370 let it define you. You take it inside of you, 02:32:44.409 --> 02:32:48.469 you let it transform or add something positive 02:32:48.469 --> 02:32:50.909 to your life, and then you move on while never 02:32:50.909 --> 02:32:53.639 forgetting. But do not be defined by that. And 02:32:53.639 --> 02:32:55.559 so that's the things we have to do. And same 02:32:55.559 --> 02:32:59.059 thing by this. That does not define us. We've 02:32:59.059 --> 02:33:01.579 learned all have lessons from this. Let's take 02:33:01.579 --> 02:33:04.059 positive ones and move on and remember this moment. 02:33:04.540 --> 02:33:07.600 Beautiful. Well, one, I did put some posts out 02:33:07.600 --> 02:33:09.780 asking if people had questions. And I think there 02:33:09.780 --> 02:33:12.159 was a couple. One, do you still stay connected 02:33:12.159 --> 02:33:14.059 with the department? Obviously, you've told us 02:33:14.059 --> 02:33:15.420 that you're good friends with Chief Pfeiffer. 02:33:16.829 --> 02:33:18.809 firehouse every now and then which is always 02:33:18.809 --> 02:33:21.670 amazing even though there was very few i think 02:33:21.670 --> 02:33:23.850 from the 55 that work there there's probably 02:33:23.850 --> 02:33:27.209 three from that day so you know every now and 02:33:27.209 --> 02:33:29.090 then i arrive and there's a rookie open the door 02:33:29.090 --> 02:33:31.989 and say yes sir how can i help you go go wish 02:33:31.989 --> 02:33:34.190 the the rig and go make me a coffee and then 02:33:34.190 --> 02:33:36.229 i'll go and see the guys but you know it's fun 02:33:36.229 --> 02:33:40.709 it has a magical feeling for me beautiful and 02:33:40.709 --> 02:33:43.010 then the other one is people ask about a follow 02:33:43.010 --> 02:33:45.709 -up but obviously we're about to hit 20 years 02:33:47.780 --> 02:33:49.799 without jinxing you and getting to... No, no, 02:33:49.799 --> 02:33:52.780 no. Well, we've always every five years, we've 02:33:52.780 --> 02:33:55.159 always did kind of what we call an update towards 02:33:55.159 --> 02:33:58.559 the end. We always do a half an hour of after 02:33:58.559 --> 02:34:00.680 the documentary on, you know, what are these 02:34:00.680 --> 02:34:04.360 people that become what has happened or highlighting 02:34:04.360 --> 02:34:07.520 certain things happening, whether it was the 02:34:07.520 --> 02:34:10.940 psychological trauma. We did that for the 50th 02:34:10.940 --> 02:34:13.319 anniversary for the 10 year. It was more, unfortunately, 02:34:13.520 --> 02:34:15.799 the people starting to die and we had lost two 02:34:15.799 --> 02:34:19.979 close. uh friends firefighters from the firehouse 02:34:19.979 --> 02:34:23.639 due to that so um for the 20th we're wearing 02:34:23.639 --> 02:34:25.979 talks right now too but we'll most probably do 02:34:25.979 --> 02:34:29.159 an update for for that point but um it's a it's 02:34:29.159 --> 02:34:31.379 still a little bit early right now but we're 02:34:31.379 --> 02:34:33.930 considering it of course Beautiful. Well, Jules, 02:34:33.969 --> 02:34:35.930 I just want to say thank you so much. I mean, 02:34:35.969 --> 02:34:38.389 this random English bloke reached out, you know, 02:34:38.389 --> 02:34:39.870 and I want to actually before I want to say thank 02:34:39.870 --> 02:34:42.469 you as well to Kate Casey, because I had been 02:34:42.469 --> 02:34:44.549 looking for you guys for a long time. As I mentioned 02:34:44.549 --> 02:34:47.790 before, I totally understand the nature of what 02:34:47.790 --> 02:34:50.809 you do and just your personalities that you don't 02:34:50.809 --> 02:34:53.829 want to be out there. But when Kate had managed 02:34:53.829 --> 02:34:55.870 to do that incredible conversation with you on 02:34:55.870 --> 02:34:59.370 her podcast, in response to mine, someone tagged 02:34:59.370 --> 02:35:01.969 her. She immediately. messaged me and sent me 02:35:01.969 --> 02:35:03.670 your email so we're having this conversation 02:35:03.670 --> 02:35:06.469 because of her but um but yeah i want to say 02:35:06.469 --> 02:35:08.250 thank you so much we've been talking for two 02:35:08.250 --> 02:35:12.030 and a half hours um but you know the the the 02:35:12.030 --> 02:35:14.510 lens that you have through from nine you know 02:35:14.510 --> 02:35:17.270 from from new york through to paris i think is 02:35:17.270 --> 02:35:19.409 invaluable and even though the documentaries 02:35:19.409 --> 02:35:24.909 speak volumes your yours and Jedion's story through 02:35:24.909 --> 02:35:27.329 your eyes, through your words, I think is something 02:35:27.329 --> 02:35:28.989 that a lot of us haven't heard. So thank you 02:35:28.989 --> 02:35:32.020 so much for being so generous today. No, my pleasure. 02:35:32.079 --> 02:35:35.079 And thank you to you and all these amazing first 02:35:35.079 --> 02:35:39.620 responders. All we do is really an homage to 02:35:39.620 --> 02:35:42.260 them and a way to say thank you in a way that 02:35:42.260 --> 02:35:44.559 we'll never be able to thank them enough. How 02:35:44.559 --> 02:35:46.700 can you thank someone who saved your life? So 02:35:46.700 --> 02:35:49.879 it's our pleasure and it's our honor to be able 02:35:49.879 --> 02:35:54.180 to help in any small way. It was a fun conversation. 02:35:54.379 --> 02:35:55.399 I really appreciate it.